Sigh... Dreams could have been a big hit and I agree with a lot of your points. It seemed Media Molecule had a lot of great ideas but didn't know how to execute it or took too long.
I'm thinking back to 2016 when they delayed the beta and then 2018 when they absolutely scrambled to make that happen to avoid a munity. The 2016 version couldn't have done worse. It's hindsight of course, but completely rebuilding your game title after 3 years of development sounds like a very bad idea any way you slice it. And then to take another 3 years after that to release...
Honestly, Dreams was just too complex. At this point, you could just pick up a modern game engine and make a real game, not much more effort. I bet they will come back to the far simpler LBP.
@@xXYannuschXxI don’t think the complexity was necessarily the issue. Sure, to make a game it takes alot of effort and time no matter where you make it (and why not make it on a real engine then..?), but the way dreams handled programming and modelling was extremely elegant and accessible and nothing really compares to that. So that type of system would be insanely popular on pc, I’m certain of it. I think the problem is the limitations of the engine itself and the PS4 hardware/ecosystem. If the ”Dreams engine” was on PC and they removed all the childish stuff, the only limitation was the power of your PC and you could compile your projects into exe files, it would be a golden goose.
@@Settiis "If the ”Dreams engine” was on PC and they removed all the childish stuff, the only limitation was the power of your PC and you could compile your projects into exe files, it would be a golden goose." I think the same. Dreams could have been REALLY successfull on PC. They could also have marketed the game alot better. LBP got ALOT of PR back in the days, but Dreams just went under everyones radar (TBH I didnt even knew it launched in 2020...)
@@Settiis I agree. I think the complexity was an issue with Dreams as it was monetized. There were plenty of good content creators and there would have been even more if they got paid for plays on their content. Make it free to play and there is nothing to discourage players other than the clunky search features and overwhelming mass of goofy content to ignore on the way to finding something worthwhile.
QUICK CORRECTION: at 1:13 I say that "live support" is ending. Development is ending in September. Live support will continue beyond that. Initially I wanted this to be about both Project Spark and Dreams, but it was getting long-winded and unfocused. However, nearly all of these issues apply to Project Spark as well: #1 No relevant IP. Same. #2 Bad monetization. Project Spark had DLC for creators and eventually transitioned into a FTP model that didn't work. Not to say pay-to-create CANT work on these platforms, but I think if you're going to burden the creators you're going to need to charge them a lot and it would then be necessary to PAY them for plays on their content. PS didn't. #3 Lack of marketing. Same. #4 PS had online multi-create and multi-play. multi-create was 2-person only and PS had no collaboration tools, so it was very limited. Better than nothing, though! PS's online multiplayer implementation has very bad to the point of being difficult to use and may as well have not existed. #5 Too complex for casuals. This did affect PS as well, but really only on the logic side. The visual tile programming was very interesting and powerful. Almost as powerful as a scripting language. Of course this made it as difficult to learn as a scripting language. The other aspects of PS were relatively easy to grasp. #6 Community tools were even worse than Dreams. I managed to get a question slipped into Q&A with the developers early in the Project Spark beta about social media tools and it was clear that hadn't been discussed much. #7 Anachronistic idea. Doesn't apply because PS didn't try to do everything like Dreams does. PS was much closer to Fortnite Creative in form. #8 This one is specific to Project Spark: MS bought Minecraft and PS instantly became irrelevant in their stable of first-party titles.
I’m just now getting into Dreams and am very sad to see that I’m a day late and a dollar short. Hopefully enough of the core user and creator base will stick around, to have an on going community of sorts to share things with.
I made things in Project spark, Dreams and Trials which all have powerful creation tools, but Dreams was truly something else out of the gate innovative all around that said it should of had things like multiplayer, ways for creators to make money and better marketing like your points mention. I had kinda seen Dreams wouldn't work out despite me loving the Dreams platform because of experience of these things failing, I pretty much stop creating on it a year ago cause of that and moved to Unreal and Roblox for fun. The thing about Dreams even with it's learning curve is it's way easier to use and more powerful than something like Roblox in many ways and for sure easier than Unreal, also to note creators make millions off of Roblox creations, I could only imagine a alternative future where Dreams got to that point they could of made good money off royalties for people using their platform to sell stuff especially since it's so diverse. Great video I think it's the most concise take on this and your experience with previous creation software gives a clearer picture.
I was always in favor of monetization for creators in Dreams. My thoughts on that subject in the big monetization debate align with my opinions on my YT channel. Yes, it's a hobby. I'm going to do it anyway, but given the choice, why would I NOT want an extra $100-200/month in my pocket? But that aside, its a little wacky, in my mind, to not only expect creators to produce for free, but to demand that creators PAY to create. I think the worst decision made in regards to Dreams was focusing on VR instead of online multi. Its difficult to believe anyone thought that was a good idea.
Just putting it out there, as much as I love everyone's videos so far regarding this subject, I really appreciate your trademark incisiveness. Also I still go back to the far cry Creator because that's a community I've been around since 2007. It just breaks my heart to know that all I can do in that is basically edit mode. And the community is still there. I feel like Ubisoft probably doesn't even know the lights are still on for arcade, being so huge. The problem is none of the skills I learned on controller will ever translate to mouse and keyboard, except for the basic manipulation of primaries perhaps in sculpting, or a few more years I've got in practicing level design. My plan now is to use dreams as a proof-of-concept tool to hopefully get hired as an environment designer at a different indie company. It just makes me sick that dreams has been reduced to PowerPoint in that regard, despite being the most fun and engaging creation tool I've ever tried, despite the steep learning curve. I hope to see you stay creative and wanted to thank you for all the tutorials that kept me from banging my head on my burning hot, jet engine of a PlayStation😂❤🎉😢
Right now my YT channel is my hobby, and I have a lot going on right now trying to find work. I'm looking forward to a time when I can get back into creative platforms. Might be a few years, though, unfortunately. I am positive, though, that no matter what I end up doing, I'll find Dreams alum there. I learned to let go from my experience with Project Spark. Hung in there until the bitter end and beyond. I avoided all of that this time around and feel much better about how I parted with Dreams. Happy to be of service with the tuts.
Dreams feels more like an introduction to game developing in the form of a simple to understand format a experience of what is like to be a game developer and all the struggles development hells and hurtles developers go through.
It’s such a shame it’s going away I loved this game and would check on it occasionally just to see what’s new. I could never wrap my head around how to create anything, though I had rough ideas on what I wanted to make, and now that it’s going away is saddening. Farewell, Dreams, you were a strange way to look into other’s minds. Loved you all.
That being said they should put it on PC, and use the income from that to keep both versions alive and promote it. Or go back to the drawing board and make something similar yet more accessible for casuals such as myself. I wanted to create things and I could never get to.
Losing Alex was a massive signal for me. Though I will always hurt. I'm sure when I'm ready I'll get back in there and continue trying to create my tank that will never be. I've spent years trying to make this thing work but it doesn't matter I just enjoy working on it from time to time. I thought for sure we'd get PSVR 2 support. So glad I didn't buy the PS5 and PSVR2. Dreams would have been the only reason for me to do so. Dreams was the only reason I bought a PS4 and PSVR. A handful of other games were a bonus but I didn't need them. I did need Dreams.
Same. Bought the PS4 and PSVR for Dreams. Didn't really like VR, though. :D I was waiting for a PS5 update to pull the trigger on the new hardware. Still no PS5 for me, probably never will be. As I recall they had Alex working on server stuff and as a graphics and sound geek that could not stand. Glad for him that he found a place at Nvidia. Its a bummer so many had to move on. It's a very different Media Molecule now than the one I first experienced 7 years ago.
@@LucidStew yeah it kind of went from 0 to 60 with we're just here for you to create, we love your work, we're working on multiplayer, all the smoke and mirrors for something I think they knew a long time ago was Dead on arrival. It's a shame it had to be the most amazing piece of software ever.
@@baddreams3850 Project Spark was same. DOA, they finished up the major parts of the product backlog and called it a day. I think the exception is that Sony wanted to see if adding full VR support would boost the PSVR.
@@LucidStew It is a real waste to let all those years of hard work just go. Even starting a new project, they could use their own Dreams engine while building out features and updates to it for their next project. While also building in a way for not just themselves but other devs to export their projects. At least for smaller indie like games. They could also have decided to build that tie in game something like LBP, called it Dreams 2 or something else to start fresh sales and have a revenue stream. Alas at least I can still have fun with Dreams until my PS Moves or PS4 die.
@@LucidStew exactly. Kind of a wash as well as to who can VR and enjoy it, and those that don't jive for whatever reason with VR. I totally understand not getting into it, but for those of us who love VR, dreams was the only thing in the world we knew of that could create VR games with such ease. The VR side is truly revolutionary, creating in a metaphysical space still sounds crazy but I absolutely love it. I recommend not using the moves and just use the DualShock imo. Can't believe they used them for VR. Such a facepalm. Edit: the creation is amazing with moves, just meant the gameplay.
Your videos were helpful when I found Dreams, what feels like about 3 years ago now. Been a while since I was on, as well. A bit sad to see the Dreams era come to an end, and worse seeing that Mm have almost moved on already. I'm one trophy away from Platinum if I remember right. Might fire up the PS4 and try to get it before September.
It may very well have been 3 years. No kidding, I've been making Dreams videos since 2016! You can see in the video I'm only something like 42% on the achievements. I always thought that was funny. I probably spent about 10,000 hours on the thing. Didn't play it right, though. :D
Great video Stew! Sad and very true. Lost potential with Dreams. I will still keep updating my latest Dream - The Arbornaut, but feel pretty uninspired to create anything new.
I think the remaining option is to be tightly involved with the community. There will be a few thousand people that will ride this train all the way to the end of the tracks. I did that with Project Spark. I posted my last PS YT video a year after the servers went dark.
The creative mode on this game *tool pretty much cured a hard depression I was going through, I grew extremely fond of the game and I think it's extremely sad that it didn't really take off as the developers wanted to.
for the last year or so i have been really worried about dreams' future, for exactly all the same reasons you share in this video. upsetting to be validated on it.
End of development is a death knell no matter how you slice it. The question now is how long live services will continue. With Project Spark, community support was in place until just before the servers went dark, although activity had dwindled near the end. SOMEONE will use Dreams as long as it exists, though. I can tell you that much.
This is a title that always interested me, I just never wanted to pick it up on a console where I would be forced to create complex projects with a GAMEPAD. I could only see myself using it with mouse + keyboard. That's also why I never touched Mario Maker and got Levelhead instead.
Minus some technical issues I really liked using the DS4 with the creation engine. Given my experience with keyboard-mouse and other similar 3D creator spaces, I'd honestly pick the controller.
I actually left Dreams when I started studying computer science. Dreams was also the reason I started it. If I had only had the prospect of making some extra money with Dreams, I would still be all in. As a program, Dreams is still unbeatable in my opinion. The tools are so precise that they actually have no place on a console with all its limitations. I'm convinced that despite AI, the concept of Dreams has a chance of success, but I've also learned over the years that it's often the little things that bring down those with big ambitions.
It definitely would have been nice to get some revenue from creating. I mean, I did make a LITTLE money from Dreams. On the order of $125 I think, but the time in was so absurd compared to the reward that the reward may as well have not existed. I also promoted the crap out of the title to no personal gain. It makes a person think twice about why they're doing such things. With this concept, it takes so long to build it and it needs continual maintenance and upgrade to the point that AI will be doing a lot of these things long before something like Dreams could come around again. I don't see how hand-crafters could possibly rise above that fray en masse.
@@LucidStew You're probably right that AI will be faster. However, people will still have the need to create something with their hands simply because it brings happiness, and I believe that requires more than just a few prompts. Who knows what awaits us. It probably won't take a decade like the development of Dreams.
In my opinion Dreams should've been LittleBigPlanet4. Media Molecule should've developed a fully-fledged campaign akin to that of previous LBP games but with the Dreams engine. Just the premise of Sackboy making his great comeback would have brought great attention to the game, and since many of the logics and tools when it comes to creating games comes directly from LBP, the series' veterans wouldn't have felt left out at all.
Yes. For now it is only new development that is ending. Since this is supposed to happen in September, that probably means one more update. After that the servers will still be live for an undetermined amount of time and you will be able to play Dreams, and post new content.
1. Make the Dreams engine free. 2. Start commercializing the best titles and putting up for purchase on the PS Store. 3. Give Mm a cut, and give the creators a cut. Why was that so hard? It’s so frustrating because Dreams even still today is incredible, with abilities other game engines may never see. It would be a sad loss if all this amazing work just dies.
Please, if there is anyone out there that has the money to buy Dreams IP. I ask you do so and find a way to port it over to PC, then make it moddable. Then your work can be done as 100s and maybe even 1000s of modders can get a hold of Dreams and add a ton of mods to add the functionalities we all want. The thing I loved about the logic is it is visual. At first it had a steep learning curve, but after a decent amount of TH-cam videos you can quickly get over that hump. Even if you watch a logic tutorial about one thing, often times you learn like 10 other things in the process and eventually you understand how the tools work. I hop into UE5 and try to pick up the logic and I am completely lost. Plus Dreams does something UE5 doesn’t. It is an all-in-one software platform for all of the things you described early in the video. This is why I love it. I don’t have to buy an expensive audio mixer, 3D sculptor software, animation software, learn C++ or other difficult programming languages, etc. I can do everything needed within Dreams to make my ideas a reality. Problem is, it was 2-3 features away from being the ultimate tool. I don’t even get why they didn’t activate co-op multiplayer. Those don’t require servers to run. All you would have to do is set it up so that other people connect to a private lobby that can be ran on the host’s console. (Much like how you can connect to a private chat room lobby in the PlayStation messages tab). They should have at least done this with up to 4 people. Then they could have dropped new content support.
Dreams for ps5 and psvr2 would of boosted sales considerably . Dreams was amazing even on ps4 and psvr as I didn’t even really need to purchase anymore games except for a few must have titles and the experiences were unique and some on par or even better visually than on other commercial games and I love mystical experiences in vr and short experiences and games suit me down to a T as I don’t have time to spend hours playing through long winded games . Am going to personally contact media molecule and see what they might be doing about this and if people like myself complain to them you never know . They could of made it into a big platform like steam and TH-cam where content creators could be sponsored and donations etc and this would of reality opened it all up and there would of been more of an incentive for people to create on there and thus develop better experiences especially with the power of ps5 and eventually ps5 pro and psvr2 . I just hope they don’t go further and pull the servers on us as well as that would surely be a bad day especially for me lol
I agree that Online Multiplayer was the biggest downfall. I'm a huge fan of VR, and enjoyed the VR Tools, but they really should have done online multiplayer first. So mamy people say PC would have "saved" Dreams, but a PC release didn't save Project Spark, and games like GMod show how much a creative PC Game relies on very strong multiplayer tools. As soon as PC Creators see that they cant import outside audio, can't import outside PNGs or videos, and can't make stronger games because of the PS4 level thermometer, all the benefits die down. I've been with your channel since the Dreams Newsletter dropped, and jts a shame that so much has fallen so soon. Keep up the good fight 👍
Project Spark's online multi play implementation was a mystery because it was SO bad, like someone took a time machine back to 1999 to get the implementation. Yeah, people think PC is the answer, but Dreams would get so hammered without online multi. At a minimum you'd need a good solid online multi implementation and the ability to iterate to more powerful hardware. In hindsight, there being no PS5 update concurrent with the PS5 release was probably the beginning of the end.
Yeah, I ended up getting a little nostalgic putting together the "we'll all look back fondly on that time when we Dreamed of a magical place where we played, shared, and created by our own hands." part of the script. This video is one of my final acts of letting go. It was really great around 2019-2020 with all the discovery and working with Dreams Guild, and I miss those times.
Makes me want to take the biggest rock I can find and crush my head with it. Dreams was supposed to be amazing, now it dies and will be forgotten forever.
Dreams for ps5 and psvr2 would of boosted sales considerably . Dreams was amazing even on ps4 and psvr as I didn’t even really need to purchase anymore games except for a few must have titles and the experiences were unique and some on par or even better visually than on other commercial games and I love mystical experiences in vr and short experiences and games suit me down to a T as I don’t have time to spend hours playing through long winded games . Am going to personally contact media molecule and see what they might be doing about this and if people like myself complain to them you never know . They could of made it into a big platform like steam and TH-cam where content creators could be sponsored and donations etc and this would of reality opened it all up and there would of been more of an incentive for people to create on there and thus develop better experiences especially with the power of ps5 and eventually ps5 pro and psvr2 . I just hope they don’t go further and pull the servers on us as well as that would surely be a bad day especially for me lol
If the idea of Dreams is too grandiose, then i fear for gaming and the next generation. The problem with Dreams, many of which you hit spot on, but mostly Media Molecule was the problem. Good creatives but terrible marketers, and not really connected to gamers or even the general population. They are niche and live in an echo chamber, thus their product similarly confined. They needed a larger more community driven company to partner with (or take them over) and really give them direction on how to appeal to gamers and the mainstream. They should have stayed as developers and left the business side to more competent people.
I am actually a new Dreams player. Bought the game in 2020, thought it was a revolutionary undertaking, but lost interest with the learning curve and the absence of proper tutorials (A massive turn off). Begin 2023, I decided to come back and literally fell in love with the tools... then the announcement dropped. As it stands, while your video is the perfect autopsy of Dreams failure, I pray the Universe for another couple of years of online servers: the Dreamiverse (while flawed in its browsing tools) is PACKED with outstanding creative achievements that make it a cultural and social experiment with way too many creations worth preserving. Turning those servers down would be the equivalent of burning a priceless library or a museum filled with loads of garbage (true) but also hundred of gygabytes of fascinating artistic insights and expressions.
The real shame is that there's no way to archive that and no way to access it once they finally pull the plug. Unless Sony mercifully comes up with a forever plan, all things made in Dreams will vanish outside of video archive.
I didn't know that you could do stop motion animation style in dreams; I realized about it from a video by the same media Molecule in youtube, but the way the man achieved this, blew my mind not only for the process but also for the hard-impossible-IQ 10000000 thinking process that you have to have for your own to reach that. Many times I tried to think "wooooww how did he/she/they do that art, effect..." and simply got stuck and frustrated at no solving the points. TH-cam was the real teacher for me in dreams and thanks to all the youtube content and dreams youtubers I could saw with better hope eyes the potential of dreams for my projects and my ideas. Totally true. There are many creative process that surely are not for the casual creators. Other issue that was frustating to me is that the painting mode doesn't have a tool for draw perfect curves but the sculpture mode yes, but is not the same... Uhhhhhh It was very annoying
Which is interesting because the stop-motion ability is a built-in feature. This goes back to the part of the video where I'm talking about empowering the users with better community tools. If we had those, it would have been so much easier for someone like you to interact with someone like me. Even if I didn't know something, I could have referred you to someone else. As it stands, that mostly only happens on Twitter, Reddit, and YT comments, so its a pain. You can draw perfect circles with paint fairly easily, just turn on the grid, stamp fleck, clone fleck and rotate 90 degrees, translate to pi/2 away, create inner clones to close the gap, repeat 3 more times. From there you can scale it to any purpose.
This is how the game could of been good you split the game up with sections like Racing, Platformer, art, movies. Same with creation they should of gave us tools and preset maker to make a race track and so on
Agreed, but look at something like ninjuana's SuperGP Kit. It's still not super easy to use and even less so to customize. Its very difficult to make an easy version of something this complex and retain the flexibility of the complex version.
Dreams should have always been sold as a development kit, with a free to use Dreams Player in the PSN marketplace on release day. Expecting people to pay $60, just to play a series of janky test demos with no guarantee of ever getting finished, is delusional. This really sucks because Dreams could have been a Playstation-Exclusive Roblox.
I dont understand why Sony couldn't pack in Dreams with ps5 for free could of marketed as the must have game and they let it go this game alone would have sold ps5s
I know a lot of people thought this. I do think Sony needed to think farther out of the box than they did. Sony should have supported this as a continuing development environment from the beginning, like UE or Unity, but specifically for hobbyists. I guess they though of it as more of a game title rather than a feature of the platform like it could have been. This also works into the IP angle. If you make it a platform thing and monetize online multi play, you can leverage ALL of your first-party IPs to rake in cash.
@@droid4d279 Yep. Dreams should have been just a feature of PS5. They could have built an entire online community around it, as a kind of PlayStation Home 2.0 It would have self sustained and possibly opened doors to other possibilities and set them apart in the console world.
I can't really speak to what is going on right now. I haven't used it in a while. It still exists, but last time I check usage was weak. It's not SO bad if you're making games and can get cherry picked for feature. People were still playing featured games at an ok clip last time I checked.
They spent 10 years creating the game then when they reached the finished line they through it in the bin, hard to get excited about any of their future upcoming projects if this is their mindset.
But you have to understand that stagnant software is essentially dead. It will never improve on any front once development is over. Meanwhile, other active, competing software will improve continuously.
Even though I thought it was an amazing tool, I knew it wasn't going to be a big hit after roughly the first week. For some of the reasons you listed, mostly the point about your average gamer isn't trying to do something so time consuming with little reward. Really, most PEOPLE wouldn't want to do that, me included.
One place I think they went wrong was not catering to players AT ALL. They were never going to have a million people creating consistently, so the other 950,000 need a reason to come back. It needed online multi for replayability. There were no player events, no tournaments. You should have been able to create clubs for games or creators or genres. If there had been a competent social aspect, like minded players could have made friends in Dreams and played together. Basically it was just assumed people would play stuff and that's that. Big opportunity missed.
I don't know that it NEEDED a PC version, but it DID need online for there to BE a PC version. Do all that, leave the base PS4 behind and I think it buys itself a future. But still, you need to find a way to drive revenue.
Saying Dreams has a learning curve is very disingenuous knowing how much larger the learning curve is for other software such as Blender, Unity, Unreal. It takes time to learn how to develop in these technologies… Dreams might be the top platform when it comes to the many features it offers such as a comfortable UI, plenty of included tutorials, and overall ease of use. Beats anything else on the market.
My opinion on the matter in not disingenuous in the slightest, which makes me think that you do not know the meaning of the word. That it is better or easier than other extremely difficult-to-learn tools does not mean that it doesn't have a daunting learning curve for people who want to casually play something.
So what you’re telling me is that the tools dreams give us are so good, that they couldn’t make money off of it because it was ACTUALLY FINISHED. Damn.
I don't think its possible to make money on a continuing basis from game creation software unless there is a way for creators to monetize their output. Then the developer could take a cut. That's why players carry the successful non-professional platforms. I'm not sure what you mean by it being finished. You don't really ever finish game creation software. You'd move on to the next version, like UE3,4,5, but those are never really done.
@@LucidStew The point I was trying to make was that all of the tools to make a game and more was already readily available WITH TUTORIALS since day one, which is unlike the other games that don’t even come out finished. They could always add more tools etc. but there i just don’t see any way of monetizing the game that is good enough without having an active fan base which is really sad. Sorry for the confusion mate.
@@jonasblanco2676 Oh yeah, it's an awesome set of tools if you can get past the learning curve and the imp drift. This is one other thing. There are now thousands of people who sunk ungodly amounts of time into a dead platform. No one made any money off of it with the exception of maybe 10 people. The other 99.9% now have 3 years experience in a non-transferable skill because Dreams is so weirdly different. And a certain percentage of those are so lost now that they're planning to go down with the ship. So it's even worse than just the company never figured out how to properly monetize it.
@@LucidStew The problem was that they dangled the carrot of monetization, which gave too many people delusions of grandeur. Dreams is a great hobby passtime and tool, but lets be honest, i have not found a single creation in Dreams that i would have paid for. Lots of fun interesting stuff. There's a reason none of these creators are making any money using the supposedly easier pc tools. It should have been clear day 1, this is just for fun.
If it had marketing, multiplayer, and something to not feel like you were wasting your time learning the system and making stuff it would get popular and lived on. Dreams is dead.
They should put it on pc, like sony is doing with a lot of their other games. PC would keep the community alive since a lot of other user-friendly creation software is popular on there like RPG Maker and stuff.
@@LucidStew Not realy. Dreams is a good box of tools, even if not for making the entire game, on pc it could had been used to make music, animations, game assets, 3d printing objects, book novels and even video games. On console? Nahhhhh I bought Dreams, actualy had preorder. I bought a psvr with the ball controlls just becouse of dreams. I tryed and i knew... it will not even stand a chance for 10 years. On PC maybe... not on consoles.
@@IAcePTI But it would be the same thing that's not working... only on PC. Why would it then magically work? I mean, yeah, if you made it into something different that DID work on PC, then it would probably work. Essentially all I'm saying is that in order to work on PC, it would need online multi.
The aim of the video is not to lay blame on anyone, but Media Molecule is not free of contribution here. Announcing the title along side the Playstation 4 and then delivering it only 6 months before the release of the PS5 in less than ideal condition was certainly part of the equation.
I think it would get killed for not having online multi. If you think about all the things that the community could do to prop up and resurrect the idea, like DreamsCom 2023, they'd have 1,000 times more weight if people could simply play together online.
Sigh... Dreams could have been a big hit and I agree with a lot of your points. It seemed Media Molecule had a lot of great ideas but didn't know how to execute it or took too long.
I'm thinking back to 2016 when they delayed the beta and then 2018 when they absolutely scrambled to make that happen to avoid a munity. The 2016 version couldn't have done worse. It's hindsight of course, but completely rebuilding your game title after 3 years of development sounds like a very bad idea any way you slice it. And then to take another 3 years after that to release...
Honestly, Dreams was just too complex. At this point, you could just pick up a modern game engine and make a real game, not much more effort. I bet they will come back to the far simpler LBP.
@@xXYannuschXxI don’t think the complexity was necessarily the issue.
Sure, to make a game it takes alot of effort and time no matter where you make it (and why not make it on a real engine then..?), but the way dreams handled programming and modelling was extremely elegant and accessible and nothing really compares to that. So that type of system would be insanely popular on pc, I’m certain of it.
I think the problem is the limitations of the engine itself and the PS4 hardware/ecosystem.
If the ”Dreams engine” was on PC and they removed all the childish stuff, the only limitation was the power of your PC and you could compile your projects into exe files, it would be a golden goose.
@@Settiis "If the ”Dreams engine” was on PC and they removed all the childish stuff, the only limitation was the power of your PC and you could compile your projects into exe files, it would be a golden goose."
I think the same. Dreams could have been REALLY successfull on PC.
They could also have marketed the game alot better. LBP got ALOT of PR back in the days, but Dreams just went under everyones radar (TBH I didnt even knew it launched in 2020...)
@@Settiis I agree. I think the complexity was an issue with Dreams as it was monetized. There were plenty of good content creators and there would have been even more if they got paid for plays on their content. Make it free to play and there is nothing to discourage players other than the clunky search features and overwhelming mass of goofy content to ignore on the way to finding something worthwhile.
QUICK CORRECTION: at 1:13 I say that "live support" is ending. Development is ending in September. Live support will continue beyond that.
Initially I wanted this to be about both Project Spark and Dreams, but it was getting long-winded and unfocused. However, nearly all of these issues apply to Project Spark as well:
#1 No relevant IP. Same.
#2 Bad monetization. Project Spark had DLC for creators and eventually transitioned into a FTP model that didn't work. Not to say pay-to-create CANT work on these platforms, but I think if you're going to burden the creators you're going to need to charge them a lot and it would then be necessary to PAY them for plays on their content. PS didn't.
#3 Lack of marketing. Same.
#4 PS had online multi-create and multi-play. multi-create was 2-person only and PS had no collaboration tools, so it was very limited. Better than nothing, though! PS's online multiplayer implementation has very bad to the point of being difficult to use and may as well have not existed.
#5 Too complex for casuals. This did affect PS as well, but really only on the logic side. The visual tile programming was very interesting and powerful. Almost as powerful as a scripting language. Of course this made it as difficult to learn as a scripting language. The other aspects of PS were relatively easy to grasp.
#6 Community tools were even worse than Dreams. I managed to get a question slipped into Q&A with the developers early in the Project Spark beta about social media tools and it was clear that hadn't been discussed much.
#7 Anachronistic idea. Doesn't apply because PS didn't try to do everything like Dreams does. PS was much closer to Fortnite Creative in form.
#8 This one is specific to Project Spark: MS bought Minecraft and PS instantly became irrelevant in their stable of first-party titles.
I’m just now getting into Dreams and am very sad to see that I’m a day late and a dollar short. Hopefully enough of the core user and creator base will stick around, to have an on going community of sorts to share things with.
I made things in Project spark, Dreams and Trials which all have powerful creation tools, but Dreams was truly something else out of the gate innovative all around that said it should of had things like multiplayer, ways for creators to make money and better marketing like your points mention. I had kinda seen Dreams wouldn't work out despite me loving the Dreams platform because of experience of these things failing, I pretty much stop creating on it a year ago cause of that and moved to Unreal and Roblox for fun. The thing about Dreams even with it's learning curve is it's way easier to use and more powerful than something like Roblox in many ways and for sure easier than Unreal, also to note creators make millions off of Roblox creations, I could only imagine a alternative future where Dreams got to that point they could of made good money off royalties for people using their platform to sell stuff especially since it's so diverse. Great video I think it's the most concise take on this and your experience with previous creation software gives a clearer picture.
I was always in favor of monetization for creators in Dreams. My thoughts on that subject in the big monetization debate align with my opinions on my YT channel. Yes, it's a hobby. I'm going to do it anyway, but given the choice, why would I NOT want an extra $100-200/month in my pocket? But that aside, its a little wacky, in my mind, to not only expect creators to produce for free, but to demand that creators PAY to create. I think the worst decision made in regards to Dreams was focusing on VR instead of online multi. Its difficult to believe anyone thought that was a good idea.
Just putting it out there, as much as I love everyone's videos so far regarding this subject, I really appreciate your trademark incisiveness. Also I still go back to the far cry Creator because that's a community I've been around since 2007. It just breaks my heart to know that all I can do in that is basically edit mode. And the community is still there. I feel like Ubisoft probably doesn't even know the lights are still on for arcade, being so huge. The problem is none of the skills I learned on controller will ever translate to mouse and keyboard, except for the basic manipulation of primaries perhaps in sculpting, or a few more years I've got in practicing level design. My plan now is to use dreams as a proof-of-concept tool to hopefully get hired as an environment designer at a different indie company. It just makes me sick that dreams has been reduced to PowerPoint in that regard, despite being the most fun and engaging creation tool I've ever tried, despite the steep learning curve. I hope to see you stay creative and wanted to thank you for all the tutorials that kept me from banging my head on my burning hot, jet engine of a PlayStation😂❤🎉😢
Right now my YT channel is my hobby, and I have a lot going on right now trying to find work. I'm looking forward to a time when I can get back into creative platforms. Might be a few years, though, unfortunately. I am positive, though, that no matter what I end up doing, I'll find Dreams alum there. I learned to let go from my experience with Project Spark. Hung in there until the bitter end and beyond. I avoided all of that this time around and feel much better about how I parted with Dreams. Happy to be of service with the tuts.
@@LucidStew 🤕🤧ngl. This news hurts like a mother. Truly do hope I see you out there in a few years nmw you have cooking. ✌️
Dreams feels more like an introduction to game developing in the form of a simple to understand format a experience of what is like to be a game developer and all the struggles development hells and hurtles developers go through.
There NEEDS to be more videos like this out there about Dreams! I feel like there's so much more out there imo.
It’s such a shame it’s going away I loved this game and would check on it occasionally just to see what’s new. I could never wrap my head around how to create anything, though I had rough ideas on what I wanted to make, and now that it’s going away is saddening. Farewell, Dreams, you were a strange way to look into other’s minds. Loved you all.
That being said they should put it on PC, and use the income from that to keep both versions alive and promote it. Or go back to the drawing board and make something similar yet more accessible for casuals such as myself. I wanted to create things and I could never get to.
I don't think your chance is too far around the corner. Give someone 5 years to refine the AI and package it all up.
@@DonkeyFilms *cough cough* so uh *cough* you could have that if they DIDN'T FUCKING SELL LITTLE BIG PLANET
Losing Alex was a massive signal for me. Though I will always hurt. I'm sure when I'm ready I'll get back in there and continue trying to create my tank that will never be. I've spent years trying to make this thing work but it doesn't matter I just enjoy working on it from time to time. I thought for sure we'd get PSVR 2 support. So glad I didn't buy the PS5 and PSVR2. Dreams would have been the only reason for me to do so. Dreams was the only reason I bought a PS4 and PSVR. A handful of other games were a bonus but I didn't need them. I did need Dreams.
Same. Bought the PS4 and PSVR for Dreams. Didn't really like VR, though. :D I was waiting for a PS5 update to pull the trigger on the new hardware. Still no PS5 for me, probably never will be. As I recall they had Alex working on server stuff and as a graphics and sound geek that could not stand. Glad for him that he found a place at Nvidia. Its a bummer so many had to move on. It's a very different Media Molecule now than the one I first experienced 7 years ago.
@@LucidStew yeah it kind of went from 0 to 60 with we're just here for you to create, we love your work, we're working on multiplayer, all the smoke and mirrors for something I think they knew a long time ago was Dead on arrival. It's a shame it had to be the most amazing piece of software ever.
@@baddreams3850 Project Spark was same. DOA, they finished up the major parts of the product backlog and called it a day. I think the exception is that Sony wanted to see if adding full VR support would boost the PSVR.
@@LucidStew It is a real waste to let all those years of hard work just go. Even starting a new project, they could use their own Dreams engine while building out features and updates to it for their next project. While also building in a way for not just themselves but other devs to export their projects. At least for smaller indie like games.
They could also have decided to build that tie in game something like LBP, called it Dreams 2 or something else to start fresh sales and have a revenue stream.
Alas at least I can still have fun with Dreams until my PS Moves or PS4 die.
@@LucidStew exactly. Kind of a wash as well as to who can VR and enjoy it, and those that don't jive for whatever reason with VR. I totally understand not getting into it, but for those of us who love VR, dreams was the only thing in the world we knew of that could create VR games with such ease. The VR side is truly revolutionary, creating in a metaphysical space still sounds crazy but I absolutely love it. I recommend not using the moves and just use the DualShock imo. Can't believe they used them for VR. Such a facepalm.
Edit: the creation is amazing with moves, just meant the gameplay.
Tremendous video! What an autopsy of what could have been...
I still play it every day
Your videos were helpful when I found Dreams, what feels like about 3 years ago now. Been a while since I was on, as well.
A bit sad to see the Dreams era come to an end, and worse seeing that Mm have almost moved on already.
I'm one trophy away from Platinum if I remember right. Might fire up the PS4 and try to get it before September.
It may very well have been 3 years. No kidding, I've been making Dreams videos since 2016! You can see in the video I'm only something like 42% on the achievements. I always thought that was funny. I probably spent about 10,000 hours on the thing. Didn't play it right, though. :D
Great video Stew! Sad and very true. Lost potential with Dreams. I will still keep updating my latest Dream - The Arbornaut, but feel pretty uninspired to create anything new.
I think the remaining option is to be tightly involved with the community. There will be a few thousand people that will ride this train all the way to the end of the tracks. I did that with Project Spark. I posted my last PS YT video a year after the servers went dark.
The creative mode on this game *tool pretty much cured a hard depression I was going through, I grew extremely fond of the game and I think it's extremely sad that it didn't really take off as the developers wanted to.
for the last year or so i have been really worried about dreams' future, for exactly all the same reasons you share in this video. upsetting to be validated on it.
End of development is a death knell no matter how you slice it. The question now is how long live services will continue. With Project Spark, community support was in place until just before the servers went dark, although activity had dwindled near the end. SOMEONE will use Dreams as long as it exists, though. I can tell you that much.
This is a title that always interested me, I just never wanted to pick it up on a console where I would be forced to create complex projects with a GAMEPAD. I could only see myself using it with mouse + keyboard.
That's also why I never touched Mario Maker and got Levelhead instead.
Minus some technical issues I really liked using the DS4 with the creation engine. Given my experience with keyboard-mouse and other similar 3D creator spaces, I'd honestly pick the controller.
I actually left Dreams when I started studying computer science. Dreams was also the reason I started it. If I had only had the prospect of making some extra money with Dreams, I would still be all in. As a program, Dreams is still unbeatable in my opinion. The tools are so precise that they actually have no place on a console with all its limitations. I'm convinced that despite AI, the concept of Dreams has a chance of success, but I've also learned over the years that it's often the little things that bring down those with big ambitions.
It definitely would have been nice to get some revenue from creating. I mean, I did make a LITTLE money from Dreams. On the order of $125 I think, but the time in was so absurd compared to the reward that the reward may as well have not existed. I also promoted the crap out of the title to no personal gain. It makes a person think twice about why they're doing such things.
With this concept, it takes so long to build it and it needs continual maintenance and upgrade to the point that AI will be doing a lot of these things long before something like Dreams could come around again. I don't see how hand-crafters could possibly rise above that fray en masse.
@@LucidStew You're probably right that AI will be faster. However, people will still have the need to create something with their hands simply because it brings happiness, and I believe that requires more than just a few prompts. Who knows what awaits us. It probably won't take a decade like the development of Dreams.
@@schrottmaker1463 I agree with that, I just don't think those people will need for all the hands-on tools to come together in one place.
In my opinion Dreams should've been LittleBigPlanet4. Media Molecule should've developed a fully-fledged campaign akin to that of previous LBP games but with the Dreams engine. Just the premise of Sackboy making his great comeback would have brought great attention to the game, and since many of the logics and tools when it comes to creating games comes directly from LBP, the series' veterans wouldn't have felt left out at all.
Will we be able to post our dream creations still when dreams goes out
Yes. For now it is only new development that is ending. Since this is supposed to happen in September, that probably means one more update. After that the servers will still be live for an undetermined amount of time and you will be able to play Dreams, and post new content.
They say history repeats itself, sounds like I was listening to a story about little big planet.
1. Make the Dreams engine free.
2. Start commercializing the best titles and putting up for purchase on the PS Store.
3. Give Mm a cut, and give the creators a cut.
Why was that so hard?
It’s so frustrating because Dreams even still today is incredible, with abilities other game engines may never see. It would be a sad loss if all this amazing work just dies.
I love it man. I hope we get a brand new one for PS5 someday and that one ends up being a hit hopefully
Please, if there is anyone out there that has the money to buy Dreams IP. I ask you do so and find a way to port it over to PC, then make it moddable. Then your work can be done as 100s and maybe even 1000s of modders can get a hold of Dreams and add a ton of mods to add the functionalities we all want. The thing I loved about the logic is it is visual. At first it had a steep learning curve, but after a decent amount of TH-cam videos you can quickly get over that hump. Even if you watch a logic tutorial about one thing, often times you learn like 10 other things in the process and eventually you understand how the tools work. I hop into UE5 and try to pick up the logic and I am completely lost. Plus Dreams does something UE5 doesn’t. It is an all-in-one software platform for all of the things you described early in the video. This is why I love it. I don’t have to buy an expensive audio mixer, 3D sculptor software, animation software, learn C++ or other difficult programming languages, etc. I can do everything needed within Dreams to make my ideas a reality. Problem is, it was 2-3 features away from being the ultimate tool. I don’t even get why they didn’t activate co-op multiplayer. Those don’t require servers to run. All you would have to do is set it up so that other people connect to a private lobby that can be ran on the host’s console. (Much like how you can connect to a private chat room lobby in the PlayStation messages tab). They should have at least done this with up to 4 people. Then they could have dropped new content support.
Dreams for ps5 and psvr2 would of boosted sales considerably . Dreams was amazing even on ps4 and psvr as I didn’t even really need to purchase anymore games except for a few must have titles and the experiences were unique and some on par or even better visually than on other commercial games and I love mystical experiences in vr and short experiences and games suit me down to a T as I don’t have time to spend hours playing through long winded games . Am going to personally contact media molecule and see what they might be doing about this and if people like myself complain to them you never know . They could of made it into a big platform like steam and TH-cam where content creators could be sponsored and donations etc and this would of reality opened it all up and there would of been more of an incentive for people to create on there and thus develop better experiences especially with the power of ps5 and eventually ps5 pro and psvr2 . I just hope they don’t go further and pull the servers on us as well as that would surely be a bad day especially for me lol
I agree that Online Multiplayer was the biggest downfall. I'm a huge fan of VR, and enjoyed the VR Tools, but they really should have done online multiplayer first. So mamy people say PC would have "saved" Dreams, but a PC release didn't save Project Spark, and games like GMod show how much a creative PC Game relies on very strong multiplayer tools. As soon as PC Creators see that they cant import outside audio, can't import outside PNGs or videos, and can't make stronger games because of the PS4 level thermometer, all the benefits die down.
I've been with your channel since the Dreams Newsletter dropped, and jts a shame that so much has fallen so soon. Keep up the good fight 👍
Project Spark's online multi play implementation was a mystery because it was SO bad, like someone took a time machine back to 1999 to get the implementation. Yeah, people think PC is the answer, but Dreams would get so hammered without online multi. At a minimum you'd need a good solid online multi implementation and the ability to iterate to more powerful hardware. In hindsight, there being no PS5 update concurrent with the PS5 release was probably the beginning of the end.
I just hope Elca can finish his Avatar game before the servers are shut down. Would be a huge waste of time for Elca.
it is still breakig my heart to witness this mistake sony is doing. another corporation another stupid decision. and we cant even change it
Yeah, I ended up getting a little nostalgic putting together the "we'll all look back fondly on that time when we Dreamed of a magical place where we played, shared, and created by our own hands." part of the script. This video is one of my final acts of letting go. It was really great around 2019-2020 with all the discovery and working with Dreams Guild, and I miss those times.
Makes me want to take the biggest rock I can find and crush my head with it. Dreams was supposed to be amazing, now it dies and will be forgotten forever.
Well, it wasn't going to last forever anyway. This is the 10th year of development. What a story...
Dreams for ps5 and psvr2 would of boosted sales considerably . Dreams was amazing even on ps4 and psvr as I didn’t even really need to purchase anymore games except for a few must have titles and the experiences were unique and some on par or even better visually than on other commercial games and I love mystical experiences in vr and short experiences and games suit me down to a T as I don’t have time to spend hours playing through long winded games . Am going to personally contact media molecule and see what they might be doing about this and if people like myself complain to them you never know . They could of made it into a big platform like steam and TH-cam where content creators could be sponsored and donations etc and this would of reality opened it all up and there would of been more of an incentive for people to create on there and thus develop better experiences especially with the power of ps5 and eventually ps5 pro and psvr2 . I just hope they don’t go further and pull the servers on us as well as that would surely be a bad day especially for me lol
If the idea of Dreams is too grandiose, then i fear for gaming and the next generation.
The problem with Dreams, many of which you hit spot on, but mostly Media Molecule was the problem. Good creatives but terrible marketers, and not really connected to gamers or even the general population. They are niche and live in an echo chamber, thus their product similarly confined. They needed a larger more community driven company to partner with (or take them over) and really give them direction on how to appeal to gamers and the mainstream. They should have stayed as developers and left the business side to more competent people.
I am actually a new Dreams player. Bought the game in 2020, thought it was a revolutionary undertaking, but lost interest with the learning curve and the absence of proper tutorials (A massive turn off). Begin 2023, I decided to come back and literally fell in love with the tools... then the announcement dropped.
As it stands, while your video is the perfect autopsy of Dreams failure, I pray the Universe for another couple of years of online servers: the Dreamiverse (while flawed in its browsing tools) is PACKED with outstanding creative achievements that make it a cultural and social experiment with way too many creations worth preserving.
Turning those servers down would be the equivalent of burning a priceless library or a museum filled with loads of garbage (true) but also hundred of gygabytes of fascinating artistic insights and expressions.
The real shame is that there's no way to archive that and no way to access it once they finally pull the plug. Unless Sony mercifully comes up with a forever plan, all things made in Dreams will vanish outside of video archive.
I didn't know that you could do stop motion animation style in dreams; I realized about it from a video by the same media Molecule in youtube, but the way the man achieved this, blew my mind not only for the process but also for the hard-impossible-IQ 10000000 thinking process that you have to have for your own to reach that. Many times I tried to think "wooooww how did he/she/they do that art, effect..." and simply got stuck and frustrated at no solving the points. TH-cam was the real teacher for me in dreams and thanks to all the youtube content and dreams youtubers I could saw with better hope eyes the potential of dreams for my projects and my ideas. Totally true. There are many creative process that surely are not for the casual creators. Other issue that was frustating to me is that the painting mode doesn't have a tool for draw perfect curves but the sculpture mode yes, but is not the same... Uhhhhhh It was very annoying
Which is interesting because the stop-motion ability is a built-in feature. This goes back to the part of the video where I'm talking about empowering the users with better community tools. If we had those, it would have been so much easier for someone like you to interact with someone like me. Even if I didn't know something, I could have referred you to someone else. As it stands, that mostly only happens on Twitter, Reddit, and YT comments, so its a pain. You can draw perfect circles with paint fairly easily, just turn on the grid, stamp fleck, clone fleck and rotate 90 degrees, translate to pi/2 away, create inner clones to close the gap, repeat 3 more times. From there you can scale it to any purpose.
Oh man thanks for tour comment!!!!. I have not tried this method yet, You just gave a spark of hope on this problem. Thaaaaanks!!
What is the dream at 0:32 ?
That's from an early B-roll. I think that may have been a precursor to Vecta Majoris.
I just want another company to copy its full feature set and make it a pc game engine platform.
I hope media molecule considers changing their minds last second
I don't see it. Many people important to Dreams left Mm.
This is how the game could of been good you split the game up with sections like Racing, Platformer, art, movies. Same with creation they should of gave us tools and preset maker to make a race track and so on
Agreed, but look at something like ninjuana's SuperGP Kit. It's still not super easy to use and even less so to customize. Its very difficult to make an easy version of something this complex and retain the flexibility of the complex version.
Dreams should have always been sold as a development kit, with a free to use Dreams Player in the PSN marketplace on release day.
Expecting people to pay $60, just to play a series of janky test demos with no guarantee of ever getting finished, is delusional.
This really sucks because Dreams could have been a Playstation-Exclusive Roblox.
I dont understand why Sony couldn't pack in Dreams with ps5 for free could of marketed as the must have game and they let it go this game alone would have sold ps5s
I know a lot of people thought this. I do think Sony needed to think farther out of the box than they did. Sony should have supported this as a continuing development environment from the beginning, like UE or Unity, but specifically for hobbyists. I guess they though of it as more of a game title rather than a feature of the platform like it could have been. This also works into the IP angle. If you make it a platform thing and monetize online multi play, you can leverage ALL of your first-party IPs to rake in cash.
@@droid4d279 Yep. Dreams should have been just a feature of PS5. They could have built an entire online community around it, as a kind of PlayStation Home 2.0 It would have self sustained and possibly opened doors to other possibilities and set them apart in the console world.
Oh, I was just thinking about getting into it
I can't really speak to what is going on right now. I haven't used it in a while. It still exists, but last time I check usage was weak. It's not SO bad if you're making games and can get cherry picked for feature. People were still playing featured games at an ok clip last time I checked.
They spent 10 years creating the game then when they reached the finished line they through it in the bin, hard to get excited about any of their future upcoming projects if this is their mindset.
In defense of the current Mm, a lot of people in major positions in development have left.
I suspect Mm will be shut down in under 2 years.
Dreams will continue, but updates to the product will discontinue
But you have to understand that stagnant software is essentially dead. It will never improve on any front once development is over. Meanwhile, other active, competing software will improve continuously.
Even though I thought it was an amazing tool, I knew it wasn't going to be a big hit after roughly the first week. For some of the reasons you listed, mostly the point about your average gamer isn't trying to do something so time consuming with little reward. Really, most PEOPLE wouldn't want to do that, me included.
One place I think they went wrong was not catering to players AT ALL. They were never going to have a million people creating consistently, so the other 950,000 need a reason to come back. It needed online multi for replayability. There were no player events, no tournaments. You should have been able to create clubs for games or creators or genres. If there had been a competent social aspect, like minded players could have made friends in Dreams and played together. Basically it was just assumed people would play stuff and that's that. Big opportunity missed.
@@LucidStew 💯
Dreams needed online multiplayer and a PC/multiplatform release bad. Too bad that'll never happen now.
I don't know that it NEEDED a PC version, but it DID need online for there to BE a PC version. Do all that, leave the base PS4 behind and I think it buys itself a future. But still, you need to find a way to drive revenue.
Emulation?
BRO WHAT THE HECK I LITERALLY JUST BOUGHT THE GAME AND NOW I SEE THIS
Oh, you didn't know? That's rough. Still fun to play though.
Saying Dreams has a learning curve is very disingenuous knowing how much larger the learning curve is for other software such as Blender, Unity, Unreal. It takes time to learn how to develop in these technologies… Dreams might be the top platform when it comes to the many features it offers such as a comfortable UI, plenty of included tutorials, and overall ease of use. Beats anything else on the market.
My opinion on the matter in not disingenuous in the slightest, which makes me think that you do not know the meaning of the word. That it is better or easier than other extremely difficult-to-learn tools does not mean that it doesn't have a daunting learning curve for people who want to casually play something.
So what you’re telling me is that the tools dreams give us are so good, that they couldn’t make money off of it because it was ACTUALLY FINISHED. Damn.
Also I’m specifically talking about the tools for creation not like the multiplayer side of things and such
I don't think its possible to make money on a continuing basis from game creation software unless there is a way for creators to monetize their output. Then the developer could take a cut. That's why players carry the successful non-professional platforms. I'm not sure what you mean by it being finished. You don't really ever finish game creation software. You'd move on to the next version, like UE3,4,5, but those are never really done.
@@LucidStew The point I was trying to make was that all of the tools to make a game and more was already readily available WITH TUTORIALS since day one, which is unlike the other games that don’t even come out finished. They could always add more tools etc. but there i just don’t see any way of monetizing the game that is good enough without having an active fan base which is really sad. Sorry for the confusion mate.
@@jonasblanco2676 Oh yeah, it's an awesome set of tools if you can get past the learning curve and the imp drift. This is one other thing. There are now thousands of people who sunk ungodly amounts of time into a dead platform. No one made any money off of it with the exception of maybe 10 people. The other 99.9% now have 3 years experience in a non-transferable skill because Dreams is so weirdly different. And a certain percentage of those are so lost now that they're planning to go down with the ship. So it's even worse than just the company never figured out how to properly monetize it.
@@LucidStew The problem was that they dangled the carrot of monetization, which gave too many people delusions of grandeur. Dreams is a great hobby passtime and tool, but lets be honest, i have not found a single creation in Dreams that i would have paid for. Lots of fun interesting stuff. There's a reason none of these creators are making any money using the supposedly easier pc tools. It should have been clear day 1, this is just for fun.
I love ps4 dreams sad to see it go
Sad.
It's free this month so for all I care the Dreams are still alive!!!
Development hasn't ended yet, so it is still alive. For a month, anyway...
If it had marketing, multiplayer, and something to not feel like you were wasting your time learning the system and making stuff it would get popular and lived on. Dreams is dead.
Yep, unfortunately it is doomed.
They should put it on pc, like sony is doing with a lot of their other games. PC would keep the community alive since a lot of other user-friendly creation software is popular on there like RPG Maker and stuff.
My personal opinion on that is that it would get hammered on PC for lack of online multi. Beyond that, I think Sony is done messing with it.
@@LucidStew Not realy. Dreams is a good box of tools, even if not for making the entire game, on pc it could had been used to make music, animations, game assets, 3d printing objects, book novels and even video games. On console? Nahhhhh
I bought Dreams, actualy had preorder. I bought a psvr with the ball controlls just becouse of dreams. I tryed and i knew... it will not even stand a chance for 10 years. On PC maybe... not on consoles.
@@IAcePTI But it would be the same thing that's not working... only on PC. Why would it then magically work? I mean, yeah, if you made it into something different that DID work on PC, then it would probably work. Essentially all I'm saying is that in order to work on PC, it would need online multi.
@@LucidStew because on pc you can use it as a tool with other programs… not like on consoles
🫤
This was Sonys fault not media Molecule
The aim of the video is not to lay blame on anyone, but Media Molecule is not free of contribution here. Announcing the title along side the Playstation 4 and then delivering it only 6 months before the release of the PS5 in less than ideal condition was certainly part of the equation.
No. Sony absolutely could've helped, but this is entirely on Mm. This is their product, their business model, or lack of.
No, PS4 Version Dreams Will Shut Down
Imagine if Dreams came to PC... thats all i have to say
I think it would get killed for not having online multi. If you think about all the things that the community could do to prop up and resurrect the idea, like DreamsCom 2023, they'd have 1,000 times more weight if people could simply play together online.