ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 22 พ.ค. 2024
- For today's video I thought about taking a quick break from WNOP/WEOP and instead talk about which characters were buffed the most from ingame patches. Hope you guys enjoy! (P.S: Yes we forgot Diddy Kong...)
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#SSBU #Characters #Buff - เกม
Bayonetta would be more popular if her recovery didn’t require a PHD to understand
I don't understand it at all but I've only tried her a handful of times
@@jak3w she can side b twice if she hit someone, and up b twice if she jump after the first up b
Exemple: up B-> side B -> Jump -> up B + bonus air dodge/ dirrectional air dodge
All these option can be mixed up as long as she jumps to reset her up B
@@jak3w she also have a trick that make her gain an extra jump and upB if she cancel her jump with an up B right before her wings appears i hope it helped
And that she has a 1 frame input to recover best
As Ceave would say, it’s actually really simple
Ryu and Ken feel like the only characters that the developers had fun buffing.
-Dude, what if we made Downsmash cancelable into specials?
-Why?
-It looks goofy
-Okay
@@kilaquill2537 they actually could cancel into specials from their down AND up smash in sf 2. they are just crouching heavies
Unfortunate you forgot Diddy Kong. One of my favourite underdog stories in smash, from a niche low-mid tier with a funny infinite to the winner of Smash's most stacked invitational. Diddy's growth, along with his community, was just so intriguing to watch.
R.I.P Pyramid Scheme
I agree, Diddy Kong should have been a honorable mention at least. The only thing is that Tweek is the only player I can think of that uses him to his full potential, but Diddy Kong prob has more of a case than Corrin. You could also argue that Diddy Kong is very hard to use at a high/top level and that he requires much more work than someone like Corrin; prob the most technical major buffed character.
Edit: I just re-read the description again and he has stated he has completely forgot Diddy Kong
Wasnt he busted in sm4sh?
@@doc.craque4254 He was Top 3 in Smash 4 behind Cloud and Bayonetta, but as a result he got destroyed by nerfs coming into the base game of Ultimate. This video is ment as those who got buffed the most from Base game of Ult to how they are now through patches. Diddy started off as a bad character coming into Ult, but now most see him as a High Tier character; in part thanks to buffes he got through patches, but also him getting some major representation and tournament results thanks to Tweek.
@@Latias38 I think Tweek is definitely the most consistent Diddy player, but if Aaron's in the zone he's a total freak of nature and a force to be reckoned with
Smash's most stacked invitational was won by Byleth/Joker.
Hard agree on Ryu and Ken being the most buffed, their Heavy prox jab was basically the same as heavy Utilt, making it useless.
By making it launch nowhere (literally), it became a central part of their kit and a true, reliable combo tool to chain into a Shoryuken.
One thing I would like people to keep in mind is the shadow nerfs to kens combo game that make certain combos and even zero to death strings no longer possible. There are videos still up of some of the true combos that worked in 1.0.0 and are no longer possible, and you can actually recreate this by using an emulator to go back to version 1.0.0.
K rool might not be so prevalent in the meta but all the buffs he got made him not bottom 5, so I see it as an absolute win for my boy.
He also was one of the very first characters nerfed, so I'm not sure he counts for the video.
He went from hot garbage to, well, not solo viable, but definitely tournament viable. Buff to Nair and Krown helped a shit ton.
I think Sheik could have received an honorable mention of some kind, needle storm alone went from an okay-ish move to a damn monster of a projectile with practically negative landing lag.
Definitely! The fair, her tilts and even vanish buffs really helped her killpower and consistency quite a bit too
She really went from an unfinished midtier to a high tier threat
Wii Fit definitely deserves an HM here. On launch, she was a somewhat serviceable, very average Mid Tier character who didn't really have too much going for her, then 3.0.0 rolled up and increased her Deep Breathing duration by a massive 3 seconds (9.2s --> 12.2s). This, combined with the various framedata improvements she received in 1.1.0 and 8.0.0, and Sun being made significantly stronger in 8.0.0, massively improved her viability and firmly put her in High Tier status, at least in my opinion anyway.
Bayo’s buff history was so weird. One patch of fixing moves that were inconsistent through no doing of the user or opponent, one patch of improving her main strength (damage on hit) and making it harder for the opponent to counterplay that strength, then one that just directly tries to bandaid her biggest weakness in killing
I wish that more of the initially terrible characters at launch got the same treatment as her, Ryu, and Ken. So much could be fixed so easily, but Doc REALLY needed his strengths buffed but still lacks a consistent way to capitalize on them
can't forget the random down smash buffs lol. first they gave it 1 more active frame then they made it come out 3 frames faster.
@@willashley23 it’s really funny you say this cause 1: I literally forgot they buffed it, and 2: I got a down smash 2 frame tonight which is REALLY funny cause it’s the first time I’ve hit it in bracket lmao
I recently found out that her F smash knock back gets nerfed when she catches someone in her down B.... Literally smash 4 DLC tax for no reason. it's infuriating, because Mythra can do the SAME THING with foresight and get a kill by rolling at the right time. It drives me nuts the privilege of DLC characters
@@TyphonCH Same. Pyra has such a huge spike hitbox on her dair, yet Lucina, Pit, and Marth are stuck with an extremely tiny spike dair hitbox (even though they're similar to Pyra's). It really doesn't make too much sense, plus Pyra can already hit hard.
@@TyphonCH Not fully true. Uncharged fsmash (or up and down smash) is exactly the same, but charging effectiveness is reduced. You can try to avoid this depending on what attack you witch timed, if it's a slower one you can wait until WT is over to release the smash attack (hit them during their normal end lag outside of witch time). A little more skilled but that will give you full knockback of the charge.
3 honorable mentions I think you should've included were Diddy Kong, Mewtwo, and Wii Fit Trainer.
Diddy went from a low tier character that had a crazy infinite, to an excellent high tier character that seems to be getting decent results lately and is garnering more and more popularity and usage by the general player base.
Mewtwo has always had great combos and a terrible defence, but over time they got tweaked just enough to make it more tournament viable. Mewtwo went from high low tier to high mid tier or arguably low high tier (as a Mewtwo main, I tend to lean more towards the latter). Mewtwo is one of the best characters that define the glass cannon archetype in Smash. It can take away stocks just as easily as it could lose them.
Wii Fit Trainer went from a pretty decent mid tier character to arguably high tier (or at the very least, the top of mid tier). Whilst they still have weird hitboxes and bad range, they are quite a force to be reckoned with if you don't know what you're doing. They can rack up damage extremely quick and play a decent camping game while also healing a tiny bit of percentage here and there.
I'd like to one day see a "top 5 most nerfed character's" video. I already have an idea of who the top 2 of that list will be (most likely Olimar and Pichu) but I'd be curious to see who else makes it on that list.
I'd lobe to bring up that Ryu and Ken literally got a new move in patch 3.1.0. Before that, Close Heavy Jab was literally just HUTilt (except the angle was slightly different for some reason) and then in 3.1.0, PJab (Close Heavy Jab) was changed to be a different move where it now doesn't have any knockback, making it now one of their best combo tools. And with their DSmash becoming special cancellable in 7.0.0, Ryu and Ken are the only characters in the game that actually feels completely different to play from day 1, while every other character got tweaks at best
I think Mewtwo is a good honorable mention although lands more of in a "Why no one plays" camp instead even though it may just be a matter a time before a competitor pops out of the woodwork
You mean more than a pocket pick for WaDi?
@@JonathanScarlet wadi comain mew2 and rob and always stated that his best character is mew2. If SDX still played the game; with the buff mew2 received I am pretty sure people wouldn't look at mew2 the sane way we do right now
0:15
Poor pichu
And for some reason, Pikachu was untouched
I think we can all expect to see pichu in the nerf video
Is that VA11-HALL-A ost I'm hearing at that intro? :>
Informative video! Love your series and your insight for smash ultimate. I've been a casual fan of the game series since I got Melee as my first Gamecube game, but I'm part of that subgroup who's too good to play with other casuals, but too casual to play competitive or have any hardcores to play and practice with.
Though my most effective practice and play-experience has been against lvl 9 CPUs half my life, having an easy-to-digest; but still very helpful information (delivered with the chillest voice ever),made me try out competitive for the first time (lost hard, but loved it very much still!)
Love your content! Keep on keeping on! ^_^
This video was a great change of pace!
I think diddy deserved a spot in the list more than bayo or jigglypuff, at the start of the game's lifespan everything about him sucked: bad recovery, nair was laggier, fair had a mediocre hitbox, ftilt was useless, up smash didn't kill, dash attack was inconsistent, etc. Thanks to the patches diddy went from a low-mid tier to a high tier that can perform well in the metagame (for example tweek, aaron, zinoto, etc), even if they nerfed the infinite diddy still has a big increase in bracket results thanks to the buffs
Hey Vars, LOVE your series your working on. Seriously I get excited when I see a new post from you. I would like to offer a suggestion/request
Is there anyway during editing you could apply a low cut to your voice. Your mic and voice-over has way too much bass in it and it makes it quite hard to understand you.
It's just the low-frequencies that need to be cut. Just underneath your actual voice. It's far too bassy on headphones/car speakers. I can tell your voice doesn't actually have that much bass it's just the mic. Anyway thank you!
Awesome video man,
Surprised to not see Sheik, but I agree with your picks. Good video!
I have been played Bayonetta a way more time than other characters, like the second character have the half time of use that Bayonetta have. From my expirience Bayonetta was very dificult to use for the troubles for kill. I remember having bad times for take stocks, but, as the time pass and Bayonetta had buff was a lot more easy to use for win
11:36
OH HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA!!!
That n-air to b-air was DIRTY, lmfao!!!
It's a shame more of the low/bottom tier characters couldn't have gotten a similar treatment. The game really could've used a handful of more patches after they were done with the DLC characters to focus on balancing out the roster.
As obvious as it is that Ganon and Isabelle needed help, in the online meta everything is Topsy turvy. And that's probably how most people play
Yeah. They really needed to focus on actual competitive play for their balance patches, not cheap GSP results.
@@Spyder-Marth actually the focus later became the Japanese meta
The tasteful VA11 Hall-A soundtrack is always a nice touch
If we could add things to cloud, I would love for the side taunt to actually send down a thundaga on an opponent in an activation hit ox that's a cone and the performs pikas thunder in front of him and adding a green and blue materia so we can also add electric effect to his spikes on forward air and down air
All of the Smash 4 DLC newcomers making it on this list. You love to see it!
Also, I’m so glad with the fact that Bayonetta is not only playable now, not only fun, but also very good.
I would maybe throw in the Pits as well. Up-smash killing earlier was pretty nice, but having up and down-tilt being able to combo unto up-air, up-air who can now kill far earlier than before, was a much needed change for characters that could struggle to close stocks. Also now bair is safe on shield, down-smash kills earlier (for a frame 6 move, that's pretty sweet), down-tilt combo way better and down-b, his only really broken move, has less end-lag as well. Overall, his kill power, combos, kill confirm, and disadvantage were all pretty significantly buffed. Also up-air now kills well before 180 and connect more reliably
But it all added up to Pit still being the most "who cares" character in the game
@@freddiesimmons1394 Still made him way better
@@smilingman4299 sure, but if it doesn't amount to anything then... shrug? Isabelle got a lot of buffs too, but at least outside of locals and friendlies these characters have almost no value.
It is nice for those of us who play the low tiers with our friends, but it's still only meh.
The pits could have had... idk... their fair's range improved and their armor on side b improved. Something to give them a solid threat to care about instead of having him be so dreadfully average.
i did not know allot of this and i played smash for a good while, the more you know
also could you maybe cover Incin one day? i love that big fire cat and i wanna hear how he been doing
Kinda off topic but nice music choice. Va11 Halla music is something else 🗿👍
it's hilarious to me how much of this list was just Smash 4 top tiers that were overnerfed in the initial transition
Ooooh, I love VA-11 Hall-A music 🥰
Mewtwo got buffed so much in the game and he legit went from a low tier to a high tier
Legit from bottom 10 to low high tier for sure. People sleep on the legendary pokemon
That character can't land for shit, gets comboed like Ridley or DK and weighs as much as olimar. Sure he has some good strengths like shadow ball, fair, great throws but it's probably not enough to be a high tier when there are so many better characters in this game.
@@Alleis just get good. All characters can get comboed. You see kola getting 4 upair with roy on top tier all day or light comboing like crazy aegies. His weight and tails is really what holding him but he's still a very good character.
@@francoisturcotte3982 Just get good? What part of my comment has anything to do with my skill level? The character has genuine flaws that prevent him from being a high tier and you respond by saying the best Roy player in the world can land 4 up airs on other characters... mewtwo on top of being lightweight and having poor disadvantage is also very prone to trades due to his massive hurtbox and relative lack of disjoints next time please provide valid reasoning insteading of resorting to insulting the person you're speaking with.
@@Alleis just get good cause every characrer can get bodied and struggle to land. You just suck to land with mew2 thats all.
I was just thinking of this exact thing. But throughout all the games.
When I read the title I thought you meant muscles, so you can imagine my surprise when I noticed Jigglypuff there
excellent choice of music
What song is it?
Could you make a "Why no one plays" on Palutena? I always thought she was designed to win, but we rarely see people use her.
Chag, Lui$, Gen, Chase, and Abadango still play her. Seems a lot more relevant than most good characters that only have 1-2 people playing them. Even online she still feels like a character you run into often.
Palu seems like a "Why everyone plays" contender, not a "Why no one plays" contender lol
@@jonathand.t.5051 either way, I would be down for a video on Palu
She IS played. For sure less than before with the introduction of DLC characters and some nerfs but she's one of the easiest top tiers to play in the game.
That belongs to why everyone plays thanks to her very easy to use kit. Chag and Lui$ are among the well known.
Rosa it’s not even close
Rosa went from bottom 10 to high tier
You're the only person that mentioned her somehow
8:18 lol, that's fatality from the 80s
Can someone tell me where this music is from and also great video man
One character that got a really good buff was Ridley, I liked playing as him but his recovery didn't reach that long, was really hard to return to stage, but with a single buff with was possible to return.
I HEARD THAT VA-11 Hall-A MUSIC
Nice Va-11halla bgm
can you make a why no one plays Sephiroth? as good of a character he is, I wonder why almost no one uses him other than Ned and Ken (there may be more but i have not seen anyone else other than those two)
His kit doesnt flow well, with awkward throws and aerials resulting in poor combos. His light weight and large size are a detriment to him, as he is a big target that can die as early as 60 with a well placed aerial. He has one wing, but has a hard time being able to make full use of it because half the time he dies before it comes out. His archetype is distance demon, but on a competitive standpoint why play him when characters like cloud and byleth get the job done more effectively? Love his inclusion and wish he was better. I missed a ton but i'd love to see a video too!
Tweek uses him on occasion, but yeah, not much top-level representation. Also, for a zoning/distance demon-type character, his projectiles are pretty bad, and he just dies so early while also having a massive hurtbox
I'm pretty sure people actually play with Sephiroth dude
@@SamuelJohnsonYT i know, i main Sephiroth. I was just curious as to why not many people use him in the competitive scene. The only people i know use him is Ken and Ned, and sometimes Tweek.
@@ShioOtanashi it could be because he's light has bad frame data and he dies to early even when you are about to get the wing that could be why people don't use him for competition but I'm fine with that he's a really fun character
Can you do a video on the original 12 characters and which were buffed/nerfed the most from Smash 64 to Ultimate
What is the song list for the video?
The first track especially sounds familiar
What's the background music in this video from? It's mad familiar and driving me crazy
Although a weight increase would have been the biggest improvement for Ridley, I was pleased with the buffs he received over time. Giving buffs that lent to his strengths by giving them more damage or more kill power (up smash, back air, side-b), and making his recovery better with the significant changes of speed activating, speed traveling, and further distance to his up-b. While he may not be "meta" these changes made him noticeably more usable and satisfying to me as a main in tournament.
I wish they would've kept the glitch where the shotos could cancel their light down tilts by buffering jump back in 1.0. That was so cool and had so much potential. 😕
Video Idea: Why Everyone Plays: Bowser
...do they?
There are 5 bowsers at my local
6:27 "ever since melee" 🤨🧐
I think Diddy and Samus should've been at least mentioned. Samus got a kill throw, a very good killmove in DSmash, better misiles and a slightly more functional UpSmash that kills more. Some people really forget how much help Samus got from patches. But all things considered, list is pretty solid. Thanks for your work both Vars and editor 💙
ness recovery is proof smash players CAN draw at least a quarter circle
Can't believe you forgot mii brawler. Almost all of thier bad or flawed moves got significantly buffed, and they went from a low/low mid tier, to a high high/low top tier.
miiBrawler had a weird patch-history,, l remember the developers really flip-flopping on his fastfall-speed. Kinda like they werent really sure how isabelle's sideB should work on its way back
And this video is why I no longer have a character crisis anymore.
Jigglypuff main and Cloud secondary, both since Smash 4.
Ridley really only had 1 good patch, 4.0 (the one that added Hero) and even then IMO it only had 1 significant change. Which was to his up air.
It was made so the sweet spot takes priority over the sour spot which made it an immensely good move to go for, before the sweet spot was quite hard to get and now its honestly kind of hard to hit the sour spot.
He also was shadownerfed the patch where his skewer was buffed slightly in damage. As it made the cheesy dthrow to skewer setup impossible to land. Not much of a loss IMO and this was done to prevent doubles infinites online, but it was still a mixup that was lost.
In that patch they buffed something really niche about his up b too
I would say every buff in that patch were really good and significant. His recovery got waaay better (faster, more distance). His Up-Smash and Back-Air are two of his best moves and they were made stronger. Up-Smash being more active made it significantly less prone to miss characters unless they’re actually low profiling. Side-B went from being deceptively weak to actually good killing move.
Sure Ridley still isn’t amazing but he’s been significantly better since that patch. Would have been nice to have another big patch like that for him.
Va11-hall-a Background music
Before ken was buffed I wouldn’t win all that often… after that first major buff I started winning nearly every game
Honorable mention could have been Incinaroar. He is a sleep on low high tier
sick on the va11halla muze
I honestly liked Smash Ultimate's philosophy on game balance, focus primarily on buffing bottom-mid tier characters while nerfing top tiers occasionally so that players who like those characters can continue to play them.
I will admit there was some flaws with leniency and targeting. Pikachu should've been heavily nerfed meanwhile Min Min was unfairly targeted for 3 patches straight when they already nerfed a good chunk of the core of what made her so oppressive in the very first set of nerfs. It's a good philosophy that wasn't executed as well as it should've been.
Remove Cloud and Corrin, insert Sheik and Diddy
No one, even in the comments, mentions Rosalina... she was really well buffed, she has a good list of buffs and a lot of them matter a lot
because no one plays rosa anymore. same with wii fit.
Can we see a video on Why Everyone Plays Snake please? :)
Thanks
I like how all Smash 4 DLC newcomers are on the list or honorable mentions
Jr I knew wouldn’t be when everyone received nerfs in shield damage his projectile stayed the same not only did he receive buffs from Wii allowing better recovery better jab he also received buffs every patch he didn’t need but got anyways theirs every reason the characters slept on but idk I kinda regret not going to tourneys after the buffs they really made his character a kiddie character
Enraged by jiggly on the thumbnail
Im ready for the villager videos
How can you not mention samus?
I haven’t seen anyone mention sheik even tho she was considered low tier when this game came out and is now considered top/high tier by many pro players
surprised smash 4 diddy didn't make it
Video suggestion
Why no one plays the belmonts
I don’t play smash competitively or genshin at all and I click on all this guys videos XD
Why only Europe plays greninja
I think shiek could have made it on the list or as a honorable mention
Diddy Kong and Falco are 2 others that could make this list
people have forgotten that day 1 witch time might have been the single worst counter in smash history. it was active for literally 10 frames with 40+ frames end lag. 3.1.0 brought it in line with other counters activity frames making it much more forgiving to land
Biggest nerfs gotta be megaman and pichu they went from both top 5 to now just high tiers
Good ol' pellets that comboed into leaf shield.
Nah man it has to be Palu. She used to be the best character in the game and they nerfed like 80 different things of that character. Pichu simply lost f tilt as a broken kill move and got a little bigger hurtbox with Megaman losing his broken leaf shenanigans but that's not comparable to how many significant nerfs Palu got. I would even argue Joker and ZSS being right behind Palu as the 2nd most nerfed characters than Pichu or Megaman
@@Gurkan790 palu is still top 15, same for joker and ZSS is still decent. They received large nerfs, except they’re still basically top tiers.
Pichu went from top 5 in the game to basically a mid tier, same for megaman except he was top 5 w/o any of his players utilizing any deeper tech. Bruh even olimar got more nerfs than ZSS joker or Palu imo
I’m still sour it took them a year and a half before buffing Marth slightly, and then another full year for them to buff him only slightly again. Marth should have received twice as many tweaks as he has in the same time frame.
I just realized - this game's final patch had learned a ton from smash 4's mistakes. Im so happy this game is competitively playable in this late stage. Smash 4's death was so depressing.
I hope you're saying that from the patches and not bayo itself. Hurts my soul to see her be treated like "the game would be perfect without those 2"
@@survivorofthecurse717 I mean smash4 Mii Brawler was breaking the game before Bayo was even added and they handled him by banning custom changes. If only things would've been as easy with Bayo
Right, but also for her, many other things genuinely did make the game gimmick filled. For just 2 examples, tell me how much you can get off of a throw or a footstool in that game
@@survivorofthecurse717 I mean that one set with Elegant was just messed up, the Samus literally killed him with a single confirm to up B at like 20%, that was depressing to watch. That's why I give my respect to ZeRo for staying the best player in the world in smash4, with 90% of all characters having the weirdest mechanis, gimmicks and comeback potentials
Yeah, and then there's people who still hate on her, even in ultimate. My siblings will never shut up whenever I hover my cursor above the character. Because everyone knows how fair it is to be hated on for your character. But then they shrug it all off when I point out how they play Waft-io (plus, Gluttony took 2 matches with waft. Would have been 3, but Bats Within)
Sephiroth 100 percent needs a buff to his weight it doesnt make sence he light and he doesnt need to be with all the end lag he has and his big hitbox.
If sephiroth deserve a weight buff so does mew2 lol
@@francoisturcotte3982 seems fair.
For the next video, probably most obvious is Pichu. Chrom is probably going to show up too.
Wyat about Samus? Her raise since the beginning of the game has been massive, some people even consider her top 20 👀
She received nice buffs for sure, but she was already good without them. She basically went from very good to great.
Imo 5 are
5: Sheik or Cloud 4: Diddy 3: Bayo 2: C. Falcon 1: Shotos
i fell asleep watching this and dreamed i punched some guy so hard at school he had to respawn at home
Cloud got all the nerfs he needed in Smash 4, in order to be balanced, and THEN he was moved to Ultimate
Is god forsaken rob.
Incineroar??
Let’s see how buffed they got physical. Okay valis bring in the big diseasel trucks. let’s she how high they can get them raise of the ground. Lol
Wait where's Sheik?
i think most characters in this list deserve the buffs, but others ... kinda why?
some like Bayo or Falcon were trash designed
but so is Ganon and he received nothing, while all the Heavies got super buffs
Cloud being Top tier Is Always funny
It's because balancing a character like Ganon is so difficult. He is easily 'top tier' for casuals because there is no room for error against him. He only needs a few hits and you're dead. So it makes it hard to figure out a way to buff him without making him even MORE of a menace for casuals. Really he is just not designed to be competitively viable and that's okay.
where the heck is diddy and sheik
And literally none of them needed the buffs besides Puff
Falco?
Shiek
Man they really buffed Cloud quite a lot huh
He needs that and more
Diddy?
Looking forward to most nerfed character video 🤓
Pichu def goes on number 1, probably followed by Olimar, ZSS, Wario, and Ike (rip Nair)
Incineroar is definitely on the list of most buffed. Almost every patch he got something different. I feel like half his kit got a leg up.
And it didn't make him any better!!! lmao almost like the damage trade off for his egregious speed was not worth it. poorly designed from the start, yet so close to being a competitive pick
Incineroar is fairly viable, so I don't know what you mean by poorly designed. Slowest character in the game, but his recovery is less exploitable than most heavies and has more recovery mixups than most characters (for whatever they're worth). The counter prevents him from being camped out by a lot of projectiles. His reward on hit is scary and unlike trash characters he has frame data to back it up
Ken still feels weird to play because his Tatsu feels like shit
Captain falcon is the only character in the game who has never had a nerf. Nothing even slight
(Correct me if im wrong)
Bair having more base knockback makes it worse at comboing at low percents. There are plenty of other character that never got nerfs either though, like Marth, Roy, DK, etc.