Someguy So you’re basically saying that it will be just as bouncy as a normal One I really can’t believe that they are taking out the paces finally after all the years of service around the north
@@VoyagerLover221-zi9uz I took ONE tram to North Manchester, and ended up having to physically throw a passenger off the tram, after he was verbally abusing the old dears on Sunday.... and had also threatened the conductor. Sad. South Manchester's amazing, by the way. Amazing, and rainy ☔️
James, that should have been "all of us North WESTERN and YORKSHIRE commuters". The Pacer replacements in the North East are very tatty 156s and 158s cascaded from the North West and Scotland. Northern have claimed they will be refurbished and as good as new; but it is pretty easy to tell the difference between a tarted-up thirty-year old DMU and a brand new train.
I do hope a couple will be preserved ! A 'short-term solution' design that was to last for a maximum of 20 years but is still running 40+ years later deserves to be imho. Besides that they will provide a low cost people carrier for the museum lines, the humongous crowds that come to confim their dislike of it's riding qualities alone will generate a tidy sum.
northern will get the new trains get rid of all the pacers they some will go to network rail or to scrap or to the London underground special pacer service or go back to buses old gwr hsts are coming to northern
For whatever reason, government projects have a habit of making things last more than double their expected lifespan. Houses built immediately after WW2 weren't meant to least more than 30 years if I recall, yet my brother moved into one last year.
Some points regard some features of the 195 / 331: - Reservations - the reservation system is the new Red/Orange/Green system which will be introduced on the only long-distance 195 / 331 services in due course - Class 195s currently work Barrow / Windermere > Preston > Manchester > Airport (Daily) PLUS Manchester to Liverpool via Warrington Central (Monday to Saturday only). Testing in West Yorkshire has only just started but no passenger services due until the autumn. - Class 331s currently only work Leeds > Wakefield W > Doncaster - further routes will benefit from the until the autumn/winter - but it must be noted here and now that not all routes will see them and will remain operated by either 15x / 170 units - doors are controlled by Conductor at all times from within the passenger area, but the units are passively fitted for DDO/DCO and included bodyside cameras - the onboard information system locations - rather than centre overhead slung allow more accurate information when it comes to saying which side of the train doors will be opened and also provided a marketing tool, removing the need of paper posters - the seating - which was publicly previewed at a number of station drop-in sessions - is also been fitted to the class 158 units and is not the so-called 'ironing board' as fitted with other recent stock - Both 195s and 331s share common parts and bodyshell and in fact, bar a couple of buttons in the cab and a pantograph vs an engine - are the same - but can not couple together - The design is an evolution of the 332/333 EMUs which CAF built with Siemens, so also share similarities against the Desiro platforms - Pacer Replacer point - class 142 will be retired from Northern, however, the 144s will remain into 2020, but focused around West/South Yorkshire owning to been based in those parts since day dot. PRMTSI Regulation exception will be applied as a result.
The west (ish) of the UK at that. :) The east and south east of England are surprisingly dry, with lower rainfall than San Francisco, Rome, and an awful load of other places that don't have the "British weather" reputation.
You needed a Barrow-Manchester Airport train, which are almost all 195s now and more regular than the Windermere trains. Also they aren't actually replacing the Pacers directly... they're replacing Transpennine 185s and Northern Sprinters. The pacers are being replaced by those Sprinters released by the 195s. No routes with Pacers will see them directly replaced by 195s, as far as I know
Was also disappointed to no 195 but also suitably surprised to see Geoff walking down the platform at Warrington as I was on the 14:44, yes Manchester was particularly grim on Sunday
Isn't it a bit misleading to call it a pacer replacer when they will mostly be running services that used to be Sprinters (thus allowing sprinters to take pacer services), but very few if any pacer services are actually being replaced by 195s? Oh well, still a catchy name and progress!
True, I gather a lot of these 195's will replace 158's which are pretty good anyway, the actual Pacer replacements will be 156's. This could actually backfire as there is a route I take often that uses a three-car 144 which is always packed at peak times, a two-car 156 will leave people stuck on the platform; I've seen this service replaced with a 156 and a 144 coupled together (presumably because the usual stock was in for maintenance) but I can't see Northern wanting to lose another 156 to accommodate this given that it really just is two rush hour services in the morning and evening that need the extra capacity. If it's going to be a two-car replacement I'd rather just keep the 144 but I imagine Northern are keen to rid them from their stock.
@@owenc6961 Certainly 158's, not sure when they were last refurbed, maybe 15 years ago the ones I use often, and (disregarding the toilets) they have actually aged very well and are a fairly pleasant to ride. There's a service from Liverpool to Norwich which I use between Manchester and Sheffield, I've no idea how long the full route takes but if for some reason I needed to go the whole route it wouldn't bother me in the slightest, feels just as smooth and comfortable as a more conventional inter-city train.
Having recently moved to Yorkshire, and experiencing the Pacers first hand, I can't wait for them to go. They are awful "trains", which are being used for metropolitan commuter lines that it wasn't designed for. The only other country that used these was Iran, and even they stopped running them. They were important trains when they came out, keeping many lines open, but they are Absolutely not fit for purpose anymore. Consign them to museums and heritage lines - they're must better serviced on those than on busy commuter lines.
It's factually incorrect to say the Class 195's are replacing Pacers. They aren't! The reality is that the cascading of Class 156's will bump down the class 150's to local services, and those will replace the Pacers... However, the 150's are the same age as the Pacers! This is similar to Northern Rail's "New Electric Service" between Manchester and Liverpool a few years back, actually being 'old' class 319's from the late 80's being replaced by new trains, and the old trains going to the northwest after a refurbishment.
I also thought the title misleading when I saw the 195 unit on the airport route as they never used pacers on this service. I can never imagine the Blackpool South to Colne line having anything other than cattle-trucks. Still, we can live in hope!
@Zexciv Does Stuff Cascading has happened for decades... nothing new here. I love the Pacers too... they aren't brilliant, but they do have a certain charisma to them. I live on the Manchester to Hadfield line, and I don't know what's happening with the Longsight allocated class 323's. They were to be sent to Birmingham to join the rest of the 323 fleet, and relaced with new 331's... however I've spoken to a couple of traincrews who said that won't happen now. I'd miss the 323's... I love the noise they make when accelerating and decelerating. I was concerned that the 331's wouldn't have the same luggage/wheelchair/bicycle storage capability (which the Hadfield 323's use all the time because of people who live on the outskirts of Glossop riding to the station, taking the bike on the train, and then riding to work)... but pleasingly the 331's have good space for bikes.
I got one of these last Sunday (21st July) and went to Windermere and I hoped for the best. I got a 158 to Windermere, waited less than an hour and a 195 turned up. It was very nice! Sorry you had to wait so long. This is classic #NorthernFail
Hey Geoff - just came across this today Nov6. Very amusing, but also enlightning for this Swede to understand what Pacers are like and to see the new 195. Thanks!
LJ TAYLOR Weird seeing Warrington Central in this video. I rode one of these new trains from WAC to Liverpool Lime Street, last Thursday. With all the melting rail line horrors, in the heatwave, I had the misfortune of catching a Pacer on the way back.
Just! Watched your Vlog. Interesting, travell into manchester 5 days a week from the Airport. It's nice to see what they look like as never seen one yet.LOL.
Great video! Nice to see the new trains! The Windermere - Manchester Airport service is only twice a day if I recall correctly. It's never been a pacer. The pacers were (still are for now?) the normal rolling stock on the Cumbrian Coast Line. A very beautiful line, but in a two car pacer rather wretched experience, especially considering the lack of services and how damn long it takes. You could see from the 'Barrow-in-Furness' train that it was a pacer replacement.
Update: refurbished interiors are now starting to become more common. Better seats, as well as two USB charger sockets at every pair of seats. The next stage will introduce air conditioning and free Wi-fi. So, improved customer experience, but at the end of the day, they're still just tarted up Sprinters.
I saw one of these on my way to work this morning. Crazy! M42 J2 heading to M5 up to Manchester. Never seen a train being carried on the motorway before.
I saw your Insta at Market Street Metrolink that day! I wish I could have come said hi but I was at work :( . But I really like these new trains. I’ve been on that Airport to Barrow train recently. Slightly sad to see the Pacers go, but at the same time I’m glad they’re being replaced with these very nice trains
Just had a ride on a 195 that crashed through the station point work then went rolling out the road with a very uncomfortable shuddering motion whilst giving violent sideways throws. If I was still at work on the railway, I would refuse to work these on H&S grounds, your spine would be reduced to dust in short time. I never had any pacer ride this bad. It was failed when it was discovered that it would only move in one direction on switching ends. And what is it with the announcements! The following 158 from the last century rode as well as I ever remember them. Such is progress
Hi Geoff! Very watchable as always! I found that a lot of table seats in both the 195 and 331 didn't align nicely with the windows. I have filmed rides on both and have uploaded them.
WOW Now back during my design Degree I fell out with one of the Tutors over the BUS PROJECT!!!!! Now who was right! Yes I am also a Friend of Chris Eden-Green! I did drawings and a model using left over APT parts and came up with something similar!!!!! We have waited so long for these!!! David and Lily Reading.
About a week later I was chasing Pacers (142s) in the Manchester area. Recorded two rides, one on a New Mills Central from Man. Piccadilly and the other from Chester to Altrincham. Wasn't interested much in the 195s, though I did see a few.
used to take a pacer daily kirkgate to leeds, there was a non-stopping sprinter that left one minute before the pacer every day but i always got the pacer instead
We get 142s on our Southport to Manchester services and on to Leeds or Blackburn. The Southport to Leeds service takes 2hrs 40minutes on a Pacer. 150/1s, 150/2s and 156s also run on this route, it's a lottery as to what you'll get. At least they have toilets, unlike the 455s and 707s from where I used to live. Our 142s are being replaced by more 150/1s, we already have ex GWR and LNWR (London Midland unit displaced by Vivarail class 230 D trains) units. They do plan in the near future to have bi-mode class 769s on the route to replace the Pacers.
Does anyone know where the last non re-fitted Pacers are hanging out? The bus style seat 142s in other words? Posh Pacers aren't that different from other modern trains internally, and I'd like a final ride in the full-fat Thatcher austerity version listening to 80s music on a cassette Walkman before they all disappear.
It appears I was in Manchester Piccadilly literally the day after you recorded this. I was on the train to Barrow-in-Furness that got cancelled and whose replacement was absolutely packed. Because Northern.
As a Middlesbrough resident we still don't get the latest from Northern. All the promises, maybe the 195's will get to us one day hopefully not after they are replaced and they too "cascade" our way..... Another fine video Geoff, thanks for being so determined/patient.
Can you visit Greater Anglia, specifically Norwich? The first Class 755 Stadler is now in service between there & Lowestoft & Great Yarmouth! Sadly they're replacing the Class 37 Short set first :(
What services do 195s run for which you can reserve a seat? Surprisingly high spec for what seem like short-distance and commuter trains: tables, toilets, power sockets. Strange place for the info screens, they are usually shallow and wide ceiling-mounted displays.
At the moment, Northern don't have seat reservations on any of their services, but (a) maybe they are planning to when they introduce the _Northern Connect_ brand later this year?, and (2) nothing wrong with future-proofing the trains at the start! Given that Northern Connect routes can be up to 2½ hours long, and are often the quickest service between their endpoints, I am really pleased to see that they are high spec. Remember, despite what Geoff implies throughout the video, they *aren't* replacing Pacers on local and commuter services, they are mostly replacing class 158s and class 319s on medium-distance regional services.
I remember being hungover on a Sunday morning about 10-15 years ago, and following my mates onto one of these Pacers on the Lime Street to Manchester Piccadilly route. As I slowly regained real consciousness - I remember joking and slagging off the 'bus train' that I found myself on - trundling from stop to stop and taking 'ages' to get to Manchester. No knowledge about the origins of these Pacers, but I was joking with the other people in the carriage that they must have just tied a bus to the train and had it bouncing down the tracks! Only just found out in 2019 that I was basically right! :D
Nice but why do the different fleets of new trains have so much lower bodyside curvature? It loses at least 30 cm width at floor level, where the width is really needed to accommodate the skirting ducts. It can't be due to loading gauge restrictions because the footsteps stick out.
Please can you go to Rollerston station which is on the line Nottingham to Lincoln route sometimes I think. It’s close to me! Cheers also love watching your videos
Just over a week after I got massively delayed thanks to the works at Warrington BQ!! Left MK 9.30am,got to Crewe,then on to Glasgow Central via Manchester Pic (diverted),terminated at Preston 3pm (ish) due to overhead wire damage, eventuallyv left there 5.45pm (drivers displaced all over the place - thanks Virgin!) - ended up in Glasgow 8.20pm,missing my last train up to the West Highlands,eventually arrived home 12.15am the following morning (Tuesday 23rd July) after a taxi home,which dropped me off at the wrong end of my village! Point of all that? Don't travel with me Geoff!
I will miss the pacers, have spent most of my life using them especially when I lived around Brockholes on the Penistone Line. I don't find them as bad as most people, get me from A to B, its all i really want out of a train!
@@jonjohnson2844 I lived on the Penistone Line for nearly 10 years about 4-5 years ago, so we got plenty 142s too. I still use them alot as I now live in Wakefield, Wakefield Kirkgate gets lots of 142s, Westgate gets a few too. I honestly don't mind any of the in service Pacers.
@@BritishAdam Fair enough, don't think many people will miss either the 142's or 144's though to be honest, had a few bone shacking journeys from Manchester to Sheffield on them and for the price we pay they certainly shouldn't have lasted as long as they did. Think the 156's will still be running in 10 years time, I don't find them terrible but, again, from a price point of view they aren't really suitable for some of the long distances they run - not sure what the fundamental difference is when you go to a 158 but they seem orders of magnitude better than any other stock from the 150 family.
@@jonjohnson2844 158/159s are a lot nicer inside, and generally have aircon that is a lot better than the rest of the Sprinter fleet, although they don't tend to have openable windows which is a bummer.
Jon Johnson for years i used to ride the class 141’s in West Yorkshire on the harrogate line. The pinnacle of a basic train but they sounded awesome with the Leyland TL11 engines and self changing gears.
Ta for coming Up North. To be fair it were grim most of the country like. (In an RP accent) I know as I was at St Pancras. Our (Hope Valley Manchester-Sheffield) line did get the very last 101 service a few years back - last mainline slam door trains. Now there's nostalgia.
Hi Geoff as You said later: Class 195 is not direct replacement for pacers Roadmap looks like: 195 will replace 158 158 will replace "sprinters" 150-156 and whatever left spare - will replace pacers BUT #northernfail again - pacers will be not withdrawn for another year beacuse delays with new trains delivery
@@andrewholland1390 Sometimes they (150/1) are in Leeds-Nottingham service instead 158's. Personally i don't like either.. And big dissapointment, at railway station because same ticket price is for EMT refurbished 158's with more seats, more legroom and aircon...
I cannot believe I was at Manchester Airport at the same time as you. I was dropping my Dutch friend off by car but had I not had my license, I would have seen you. xD
This is normal up here mate.. Nothing goes to plan. 🤣 I do like the new 195/331's btw.. Gonna miss the pacer in a weird way.. Its a positive step forward. (years late, but STILL forward) .. 👍🏼
What is the entrance height above rail top for British trains - I notice the Class 195 doorways are well above platform height. In Sydney Australia we adopted 1200 mm decades ago to position the entrance midway between the floors of the upper and lower cabins and maximise the seating available in a carriage - we have many carriages with 118 seats each. I assume the floor level chosen in Brittan is purely to have a continuous level floor over the bogies.
A pacer replacement train... a Replacer?
Well done.
Pacer Replacer.
whitty replays. I like.
Class 142 pacer
Class 195 repacer
Someguy So you’re basically saying that it will be just as bouncy as a normal One I really can’t believe that they are taking out the paces finally after all the years of service around the north
"I've spent 6 hours at Manchester and it rained the entire time"
Welcome to Manchester mate.
Honestly, I'd much prefer the rain over the summer heat.
Shimmer Zara r/nobodyasked
@@VoyagerLover221-zi9uz
I took ONE tram to North Manchester, and ended up having to physically throw a passenger off the tram, after he was verbally abusing the old dears on Sunday.... and had also threatened the conductor.
Sad.
South Manchester's amazing, by the way. Amazing, and rainy ☔️
Just saying it rains in the south too
@@TechRyze It doesn't rain a lot in Manchester compared to elsewhere - just more frequently than elsewhere...
"After 6 hours of waiting" much like every commuter in the north then
200th like
“After 6 hours of waiting, my northern train finally arrived to take me to work”
Attempting to fly would be easier than getting Northern services to arrive on time.
Very true especially in the North West
4:00 This is kind of how all of us Northern commuters feel about them - “they’re coming, they’ll be here, just have to wait”
Same with all new trains really, from Crossrail and the Goblin to the Caledonian Sleeper and the new TransPennine trains.
James, that should have been "all of us North WESTERN and YORKSHIRE commuters". The Pacer replacements in the North East are very tatty 156s and 158s cascaded from the North West and Scotland. Northern have claimed they will be refurbished and as good as new; but it is pretty easy to tell the difference between a tarted-up thirty-year old DMU and a brand new train.
@@simontay4851 they are replacing some pacers with them, i saw a rusty london midland 150 on the local northern route
@@dwgray9000 I know. Have you seen the 158 missing a table that han't been cleaned since its last commuter run in Leeds?
So sprinter is being replace by this train and pacer will be replace by sprinter?
6 hours to see a train you've already seen... Definitely deserves a like 🤣🤣
I do hope a couple will be preserved !
A 'short-term solution' design that was to last for a maximum of 20 years but is still running 40+ years later deserves to be imho.
Besides that they will provide a low cost people carrier for the museum lines, the humongous crowds that come to confim their dislike of it's riding qualities alone will generate a tidy sum.
the NRM are taking 142001
The oldest Pacers in service are from 1985, so 34 years. Not 40+.
northern will get the new trains get rid of all the pacers they some will go to network rail or to scrap or to the London underground special pacer service or go back to buses old gwr hsts are coming to northern
For whatever reason, government projects have a habit of making things last more than double their expected lifespan. Houses built immediately after WW2 weren't meant to least more than 30 years if I recall, yet my brother moved into one last year.
Well they are now hope ur happy
I had no idea what a Pacer train was until you made this video. Wow.
This American who visited London this summer LOVES your channel and videos!
Some points regard some features of the 195 / 331:
- Reservations - the reservation system is the new Red/Orange/Green system which will be introduced on the only long-distance 195 / 331 services in due course
- Class 195s currently work Barrow / Windermere > Preston > Manchester > Airport (Daily) PLUS Manchester to Liverpool via Warrington Central (Monday to Saturday only). Testing in West Yorkshire has only just started but no passenger services due until the autumn.
- Class 331s currently only work Leeds > Wakefield W > Doncaster
- further routes will benefit from the until the autumn/winter - but it must be noted here and now that not all routes will see them and will remain operated by either 15x / 170 units
- doors are controlled by Conductor at all times from within the passenger area, but the units are passively fitted for DDO/DCO and included bodyside cameras
- the onboard information system locations - rather than centre overhead slung allow more accurate information when it comes to saying which side of the train doors will be opened and also provided a marketing tool, removing the need of paper posters
- the seating - which was publicly previewed at a number of station drop-in sessions - is also been fitted to the class 158 units and is not the so-called 'ironing board' as fitted with other recent stock
- Both 195s and 331s share common parts and bodyshell and in fact, bar a couple of buttons in the cab and a pantograph vs an engine - are the same - but can not couple together
- The design is an evolution of the 332/333 EMUs which CAF built with Siemens, so also share similarities against the Desiro platforms
- Pacer Replacer point - class 142 will be retired from Northern, however, the 144s will remain into 2020, but focused around West/South Yorkshire owning to been based in those parts since day dot. PRMTSI Regulation exception will be applied as a result.
seat reservations still havent been introduced
Why do I keep watching Geoff's videos, I mean I've never been to the UK.
Come and visit then: the landscape is green, the transport is good, and the weather's nice (rarely very hot or cold). :D
Ricardo Wiggett ‘the weather’s nice’ you mean, it rains nearly everyday in spring, summer and winter?
@@atomic_typh00n66 Only toward the north and west. It's drier toward the southeast and east.
@@atomic_typh00n66
Better lots of rain than no rain
Raining in the UK, by golly what an inconceivable turn of events.
The west (ish) of the UK at that. :)
The east and south east of England are surprisingly dry, with lower rainfall than San Francisco, Rome, and an awful load of other places that don't have the "British weather" reputation.
You needed a Barrow-Manchester Airport train, which are almost all 195s now and more regular than the Windermere trains. Also they aren't actually replacing the Pacers directly... they're replacing Transpennine 185s and Northern Sprinters. The pacers are being replaced by those Sprinters released by the 195s. No routes with Pacers will see them directly replaced by 195s, as far as I know
Warrington had Pacers.
@@طزفيكمياقوكل and
@@طزفيكمياقوكل warrington is the best
Was also disappointed to no 195 but also suitably surprised to see Geoff walking down the platform at Warrington as I was on the 14:44, yes Manchester was particularly grim on Sunday
Your picture would be me if I ever saw him irl
Bank Quay or Central?
@@dickmartino9933 bank quay more trains
Thx Geoff for showing your videos because a lot of us can't get around anymore.
Looking forward to your upcoming series, Median Used Stations.
@Staulk The Fiery TH-camr Nothing less than Second, Third And Fourth Quintile Used Stations, frankly.
Always nice to see you in town Geoff.
Get some food in you if you're ever stuck on Oxford Road. Plenty to do round there.
Entertaining video. Quite interesting for those who have no opportunity to visit that part of the country. Thanks.
Thanks Geoff for your dedication
We appreciate your dedication in keeping us informed (and entertained). Thanks Geoff.
Isn't it a bit misleading to call it a pacer replacer when they will mostly be running services that used to be Sprinters (thus allowing sprinters to take pacer services), but very few if any pacer services are actually being replaced by 195s? Oh well, still a catchy name and progress!
"Few if any" none, as far as I know
@@audigex I'm pretty sure the Barrow-in-Furness service was a pacer.
Sprinters are at least a lot better than pacers.
True, I gather a lot of these 195's will replace 158's which are pretty good anyway, the actual Pacer replacements will be 156's. This could actually backfire as there is a route I take often that uses a three-car 144 which is always packed at peak times, a two-car 156 will leave people stuck on the platform; I've seen this service replaced with a 156 and a 144 coupled together (presumably because the usual stock was in for maintenance) but I can't see Northern wanting to lose another 156 to accommodate this given that it really just is two rush hour services in the morning and evening that need the extra capacity. If it's going to be a two-car replacement I'd rather just keep the 144 but I imagine Northern are keen to rid them from their stock.
@@owenc6961 Certainly 158's, not sure when they were last refurbed, maybe 15 years ago the ones I use often, and (disregarding the toilets) they have actually aged very well and are a fairly pleasant to ride. There's a service from Liverpool to Norwich which I use between Manchester and Sheffield, I've no idea how long the full route takes but if for some reason I needed to go the whole route it wouldn't bother me in the slightest, feels just as smooth and comfortable as a more conventional inter-city train.
Having recently moved to Yorkshire, and experiencing the Pacers first hand, I can't wait for them to go.
They are awful "trains", which are being used for metropolitan commuter lines that it wasn't designed for.
The only other country that used these was Iran, and even they stopped running them.
They were important trains when they came out, keeping many lines open, but they are Absolutely not fit for purpose anymore.
Consign them to museums and heritage lines - they're must better serviced on those than on busy commuter lines.
They were that bad in the mid eighties pal
They’re legendary trains
I live in Barrow and these replacements have really hit the headlines. I've been waiting for a video from you. Thanks for the quality review.
Can't wait to see them for the next 40 years!
Kevin Zhang I would say, “Can’t wait to see them IN the next 40 years”.
Patience and Perseverance! Hats off to you, sir.
The Pacer Replacers - That would be a great name for a band!
The RePacers? The RePacers.
I didn’t know I needed this channel until now.
Alex Churcher Welcome! 😃
Geoff this is true dedication that you have shown .
It's factually incorrect to say the Class 195's are replacing Pacers. They aren't!
The reality is that the cascading of Class 156's will bump down the class 150's to local services, and those will replace the Pacers...
However, the 150's are the same age as the Pacers!
This is similar to Northern Rail's "New Electric Service" between Manchester and Liverpool a few years back, actually being 'old' class 319's from the late 80's being replaced by new trains, and the old trains going to the northwest after a refurbishment.
UK Diesel and Electric Railway Modelling Also, we have Pacers in Newcastle. The new trains aren’t coming to Newcastle
I also thought the title misleading when I saw the 195 unit on the airport route as they never used pacers on this service.
I can never imagine the Blackpool South to Colne line having anything other than cattle-trucks. Still, we can live in hope!
@Zexciv Does Stuff Cascading has happened for decades... nothing new here.
I love the Pacers too... they aren't brilliant, but they do have a certain charisma to them.
I live on the Manchester to Hadfield line, and I don't know what's happening with the Longsight allocated class 323's. They were to be sent to Birmingham to join the rest of the 323 fleet, and relaced with new 331's... however I've spoken to a couple of traincrews who said that won't happen now.
I'd miss the 323's... I love the noise they make when accelerating and decelerating.
I was concerned that the 331's wouldn't have the same luggage/wheelchair/bicycle storage capability (which the Hadfield 323's use all the time because of people who live on the outskirts of Glossop riding to the station, taking the bike on the train, and then riding to work)... but pleasingly the 331's have good space for bikes.
@@stephenmatura1086 You'll get 150's... or if you're lucky, 156's.
Yep, my line is getting 150s instead of Pacers. Better than nothing.
Welcome to Northern Rail. Always finding new ways to dissappoint.
Good looking trains, can’t wait for them to come to NSW (they’re replacing our XPTs, the Aussie varient of the HST)
Great show. Chasing trains.
I used to commute on a pacer. This is the best news ever and I'm not served by Northern anymore!
Caught this train from Sheffield a few weeks back and it is awesome, So modern and smooth!
They're not running from Sheffield yet
@@norbitonflyer5625 I did catch one from Sheffield, it was on the Bridlington route I think.
We can only stan a mans effort to find this train. Well done lad!
I got one of these last Sunday (21st July) and went to Windermere and I hoped for the best. I got a 158 to Windermere, waited less than an hour and a 195 turned up. It was very nice! Sorry you had to wait so long. This is classic #NorthernFail
Wow, the revolution is here, Geoff Marshall told me. 6 hours, that's dedication. Thanks Geoff.
Your dedication to your craft is remarkable.
Hey Geoff - just came across this today Nov6. Very amusing, but also enlightning for this Swede to understand what Pacers are like and to see the new 195.
Thanks!
I'm always honoured when i see you're in warrington. the trains here are a nightmare at the moment.
LJ TAYLOR Weird seeing Warrington Central in this video. I rode one of these new trains from WAC to Liverpool Lime Street, last Thursday. With all the melting rail line horrors, in the heatwave, I had the misfortune of catching a Pacer on the way back.
Bravo Geoff, great endurance up north in the rain.
Just! Watched your Vlog. Interesting, travell into manchester 5 days a week from the Airport. It's nice to see what they look like as never seen one yet.LOL.
That video was dedication to the cause !
You been waiting for a class 195 for six hours? How about getting a Delay Repay Geoff?
Great video! Nice to see the new trains!
The Windermere - Manchester Airport service is only twice a day if I recall correctly. It's never been a pacer.
The pacers were (still are for now?) the normal rolling stock on the Cumbrian Coast Line. A very beautiful line, but in a two car pacer rather wretched experience, especially considering the lack of services and how damn long it takes. You could see from the 'Barrow-in-Furness' train that it was a pacer replacement.
Pacers are still occasionally used, but for now, it's mostly unrefurbished 156s.
Update: refurbished interiors are now starting to become more common. Better seats, as well as two USB charger sockets at every pair of seats. The next stage will introduce air conditioning and free Wi-fi.
So, improved customer experience, but at the end of the day, they're still just tarted up Sprinters.
I saw one of these on my way to work this morning. Crazy! M42 J2 heading to M5 up to Manchester. Never seen a train being carried on the motorway before.
Good that you mentioned the baby changing facility - we changed our baby on the luggage rack on the Heart of Wales line!
So there was an alternative baby on the rack for you - or did you have to wait!
@@kenjones3253 - same one - just cleaner! It caused some amusement from the train staff.
I’ve they don’t get the nickname Re-pacer or Replacer I’m gonna be disappointed 😂
So what the places are the stuff that run on buses now there trains no 331 the 195 taken over them
There are two 195’s sat in the sidings at Wigan Wallgate, they never moved all last week - I went past them 4 times during the course of the week!!
Great video, your dedication to TH-cam love the music as the pacer replacement pulled into Oxford
It somehow feels appropriate that it was a grey rainy day in Manchester when you did this. Hope they can get the 195 and 331 replacements out quickly.
I saw your Insta at Market Street Metrolink that day! I wish I could have come said hi but I was at work :( . But I really like these new trains. I’ve been on that Airport to Barrow train recently. Slightly sad to see the Pacers go, but at the same time I’m glad they’re being replaced with these very nice trains
"I'll just get out and hang at Warrington" - Be careful
I'm from Manchester and saw this the other day going past cornbrook. Also rain is a permenant thing here 🤣
Seen them a few times they look nice.
Just had a ride on a 195 that crashed through the station point work then went rolling out the road with a very uncomfortable shuddering motion whilst giving violent sideways throws. If I was still at work on the railway, I would refuse to work these on H&S grounds, your spine would be reduced to dust in short time. I never had any pacer ride this bad. It was failed when it was discovered that it would only move in one direction on switching ends. And what is it with the announcements! The following 158 from the last century rode as well as I ever remember them. Such is progress
Hey Geoff, I visited the Giant's Causeway in N. Ireland that day - and it rained all day there as well!
Hi Geoff! Very watchable as always! I found that a lot of table seats in both the 195 and 331 didn't align nicely with the windows. I have filmed rides on both and have uploaded them.
WOW Now back during my design Degree I fell out with one of the Tutors over the BUS PROJECT!!!!! Now who was right! Yes I am also a Friend of Chris Eden-Green!
I did drawings and a model using left over APT parts and came up with something similar!!!!! We have waited so long for these!!! David and Lily Reading.
The motor noise of the 331 are AMAZING
I'm from Warrington haha, The 195s are usually on the manny airport to Lime Street, and the 331s are currently between doncaster to leeds
About a week later I was chasing Pacers (142s) in the Manchester area. Recorded two rides, one on a New Mills Central from Man. Piccadilly and the other from Chester to Altrincham. Wasn't interested much in the 195s, though I did see a few.
used to take a pacer daily kirkgate to leeds, there was a non-stopping sprinter that left one minute before the pacer every day but i always got the pacer instead
that's dedication right there
Great video Geoff, fantastic to see the north getting 21st century trains
I never thought we would see the back of them
Nice. Good juggling, as well.
I hope these will also go to Blackpool South! (much better than North station with its unfriendly staff)
We get 142s on our Southport to Manchester services and on to Leeds or Blackburn. The Southport to Leeds service takes 2hrs 40minutes on a Pacer. 150/1s, 150/2s and 156s also run on this route, it's a lottery as to what you'll get. At least they have toilets, unlike the 455s and 707s from where I used to live. Our 142s are being replaced by more 150/1s, we already have ex GWR and LNWR (London Midland unit displaced by Vivarail class 230 D trains) units.
They do plan in the near future to have bi-mode class 769s on the route to replace the Pacers.
Does anyone know where the last non re-fitted Pacers are hanging out? The bus style seat 142s in other words? Posh Pacers aren't that different from other modern trains internally, and I'd like a final ride in the full-fat Thatcher austerity version listening to 80s music on a cassette Walkman before they all disappear.
I believe there are still a few poverty class pacers running on the Harrogate line from York/Leeds but they're few and far between now.
One 3 pin plug in between 2 seats I don't get it surly should be 2 plugs. Also with the new 331s only 1 toilet scandalous!!!
It appears I was in Manchester Piccadilly literally the day after you recorded this. I was on the train to Barrow-in-Furness that got cancelled and whose replacement was absolutely packed. Because Northern.
The 195 Has The Best Diesel Train Motor I've ever heard. The 1st time I am fond on a diesel train motor.
For all the good work you do, how can anyone give you the “thumbs down.” Keep up the good work, and best regards from Germany
As a Middlesbrough resident we still don't get the latest from Northern. All the promises, maybe the 195's will get to us one day hopefully not after they are replaced and they too "cascade" our way..... Another fine video Geoff, thanks for being so determined/patient.
Music woz very nice Geoff. Good video
Can you visit Greater Anglia, specifically Norwich? The first Class 755 Stadler is now in service between there & Lowestoft & Great Yarmouth! Sadly they're replacing the Class 37 Short set first :(
whenever i see the word norwich i always hear nor ridge
What services do 195s run for which you can reserve a seat? Surprisingly high spec for what seem like short-distance and commuter trains: tables, toilets, power sockets.
Strange place for the info screens, they are usually shallow and wide ceiling-mounted displays.
At the moment, Northern don't have seat reservations on any of their services, but (a) maybe they are planning to when they introduce the _Northern Connect_ brand later this year?, and (2) nothing wrong with future-proofing the trains at the start!
Given that Northern Connect routes can be up to 2½ hours long, and are often the quickest service between their endpoints, I am really pleased to see that they are high spec. Remember, despite what Geoff implies throughout the video, they *aren't* replacing Pacers on local and commuter services, they are mostly replacing class 158s and class 319s on medium-distance regional services.
5:49 the moment you’ve been waiting for
Argh! No more "Nodding Dogs"! :)
Nice one Geoff. All the best.
I remember being hungover on a Sunday morning about 10-15 years ago, and following my mates onto one of these Pacers on the Lime Street to Manchester Piccadilly route.
As I slowly regained real consciousness - I remember joking and slagging off the 'bus train' that I found myself on - trundling from stop to stop and taking 'ages' to get to Manchester.
No knowledge about the origins of these Pacers, but I was joking with the other people in the carriage that they must have just tied a bus to the train and had it bouncing down the tracks!
Only just found out in 2019 that I was basically right!
:D
Are Northern going to be introducing seat reservations?
Nice but why do the different fleets of new trains have so much lower bodyside curvature? It loses at least 30 cm width at floor level, where the width is really needed to accommodate the skirting ducts. It can't be due to loading gauge restrictions because the footsteps stick out.
They look nice, plug sockets are always good to see I wish SWR would put more on their Salisbury trains.
I think the SWR 158s and 159s will be refurbished next year and get plug sockets as well
How on earth did this video make it to trending!? Big congrats Geoff!! :D
Please can you go to Rollerston station which is on the line Nottingham to Lincoln route sometimes I think. It’s close to me! Cheers also love watching your videos
Just over a week after I got massively delayed thanks to the works at Warrington BQ!! Left MK 9.30am,got to Crewe,then on to Glasgow Central via Manchester Pic (diverted),terminated at Preston 3pm (ish) due to overhead wire damage, eventuallyv left there 5.45pm (drivers displaced all over the place - thanks Virgin!) - ended up in Glasgow 8.20pm,missing my last train up to the West Highlands,eventually arrived home 12.15am the following morning (Tuesday 23rd July) after a taxi home,which dropped me off at the wrong end of my village! Point of all that? Don't travel with me Geoff!
I will miss the pacers, have spent most of my life using them especially when I lived around Brockholes on the Penistone Line. I don't find them as bad as most people, get me from A to B, its all i really want out of a train!
They've been 144s and 150's for a long time though Adam, the true Pacer is the 142, literally like getting on an old bus with the low triple seats.
@@jonjohnson2844 I lived on the Penistone Line for nearly 10 years about 4-5 years ago, so we got plenty 142s too. I still use them alot as I now live in Wakefield, Wakefield Kirkgate gets lots of 142s, Westgate gets a few too. I honestly don't mind any of the in service Pacers.
@@BritishAdam Fair enough, don't think many people will miss either the 142's or 144's though to be honest, had a few bone shacking journeys from Manchester to Sheffield on them and for the price we pay they certainly shouldn't have lasted as long as they did. Think the 156's will still be running in 10 years time, I don't find them terrible but, again, from a price point of view they aren't really suitable for some of the long distances they run - not sure what the fundamental difference is when you go to a 158 but they seem orders of magnitude better than any other stock from the 150 family.
@@jonjohnson2844 158/159s are a lot nicer inside, and generally have aircon that is a lot better than the rest of the Sprinter fleet, although they don't tend to have openable windows which is a bummer.
Jon Johnson for years i used to ride the class 141’s in West Yorkshire on the harrogate line. The pinnacle of a basic train but they sounded awesome with the Leyland TL11 engines and self changing gears.
I’ve been on one they’re very comfortable, why did you get out at Warrington you should’ve got out at Deansgate and waited there. Nice video though.
Such dedication!
Ta for coming Up North. To be fair it were grim most of the country like.
(In an RP accent) I know as I was at St Pancras.
Our (Hope Valley Manchester-Sheffield) line did get the very last 101 service a few years back - last mainline slam door trains. Now there's nostalgia.
There are still a few slam door trains running even now - HSTs on EMR and LNER
Are you wearing two watches? Is there a different time zone in London? =D
Northern rail use a different time. Usually 15 - 45 minutes behind BST.
@@EinkOLED underrated comment
Hi Geoff as You said later:
Class 195 is not direct replacement for pacers
Roadmap looks like:
195 will replace 158
158 will replace "sprinters" 150-156
and whatever left spare - will replace pacers
BUT #northernfail again - pacers will be not withdrawn for another year beacuse delays with new trains delivery
YAY
And those 150s are horrific and almost as bad to ride on as pacers, outmoded and obsolete, smelly, noisy and (pre-refurb) very dirty and scruffy.
@@andrewholland1390 Sometimes they (150/1) are in Leeds-Nottingham service instead 158's.
Personally i don't like either..
And big dissapointment, at railway station because same ticket price is for EMT refurbished 158's with more seats, more legroom and aircon...
You should have nicked into Manchester Comic-con. You could have seen me in my Deathtrooper outfit.
Omg!! I love trains! 😍👏👏👏👏👏👏👏❤
Thank goodness you found one. I think it's a dramatic improvement on the pacer.
I cannot believe I was at Manchester Airport at the same time as you. I was dropping my Dutch friend off by car but had I not had my license, I would have seen you. xD
This video is almost like my "diesels to Dunblane" video, where i went to Alloa and Dunblane trying to get a ride on a class 385 and never got one! :D
You are a martyr to the cause Geoff.
This is normal up here mate.. Nothing goes to plan. 🤣 I do like the new 195/331's btw.. Gonna miss the pacer in a weird way.. Its a positive step forward. (years late, but STILL forward) .. 👍🏼
What is the entrance height above rail top for British trains - I notice the Class 195 doorways are well above platform height. In Sydney Australia we adopted 1200 mm decades ago to position the entrance midway between the floors of the upper and lower cabins and maximise the seating available in a carriage - we have many carriages with 118 seats each. I assume the floor level chosen in Brittan is purely to have a continuous level floor over the bogies.
Class 195 has been tested in Romania, I've got pictures from a friend of mine who spotted class 195
The door closing chime of this train sounds like Class 800 and Taiwan Railway Types EMU900 and EMU3000...