I’m retired, so my need for a truck isn’t what it once was. I still love the way a truck rides, and at 6’ 5” I like having the leg and head room. A hybrid Tundra is VERY tempting. I might just have to buy one. 🤔
Before you do, just know that there is only one 12V outlet on the dash, and the AC power outlets is limited to 100W while driving. It's a bit underpowered if you have family/friends with you that might be trying to charge a laptop and their phones.
Edmunds says that most pickup drivers (3 out of 4) only tow once a year, even then light loads. So gearing this towards speed and towing and not mpg doesn't make a bit of sense to me. I tow my 5x9 trailer maybe once a month, light loads. The rest of the time, I want to pay less at the pump, and honestly, this seems useless.
Well said, they should offer different axle ratios. I wish this was more like the Prius with the Atkinson cycle powertrain. I prefer to eek out the maximum efficiency at the expense of power or towing ability.
@@garrettw99 I agree. All I can figure is they didn't want to spend the money to completely rearrange everything to incorporate the planetary gearset and electric motors under the hood. Slipping a pancake motor in where the torque converter would have been, and a battery under the back seat, is much simpler.
Because TH-cam commenters will flame every Tundra video if the gap is too big with the Big 3. Someone will surely say how awesome the 5 figure tow rating on their Ram 1500 puts the Toyota to shame.
I see it differently. If one only need a pickup for heavy loads only once or twice a year.. buy a car. Rent the truck. Toyota did it right because a truck , especially a tundra needs to be able to tow. Buyers who are overly optimistic about their requirements are not Toyota's problem to fix. In fact... They are not incentivised to bother because sell more trucks
I'm a die hard Toyota fan, have owned many, including a Camry Hybrid. Like the thought of the hybrid, hate losing the storage under the rear seats, and at $3,500 more than the gas you would have to drive it 150,000 miles at current gas prices just to break even. Think Toyota has some more work to do!
I owned a 2007 Camry Hybrid and got 365,000 miles before retiring it. It was one of the best vehicles I ever owned w awesome mpg. Although I am big on hybrids, I just can't see myself paying thousands more for a 4 mpg savings over a regular Tundra.
We should probably show the math for estimating it. Start by estimating the average price of fuel you expect to see such as $3/gallon (we don't have RU-UKR wars every year). Next you set up an expressions to show total cost for a hybrid plus its fuel cost as a function of miles: cost = ($3500) + [($3/gallon)*(1gallon/24miles)*(X miles)] cost = 3500 + (0.125)*(miles) Now do the same for the non-hybrid: cost = ($0) + ($3/gallon)*(1gallon/20miles)*(X miles) cost = (0.15)*miles Now see where they intersect: 3500 + (0.125)*miles = (0.15)(miles) 3500 = 0.025*miles miles = 140,000 miles to pay for itself Play around with different estimates for gasoline cost and see how the numbers change. What's even more fun is filling in the numbers for a Toyota Prius compared to a similar Toyota compact car. I remember doing this a decade ago and the numbers never made sense. Unless you drove an absurd distance every day, the Prius never paid for itself. The Prius has other benefits to it (the eCVT is apparently bulletproof in term of reliability), but fuel cost was not an attractive selling point.
@@berkit1959 If you have to replace those turbos a couple of times over 365,000 miles, it probably won't pay for itself. 4 mpg is a disappointment to me too. I wonder if just adding the 10 speed trans to the V8 would have given us at least 2 MPG increase, and still have the V8. Who knows I guess.
Alex, Yes, it was a very well kept secret that they were using a different Hybrid system for trucks not the design they were already using in the Lexus LS. While the boost in power is clear, we need to wait for mpg results to fully evaluate the virtues of the Hybrid. Since you asked, the electrical outlet in the bed ought to be able to 'bacon' as well as a Sienna but I am happy they chose a traditional nickel metal hydride battery. I suspect the required materials to make nickel batteries are more readily available so hopefully, supply should be greater.
Except no one was anticipating with deposit on a Tundra when they barely average 100,000 annually where F-150, Ram Truck, and Silverado/Sierra are eight to ten times that much!
As a Tundra enthusiast, (I own a 2021 SR5) I am a bit disappointed. The Ford Power Boost capabilities seem superior? I wish the Tundra had the same 4000 W power station option. For truck buyers trailering campers and charging boat batteries on the road, the power boost system is a game changer. I'm certain the Toyota engineers have designed and built a vastly superior truck in terms of reliability and longevity, but the electrical station option would sure be nice. Perhaps it can be added to the Tundra as an aftermarket improvement.
Even before seeing the bodywork on this huge chassis we understand that we will stick our hand in our wallet with each refueling.People are really innocent to think that this pick-up can do 30 mpg whatever the hybridization. Too many people think technology is magic and don't understand the laws of physics
I don't buy the gas mileage until people start towing with this thing for real. I'm a bit worried about reliability and long term durability of this Hybrid stuff too. I know it's a Toyota, but still.
@@plkracer If you keep your foot out of it when going to the job site, it will get 3-4 better MPG. It adds up. The regenerative braking lengthens brake life. And when you go through Arby's drive through the engine isn't even needed. It also has nearly diesel level low-end torque. Overall it's much better than a conventional truck.
Jesus Christ. I mean it might grow in value, but its already overpriced. My Tacoma TRD OR (21) has grown in value by $8k since i bought it. Crazy times.
Thank you for not just talking about the badging and cosmetics. Really dont care much about the aesthetics too much, need all the details about the drivetrain which I appreciate.
Beds on half tons don’t shake like that, the mount or one of the arms on the mount was loose. I would imagine a late model GoPro would be able to solve that as my GoPro 8 can smooth out my running footage. A loose mount would shake a lot more though
@@TobyCostaRica Tundra has a composite bed and s fully boxed frame. Maybe that's why it shakes because it's so sturdy and can't bend to make it smoother.
Redline got 6.3 sec 0-60. Also San Antonio's elevation is 650ft. If you look at some of the foreign LC300 vs LC200 5.7 V8 drag race video, it seems that at least for the 0-60 or quarter mile there isn't a lot of difference between the V8 and the V6 it is afterwards that the V6 starts pulling away.
I'm an absolute fan of Toyota. And I just love the fact that they are the leader of hybrid cars BUT they don't have any Hybrid Sport car, they stick with good recipes like we love. Toyota knows that Hybrids are good, but they don't want this in their sport cars because it's killing the passion of a sport car. I just admire this brand
If this doesn't offer more towing, speed, or more MPG than the F-150 hybrid, why get it at all? This is speaking only to fanbois, not the general public. This will get very few "conquest" buyers. I expected better from Toyota, especially after 15 years between redesigns
Why not, if it meets your needs? It's likely to be reliable, the gas mileage is somewhat better than most trucks, and it looks OK. The F-150 hybrid is more impressive, but only if you value those extras.
Pretty cool .. just wish they had decided to go with a full electric truck! The F-150 lightning is looking pretty good - and I am a Toyota fan (owned several of their cars).
Alex. I always appreciate your knowledge and review style. Consider locking those cameras down tighter. That was nauseating having those jiggle around so much
No one does hybrids better than Toyota, and there are few cars more reliable than the Tundra. I'm hoping it will live up to Toyota's reputation, but only time will tell.
None of this is really new tech. toyota has been doing hybrids for over 20 years. Turbos? basically century old tech. the 10 speed? already in use in lexus vehicles for almost 5 years now
People complain that Tundra Hybrid is tuned toward power instead of MPGs. If you want you can buy a F150 Lighting and skip the gas pump and then you would have both power and efficiency!
@@rv2167 That hybrid rav4 is pretty dang good. I'm on the fence about trading my NX in for the new one with the same system. I'm wondering what the gas mileage is when the Tundra is in 4 low and crawling for miles. I had a Tacoma 4x4 and it just guzzled gas while off-road.
Hi Alex! Great video as usual. I have 2 questions. One... Do you think that the Hybrid not having a generator is a missed opportunity when compared to the F-150. To me the F-150 offers more with the generator capability. Like you I live in Ca and with our state spontaneously combusting every year, having the capability to power much of your house does offer some peace of mind when PG&E shotes off the power. At least to me it can be a deal breaker. Two... No 4 Auto? Did Toyota say why no 4A? Did they incorporate it into 4H? Seems odd when the big 3 American trucks offer it. Bones question not related... Do you plan to review the F-150 Tremor?
I don’t love Ford and Toyota has treated me well but I’d say it was a missed opportunity. Now Toyota doesn’t really sell a ton to fleets who would be the main ones using it, but still! Although… another solution would be for you to move from that awful state and still get the Toyota :-)
I’m very disappointed that there’s not a bigger 120v option at least on the hybrid. I’m still thinking there’s a Tundra IForce Prime coming in the next couple years. Plug in with a larger battery.
I have my doubts. Putting a small battery under the rear seat was easy. Finding a place for a much bigger battery would be trickier. I'd have said under the bed somewhere, but that cutaway truck doesn't show any big space where they could put one. We can hope, but it would be a lot more expensive, if even possible.
Very, very disappointed that the back seat doesn’t have a completely flat floor once the seats are flipped up. Also not feeling great about all the gray fenders around the wheels. Looks like only the TRD Pro gets body colored fenders.
It seems that if we are already past what a non-CDL driver could haul without the hybrid system, that it would have made more sense to add fuel efficiency instead of more power with the hybrid system. I am always ok with more power, but a hybrid system extending the power of past the rate that we already cannot use all of seem ridiculous.
if north American regulations were more fair for diesel imports meaning that the emissions levels would be same for both domestic and import not artificially limited then they would have had the D4D V8 Diesel for cheaper than the hybrid. and similar mpg
Very thorough review. Thank you. I will keep my 1995 Dodge 12v Cummins going no matter what. 21mpg empty at 65mph and does everything I want it to do including pulling a gooseneck with 6k lbs on it grossing out at 16k lbs doing 14mpg.
This is actually an older hybrid system than most Toyotas, similar to Honda's IMA and the first Toyota hybrid that was never brought to market. The fact that it took until now to get to trucks probably has to do with CAFE's stupid truck exception rather than technology. I'm surprised Toyota didn't try to do a dual-cycle Otto-Atkinson engine like GM has for this.
Always have loved owning Tundras. My fellow workers with Ford or Chevy were always talking about truck in shop getting serviced for this or that. I took my Tundras in for oil changes.👍
@@gwot What about all the extra expensive parts involved. Looks like a maintenance nightmare to me while I trust Toyota generally their stuff last because they worked the bugs out over the years stick with a system that works. This thing is brand new so the customer will be the long term test when we get to 2028 then they will fix all the weak points. Might as well price in 10 year extended warranty.
@@Mike-01234 This may be first for Tundra, but far from first for Toyota. They've been using this hybrid setup in their Hino trucks for decades now. and what maintenance nightmare are you talking about? hybrid systems aren't in the way of maintenance, and you change the inverter coolant along with the engine coolant, other than that it's the exact same maintenance as a non hybrid.
The pricing for these hybrids, and electric vehicles as a whole, is what turns many people off. What a car owner would have saved in fuel, he/she is paying up front with a higher initial price tag at the stealership.
This "solution" for more efficiency and power looks so overwhelmingly complicated. It really is a selling point to just go full electric like the F-150 Lightening. No gas at all and much faster, huge front trunk, no oil changes, etc.
I didn’t realize the electric motor can run out of charge and the truck will lose power. How do you know when battery is low, and how does it recharge?
hi 👋 hybrid veh driver here. the situation is less severe and less likely than you might be thinking. the HV battery gen / regen logic is quite simple and is tailored for maximum efficiency, not maximum availability. in theory, the logic could be better informed by telematics, but afaik no system does that (maybe bmw?). the logic operates on the principle of ascending and descending grades, and by extension on-power acceleration and off-power regeneration. every day driving conditions, the natural occurences of road elevations do not extend for meaningfully long distances, that is to say if you are driving up a slope, in a short while you will be at the road's peak and then you will be driving down the slope. when you are driving down the slope, you are essentially expending no energy and are recovering nearly all of the kinetic energy you acquired on the way up the hill. this regen keeps the HV battery charged with enough energy to provide it's torque-assist functions, and other EV functions. the hybrid system also has the ability to trickle charge the HV battery directly off of - in this case - the output shaft, but it avoids doing this as much as possible bc this is the most wasteful use of petrol. it is better for the system to blindly wait until the vehicle is in a coasting state to recover the coasting and braking energy, than to generate the HV reserve from the ICE. now picture a very long distance uphill grade, you're going to deplete the HV charge in the first few gears of acceleration fairly quickly, and then the system will slowly be trickle charging the HV battery whenever you're on power. the build up is not that quick. if you were to stop the truck on the hill, you would then be re-accelerating from a stop with less EV torque than before. another example is if you were to idle the truck at a very long stop light with the AC running (high electricity consumption). the truck will eventually restart the ICE to being to recharge the HV battery, but since the battery is depleted, you would be accelerating with less torque than if the HV battery had a higher state of charge. if you were to stop at a very short red light, you would be accelerating from a stop using more EV torque and less petrol. i guess you could think of the higher torque figures during EV assisted operation as a fun and useful bonus, but the system is tailored to essentially use up as much HV charge as possible as quickly as possible when moving from a stop. this is how any hybrid system achieves its efficiency.
The electric motor is an "assist" to the gas motor. When it's low on juice, you get limited assist. It charges by just driving it, similar to how your 12v battery stays charged by using the truck.
Disassembled Tundra to show its Hybrid system.... classic! Toyota: Hey Alex, you need to bring the Truck back. Alex: Umm, yupp I will, just need to put it back together. LOL.
whats your point? regular gas vs diesel powered trucks are compared.... so it still would have bean interesting to have a cost vs benefit comparison here too...
@@nc3826 wow, I was just making sure you know they're not the same hybrid system... not correcting you, and you're so offended to the point of insulting me? You're a joy to be around. You want me to be pedantic? The F150's "plug in" is full BEV, not a hybrid, again different. There was no "point" to prove.
I think I would probably buy this over an F-150. F-150 is faster and has the cool inverter, but I like the interior in this. Also this will have better resale value, likely better reliability, and a better ride than the F-150. I would hope it would be a little cheaper than the Ford too. I’d buy the F-150 Lightning or Rivian over all of these though.
Preproduction Tundras driven by Truck Kings had a sloppy ride,as they say....not dialed in. Better reliability.....will see,new things tend to have some issues....and Toyota isnt used to new things. The new Tundra brings nothing that isnt already in the market,and in most cases already better in the market. But hey it's a new Tundra....that's a start isnt it🤣
The Rivian R1T looks like a technological wonder in the truck world! However it's geared more as an adventure truck which is what many people will use it for but I think winter plowing, long distance towing and construction sites are not part of it's DNA. It certainly is capable and has some cool storage solutions but it won't replace the traditional truck as a work truck. Saying that, I'll be curious to see "real reviews" when it hits the market. There's certainly a lot of buzz about Rivian right now.
@@MIZUNOMP60 yeah I agree with you. Where I live, if a truck isn’t used as a work truck (meaning a white base model fleet/company truck) then it is used as a status symbol or for off-roading. The Rivian R1T could be the first “commuter truck” lol. I saw one on the freeway near Rivian HQ last week and it looks very sleek, even more modern-looking than a Tesla.
The current Tacoma tows more… their new one I’m sure would be getting better mileage as well. This thing will probably be getting great mileage…for a truck.
They should've just used a Hybrid Synergy Drive drivetrain in this Tundra. It works incredibly well in Toyota's other vehicles, even the heavy Sienna minivan. It would make the truck more efficient and reliable, as you wouldn't need a heavy transmission with friction losses or dozens of parts that need lubrication, and additionally, the AWD system could just rely on an electric motor for the rear axle, like Toyota's other e-awd models. Oh, and the regular old starter motor is just ridiculous for a car that is supposed to be a full hybrid. It just adds more complexity.
I think that Toyota should put a bigger inverter on the tundra I think that’s if Toyota is going to go after Ford F-150 and put an exact size twin turbo hybrid in their truck they should go all the way, tundra customers didn’t ask Toyota to go and put a twin turbo V6 hybrid in their truck we have been asking for a diesel but Toyota seems to ignore that fact.
Definitely makes sense that Toyota, being in the Hybrid game much longer than most, would choose the most reliable and affordable/available to replace battery since reliability/dependability ang longevity is their mantra. If I were spending upwards of $50,000 on a hybrid truck and looking at both the Ford and the Toyota I would without a doubt go with the Toyota. The money saved from maintenance and the resale value would help sweeten the deal for my next vehicle when it comes time to trade up.
Does the AC and heat work when the engine is off due to the hybrid battery? I have a ferry commute where the engine need to be off. It would be great if the AC and heat would continue working while the engine is off. I’d buy it immediately when available for that comfort factor alone.
I hope you are wrong about the Nickle Metal Hydride battery because that is ancient obsolete tech and Toyota switched over to Li ion a long time ago. Also, under the rear seat takes up storage space - ford puts theirs under the truck bed for that reason.
@@naveenthemachine Tuning the hybrid for power was a mistake. They should've tried to get the best fuel economy possible. Also their marketing said this was a diesel replacement. That's laughable, hybrids get WORSE MPG towing than non-hybrid gasoline engines and a diesel is just better at all of that.
@@imnotusingmyrealname4566 It's not a mistake, it's tuned for TORQUE, this is a truck! no point in going for fuel economy and lack towing. This is a diesel replacement, it makes more torque than a diesel at all speeds, immediately and at zero additional emissions, not to mention diesel emission systems are just garbage that breaks all the time.
I like the concept, 22mpg on a truck is good enough for me but…I have to wonder why the went with Ni over Li ion, and why they put it under the rear seat, thus killing storage space. Also, if you rear end another car or tree, will that heavy battery stay put?
It will be interesting to see when Toyota shifts this from Nickel to Lithium hybrid batteries Is that being saved for the mid-gen refresh in 2025? I think Toyota can do much more, but are saving more power and efficiency for any future competitors from Ford.
I've always been favorable toward Toyota hybrids because they are mechanically simpler than non-hybrids. This Tundra Hybrid, on the other hand, adds complexity.
If the TRD Pro has the same tailpipe placement as the Hybrid model in the video, then the tailpipe will be "pancaked" the first time it goes anywhere (seriously) off road, at least in the Michigan woods.
Most serious contractors already have a dedicated generator, and some sites you can't drive a truck in and not practical to run a 200ft extension cord. Also, would you rather use a 50k engine or a 2k portable generator for constant use on a job? and no contractor would rely on their truck to be the generator. The truck generator's nice for the niche camper, or the occasional plug in, pretty much a gimmick. Toyota said the cost of the inverter and pluming would be more than 2k, which is the price of a good generator, they didn't see the value in it.
It's simpler than the planetary gearset drivetrains used by the Prius and many other hybrids. All it does is insert a pancake motor/generator and clutch pack where the torque converter would otherwise be and attach the motor to a modest battery. This is similar to the hybrids offered by Hyundai/Kia and others. Pretty simple, really.
I feel like Toyota should've kept the V8 option. Lots of Tundra owners wanted the simplicity and reliability of the V8 with no turbos or excessive electronics.
I think like the F-150, in that case we would see many more go for the 3.5 V6. Given the economies of scale, makes sense for Ford to offer a wide range, not so much for Toyota.
@@ALMX5DP I would agree to that except for the fact that the average Tundra owner keeps their trucks a loong time. Tundra is beautiful but this whole TTv6 might not be what a large number of customers want. Sales #s will do the talking.
@@migueralliart true, but only time will tell if this powertrain holds up. Being a Toyota, I think expectations are high, but for good reason so hopefully they keep their stellar reputation.
The car industry abandoned simplicity years ago. Now you have a myriad of complex failure points designed mainly for dealer profits down the line. Thats the future.
I highly doubt anyone will ever really use all that inverter power of the F 150. I can firmly say it would never get used on my job sites. The only thing those bed mounted outlets will get used for is my dump trailers electric hydraulic dump motor on the trailer which will mean no more battery mounted on the trailer tongue but the problem is that a 1/2 ton truck would get broken in half in the first 2 miles LOL.
Aren't you forgetting that your dump trailer's pump motor needs 12v DC? which these hybrid trucks do not supply any more 12v amps than any other normal half-ton as far as i can tell. It doesn't look like they even have any high current 12v power wired to the back of the truck.
The fact they decided to put a 32-gallon fuel tank means they know fuel economy is not going to be great, but at least you'll have decent range, not like GM. The saddest part of their equipment is that they are going to put their nasty vinyl SofTex on the SR5 with options, Limited and TRD PRO. that's the huge turn off for me. Waiting for pricing for platinum or 1794 at this point...
They have cheapened this Toyota Tundra right out of the gate. Plastic grill plastic bumper plastic side doors plastic dash and even vinyl plastic seats. Not to mention Alex is only 5'10 so anybody sitting in the backseat that's 6 ft tall will hit their head on the roof. But at least Toyota put the grab handles back in the truck where you don't have to grab the steering wheel.
I have a 2016 Tundra that I won’t change for a new 2022. No grab handles,I don’t really care. I’ve had dependability and reliability for years now. I’m not sure the New Tundra will meet my needs. Will take the wait and see method for a few years.🤔
I assumed the hybrid would be much faster than 7.4 secs to 60 - perhaps in high 6 sec. Another TH-camr managed 22.5 mpg in a non-hybrid Tundra. “It had lots of power.” You said the Tundra’s hybrid system is different than the Lexus version. - but you didn’t describe in detail how. Toyota’s nickel hydride battery is also different than Ford’s. Could you describe the pros and cons of each? I also assumed MPG hwy would be at least 26 mpg in hybrid form. Its mpg is similar to non-hybrid which then brings the question: Why not offer a V6 diesel (w/600 ft lbs) and be done with complexity and cost? Diesel is lighter and cheaper. * I think they should offer a bigger inverter. Good video! 👍
He went over the difference between the Lexus hybrids at 3:44. It's a truck designed to TOW, not for fuel economy. "Truck king" towed a 7,000 lbs trailer and did a 0-60 for the old v8 SR5 in 17 seconds. With the new Tundra, the SR5 (non hybrid) he towed it in 13.8 seconds. I bet this hybrid can shave off at least another second. NiMH batteries are cheaper, more readily available, much more recyclable, more eco friendly, does not heat up as much, much better temperature range, and not as susceptible to blowing up. Downside is less capacity, heavier, doesn't charge as fast, has potential memory issues, and less ability to perform long charge cycles. Ford's lithium batteries are mounted outside, under the cab, exposed to the element and outside temperatures, it is water cooled, exhaust heated, AND refrigerant cooled, with high Voltage wires running to the back into the high power inverter. Tundra's just sits in the cabin, cooled with a fan and utilizes climate controlled cabin temperatures. Diesels requires emissions systems, which are notoriously unreliable, even for Toyota, it's just the nature of it, and has a level of complexity as well. Also it will cost too much to have their diesel engines certified for emissions for the small diesel market in US/Canada. Ford discontinued their already emissions approved 3.0 diesels in their F150, Toyota's not eager to jump on that sinking ship if even Ford has abandoned it. Electric motors have immediate full torque at any given speed no waiting for turbos, and zero emissions. Toyota said a powerful inverter would cost more than $2k, which is the price of a good generator, they don't see the value in it, and don't want to add another complexity and potential part to fail. Most people can get away with 400W, and serious contractors already have high end generators all set up, and some sites can't be accessed by truck and impractical to connect a 200ft power cable, which would require a portable generator. And would you rather run a 40k engine to power something or a 2k generator?
Unfortunately another missed opportunity that needs a much bigger battery like a 20-40kw battery to get at least 75-100+km with ICE backup. When the battery is exhausted!!!.
Most plugs from the factory are either platinum or iridium plugs so you're looking at once every 100k miles. Are you changing copper plugs every oil change?
Toyota and ford for that matter need to make a 30+ MPG pickup using and Atkinson engine. Not everybody wants to take their truck to the drag strip or cares about topping the grapevine at 75MPH !! If you poll people I think you will find that fuel economy is more important to them than Mustang GT style performance. Toyota has achieved 41% thermal efficiency with their D-4S engine in the cars and it's time to do so in the pickups !
On the Toyota Tundra Hybrid: - No recovery points in the front. - No underseat storage due to battery. - Only one 12V outlet on the dash. - 120V AC outlets limited to 100W while driving (underpowered)/400W while parked. (Good luck trying to charge your phones and a laptop at the same time) - Built-in USB ports not Quick Charge/USB-C PD enabled. - No self driving functions compared to Ford/GMC. On the Ford F-150 Hybrid: - Recovery points! - Underseat storage! - A few 12V outlets in the cab. - 120V AC outlets at 2.4kW (standard), 7.2kW (option available). - Same USB ports with no Quick Charge/USB-C PD (but you can use your own chargers on the AC outlets/12V outlet). - BlueCruise will drive for you hands free on pre-mapped highways. These points skewed our family towards wanting a Ford F-150. Toyota needs to step up their game. We were looking at the GMC too, but apparently they put in the horrible 120V AC outlets in their pickups like Toyota, and offered no 12V outlet. Have to give GMC credit on their SuperCruise system which is way better than Ford BlueCruise though.
Honestly mpg estimates for regular around town driving are not at all what I’m interested in. The extra torque that the electric motor is putting out is obviously aimed at mpg when towing. Don’t give a flip about regular mpg what’s its mpg while towing 10k lbs?
I would have expect hybrid gives you better mpg but not much. Regular 2022 model does not gives you battery gas mpg either. I have 2021 model which I will be keeping rather then getting new.
It would have required a major redesign of the truck. This is a very simple change that doesn't cost much and gives a useful boost in efficiency and performance.
@@markmiller3279ask Tesla about redesigns. They just do it. They have the system they just don't have the battery. The tundra hybrid is a waste of time.
considering comparison between the Tundra and the F-150 is an informative and unbiased, subtle comparison. Very informative.
I love Alex's thoroughness. best car review channel! Keep up the good work Alex! Very much appreciated!
If Toyota made a Maverick equivalent out of the Rav id buy two.
Yes, and keep the price under $25K.
They need to make a small hybrid focused truck
Will have to wait and see what redesigned Taco has in store. Toyota has said by 2025 every vehicle will offer hybrid variant.
I think they already have, it's just not sold here in the states. Look up the Toyota Hilux.
That's what I'm waiting for
I’m retired, so my need for a truck isn’t what it once was. I still love the way a truck rides, and at 6’ 5” I like having the leg and head room. A hybrid Tundra is VERY tempting. I might just have to buy one. 🤔
Before you do, just know that there is only one 12V outlet on the dash, and the AC power outlets is limited to 100W while driving. It's a bit underpowered if you have family/friends with you that might be trying to charge a laptop and their phones.
Edmunds says that most pickup drivers (3 out of 4) only tow once a year, even then light loads. So gearing this towards speed and towing and not mpg doesn't make a bit of sense to me. I tow my 5x9 trailer maybe once a month, light loads. The rest of the time, I want to pay less at the pump, and honestly, this seems useless.
Well said, they should offer different axle ratios. I wish this was more like the Prius with the Atkinson cycle powertrain. I prefer to eek out the maximum efficiency at the expense of power or towing ability.
@@garrettw99 I agree. All I can figure is they didn't want to spend the money to completely rearrange everything to incorporate the planetary gearset and electric motors under the hood. Slipping a pancake motor in where the torque converter would have been, and a battery under the back seat, is much simpler.
Because TH-cam commenters will flame every Tundra video if the gap is too big with the Big 3. Someone will surely say how awesome the 5 figure tow rating on their Ram 1500 puts the Toyota to shame.
I see it differently. If one only need a pickup for heavy loads only once or twice a year.. buy a car. Rent the truck.
Toyota did it right because a truck , especially a tundra needs to be able to tow. Buyers who are overly optimistic about their requirements are not Toyota's problem to fix. In fact... They are not incentivised to bother because sell more trucks
@@TsLeng this. Too many people buy trucks and don’t use them
Thank -You ,this is the best preview of the new Tundra I have seen. Honest with no smoke or company affiliation.👍
I'm a die hard Toyota fan, have owned many, including a Camry Hybrid. Like the thought of the hybrid, hate losing the storage under the rear seats, and at $3,500 more than the gas you would have to drive it 150,000 miles at current gas prices just to break even. Think Toyota has some more work to do!
Used hybrid cars are more expensive though right?
I owned a 2007 Camry Hybrid and got 365,000 miles before retiring it. It was one of the best vehicles I ever owned w awesome mpg. Although I am big on hybrids, I just can't see myself paying thousands more for a 4 mpg savings over a regular Tundra.
How much is 4mpg? Like 25% less fuel consumed? Context mattes a lot.
3500 option. Over 365000 miles even a 4mpg saving would pay for itself
We should probably show the math for estimating it. Start by estimating the average price of fuel you expect to see such as $3/gallon (we don't have RU-UKR wars every year). Next you set up an expressions to show total cost for a hybrid plus its fuel cost as a function of miles:
cost = ($3500) + [($3/gallon)*(1gallon/24miles)*(X miles)]
cost = 3500 + (0.125)*(miles)
Now do the same for the non-hybrid:
cost = ($0) + ($3/gallon)*(1gallon/20miles)*(X miles)
cost = (0.15)*miles
Now see where they intersect:
3500 + (0.125)*miles = (0.15)(miles)
3500 = 0.025*miles
miles = 140,000 miles to pay for itself
Play around with different estimates for gasoline cost and see how the numbers change. What's even more fun is filling in the numbers for a Toyota Prius compared to a similar Toyota compact car. I remember doing this a decade ago and the numbers never made sense. Unless you drove an absurd distance every day, the Prius never paid for itself. The Prius has other benefits to it (the eCVT is apparently bulletproof in term of reliability), but fuel cost was not an attractive selling point.
@@berkit1959 If you have to replace those turbos a couple of times over 365,000 miles, it probably won't pay for itself. 4 mpg is a disappointment to me too. I wonder if just adding the 10 speed trans to the V8 would have given us at least 2 MPG increase, and still have the V8. Who knows I guess.
@@shawn576 That would be assuming this V6 is as dependable as the V8 and never had to replace the turbos I'm guessing?
Alex, Yes, it was a very well kept secret that they were using a different Hybrid system for trucks not the design they were already using in the Lexus LS. While the boost in power is clear, we need to wait for mpg results to fully evaluate the virtues of the Hybrid. Since you asked, the electrical outlet in the bed ought to be able to 'bacon' as well as a Sienna but I am happy they chose a traditional nickel metal hydride battery. I suspect the required materials to make nickel batteries are more readily available so hopefully, supply should be greater.
Except no one was anticipating with deposit on a Tundra when they barely average 100,000 annually where F-150, Ram Truck, and Silverado/Sierra are eight to ten times that much!
How many bacons can Alex bacon in the F-150 PowerBoost 7.2kw inverter? He’d need to buy some more microwaves
It’s all about the availability of the materials to make the battery’s Give toyota credit it’s a very smart move
They purposely low balled this first generation Tundra so they could improve upon it in subsequent itinerations.
The camera shake at the rear bed got me thinking I am in a rave party. Excellent technical review as always!
As a Tundra enthusiast, (I own a 2021 SR5) I am a bit disappointed. The Ford Power Boost capabilities seem superior? I wish the Tundra had the same 4000 W power station option. For truck buyers trailering campers and charging boat batteries on the road, the power boost system is a game changer. I'm certain the Toyota engineers have designed and built a vastly superior truck in terms of reliability and longevity, but the electrical station option would sure be nice. Perhaps it can be added to the Tundra as an aftermarket improvement.
Rob,
believe me, Toyota will be copying fords innovations by next yr
Even before seeing the bodywork on this huge chassis we understand that we will stick our hand in our wallet with each refueling.People are really innocent to think that this pick-up can do 30 mpg whatever the hybridization. Too many people think technology is magic and don't understand the laws of physics
100%, even more true when towing at highway speed. I'd imagine the hybrid option will not pay off for anyone using this as an actual truck.
I don't buy the gas mileage until people start towing with this thing for real. I'm a bit worried about reliability and long term durability of this Hybrid stuff too. I know it's a Toyota, but still.
thats why im waiting for a hybrid tacoma or maverick competitor
@@MahendraSingh-rp6er The Tacoma is still a pretty heavy truck too honestly
@@plkracer If you keep your foot out of it when going to the job site, it will get 3-4 better MPG. It adds up. The regenerative braking lengthens brake life. And when you go through Arby's drive through the engine isn't even needed. It also has nearly diesel level low-end torque. Overall it's much better than a conventional truck.
There’s a 2021 SR5 trail package at my local dealer for 47k right now. We test drove it, and I’m probably gonna buy it, value is gonna sky rocket.
Jesus Christ. I mean it might grow in value, but its already overpriced.
My Tacoma TRD OR (21) has grown in value by $8k since i bought it. Crazy times.
there's one that's not accounted for and available for test drive? surprising
@vitaly
All brands have increased in value the last 15 months, not just a toyota
Been waiting for this. Thanks Alex!
Thank you for not just talking about the badging and cosmetics. Really dont care much about the aesthetics too much, need all the details about the drivetrain which I appreciate.
Did you forget to turn on the stabilization on the rear-mounted camera? Those were pretty horrible shakes even on a relatively smooth road surface.
Its the reality of any body-on-frame bed, no stabilization can fix that. Next time put the camera on the rear of the cab.
@@Wised1000 I disagree. Alex's Ford F150 hybrid review has a camera mounted on the same location, and the footage is very stable.
@@AmericanRoads Then he forgot to engage it. All beds shake like crazy.
Beds on half tons don’t shake like that, the mount or one of the arms on the mount was loose. I would imagine a late model GoPro would be able to solve that as my GoPro 8 can smooth out my running footage. A loose mount would shake a lot more though
@@TobyCostaRica Tundra has a composite bed and s fully boxed frame. Maybe that's why it shakes because it's so sturdy and can't bend to make it smoother.
Redline got 6.3 sec 0-60. Also San Antonio's elevation is 650ft. If you look at some of the foreign LC300 vs LC200 5.7 V8 drag race video, it seems that at least for the 0-60 or quarter mile there isn't a lot of difference between the V8 and the V6 it is afterwards that the V6 starts pulling away.
Not enough altitude to matter. That's low for the Western US.
I'm an absolute fan of Toyota. And I just love the fact that they are the leader of hybrid cars BUT they don't have any Hybrid Sport car, they stick with good recipes like we love. Toyota knows that Hybrids are good, but they don't want this in
their sport cars because it's killing the passion of a sport car. I just admire this brand
If this doesn't offer more towing, speed, or more MPG than the F-150 hybrid, why get it at all?
This is speaking only to fanbois, not the general public.
This will get very few "conquest" buyers.
I expected better from Toyota, especially after 15 years between redesigns
Toyota Reliability
@@wwilliams6344
Tundra didn't change for years....it better have been reliable,cause that's all it had.
X2 reliability. The big three will forever be in a bigger better faster arms race. I do agree the MPG should be best in class.
Why not, if it meets your needs? It's likely to be reliable, the gas mileage is somewhat better than most trucks, and it looks OK. The F-150 hybrid is more impressive, but only if you value those extras.
Bro Toyota is never the best. King of Mediocrity.
Love this truck but unlike the Ford Hybrid F150, there is no appreciable big power inverter for external usage.
It's not completely useless, but it does seem like a big missed opportunity.
@@markmiller3279 Not at all...I still very much like the truck. Perhaps Toyota will rectify the situation.
It's laughable. 400 watts?
@@rxonmymind8362 F150 Hybrid can be had with 7000 watts.
@mark miller
With this truck there is a lot of missed opportunities
Pretty cool .. just wish they had decided to go with a full electric truck! The F-150 lightning is looking pretty good - and I am a Toyota fan (owned several of their cars).
Alex. I always appreciate your knowledge and review style. Consider locking those cameras down tighter. That was nauseating having those jiggle around so much
So much complexity, it will be amazing if it proves reliable.
No one does hybrids better than Toyota, and there are few cars more reliable than the Tundra. I'm hoping it will live up to Toyota's reputation, but only time will tell.
None of this is really new tech. toyota has been doing hybrids for over 20 years. Turbos? basically century old tech. the 10 speed? already in use in lexus vehicles for almost 5 years now
People complain that Tundra Hybrid is tuned toward power instead of MPGs. If you want you can buy a F150 Lighting and skip the gas pump and then you would have both power and efficiency!
Toyota's last ditch attempt to not do an EV is pretty feeble. We have a Lightning reservation in with Ford.
24 MPG would be nearly double what I average in my ‘21 TRD PRO… who would be disappointed by that?!
That is what my Lexus NX 200t averages. I'd take that all day in a full sized truck.
@@rv2167 That hybrid rav4 is pretty dang good. I'm on the fence about trading my NX in for the new one with the same system. I'm wondering what the gas mileage is when the Tundra is in 4 low and crawling for miles. I had a Tacoma 4x4 and it just guzzled gas while off-road.
@@AdamBusbin my v6 Camry gets 28-29mpg mixed driving. And the highway mpg will embarrass the rav4 hybrid
Because it is just ok not a WOW
@@AdamBusbin I'd be looking at the nicer Venza if I were trading in an NX. The RAV4 is plain inside.
Hi Alex! Great video as usual. I have 2 questions. One... Do you think that the Hybrid not having a generator is a missed opportunity when compared to the F-150. To me the F-150 offers more with the generator capability. Like you I live in Ca and with our state spontaneously combusting every year, having the capability to power much of your house does offer some peace of mind when PG&E shotes off the power. At least to me it can be a deal breaker. Two... No 4 Auto? Did Toyota say why no 4A? Did they incorporate it into 4H? Seems odd when the big 3 American trucks offer it. Bones question not related... Do you plan to review the F-150 Tremor?
I don’t love Ford and Toyota has treated me well but I’d say it was a missed opportunity. Now Toyota doesn’t really sell a ton to fleets who would be the main ones using it, but still!
Although… another solution would be for you to move from that awful state and still get the Toyota :-)
A better solution yet would be to get out of California, don’t get a Toyota, get a real truck
I’m very disappointed that there’s not a bigger 120v option at least on the hybrid. I’m still thinking there’s a Tundra IForce Prime coming in the next couple years. Plug in with a larger battery.
I'm crossing my fingers for a Tacoma iForce Prime!
I have my doubts. Putting a small battery under the rear seat was easy. Finding a place for a much bigger battery would be trickier. I'd have said under the bed somewhere, but that cutaway truck doesn't show any big space where they could put one. We can hope, but it would be a lot more expensive, if even possible.
Very, very disappointed that the back seat doesn’t have a completely flat floor once the seats are flipped up. Also not feeling great about all the gray fenders around the wheels. Looks like only the TRD Pro gets body colored fenders.
$??? I'll wait a few years for Toyota to beef up the hybrid system. The RAV-4 Hybrid Limited meets my everyday needs for now.
Welcome to my stomping grounds Alex. I hope you enjoyed the Texas Hill Country during your trip.
It seems that if we are already past what a non-CDL driver could haul without the hybrid system, that it would have made more sense to add fuel efficiency instead of more power with the hybrid system. I am always ok with more power, but a hybrid system extending the power of past the rate that we already cannot use all of seem ridiculous.
Payload would’ve suffered but still I agree 100%
VERY ready to pre-order Tundra Hybrid Limited first chance I get
if north American regulations were more fair for diesel imports meaning that the emissions levels would be same for both domestic and import not artificially limited then they would have had the D4D V8 Diesel for cheaper than the hybrid. and similar mpg
Toyota has a brand new V6 diesel that is better than the domestics in every way and it's used in the Land Cruiser and LX.
Apparently Toyota doesn’t think that it’s good enuf
Very thorough review. Thank you. I will keep my 1995 Dodge 12v Cummins going no matter what. 21mpg empty at 65mph and does everything I want it to do including pulling a gooseneck with 6k lbs on it grossing out at 16k lbs doing 14mpg.
This is actually an older hybrid system than most Toyotas, similar to Honda's IMA and the first Toyota hybrid that was never brought to market. The fact that it took until now to get to trucks probably has to do with CAFE's stupid truck exception rather than technology.
I'm surprised Toyota didn't try to do a dual-cycle Otto-Atkinson engine like GM has for this.
Do you have any information on the "clutch" as Alex called it? I'm sure they can run a different (pseudo) engine cycle with variable valve timing.
If this thing gets 25 miles mpg I’m just gonna keep buying Silverado’s
Great review, but Toyota blew it with this hybrid. The extra "oomph" and modest fuel economy gain make this much ado about nothing...
Compared to the V8 tundra the gains on efficiency is very real and quite a bit.
Always have loved owning Tundras. My fellow workers with Ford or Chevy were always talking about truck in shop getting serviced for this or that. I took my Tundras in for oil changes.👍
this is made for towing, not for fuel economy like the other hybrids.
@@gwot What about all the extra expensive parts involved. Looks like a maintenance nightmare to me while I trust Toyota generally their stuff last because they worked the bugs out over the years stick with a system that works. This thing is brand new so the customer will be the long term test when we get to 2028 then they will fix all the weak points. Might as well price in 10 year extended warranty.
@@Mike-01234 This may be first for Tundra, but far from first for Toyota. They've been using this hybrid setup in their Hino trucks for decades now. and what maintenance nightmare are you talking about? hybrid systems aren't in the way of maintenance, and you change the inverter coolant along with the engine coolant, other than that it's the exact same maintenance as a non hybrid.
How is the ride and handling compare to ram 1500 with air suspension
According to straightpipes review it's a little firmer in the Tundra
Look at that frame. Jesus, it's huge.
All that power and only 7.2 seconds 0-60? Surprising. I'd probably would just go for the non-hybrid version.
Driving Sports TV tested it at 6.6. Still not stellar, but pretty good.
The model Alex tested here a has the longer 6.5ft bed. The additional weight over the 5.5ft bed may add a few ticks to the 0-60 acceleration time!
Alley
🐌🐌
That car actually looks quite good
Looks like we will be waiting to get one that will get more that 3-5 miles per gallon than what it gets on gas. We love our PHEV Prime.
These kind of vehicles are your bread and butter. Information dense. Great job
Alex, I'm Curious, IS The Fuel Tank Size the Same on the Hybrid AWD As is the Regular AWD Versions?
The pricing for these hybrids, and electric vehicles as a whole, is what turns many people off. What a car owner would have saved in fuel, he/she is paying up front with a higher initial price tag at the stealership.
This "solution" for more efficiency and power looks so overwhelmingly complicated. It really is a selling point to just go full electric like the F-150 Lightening. No gas at all and much faster, huge front trunk, no oil changes, etc.
@JPL
No charging stations..
If they make a PHEV it'll be amazing for city driving. Give it a real lithium battery and 60 km range and they won't be able to make them fast enough.
Very much agree!!
aka Tundra prime.
@@gwot indeed
I didn’t realize the electric motor can run out of charge and the truck will lose power. How do you know when battery is low, and how does it recharge?
The car charges itself and will turn on the engine as needed
hi 👋 hybrid veh driver here. the situation is less severe and less likely than you might be thinking. the HV battery gen / regen logic is quite simple and is tailored for maximum efficiency, not maximum availability. in theory, the logic could be better informed by telematics, but afaik no system does that (maybe bmw?). the logic operates on the principle of ascending and descending grades, and by extension on-power acceleration and off-power regeneration. every day driving conditions, the natural occurences of road elevations do not extend for meaningfully long distances, that is to say if you are driving up a slope, in a short while you will be at the road's peak and then you will be driving down the slope. when you are driving down the slope, you are essentially expending no energy and are recovering nearly all of the kinetic energy you acquired on the way up the hill. this regen keeps the HV battery charged with enough energy to provide it's torque-assist functions, and other EV functions. the hybrid system also has the ability to trickle charge the HV battery directly off of - in this case - the output shaft, but it avoids doing this as much as possible bc this is the most wasteful use of petrol. it is better for the system to blindly wait until the vehicle is in a coasting state to recover the coasting and braking energy, than to generate the HV reserve from the ICE. now picture a very long distance uphill grade, you're going to deplete the HV charge in the first few gears of acceleration fairly quickly, and then the system will slowly be trickle charging the HV battery whenever you're on power. the build up is not that quick. if you were to stop the truck on the hill, you would then be re-accelerating from a stop with less EV torque than before. another example is if you were to idle the truck at a very long stop light with the AC running (high electricity consumption). the truck will eventually restart the ICE to being to recharge the HV battery, but since the battery is depleted, you would be accelerating with less torque than if the HV battery had a higher state of charge. if you were to stop at a very short red light, you would be accelerating from a stop using more EV torque and less petrol. i guess you could think of the higher torque figures during EV assisted operation as a fun and useful bonus, but the system is tailored to essentially use up as much HV charge as possible as quickly as possible when moving from a stop. this is how any hybrid system achieves its efficiency.
The electric motor is an "assist" to the gas motor. When it's low on juice, you get limited assist. It charges by just driving it, similar to how your 12v battery stays charged by using the truck.
Disassembled Tundra to show its Hybrid system.... classic!
Toyota: Hey Alex, you need to bring the Truck back.
Alex: Umm, yupp I will, just need to put it back together. LOL.
Great review as always, but should have also compared and contrasted it to the Ram eTorque Hybrid....
the Ram is a mild hybrid, not apples to apples.
whats your point? regular gas vs diesel powered trucks are compared....
so it still would have bean interesting to have a cost vs benefit comparison here too...
@@nc3826 that's fine, I was just letting you know, incase you thought Ram's hybrid is the same as Ford/Toyota's hybrid. Just clarifying things is all.
No DuhDuh....
and since the 150 hybrid comes in a plug- in version too.... thx for proving my point... my pedantic friend...
@@nc3826 wow, I was just making sure you know they're not the same hybrid system... not correcting you, and you're so offended to the point of insulting me? You're a joy to be around. You want me to be pedantic? The F150's "plug in" is full BEV, not a hybrid, again different. There was no "point" to prove.
I think I would probably buy this over an F-150. F-150 is faster and has the cool inverter, but I like the interior in this. Also this will have better resale value, likely better reliability, and a better ride than the F-150. I would hope it would be a little cheaper than the Ford too. I’d buy the F-150 Lightning or Rivian over all of these though.
Preproduction Tundras driven by Truck Kings had a sloppy ride,as they say....not dialed in.
Better reliability.....will see,new things tend to have some issues....and Toyota isnt used to new things.
The new Tundra brings nothing that isnt already in the market,and in most cases already better in the market.
But hey it's a new Tundra....that's a start isnt it🤣
The Rivian R1T looks like a technological wonder in the truck world! However it's geared more as an adventure truck which is what many people will use it for but I think winter plowing, long distance towing and construction sites are not part of it's DNA. It certainly is capable and has some cool storage solutions but it won't replace the traditional truck as a work truck. Saying that, I'll be curious to see "real reviews" when it hits the market. There's certainly a lot of buzz about Rivian right now.
@@MIZUNOMP60 yeah I agree with you. Where I live, if a truck isn’t used as a work truck (meaning a white base model fleet/company truck) then it is used as a status symbol or for off-roading. The Rivian R1T could be the first “commuter truck” lol. I saw one on the freeway near Rivian HQ last week and it looks very sleek, even more modern-looking than a Tesla.
@alley
I’ll bet the tundra won’t handle a plow, as Toyota couldn’t even find a place for tow hooks
I think Toyota will add additional power features in later updates
Yup, check back in a decade...
@@paulhunter9613 lol
Nice, thank you Alex.
Maybe Toyota should make an MPG focused Tundra hybrid. If it can tow say 6000-7000 lbs, they'd probably have more happy customers
The current Tacoma tows more… their new one I’m sure would be getting better mileage as well.
This thing will probably be getting great mileage…for a truck.
Another great review as always Alex, thank you! Nice truck.
I sure hope the IForce Max gets at least 26 mpg because if it doesn't then "Dominating Soon" would just be a marketing ploy.
They should've just used a Hybrid Synergy Drive drivetrain in this Tundra. It works incredibly well in Toyota's other vehicles, even the heavy Sienna minivan. It would make the truck more efficient and reliable, as you wouldn't need a heavy transmission with friction losses or dozens of parts that need lubrication, and additionally, the AWD system could just rely on an electric motor for the rear axle, like Toyota's other e-awd models. Oh, and the regular old starter motor is just ridiculous for a car that is supposed to be a full hybrid. It just adds more complexity.
I think that Toyota should put a bigger inverter on the tundra I think that’s if Toyota is going to go after Ford F-150 and put an exact size twin turbo hybrid in their truck they should go all the way, tundra customers didn’t ask Toyota to go and put a twin turbo V6 hybrid in their truck we have been asking for a diesel but Toyota seems to ignore that fact.
Definitely makes sense that Toyota, being in the Hybrid game much longer than most, would choose the most reliable and affordable/available to replace battery since reliability/dependability ang longevity is their mantra. If I were spending upwards of $50,000 on a hybrid truck and looking at both the Ford and the Toyota I would without a doubt go with the Toyota. The money saved from maintenance and the resale value would help sweeten the deal for my next vehicle when it comes time to trade up.
Another great thorough review Alex
I am surprised that this hybrid lags behind the F-150 and where is the 7.2kW output? I was hoping for a little more.
Think about changing out the plugs on this thing.
Does the AC and heat work when the engine is off due to the hybrid battery? I have a ferry commute where the engine need to be off. It would be great if the AC and heat would continue working while the engine is off. I’d buy it immediately when available for that comfort factor alone.
I hope you are wrong about the Nickle Metal Hydride battery because that is ancient obsolete tech and Toyota switched over to Li ion a long time ago. Also, under the rear seat takes up storage space - ford puts theirs under the truck bed for that reason.
Totally discounted this truck when I heard NMHI battery pack is in it.
I thought it would be a better performer than the outgoing model. I was thinking along the lines of the Ford 3.5t
Me too. I am honestly disappointed with this. Even the f150 2.7 is faster. Or even the tundra with the v8 is faster
It's probably because they want you to pay for 400+HP...much more. The Lexus LX 600 has 409-415HP from the same engine.
@@damilolaakanni doesn’t the hybrid have 435hp? But even that’s slower than the f150 hybrid
@@naveenthemachine Tuning the hybrid for power was a mistake. They should've tried to get the best fuel economy possible. Also their marketing said this was a diesel replacement. That's laughable, hybrids get WORSE MPG towing than non-hybrid gasoline engines and a diesel is just better at all of that.
@@imnotusingmyrealname4566 It's not a mistake, it's tuned for TORQUE, this is a truck! no point in going for fuel economy and lack towing. This is a diesel replacement, it makes more torque than a diesel at all speeds, immediately and at zero additional emissions, not to mention diesel emission systems are just garbage that breaks all the time.
it was looking good till alex started talking about the rear 120v outlet at 400 watts.
Ford's Pro Power generation is a huge competitive advantage for them.
@@bryanmills2295
Because Ford knows contractors need that outlet or work and occasional weekend warrior / camper.
Looks like an absolute nightmare to work on. Park the F150 Lightning skateboard next to it and do a comparison.
I like the concept, 22mpg on a truck is good enough for me but…I have to wonder why the went with Ni over Li ion, and why they put it under the rear seat, thus killing storage space. Also, if you rear end another car or tree, will that heavy battery stay put?
I don’t like that they vented the batteries compartment into the cabin air
It will be interesting to see when Toyota shifts this from Nickel to Lithium hybrid batteries
Is that being saved for the mid-gen refresh in 2025?
I think Toyota can do much more, but are saving more power and efficiency for any future competitors from Ford.
You won't have to wait til 2025 or whenever the mid cycle refresh will be, the plug-in hybrid version will have Li-ion batteries.
Camry hybrids used to be NiMH in the higher trims, but now they’re all lithium ion in every trim.
The next gen Prius will have solid state batteries.
I've always been favorable toward Toyota hybrids because they are mechanically simpler than non-hybrids. This Tundra Hybrid, on the other hand, adds complexity.
Yeah it's RWD. The Toyota power split hybrid is for FWD.
This hybrid system is the same design that Toyota has been using in their Hino trucks and buses since the 90's.
If the TRD Pro has the same tailpipe placement as the Hybrid model in the video, then the tailpipe will be "pancaked" the first time it goes anywhere (seriously) off road, at least in the Michigan woods.
Bigger inverter would be nice.
I was really hoping for a more powerful invertor, akin to the Ford Powerboost setup. Would have come in very handy on the jobsite.
I believe Toyota is keeping to their classic core ideals that have made them reliable, crawl before they walk and walk before they run :)
Most serious contractors already have a dedicated generator, and some sites you can't drive a truck in and not practical to run a 200ft extension cord. Also, would you rather use a 50k engine or a 2k portable generator for constant use on a job? and no contractor would rely on their truck to be the generator. The truck generator's nice for the niche camper, or the occasional plug in, pretty much a gimmick. Toyota said the cost of the inverter and pluming would be more than 2k, which is the price of a good generator, they didn't see the value in it.
I hope all truck should remove chrome rear bumper, it’s a safety concerns for rear drivers at night.
1:40 Holy Hoses batman! Talk about a complicated drivetrain.
It's simpler than the planetary gearset drivetrains used by the Prius and many other hybrids. All it does is insert a pancake motor/generator and clutch pack where the torque converter would otherwise be and attach the motor to a modest battery. This is similar to the hybrids offered by Hyundai/Kia and others. Pretty simple, really.
I feel like Toyota should've kept the V8 option. Lots of Tundra owners wanted the simplicity and reliability of the V8 with no turbos or excessive electronics.
I think like the F-150, in that case we would see many more go for the 3.5 V6. Given the economies of scale, makes sense for Ford to offer a wide range, not so much for Toyota.
@@ALMX5DP I would agree to that except for the fact that the average Tundra owner keeps their trucks a loong time. Tundra is beautiful but this whole TTv6 might not be what a large number of customers want. Sales #s will do the talking.
@@migueralliart true, but only time will tell if this powertrain holds up. Being a Toyota, I think expectations are high, but for good reason so hopefully they keep their stellar reputation.
The car industry abandoned simplicity years ago. Now you have a myriad of complex failure points designed mainly for dealer profits down the line. Thats the future.
@@aussie2uGA that's exactly what they want. They want the customer to HAVE to take it to the dealership due to complexities and special diagnostics.
I highly doubt anyone will ever really use all that inverter power of the F 150. I can firmly say it would never get used on my job sites. The only thing those bed mounted outlets will get used for is my dump trailers electric hydraulic dump motor on the trailer which will mean no more battery mounted on the trailer tongue but the problem is that a 1/2 ton truck would get broken in half in the first 2 miles LOL.
Aren't you forgetting that your dump trailer's pump motor needs 12v DC? which these hybrid trucks do not supply any more 12v amps than any other normal half-ton as far as i can tell. It doesn't look like they even have any high current 12v power wired to the back of the truck.
The fact they decided to put a 32-gallon fuel tank means they know fuel economy is not going to be great, but at least you'll have decent range, not like GM. The saddest part of their equipment is that they are going to put their nasty vinyl SofTex on the SR5 with options, Limited and TRD PRO. that's the huge turn off for me. Waiting for pricing for platinum or 1794 at this point...
Per head engineer they are aiming for 4hrs of towing range.
They have cheapened this Toyota Tundra right out of the gate. Plastic grill plastic bumper plastic side doors plastic dash and even vinyl plastic seats. Not to mention Alex is only 5'10 so anybody sitting in the backseat that's 6 ft tall will hit their head on the roof.
But at least Toyota put the grab handles back in the truck where you don't have to grab the steering wheel.
I have a 2016 Tundra that I won’t change for a new 2022. No grab handles,I don’t really care. I’ve had dependability and reliability for years now. I’m not sure the New Tundra will meet my needs. Will take the wait and see method for a few years.🤔
I assumed the hybrid would be much faster than 7.4 secs to 60 - perhaps in high 6 sec. Another TH-camr managed 22.5 mpg in a non-hybrid Tundra. “It had lots of power.” You said the Tundra’s hybrid system is different than the Lexus version. - but you didn’t describe in detail how. Toyota’s nickel hydride battery is also different than Ford’s. Could you describe the pros and cons of each? I also assumed MPG hwy would be at least 26 mpg in hybrid form. Its mpg is similar to non-hybrid which then brings the question: Why not offer a V6 diesel (w/600 ft lbs) and be done with complexity and cost? Diesel is lighter and cheaper. * I think they should offer a bigger inverter. Good video! 👍
He went over the difference between the Lexus hybrids at 3:44.
It's a truck designed to TOW, not for fuel economy. "Truck king" towed a 7,000 lbs trailer and did a 0-60 for the old v8 SR5 in 17 seconds. With the new Tundra, the SR5 (non hybrid) he towed it in 13.8 seconds. I bet this hybrid can shave off at least another second.
NiMH batteries are cheaper, more readily available, much more recyclable, more eco friendly, does not heat up as much, much better temperature range, and not as susceptible to blowing up. Downside is less capacity, heavier, doesn't charge as fast, has potential memory issues, and less ability to perform long charge cycles. Ford's lithium batteries are mounted outside, under the cab, exposed to the element and outside temperatures, it is water cooled, exhaust heated, AND refrigerant cooled, with high Voltage wires running to the back into the high power inverter. Tundra's just sits in the cabin, cooled with a fan and utilizes climate controlled cabin temperatures.
Diesels requires emissions systems, which are notoriously unreliable, even for Toyota, it's just the nature of it, and has a level of complexity as well. Also it will cost too much to have their diesel engines certified for emissions for the small diesel market in US/Canada. Ford discontinued their already emissions approved 3.0 diesels in their F150, Toyota's not eager to jump on that sinking ship if even Ford has abandoned it. Electric motors have immediate full torque at any given speed no waiting for turbos, and zero emissions.
Toyota said a powerful inverter would cost more than $2k, which is the price of a good generator, they don't see the value in it, and don't want to add another complexity and potential part to fail. Most people can get away with 400W, and serious contractors already have high end generators all set up, and some sites can't be accessed by truck and impractical to connect a 200ft power cable, which would require a portable generator. And would you rather run a 40k engine to power something or a 2k generator?
Does the motor go between the engine and the torque converter
Or the torque converter goes between engine and motor ?
Or is there no torque converter?
excellent review. Thanks a lot.
I can't believe we finally have a twin turbo engine in a Toyota.
Many early repairs are to follow with Twin Turbos🤔. Ask all the happy ford owners😬
I'm always so disappointed by the payload numbers of these "full size trucks". The Cybertruck will do 3500lbs payload, ok, I'm sold.
Made in plugin hybrid and 6 seaters and 7. 2kw power station and ventilated seat for hot climate
what are you using 7.2kw for?
Great review as always.
Another informative and fantastic video! Beautiful truck!
The side view of the new Turdra looks very much like the New Chevy trucks.
Whatever, that is a very good looking truck. In my subjective opinion.
Unfortunately another missed opportunity that needs a much bigger battery like a 20-40kw battery to get at least 75-100+km with ICE backup. When the battery is exhausted!!!.
It will take a service tech three hours to remove the stuff on top of the engine before the spark plugs can be replaced.
Most plugs from the factory are either platinum or iridium plugs so you're looking at once every 100k miles. Are you changing copper plugs every oil change?
Toyota and ford for that matter need to make a 30+ MPG pickup using and Atkinson engine. Not everybody wants to take their truck to the drag strip or cares about topping the grapevine at 75MPH !! If you poll people I think you will find that fuel economy is more important to them than Mustang GT style performance. Toyota has achieved 41% thermal efficiency with their D-4S engine in the cars and it's time to do so in the pickups !
We can put an LPG sistem in it and obtain 40% better economy compare to the regular hybrid truck!!!. I'm thinking in central and southamerican buyers.
On the Toyota Tundra Hybrid:
- No recovery points in the front.
- No underseat storage due to battery.
- Only one 12V outlet on the dash.
- 120V AC outlets limited to 100W while driving (underpowered)/400W while parked. (Good luck trying to charge your phones and a laptop at the same time)
- Built-in USB ports not Quick Charge/USB-C PD enabled.
- No self driving functions compared to Ford/GMC.
On the Ford F-150 Hybrid:
- Recovery points!
- Underseat storage!
- A few 12V outlets in the cab.
- 120V AC outlets at 2.4kW (standard), 7.2kW (option available).
- Same USB ports with no Quick Charge/USB-C PD (but you can use your own chargers on the AC outlets/12V outlet).
- BlueCruise will drive for you hands free on pre-mapped highways.
These points skewed our family towards wanting a Ford F-150. Toyota needs to step up their game. We were looking at the GMC too, but apparently they put in the horrible 120V AC outlets in their pickups like Toyota, and offered no 12V outlet. Have to give GMC credit on their SuperCruise system which is way better than Ford BlueCruise though.
Honestly mpg estimates for regular around town driving are not at all what I’m interested in. The extra torque that the electric motor is putting out is obviously aimed at mpg when towing. Don’t give a flip about regular mpg what’s its mpg while towing 10k lbs?
Thanks for the preview Alex! Not sure how to feel about this one. Guess I fall into the group that is more interested in a fully electric option.
You want to go hybrid unless you don't tow and travel very far.
I would have expect hybrid gives you better mpg but not much. Regular 2022 model does not gives you battery gas mpg either. I have 2021 model which I will be keeping rather then getting new.
How much heat does the battery under the second row seat dissipate into the cab? Is it going to be like a radiator in the cab?
Being the battery compartment is directly vented into the interior, you will be able to smell them when getting hot
Just don't understand why they don't make truck bed floors the battery location. They are doing it with full electrics.
It would have required a major redesign of the truck. This is a very simple change that doesn't cost much and gives a useful boost in efficiency and performance.
@@markmiller3279ask Tesla about redesigns. They just do it. They have the system they just don't have the battery. The tundra hybrid is a waste of time.