Gotta say, I like the ambient music you're putting in the background now, adds just a bit of mood but without intruding on the narrating and conversations, just the right balance.
Its interesting. And I like how your channel and others like it are basically an archive to understanding black powder and how much guns and gunpowder has evolved since its invention.
I use a card between the black powder and my felt wad so the grease doesn't effect the powder when using bullets made for smokeless powder. I've already loaded Johnson and Dow into a 45 colt case just to see how they worked.
As soon a s you mentioned the 1866, I knew how it would go. I have one too and did the same with semi wadcutters. It's always fun trying to get that cartridge back out through the loading gate!
Entertaining as always Jake. Yes the OAL of 1.6" cannot be significantly be exceeded in an 1873......... I use the 200gr Lee bullets in my cap'n'ball revolvers. They do have a lube groove so I run them through the sizer to lube them and then just load them like that. Seems to work fine. For RBs I use a 1/16" (or thereabouts) wool felt wad soaked in the same lube (60/40 beeswax/vaseline) which seems to work well too and is not hard to clean up. I have wondered about the J&Ds and similar with no lube grooves and how they would go both in percussion arms and metallic cartridges. Personally, I'd be inclined to put a thin paper wad over the powder to protect it from the lube, although I think the fear of 'contamination' is probably over rated. I have noticed that those 1/16" felt wads to sometimes stay stuck to the ball, and on hot days give a faint smoke trail to the target. Accuracy does not seem adversely affected for my purposes, but that's not bullseye shooting it's on steel. Interesting that your 'odds and sods' powder performed just fine. I must confess to mixing remnants of commercial powders this way and have not noticed any significant degradation of performance; after all, I can see little reason why there should be. Thanks as always for another interesting video,... 🙂
Exelente Mr. Jake, ya puedo traducir al español sus educativos videos. Aca en Chile ,y tambien el resto del cono sur en la segunda mitad del siglo XIX hubo una guerra entre 1879 - 1883 que involucró a tres paises , Perú, Bolivia y Chile en ese conflicto fueron muy populares los revolveres Sistema Lefaucheux o pin fire como ustedes lo llaman, Yo conservo uno de esos pin fire. Que uso recreando sus cartuchos. Los revolveres americanos como los Colt, Remington o S&W, solo los tenian los altos oficiales ya que eran muy caros y escasos Yo hace poco adquirí una replica de un Colt Walker fabicada por Aldo Uberti. Esos modelos en su tiempo no llegaron aqui... Saludos desde Chile Souht-America. Y mis Felicitaciones por el triunfo de Mr. Donald Trump...
The J&D bullet DOES have a grease groove, but it is outside lubed. As you probably know, the paper Ctg bullets were often dipped in a lube, after assembly. Most was probably removed, when loaded, but enough to do the job.
That's interesting, I have a few pounds of who knows what BP in different containers, won't be that way for long I assure you. Really like your videos, I seem to learn a little more each time. When you hit my age learning is something you did years back. Thanks for the video.
I also sometimes load the Johnston & Dow for my 45Colt Kirst conversion cylinders in my Walker and 1860 revolvers. I size them like you did, and just put a little bit of lube in my revolver cylinders and they work great!
Take that comment! I am waiting for someone to do some tests with the new GOEX to see if they made it any better. I can't get any real powder around here so I make mine like you used to and go with it as best as I can. you do a great job with your tests and make everything interesting. Thank you for that, and thank you for knowing "You can't" means "TRY it!"
I had the same cronograph, damn thing only worked on a sunny cloud free day. The smoke sometimes interferes with the optical sensors too. Got a Garmin cronograph works every time and ya don't have to shooting through anything. There expensive but worth it.
Those pointed conical projectiles are fine for revolvers but tubular magazines can get "exciting" when centerfire rounds, instead of the original rimfire are used.😮 I love the channel and thoroughly enjoy the videos. Those conical rounds always knocked the rammer free on my 1851 colts 😂
A little crisco for lube goes a long way 🤪 Awesome research being done you guys! Very interesting to see the mixed powder be edged out by flex in the rifle, but vice versa in the pistola! Muy interesante!
Dadgum conscience! A piece of custom tubing over push rod centers reverse bullet and stops at die when custom fit. Plastic or aluminum is ok. Air pop and an easy finger pinch removes a perfect taper base.
Had similar over length with .45 Colt loaded for old Vaquero when I was so excited taking my 7th Cavalry SAA to shoot. Colt cylinder shorter than the Ruger. Eerrrrr!
You must have been reading my mind. I use J&D conicals in my Whitneyville percussion Dragoon and it loves them. I thought about using them in my .45 LC revolvers and am glad you taught me they would have to be sized 1st. Only flat nose .45 LC bullets should be used in the Uberti lever guns because a conical pointed bullet could set off the primer in a centerfire cartridge when it is in the loading tube under the barrel.
Magazine tube detonations could happen, but it's not as trivial and easy as it seems. I forgot which one, but there was a gun rag which did a test many years ago where they loaded up some .30-30s with pointy bullets and filled a Winchester 94 with them, then knocked the thing around a whole bunch. They did eventually get detonation, but it took a whole damn lot to make it actually happen, they had to climb a tree and throw the rifle on the ground several times to make some primers finally pop, and they only managed to get two of them to fire, they didn't all go off in one row. The magazine also doesn't support the cartridges like the chamber does, so the popping isn't quite so dramatic as some people envision.
@@kneyork9930 It's unlikely, but it might. I think the most likely gun to experience this is centerfire reproductions of the old 1860 Henry, with its weird follower setup and the open slot in the bare magazine tube. Don't need pointed bullets there, flatnosed ones will do it, if you drop the cartridges down into there in a way which lets them fall a good distance, or if you let the follower go after partially loading so it gets to smack them real good (both which the manual tells you to NOT do), then inertia can make primers go off, and with the uncovered magazine and its open slot, that can cause injury. This happened to Ian McCollum, fortunately he wore shooting glasses and only got a minor wound, with a sliver of .45 Colt brass left in his chest.
@@0neDoomedSpaceMarine Ouch! I've also seen tests, and although it's not "pleasant", it does not kill the shooter, or blow one's hands off, set off all the cartridges, etc. I think another factor in this case is that the load was very mild, I think there was very little recoil with that bullet and only 30 grains of pixie dust.
"Why?" Why? NOT? "I have" a mixed stash too of my less than what I hoped for AMP stash of "mixed AMP" I was thinking another milling all together may change things?
I powdercoat my black powder bullets, works great for me. No lube needed.... Coat stays intact after resizing. I use the coating methode from Cees ....aka....Lead Cees... Take a can of siliconespray.....spray your bullets.....take pair of pincers and hold the bottem part... Gently put the bullet into the powdercoat and dont let the bullet go...take the bullet out and tap of the exces powder bij gently tapping the pincers with a rod. Place the bullet on a silicone mat into an oven and bake by the powdercoat manufactors instructions...and voila...a nicely powdercoated bullet.
Give the Kaido conicals a try when you get a chance. They're offered in 220, 240, and 255gr versions and they hit harder and penetrate deeper than anything else. A seller on Etsy machines 220gr castings into hollow points and claimed a kill on a deer at 30 yards that passed all the way through, which if true is damned impressive.
Ok I know this video has been up for a minute but I just had an idea. Since they come out of the mold at .460, why not size them to 458-459 and try them in a 45-70 carbine?
Alright yeah that is still a cool idea. Hasn't thought of using a shot card with bp loads - I do use plastic ones for smokeless 45 Colt that I just 3d print a zillion of for cheap
hell i'll cap brass with`em!! Jake ever try ammonium nitrate in place of potassium nitrate? i've seen it done in rocket motors both are oxidizers it should work! i'm planning on doing a batch but finding a small bag is being a pain around here and i don;t have any use for 50 pounds of the stuff!!
I went the other way. I have a Lee 50 cal hollow base wadcutter mold that I use for 500 S&W. Just run them thru a .501 luber sizer. And they stabilize backwards.
The video, as always, didn't suck. Just a follow-up from your previous video regarding milling-time; Have you tried using a larger diameter mill? I suspect that the balls don't quite have enough energy to properly smash everyhting together/apart. You said that you experienced a reduction in perormance (but increase in cleanlieness) when switching from lead to brass, and that checks out with my theory. If you can get ahold of / make a larger diameter mill, the time it takes to get that ultra-clean burn should be reduced.
Have you tried lee liquid alox for the bullets and the felt for the powder fouling? And why the choice of wheel weights instead of a softer alloy, just a convenience thing? Love what you guys do keep it going. I wonder how that j&d would do in a reduced 45-70
I use Lee liquid alox for 50-70 and 577 snider smokeless loads and it works just fine. own an automotive repair shop so I have an abundance of used wheel weights so it’s simply a matter of convenience..
So the greasy wads are not absorbed by the powder? Would have figured the over shot cards would prevent that if placed under the felt wad. Is the projectile seated firmly against everything?
Well if it is absorbed by the powder it doesn’t affect it much. The reason why I assemble them this way is because I’ve had the felt wad stick to the base of the bullet and cause flyers. If you like, you could always use a card wad on either side of the greased felt wad just to be safe. That’s how Murphys Muskets does all of his BP cartridges.
@@Everythingblackpowder The flyer is a good point as I see a lot of BP wads smoldering after the shot potentially starting fires. I suspect a lot of fires were started during wars and otherwise. I have to chase down the wad and make sure its out.
Been looking at a dragoon, eventually want to get a conversion cylinder for one as well. This was informative. I wonder the difference if using a Lee conical bullet.
I haven’t seen black powder on shelves in years. Anywhere. They have told me it due to the classification being explosive but equivalent is not. It’s classified as flammable.
all my pistols with solid sights get a dovetail filed into the barrel so i can have my sights filed to fit my load and if for some reason i need a taller sight i can jus swap it out with another instead of fighting the soldered sights that come on em
Just like when I was 9 and Saturday morning came around ,I was happy .Cartoons,yeah. Today , Jake posts , I thought yeah it's Saturday! Then my brain locked the hubs ,Oh it's Friday. So, I got a Fathers day bonus,a couple days early. YEAH, "Cup Half Full!"
After reading the comments about pointy bullets in a tube magazine, I'd like to say that that lead is not going to set off a primer. Even hard lead would be too soft. If you made a firing pin out of the same lead, it would not fire the cartridge. (and only be good for one try) Also, 30 grains of black under a 200-218? grain bullet would not have enough recoil to do it. I'm guessing that load in an 1866 didn't have much more kick than a .22. Consider that many 30-30 bullets are very round-nosed, but are safe with the lead tip of the bullet. It's FMJ bullets in a powerful cartridge, in a tube that one might not want to do. So, the pointy nose of the J&D bullet is a non-issue in a '66, firing a light load. Just saying.
Something ive noticed with some smokeless reloaders, and with good reason usually, they think if they cant find it in a reloading manual, that it cant be done. One of my best friends was convinced i was going to blow up my 1911 loading a 0.454" round ball with pyrodex p in a 45 auto case. I laughed out loud when it actually cycled well enough to load a round when i fired it. He was dumb struck and i took him down the rabbit hole that is black powder. He's used it, at least as a fun experiment, in almost everything he owns at one time or another, including ARs lol.
Shotgun loaders are the worst about this. I can’t count how many times I hear even rather mundane off-book tricks called “impossible” or “unsafe.” Even things like replacing 1 1/8 oz of birdshot with 1 oz of buckshot
@@jacobackley502 With shotgun it's kind-of-sort-of understandable. SAAMI max for shotgun shells is usually around 11,000 psi compared to the 30,000 and up for metallic cartridges, so there's less margin for error. However, you're right that they may be a bit too finicky about things. Substituting primers, for example, or mixing brands of hull as long as they're the same category (tapered vs. straight). otoh I'm mainly a metallic reloader and I'm not averse to experimenting. For example, I couldn't find data for a 168 grain bullet in .300 Blackout using Accurate No. 11FS, so I went to the burn rate charts and found that it was around the same speed as H110 or Win 296. So I started at the minimum charge for those and now have a decent load worked up. Of course, learning to reload from Johnny's Reloading Bench may have influenced my willingness to experiment. XD
@@vicroc4 I’d say there’s actually quite a bit more margin of error for shotguns. Many are proofed above 20kpsi. Some are good up until the 30s. If you have a known good shotgun like an 870, the idea that you’ll blow it up with minor experiments is pretty silly. It’s a lot like a 45 colt Ruger Blackhawk. If you’re around 45 colt load data, you’re miles away from damaging it.
@@jacobackley502 I mean, you're not wrong. I'm just saying that the difference in pressures might be why more reloaders are willing to experiment in metallic cartridges than in shotguns.
Question for you .i tried the black load in a single action revolver.but noticed a huge difference in the size grains used real fine grains of powder on hard ball was holy moly what a difference from course powder say 3f compaired to four f .it realy made a big difference in power like night and day.
Idk if you'll see this or not but do you know if there are any lever guns that work with the .45 colt " magnum" rounds that qre still made i heard the 1892 winchester and there clones work but id rather not be the one who foud out
Good video, didn't suck, but why didn't you put the card wad under the lubed wad, rather than over it? Wouldn't the card wad under the lubed wad protect the powder from the lube? Asking for a friend.
So I can see using the pointy bullets I a revolver as long as they fit. However I don’t think that I want to load pointy bullets (unless they have the polymer tip) in to a tube feed rifle. I’m not interested in chancing a chain fire 🔥 in my rifles.
I always put the card under the wonderwad or a grease cookie. I will look and see if I can find the recipe for the lanolin, bees wax and something else lube.
@@Everythingblackpowder I haven't had them stick on me, yet, and I got to thinking about it and I put a wad on each side of a grease cookie. Have you tried paper patched bullets yet? When they work they are great, but a bad day with them you will wish you stayed in bed.
@@Everythingblackpowder Get ready to tear your hair out until you find what works, the loads that work in my rolling block don't work in my trapdoor and vice versa.
This is unrelated to the video but today I was experimenting with my dog lock pistol and sea service pistol found that using 40 grains of 2f and some paper with .22 cal pellets I used 10-12 and you get a pretty decent pattern but I don’t really now if you would call that buckshot or just shot
LOL! You *had* to go there. Cool, though. I wonder if you aren't better off that they didn't chamber in the rifle--they say pointy bullets can set off the primers of bullet ahead of them in the tube, although I don't know if that's a myth. I had Accurate Molds make a custom mold that is a very close match to the original bullets used in the M1873 .45 Colt cartridges, and it works very well, and looks almost exactly the same as the original civilian cartridges (the military ones were copper with Benet primers, and I can't reproduce that).
@@Everythingblackpowder 255 grains with 20:1 lead:tin. It should have a slightly hollow base, and it should be .452 instead of .454, but Accurate can't make hollow-base bullet molds, and they only made the originals .452 to deal with a problem with the loading mechanisms they used, so it's otherwise quite close. I wish I could post a link here, I wrote up a couple of articles on my blog about it and the Frankford Arsenal reproduction packaging I made for them.
Maybe a random idea... What happens if you take 2 different powders like cottonelle and cottonwood, and mix them like 25/75 or 50/50 does it just average out or something else?
Excellent. I love seeing the "you can't do that" being done with style.
always fired me up when anyone wave this "Can't or Don't?" red flag in my face.
Gotta say, I like the ambient music you're putting in the background now, adds just a bit of mood but without intruding on the narrating and conversations, just the right balance.
Glad to hear it, thank you
I love this content. It's turned into one of my favorite channels.
Glad to hear it
Love your matter of fact sarcasm
Glad to hear it
Its interesting. And I like how your channel and others like it are basically an archive to understanding black powder and how much guns and gunpowder has evolved since its invention.
Thank you
I use a card between the black powder and my felt wad so the grease doesn't effect the powder when using bullets made for smokeless powder. I've already loaded Johnson and Dow into a 45 colt case just to see how they worked.
As soon a s you mentioned the 1866, I knew how it would go. I have one too and did the same with semi wadcutters. It's always fun trying to get that cartridge back out through the loading gate!
Those J&D make one cool looking 45colt Cartridge. A dragoon Cartridge covertion is a thing of beauty
Thanks, Snapper
Entertaining as always Jake. Yes the OAL of 1.6" cannot be significantly be exceeded in an 1873.........
I use the 200gr Lee bullets in my cap'n'ball revolvers. They do have a lube groove so I run them through the sizer to lube them and then just load them like that. Seems to work fine. For RBs I use a 1/16" (or thereabouts) wool felt wad soaked in the same lube (60/40 beeswax/vaseline) which seems to work well too and is not hard to clean up. I have wondered about the J&Ds and similar with no lube grooves and how they would go both in percussion arms and metallic cartridges. Personally, I'd be inclined to put a thin paper wad over the powder to protect it from the lube, although I think the fear of 'contamination' is probably over rated. I have noticed that those 1/16" felt wads to sometimes stay stuck to the ball, and on hot days give a faint smoke trail to the target. Accuracy does not seem adversely affected for my purposes, but that's not bullseye shooting it's on steel.
Interesting that your 'odds and sods' powder performed just fine. I must confess to mixing remnants of commercial powders this way and have not noticed any significant degradation of performance; after all, I can see little reason why there should be.
Thanks as always for another interesting video,... 🙂
Exelente Mr. Jake, ya puedo traducir al español sus educativos videos.
Aca en Chile ,y tambien el resto del cono sur en la segunda mitad del siglo XIX hubo una guerra entre 1879 - 1883 que involucró a tres paises , Perú, Bolivia y Chile en ese conflicto fueron muy populares los revolveres Sistema Lefaucheux o pin fire como ustedes lo llaman,
Yo conservo uno de esos pin fire.
Que uso recreando sus cartuchos.
Los revolveres americanos como los Colt, Remington o S&W, solo los tenian los altos oficiales ya que eran muy caros y escasos
Yo hace poco adquirí una replica de un Colt Walker fabicada por Aldo Uberti. Esos modelos en su tiempo no llegaron aqui...
Saludos desde Chile Souht-America.
Y mis Felicitaciones por el triunfo de Mr. Donald Trump...
Great video.. really interesting stuff. Like the low background music, very good choice of tunes, goes well with the narrative and not overpowering!
Glad to hear it. Thank you
The J&D bullet DOES have a grease groove, but it is outside lubed. As you probably know, the paper Ctg bullets were often dipped in a lube, after assembly. Most was probably removed, when loaded, but enough to do the job.
Looks like a real nice day on the range .. relaxing. - Thank You Jake & The Team.
Thank
Thank you for sharing another enjoyable video six stars brother
Thank you
That's interesting, I have a few pounds of who knows what BP in different containers, won't be that way for long I assure you. Really like your videos, I seem to learn a little more each time. When you hit my age learning is something you did years back. Thanks for the video.
Thank you
Nicely done as always. Happy Father’s Day to you(obviously early) Have a great weekend.
Thank you!
I also sometimes load the Johnston & Dow for my 45Colt Kirst conversion cylinders in my Walker and 1860 revolvers. I size them like you did, and just put a little bit of lube in my revolver cylinders and they work great!
Excellent
your nick sounds reaally polish, czy mam rację? :D
Take that comment!
I am waiting for someone to do some tests with the new GOEX to see if they made it any better. I can't get any real powder around here so I make mine like you used to and go with it as best as I can. you do a great job with your tests and make everything interesting. Thank you for that, and thank you for knowing "You can't" means "TRY it!"
Thank you
I had the same cronograph, damn thing only worked on a sunny cloud free day. The smoke sometimes interferes with the optical sensors too.
Got a Garmin cronograph works every time and ya don't have to shooting through anything. There expensive but worth it.
I have some similar molds . But whatever the British version was back then. They shoot great out of my Remington reproduction.
They are just a little shorter and might run in your lever guns. I can send you a batch for Science .
@@markveenstra9378 is it the Kerr bullet?
Good Morning and Thank-You!
Thank you
Grease is good with BP, but I understand your concerns for the chronograph. Thanks for the video !
Thank you
Those pointed conical projectiles are fine for revolvers but tubular magazines can get "exciting" when centerfire rounds, instead of the original rimfire are used.😮
I love the channel and thoroughly enjoy the videos.
Those conical rounds always knocked the rammer free on my 1851 colts 😂
A little crisco for lube goes a long way 🤪 Awesome research being done you guys! Very interesting to see the mixed powder be edged out by flex in the rifle, but vice versa in the pistola! Muy interesante!
Dadgum conscience! A piece of custom tubing over push rod centers reverse bullet and stops at die when custom fit. Plastic or aluminum is ok. Air pop and an easy finger pinch removes a perfect taper base.
Another educational video, and happy fathers day to you and your team!
Thank you
Thanks for using one of my better portraits for your meme. 😊
Thank you! I knew you would appreciate it.
I've used a Lee 450-200-1R conical in 45 Colt & ACP loads. As cast they are .454" with a .450" rebated base.
Had similar over length with .45 Colt loaded for old Vaquero when I was so excited taking my 7th Cavalry SAA to shoot. Colt cylinder shorter than the Ruger. Eerrrrr!
Thanks for the video !
Thank you
You must have been reading my mind. I use J&D conicals in my Whitneyville percussion Dragoon and it loves them. I thought about using them in my .45 LC revolvers and am glad you taught me they would have to be sized 1st. Only flat nose .45 LC bullets should be used in the Uberti lever guns because a conical pointed bullet could set off the primer in a centerfire cartridge when it is in the loading tube under the barrel.
That’s how it ended up
Magazine tube detonations could happen, but it's not as trivial and easy as it seems. I forgot which one, but there was a gun rag which did a test many years ago where they loaded up some .30-30s with pointy bullets and filled a Winchester 94 with them, then knocked the thing around a whole bunch.
They did eventually get detonation, but it took a whole damn lot to make it actually happen, they had to climb a tree and throw the rifle on the ground several times to make some primers finally pop, and they only managed to get two of them to fire, they didn't all go off in one row. The magazine also doesn't support the cartridges like the chamber does, so the popping isn't quite so dramatic as some people envision.
That would be a pretty big "could". I doubt the bare lead bullet nose would do that.
@@kneyork9930 It's unlikely, but it might.
I think the most likely gun to experience this is centerfire reproductions of the old 1860 Henry, with its weird follower setup and the open slot in the bare magazine tube. Don't need pointed bullets there, flatnosed ones will do it, if you drop the cartridges down into there in a way which lets them fall a good distance, or if you let the follower go after partially loading so it gets to smack them real good (both which the manual tells you to NOT do), then inertia can make primers go off, and with the uncovered magazine and its open slot, that can cause injury. This happened to Ian McCollum, fortunately he wore shooting glasses and only got a minor wound, with a sliver of .45 Colt brass left in his chest.
@@0neDoomedSpaceMarine Ouch! I've also seen tests, and although it's not "pleasant", it does not kill the shooter, or blow one's hands off, set off all the cartridges, etc. I think another factor in this case is that the load was very mild, I think there was very little recoil with that bullet and only 30 grains of pixie dust.
Atta boy! Don’t take no $h.t from nobody! 👍🏻
Back in the day they crammed whatever would fit down for the barrel it was life or death 😂
Yep
Thanks!
Thank you!
"Why?" Why? NOT?
"I have" a mixed stash too of my less than what I hoped for AMP stash of "mixed AMP"
I was thinking another milling all together may change things?
They say it can't be done!
Love the videos!!!! In regards to the leading problem try using powder coat for the lead bullets, I use this method in modern firearms.
Love the videos, thank you, and you are a shooter.
Thank you
Thanks for sharing good info
You bet
I powdercoat my black powder bullets, works great for me. No lube needed....
Coat stays intact after resizing.
I use the coating methode from Cees ....aka....Lead Cees...
Take a can of siliconespray.....spray your bullets.....take pair of pincers and hold the bottem part...
Gently put the bullet into the powdercoat and dont let the bullet go...take the bullet out and tap of the exces powder bij gently tapping the pincers with a rod.
Place the bullet on a silicone mat into an oven and bake by the powdercoat manufactors instructions...and voila...a nicely powdercoated bullet.
Give the Kaido conicals a try when you get a chance. They're offered in 220, 240, and 255gr versions and they hit harder and penetrate deeper than anything else. A seller on Etsy machines 220gr castings into hollow points and claimed a kill on a deer at 30 yards that passed all the way through, which if true is damned impressive.
Those worked pretty well. They sure do look sexy too.
Ok I know this video has been up for a minute but I just had an idea. Since they come out of the mold at .460, why not size them to 458-459 and try them in a 45-70 carbine?
You most certainly could do that
Jake, you are the true purpose behind the reason that TH-cam is here.
Hmm… is that good or bad?
@@Everythingblackpowder Bueno, very mucho Bueno.
Glad to hear it.
Still fine tuning, if you get me drift, still looking for that 'INSTANT' IGNIGHT
great content as always.
Thank you
Alright yeah that is still a cool idea.
Hasn't thought of using a shot card with bp loads - I do use plastic ones for smokeless 45 Colt that I just 3d print a zillion of for cheap
hell i'll cap brass with`em!! Jake ever try ammonium nitrate in place of potassium nitrate? i've seen it done in rocket motors both are oxidizers it should work! i'm planning on doing a batch but finding a small bag is being a pain around here and i don;t have any use for 50 pounds of the stuff!!
I went the other way. I have a Lee 50 cal hollow base wadcutter mold that I use for 500 S&W. Just run them thru a .501 luber sizer. And they stabilize backwards.
Interesting
@@Everythingblackpowder I'm using a very mild load of 12.5 grains unique but I disavow any responsibility for unpublished loads.
Great video
Thank you
The video, as always, didn't suck.
Just a follow-up from your previous video regarding milling-time; Have you tried using a larger diameter mill? I suspect that the balls don't quite have enough energy to properly smash everyhting together/apart. You said that you experienced a reduction in perormance (but increase in cleanlieness) when switching from lead to brass, and that checks out with my theory.
If you can get ahold of / make a larger diameter mill, the time it takes to get that ultra-clean burn should be reduced.
We’re looking into that
This has me thinking if you could do a 45 caliber version of a 44 Smith and Wesson American with the J&D conical and some 45 cowboy special brass.
I don’t see why not
i still use wax as lube but i mainly shoot matchlock and flintlock
Have you tried lee liquid alox for the bullets and the felt for the powder fouling? And why the choice of wheel weights instead of a softer alloy, just a convenience thing? Love what you guys do keep it going. I wonder how that j&d would do in a reduced 45-70
I use Lee liquid alox for 50-70 and 577 snider smokeless loads and it works just fine. own an automotive repair shop so I have an abundance of used wheel weights so it’s simply a matter of convenience..
I don't even shoot black powder, but for some reason, I find this stuff pretty interesting.
Glad to hear it
Have you ever used the Lee Classic loader? I really like mine, but i dont have a dedicated reloading area in my current home yet.
Yes they work well.
Great video!
Thank you
5:25 maybe the bamboo is creating more ashes and thats why it's grey? You should test this theory by dropping the temp on it and just cook it longer
So the greasy wads are not absorbed by the powder? Would have figured the over shot cards would prevent that if placed under the felt wad. Is the projectile seated firmly against everything?
Well if it is absorbed by the powder it doesn’t affect it much. The reason why I assemble them this way is because I’ve had the felt wad stick to the base of the bullet and cause flyers. If you like, you could always use a card wad on either side of the greased felt wad just to be safe. That’s how Murphys Muskets does all of his BP cartridges.
@@Everythingblackpowder The flyer is a good point as I see a lot of BP wads smoldering after the shot potentially starting fires. I suspect a lot of fires were started during wars and otherwise. I have to chase down the wad and make sure its out.
Been looking at a dragoon, eventually want to get a conversion cylinder for one as well. This was informative. I wonder the difference if using a Lee conical bullet.
Only one way to find out
I haven’t seen black powder on shelves in years. Anywhere. They have told me it due to the classification being explosive but equivalent is not. It’s classified as flammable.
I’m thinking maybe the goex had a longer burn time than the mix. Thereby getting slightly lower in the pistol, but slightly higher in the rifle.
Just a question, why use the greased wadd under the card wadd? I would think the lubricant would be best nearest to the projectile.
I’ve often had the greased felt large stick to the back of the bullet and give even worse accuracy than it already gets
Just got through casting my first Johnston & Dow bullets on the 13th very curious to see how this goes.
It worked
I still haven’t caught Goex available yet either but seems Grafs has their own powder now.
Yeah which is rather made by Goex or schuetzen
all my pistols with solid sights get a dovetail filed into the barrel so i can have my sights filed to fit my load and if for some reason i need a taller sight i can jus swap it out with another instead of fighting the soldered sights that come on em
Good idea
Just like when I was 9 and Saturday morning came around ,I was happy .Cartoons,yeah. Today , Jake posts , I thought yeah it's Saturday! Then my brain locked the hubs ,Oh it's Friday. So, I got a Fathers day bonus,a couple days early. YEAH, "Cup Half Full!"
😂
After reading the comments about pointy bullets in a tube magazine, I'd like to say that that lead is not going to set off a primer. Even hard lead would be too soft. If you made a firing pin out of the same lead, it would not fire the cartridge. (and only be good for one try) Also, 30 grains of black under a 200-218? grain bullet would not have enough recoil to do it. I'm guessing that load in an 1866 didn't have much more kick than a .22. Consider that many 30-30 bullets are very round-nosed, but are safe with the lead tip of the bullet. It's FMJ bullets in a powerful cartridge, in a tube that one might not want to do. So, the pointy nose of the J&D bullet is a non-issue in a '66, firing a light load. Just saying.
Something ive noticed with some smokeless reloaders, and with good reason usually, they think if they cant find it in a reloading manual, that it cant be done. One of my best friends was convinced i was going to blow up my 1911 loading a 0.454" round ball with pyrodex p in a 45 auto case. I laughed out loud when it actually cycled well enough to load a round when i fired it. He was dumb struck and i took him down the rabbit hole that is black powder. He's used it, at least as a fun experiment, in almost everything he owns at one time or another, including ARs lol.
Shotgun loaders are the worst about this. I can’t count how many times I hear even rather mundane off-book tricks called “impossible” or “unsafe.” Even things like replacing 1 1/8 oz of birdshot with 1 oz of buckshot
@@jacobackley502 With shotgun it's kind-of-sort-of understandable. SAAMI max for shotgun shells is usually around 11,000 psi compared to the 30,000 and up for metallic cartridges, so there's less margin for error.
However, you're right that they may be a bit too finicky about things. Substituting primers, for example, or mixing brands of hull as long as they're the same category (tapered vs. straight).
otoh I'm mainly a metallic reloader and I'm not averse to experimenting. For example, I couldn't find data for a 168 grain bullet in .300 Blackout using Accurate No. 11FS, so I went to the burn rate charts and found that it was around the same speed as H110 or Win 296. So I started at the minimum charge for those and now have a decent load worked up.
Of course, learning to reload from Johnny's Reloading Bench may have influenced my willingness to experiment. XD
@@vicroc4 I’d say there’s actually quite a bit more margin of error for shotguns. Many are proofed above 20kpsi. Some are good up until the 30s. If you have a known good shotgun like an 870, the idea that you’ll blow it up with minor experiments is pretty silly. It’s a lot like a 45 colt Ruger Blackhawk. If you’re around 45 colt load data, you’re miles away from damaging it.
@@jacobackley502 I mean, you're not wrong. I'm just saying that the difference in pressures might be why more reloaders are willing to experiment in metallic cartridges than in shotguns.
Question for you .i tried the black load in a single action revolver.but noticed a huge difference in the size grains used real fine grains of powder on hard ball was holy moly what a difference from course powder say 3f compaired to four f .it realy made a big difference in power like night and day.
That’s typical
All I ever use in my black powder guns is a wad less mess works fine
Idk if you'll see this or not but do you know if there are any lever guns that work with the .45 colt " magnum" rounds that qre still made i heard the 1892 winchester and there clones work but id rather not be the one who foud out
@@daltond.2492 yes 1892 and 1894 Winchester will work and I hear that the new Henry rifles will hold up.
Good video, didn't suck, but why didn't you put the card wad under the lubed wad, rather than over it? Wouldn't the card wad under the lubed wad protect the powder from the lube? Asking for a friend.
I’ve tried it both way and the only difference was that the wad can sometimes stick to the back of the bullet and cause some flyers
Lookin forward to it
I wonder if that card after black powder before bullet works kinda like a gas check.... and how much of it survives?
So I can see using the pointy bullets I a revolver as long as they fit. However I don’t think that I want to load pointy bullets (unless they have the polymer tip) in to a tube feed rifle. I’m not interested in chancing a chain fire 🔥 in my rifles.
I really look forward to your videos. Always pushing the science of black power.
Thank you
Have you ever tried to load round ball in to cardtriges im curious if its possible
Never mind I just saw your old video
Why would you not put the card wad before the felt, to minimize the chance of powder contamination?
Ive tried it both ways and the only difference I’ve noticed is that sometimes the felt was gets stuck to the back of the bullet and causes flyers
Slugs are kinda pointy for a tube magazine, dontcha think?
They are lead, even hard lead is soft. Very unlikely to set off a primer. It's FMJ that one has to be careful with.
Just curious, what conversion for 45 Colt do you have on your Colt Dragoon?
Gated Kirst conversion
I always put the card under the wonderwad or a grease cookie. I will look and see if I can find the recipe for the lanolin, bees wax and something else lube.
I’ve found that the lubed wad can stick to the base of the bullet and give even worse accuracy than it already gets
@@Everythingblackpowder I haven't had them stick on me, yet, and I got to thinking about it and I put a wad on each side of a grease cookie. Have you tried paper patched bullets yet? When they work they are great, but a bad day with them you will wish you stayed in bed.
@IWatchedWhat I’ve never tried paper patched bullets
@@Everythingblackpowder Get ready to tear your hair out until you find what works, the loads that work in my rolling block don't work in my trapdoor and vice versa.
Would it make a difference if the mixed together powders were milled for a longer time period (a subject that you touched on in your next video)?
I don’t think so
Would it not be better for the card wad to be on top of powder to prevent contamination of the powder just a thought
I found that sometimes the lube felt wide, can get stuck to the back of the bullet and make the accuracy worse than it already is
@@Everythingblackpowder Two card wads, one on both sides of the lubed wad? Kind of like a sammich.
I can't think of a good way to test this, but is the mixed powder producing a smaller volume of gas so the pressure tapers off in the rifle?
Beats me
This is unrelated to the video but today I was experimenting with my dog lock pistol and sea service pistol found that using 40 grains of 2f and some paper with .22 cal pellets I used 10-12 and you get a pretty decent pattern but I don’t really now if you would call that buckshot or just shot
Interesting
Good video
Thanks
Make your own damn video!
Good stuff, as per usual
Thank you
Still think you need a cannon.... they eat mixed stuff without complaining 👍
I completely agree
I love how you basically said GOEX is not worthy of greater things. ;)
😂
Have u tried Mesquite wood? It burns hot and fast on its own
I have not
@@Everythingblackpowder that would be interesting cool vids keep em up
Can’t be done, hold my beer
LOL! You *had* to go there. Cool, though. I wonder if you aren't better off that they didn't chamber in the rifle--they say pointy bullets can set off the primers of bullet ahead of them in the tube, although I don't know if that's a myth. I had Accurate Molds make a custom mold that is a very close match to the original bullets used in the M1873 .45 Colt cartridges, and it works very well, and looks almost exactly the same as the original civilian cartridges (the military ones were copper with Benet primers, and I can't reproduce that).
Thanks, Hugh. What weight bullet does that mold drop?
@@Everythingblackpowder 255 grains with 20:1 lead:tin. It should have a slightly hollow base, and it should be .452 instead of .454, but Accurate can't make hollow-base bullet molds, and they only made the originals .452 to deal with a problem with the loading mechanisms they used, so it's otherwise quite close. I wish I could post a link here, I wrote up a couple of articles on my blog about it and the Frankford Arsenal reproduction packaging I made for them.
bro hates to count to six.
Maybe a random idea... What happens if you take 2 different powders like cottonelle and cottonwood, and mix them like 25/75 or 50/50 does it just average out or something else?
Seems to average out
The dreaded 1.6” OAL measurement. Burned me twice and I know better. Oh well, the magazine tube and follower needed cleaning anyway.
I think I caught on to something, If I want to see something tried all I have to do is say " IT CANNOT BE DONE ! " and you will do it . 😉
I am enjoying this content allot more
Glad to hear it
I'm kinda a noob in black powder but seems like the card would go between the powder and lubed felt wad, or isn't it oily enough to bother the powder?
Not oily enough to bother the powder
Would this be possible with the dragoon bullet from eras gone?
I don’t see why not