Although I consider myself a pagan, I totally agree with most of what you said. For all the anti-Abrahamic rhetoric you hear in Germanic pagan circles, the popular mode of practice feels nonetheless far too churchy and tainted by residual Christianity. It's like Lutheranism in Viking drag. I mean, people treat the Havamal like it's the Holy Bible, and even go so far as to number and quote specific lines in the text as if they were Bible verses. That's not exactly what you would expect from people trying to distance themselves from Christianity. Plus, most of our ancestors would have been illiterate and had no access to books (especially one that hadn't even been written yet when they were alive). Also, I completely share your distaste for the popular pagan preoccupation with dark aesthetics. Some of that is fine in moderation, but when all the art has a totenkopf vibe, and the music sounds like new age Native American tom-tom beating with gloomy Gregorian chanting mixed in, it's like, "Guys, where's the color? Where's the cheerfulness?… Less black metal, and more power metal, please." I've even seen some of these types sharing memes critiquing the Hollywood trope of portraying medieval Europe as entirely drab, dirty, and gloomy -- and yet they perpetuate the same trope! Our ancestors spent their waking hours in the sunshine and they wore shiny gold jewelry when they could get it. And although their music is lost to us, I'm sure they must have rocked out to some rather jaunty tunes. The aesthetics should reflect all of that.
Americans are so drenched in protestant puritanism that even far-left atheism in America is just protestant puritanism with a thin coat of neo-marxism slapped on it. Judgmental, dogmatic, condescending moral hysteria in service of the god of Equity. Most American pagans I've come across tended to interpret the Norse mythology like DnD rules, a practice clearly stemming from the biblical dogmatism they were entrenched in.
I completely agree with you in your "critique" of the modern "Viking Ambient Music" (whatever it is called). It sounds just like ordinary New Age music, it really does. But, the dark esthetics is not that far from how it actually looks like here in Scandinavia - at least for most part of the year (it I a rather gloomy part of the word, unfortunately - and that why we really live up during these precious summer days, and nights. But, you wrote that the pre-christian norse, and/or germanic pagans were illiterate, I must disagree. First, they had their own writing system, the runes, and why really know just how any could read and write "runic"? Perhaps it was only a small minority, but I don't believe so. Even some freed tralls seems to have had at least some understanding of the runes. Secondly, these people even knew other languages, certainly latin and greek. Some tribes, like the ancient Preussians, actually bragged about how many "books" (scrolls/pergament collections) of the Ancient Greek philosophers they had in their "communal library." So, they "knew stuff" even back then. They were no simpletons, and they didn't wanted to be viewed as such either. Unfortunately the climate in the northern parts of Europe is quite hostile for organic material, so almost nothing has remained. As you wrote, he "Viking music" is lost for us. We only have one contemporary "review" about how it sounded like, from Ibn Fadlan. But it was not a favorable review, to say the least. He thought that the viking songs reminded him of women screaming, if I remember it correctly. And, interestingly enough, we actually have some linguistic traces of that (maybe). I.e., the word "gala" (to scream) is the same as "galen" (to be crazy/mad). And both is connected to the original "Galder" (the magical singing style from the "Sejd", the shamanistic Viking "Magic technique"). So, to "sing" in a high-pitched screaming style was how they sung their religious songs. Maybe something similar to Black Metal-singing (the original Norwegian Black Metal), but probably more chaotic than that. I don't know if it had any relatable "melody", but old Scandinavian "folk music" ("fiddling" music, with violins and bagpipes and such, not like the American "folk music" with Bob Dylan etc) usually is very, very, very melodic, usually in a "sad key". I.e. not "happy sounding", Scandinavians do not like "happy." =) Only summer is happy for Scandinavians, even more so the farther north one goes. "Darkness, sadness, misery and longing," that is the preferred mental state for all Scandinavians. If you ever want to get an "inside look" inside the Scandinavian mentality, you only need to "Picture Google" the name "John Bauer" and look at his paintings of deep, dark Swedish forests filled with trolls, and other creatures of the forests. He died more than 100 years ago, but his pictures still resonate deeply with the majority of the Scandinavians. If there is such a thing as a "collective regional character-trait" he surely happened to "tap into it." Btw ... The medieval period in Northern Europe actually Was quite colorful. All the churches was painted inside with all kinds of colors that they had access to. It was not as we see them today. But during the reformation the old church paintings were painted over, with ordinary white. And that was how we thought that it always had looked like - until we started to see the small traces of what was under the white, during restoration work. So it was a huge surprise for us, because we really had no idea. Today, some churches have been restored as close to the original as possible, and even though the paintings have lost it original vibrant colors, we can at least still see what they painted - although faint.
@@magnusdahlgren3461 Hi, Magnus. To clarify, I wasn't using the word "illiterate" in a pejorative sense. On the contrary, I think illiteracy gets a bad reputation. There's a reason why so many pre-Christian European cultures had oral traditions, and it wasn't because they were "stupid." They knew that knowledge survived far longer when it was stored primarily in the mind rather than in manuscript form, and passed from generation to generation. Consider, for example, how completely dependent many people today are on their ability to text and read things online. They can't even remember simple phone numbers which thirty years ago they would have had no problem recalling off the top of their head. In spite of modern man's ability to read and write, he is probably far dumber in many respects than the majority of his ancestors who did not read or write extensively before the invention of the Gutenberg press. When people fail to exercise their memory, it atrophies. And, as you said, many of our forebears were multilingual, which is more than you can say of most Americans, so they were obviously not stupid. I suppose you could consider the ability to read and write runes a form of literacy, but even then, I doubt they were in daily use by most people -- certainly they weren't using them to read and write Tolkien-sized novels and short stories -- and that's perfectly alright. Far better to engage in dialogue and memorization than slavishly reference some hoary old tome like the Bible or Google. Also, to further clarify on the subject of art, I definitely think there is a place for darkness and sorrow, but I think it should be balanced to some degree by joyous, life-affirming art and music, which is not something I see much of in the popular heathen scene. Certainly, there is a strong tradition of mournful, melancholy music in our folk cultures, and even our myths (for example, the magic harp whose music could make everyone weep), but there is also a strong tradition of joyful music, and I'm not just talking about drinking songs. I simply wish there was more diversity (in the true sense of that word) in the music and visuals of modern paganism (which isn't to say there isn't any at all; only that it seems underrepresented). The unflinching fixation on death and darkness is something I would expect from puritanical Christians and Satanists, not pagans when celebrating the summer solstice. (To that point,"Sumer is icumen in" is a great example of a jaunty, medieval English tune; exactly the sort of music we need more of in the heathen scene.)
@@Sam-lm8gi Just like today, I believe that there was a few different "musical genres" (or "styles") back then. Not all the music was ceremonial in nature, with chanting and screaming and so on, but probably more like everyday singing. Funny song, for example, and "popular songs," that were shared across both time and place för some time. But we only have Ibn Fadlans memory - of a rather "dark" death ceremony to refer to. Still, even medieval western music is a little bit strange for our modern ears. And it was not popular music, it was music from the high culture, only ment to be played in certain settings. The ordinary medieval peasant probably singed different songs, in different styles. So called "working songs" have always been a staple in old cultures, so it would have been normal even during the norse "viking era." Probably useful when the were rowing their viking ships up river, perhaps. And during ordinary work. We have quite a few folk songs in that style, with rhythmic singing and repeating lines. They are older than written memory, so who really knows? And, about the "illiterate vikings," I still maintain that the nors invention of the runic alphabet, writing system, cannot be understood as something else that a clear sign of a Litterate society. You shouldn't limit your understanding of runes to merely the rune stones, because they did write their runes on wooden planks also - that could be quite the collection. Almost none have remained, though. Evidence of a common level of literacy could, perhaps, be vied in the "runic grafitti" as seen in Greece and Bysans. I.e. some ordinary norse men carved in som runic sentences in these places, so they knew how to write - and read - their runic language. And they did. Also, the rune stones were intended to be read, by people that were passing by. If nobody were expected to be able to read the words, I cannot see the meaning of its use, at all. I can only se a meaning, if a lot of people could understand it. How many could read and write, latin in the Roman Empire, for example? Why shouldn't there be just as many in other cultures too, that even had bothered to develop their own version of it. Think about that. And, about "vikings having fun." You know, they actually danced, they did. There are several images of ancient norse men dancing. Dancing while dressed up too. And they had developed really advanced poetry. They played strategic board games (like chess, only slightly different). They wore "funny mustaches" (no wild beards nor long hair). They loved pretty things, and the gold sites of ancient Scandinavia were among the most advanced at that time, (even after). Not to mention their wood carving skills, that were really impressive. They were not "primitive blues," that's what Im trying to say, and they surely knew how to have a good time. So much so that they even managed to anger the troll Grendel, who got disturbed by the high volume (laughing, singing, dancing and playing music, and so on) coming from the mead hall, during celebration and feasting. - "You shouldn't have That funny," Grendel thought, and crawled out of his mound to go to the hall and eat some of the party goers. - "Well, that managed to shut them up," Grendel thought for himself afterwards, while happily being caressed too sleep again by his dear old mother, the dragoness.
Whiteness is an administrative invention to describe people who lost touch with their very different ethnic heritages a very long time ago - most of whom really know little if anything about who their ancestors were past 1700. I don’t hate being white or want to be anything else or think there is anything intrinsically bad about it. It’s just not my primary identity. People who want it to be are crabs in a bucket, or people who want to put you on a team so they can play a game.
I have been a long admirer of your writings and have driven many miles of freeway listening to your audio books. The concept of the Solar Path (written about by you as well as Tom Billinge) is valid and does represent a higher path for man to stride upon. Yet, the Germanic/Norse representation of this path resonates within me. My great grandparents were from Denmark, Germany and Sweden on my dads side, and Scotland and Norway on my moms (go figure that one...Merica). My grandad still spoke Platzdeutsch, (schleswig-holstein), which is spoken in Northern Germany, Denmark, Netherlands and the coast of Poland. Its basically the Saxon language as far as i know. Thus, when the name Woden is spoken, I feel it. Both Celtic and Germanic are descended from Indo-European culture, hence the chariots and such ridden by the Norse gods in a land wholly unsuitable for such modes of travel. I feel this interpretation of the solar path within my blood, and would be unique to it as other modalities (Roman, Greek, Slavic etc) would be to others.
Saw this video and decided to try to cover some of your issues with germanic paganism. I agree with you to an extent. The brosatru types sorta treat the eddas like it’s a bible and bring in Christian attitudes in regards to the gods in the sense of they can do no wrong. I still regard myself as a Heathen, but I fully understand that this is a reconstructed faith in the modern era. The parts that are missing are borrowed from similar cultures. Modern Heathenry is not like it was in 1.5K years ago. Regardless it works for some people and it pulls people away from techno industrial society which is always a plus.
I think what I appreciate the most about this is the honesty & integrity. A lot of what you’re criticising here is a lack of both in people who are consuming rather than truly engaging with belief systems. It’s a fundamental problem for the modern man who has been conditioned to do so.
Jack, its interesting that you have reduced your belief system to something more primal than so called paganism. I was culturally interested in Slavic paganism but Im thrid generation Zen Buddhist and Ive found myself wondering, if you go back then how far should you actually? I am now studying the PIE religion, read Campbell and early Vedas that are part of the Buddhist canon as well. I also find Mormonism super fascinating and the deeper you go the better it gets, its actually very pagan I would say and actually inspires some pagan movements nowadays. I am all for reduction and keeping it close to the heart, intimate instead of too much abstract.
When people try to claim ancestry to the old gods, as you say that some within the American "asatru/odinist circles" do, they really miss that it was only the Ruling Classes that "could trace their ancestry back to some god," like Frey for example." Ordinary people did not claimed Divine ancestry, and it they had tried to do that they most certainly would have been killed, quite swiftly, by members of the rulers "hird." You did not try to pass between the different classes back then. You did not marry up, nor down. You stayed exactly as you have been born, as a trall, as a free man, as a ruler, etc. So, it is a little bit stupid to try to claim an ancestral line back to some germanic, or norse, god. But I can almost understand it, since it must be a strange feeling to live in a country who's native history and culture are someone else's. So they try to make a connection to their original country, but not the present culture but rather the "cool historic culture," thousand years ago. But, the so called Vikings, were not germans. The germanic tribes were forest living tribes. Only the northern germanic tribes that lives along the southern Baltic Sea had a connection with the norse culture (Like the Preussians, or the Vends). But the majority of the germans really have no historical connection with the so called "Viking culture." Sometimes I have thought about how alien I might have felt if I had grown up in, for example, the USA. Because here, in Scandinavia, I do see the remains of the ancient cultures everywhere I look. And I only have to walk over some farmers field to find old traces from the Stone Age, Bronze Age and Iron Age. And everywhere is all these burial Mounds, really everywhere. So it is really easy to feel connected to my history when living here. Because it is so present, all the time, everywhere. And, about what you said about the dislike for christianity, I've never understood that. I think it have more to do with their understanding of the present, modern, christianity than the original medieval - norse - christianity. It was quite different from the present, modern protestant version. And I think it is important to understand that christianity, in Scandinavia, never was forced upon the people - at first (with time laws were being written that banned "belief in mounds and groves"). It was invited, and all the medieval churches that were being built almost thousand years ago, they were being built by the local norse peoples, and they erected villages around them. That lasted all the way until the great agricultural revolution during the 19th century. The first, medieval, norse christianity was more pagan than we might think. Even the figure of Christ was different from what we think today. Medieval norse Christ was a god of Victory, suitably for a conquering people. And a lot of ancient prechristian traditions and festivities were being kept, and celebrated, at least until the Reformation. But still a few ancient pre-christian traditions have survived, and are still bing celebrated - like the celebrating of the return of the Light, during the darkest night of the year (Lucia), or Midsummer, and naturally the "Jul" (Christmas Eve). Lastly, I just have a question about what you said about the time you "sacrificed some poor goat." You said that it was "to dark," and maybe even "satanic." So I wonder about how you performed that sacrifice. Was the act of killing the goat the central part of the ceremony, or was the killing of the goat more like a part of a "complete sacrificial ceremony" that included the following feast, when you all cooked and ate the meat of the goat? Few sacrificial traditions have the act of the killing of the sacrifice as the only, and central, part - it is usually just a part in a whole feast, where the eating of the sacrificed food is the central thing. Maybe just one piece (usually the heart) of the sacrificed animal will be left on the fire, for the gods to consume as the smoke rises up to the heavens. The whole village, or the whole tribe - at least all the participants, will take part of the sacrifice in this way. And I can not see that as "satanic." But to just kill, for the sake of the killing, could be interpreted as more satanic, wouldn't you agree about that? It is aslo quite interesting to understand that the ancient christian commentators and missionaries, etc, actually called several pre-christian religions and cults (that included sacrifice) as "satanism." So the very act of sacrifice animals (and humans I assume) for religious purposes could probably be interpreted as "Satanism." Especially without feasting of the meat. Because even christian culture eat animals, and slaughter them. And that is not viewed as satanic. Sure, some cultures did engage in sacrifice of humans, and killing just for the sake of killing, in a religious setting. And the ancient norse at least seemed to have done exactly that (Different sources describe the 9 year blots, that took place at both Uppsala and Leyre. And the precolombian cultures of mesoamerica, certainly were engaged in human sacrifice on a massive scale. Probably Polynesian cultures too. But most sacrificial practices didn't just kill their offering just for the sake of killing, it was just a part of their collective festivities. Just like they do in "Valhall" where the gathered warriors feast on the flesh of the sacrifices pig "Särimner" every evening. So if the myths mirror the present culture, it could say something about how the ancient norse practiced animal sacrifice - not just killing for the sake of killing, but more like inviting the gods and the ancestors to the table, and let them share in the feast. Quite far from "satanism". It wouldn't be accepted today, in the west at least, even though most of us eat meat, and are accepting the mass slaughter of animals on a humongous scale. But somehow we have a hard time accepting killing before our very eyes.
Sacrifice is historically correct, and yes, in rituals I ran I always tried to make sure I took the animal home, butchered it, and prepared it to serve at the next event so that it wasn’t wasteful. And it was always part of a larger ritual. Sacrifice itself isn’t Satanic, but it does attract people in the modern world who just want to kill things because it is “metal.” I don’t believe I ever did anything with that intent, and after a while it seemed rather pointless to me and it isn’t part of what I do now.
मि॒त्रस्तन्नो॒ वरु॑णो दे॒वो अ॒र्यः प्र साधि॑ष्ठेभिः प॒थिभि॑र्नयन्तु । ब्रव॒द्यथा॑ न॒ आद॒रिः सु॒दास॑ इ॒षा म॑देम स॒ह दे॒वगो॑पाः ॥ मित्रस्तन्नो वरुणो देवो अर्यः प्र साधिष्ठेभिः पथिभिर्नयन्तु । ब्रवद्यथा न आदरिः सुदास इषा मदेम सह देवगोपाः May Mitra, Varuṇa, the divine Aryaman, conduct us by the most practicable paths, then, (when wedesire their guidance), accordingly as Aryaman promises to the liberal donor (of oblations), may we, enjoying the protection of the gods, rejoice in abundance, together with posterity. Rigveda 7.64.3.Happy new year from a hindu believer of the divine gods. Coming from a vedantic hindu family i believe you might be going through the same phase as late vedic rishis who tried many gods before devoting to brahman. Anyways your t-shirt(rta) is dope. Very few people or actually i can count those people, realise that rta is superior to dharma.
I know I've said this in the past, but i really appreciate watching your perspective evolve. I too saw alot of problems within the Heathen community that ultimately lead me to think it wasn't tenable as a religion despite me learning a great deal about religious concepts and archetypes because of it. I've evolved into a much more panthiestic and stoic view of God. Took alot of reading about various religions and philosophies, but that's where i tend to sit today.
Finally somebody who with sense!! This is a video that absolutely needs more views!! Lots of truth in this video and great points Especially recently i have really seriously started lose my temper over these freaking Asatru folks. I really felt hopeless that is there anybody who has common sense anymore, i just saw only these neo-eugenetists, natsoc (or neo-nazi type people whatever) pan-germanists, racial and religious purinists, pagan crusaders and fundamentalists, new age folks etc. But then you appeared and restored my hope. I tried Norse faith for a while, but didn't feel it was for me. I like these stories and deities ofcourse, but i couldn't properly relate to them. May have something to do with my country's history. It is really shame such a great mythology is totally corrupted by this type crap what you said the video. Great points what you said about influences from Satanism, didn't even fully realize that untill now. I think another problem with Asatru and neo-paganism is mystification, making ancient religion looking kind of weird and obscure.
Started watching because it randomly popped onto my algorithm. Kept watching because this guy is hot. Finished watching because it was very informative.
As someone with the black pagan stallion of Widukind, because its the Coat of arms of my birth county, i have a few points. 1. "Western/Anglo" Culture is deeply germanic, Angeln, Sachsen, Dänen were heathen/pagan who deeply influenced the british isles. Our understanding of democracy is germanic not ancient greek. 2. Laconicly i would say you could differenciate between heathen and pagan. Pagan is the anglocized form where nordic, germanic and celtic mixed. Heathen are for me the old rituals and believes of the homeland, as someone who grew up in the old country its just a mentality and folklore. 3. I am too drunk right now to talk about scaninavians and celtics, franks etc. my time and buzz are worth to much 4. Wotan as the wanderer and holder of female magic. How you tread women really reflects if your ancestors pray to wotan or odin. He was a trickster that made sacrifices for wisdom, writing and poetry. It really discribes the "western" way of how to engage problems, ofcourse there are greco roman influences but the fusion of being willing to work hard but find a clever solution that works is something that realy can be found even in american work ethic. 5. You are sometimes as cringy as your physique is developed. 6.
That’s the funny thing about objective truth. It’s True for everyone, everywhere at all times regardless of who espouses it, who denies and who believes it. If one group does a better job demonstrating they have it but you don’t like them it does not change Truth.
As a spinoff of Satanism, modern “Germanic“ [neo-]paganism falls within the framework of Judaism and the Jacob vs. Esau dialectic it establishes, i.e. Yahweh and his Chosen People-the seed of Jacob (aka Israel)-vs. Satan (aka Samael), guardian angel of the seed of Esau (aka Edom) i.e. Rome i.e. 'Christendom' i.e. all European Gentiles.
As a Norwegian, I never understod why Americans get so into this. I feel some connecting to it, because of the cultural aspect, but I don't understand why anyone else but Northen Europeans would connect with this. These old sagas are essentially nursery rhymes for adults written around the themes of our culture and nature. And as you said, the current representation of this is obviously nonsense and fantasy from the last 200 years. The people who worshipped Tor and Odin was farmers and fishermen, poor as hell, hoping that saying a few words to Tor would help them in some way. This practice, of praying to some entity for luck, is common in all human history all over the world. It's quite different from modern religions. Norse mythology is just our version of this with our cultural spin on it. Back then you "prayed" to gods to feel like you have something or someone on your side because of their misery and struggles. No offense, but if they could see some of this American worship, like watching a bunch of buff guys with tattos run into the woods screaming and burning shit, I think they would wonder what a hell you guys were doing.
Ahhh, the old "my ancestors wouldn't have said/ done/ thought THAT" argument. Until you find a working time machine, these claims are speculative at best, frivolous at worst.
@@rabidbadger3855 Correct, that's why I said "i think". We don't know. Just as we don't know if the current pagan scene has anything to do with the real past.
Hey Jack, you will probably never read this, but I have read all your books and followed you for several years. I thinks it admirable how you continue to evolve and really dig your concept of solar idealism, however with all due respect do you think if you had children some of your perspectives could change on certain subjects mentioned in this video?
Saying that a group of people have no connection to their past, because they are not the same as a modern group of people, who live closer to the geographic location of a historic group of people, is completely asinine. The modern group of people who Americans are not completely identical to, are just as different and removed in their modern lives from their less evolved, and antique ancestors. If Americans have no connection to their past, than Germans have no connection to their past, and no group of people in the entire world who are slightly different from their ancestors culturally, even if they are not so much genetically. Would have no connection to their past, at least in the propagandist sense that you are trying to persuade.
Why aren't they Roman? Why "this" particular block of a few hundred years and not a different one? How long does a people remain a people? If Americans have been in America for several generations, which identity is more important, and why?
@@orderoffire People could worship roman gods if they want, most of them are Indo-european in origin anyways. Western indo-european people all share a common descent and culture that it is at least 6000 years old. Thats how old most folktales are too btw. That's why white pagans are largely interested in their own native religions, because that mythology reflects the deep seated psychology of their ancestors which is embedded into their genes, and they now have the freedom to pursue those interests without fear of being persecuted by Christians. A people remain a people to the extent that they still exist. Prior to ww2, Americans would always describe themselves as union formed of multiple nations and peoples who all have their own culture. It was only after ww2 that this bland form of fake phony anglo-centric protestant christian-esque corporate conformity """culture""" was astroturfed as the norm, and it has drained the life from the american people's souls. They can no longer drown themselves with high wages, booze, and the old good times, because they no longer exist. It is only natural the alienated youth couldn't give two shit fucks less about American "culture", what little of it even remains. How many Americans own their own business? What percentage of the population are still farmers? Is small town America not effectively dead? America is nothing like what it was in the 1800s, or even the early 1900s. Americans are not a nation, they are a collection of mutts with mostly English ancestry, and even that is not universally true. Ultimately America's attempts to completely distinguish itself from the old world has only led to it having boring ugly architecture, and fucking up simple shit like bread with stuff like heavily processed wonder bread. Most of America's achievements and accomplishments are but a thing of the past, whether it be our freedoms, living standards, or works of beauty and wonder that have now been torn down. Our main place in this world is to be nothing more than corporate drones who fund the military industrial complex so we can selflessly babysit the entire world, at our own expense of course. The good thing is that we keep the peace, the bad thing is that everyone hates us and we don't receive any of the real positive benefits of being an empire. I'm rambling a lot here, but I and many other people out there don't really give a shit about something as artificial as America's civic identity. If we had the means to leave, and weren't discriminated against by most non-Anglo western Europeans, then there would be no reason to double down on a sense of american identity simply as a response to being isolated or ostracized. American identity only exists out of spite and contempt, or pure ignorant bliss.
As a kid I would pass a place that was dug up as an Native American Burial place does that mean I can connect with "a little piece of that heritage" answer please. My problem is that religion experience comes from just that experience.
All my male ancestors look like you (not the tattoos, just the conformation). Even my darling daughter is six foot two, 285 pounds, strong as an ox and very inclined to her own opinion (but very girly, nevertheless). My parents, on both sides, were German, Scot/Irish, and Cherokee. All the men are over 6 feet (most are over 6 ft 4 in) and quite robust. My father's dad was born in the Hamburg area of north western Germany. In fact, all his relatives, those who came to the USA, were from that area of Lower Saxony, near to the southern border of Denmark. All of the members of this family who came to the USA are related, all from one family. I've done some research and there are over 200 of the German relatives still in the Hamburg region today. I believe most of those people were Lutheran (makes sense, I guess), and they had lots of kids and most of them have retained the tendency to be religious, to some extent. I was raised Baptist but managed to weasel out of the church-going rituals early in life and then did some of that "exploration" of various kinds of religious practices on my own, never to adopt anything as a life-long thing to stick with. I was mostly doing amateur research on the who, what, why, and how of the phenomenon to see if any of it was really something essential and true and necessary to human life, you might say. I got what I wanted from each and moved on. Eventually I realized it wasn't religion, per se, that meant all that much to me, but found there was an underlying truth to be had from the core of religion that put EVERYTHING (the universal "Everything") into perspective. You might describe it the way the scene from the old TV series Kung Fu did, in which the Master asked Kwai-Chang Caine (then a boy) "Who are you?" and the boy didn't have the right answer initially but later on he did answer "You." Yes. It's not the surface features of brand-name religion that we need to pay attention to but the core that the features hopefully point to. The One. It's all one. All the trappings of this or that religion are interesting and cultural and social and all the things that might (or might not) bind a group of people together...they didn't bind me together with anybody, alas...but they sort of serve a purpose to the psychology of the individual looking for his or her "tribe." Genetically I have a tribe, and only recently discovered where they came from, and it's all very fun to hear about Vikings and so forth possibly being "my people." The Cherokee ancestor was from my dad's mother whose great grandmother was on the Trail Of Tears from Tennessee to Oklahoma (survived it, thank God). I do believe in God, capital "G," and have assumed this to be the Core but also the Path and the Language and the Tribe and the Reason for existence. In this, we are all One, all related, all aspects, all elements of the great I AM. Obviously, I'm brand new to your channel. I'll watch again, partially because I think you're On The Road...I was once told by a good friend that he thought most people spent their lives looking for The Road but he thought I was On The Road. I took it as one of those "little birdie" whisperings that come into your ear to give you a hint that you're making progress on your path and to encourage you to keep going. God whispers like that and I get those often. Sometimes He blows a gale but I really like the little whisperings. It's like a puzzle you're supposed to work out. Fun.
I'm a heathen. And I get to know and include ideas and people based on what entitles I see working through them or attached to them. I've learnt allot of magic of the Aboriginal culture here in Australia. But they aren't my ancestors but they could help me learn how to access the roots of my genetic expression and my soul lineage. Etc. Yeah it's easier with Europeans to be honest cause it's coded in the DNA but there are plenty of black fellas who have met Odin. I'm a heathen because the vale lifted , Frigga took mu conciousness to Asgard. Then Odin blew me into a dark realm where I met Hernaz in tears. Boom. Being faring firth ever since. I've met many many beings now. That different cultures have met along the road.
I'm gonna call it... this video is going to be the beginning of the take off of your channel. Not only is the ideals expressed within the video pure, but the "aesthetic" of it with the "golden hour" glow of the lights, and the more wide angle shot with you in the center proselytizing and sharing your knowledge in a free/neutral tone, and the unique "harsh" maybe ai-generated thumbnail of odin and the ravens, all add to what I think is a unique "hit" for what your channel is to become. Continue to seek the light, i'm sure it will help others in time as well.
Very interesting video. Just one comment. The border between Celtic and Germanic is very clear. All Germanic culture begun with the Battle Axe Culture and The Nordiz Bronze Age in Sweden and Denmark. Celtic people lived in Germany until 700-500 BC when Germanic people migrated there from Scandinavia. When the Garmanic people started to migrate down to Germany it also split the Germanic language in two branches. North Germanic in those that stayed in Scandinavia and West Germanic in those the settled down in Germany.
Yes but he meant that we can't be 100% sure which tribe was Germanic and which Celtic and they also intermingled when the Germanic tribes pushed south.
Satanism is especially the gateway for former Christians, I'd say. As the idea of Satan represents rebellion against the insane strictures of the Abrahamic God/s, so those who leave those religions want to demonstrate, in no uncertain terms, their rejection of its God/s. Satanism is also a great way of stopping the "I know you'll come back to the fold" and other apologetics from friends and family that inevitably come in torrents when one leaves the family religion/cult.
Something i found very interesting, whilst i was looking for traces of monotheism in the ancient germanic peoples was this here "In wider Germanic mythology, he is known in Old English as Tīw and in Old High German as Ziu, all stemming from the Proto-Germanic theonym *Tīwaz, meaning '(the) God'. Little information about the god survives beyond Old Norse sources. Due to the etymology of the god's name and the shadowy presence of the god in the extant Germanic corpus, some scholars propose that Týr may have once held a more central place among the deities of early Germanic mythology." To me, it always seems like the same story in most cultures, originally there was faith in only one God, the Creator, but in time, people started adding their own folklore, the ancient chinese had this with Shang-Di, even the Aztecs had a concept of what we would understand as "God" yet they were too preoccupied with their "Gods". I found this information about "Tiwaz (the) God" so interesting since it is the fairly same with "Al-Lah (the) God".
As a native German in Germany, I got a closer tie to heathenry over Americans, which take race way more serious but also water it down to the skin. You can be white, but is it really your history, culture and people. I don't take pride in Nordic heathenry, since I am not Nordic, I am German.
Really enjoying all of the enraged extremely online neo-nazi race-fetishists proving my point in the comments. There's not an argument they have that I haven't had to sit and listen to a hundred times, which is why am actively alienating them. They destroy everything they touch.
I think that christianity perfectly rounds up this issue. Because they clearly state what a sin is but give free choice. Also, Christians are allowed to practise therre way of showing love to god and praising his creation by certain lifestyles.
Hi Jack, how much theatrical acting work have you done outside of the God of War Pagan Shaman character you play? The English have been rivals with Germany over who wears the pants as the dominant central establishment group of western Europe for centuries. We speak English, but the Royal Family of England are all German. Empirical Great Britain, along with it's dubious allies, the Russian Bolsheviks and the war hungry US, all carved up Germany and shared in the rich spoils of war for themselves during the occupation beginning in 1945. Thick as thieves they were! And the good times lasted for decades! But like all hungry lions and nesting war hawks, eventually their carnal appetites get the better of them and they look for more lifeblood to ingest. And when there isn't any, they turn on themselves. It's a tremendously cruel and vicious circle to tread, but nevertheless one that can gather a great deal of participation.
808 subscribers, at the time of viewing, is a great number. Interesting work, brother, although I am still to look at it in depth (time permitting). At any rate, I suppose the task is to elevate oneself above the mundane, from whatever perspective/angle one chooses to do so, and in protective respect of other beings (visible and invisible). This is sine qua non. As is the cultivation of qualities such as virtue (strength) and wisdom (vision, pardon the pun). Good luck, etc [the Devanagari t-shirt is not bad either]
No, people want a history. The God we worship is a Jewish one. We have no religions of our own as Europeans....AFter WW2 all Aryan historical research was banned from Academia. It all comes back to the Indo European Myths.
More I learn more I realize we are all the same, they paint africans as tribal but all humans were. We basically all did the same stuff but claim to be different.
Kinda of a random video to be recommended to a muslim, but nonetheless very interesting video glad it got recommended to me for me I like a religion that transcend tribal and racial boundaries and treat all it's members equally regardless of ethnicity. Of course there's nothing wrong with celebrating you people or culture but God putting your people on a pedestal that's a whole another level. Religion that only accepts spusific race or tribe never really made sense to me, for god to create the world and then choose only a spusific tribe or race to be the chosen people and give them special treatment. I'd rather believe in a god that will judge me based on my actions not based on my blood or ancestors and that why I prefer religions like islam or christianity. And there are many other points that I have problem with when it comes to those ancient tribal religions and I think your video made a very good critique to these tribal religions. And raised points I never really considered or known about, that was certainly an insightful video.
You are right that "tribal religions" don't make sense. Because they aren't religion. They are a political agenda, and one which was created during the 19th century to promote European Nationalism. It wasn't just Paganism that this happened to, but also Christianity. Read about Positive Christianity, the official religion of Nazi Germany: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Positive_Christianity This "tribal religion" thing also happened to Judaism. It was called "Zionism." See what it has brought us nowadays. The real Heathen religion is one that accepts all people, because the gods created everything and they are in everything. The ancient Heathens had no concept of race whatsoever. And the Havamal, which are the morals Odin gave to humanity, and all the ancient myths which have been passed on to us, show that hospitality was always the greatest and most important virtue. People would even let complete strangers into their own home because that stranger could be one of the gods themselves. And the stranger also needed to be respectful to their host, because common decency and mutual work is the only path for life. And you should have common respect for all mortals, and everything in the world, because that is the only way humanity will live and thrive. Ragnarok will come "when no man is true to one another." And man here means "human" not just the masculine gender. But these Nationalists who pretend to be "Pagan," and this idiot who made this video, are all blasphemers who just want to push an agenda. They don't want whats best for people, and certainly not for Pagans. They worship Nietszche and Carl Jung and Julius Evola first before Odin. They have no idea what Odin truly is!
@@orderoffire If you were open to certain verifiable information you would know why these things are mentioned. As well as the fact that Abrahamism is itself Satanic. But I will admit that Varg Vikerness is a fool.
I received a comment relating to a personal comment I made earlier. Unfortunately, I cannot reply directly to this person. He claims to know more about my personal reading habits than I do, and chooses yo ignore the personal experience which people my age have gone through.. We must not forget the very dark shadow the Nazis cast upon Europe and the US. I regret that these atrocities have been repeated several times since then. Sorry for disrupting the flow of conversation.
I delete the neo-nazi comments that come after the initial reactions. They are obsessed, mentally ill losers with nothing to do but create multiple anonymous profiles -- but not enough talent to make their own videos. If they showed their faces, no one would respect them anyway.
Steiner talked about an Anglo Norman pursuit for English not German to replace French as the global language. It all goes back to one civilization conquers another .re germanic pride start with Goethe
I personally get the feeling that all the ancient peoples of the earth worshipped the sun. as the 1st religious act on the planet. all the organized religions and labeled practices give me red flags.
I prefer the Gnostic path in norse paganism called Thursatru that a)basically says fire is masculine and ice is feminine b) isn't about ancestry because the framework is about the anti-cosmic order of the aesir and c)doesn't see the eddas as the be all end all.
@@orderoffirebut they’re not saying that their practice absolutely has to stem from the eddas but it uses it as a guide, but they’re comfortable changing things.
@@orderoffirei don’t think it’s shocking but i think it’s another way to address the problems of norse paganism that you pose without necessarily leaving the perspective.
As an afghan pashtun, 2andme confirmed that I have scandinavian y dna going back countless generations. As an aryan I feel quite close to my germanic kin and I must say that cursing other races for the sake of it (ie blacks, jews) is stupid and immoral however at the same time there is nothing wrong about having pride in your warrior ancestry and wanting to preserve it by "having white babies", every other race has the that same ethos. So I wouldn't blame modern white odinists for wanting that same thing for their race/heritage
Agreeing with most of what you say. Not with the concept of how the sun is die Sonne and the moon is der Mond. I thought about that a lot and it will make sense when you look beyond the obvious. The sun is in fact neither male nor female, right, but since it (she/he? lol) represents something symbolically and not just in language, the ‘flipped’ article is like acknowledging the suns inner anima, and the moons inner animus. Or one could also say the moon reflects femininity, but it essentially is thus the opposite. The sun reflects masculinity in the concept of masculinity also symbolizing authority in this regard, threrefor it is essentially female. I am pretty sure this is kind of a narrow path and one that in itself symbolizes a well preserved wisdom, or concept of wisdom. German is one of the rare languages that not only has three articles (still) like Sanskrit, but it can be traced back very far back towards the previous ages/ yugas. Remember Shiva also has the moon symbolized on his forehead. And that implies consciousness. The sun is thus a symbol for energy, all firms of energy are Shakti, the female counterpart to Shiva. Both represent the initial Godhead that split itself to experience itself and ultimately reunite with itself.
I've always found Jung's anima/animus a bit trans, and obviously inspired by the alchemy and occultism he loved so much. Everything is a Baphomet if you want it to be.
@@orderoffire understood. But please don't overlook my other argument, which I personally put more weight on: that the sun is only conceptually male, and the moon only conceptually female because we as a culture like to associate the sun with authority and the moon with reflections and changes (and we dualistically assign the same values to male and female accordingly). My argument was pointing towards an older wisdom beyond these concepts which is now hidden not because it is intended so but because of culture and the zeitgeist. The sun represents energy, energy is also female (die Energie) in German. The moon represents the mind (der Verstand) in German,, which is also male. The mind can be intentional and represents potential focus. Those characteristics are dualistically assigned as male. Energy is potential power, that is Shakti, female. The sun is representing that universal source of energy. And last but lost least, German just like Sanskrit also has a third (es, das) article. Consciousness is das Bewusstsein in German. Why is consciousness not male in German when it is so often opposed conceptually with matter (mater, mother, female energy)? Shiva is the opposite of Shakti right? Yes, and Shiva is conceptually male, but potentially Shiva and Shakti are one. Therefor, it makes sense to me that the mind is male but consciousness is neither male nor female, but rather both and none at the same time. Consciousness without our mental limits is potentially boundless, goes beyond our concepts we create with the mind. I hope you see that my argument was more about this idea, not so much about Jungs anima, animus. I only mentioned that because that could be another point for the logic of the mind. My reasoning though is rather looking deeper into the concepts of old still somewhat traceable in language..I am trying to break the limits we put ourselves into, and I don't intend to talk about shitty genderism bs.
@MattyDRx Ive researched a lot of ANCIENT society and we used to be a matriarch as humans. Women actually started civilizations according to a few sources before men even knew about how child birth actually worked. According to a few sources the y chromosome almost disappeared between 7-10 thousand ywars ago, and it's written that the oldest holy animal or animal with god like praises was the praying mantis. If this is true and they were messengers of god they would have been sacrificing men left and right 😵💫
@@Jaybee6428 That's totally inaccurate feminist revisionism with zero evidence to support it. If women "started" civilization, they were totally outcompeted by patriarchal societies to the point where all evidence of "their" civilizations were (conveniently) wiped off the face of the earth.
I have followed Heathenry for many years. But the East Coast version is much more focused on practices and making sure we are not associated with the Nazism that was so destructive. My ancestry is Irish/German. And being a post WWII child, I had to deal with the aftermath of Hitler in a city that was full of Jewish refugees and their relatives. No one wanted to be identified with Nazis. The German immigrants were refugees of the collapse of a nation. In my eclectic research, I have mostly encountered, open groups, who are mostly northern European in heritage, being open to all. Thanks for your post.
in my personal point of view, which I don't disagree that some people take race in the wrong direction, most people of euro decent are looking for their DOS if you will and default to Germanic. there are to my scant research some shared ideas for euro pagans that we still default to, the number of black folk I have worked with that think I'm crazy for just doing things not worrying about my safety which everyone of them say is a white person thing makes me laugh. I believe that people need to do the research to find where they come from, yes the water is muddy in most areas when it comes to religion of old. that does not change the core tents of that area, if your Celt, Germanic, Slavic, gallic doesn't matter the core is going to fit a lot better then modern religion. on the note of race or hate in general I dislike the people that hate Abrahamic religions on principle, if their intent is good let them be, but those people are hatful anyways doesn't matter if they believe in the flying spaghetti monster or Christ or Odin or Zeus. I say people need to spend time on this even if I know they wont and are looking for a quick answer.
Not sure if it's because you are an American born in a "melting pot", but for someone who claims to have to much experience with Paganism, you seems like you don't really understand it. EVERY Pagan tradition is the tradition of a specific people. It is the spiritual manifestation of a specific culture and thus, a specific race too. It doesn't mean that one hates any other race. It's only that the particular Pagan tradition in question is OF a particular people. It is their root to the past and ancestors. Every people can have theirs. And in case you don't know, as you may not know because you are an American - most people in the world throughout all history, were not born in a "multicultural melting pot". The USA is the abnormality, not the other nations. You can go for Neopaganism like the Order of Fire or Wicca which are rootless and be multicultural with that, and that's fine too.
@@AntonioBrandao You can believe whatever you like, but what I said is a fact. There is absolutely no evidence of an unbroken practice of anything approaching Germanic paganism in Europe. Whoever told you otherwise is making things up.
Perhaps this racial stuff is what motivates some people, I think it's unnecessary. To be sure, there is value in family, tradition, and firm roots. But this doesn't require inbreeding - these are things which carry on regardless of your partner's race, as long as your tradition remains strong. What draws me to Odin is nothing to do with race. If anything I'm more connected to my east-Asian side. What draws me to Odin is the fact that I suffer, and I have developed a certain masochism in my pursuit of enlightenment. Pain gives me perspective, and through this I have learned the power of narrative to guide my destiny. My path in life is that of the dark wizard. Getting caught up in all the technicalities of lineage and geography will merely distract from the primal essence of spirituality that one is seeking to begin with. If you want to know the gods, then feel them in your soul.
forced beliefs don´t really count in terms of true spirituality.. that´s why modern christians who have chosen to be that are way more christian than anyone in medieval germany. as are voluntary modern pagans more pagan than anyone in the viking age. often it´s only the priests who are actually into the religious side of things.. the others are just bystanders, the great majority of people, they care more about what´s for dinner! you could argue that religion isn´t even needed in regular life.. food is, sun is, jesus christ, definately not. if you removed all the cultural stuff from the forced religions they would have nothing left.. you can´t be both cultural and universal at the same time (that´s why they´re such a shit show). everyone who speaks the same language as me, definately not my people.. those who walk the same winter paths, especially now that the sun is returning.. we might have something in common.
none of this is true for me so i don't really know what shrooms you're on about. what you're describing seems like folkism/odinism and larpers and not real reconstructed germanic paganism.
Who has outlined the "real reconstructed germanic paganism" you're talking about? I'm very familiar with the scope of the scene in America from left wing etsy witches to right wing folkish heathens/odinists, the afa, and the people I've interviewed in the middle like academics Nordvig and Brute Norse. If you think you're practicing something that has been accurately reconstructed in the absence of significant source material, that's fine. I don't care. This video is about why I don't practice it and why my group doesn't practice it.
"not in 2023". Yet, now more than ever is when we need to be... I'm one of these very tribal people, but at the same time you're taking it to the extreme by saying it should only be worshipped where it was founded and if you're in America you're totally disconnected. First, that makes zero sense if you have any belief of ancestry and spirits. Second, we have always been explorers and conquerors. So in a way, Americans still have that spirit even more so. Third, time is much more of a disconnector than space. Would you say the same thing about the Icelandic Vikings? You're really trying hard here to discourage people. With that last point about time, every religion is basically a new religion. Christianity has split off into tons of sects. 99% of them don't follow the same rules, etc. You're also making your own religion. So I see no issue in people trying their best to recreate a religion. Heck, I'd say modern Pagans are closer to the real thing than modern Christians are to their original form.
"Heck, I'd say modern Pagans are closer to the real thing than modern Christians are to their original form." You actually have less of an idea what "the real thing" is with the invented religion of Asatru etc.,, because no one really knows what the actual beliefs of the diverse groups of people you're cherry-picking from history for racial and aesthetic reasons actually was. "First, that makes zero sense if you have any belief of ancestry and spirits." Confirmation that this is basically Viking Racialist Wicca. "The spirits told me we're doing it right." OK. "Second, we have always been explorers and conquerors." Who is "we?" Actually, the majority of the people included in whatever "we" you come up with were peasants. Such is the case with any people. "You're also making your own religion" Yes, you are correct. The difference is that I am being honest about it instead of pretending that spirits have revealed the ancient ancestral wisdom of my people to me.
All of that aside, as I said in the video, this is my criticism of that religion and the scene that comes with it after practicing and studying it for several years and doing far more than most who claim it as an identity. I actually made this video for The Order of Fire to better explain my position to the guys, who sometimes ask about it. I really don't care if other people practice Germanic Paganism or not. Most religions are actually pretty ridiculous on paper, and Germanic Paganism certainly isn't the most ridiculous religion by a long shot.
Been watching your evolution as a writer and speaker since you were with the Wolves ( I was never one, or associated with them,; just aware of them). I've been shrugging off this Solar Idealism concept as something like a new-age cult-of-personality... well... cult. However, given that you're still diving deep into issues that matter, and making sober analyses of other religions, I feel like I shouldn't brush off what you're doing. That said, I have a couple concerns I'd like to express, with the hope that you might see them. First of all, and I mean no disrespect, but rather complete honesty, it feels extremely LARPy. Assuming that you don't literally believe in the 3 gods you outline in Solar Idealism, aren't you just playing pretend and going through empty motions? Especially in the face of countless ancient real religions, that have real gods that people genuinely believe in, which you openly borrow from. Essentially, this would be the definition of D&D-style LARP, but taken to an extreme level. On the other hand, you believe the 3 gods literally exist, in which case, where does your belief come from? Instead of accepting/respecting any names or descriptions of historical precedent, you give them your own nicknames and symbols. How does this carry any legitimacy? How can you be confident that what you are doing is pleasing to the gods? If we compare what you are doing to something like what Survive The Jive advocates for, it seems like his approach to reconstructionist pagan spirituality has a lot more... well... evidence behind its practice - tried and true methods, specifics instead of generalities. Secondly, and I again mean this with all due respect as someone who has read 3 of your books, your background in Satanism does not inspire confidence that this cult is not also founded, on some deep level, out of spite against the Christian establishment, or otherwise informed by Satanic inverted morality (selfishness and power-mongering as virtues in and of themselves, for instance). What is the actual "good" in this, for society, for humanity, for your tribe, etc. I suppose what I mean to ask is - is this something self-serving, or is this something that recognizes that you are beneath a greater force (the gods, the forces of nature, etc)?
You mean my background of being in Satanism for 4 years, 20 years ago, like 80% of the practicing neopagans today? Obviously you haven't read the book that addresses your questions, Fire in the Dark, so this reads like insincere concern trolling.
@@orderoffire Is is so interesting to see how different it can be between the American, and the European culture. Here you make the claim that you, in the US, have about 80% neopagans that have a background in "Satanism." In Europe, at least in Northern Europe, it can be said that about 80% have a background within the "Environmental Movement." And quite a lot have a background in the anti-fascist movement. Perhaps it could have had developed differently, if the "Viking-Loving Skinheads" from the 80s and 90s never had been met with this nationwide condemnation as they were met with. That movement totally disappeared, and today there are exactly zero neo-nazi skinheads left in Scandinavia (that doesn't mean that there are no racists, and so on, in Scandinavia, it is only the "neo-nazi Skinhead Movement" that disappeared. So, that never happened, and instead we have a neopagan thing here in Scandinavia that are based more of former Environmentalists and antifascists, and are more inclined towards radical Left Wing politics, rather than Right Wing politics. But perhaps this have more to do with the overall Scandinavian political culture - that is so much more Left Wing compared with the Americans. It has more to do with present day culture, since the old Vikings most certainly were no "Left Wingers" ... 🙂
I don’t disagree with many of the things that you say; however, you’re clearly skimming surface level ideas from Richard Spencer and Mark Brahmin, retarding them, and ultimately rebranding them into your “solar religion”-again taking from Mark and Richard. Many of the things you mentioned: Wagner, metal music, an emphasis on Christian influence on the Eddas, were all mentioned in the past weeks on Mark and Richard’s classes/podcasts. You are obviously listening to them.
I don't follow RIchard or Mark (I actually have no idea who Mark is, but wouldn't follow anyone associated with Richard on general principle). All of this is based on a book I published in 2021 and have been using the slogan "stay solar" since 2019. The Order of Fire is over a year old and I've already performed rituals with our members several times and in have even done so in Ireland. As the video explained, I actually performed Germanic pagan rituals for years and abandoned them around 2020 for the reasons explained. I have receipts. Your echo chamber isn't as influential as you think it is, and I don't want anyone associated with white nationalists as a follower.
Anything that isn’t the worship of the living Triune God Father, Son and Holy Spirit is pagan my brother! And if there is only 1 God why wouldn’t you think That God would be the only way ??? Doesn’t it make sense , if there is a all powerful creator then He would more then likely be the only of His kind , and if He’s the only one He would be the only way right ? I just got to the part while I was typing where you said you was a priest of Satan , makes all the sense
@@ConcedoNulli : your assuming , I speaking from a monotheist standpoint , that if someone believes their is 1 Almighty God the it would be very logical to believe there is only 1 way , His way ! Your making the common mistake that most humans make by assuming what someone means without asking for more context and more details of a said statement! Respectfully 🤙🏼
I largely agree with you criticisms, but Slightly disagree about your criticism of reconstruction. Predicted proto-germanic forms have been found in the archeological record. Predicted Proto-Indo-European phonemes were found in Hittite. So at least linguistic reconstruction has shown to be reliable, or maybe I am just biased because my area of study was in Linguistics. I am mixed my father being of Anglo-Saxon ancestry and mother Hispanic. How does one of mixed ancestry choose which gods to venerate? I am not really religious, but I do have a draw towards the religious traditions and customs of Prechristian Europe. I come to similar or the same conclusions as you on Germanic paganism and neopaganism. Thank you for your work.
I'm not criticizing the reconstruction of language (I cite that kind of material all the time) but the reconstruction of religious practices and beliefs based on a combination of fantasy and conjecture.
![F.HERO Ft. JSPKK x ลำไย ไหทองคำ x M-PEE - ไม่สนิทบิดหมด (Thai Riders Anthem) [Official MV]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/kPJZ0UihBfk/mqdefault.jpg)
Although I consider myself a pagan, I totally agree with most of what you said. For all the anti-Abrahamic rhetoric you hear in Germanic pagan circles, the popular mode of practice feels nonetheless far too churchy and tainted by residual Christianity. It's like Lutheranism in Viking drag. I mean, people treat the Havamal like it's the Holy Bible, and even go so far as to number and quote specific lines in the text as if they were Bible verses. That's not exactly what you would expect from people trying to distance themselves from Christianity. Plus, most of our ancestors would have been illiterate and had no access to books (especially one that hadn't even been written yet when they were alive).
Also, I completely share your distaste for the popular pagan preoccupation with dark aesthetics. Some of that is fine in moderation, but when all the art has a totenkopf vibe, and the music sounds like new age Native American tom-tom beating with gloomy Gregorian chanting mixed in, it's like, "Guys, where's the color? Where's the cheerfulness?… Less black metal, and more power metal, please."
I've even seen some of these types sharing memes critiquing the Hollywood trope of portraying medieval Europe as entirely drab, dirty, and gloomy -- and yet they perpetuate the same trope!
Our ancestors spent their waking hours in the sunshine and they wore shiny gold jewelry when they could get it. And although their music is lost to us, I'm sure they must have rocked out to some rather jaunty tunes. The aesthetics should reflect all of that.
Americans are so drenched in protestant puritanism that even far-left atheism in America is just protestant puritanism with a thin coat of neo-marxism slapped on it. Judgmental, dogmatic, condescending moral hysteria in service of the god of Equity. Most American pagans I've come across tended to interpret the Norse mythology like DnD rules, a practice clearly stemming from the biblical dogmatism they were entrenched in.
I completely agree with you in your "critique" of the modern "Viking Ambient Music" (whatever it is called). It sounds just like ordinary New Age music, it really does.
But, the dark esthetics is not that far from how it actually looks like here in Scandinavia - at least for most part of the year (it I a rather gloomy part of the word, unfortunately - and that why we really live up during these precious summer days, and nights.
But, you wrote that the pre-christian norse, and/or germanic pagans were illiterate, I must disagree.
First, they had their own writing system, the runes, and why really know just how any could read and write "runic"?
Perhaps it was only a small minority, but I don't believe so. Even some freed tralls seems to have had at least some understanding of the runes.
Secondly, these people even knew other languages, certainly latin and greek. Some tribes, like the ancient Preussians, actually bragged about how many "books" (scrolls/pergament collections) of the Ancient Greek philosophers they had in their "communal library."
So, they "knew stuff" even back then. They were no simpletons, and they didn't wanted to be viewed as such either.
Unfortunately the climate in the northern parts of Europe is quite hostile for organic material, so almost nothing has remained.
As you wrote, he "Viking music" is lost for us. We only have one contemporary "review" about how it sounded like, from Ibn Fadlan. But it was not a favorable review, to say the least. He thought that the viking songs reminded him of women screaming, if I remember it correctly.
And, interestingly enough, we actually have some linguistic traces of that (maybe).
I.e., the word "gala" (to scream) is the same as "galen" (to be crazy/mad). And both is connected to the original "Galder" (the magical singing style from the "Sejd", the shamanistic Viking "Magic technique").
So, to "sing" in a high-pitched screaming style was how they sung their religious songs. Maybe something similar to Black Metal-singing (the original Norwegian Black Metal), but probably more chaotic than that.
I don't know if it had any relatable "melody", but old Scandinavian "folk music" ("fiddling" music, with violins and bagpipes and such, not like the American "folk music" with Bob Dylan etc) usually is very, very, very melodic, usually in a "sad key".
I.e. not "happy sounding", Scandinavians do not like "happy." =) Only summer is happy for Scandinavians, even more so the farther north one goes. "Darkness, sadness, misery and longing," that is the preferred mental state for all Scandinavians.
If you ever want to get an "inside look" inside the Scandinavian mentality, you only need to "Picture Google" the name "John Bauer" and look at his paintings of deep, dark Swedish forests filled with trolls, and other creatures of the forests. He died more than 100 years ago, but his pictures still resonate deeply with the majority of the Scandinavians. If there is such a thing as a "collective regional character-trait" he surely happened to "tap into it."
Btw ...
The medieval period in Northern Europe actually Was quite colorful. All the churches was painted inside with all kinds of colors that they had access to. It was not as we see them today.
But during the reformation the old church paintings were painted over, with ordinary white.
And that was how we thought that it always had looked like - until we started to see the small traces of what was under the white, during restoration work. So it was a huge surprise for us, because we really had no idea.
Today, some churches have been restored as close to the original as possible, and even though the paintings have lost it original vibrant colors, we can at least still see what they painted - although faint.
@@magnusdahlgren3461 Hi, Magnus. To clarify, I wasn't using the word "illiterate" in a pejorative sense. On the contrary, I think illiteracy gets a bad reputation. There's a reason why so many pre-Christian European cultures had oral traditions, and it wasn't because they were "stupid." They knew that knowledge survived far longer when it was stored primarily in the mind rather than in manuscript form, and passed from generation to generation.
Consider, for example, how completely dependent many people today are on their ability to text and read things online. They can't even remember simple phone numbers which thirty years ago they would have had no problem recalling off the top of their head. In spite of modern man's ability to read and write, he is probably far dumber in many respects than the majority of his ancestors who did not read or write extensively before the invention of the Gutenberg press. When people fail to exercise their memory, it atrophies.
And, as you said, many of our forebears were multilingual, which is more than you can say of most Americans, so they were obviously not stupid. I suppose you could consider the ability to read and write runes a form of literacy, but even then, I doubt they were in daily use by most people -- certainly they weren't using them to read and write Tolkien-sized novels and short stories -- and that's perfectly alright. Far better to engage in dialogue and memorization than slavishly reference some hoary old tome like the Bible or Google.
Also, to further clarify on the subject of art, I definitely think there is a place for darkness and sorrow, but I think it should be balanced to some degree by joyous, life-affirming art and music, which is not something I see much of in the popular heathen scene. Certainly, there is a strong tradition of mournful, melancholy music in our folk cultures, and even our myths (for example, the magic harp whose music could make everyone weep), but there is also a strong tradition of joyful music, and I'm not just talking about drinking songs.
I simply wish there was more diversity (in the true sense of that word) in the music and visuals of modern paganism (which isn't to say there isn't any at all; only that it seems underrepresented). The unflinching fixation on death and darkness is something I would expect from puritanical Christians and Satanists, not pagans when celebrating the summer solstice. (To that point,"Sumer is icumen in" is a great example of a jaunty, medieval English tune; exactly the sort of music we need more of in the heathen scene.)
@@Sam-lm8gi Just like today, I believe that there was a few different "musical genres" (or "styles") back then. Not all the music was ceremonial in nature, with chanting and screaming and so on, but probably more like everyday singing. Funny song, for example, and "popular songs," that were shared across both time and place för some time.
But we only have Ibn Fadlans memory - of a rather "dark" death ceremony to refer to.
Still, even medieval western music is a little bit strange for our modern ears. And it was not popular music, it was music from the high culture, only ment to be played in certain settings.
The ordinary medieval peasant probably singed different songs, in different styles.
So called "working songs" have always been a staple in old cultures, so it would have been normal even during the norse "viking era." Probably useful when the were rowing their viking ships up river, perhaps.
And during ordinary work.
We have quite a few folk songs in that style, with rhythmic singing and repeating lines. They are older than written memory, so who really knows?
And, about the "illiterate vikings," I still maintain that the nors invention of the runic alphabet, writing system, cannot be understood as something else that a clear sign of a Litterate society.
You shouldn't limit your understanding of runes to merely the rune stones, because they did write their runes on wooden planks also - that could be quite the collection.
Almost none have remained, though.
Evidence of a common level of literacy could, perhaps, be vied in the "runic grafitti" as seen in Greece and Bysans. I.e. some ordinary norse men carved in som runic sentences in these places, so they knew how to write - and read - their runic language. And they did.
Also, the rune stones were intended to be read, by people that were passing by.
If nobody were expected to be able to read the words, I cannot see the meaning of its use, at all. I can only se a meaning, if a lot of people could understand it.
How many could read and write, latin in the Roman Empire, for example? Why shouldn't there be just as many in other cultures too, that even had bothered to develop their own version of it. Think about that.
And, about "vikings having fun." You know, they actually danced, they did. There are several images of ancient norse men dancing. Dancing while dressed up too.
And they had developed really advanced poetry. They played strategic board games (like chess, only slightly different). They wore "funny mustaches" (no wild beards nor long hair).
They loved pretty things, and the gold sites of ancient Scandinavia were among the most advanced at that time, (even after). Not to mention their wood carving skills, that were really impressive.
They were not "primitive blues," that's what Im trying to say, and they surely knew how to have a good time.
So much so that they even managed to anger the troll Grendel, who got disturbed by the high volume (laughing, singing, dancing and playing music, and so on) coming from the mead hall, during celebration and feasting.
- "You shouldn't have That funny," Grendel thought, and crawled out of his mound to go to the hall and eat some of the party goers.
- "Well, that managed to shut them up," Grendel thought for himself afterwards, while happily being caressed too sleep again by his dear old mother, the dragoness.
@@magnusdahlgren3461 well, is there any real ancient scandinavian music traditions preserved untill today?
There is nothing wrong with celebrating & honoring your race.
Whiteness is an administrative invention to describe people who lost touch with their very different ethnic heritages a very long time ago - most of whom really know little if anything about who their ancestors were past 1700.
I don’t hate being white or want to be anything else or think there is anything intrinsically bad about it.
It’s just not my primary identity. People who want it to be are crabs in a bucket, or people who want to put you on a team so they can play a game.
................ life is so confusing
God I miss that Austrian painter tho
@@CW0123 BAIT
Thank him for Israel becoming the powerhouse it is today
I have been a long admirer of your writings and have driven many miles of freeway listening to your audio books. The concept of the Solar Path (written about by you as well as Tom Billinge) is valid and does represent a higher path for man to stride upon. Yet, the Germanic/Norse representation of this path resonates within me. My great grandparents were from Denmark, Germany and Sweden on my dads side, and Scotland and Norway on my moms (go figure that one...Merica). My grandad still spoke Platzdeutsch, (schleswig-holstein), which is spoken in Northern Germany, Denmark, Netherlands and the coast of Poland. Its basically the Saxon language as far as i know. Thus, when the name Woden is spoken, I feel it. Both Celtic and Germanic are descended from Indo-European culture, hence the chariots and such ridden by the Norse gods in a land wholly unsuitable for such modes of travel. I feel this interpretation of the solar path within my blood, and would be unique to it as other modalities (Roman, Greek, Slavic etc) would be to others.
Saw this video and decided to try to cover some of your issues with germanic paganism. I agree with you to an extent. The brosatru types sorta treat the eddas like it’s a bible and bring in Christian attitudes in regards to the gods in the sense of they can do no wrong. I still regard myself as a Heathen, but I fully understand that this is a reconstructed faith in the modern era. The parts that are missing are borrowed from similar cultures. Modern Heathenry is not like it was in 1.5K years ago. Regardless it works for some people and it pulls people away from techno industrial society which is always a plus.
What do you mean by "they can do no wrong?"
I think what I appreciate the most about this is the honesty & integrity. A lot of what you’re criticising here is a lack of both in people who are consuming rather than truly engaging with belief systems. It’s a fundamental problem for the modern man who has been conditioned to do so.
Jack, its interesting that you have reduced your belief system to something more primal than so called paganism. I was culturally interested in Slavic paganism but Im thrid generation Zen Buddhist and Ive found myself wondering, if you go back then how far should you actually? I am now studying the PIE religion, read Campbell and early Vedas that are part of the Buddhist canon as well. I also find Mormonism super fascinating and the deeper you go the better it gets, its actually very pagan I would say and actually inspires some pagan movements nowadays. I am all for reduction and keeping it close to the heart, intimate instead of too much abstract.
The Scythian religion would be more accurate.
When people try to claim ancestry to the old gods, as you say that some within the American "asatru/odinist circles" do, they really miss that it was only the Ruling Classes that "could trace their ancestry back to some god," like Frey for example."
Ordinary people did not claimed Divine ancestry, and it they had tried to do that they most certainly would have been killed, quite swiftly, by members of the rulers "hird."
You did not try to pass between the different classes back then. You did not marry up, nor down. You stayed exactly as you have been born, as a trall, as a free man, as a ruler, etc.
So, it is a little bit stupid to try to claim an ancestral line back to some germanic, or norse, god.
But I can almost understand it, since it must be a strange feeling to live in a country who's native history and culture are someone else's. So they try to make a connection to their original country, but not the present culture but rather the "cool historic culture," thousand years ago.
But, the so called Vikings, were not germans. The germanic tribes were forest living tribes. Only the northern germanic tribes that lives along the southern Baltic Sea had a connection with the norse culture (Like the Preussians, or the Vends). But the majority of the germans really have no historical connection with the so called "Viking culture."
Sometimes I have thought about how alien I might have felt if I had grown up in, for example, the USA.
Because here, in Scandinavia, I do see the remains of the ancient cultures everywhere I look. And I only have to walk over some farmers field to find old traces from the Stone Age, Bronze Age and Iron Age. And everywhere is all these burial Mounds, really everywhere.
So it is really easy to feel connected to my history when living here. Because it is so present, all the time, everywhere.
And, about what you said about the dislike for christianity, I've never understood that.
I think it have more to do with their understanding of the present, modern, christianity than the original medieval - norse - christianity.
It was quite different from the present, modern protestant version.
And I think it is important to understand that christianity, in Scandinavia, never was forced upon the people - at first (with time laws were being written that banned "belief in mounds and groves"). It was invited, and all the medieval churches that were being built almost thousand years ago, they were being built by the local norse peoples, and they erected villages around them. That lasted all the way until the great agricultural revolution during the 19th century.
The first, medieval, norse christianity was more pagan than we might think. Even the figure of Christ was different from what we think today. Medieval norse Christ was a god of Victory, suitably for a conquering people.
And a lot of ancient prechristian traditions and festivities were being kept, and celebrated, at least until the Reformation. But still a few ancient pre-christian traditions have survived, and are still bing celebrated - like the celebrating of the return of the Light, during the darkest night of the year (Lucia), or Midsummer, and naturally the "Jul" (Christmas Eve).
Lastly, I just have a question about what you said about the time you "sacrificed some poor goat."
You said that it was "to dark," and maybe even "satanic."
So I wonder about how you performed that sacrifice. Was the act of killing the goat the central part of the ceremony, or was the killing of the goat more like a part of a "complete sacrificial ceremony" that included the following feast, when you all cooked and ate the meat of the goat?
Few sacrificial traditions have the act of the killing of the sacrifice as the only, and central, part - it is usually just a part in a whole feast, where the eating of the sacrificed food is the central thing. Maybe just one piece (usually the heart) of the sacrificed animal will be left on the fire, for the gods to consume as the smoke rises up to the heavens.
The whole village, or the whole tribe - at least all the participants, will take part of the sacrifice in this way.
And I can not see that as "satanic."
But to just kill, for the sake of the killing, could be interpreted as more satanic, wouldn't you agree about that?
It is aslo quite interesting to understand that the ancient christian commentators and missionaries, etc, actually called several pre-christian religions and cults (that included sacrifice) as "satanism."
So the very act of sacrifice animals (and humans I assume) for religious purposes could probably be interpreted as "Satanism."
Especially without feasting of the meat. Because even christian culture eat animals, and slaughter them. And that is not viewed as satanic.
Sure, some cultures did engage in sacrifice of humans, and killing just for the sake of killing, in a religious setting. And the ancient norse at least seemed to have done exactly that (Different sources describe the 9 year blots, that took place at both Uppsala and Leyre. And the precolombian cultures of mesoamerica, certainly were engaged in human sacrifice on a massive scale. Probably Polynesian cultures too.
But most sacrificial practices didn't just kill their offering just for the sake of killing, it was just a part of their collective festivities.
Just like they do in "Valhall" where the gathered warriors feast on the flesh of the sacrifices pig "Särimner" every evening.
So if the myths mirror the present culture, it could say something about how the ancient norse practiced animal sacrifice - not just killing for the sake of killing, but more like inviting the gods and the ancestors to the table, and let them share in the feast.
Quite far from "satanism".
It wouldn't be accepted today, in the west at least, even though most of us eat meat, and are accepting the mass slaughter of animals on a humongous scale. But somehow we have a hard time accepting killing before our very eyes.
Sacrifice is historically correct, and yes, in rituals I ran I always tried to make sure I took the animal home, butchered it, and prepared it to serve at the next event so that it wasn’t wasteful. And it was always part of a larger ritual. Sacrifice itself isn’t Satanic, but it does attract people in the modern world who just want to kill things because it is “metal.” I don’t believe I ever did anything with that intent, and after a while it seemed rather pointless to me and it isn’t part of what I do now.
मि॒त्रस्तन्नो॒ वरु॑णो दे॒वो अ॒र्यः प्र साधि॑ष्ठेभिः प॒थिभि॑र्नयन्तु । ब्रव॒द्यथा॑ न॒ आद॒रिः सु॒दास॑ इ॒षा म॑देम स॒ह दे॒वगो॑पाः ॥
मित्रस्तन्नो वरुणो देवो अर्यः प्र साधिष्ठेभिः पथिभिर्नयन्तु । ब्रवद्यथा न आदरिः सुदास इषा मदेम सह देवगोपाः
May Mitra, Varuṇa, the divine Aryaman, conduct us by the most practicable paths, then, (when wedesire their guidance), accordingly as Aryaman promises to the liberal donor (of oblations), may we, enjoying the protection of the gods, rejoice in abundance, together with posterity. Rigveda 7.64.3.Happy new year from a hindu believer of the divine gods. Coming from a vedantic hindu family i believe you might be going through the same phase as late vedic rishis who tried many gods before devoting to brahman. Anyways your t-shirt(rta) is dope. Very few people or actually i can count those people, realise that rta is superior to dharma.
I know I've said this in the past, but i really appreciate watching your perspective evolve. I too saw alot of problems within the Heathen community that ultimately lead me to think it wasn't tenable as a religion despite me learning a great deal about religious concepts and archetypes because of it. I've evolved into a much more panthiestic and stoic view of God. Took alot of reading about various religions and philosophies, but that's where i tend to sit today.
Thanks and good to hear.
Reading fire in the dark is fantastic to have this videos
Good to hear!
Finally somebody who with sense!! This is a video that absolutely needs more views!! Lots of truth in this video and great points
Especially recently i have really seriously started lose my temper over these freaking Asatru folks. I really felt hopeless that is there anybody who has common sense anymore, i just saw only these neo-eugenetists, natsoc (or neo-nazi type people whatever) pan-germanists, racial and religious purinists, pagan crusaders and fundamentalists, new age folks etc.
But then you appeared and restored my hope.
I tried Norse faith for a while, but didn't feel it was for me. I like these stories and deities ofcourse, but i couldn't properly relate to them. May have something to do with my country's history.
It is really shame such a great mythology is totally corrupted by this type crap what you said the video.
Great points what you said about influences from Satanism, didn't even fully realize that untill now. I think another problem with Asatru and neo-paganism is mystification, making ancient religion looking kind of weird and obscure.
it seems like you just view the religion by what others are doing with it and not what YOU can do with it
Started watching because it randomly popped onto my algorithm. Kept watching because this guy is hot. Finished watching because it was very informative.
As someone with the black pagan stallion of Widukind, because its the Coat of arms of my birth county, i have a few points.
1. "Western/Anglo" Culture is deeply germanic, Angeln, Sachsen, Dänen were heathen/pagan who deeply influenced the british isles. Our understanding of democracy is germanic not ancient greek.
2. Laconicly i would say you could differenciate between heathen and pagan. Pagan is the anglocized form where nordic, germanic and celtic mixed. Heathen are for me the old rituals and believes of the homeland, as someone who grew up in the old country its just a mentality and folklore.
3. I am too drunk right now to talk about scaninavians and celtics, franks etc. my time and buzz are worth to much
4. Wotan as the wanderer and holder of female magic. How you tread women really reflects if your ancestors pray to wotan or odin.
He was a trickster that made sacrifices for wisdom, writing and poetry. It really discribes the "western" way of how to engage problems, ofcourse there are greco roman influences but the fusion of being willing to work hard but find a clever solution that works is something that realy can be found even in american work ethic.
5. You are sometimes as cringy as your physique is developed.
6.
"Not (Judeo-)Christian" is pretty funny, as if the judeo-part wasn't added only recently.
That’s the funny thing about objective truth. It’s True for everyone, everywhere at all times regardless of who espouses it, who denies and who believes it. If one group does a better job demonstrating they have it but you don’t like them it does not change Truth.
so i created my own religion, tax free, retirement, ect....
Awesome. Can we be expecting a "problems with Judaism" video any time soon?
I've never practiced Judaism, but thanks for proving my point.
As a spinoff of Satanism, modern “Germanic“ [neo-]paganism falls within the framework of Judaism and the Jacob vs. Esau dialectic it establishes, i.e. Yahweh and his Chosen People-the seed of Jacob (aka Israel)-vs. Satan (aka Samael), guardian angel of the seed of Esau (aka Edom) i.e. Rome i.e. 'Christendom' i.e. all European Gentiles.
I disagree with this dudes video in a lot of way but the whataboutism here is pointless
@@orderoffire The are very racist and prejudicial, yet they want us to be the exact opposite; beginning with the Frankfurt School.
@@johnmarston-yb5gn Google my name and realize who you are talking to. I was on a hatewatch list before you figured out how to masturbate.
I don't Thor's hammer often but when I do I swear up and down it's Buddhist
Too much of it is "Unsubstantiated Personal Gnosis".
As a Norwegian, I never understod why Americans get so into this. I feel some connecting to it, because of the cultural aspect, but I don't understand why anyone else but Northen Europeans would connect with this. These old sagas are essentially nursery rhymes for adults written around the themes of our culture and nature. And as you said, the current representation of this is obviously nonsense and fantasy from the last 200 years. The people who worshipped Tor and Odin was farmers and fishermen, poor as hell, hoping that saying a few words to Tor would help them in some way. This practice, of praying to some entity for luck, is common in all human history all over the world. It's quite different from modern religions. Norse mythology is just our version of this with our cultural spin on it. Back then you "prayed" to gods to feel like you have something or someone on your side because of their misery and struggles. No offense, but if they could see some of this American worship, like watching a bunch of buff guys with tattos run into the woods screaming and burning shit, I think they would wonder what a hell you guys were doing.
I think you are correct.
Ahhh, the old "my ancestors wouldn't have said/ done/ thought THAT" argument. Until you find a working time machine, these claims are speculative at best, frivolous at worst.
@@rabidbadger3855 Correct, that's why I said "i think". We don't know. Just as we don't know if the current pagan scene has anything to do with the real past.
Hey Jack, you will probably never read this, but I have read all your books and followed you for several years. I thinks it admirable how you continue to evolve and really dig your concept of solar idealism, however with all due respect do you think if you had children some of your perspectives could change on certain subjects mentioned in this video?
I don't think so. At least half if not a majority of the men in The Order of Fire have children.
Saying that a group of people have no connection to their past, because they are not the same as a modern group of people, who live closer to the geographic location of a historic group of people, is completely asinine. The modern group of people who Americans are not completely identical to, are just as different and removed in their modern lives from their less evolved, and antique ancestors. If Americans have no connection to their past, than Germans have no connection to their past, and no group of people in the entire world who are slightly different from their ancestors culturally, even if they are not so much genetically. Would have no connection to their past, at least in the propagandist sense that you are trying to persuade.
Why aren't they Roman? Why "this" particular block of a few hundred years and not a different one? How long does a people remain a people? If Americans have been in America for several generations, which identity is more important, and why?
@@orderoffire People could worship roman gods if they want, most of them are Indo-european in origin anyways. Western indo-european people all share a common descent and culture that it is at least 6000 years old. Thats how old most folktales are too btw. That's why white pagans are largely interested in their own native religions, because that mythology reflects the deep seated psychology of their ancestors which is embedded into their genes, and they now have the freedom to pursue those interests without fear of being persecuted by Christians. A people remain a people to the extent that they still exist.
Prior to ww2, Americans would always describe themselves as union formed of multiple nations and peoples who all have their own culture. It was only after ww2 that this bland form of fake phony anglo-centric protestant christian-esque corporate conformity """culture""" was astroturfed as the norm, and it has drained the life from the american people's souls. They can no longer drown themselves with high wages, booze, and the old good times, because they no longer exist. It is only natural the alienated youth couldn't give two shit fucks less about American "culture", what little of it even remains. How many Americans own their own business? What percentage of the population are still farmers? Is small town America not effectively dead? America is nothing like what it was in the 1800s, or even the early 1900s. Americans are not a nation, they are a collection of mutts with mostly English ancestry, and even that is not universally true.
Ultimately America's attempts to completely distinguish itself from the old world has only led to it having boring ugly architecture, and fucking up simple shit like bread with stuff like heavily processed wonder bread. Most of America's achievements and accomplishments are but a thing of the past, whether it be our freedoms, living standards, or works of beauty and wonder that have now been torn down. Our main place in this world is to be nothing more than corporate drones who fund the military industrial complex so we can selflessly babysit the entire world, at our own expense of course. The good thing is that we keep the peace, the bad thing is that everyone hates us and we don't receive any of the real positive benefits of being an empire. I'm rambling a lot here, but I and many other people out there don't really give a shit about something as artificial as America's civic identity. If we had the means to leave, and weren't discriminated against by most non-Anglo western Europeans, then there would be no reason to double down on a sense of american identity simply as a response to being isolated or ostracized. American identity only exists out of spite and contempt, or pure ignorant bliss.
As a kid I would pass a place that was dug up as an Native American Burial place does that mean I can connect with "a little piece of that heritage" answer please. My problem is that religion experience comes from just that experience.
All my male ancestors look like you (not the tattoos, just the conformation). Even my darling daughter is six foot two, 285 pounds, strong as an ox and very inclined to her own opinion (but very girly, nevertheless). My parents, on both sides, were German, Scot/Irish, and Cherokee. All the men are over 6 feet (most are over 6 ft 4 in) and quite robust. My father's dad was born in the Hamburg area of north western Germany. In fact, all his relatives, those who came to the USA, were from that area of Lower Saxony, near to the southern border of Denmark. All of the members of this family who came to the USA are related, all from one family. I've done some research and there are over 200 of the German relatives still in the Hamburg region today. I believe most of those people were Lutheran (makes sense, I guess), and they had lots of kids and most of them have retained the tendency to be religious, to some extent.
I was raised Baptist but managed to weasel out of the church-going rituals early in life and then did some of that "exploration" of various kinds of religious practices on my own, never to adopt anything as a life-long thing to stick with. I was mostly doing amateur research on the who, what, why, and how of the phenomenon to see if any of it was really something essential and true and necessary to human life, you might say. I got what I wanted from each and moved on. Eventually I realized it wasn't religion, per se, that meant all that much to me, but found there was an underlying truth to be had from the core of religion that put EVERYTHING (the universal "Everything") into perspective. You might describe it the way the scene from the old TV series Kung Fu did, in which the Master asked Kwai-Chang Caine (then a boy) "Who are you?" and the boy didn't have the right answer initially but later on he did answer "You." Yes.
It's not the surface features of brand-name religion that we need to pay attention to but the core that the features hopefully point to. The One. It's all one. All the trappings of this or that religion are interesting and cultural and social and all the things that might (or might not) bind a group of people together...they didn't bind me together with anybody, alas...but they sort of serve a purpose to the psychology of the individual looking for his or her "tribe."
Genetically I have a tribe, and only recently discovered where they came from, and it's all very fun to hear about Vikings and so forth possibly being "my people." The Cherokee ancestor was from my dad's mother whose great grandmother was on the Trail Of Tears from Tennessee to Oklahoma (survived it, thank God). I do believe in God, capital "G," and have assumed this to be the Core but also the Path and the Language and the Tribe and the Reason for existence. In this, we are all One, all related, all aspects, all elements of the great I AM.
Obviously, I'm brand new to your channel. I'll watch again, partially because I think you're On The Road...I was once told by a good friend that he thought most people spent their lives looking for The Road but he thought I was On The Road. I took it as one of those "little birdie" whisperings that come into your ear to give you a hint that you're making progress on your path and to encourage you to keep going. God whispers like that and I get those often. Sometimes He blows a gale but I really like the little whisperings. It's like a puzzle you're supposed to work out. Fun.
I'm a heathen. And I get to know and include ideas and people based on what entitles I see working through them or attached to them. I've learnt allot of magic of the Aboriginal culture here in Australia. But they aren't my ancestors but they could help me learn how to access the roots of my genetic expression and my soul lineage. Etc. Yeah it's easier with Europeans to be honest cause it's coded in the DNA but there are plenty of black fellas who have met Odin.
I'm a heathen because the vale lifted , Frigga took mu conciousness to Asgard. Then Odin blew me into a dark realm where I met Hernaz in tears. Boom. Being faring firth ever since.
I've met many many beings now. That different cultures have met along the road.
Great video and it really gave me better understanding and perspective on these things.
I'm gonna call it... this video is going to be the beginning of the take off of your channel. Not only is the ideals expressed within the video pure, but the "aesthetic" of it with the "golden hour" glow of the lights, and the more wide angle shot with you in the center proselytizing and sharing your knowledge in a free/neutral tone, and the unique "harsh" maybe ai-generated thumbnail of odin and the ravens, all add to what I think is a unique "hit" for what your channel is to become. Continue to seek the light, i'm sure it will help others in time as well.
Thanks!
Very interesting video. Just one comment. The border between Celtic and Germanic is very clear. All Germanic culture begun with the Battle Axe Culture and The Nordiz Bronze Age in Sweden and Denmark. Celtic people lived in Germany until 700-500 BC when Germanic people migrated there from Scandinavia. When the Garmanic people started to migrate down to Germany it also split the Germanic language in two branches. North Germanic in those that stayed in Scandinavia and West Germanic in those the settled down in Germany.
Yes but he meant that we can't be 100% sure which tribe was Germanic and which Celtic and they also intermingled when the Germanic tribes pushed south.
Satanism is a gateway. It is not the destination. With age and experience comes the need for structure/order.
Agreed
Satanism is especially the gateway for former Christians, I'd say. As the idea of Satan represents rebellion against the insane strictures of the Abrahamic God/s, so those who leave those religions want to demonstrate, in no uncertain terms, their rejection of its God/s.
Satanism is also a great way of stopping the "I know you'll come back to the fold" and other apologetics from friends and family that inevitably come in torrents when one leaves the family religion/cult.
Something i found very interesting, whilst i was looking for traces of monotheism in the ancient germanic peoples was this here "In wider Germanic mythology, he is known in Old English as Tīw and in Old High German as Ziu, all stemming from the Proto-Germanic theonym *Tīwaz, meaning '(the) God'. Little information about the god survives beyond Old Norse sources. Due to the etymology of the god's name and the shadowy presence of the god in the extant Germanic corpus, some scholars propose that Týr may have once held a more central place among the deities of early Germanic mythology." To me, it always seems like the same story in most cultures, originally there was faith in only one God, the Creator, but in time, people started adding their own folklore, the ancient chinese had this with Shang-Di, even the Aztecs had a concept of what we would understand as "God" yet they were too preoccupied with their "Gods". I found this information about "Tiwaz (the) God" so interesting since it is the fairly same with "Al-Lah (the) God".
As a native German in Germany, I got a closer tie to heathenry over Americans, which take race way more serious but also water it down to the skin. You can be white, but is it really your history, culture and people. I don't take pride in Nordic heathenry, since I am not Nordic, I am German.
Really enjoying all of the enraged extremely online neo-nazi race-fetishists proving my point in the comments. There's not an argument they have that I haven't had to sit and listen to a hundred times, which is why am actively alienating them. They destroy everything they touch.
"extremely online" lol
I think that christianity perfectly rounds up this issue. Because they clearly state what a sin is but give free choice. Also, Christians are allowed to practise therre way of showing love to god and praising his creation by certain lifestyles.
Hi Jack, how much theatrical acting work have you done outside of the God of War Pagan Shaman character you play? The English have been rivals with Germany over who wears the pants as the dominant central establishment group of western Europe for centuries. We speak English, but the Royal Family of England are all German. Empirical Great Britain, along with it's dubious allies, the Russian Bolsheviks and the war hungry US, all carved up Germany and shared in the rich spoils of war for themselves during the occupation beginning in 1945. Thick as thieves they were! And the good times lasted for decades! But like all hungry lions and nesting war hawks, eventually their carnal appetites get the better of them and they look for more lifeblood to ingest. And when there isn't any, they turn on themselves. It's a tremendously cruel and vicious circle to tread, but nevertheless one that can gather a great deal of participation.
I'm from a military town in the US,and yes,the military industrial complex profits from Germany to this day.
808 subscribers, at the time of viewing, is a great number. Interesting work, brother, although I am still to look at it in depth (time permitting). At any rate, I suppose the task is to elevate oneself above the mundane, from whatever perspective/angle one chooses to do so, and in protective respect of other beings (visible and invisible). This is sine qua non. As is the cultivation of qualities such as virtue (strength) and wisdom (vision, pardon the pun). Good luck, etc [the Devanagari t-shirt is not bad either]
No, people want a history. The God we worship is a Jewish one. We have no religions of our own as Europeans....AFter WW2 all Aryan historical research was banned from Academia. It all comes back to the Indo European Myths.
I'm sure you're an absolute hoot at parties.
@@JohnDorian-j7x We're not at a party are we?
More I learn more I realize we are all the same, they paint africans as tribal but all humans were. We basically all did the same stuff but claim to be different.
Yea,we're all tribal,for sure.
@@ConcedoNulli beautifully said 😊
@@ConcedoNulli apart from the nazis in the mooon!
Kinda of a random video to be recommended to a muslim, but nonetheless very interesting video glad it got recommended to me
for me I like a religion that transcend tribal and racial boundaries and treat all it's members equally regardless of ethnicity. Of course there's nothing wrong with celebrating you people or culture but God putting your people on a pedestal that's a whole another level.
Religion that only accepts spusific race or tribe never really made sense to me, for god to create the world and then choose only a spusific tribe or race to be the chosen people and give them special treatment. I'd rather believe in a god that will judge me based on my actions not based on my blood or ancestors and that why I prefer religions like islam or christianity.
And there are many other points that I have problem with when it comes to those ancient tribal religions and I think your video made a very good critique to these tribal religions. And raised points I never really considered or known about, that was certainly an insightful video.
Thanks for watching and for your comment.
You are right that "tribal religions" don't make sense. Because they aren't religion. They are a political agenda, and one which was created during the 19th century to promote European Nationalism. It wasn't just Paganism that this happened to, but also Christianity. Read about Positive Christianity, the official religion of Nazi Germany: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Positive_Christianity
This "tribal religion" thing also happened to Judaism. It was called "Zionism." See what it has brought us nowadays.
The real Heathen religion is one that accepts all people, because the gods created everything and they are in everything. The ancient Heathens had no concept of race whatsoever. And the Havamal, which are the morals Odin gave to humanity, and all the ancient myths which have been passed on to us, show that hospitality was always the greatest and most important virtue. People would even let complete strangers into their own home because that stranger could be one of the gods themselves. And the stranger also needed to be respectful to their host, because common decency and mutual work is the only path for life. And you should have common respect for all mortals, and everything in the world, because that is the only way humanity will live and thrive. Ragnarok will come "when no man is true to one another." And man here means "human" not just the masculine gender.
But these Nationalists who pretend to be "Pagan," and this idiot who made this video, are all blasphemers who just want to push an agenda. They don't want whats best for people, and certainly not for Pagans. They worship Nietszche and Carl Jung and Julius Evola first before Odin. They have no idea what Odin truly is!
@@JackDonovan and thank you for the informative video
What camera do you use, Jack? Amazing quality
Sony A7iii with a Black Promist Filter to make it more cinematic and give the light a bloom.
@@orderoffire If you were open to certain verifiable information you would know why these things are mentioned. As well as the fact that Abrahamism is itself Satanic. But I will admit that Varg Vikerness is a fool.
Worth the listen
Thanks
You're aware that Wotan, Woden and Oden are the same right?
OMG NO WAY I SOMEHOW MISSED THAT.
Glad to see humans with compassion still exist 😊
I received a comment relating to a personal comment I made earlier. Unfortunately, I cannot reply directly to this person. He claims to know more about my personal reading habits than I do, and chooses yo ignore the personal experience which people my age have gone through..
We must not forget the very dark shadow the Nazis cast upon Europe and the US. I regret that these atrocities have been repeated several times since then. Sorry for disrupting the flow of conversation.
I delete the neo-nazi comments that come after the initial reactions. They are obsessed, mentally ill losers with nothing to do but create multiple anonymous profiles -- but not enough talent to make their own videos. If they showed their faces, no one would respect them anyway.
Steiner talked about an Anglo Norman pursuit for English not German to replace French as the global language. It all goes back to one civilization conquers another .re germanic pride start with Goethe
I personally get the feeling that all the ancient peoples of the earth worshipped the sun. as the 1st religious act on the planet. all the organized religions and labeled practices give me red flags.
I prefer the Gnostic path in norse paganism called Thursatru that a)basically says fire is masculine and ice is feminine b) isn't about ancestry because the framework is about the anti-cosmic order of the aesir and c)doesn't see the eddas as the be all end all.
So basically Satanism based loosely on Snorri's lore.
@@orderoffireyes. lol
@@orderoffirebut they’re not saying that their practice absolutely has to stem from the eddas but it uses it as a guide, but they’re comfortable changing things.
@@alimushtaq2589 Why anti-cosmic? Isn't the postmodern world anti-cosmic enough? It's not shocking or interesting...satanism is normal.
@@orderoffirei don’t think it’s shocking but i think it’s another way to address the problems of norse paganism that you pose without necessarily leaving the perspective.
Good stuff here.
Thanks
As an afghan pashtun, 2andme confirmed that I have scandinavian y dna going back countless generations.
As an aryan I feel quite close to my germanic kin and I must say that cursing other races for the sake of it (ie blacks, jews) is stupid and immoral however at the same time there is nothing wrong about having pride in your warrior ancestry and wanting to preserve it by "having white babies", every other race has the that same ethos.
So I wouldn't blame modern white odinists for wanting that same thing for their race/heritage
Agreeing with most of what you say. Not with the concept of how the sun is die Sonne and the moon is der Mond. I thought about that a lot and it will make sense when you look beyond the obvious. The sun is in fact neither male nor female, right, but since it (she/he? lol) represents something symbolically and not just in language, the ‘flipped’ article is like acknowledging the suns inner anima, and the moons inner animus. Or one could also say the moon reflects femininity, but it essentially is thus the opposite. The sun reflects masculinity in the concept of masculinity also symbolizing authority in this regard, threrefor it is essentially female. I am pretty sure this is kind of a narrow path and one that in itself symbolizes a well preserved wisdom, or concept of wisdom. German is one of the rare languages that not only has three articles (still) like Sanskrit, but it can be traced back very far back towards the previous ages/ yugas. Remember Shiva also has the moon symbolized on his forehead. And that implies consciousness. The sun is thus a symbol for energy, all firms of energy are Shakti, the female counterpart to Shiva. Both represent the initial Godhead that split itself to experience itself and ultimately reunite with itself.
I've always found Jung's anima/animus a bit trans, and obviously inspired by the alchemy and occultism he loved so much. Everything is a Baphomet if you want it to be.
@@orderoffire understood. But please don't overlook my other argument, which I personally put more weight on: that the sun is only conceptually male, and the moon only conceptually female because we as a culture like to associate the sun with authority and the moon with reflections and changes (and we dualistically assign the same values to male and female accordingly). My argument was pointing towards an older wisdom beyond these concepts which is now hidden not because it is intended so but because of culture and the zeitgeist. The sun represents energy, energy is also female (die Energie) in German. The moon represents the mind (der Verstand) in German,, which is also male. The mind can be intentional and represents potential focus. Those characteristics are dualistically assigned as male. Energy is potential power, that is Shakti, female. The sun is representing that universal source of energy. And last but lost least, German just like Sanskrit also has a third (es, das) article. Consciousness is das Bewusstsein in German. Why is consciousness not male in German when it is so often opposed conceptually with matter (mater, mother, female energy)? Shiva is the opposite of Shakti right? Yes, and Shiva is conceptually male, but potentially Shiva and Shakti are one. Therefor, it makes sense to me that the mind is male but consciousness is neither male nor female, but rather both and none at the same time. Consciousness without our mental limits is potentially boundless, goes beyond our concepts we create with the mind. I hope you see that my argument was more about this idea, not so much about Jungs anima, animus. I only mentioned that because that could be another point for the logic of the mind. My reasoning though is rather looking deeper into the concepts of old still somewhat traceable in language..I am trying to break the limits we put ourselves into, and I don't intend to talk about shitty genderism bs.
@MattyDRx Ive researched a lot of ANCIENT society and we used to be a matriarch as humans. Women actually started civilizations according to a few sources before men even knew about how child birth actually worked. According to a few sources the y chromosome almost disappeared between 7-10 thousand ywars ago, and it's written that the oldest holy animal or animal with god like praises was the praying mantis. If this is true and they were messengers of god they would have been sacrificing men left and right 😵💫
@@Jaybee6428 That's totally inaccurate feminist revisionism with zero evidence to support it. If women "started" civilization, they were totally outcompeted by patriarchal societies to the point where all evidence of "their" civilizations were (conveniently) wiped off the face of the earth.
@@Jaybee6428 very interesting! Thanks for sharing.
you should talk with youtuber Skjalden about this
I have followed Heathenry for many years. But the East Coast version is much more focused on practices and making sure we are not associated with the Nazism that was so destructive.
My ancestry is Irish/German. And being a post WWII child, I had to deal with the aftermath of Hitler in a city that was full of Jewish refugees and their relatives. No one wanted to be identified with Nazis. The German immigrants were refugees of the collapse of a nation.
In my eclectic research, I have mostly encountered, open groups, who are mostly northern European in heritage, being open to all.
Thanks for your post.
19:20 note to self
great stuff!
Odin was their deity who becomes man . Also ,w o tolkien ,there wud b n0 black met4l !
in my personal point of view, which I don't disagree that some people take race in the wrong direction, most people of euro decent are looking for their DOS if you will and default to Germanic. there are to my scant research some shared ideas for euro pagans that we still default to, the number of black folk I have worked with that think I'm crazy for just doing things not worrying about my safety which everyone of them say is a white person thing makes me laugh. I believe that people need to do the research to find where they come from, yes the water is muddy in most areas when it comes to religion of old. that does not change the core tents of that area, if your Celt, Germanic, Slavic, gallic doesn't matter the core is going to fit a lot better then modern religion. on the note of race or hate in general I dislike the people that hate Abrahamic religions on principle, if their intent is good let them be, but those people are hatful anyways doesn't matter if they believe in the flying spaghetti monster or Christ or Odin or Zeus. I say people need to spend time on this even if I know they wont and are looking for a quick answer.
Isn't American blood native american blood? I just want to understand what my ancestors believed.
Sounds like I'm an Odinist.
A real big one.
Later dude
Not sure if it's because you are an American born in a "melting pot", but for someone who claims to have to much experience with Paganism, you seems like you don't really understand it. EVERY Pagan tradition is the tradition of a specific people. It is the spiritual manifestation of a specific culture and thus, a specific race too. It doesn't mean that one hates any other race. It's only that the particular Pagan tradition in question is OF a particular people. It is their root to the past and ancestors. Every people can have theirs. And in case you don't know, as you may not know because you are an American - most people in the world throughout all history, were not born in a "multicultural melting pot". The USA is the abnormality, not the other nations. You can go for Neopaganism like the Order of Fire or Wicca which are rootless and be multicultural with that, and that's fine too.
Paganism died in Europe centuries ago. All European paganism is neopaganism.
@@orderoffire let’s respectfully agree to disagree on that one.
@@AntonioBrandao You can believe whatever you like, but what I said is a fact. There is absolutely no evidence of an unbroken practice of anything approaching Germanic paganism in Europe. Whoever told you otherwise is making things up.
@@orderoffire Paganism never dies because it lives with the respective people. It’s can be put asleep and awaken at any time.
🙄
Perhaps this racial stuff is what motivates some people, I think it's unnecessary. To be sure, there is value in family, tradition, and firm roots. But this doesn't require inbreeding - these are things which carry on regardless of your partner's race, as long as your tradition remains strong.
What draws me to Odin is nothing to do with race. If anything I'm more connected to my east-Asian side. What draws me to Odin is the fact that I suffer, and I have developed a certain masochism in my pursuit of enlightenment. Pain gives me perspective, and through this I have learned the power of narrative to guide my destiny. My path in life is that of the dark wizard.
Getting caught up in all the technicalities of lineage and geography will merely distract from the primal essence of spirituality that one is seeking to begin with. If you want to know the gods, then feel them in your soul.
forced beliefs don´t really count
in terms of true spirituality..
that´s why modern christians who
have chosen to be that are way more
christian than anyone in medieval
germany.
as are voluntary modern pagans more
pagan than anyone in the viking age.
often it´s only the priests who are
actually into the religious side
of things.. the others are just
bystanders, the great majority of
people, they care more about what´s
for dinner!
you could argue that religion
isn´t even needed in regular life..
food is, sun is, jesus christ,
definately not.
if you removed all the cultural
stuff from the forced religions they
would have nothing left.. you can´t
be both cultural and universal
at the same time (that´s why they´re
such a shit show).
everyone who speaks the same language
as me, definately not my people..
those who walk the same winter paths,
especially now that the sun is
returning.. we might have something
in common.
acknowledging satanism is the same as christianity, I do neither. Move along
none of this is true for me so i don't really know what shrooms you're on about.
what you're describing seems like folkism/odinism and larpers and not real reconstructed germanic paganism.
Who has outlined the "real reconstructed germanic paganism" you're talking about?
I'm very familiar with the scope of the scene in America from left wing etsy witches to right wing folkish heathens/odinists, the afa, and the people I've interviewed in the middle like academics Nordvig and Brute Norse.
If you think you're practicing something that has been accurately reconstructed in the absence of significant source material, that's fine. I don't care. This video is about why I don't practice it and why my group doesn't practice it.
"not in 2023". Yet, now more than ever is when we need to be...
I'm one of these very tribal people, but at the same time you're taking it to the extreme by saying it should only be worshipped where it was founded and if you're in America you're totally disconnected. First, that makes zero sense if you have any belief of ancestry and spirits. Second, we have always been explorers and conquerors. So in a way, Americans still have that spirit even more so. Third, time is much more of a disconnector than space. Would you say the same thing about the Icelandic Vikings? You're really trying hard here to discourage people.
With that last point about time, every religion is basically a new religion. Christianity has split off into tons of sects. 99% of them don't follow the same rules, etc. You're also making your own religion. So I see no issue in people trying their best to recreate a religion. Heck, I'd say modern Pagans are closer to the real thing than modern Christians are to their original form.
"Heck, I'd say modern Pagans are closer to the real thing than modern Christians are to their original form."
You actually have less of an idea what "the real thing" is with the invented religion of Asatru etc.,, because no one really knows what the actual beliefs of the diverse groups of people you're cherry-picking from history for racial and aesthetic reasons actually was.
"First, that makes zero sense if you have any belief of ancestry and spirits."
Confirmation that this is basically Viking Racialist Wicca.
"The spirits told me we're doing it right."
OK.
"Second, we have always been explorers and conquerors."
Who is "we?" Actually, the majority of the people included in whatever "we" you come up with were peasants. Such is the case with any people.
"You're also making your own religion"
Yes, you are correct. The difference is that I am being honest about it instead of pretending that spirits have revealed the ancient ancestral wisdom of my people to me.
All of that aside, as I said in the video, this is my criticism of that religion and the scene that comes with it after practicing and studying it for several years and doing far more than most who claim it as an identity.
I actually made this video for The Order of Fire to better explain my position to the guys, who sometimes ask about it.
I really don't care if other people practice Germanic Paganism or not. Most religions are actually pretty ridiculous on paper, and Germanic Paganism certainly isn't the most ridiculous religion by a long shot.
PATCH ON THE WRONG EYE..JS
Been watching your evolution as a writer and speaker since you were with the Wolves ( I was never one, or associated with them,; just aware of them). I've been shrugging off this Solar Idealism concept as something like a new-age cult-of-personality... well... cult. However, given that you're still diving deep into issues that matter, and making sober analyses of other religions, I feel like I shouldn't brush off what you're doing. That said, I have a couple concerns I'd like to express, with the hope that you might see them.
First of all, and I mean no disrespect, but rather complete honesty, it feels extremely LARPy. Assuming that you don't literally believe in the 3 gods you outline in Solar Idealism, aren't you just playing pretend and going through empty motions? Especially in the face of countless ancient real religions, that have real gods that people genuinely believe in, which you openly borrow from. Essentially, this would be the definition of D&D-style LARP, but taken to an extreme level. On the other hand, you believe the 3 gods literally exist, in which case, where does your belief come from? Instead of accepting/respecting any names or descriptions of historical precedent, you give them your own nicknames and symbols. How does this carry any legitimacy? How can you be confident that what you are doing is pleasing to the gods?
If we compare what you are doing to something like what Survive The Jive advocates for, it seems like his approach to reconstructionist pagan spirituality has a lot more... well... evidence behind its practice - tried and true methods, specifics instead of generalities.
Secondly, and I again mean this with all due respect as someone who has read 3 of your books, your background in Satanism does not inspire confidence that this cult is not also founded, on some deep level, out of spite against the Christian establishment, or otherwise informed by Satanic inverted morality (selfishness and power-mongering as virtues in and of themselves, for instance). What is the actual "good" in this, for society, for humanity, for your tribe, etc. I suppose what I mean to ask is - is this something self-serving, or is this something that recognizes that you are beneath a greater force (the gods, the forces of nature, etc)?
You mean my background of being in Satanism for 4 years, 20 years ago, like 80% of the practicing neopagans today?
Obviously you haven't read the book that addresses your questions, Fire in the Dark, so this reads like insincere concern trolling.
@@orderoffire Is is so interesting to see how different it can be between the American, and the European culture.
Here you make the claim that you, in the US, have about 80% neopagans that have a background in "Satanism."
In Europe, at least in Northern Europe, it can be said that about 80% have a background within the "Environmental Movement." And quite a lot have a background in the anti-fascist movement.
Perhaps it could have had developed differently, if the "Viking-Loving Skinheads" from the 80s and 90s never had been met with this nationwide condemnation as they were met with. That movement totally disappeared, and today there are exactly zero neo-nazi skinheads left in Scandinavia (that doesn't mean that there are no racists, and so on, in Scandinavia, it is only the "neo-nazi Skinhead Movement" that disappeared.
So, that never happened, and instead we have a neopagan thing here in Scandinavia that are based more of former Environmentalists and antifascists, and are more inclined towards radical Left Wing politics, rather than Right Wing politics.
But perhaps this have more to do with the overall Scandinavian political culture - that is so much more Left Wing compared with the Americans. It has more to do with present day culture, since the old Vikings most certainly were no "Left Wingers" ... 🙂
I don’t disagree with many of the things that you say; however, you’re clearly skimming surface level ideas from Richard Spencer and Mark Brahmin, retarding them, and ultimately rebranding them into your “solar religion”-again taking from Mark and Richard. Many of the things you mentioned: Wagner, metal music, an emphasis on Christian influence on the Eddas, were all mentioned in the past weeks on Mark and Richard’s classes/podcasts. You are obviously listening to them.
I don't follow RIchard or Mark (I actually have no idea who Mark is, but wouldn't follow anyone associated with Richard on general principle). All of this is based on a book I published in 2021 and have been using the slogan "stay solar" since 2019. The Order of Fire is over a year old and I've already performed rituals with our members several times and in have even done so in Ireland. As the video explained, I actually performed Germanic pagan rituals for years and abandoned them around 2020 for the reasons explained. I have receipts. Your echo chamber isn't as influential as you think it is, and I don't want anyone associated with white nationalists as a follower.
@@JackDonovan When the ethnostate comes, keep that same energy how your not associating with white nationalists when you can go live with the blacks.
@@NatsocRevolutionary I have many concerns about the future, but Internet Nazis taking over America and creating an ethnostate isn’t one of them.
Hey
Then you google "Isaac Newton Heruli" Arian not Aryan. 1000 years? That would be 1023 AD. Yes I can do that number.
Anything that isn’t the worship of the living Triune God Father, Son and Holy Spirit is pagan my brother! And if there is only 1 God why wouldn’t you think That God would be the only way ??? Doesn’t it make sense , if there is a all powerful creator then He would more then likely be the only of His kind , and if He’s the only one He would be the only way right ? I just got to the part while I was typing where you said you was a priest of Satan , makes all the sense
@@ConcedoNulli : your assuming , I speaking from a monotheist standpoint , that if someone believes their is 1 Almighty God the it would be very logical to believe there is only 1 way , His way ! Your making the common mistake that most humans make by assuming what someone means without asking for more context and more details of a said statement! Respectfully 🤙🏼
I largely agree with you criticisms, but Slightly disagree about your criticism of reconstruction. Predicted proto-germanic forms have been found in the archeological record. Predicted Proto-Indo-European phonemes were found in Hittite. So at least linguistic reconstruction has shown to be reliable, or maybe I am just biased because my area of study was in Linguistics.
I am mixed my father being of Anglo-Saxon ancestry and mother Hispanic. How does one of mixed ancestry choose which gods to venerate? I am not really religious, but I do have a draw towards the religious traditions and customs of Prechristian Europe. I come to similar or the same conclusions as you on Germanic paganism and neopaganism. Thank you for your work.
I'm not criticizing the reconstruction of language (I cite that kind of material all the time) but the reconstruction of religious practices and beliefs based on a combination of fantasy and conjecture.