I've been a guitar player for over 12 years and, 6 years ago I had severe lack of coordination/strenght on the pinky and ring finger of my left arm. After a mistaken diagnostic, I had a cubital tunnel surgery and it did not improve my condition at all. A couple weeks ago I had the thoracic outlet syndrome diagnosis from another medic. Im following your videos and doing the exercises, I really hope to get better for guitar playing is what I like best in life and I can't do it properly for 6 years now. Thx Bob and Brad.
This condition crimps my piano style as well. Also being an artist, I really need my left hand to work properly. My chiropractor told me ergonomics and posture are very important for this. I think maximizing a limited practice time by reading sheet music if that will apply or listening a lot. Playing back recordings of yourself, making sure you have the lightest setup possible for your guitar. More slow practice maybe? You can listen to it faster on the playback. Expression will be better since there is so much control. Chiropractor adjustments helped me as well.
After of over a year experiencing and having these symptoms and doing all sorts of chest releases stretches hanging from bars serratus anterior stretches all kind of back releases qll stretches inner armpit tricep and bicep stretches all which would give me some minor relief I finally found videos and the cause with videos like yours and I'm very grateful and thankful thank you for all that you guys do you're awesome.
I'm actually diagnosed with Therasic Outlet Syndrome with Bilateral Cervical Ribs and it took extremely long (a full year) to find and now has caused tendinous in both rotator cuffs as well as extreme neck pain and striffness. My physical therapist found it before any doctor did. Everyone thought I was faking it. (Age 21)
My chiropractor is my best bet when it comes to diagnosing anything. I've been to a well-known orthopedist in my area and he thinks I have "sick scapula syndrome." After doing the first test in this video, my arm and hand tingled. I am going back to the ortho next week and I will mention TOS. Thanks!
We have similar stories CodyWynnee! I got accused of drug seeking, brushed off, and eventually misdiagnosed with a rheum disease despite all rheum tests being negative before I was diagnosed w/ TOS. Your comment was 4 years ago. How are you now?
Yeah, this is what I’m dealing with. It was initiated by a spinal injury at age 19. The doctor’s mention of neglecting back exercise is spot on. Weight training simply exacerbates the problem unless it is balanced with properly coached back muscles training. Exercising for vanity can do more damage than good. Exercise for utility, not for vanity.
Wtf this is exactly what happened to me how do you fix it?
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3 years. It took me 3 years to finally find what has been causing my damn hand problems. Only a few days ago I found out about TOS and now I am 90% sure that's what I have. Thank you for helping confirm my hypothesis.
yup, i have that extra rip- also been in accidents and doctors now just say i have permanent concussion syndrome. Your exercises help, and i've you are like me - you do them for life.
oh wow- I think I may have finally found out what is wrong with my shoulder...after 5+ years of horrific pain, disc surgery, nerve ablation, implanted stimulators, and daily painkillers...I am calling my Neuro surgeon first thing Monday morning to offer TOS as a possibility...Hope to God I'm right, because this pain is unbearable- I want my life back!!!
Hi- in the end, it wasn’t TOS, and I went another few years in agony, until I finally convinced my shoulder surgeon to do a laparoscopic exploratory surgery before I finally gave up and accepted the intense intense pain... he said he was 98% certain that he would find nothing wrong. In fact- I had a completely shredded bicep tendon that was wrapped up in my nerve. Oddly enough, it was completely hidden in my multiple MRIs and other tests. It took about a year before it was healed, but thankfully it feels so much better ( not perfect- those days are gone thanks to the delay in treatment). I hope you all find some relief from your pain soon! M
for the past collar bone and sub clavicles pain kind of mimic for chest pain. many doctor rule out many conditions but never found out what is wrong and now i have shoulder pain, which travels from trapazius to rhomboid muscle and also hurt my occipital and for the past 6 months i have been gone to the countless doctor. now another new doctor asked me to do Thoracic outlet syndrome test. EMG. did you figure out and fix everything?
4 years i been going through pain. Had multiple mris and nerve studies for my shoulder and nothing. I now im convinced that its TOS. I will check with my dr.
I was diagnosed with Thoracic Outlet Syndrome after my arm went twice the size and purple due to a clot in the artery. Thankfully it was all caught in time and now am on blood thinners and going to have surgery! Great video. Helps to know exactly where the issue stemmed from. Appreciate it!
My arm did that but no doctor can come up with the cause.please, whats the name of this surgery!? Ive been on blood thinners 5 years and im so tired of pain and the scaryness.im a father of 3 and im only 25. I need help please
@@joshuamcatee3178 I hope you have had an answer already, but in case not, the relevant surgeries are scalenectomy (they cut the middle and anterior scalene muscles), first rib resection (they remove part or all of the 1st rib) and pec minor release (they can put holes in the muscle, cut part of it, or cut it entirely). The combination of surgeries required for symptom relief depend on what is causing the compression. There is a very active and informative Facebook group, if you look up Thoracic Outlet Syndrome.
Great video as always! I appreciate your commitment a lot ..sooo helpful and I really learn a lot from this channel. I realize that my numbness and tingling increase when I laydown on my back. Is it common for people with TOS?
When I the Roos test, my hands get almost instantly stiff. Is it common symptom to feel more tingling and numbness when you lay down on your back if you have a nerve issue on your neck or more so if you have TOS?
I have intense pain down both arms from my neck. Neck muscles are hard on the sides of my neck. Fingers go numb on both hands. Right shoulder aches. Tremor in right hand. Upper chest muscles are tender. I would be grateful for any help. TY. Have been subscribed for a long time. You have helped me through some painful nights following a car accident that still torments me.
I got problems with my heart, palpitations, tachycardia. totally scary, sometimes while I am in bed, I can feel the blood pulsing at the shoulder and at neck height, sometimes I get very warm up on the face, sometimes I think I am getting a heart attack.
Iv also been having palpitations that make me feel I’m going to have an heart attack and slight pain between my spine and left shoulder blade which radiates to the front of my chest doctors have put me on a ecg and heart rate seems fine. I also feel like my deep breath’s aren’t satisfying my lungs as if I’m at high altitude this started a year and half ago and my life’s been a nightmare ever since. I just want my life back
@@realtalk9195 nowadays I often think the same. want my life back, what hell, it is very depressing. I was training marathon swimming and know I can barely move. you see. the palpitations problem has improved with manual therapy and I can now at least sleep through the night, mostly. Activity seems to help somehow. It is always very hard during the first 15 minutes but then it gets better, probably because it mobilizes the area a bit. walking, doing some exercise with low cardio and low impact. no arms training other than the plank. it definitely improved when I started to avoid some positions, and in some cases, I had re-educated my body to re-accept some positions. for instance, for a month I could not sleep with only one pillow without getting these terrible palpitations. I had to use four or five pillows and still, I could not sleep properly. then I decided that enough was enough and I forced myself to lay down and just sleep with the normal one pillow. the first week was difficult but my body eventually re-adjusted. I did a lot of stretching for the upper back (I use David Procyshyn | DoYogaWithMe.com videos, avoiding positions that cause pain) and I do exercises for TOS. I also started to do exercises to get my back in shape again, doing physiotherapy exercises for shoulder and shoulder blade stability. I am not feeling well yet and I will be doing an ultrasound for TOS soon. it really sucks and I practically had to explain my doctor what TOS is, so I did a lot of useless tests for the heart, etc. but I could never survive this without physiotherapy, manual therapy, massage. It really helps a lot.
@@ip1261 omg mate thanks for the massive reply it means a lot I’m a bit busy at the min but I’m definitely going to reply to you ASAP I feel like your the only one who can relate to what I’m going through I’m also normally very active and work out a lot as you can see from my back but never taken steroids or anything only ever smoked weed and cigarettes 🚬 which I’m trying to stop I shouldn’t be feeling like this at 35. But anyway take care for now mate and I’ll reply properly soon 👍
Was also thinking it might be TOS as iv been doing all my own research. Last night I was looking into angina as I feel a horrible lump in my throat and it’s apparently a symptom of angina which sounds like heart surgery is the option to resolve it. Absolutely scared the shit out of me so I’m really really hoping it’s a nerve problem like TOS
Love your informative videos & the obvious camaraderie between you. Your interaction reminds me of the car talk guys! You are the best of the chiropractic bodywork guys :)
Oh man, I have an extra set of cervical ribs and I think I have this. My doctors and Physical Therapists thought it was just impingement because it presents in the left shoulder to a higher degree and shares the similar symptoms as what you have described here.
Thank you so much for this! I have been experiencing pain from the neck down the arm due to continuous drawing and working on the computer. The 90-90 exercise was positive for me. I would love to see the stretches to help with this. Again, thanks a ton for putting in the effort to make the video!
TH-cam recommended me to watch this video despite me not watching bob and brad or this topic on my account for several months SO somehow is listening to my conversations because this is exactly what my wife is struggling with for several weeks now. DONT SPY ON ME TH-cam, MAJOR INTRUSION OF MY PRIVACY!!!!!!!!!
It's amazing how there are many different things that can mimic cubital tunnel syndrome! That's what I thought I had but turns out it's further up! Crazy
i've started having tingling in my right armpit, right chest & back, all at the same time. no pain at all. my dr can't figure it out & my insurance sucks. what should i have them look at first?
I have TOC and I have pain in my arm, neck and shoulder. Also I have sever migraines. I can't hardly lay down to sleep. I'm being referred to a thoracic dr to see what he wants to do.
Shoveled out my driveway after 3 ft of snow....voila....next day numb right arm and hand. Hello misery. Trying all your stretches as I am a graphic designer & this is effecting my ability to work.
For me the ROOS test is negative, but when I do my job at work (ex handling files), it involves a left to right movement with my hands, I feel pain ( a pressure like) in my inner elbow, wrist, than I get up to have a rest. After this if I leave my arms hanging. My left hand swells and turns red, sometimes even blueish color. The veins are also protruding, and even visible blue veins in my palm. After some 15 min break it disappears. I often have neck pain on the left side of the neck, arm pain, elbow, wrists pain. Numbness and tingling in hands. These are changing with movements and sides. I have trigger points in my neck and chest.
I have TOS and it’s miserable. Mine was caused when the vehicle I was in was rear ended. I was at work (healthcare). It happened March 2014, I HAD to stop working Nov 2016. First surgery Dec 2016, second Nov 2017 and third was April 2019. I now need a port, more nerve blocks, more MRI’s and potentially getting a spinal cord stimulator (if I’m a candidate). I have developed serious RSD as a result of all this. I don’t wish this on anyone...
A very interesting video to me! I've been diagnosed with arthritis in c2 and c3 and am seeing my pcm tomorrow to discuss my recent mri. My physical therapist did a whole lot of testing but she said my symptoms aren't typical to what she'd expect. Maybe she was thinking what you are describing in this video. She's got me working improving posture, doing neck retractions and doorway stretches. I'll be interesting in trying your upcoming stretches, thank you for all these informational videos.
stick with it - i have been in several accidents and pretty much have permanent whiplash. i also have the extra rib - it's gets so tight in there i can't move my arms and i black out. A doctor was injecting magnesium which helps awesome - short of that do the stretches. and these guys and your physio person should help
Does Bob have an ulnar nerve injury? He seems to have trouble extending the 4th and 5th fingers on the left side. Just a quick observation based on this video.
Hi, thanks for the video. I've been dealing with significant numbness in my 4th and 5th fingers and the ulnar side of my hand, which became dramatically worse when I began doing weight training. I don't really have any neck or upper arm pain or numbness, but I thought it still might be Thoracic Outlet Syndrome because it seems to be worsened by wearing a backpack. Just now I tried the 90 90 test and I don't think I experienced any worsening of symptoms. Do you think it might be cubital tunnel syndrome? Also what type of specialist would you recommend that I see for diagnosis? Thanks!
My friend went to physical therapy what they did pull his head up with some machine its relief his pinching nerves some how he healed for over 20 years now
If we have this can we still exercise and live a normal life? Normal is subjective of course. Can we do pull ups and handstands and take care of ourselves what does it require surgery?
I am almost certain I have ntos. I suffered a trauma back in 2018 and have regularly seen my doctor for chronic pain. She is not willing to diagnose me, and I’ve had no luck with second/third opinions from other doctors. What do i do from here? Thanks so much.
I just did this test looking at you and in about 30 seconds my left hand start to heat up, increasing burning feeling especially between the elbow and the hand on the back /interior side. Some numbness as well. It is the same hand that every evening starts to get numb because I use to lie in bed, on a side, holding myself in the elbow and supporting my head with my palm, while I am looking at the phone screen. I know this is a terrible position...it is my fault. Thank you very much for the video.
I've suffered from radiating arm pain and a loss of about half my strength in my right arm for almost 2 years following a rotator cuff injury from a fall. Bob and Brad's 'chin tuck' and neck exercises have done an amazing job in helping me get rid of most of the weakness and pain. I am grateful.
what to say.. watching + commenting on videos! tryin to understand more..l have extra cervical ribs in neck left one, causes me lot's of problems, many symptoms yous speak of. your videos, great tips! even though watching in pain! both of you have a great sense of humour, with your work ☺ thanks very much
I fell forward years ago and jammed the left arm. Felt severe pain, weakness, and swelling. Even air-conditioning felt uncomfortable. Also pain in the face one same side as the arm.
🙋♀️ is throstic Outlet on BOTH SIDES?? I do have extra ribs. Pain chronic for 30 yrs .. I'm dismissed, trying 12 weeks acupressure Question acupuncture ok to try???
Thanks for the help guys. Could this type of pain be caused by a spinal fusion in the neck? Ever since I had the surgery my right arm has been so painful. I have 0 strength in it and the pain is just too much for me.
Hi Yes I have watched that video,my chronic pain, very hard doing normal day to day activities unable to work! My Dr has tried everything to get rib removed they are worried could cause more nerve damage, extra rib compressors on nerves, blood flow, my hand, arm do not function properly, cramps shaking, no feeling, purple swells up! Thank you both, lov your sense of humour ☺ here's a bit of mine, I could get a job breaking things excellent at that! hand releases I notice when hear something smash.😊 but life is very stressful for me
***** yes it's not a great situation I'm in, not going to get any better,,just do my best to stay positive... Thanks very much and for your videos very helpful information
i was diagnosed with an extra cervical rib (left side) with the possibility of TOS i have been experiencing chest pain frequently, soreness under my left armpit an sometimes weakness in my left arm i went to a cardiologist for my chest pain an they did an ekg an came back good....so i’m just wondering is it possible for TOS to cause chest pain? Please respond with this epidemic going on in america it’s impossible to get responses, Thanks
I have TOS due to 4 open-chest surgeries... Subsequent my last chest-wall reconstruction where my rigid fixation plates were replaced, the TOS through my clavicular ridge has progressed severely, despite physical therapy. Insurance still won't cover botox treatments. Do you Docs know of anything other than the recommended bilateral surgical correction I now face? I have a wonderful thoracic (and heart transplant) care team, just curious.
I was wondering if TOC can cause pain in upper chest, shoulder, neck, ribs, upper back and head all on the left side. I don't seem to get pain so much down my arm but when I do it is to the index finger thumb area. I have been dealing with pain for almost two years do to being rear ended in a car accident and want to get this figured out. it is worse while lying down or sitting.
One of the exercises I do, requires me to stand in the doorway and stretch my arms sort of above my head. Whenever I do that I feel a rush of blood in my arm, numbness, and heaviness. Why is that? The orthopedic surgeon diagnosed me with a pinched nerve on the c6 nerve, but my physical therapist believe it's TOS. My symptoms continue to change, so I'm not entirely sure what's going on. I just know I'm much better now (after three months), but it's still a struggle to workout because whenever I walk/run there's this heaviness/pain that goes to my shoulder. There's also a lot of sensitivity and pain in the base of my neck, upper back, and shoulder blade. I also have a region of my upper thigh that is extremely sensitive to pain/touch. The pain is always amplified in that specific region and I have no idea why. I just started with pain gradually and continually got worse to the point where it was excruciating and I couldn't even sleep because any movement was extremely painful.
I have pain in my thoracic partially 4th rib on my right side. The nerve pain goes to my rear delt where I’ve lost strength in that rear delt. The pain radiates from my rear delt, to my elbow, and to my pointer finger. I also have nerve pain in my right upper pec. Other questions is when i tilt my head back and to the side it hurts on, i feel the nerve pain greatly of course in my neck, rear delt and chest. Would that still be thoracic outlet syndrome?
Does it matter what arm? I belive I have this, In 2014 I was diagnosed with P E in my lungs and left arm. its very scary and i hate taking blood thinners. As a parent of three and im only 25. I shouldnt have this issue. Ive had 5 different doctors and no one knows how to stop it.
I have scalene pain (specially when I palpate scalene) on my left side. Upper traps and levator scapulae stiffness. One thing that I noticed different than before is cracking and clicking in area where first rib attaches to sternum. I do gym excercises but in last few months i do not go too heavy. At the moment I am pausing physical activity. What could be the cause and diagnose? Thanks!
wow this condition is already 2 years old! hope your condition is much better now. could it be first rib fixation syndrome? which type of movement/activities that you do that cause the cracking sound on your first rib and sternum? your anterior and middle scalenes are inserted to your first rib, which may cause that pain with unstable first rib. i was thinking that stiffness in your upper traps and levator scapulae may be compensating the unstable first rib hence they're stiffness and constant firing. tough to conclude what's really happening. it may help if you can elaborate more on what happened/what you were doing prior to when the pain occurred and what your daily activities look like during the onset of your pain.
Thanks guys. I'm a guitar player that's had surgery at the elbow and it improved, but not enough for me to return to working(playing guitar 3 hours plus at a time. It's bilateral, neck pain and scoliosis involved. Any advice would help I've spent a fortune and its cost me years of career. If anyone thinks they can help please speak up, I'm desperate
I believe Roos test is more accurate if you add external rotation to the shoulders because it closes off that brachial plexus. If the artery stops isn’t that just a positive sign of arterial insufficiency due to thoracic outlet and doesn’t that just make up 1% of all thoracic outlet cases?
I have these symptoms and it's driving me mad. Also have a 'vapour' like sensation on top of the pain, burning, cold and tingling but uts in both arms and hands? I've subscribed and hoping to get to the bottom of my symptoms ..been going on for over a year now, started with pain in just right shoulder, thought it was rotator cuff at first 😪
Is torn rotator type 3 a cause of thoracic syndrome? My pain and numbness (knives and ice picks not pins and needles) starts at the shoulder joint all the way to my finger tips. I fell against my arm and my deltoid has felt like it tore.
I dont feel a pinch near my shoulder but my ring and pinky fingers get numb when my arms are bent and relaxed. I got tested for cubital tunnel and it came back negative.
I have referred pain to my eye from around that same pinched area, could this be something else or is this sometimes a symptom of TOS? I never hear anyone mention that.
Do you both have new videos on this? Or can you do some please? Also with the ulnar nerve irritation? I received a massage and I already have some shoulder issues and I left with this new one. We’re trying to figure out what it is. I’m going to occupational therapy and saw hand orthopedic surgeon. It’s quite uncomfortable with all the tingling, numbness, and restrictions and some pain.
This was just mentioned to me from a neurologist I saw for the first time for a new diagnosis of Chianti malformation, for which I have had many progressive worsening symptoms over the years. Just didn’t know what was causing my problems. At any rate, I’ve exp bilateral arm and hand numbness for the past couple of years. This has happened one other time that lasted 6 months and spontaneously resolved just as it abruptly began. However, this is accompanied by instant edema in the hands as soon as I lay down for bed. Left side is the worst. I’m not a back sleeper but have found myself sleeping this way for the past two years thinking it’s alleviating symptoms, but doesn’t. My left hand instantly swells and I experience shooting pain up my arm and in my hands all nite long. More often than not, I lay awake repositioning my left arm for hours until I fall asleep. I cannot carry anything with my left arm and I lose capacity to even feel I’m grasping anything almost instantly. I would awaken with pain in the middle finger joint and have a clicking movement which has resolved, but has moved to the left thumb. I had thought it was due to the herniation of the cerebellum, which makes sense. Until the neurologist mentioned thoracic outlet syndrome. She did movement testing but apparently I don’t have positives where they should be. I’m also an RN and have been working on a masters degree, so I’m no stranger to interpreting research and also know that a person doesn’t necessarily have to fit into those testing maneuvers to have a specific disorder. The neurologist determined that I don’t have this condition, but I’m unconvinced. I also live in Vermont and most know this is a rural state. Her practice is an hour north of Stowe- again, rural. I don’t trust her findings nor do I feel she’s mot as up to date with current research. I’m experiencing a great deal of pain from Chiari and most of my symptoms have been dismissed, even tho I know better. The instant hand edema as soon as I lay down and the pain waking me thru out the nite is unbearable. I don’t know what to do.
Just started experiencing this about a month ago and it is progressively getting worse. I dread going to bed at night because that is when it flares up the most. Not fun at all
Do you have eds with Chari I don't have Chari off brain MRI anyways.i have hsd this been diagnosed fybromyalgia as this lot started in my throat 6 years ago then to collerbone 2.5 years now it's in shoulder s armpits I have had tingling down arm but it's constant in shoulders armpits something to do with hypomobility ime sure
Can this effect both arms or just the right as you are demonstrating? I mainly have these symptoms in my left arm as well as arthritic like inflammation in my elbow and thumb stemming from neck/shoulder all the way down arm. Can the elbow and joints be effected by this condition or could that be something else?
Found this and your other shoulder videos interesting as I can’t find much on here re a rare Arthritis syndrome called SAPHO syndrome-I have had 2 shoulder surgery’s and next month having 1st rib resection and bone growth removed from left clavicle (poss clavicle section completely removed ). Thanks for your very informative videos Sal
I'm 29. Whats Strange is my thumb, index and middle fingers all went tingly at first and then numb a while ago.. not the ring and pinky. But I Was just diagnosed with TOS. Have major weakness in arm. How risky is surgery and will the muscles heal afterwards? I'm sick of this weakness, numbness,, and pain. I have a degree in climate control so my work is demanding on my body. Cant lift my arm over my head for 60 seconds without it going limp. Pain does go through neck sometimes, and under armpit, and into right peck, down my right-side of chest.. I gave up hope a while ago but now that there's an option open to me I'm going to take it if PT doesn't work out well. Thoughts?
As PT's, do you find a lot of comorbid conditions, such as Eagle Syndrome, Ankylosing Spondylitis or even Thyroid Disease amongst your TOS patients? I also have SJogren's which resulted in Pancreatitis, then loss of all my teeth ( I believe the AS which was undetected at age 35 with removal of all my natural teeth could have been a combination cause as to formation of proper bone within my entire body) Do you find mostly the Neurogenic type TOS is in most of your patients seeking PT? IS PT BEFORE any surgery to remove ribs bilaterally, better to do or is it better to wait until AFTER surgery? or BOTH? Do you find it harder to work on those who are athletes, versus those who are not? Have either of you ever worked on patients who have been hit by lightning (not the CAUSE of the NTOS, but possibly exacerbating it?) I can perform self-acupressure to various areas of my body which relieves me of some pain. When I do this, the blood flow change is palpable by others as well. No one knows what to make of this anomaly of mine, but I feel that even if BOTH ribs are removed, that if there IS an underlying cause affecting me that is not addressed that I will be back at square one... As you well know, determining that it is NTOS took some time, I am now in pursuit of a good surgeon. Initially, it was thought I'd had FMD (Fibromuscular Dysplasia) prior ot the angiography and I still feel that is a possibility, although the surgeon who did my angiography told me it is not, I felt it may be in other areas of the body which is why I feel the acupressure connected changes in flow. I am aware there are no nerves in veins and adn arteries but there certainly ARE in the surrounding muscles, fascia, tendons etc, which I s what I was trying to explain to these doctors BEFORE the NTOS diagnosis. I also had some issues during my angiography, suffering a small left sided stroke which THEY did not SEE me having, as they quickly ledme out of the procedure room without performing ANY type of test to ensure NOTHING happened ( I told them later they ought to at least perform at the very least, a vision tests with EVERY SINGLE PATIENT getting an angiography from now on, to make sure they hada NOT suffered a stroke, he promised me he would) I suffered a small loss of vision but nothing else, I can still drive with special glasses thankfully! I kept banging into doors on the drive home as we stopped for a bite to eat and I felt extraordinarily LOOPY fro the partial anesthesia, depsite having had major surgeries before that I got up and walked a straight line and here I was totally OUT of it! I was SPOT BLINDED! I am ok now. I have noticed some ageism within doctors opinions in some studies I've read, regarding surgery versus PT. I believe that some doctors would be scared off from wanting to perform surgery, due to the comorbid conditions. SOme have looked at me NOT at my studies at all and proclaimed me to be OK I don't have it, when the studies I'd brought with me showed it for certain! The diagnosing doctor is no longer at that facility, so now I am on a quest to find a surgeon and am hopefully wanting to be able to save some of the bone for reconsutructive surgery on my sinus bridge as overly aggressive sinus surgery removed too much turbinate and I am having problems sleeping due to breathing issues (machines dry me out it's like sucking on a blow dryer all night, in addition to Sjogren's) I thank you both in advance for any and all suggestions you might have for me! I look forward to your reply. This video is very helpful as well!
I find out my from ultrasound by lifting my arm in difference positions and show the uneven pulse, so i did physical therapy with out procedure. How ever after I lost 30 pounds of weight my symptoms was going away on it own
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Thanks guys, I've been trying to figure out my arm/shoulder pain, but tested neg on the 90 90 one. I know my symptoms arise from writing notes and using a mouse. Because that's when it hurts the most. My 5th and 4th digits get really weak it's hard to hold a pencil after an hour of writing or typing. And when I stretch my forearm out I definitely feel a painful stretch in my flexor Capri ulnaris and those same digits. Then occasionally I have a dull pinpoint pain in my shoulder underneath the acromion. I can make the pain from that same location sharp if I try to practice good posture(shoulders back) , and turn my head to look over opposite shoulder while also bring ear down to shoulder to make a stretch on the affected side. The stretch on affected side feels good, but it definitely makes that dull pain turn sharp. If you have any videos on that or could make one that'd be great! -best
@@flick9066 it was a neck referral! Took about 6 months before we figured out what it was. My physical therapist found a spot on my upper trap that with trigger point release the referral went away. I haven’t had any pain since and able to return to writing and using a mouse, but I also don’t write as much as i used to (no longer a student).
@@t4health527 i reckon i have thoracic outlet syndrome. As i have serious tightness in brachial plexus and continuously tingling and weakness in right arm(ulnar path) .
I've got a cervical rib and I'm a powerlifter ... don't get any arm issue just get stiff neck issues, currently have a kind of trapped nerve turning head to left ..
My numbing and tingling and when there’s pain doesn’t go away It’s been constant for a week now. Definitely a weakness and it’s hard to open and close my hand.
@@deerinheadlights9784 Oh my, did you ever go to the doctor? Are you able to lift heavy items? Mine is aggravated and now it's radiating to my collarbone which it never did. I have an appointment with my doctor tmrw. I really hope this goes away soon because it's affecting my life. I can't even work right now. :(
@@brittanygriffin6609 yes I went to hand therapy (occupational). They did cranial sacral, Myofascial tissue release, and gave me some exercises. Mine was really bad for awhile. I couldn’t do much at all with that hand. Nerve stuff Is scary and takes a few months to heal (depending on what it is). Trust your provider (if you do) and ask for help if you can. I had a lot of help from 2 people those 3 months. I have other injures too so not out of the clear. Glad that one is better (no 100 but much much better). Hope you make it through and feel better soon as can be. Definitely could not lift even like 5 lbs. I couldn’t even grip my steering wheel, eat, and was afraid I’d need a home health care aid (live solo). It was scary, I cried a lot, couldn’t type, the lost goes on. I had to restructure my life. I also have a tough shoulder injury on the other side and now whiplash from a few months ago (and a hip labrum tear that is much better) so taking things a day at a time. More then you asked I know. All that to say it depends on what all is going on in your body, mind, emotions, circumstances, etc.
@@brittanygriffin6609 be easy on yourself emotionally as you can. Give yourself a break and to grieve not working. I learned to be appreciative of the perspective being injured gives. People don’t realize how much our bodies help and it gives me some clarity on aspects of ableism. Not a give I asked for but not one id have if none of this happened because why or how could I?
Several years ago I got a problem when lifting a weight. I got something like a cramp in the muscles above my right scapula near the neck. It wasn't painful but suddenly mu shoulder blade felt like it was out of place and hanging. My entire right shoulder dropped lower. Since then I always have the urge to try and reposition it back and into place. Imagine like you are carrying a backpack on one shoulder and you feel it slipping. This is what I feel and the motion I would do to reposition the backpack is what I am constantly doing with my shoulder. The bigger problem however is that I got some weakness in my pectoral muscles on the right side, in my right triceps and some tingling in my pectoralis. When I go to the gym and do bench press, my right side is always weaker and it feels like I can never really engage the muscles into the motion. Please help me, what is this and how can I get rid of it?
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I've been a guitar player for over 12 years and, 6 years ago I had severe lack of coordination/strenght on the pinky and ring finger of my left arm. After a mistaken diagnostic, I had a cubital tunnel surgery and it did not improve my condition at all. A couple weeks ago I had the thoracic outlet syndrome diagnosis from another medic. Im following your videos and doing the exercises, I really hope to get better for guitar playing is what I like best in life and I can't do it properly for 6 years now. Thx Bob and Brad.
Rômulo Lopes best wishes, I hope this is the solution and you can go back to making music, talent is such a gift when it is studied and mastered!
I have it too. Play guitar too. Heavy laborer too. I've had surgeries. 6 years later it's worse
This condition crimps my piano style as well. Also being an artist, I really need my left hand to work properly. My chiropractor told me ergonomics and posture are very important for this. I think maximizing a limited practice time by reading sheet music if that will apply or listening a lot. Playing back recordings of yourself, making sure you have the lightest setup possible for your guitar. More slow practice maybe? You can listen to it faster on the playback. Expression will be better since there is so much control. Chiropractor adjustments helped me as well.
My arm goes numb within 1 min of playing
I pray you all get well soon :( salam
After of over a year experiencing and having these symptoms and doing all sorts of chest releases stretches hanging from bars serratus anterior stretches all kind of back releases qll stretches inner armpit tricep and bicep stretches all which would give me some minor relief I finally found videos and the cause with videos like yours and I'm very grateful and thankful thank you for all that you guys do you're awesome.
Witch videos helped you ?
Q
@@Peterhgf3214 this one
I'm actually diagnosed with Therasic Outlet Syndrome with Bilateral Cervical Ribs and it took extremely long (a full year) to find and now has caused tendinous in both rotator cuffs as well as extreme neck pain and striffness. My physical therapist found it before any doctor did. Everyone thought I was faking it. (Age 21)
My chiropractor is my best bet when it comes to diagnosing anything. I've been to a well-known orthopedist in my area and he thinks I have "sick scapula syndrome." After doing the first test in this video, my arm and hand tingled. I am going back to the ortho next week and I will mention TOS. Thanks!
We have similar stories CodyWynnee! I got accused of drug seeking, brushed off, and eventually misdiagnosed with a rheum disease despite all rheum tests being negative before I was diagnosed w/ TOS. Your comment was 4 years ago. How are you now?
Yeah, this is what I’m dealing with. It was initiated by a spinal injury at age 19. The doctor’s mention of neglecting back exercise is spot on. Weight training simply exacerbates the problem unless it is balanced with properly coached back muscles training. Exercising for vanity can do more damage than good. Exercise for utility, not for vanity.
Wtf this is exactly what happened to me how do you fix it?
3 years. It took me 3 years to finally find what has been causing my damn hand problems. Only a few days ago I found out about TOS and now I am 90% sure that's what I have. Thank you for helping confirm my hypothesis.
Same! I’ve been to countless doctors, ran so many tests
Did you get it fixed?
@@PlayCodeCreate how is it now
Great video guys. I specifically help people with TOS and also do videos to try help. Great info!
Any tips you can help me with?
yup, i have that extra rip- also been in accidents and doctors now just say i have permanent concussion syndrome. Your exercises help, and i've you are like me - you do them for life.
Golf and bad workout in the gym have caused me to have these symptoms!
oh wow- I think I may have finally found out what is wrong with my shoulder...after 5+ years of horrific pain, disc surgery, nerve ablation, implanted stimulators, and daily painkillers...I am calling my Neuro surgeon first thing Monday morning to offer TOS as a possibility...Hope to God I'm right, because this pain is unbearable- I want my life back!!!
So wtf happened?
Yeah what happened
Hi- in the end, it wasn’t TOS, and I went another few years in agony, until I finally convinced my shoulder surgeon to do a laparoscopic exploratory surgery before I finally gave up and accepted the intense intense pain... he said he was 98% certain that he would find nothing wrong.
In fact- I had a completely shredded bicep tendon that was wrapped up in my nerve. Oddly enough, it was completely hidden in my multiple MRIs and other tests.
It took about a year before it was healed, but thankfully it feels so much better ( not perfect- those days are gone thanks to the delay in treatment).
I hope you all find some relief from your pain soon!
M
@@MBrusaZappellini god bless you mane I hope everyone else will get better too!!
for the past collar bone and sub clavicles pain kind of mimic for chest pain. many doctor rule out many conditions but never found out what is wrong and now i have shoulder pain, which travels from trapazius to rhomboid muscle and also hurt my occipital and for the past 6 months i have been gone to the countless doctor. now another new doctor asked me to do Thoracic outlet syndrome test. EMG.
did you figure out and fix everything?
Can you do a video on exercises that can improve TOS as well pleeeease?! 🙏🙏🙏 Thanks for all the good content, your channel is so helpful!
th-cam.com/video/NJ6jHfdZGlg/w-d-xo.html
4 years i been going through pain. Had multiple mris and nerve studies for my shoulder and nothing. I now im convinced that its TOS. I will check with my dr.
Do you have raynards alongside it?
I was diagnosed with Thoracic Outlet Syndrome after my arm went twice the size and purple due to a clot in the artery. Thankfully it was all caught in time and now am on blood thinners and going to have surgery! Great video. Helps to know exactly where the issue stemmed from. Appreciate it!
My arm did that and I had the surgery too. Quite painful lol
My arm did that but no doctor can come up with the cause.please, whats the name of this surgery!? Ive been on blood thinners 5 years and im so tired of pain and the scaryness.im a father of 3 and im only 25. I need help please
@@joshuamcatee3178 I hope you have had an answer already, but in case not, the relevant surgeries are scalenectomy (they cut the middle and anterior scalene muscles), first rib resection (they remove part or all of the 1st rib) and pec minor release (they can put holes in the muscle, cut part of it, or cut it entirely). The combination of surgeries required for symptom relief depend on what is causing the compression. There is a very active and informative Facebook group, if you look up Thoracic Outlet Syndrome.
Great video as always! I appreciate your commitment a lot ..sooo helpful and I really learn a lot from this channel. I realize that my numbness and tingling increase when I laydown on my back. Is it common for people with TOS?
When I the Roos test, my hands get almost instantly stiff. Is it common symptom to feel more tingling and numbness when you lay down on your back if you have a nerve issue on your neck or more so if you have TOS?
@@itsyejy I feel this same symptom. How are you doing now? Ever get a diagnosis?
I have intense pain down both arms from my neck. Neck muscles are hard on the sides of my neck. Fingers go numb on both hands. Right shoulder aches. Tremor in right hand. Upper chest muscles are tender. I would be grateful for any help. TY. Have been subscribed for a long time. You have helped me through some painful nights following a car accident that still torments me.
I got problems with my heart, palpitations, tachycardia. totally scary, sometimes while I am in bed, I can feel the blood pulsing at the shoulder and at neck height, sometimes I get very warm up on the face, sometimes I think I am getting a heart attack.
Iv also been having palpitations that make me feel I’m going to have an heart attack and slight pain between my spine and left shoulder blade which radiates to the front of my chest doctors have put me on a ecg and heart rate seems fine. I also feel like my deep breath’s aren’t satisfying my lungs as if I’m at high altitude this started a year and half ago and my life’s been a nightmare ever since. I just want my life back
@@realtalk9195 nowadays I often think the same. want my life back, what hell, it is very depressing. I was training marathon swimming and know I can barely move. you see. the palpitations problem has improved with manual therapy and I can now at least sleep through the night, mostly. Activity seems to help somehow. It is always very hard during the first 15 minutes but then it gets better, probably because it mobilizes the area a bit. walking, doing some exercise with low cardio and low impact. no arms training other than the plank. it definitely improved when I started to avoid some positions, and in some cases, I had re-educated my body to re-accept some positions. for instance, for a month I could not sleep with only one pillow without getting these terrible palpitations. I had to use four or five pillows and still, I could not sleep properly. then I decided that enough was enough and I forced myself to lay down and just sleep with the normal one pillow. the first week was difficult but my body eventually re-adjusted. I did a lot of stretching for the upper back (I use David Procyshyn | DoYogaWithMe.com videos, avoiding positions that cause pain) and I do exercises for TOS. I also started to do exercises to get my back in shape again, doing physiotherapy exercises for shoulder and shoulder blade stability. I am not feeling well yet and I will be doing an ultrasound for TOS soon. it really sucks and I practically had to explain my doctor what TOS is, so I did a lot of useless tests for the heart, etc. but I could never survive this without physiotherapy, manual therapy, massage. It really helps a lot.
@@ip1261 omg mate thanks for the massive reply it means a lot I’m a bit busy at the min but I’m definitely going to reply to you ASAP I feel like your the only one who can relate to what I’m going through I’m also normally very active and work out a lot as you can see from my back but never taken steroids or anything only ever smoked weed and cigarettes 🚬 which I’m trying to stop I shouldn’t be feeling like this at 35. But anyway take care for now mate and I’ll reply properly soon 👍
Was also thinking it might be TOS as iv been doing all my own research. Last night I was looking into angina as I feel a horrible lump in my throat and it’s apparently a symptom of angina which sounds like heart surgery is the option to resolve it. Absolutely scared the shit out of me so I’m really really hoping it’s a nerve problem like TOS
I’m dealing with the same issue
Love your informative videos & the obvious camaraderie between you.
Your interaction reminds me of the car talk guys! You are the best of the chiropractic bodywork guys :)
Oh man, I have an extra set of cervical ribs and I think I have this. My doctors and Physical Therapists thought it was just impingement because it presents in the left shoulder to a higher degree and shares the similar symptoms as what you have described here.
same with me, doctors said rotator cuff/bicep tendonitis. Nobody thinks thoracic outlet except me.
Thank you so much for this! I have been experiencing pain from the neck down the arm due to continuous drawing and working on the computer. The 90-90 exercise was positive for me. I would love to see the stretches to help with this. Again, thanks a ton for putting in the effort to make the video!
TH-cam recommended me to watch this video despite me not watching bob and brad or this topic on my account for several months SO somehow is listening to my conversations because this is exactly what my wife is struggling with for several weeks now. DONT SPY ON ME TH-cam, MAJOR INTRUSION OF MY PRIVACY!!!!!!!!!
It's amazing how there are many different things that can mimic cubital tunnel syndrome! That's what I thought I had but turns out it's further up! Crazy
Hey are you feeling better?
i've started having tingling in my right armpit, right chest & back, all at the same time. no pain at all. my dr can't figure it out & my insurance sucks. what should i have them look at first?
You guys rule.
I have TOC and I have pain in my arm, neck and shoulder. Also I have sever migraines. I can't hardly lay down to sleep. I'm being referred to a thoracic dr to see what he wants to do.
Would wearing a posture correction vest help by retracting the shoulders to manage tightness
What exercises can you do to help alleviate thoracic outlet syndrome?
Shoveled out my driveway after 3 ft of snow....voila....next day numb right arm and hand. Hello misery. Trying all your stretches as I am a graphic designer & this is effecting my ability to work.
I am a painter and I cannot work at all because of it.
How are you doing now? Did you see a doctor?
@@ip1261 same here. How are you doing now?
For me the ROOS test is negative, but when I do my job at work (ex handling files), it involves a left to right movement with my hands, I feel pain ( a pressure like) in my inner elbow, wrist, than I get up to have a rest. After this if I leave my arms hanging. My left hand swells and turns red, sometimes even blueish color. The veins are also protruding, and even visible blue veins in my palm. After some 15 min break it disappears. I often have neck pain on the left side of the neck, arm pain, elbow, wrists pain. Numbness and tingling in hands. These are changing with movements and sides. I have trigger points in my neck and chest.
How do you treat it?
I found it! What if you put pressure right above the clavicle and it reproduces the pain in my arm; shoots pain down my arm. Is that TOS?
.. hoping you do more of this kind of videos please... 😊
I have TOS and it’s miserable. Mine was caused when the vehicle I was in was rear ended. I was at work (healthcare). It happened March 2014, I HAD to stop working Nov 2016. First surgery Dec 2016, second Nov 2017 and third was April 2019. I now need a port, more nerve blocks, more MRI’s and potentially getting a spinal cord stimulator (if I’m a candidate). I have developed serious RSD as a result of all this. I don’t wish this on anyone...
A very interesting video to me! I've been diagnosed with arthritis in c2 and c3 and am seeing my pcm tomorrow to discuss my recent mri. My physical therapist did a whole lot of testing but she said my symptoms aren't typical to what she'd expect. Maybe she was thinking what you are describing in this video. She's got me working improving posture, doing neck retractions and doorway stretches. I'll be interesting in trying your upcoming stretches, thank you for all these informational videos.
stick with it - i have been in several accidents and pretty much have permanent whiplash. i also have the extra rib - it's gets so tight in there i can't move my arms and i black out. A doctor was injecting magnesium which helps awesome - short of that do the stretches. and these guys and your physio person should help
So, are you saying pain is more in the arm and not so much in the shoulder with TOS?
Does this cause atrophy on your hands? Also does wearing suspenders all day cause this?
Try doing iron pose when he shoots out of his palms but laterally.
Does Bob have an ulnar nerve injury? He seems to have trouble extending the 4th and 5th fingers on the left side. Just a quick observation based on this video.
I saw that too. Thats interesting. If he cant fix that for himself, then nobody can
He has a syndrome where your fingers get into a bent position and stay that way. It starts with a 'D', my husbands family has this also.
@@brodhax6148
@@brodhax6148 it is called Dupuytren Syndrome, just remembered what it was called.
Hi, thanks for the video. I've been dealing with significant numbness in my 4th and 5th fingers and the ulnar side of my hand, which became dramatically worse when I began doing weight training. I don't really have any neck or upper arm pain or numbness, but I thought it still might be Thoracic Outlet Syndrome because it seems to be worsened by wearing a backpack. Just now I tried the 90 90 test and I don't think I experienced any worsening of symptoms. Do you think it might be cubital tunnel syndrome? Also what type of specialist would you recommend that I see for diagnosis? Thanks!
My friend went to physical therapy what they did pull his head up with some machine its relief his pinching nerves some how he healed for over 20 years now
How are you doing now? Did you find an answer?
@@izzysat7041 decompression, yeeesssss
If we have this can we still exercise and live a normal life? Normal is subjective of course. Can we do pull ups and handstands and take care of ourselves what does it require surgery?
I am almost certain I have ntos. I suffered a trauma back in 2018 and have regularly seen my doctor for chronic pain. She is not willing to diagnose me, and I’ve had no luck with second/third opinions from other doctors. What do i do from here? Thanks so much.
Same here with similar Dr.s except since 2005. Keep trying new Dr's till you feel they serve your needs. Keep trying & don't give up.
I just did this test looking at you and in about 30 seconds my left hand start to heat up, increasing burning feeling especially between the elbow and the hand on the back /interior side. Some numbness as well. It is the same hand that every evening starts to get numb because I use to lie in bed, on a side, holding myself in the elbow and supporting my head with my palm, while I am looking at the phone screen. I know this is a terrible position...it is my fault. Thank you very much for the video.
I've suffered from radiating arm pain and a loss of about half my strength in my right arm for almost 2 years following a rotator cuff injury from a fall. Bob and Brad's 'chin tuck' and neck exercises have done an amazing job in helping me get rid of most of the weakness and pain. I am grateful.
are you serious how is this possible?
You guys are awesome!
what to say.. watching + commenting on videos! tryin to understand more..l have extra cervical ribs in neck left one, causes me lot's of problems, many symptoms yous speak of. your videos, great tips! even though watching in pain! both of you have a great sense of humour, with your work ☺ thanks very much
Hi I have pain in my right upper chest near beauty bone pain spreads in under arm shoulder arm and had fingers ..are these symptoms thoracic out let
You guys are always so funny! Was wondering about how Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome would play into developing this? any info would be great, Thanks!
I have this problem. My right hand does not have any power & are numb. By my question is that which kind of doctors should operate this issue?
Does this result in muscle wasting in palm and hand ?
I fell forward years ago and jammed the left arm. Felt severe pain, weakness, and swelling. Even air-conditioning felt uncomfortable. Also pain in the face one same side as the arm.
I have the same symptoms as yours.. itching like burning and numbness in my left arm
what happened? are you ok now?
Why 2 mins it's too. Long this 90 degress
QUESTION!! Can this cause TINNITUS?
🙋♀️ is throstic Outlet on BOTH SIDES?? I do have extra ribs. Pain chronic for 30 yrs .. I'm dismissed, trying 12 weeks acupressure
Question acupuncture ok to try???
Thanks for the help guys. Could this type of pain be caused by a spinal fusion in the neck? Ever since I had the surgery my right arm has been so painful. I have 0 strength in it and the pain is just too much for me.
I am seeing a dr on monday. not cleared for any kind of pt yet
It could be
what if you have the opposite symptoms? so excessive blood flow/pooling/swelling/pain/burning to the hand that is relieved by raising the arms.
Hi Yes I have watched that video,my chronic pain, very hard doing normal day to day activities unable to work! My Dr has tried everything to get rib removed they are worried could cause more nerve damage, extra rib compressors on nerves, blood flow, my hand, arm do not function properly, cramps shaking, no feeling, purple swells up! Thank you both, lov your sense of humour ☺ here's a bit of mine, I could get a job breaking things excellent at that! hand releases I notice when hear something smash.😊 but life is very stressful for me
***** yes it's not a great situation I'm in, not going to get any better,,just do my best to stay positive... Thanks very much and for your videos very helpful information
does anyone have this symptom when you push your neck down and you get chest pain near the collar bone and sub clavicles and travels to sternum?
Me too
Thank you 🙏🙂
i was diagnosed with an extra cervical rib (left side) with the possibility of TOS i have been experiencing chest pain frequently, soreness under my left armpit an sometimes weakness in my left arm i went to a cardiologist for my chest pain an they did an ekg an came back good....so i’m just wondering is it possible for TOS to cause chest pain? Please respond with this epidemic going on in america it’s impossible to get responses, Thanks
It does cause chest pain, I have a cervical rib in my left side aswell and I’ve been experiencing chest pain.
I have TOS due to 4 open-chest surgeries...
Subsequent my last chest-wall reconstruction where my rigid fixation plates were replaced, the TOS through my clavicular ridge has progressed severely, despite physical therapy. Insurance still won't cover botox treatments. Do you Docs know of anything other than the recommended bilateral surgical correction I now face? I have a wonderful thoracic (and heart transplant) care team, just curious.
Is there any radiologic test you have to do for the definitive diagnosis or is it clinically diagnosed?
Thanks for the reply
I was wondering if TOC can cause pain in upper chest, shoulder, neck, ribs, upper back and head all on the left side. I don't seem to get pain so much down my arm but when I do it is to the index finger thumb area.
I have been dealing with pain for almost two years do to being rear ended in a car accident and want to get this figured out. it is worse while lying down or sitting.
An injury, such as a car accident can cause TOS.
@@singingmanmd Thank you for replying. I just started IMS Intra muscular simulation. I am crossing my fingers.
One of the exercises I do, requires me to stand in the doorway and stretch my arms sort of above my head. Whenever I do that I feel a rush of blood in my arm, numbness, and heaviness. Why is that?
The orthopedic surgeon diagnosed me with a pinched nerve on the c6 nerve, but my physical therapist believe it's TOS. My symptoms continue to change, so I'm not entirely sure what's going on. I just know I'm much better now (after three months), but it's still a struggle to workout because whenever I walk/run there's this heaviness/pain that goes to my shoulder. There's also a lot of sensitivity and pain in the base of my neck, upper back, and shoulder blade. I also have a region of my upper thigh that is extremely sensitive to pain/touch. The pain is always amplified in that specific region and I have no idea why. I just started with pain gradually and continually got worse to the point where it was excruciating and I couldn't even sleep because any movement was extremely painful.
How are you now?
@@amylynnlee3 Much better but that area still gets tight very easily regardless of stretching.
I have this. No medical insurance. Has progressed over 18 years. Debilitating.
I have pain in my thoracic partially 4th rib on my right side. The nerve pain goes to my rear delt where I’ve lost strength in that rear delt. The pain radiates from my rear delt, to my elbow, and to my pointer finger. I also have nerve pain in my right upper pec. Other questions is when i tilt my head back and to the side it hurts on, i feel the nerve pain greatly of course in my neck, rear delt and chest. Would that still be thoracic outlet syndrome?
Does it matter what arm? I belive I have this, In 2014 I was diagnosed with P E in my lungs and left arm. its very scary and i hate taking blood thinners. As a parent of three and im only 25. I shouldnt have this issue. Ive had 5 different doctors and no one knows how to stop it.
I have scalene pain (specially when I palpate scalene) on my left side. Upper traps and levator scapulae stiffness. One thing that I noticed different than before is cracking and clicking in area where first rib attaches to sternum. I do gym excercises but in last few months i do not go too heavy. At the moment I am pausing physical activity. What could be the cause and diagnose? Thanks!
Frana Perišić sane! I wish there were answers here!
wow this condition is already 2 years old! hope your condition is much better now.
could it be first rib fixation syndrome?
which type of movement/activities that you do that cause the cracking sound on your first rib and sternum? your anterior and middle scalenes are inserted to your first rib, which may cause that pain with unstable first rib. i was thinking that stiffness in your upper traps and levator scapulae may be compensating the unstable first rib hence they're stiffness and constant firing. tough to conclude what's really happening. it may help if you can elaborate more on what happened/what you were doing prior to when the pain occurred and what your daily activities look like during the onset of your pain.
Wow sir outstanding..... Super..... Helpful....
Thank u sir
Thanks guys. I'm a guitar player that's had surgery at the elbow and it improved, but not enough for me to return to working(playing guitar 3 hours plus at a time. It's bilateral, neck pain and scoliosis involved. Any advice would help I've spent a fortune and its cost me years of career. If anyone thinks they can help please speak up, I'm desperate
I work with Robert Thompson, the major guy who does this surgery. He is a super nice guy
I believe Roos test is more accurate if you add external rotation to the shoulders because it closes off that brachial plexus.
If the artery stops isn’t that just a positive sign of arterial insufficiency due to thoracic outlet and doesn’t that just make up 1% of all thoracic outlet cases?
Sir i m in 1%, show me solution without surgery, its coz ig coz of athritis, my artery pressed by first rib according to doctors
Witch video is to relieve that pain?
I have these symptoms and it's driving me mad. Also have a 'vapour' like sensation on top of the pain, burning, cold and tingling but uts in both arms and hands? I've subscribed and hoping to get to the bottom of my symptoms ..been going on for over a year now, started with pain in just right shoulder, thought it was rotator cuff at first 😪
Is torn rotator type 3 a cause of thoracic syndrome? My pain and numbness (knives and ice picks not pins and needles) starts at the shoulder joint all the way to my finger tips. I fell against my arm and my deltoid has felt like it tore.
I dont feel a pinch near my shoulder but my ring and pinky fingers get numb when my arms are bent and relaxed. I got tested for cubital tunnel and it came back negative.
Hello Dr Bob Schrubb are suffered with Dupuytren's contracture?
I noticed that too. on his left hand. pretty obvious
I have referred pain to my eye from around that same pinched area, could this be something else or is this sometimes a symptom of TOS? I never hear anyone mention that.
Do you both have new videos on this? Or can you do some please? Also with the ulnar nerve irritation? I received a massage and I already have some shoulder issues and I left with this new one. We’re trying to figure out what it is. I’m going to occupational therapy and saw hand orthopedic surgeon. It’s quite uncomfortable with all the tingling, numbness, and restrictions and some pain.
Does this causes migraine and headaches?
This was just mentioned to me from a neurologist I saw for the first time for a new diagnosis of Chianti malformation, for which I have had many progressive worsening symptoms over the years. Just didn’t know what was causing my problems. At any rate, I’ve exp bilateral arm and hand numbness for the past couple of years. This has happened one other time that lasted 6 months and spontaneously resolved just as it abruptly began. However, this is accompanied by instant edema in the hands as soon as I lay down for bed. Left side is the worst. I’m not a back sleeper but have found myself sleeping this way for the past two years thinking it’s alleviating symptoms, but doesn’t. My left hand instantly swells and I experience shooting pain up my arm and in my hands all nite long. More often than not, I lay awake repositioning my left arm for hours until I fall asleep. I cannot carry anything with my left arm and I lose capacity to even feel I’m grasping anything almost instantly. I would awaken with pain in the middle finger joint and have a clicking movement which has resolved, but has moved to the left thumb. I had thought it was due to the herniation of the cerebellum, which makes sense. Until the neurologist mentioned thoracic outlet syndrome. She did movement testing but apparently I don’t have positives where they should be. I’m also an RN and have been working on a masters degree, so I’m no stranger to interpreting research and also know that a person doesn’t necessarily have to fit into those testing maneuvers to have a specific disorder. The neurologist determined that I don’t have this condition, but I’m unconvinced. I also live in Vermont and most know this is a rural state. Her practice is an hour north of Stowe- again, rural. I don’t trust her findings nor do I feel she’s mot as up to date with current research. I’m experiencing a great deal of pain from Chiari and most of my symptoms have been dismissed, even tho I know better. The instant hand edema as soon as I lay down and the pain waking me thru out the nite is unbearable. I don’t know what to do.
Just started experiencing this about a month ago and it is progressively getting worse. I dread going to bed at night because that is when it flares up the most. Not fun at all
Do you have eds with Chari I don't have Chari off brain MRI anyways.i have hsd this been diagnosed fybromyalgia as this lot started in my throat 6 years ago then to collerbone 2.5 years now it's in shoulder s armpits I have had tingling down arm but it's constant in shoulders armpits something to do with hypomobility ime sure
If your hand is weak is that only nerve interference or more serious?
Can this effect both arms or just the right as you are demonstrating? I mainly have these symptoms in my left arm as well as arthritic like inflammation in my elbow and thumb stemming from neck/shoulder all the way down arm. Can the elbow and joints be effected by this condition or could that be something else?
Does Bob have Dupuytren's contracture @ min 4.00?
Found this and your other shoulder videos interesting as I can’t find much on here re a rare Arthritis syndrome called SAPHO syndrome-I have had 2 shoulder surgery’s and next month having 1st rib resection and bone growth removed from left clavicle (poss clavicle section completely removed ). Thanks for your very informative videos Sal
Did the surgery help you??? After it was done and you went to PT were you stronger afterwards and did feeling return to your arm???
I'm 29. Whats Strange is my thumb, index and middle fingers all went tingly at first and then numb a while ago.. not the ring and pinky. But I Was just diagnosed with TOS. Have major weakness in arm. How risky is surgery and will the muscles heal afterwards? I'm sick of this weakness, numbness,, and pain. I have a degree in climate control so my work is demanding on my body. Cant lift my arm over my head for 60 seconds without it going limp. Pain does go through neck sometimes, and under armpit, and into right peck, down my right-side of chest.. I gave up hope a while ago but now that there's an option open to me I'm going to take it if PT doesn't work out well. Thoughts?
As PT's, do you find a lot of comorbid conditions, such as Eagle Syndrome, Ankylosing Spondylitis or even Thyroid Disease amongst your TOS patients? I also have SJogren's which resulted in Pancreatitis, then loss of all my teeth ( I believe the AS which was undetected at age 35 with removal of all my natural teeth could have been a combination cause as to formation of proper bone within my entire body) Do you find mostly the Neurogenic type TOS is in most of your patients seeking PT? IS PT BEFORE any surgery to remove ribs bilaterally, better to do or is it better to wait until AFTER surgery? or BOTH?
Do you find it harder to work on those who are athletes, versus those who are not? Have either of you ever worked on patients who have been hit by lightning (not the CAUSE of the NTOS, but possibly exacerbating it?) I can perform self-acupressure to various areas of my body which relieves me of some pain. When I do this, the blood flow change is palpable by others as well. No one knows what to make of this anomaly of mine, but I feel that even if BOTH ribs are removed, that if there IS an underlying cause affecting me that is not addressed that I will be back at square one...
As you well know, determining that it is NTOS took some time, I am now in pursuit of a good surgeon. Initially, it was thought I'd had FMD (Fibromuscular Dysplasia) prior ot the angiography and I still feel that is a possibility, although the surgeon who did my angiography told me it is not, I felt it may be in other areas of the body which is why I feel the acupressure connected changes in flow. I am aware there are no nerves in veins and adn arteries but there certainly ARE in the surrounding muscles, fascia, tendons etc, which I s what I was trying to explain to these doctors BEFORE the NTOS diagnosis. I also had some issues during my angiography, suffering a small left sided stroke which THEY did not SEE me having, as they quickly ledme out of the procedure room without performing ANY type of test to ensure NOTHING happened ( I told them later they ought to at least perform at the very least, a vision tests with EVERY SINGLE PATIENT getting an angiography from now on, to make sure they hada NOT suffered a stroke, he promised me he would) I suffered a small loss of vision but nothing else, I can still drive with special glasses thankfully! I kept banging into doors on the drive home as we stopped for a bite to eat and I felt extraordinarily LOOPY fro the partial anesthesia, depsite having had major surgeries before that I got up and walked a straight line and here I was totally OUT of it! I was SPOT BLINDED! I am ok now.
I have noticed some ageism within doctors opinions in some studies I've read, regarding surgery versus PT. I believe that some doctors would be scared off from wanting to perform surgery, due to the comorbid conditions. SOme have looked at me NOT at my studies at all and proclaimed me to be OK I don't have it, when the studies I'd brought with me showed it for certain! The diagnosing doctor is no longer at that facility, so now I am on a quest to find a surgeon and am hopefully wanting to be able to save some of the bone for reconsutructive surgery on my sinus bridge as overly aggressive sinus surgery removed too much turbinate and I am having problems sleeping due to breathing issues (machines dry me out it's like sucking on a blow dryer all night, in addition to Sjogren's)
I thank you both in advance for any and all suggestions you might have for me! I look forward to your reply. This video is very helpful as well!
What if it’s a neck problem? What does that mean?
Thank you...
i have numbness in my both hand and fingers. what is the area I'm looking at in the spine?
I find out my from ultrasound by lifting my arm in difference positions and show the uneven pulse, so i did physical therapy with out procedure. How ever after I lost 30 pounds of weight my symptoms was going away on it own
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Hello are you doing better?
I think I have Phila Outlet Syndrome. What can I do about that?
I will add that to our to do list!
How about a video with best thoracic spine stretches? I feel very immobile in this section of my back (rib cage, serratus posterior, etc). Any help?
check out tim keeley videos
So what do u do for a temporary relief
Thanks guys, I've been trying to figure out my arm/shoulder pain, but tested neg on the 90 90 one. I know my symptoms arise from writing notes and using a mouse. Because that's when it hurts the most. My 5th and 4th digits get really weak it's hard to hold a pencil after an hour of writing or typing. And when I stretch my forearm out I definitely feel a painful stretch in my flexor Capri ulnaris and those same digits. Then occasionally I have a dull pinpoint pain in my shoulder underneath the acromion. I can make the pain from that same location sharp if I try to practice good posture(shoulders back) , and turn my head to look over opposite shoulder while also bring ear down to shoulder to make a stretch on the affected side. The stretch on affected side feels good, but it definitely makes that dull pain turn sharp. If you have any videos on that or could make one that'd be great! -best
I have exactly same issues. What therapy did you underwent or are you still in pain
@@flick9066 it was a neck referral! Took about 6 months before we figured out what it was. My physical therapist found a spot on my upper trap that with trigger point release the referral went away. I haven’t had any pain since and able to return to writing and using a mouse, but I also don’t write as much as i used to (no longer a student).
@@t4health527 i reckon i have thoracic outlet syndrome. As i have serious tightness in brachial plexus and continuously tingling and weakness in right arm(ulnar path) .
Hey i have the same problem did you do some exercises? Or how did the trigger point disappear?
I've got a cervical rib and I'm a powerlifter ... don't get any arm issue just get stiff neck issues, currently have a kind of trapped nerve turning head to left ..
KJH Drug Free Masters Powerlifting I have a cervical rib as well, and it is causing thoracic outlet syndrome, having surgery Friday. :)
Marc Schreiber good luck with that ... hope it all goes well .. report back on progress
My numbing and tingling and when there’s pain doesn’t go away It’s been constant for a week now. Definitely a weakness and it’s hard to open and close my hand.
How are you doing now?
@@brittanygriffin6609 good thanks! It was an aggravated ulnar nerve. Not 💯better but much better. How are you doing (with this)?
@@deerinheadlights9784 Oh my, did you ever go to the doctor? Are you able to lift heavy items? Mine is aggravated and now it's radiating to my collarbone which it never did. I have an appointment with my doctor tmrw. I really hope this goes away soon because it's affecting my life. I can't even work right now. :(
@@brittanygriffin6609 yes I went to hand therapy (occupational). They did cranial sacral, Myofascial tissue release, and gave me some exercises. Mine was really bad for awhile. I couldn’t do much at all with that hand. Nerve stuff Is scary and takes a few months to heal (depending on what it is). Trust your provider (if you do) and ask for help if you can. I had a lot of help from 2 people those 3 months. I have other injures too so not out of the clear. Glad that one is better (no 100 but much much better). Hope you make it through and feel better soon as can be. Definitely could not lift even like 5 lbs. I couldn’t even grip my steering wheel, eat, and was afraid I’d need a home health care aid (live solo). It was scary, I cried a lot, couldn’t type, the lost goes on. I had to restructure my life. I also have a tough shoulder injury on the other side and now whiplash from a few months ago (and a hip labrum tear that is much better) so taking things a day at a time. More then you asked I know. All that to say it depends on what all is going on in your body, mind, emotions, circumstances, etc.
@@brittanygriffin6609 be easy on yourself emotionally as you can. Give yourself a break and to grieve not working. I learned to be appreciative of the perspective being injured gives. People don’t realize how much our bodies help and it gives me some clarity on aspects of ableism. Not a give I asked for but not one id have if none of this happened because why or how could I?
What about tingling in one side of the rimroids?
Several years ago I got a problem when lifting a weight. I got something like a cramp in the muscles above my right scapula near the neck. It wasn't painful but suddenly mu shoulder blade felt like it was out of place and hanging. My entire right shoulder dropped lower. Since then I always have the urge to try and reposition it back and into place. Imagine like you are carrying a backpack on one shoulder and you feel it slipping. This is what I feel and the motion I would do to reposition the backpack is what I am constantly doing with my shoulder. The bigger problem however is that I got some weakness in my pectoral muscles on the right side, in my right triceps and some tingling in my pectoralis. When I go to the gym and do bench press, my right side is always weaker and it feels like I can never really engage the muscles into the motion. Please help me, what is this and how can I get rid of it?
Could scoliosis contribute?
Thanks a lot sir . Please, make a video on the sleeping position of thoracic outlet syndrome.
good video, but 15 times is not enough. most TOS references say 1-3 min. but not just 15 - this rushes observation!
What do you do if after doing the tests to come to the conclusion that it is from the nerve at the neck?
DVT can develop if it goes untreated.