The TRUTH About MotoAmerica and King Of The Baggers
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 22 พ.ย. 2024
- In this episode Mark and Kevin talk about King of the Baggers, and the insanity that is Harley-Davidson and Indian roadrace bikes. Listen as we go in-depth on the science behind these bikes, and the hype around this series!
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My 5' 7" dad rode an Indian in WWII in an Armored Division. He rode that bike from North Africa to Belgium through some of the worst weather and mud. Constantly shot at as he was a dispatcher delivering command messages to the front. After 4 years he had the physique of Bruce Lee where he looked small but, when he puffed up you thought he was a different person. When I was a kid he had promised he would buy his favorite bike of the time a Harley Electra Glide and we would go cross country. Unfortunately he passed away just after my 15th B-Day. He would have been 102 last week. I've always been a road racer myself so these baggers are a blast to watch.
Wow, I have a copy of 1942 military bike. Will be showing at June 29th at Naughty School Girls rally for veterans in Durango, Colorado.
I bet he was a great man. Don't let his story ever die! God bless you.
Much respect for your Dad!!
god bless you men, keeping his legacy never let it die
I'd like to see Honda's bagger allowed to race with Harely and Indian: the Goldwing F6B.
Not me, keep it like it is. Taking in the Japanese motorcycles is like allowing Transgender male playing in woman’s sports
Honda cannot make the goldwing light enough to compete
@@randylucas2458 - Really? How much do the Harley and Indian baggers weigh? My stock F6B weighs 804 pounds. An HD Road glide is 837 pounds according to Google. I realize the racing bikes aren't stock, but how much weight did they shave off? Also, somewhere in the rules, doesn't it say the baggers have to be V-twins? That would rule out the Goldwing, unfortunately.
@@KurtisIsley The problem with the goldwine itself is the way the engine is designed. It's just a very heavy engine. Even if they could somehow make a stainless steel frame for it's still wouldn't be light Enough to compete I ran gold wings for thirty years. My current Harley is a 01 roadglide. Its 735 with 1 gallon of gas. Not all harleys are heavy.
@@randylucas2458 735 lbs…!!! Not heavy…? GTFOOH.
By the way, I think min weight for the baggers 620 lbs.
I want to see a BMW R1800 Bagger turned into a KOB racer.
Won't ever happen. Would need a redesigned engine.
Why? Ground clearance?
Why? BMW has sport bikes. All Harley has is straight line vibrators.
I love these conversations. I subscribed to Cycle World for years, and when a new magazine arrived, Keven's column was the first place I went. All those lovely engineering secrets I learned there.
Bagger racing is fun to watch esp the Indian , Harley rivalry. Hope they have more races though
'Visceral' is the word.
Barry Sheene was asked what he thought about during the race and he answered that he wonder about where he left his car keys, etc.
I love hearing those big baggers strung out on the high banks at Daytona! Reminds me of when I was a young teen in Upstate NY and guys would meet late at night on the arterial thruway and set up drag races. Late at night when it was cool and the humid air was dense, those bikes would run great and sound beautiful. Sometimes you'd hear two of them take off and one would get off at the next exit, and one of them would just keep riding, leaving and you could hear that engine for miles and miles and miles. It was beautiful. I used to be able to tell the difference between Flatheads, Knuckleheads, Panheads and Shovels just by the sound. It was a beautiful thing.
I ride Japanese naked bikes. I’m not a cruiser/bagger guy yet I find KOTB to be a fascinating race series that I can follow and understand. The emerging theories and technology they showcase is there for all to see. As fantastic as MotoGP is, those guys are not even from planet Earth riding bikes that are technologically and mechanically unobtanium.
Agree. MotoGP ceased to be interesting when computers took over the bikes.
Like comparing f1 to sprint cars
It is fascinating. The long wheelbase looks a little more forgiving when the bike gets squirrely. But it doesn't look like the KOTB bikes share many parts with the ones you find in the showroom. The rider position looks like it's the same as a 600 supersport.
This is why I'm glad someone at MotoAmerica isn't smoking rolled up Benjamins in their pipe, and started Mission Mini Cup By Motul to get young people into motorcycles.
@@colinbowman8816 The seats and pegs are jacked way up.
Please include Peter Egan in these fantastic TH-cam presentations
Racing is racing. As a boy in the fifties and early sixties, if we had two Radio Flyers and a bit of a hill, it was on! Then it was Schwinn Stingrays in the canyon. Junior high and we were racing home on our Varsities. High school brought in air-cooled VW bugs and big bore kits, carbs, cams, and propped up engine lids. I was reintroduced to road racing and Moto America by Kyle Wyman's channel with his Ducati Panigale racing effort. Then they did the Bagger Racing as a sideshow. WTF! It's no more unusual to race baggers than to race a '65 Ford Galaxy 500. A lot of people can identify with bagger racing because they own a bagger. They couldn't sit on a sport bike. Well, not for long (even my '98 Honda VFR800FI gives my wrists and behind a bit of grief).
Now, for a topic. How about the Build. Train. Race. series? Maybe bring on a third person, one of the racers, and talk about their experiences? This series you have going is the best! Very grateful!
Your definitely showing your age. LOL Oh how I wanted a Schwinn Stingray back in the day. I bought a Continental instead only because I could ride it farther and it had 10 speeds. There is still a company near me that makes all the VW big bore and stroker stuff for a VW. They currently have parts to take your VW to 2276cc. And yes Bagger racing is awesome!
My eyes were opened when I saw a video of a Harley bagger running a 9 second quarter mile. Amazing. Reminded me of when I first saw a 1961 full size chevy with a 409 cu in engine.
When I was younger the first thing that caught my eye was motocross and along with every young lad in our neighborhood. Now that I'm older (67) touring motorcycles specifically a 2003 BMW R1200CL fairing, bags etc. have gained my interest and I like to play on the curvy roads every now and then. I remember picking up a Cycle magazine just before I purchased my new 1975 Kawasaki 750 H2 (triple 2-stroke) and reading it was like the bible. Thank you, Cycle World magazine, for the Magazines and now what you are giving us on You Tube!
I was at COTA for MotoGP this year. I met a guy who was there for the king of the baggers and knew nothing about MotoGP. He enjoyed both though. This is good!
NASCAR, as alienated most of its fans We are hungry for real racing. The ones who find the bagger racing Will watch.
I was/am kind of indifferent to the baggers, but noticed that you said they have no rider aids..traction control, etc.
Well, that is a good thing to omit, I'm a little more interested now.
Do the rules keep gl1800s out? They run pretty good.
Even a gl1500 will wheelie if you hit second hard without letting off the throttle at all, they are only about 100 hp.
(Never owned one..used to work on them. Things you learn on test rides, or borrowing one for a weekend.)
Left out the fact that a passenger helps with the 1500 wheelie. A tolerant passenger.
Battle of the Twins was my favorite class at Daytona. There were so many different bikes and International interest and participation was so strong. It was so much different from all the other races that were going on and of course it was cancelled. It should have been expanded to all the race venues.
I tend to like the hooligan races more. There are more bikes than the 2 brands in the bagger races. They just need to get those other brands in the hooligans more competitive.
Bagger racing is equivalent to watching a series where Buick LeSabres race Mercury Montegos.
Good close racing, but the drivers can take their coffee along, to make it seem faster.
Guys, thank you for producing this video!! I have been reading Kevin Cameron since the early 80's. Awesome to watch him and hear him! like someone did comment below, bring Peter Egan too! Keep it coming PLEASE!
Back when the HD VR1000 was raced, the stands at AMA races were full of first time fans. It put butts in the bleachers . The butts had beards, vests, and chaps too !
Even I cheered for the HD.
That was good for the sport as are the Baggers !
Bagger racing is the equivalent to vintage NASCAR racing. You wouldn’t have guessed those massive cars were suitable for racing, but stock car racing was excellent marketing for selling cars on Monday.
An old roadking police, suspension and a little motor work it's fun to ride and it's comfortable I tour and we chase around mountain roads been a harley fan as long as I can remember. king of the baggers hell ya root for the home team.
I like the fact that they aren’t totally reliable. Keeping them from blowing up is part of the game. Makes it even more fun to watch.
I tried to put top of the line shocks on my bagger back in the 80's, and no one made them.
Fun stuff, really enjoying the podcast. What is the true reason the 1984 Honda VF1000F Interceptor ate its cams and rocker arms? Still have mine I bought new and took my honeymoon on. Yeah, we were a bit younger. Thanks for the show, it's great.
Back in the early ‘70s the Mountain Roadracing Association in Colorado decided they would create whatever class riders wanted. At Aspen there was a “Touring Class” for those who rode to the race weekend. The requirement was that you had to race with everything you brought with you, including your cooler bungee corded to the saddle. They even had a dirt bike class running knobby tires. Lots of fun!
Its something to see in live and in person. Makes the MotoAmerican race day even more interesting and drawing the crowds. Everyone having a good time at races.
I've always loved racing. It struck me as odd that people were racing huge cruisers until I watched this. My friends and myself always raced our bikes even though they were only street bikes so it makes sense.
It’s down to earth! Not overly complicated and just damn awesome to watch!
I agree 100%
Shout out to Super Hooligan. Racing stuff a good number of people could afford to buy at a dealership.
Harley never succeeded (or really cared) about making a pure sportbike. It’s not their market demographic. So MotoAmerica invented a v-twin “race class” to lure the Sturgis crowd out to their races. The irony is that the baggers are now re-inventing what the Brit’s and Japanese already made after WW2. They went racing with war surplus, discovered what made a motorcycle faster and then invented the inline 4 motorcycle.
You cant say never cared. Or you dont know history. HD brought 750 twp strokes to daytona in the 70s. This was to beat kenny roberts. They would have. They pulled the plug on racing and never did it again after that. This is the American way. Invest nothing make millions. HD needs to thank all the Japanese bikes that were affordable. This is what old guys learned to ride on.
Don't tell Gilera and MV Augusta that the Japanese invented the 4 cyl motorcyle as we know it. Don't bother looking at Excelsior Henderson or Indian history and their 4 cyl motorcycles of the 20s.
@@paulfleming4710I don’t remember Harley having any750 2 stroke bikes? They had those 250 cc and 350 cc models that Walter Villa was winning in Europe but no 750 2 strokes
Somebody doesn't know their Harley history. There never was a 750 two stroke.
Mw6563, you would have to be a dunce to make the statement you did. Ever hear of Miguel DuHamel?
I’ve ridden sports bikes competitively for twenty years, and love the bagger racing, there is nothing better than racing something that’s not meant to go fast, go fast… what’s missing on all bikes is the fun gauge, Harley’s in general hit the fun point much earlier than other bikes. I think bagger racing is the future 😎👍🏻
Fascinating that neither Harley nor Indian offer a "Race Raplica" bagger.
My Harley-Davidson dealer keeps one on the showroom podium 2024 Road King special as my Harley shop gets the Blue why is that they sell faster and have a racing stripe. MSRP $24,999 if you are really going to buy one to ride and you want it to stay together and no disassemble itself on Saturday night in front of all your friends and Buddy who will never stop laughing you do what I say no matter what anybody else tells you take two aspirin and call me in the morning .... Here are the pros that's very short yes they will have the same engine detuned to handle low octane no lead yes they have exactly the same frame as the real States they're not allowed to modify anything on the frame so your factory model has the same frame that goes 185 miles an hour just won't have the horsepower quite enough to do it they'll only have 150 horsepower will that be enough as it will yank the front wheel with just a tickle of the wick that will bring out all the cons unbelievable astronomical cons that Harley Davidson will absolutely deny is impossible to happen but if you don't want to be like me and have a basket for a million dollar parts you will secretly when nobody's looking pull the compensating bracket off the engine and throw it in the deepest Pond you can find and have a aftermarket Plain Jane double sprocket that they make they'll flip right on there in place of it OEM anything and nobody will know the f****** differences we're getting it trying to save her two year worthless warranty if I had this job to you over again I tell him right up front piss on it I don't want anything of Harley Davidson extra b******* and give me the solid sprocket and the King Kong clutch made by Baker Drive Lines that specializes in only Harley-Davidsons on Overkill 300 horsepower in your face monster bites and so you're going to say well hell I don't need no place it's worth 500 horsepower oh yes you do because it'll take a thousand more hits of at a 150 horsepower that it never will do on a stock Harley screaming and go clutch that's worthless I went through three of them and three weeks and then a busted primary chain composting sprocket off center Twisted the crank locked up the motor busted the transmission are you getting this that's everything that you can break and they said oh they don't make that noise oh yeah two days later I'm calling them do they make that big screaming sound and leave a black mark 40 ft long and the motor won't turn over no more do they make that noise I want it fixed and they come out and picked it up in there Hurley hauler going to sit there for a week before they unwrapped it in the very next day my gut feeling said trade it in while they're interested and they took a blowed up busted forever Harley-Davidson that will never run again and for $7,000 more they gave me that drag racing model that won the 2020 championship US Nationals at Indianapolis pro stock drag bike..... I can probably say I'm a better expert of what I'm telling you about didn't anybody else in the world because nobody is insane in the membrane as I went through four different bikes and $250,000 to finally figure out what works and what don't and now I'm flat busted broke riding a piece of junk,,,, Clearwater boils down to you you don't know me and I don't know you but I will tell the truth to get even, with Harley ;, maybe even Steven as I traded up for a bite that cost $10,000 more than the one I blew up and they charged me only $7,000 difference for a bike that cost $1,5800 and I got a two-year newer just released the day I traded as I got the very first one ever that was priced at 25,000 give them the keys to my wreck busted broke and 7K more and when they pulled the primary cover for my FX silver pea gravel fell out that used to be my clutch basket cuz they didn't believe me in the first place when it was rather than making noise but they believe me now and they lost money big time oh by the way my purse man who forced me and by twisting my arm to pay a $50 more beyond the stage 4 Kit for the oversized gigantic high compression racing cylinder heads for only $150 more you can have them and I'll keep my mouth shut so you'll retain your extended warranty well so it seems while they were building dyna s they had called the factory for directions to Mount the racing heads and that my friend blew the whole warranty out of the water that they were not aware of as when you ask Harley Factory it's just like everywhere else you're going to talk to a bot AI virtual assistant who automatically ties in your kit you bought to soup up my Harley oh that's Mr hargis's Harley with the raising heads red light red light honk honk honk working warranty deleted automatically local Harley job a little hot as they had to dump about an extra 10 grand of their own cash into my spoiled pie I'm still laughing as I won$3,000 under what the new bike cost Plus another $10,000 personal pockets of the Harley Owners dealer and they don't seem to laugh anymore I'll put it that way Harleys are still tuner bikes for the very beginning don't ride the balls off of it until you buy the Harley manual read it like the Bible and do all the fixing of all the things that aren't broke before you take off and you'll be fine everything else well you can hear them they're standing out there Crying by the thousands that they've lost by the way Kyle Winans model just like this what I'm telling you about it's only about 5 minutes slower which is bugs really on the clock when he had his stock showroom fresh king of the Baggers on the track the only thing slowing it down was the stock Riding High that pretty much shorter than this why they got those suckers jacked up it's ridiculous but Kyle Lyman drags his f****** nature around the corners Moto GP Style and by the way do you have any C4 I can pack in this10-year-old Dell from Hell laptop that my AI artificial intelligent virtual assistant has fell in love with and hates me with just looking print up here I'm not going to go back and spend another half a f****** hour trying to fix it I was cuz she'll just change it back please b**** from hell you are never going to believe this but this particular AI artificial assistant she will come on and ask me hello can I help you let's play a game right in the middle of the money shot on every God damn p*** station
Kevin is a wealth of information! I met him when he was with Kawasaki tuning some of the fastest riders.. ( too many years ago ).. I grew up riding an road racing in so. Cal. An now I find myself gravitating towards the king of baggers an the new Harley ST…
Racing baggers are the NASCAR of motorcycles. but unlike NASCAR that doesn't even resemble nor represent the average car, the bagger class still identifies with the road going bikes . The challenge over the years will be to continue that representation of a road going motorcycle and still keep it entertaining and competitive to watch, and not just become the MotoGP of baggers.
They went faster than MotoGP at Daytona this year ... Kyle Wyman and Tyler O'Hare were trading paint at 185 mph up on the high bank !!!!! During the MotoGP race I heard announcer say 177 mph was the top speed ..which makes sense ...I would guess the MotoGP were geared a bit lower for more torque coming out of the turns
unfortunately, we're not seeing this trickle down effect into the showroom floor. Unlike world superbike where you can literally go into the showroom floor and buy a replica motorcycle that's just minus the race rule allowed go fast parts, you can't walk into an Indian Harley Davidson store and buy an actual race bike. That is raced in the king of the bangers.
On second note, unfortunately no one else is allowed to participate. So the BMW case 1600 bagger and the Ducati Davelle aren't to be seen. It's almost like it's a DEI race class.
@@distancejunkiemonkey4491 you can go to Vance & Hines world headquarters in brownsberg a sub of Indy just north of raceway park and by a brand new XG750R Harley Davidson dirt track race bike for around $38k ...Eddie Krawiec's mechanic got one and rides it to work everyday with lights and a licences plate
As far as king of baggers racing goes of want one just like Kyle Wyman you go to Harley buy a stock frame and stock 131 crate motor and everything else is aftermarket ..is just that easy and simple to do ..and stop telling people its not !
@@distancejunkiemonkey4491 the beemer needs to grow up , its way under powered and bout 65 mph too slow...same goes for the duck that is 30 mph TOO SLOW ..THOSE Indians and harleys are topping out at 185 mph today ..and if you want one you can buy it one piece at s time ..stock frames with no mods is the goddamn rules ..Harley is using stock 131 crate motors. And everything else is aftermarket ..THATS what this race is all about ..the public can buy a performance road king and bolt on the aftermarket parts and go racing ..Kyle Wyman got a you video that shows you all about his factory bike and what all was done to it ...but unfortunately there are people like you who tell totally different stories that are not real
@@donniebaker5984 lol so you would limit the Ducati and the Beamer to remain completely stock so you could win with your American V twin? Sounds like DEI racing to me.
I remember an old Honda commercial for their three wheelers. "After Honda built the world's first ATC, we built the second, and the first three wheeler race was on". Everything about life is a competition, that's why we race everything we create.
Top boxes, cup holders & sound systems should be mandatory.
Great idea!!
Also...make ape hangers mandatory..."cuz they make my bike handle better".
Chopper racing series?
What would quality as illegal performance enhancing music i wonder?
Thank you, gentlemen, for a very entertaining and educational experience!
Kevin, that adventurous spirit you talk about was raised in me when you did the first article about the “new” M8 engine several years ago. I bought one and have loved every minute of ownership. Your enthusiasm is contagious and your experiences are a treasure to me. God bless you!
I hope the KOTB grows. It’s a awesome series to watch and it is easy to relate to these bikes
Can't wait until Buell enters the bagger class 😂
Baggers if they haven’t already will soon be the centerpiece of AMA racing series! P.S. this was very informative I learned more in this pod cast than watching bagger racing the last 2 years! Seems like no one cared enough to discuss g into the technical specs in this class.
Laughable, Truck pulls will be the centerpiece of AMA racing before Baggers will be. Bagger racing is a joke
Mark, I also happen to have a 94 Ducati (900SS), and I did tig weld a standard 18mm Lambda Sensor bung into the headers. What I learned is that the jets included in the common Keihin FCR41 carburetor kits for these 2V motors are wildly incorrect, but apparently they are also pretty tolerant regarding air fuel ratios and still manage to run.
I am glad to see you cover this. This racing is still kind of raw. I love this. I love dragging floorboards and pushing young crotch rocket riders. They would look in there rear view to find an old man on a bagger with Apex hangers pushing them. They can walk away in long straights, but I can keep up in the twistiest.. 😂
My 01 road glide, which was cycle world's sport tour of the year in 01, it came w a13.5" Airide. currently has a hundred and seventeen cubic inch big bore(4.125") engine and runs tens in the quarter and a hundred and forty five miles an hour on its Metzler street tires
King of Baggers is great movement! Most of us used to ride dirt & super bikes. As u get older you need to slow down to a Harley! Lol
Some of us knew if we road the sport bikes we would end up dead. I do dumb shit on my harley imagine the dumb shit I'd would have done on a sport bike lol
NASCAR actually did race Mustangs and Camaros for a while. More common on shorter tracks but a few people ran them on the bigger ovals.
That was fun thanks guys.
Fascinating insight.
I was relieved to hear the interests, enthusiasm and approval from these two purveyors of technology.
The top riders of this class are some of the most loved characters in racing, I can't wait to see J.D. Beach joining their ranks 👍
Great video guys!!
Very much enjoyed the interview!!
I ride sportbikes. and I love the bagger and Hooligan race series really fun to watch.
A lot of it is perception. If ultimate racing performance to the highest level and degree is where you stand, you're going to look at baggers going fast as a regression and repulsive. Like F1 racers turning their nose up at the Mustang GT track car.
If you're standing at the place of a bagger or something of a common street bike and want to go fast, go better, do more things with that platform, this bagger racing series is going to be the talk of the town.
What people say about any motorsport is going to have a lot to do with whether or not they have the maturity to appreciate broad perspective and reason from the position of folks with interests way outside their own.
If I may suggest a topic, I've always been fascinated by the early 1900s murderdrome era of motorcycle racing. It'd be fun to watch you guys discuss it.
The baggers series is great and Harley and Indian both are doing great things in this series. All the while AFT, the American Flat Track series is suffering from the lack of factory support from Indian and Harley Davidson. Indian still had the FTR750 as a dominant bike in the series. While Harley Davidson abandoned the sport all together. There are only two Harley Davidson motorcycles being ran in the sport without any factory support. Those being the XG750R supported by a dealer like Latus Motors and a XR750 from Dodge Brothers racing, that's rated on a part time limited schedule at mostly short tracks and halfmile races. There's talk of a an adventure tracker series starting up for just one race a Sturgis. Both Harley Davidson and Indian need to refocus their interests in AFT, instead of devoting all their time and energy in the Moto America Bagger series.
This was fun to listen to. Was curious how they were attempting to normalize output on the two different engine architectures; glad you covered that portion. Thanks guys! 👍🏼
You say the bagger racing thing is uniquely american but Bagger Racing could have EASILY came out of Japan too. Japanese hobby niches are really interesting and they keep all kinds of racing alive. Bagger racing is 100% something I could see Japanese people coming up with considering there's a whole racing league based around dodge vans in Japan.
King of the Baggers has reinvigorated my interest in Racing. It's so freaking cool.
Indian Challengers have always used a slipper clutch, even the OEMs. Some other small facts were off, but overall great talk. I do find it funny how the motorcycle snobs lose their minds anytime they see anything KOB related. Most of them don't even know anything about it. I guess some just need to feed that ego.
Sitting near turn one at the Indy Motor Speedway during MotoGp days laughing my ass off watching the XR1200 Harley-Davidson support race slide, wobble and complain around the course. What fun! It's entertainment folks.
great conversation.. thanks
The only way you can have American iron racing is special classes. Harley became irrelevant in road racing 40 years ago and even dirt track rancing has seen them sliding backwards.
My gripe about "bagger" racing is they are not baggers. Not low, do not have huge front wheels, don't have functional bags, don't have forward controls. They just took Indians and Harleys and set them up for racing (against each other) but they are not, and never were, "baggers" . Type bagger motorcycles into Google and see what you get.
Next will be scooter class racing. Fact is, Moto America has sold American road racing down the tubes for a "show".
Racing is racing. I'd watch grown men race on modified pogo sticks.
Bulbous fairings and saddle bags on a racing bike is the most ridiculous thing ever. It looks so stupid…BUT it’s racing so I love it just the same.
So many uninformed people in the comments saying they want to see Honda or bmw in the bagger races 😂😂😂. Tell me you aren’t in the culture without telling me! These bagger races were started bc Harley riders started making performance baggers and then some Indian riders jumped on board. Harley and Indian got behind the idea after a few years bc it also helps sell their bikes! A bmw isn’t a touring cruiser it’s more of a sport bike. And nobody has ever made a performance Honda or bmw. Stop trying to jump into a culture that has zero to do with those companies and there isn’t a market for it either! Let them start their own race. The consumers built this shit!
Harleys and Indian only in my opinion!! Let’s keep it All American!
@@scottyskydog They touched on this when they mentioned NASCAR. The attraction of NASCAR was the cars were family sedans, taxi cabs. The guy in the suburbs driving a Ford Galaxie could relate to it. Techno geeks liked F1 and Indy/CART cars. The average Harley/Indian rider generally doesn't care about Super Bike. It's not relatable. I believe NASCAR has gone down a path of trying to create spec series race car that in no way resembles street cars. And they have been shedding fans since that strategy has been undertaken. This KOTB is relatable to the majority of Harley and Indian riders who feel there is nothing for them elsewhere. Allowing Honda, BMW, et al, destroys that for the target audience. Just like allowing Toyota into NASCAR has hurt them long term. Call it boomer thinking but there it is. NASCAR might want to try Ford Explorers vs Chevy Equinoxes instead of whatever the cars are supposed to be now. YMMV, batteries not included, JMHO.
@@mikemccabe5492 well said!
From my understanding the worst drawback for running slicks even in totally dry weather on the street is no one makes them in street compounds? Meaning they REQUIRE being warmed up to work as opposed to DOT tires which you can get away with pretty much not warming them up...I mean within reason. Personally I NEVER ride in the wet so if I had the option on my canyon carving bike I would absolutely try slicks....that is IF they were the same chemistry as the DOT treaded tires I run. Having said this I HAVE seen quite a number of crazies show up with racing slicks...almost always they are track bikes the owners are just taking for a spin in the twisties and are not about to mount DOT tires for one afternoon or whatever....plus maybe a good way to get a bit more use from tires that otherwise would be swapped for new to take to the track....always these guys are just GONE everytime I take off behind em! They also seem to park their bikes in the sun and dont hang out long it seems like
Watching baggers race is like watching snowmobile grass drags. You can do it but they really weren't designed for it.
Indian needs another Model of the Challenger built as a Performance Bagger. Lighter Crank , Stronger Frame sitting up higher .. Narrower Radiator ect..
Speaking of the IOM TT, could Baggers compete there. It would be enjoyable to watch
I love the Baggers races because the bikes look older and are interesting. Modern race bikes just do not interest me at all. My cut off point as far as the last great looking racing superbike was the 1980 suzuki XR69 based on the air cooled GS1000 engine.
Kevin has been my mentor since the 70’s.
Great topic guys. I couldn’t look away. 👍
And no, I didn’t mean like a train wreck.
I haven't heard from Kevin in an age 🙂 he knows so much 😁
Open the class up to Japanese and European twin cylinder bagger models - Guzzi Stelvio, BMW R-18s, Kawasaki Vulcans, Yamaha Road Stars, Suzuki Boulevards etc .... hell, even the multi-cylinder touring bikes like Gold Wings, or the BMW K1600s ..... the mind boggles :)
Moto GP is huge in Europe , a Huge Fan Base Huge Budget.
Road racing in the USA is not very Popular. It looks to me like the King of the Baggers has about Doubled Track attendance. That's what pays to keep the tracks open and pays winning purses.
People who ride Cruisers and Touring bikes want to see Baggers race where as they are not so interested in seeing actual high performance Crotch Rocket type bikes race.
I love your channel & I love Bagger racing & guys like McWilliams … I don’t think it will catch on in Europe though, our roads are too small
Do you guys have a million BMW GS with hard bags cruising around?
Anything that brings more people to the track is great,superbike grid is sad
My 2008 Buell Ulysess would be close to competitive in the Air Cooled Class of the BRL but I think they dropped the air cooled class for this year. Which just goes to show how advanced Buell's for back in 2008.
Spending $125 Million to shut down the new Buell Factory in 2009 was just another of Harley Davidson's Bone Head Ideas.
I had a Ulysses. Loved the ergonomics and the handling, the quirks and nags not so much. That bike fit me better than any I've ridden in the past 20 years. It would have been much better, however, with an engine and drivetrain similar to the Pan America's.
@@userer4579 Yes I need to start saving my money for the New Buell That Air cooled Evo motor is very heavy and it roasts your balls on a warm day .. Also the gas boils in the frame if you get bogged down in City Traffic . My bike is the More Street oriented version with less suspension Travel and a lower seat height..
You can't expect to ride a bike like that off road with a 17" front wheel and very steep 23.5 Degree fork rake . You have to pay attention on a gravel road..
And we need to bring in new people to racing!👍👍
I understand the interest in Bagger racing, or any other type of racing but my interest is in naked bikes and, or standard rides so I really can't force an interest in racing something I am not interested in owning so I understand the attraction but just can't force an interest in something I don't care for.
The first race at Laguna was never supposed to be a one time race.
Yes indian used and is putting the slipper clutch in the baggers for us customers since 2020 or 21
Harley needed a class to compete in. Is why bagger racing was born.
Harley aren’t race bikes, unless you make a slower, shorter race series.
I ride a Harley, but not cause it’s faster than any 600cc sport bike I’ve owned.
Cause it’s a cruiser.
Just like in Aircraft design, if the plane looks right it'll fly right. I have the same philosophy in motorcycle design. If it looks right it'll ride right and people will want it. if it looks wrong it'll be wrong forever.
never a bagger guy , but if i had one I'd be racing it 😂
Great insights guys. 👍👍
Can you please get closed captions- I can't read lips that well. The sound on your video seems a little off, also.
A real "Bagger race" would NOT exclude other models of baggers!
Excellent, thanks
Kevin, HD has used piston cooling jets in Big Twins since 1999 fyi
you can race anything including lawn tractors.
Miguel had big! big balls and no fear!
Bagger racing... as american as nascar! That's a slogan
Yeh, baggers and hooligans the Spirit of America! 👍👍😘
Mark doesn’t quite know what he’s talking about, luckily we have Kevin to grab the reins
There should be no limits on this bagger racing except for having bags and being a big production bikeLet Honda do whatever they want and the other Japanese and Euro bikes too.The thing is that they won’t enter because people that ride Hondas could care less about Baggers and those factories know that isn’t their money earner like they have in Moto GP and WSB
I can’t handle the truth!
Are none of the other manufacturers interested or is it limited to Indian and Harley?
Twins cup is where it’s at
Aaaand.. the top 5 baggers are faster than the slower half of the SUPER BIKES! they match the midpac track times😮
Can we get king of the mini-vans too?
HAHAHA!
Why not! I've even seen semi trucks racing!
I've seen school bus racing !.
Enjoyed the video very much….. still don’t like baggers.
As good as rider aids are for the sport it sure is nice seeing the uninhibited skill of these riders. Makes for a great show!
What? $8k for a 135? Last I heard it’s $12k plus install. Total $15k
The problem with the baggers is it was limited to Harley and Indian. Why not a FJR or Connie 14 in the field let alone a H2 SX SE. Harley and Indian would get lapped. The true king of baggers is not made in North American.
I think GP and F1 are a total snooze... Too much tech takes the excitement out of it.
Exactly.
Too much intervention from on-board tech. The race engineers tell them what buttons to push and totally control the engine/'power unit' from the pit. If a car side slips a bit it's replayed 8 times because it's so rare. I'd rather have 1950's speeds and technology on the track than the robotic devices they refer to as race cars. Next will be driverless cars and we'll have the on track equivalent of Battle Bots.