How is Sonic Planetary if he even beat a Planetary character? Its not like stats are relative to each other in Sonic like it is in DB, Sonic defeating something with weak durability doesnt exactly make him Planetary, Im not the best at scaling but this guy scales so weirdly, if I defeat a slow ass Mike Tyson whos as durable as a baby with bone cancer then does that make me Prime Mike Tyson level? And why does he just outright ignore the fact Kid Goku is Planetary level? Its so strange to me how he just ignores the giant ass holes in his scaling while also ignoring Gokus feats or scaling, its also notable that even Super Sonic could not defeat a Planetary being in frontiers as it was outright stated, so with all this negative feats, why does he just ignore these glaringly obvious holes?
THIS is how vs battle videos should be made. Snappy editing, solid tracks, factual statements,counter-arguements. Great work Six. Genuinely entertaining and informative
I think an important thing to note about Modern Sonic is that he beat Perfect Chaos in base, and he needed Super Sonic to beat him in Adventure, which either implies Perfect Chaos is weaker now for some reason or Sonic got a Super Form level increase from Adventure to Generations. Edit: Rip the editor lmao
One cool detail supports your latter hypothesis which is Sega insistence on "Sonic gets stronger with every game" going back to the Classic Era where they insisted by Sonic 2, Sonic has gone faster than ever than during Sonic 1. This can be seen as physical growth, but later on in the series, it's just stated Sonic when serious just has endless amount of growth that can be amount to getting 2x stronger with every minute which already is broken when stacking with limitless speed and Sonic somehow able to amp that up since the Classic Era.
He also beat emerl who not only had all the emeralds, every character in the games battle data (meaning he was basically a super sonic, shadow, amy, knuckIes, etc) but he beat him in base and in 30 seconds.
But can you really scale Perfect Chaos to some of these other threats or was Super Sonic just that much over Perfect Chaos or that version of Super Sonic and thus Sonic say got strong enough later to beat a PErfect Chaos who sort of didn't compare to later threats?
When sonic fought infinite in a rematch and sonic beat him infinite asked how did he become so strong and sonic says he grows every second so sonic’s potential is insane
0:00 - Tekken Tag Tournament 2 Piano Intro Massive Mix 1:35 - Tekken Tag Tournament Ending Music 4:01 - Sonic Unleashed - Windmill Isle (Day) 6:23 - Tekken 6 OST: Electric Fountain (Karma) 8:49 - Tekken: Dark Resurrection - Hall of Fate 14:48 - Undertale OST - Another Medium 22:56 - Dragon Ball FighterZ OST Cell's Theme 27:54 - Guilty Gear Strive - Smell Of The Game (Main Theme)
Mario is pretty fucking op too tho, luigi and him beat a reality warping bowser and a satanic star, and a bunch of demigods and eldritch creatures if counting paper mario
@Thatitalianlameguy when nintendo characters aren't used as a way to please fans after losses like knuckles vs dk and sonic vs Mario they are quite the underrated underdogs.
My guy, I'm sorry, but nine times out of ten, Mario claps Sonic. He's reacted to faster and has on a multitude of occasions been shown to be able to anticipate and avoid attacks executed in frozen time. Let me repeat that: Mario can read and preemptively dodge attacks that are performed _when time _*_isn't moving._* That kind of reaction time is almost as ludicrous as Popeye being able to occupy two places at once and fight himself. Not being as fast as Sonic doesn't even _matter_ at that stage, and he's got him outclassed in strength, experience and versatility by default. Couple that with a vastly larger arsenal and more continuous and regular cosmic feats, and it's in the bag. Hell, Mario survived being sucked into the epicenter of a supermassive black hole that destroyed the universe, followed by a new big bang. Mario was in ground zero of the death and rebirth of existence, _and he was fine._ That's not even the RPGs, that is a mainline platformer feat.
Chaos Energy seems to be arguably the most broken source of power in fiction. Like, to go from base Sonic to Super Sonic is like going from an obese and jobless reddit moderator to Soul King-absorbed Yhwach Bach in a few seconds, you can't make this shit up.
It truly is. The original concept of the Super form was to be a reward for the player for taking the effort of going for completion by collecting the 7 Chaos Emeralds, like it's telling us: "great job, here, for your hard work YOU BECOME GOD for the final stomp". And it's great
And the fact that is canon that Sonic CAN grow in power fast enough to surpass or at least match previous super forms with generations where he fought enemies that he previously needed a super form to even have a chance (perfect Gaia,and the biolizard),so you could Argue that current Sonic is stronger than 06 super Sonic,maybe even unleashed super Sonic,why? Because A,he already had +6 months of getting power thanks to fórces,and all the stuff inbetween this Game and frontiers (team Sonic Racing,the IDW comics and stuff) And then,in frontiers Sonic gets a "potential unleashed" treatment in frontiers thanks to the hermit and Elder kocos,like if level 1 Sonic in frontiers,is already kind of superior to forces Sonic,then what the heck is level 99 Sonic?,hell the end powered Sonic Up along the adventure with various tecniques,so Sonic becoming stronger in frontiers is pretty much canon
Also- according to Sonic Team when making the Classic Era, Chaos Energy on its own is Omnipresent, and acts as an Super-Substance that gives energy to everything within Sonic's Universe before the Universe was later opened up into an vast and open-ended Cosmology. Super Sonic literally can never run out of Chaos Energy if just siphoning it from the Air while the Emeralds have the same energy magnified by an infinite fold. Sort of the reason why why 1 Emerald can just stop Space-Time while 2x Emeralds just manipulate Concepts freely such as Time Travel paradox-free.
Not really, things like plot manipulation, mathematical manipulation etc do that just better Correct me if I'm wrong but that would be a source of power right?
Also, fun thing to note; Archie Comics sonic can be measured to have immeasurable speed as during the Mega Man crossover, time was stopped and sonic was still able to move, similar to sonic generations' "white space" and the whole not having time thing.
Easy mistake regarding terminology: Infinite Speed: Can travel an infinite distance in any amount of time. Inaccessible Speed: Can move even when time is stopped or otherwise completely absent.
Sonic having space time erasure resistance actually makes sense because if he didn't have that resistance, everytime he would move faster than space time, his atomic structure would probably be burned up
Then I’m trying to figure of why people still debating when sonics creator said he can’t beat goku 💀💀 dude said this a awhile ago yet TH-camrs still be trying to over rule it like it’s they character and they know better then the creator
Sonic's feats become a bit more impressive when you realize that Sonic took a beating multiple times in Sonic and the Black Knight while trying to fight the Dark Queen in his base form while wielding Caliburn. Even after Caliburn *shattered in two* Sonic was still willing to fight back no matter what, which eventually resulted in the lost power of Excalibur returning causing Caliburn's broken remains and Sonic himself to power up into Excalibur and Excalibur Sonic respectively after the three Sacred Swords were used to assist Sonic. Adding on to that, the game prior in the Storybook duology, Sonic and the Secret Rings has Sonic facing up against and then *defeating* Erazor Djinn, the Genie of the Lamp, *while at death's door* thanks to the Flame of Judgement Erazor originally tried to cast at Shahra and is constantly *draining his LIFE FORCE* and *is almost GONE* by the time he uses the White World Ring of Wishes to open the doors to the Night Palace and was most likely fading away even more while running through the floating palace considering Sonic half jokingly asks Erazor to add a bit more to the Flame of Judgement still stuck on his chest. Adding even more on top that, Sonic once got infected with the Metal Virus, a liquid metallic substance that turns any and all living things into machines. During a scuffle with two Zombots (a term coined by Sonic) Sonic himself was infected while fighting them and unfortunately kept making it worse by fight more and more Zombots head on. He was able to his speed to run off the infection, but eventually it was starting to fail after multiple physical contacts with Zombots and he could only hold it back at that rate. Eventually at the final issue of the Zombot arch Sonic almost fully succumbs to the Metal Virus only for Sonic to turn Super and literally burn it off and with the help of Super Silver and another reality warping gem known as the Warp Topaz, sends every last ounce of the Metal Virus to the f*cking Sun but unfortunately Sonic winds up in the Sol Dimension for an undisclosed amount of time. And before anyone tries to correct me saying the events that take place in the IDW Sonic comics aren't canon, Sonic makes a reference to the comics by mentioning Tangle the Lemur, an IDW Sonic character and the IDW Sonic comics follow the same events as the games as the previously mentioned Tangle first appeared in issue 4 of the IDW Sonic comics which follows the aftermath of Sonic Forces, a mainline entry in the Sonic franchise. (Sticks the Badger is also mentioned in the ending.) And also, Tangle and Whisper (another IDW Sonic character) appear in Sonic Dash and Sonic Forces: Speed Battle as playable characters. Also, never piss Sonic off. Dude broke the *sound barrier FOUR TIMES in a ROW* in issue 42 all because The Deadly Six thought they were clever with attacking Restoration HQ while no one strong or capable enough was around. If Sonic didn't know how to control his speed I'm pretty sure The Deadly Six would just be The Dead Six because I shutter to think about what the impact of the force behind Sonic would be like after he stopped moving.
@@gamingwithjay9728 That's true, but was with the help of the Avatar character via Double Boost. But that being said, Double Boost itself technically first appeared in Generations 3DS at the end of the Time Eater fight when both Super Sonics combined their powers to unleash the stronger Boost which completely obliterates any attacks the Time Eater sends to the hedgehogs. Even though Classic Sonic never learned the Boost itself until the ending of the game. The positions of Classic Super Sonic and Modern Super Sonic even match up with the Double Boost positions the Avatar and Modern Sonic are in during the technique! And considering neither Classic Sonic or the Avatar character have the Boost in their moveset, even though it was teased that Classic Sonic might have some variation of the Boost in the teaser reveal trailer and both iterations of Classic Sonic (Console/PC & 3DS) learn the Homing Attack in Generations regardless of which version you're playing, it might be possible Sonic can share the Chaos Energy he uses to Boost with other people who interact with him or help him out. I mean, in both Sonic Heroes and Sonic The Hedgehog (2006) Super Sonic transfers Chaos Energy to Tails and Knuckles in Heroes and Shadow and Silver in '06 to allow the respective duos to go Super. Although in the case Tails and Knuckles they gain odd Shields that mimic what the Super Transformation is like.
@@ulquiorracifer__ And typically in a DRAGONBALL debate, these are the same people who will use non-canon feats and/or characters when they feel they are losing a debate
Forgot to mention one thing about the Emerl feat. Emerl has also absorbed all 7 Chaos Emeralds over the course of Sonic Battles story, so during the time Emerl and Sonic fight, Emerl has the power of the Chaos Emeralds and the excess energy of the supposedly multi-star level Final Egg Blaster, and Sonic beat him in 30 seconds.
@@AVAgustusCeaser yes, full power emerl has access to every single skill available in the game, meaning he can perfectly replicate everyones fighting style.
The amount of work that has been put in this video makes me realize that we don’t deserve six, he’s just the GOAT when it comes to these types of videos
@@TheMadPickler01 Kid Buu was more "dangerous" because of his being pure evil, not stronger but he is right about Kid Buu having the power to destroy a galaxy in an instant, it was stated many times that the universe would be destroyed if they lost.
I mean is he wrong i think that attack would eradicate Ichigo aizen black box only disrupt it and grim also did the same time while that attack straight up erases or tears it apart
It's criminal how under utilized Hyper Sonic is. I remember the exhilaration I got when I first achieved this form playing Sonic as a kid. Only to be let down that it never came back or at least to my knowledge it hasn't
I'm pretty sure it was only mande because of the fact that Sonic & Knuckles, and Sonic 3 being separate games, so that they could have a reason for the players to collect the chaos emeralds in both games
@@christopherford39 Pretty sure the director for the game said that Hyper isn't coming back (didn't say why, probably because of the massive power increase that they wouldn't realistically be able to fit well into the story) BUT they did say that they wanted to give Sonic some new kind of form soon... so a possible Cyberspace-powered form could be happening.
@@lukasruston8618Love the fact you basically predicted new Sonic Frontier events for the new update without realizing it lol, and in all seriousness I don’t think Hyper Sonic should even be battle applicable for Sonic anymore simply due to the fact since its officially stated never being able to come back into the series, and even making sure they made up lore event to not be able to return because they’re in another place entirely, more than shows imo this form was a one off thing in the classic run and shouldn’t even be canon let alone scaled and calculated since its a boost too large to even be consistent for Sonic lore, and plus I like Sonic’s new Cyber Space Super Form anyway, its boost is kinda massive in its own right, despite us not truly knowing what it brings to the table, but hey at least its canon and can be used ☠️(even tho it might be a one off form)
I love when Six talks about scaling outside the naruto verse. Dude is most knowledgeable on Naruto of course but its cool seeing him scale other verses
You forgot to mention that Emerl was also being powered by the 7 chaos emeralds, which merge entire universes together with the sol emeralds. Making Base Modern Sonic arguably Universal + as a highball. He also defeats Perfect Chaos in base who would scale to this as well in base.
He isn't using them to their full reality warping capabilities tho, just as a power source, which means he should have enough energy to split the planet apart with ease and destroy stars
@OzSkeeOz Sonic would easily destroy Goku then since the only major power boost Goku would have is Kaio-Ken and he can't use that for prolonged periods nor is it anywhere close to the level of Super Saiyan.
I like how prime showed us that sonic only knows the most basic of fighting while relying more on his speed, while shadow has speed but also knows how to fight better and uses both to get the upper hand at first. This could give sonic a reason to actually learn how to fight from knuckles or even shadow himself later
@@devEdev1100 Not only Frontiers, but also Sonic Battle and Sonic the Fighters as well. And that one little segment in Forces where Sonic just beats the brakes off Zavok.
But looking at the games specifically secret rings base sonic there is arguably stronger than all 3 super hedgehogs in 06 which is were shadow and silver peak,being that strong really doesn't encourage learning fighting styles.
Not sure if you'll see this comment but it is important to note that the spin off games are canon to the main Sonic continuity based off of the comment made in Generations where he mentions several spin offs. There might be some scaling there that could upgrade Sonic.
You could say the same for both sides, like if we include some of the feats he didn’t mention like Goku shaking the void with his existence alone. Or sonic outrunning nullspace with someone with him
Sonic in base has demonstrated Universal - Multiversal scaling with Secret Rings, Black Knight and more. He has more Universal or higher feats in base than star level ones I'd argue. I'd argue end of DB Goku to planet to large planet too. Good video overall, Six.
Not to mention that Sonic R has shown the Emeralds are able and contain their own Universe's which contain no trace of physics, are potentially endless and just a fraction of the Emeralds power which the Classic Era has built Classic Sonic has having surpass the power of an Emerald by Sonic 2. The series is vastly underrated, just one thing that comes to mind would be rapid and monstrous jumps in power such as how Mania Sonic after going through Forces was undeterred and stalemate Classic Metal who was Amped on the Master Emerald.
Maybe Sonic's got Universal and Multiversal Durability since in Base he survives hits from things like the Dark Queen (who most definitely is trying to kill him) and Time Eater (being Piloted by the Eggmen so it's most DEFINITELY trying to kill him), but I don't see it being for his AP.
@@sonicandshadowsjunction It was Sonic's AP when vastly weaken that did damage enough to basically blitz Erazor Djinn who was borderline close to Merlina's power by the end of the game without the World Rings.
@@marcxworld5708and his speed as being immensely faster than Buu since it’s stated in Secret Rings and implied in Black Knight that after Sonic’s adventures concluded in those respective worlds, he ran between universes to get back home, which, uh… I think running between universes that all have trillions and trillions of galaxies is faster than Buu moving through a single galaxy in a second or so.
you have no idea how long ive been thirsting for you to cover this. Ive never smiled so hard to seeing a video on my feed. I havent even watched the video but I know im gonna love it regardless. Six I love you so much you’re killing it. Please make more sonic related videos.
I'm gonna disagree with the Modern Base Sonic rounds because there are scans for Erazor Djinn that put him at multi-universal with a weakened Sonic beating him. It also doesn't make sense to use Kid Buu destroying a galaxy for both a destructive capacity feat and a speed feat. It has to be either/or.
There is two ways of scaling hyper Sonic,either he is x7 times super Sonic,or he is the super Sonic of súper Sonic (As in,if base Sonic is a 1,and súper Sonic is 1.000,hyper Sonic would be 1.000.000)
@@gabrielmachado1247 I go by a mixture of both to be honest. The Super Emeralds would be the Super Form version of the Emeralds since we see Robots, and Animals able to become Super which would hint that the only thing left would be objects which make the Super Emeralds fall into that category. I say 1 Super Emerald = 7x Chaos Emeralds which makes it an odd number of Hyper Form being 49x stronger than Super Form. This comes from how Archie Series has an Super Emerald able to let one achieve a Super Form implying both are somewhat equal in power. My headcanon simply includes the Master Emerald as its own supplying the Super Emeralds which makes 50x Super Sonic. It may sound limited, but this would be an multiplier of infinite-stats such as how spin-dash takes Sonic to his peak speed but moves like Peel Out, Light-Speed Dash or Boost are several folds faster than the regular spin dash. Also, in canon example would be Metal Sonic who matches Sonic's limitless speed but uses Maximum V Overdrive to go 4x faster than Sonic; who can keep up with Peel Out which is an older technique that would be surpassed by Sonic's growth and later techniques like Light-Speed Dash and Boost.
@@Rathalos2428 You can't really put a number on the chaos emeralds. They're stated that even a SINGULAIR chaos emerald has infinite power (that could either mean just infinite stats or just infinite power that could be withdrawn from) now imagine all 7. A singular super emerald is obviously stronger than the chaos emeralds combined, just imagine all 7 super emeralds.
@@RadicalBoiChris i think its kinda like enerjack. your only as strong as your imagination. seeing as sonic is only known for kicks, he really don't be using the power of super other than for the huge power boost
The craziest part is, Archie sonic (which is the comic version) is this strong in his base form and can scale up to outerversal with his super and ultra forms.
Cool video, had a lot of fun watching it. I do have some questions about the Buu Saga vs Modern Sonic section though. I haven't seen your other Sonic video, so if those answered my questions, I apologize in advance. 1. I remember Sonic beating Infinite by his lonesome about halfway through Forces, so would he still be amped by the power of friendship during that feat? It's not unheard of for Sonic to surpass previous versions of Super Sonic, we saw Generations Base Sonic defeat Perfect Chaos after all. 2. We've seen Sonic keep pace with space ships in Colors, so there's reason to believe he's faster that Dodon Pa's rocket ship that traveled in the quadrillions of times the speed of light. I know Buu saga characters can upscale from similar feats, but I figured it'd be worth bringing up. 3. You could argue immeasurable speed for Base Sonic since the CD guide you showed credits Sonic's speed for creating a time warp. You already talked about how "traveling through time and space" was metaphorical in Generations, but what about Sonic restoring time through speed? I'm not sure if I'd say that's just an ability since Sonic's speed is credited for the restoration, not any hax or special circumstance. I'm surprised you didn't mention Egg Reverie Zone and how its HUD timer was constantly jumping to different points in time, that'd at least scale to Super Sonic, but also Base Sonic since he only transformed after entering the zone. I understand inaccessible/immeasurable speed is weird for both Goku and Sonic since every piece of media featuring them shows time pass as they do things. But I suppose we can say the same thing for even lower speed scaling, like an MFTL+ Goku and Sonic would have no trouble crossing global distances in femtoseconds, yet the Broly Movie and Sonic Unleashed show them opting for plane travel instead. Same for many Attack Potency feats, even scaling both to Planetary levels would mean stomping a little hard would surface-wipe their worlds. Overall, the video was still good and I look forward to see what you make in the future.
What an absolute banger of a video! I love seeing people who normally scale anime or other specific genres attempt to branch out into different verses, it's a nice change of pase and gives less frequently scaled verses some deserved spotlight.
Archie Sonic 1 shots Goku. But if we're using Archie Sonic we also have to use Goku's other versions that 1 shot even Zeno and the Grand Priest. Hell, even Xeno Krillin 1 shots the Grand Priest and Zeno from the main timeline. And let's not bring out GFG, because he's 1 shotting Archie, since he's boundless and "above fiction" since he fused with a metaphysical version of the audience (which is all of us.) And as real people we're boundless.
There's a concept called Hypertime, basically it's when there's at least one other dimension of time, just like how Space has at least 3 dimensions. White Space doesn't have a 3-D time but there's still a higher plane of time. This also explains why Shadow can stop time in a place with no time
In the DBS anime, the hit timeskip statements are valid. The manga is the one that declares his timeskip doesn’t work really on people with higher strength. This isn’t the case in the anime as timeskip works even on SSBKK Goku later on and Hit is stated to not grow in actual strength at all. The timeskip shouldn’t even work nor the time cage at all against Jiren if the ki thing was just 100% valid. But I don’t think it changes much anyways
The timeskip still works on Goku, but since Goku has a higher PL it means that Goku has higher resistance to its effects. The higher pl you are than Hit the more resistance and then immunity you get
@@kanewilson8624 in the anime that’s not indicated at all. I’ll agree it’s written very poorly in the anime, but the whole higher power so you get resistance thing just isn’t really prevalent there. Hits timeskip at its weakest was still too much for Vegeta and Vegeta states that Hit lacks strength. Goku had to develop a skill counter (that doesn’t make too much sense) but hey, he did what he did.
Even if the Higher Power Level thing is how it works, it wouldn't really stop something like Chaos Control where it's shown to work on characters of equal strength. If Infinite's Phantom Clones are as strong as the originals as stated, then Shadow chaos controlling his clone and Sonic shows that their hax works regardless of strength so Goku's getting stopped regardless.
@@jayscription6376 They only won from their Universe rules while Chaos Emeralds have shown complete control beyond the Multiverse such as repairing Dimensions/Universes that are not part of Sonic's Timeline such as the Sol Dimension, MaginaryWorld and White Space.
basically he fought a super form opposite version of himself, and he figured out since he got boosted upon depowring down from super form, that opposite version of him would do the opposite, so he tricked him to exit super form together and got the upper hand
Your videos and the effort and personality you put behind them are off the charts in therms of quality and enjoyment. So much so that Im able to watch a 30min video about 2 characters I find boring and couldn't care less about.
Just one correction, Kid Buu is not the strongest form of Buu, that goes to Buuhan. Kid Buu was stated to be the most DANGEROUS form of Buu, given that he was out of the control and lacked intelligence.
This video proves that running a YT channel doesn't improve your arguments, no matter the followers count. This is just a below-average Reddit post with nice visuals. Read the sources for yourselves guys, and discuss with an open mind to find answers - not to prove a point. Otherwhise you'll get stuck with your convictions. Just like 99% powerscalers on YT.
So my bias for who would win between my childhood favourite anime character and childhood favourite game character was right??? But fr, this was a great matchup. The statements and counter-arguments all felt very factual and the scaling was top notch. Keep it up, Six. 👍
Saying Goku isn't even 5D until after the Broly movie is a pretty dumb take ngl especially since universe 7 is comprised of at the very least 8 different space-times (possibly even more if you count the realms in between dimensions like the void and Suguroku Space) with a good portion of them transcending space and time, the afterlife alone is stated multiple times in not only the guides but by the teams who worked on DB to be a higher dimensional realm over the mortal universe and that it transcends all of space and time and the totality of dimensionality which at bare minimum places it at 5D. It was also stated in the guides and V Jump magazines for BOG that Goku and Beerus's battle was "Super dimensional" and that even Beerus's power alone was "beyond dimensions", "super dimensional" on its own dosent mean much without proper context but the definition of the term usually just means "1+ dimensional" aka scaling 1 extra layer into dimensional power which means Goku in BOG can already be scaled to 6th dimensional levels of strength. There's also the fact that Infinite Zamasu (in the anime) engulfed all of Future Trunk's timeline and fused with the entirety of universe 7 (which is a multiversal sized realm) and grew so much to the point where his power seeped into multiple other timelines such as the present, this alone makes Infinite Zamasu 5D at bare minimum and Goku was confident he could have stopped him with a single Senzu Bean. Jiren also surpasses this version of Zamasu in his base form and is so powerful he can shake the entire World of Void just by walking which at bare minimum is a 5D construct because it transcends space and time, Goku later replicates this feat in UI just by powering up as well. There are many more arguments to be used but I'll disregard those for the sake of this comment not being too long. Overall there are many ways you can scale Goku to 6D+ levels of power and higher even at the start of super which I feel were kinda disregarded throughout most of this video.
I was scrolling looking for this comment. Bro legit downplayed Goku to wank the hedgehog. Maybe he just has knowledge on Sonic compared to Dragon Ball. He didn't even mention Granolah having a faster than instant speed feat and Goku scaling above that. Or Champa and Vados flying to the Kaioshin Realm instantly after being spied on by the kais in U7.
*In 2023 Game Sonic would still win in a fight against Goku, anime and manga, no debate* proof: Why Sonic definitely wins against goku, Destructive Capacity: In the Adventure Era, Super Sonic was able to defeat Perfect Chaos, who is powered by all the 7 Chaos Emeralds A single Chaos Emerald is able to break the World into seven parts, Multi-Continental to Large Planet DC So it would be no exaggeration to say that Perfect Chaos would also be Large Planet level, since the main reason to why Chaos lost it's because of his inability to harness the positive energy of the seven Chaos Emeralds Later in Sonic Generations, Sonic once again managed to defeat Perfect Chaos, but this time in his Base form, that's due to the constant progression in power that Sonic had, making Generations Base Sonic > SA1 Super Sonic = Large Planet level. In Sonic Unleashed, Base Sonic was able to cause massive damage to Dark Gaia. Dark Gaia is a being with limitless supply of energy due to being powered Chaos Energy which can destroy entire Planets to even Large Planets. In Sonic Lost World, Sonic managed to defeat the Eggrobo, a giant mech powered by the life energy of Sonic's world, who has been calculated to be Dwarf Star level In Sonic Adventure 2, Super Sonic, alongside Super Shadow, managed to defeat the Finalhazard, who had previously fused with the ARK via Chaos Energy also powered by it which can destroy entire planets and pierce through stars. Star level Super Sonic Later in Sonic & The Black Knight, Sonic manages to defeat a Dragon which he compares it to the Final Hazard Star level base Sonic In Sonic Colors, Sonic managed to defeat the Nega-Wisp Armor, a giant robot piloted by Dr. Eggman, who uses the powers of the Wisps and can combine them at his will. Because the Nega-Wisp Armor drains Hyper-go-on energy quickly like the Mind Control Ray, Dr. Eggman needs to harvestisps constantly throughout the battle. The same Black-hole like object that appears in the game is also empowered by the same source of energy of the Nega-Wisp Armor which has a strength calculated of 1.83 Foe, which is the equivalent of Large Star level In Sonic Battle, Sonic manages to defeat and overpower Ultimate Emerl in just 30 seconds, Emerl's abilities were not only upgraded by the Chaos Emeralds which can pierce through entire stars, but also captured the energy of The Final Egg Blaster, which can one-shot entire galleries of Star systems. When Emerl captures energy/data all of his abilities including physicals are greatly improved Not only that but all the energy absorbed couldn't go into the input so it was released in the output instead, proven by his upgraded and overpowered abilities that he used in his fight with Sonic th-cam.com/video/EoQ5ThVfgCo/w-d-xo.html (10:08) Multi-Solar System level Base Sonic In Sonic Riders: Zero Gravity, Sonic managed to damage and overpower the Master Core: ABIS. This being abilities were amplified by the Arks of the Cosmos which can form a Black Hole that not only consume stars but create them as well a large collection of them as you see the inside of it proving the point. Not only that but he tanked his own Black Hole as well. Multi-Solar System level In Sonic Mania Plus, Sonic is able to defeat Metal Sonic Kai, Metal Sonic Kai's abilities were amplified by the Phantom Ruby at the time that he was able to warp Little Planet which had multiple Stars and constellations Multi-Solar System level In Team Sonic Racing, Sonic and the gang are superior to the Boos, who are able to control a dimension that contains numerous stars which would be a Multi-Solar System level feat In Sonic and The Secret Rings, Sonic defeats Erazor Djinn, an evil genie who was responsible for making the universe vanish from existence, and if he had enough power he would enter into Sonic's reality. Erazor's magic should be far superior to King Shahryar, who was able to create the world of Arabian Nights using unknown magic that he performed. He was able to use those same magic powers to amplify his physical abilities in his fight against Sonic Universe level+ Base Sonic Continuing on Sonic and The Secret Rings, Sonic was able to defeat the Ifrit Golem who was revealed that he had the power to burn the world due the power of the World Ring even while time was stopped Proving that even with just one ring is enough to destroy the Universe This was not implying that it's Planet, it was implying to be a Universe to the point that the game was traveling through them And we all know that you can control the universe with less world rings like 3 or 4 like Darkspine Sonic (3) and Al Layla Wa Layla (4). So that is another Universal+ feat. In Sonic Forces, Sonic damaged and overpowered Infinite, Infinite's abilities are empowered by the Phantom Ruby which energies can create universes with space-times like the Egg Reverie Zone and Null Space. Null Space = Subspace Universe level+ Base Sonic In Sonic Rush, Super Sonic alongside Burning Blaze were able to defeat the Egg Salamander, a powerful lizard-like mecha created by the combined efforts of Dr. Eggman and Dr. Eggman Nega to harness the energy of the Sol Emeralds, his presence enough was causing Blaze's world to merge with Sonic's which in turn would've caused both worlds to collapse Dr. Eggman planned to use this mecha's power to create his own dimension after the destruction of both worlds Low Multiversal feat for Super Sonic Later in Sonic Rush Adventure, Super Sonic defeats the Egg Wizard, Who had obtained the Power of the Stars, which was sustaining both Sonic and Blaze's universes along with their space-time and the existence of other parallel universes along with their space-time. The Egg Wizard can also merge the two universes and reign as its king, and Super Sonic can single-handedly deflect his attacks and later defeat him alongside Burning Blaze again Multiversal feat for Super Sonic. In Sonic Generations, Sonic, alongside his Classic counterpart in their Super states managed to defeat the Time Eater, an alien creature with dominion over time and space, which Eggman used it to erase Sonic's history and undo his numerous defeats in the process, it's also the responsible of the White Space, which is a broken realm composed of many stolen ares from their place in space-time. And in one of the Generations guide, the Time Eater was considered a threat to the destruction of both Sonic and Classic Sonic worlds/universes, making it a Low Multiversal feat Note that, The Emeralds were affected by the destruction of the Time Eater and were colorless like the rest of the Sonic universe, unlike the time when they prevented a universe from collapsing due to the absence of the "Power of The Stars" in Sonic Rush Adventure, which proves that he's superior to the Egg Wizard, who is Multiversal And yet, another Multiversal feat for Super Sonic. Now we will talk about the biggest threat and enemy ever faced in the Sonic Gameverse franchise, Solaris. Solaris is the central antagonist and final boss of Sonic the Hedgehog (2006). He is the sun god of Soleanna, as well as a super-dimensional lifeform and a god of time, who is worshiped by the people of Soleanna. Eggman stated that Solaris was capable of destroying all existing timelines and collapse time itself into nothingness. timelines are the same as dimensions, universes and realities in the Sonicverse. He was about to destroy every single dimension, which would also include the MaginaryWorld, a dimension which contains the 4th dimension itself, which has innumerable amount of dimensions. Multiversal feat Not only that, but he was also born not only due to Iblis and Mephiles, but also the Chaos Emeralds itself. So all of his feats are Chaos Energy powered, and the Chaos Emeralds have been consistently stated in the series to be a source of infinite power ever since the Classic era. "But Sonic needed the help of Shadow and Silver to accomplish this feat, so it's not all by his merit" Not only this mean nothing since he still scales to them, but also there's the fact that Solaris is an transcendent life form that exists in 3 periods of time, the Past, Present and Future, and each of the Super Hedgehogs needed to take him by himself on each period cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/569997237854273547/597130781424615499/Screenshot_2019-07-06-15-15-21.png ^ "Defeating it here, now, would do nothing" There's also the fact that the '06 guide itself states that Super Sonic had already enough power and strength to defeatk Solaris. Multiversal Super Sonic. Skils and abilities: He can stop time using Time Stop (Sonic Adventure 2 Multiplayer), Time Break (Sonic and the Secret Rings) (Sonic Generations) and Chaos Control (SA2) (Sonic 06). -has had two fighting games were its shown he often trains -in Sonic Battle he said that he can easily adapt to his opponents fighting style and he has shown this too since he defeated the Knights of the round table who experts at swordsmanship.
@@MexicanoIrredentista2008 of course mr '7 different types of immortality" would solo the sonicverse, he also solos the dbverse. if you was calling Kakarot the name of the character he was based on then no you are incorrect.
i like how hes ACTUALLY HONEST unlike a lot of scalers something that also gives hyper sonic the advantage is that hyper sonic is said to be infinitely stronger (probably faster to) than super sonic (something about the second round is that in sonic generations sonic easily beats chaos in base which took adventure sonic difficulty in super form and he went from getting cooked by infinite to cooking infinite in an extremely fast time period also movies arent canon in dragon ball so pikkon shouldnt be considered) Great vid!
I could kinda make a point about base Sonic immesurable speed scaleing But it's kinda wage since it comes from a compearesing to an another character So there was this one time, when Takashi Idzuka (head of sonic team) stated that game Sonic could rival the comic book version of the flash in terms of speed And that's quite a speed scaling to say the list If we go with the high end and take Wally West - the fastest flash in the comic books, well this guy has quite an amount of feats like outruning the imbodiment of deth or outpasring teleportaithion, we could actually kinda scale the last one to Sonic since he defeated Shadow a lot of times, and Shadow is not only the second fastest character in canon but also casually uses telepirtaition and time manipulation in his fights We could also scale it to pre crisis superman who could travel in beetwen solar systems in a metter of seconds and from the flash rebearth we know that Barry Alen could otrun superman without breaking a swet and Wally is even faster than Barry, so we should at the wery list go way past kid Buu feats in terms of speed You could find calculations on Wally West's top speed on the doctor comics chanel (not an ad or anithing) for exampel, and it's a big number to say the list, I honestly don't think even Whis could move that fast So yeah you could kinda scale game Sonic to all of this, but only if you take that one statement from Idzuka as 100% canon Also in sonic advance 2 and sonic rush Sonic opened portals to special stages, which are in another dimensions, useing his speed, which should be at least a 4d speed feat Also this comment is way longer then I thought it woudl be, I'm sorry, I'm just kinda into power and speed scaling and I could get carried away sometimes
My question is- Sonic has all the speed, but how much power would his attacks actually have against Goku? No matter how fast you are getting hit by Jiren would be WAY worse than getting punched by Sonic..I mean look at those noodle arms😂
@@BattleBrotherCasten people are probably going to throw the whole momentum thing at you to make up for the fact that he's 3 foot tall and and extremely small body mass
I know im probably in the minority demographic content wise, but yo Six if you keep putting out Sonic videos i'll definitely come through and watch all of them. Also, id be curious to see how youd scale Archie Sonic in general. Nice vid bro, take care and have a good day
Bro. I'd watch like and share a video from Six on Archie Sonic's scaling any day. I never read any of the Sonic comics but I've seen video addressing the story, themes, and scaling. Sonic is beyond comprehension of how busted he is in that comic.
@@KIDInuyasha96 Archie Sonic is a different beast, his feats are actually insane and I honestly don’t know what would be a good matchup for that Sonic cuz I think that version stomps Goku way harder
@TheKillaBoy 88 unless its like a cartoon character like popeye or spongebob where nothing can really defeat them since they are broken "gag" characters. I do agree no one i know could contend with that version of Sonic.
(I'm trying not to spoil it for anyone who didnt watch the video first. So if you know you know.) Since I love both of these characters, I don't mind the ending. I mean, I always assumed it would end the way it ended, so I am very happy. But still. Its nice to see one of these videos that are ACTUALLY non biased and are just being as honest as they could possibly be.
Sonic is insane bro, in Sonic battle it states that he beat Emerl, who had the power of every single star in the sky inside of him, and Sonic beat him in base form, theres a lot of other feats Sonic has done that are extremely powerful as well.
Since Saiyan's get more power during fights, that means that their ki control allows them to midigate damage, and since they have a sort of way to just handle infinite ki, this means that ki can work like a really slow heal when used by a master and if taken slowly, but what makes it weird is how vegito fits into this. Since both goku and vegeta's ki are being used, it's possible that every time they fuse to fight an opponent more powerful...enough then they get to abuse the zenkai boost through fusion (probably why the earings are only for supreme kai)
@@gabrielmachado1247 I don't know. We actually don't know how much faster Hyper is versus Super Sonic as we have only one reference point from one game. The fact alone that they were moving faster than instant means it's a immeasurable speed feat. If Super Sonic has one of his own, we would have difficulty attesting who is faster as it's both a ridiculous feat. I'd say that Goku would take this one, as he still is stronger and more experienced than Sonic is in hand to hand combat, even with Hyper, taking this guys Buu Goku highball.
@@burnttoast.2017 i really don't agree Here, because i think you are really downplaying Hyper Sonic,Hyper Sonic is deadass the super form of a super form,the chaos emerald obtain transformations,super forms of their own that Grant each one of then a similar power jump,and then Sonic gets all,that power imaginé the jump from base Sonic from Super Sonic,and do It again,but this time from super to hyper Hell, Goku's experience and power (speaking as if he WAS stronger,something he is not) might not even Matter because none of Sonic's Hax are ki based,so Goku overpowering Sonic is not gonna save him from chaos control,time break,time stop,getting turn into rings,and Other shit Sonic can do and thanks to Sonic and the black Knight,we learn one of two things Sonic's growth is insane as he goes from being unworthy of being killed by King Arthur to low-diffing him in a few days or sonic's learning speed is as high as everything else with him And even more importantly,Six said It himself,HE WANKED GOKU for this video,and he still got stomped
Btw the storybook game is cannon thanks to generations mentioning them, and also, thanks to the encyclo-speed-ia, it's confirmed that sonic shuffle is cannon and using thos it is possible to get sonic to universal in base. Also, through that book, it also claims by Sonic by running in gens he restored time and space.
While i mostly agree with the Goku scaling, i felt that you heavily downplayed him in some parts and misinterpreted/disregarded many of the statements surrounding his power that can easily scale him far past just 5D. It's an okay video but there are many errors in it
Actually, Base Sonic would be universal. Scaling to Prefect Chaos means he scales the base full power of the 7 chaos emeralds. the base full power of the 7 chaos emeralds should be equal to that of the base full power of the 7 Sol emeralds, which had the power to drag Blaze’s universe. Base Sonic travel through the Arabian Nights can also get to trillions to quadrillions FTL, depending on how you interpret it.
What is funny to me, is that you didn't even measure Hyper Sonic as you just knew that Goku wouldn't be fast enough. As well as Hyper Sonic there is almost no true way to measure his full power because the only game he was shown in was in Sonic 3 and Knuckles, which is 2d. So you would have to scale it off the Super Emeralds power in the archie comics to get like a low ball of where he would end up. This was very informational and to be honest I'm not surprised Sonic won because of how stupidly strong Super Sonic is. Thanks for making this so detailed time to win more arguments with this video. Take care have a good one and very good video it was interesting and awesome to watch!
Its just, i played alot of sonic games and watched the two movies and been a fan for this hedgehog and stuff, but when i saw this match up i said, bruh goku slams no diff- Never felt sonic can even touch him, like goku being the strongest its like a fact, even if you asked google He will say goku stombs, sonic known for his speed and agilty (at least thats what i see) but goku always was with the strength and ablites, but anyway that's just what i felt lol
Though I feel as if Goku was downplayed a bit from my point of view , I respect you as well the editing was pretty good. So was the counter points and etc.
Hyper sonic is Featless. But I do wish he made a Legit Appeance in the game Series and Have him provide Overpowered Feat That would be hard to top. Remember feats and calculations are more important than mere statemen8ts. Statements are only Legit when they are backed up With feats ands Calcs..
@igboamakauktv591 Super Sonic is not Outerversal. As for Hyper Sonic, you technically should've said it's a ascended version of Ultra Sonic since Ultra Sonic>Super Sonic and he only had 1 Mastered Emerald whereas Hyper has all 7 of them.
@@divine8405 yeah,the feats of hyper Sonic are the fact that Its extremely straigh foward scaling,everything full power super Sonic can do,hyper Sonic can do either 7x better,or straight up on a infinitely higher scale
16:50 counterpoint for the "sonic's increase in power over time doesn't compare to his super form's increase" point is sonic generations perfect chaos. a being he needed super sonic to beat in sonic adventure, and now he can beat perfect chaos in base by generations.
I'll never get the "there is no time in otherworld" thing when Goku only had a year (well, half that) to train against raditz, like if he really is so fast (which he wasn't, I dont think Goku was at light speed till frieza, and we can't take the roshi sunglasses feat) then he'd have been training for infinite (Technically, no time at all) time and could of blitzed anyone in the following arcs. Hell, he could of been revived the day after he died with enough power to erase Buu, casually. I feel like "no time" only implies to age, as power can still grow, but he'd never age in Otherworld. Nowhere is it implied that movement in otherworld would be tied to the person's speed themselves either- its at least just "timeless" in terms of a quality, not that nobody can move in it unless they were immeasurable. White space has the actual spacetime literally frozen in time and space. Like to those in it, it's a frozen instance that sonics speed restores. These planes are different but we haven't been shown proper time passing while the characters are in it like with Otherworld. Maybe it does, but theres no evidence for it.
You misinterpret how time I’m dragon ball works. There’s still time in the normal universe so yeah he only had a year. Not to mention even if they did revive him time in dragon doesn’t work linearly. You don’t actually go back in time you go to a different parallel universe. Meaning that interpretation of reviving him a day afterwards makes no sense to the narrative being told. Like you said because there’s no time he doesn’t age in other world.
@@youngfish1370 i don't think you get it but alright. I'm not a "serious power scaler" or someone who'd really be invested in these things often, so no credit to me, but this is the point where I just wanted to talk about it. Pick it apart, but there came a point where it didn't make sense.
I really like this comparison and interpretation of both Sonic and Goku and how the difference between Anime and Manga could affect Goku's scaling. For me, I always think True UI/MUI in the manga is weaker than in the anime since comparing the manga to the amine, Jiren doesn't seem to go full power in the manga, unless I forgot (that saga in the manga was pretty short). Then again, that wouldn't really matter since Goku would be stronger by now. Also, I notice you didn't mention the battle with Solaris in 06. I know it technically never happen in Sonic's timeline but would it make Sonic stronger or weaker compared to the feats you stated if you did use it?
So basically Round 1; Sonic Round 2:Unknown(basically open to interpretation with it being more Consistent with Goku) Round 3: Super Sonic Round 4: Hyper Sonic
Great vid. I was worried you wouldnt use Classic Sonic from Mania and that youd highball Sonic but you discussed both favourable and more stringent scales for him. So it feels more like an unbiased scale presenting both sides of the arguement. I just have a few questions relating to scaling for Sonic. What I dont understand too well is the use of hyper sonic because it does not have much showing outside of Sonic 3. and at best we can only say it improves Sonic's speed, strength and various other stats by an unquantifiable amount The other is your point about the power of friendship recharging the sol emeralds (tho it should not effect scaling too much) Im split on that because we know how strong the power of friendship can be (like you mentioned before it helped Sonic and the avatar to fight full powered infinite) so its definitely super strong. but from my understanding the chaos emeralds are just able to react to and be influenced by emotions in general, not necessarily the power of friendship. In the jp manual for Sonic Adventure when it discusses chaos it explains that it was chaos negative emotions that the emeralds then amplified and transformed him into perfect. Chaos energy has also shown similar reactions like with the guages in Shadow the Hedgehog 2005 where it increases his chaos abilities. So it could be that just emotions in general effect the chaos emeralds and not just the power of friendship being that strong. Another thing is that you made a mistake by saying the maximum overdrive makes CD Metal Sonic 4x faster than light. Its acceleration is said to be faster than Sonic's so it will REACH lightspeed before sonic not necessarily have higher speed. In game it DOES have higher speed but I dont believe its 4x
Another banger, we love to see it. 13:10 Got me thinking about Battle of Gods when Goku recovered from a stab in the chest that looked fatal. In Super, Goku and Vegeta might be using that healing ability to recover from near death states to gain zenkai boosts during battle. Thoughts on this interpretation?
20:00 I disagree with your immeasurable speed argument for Sonic. You say that Sonic being able to do basic movements in White Space is contradictory to the events of Generations. To me, this doesn’t make sense because the reason why Sonic can do basic movements in White Space despite it not having time is because he wasn’t frozen in time like everyone else. Space time was erased around Sonic but he wasn’t frozen so him being able to wake up and move means that he was completely unaffected by the time erasure unlike Tails who was sucked into Green Hill before being frozen. Additionally, the reason Tails says that they’re traveling through time is because Sonic is using his speed to restore time to the zones and by extension, White space. If Sonic’s perception of time was affected, then he wouldn’t be able to wake up in White space, let alone restore it by running because he’d be frozen in time. Plus, Sonic’s perception of time has been challenged before in CD and 06; he time traveled in both games but his perception of time was never negatively altered. So there’s no contradiction here. Sonic simply has resistance to time manipulation. How else would he have been able to wake up in White Space if he didn’t?
He has resistance to the White Space because of his speed, it's specifically stated and shown that when both Sonic and Classic Sonic accelerate fast enough in the White Space they are apparently able to "restore" certain fractions of time, that's just how the White Space works, fast enough movements are able to negate the affects of White Space
Base Game Sonic Has Shown Immeasurable Speed and Multiversal feats alone, so I feel he got massively downplayed in this Overall, Nice Video and explanation, Six.
Good video, i think you missed some feats that could apply to goku, like zamasu threatening to merge with infinite or countless timelines due to the db multiverse following the many worlds interpretation, or goku moving in a realm that has time erased, could argue inaccessible speed, or the afterlife being infinite which could actually upscale the macrocosm to 5d even early on, but overall the outcome for canon goku is correct, i think whis vs sonic could also be interesting, because we know whis can travel to different timelines.
Db doesn't follow many world interpretation unlike xenoversep Also you gotta move in space without time but in this case both space and time weren't there, also 5d db ain't real nor does it m9ake sense
@@ohhellwhereami2574 Yes he was lmao, and the whole narrative around zamasu is that there should only be one god who rules the cosmos, devoid of ANY mortals, he would've fused with all timelines had zeno not stepped in and erased him. Also the db universe has been stated many times to be infinite in size, the living realm itself is infinite, that means the afterlife would be a higher infinity making is theoretically 5d. Because to be infinitley larger than an already infinite structure, it would be a dimensional tier higher. And yes DB does follow the many worlds interpretation because of trunks statements and some scans I have on how time rings actually work. And the official db sight had dove deep into how time travel works in DB.
@@tiltedxfn3635 bro that was only about one universe, he didn't know about other timeline to begin with, I don't think just because he could have taken over infinite timeline means he was that powerful already it directly implies he could have been stronger not was stronger so yeah To be higher d one infinite must transcend other infinity by infinite times Which is never implied just to say the example you're referring is infinite +infinite or finitely bigger infinity containing basic infinity You think it's like this, infinite ×infinite While it is infinite x+ infinite (where x is value on how much afterlife is bigger than living world) I want the site where I can find it Also trunks statement nowhere near stating it's quantum mechanics type many world interpretation to be high hyper
HIGH HYPER? Bro that's now what many worlds interpretation means bro, it means that there are an infinite number of timelines, not an infinite number of timelines that inaccessible transcend the last, I'm using that scaling method to get Goku to multiversal or multiversal+ to 5d ranges. I know dragon ball isn't hyper or infinite dimensional, but you can argue the multiverse to be 5d using higher infinites, but that's where it caps.
yoooo wassup my boy ebullience. i used to watch you for 2 years. unfortunately i had to unsub because my subscriptions were getting flooded, how are you doing though
Game Sonic's only real feats are beating Solaris who destroyed the entire universe which would put him at universal. With that being said however it still doesn't change the fact that Sonic's base form is only around planet level and you can't add super Sonic's feats to regular sonic since that's a transformation that he can't achieve on his own. Anime Goku has low multversal + feats by the end of the series due to the stuff he pulls like withstanding the hakai in base form (which can destroy your body and soul), completely mopping fused zamasu who was at the very least a million times stronger than him, nearly destroying the entire universe just by clashing his fist's with lord Beerus, beating kefla who can destroy a universe in one shot, defeating Jiren who shook an infinite realm just by walking, shaking the infinite dimension of the TOP just by powering up ect, ect. All of these feats put him at multiversal at a bare minimum. Manga Goku (AKA "canon" Goku) has all of these feats as well but even more advanced including additional ones like being able to contend with gas who was the strongest in his universe at the time. All of those feats combined easily makes manga Goku outerversal +. Now while it can be argued that Archie Sonic has feats that surpass some of this Goku still has stronger variants like Xeno Goku, CC Goku, COMP Goku, ect ect who have feats that scale beyond 11D/ outerversal and possibly even higher compared to Archie Sonic's 4D feats. Xeno Goku alone scales beyond outerversal in base form considering he beat foes like demigra (in base) who were threatening infinite timelines, dimensions, and even the real world itself. I don't think sonic is touching any of that even at his peak.
I really enjoyed the video. To my view I thought sonic in frontiers was way beyond universal strength. But is it possible u could do a power scaling for frontiers sometime.
Very nice power scaling, Couldn't really say anything better, just wanted to point out how Sonic was able to survive in Null Space, "where nothing exist".
@TanDoesStuff goku hasn't, goku at best was in an area without time with his mortal body which was heaven, which can be debunked to king Kai allowing him to walk in it with his body.
30 minutes of heat. you love to see it
masked donate to me I'm struggling in the hood🥺
Masked you gotta give your money for a egg man vs the DBS verse
@@gameuniverse5973 EEG man is scrambled egg if he fought against DBS verse💀
@borutardfan nah, he would mass producing cell max
@@AlriaGonzela man, eggman has 12D strength and survived something stronger than the source of super forms
I like how Sonic chills out at maybe Planet level then inexplicably jumps to Complex Multiversal with one transformation
Friendship, my guy
He isnt palnetary at base tho he atleast high universel if you see sonic arabien nights you will see
How is Sonic Planetary if he even beat a Planetary character? Its not like stats are relative to each other in Sonic like it is in DB, Sonic defeating something with weak durability doesnt exactly make him Planetary, Im not the best at scaling but this guy scales so weirdly, if I defeat a slow ass Mike Tyson whos as durable as a baby with bone cancer then does that make me Prime Mike Tyson level? And why does he just outright ignore the fact Kid Goku is Planetary level? Its so strange to me how he just ignores the giant ass holes in his scaling while also ignoring Gokus feats or scaling, its also notable that even Super Sonic could not defeat a Planetary being in frontiers as it was outright stated, so with all this negative feats, why does he just ignore these glaringly obvious holes?
That is why Hyper Sonic only appeared in one Game,why the fuck would you need more power?
base sonic isnt planet level at all, gens literally boots this man atleast unviversal
My favorite sonic scaling channel
Ikr
You should also check out SaiyanScholar he delivers amazing content as well
Masked really made six a sonic scaling channel
@@TheCanineContrarian yes he is both good at sonic and dragon ball
And for some reason, mario fans think that mario can solo goku and sonic with the white toonoki suit?
THIS is how vs battle videos should be made. Snappy editing, solid tracks, factual statements,counter-arguements. Great work Six. Genuinely entertaining and informative
Heh. Nice
Counter-arguments especially
I think an important thing to note about Modern Sonic is that he beat Perfect Chaos in base, and he needed Super Sonic to beat him in Adventure, which either implies Perfect Chaos is weaker now for some reason or Sonic got a Super Form level increase from Adventure to Generations.
Edit: Rip the editor lmao
One cool detail supports your latter hypothesis which is Sega insistence on "Sonic gets stronger with every game" going back to the Classic Era where they insisted by Sonic 2, Sonic has gone faster than ever than during Sonic 1. This can be seen as physical growth, but later on in the series, it's just stated Sonic when serious just has endless amount of growth that can be amount to getting 2x stronger with every minute which already is broken when stacking with limitless speed and Sonic somehow able to amp that up since the Classic Era.
He also beat emerl who not only had all the emeralds, every character in the games battle data (meaning he was basically a super sonic, shadow, amy, knuckIes, etc) but he beat him in base and in 30 seconds.
But can you really scale Perfect Chaos to some of these other threats or was Super Sonic just that much over Perfect Chaos or that version of Super Sonic and thus Sonic say got strong enough later to beat a PErfect Chaos who sort of didn't compare to later threats?
Sonic has stupid accelerated development.
When sonic fought infinite in a rematch and sonic beat him infinite asked how did he become so strong and sonic says he grows every second so sonic’s potential is insane
0:00 - Tekken Tag Tournament 2 Piano Intro Massive Mix
1:35 - Tekken Tag Tournament Ending Music
4:01 - Sonic Unleashed - Windmill Isle (Day)
6:23 - Tekken 6 OST: Electric Fountain (Karma)
8:49 - Tekken: Dark Resurrection - Hall of Fate
14:48 - Undertale OST - Another Medium
22:56 - Dragon Ball FighterZ OST Cell's Theme
27:54 - Guilty Gear Strive - Smell Of The Game (Main Theme)
You are a goat 🙏
The music 😌👌
Thank you so much 🙏
damn
Why are you the MVP, right now, sir?❤️
It’s bizarre seeing someone scale sonic properly after death battle had Mario beat him. They honestly had no idea what they were talking about
Right they downplayed him and Archie sonic
Mario is pretty fucking op too tho, luigi and him beat a reality warping bowser and a satanic star, and a bunch of demigods and eldritch creatures if counting paper mario
@Thatitalianlameguy when nintendo characters aren't used as a way to please fans after losses like knuckles vs dk and sonic vs Mario they are quite the underrated underdogs.
My guy, I'm sorry, but nine times out of ten, Mario claps Sonic. He's reacted to faster and has on a multitude of occasions been shown to be able to anticipate and avoid attacks executed in frozen time.
Let me repeat that: Mario can read and preemptively dodge attacks that are performed _when time _*_isn't moving._*
That kind of reaction time is almost as ludicrous as Popeye being able to occupy two places at once and fight himself. Not being as fast as Sonic doesn't even _matter_ at that stage, and he's got him outclassed in strength, experience and versatility by default. Couple that with a vastly larger arsenal and more continuous and regular cosmic feats, and it's in the bag.
Hell, Mario survived being sucked into the epicenter of a supermassive black hole that destroyed the universe, followed by a new big bang. Mario was in ground zero of the death and rebirth of existence, _and he was fine._ That's not even the RPGs, that is a mainline platformer feat.
@@MagnificantSasquatch hate to break to you but the second sonic goes into his super form its over for mario
Chaos Energy seems to be arguably the most broken source of power in fiction. Like, to go from base Sonic to Super Sonic is like going from an obese and jobless reddit moderator to Soul King-absorbed Yhwach Bach in a few seconds, you can't make this shit up.
It truly is. The original concept of the Super form was to be a reward for the player for taking the effort of going for completion by collecting the 7 Chaos Emeralds, like it's telling us: "great job, here, for your hard work YOU BECOME GOD for the final stomp".
And it's great
And the fact that is canon that Sonic CAN grow in power fast enough to surpass or at least match previous super forms with generations where he fought enemies that he previously needed a super form to even have a chance (perfect Gaia,and the biolizard),so you could Argue that current Sonic is stronger than 06 super Sonic,maybe even unleashed super Sonic,why?
Because A,he already had +6 months of getting power thanks to fórces,and all the stuff inbetween this Game and frontiers (team Sonic Racing,the IDW comics and stuff)
And then,in frontiers Sonic gets a "potential unleashed" treatment in frontiers thanks to the hermit and Elder kocos,like if level 1 Sonic in frontiers,is already kind of superior to forces Sonic,then what the heck is level 99 Sonic?,hell the end powered Sonic Up along the adventure with various tecniques,so Sonic becoming stronger in frontiers is pretty much canon
Also- according to Sonic Team when making the Classic Era, Chaos Energy on its own is Omnipresent, and acts as an Super-Substance that gives energy to everything within Sonic's Universe before the Universe was later opened up into an vast and open-ended Cosmology.
Super Sonic literally can never run out of Chaos Energy if just siphoning it from the Air while the Emeralds have the same energy magnified by an infinite fold. Sort of the reason why why 1 Emerald can just stop Space-Time while 2x Emeralds just manipulate Concepts freely such as Time Travel paradox-free.
Not really, things like plot manipulation, mathematical manipulation etc do that just better
Correct me if I'm wrong but that would be a source of power right?
@@TheOrcKatariChaos energy: OP power source.
Omnitrix: OP gadget.
Also, fun thing to note; Archie Comics sonic can be measured to have immeasurable speed as during the Mega Man crossover, time was stopped and sonic was still able to move, similar to sonic generations' "white space" and the whole not having time thing.
Immeasurable*
Easy mistake regarding terminology:
Infinite Speed: Can travel an infinite distance in any amount of time.
Inaccessible Speed: Can move even when time is stopped or otherwise completely absent.
That was Sonic Man against Flash Man not the actually Sonic so I don't know if it scales
@@joeda900 That was a robotized Sonic, so it should count.
@@joeda900 that was sonic
Sonic having space time erasure resistance actually makes sense because if he didn't have that resistance, everytime he would move faster than space time, his atomic structure would probably be burned up
It really doesn’t flash is sad to be faster and he still can’t resistance getting deleted from reality so that’s just bs
Then I’m trying to figure of why people still debating when sonics creator said he can’t beat goku 💀💀 dude said this a awhile ago yet TH-camrs still be trying to over rule it like it’s they character and they know better then the creator
@@ka_killers2088 the comic writer doesn’t realize how strong he made Sonic. In other words, he sucks at powerscaling his own verse.
@@ka_killers2088 why are you so butthurt over a cartoon hedgehog vs an martial arts alien
@@mukuroikusaba7347 butt hurt? Please don’t try to read people emotions thru a phone screen you makes you look stupid.
Sonic's feats become a bit more impressive when you realize that Sonic took a beating multiple times in Sonic and the Black Knight while trying to fight the Dark Queen in his base form while wielding Caliburn. Even after Caliburn *shattered in two* Sonic was still willing to fight back no matter what, which eventually resulted in the lost power of Excalibur returning causing Caliburn's broken remains and Sonic himself to power up into Excalibur and Excalibur Sonic respectively after the three Sacred Swords were used to assist Sonic.
Adding on to that, the game prior in the Storybook duology, Sonic and the Secret Rings has Sonic facing up against and then *defeating* Erazor Djinn, the Genie of the Lamp, *while at death's door* thanks to the Flame of Judgement Erazor originally tried to cast at Shahra and is constantly *draining his LIFE FORCE* and *is almost GONE* by the time he uses the White World Ring of Wishes to open the doors to the Night Palace and was most likely fading away even more while running through the floating palace considering Sonic half jokingly asks Erazor to add a bit more to the Flame of Judgement still stuck on his chest.
Adding even more on top that, Sonic once got infected with the Metal Virus, a liquid metallic substance that turns any and all living things into machines. During a scuffle with two Zombots (a term coined by Sonic) Sonic himself was infected while fighting them and unfortunately kept making it worse by fight more and more Zombots head on. He was able to his speed to run off the infection, but eventually it was starting to fail after multiple physical contacts with Zombots and he could only hold it back at that rate. Eventually at the final issue of the Zombot arch Sonic almost fully succumbs to the Metal Virus only for Sonic to turn Super and literally burn it off and with the help of Super Silver and another reality warping gem known as the Warp Topaz, sends every last ounce of the Metal Virus to the f*cking Sun but unfortunately Sonic winds up in the Sol Dimension for an undisclosed amount of time.
And before anyone tries to correct me saying the events that take place in the IDW Sonic comics aren't canon, Sonic makes a reference to the comics by mentioning Tangle the Lemur, an IDW Sonic character and the IDW Sonic comics follow the same events as the games as the previously mentioned Tangle first appeared in issue 4 of the IDW Sonic comics which follows the aftermath of Sonic Forces, a mainline entry in the Sonic franchise. (Sticks the Badger is also mentioned in the ending.) And also, Tangle and Whisper (another IDW Sonic character) appear in Sonic Dash and Sonic Forces: Speed Battle as playable characters.
Also, never piss Sonic off. Dude broke the *sound barrier FOUR TIMES in a ROW* in issue 42 all because The Deadly Six thought they were clever with attacking Restoration HQ while no one strong or capable enough was around. If Sonic didn't know how to control his speed I'm pretty sure The Deadly Six would just be The Dead Six because I shutter to think about what the impact of the force behind Sonic would be like after he stopped moving.
Let's not forget about escaping null space
Right and for people who throw the “ it’s not canon” sonic mentions both story book games in both generations and frontiers
@@gamingwithjay9728 That's true, but was with the help of the Avatar character via Double Boost.
But that being said, Double Boost itself technically first appeared in Generations 3DS at the end of the Time Eater fight when both Super Sonics combined their powers to unleash the stronger Boost which completely obliterates any attacks the Time Eater sends to the hedgehogs. Even though Classic Sonic never learned the Boost itself until the ending of the game. The positions of Classic Super Sonic and Modern Super Sonic even match up with the Double Boost positions the Avatar and Modern Sonic are in during the technique!
And considering neither Classic Sonic or the Avatar character have the Boost in their moveset, even though it was teased that Classic Sonic might have some variation of the Boost in the teaser reveal trailer and both iterations of Classic Sonic (Console/PC & 3DS) learn the Homing Attack in Generations regardless of which version you're playing, it might be possible Sonic can share the Chaos Energy he uses to Boost with other people who interact with him or help him out. I mean, in both Sonic Heroes and Sonic The Hedgehog (2006) Super Sonic transfers Chaos Energy to Tails and Knuckles in Heroes and Shadow and Silver in '06 to allow the respective duos to go Super. Although in the case Tails and Knuckles they gain odd Shields that mimic what the Super Transformation is like.
@@ulquiorracifer__ And typically in a DRAGONBALL debate, these are the same people who will use non-canon feats and/or characters when they feel they are losing a debate
"The Dead Six" ohmygod that's funny
Forgot to mention one thing about the Emerl feat.
Emerl has also absorbed all 7 Chaos Emeralds over the course of Sonic Battles story, so during the time Emerl and Sonic fight, Emerl has the power of the Chaos Emeralds and the excess energy of the supposedly multi-star level Final Egg Blaster, and Sonic beat him in 30 seconds.
He literally mentioned the feat in this video ☠️
@@Oreo_166 I meant the whole 7 chaos emeralds in emerl theme
Didn't he also copy everyone's skills including Sonics ?
@@AVAgustusCeaser yes, full power emerl has access to every single skill available in the game, meaning he can perfectly replicate everyones fighting style.
Well,Prime Now being after Advance 3 makes Sonic Having Low Battle Skill kind of Null,because afterward we can see he clearly Got Waaaaay better
The amount of work that has been put in this video makes me realize that we don’t deserve six, he’s just the GOAT when it comes to these types of videos
Bars.
bro said kid buu was stronger then buuhan and that he destroyed a galaxy in an instant though 🫠
We know he had help from he who shall not be named.
@@TheMadPickler01 kid buu is stronger tho ☠️
@@TheMadPickler01 Kid Buu was more "dangerous" because of his being pure evil, not stronger but he is right about Kid Buu having the power to destroy a galaxy in an instant, it was stated many times that the universe would be destroyed if they lost.
15:10 he still managed to diss ichigo 😂😭
This man really doesn't like Ichigo 😂
I mean is he wrong i think that attack would eradicate Ichigo aizen black box only disrupt it and grim also did the same time while that attack straight up erases or tears it apart
It's over...
When he was talking about the egg man robot in round one he put in quotes that it “bullies the soul society” 💀😂
What did ichigo do 😂
Yugi: human level strength
Yugi: "I believe in the heart of the cards and my friends"
Yugi: *bench presses galaxies*
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
It's criminal how under utilized Hyper Sonic is. I remember the exhilaration I got when I first achieved this form playing Sonic as a kid. Only to be let down that it never came back or at least to my knowledge it hasn't
I'm pretty sure it was only mande because of the fact that Sonic & Knuckles, and Sonic 3 being separate games, so that they could have a reason for the players to collect the chaos emeralds in both games
@@PonderedSwine Whatever the reason it was pure genius
@donavanfrea6768 and with update 3 of Frontiers coming soon, there is a chance Hyper can return.
@@christopherford39 Pretty sure the director for the game said that Hyper isn't coming back (didn't say why, probably because of the massive power increase that they wouldn't realistically be able to fit well into the story) BUT they did say that they wanted to give Sonic some new kind of form soon... so a possible Cyberspace-powered form could be happening.
@@lukasruston8618Love the fact you basically predicted new Sonic Frontier events for the new update without realizing it lol, and in all seriousness I don’t think Hyper Sonic should even be battle applicable for Sonic anymore simply due to the fact since its officially stated never being able to come back into the series, and even making sure they made up lore event to not be able to return because they’re in another place entirely, more than shows imo this form was a one off thing in the classic run and shouldn’t even be canon let alone scaled and calculated since its a boost too large to even be consistent for Sonic lore, and plus I like Sonic’s new Cyber Space Super Form anyway, its boost is kinda massive in its own right, despite us not truly knowing what it brings to the table, but hey at least its canon and can be used ☠️(even tho it might be a one off form)
I love when Six talks about scaling outside the naruto verse. Dude is most knowledgeable on Naruto of course but its cool seeing him scale other verses
You forgot to mention that Emerl was also being powered by the 7 chaos emeralds, which merge entire universes together with the sol emeralds. Making Base Modern Sonic arguably Universal + as a highball. He also defeats Perfect Chaos in base who would scale to this as well in base.
He isn't using them to their full reality warping capabilities tho, just as a power source, which means he should have enough energy to split the planet apart with ease and destroy stars
feels good to be a huge sonic fan
You really believe that sonic can beat Goku 😂😂😂 white people I swear
@OzSkeeOz Fr
@OzSkeeOz Sonic would easily destroy Goku then since the only major power boost Goku would have is Kaio-Ken and he can't use that for prolonged periods nor is it anywhere close to the level of Super Saiyan.
@OzSkeeOz Hyper Sonic = UI
lol
@@Best_Ship_Ever Nah Super Sonic is actually enough to beat MUI Goku
16:27 who knew heart soul n friendship can make u a 6th dimensional tier power🤔
Persona and kingdom hearts
@@gameuniverse5973 facts
@@gameuniverse5973 people think manga, comic, and anime characters be busted but I swear video game characters are something else
@@gameuniverse5973 I remember learning Persona scaling. Shits wild man.
Sora from kingdom hearts be like:
I like how prime showed us that sonic only knows the most basic of fighting while relying more on his speed, while shadow has speed but also knows how to fight better and uses both to get the upper hand at first. This could give sonic a reason to actually learn how to fight from knuckles or even shadow himself later
When you can punch someone at mach speeds there’s really no need to learn to fight.
I haven't even watched Sonic Prime but dang
Prime sonic seems much more immature so he's not the best version to go off of. Frontiers shows that sonic definitely know how to fight
@@devEdev1100 Not only Frontiers, but also Sonic Battle and Sonic the Fighters as well. And that one little segment in Forces where Sonic just beats the brakes off Zavok.
But looking at the games specifically secret rings base sonic there is arguably stronger than all 3 super hedgehogs in 06 which is were shadow and silver peak,being that strong really doesn't encourage learning fighting styles.
Not sure if you'll see this comment but it is important to note that the spin off games are canon to the main Sonic continuity based off of the comment made in Generations where he mentions several spin offs. There might be some scaling there that could upgrade Sonic.
Magiaryworld was one of them which he mentions in the vid.
You could say the same for both sides, like if we include some of the feats he didn’t mention like Goku shaking the void with his existence alone. Or sonic outrunning nullspace with someone with him
@@jayscription6376 I don’t think those feats are canon cause goku never mentioned it again
Secret Rings has some OBUNGA level feats for Sonic, some of his most impressive of all time.
@@daseal1479 yeah those are a whole nother "can of worms"
Honestly, this video is amazing. Especially, with regards to Sonic's scaling.
Sonic in base has demonstrated Universal - Multiversal scaling with Secret Rings, Black Knight and more. He has more Universal or higher feats in base than star level ones I'd argue.
I'd argue end of DB Goku to planet to large planet too.
Good video overall, Six.
Not to mention that Sonic R has shown the Emeralds are able and contain their own Universe's which contain no trace of physics, are potentially endless and just a fraction of the Emeralds power which the Classic Era has built Classic Sonic has having surpass the power of an Emerald by Sonic 2.
The series is vastly underrated, just one thing that comes to mind would be rapid and monstrous jumps in power such as how Mania Sonic after going through Forces was undeterred and stalemate Classic Metal who was Amped on the Master Emerald.
Maybe Sonic's got Universal and Multiversal Durability since in Base he survives hits from things like the Dark Queen (who most definitely is trying to kill him) and Time Eater (being Piloted by the Eggmen so it's most DEFINITELY trying to kill him), but I don't see it being for his AP.
@@sonicandshadowsjunction It was Sonic's AP when vastly weaken that did damage enough to basically blitz Erazor Djinn who was borderline close to Merlina's power by the end of the game without the World Rings.
You could easily scale base sonic in secret rings to high hyperversal+++ just with metaphysics and astral planes
@@marcxworld5708and his speed as being immensely faster than Buu since it’s stated in Secret Rings and implied in Black Knight that after Sonic’s adventures concluded in those respective worlds, he ran between universes to get back home, which, uh… I think running between universes that all have trillions and trillions of galaxies is faster than Buu moving through a single galaxy in a second or so.
Just by a few seconds you can tell this video quality is amazing
More Star Wars, Sonic, and anything else you find interesting would be cool, I enjoy the in-depth explanations in your videos
you have no idea how long ive been thirsting for you to cover this. Ive never smiled so hard to seeing a video on my feed. I havent even watched the video but I know im gonna love it regardless. Six I love you so much you’re killing it. Please make more sonic related videos.
The answer to the question ive been waiting for since i was 5 😭
what??
I'm gonna disagree with the Modern Base Sonic rounds because there are scans for Erazor Djinn that put him at multi-universal with a weakened Sonic beating him. It also doesn't make sense to use Kid Buu destroying a galaxy for both a destructive capacity feat and a speed feat. It has to be either/or.
Oh yeah, i forgot, the storybook games are canon
@@blueblitz283yeah so the fight is 4-0 lol
Thank you for giving Game Sonic his flowers. Although not as BUSTED as Archie Sonic, he can very much still hold his own against juggernauts.
Bro I can’t believe that Six got paid THAT MUCH to do a Sonic video 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
Masked has that drug dealing money I swear
How much
@@dantemitsoyu977 idk I’m not Six
@@dantemitsoyu977 Six said on stream that he’d do this video for like 1-3k can’t remember the exact amount.
Hyper sonic is kind of hard to scale since we’ve only seen him once in s3&k. But I still agree he would slam goku
There is two ways of scaling hyper Sonic,either he is x7 times super Sonic,or he is the super Sonic of súper Sonic
(As in,if base Sonic is a 1,and súper Sonic is 1.000,hyper Sonic would be 1.000.000)
@@gabrielmachado1247 I go by a mixture of both to be honest. The Super Emeralds would be the Super Form version of the Emeralds since we see Robots, and Animals able to become Super which would hint that the only thing left would be objects which make the Super Emeralds fall into that category.
I say 1 Super Emerald = 7x Chaos Emeralds which makes it an odd number of Hyper Form being 49x stronger than Super Form. This comes from how Archie Series has an Super Emerald able to let one achieve a Super Form implying both are somewhat equal in power.
My headcanon simply includes the Master Emerald as its own supplying the Super Emeralds which makes 50x Super Sonic. It may sound limited, but this would be an multiplier of infinite-stats such as how spin-dash takes Sonic to his peak speed but moves like Peel Out, Light-Speed Dash or Boost are several folds faster than the regular spin dash. Also, in canon example would be Metal Sonic who matches Sonic's limitless speed but uses Maximum V Overdrive to go 4x faster than Sonic; who can keep up with Peel Out which is an older technique that would be surpassed by Sonic's growth and later techniques like Light-Speed Dash and Boost.
@@Rathalos2428 You can't really put a number on the chaos emeralds. They're stated that even a SINGULAIR chaos emerald has infinite power (that could either mean just infinite stats or just infinite power that could be withdrawn from) now imagine all 7. A singular super emerald is obviously stronger than the chaos emeralds combined, just imagine all 7 super emeralds.
@@RadicalBoiChris hyper
@@RadicalBoiChris i think its kinda like enerjack. your only as strong as your imagination. seeing as sonic is only known for kicks, he really don't be using the power of super other than for the huge power boost
I'll admit, I wasn't really expecting Sonic to be THAT powerful.
The craziest part is, Archie sonic (which is the comic version) is this strong in his base form and can scale up to outerversal with his super and ultra forms.
Cool video, had a lot of fun watching it. I do have some questions about the Buu Saga vs Modern Sonic section though. I haven't seen your other Sonic video, so if those answered my questions, I apologize in advance.
1. I remember Sonic beating Infinite by his lonesome about halfway through Forces, so would he still be amped by the power of friendship during that feat? It's not unheard of for Sonic to surpass previous versions of Super Sonic, we saw Generations Base Sonic defeat Perfect Chaos after all.
2. We've seen Sonic keep pace with space ships in Colors, so there's reason to believe he's faster that Dodon Pa's rocket ship that traveled in the quadrillions of times the speed of light. I know Buu saga characters can upscale from similar feats, but I figured it'd be worth bringing up.
3. You could argue immeasurable speed for Base Sonic since the CD guide you showed credits Sonic's speed for creating a time warp.
You already talked about how "traveling through time and space" was metaphorical in Generations, but what about Sonic restoring time through speed? I'm not sure if I'd say that's just an ability since Sonic's speed is credited for the restoration, not any hax or special circumstance. I'm surprised you didn't mention Egg Reverie Zone and how its HUD timer was constantly jumping to different points in time, that'd at least scale to Super Sonic, but also Base Sonic since he only transformed after entering the zone.
I understand inaccessible/immeasurable speed is weird for both Goku and Sonic since every piece of media featuring them shows time pass as they do things. But I suppose we can say the same thing for even lower speed scaling, like an MFTL+ Goku and Sonic would have no trouble crossing global distances in femtoseconds, yet the Broly Movie and Sonic Unleashed show them opting for plane travel instead. Same for many Attack Potency feats, even scaling both to Planetary levels would mean stomping a little hard would surface-wipe their worlds.
Overall, the video was still good and I look forward to see what you make in the future.
What an absolute banger of a video! I love seeing people who normally scale anime or other specific genres attempt to branch out into different verses, it's a nice change of pase and gives less frequently scaled verses some deserved spotlight.
The amount of effort put into this video is priceless! I Loved seeing Sonic Winning, Thanks a lot for the info Six, You're THE GOAT!
No way.. he ACTUALLY did it. Haven’t started watching yet but I’m impressed you were able to even get a video made on the topic💯
This is only Videogame Sonic from what he had shown, so imagine how strong Archie Sonic would be if this Sonic is this strong
Archie Sonic 1 shots Goku. But if we're using Archie Sonic we also have to use Goku's other versions that 1 shot even Zeno and the Grand Priest.
Hell, even Xeno Krillin 1 shots the Grand Priest and Zeno from the main timeline.
And let's not bring out GFG, because he's 1 shotting Archie, since he's boundless and "above fiction" since he fused with a metaphysical version of the audience (which is all of us.) And as real people we're boundless.
@@Anti-Alphabet_Mafia I'm finna solo goku ong
@@LightLemon. No offense, but you would have to solo yourself, and every other human to solo GFG. Since he's part of all of us.
@@Anti-Alphabet_Mafia I would beat the shit out of myself. I do it on a daily basis.
@@Anti-Alphabet_Mafia Is God fusion Goku official, or is he fan made?
There's a concept called Hypertime, basically it's when there's at least one other dimension of time, just like how Space has at least 3 dimensions.
White Space doesn't have a 3-D time but there's still a higher plane of time. This also explains why Shadow can stop time in a place with no time
this was alot more interesting than i thought it will be
In the DBS anime, the hit timeskip statements are valid. The manga is the one that declares his timeskip doesn’t work really on people with higher strength. This isn’t the case in the anime as timeskip works even on SSBKK Goku later on and Hit is stated to not grow in actual strength at all. The timeskip shouldn’t even work nor the time cage at all against Jiren if the ki thing was just 100% valid. But I don’t think it changes much anyways
The timeskip still works on Goku, but since Goku has a higher PL it means that Goku has higher resistance to its effects. The higher pl you are than Hit the more resistance and then immunity you get
@@kanewilson8624 in the anime that’s not indicated at all. I’ll agree it’s written very poorly in the anime, but the whole higher power so you get resistance thing just isn’t really prevalent there. Hits timeskip at its weakest was still too much for Vegeta and Vegeta states that Hit lacks strength. Goku had to develop a skill counter (that doesn’t make too much sense) but hey, he did what he did.
Even if the Higher Power Level thing is how it works, it wouldn't really stop something like Chaos Control where it's shown to work on characters of equal strength. If Infinite's Phantom Clones are as strong as the originals as stated, then Shadow chaos controlling his clone and Sonic shows that their hax works regardless of strength so Goku's getting stopped regardless.
@@sonicandshadowsjunction nah, people like guldo from early dbz could this and they still beat him.
@@jayscription6376 They only won from their Universe rules while Chaos Emeralds have shown complete control beyond the Multiverse such as repairing Dimensions/Universes that are not part of Sonic's Timeline such as the Sol Dimension, MaginaryWorld and White Space.
Also, it is stated that every time Sonic finishes using the emerlds, he also gets a power boost.
Where?
where was that stated?
comics as of right now
basically he fought a super form opposite version of himself, and he figured out since he got boosted upon depowring down from super form, that opposite version of him would do the opposite, so he tricked him to exit super form together and got the upper hand
@@ariffirdaus5376 in the idea comics
Your videos and the effort and personality you put behind them are off the charts in therms of quality and enjoyment. So much so that Im able to watch a 30min video about 2 characters I find boring and couldn't care less about.
never have i ever thought i'd see someone actually do a "Can they beat Goku?" conversation and they aren't completely losing
Tbf there are a ton of characters that beat goku. Dragon ball fans are just kind of dumb
The way you explained and the way I already understood the two characters I took a guess at who takes and I got it everytime
Just one correction, Kid Buu is not the strongest form of Buu, that goes to Buuhan. Kid Buu was stated to be the most DANGEROUS form of Buu, given that he was out of the control and lacked intelligence.
This video proves that running a YT channel doesn't improve your arguments, no matter the followers count. This is just a below-average Reddit post with nice visuals.
Read the sources for yourselves guys, and discuss with an open mind to find answers - not to prove a point. Otherwhise you'll get stuck with your convictions. Just like 99% powerscalers on YT.
facts
Rare based TH-cam comment. Stay true, king.
Death Battle is shit. THIS is how it’s done. Amazing work. It has not gone unrecognized, sir.
Wanking is not how it's done.
@@ChileanRexare so giving yourself a like? Great boost to your self
@@khalidsaeedali8756 I didn't lol. The like button is white on my screen. If it was possible I would show you
@@khalidsaeedali8756 You know what? Just because you said that, I will give myself a like and have 2 instead of 1.
@@ChileanRex great not only giving yourself a like it which is good but also have extra account? That's explain much more on What? Nothing
Love to see Sonic winning Let's Go🔥🤝🏾
So my bias for who would win between my childhood favourite anime character and childhood favourite game character was right???
But fr, this was a great matchup. The statements and counter-arguments all felt very factual and the scaling was top notch. Keep it up, Six. 👍
Finally, a good comment on this video
THANK YOU FINALLY SOMEONE WHO REALIZES THAT SONIC BEATS GOKU it's been years
Saying Goku isn't even 5D until after the Broly movie is a pretty dumb take ngl especially since universe 7 is comprised of at the very least 8 different space-times (possibly even more if you count the realms in between dimensions like the void and Suguroku Space) with a good portion of them transcending space and time, the afterlife alone is stated multiple times in not only the guides but by the teams who worked on DB to be a higher dimensional realm over the mortal universe and that it transcends all of space and time and the totality of dimensionality which at bare minimum places it at 5D. It was also stated in the guides and V Jump magazines for BOG that Goku and Beerus's battle was "Super dimensional" and that even Beerus's power alone was "beyond dimensions", "super dimensional" on its own dosent mean much without proper context but the definition of the term usually just means "1+ dimensional" aka scaling 1 extra layer into dimensional power which means Goku in BOG can already be scaled to 6th dimensional levels of strength. There's also the fact that Infinite Zamasu (in the anime) engulfed all of Future Trunk's timeline and fused with the entirety of universe 7 (which is a multiversal sized realm) and grew so much to the point where his power seeped into multiple other timelines such as the present, this alone makes Infinite Zamasu 5D at bare minimum and Goku was confident he could have stopped him with a single Senzu Bean. Jiren also surpasses this version of Zamasu in his base form and is so powerful he can shake the entire World of Void just by walking which at bare minimum is a 5D construct because it transcends space and time, Goku later replicates this feat in UI just by powering up as well. There are many more arguments to be used but I'll disregard those for the sake of this comment not being too long. Overall there are many ways you can scale Goku to 6D+ levels of power and higher even at the start of super which I feel were kinda disregarded throughout most of this video.
I was scrolling looking for this comment. Bro legit downplayed Goku to wank the hedgehog. Maybe he just has knowledge on Sonic compared to Dragon Ball. He didn't even mention Granolah having a faster than instant speed feat and Goku scaling above that. Or Champa and Vados flying to the Kaioshin Realm instantly after being spied on by the kais in U7.
That's exactly right dude. Was hoping someone would point stuff like this out
@@jaylingraves8800for real dude,I wouldn't be surprised if the op intentionally downplayed goku so sonic could win.
*In 2023 Game Sonic would still win in a fight against Goku, anime and manga, no debate*
proof:
Why Sonic definitely wins against goku,
Destructive Capacity:
In the Adventure Era, Super Sonic was able to defeat Perfect Chaos, who is powered by all the 7 Chaos Emeralds
A single Chaos Emerald is able to break the World into seven parts, Multi-Continental to Large Planet DC
So it would be no exaggeration to say that Perfect Chaos would also be Large Planet level, since the main reason to why Chaos lost it's because of his inability to harness the positive energy of the seven Chaos Emeralds
Later in Sonic Generations, Sonic once again managed to defeat Perfect Chaos, but this time in his Base form, that's due to the constant progression in power that Sonic had, making Generations Base Sonic > SA1 Super Sonic = Large Planet level.
In Sonic Unleashed, Base Sonic was able to cause massive damage to Dark Gaia.
Dark Gaia is a being with limitless supply of energy due to being powered Chaos Energy which can destroy entire Planets to even Large Planets.
In Sonic Lost World, Sonic managed to defeat the Eggrobo, a giant mech powered by the life energy of Sonic's world, who has been calculated to be Dwarf Star level
In Sonic Adventure 2, Super Sonic, alongside Super Shadow, managed to defeat the Finalhazard, who had previously fused with the ARK via Chaos Energy also powered by it which can destroy entire planets and pierce through stars.
Star level Super Sonic
Later in Sonic & The Black Knight, Sonic manages to defeat a Dragon which he compares it to the Final Hazard
Star level base Sonic
In Sonic Colors, Sonic managed to defeat the Nega-Wisp Armor, a giant robot piloted by Dr. Eggman, who uses the powers of the Wisps and can combine them at his will. Because the Nega-Wisp Armor drains Hyper-go-on energy quickly like the Mind Control Ray, Dr. Eggman needs to harvestisps constantly throughout the battle. The same Black-hole like object that appears in the game is also empowered by the same source of energy of the Nega-Wisp Armor which has a strength calculated of 1.83 Foe, which is the equivalent of Large Star level
In Sonic Battle, Sonic manages to defeat and overpower Ultimate Emerl in just 30 seconds, Emerl's abilities were not only upgraded by the Chaos Emeralds which can pierce through entire stars, but also captured the energy of The Final Egg Blaster, which can one-shot entire galleries of Star systems.
When Emerl captures energy/data all of his abilities including physicals are greatly improved
Not only that but all the energy absorbed couldn't go into the input so it was released in the output instead, proven by his upgraded and overpowered abilities that he used in his fight with Sonic
th-cam.com/video/EoQ5ThVfgCo/w-d-xo.html (10:08)
Multi-Solar System level Base Sonic
In Sonic Riders: Zero Gravity, Sonic managed to damage and overpower the Master Core: ABIS. This being abilities were amplified by the Arks of the Cosmos which can form a Black Hole that not only consume stars but create them as well a large collection of them as you see the inside of it proving the point. Not only that but he tanked his own Black Hole as well.
Multi-Solar System level
In Sonic Mania Plus, Sonic is able to defeat Metal Sonic Kai, Metal Sonic Kai's abilities were amplified by the Phantom Ruby at the time that he was able to warp Little Planet which had multiple Stars and constellations
Multi-Solar System level
In Team Sonic Racing, Sonic and the gang are superior to the Boos, who are able to control a dimension that contains numerous stars which would be a Multi-Solar System level feat
In Sonic and The Secret Rings, Sonic defeats Erazor Djinn, an evil genie who was responsible for making the universe vanish from existence, and if he had enough power he would enter into Sonic's reality.
Erazor's magic should be far superior to King Shahryar, who was able to create the world of Arabian Nights using unknown magic that he performed.
He was able to use those same magic powers to amplify his physical abilities in his fight against Sonic
Universe level+ Base Sonic
Continuing on Sonic and The Secret Rings, Sonic was able to defeat the Ifrit Golem who was revealed that he had the power to burn the world due the power of the World Ring even while time was stopped
Proving that even with just one ring is enough to destroy the Universe
This was not implying that it's Planet, it was implying to be a Universe to the point that the game was traveling through them
And we all know that you can control the universe with less world rings like 3 or 4 like Darkspine Sonic (3) and Al Layla Wa Layla (4). So that is another Universal+ feat.
In Sonic Forces, Sonic damaged and overpowered Infinite, Infinite's abilities are empowered by the Phantom Ruby which energies can create universes with space-times like the Egg Reverie Zone and Null Space.
Null Space = Subspace
Universe level+ Base Sonic
In Sonic Rush, Super Sonic alongside Burning Blaze were able to defeat the Egg Salamander, a powerful lizard-like mecha created by the combined efforts of Dr. Eggman and Dr. Eggman Nega to harness the energy of the Sol Emeralds, his presence enough was causing Blaze's world to merge with Sonic's which in turn would've caused both worlds to collapse
Dr. Eggman planned to use this mecha's power to create his own dimension after the destruction of both worlds
Low Multiversal feat for Super Sonic
Later in Sonic Rush Adventure, Super Sonic defeats the Egg Wizard, Who had obtained the Power of the Stars, which was sustaining both Sonic and Blaze's universes along with their space-time and the existence of other parallel universes along with their space-time. The Egg Wizard can also merge the two universes and reign as its king, and Super Sonic can single-handedly deflect his attacks and later defeat him alongside Burning Blaze again
Multiversal feat for Super Sonic.
In Sonic Generations, Sonic, alongside his Classic counterpart in their Super states managed to defeat the Time Eater, an alien creature with dominion over time and space, which Eggman used it to erase Sonic's history and undo his numerous defeats in the process, it's also the responsible of the White Space, which is a broken realm composed of many stolen ares from their place in space-time.
And in one of the Generations guide, the Time Eater was considered a threat to the destruction of both Sonic and Classic Sonic worlds/universes, making it a Low Multiversal feat
Note that, The Emeralds were affected by the destruction of the Time Eater and were colorless like the rest of the Sonic universe, unlike the time when they prevented a universe from collapsing due to the absence of the "Power of The Stars" in Sonic Rush Adventure, which proves that he's superior to the Egg Wizard, who is Multiversal
And yet, another Multiversal feat for Super Sonic.
Now we will talk about the biggest threat and enemy ever faced in the Sonic Gameverse franchise, Solaris. Solaris is the central antagonist and final boss of Sonic the Hedgehog (2006). He is the sun god of Soleanna, as well as a super-dimensional lifeform and a god of time, who is worshiped by the people of Soleanna.
Eggman stated that Solaris was capable of destroying all existing timelines and collapse time itself into nothingness. timelines are the same as dimensions, universes and realities in the Sonicverse. He was about to destroy every single dimension, which would also include the MaginaryWorld, a dimension which contains the 4th dimension itself, which has innumerable amount of dimensions. Multiversal feat
Not only that, but he was also born not only due to Iblis and Mephiles, but also the Chaos Emeralds itself. So all of his feats are Chaos Energy powered, and the Chaos Emeralds have been consistently stated in the series to be a source of infinite power ever since the Classic era.
"But Sonic needed the help of Shadow and Silver to accomplish this feat, so it's not all by his merit"
Not only this mean nothing since he still scales to them, but also there's the fact that Solaris is an transcendent life form that exists in 3 periods of time, the Past, Present and Future, and each of the Super Hedgehogs needed to take him by himself on each period
cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/569997237854273547/597130781424615499/Screenshot_2019-07-06-15-15-21.png
^ "Defeating it here, now, would do nothing"
There's also the fact that the '06 guide itself states that Super Sonic had already enough power and strength to defeatk Solaris.
Multiversal Super Sonic.
Skils and abilities:
He can stop time using Time Stop (Sonic Adventure 2 Multiplayer), Time Break (Sonic and the Secret Rings) (Sonic Generations) and Chaos Control (SA2) (Sonic 06).
-has had two fighting games were its shown he often trains
-in Sonic Battle he said that he can easily adapt to his opponents fighting style and he has shown this too since he defeated the Knights of the round table who experts at swordsmanship.
This is an amazing telling of sonic feats and yeah..... goku is getting utterly claped with just a single flick😅😅
Sun Wukong solos
@@MexicanoIrredentista2008 of course mr '7 different types of immortality" would solo the sonicverse, he also solos the dbverse.
if you was calling Kakarot the name of the character he was based on then no you are incorrect.
@@obsessionsofthevoid No I wasn't
@@MexicanoIrredentista2008i mean you’re completely right
but why bring it up
i like how hes ACTUALLY HONEST unlike a lot of scalers something that also gives hyper sonic the advantage is that hyper sonic is said to be infinitely stronger (probably faster to) than super sonic (something about the second round is that in sonic generations sonic easily beats chaos in base which took adventure sonic difficulty in super form and he went from getting cooked by infinite to cooking infinite in an extremely fast time period also movies arent canon in dragon ball so pikkon shouldnt be considered) Great vid!
I could kinda make a point about base Sonic immesurable speed scaleing
But it's kinda wage since it comes from a compearesing to an another character
So there was this one time, when Takashi Idzuka (head of sonic team) stated that game Sonic could rival the comic book version of the flash in terms of speed
And that's quite a speed scaling to say the list
If we go with the high end and take Wally West - the fastest flash in the comic books, well this guy has quite an amount of feats like outruning the imbodiment of deth or outpasring teleportaithion, we could actually kinda scale the last one to Sonic since he defeated Shadow a lot of times, and Shadow is not only the second fastest character in canon but also casually uses telepirtaition and time manipulation in his fights
We could also scale it to pre crisis superman who could travel in beetwen solar systems in a metter of seconds and from the flash rebearth we know that Barry Alen could otrun superman without breaking a swet and Wally is even faster than Barry, so we should at the wery list go way past kid Buu feats in terms of speed
You could find calculations on Wally West's top speed on the doctor comics chanel (not an ad or anithing) for exampel, and it's a big number to say the list, I honestly don't think even Whis could move that fast
So yeah you could kinda scale game Sonic to all of this, but only if you take that one statement from Idzuka as 100% canon
Also in sonic advance 2 and sonic rush Sonic opened portals to special stages, which are in another dimensions, useing his speed, which should be at least a 4d speed feat
Also this comment is way longer then I thought it woudl be, I'm sorry, I'm just kinda into power and speed scaling and I could get carried away sometimes
that grammar tho 😭
@@hajimemightflex5185 sorry
English is not my native language and I didn't have a lot of practice lately
@@EdgyTheHedgy891 ah ok
My question is- Sonic has all the speed, but how much power would his attacks actually have against Goku? No matter how fast you are getting hit by Jiren would be WAY worse than getting punched by Sonic..I mean look at those noodle arms😂
@@BattleBrotherCasten people are probably going to throw the whole momentum thing at you to make up for the fact that he's 3 foot tall and and extremely small body mass
I know im probably in the minority demographic content wise, but yo Six if you keep putting out Sonic videos i'll definitely come through and watch all of them.
Also, id be curious to see how youd scale Archie Sonic in general.
Nice vid bro, take care and have a good day
Bro. I'd watch like and share a video from Six on Archie Sonic's scaling any day. I never read any of the Sonic comics but I've seen video addressing the story, themes, and scaling. Sonic is beyond comprehension of how busted he is in that comic.
@@KIDInuyasha96 Archie Sonic is a different beast, his feats are actually insane and I honestly don’t know what would be a good matchup for that Sonic cuz I think that version stomps Goku way harder
@TheKillaBoy 88 unless its like a cartoon character like popeye or spongebob where nothing can really defeat them since they are broken "gag" characters. I do agree no one i know could contend with that version of Sonic.
@MoloTurbo hahah probably but if it lets him throw more shade at the Bleach verse, I'm sure he wouldn't mind 😂
@@KIDInuyasha96 bro really be dunking HARD on Bleach it’s funny asf though 😂
This is gonna be peak, time to watch!!
(I'm trying not to spoil it for anyone who didnt watch the video first. So if you know you know.)
Since I love both of these characters, I don't mind the ending. I mean, I always assumed it would end the way it ended, so I am very happy. But still.
Its nice to see one of these videos that are ACTUALLY non biased and are just being as honest as they could possibly be.
As a massive Sonic fan, this video gives me LIFE. I found you for the Naruto content but stayed for the Sonic love. My GUY! ✊🏽
🤓
This is what I mainly use to scale a sonic vs goku argument
Sonic is insane bro, in Sonic battle it states that he beat Emerl, who had the power of every single star in the sky inside of him, and Sonic beat him in base form, theres a lot of other feats Sonic has done that are extremely powerful as well.
I am in a glazing competition and this guy is my opponement. 💀
Congrats on winning
now he has Super Sonic 2 😍
love your videos. can't believe I missed this one. but amazing job.
Since Saiyan's get more power during fights, that means that their ki control allows them to midigate damage, and since they have a sort of way to just handle infinite ki, this means that ki can work like a really slow heal when used by a master and if taken slowly, but what makes it weird is how vegito fits into this. Since both goku and vegeta's ki are being used, it's possible that every time they fuse to fight an opponent more powerful...enough then they get to abuse the zenkai boost through fusion (probably why the earings are only for supreme kai)
I'm surprised he didn't mention that Goku said Granola and Gas were moving faster than instant transmission. Who true ui Goku now scales above.
That would mean that they were moving faster than instant.
@@burnttoast.2017 Yeah. Which is why I'm surprised he didn't mention that.
@@dbzmods6429 i mean,hyper Sonic would probably still be a tier or two above in speed
@@gabrielmachado1247 I don't know. We actually don't know how much faster Hyper is versus Super Sonic as we have only one reference point from one game.
The fact alone that they were moving faster than instant means it's a immeasurable speed feat. If Super Sonic has one of his own, we would have difficulty attesting who is faster as it's both a ridiculous feat.
I'd say that Goku would take this one, as he still is stronger and more experienced than Sonic is in hand to hand combat, even with Hyper, taking this guys Buu Goku highball.
@@burnttoast.2017 i really don't agree Here, because i think you are really downplaying Hyper Sonic,Hyper Sonic is deadass the super form of a super form,the chaos emerald obtain transformations,super forms of their own that Grant each one of then a similar power jump,and then Sonic gets all,that power imaginé the jump from base Sonic from Super Sonic,and do It again,but this time from super to hyper
Hell, Goku's experience and power (speaking as if he WAS stronger,something he is not) might not even Matter because none of Sonic's Hax are ki based,so Goku overpowering Sonic is not gonna save him from chaos control,time break,time stop,getting turn into rings,and Other shit Sonic can do and thanks to Sonic and the black Knight,we learn one of two things
Sonic's growth is insane as he goes from being unworthy of being killed by King Arthur to low-diffing him in a few days or sonic's learning speed is as high as everything else with him
And even more importantly,Six said It himself,HE WANKED GOKU for this video,and he still got stomped
Btw the storybook game is cannon thanks to generations mentioning them, and also, thanks to the encyclo-speed-ia, it's confirmed that sonic shuffle is cannon and using thos it is possible to get sonic to universal in base. Also, through that book, it also claims by Sonic by running in gens he restored time and space.
No bias just straight on info and proof. That’s what I like
There was some speculation, but mostly very well done.
While i mostly agree with the Goku scaling, i felt that you heavily downplayed him in some parts and misinterpreted/disregarded many of the statements surrounding his power that can easily scale him far past just 5D. It's an okay video but there are many errors in it
The editing on this video was on Point. Super solid video
Fun fact. Super sonic was a thought way before super saiyan. Super sonic song came out 1988.
Super sonic came out in 1992 kid
Actually, Base Sonic would be universal. Scaling to Prefect Chaos means he scales the base full power of the 7 chaos emeralds. the base full power of the 7 chaos emeralds should be equal to that of the base full power of the 7 Sol emeralds, which had the power to drag Blaze’s universe. Base Sonic travel through the Arabian Nights can also get to trillions to quadrillions FTL, depending on how you interpret it.
He’s using Game sonic not the overpowered Archie(Comic) Sonic
@@animixgamer7894 I know. This is game sonic
@@animixgamer7894Sonic and The Secret Rings/Arabian Nights is Game Sonic.
Great video man happy it came across the timeline lov the music too 🍻
I believe that you actually forgotten one feat that can scale goku to 5d in the TOP and it's when shoke the infinite void which is a 5d construct
I would love to see Six’s opinion on Mario vs Sonic.
mario ain‘t shit compared to sonic
Dragon Ball, Sonic, and Undertale music in one video? This is why Six is awesome.
What is funny to me, is that you didn't even measure Hyper Sonic as you just knew that Goku wouldn't be fast enough. As well as Hyper Sonic there is almost no true way to measure his full power because the only game he was shown in was in Sonic 3 and Knuckles, which is 2d. So you would have to scale it off the Super Emeralds power in the archie comics to get like a low ball of where he would end up. This was very informational and to be honest I'm not surprised Sonic won because of how stupidly strong Super Sonic is. Thanks for making this so detailed time to win more arguments with this video. Take care have a good one and very good video it was interesting and awesome to watch!
How ironic. So many see this matchup as a joke and in the end, sonic takes it 3 times out of 4
Its just, i played alot of sonic games and watched the two movies and been a fan for this hedgehog and stuff, but when i saw this match up i said, bruh goku slams no diff-
Never felt sonic can even touch him, like goku being the strongest its like a fact, even if you asked google He will say goku stombs, sonic known for his speed and agilty (at least thats what i see) but goku always was with the strength and ablites, but anyway that's just what i felt lol
@@mugenbattleandedits2412
I respect that u said mid instead of negs but i still don't agree
Though I feel as if Goku was downplayed a bit from my point of view , I respect you as well the editing was pretty good. So was the counter points and etc.
Goku was downplayed. Don’t most people put him a low multiversal at most.
@@amateuranimationz1785 yeah, but under scaling you can get him too, complex multi, high complex multi anyways.
subbed for the naruto stuff but this other verse scaling fire af G keep up the good work
Hyper sonic is Featless. But I do wish he made a Legit Appeance in the game Series and Have him provide Overpowered Feat That would be hard to top. Remember feats and calculations are more important than mere statemen8ts. Statements are only Legit when they are backed up With feats ands Calcs..
Didn't he appear in Generations?
To put it more clearly, h
Hyper sonic is an ascended version of super sonic, and super sonic is outerversal.
@igboamakauktv591 Super Sonic is not Outerversal. As for Hyper Sonic, you technically should've said it's a ascended version of Ultra Sonic since Ultra Sonic>Super Sonic and he only had 1 Mastered Emerald whereas Hyper has all 7 of them.
Hyper sonic's "feat" is just being the stronger form between the two
@@divine8405 yeah,the feats of hyper Sonic are the fact that Its extremely straigh foward scaling,everything full power super Sonic can do,hyper Sonic can do either 7x better,or straight up on a infinitely higher scale
16:50 counterpoint for the "sonic's increase in power over time doesn't compare to his super form's increase" point is sonic generations perfect chaos. a being he needed super sonic to beat in sonic adventure, and now he can beat perfect chaos in base by generations.
Dang I wanted to hear the Zeno retrieval interpretations (Zeno destroys a timeline and makes a realm that lacks space and time)
I'll never get the "there is no time in otherworld" thing when Goku only had a year (well, half that) to train against raditz, like if he really is so fast (which he wasn't, I dont think Goku was at light speed till frieza, and we can't take the roshi sunglasses feat) then he'd have been training for infinite (Technically, no time at all) time and could of blitzed anyone in the following arcs. Hell, he could of been revived the day after he died with enough power to erase Buu, casually. I feel like "no time" only implies to age, as power can still grow, but he'd never age in Otherworld. Nowhere is it implied that movement in otherworld would be tied to the person's speed themselves either- its at least just "timeless" in terms of a quality, not that nobody can move in it unless they were immeasurable.
White space has the actual spacetime literally frozen in time and space. Like to those in it, it's a frozen instance that sonics speed restores. These planes are different but we haven't been shown proper time passing while the characters are in it like with Otherworld. Maybe it does, but theres no evidence for it.
Fax man
You misinterpret how time I’m dragon ball works. There’s still time in the normal universe so yeah he only had a year. Not to mention even if they did revive him time in dragon doesn’t work linearly. You don’t actually go back in time you go to a different parallel universe. Meaning that interpretation of reviving him a day afterwards makes no sense to the narrative being told. Like you said because there’s no time he doesn’t age in other world.
Just loud and wrong
@@youngfish1370 i don't think you get it but alright. I'm not a "serious power scaler" or someone who'd really be invested in these things often, so no credit to me, but this is the point where I just wanted to talk about it.
Pick it apart, but there came a point where it didn't make sense.
@@hardcoore_gyt9254 "no time" as in events in the otherworld not happening parallel to the mortal plane doesn't make much sense.
Bro really gave us all the knowledge we needed about these characters
Dang ima sup bc of that
Raw durability will never be a normal phrase again
Was it ever a normal phrase?
I mean like you don't go up to someone and say "I HAVE RAW DURABILITY".
@@ZelZ-.-z 😂
Absolutely Love the Editing ❤
I really like this comparison and interpretation of both Sonic and Goku and how the difference between Anime and Manga could affect Goku's scaling. For me, I always think True UI/MUI in the manga is weaker than in the anime since comparing the manga to the amine, Jiren doesn't seem to go full power in the manga, unless I forgot (that saga in the manga was pretty short). Then again, that wouldn't really matter since Goku would be stronger by now. Also, I notice you didn't mention the battle with Solaris in 06. I know it technically never happen in Sonic's timeline but would it make Sonic stronger or weaker compared to the feats you stated if you did use it?
he did mention the battle with solaris he just didn't go into detail about it
It did happen, thanks to generations (Time Eater) bringing back crisis city and Blaze remembering the events of 06.
So basically
Round 1; Sonic
Round 2:Unknown(basically open to interpretation with it being more Consistent with Goku)
Round 3: Super Sonic
Round 4: Hyper Sonic
Great vid. I was worried you wouldnt use Classic Sonic from Mania and that youd highball Sonic but you discussed both favourable and more stringent scales for him. So it feels more like an unbiased scale presenting both sides of the arguement. I just have a few questions relating to scaling for Sonic.
What I dont understand too well is the use of hyper sonic because it does not have much showing outside of Sonic 3. and at best we can only say it improves Sonic's speed, strength and various other stats by an unquantifiable amount
The other is your point about the power of friendship recharging the sol emeralds (tho it should not effect scaling too much) Im split on that because we know how strong the power of friendship can be (like you mentioned before it helped Sonic and the avatar to fight full powered infinite) so its definitely super strong.
but from my understanding the chaos emeralds are just able to react to and be influenced by emotions in general, not necessarily the power of friendship.
In the jp manual for Sonic Adventure when it discusses chaos it explains that it was chaos negative emotions that the emeralds then amplified and transformed him into perfect. Chaos energy has also shown similar reactions like with the guages in Shadow the Hedgehog 2005 where it increases his chaos abilities. So it could be that just emotions in general effect the chaos emeralds and not just the power of friendship being that strong.
Another thing is that you made a mistake by saying the maximum overdrive makes CD Metal Sonic 4x faster than light. Its acceleration is said to be faster than Sonic's so it will REACH lightspeed before sonic not necessarily have higher speed. In game it DOES have higher speed but I dont believe its 4x
super sonic (game) would win in a fight against goku (anime or manga)
Another banger, we love to see it. 13:10 Got me thinking about Battle of Gods when Goku recovered from a stab in the chest that looked fatal. In Super, Goku and Vegeta might be using that healing ability to recover from near death states to gain zenkai boosts during battle. Thoughts on this interpretation?
hi verified
yeah he had healing powers in ssg but unfortunately it was retconned :(
zenkais seemed to be retconned and replaced with "saiyans growing stronger as they fight"
This is a certified hood classic
20:00 I disagree with your immeasurable speed argument for Sonic. You say that Sonic being able to do basic movements in White Space is contradictory to the events of Generations. To me, this doesn’t make sense because the reason why Sonic can do basic movements in White Space despite it not having time is because he wasn’t frozen in time like everyone else. Space time was erased around Sonic but he wasn’t frozen so him being able to wake up and move means that he was completely unaffected by the time erasure unlike Tails who was sucked into Green Hill before being frozen. Additionally, the reason Tails says that they’re traveling through time is because Sonic is using his speed to restore time to the zones and by extension, White space. If Sonic’s perception of time was affected, then he wouldn’t be able to wake up in White space, let alone restore it by running because he’d be frozen in time. Plus, Sonic’s perception of time has been challenged before in CD and 06; he time traveled in both games but his perception of time was never negatively altered. So there’s no contradiction here. Sonic simply has resistance to time manipulation. How else would he have been able to wake up in White Space if he didn’t?
He has resistance to the White Space because of his speed, it's specifically stated and shown that when both Sonic and Classic Sonic accelerate fast enough in the White Space they are apparently able to "restore" certain fractions of time, that's just how the White Space works, fast enough movements are able to negate the affects of White Space
Base Game Sonic Has Shown Immeasurable Speed and Multiversal feats alone, so I feel he got massively downplayed in this
Overall, Nice Video and explanation, Six.
Good video, i think you missed some feats that could apply to goku, like zamasu threatening to merge with infinite or countless timelines due to the db multiverse following the many worlds interpretation, or goku moving in a realm that has time erased, could argue inaccessible speed, or the afterlife being infinite which could actually upscale the macrocosm to 5d even early on, but overall the outcome for canon goku is correct, i think whis vs sonic could also be interesting, because we know whis can travel to different timelines.
Zamasu was never going to do that at best he only started to fuse with 2 timeline
Db doesn't follow many world interpretation unlike xenoversep
Also you gotta move in space without time but in this case both space and time weren't there, also 5d db ain't real nor does it m9ake sense
@@ohhellwhereami2574 Yes he was lmao, and the whole narrative around zamasu is that there should only be one god who rules the cosmos, devoid of ANY mortals, he would've fused with all timelines had zeno not stepped in and erased him. Also the db universe has been stated many times to be infinite in size, the living realm itself is infinite, that means the afterlife would be a higher infinity making is theoretically 5d. Because to be infinitley larger than an already infinite structure, it would be a dimensional tier higher. And yes DB does follow the many worlds interpretation because of trunks statements and some scans I have on how time rings actually work. And the official db sight had dove deep into how time travel works in DB.
@@tiltedxfn3635 bro that was only about one universe, he didn't know about other timeline to begin with, I don't think just because he could have taken over infinite timeline means he was that powerful already it directly implies he could have been stronger not was stronger so yeah
To be higher d one infinite must transcend other infinity by infinite times
Which is never implied just to say the example you're referring is infinite +infinite or finitely bigger infinity containing basic infinity
You think it's like this, infinite ×infinite
While it is infinite x+ infinite (where x is value on how much afterlife is bigger than living world)
I want the site where I can find it
Also trunks statement nowhere near stating it's quantum mechanics type many world interpretation to be high hyper
HIGH HYPER? Bro that's now what many worlds interpretation means bro, it means that there are an infinite number of timelines, not an infinite number of timelines that inaccessible transcend the last, I'm using that scaling method to get Goku to multiversal or multiversal+ to 5d ranges. I know dragon ball isn't hyper or infinite dimensional, but you can argue the multiverse to be 5d using higher infinites, but that's where it caps.
Is that my thumbnail at 0:13 bottom left corner ????? :DDDDDD
Yessir
@@sixfromtokyo nice video bro
yoooo wassup my boy ebullience. i used to watch you for 2 years. unfortunately i had to unsub because my subscriptions were getting flooded, how are you doing though
@@LavaCreeperPeople sup bro, tryna add me back 😭
@@Ebullience im going to resub :D
Amazing job my dude. So much went into this video, and as I big fan of both series; I really enjoyed it.
Game Sonic's only real feats are beating Solaris who destroyed the entire universe which would put him at universal. With that being said however it still doesn't change the fact that Sonic's base form is only around planet level and you can't add super Sonic's feats to regular sonic since that's a transformation that he can't achieve on his own. Anime Goku has low multversal + feats by the end of the series due to the stuff he pulls like withstanding the hakai in base form (which can destroy your body and soul), completely mopping fused zamasu who was at the very least a million times stronger than him, nearly destroying the entire universe just by clashing his fist's with lord Beerus, beating kefla who can destroy a universe in one shot, defeating Jiren who shook an infinite realm just by walking, shaking the infinite dimension of the TOP just by powering up ect, ect. All of these feats put him at multiversal at a bare minimum. Manga Goku (AKA "canon" Goku) has all of these feats as well but even more advanced including additional ones like being able to contend with gas who was the strongest in his universe at the time. All of those feats combined easily makes manga Goku outerversal +. Now while it can be argued that Archie Sonic has feats that surpass some of this Goku still has stronger variants like Xeno Goku, CC Goku, COMP Goku, ect ect who have feats that scale beyond 11D/ outerversal and possibly even higher compared to Archie Sonic's 4D feats. Xeno Goku alone scales beyond outerversal in base form considering he beat foes like demigra (in base) who were threatening infinite timelines, dimensions, and even the real world itself. I don't think sonic is touching any of that even at his peak.
This scaling sucks bruh 😭🙏
@@Zoneismcry
@@anhillary9345 why should I cry when someone was wrong
Anime goku is stronger than manga goku but manga goku still claps
@@Zoneismfr
I really enjoyed the video. To my view I thought sonic in frontiers was way beyond universal strength. But is it possible u could do a power scaling for frontiers sometime.
Great video and great music choice, you love to see it
Very nice power scaling, Couldn't really say anything better, just wanted to point out how Sonic was able to survive in Null Space, "where nothing exist".
Goku has also survived similar conditions, so that's probably worth something
@TanDoesStuff goku hasn't, goku at best was in an area without time with his mortal body which was heaven, which can be debunked to king Kai allowing him to walk in it with his body.