I loaded and shot 777 in thousands of cartridges over 12 years in Cowboy Action Shooting competitions with no issues. I used 17 grains by VOLUME in my .45 colt pistols and rifle. ❤
What are you meaning that you used only 17 grains to load 45 Colt cartridges? You clearly are not telling any truth! Triple 7 is a black powder substitute its not smokeless powder!! You must be talking about smokeless powder apparently! If you loaded only 17 grains of volume of triple 7 it would not compress at all! And that would not be good! 45 colt needs a 40 grain or some substitutes you might only be able to use 38 grains or so! Yes, 17 grains you are talking about must be a smokeless powder charge!
Back about a year ago, i made contact with someone (i dont want to name names) at Hodgdon about using fffg in handgun cartridges. So i was told that fffg is 10% more “energetic” than ffg, also trip7 is overall 15% more “energetic” than bp or pyrodex. So because the pressures of fffg exceed the bp pressures of these cartridges (im sure those well under ruger type loads) they recommend using ffg. Also, trip7 does not like to be compressed. Its not as forgiving as bp. Thats possibly where the wide spread comes from?!?! Thanks for another great video! Im in the process of building a press for pucking! The prices these days which ever way you look at it are imo gouging!
Great video. I use Swiss in my Flints and Hodgens 777 in my Percussions. With 777 the rule to lower velocity spread is do not compress it. In my .54 rifle I use 60-grains of 777 under a 0.015 patched .535" round ball. When I feel the ball settle against the powder I stop, not tamping. This normally will give a spread of about 30 feet per second.
@@taofledermaus I’ve heard they have load data for 2F 777 in cartridges but not 3F. Something about erratic burn rates under compression which I suspect is the reason for the wide spread. Either way, onward and upward. Next we’re going to try the same load in a rifle to see how it does.
I've been loading 45 Colt cartridges with Blackhorn 209 black powder substitute. It shoots great, ignites good, still gives you a lot of smoke but with a lot less fauling and much easier to clean. I really enjoy watching your channel and you give a lot of good information. Great video thank you.
Too bad it costs like $85……+ for a measly 8 oz……used to be 10 or 12oz. Really kicking myself in the arse for not buying more at Wally World a few years back when it was $30-$35 for 12oz. What are ya gonna do? At least I have 2 cans left!
Hodge on says use ffg triple 7 in cartridges. In the 45 Colt w/250 they say 30 grains volume for 838fps. Just another great option when our powder selections are unavailable.
This channel is definitely inspiring. I got to watching this channel a little over a year ago in the middle of winter and decided that I would learn how to make BP. It worked great!!! I didn’t have a fancy press so I corned it by using a bottle jack under my loaded 1-ton dump truck. Ground it up and sized it with screens. Worked great!!!
I have the same chronograph. My wife shot one of the diffuser support rods with her .308 one day. I gave her a rash of shit for months... Right up until I put a 150 FMJ through the display screen with my .308 She still hasn't let me live it down.
Way back before the component shortages started I was desperate to include something in my kit so I ended up with 1 x 777 (FFG), and 1 x Pyrodex (RS), I haven't seen BP available locally for a number of years and I have yet to crack open the stuff I have. I don't regret having something to play with when the time comes and at this point have no preference anyway. If I ever spy some GOEX or Swiss at a local gunshow it'll end up at home too. haha
Hi Jake, In Australia we pay $152 per plastic bottle of 3F Blackpowder . That’s about $100 USD on current change over rate. A tin of caps 100 per tin $10 USD. Flints $6 each. You guys have it pretty good over there.
According to instructions for cartridge loads for 777 - use FFG and it says to avoid compressing powder. In a reproduction revolver I would hesitate to using FFFG / Compression in a reproduction revolver - in Ruger would be better.
Living in New York have used triple 7 for years in my 45 Colt cartridges. Got to save the precious real stuff for my flintlock. Ps can't sell BP in N.Y.
When I began the journey of black powder, Pyrodex was the only thing to be had in my area $20 pound (Now 2023 I think $27) Black Powder was no where close still 160 mile round trip, add the needless mark up of black powder between $39-$49 a pound plus travel......Nah Pyrodex works well I will grab Triple 7 if there. Pyrodex RS and P are always on a shelf. Funny picked on degraded but yet no one wants to step out in front of it to show me how "WEAK" or "INACCURATE" it is...
Ok so you got me thinking, being in Ca I buy whatever is available whenever it's available. I was pretty sure I bought some 777 back when Obama was in office. I haven't been in my reloading room for years as it is stacked to the roof with contracting tools from when I retired but I fought my way in and took a peak. All I can say is you must be Santa Clause, because it is Christmas in November, I won't give any numbers as it's Ca, but not only 777, but Trailboss, Goex and Swiss on that shelf as well, and rows of large pistol primers. Next time the wife tells me to get lost, I am going in there and not coming out for weeks.
This channel is inspiring. Made my first batch of around 4oz milled and milled some more and milled some more then wet into a ball of dough and ran through some window screen to produce what fool mostly to be FFF and been burning it in my Kentucky Pistol with great results 15gn at a time by weight not volume, looks to be between 22 and 25gn volume. Stuff is consistent, shooting at least as good groups as Goex, and I can’t see it as any more dirty than Goex. Hoping to make some the CIA method you showed next month and compare them. Get some more screens and end up putting up 5-10 pounds of FFF since I’m mostly moving to FFF anyway
Friend you have to try corning your powder. There is a video on this channel about how to do it. Its by far the biggest improvement to homemade powder. All you do is press the powder into pucks with a vise or a shop press. They become extremely hard almost like a ceramic. Then you break it up and grind it to 2ff or 3 fff size. This makes the powder as good as store-bought if not better
Too bad I'm not allowed to make BP here in the barrio as we live together too close to neighbors and are nosey and grandma would go on a rant about blowing up the backyard and house, so I have been forced to buy pyrodex as nobody around here in LA sell BP... Good for all the information as knowledge for the future...
This surprised me also. I have shot 777 in all my cap and ball guns for years and my shotguns love the stuff but never gave it a thought about using it for cartridge.
My local gunsmith/fellow BP shooter keeps recommending T-7. I've always been a little hesitant to explore that powder after learning how to make my own BP. Thanks for sharing this.
Great video! Yep, I’m one I’ve those that likes all the propellants and real black powder just the same. 777 3Fg is my favorite substitute. I have loaded cartridges with it for many years. It works. I’ve never experienced any problems by doing so. It’s a stellar performer in my old .32 long black powder revolvers and it shoots relatively clean in them. I like it for a deer hunting load in my Pietta Remington .44 with a 200 grain LEE conical. It gets em good. I also like it in my old .45 CVA Kentucky rife with a LEE 200 grain REAL bullet and a 75 grain by volume charge for deer hunting. This rifle and load averages 1938 FPS as measured on my old chrony F1. That works out to mighty fine energy transfer on the deer and it’s a tight shooting load.
I guy gave me a can of triple 777 he said it sucked. It sat on my self on my loading bench for yrs. I do CAS and shoot Frontier gun fighter and loaded up 38slp and 44 colt with the stuff at the insistence of another shooter and it worked fine. However I see no advantage to it it is expensive and is just as hard to clean up as real BP. I saw no issues with it in a cartridge other than a bit more pressure that shouldn't matter in a modern made revolver like Uberti but I did reduce what would be a black powderl oad by volume. .
Thanks for sharing. - Down here service and 'choice' are long gone - I just buy what I can while sorting-out how to make my own brew of BP antique propellent asap. You do a great job. Cheers.
777 is potentially pushing the limits on open top Colt replicas. I shot a couple of my cap and ball guns loose. After chronographing, I understood why. My 1851 Navy was pushing 320+ foot pounds energy. My .44 was pushing 500+ fpe. After just a few cylinders of those loads, the loading lever catch had worked loose, the loading lever started falling down, and the central arbor wiggled. The .44 had gone so loose that the hammer no longer reached the caps and the barrel wiggled side to side. After a couple expensive gunsmith bills, I started working to determine a maximum safe 777 load for each gun. I maximally loaded with premium black powder (Swiss 3f or Old Eynsford), then loaded 777 down until it reached those lower velocities. For a .36, 200 foot pounds energy is acceptably powerful and mild on the gun. For a .44, 400 fpe is a hot load, but is reliably handled. Both loads are equivalent to 1,000 feet per second with roundball, and I don’t think it’s a coincidence that Colt cap and ball designs reach that exact speed with full chambers of black powder. Colt probably intended that to be the maximum velocity of a fully loaded percussion pistol. I load 777 to 80% volume to get those levels.
Videos are always educational. I use it in a 209 primer. 50 cal. So, ignition is not a problem. Having real black power for Flint lock is definitely recommended for consistency
Thank you I dont think I have ever been accused of being polite lol. By the way I love 40 grains of 777 in 45 colt. I like the substitute only for cartridges and only to push the velocity as high as possible. Thanks again I really wanted to know the velocity
Intriguing... I had wondered about using substitutes in cartridges and how it would perform, specifically 777. It would appear that it stacks up pretty nice and on par with Swiss. I still prefer Swiss, but being on the road as much as I am, sometimes I have to use 777. Thank you for this video.
Thank you for sharing Jake, I wanted to make my own, but snitches in the neighborhood here in the hood will tell the sheriff office about it cause here in LA, it's close to impossible to find BP and been forced into getting Pyrodex and subs cause that's the only thing that they sell here, in some shops only a handful, but I DID score some Goex from a guy in the Valley but saving it cause I'd rather use the subs cause they readily available here, so I was curious about the results of your experiment Jake cause well, the reasons I stated, still prefer real BP, hard to clean subs...
Awesome video as always. Where I'm at in NC its 31 a pound last i bought. Finally got some graft and sons fffg real black from watching you have fun with the real deal.With shipping it was 25 a pound on sale.
The reason that many BP subs dont work well in flintlocks and cap and ball revolvers is that they are much harder to ignite. Im a propellant chemist and have been making my own versions of sub powders fir many years, the general trend is to replace charcoal with fuels that produce more gas and less solids, and use more powerful oxidizers (perchlorate). Asorbic acid, benzoate, sorbitol, and gluconic acid are examples of fuels that are used. If a sub powder is crushed to a powder durung loading, that makes it even harder ti ignite evenly, the tiny air spaces between propellant granules allows the shock wave from the primer to propagate through the powder charge and hot particles to penetrate better into the charge. Love your channel, keep up the research because powder is only going to get harder to come by, this is a lost art.
I’ve just started watching your videos. Somewhere I seen a suggestion on how to extending your chronographs life span by changing the steel sun shade rods to 3’16’ wooden dowels.
From my limited experience with subs, being on my 2nd CVA Accura, first one was a 45, 2nd one a 50 i was always under the impression i had to shoot 777. In the meanwhile i dropped that impression completely and am back to bp. 777 is crushing easier than corned bp - so maybe thats the reason for the warning: crushed powder causing inconsistent burnand pressure spikes. Maybe try 35 and 30 to check the spread ?
Good thing about 777 is it doesn't corrode your gun. I have a long rifle Lancaster 40cal.for over 20 years and my barrel still pretty and shiny and I probably shot it over a 1000 rds and it shoots tight groups and easy to clean.
Should try what tools and targets does and replace the metal rods on the chronograph with wooden dowels . If you hit on just breaks the dowel and not the chrono . Don’t have a black powder gun but thinking of getting one . Keep up the great videos
Ya I never really had any interest in Black powder guns. Now I have one rifle, one shotgun and one revolver. I don't have the money now, but I'll be adding a blunderbuss to the collection at some point. It's like a crack addiction.
Hogdon's does have loading data for Triple Seven but only in ffg, it also comes with the caveat not to compress. It also supposedly (I tend to agree) has 15% more energy per volume than BP. I have plenty of BP on hand but still use 777 partially because it is consistently available near me. I do like it in my 50-95 express as a case full will put me right at what the advertised factory load was even though I use a slightly heavier bullet. I also like 777 in that cartridge as my bullet doesn't hold enough lube to be very effective with BP but it does fine with 777. Really enjoy your channel!
Another good video. I have used Tripple 7 in some cap and ball revolvers when I could not find real black powder before. Have used Pyrodex more than Tripple 7 but I still prefer the real thing over the subs if I had my choice.
Not sure where you're at, but Great Northern Guns off of Tudor in Anchorage sells real black powder. It's not the cheapest at $40 per pound, but it's there.
Stand further back from the chrono 7-10 yards is what I've been told is ideal unless using a scatter gun. Also the smoke wont interfere unless the wind is blowing from behind.
i use T7 FFFG in my loads for cap'n ball but also in 44-40, 45 colt 38 spécial an 12 Gauge, in CAS. light load with filler (recommended by Capt. Georges Baylor, CAS Shooter BP specialist...) without problem. i use same volume as blackpowder and that work well. here in france we find only FFFG, not choice...
Huh. Interesting. Ima go throw another $3 worth of AMLP ingredients in the ball mill and carry on, but thanks for seeing how that stuff works. I hear Triple Seven of the appropriate granulation is good in percussion frontstuffers and leaves very little residue in the barrel.
If I recall they don't hit you with the hazard material charge for Triple 777 like BP. I could be wrong as I've never ordered any I was given the can I have. I see no advantage to it myself over good old BP.
Good video. I will keep shooting BP. Many years ago I was shooting muzzle loaders competently. I bought by the case. Bought two cases just before U stopped competing. 24 pounds in a case. I gave $125 a case. When I was competing that amount would not have been enough for a year.
It's all I use in my inlines and fun in cap/ball but yeah, expensive for loading a bunch of brass. Wouldn't use in BP antiques outside of rolling or falling block.
I got some cheap 777 because the shop couldn't sell it to anybody else. Good stuff. My view is you can put any black powder in brass. Just don't over-do it. Brass cases were invented to make it easy'
From what I've been able to find on the net re. H-777 and cartridges is that ffg is recommended and data published but fffg is not. Supposedly due to lab pressure excursions and aggrvated by any significant compression. I have used H-777 in Schofield brass with 25 gn by volume (1.6 cc Lee dipper approx 17.5 gn by weight) and 2 thin cardboard wads with Desperado 200 gn RNFP Cowboy bullets seated to just "kiss" the the wads. Boomed loudly A lot of smoke and chronographed at 750 +/- 4 fps for 5 shot group. Seemed quite acceptable performance for me. The fired bass was extremely clean. I just shook in water and dash Dawn detergent , rinsed and dried . Good to go No darkening like real BP. I still prefer Sheutzen which I have on hand. But if supplies of BP get tight would not hesitate to use the ff Triple 7 but it is pricey as you mentioned. Loved your video DJ❤
That "don't use in cartridges" isn't on the cans any more as it used to be..... I thought that perhaps it was there because it doesn't take well to air space in the case.....777 is a bit hotter than real BP, so I'd not use it in an antique Colt wit full loads. Like you I love my real BP... but 777 is always a good standby if supplies are ow (often so in NZ) and I haven't made a batch.... I've used it for shotguns too... 50gr works well. Here in NZ both BP and 777 are about $75 -80 a pound.....
There hasn't been any availability of real black powder in my area for a few years now. It is interesting that this substitute was as decent as it was.
I remember before biting the bullet and ordering real BP online and having it shipped to get Pyrodex to shoot from my percussion guns I had to drill the flash holes in the nipples over what they come. It made ignition reliable but allows more pressure to be exerted on that end of the system too so my Kentucky Pistol when shooting it with the sabots I used in my inline Muzzleloader would recoil it’s own hammer. So almost wanna say increased bolt thrust but there’s no bolt face. That was a 200gn bullet in a sabot of which I’ve never weighed in a pistol meant for .490 round balls and lubed patches. I bet if the flash hole was nearly nonexistent it would have been fine but it had to be opened up to allow enough spark through to light the Pyrodex. After experiencing real BP I ain’t going back. I’ll use 3x the amount of the fluffiest dirtiest stuff I can come up with before using Pyrodex or Triple 7 or whatever else. Alliant made a great substitute but it never hit the shelves until they had killed it and were selling off the old inventory that was never put out. I wish I knew that when I could get it. BlackMZ was good, noncorrosive (can’t say that for anything Hodgdon has) I could shoot and reload and leave it reloaded for weeks before cleaning and no pitting in the bore. Pyrodex rusts your bore in hours here because the humidity is so high. BlackMZ was also very consistent. I had a reliably 2” grouping load with it at 100 Meters and Pyrodex most people are happy if they hit a paper plate at 50 yards with 1 of 3 shots. I’m not saying accuracy can’t be achieved with Pyrodex because I found loads that weren’t 2 MOA but still would hit that plate at 100 yards every shot and maybe a 3-4” group but never got any better. I think ignition is part of Pyrodex’s problem. I had to replace muzzleloading rifles and when I did my new one never saw Pyrodex and barely seen any BlackMZ since getting my first purchase of BP. I have some Pyrodex but it’s leftover. Stuff rusted my stepdad’s Stainless in-line up so bad it can’t be taken down for cleaning because you can’t see all the fouling and when you put it back together it’s still rusting your gun and breech plug in place. He will have to buy a new muzzleloader if he ever wants to hunt somewhere that has a muzzleloader season again.
I used it in 20 gauge buckshot and small game loads. Payload weight was 1 oz in both and other than it being horribly dirty it’s a game getter my 10 year old son loves
Imitation powders work great in revolvers. But, I have found they don't in caplock rifles with flash channels that are not in-line with the flash. In 40 years, the only hangfires I have had were with imitation powders in rifles with 90 degree flash channels - unless I did not clear the channel well enough from the last cleaning, which is extremely rare - maybe 3 times in all those years. Converesley, revolvers have very short, in-line flash channels and are very reliably ignited with imitations. Definitely a cleaner run between wipe downs. Knowing that, I would not hesitate to re-load my .45 Colt with Pyro or any other imitation if I wanted more smoke-n-stuff.
I live where you can't get powder shipped, so any powder is fine and the substitutes can come in with smokeless. 777 x 3F is for sure more dense though in two pistols there is a good 100 FPS split and I suspect the one has a bigger bore than the other.
I have used Alliant Black MZ in 45 Colt cartridges and done the 40 gr equivalent method like you did. It, too, is a "sugar-based" powder like 777 as I understand, and it also advises against using in cartridges (as well as advising against using any lube so I powder coated my 255 grain LRNFP bullets). My results were similar to yours -- it's got more oomph than standard black powder. I will say that I noticed it did split a few brass cases, though. I actually have pressure measuring equipment and I have used it on my MZ cartridges. For rounds where I measured the pressure, I never exceeded about 12,500 psi, which is well under SAAMI spec for 45 Colt of 14,000 psi. I reload my brass many times, so I am just assuming that the "super compressed" powder is what added pressure to the case or the the brass was just past it's prime.
I did some testing to answer your question. Keep in mind some things may not make intuitive sense at first, as what I'm measuring is peak pressure of the pressure curve, but it's the total area under the curve that gives you velocity/energy. I used 37.0 grains by weight of the following powders and used a SPG lubed 241 grain RNFP powder coated lead bullet. All powder charges compressed, and velocity taken from 5.5" Uberti Cattleman 45 Colt. 37.0 3F Goex was 856 fps, 392 ft-lb, 13,493 psi peak pressure; 37.0 Grafs was 723 fps, 280 ft-lb, 10,534 psi; 37.0 3F Swiss was 920 fps, 453 ft-lb, 13,082 ft-lb; 37.0 2F Goex was 767 fps, 315 ft-lb, 11,543 psi. I checked my other loads (loaded previously). That last load was approx. 37.0 gr Alliant MZ by volume, 266 gr RNFP powder coated, 740 fps, 323 ft-lb, 11492 psi. Notice the Swiss had a slightly lower peak than Goex, but a "wider" pressure curve so it delivered more energy over time with a lower peak.
I've been using 2f 777 for a while now... though I have not done any serious evaluation. I'm shooting it in .44 Special with both a 235 grain and 255 grain Keith-style SWC using a Ruger Blackhawk Bisley. I avoid compressing the powder as Hodgdon recommends against that. They also recommend using 2f powder, just an FYI. One of the nice things about 777 is that you do not need specific black powder lubricant... whatever your bullets are lubed with will work fine. As with all cast bullets, you need to have them sized properly for your individual gun, in my case .332 - 331 diameter. You really don't need to weigh the charges, a set of Lee scoops will work OK, consistency is the thing you are shooting for, but black powder and 777 are both fairly forgiving on that. You really gotta read Hodgdon's articles on the subject before you try this stuff. I'm not putting my charges here as your mileage may vary and it really IS possible to blow up your gun. It burns much cleaner than traditional black powder, which is nice in a revolver as you don't have fowling issues. Another nice side effect is that I don't seem to be getting much leading... if any... and whatever I do get seems to mostly come out with the standard water/Murphy's Oil Soap solvent. As my gun is stainelss steel, I can fully immerse it and scrub it down good after removing the grips. After a rinse, I dry it in a convection oven for ten minutes at 200 degrees, then use conventional solvents like Hoppes No. Nine, use the Lewis Lead Remover if would think I need to, re-lube the revolver and reassemble it. Accuracy could be better, but with my old eyes, I am not prepared to put the blame entirely on the powder.
In my experience, higher velocity hits higher, lower velocity hits lower. Even at those short distances, no clue why. Both smokeless and black powder has shown me these results.
I recall reading someplace that 777 has a problem when overly compressed. Perhaps that is more likely in a cartridge with the mechanical advantage of a reloading press as opposed to a ramrod or loading lever. Maybe?
In 1993 my home was overtaken by the mighty Mississippi flood of 1993, I had several pounds of goex and a pound of pyrodex in my magazine that was underwater for a month plus. When I was able to retrieve my supplies I found that the goex cans were a bit rusty, but overall the powder was fine, and in fact I have the FFFFg can to this day. That powder is still good. The pyrodex was a solid chunk of dirt in the plastic bottle. I can only assume that it drew water, somehow through the seal around the lid. I have never since that day purchased pyrodex, I don't trust it.
That "do not use un ctdg" sounds more than a suggestion to give it a try, maybe they say not to use cause the posibility of someone without experiencia un BP filling a ctg with an air gap inside, just maybe...as always entertaining, educational and inspiring.
In canada its much more economical to run pyrodex for my needs. Denser, so i get more shots per pound, and less expensive than any of the options for bp here. Swiss is a good 15-20 dollars more and isn’t available locally so i have to ship it.
Great video, I am glad you did the 777 test, have you tried Pirodex P? Where I live none of my stores carry real black powder due to regulations or something im told.
@@bluescatreimer if you are going to use pyrodex or traditional black powder, use magnum primers for better combustion. Youre welcome. Always compress pyrodex at least a little bit.
I like Triple7! Of course, Swiss real BP is way better but it is impossible for me to find it at a driving distance from my home so, with transport fees, it's prohibitive ( for me). There are 3 stores that sale triple 7 very close from where I live so I've tried this stuff and it works for me! BTW, comparing to Go Ex ( I've used it in the past) I think I prefer triple 7, it's not cheaper, not better but it cleans faster.
Triple Seven? I feel like I don't know you any more...😆 To be honest, I played with it when it first came out, and just didn't get groups that pleased me. The fouling also seemed really hard, despite my use of Big Lube bullets and an SPG-style lube. Actions got stiff pretty quickly shooting it. The only sub I've found that I actually like is APP/Jim Shockey's Gold. Creates moisture as it burns, which keeps fouling soft and allows for long strings without needing to clean, as well as maintaining accuracy which is respectable. Downside is it isn't as energetic as the real stuff or 777.
I've been watching your video on making BP and I'm curious as to what your sources are . This isn't an attack or anything like that, I just like information. A lot of your information I've found in a wonderful book but I found your videos easier to follow. The book in particular I'm speaking of is "Like Fire and Powder"
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The "no use in cartridges" is likely a corporate liability thing.
I loaded and shot 777 in thousands of cartridges over 12 years in Cowboy Action Shooting competitions with no issues. I used 17 grains by VOLUME in my .45 colt pistols and rifle. ❤
17 grains by volume for 777 x 3F would be something like 25 grains of Black Powder by the same volume.
@@gregoryschmitz2131 Exactly, and 777 being hotter, it was a great mild load.
What are you meaning that you used only 17 grains to load 45 Colt cartridges?
You clearly are not telling any truth!
Triple 7 is a black powder substitute its not smokeless powder!!
You must be talking about smokeless powder apparently!
If you loaded only 17 grains of volume of triple 7 it would not compress at all! And that would not be good!
45 colt needs a 40 grain or some substitutes you might only be able to use 38 grains or so!
Yes, 17 grains you are talking about must be a smokeless powder charge!
@@oldeays5085 I used a 1 1/2" plug of 3/8" foam caulk backer rod between the powder and the bullet base for compression.
@@oldeays5085 It has more pressure grain for grain. Some people use cornmeal in in BP revolvers to make up the difference.
Back about a year ago, i made contact with someone (i dont want to name names) at Hodgdon about using fffg in handgun cartridges. So i was told that fffg is 10% more “energetic” than ffg, also trip7 is overall 15% more “energetic” than bp or pyrodex. So because the pressures of fffg exceed the bp pressures of these cartridges (im sure those well under ruger type loads) they recommend using ffg. Also, trip7 does not like to be compressed. Its not as forgiving as bp. Thats possibly where the wide spread comes from?!?! Thanks for another great video! Im in the process of building a press for pucking! The prices these days which ever way you look at it are imo gouging!
Great video. I use Swiss in my Flints and Hodgens 777 in my Percussions. With 777 the rule to lower velocity spread is do not compress it. In my .54 rifle I use 60-grains of 777 under a 0.015 patched .535" round ball. When I feel the ball settle against the powder I stop, not tamping. This normally will give a spread of about 30 feet per second.
“Yeah it shoots high out there”
This is what we call “foreshadowing”. Lol
I was really hoping you'd know what their issue was with using that in a cartridge.
Sorry to disappoint.
@@Everythingblackpowder I couldn't think of a reason!
@@taofledermaus I’ve heard they have load data for 2F 777 in cartridges but not 3F. Something about erratic burn rates under compression which I suspect is the reason for the wide spread. Either way, onward and upward. Next we’re going to try the same load in a rifle to see how it does.
@@Everythingblackpowder That makes sense. Still appreciate you actually trying it.
@@taofledermaus just doing my civic duty, Sir.
I've been loading 45 Colt cartridges with Blackhorn 209 black powder substitute. It shoots great, ignites good, still gives you a lot of smoke but with a lot less fauling and much easier to clean.
I really enjoy watching your channel and you give a lot of good information. Great video thank you.
Thank you
Too bad it costs like $85……+ for a measly 8 oz……used to be 10 or 12oz.
Really kicking myself in the arse for not buying more at Wally World a few years back when it was $30-$35 for 12oz. What are ya gonna do? At least I have 2 cans left!
@@johnanderson186 The price is prohibitive!
Hodge on says use ffg triple 7 in cartridges. In the 45 Colt w/250 they say 30 grains volume for 838fps. Just another great option when our powder selections are unavailable.
Caution do not use 777 in a cartridge
Huh, what do those guys know
F in hilarious. Made my day!!
Thank you
This channel is definitely inspiring. I got to watching this channel a little over a year ago in the middle of winter and decided that I would learn how to make BP. It worked great!!! I didn’t have a fancy press so I corned it by using a bottle jack under my loaded 1-ton dump truck. Ground it up and sized it with screens. Worked great!!!
Excellent, glad to hear it
I built a small bottle jack press with all thread and square allium and bolts washers simple bolted to a peace of 2x12 works wonders
I have the same chronograph. My wife shot one of the diffuser support rods with her .308 one day. I gave her a rash of shit for months... Right up until I put a 150 FMJ through the display screen with my .308
She still hasn't let me live it down.
...Rightly so! 🤣👍
Works very well in percussion devices. It does corrode if you do not clean in a timely manor.
Way back before the component shortages started I was desperate to include something in my kit so I ended up with 1 x 777 (FFG), and 1 x Pyrodex (RS), I haven't seen BP available locally for a number of years and I have yet to crack open the stuff I have. I don't regret having something to play with when the time comes and at this point have no preference anyway. If I ever spy some GOEX or Swiss at a local gunshow it'll end up at home too. haha
Hi Jake, In Australia we pay $152 per plastic bottle of 3F Blackpowder . That’s about $100 USD on current change over rate. A tin of caps 100 per tin $10 USD. Flints $6 each. You guys have it pretty good over there.
According to instructions for cartridge loads for 777 - use FFG and it says to avoid compressing powder.
In a reproduction revolver I would hesitate to using FFFG / Compression in a reproduction revolver - in Ruger would be better.
That’s why I always test these kind of loads in my Ruger.
Living in New York have used triple 7 for years in my 45 Colt cartridges. Got to save the precious real stuff for my flintlock. Ps can't sell BP in N.Y.
Understood
A Great bit of information on powders Thanks
When I began the journey of black powder, Pyrodex was the only thing to be had in my area $20 pound (Now 2023 I think $27) Black Powder was no where close still 160 mile round trip, add the needless mark up of black powder between $39-$49 a pound plus travel......Nah Pyrodex works well I will grab Triple 7 if there. Pyrodex RS and P are always on a shelf. Funny picked on degraded but yet no one wants to step out in front of it to show me how "WEAK" or "INACCURATE" it is...
Ok so you got me thinking, being in Ca I buy whatever is available whenever it's available. I was pretty sure I bought some 777 back when Obama was in office. I haven't been in my reloading room for years as it is stacked to the roof with contracting tools from when I retired but I fought my way in and took a peak.
All I can say is you must be Santa Clause, because it is Christmas in November, I won't give any numbers as it's Ca, but not only 777, but Trailboss, Goex and Swiss on that shelf as well, and rows of large pistol primers.
Next time the wife tells me to get lost, I am going in there and not coming out for weeks.
Your videos always inspire me to go out and shoot more BP. I love my modern guns, but nothing beats hunting or shooting the guns of our ancestors.
Glad to hear it
This channel is inspiring. Made my first batch of around 4oz milled and milled some more and milled some more then wet into a ball of dough and ran through some window screen to produce what fool mostly to be FFF and been burning it in my Kentucky Pistol with great results 15gn at a time by weight not volume, looks to be between 22 and 25gn volume. Stuff is consistent, shooting at least as good groups as Goex, and I can’t see it as any more dirty than Goex. Hoping to make some the CIA method you showed next month and compare them. Get some more screens and end up putting up 5-10 pounds of FFF since I’m mostly moving to FFF anyway
Excellent!
Friend you have to try corning your powder. There is a video on this channel about how to do it. Its by far the biggest improvement to homemade powder. All you do is press the powder into pucks with a vise or a shop press. They become extremely hard almost like a ceramic. Then you break it up and grind it to 2ff or 3 fff size. This makes the powder as good as store-bought if not better
@@snappers_antique_firearms it makes it more stable too, it won't change grain size as it shakes around.
Too bad I'm not allowed to make BP here in the barrio as we live together too close to neighbors and are nosey and grandma would go on a rant about blowing up the backyard and house, so I have been forced to buy pyrodex as nobody around here in LA sell BP... Good for all the information as knowledge for the future...
Interesting results. Thank you for posting.
Thank you
Thanks for your hard work.
Thank you
Missed this one - great comparative - well done again mate - cheers
Thanks 👍
Very cool. I picked up some 777 for my 1858 Remington a couple years ago, love it. My only experience before that war pyrodex
This surprised me also. I have shot 777 in all my cap and ball guns for years and my shotguns love the stuff but never gave it a thought about using it for cartridge.
One things for sure - you aren’t getting more of that 777 into that brass than you did here.
Fair review. I've used it lots in my C&B, but I'm no connoisseur of powders. The powder I have on-hand is my favourite.
My local gunsmith/fellow BP shooter keeps recommending T-7. I've always been a little hesitant to explore that powder after learning how to make my own BP. Thanks for sharing this.
Great video! Yep, I’m one I’ve those that likes all the propellants and real black powder just the same. 777 3Fg is my favorite substitute. I have loaded cartridges with it for many years. It works. I’ve never experienced any problems by doing so. It’s a stellar performer in my old .32 long black powder revolvers and it shoots relatively clean in them. I like it for a deer hunting load in my Pietta Remington .44 with a 200 grain LEE conical. It gets em good. I also like it in my old .45 CVA Kentucky rife with a LEE 200 grain REAL bullet and a 75 grain by volume charge for deer hunting. This rifle and load averages 1938 FPS as measured on my old chrony F1. That works out to mighty fine energy transfer on the deer and it’s a tight shooting load.
I guy gave me a can of triple 777 he said it sucked. It sat on my self on my loading bench for yrs. I do CAS and shoot Frontier gun fighter and loaded up 38slp and 44 colt with the stuff at the insistence of another shooter and it worked fine. However I see no advantage to it it is expensive and is just as hard to clean up as real BP. I saw no issues with it in a cartridge other than a bit more pressure that shouldn't matter in a modern made revolver like Uberti but I did reduce what would be a black powderl oad by volume. .
Thanks for sharing. - Down here service and 'choice' are long gone - I just buy what I can while sorting-out how to make my own brew of BP antique propellent asap. You do a great job. Cheers.
Thank you
More data is always a good thing and thank you for putting it out.
Thank you
Been waiting for this. Would like to see how it performs out of a rifle. Thanks for showing us so much. I really enjoy the channel.
Thank-You!
Thank you
Great video, Thank you.
Thank you
Thank you for making great videos That are educational And entertaining to watch.
Thank you
I’ve been wondering about this for a while, thanks for testing it. A test with blackhorn 209 would be great too if you ever get the chance.
777 is potentially pushing the limits on open top Colt replicas. I shot a couple of my cap and ball guns loose. After chronographing, I understood why. My 1851 Navy was pushing 320+ foot pounds energy. My .44 was pushing 500+ fpe. After just a few cylinders of those loads, the loading lever catch had worked loose, the loading lever started falling down, and the central arbor wiggled. The .44 had gone so loose that the hammer no longer reached the caps and the barrel wiggled side to side. After a couple expensive gunsmith bills, I started working to determine a maximum safe 777 load for each gun. I maximally loaded with premium black powder (Swiss 3f or Old Eynsford), then loaded 777 down until it reached those lower velocities. For a .36, 200 foot pounds energy is acceptably powerful and mild on the gun. For a .44, 400 fpe is a hot load, but is reliably handled. Both loads are equivalent to 1,000 feet per second with roundball, and I don’t think it’s a coincidence that Colt cap and ball designs reach that exact speed with full chambers of black powder. Colt probably intended that to be the maximum velocity of a fully loaded percussion pistol. I load 777 to 80% volume to get those levels.
Are they brass or steel frame guns?
@@Everythingblackpowder Both were steel frame.
Wow
Videos are always educational. I use it in a 209 primer. 50 cal. So, ignition is not a problem.
Having real black power for Flint lock is definitely recommended for consistency
Thank you very inspiring
Glad to hear it
This channel is inspiring.
Another Great Video! Now we need a Blackhorn 209 test. Thanks for taking all the guess work out for us Jake!
Happy to help
Thank you I dont think I have ever been accused of being polite lol. By the way I love 40 grains of 777 in 45 colt. I like the substitute only for cartridges and only to push the velocity as high as possible. Thanks again I really wanted to know the velocity
You bet
Black and never go Back!! 3f Baby! thanks for your Great vid!!!
Jake, you know MORE about black powder than I do. But what you just demonstrated, I had always thought it was possible. Keep doing what you're doing!👍
Thank you
Can you do it with jacketed bullets?
Nice video thank you.
Intriguing... I had wondered about using substitutes in cartridges and how it would perform, specifically 777. It would appear that it stacks up pretty nice and on par with Swiss. I still prefer Swiss, but being on the road as much as I am, sometimes I have to use 777. Thank you for this video.
Thank you
Thank you for sharing Jake, I wanted to make my own, but snitches in the neighborhood here in the hood will tell the sheriff office about it cause here in LA, it's close to impossible to find BP and been forced into getting Pyrodex and subs cause that's the only thing that they sell here, in some shops only a handful, but I DID score some Goex from a guy in the Valley but saving it cause I'd rather use the subs cause they readily available here, so I was curious about the results of your experiment Jake cause well, the reasons I stated, still prefer real BP, hard to clean subs...
Awesome video as always. Where I'm at in NC its 31 a pound last i bought. Finally got some graft and sons fffg real black from watching you have fun with the real deal.With shipping it was 25 a pound on sale.
Excellent
The reason that many BP subs dont work well in flintlocks and cap and ball revolvers is that they are much harder to ignite. Im a propellant chemist and have been making my own versions of sub powders fir many years, the general trend is to replace charcoal with fuels that produce more gas and less solids, and use more powerful oxidizers (perchlorate). Asorbic acid, benzoate, sorbitol, and gluconic acid are examples of fuels that are used. If a sub powder is crushed to a powder durung loading, that makes it even harder ti ignite evenly, the tiny air spaces between propellant granules allows the shock wave from the primer to propagate through the powder charge and hot particles to penetrate better into the charge. Love your channel, keep up the research because powder is only going to get harder to come by, this is a lost art.
Bought a bunch of 777 cheap after deer season 5 years ago. Works great in 45-70. Still like Black better, but 777 has some balls.
I’ve just started watching your videos. Somewhere I seen a suggestion on how to extending your chronographs life span by changing the steel sun shade rods to 3’16’ wooden dowels.
I have heard that compression is the issue. Supposedly it causes the variation between shots. Just what I've been told.
I wouldn’t doubt it
From my limited experience with subs, being on my 2nd CVA Accura, first one was a 45, 2nd one a 50 i was always under the impression i had to shoot 777. In the meanwhile i dropped that impression completely and am back to bp. 777 is crushing easier than corned bp - so maybe thats the reason for the warning: crushed powder causing inconsistent burnand pressure spikes. Maybe try 35 and 30 to check the spread ?
Good thing about 777 is it doesn't corrode your gun. I have a long rifle Lancaster 40cal.for over 20 years and my barrel still pretty and shiny and I probably shot it over a 1000 rds and it shoots tight groups and easy to clean.
You make me smile😊 keep up the good stuff
Thank you
Should try what tools and targets does and replace the metal rods on the chronograph with wooden dowels . If you hit on just breaks the dowel and not the chrono . Don’t have a black powder gun but thinking of getting one . Keep up the great videos
Thank you
Ya I never really had any interest in Black powder guns. Now I have one rifle, one shotgun and one revolver. I don't have the money now, but I'll be adding a blunderbuss to the collection at some point. It's like a crack addiction.
Really liked seeing the smoke blast take off in the wind
Cool video...thank ya!
Hogdon's does have loading data for Triple Seven but only in ffg, it also comes with the caveat not to compress. It also supposedly (I tend to agree) has 15% more energy per volume than BP. I have plenty of BP on hand but still use 777 partially because it is consistently available near me. I do like it in my 50-95 express as a case full will put me right at what the advertised factory load was even though I use a slightly heavier bullet. I also like 777 in that cartridge as my bullet doesn't hold enough lube to be very effective with BP but it does fine with 777. Really enjoy your channel!
Thank you
Another good video. I have used Tripple 7 in some cap and ball revolvers when I could not find real black powder before. Have used Pyrodex more than Tripple 7 but I still prefer the real thing over the subs if I had my choice.
Load my 44’s like this. Scoop to the top Squeeze in a projectile and have some fun.
Great video. I always get great results with 777 in my flintlock......just kidding. I can't even type that with a straight face. Have a good day.
We have a hard time getting real BP up here in AK. Unless you make it the second most reliable supply is substitutes.
Not sure where you're at, but Great Northern Guns off of Tudor in Anchorage sells real black powder. It's not the cheapest at $40 per pound, but it's there.
@@jeredhersh789that’s good to know I will check it out!
In Australia Swiss is around $200AU/kilo. The German made Wano isn't far behind. Those brands of BP are all we can get.
Stand further back from the chrono 7-10 yards is what I've been told is ideal unless using a scatter gun. Also the smoke wont interfere unless the wind is blowing from behind.
i use T7 FFFG in my loads for cap'n ball but also in 44-40, 45 colt 38 spécial an 12 Gauge, in CAS. light load with filler (recommended by Capt. Georges Baylor, CAS Shooter BP specialist...) without problem. i use same volume as blackpowder and that work well. here in france we find only FFFG, not choice...
Huh. Interesting. Ima go throw another $3 worth of AMLP ingredients in the ball mill and carry on, but thanks for seeing how that stuff works. I hear Triple Seven of the appropriate granulation is good in percussion frontstuffers and leaves very little residue in the barrel.
If I recall they don't hit you with the hazard material charge for Triple 777 like BP. I could be wrong as I've never ordered any I was given the can I have. I see no advantage to it myself over good old BP.
Good video. I will keep shooting BP. Many years ago I was shooting muzzle loaders competently. I bought by the case. Bought two cases just before U stopped competing. 24 pounds in a case. I gave $125 a case. When I was competing that amount would not have been enough for a year.
It's all I use in my inlines and fun in cap/ball but yeah, expensive for loading a bunch of brass. Wouldn't use in BP antiques outside of rolling or falling block.
I got some cheap 777 because the shop couldn't sell it to anybody else. Good stuff. My view is you can put any black powder in brass. Just don't over-do it. Brass cases were invented to make it easy'
From what I've been able to find on the net re. H-777 and cartridges is that ffg is recommended and data published but fffg is not. Supposedly due to lab pressure excursions and aggrvated by any significant compression. I have used H-777 in Schofield brass with 25 gn by volume (1.6 cc Lee dipper approx 17.5 gn by weight) and 2 thin cardboard wads with Desperado 200 gn RNFP Cowboy bullets seated to just "kiss" the the wads. Boomed loudly A lot of smoke and chronographed at 750 +/- 4 fps for 5 shot group.
Seemed quite acceptable performance for me. The fired bass was extremely clean. I just shook in water and dash Dawn detergent , rinsed and dried . Good to go No darkening like real BP. I still prefer Sheutzen which I have on hand. But if supplies of BP get tight would not
hesitate to use the ff Triple 7 but it is pricey as you mentioned. Loved your video DJ❤
Forgot to include that I used the ffg Triple 7 sorry
My bad again I was firing a Pietta 4 3/4 " SAA🙁 DJ
That "don't use in cartridges" isn't on the cans any more as it used to be..... I thought that perhaps it was there because it doesn't take well to air space in the case.....777 is a bit hotter than real BP, so I'd not use it in an antique Colt wit full loads. Like you I love my real BP... but 777 is always a good standby if supplies are ow (often so in NZ) and I haven't made a batch.... I've used it for shotguns too... 50gr works well.
Here in NZ both BP and 777 are about $75 -80 a pound.....
There hasn't been any availability of real black powder in my area for a few years now. It is interesting that this substitute was as decent as it was.
I remember before biting the bullet and ordering real BP online and having it shipped to get Pyrodex to shoot from my percussion guns I had to drill the flash holes in the nipples over what they come. It made ignition reliable but allows more pressure to be exerted on that end of the system too so my Kentucky Pistol when shooting it with the sabots I used in my inline Muzzleloader would recoil it’s own hammer. So almost wanna say increased bolt thrust but there’s no bolt face. That was a 200gn bullet in a sabot of which I’ve never weighed in a pistol meant for .490 round balls and lubed patches. I bet if the flash hole was nearly nonexistent it would have been fine but it had to be opened up to allow enough spark through to light the Pyrodex. After experiencing real BP I ain’t going back. I’ll use 3x the amount of the fluffiest dirtiest stuff I can come up with before using Pyrodex or Triple 7 or whatever else. Alliant made a great substitute but it never hit the shelves until they had killed it and were selling off the old inventory that was never put out. I wish I knew that when I could get it. BlackMZ was good, noncorrosive (can’t say that for anything Hodgdon has) I could shoot and reload and leave it reloaded for weeks before cleaning and no pitting in the bore. Pyrodex rusts your bore in hours here because the humidity is so high. BlackMZ was also very consistent. I had a reliably 2” grouping load with it at 100 Meters and Pyrodex most people are happy if they hit a paper plate at 50 yards with 1 of 3 shots. I’m not saying accuracy can’t be achieved with Pyrodex because I found loads that weren’t 2 MOA but still would hit that plate at 100 yards every shot and maybe a 3-4” group but never got any better. I think ignition is part of Pyrodex’s problem. I had to replace muzzleloading rifles and when I did my new one never saw Pyrodex and barely seen any BlackMZ since getting my first purchase of BP. I have some Pyrodex but it’s leftover. Stuff rusted my stepdad’s Stainless in-line up so bad it can’t be taken down for cleaning because you can’t see all the fouling and when you put it back together it’s still rusting your gun and breech plug in place. He will have to buy a new muzzleloader if he ever wants to hunt somewhere that has a muzzleloader season again.
I used it in 20 gauge buckshot and small game loads. Payload weight was 1 oz in both and other than it being horribly dirty it’s a game getter my 10 year old son loves
Imitation powders work great in revolvers. But, I have found they don't in caplock rifles with flash channels that are not in-line with the flash. In 40 years, the only hangfires I have had were with imitation powders in rifles with 90 degree flash channels - unless I did not clear the channel well enough from the last cleaning, which is extremely rare - maybe 3 times in all those years.
Converesley, revolvers have very short, in-line flash channels and are very reliably ignited with imitations. Definitely a cleaner run between wipe downs.
Knowing that, I would not hesitate to re-load my .45 Colt with Pyro or any other imitation if I wanted more smoke-n-stuff.
Dollars out the door are a lot different if you order online, hazmat explosive shipping is +$30 standard so keep that in mind.
I live where you can't get powder shipped, so any powder is fine and the substitutes can come in with smokeless. 777 x 3F is for sure more dense though in two pistols there is a good 100 FPS split and I suspect the one has a bigger bore than the other.
I have used Alliant Black MZ in 45 Colt cartridges and done the 40 gr equivalent method like you did. It, too, is a "sugar-based" powder like 777 as I understand, and it also advises against using in cartridges (as well as advising against using any lube so I powder coated my 255 grain LRNFP bullets). My results were similar to yours -- it's got more oomph than standard black powder. I will say that I noticed it did split a few brass cases, though. I actually have pressure measuring equipment and I have used it on my MZ cartridges. For rounds where I measured the pressure, I never exceeded about 12,500 psi, which is well under SAAMI spec for 45 Colt of 14,000 psi. I reload my brass many times, so I am just assuming that the "super compressed" powder is what added pressure to the case or the the brass was just past it's prime.
I would love to know what the pressure is on a 40gr 3F Swiss with a 250gr projectile.
I did some testing to answer your question. Keep in mind some things may not make intuitive sense at first, as what I'm measuring is peak pressure of the pressure curve, but it's the total area under the curve that gives you velocity/energy. I used 37.0 grains by weight of the following powders and used a SPG lubed 241 grain RNFP powder coated lead bullet. All powder charges compressed, and velocity taken from 5.5" Uberti Cattleman 45 Colt. 37.0 3F Goex was 856 fps, 392 ft-lb, 13,493 psi peak pressure; 37.0 Grafs was 723 fps, 280 ft-lb, 10,534 psi; 37.0 3F Swiss was 920 fps, 453 ft-lb, 13,082 ft-lb; 37.0 2F Goex was 767 fps, 315 ft-lb, 11,543 psi. I checked my other loads (loaded previously). That last load was approx. 37.0 gr Alliant MZ by volume, 266 gr RNFP powder coated, 740 fps, 323 ft-lb, 11492 psi. Notice the Swiss had a slightly lower peak than Goex, but a "wider" pressure curve so it delivered more energy over time with a lower peak.
Very interesting! Thank you for getting back to me
Willard I love you. Lol jk, but you are awesome subbed!!!
I use 4f triple 7 in my NAA super mag! Great video
3:54 yup... did that a few times.
I've been using 2f 777 for a while now... though I have not done any serious evaluation. I'm shooting it in .44 Special with both a 235 grain and 255 grain Keith-style SWC using a Ruger Blackhawk Bisley. I avoid compressing the powder as Hodgdon recommends against that. They also recommend using 2f powder, just an FYI. One of the nice things about 777 is that you do not need specific black powder lubricant... whatever your bullets are lubed with will work fine. As with all cast bullets, you need to have them sized properly for your individual gun, in my case .332 - 331 diameter. You really don't need to weigh the charges, a set of Lee scoops will work OK, consistency is the thing you are shooting for, but black powder and 777 are both fairly forgiving on that. You really gotta read Hodgdon's articles on the subject before you try this stuff. I'm not putting my charges here as your mileage may vary and it really IS possible to blow up your gun. It burns much cleaner than traditional black powder, which is nice in a revolver as you don't have fowling issues. Another nice side effect is that I don't seem to be getting much leading... if any... and whatever I do get seems to mostly come out with the standard water/Murphy's Oil Soap solvent. As my gun is stainelss steel, I can fully immerse it and scrub it down good after removing the grips. After a rinse, I dry it in a convection oven for ten minutes at 200 degrees, then use conventional solvents like Hoppes No. Nine, use the Lewis Lead Remover if would think I need to, re-lube the revolver and reassemble it. Accuracy could be better, but with my old eyes, I am not prepared to put the blame entirely on the powder.
In my experience, higher velocity hits higher, lower velocity hits lower. Even at those short distances, no clue why. Both smokeless and black powder has shown me these results.
I recall reading someplace that 777 has a problem when overly compressed. Perhaps that is more likely in a cartridge with the mechanical advantage of a reloading press as opposed to a ramrod or loading lever. Maybe?
Very possible
Would using a drop tube compress to much?
In 1993 my home was overtaken by the mighty Mississippi flood of 1993, I had several pounds of goex and a pound of pyrodex in my magazine that was underwater for a month plus.
When I was able to retrieve my supplies I found that the goex cans were a bit rusty, but overall the powder was fine, and in fact I have the FFFFg can to this day. That powder is still good.
The pyrodex was a solid chunk of dirt in the plastic bottle. I can only assume that it drew water, somehow through the seal around the lid. I have never since that day purchased pyrodex, I don't trust it.
That "do not use un ctdg" sounds more than a suggestion to give it a try, maybe they say not to use cause the posibility of someone without experiencia un BP filling a ctg with an air gap inside, just maybe...as always entertaining, educational and inspiring.
Thank you
I never thought I'd see the day 😂
Don’t tell anybody.
Great video.
I use Pyrodex P in my 45 loads, works good.
In canada its much more economical to run pyrodex for my needs. Denser, so i get more shots per pound, and less expensive than any of the options for bp here. Swiss is a good 15-20 dollars more and isn’t available locally so i have to ship it.
Colt walker numbers, which I’m happy with because of the 45 lc conversion
Great video, I am glad you did the 777 test, have you tried Pirodex P? Where I live none of my stores carry real black powder due to regulations or something im told.
Pyrodex P and RS both work really well in brass cartridges.
@@blueduck9409 Thanks for the info!
@@bluescatreimer if you are going to use pyrodex or traditional black powder, use magnum primers for better combustion. Youre welcome. Always compress pyrodex at least a little bit.
I like Triple7! Of course, Swiss real BP is way better but it is impossible for me to find it at a driving distance from my home so, with transport fees, it's prohibitive ( for me). There are 3 stores that sale triple 7 very close from where I live so I've tried this stuff and it works for me! BTW, comparing to Go Ex ( I've used it in the past) I think I prefer triple 7, it's not cheaper, not better but it cleans faster.
Were the primers flattened? Great video as always.😊
Not any more flattened than a 40gr Swiss load
Triple Seven? I feel like I don't know you any more...😆 To be honest, I played with it when it first came out, and just didn't get groups that pleased me. The fouling also seemed really hard, despite my use of Big Lube bullets and an SPG-style lube. Actions got stiff pretty quickly shooting it. The only sub I've found that I actually like is APP/Jim Shockey's Gold. Creates moisture as it burns, which keeps fouling soft and allows for long strings without needing to clean, as well as maintaining accuracy which is respectable. Downside is it isn't as energetic as the real stuff or 777.
Swiss as of March 2024 is $47 at my local muzzloading shop which is way up from where it was even a year ago.
I've been watching your video on making BP and I'm curious as to what your sources are . This isn't an attack or anything like that, I just like information.
A lot of your information I've found in a wonderful book but I found your videos easier to follow.
The book in particular I'm speaking of is "Like Fire and Powder"
I’ve read a couple of Brett’s books and that is one of them. The majority of my stuff is simply trial and error.