Double row timing chain on TR6. RPM limit 500 higher (same max piston speed) GT6. 1.5" vs 1.75" CD carbs. Mill block deck to zero for 10.25 CR ratio. Smoothest engine ever, OK, top ten ever. Thanks.
Since the same gasket set is sold for all verions of all 2.0 cars this is either a change that happened during the production life of the MK1 engines - were used in early versions of Saloon GT6 and Vitesse - they have a different cylinder head design, or happened at the change to MKII version you have there, I believe some of the MKII updates were introduced during MKI production. There are later "MK3" 2.0l engines with domed pistons so they can use TR6 type head with larger combustion chamber for 2.5l engine. There are also USA only castings with ports for EGR ( and lower compression) ?
Great video, you two work really well together👏👏 Be interesting to see your conclusions as to why it turned over so easily. Good luck from Spain!! EDIT: Sometimes the input shaft bearing in the crankshaft are different .... I discovered this when I used a crankshaft on an earlier MK1 cortina and couldn't get the engine to mate with the gearbox!!
If it's an original oil pump try to keep it, new ones are very variable quality. You don't need to replace the oil pump just for end scoring , you can reface the cover and housing to reset the end float if necessary, the most important measurement is the installed clearance between inner and outer rotor as that is the biggest cause of internal leakage and poor efficiency.
Hi Elin & David, excellent stripped in record time. When you measure the camshaft could you if possible give a close up of the lobes please. On mine there is no pitting but where you see the dark patches mine looks mottle. I will be measuring once I have watch how to. Thank you
Vale Lash adjusted to no clearance valves will not close against seat Replaced head gasket on six cylinder ford after surfacing head. Did not re adjust valve clearance no compression. different set of eyes helped me find problem. Lesson learned
Hi Elin, thanks for explaining the comparisons between the 2.0 and 2.5 engines. I guess if someone wanted a little more power (or torque) in a GT6 then it would not be too difficult to convert or fit a 2.5 engine assembly (assuming crank and transmissions mated up ok….)
Yes, I was thinking the same. You can easily turn a GT6 engine into a TR6. You need a TR6 crank and pistons. The rear end of the crank is the same as the fly wheel is the same for both models. The clutch is what is different. Well, the compression ratio needs to be considered too. I haven't checked the combustion chamber volume yet, so I don't know about that. It might go way too high :)
That motor didn't look bad at all. Well, low bar as mine had a thrown rod so the bearings were all shot. I'm still debating on fixing the original GT6 motor or replacing it all together. The old one can be fixed but with a line bore and turning the crank it's cheaper to rebuild and put in a junk yard 2.0 I found.
The absence of compression in ANNA's engine is perplexing me; especially considering the 'good' condition of the rings not being stuck. Would zero valve lash account for this, or the total lack of oil give no compression? Even with zero lash, wouldn't you have heard/felt the air being slightly compressed and released? I'm looking forward to learning what all the measurements reveal!
I'm jumping in on this comment because I am perplexed too. After pulling it all down you found that the engine to have been in good order. You ended your video without finding the reason for no compression. It appears that you are about to rebuild it with new Rings and Bearings without understanding why it had no compression in the first place. So why does everything look as if it was a running engine. I don't think the timing has changed. Is there a sheared keyway? The head does not have a new gasket so all valve clearances can't be that far off. If the head was cracked you would have some compression. How did you deduce that it had a total loss of compression?????????
@@robertfountain4856 Well, I still haven't taken the valves out, right :) At least not in this video... that is still to come. Also, I don't know if there was any compression, I concluded there wasn't because I didn't hear it and the fly wheel was turning easy and smooth. So there might have been some compression, but not a lot. I think I know the reason now, but I will leave it for the next video :) Of course I wouldn't just assemble it without finding out the reason.
Looks like they had a shorter version of block at one time? the gasket is close to fitting.. you mentioned a short stroke version..so probably they changed it to one block later on and did the piston and crankshaft changes to get the short stroke ? Usually gaskets are included due to different versions and why one is only needed.... especially on older vehicles of that era...
Rings stuck in grooves is one reason for low compression...as well as stuck valves...another more common reason is wear on rings ....and cylinders too.... this is why you measure the gaps after teardown...it is probably wear as you found no valves or rings stuck in piston grooves..and those usually only are a few cylinders not all of them...
The aluminum part at the front of the block below the crank shaft that you indicated often had stripped threads from over-torquing, I believe that the lower timing cover bolt goes into one of those, and my 73 appears to have those threads at least partially stripped. Can that aluminum part be removed without removing the engine for repair or replacement?
Are you keeping the engine stock or are you going bore it out to its max capacity of 2725cc ? *** Always dreamed of doing a GT6 Mk3. Engine taken out to 2725cc. Triple Weber 40 DCN Carburettors. 4 plus Overdrive Gearbox, with uprated Clutch. All Round Disc Brakes, Vented at the front, power assisted with an ABS system fitted. Upgraded Suspension. Wider Tyres, with Mini-lite Mag Alloy Wheels in Gold. Chassis Stripped, Galvanise dipped and Powder Coated Black. Perspex Headlight Covers. Gloss Diamond Black paint, with Matt Black rear panel, with Metallic Gold Triumph Laurel Reef on the nose. Black Leather interior. Black Wilton Carpets. Dashboard, that is dark stained Teak Wood, with a Dark Varnish, that is very smooth to the touch.
Or turning a GT6, into a Spitfire 6 Convertible. Engine bored out to 2498cc Twin Weber 40 DCN Carburettors. 4 plus Overdrive Gearbox, with uprated Clutch. All Round Disc Brakes, Vented at the front, power assisted with an ABS system fitted. Upgraded Suspension. Mini-lite Mag Alloy Wheels in Silver. Chassis Stripped, Galvanise dipped and Powder Coated Black. Perspex Headlight Covers. Metallic Phantom Grey paint, with Matt Black rear panel, with Black Triumph Laurel Reef on the nose. Ox Blood Red Leather interior. Red Wilton Carpets. Turned Aluminium Dashboard
Yeah, I am thinking of that. Maybe not decking as I don't think I have lots of room for that, but porting and polishing would be nice :) Hardened exhaust seats too.
Could you have put WD40 or similar on the studs before (and while) removing the head to make it easier? What about removing at least some of the studs before pulling the head off? (I can't remember if you can take the studs out before taking head off)
I could have used WD40, but I know from experience that it doesn't help a lot. The studs can come out through the head, no problem, but I didn't have enough threads to lock two nuts at the top end. I did that on the TR4 engine that I work on right now. The video is not up yet
Dave, I imagine I wouldn’t have reinstalled it when I drained it for storage. I gave it frequent oil changes. Engine, trans and diff prior to my trips to Bridgenorth, ON each fall. My inability to properly tune the carbs is evident. All things considered it looks ok.
I haven't checked them before I took them out, but it is very possible as we didn't find any other issues. Possibly worn rings, but the bores were still in the tolerance. Well, that is part of the next video :)
Did you know Triumph is building Motocross dirt bikes to compete in Supercross and Motocross - USA / World Grand Prix Championships?? / World Supercross - Europe/World They are starting fielding Teams in 2024...built from ground up Dirt Bikes..they have been planning and testing for a few years now... 😀
The bike part of Triumph was sold over 100 years ago and they are separate companies ever since. Nothing to do with each other other than the name. So I am not familiar with the bikes :)
The humidity of where it was sitting can cause rust like that..depending on which valves are open etc...then those cylinders get the moisture more than others..it looks like normal rust from long term unused storage....doesn't take long to get rust started..why spraying it inside through sparkplug holes and turning it over every 6 months ( at least ) can prevent rust inside...
Excellent strip-down Elin & David.. To my aging eyes those internals all looked pretty good considering the engine hasn't been running for many decades. Here in the UK, our glorious lords & masters have ordered that the unleaded petrol must have a 10% Ethanol blend. The situation in the US seems the same ; i.e. "E10 is a blend of regular unleaded (RON 91) petrol and between 9% and 10% ethanol. Blending the ethanol at this ratio increases the RON to 94" .. So you gain back the octane loss but the price for this 'net-zero' BS is increased engine ware and it eats away at any conventional type rubber hoses in the fuel lines. So hardened valve seats might be a wise precaution. I bet Elon Musk is laughing all the way to the bank (for now ! )🤣🚀🛰
@@cheftush ... Looking at the present insanity (that none of us voted for), I think your sainted leader will be putting down his dainty little foot down on that one eventually. Have a great Christmas David.. ⛄
![SAFEPLANET - ดาวเคราะห์ [ THE PLANET ]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/4X1XL3I_k3c/mqdefault.jpg)
Rumbling on, Elin! Love the two of of you together crack-a-lacking! Always a learning experience.
You two really work well together, very entertaining episode, thank you.
What a great guy and friend, David is. You both worked well together, great content very entertaining
You two made it look really easy, and quick too. No joke nice work!!
Great explaination for the difference between the GT6 and TR6
Double row timing chain on TR6.
RPM limit 500 higher (same max piston speed) GT6.
1.5" vs 1.75" CD carbs.
Mill block deck to zero for 10.25 CR ratio.
Smoothest engine ever, OK, top ten ever.
Thanks.
Hi Elin. I’m so happy to see that GT6 project back! I’ve watched all the episodes from the beginning. Thanks for all.
Never seen the engine pulled apart that much before this is great for watching and also educational.
He’s right you know. Most of us long term viewers have a memory. 😉
I laughed when I saw Rusty in Chef’s chair and Chef in the office chair.
Yes, Rusty kicked me out!😉
Like the sound effects!
Wow two TH-cam stars in one video. Very nice of CT to help. Cylinder/piston measurements should be interesting. Great project and videos. Thanks.
Good stuff Elin thanks
Since the same gasket set is sold for all verions of all 2.0 cars this is either a change that happened during the production life of the MK1 engines - were used in early versions of Saloon GT6 and Vitesse - they have a different cylinder head design, or happened at the change to MKII version you have there, I believe some of the MKII updates were introduced during MKI production. There are later "MK3" 2.0l engines with domed pistons so they can use TR6 type head with larger combustion chamber for 2.5l engine. There are also USA only castings with ports for EGR ( and lower compression) ?
I just rebuilt a 76 tr6 with a 69block in it. Your videos helped A LOT!!! Thank you from Nova Scotia
Great video, you two work really well together👏👏
Be interesting to see your conclusions as to why it turned over so easily.
Good luck from Spain!!
EDIT: Sometimes the input shaft bearing in the crankshaft are different .... I discovered this when I used a crankshaft on an earlier MK1 cortina and couldn't get the engine to mate with the gearbox!!
Very interesting. I thought that the valves would all be hung up. BTW, the standard compression ratio for a GT6 is 9.5:1.
If it's an original oil pump try to keep it, new ones are very variable quality. You don't need to replace the oil pump just for end scoring , you can reface the cover and housing to reset the end float if necessary, the most important measurement is the installed clearance between inner and outer rotor as that is the biggest cause of internal leakage and poor efficiency.
Hi Elin & David, excellent stripped in record time. When you measure the camshaft could you if possible give a close up of the lobes please. On mine there is no pitting but where you see the dark patches mine looks mottle. I will be measuring once I have watch how to. Thank you
Vale Lash adjusted to no clearance valves will not close against seat
Replaced head gasket on six cylinder ford after surfacing head.
Did not re adjust valve clearance no compression.
different set of eyes helped me find problem.
Lesson learned
Yes, it is a possibility. I should have checked that but it is too late now. However the previous owner said it was running before he took it out.
Hi Elin, thanks for explaining the comparisons between the 2.0 and 2.5 engines. I guess if someone wanted a little more power (or torque) in a GT6 then it would not be too difficult to convert or fit a 2.5 engine assembly (assuming crank and transmissions mated up ok….)
Yes, I was thinking the same. You can easily turn a GT6 engine into a TR6. You need a TR6 crank and pistons. The rear end of the crank is the same as the fly wheel is the same for both models. The clutch is what is different. Well, the compression ratio needs to be considered too. I haven't checked the combustion chamber volume yet, so I don't know about that. It might go way too high :)
That motor didn't look bad at all. Well, low bar as mine had a thrown rod so the bearings were all shot. I'm still debating on fixing the original GT6 motor or replacing it all together. The old one can be fixed but with a line bore and turning the crank it's cheaper to rebuild and put in a junk yard 2.0 I found.
congrats on the engine components being reusable Elin.
The absence of compression in ANNA's engine is perplexing me; especially considering the 'good' condition of the rings not being stuck. Would zero valve lash account for this, or the total lack of oil give no compression? Even with zero lash, wouldn't you have heard/felt the air being slightly compressed and released? I'm looking forward to learning what all the measurements reveal!
I'm jumping in on this comment because I am perplexed too. After pulling it all down you found that the engine to have been in good order. You ended your video without finding the reason for no compression. It appears that you are about to rebuild it with new Rings and Bearings without understanding why it had no compression in the first place.
So why does everything look as if it was a running engine.
I don't think the timing has changed. Is there a sheared keyway?
The head does not have a new gasket so all valve clearances can't be that far off.
If the head was cracked you would have some compression. How did you deduce that it had a total loss of compression?????????
@@robertfountain4856 Well, I still haven't taken the valves out, right :) At least not in this video... that is still to come. Also, I don't know if there was any compression, I concluded there wasn't because I didn't hear it and the fly wheel was turning easy and smooth. So there might have been some compression, but not a lot. I think I know the reason now, but I will leave it for the next video :) Of course I wouldn't just assemble it without finding out the reason.
Looks like they had a shorter version of block at one time? the gasket is close to fitting.. you mentioned a short stroke version..so probably they changed it to one block later on and did the piston and crankshaft changes to get the short stroke ? Usually gaskets are included due to different versions and why one is only needed.... especially on older vehicles of that era...
Morning, boys.
M
Morning :)
Good Morning!
Rings stuck in grooves is one reason for low compression...as well as stuck valves...another more common reason is wear on rings ....and cylinders too.... this is why you measure the gaps after teardown...it is probably wear as you found no valves or rings stuck in piston grooves..and those usually only are a few cylinders not all of them...
All measurements and conclusion in the next video
The aluminum part at the front of the block below the crank shaft that you indicated often had stripped threads from over-torquing, I believe that the lower timing cover bolt goes into one of those, and my 73 appears to have those threads at least partially stripped. Can that aluminum part be removed without removing the engine for repair or replacement?
I've done it on a TR6 without removing the engine, but I am not sure if it will work on a GT6 as well.
Are you keeping the engine stock or are you going bore it out to its max capacity of 2725cc ?
***
Always dreamed of doing a GT6 Mk3.
Engine taken out to 2725cc.
Triple Weber 40 DCN Carburettors.
4 plus Overdrive Gearbox, with uprated Clutch.
All Round Disc Brakes, Vented at the front, power assisted with an ABS system fitted.
Upgraded Suspension.
Wider Tyres, with Mini-lite Mag Alloy Wheels in Gold.
Chassis Stripped, Galvanise dipped and Powder Coated Black.
Perspex Headlight Covers.
Gloss Diamond Black paint, with Matt Black rear panel, with Metallic Gold Triumph Laurel Reef on the nose.
Black Leather interior. Black Wilton Carpets. Dashboard, that is dark stained Teak Wood, with a Dark Varnish, that is very smooth to the touch.
Or turning a GT6, into a Spitfire 6 Convertible.
Engine bored out to 2498cc
Twin Weber 40 DCN Carburettors.
4 plus Overdrive Gearbox, with uprated Clutch.
All Round Disc Brakes, Vented at the front, power assisted with an ABS system fitted.
Upgraded Suspension.
Mini-lite Mag Alloy Wheels in Silver.
Chassis Stripped, Galvanise dipped and Powder Coated Black.
Perspex Headlight Covers.
Metallic Phantom Grey paint, with Matt Black rear panel, with Black Triumph Laurel Reef on the nose.
Ox Blood Red Leather interior. Red Wilton Carpets. Turned Aluminium Dashboard
Zoom zoom 😀
It's probably timed 180 degrees out so no compression ! ;-)
Well... that I didn't check, but Keith said that it was running before he pulled it off the car.
@@RustyBeauties Looks like a cheap refresh and not a rebuild !
Single timing chain will be fine, and the old oil pump too probably….
Redo the head, port & polish new seats and guides and decked, you will gain 5 to 10 hp
Yeah, I am thinking of that. Maybe not decking as I don't think I have lots of room for that, but porting and polishing would be nice :) Hardened exhaust seats too.
Could you have put WD40 or similar on the studs before (and while) removing the head to make it easier? What about removing at least some of the studs before pulling the head off? (I can't remember if you can take the studs out before taking head off)
I could have used WD40, but I know from experience that it doesn't help a lot. The studs can come out through the head, no problem, but I didn't have enough threads to lock two nuts at the top end. I did that on the TR4 engine that I work on right now. The video is not up yet
I’m afraid to look!
Lol. It wasn’t bad actually. You were tight when you said it was a good engine before you turned the key off 35 years ago
What I want to know is if you knew there was no oil filter in there 🥰
Dave, I imagine I wouldn’t have reinstalled it when I drained it for storage. I gave it frequent oil changes. Engine, trans and diff prior to my trips to Bridgenorth, ON each fall. My inability to properly tune the carbs is evident. All things considered it looks ok.
@@kge420 yes, it looks to be in very good shape actually…I’m sure you will be interested in seeing the measurements in the next video….
@@cheftush For sure
Is it possible there was no compression because there was no oil in ....on the rings?
Maybe, yeah, that is a possibility. But I think I know the real reason now. Coming up next :)
@@RustyBeauties
I'm on the edge of my seat!!
I'm 5 minutes in and predict that the valves are out of adjustment and not fully closing.
I haven't checked them before I took them out, but it is very possible as we didn't find any other issues. Possibly worn rings, but the bores were still in the tolerance. Well, that is part of the next video :)
Did you know Triumph is building Motocross dirt bikes to compete in Supercross and Motocross - USA / World Grand Prix Championships?? / World Supercross - Europe/World They are starting fielding Teams in 2024...built from ground up Dirt Bikes..they have been planning and testing for a few years now... 😀
The bike part of Triumph was sold over 100 years ago and they are separate companies ever since. Nothing to do with each other other than the name. So I am not familiar with the bikes :)
@@RustyBeauties
ok i don't know either... it is owned by the same family that had it for a long time...lol
@@RustyBeauties
i'm into dirt bikes more than cars...i used to compete..
Two ratchet straps around the engine, not tight, would stop the head from dropping.
For me looks the head like water was in the cylinder?
Well, it was sitting for 35 years so... everything is possible
The humidity of where it was sitting can cause rust like that..depending on which valves are open etc...then those cylinders get the moisture more than others..it looks like normal rust from long term unused storage....doesn't take long to get rust started..why spraying it inside through sparkplug holes and turning it over every 6 months ( at least ) can prevent rust inside...
Excellent strip-down Elin & David.. To my aging eyes those internals all looked pretty good considering the engine hasn't been running for many decades. Here in the UK, our glorious lords & masters have ordered that the unleaded petrol must have a 10% Ethanol blend. The situation in the US seems the same ; i.e.
"E10 is a blend of regular unleaded (RON 91) petrol and between 9% and 10% ethanol. Blending the ethanol at this ratio increases the RON to 94" .. So you gain back the octane loss but the price for this 'net-zero' BS is increased engine ware and it eats away at any conventional type rubber hoses in the fuel lines. So hardened valve seats might be a wise precaution. I bet Elon Musk is laughing all the way to the bank (for now ! )🤣🚀🛰
Fortunately, we can still get non ethanol fuel here in certain stations.
Yeah, hardened valve seats are probably going in.
@@cheftush ... Looking at the present insanity (that none of us voted for), I think your sainted leader will be putting down his dainty little foot down on that one eventually. Have a great Christmas David.. ⛄