Definitely a big shift, and I'll be dropping breadcrumbs to make it a little less abrupt. I do think the structure of 5E kind of makes it necessary to have some kind of escalation as the levels increase and cosmic horror is a great answer to where to take this super hero fantasy to make it meaningful and challenging again. At least for me, I know this one won't be everyone's favorite
My semi-homebrew world was built off of Lost Mine’s & Icespire Peak town and area, including npcs, but adapted to the town I ran my first one-shot in, Weird Creek. The players really liked the town and their characters and wanted to keep playing, so I slowly introduced npcs from the book into town, or adapted existing ones to fit their roles. A temple keeper in town named Esther turned out to have the last name Garaele, and was working to become a full cleric (and, secretly, a Harper). The mayor’s record keeper was Rita Gardenstone, taking Gundren’s place, and the new mayor after the previous one escaped justice (he was the one-shot’s villain) was the local land lord and farm owner, Harbin Wester. Right now, our group is in Conyberry, which ended up being a halfling town, reclaiming the ruins of their ancestral home. They’ve gone on a few different quests, some side quests from the book like meeting the red wizard, and some unique ones, and haven’t even started the Phandelver storyline yet. I’ve made it clear I want to run it eventually, though. I imagine by the time we get to it, they’ll be level 7 or 8. Quite a departure. But it definitely feels like they’ll have more fun than running it from scratch, since all of these characters are now familiar to them. We’ve kind of joked that it’s like a weird multiverse version of the official adventure. That said, it doesn’t look like I’ll be running And Below, at least not without some serious changes. I don’t think it really fits where our version of the world is going, but I feel like it could fit in to happen to some other part of the local area. I just don’t think any of us would want to see those kinds of horrors happen to the town we’ve come to be so attached to, but the overall story sounds fun so I’m totally looking forward to getting my hands on it and possibly picking out pieces, just like I have from the other books.
That all sounds really great, and I can definitely see opportunities to connect what you have to what's in here. Rita could be a better version of Gwyn, etc. The fact that they wouldn't want to see doom come to this town their invested in could be a great reason to run this, but I get that not everyone is into that sort of thing. It would be pretty easy to move this over to Leilon or Triboar, or just about anywhere else really, and launch into chapter 5. Multiverse is also a great angle, or prequel/sequel even
Perfect! You could definitely pick this up at level 5 easily, or just run WEC at 4. You could also have Waterdeep under threat from all of this below material if they're really invested in that location
@@RdotDoyle I skim read the book over the weekend & I could probably easily replace the new NPC Gwyn Oresong with Volo from Waterdeep, who my players already have a connection with
Oh awesome, definitely check out my original LMoP playlist as all of that is still relevant and you may actually want to run that older version anyway as a lot of the combats are actually easier
Don’t have the new book yet but helpful tips. My group ran LMoP years ago so I need to run another adventure for levels 1-5. Maybe Dragon of Icespire Peak and Sunless Citadel or combination thereof.
You could easily run DoIP into this, or Sunless Citadel and Forge of Fury as well. You could also pick up from chapter 5 with the same or new characters and treat it as a sequel
I'm hoping I can run it after divine contention, as my players are heavily invested in the sword coast, Leilon and Phandelin, we have already done lost mines before, so its either this or onto waterdeep🤔we had the witchlight carnival show up and linked the house of Thalivar to Candlekeep, so my players may be abit OP for this, which can be fun for me as a DM to spice up the encounters👹I feel some worldbuilding coming on, thanks for the review👍
Absolutely! I think the nature of this one makes it pretty easy to pick up from chapter 5 or chapter 7. You'd definitely have to scale things up and get creative, but that sounds right up your alley
Awesome!! Great review/preview, man! This sounds like something that I can have a lot of fun running some day. I've run the first half of this campaign half a dozen times already, may as well "really" finish it out, right? 😂
Thanks man! There's a lot of cool potential in this one and I am definitely pumped to return to Phandalin. A lot of my players are as well, but they've got no idea what's coming, unless they're watching this of course!
Based on this review, I think I might bite the bullet and buy this adventure... The first dnd product I'll be buying from WotC in a long time, if I'm being honest, but I like what I've seen enough that I think it's worth it
I hear you, I'm pretty much in the same boat. I rolled the dice on this one because Phandalin holds such a special place in my heart and I knew people would come asking my opinion on this after the success of my Phandelver guides. I'm happy with it. Could it be better? Absolutely. Each latest product should be their greatest with the resources they have at their disposal now, and sadly that has not been the case. But I think we'll have fun with this one
@@RdotDoyle yeah, I think it's really cool that a lot of people's first exposure with 5e was Phandelver, and now the (I'm guessing) last official WotC campaign before the 2024 books will be Phandelver, but full and with cosmic horror (I love cosmic horror, so I'm excited about this
LMoP is a classic and I can see why they’d want to write a sequel. I just don’t know why this has to be the continuation. Lost Mine deliberately leans into D&D and fantasy rpg tropes, to go from that straight to cosmic horror is such a weird left turn and I genuinely don’t understand it. Someone who wants classic D&D will get weirded out by the second half of the adventure, cosmic horror buff will be bored by the first half. It’s just the worst of both worlds.
No worries, when the Compendium is done it will be available on DriveThruRPG. Follow the channel or sign up for the newsletter on our site to make sure you don't miss it when it launches!
Harder? That Bugbear at level 1 has killed so many players. I’ve had to “ITS NOT YOUR TIME - RANDOM GOD” a lot with that. I teach and dM after school for kids and holy shit that Bugbear has made some cry
Yeah I was surprised too honestly. I'd definitely run the old version for beginners, and have some tricks up my sleeve in either version because level one characters are fragile even with experienced players
Both of my groups went to Pathfinder 2E for the past few months. There are some other, more rules-light systems like ShadowDark I have my eye on, maybe just for some one shots. We’re pivoting back to 5E in different ways at both tables next month. With all the changes on the horizon I don’t know what’s coming after that but I’m excited to experiment
Can uou do videos like you did for changes to LMoP? My group just finished up Lost Mines and i picked this up to keep them going. Would be interested to hear your thoughts about yhe whole book
I have plans for that for sure. I don't know if I'll walk through the whole book the same way I did the LMoP series but there will be a future video or two for sure. In the meantime feel free to ask anything over on the discord
The more connected to the other PCs and the town of Phandalin the better I think. The one spoiler I'll often clue my players into is potentially useful languages, so I'd take a look at Undercommon, maybe Deep Speech
Started with the OG lost mines of phandelver and am about to start with the post mine content (it came out halfway through my og run) and man... not impressed with what im reading. Replacing original character or just sidelining them for new characters really wrecks all the character development and investment that was made with those characters previously for no reason. Just reading through the opening events post chapter 4, so many of the new details make no sense. Having a well the has been used for years that now gives people nightmares (and apparently always has), but still remains in use? A crystal being used as the well's winch drum? It makes no sense. Removing the corner stone of a building that would cause it to lean over (that's not how corner stones work) done by a handful of relatively weak goblins in the cover or night... it makes no sense. And it keeps going.. nearly every detail about the investigation I will have to alter so it makes some sense. It reads like the writers are very very young and don't have a good grasp on how things work. These poorly thought out details and changes do not give me much hope that the rest will not be just as badly written and am seriously considering jumping to a different adventure.
I saw a lot of the same issues you mention here and fixed most of them by just compressing the timeline, which also made things feel more fun and cinematic at the same time. Like I said in here, I did make that first half of chapter five into a big invasion instead of a whodunit and it was a blast. They fought a set of goblins at the well but didn't follow them down there, then the PCs managed to get the shrine piece recovered when they chased a batch of goblins back to their camp. By the time they got back the miners were shoring up the exchange from collapsing further and the sleeping giant was a crime scene. Also, in my head canon all these effects from the shards only just started happening, as the mind flayers have only just begun using the obelisk. And they keep ramping up as things progress, beginning to impact the player characters as well, especially since they've been carrying a shard the whole time now. I don't want to convince you one way or the other on if you should run it. I'm not done but so far the rest of the chapters are mostly dungeon dives, so far so good. Nothing amazing but nothing that has left me scratching my head
@@RdotDoyleI hope so. most of the point of running a pre-written campaign is im a new DM and just want something I can run without having to worry about world building. Its hard enough just running all the NPC, getting all the online stuff working, scheduling, etc. And long stretches of investigating, particularly if they dont draw the correct conclusions that is required to move things along (which is nearly guaranteed) can be a slog to get through.
@@UndeadMark I hear that. The game isn't really built for investigations exactly. My group had five pieces of the puzzle and are experienced players with a few note takers among them and they floundered for a bit to figure out what the next move was once the shards were stolen.
@@RdotDoyle any tips on how to better handle this section would be appreciated. reading the random encounters often take place in the same locations as some of the crime scenes and seem contrary to the investigation progress, so as a new dm, any advice you can give based on what when right and wrong with your experience would really help.
@@UndeadMark I had a big festival going on with just about everyone from town in the town square. Screams and shouts start coming from the North near Barthens and the road to the Triboar trail, then out by the Sleeping Giant, and there's a ruckus at the Miner's Exchange. They go to investigate one of those and the goblins come for the shrine while they're gone. It takes a good amount of prep to be ready to run all of it an once and let the players decide in the moment which part to interact with, but I think it's way more fun and also makes more sense. If they manage to stop the goblins from taking a shard alright, now they have it and have to figure out what to do with it. Hope that helps for now
There are other minor changes to the characters' outlook in a progressive/inclusive way. For example, Reidoth LMOP: "If the characters ask about Cragmaw Castle, Reidoth gladly provides directions. He is a member of the Emerald Enclave, a widespread group of wilderness survivalists who preserve the natural order while rooting out troublesome threats. The enclave works to restore and preserve the natural order by keeping the elemental forces of the world in check, preventing civilization and the wilderness from destroying one another, and helping others survive the perils of the wilds. **The goblins are a threat to the delicate balance**." Obelisk: "If the characters ask about Cragmaw Castle, Reidoth hesitates to provide directions. She is a member of the Emerald Enclave [... ...] the perils of the wilds. As such, **Reidoth doesn't want to rile the goblins without good cause**."
Gotta say I’m not impressed with the new material. D&D adventure writers seem to be unaware that “less is more.” This just feels wildly overdone, worse than usual for D&D. I’ll likely pick it apart if there’s any parts I can recycle. Also I really don’t find D&D very compatible with what made Lovecraft work. Also, the book is $75 here!
Very specific tone to this one, I think it's a great way to evolve from the super heroic fantasy of 5E but it's definitely not going to be the right fit for every table or every campaign
In a bit I’ll do my remix on how I transitioned into chapter five and the shattered obelisk material. I like to run the thing before I really deep dive into it. Worse for my TH-cam views but I think better for my viewers
Phandelver and Below The Shattered Obelisk is a disaster. Peak example of how WotC don't care about their products. No fix of existing problems in Phandelver part. Just changed few genders and added more enemies. The transition to second part of module is ridiculous. Silly goblins make some pranks in the village. Wow. We are playing body horror adventure, right? The first dungeon is boring to the bone. The rest is... I am just tired changing and fixing it.
![[TH] 2024 PMSL SEA Finals D2 | Fall | ต้องรักษาฟอร์ม อย่ายอมให้ใครแซง](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/x38QsGn7A3M/mqdefault.jpg)
I like the fact they made some changes like Yeemik being a goblin boss instead of a goblin with max hit points etc
Same. I like Yeemik as a goblin boss, but then there's another nameless one in the mix too, which isn't it a big deal but bothered me a little
It feels like a far cry from the tone of the original that this builds off. Like a big tone shift.
Definitely a big shift, and I'll be dropping breadcrumbs to make it a little less abrupt. I do think the structure of 5E kind of makes it necessary to have some kind of escalation as the levels increase and cosmic horror is a great answer to where to take this super hero fantasy to make it meaningful and challenging again. At least for me, I know this one won't be everyone's favorite
My semi-homebrew world was built off of Lost Mine’s & Icespire Peak town and area, including npcs, but adapted to the town I ran my first one-shot in, Weird Creek. The players really liked the town and their characters and wanted to keep playing, so I slowly introduced npcs from the book into town, or adapted existing ones to fit their roles. A temple keeper in town named Esther turned out to have the last name Garaele, and was working to become a full cleric (and, secretly, a Harper). The mayor’s record keeper was Rita Gardenstone, taking Gundren’s place, and the new mayor after the previous one escaped justice (he was the one-shot’s villain) was the local land lord and farm owner, Harbin Wester.
Right now, our group is in Conyberry, which ended up being a halfling town, reclaiming the ruins of their ancestral home. They’ve gone on a few different quests, some side quests from the book like meeting the red wizard, and some unique ones, and haven’t even started the Phandelver storyline yet. I’ve made it clear I want to run it eventually, though. I imagine by the time we get to it, they’ll be level 7 or 8. Quite a departure. But it definitely feels like they’ll have more fun than running it from scratch, since all of these characters are now familiar to them. We’ve kind of joked that it’s like a weird multiverse version of the official adventure.
That said, it doesn’t look like I’ll be running And Below, at least not without some serious changes. I don’t think it really fits where our version of the world is going, but I feel like it could fit in to happen to some other part of the local area. I just don’t think any of us would want to see those kinds of horrors happen to the town we’ve come to be so attached to, but the overall story sounds fun so I’m totally looking forward to getting my hands on it and possibly picking out pieces, just like I have from the other books.
That all sounds really great, and I can definitely see opportunities to connect what you have to what's in here. Rita could be a better version of Gwyn, etc. The fact that they wouldn't want to see doom come to this town their invested in could be a great reason to run this, but I get that not everyone is into that sort of thing. It would be pretty easy to move this over to Leilon or Triboar, or just about anywhere else really, and launch into chapter 5. Multiverse is also a great angle, or prequel/sequel even
Yay! I was really looking forward to get your view on this!
Thanks! Hope you enjoyed it
Awesome you are one of my favorite dnd TH-cam commentators thank you for the review!!
Thanks, that's very kind of you to say. Hope you enjoyed this one
My current group are level 3 in Waterdeep, Looks like they're going to be heading north to Phandalin shortly
Perfect! You could definitely pick this up at level 5 easily, or just run WEC at 4. You could also have Waterdeep under threat from all of this below material if they're really invested in that location
@@RdotDoyle I skim read the book over the weekend & I could probably easily replace the new NPC Gwyn Oresong with Volo from Waterdeep, who my players already have a connection with
@@newtonjay72 Volo would definitely be here scribing things away. Good choice!
Im thinking to runt his as my first campaign and your info here makes me excited to try
Oh awesome, definitely check out my original LMoP playlist as all of that is still relevant and you may actually want to run that older version anyway as a lot of the combats are actually easier
When is WotC going to learn ALL DWARVES, male and female have beards.
I love this take
All dwarves have beards until the development of chemical warfare.
Don’t have the new book yet but helpful tips. My group ran LMoP years ago so I need to run another adventure for levels 1-5. Maybe Dragon of Icespire Peak and Sunless Citadel or combination thereof.
You could easily run DoIP into this, or Sunless Citadel and Forge of Fury as well. You could also pick up from chapter 5 with the same or new characters and treat it as a sequel
Thank you so much ❤
I'm hoping I can run it after divine contention, as my players are heavily invested in the sword coast, Leilon and Phandelin, we have already done lost mines before, so its either this or onto waterdeep🤔we had the witchlight carnival show up and linked the house of Thalivar to Candlekeep, so my players may be abit OP for this, which can be fun for me as a DM to spice up the encounters👹I feel some worldbuilding coming on, thanks for the review👍
Absolutely! I think the nature of this one makes it pretty easy to pick up from chapter 5 or chapter 7. You'd definitely have to scale things up and get creative, but that sounds right up your alley
Awesome!! Great review/preview, man! This sounds like something that I can have a lot of fun running some day. I've run the first half of this campaign half a dozen times already, may as well "really" finish it out, right? 😂
Thanks man! There's a lot of cool potential in this one and I am definitely pumped to return to Phandalin. A lot of my players are as well, but they've got no idea what's coming, unless they're watching this of course!
Based on this review, I think I might bite the bullet and buy this adventure... The first dnd product I'll be buying from WotC in a long time, if I'm being honest, but I like what I've seen enough that I think it's worth it
I hear you, I'm pretty much in the same boat. I rolled the dice on this one because Phandalin holds such a special place in my heart and I knew people would come asking my opinion on this after the success of my Phandelver guides. I'm happy with it. Could it be better? Absolutely. Each latest product should be their greatest with the resources they have at their disposal now, and sadly that has not been the case. But I think we'll have fun with this one
@@RdotDoyle yeah, I think it's really cool that a lot of people's first exposure with 5e was Phandelver, and now the (I'm guessing) last official WotC campaign before the 2024 books will be Phandelver, but full and with cosmic horror (I love cosmic horror, so I'm excited about this
How has the adventure been so far?
I’m glad you asked: 5 Changes for Phandelver and Below: The Shattered Obelisk
th-cam.com/video/lCWL2Ioh010/w-d-xo.html
Just starting my first in-person session this friday
Im usually a discord DM
Excited for my new group
Thank you
You're welcome
LMoP is a classic and I can see why they’d want to write a sequel. I just don’t know why this has to be the continuation. Lost Mine deliberately leans into D&D and fantasy rpg tropes, to go from that straight to cosmic horror is such a weird left turn and I genuinely don’t understand it. Someone who wants classic D&D will get weirded out by the second half of the adventure, cosmic horror buff will be bored by the first half. It’s just the worst of both worlds.
Eu adorei vou manter essas dicas em mente! obrigado S2
De nada, obrigado!
of course I would miss the kickstarter for the awesome books :(
No worries, when the Compendium is done it will be available on DriveThruRPG. Follow the channel or sign up for the newsletter on our site to make sure you don't miss it when it launches!
Harder? That Bugbear at level 1 has killed so many players. I’ve had to “ITS NOT YOUR TIME - RANDOM GOD” a lot with that.
I teach and dM after school for kids and holy shit that Bugbear has made some cry
Yeah I was surprised too honestly. I'd definitely run the old version for beginners, and have some tricks up my sleeve in either version because level one characters are fragile even with experienced players
To what system is your group switching? would be curious to hear what you're checking out
Both of my groups went to Pathfinder 2E for the past few months. There are some other, more rules-light systems like ShadowDark I have my eye on, maybe just for some one shots. We’re pivoting back to 5E in different ways at both tables next month. With all the changes on the horizon I don’t know what’s coming after that but I’m excited to experiment
Can uou do videos like you did for changes to LMoP? My group just finished up Lost Mines and i picked this up to keep them going. Would be interested to hear your thoughts about yhe whole book
I have plans for that for sure. I don't know if I'll walk through the whole book the same way I did the LMoP series but there will be a future video or two for sure. In the meantime feel free to ask anything over on the discord
Thanks for the through review, the suggestions, and the warning about the book not being appropriate for young players.
Definitely, happy to help
gonna be a player in this campaign soon but im not sure what kinda pc to make
The more connected to the other PCs and the town of Phandalin the better I think. The one spoiler I'll often clue my players into is potentially useful languages, so I'd take a look at Undercommon, maybe Deep Speech
Started with the OG lost mines of phandelver and am about to start with the post mine content (it came out halfway through my og run) and man... not impressed with what im reading. Replacing original character or just sidelining them for new characters really wrecks all the character development and investment that was made with those characters previously for no reason.
Just reading through the opening events post chapter 4, so many of the new details make no sense. Having a well the has been used for years that now gives people nightmares (and apparently always has), but still remains in use? A crystal being used as the well's winch drum? It makes no sense. Removing the corner stone of a building that would cause it to lean over (that's not how corner stones work) done by a handful of relatively weak goblins in the cover or night... it makes no sense.
And it keeps going.. nearly every detail about the investigation I will have to alter so it makes some sense. It reads like the writers are very very young and don't have a good grasp on how things work.
These poorly thought out details and changes do not give me much hope that the rest will not be just as badly written and am seriously considering jumping to a different adventure.
I saw a lot of the same issues you mention here and fixed most of them by just compressing the timeline, which also made things feel more fun and cinematic at the same time.
Like I said in here, I did make that first half of chapter five into a big invasion instead of a whodunit and it was a blast. They fought a set of goblins at the well but didn't follow them down there, then the PCs managed to get the shrine piece recovered when they chased a batch of goblins back to their camp. By the time they got back the miners were shoring up the exchange from collapsing further and the sleeping giant was a crime scene.
Also, in my head canon all these effects from the shards only just started happening, as the mind flayers have only just begun using the obelisk. And they keep ramping up as things progress, beginning to impact the player characters as well, especially since they've been carrying a shard the whole time now.
I don't want to convince you one way or the other on if you should run it. I'm not done but so far the rest of the chapters are mostly dungeon dives, so far so good. Nothing amazing but nothing that has left me scratching my head
@@RdotDoyleI hope so. most of the point of running a pre-written campaign is im a new DM and just want something I can run without having to worry about world building. Its hard enough just running all the NPC, getting all the online stuff working, scheduling, etc.
And long stretches of investigating, particularly if they dont draw the correct conclusions that is required to move things along (which is nearly guaranteed) can be a slog to get through.
@@UndeadMark I hear that. The game isn't really built for investigations exactly. My group had five pieces of the puzzle and are experienced players with a few note takers among them and they floundered for a bit to figure out what the next move was once the shards were stolen.
@@RdotDoyle any tips on how to better handle this section would be appreciated. reading the random encounters often take place in the same locations as some of the crime scenes and seem contrary to the investigation progress, so as a new dm, any advice you can give based on what when right and wrong with your experience would really help.
@@UndeadMark I had a big festival going on with just about everyone from town in the town square. Screams and shouts start coming from the North near Barthens and the road to the Triboar trail, then out by the Sleeping Giant, and there's a ruckus at the Miner's Exchange. They go to investigate one of those and the goblins come for the shrine while they're gone.
It takes a good amount of prep to be ready to run all of it an once and let the players decide in the moment which part to interact with, but I think it's way more fun and also makes more sense.
If they manage to stop the goblins from taking a shard alright, now they have it and have to figure out what to do with it. Hope that helps for now
Is there a chance you’re going to do guides on chapter 5 till 8?
Great question, just started running it for one of my games and I’m leaning towards yes.
I hope so! As a first time dm I am running lmop with 2 different groups and your videos have been the most helpful so far!
There are other minor changes to the characters' outlook in a progressive/inclusive way. For example, Reidoth
LMOP: "If the characters ask about Cragmaw Castle, Reidoth gladly provides directions. He is a member of the Emerald Enclave, a widespread group of wilderness survivalists who preserve the natural order while rooting out troublesome threats. The enclave works to restore and preserve the natural order by keeping the elemental forces of the world in check, preventing civilization and the wilderness from destroying one another, and helping others survive the perils of the wilds. **The goblins are a threat to the delicate balance**."
Obelisk: "If the characters ask about Cragmaw Castle, Reidoth hesitates to provide directions. She is a member of the Emerald Enclave [... ...] the perils of the wilds. As such, **Reidoth doesn't want to rile the goblins without good cause**."
oh interesting, I missed that one
Gotta say I’m not impressed with the new material. D&D adventure writers seem to be unaware that “less is more.” This just feels wildly overdone, worse than usual for D&D. I’ll likely pick it apart if there’s any parts I can recycle.
Also I really don’t find D&D very compatible with what made Lovecraft work.
Also, the book is $75 here!
Yeah, I like it a lot better than other things that have come out in the last few years, but the best parts of this are the original parts of this
Great vid. Good to know it doesn't fit the vibe of my game!
Very specific tone to this one, I think it's a great way to evolve from the super heroic fantasy of 5E but it's definitely not going to be the right fit for every table or every campaign
The link doesn’t work
Thanks for the head's up but which one?
@@RdotDoyle the Amazon one, it goes to dragon heist
Man there really is nobody making any videos for chapter 5 and up. Lol
In a bit I’ll do my remix on how I transitioned into chapter five and the shattered obelisk material. I like to run the thing before I really deep dive into it. Worse for my TH-cam views but I think better for my viewers
Is there a reason he cant say "goblin"?
I can say goblin but "gerblin" is just so much better. That's what the locals call them
Phandelver and Below The Shattered Obelisk is a disaster. Peak example of how WotC don't care about their products.
No fix of existing problems in Phandelver part. Just changed few genders and added more enemies.
The transition to second part of module is ridiculous. Silly goblins make some pranks in the village. Wow. We are playing body horror adventure, right?
The first dungeon is boring to the bone. The rest is... I am just tired changing and fixing it.