That's how Darth Dawkins, who this is (and who doesn't live in Texas so he's happy to lie) operates. This is him fairly tame honestly. He's also lying that he doesn't think this is, or should be, a Christian Nation.
Matt also wouldn’t have entertained the “is it possible” question that took up 20 minutes of this call. He would’ve just said “I don’t give a shit about what’s possible, I care about what’s actually true”
Me a few minutes in: Huh. Hes actually being somewhat cordial today. Good for him. Me after 5 minutes: Ah. There it is. Welcome back, Darth, you turd sucker...
“Don’t over talk me or I’ll lose my place in my script.” I cannot at the moment remember the apologist who wrote a book about how to argue by asking question 1, presuming what the answer will be then question 2, etc.
Brainwashing was invented by atheists in China. They would destroy a person's mind by dripping water on a person's forehead until their minds were destroyed.
@@Francis-m2dindeed! Only the rational people who's arguments are backed up with scientific EVIDENCE have the truth! People should believe something to be true on the basis of EVIDENCE! Not because they have been brainwashed with all that supernatural nonsense of ANY religion, or because they like the idea that there is an imaginary skydaddy that takes care of them or because they like the idea that there is an imaginary afterlife! Anyway, science and especially evolution have already debunked the crux of christianity and the crux of all the other religions I know of ages ago. Moreover, there is not a shred of evidence for the existence of ANY god or Allah or whatever name they gave to their non-existing celestial dictator!
Seriously, I don’t know how you manage to remain courteous and calm with these people. I don’t believe I have ever finished a single one of these videos. I rage quit every single time.
This EF guy's modus operandi is to literally dominate the narrative start to end and avoid having ANY of his beliefs held to account. Because he sees these as absolute. And his arrogance and narcissism (EF's) is so extreme that his attitude turns on a dime the moment the conversation goes in any direction he doesn't want. The best thing to do is to not talk to these people
Your atheism depends entirely on the definition of God. Which means it's a moving target that you constantly have to balance to feel contentment with it. That's a very unsettling and exhausting position for a brain to hold. So to alleviate that, atheists force a false dichotomy where there's only 2 possibilities. A delusion they need to live in to hold on to contentment with consciousness. The False Dichotomy of Atheism: 1. An illogical Christian God concept (a god with human like consciousness) 2. No God There are many other possibilities that atheists choose to ignore and atheism is just stopping you from furthering your understanding of your own consciousness. Is it possible that you just don't know what God is so you choose to adhere to the God of a ridiculous religion?
@@YamadaDesigns Except that theirs is a positive claim for which they carry a burden of proof. Although Asimov is saying here that he doesn't have evidence of disproof, he doesn't need it to simply be unconvinced. He would only need it to support a counter proof. And he's saying that it isn't sufficiently interesting to warrant the effort.
Darth is dishonest, he said he doesn't interrupt after doing so several times. His narcissistic attitude will never let him learn,or at least never admit he's wrong.
Socipaths like this caller helps dissuade people from Religion. When all the moderates eventually leave religion, what little remains in the churches will be fanatics, bigots and conmen like the caller dude.
“Your Honor, the defense claims Bill did not commit the murder. But, if he didn’t commit the murder, I ask the defense, who did? Since they cannot prove who committed the murder, the only answer is that is was Bill. I rest my case.”
@@gregsanich5183 But that's only the case, _after_ it was established that the cause of death was indeed murder, hence the fact that it was brought into a courtroom. When it comes to existence, the claim that its the handy work of a creator god, hasn't been established at all.
@@BorisNoiseChannel you meant it hasn't been verified convclusively? ....bc the creator hypothesis most certainly has indeed been established.... in fact countless diff conceptualizations of what it is have been.
@@gregsanich5183 that "hypothesis" has been established the same way gossiping journals about the death of the person have established the cause of death before the official announcement of the cause of death by the investigators.
@@gregsanich5183 You are right; there is indeed a hypothesis that a creator god did it. There is also a hypothesis that pixies did it, or that a unicorn did it. All of these hypotheses have indeed been established.
I heard this caller for years on an audio chatroom. He does the same thing every time. He tries to talk over you when you’re answering him and then claims that YOU are rude for interrupting him. He will actually cry if you don’t let him away with it.
I love how theists demand atheists have an answer for every single question in the world or we must be wrong. But when you question them suddenly all you need is faith.
The holy bible and dean odles biblical flat earth presentation destroys atheist beliefs! Time to get a new gig atheists! Jesus saves sinners! Use the brain God gave you
The holy Bible and dean odles biblical flat earth presentation destroys atheist beliefs! Time to get a new gig atheists! Jesus saves sinners! Now use that brain God gave you!
Exactly. Like he seriously askes without a hint of irony "If the answer to X isn't god, then what else is it?" May as well ask 'If the answer to the question isn't 4, then what's your answer?', like, buddy whether I have an answer to the question or not you gotta show your work.
Do you know why? The Christian theist wants to invoke "tu quoque", "you atheist have faith too", but we have a big sky daddy while you have not, therefore we are the winner. LOL
Holy Bible and dean odles biblical flat earth presentation destroys atheist beliefs! Time to get a new gig atheists! Jesus saves sinners! Use that brain God gave you!
The holy bible and dean odles biblical flat earth presentation destroys atheist beliefs! Time to get a new gig atheists! Jesus saves sinners! Now use the brain God gave you!
That's the whole presup "special revelation" stance, I think. It's ridiculous. The moment they get put in the position of having to defend that premise their argument breaks down or they deflect.
Religious people are always miraculously born into the right religion, no matter which of the thousands of religions that happens to be. They all present the exact same arguments (fallacies) which miraculously supports only the religion they happen to believe in.
Not to mention, Alison the many denominations that make mutually exclusive claims about Christianity. This person going by the alias Darth Dawkins also implies that his interpretation of the bible is the exclusive and unique truth. I think that the late Christopher Hitchens point is relevant here. Paraphrased "Even if you prove that Atheism is false and that a god exists you would still have to prove it is yours that is the real god. You would not have won, you would in fact still have all of your work ahead of you" (as I said it is paraphrased. Please feel free to put the actual quote should you find it).
Imagine having this Darth POS guy as your roommate hammering you day and night about "what is the ultimate nature of reality" and his ever so tedious and monotonous "non-material, non-contingent mind that has the power to effectuate the initial conditions of the universe" as arguments for you to accept the Christian deity he's enamored with as a logical conclusion. It's insane.
BUT MUH SCRIPT! MAY I FINISH! MAY I FINISH, YOU'RE OVERTALKING ME! YOU HAVE NOT ANSWERED! WHAT IS IT THAT IS ULTIMATE THAT ALL BEING IS CONDITIONAL UPON!? I'M NOT MAKING AN ARGUMENT I'M ASKING YOU A QUESTION!
I've listened to this call before like 20 times and I still can't understand shit, why to demostrate that something exists and interacts with the world needs so much mental masturbation? If I want you to meet my mom I dont need to construct a whole fucking argument and justify the laws of logic.
I think the caller was trying to do the cosmological argument, premise by premise. I love this show, and the man was rude and aggressive, but I don’t think the presenters handled his points well at all, very unusually.
"I am a Christian. So you must listen to everything that I say, without question. You must do what I say, without question. You must live your life the way I tell you to live, loving only those I give you permission to love and hating everyone that I tell you to hate. You must never have any religion other than the religion I allow you to have. Give me money."
I've been watching these calls for the past 4 months and this was the worst guy I've ever had the misfortune of listening to. He actually gave me a migraine. You guys are astonishingly patient.
Challenging religious ideologies is not `suppressing religious people.` While I certainly would not mourn the death of religion in general, I have no desire to destroy it, or dictate what people ought to believe. However, if the religious indoctrination machine can't stand up to scrutiny, to the point such scrutiny is seen as `suppressing religious people,` I'd say it doesn't need my help anyway.
A mute button would have been really freaken nice during this call. My god. This guy boils my blood. He so stuck on his argument he won't even stop and consider what's being actually said.
With all of the arguing that EF did, he STILL did not prove that his God exist. He only wanted to argue to TRY to get "gotcha" moments. Under all of his words, he was "secretly" asserting his God.
How did this call drag on for so long? This guy is *obviously* reading from a script, and you can tell he gets frustrated every time the hosts pull him off it. They hit him with some clarifying questions, and since those questions aren’t in his script, all he does is repeat the same nonsense. It’s like, "If they say yes, respond with this... If they say no, respond with that..." 🤦🏾♂️ Man, he’s beyond annoying. He’s not here to defend his beliefs; he’s trying to put atheism on trial. I heard one of his other calls and it was literally the same shit.
Gary suggests that if you don't know how the internals of your phone work, you don't have the ability to use it... I don't need to know the ultimacy of existence
What a rude caller. He was answered piece by piece, but he didn't like it, so he kept repeating and changing the question. Y'all have more patience than I do.
14:29 "I'm not being rude", he says, rudely. My word, I've never been this annoyed at someone trying to make their point by steamrolling the entire conversation, from start to finish, having zero interest in actually listening to any of the responses given, interrupting as soon as anyone tries to give more than a one-word answer, and getting annoyed when anyone interrupts him to try to discuss or clarify a point instead of letting him monologue ahead with his point, ignoring what people say in favour of throwing out principles of reasoning he has a very poor understanding of, all just to try to make lazy "gotcha" for the sake of scoring some imaginary debate points.
"I'm not saying that's a requirement, I'm just saying it's a necessary prerequisite" is like saying, "I'm not saying that the Arrow III is an electric train, I'm just saying that it's a train that draws electricity from an overhead wire."
It's not that atheists want to suppress religion, we just want people to think critically and come to atheism on their own without forcing it. I don't want to be like religion and try to convert them or force it on them. I believe in freedom, freedom to believe or not to believe as long as you don't take that freedom from me.
I absolutely want to suppress religion. It's just a matter of method. I want them to lose their tax-exempt status, I want the faith seeding stuff to go away, I want it to be considered neglectful indoctrinate children into religious faith, I want the Bible nonsense out of public schools, I don't want priests to be able to shelter other priests because of the protections they get from confession, I want the churches responsible for abuse to be held accountable, and I'm sure I can come up with others. And Christians will absolutely consider all of that a suppression of their religion. But I'd bet money they'd agree with me if I said it about Scientology. If people want to believe nonsense all on their own... I guess go for it. I don't like it, but it's whatever. But we can not let religions get away with as much as they do when it allows them to still function in grotesque ways we should otherwise be able to limit.
This guy, to me, sounds like the guy who took his phone into the repair shop and was so adamant that rice would've fixed it, regardless of what the repairman said
Maybe, the best answer to the question about the possibility would be "I cannot know, therefore I don't know, but due to the given characteristics, I find the probability close to impossible.
@@Hariester You'd have to demonstrate that some form of AI is conscious. As a forrmer AI researcher, I'm pretty confident in predicting that you won't be able to do that.
As an atheist, I don't want to force religious people to stop. I want them to conclude that on their own. After that, religion would die off naturally.
The whole call was aggravating as all hell, but the video is so worth it for the rant at the end. Shame the one person who needed to hear it most will never listen to it.
Way more patient then i would have been without the debate spanning weeks, however i think the end point is extremely valuable in dealing with that sort of presupposition.
Also a great example of good old fashioned sophistry, he had to keep framing his position as a yes no question, with the priming that a rational person wouldn't give either, he makes it seem like his position is the only rational conclusion but refuses to allow further discussion on it, exactly what an appeal to ignorance looks like.
We may have difference of opinion... For religious organizations, they should not receive government money. Period. No tax dodges, no risk free loans, none of the "government benefits" they currently enjoy. I also belive that all "societal boons" should be removed, just because someone is a priest, doesn't mean "oh they would never touch a child, they are a man of god". If a church, religious leader commits a crime, they are not to be treated differently. And... I think that's about it... they should be properly taxed on that property holdings, like every other organization... um... hmmm I think that's it. Is that "me wanting to cripple them", I don't think so. Would that in effect cripple them? Yeah, probably, they are fricking scams, relying on the gullability of the masses, and the tax deductions. At least a lot of the worst churches...
We've seen from the inside of an atom to the farthest reaches of the known universe. Every time science makes a discovery God has one less place to hide
WE DO? Not me. I don't mind if religion goes away, but I don't really care if it doesn't either. My biggest beef with religion is conning old people out of their savings for fairytales. Even if I'm wrong the preachers, I have a beef with are absolutely nothing like Jesus.
I call that cluster fuckin. He seems to take the Peterson approach to cluster fuckin his way through with endless word salad with no nutritional value whatsoever.
This was so ridiculous. The answer is- possibility needs to be demonstrated. Until you present evidence that it is possible, the answer is "I don't know".
I'm one of those who want to do away with the destructive influence of religion. Yet it is the best to do away with it. I think the church as a business does need to be done away with. I would support that
Is it possible for a creator god to exist? Who cares whether it is possible? It's a ludicrous idea. It's possible that aliens abducted JFK. It's possible that flying penguins exist. It's possible that antigravity exists. It's possible that I can dance on my head.
Yall let this conversation go on to long. I understand giving someone a chance because they might turn around. Just saying this was one that the person didn't need it. There's no way to know before hand, so I'm not being critical of the decision. Just his performance. He's a troll.
Great example of how philosophy is just chewing gum for the mind. It starts out ok but shortly loses its flavour and your still left hungry for the truth.
He called in thinking he held all the cards but met with straightforward critical thinking, his house of cards collapsed. He was also closed minded and was unable to comprehend the answers he was given.
i know this is a throwback but i like the way Matt approaches the question "do you think its possible that this X and Y god exists? ", he usually says something like "yeah, its possible. but without sufficient evidence its on the same plain as the probability of unicorns existing." Also how can you ask someone to "reason" whether you need "logic" to "reason". that seems very circular... how could you answer that question without logic?
Have heard this guy many times. Just drive him crazy by asking him to define his assertions. Talking over him is recommended. But that's just too much fun.
My question is why should Christian organisations be given any preferential treatment over other organisations. When it is only run for the benefit of it's own members.
He simply didn't try to adress the arguments, he wanted to find reason to dismiss any arguments of the oposition based on suggesting, that we must have any absolutes for even using the arguments.
Caller: "Stop talking over me"
Also Caller: Talks over everybody
That's the only way Gary operates.
That's how Darth Dawkins, who this is (and who doesn't live in Texas so he's happy to lie) operates. This is him fairly tame honestly. He's also lying that he doesn't think this is, or should be, a Christian Nation.
I just love how triggggered Darth gets when people breakdown his presup questions and show the fallacies in them..
MAY I FINISH?
@@Stile4aly
😂😂😂
Ad much as I love these guys I so wish Matt had been on this call. We'd have gotten "Listen here jackass" five times already. 🤣🤣🤣
Matt also wouldn’t have entertained the “is it possible” question that took up 20 minutes of this call. He would’ve just said “I don’t give a shit about what’s possible, I care about what’s actually true”
Me a few minutes in: Huh. Hes actually being somewhat cordial today. Good for him.
Me after 5 minutes: Ah. There it is. Welcome back, Darth, you turd sucker...
People like this are unbelievably tedious to listen to!! 😡
@@Ryangubbs and his breathe smells awful
@@ganndeber1621kinda what happens with diarrhea of the mouth.
I love the callers that talk over the hosts are the same ones that get super pissy about being talked over😂
“Don’t over talk me or I’ll lose my place in my script.”
I cannot at the moment remember the apologist who wrote a book about how to argue by asking question 1, presuming what the answer will be then question 2, etc.
I have not read the book myself, but it sounds like it could be Tactics by Greg Koukl
@@tekbarrier
That’s it.
Discouraging religion is a noble goal. Truth is better than brainwashing, whether you like it or not.
Atheists know quite a bit about brainwashing. Brainwashing was invented by atheist Chinese Communists.
Nobody has a monopoly re: truth.
Brainwashing was invented by atheists in China. They would destroy a person's mind by dripping water on a person's forehead until their minds were destroyed.
Preach, brother!🙌
🤭
@@Francis-m2dindeed! Only the rational people who's arguments are backed up with scientific EVIDENCE have the truth! People should believe something to be true on the basis of EVIDENCE! Not because they have been brainwashed with all that supernatural nonsense of ANY religion, or because they like the idea that there is an imaginary skydaddy that takes care of them or because they like the idea that there is an imaginary afterlife!
Anyway, science and especially evolution have already debunked the crux of christianity and the crux of all the other religions I know of ages ago.
Moreover, there is not a shred of evidence for the existence of ANY god or Allah or whatever name they gave to their non-existing celestial dictator!
I have had my fill of pseudo intellectual bullies who play the victim to dominate the conversation.
nailed it. This arrogant guy Darth is unbearable.
Agree with Corpeedo. You summed up Darth Dawkins to a tee. Literally could not have said it better myself.
Bingo. I only recently learned of this dude but this is always his go-to move
Seriously, I don’t know how you manage to remain courteous and calm with these people. I don’t believe I have ever finished a single one of these videos. I rage quit every single time.
I am the same. I would probably shout at these idiots. 😅
When you want to rage quit, you might try jumping to the last 2 minutes (30 seconds?) of the video.
You have trouble managing emotions. Get psycological help
Especially Darth Darwin he is something else🤤
This EF guy's modus operandi is to literally dominate the narrative start to end and avoid having ANY of his beliefs held to account. Because he sees these as absolute. And his arrogance and narcissism (EF's) is so extreme that his attitude turns on a dime the moment the conversation goes in any direction he doesn't want. The best thing to do is to not talk to these people
Good ol' Darth Dawkins. Well known as the man who has turned more Christians into Atheists than any other.
this is the second time i’ve heard him and both times he’s been a maroon (sic)
Is this person the offspring of Darth Vader and Richard Dawkins?
His debate with Shannon Q is amazing!
Came here to make the same comment, took me a couple minutes to connect the voice to the idiocy being spewed.
Kudos..
"I don't have the evidence to prove that God doesn't exist, but I so strongly suspect he doesn't that I don't want to waste my time." Isaac Asimov
Your atheism depends entirely on the definition of God. Which means it's a moving target that you constantly have to balance to feel contentment with it.
That's a very unsettling and exhausting position for a brain to hold. So to alleviate that, atheists force a false dichotomy where there's only 2 possibilities. A delusion they need to live in to hold on to contentment with consciousness.
The False Dichotomy of Atheism:
1. An illogical Christian God concept (a god with human like consciousness)
2. No God
There are many other possibilities that atheists choose to ignore and atheism is just stopping you from furthering your understanding of your own consciousness. Is it possible that you just don't know what God is so you choose to adhere to the God of a ridiculous religion?
I could see a similar statement being made by a theist
@@YamadaDesigns
Except that theirs is a positive claim for which they carry a burden of proof.
Although Asimov is saying here that he doesn't have evidence of disproof, he doesn't need it to simply be unconvinced. He would only need it to support a counter proof. And he's saying that it isn't sufficiently interesting to warrant the effort.
Come on now, yall know the flying spaghetti monster made all of existence last thursday 😆
@@kevin-en2pi
Why is it always Thursday? 😂
Darth is dishonest, he said he doesn't interrupt after doing so several times.
His narcissistic attitude will never let him learn,or at least never admit he's wrong.
Socipaths like this caller helps dissuade people from Religion.
When all the moderates eventually leave religion, what little remains in the churches will be fanatics, bigots and conmen like the caller dude.
Because he doesn't want to learn. He wants to use his religion to fleece people.
This is Gary Milne, a.k.a. ‘Darth Dawkins’. Any attempt at reasoning with him is wasted time.
I love how he just cries every time someone breaks down his “question” that is his presup argument. He knows it shows how weak it is.
I was searching for this xD
His obnoxiously condescending tone is unique
@@AkanoWirecheck out Jefferson Spatchcock for more Darth
Yeah he’s the complete opposite of the real DAWKINS ones a genius and the other is one of the special people 🤨❤️
He is exactly like Bill O'Reilly
This guy must be an absolute blast at parties.
Nobody invites Darth Dawkins to parties
A party is a finite congregation that does not account for that which is unconditionally nondependent. He wouldn't be interested
@@eccodlikely true, not even his little mini me discord sycophants.
He's probably not legally allowed within 500 feet of a party since there might be children there.
@@WhiteRabbitObject1 what kind of parties are you going to...
Unless you're a magician or clown... then carry on.
“Your Honor, the defense claims Bill did not commit the murder. But, if he didn’t commit the murder, I ask the defense, who did? Since they cannot prove who committed the murder, the only answer is that is was Bill. I rest my case.”
Regardless, the fact remains that somebody did indeed commit the murder.
@@gregsanich5183 But that's only the case, _after_ it was established that the cause of death was indeed murder, hence the fact that it was brought into a courtroom. When it comes to existence, the claim that its the handy work of a creator god, hasn't been established at all.
@@BorisNoiseChannel you meant it hasn't been verified convclusively?
....bc the creator hypothesis most certainly has indeed been established.... in fact countless diff conceptualizations of what it is have been.
@@gregsanich5183 that "hypothesis" has been established the same way gossiping journals about the death of the person have established the cause of death before the official announcement of the cause of death by the investigators.
@@gregsanich5183 You are right; there is indeed a hypothesis that a creator god did it. There is also a hypothesis that pixies did it, or that a unicorn did it. All of these hypotheses have indeed been established.
Ah, Darth, the most painful of all presuppers. He was on a show run by a mate of mine here in Australia, and was absolutely crushed, it was hilarious!
That is Darth! I didn't pick it up until about 4 minutes in.
You gotta share a link. Few things make me happier than Darth.
Not sure if you're able to post links here but how do we find this episode??
@@bryanmack5410Darth cracks me up
I too want to see this video.
I heard this caller for years on an audio chatroom. He does the same thing every time. He tries to talk over you when you’re answering him and then claims that YOU are rude for interrupting him. He will actually cry if you don’t let him away with it.
The guy sounds like a sociopath and needs mental health treatment, adding Religion I believe just makes a nasty mix.
I love how theists demand atheists have an answer for every single question in the world or we must be wrong. But when you question them suddenly all you need is faith.
The holy bible and dean odles biblical flat earth presentation destroys atheist beliefs! Time to get a new gig atheists! Jesus saves sinners! Use the brain God gave you
The holy Bible and dean odles biblical flat earth presentation destroys atheist beliefs! Time to get a new gig atheists! Jesus saves sinners! Now use that brain God gave you!
The format's backwards it should be the host asking questions in the guest explaining on this type of show
Exactly. Like he seriously askes without a hint of irony "If the answer to X isn't god, then what else is it?"
May as well ask 'If the answer to the question isn't 4, then what's your answer?', like, buddy whether I have an answer to the question or not you gotta show your work.
Do you know why? The Christian theist wants to invoke "tu quoque", "you atheist have faith too", but we have a big sky daddy while you have not, therefore we are the winner. LOL
23 min - I made it this far because I was doing dishes and couldn’t rage quit with my hands soapy.
The dishes are done and so am I.
That pause, smile and high five made my day. That feeling of understanding someone and what they just went thru. Love it
How does that guy "know" that some other religion than Christianity is false. Seems quite convenient that the religion he believes it true?!?
Holy Bible and dean odles biblical flat earth presentation destroys atheist beliefs! Time to get a new gig atheists! Jesus saves sinners! Use that brain God gave you!
The holy bible and dean odles biblical flat earth presentation destroys atheist beliefs! Time to get a new gig atheists! Jesus saves sinners! Now use the brain God gave you!
That's the whole presup "special revelation" stance, I think. It's ridiculous. The moment they get put in the position of having to defend that premise their argument breaks down or they deflect.
Religious people are always miraculously born into the right religion, no matter which of the thousands of religions that happens to be.
They all present the exact same arguments (fallacies) which miraculously supports only the religion they happen to believe in.
Not to mention, Alison the many denominations that make mutually exclusive claims about Christianity. This person going by the alias Darth Dawkins also implies that his interpretation of the bible is the exclusive and unique truth. I think that the late Christopher Hitchens point is relevant here. Paraphrased "Even if you prove that Atheism is false and that a god exists you would still have to prove it is yours that is the real god. You would not have won, you would in fact still have all of your work ahead of you" (as I said it is paraphrased. Please feel free to put the actual quote should you find it).
“Destroy religion and suppress religious people?” Dude, no. I only want to do one of those things.
I really just want not to be bothered by deluded people and their intrusions upon my life. That includes Strawman fallacies directed at atheists.
Imagine having this Darth POS guy as your roommate hammering you day and night about "what is the ultimate nature of reality" and his ever so tedious and monotonous "non-material, non-contingent mind that has the power to effectuate the initial conditions of the universe" as arguments for you to accept the Christian deity he's enamored with as a logical conclusion. It's insane.
BUT MUH SCRIPT! MAY I FINISH! MAY I FINISH, YOU'RE OVERTALKING ME! YOU HAVE NOT ANSWERED! WHAT IS IT THAT IS ULTIMATE THAT ALL BEING IS CONDITIONAL UPON!? I'M NOT MAKING AN ARGUMENT I'M ASKING YOU A QUESTION!
You're being very rude. May I SPEAK without being OVERSPOKEN?!
I've listened to this call before like 20 times and I still can't understand shit, why to demostrate that something exists and interacts with the world needs so much mental masturbation? If I want you to meet my mom I dont need to construct a whole fucking argument and justify the laws of logic.
“Mental masturbation” is a term that should be applied to callers like this often. Always, even.
I think the caller was trying to do the cosmological argument, premise by premise. I love this show, and the man was rude and aggressive, but I don’t think the presenters handled his points well at all, very unusually.
This caller has made my day much brighter because I am not his wife, not his daughter, not his neighbor or colleague. Great!
I hate that I can identify Darth by his voice. I wasted brain cells on that.
I have no interest in banning religion unless it advocates for me to have to follow their crap or have my taxes fund them.
"I am a Christian. So you must listen to everything that I say, without question. You must do what I say, without question. You must live your life the way I tell you to live, loving only those I give you permission to love and hating everyone that I tell you to hate. You must never have any religion other than the religion I allow you to have. Give me money."
He’ s trying so hard to open the door to a ‘God of the Gaps” argument.
Because that's all he and any other theist has.
This is Darth Dawkins. He has one script and he does not deviate from it.
I've been watching these calls for the past 4 months and this was the worst guy I've ever had the misfortune of listening to. He actually gave me a migraine. You guys are astonishingly patient.
It's Darth Dawkins, he has called multiple times and he is just as abrasive every time.
This dude thinks because he knows big words, he makes a solid argument!
Challenging religious ideologies is not `suppressing religious people.` While I certainly would not mourn the death of religion in general, I have no desire to destroy it, or dictate what people ought to believe. However, if the religious indoctrination machine can't stand up to scrutiny, to the point such scrutiny is seen as `suppressing religious people,` I'd say it doesn't need my help anyway.
A mute button would have been really freaken nice during this call. My god. This guy boils my blood. He so stuck on his argument he won't even stop and consider what's being actually said.
With all of the arguing that EF did, he STILL did not prove that his God exist. He only wanted to argue to TRY to get "gotcha" moments. Under all of his words, he was "secretly" asserting his God.
How did this call drag on for so long? This guy is *obviously* reading from a script, and you can tell he gets frustrated every time the hosts pull him off it. They hit him with some clarifying questions, and since those questions aren’t in his script, all he does is repeat the same nonsense. It’s like, "If they say yes, respond with this... If they say no, respond with that..." 🤦🏾♂️ Man, he’s beyond annoying. He’s not here to defend his beliefs; he’s trying to put atheism on trial. I heard one of his other calls and it was literally the same shit.
Gary suggests that if you don't know how the internals of your phone work, you don't have the ability to use it... I don't need to know the ultimacy of existence
I'm addicted to these videos 😂. The way they go "Don't depart from my script, otherwise my argument doesn't make sense".
I don't think i've ever heard darth get anywhere in a debate, he will never leave his script.
It's always, you prove to me my god doesn't exist or is possible. Lol
What a rude caller. He was answered piece by piece, but he didn't like it, so he kept repeating and changing the question.
Y'all have more patience than I do.
Kudo to you two for not playing his games
14:29 "I'm not being rude", he says, rudely.
My word, I've never been this annoyed at someone trying to make their point by steamrolling the entire conversation, from start to finish, having zero interest in actually listening to any of the responses given, interrupting as soon as anyone tries to give more than a one-word answer, and getting annoyed when anyone interrupts him to try to discuss or clarify a point instead of letting him monologue ahead with his point, ignoring what people say in favour of throwing out principles of reasoning he has a very poor understanding of, all just to try to make lazy "gotcha" for the sake of scoring some imaginary debate points.
"I'm not saying that's a requirement, I'm just saying it's a necessary prerequisite" is like saying, "I'm not saying that the Arrow III is an electric train, I'm just saying that it's a train that draws electricity from an overhead wire."
It's not that atheists want to suppress religion, we just want people to think critically and come to atheism on their own without forcing it. I don't want to be like religion and try to convert them or force it on them. I believe in freedom, freedom to believe or not to believe as long as you don't take that freedom from me.
I absolutely want to suppress religion. It's just a matter of method. I want them to lose their tax-exempt status, I want the faith seeding stuff to go away, I want it to be considered neglectful indoctrinate children into religious faith, I want the Bible nonsense out of public schools, I don't want priests to be able to shelter other priests because of the protections they get from confession, I want the churches responsible for abuse to be held accountable, and I'm sure I can come up with others.
And Christians will absolutely consider all of that a suppression of their religion. But I'd bet money they'd agree with me if I said it about Scientology.
If people want to believe nonsense all on their own... I guess go for it. I don't like it, but it's whatever. But we can not let religions get away with as much as they do when it allows them to still function in grotesque ways we should otherwise be able to limit.
This guy, to me, sounds like the guy who took his phone into the repair shop and was so adamant that rice would've fixed it, regardless of what the repairman said
This caller would have been perfect for Matt
They’ve talked.
@diogeneslamp8004 Really!
Need to see 👀
@@vance9460
Wish I knew the episode. For a more substantive conversation you should look up Matt’s debate with Sye ten Bruggencate.
@@diogeneslamp8004 thanx
I agree. Delusion should be classified as illness.
Your patience with this guy is impressive
Don't talk over me, says the nitwit.
But he is doing it himself.
“How dare you suggest treating us the way we treat you?!”
Only a problem if you’re hurting people, Mr. Bizarro-Golden-Rule.
What an insufferable caller. You guys were more patient than he deserved.
Caller desperately trying to get an "ah ha told you so" moment is hilarious
Maybe, the best answer to the question about the possibility would be "I cannot know, therefore I don't know, but due to the given characteristics, I find the probability close to impossible.
Does blue orange tomatoes? I say no
HERETIC!
"Just let me tuck this assertion into this question so I can swap between the two on the fly"
The way my brain lit up when I realized that I recognized this caller’s voice.
All conscious entities require a biological substructure for thought to commence. No body, no deity.
Not exactly. You can have artificial intelligence. Processor doesn't need to be biological.
@@Hariester
You'd have to demonstrate that some form of AI is conscious.
As a forrmer AI researcher, I'm pretty confident in predicting that you won't be able to do that.
@@starfishsystems today - very much unlikely. But in a hundred years? Two hundred years?
I don't understand your question.
Liar 😠
He can't answer honestly because it would result in the admission that he's trying to avoid.
Next time he asks that dumb question answer “blue.”
As an atheist, I don't want to force religious people to stop. I want them to conclude that on their own. After that, religion would die off naturally.
@@gregsimmons694 Is this supposed to be a joke?
@@gregsimmons694 Are the sun and other planets also flat?
@@gregsimmons694 Yes. I want the Zombie man to save me, from what he's going to do to me, if he doesn't save me.
He is just like the Mafia.
@@gregsimmons694 ...please get some mental therapy
Religion will only die off if you maintain a society that allows people to be able to conclude on their own.
Ok, when Jamie's voice volume rises, sh*t's gonna get real.
Darth Dawkins would be fun in bars, and even more fun just outside.
The whole call was aggravating as all hell, but the video is so worth it for the rant at the end. Shame the one person who needed to hear it most will never listen to it.
Way more patient then i would have been without the debate spanning weeks, however i think the end point is extremely valuable in dealing with that sort of presupposition.
Also a great example of good old fashioned sophistry, he had to keep framing his position as a yes no question, with the priming that a rational person wouldn't give either, he makes it seem like his position is the only rational conclusion but refuses to allow further discussion on it, exactly what an appeal to ignorance looks like.
“I wasn’t hearing a direct answer…” Yeah, that happens when you don’t listen and read your script instead. 🙄
We may have difference of opinion...
For religious organizations, they should not receive government money. Period. No tax dodges, no risk free loans, none of the "government benefits" they currently enjoy.
I also belive that all "societal boons" should be removed, just because someone is a priest, doesn't mean "oh they would never touch a child, they are a man of god". If a church, religious leader commits a crime, they are not to be treated differently.
And... I think that's about it... they should be properly taxed on that property holdings, like every other organization... um... hmmm I think that's it.
Is that "me wanting to cripple them", I don't think so.
Would that in effect cripple them? Yeah, probably, they are fricking scams, relying on the gullability of the masses, and the tax deductions. At least a lot of the worst churches...
Dark Dawkins reading his flow chart again
Caller took both hosts to school. Good video by the way.
Did we watch the same video?
CAN I FINISH? CAN I FINISH?! ... alright I'm finished
We've seen from the inside of an atom to the farthest reaches of the known universe. Every time science makes a discovery God has one less place to hide
Gary is Master Word Salad Chef
WE DO? Not me. I don't mind if religion goes away, but I don't really care if it doesn't either. My biggest beef with religion is conning old people out of their savings for fairytales. Even if I'm wrong the preachers, I have a beef with are absolutely nothing like Jesus.
So, by EFs question, is it possible that a pink unicorn farted the universe into existence? If not, whynot?
23:09
"Why wont you let me gish gallop?!"
I call that cluster fuckin. He seems to take the Peterson approach to cluster fuckin his way through with endless word salad with no nutritional value whatsoever.
This was so ridiculous. The answer is- possibility needs to be demonstrated. Until you present evidence that it is possible, the answer is "I don't know".
" What is the ultimacy of your reality that lets you believe in ....reality"..... Good grief.
Like arguing with a fence
I'm one of those who want to do away with the destructive influence of religion. Yet it is the best to do away with it.
I think the church as a business does need to be done away with. I would support that
Is it possible for a creator god to exist? Who cares whether it is possible? It's a ludicrous idea. It's possible that aliens abducted JFK. It's possible that flying penguins exist. It's possible that antigravity exists. It's possible that I can dance on my head.
"Is it too much to ask to be able to talk without being interrupted *and* also interrupt you while you're talking?" 🤦♂😂
DD lol. I say no more.
@@gregsimmons694 Oh, honey... You poor thing. I hope you find the strength to seek help - or at least find better things to do with your time.
@@gregsimmons694Sin is a made up concept.
Yall let this conversation go on to long. I understand giving someone a chance because they might turn around. Just saying this was one that the person didn't need it. There's no way to know before hand, so I'm not being critical of the decision. Just his performance. He's a troll.
Great example of how philosophy is just chewing gum for the mind. It starts out ok but shortly loses its flavour and your still left hungry for the truth.
When a debate pervert calls in and wants to prove the ultimate question by playing a trick with words...
He called in thinking he held all the cards but met with straightforward critical thinking, his house of cards collapsed. He was also closed minded and was unable to comprehend the answers he was given.
It's the give me the answers that I want or I'll accuse you of avoiding the question guy again.
Yeah, E.F. is totally not overtalking the hosts. (sarcasm)
i know this is a throwback but i like the way Matt approaches the question "do you think its possible that this X and Y god exists? ", he usually says something like "yeah, its possible. but without sufficient evidence its on the same plain as the probability of unicorns existing."
Also how can you ask someone to "reason" whether you need "logic" to "reason". that seems very circular... how could you answer that question without logic?
9:21 "No, i mean my magic incantation, not your understanding of it"
Found this fall so frustrating because when the caller asked if X is possible, the answer should have been I don’t know.
This is one of the most dishonest and arrogant callers, dude.
A real Creative Unique Natural Talent.
If you give someone $100 every day for long enough, they will take it for granted. Then, if you stop one day, they will think you owe them $100.
"The separation of church and state are to keep forever from these shores the constant strife that soaks Europe's soil in blood" James Madison.
EF is such a horrible person
Siri, what is the definition of "insufferable"?
The tag argument. Havent this been refuted hundreds of times
Dang it! As soon as I heard him speak I knew it was Darth Dawkins.
Darth will never answer any direct questions and always dismisses any reasonable challenge.
Have heard this guy many times.
Just drive him crazy by asking him to define his assertions. Talking over him is recommended. But that's just too much fun.
My question is why should Christian organisations be given any preferential treatment over other organisations. When it is only run for the benefit of it's own members.
He simply didn't try to adress the arguments, he wanted to find reason to dismiss any arguments of the oposition based on suggesting, that we must have any absolutes for even using the arguments.