Helldivers are special forces essentially, their primary job is to disrupt enemy operations and supply lines, while SEAF regular forces grind down the enemy. The combination of Helldiver asset and capability denial and SEAF regular forces conventional warfare slowly but surely grinds down their enemies into dust one planet at a time.
Literally the glitched shield pack that blocked ALL melee attacks a couple weeks ago was confirmed as canon and part of “general brasch’s personal stash”
@@sparkls4492 How about the fact that a literal cannon that both explodes and burns/melts targets, that is found on a ship many times bigger than even the biggest enemy we currently have in the game?
Today, there are 200 million helldivers KIA in Jin Xi sector ALONE. Thats one TERMINID sector. There is Hydra and Lacalle Sectors, which both have about 320 million Helldiver casualties alone. And thats just 3 sectors. Malevelon Creek had 170 million casualties There are much more helldivers on standby than just 400 million
BTW, Helldivers have even more easier access to plasma weaponry than the UNSC. Even energy shields are not problem for Helldivers in terms of mass producing.
The super earth simpage is real with this one... There there kiddo im suuuuure they would win mhm mhm mhm.... The people that can barely stop a few insects and car assembly drones..... LOL!
@@brentonherbert7775 You couldn't even think of any good arguments so you preferred to go straight to treating others as if they were children, that is certainly the attitude of a child.
One thing to not overlook is a Helldiver’s religious, fanatical loyalty to Super Earth. They aren’t afraid of death, and they will fight tooth and nail obeying any order given. If one diver falls, their comrades aren’t dismayed or affected at all really. Every soldier is expendable, all for the glory that is Managed Democracy🫡
Technically the Covenant also had zealously loyal soldiers as well, but the Helldivers would still have the advantage in that category. The Covenant had civil wars like the Unggoy rebellion, and there was also animosity between some of the species (most notably Sangheli vs Jiralhanae), whereas Super Earth’s government seem to be much more efficient at maintaining morale. Only the Chaosdivers seem to pose any real threat, and even then they technically fight for the people of Super Earth if not their government.
@@JC-eo2qe The cyborg/automaton faction is a result of civil rebellions against super earth, and one common mission on bug planets is to destroy illegal broadcast towers...that bugs wouldn't be able to build or use at all. Likely there is much more dissent and civil unrest than super earth would have you believe, but they are masters of propaganda so we'll never know the truth. Chaosdivers are just non-canon player bullshit.
@@StickmanAdam lol, merely glassed? Did you see what the Helldivers did to Meridia when it decided to stop being a tropical paradise and catered to the bugs?
@@StickmanAdam sacrificing super earth itself to save the glorious ideal of super earth seems like exactly the kind of doublethink the HD universe would be perfectly okay with.
Super Earth won a three-way war despite being outnumbered, outgunned, and outsmarted. They adapted faster than most sci-fi factions, reverse-engineering technology within weeks and using it to their advantage on a large scale. Their Helldivers' FTL capability was several times faster than the Covenant's, giving them the edge in battles. Even if the Covenant had the chance to exploit the technology, their history of rebellions and parasitic infestations would make it difficult for them to do so effectively, especially if the planet had Forerunner artifacts. Comparing the feats of Super Earth and the Covenant, the gap is too significant. Super Earth transitioned from a nuclear wasteland to a galactic superpower in less than a century, while the Covenant, despite having overwhelming advantages, struggled to maintain control over a single galactic arm over thousands of years using second-hand technology.
"Several times faster" is an understatement. Super Earth FTL is instantaneous. It's honestly Forerunner-tier, lol. UNSC slipspace drives afaik have rates measured in "lightyears per day". It's laughable in comparison.
@@AmandaFessler yup. Super Earth would repel the forces of the USNC with ease unless SEAF is banned and can only rely on hell divers for the battle for whatever reason.
You really cant compare the the Halo enemy to the Helldivers enemies lol. You are very much underestimating the Halo lore. For example the Terminids do spread fast but the Halo Flood spread even faster, they can literally infect you via airborne particle spores. The Bots are very advance but the Forerunners make them look like child play, they literally had universe scale killing weapons lol. The UNSC actually has better tech then Super Earth, they have better ships, better trained forces, better equipment, MUCH better vehicles. For example the mechs; The UNSC Mantis has superior Gauss chainguns, carries more ammunition, is faster, more durable and has shielding. Their fighter jets carry very similar armaments with nukes and bombing runs but their space artillery is significantly stronger, a MAC canon makes Super Earths 380 barrage and 500kg bombs look bad lol. The only thing the Hell Divers have them beat is their numbers but the UNSC did have a very LARGE military too and even with the better tech, literal super soldiers and reverse engineering Covenant weapons they still technically lost, they only survived because of the Flood and the Banish Rebellion. Yes Super Earth has supposedly faster ships but even they cant fly thru enemy lines, the Covenant literally jumped to earth, messed it up and then left just as quick.
One thing I haven't seen anyone mention is that: sure, there was at the peak player base, 500,000 concurrent players, that was from probably around a million if not more different people. Which would mean over a million Super Destroyers, and if the Super Destroyers only make up a smaller fraction of the SEAF Navy, I can't even imagine just how many of the Liberty class ships there are, not to mention the millions of Eagle-1s and Pelican-1s that would come with the millions of Super Destroyers. Basically, their navy is absolutely enormous.
@@VeryScarySmile And even then the helldiver superdestroyer is a support craft. It's not meant to be fighting in a naval engagement at all. Considering that superearth likely isn't stupid they will probably design ships for naval combat, if they don't already have any, and make better ships for naval combat.
Fellow Halo lover here, a couple of points. 1. I don't deny a battle with a covenant destroyer would be very difficult, but there is a way to get around the shields. A covie starship has to drop its shields to fire its cannons. So timing shots would have to be perfect. 2. The covenant don't glass every single planet, only significant ones. Even by covenant standards, glassing takes a massive amount of energy. 3. I would lightly counter the claim of ghosts being good on all terrain. Because of the height off the ground, no contact with the ground and speed, they would be less effective on the rocky and jungle planets. It would be heavy casualties on both sides, but I ultimately think the Helldivers would win for a few reasons. 1. They do have the technology to beat the covenant. Helldivers have little regard to their own survival or friendly fire, if it means defeating the enemy. 3. We know Super Earth is adept at reverse engineering enemy tech, and it's not as big a leap for them as it would be the UNSC. Plus the abundance of resources at the Divers' disposal would mean anything developed would rapidly reach the whole fleet. The only way I see the covenant winning is by being fast in destroying the Divers, before they have a chance to learn and engineer any countermeasures.
imagine the covenant seeing bunch of helldivers stand back up from over-dozing the stim they carried. even the fanatic like Covenant would feel a slight fear of "zombie-like" human charging at them, bombarding high explosive / napalm along the way regard of their safety. literally fighting Korps of KRIEG at that point.
I think that the space battles against the Covenant would be like the Cario station in Halo 2 but in reverse. The Super Destroyers would take every opportunity to fire Hellpods in an attempt to board the ship, the Helldivers look for any weak spots while engaging in gunfire with the Coventant, then assemble one or more Hellbombs. Run to the ship's bay, rescue whoever is left alive in a Pelican and repeat.
assuming the SEAF is banned for this battle then sure the Covenant might win but is all of the Super Earth forces are able to be used then the SE wins 10 times out of 10. hell divers are not the main fight force. they are special forces designed to hit key targets or break enemy lines that have halted the SEAF.
As a Halo lover, you seem to be forgetting a few key facts about the Covenant and the UNSC. 1. The UNSC were losing and never would have won if it wasnt for the Flood and Banish Rebellion during the war. In fact the UNSC never even fought the full force of the Covenant, they always only fought small portions of them at a time. The Covenant military was INSANE in numbers. 2. The Covenant will gladly glass a planet if it means an easy victory. 3. The UNSC tech is actually arguably better then the Helldivers. Their space ships are better, their super solder units are far superior, their air strikes are actually very similar but the UNSC definitely have the Divers beat in terms of heavy vehicles. For example the UNSC Mantis is better then the Divers Mechs in every way; faster, more durable with shielding, gauss chain guns are better then normal chain guns they even carry more ammunition. The UNSC vehicles are actually on par if not even better then the bots tanks. The only thing the Divers are potentially better is their weapon range of high penetration and plasma weaponry but honestly if a Spartan Laser cant turn the war for the UNSC then neither of those are gonna help the Divers lol. 4. Yes Super Earth is quick at reverse engineering but so was the UNSC, they literally reverse engineered the shields and cloaking from them and they even knew and studied the covenant weapons and vehicles and trained their soldiers to use them. Buck's ODST squad from Halo knew how to fly Phantoms however ironically the best equipment for them was actually their ballistics, like the MAC canon was actually effective against Covenent cruisers. Super earths biggest weakness is their space ships and if they cant survive space then all it takes if the Covenant to simply glass the planets. 5. I honestly believe the Helldivers could beat the Banish but they dont stant a chance against the Covenant at full strength let alone a flood infestation or a Forerunner attack.
To the comment above, yes the mantis, cloaking, and shields may have been better in performance. But difference I assume is that Helldivers mechs and equipment were more likely designed with mass production as a priority.
Short answer: Yes Long Answer: Super Earth conquered the galaxy in a 3 front war by 2084. Helldivers would crush the covenant To offer a few major corrections 1: Super Destroyers are not the only ship in the SEAF, they're just the only ones Helldivers use. 2: Helldivers only deploy when it's clear enough to deploy, the SEAF is the front line grunts while Helldivers are spec-ops 3: Super Earth has access to plasma and energy weapons, along with energy shield bubbles that can survive literal mini nukes 4: Super Earth is, REALLY GOOD at backwards engineering pretty much anything 5: Super Earth is really good at wars of attrition. They can basically imperial guard the covenant 6: Mech go brrt 7: Dark Fluid exists. That's just it I am yet to see the covenant defeat literal black holes The covenant will put up a fight, but super earth is basically the inverse of the UNSC, it's humanity as the dominant species in the galaxy that has the history and capability to punch up effectively. The covenant would find themselves with just as much hell as they could potentially give. But the one thing super earth has that the covenant are not prepared for: Humanity in halo was struggling in the moral department. They had to push so much propaganda and keep the whole war secret just to lose at a manageable rate. Super Earth has an almost unbreakable moral. And moral is an invaluable tool in a war.
While i am a huge halo fan, i agree! Illuminate alone are the covenant grade enemy (in some aspects, even more advanced) and Super Earth did defeat them, terminids and cyborgs at the same time.
Would also like to point out that if the covenant get out of hand and start taking planet, super earth will just destroy its own planets instead of letting them be lost.
@@Blindstrike01 true I don't think the covenant are ready for the literal black hole Somehow Super Earth does planet destruction better because *forbidden grape soda*
The main difference between the Helldivers and the ODST is the descent capsule. The ODST capsule descends at high speed but they are maneuverable and at approximately 3 kilometers high it activates the parachute, reducing its speed to about 100 kilometers per hour, enough distance for a gunner with good aim to shoot them down. The Hellpods descend with additional propulsion when fired instead of having a rocket, so once you fire them you cannot change the trajectory, you will have a 3 meter bullet traveling at mach 5 and only about 50 meters from the ground the The retro-thrusters will be activated to control the fall a little, which is why a beacon is needed to indicate where to fire the Hellpods. But still in physical terms if a Hellpod falls on something it would be equivalent to being crushed by a cargo ship due to the kinetic energy.
Super Earths navy obviously doesn’t just consists of Super Destroyers though, they’re made for low orbit engagements not naval combat SEAF navy must be even more massive
Keep in mind that Super Destroyers are used almost exclusively by the Helldivers Corps., and they are considered the special forces units. Special forces only make up a fraction of the forces in a single branch of the military i.e. Navy and Army. So that means that the number of Super Destroyers would only make up a fraction of the total vessels used by the SEAF.
@martechi4236 has an amazing series of videos of how Super Earth fleet might look like, they're beautiful and fill the gaps that arrowhead is not currently interesting in filling. But the DSS is basically going to be a Death Star and Super Earth has already made black holes (we think) out of planets, so Super earth is no slouch in the scorched planet policy field.
@@duncanharrell5009 If you think about it, the SEAF Navy most likely beat back the Automaton armada in space and blockaded most of their ships to allow Divers to retake the planets.
Hold on. This video took the Helldivers into account, but what about the greater SEAF? For all we know, for every helldiver, Super Earth has at least 100 SEAF soldiers. While they are without a doubt squishier, less trained, and less well armed than Helldivers, they still do use the standard liberator, which we know rips lighter bugs and bots apart, and likely do use support weapons and stratagems, just on a much, much smaller scale. I think if we take the SEAF and Helldiver corps into account, it may not even be a question. I think Super Earth would roll over the Covenant if the full force of the SEAF was deployed. And that's not taking into account how fast the Ministry of Science adapts to threats, and how easily they weaponize superior alien tech through samples, as we've seen via the Illuminate. Gaining ground from Super Earth would be downright impossible for the covenant, and the longer a war with Super Earth drags out, the more they adapt and the more effective it becomes at combatting whatever threat its faced with.
There are bodies of SEAF troops dead next to a destroyed devastator with a shovel jammed into its chest. SEAF troops are prepared to go full Kreig on robots twice their size.
@@AezryaKitsunei don’t think SE would even only limit them that, for all we know they would fund their main force SEAF like how US army arms theres, a ton of guns and vehicles.
I bet on super earth Because in the first game, they managed to beat the faction that was hundreds of years more advanced while fighting to other enemies
@@gabusdeuxthose peace loving squids had actual mind control powers and a planet destroying device they’d use if they reached Super Earth (non-cannon since SE won the first war story wise but losing shows they blow it up)
@@gabusdeux those "peace loving squids" were not only leagues more technologically advanced than the covenant, but also had psychic powers to boot. They are basically the love child of the Tau and Eldar from warhammer 40k
Its worth noting that Super Earth specializes in fighting numerically superior forces. They also undoubtedly have a number of larger ships built for space combat rather than ground support.
Nah, Helldivers are used to fighting numerically superior foes, but humanity in the Helldiver's universe has near 40k levels of population. Helldivers are special forces and the SEAF in general is nearly incomprehensibly massive.
@lorehammer40k4 the reason nobody wins when 40k is because they fight on all fronts. Humanity was fighting a three front war including a species that literally breeds faster than cockroaches and a species that is far older and has had far more time to reproduce. The cyborgs were far fewer in number yes, but they diverted a third of SE's forces away from the other fronts. In short Super earth won a war that was harder (or at least on par with) Humanity's war in warhamer 40k. Super earth would crush in this fight no contest.
@@onikai7055 maybe, but if super earth's dinky little troop carriers can give them a run for their money due to shear numbers, what can SE cruisers, battleships and aircraft carriers do in similarly massive numbers? Also SE territory is massive. Even if the covenant destroyed the entire SE navy in the early war, SE would copy covenant tech and make a better fleet before the covenant could glass every world.
Biggest issue is we don’t know Super Earths naval to naval capability. But we know the funding is there. Each individual helldiver has their own ship. That’s fucking insane. I cannot imagine the scale of the rest of the navy
"The cost of a single Helldiver Deployment is equal to the cost of a single 'Liberty' Class Cruiser." So the knowledge that there are other types of ships since we fight on a 'Super Destroyer' and the Eagle is effectively the fighter craft of choice here, safe to say that Super Earth DOES have a competent and diversified Space Navy.
Because of how slow the Covenant are to adopt new technology and how extremely militarized super Earth is to the point of trying to weaponize nearly anything and everything. The Helldivers would very quickly start adopting and advancing their technology to match or surpass the Covenant after they get their hands on some wreckages/samples. After a year or less of combat they would likely start overtaking the Covenant unless the Covenant started treating them like the flood and just glassed everything and anything.
The issue with comparing the super earth space navy (SESN?) to the covenant navy is our perspective as players. We effectively only ever engage planets where we have total space superiority, the automatons are forced to fire at us planetside. We are also the specialized orbital shock troops, one branch of the army. We don't see SEAF because we're the vanguard, we're ahead of them, we don't see the navy because they are our vanguard. TLDR: We can't compare space born assets because we never see them, and the super destroyer is a dedicated orbital bombardment craft.
You're right, we don't know anything concrete about the SEAF navy ships, but I believe it's possible to speculate about them based on information already present in the game. 1: The possibility of them having shields is high, since it is a common technology of Super Earth, and they have the advantage of not needing to lower their shields to shoot. 2: Super Destroyers are extremely numerous ships, and they only represent a fraction of the Navy, so it is possible that the other ships exist in equally large or even greater numbers. 3: Super Earth has access to several energy weapons, such weapons could give them greater ease in dealing with Covenant shields that the UNSC lacked. 4: Finally, there is also a high chance that they are very agile ships, since Super Destroyers have the ability to turn and move at extreme speeds through the orbit of planets.
@@LipeSun What makes you believe that their shielding would be on par with the covenant? Who’s ships could regularly tank into the triple digits of megaton yields and keep fighting. The covenant had the industry to produce millions of ships, and they did. Nothing to me suggests that SE plasma is on the same level as Covenant plasma, which can burn through armor with glancing shots, and with direct impact can burn through meters of treated titanium alloy. Plasma Torpedoes could track SE ships endlessly without halting, don’t know if they’d be agile enough to outrun it forever.
@@zenoohshit5498 I won't say for sure that I believe the shields of the SE ships are equivalent to those of the Covenant, but I will say for sure that they could at least withstand a few hits, and I say this based on personal shields (which are better than the Covenant's), in the vast majority of cases, Covenant personal shields can only withstand one hit from an anti-tank weapon before falling, and often the user dies with it, Meanwhile, Helldivers' shield backpacks are capable of withstanding a tank hit before falling and still keeping the wearer alive with little to no injuries, If personal shields can be this strong, then I imagine ship-sized shields should be able to withstand at least a few hits from some of the Covenant ships before being disabled. The Super Earth industry is also capable of producing hundreds of thousands of ships, given the size of the Super Destroyer fleet and the fact that huge numbers of them have already been destroyed, but this doesn't seem to be a bother to SE. Plasma weapons may not be on the same level as the Covenant's, but they are certainly not far behind, because they can burn through the armor of Devastators, whose armor is approximately equivalent to the armor of a Hanvee, Furthermore, they have an area effect, allowing them to take down several enemies at once. Lastly, Super Destroyers are capable of circling an Earth-sized planet in a few seconds, I don't know how fast Covenant plasma missiles are, but I doubt they'll be able to keep up with this for long.
@@LipeSunYou can't really compare a mass produced infantry shielding with capital ship grade shielding that is able to tank multiple nukes and some withstanding orbital Mac platforms that fire at 4% of the speed of light. Also in consideration that the Covie infantry shields get stronger by rank. Game mechanics being lore is a double edge sword, one hand you get funny casualty numbers and the other you get SE Super Destroyers getting blasted out the sky with pretty unimpressive firepower.
@@snimon5824 I can indeed compare if I am going to theorize the strength of the shield as it goes up in level, the shield backpack can withstand a tank shot and quickly recharge afterwards, the shield generator is not much bigger but can withstand the combined firepower of a small army for quite some time, a ship-sized shield doesn't need to be equivalent to the Covenant's, just resisting a few shots from their weapons would already be a good advantage for Super Earth. IIRC not even the highest ranking soldiers' personal shields can withstand a tank shell. I wouldn't call the Automatons' orbital weapons "unimpressive firepower", They're not super impressive, but for cannons of that size, being able to fire into orbit and cause damage to ships with titanium hulls is something to be recognized for.
just gonna point iut about helldivers againts snipers helldivers do have expierince against snipers illuminates theres also reason why a counter sniper weapom exist ingame
Imagine planet with 20,000 players on it. It's 20k super destroyers in orbit. Each with hundreds of frozen divers and we don't even know what other space assets SE navy has.
Of course for balancing reasons we only get up to 5 of them before we're at the mercy of cooldowns. But that's still a potential *minimum* of 100k helldivers.
You have to remember that super destroyers are just space C-17s. They're entirely meant for helldiver support. They arent the F35s of the helldiver universe
Because there’s a difference between how many personnel were killed over a period of time and the limit of active personnel a military can logistically support and deploy at any given moment
@@yunggaryy3088ya but when more than 1 Billion deaths in less than a year of war, is considered more than acceptable. I think the scale of super earths military is much higher than that.
@@imjezzo1989 You cant take video game mechanics into conversations like this lmao. that is video game. there is not a HUGE ammount of lore in helldivers. if you really want to take mechanics of games into account then every spartan killed in multiplayer since Halo CE is canon and lends to the overall numbers of just spartans alone. You HAVE to separate game mechanics from lore.
@@freed991 There is the difference that helldiver's in game statistics, community choices, and if they win or lose is actually consideded for the games lore. Like when the helldiver resupply missions happened and you needed to defend the launch pods with frozen helldiver's. It shapes the story and the numbers are always changing. It's a fluid campaign. Halo instead is a strict cannon with a known amount of gen 2 and three Spartans (ignore the last spartan threes to leave onyx. As far as I know we don't know much about them yet) but the multiplayer is completely separated from the actual lore of the games itself. It's not really a fair comparison to make because both games are doing cannon in different ways. Sorry if this was a hard to understand ramble
the ftl jumps of the super destroyaers are just about instantaneous right? while the covenant have naval superiority, the helldiver's ability to mobilise quickly gives them a tremendous edge. allowing for hit and run tactics in massive amounts.
Honestly, I when I first saw this video months back, I was leaning towards "no". But after seeing how important good FTL is, the SEAF have a HUGE advantage here... their FTL-capabilities literally beat out nearly any other Sci-Fi Universe. It's faster and more reliable than the UNSC, Covenant, and even 40k's solution to cross-galactic travel. Even if the Covies slipspace in a fleet that would crush a smaller SEAF force, they literally just go 'boop', and all them ships are gone. The only issue would come is if the Covenant discovered Super-Earth.. though the SEAF have a massive mobility advantage, that isn't so useful, if you're required to defend the planet.
This is a common theme in such setting wars. The sheer mobility of the Helldivers allows them victories that entire settings, including Warhammer 4o,ooo could only dream of. This alone would be a massive advantage, but the Helldivers are no pushovers, despite being just human.
Something I didn't see mentioned before: FTL is very near instantaneous in Helldivers. Slipspace travel still takes quite a while. Reach and CE are months apart, but the Covenant is significantly faster than the UNSC at Slipspace travel and the Forerunners were quite close to instantaneous travel (as seen in H4) That by itself is a massive advantage in space engagements.
Halo Reach fell on August 30, 2552. Halo CE started September 19, 2552. Thats not Months lol thats days and thats because there was actually multiple conflicts in between the 2 games. Yes Super Earth has faster ships but they are very weak, we can literally see them get taken out from the planets and their space armaments arnt very impressive. The UNSC ships have them beat especially with MAC cannons. Super Earth ships also cant travel past enemy lines which could mean they actually cant travel that fast and just have lots of 'clone ships' or they simply cant penetrate enemy space defenses. Whereas a very small Covenant fleet accidentally traveled straight to earth, absolutely destroyed their defenses then left just as quick lol.
@@phatdogwhile you are technically right about seeing ships get taken out those are super destroyers which are mainly built to provide orbital support and isn't one of their mains warships they use for fleet battles
@@phatdogahh yes cuz a planet surface gun able to shoot something from atmo is weak, ever thought of those scenes you see when a SD explodes, consider that the automaton gun is just that strong and not because the SD is weak?
@@unloyal4847maybe part of what he’s trying to say is true. Covenant ships were notorious for decimating titanium armor and metals as they were basically shooting stars at the unsc. So, even if super earth has bigger ships than the liberty class destroyer, that doesn’t change that the covenant have super earth bested in terms of tech. Also, guerrilla space warfare won’t work for super earths ships either, as the covenant have energy shields on their ships which can block attacks from super earth ships.
Money is on super earth with the covenant probably saying “these guys are more fanatical zealots than us…” obviously in Halo they have ODST but now imagine every single one of them has a personal arsenal of calling in mini nukes artillery powerful weapons, and suddenly every piece of land your conquering can’t be fortified because your playing a game of hide and seek trying to find a squad of shock troopers that are destroying important strategic assets to your war effort. I’d imagine some missions for helldivers would be “deliver this havoc nuke to that covenant carrier” and they’d have ships land on top to drop pod on. Worst case scenario Super Earth finds the home world for each alien species and tells the Helldivers “your mission is to drill this liquid into their planet” and suddenly the planet is breaking apart becoming a black hole
@@karal_the_crazy Does? i see people saying all sorts of crazy stuff super earth has but there is little to no lore for hell divers and most of it seems like head cannon or video game mechanics. Covenant easily steam rolls the hell divers
A lot of the comments here mention, SEAF forces, helldivers is only spec-ops, super earth is really good at reverse engineering tech, etc. I don't see any comments mentioning General Brasch. Pretty much the master chief of helldivers. (Lore accurate master chief) not game master chief
We've seen the training that Helldivers take, they're literally just expendable soldiers to throw on suicide guerrilla warfare missions. Yes they are trained and some survive to be very experienced like General Brasch but they are by no means anywhere near as trained or equipped like a Spartan lol. And to put it in perspective the Spartans were thrown on suicide missions too just like Helldivers but they basically never returned and only stalled the Covenant. The UNSC never fought the full might of the Covenant and only survived the war because of the Banish Rebellion and the Flood.
@@phatdog yeah, but there are billions of helldivers and about 2000ish spartans. Makes no sense comparing them. Also, spartans are expensive to make and takes time. Helldivers are just hot-headed fanatics that grow on every tree. They are super expendable.
@@phatdog The fact that their training is poor does not take away from their role as “Special Forces” that Super Earth gives them, however questionable it may be...
@@phatdog In Training? Without a doubt, but in Equipment?? They are more equal than you think: The Helldivers have a wide arsenal of weapons and armor, ranging from kinetic and laser weapons equal in capacity to those of the UNSC [the latter having unlimited ammunition], Plasma weapons that rival those of the Covenant and armor that does not have to envy much to the Spartan armor in terms of damage absorption, all this Without counting that each Helldiver Captain receives command of a *Planetary Siege Ship* with Subliminal capacity and practically Instant FTL and enough firepower to level a Small City several times.
The unsc is also very good at reverse engineering, they had forerunner engines and shields in a few years. They just didn't have room to breath because the convenent glassed most of their planets before they knew what was going on, and insurgent colonies were also a problem. The unsc was on the road to becoming an empire comparable to the SEAF. The convenent just hit them just before they got there. If the convenent got to the humans maybe a hundred years later they wouldn't have a chance.
A few corrections here: 1. Super Earth definitely has more to their navy than Super Destroyers and Cruisers. They can contend with Automaton space fleets, which when viewed from the ground consist of ships that make Super Destroyers look like toys. And that's not even counting the shadows of Illuminate ships you can sometimes see in skyboxes. Super Earth is hardly lacking in the space fighting department. 2. Super Earth has *rudimentary* energy shields. I wouldn't say they're as good as the Covenant, but they can definitely both bring and break through energy shields. Their application in the space fighting field, though, is definitely lesser, since Orbital Cannons can actually take out Super Destroyers meaning they don't have energy shields/don't have good energy shields. Maybe they only use them on Cruisers and up? 3. A Helldiver is likely approaching being comparable to a Spartan in capability, although obviously not quite as good. Their armor, although fairly meh in game, is canonically made of the same stuff the armor on the Super Destroyer is made of, so some kind of advanced light yet durable alloy like the Spartans. They can use experimental and totally not addictive stims to shrug off grievous injury and boost their physical capability - without which they can already carry and run with dozens of kilos of weapons, grenades, ammo and armor. 4. Unlike the Spartans, Helldivers are not the product of a specific, dedicated and expensive program with only a handful of participants. Helldivers are just young, hot-blooded individuals who volunteer from within the SEAF forces, and, if they survive more than 2 seconds on their downright suicidal Special Ops missions, are damn good at what they do. And given the base SEAF is massive, likely encompassing every aspect of Super Earth life, there's always fresh blood for the Helldivers and the SEAF in general. 5. The success of the Helldivers and SES implies a strategic flexibility beyond that of the UNSC's, meaning they can fight a galactic war in a nimbler and more adaptive manner, which is the main weakness of the Covenant. 6. The difference in morale and war manpower between UNSC and SEAF is incomparable. The whole empire is an army, and one willing to die for Super Earth. This is how they contended with 3 separate invasions by the Cyborgs, Illuminate and Terminids. In fact, given that Super Earth beat Covenant-Lite (the Illuminate) whilst fighting 2 other civilisations 100 years ago, I'd say they're equipped to fight the Covenant.
I think you need to research the sheer scale of the Covenant. They make the illiminate look like a small invasion fleet. The Flood is also significantly more deadlier then the Terminids and the Forerunners and far superior then the bots in every way, they literally have galaxy wide super weapons.
@@phatdog Fighting a 3 war front against 3 completely different opponents. 1 massive rebellion leading to death machine human hybrids than would cut a covvie in half very painfully, 1 peaceloving hyperadvanced race of hyperintelligent beings, and 1 lot of intelligent bugs that HAD star to star capability. This was 100 years ago and Super Earth fought every one of them, AND WON with arguably, less superior tech now. The covenant have the numbers, but they aren't completely fanatic nor completely perfect in speed of most aspects. The flood are pretty easily countered thanks to this thing called helmets. Helldivers have access to Corrosive Gas which will ERADICATE spores. Helldivers can deploy anywhere on a planet's surface in no time at all and can hot drop into a hive. They can complete suicide missions with 24 or less divers. The Flood are formidable, but Super Earth thrives in being the "underdog"
@@glazredfield9489first, how do you know that corrosive gas will counter the flood, it’s basically big bug spray. Second, the flood also have infection forms which will bypass the armor of anyone, even Spartans. Third, if a helldivers comes into the ship with contaminated armor, then the spores will infect at least one person on the ship, and yes, there can be cleaning of the armor before a helldiver re-enters a ship but let’s be honest, at least one person out of the millions in the SEAF will be ignorant and let it happen, which will result in infighting, and then it is just high charity all over again. Not to mention flood dispersal pods which can be a sort of countermeasure to the helldivers. Not to mention the gravemind can be formed in not too long of a time, and if the infestation gets to that point, super earth better pray to the Statue of Liberty because they are not getting out of that. Not to mension that pressure plus the covenant will decimate the SEAF’s morale, leading to a victory for the flood.
also your wrong about the Helldiver is likely approaching being comparable to a Spartan in capability depends heck helldivers not close to spartains 3. they close to odst but even not fully close odst still 10x better in everyway because train for it so think helldivers which are the elite were trained and get gun and instant into war... yah... spartains make odst look like toys... and 3s... 2s.. make all spartains look toys... spartains close warhammer super solider and should say alot example mastercheif is not fastest,strongest,more skill etc spartain 2 but the luckest but being spartain 2 mc for example (Can deadlift at least 3 times his own body weight, and deadlifted 500 kilograms as a test. Kicked a man wearing an exoskeleton comparable in mass to Mjolnir armor 8 meters away) | Class 10 with MJOLNIR armor and keep in mind 3x there body weight and hes with his armor is around a 1 ton and for example class 10 is The weight of an adult elephant. Casually flips overturned 3 ton Warthog jeeps single-handedly. One Spartan moved a large stone monolith while also fighting back the pain of losing half of his left arm lol and his durablity (Renders him virtuously impervious to all UNSC and Covenant infantry weapons, this includes Spartan Lasers, Wraith Mortars, and Scarab beam), at least Small City level with Bubble Shield (Repels all projectiles and nearly all explosions outside the bubble shield. Withstood a several Megaton Nuclear explosion) and striking strength Wall level (A 14-year old John accidentally pummeled several ODSTs to death without even realizing it and launched one of them 30 feet with a few punches) and keep mind again odst make helldivers look childplay helldivers but train.. like special forces Is also comparable to Holly Tanaka, who effortlessly smashed through rock this big with a Spartan charge) i cant find the picture but this pictur vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:FanofRPGs/Spartan_Ramming_Strength and can (Comparable to Cal-141, who deadlifted 5 tonnes Superhuman movement speed (Ran half a kilometer in 17 seconds; nearly 106 kilometers per hour, but tore his Achilles tendon doing it) with Subsonic combat speed (Can react to stun rounds) | Superhuman movement speed (Should be faster than before), higher with Speed Amps, with Supersonic combat speed (Can react to bullets and Covenant plasma projectiles. Has barely dodged handgun fire at point-blank range. Viewed combat with the ODST's in slow motion) higher with Cortana (With her help, he reacted to a projectile he'd be unable to normally)... yep... sorry these spartain 2 helldiver dont comapire and spartains 3 like half that.. only execption spartain 3 who close to spartain 2 and noble 6.. and close mc both hyper leathal vector and few things , Can see Invisible beings and X-Ray/Thermographic Vision with Promethean Vision so alot more to spartains then think... im sorry helldivers very good sci fire... when comes halo.. halo outclass most helldiverse verse tect,power name it all.. but still be pretty good but halo is just that and dont me started ai... any of ai break the helldiverse verse into nothingless.. ai like cortna hack all of super earth forces,and robots.. at same time without even trying... that power ai... im sorry nah.
Some things that aren’t mentioned are super destroyers can move around a planet in seconds and it was stated that one super destroyer has enough firepower to destroy a small moon
@@shoulderpyro in space that isn't that much of a down side when you can just rotate 180 degrees upside down there nothing stoping you from doing that in space plus most covenant weapons are on the sides or bottom so your probably better off attacking from the covenant relative above so they can't shoot back immediately
A major factor few latch onto here: When your FTL moves you around at warp 9.999999, against most possible rivals in a sci-fi battle you get to choose every space engagement. Hell save the covies if the SEAF figured out how to practice tactical use of the alcubierre drive to blink their ships around.
I would like to point out 2 things.1) the super destroyers purpose is low orbit ordinance delivery so it would not fight "battle cruiser" kind of ships and 2) knowing super earth the black liquid(same as the one in meridia) would be used in sone kind of torpedo to make energy shields stop working
Super Earth loves to “burrow” tech and reverse engineer them, take out a covenant ship and they’ll make it 10x better and would mass produce then enough that would even make 40k manifactorum blush
Yeah, no. Helldivers can barely harness illuminate technology. They still don't even know how it works. That and the fact that the imperium is much bigger than super earth. The illuminate and covenant are undeniably more advanced.
That’s completely inaccurate, a lot of covenant technology derives from the nearly 100 thousand year old civilization known as the forerunners, which were basically gods with all of the power they had. If super earth can’t figure out how to replicate a illuminate jet pack they can’t even come close to replicating a covenant ship
The DSS station that Super Earth just now built has shown itself to blow up moons. The discussion is completely over with super earth stomping the covenant now.
@@joshuamitchell5018Let's not exaggerate here, it was said that DSS destroyed a small moon, and we don't know how exactly it did it, so we can't assume that it can do it consecutively and if the same could be done with Covenant ships
@@joshuamitchell5018 the UNSC already had that firepower equivalent with a NOVA nuke. need to know defensive capabilities of the DSS, otherwise concentrated fire isn't going to work on a fleet of hundreds of ships
I feel like it's worth mentioning that the Automatons also have their own spacefaring Navy. Outside of their first Out-Of-Nowhere surprise attack, their Navy hasn't made significant progress towards Super Earth, often times being held back and slowly losing ground to SEAF and Helldiver operations As for the Super Destroyer, I personally think that a full Laser Strike from the Destroyer's Laser Cannon could punch a hole in the Covenant's shields, thus allowing them to damage the Covenant Ships with their other weapons They could also just, like, launch pre-armed Hellbombs at the Covenant
helldivers would put the covenant on another one of their super earth montages and if they were too lazy, John Helldiver would easily put the Covenant on a hospital bed
lets say they do decide to glass a planet in HD2 the problem is when they try they will have to deal with surface to orbit anti ship guns and given the fact the illuminate most likely had shielding similar to the covenant its no stretch to think they could down their ships.
I doubt any orbital weapon the they have can stop a battlecruiser, let alone an Assault Carrier. These are the ships that can withstand a 30 megaton nule without any problems.
It’s worth mentioning that the Super Destroyers that the Helldivers utilise are designed almost entirely for ground support, (as emphasised by all its weapons on its underbelly). It’s also worth mentioning that the Super Destroyer we see in game is reserved exclusively for the Helldivers. The actual naval power would come from the SEAF. Although there isn’t much information regarding them, it’s safe to assume that a frontline has the most action, (if you look on the horizon of some Helldiver missions you can see massive fires indicating the actual frontline). Point in being that the Covenant would be going against a foe which is equally if not more fanatic, (don’t put me in a freedom camp), that has the tools required to defeat the Covenant or at put them in a stalemate. Unlike the UNSC which did not have that Libertea… get it? Funny joke? Right guys?
A big problem with the super destroyer is that its not meant for space combat, all the weapons are on the front and those are meant for orbital attacks
Yup, super destroyers are planetary assault ships, while space combat is the liberty class cruisers specialty. The only thing we know about them is they are as expensive as a super destroyer operation. You can actually see some on automaton planets and, in some cases, crashing down to the surface of a planet when you are doing an automaton mission.
@@bbunkey what you’re forgetting is that no enemy will voluntarily let you go ontop of them to attack, a super destroyer would be absolutely obliterated before they would have any chance to do that
@@Shadow-sword I’d assume due to the ships artificial gravity, all the crew would be leaning awkwardly and that’d make it harder for them to fire their weapons, but I’m no expert on sci fi space tactics lol
The way helldivers send small squads of troops willing to sacrifice themselves for any objective necessary combined with a seemingly unending number of ground troops I believe ground warfare would be near impossible for the covenant. Space warfare is a bit different due to a lack of knowledge. However I believe even though super destroyers are mostly an orbit to ground type vehicle they could likely perform space to space combat fairly well. The level of penetrative capabilities some strategems possess could be used for devastating the energy shield. The ems strike, railcannon, and laser come to mind. So we don't know the capability of super destroyer captains, pilots, and weapons officers, but I believe they could develop strategies to target the larger vessels while having pelicans and eagles performing defensive combat space patrols. Helldivers would definitely suggest aiming the hellpod system into the covenant ships and if successful would willingly sacrifice themselves to destroy power infrastructure or disable shielding to be rescued while higher damage strategems make quick work of exposed power cores. I don't think it would be any easy battle, but just remember. The helldivers turned meridia into a black hole through sheer numbers and determination.
Spartans are literally extremely trained super soldiers and better then Helldivers in every way. They were dropped into enemy territory in large numbers and still lost. The UNSC never actually fought the Covenants full force only small portions of it, in fact they only survive the war because of the Banish Rebellion and the Flood attack. We see Super Earth ships getting blown up from single hits from planetary guns implying they are very weakly armored and feature no shielding. The UNSC ship armaments actually make the Helldivers ships look very tiny too. MAC cannons are SIGNIFICANTLY bigger then the railcanon. They also feature Hellfire missile barrages and have jets that can drop nuke payloads. The UNSC has ODST drop pods which are basically identical to the Helldiver pods and they werent very effective at all against the Covenant ships, good idea tho and was used a few times in the Halo war. The covenants ground units make the Bots vehicles look like toys. And if you cant put up a fight against them in space then I'm sorry to say but their Glassing beam laser is significantly more deadly then the Helldivers one and they will show no mercy at terraforming planets from space.
I would like to: 1: See some spurces that would incline you to believe that the Covenant weapons are so much more powerful than Helldivers ones. You can’t? Well thats fine because: 2: Glassing a planet requires massive amounts of energy from the Covenant to use at a time, and can only be done every so often. Those weak, insignificant Rail Cannons can be used every few MINUTES! I dont think any shields in the Covenant arsenal can handle an every minute barrage of Rail Cannons. And thats just one Super Destroyer. How about thousands, if not millions? Numbers subdue stronger foes with ease: 3: The number of canon Helldivers and thus Super Destroyers is kind of insane. There are so many Super Destroyers that the Helldivers would have both complete air to air superiority and also air to ground superiority. If you really think the Covenant are so strong then how do you think they would fare in a 1vs3 fight against the flood, UNSC and the forerunners? They would get stomped! But the SEAF and by extension Helldivers beat back 3 races and won despite being initially weaker in literally every way. This is like the UNSC beating back every race in the halo universe. Stop coping just because you like Halo, your arguements don’t even use facts and it sounds poorly put together and mostly illogical. The Helldivers and SEAF win. End if story. They are just a better UNSC in every possible way. And before you say; “bUt WhAt AbOuT tHe SpArTaNs!1!1!1! AnD mAc GuN!1!!1!1” Yeah, what about them? Neither did anything other than help the UNSC lose the war slower, while SEAF tech turned the tide of their war against THREE DIFFERENT MORE ADVANCED RACES!!! The Helldivers win no diff. Come at me id you dare, Halo scrub comment warriors.
@@Overhawk_Red1214 you obviously didn't read my reply properly then :) 1) Covenant weaponry is made up from multiple different species all of which are more advanced then humanity. Not only that but they have reverse engineered forerunner artifacts and since you dont know much about them let me make it real simple, they made galaxy wide weapons that can kill to a molecule level. The Covenant obviously didn't access that particular weapon but they did get their smaller weapons. Plasma based weapons burn, they literally melt thru armor to the point that no material the UNSC had was resistant to it so all they could do was put on some layers and hope the user survives by a miracle. And when I say melt thru armor I mean the ships were literally designed to be as thick and bulky as they could but even that wasn't enough. 2) Yes glassing a planet does take a lot of resources but guess what? They have that in plenty as they are literally a galaxy wide threat that have entire planets simply dedicated to making fuel etc etc. The UNSC have rail canons to, they call them MAC cannons and are MUCH bigger then anything Super Earth has shown yet. They were were basically their only winning asset in space combat but would require 4+ ships to take out one Covenant cruiser which number in millions. 3) you brag about the covenant struggling against the flood, unsc and forerunner. Your wrong they were fighting a 1v5! and still managed to achieve their goal but were only stopped due to plot armor with the Flood (A parasite hell bent of infecting all living things) of all things forming and alliance lol. You brag that the Helldivers held back 3 factions, to which yes they did but with HD2 now out do you mind telling me how that war is going again? Last time I checked the bots are getting awfully close to Super Eartj now and the bugs havnt been able to be pushed back at all. Also the illuminate who were supposedly wiped out are back again even stronger. You can actually very easily compare those 3 factions to the Halo universe however I'm sorry to say but the Halo universe makes them look easy. First of the illuminate and the forerunner is nice and easy, when has the illuminate ever developed a galaxy wide super weapon that can kill any living creature down to the molecule level? Second the Terminids vs the Flood. The flood can infect an entire planet within weeks using only airborne spores, also remember those galaxy wide weapons I told you about? Yeah the flood forced them to use it twice! Covenant vs Bots, yeah those bots striders have nothing to fight against the Halo Scarab, the Covenant even have air superiority, planet terraforming glassing beams and ground units that are literally bred to hack, reverse engineer and destroy any tech. 4) "your arguements don’t even use facts and it sounds poorly put together and mostly illogical" you didnt list a single example of how they would win apart from them having "numbers" despite the Covenant literally having more numbers lol. "They are just a better UNSC in every possible way" cool, name an example then? Because I literally just listed everything that the UNSC beats them at. " mAc GuN!1!!1!1” Yeah, what about them? Neither did anything other than help the UNSC lose the war " The MAC gun is literally bigger then any of the Helldivers ships weaponry lmao 🤣the fact that it takes multiple of them to take out 1 Covenant Cruiser implies Super Earth has nothing. Before you go and say the new Super Earth Space station has better weaponry well I encourage you to WATCH THE HALO 2 INTRO CUTSCENE. You'll see that the UNSC actually has multiple of those and still lost to a small Covenant invasion fleet. Bonus) You fail to realize that Super Earth and the Halo UNSC are actually pretty similar, only problem is that the UNSC are stronger. They too held a majority of the galaxy with plenty of resources and manpower. They actually even had more superior weaponry for example the MAC canon I said earlier, their support cruisers actually feature more weaponry variety then the Helldivers ships. They also had more air support like like a lot more and they too had plenty of nukes as well lol and they had FAAAR more ground vehicle support. A perfect example of the difference in tech is the Halo Mantis vs the Helldivers mech, Halo's one features much larger caliber rounds, more munition, is faster, features shielding tech and has thicker armor. As for ground forces SEAF soldiers could be argued as similar to UNSC soldiers, however as for the Divers themselves they're more along the lines of the Halo ODST's with the only difference is that the Divers have access to better tech but overall worst training (They are literally canon fodder in lore sent in to do Guerrilla tactics to take out key objectives). But the UNSC have an even stronger unit aka the Spartans who are far better trained, augmented beyond doubt, have stronger armor, more speed and a hella alot more strength. But despite all that even they were still not good enough to survive the onslaught of the Covenant. As for weaponry, the UNSC rifles and SMG's all feature similar munition to Helldivers, the UNSC actually have a railgun and laser based weaponry too. Now what I need you to understand is that despite the UNSC having very similar and in some cases superior circumstances then Super Earth, even with all that they weren't even able to put a dent in the Covenant forces as in the only thing they could achieve in the entire war was SURVIVE long enough for the Covenant to have to spread its forces in a 5 way battle. The UNSC were losing massively and only survived the war because of the Banish rebellion, the Sangheili rebellion, the Flood emergence and the Forerunner defense systems.
2 things i like to consider when talking about different lores conflicting in video games. 1. Video game mechanics vs real lore, people tend to forget that in books, cut scenes, and general lore is more accurate then just looking at how things work in gameplay, some full fledged spartans have actually died to things that would never kill chief in game, and how enemies feel to fight in helldivers is far different to how they feel to fight in halo. For instance, armor just works fundamentally differently. The diligence counter sniper would likely 1 shot a brute, but the dmr from halo does not 2. Especially with video games, we have little way of knowing the true extent of the lore, you brought this up with both games we have very little real information on the true number of soldiers, but one thing you should address is that looking at active players in helldivers, isn't the best representation of helldivers number, after all they won the first galactic war, helldivers 1 canonically happened. That means super earth has dozens of fully colonized planets, they were defence missions afterall. With that population of under super earth claiming they have 2 million helldivers feels off, and that's ignoring the obvios lack of mention for the SEAF, and like you, i too grew up with halo. So i am also very biased. But i also like to look at all sources to make the most accurate assumptions in these cases.
Another thing that someone else mentioned is that the game in helldivers 2 is a bit more accurate than the game in halo. I think I heard somewhere that all deaths in hd2 is canon, so we know AT LEAST how many helldivers have died
@@jonothanrennert3098 so that would mean that the number of active players is the size of the HDs assuming all of the player stats are canon like the deaths.
The elite piloting the wraith watching the sky as a targeting laser lines up directly on its center mass(its about to be shot with a hunk of tungsten flying mock 7 from orbit)
The Elite hits the Wraith's boosters, swings around as the Diver misses, and vaporizes them just as they're emerging from the ground with a plasma mortar. The Elite then waits for another, pleased with its kill total of ten so far.
@@voidtempering8700 eh I could see a few being hit then the covenant instantly getting jumped on by ship's that can near instantly cover any distance. Also super destroyers are not space combat ships, that's what the rest of the military is for
@@jacobfast1425 Only their FTL is near instantaneous, if a Covenant ship invades, or if they mount a large attack, even weaker Covenant ships would have very good odds at taking multiple ships.
Super Earth would immediately enslave the covenant engineers in the most brutal and inhumane way possible. Every piece of covenant technology they could force them to create would be shipped straight off an assembly line and onto super destroyers. Any recoverable tech and especially those fancy vehicles would be reverse engineered by the end of the year. The Helldivers already have an ungodly amount of fire support even without co-opting covenant tech, but stealing designs like energy swords, shields, or higher power plasma weaponry would make the covenant just another faction on the galactic map.
Honestly, outnumbering Covenant Cruisers with smaller, offensive-minded Destroyers is probably a great idea. Destroyer laser weapons on mass would be ideal for taking down Covenant shield technology, and Super Earth could theoretically create ship-grade plasma weaponry for later stages of the war. Assuming the Covenant have better FTL technology, a Super Earth fleet could likely afford to be jumped, lose a few destroyers, and then retaliate. As long as Super Earth's propaganda machine can withstand the loss of multiple destroyers per cruiser engagement, they're probably better equipped than the UNSC is. Super Earth could afford the cruel cost of void warfare better than the UNSC. Amusingly on the ground, Super Earth forces have readier access to anti-shield technology in the form of their own plasma and laser weapons. What super earth lacks in spartan-grade super soldiers, it probably makes up for with technological flexibility and a more powerful propaganda machine that is even more unified than the covenant's theocracy. TL;DR: SEAF has a more flexible and robust wartime economy and mindset than the UNSC.
One more thing to add: Essentially, the UNSC lost the conventional war against the Covenant. So "definitely better than the UNSC" doesn't necessarily mean Super Earth wins. I assume we're taking the muguffin's out of the equation: The Halo arrays, the Ark, the Flood, etc. The Covenant was defeated more by a comedy of errors, civil war, forerunner technology, and getting High Charity eaten by the Flood.
I would like to add here, Super Earth's FTL Technology is far superior to the Covenant's, like, infinitely superior, besides, Super Destroyers are not even combat ships, Super Earth has ships specially designated for combat that should come in numbers equally large or even larger than the Super Destroyers
Super earth's FTL is instantaneous. It pretty much can't be any faster than that. Any planet Covenant attacks, super earth will respond extremely quickly.
@vineveer4358 another things is super destroyers could definitely support in naval combat if needed but that's not their job. Notice how in game when fighting the Automatons there is never a ship in sight shooting Super destroyers down. The Helldivers Navy clears what airspace so that the Helldivers can work. If the airspace wasn't clear it's safe to say that the Helldivers wouldn't be fighting there in the first place. The Seaf is the Hammer while the Helldivers are the scapel as they have described
If the Covenant were to invade Super Earth, or any of the other planets under SEAF control, I think they would be dealing with a nightmare. Helldivers are literally fearless. They think they never die. They're expendable, yes but there are records of Super Helldive missions against the Automatons being completed with 0% casualties. If 1 to 4 Helldivers can do that, imagine what more divers like that could do to a Covenant army on the ground. As for their ordnance, they have the opportunity to be equipped with weapons far more devastating and convenient than the Covenant and the UNSC. Each of them can carry more firepower than any of the Covenant ground units. They have the capacity to be equipped with the tools to fight the deadliest vehicles head-on and still come out on top. One single Helldiver with a Heavy machine gun (which is essentially just a full auto AMR) and a shield pack can wipe out a squad of elites before he goes down. It's crazy what these brainwashed maniacs are capable of. Now, in space, there's no doubt that the Covenant would probably eradicate their ships. The only way they would secure their victory against the SEAF is to wipe out their navy first. The super destroyers carry and nurture the firepower that the Helldivers need to carry out and complete their missions, so if they don't have that, they will have to rely on what they have left on the planet. Like I said before though, Helldivers have ground superiority big time. The Covenant will be forced to spend a lot of resources on a ground war if they wish to parttake in one against the SEAF. At that point they would have to recover once they do take over a planet. The longer they take to do that, the larger the SEAF's retaliatory force will be.
All great points i agree with but remember that the SEAF navy do have purely Naval combat ships called the Liberty Class cruisers which have a fair bit more firepower than the Super Destroyers. Yes the lure on them are sparse but since they will most likely have way more of the Liberty Cruisers than Destroyers it will not be easy to reach a Helldiver and their Super Destroyer
Not sure if this was added, but the Orbital Railcannon strike sounds and acts like what a MAC in the Halo series does. So that could even the odds on getting rid of the Covenant naval shields during combat.
The Helldivers would be able to shred vehicles, support weapons like the R.R., railgun, autocannon, etc. can bust open a hulk just fine. The R.R. can 2 hit a factory strider too. Edit: R.R. (Recoiless Rifle) could delete a mechanized bile titan thing.
Scarabs are a bit bigger than a factory strider, and slightly better armed. They often carry troops with them like a giant IFV, so not unlike the strider. That being said, a squad of helldivers should still be able to bring one down. Even if it can survive a few recoilless rifle rounds and 500kg bomb hits, I doubt it'd survive a 380mm barrage.
Okay the covenant as much as I love halo are boned againts super earth because we know how this goes it’s called the first galatic war. The covenant had their hands full with Odsts and Spartans as limited as they were helldivers especially the fact 90% of all engagements end in helldivers accomplishing the mission would overwhelm any covenant strategy. Furthermore super earth has had a century to prepare for a round two with the squids or the illuminate. Arguably even more advanced than the covenant more leaning towards forunner level. Yet were wiped off the face of the galaxy wil super earth faught two other factions. Super earth has two legendary soilders in general Brasch ,and John helldiver who rival the master chief ,the numbers in space and on the ground, the experience fighting multiple factions, as well as technology to turn planets into black holes, create sector missile defense systems, and bio warfare that can stop invasions of solar systems. It’s just one is a semi realistic stylized stained glass empire, the other is a comically over powered war machine. I can’t say super earth isn’t coming out on top
You kinda forget... Heldivers 2 already beat our existing enemies by a ratio of 1 - 40... and every time is 4 Helldiver vs a regiment size of enemy force...
At first, I would've said "no". I didn't even think the SEAF would've been able to defeat the UNSC when the game first dropped. Buuuut everything that happens in HD2's gameworld is cannon. All of the Divers, all of the Deaths. And that's hundreds of millions of divers dead, with no one batting an eye. The thing that kinda has me leaning towards the SEAF winning is their FTL-Tech. It's stupid-OP, and beats out even the Covenant and 40K races in terms of how fast and reliable it is. There hasn't been any lore shown about wind-up or preparation times, or if the actual travel-time takes days.. as far as we know, if a Super Destroyer wants to go from one end of the galaxy to another; the MF just presses a button and 'poof'. There it is.
Helldiver's using fire weapons And gas weapons would be funny. Watching grunts running around on fire or gassed covenant troops walking around randomly, blind firing at random. In the halo universe. The grunts and smaller troops can be spooked or scared easy.The helldivers could dark fluid planets or use bug spores against the covenant. There's nothing the covenant could do to stop bug spores from traveling in space and spreading from planet to planet.yes they could glass a planet once the bug spores start making outbreaks of bugs. Also the bugs and bots will be attacking them also. Also the helldiver's are starting to make a space station. So we gotta consider that.
Firstly; We don't have the dark fluid anymore. It was being studied, and was used in an emergency to collapse Meridia. They flat out told us that we have no more Dark Fluid after the operation. People arguing this need to fucking read the messages from High Command. Secondly; this is Covenant vs Helldivers. No one else. The Super Destroyer is a terrible ship, and will be ripped apart by even the smallest of Covenant ships. Thirdly; now that we have said station, we have seen it is *hilariously* inept at combat operations. The populace is sending the damn thing to places where we can't bother going *just to get it out of our way.*
I'm pretty sure one Liberty-class cruiser is as expensive as one Helldiver operation. This is pretty much a confirmation that they are similar in numbers. Also, they are way more specialised for space warfare, using lasers and maybe fighters. Considering the fact that Super Earth has access to way more resources and has a gigantic industry compared to the UNSC, while equipping their forces with energy weapons and advanced navigational technology, I say the Covenant is facing an actual threat. The never ending waves of the SEAF, the fast response time from the side of Super Earth and the heavy use of combined arms would probably overwhelm them.
Super destroyer are specifically for ground support only so they wouldn't even likely engage other ships at all. This is where cruisers would step in to deal with it, the cruisers routinely deal with automaton appox. 1km 'carriers' at the moment which is armed with an equally long rail cannons. One scary factor that super earth has over covenant and UNSC is instantaneous galactic wide FTL. Super Earth can swarm and level every fueling depot, farm, city, population center, government center, knowledge center and food source the covenant has then leave before the first defense ships arrive to deal with them. Inversely Covenant throw pretty large fleets at problems and in a head on scenario super earth would struggle to repel any single fleet alone but as mentioned before the helldiver core can make sure they get starved and covenant seemingly while not needing materials as often have a food problem. Finally more possible fun factors: There's a non zero chance super earth is earth original, its quite possible one was destroyed in the past and they just moved it to another earth like planet. Super Earth intentionally started this war as a depopulation method. WH40k imperium guard once deployed average lifespan is 14 minutes, A Helldiver is 12 seconds. In spite of this they're racking up easily over 100:1 kill ratios. Do not underestimate anyone who can call an air strike or orbital strike on demand with nearly zero hassle. UNSC has to do paperwork for every strike, organize. supply, and plan for it. The covenant never ever seemingly get anything sent out fast enough anytime a spartan shows up to kick the hornets nest. Chief mows them all down and reinforcements are never sent in the required numbers to fill in the holes. Super Earth has zero problems throwing helldivers to fix the problem, and they are considered the special forces, a drop in the bucket to the poorly armed PDF and the SEAF troopers. At some point we have to reconcile the sheer vast number of helldivers and earth citizens at super earth's disposal. Morally Super Earth would destroy planets and make species extinct the only reason they did not eliminate two of the three species in the last war is they had uses. Bugs as FTL fuel and Bots as free labor. Majority of the covenant species would likely be forced on the dinner menu if edible, or wiped out entirely as they're not going to provide any better services than the bots or bugs currently do. I also wouldn't put it past super earth to sacrifice a dying super destroyer to sublight (we're talking about a ship that can orbit a planet under a minute at sublight) into a covenant ship and with that much ordnance aboard that is bound to cause a lot of damage. Finally Super Earth is quite capable of stealing tech. They have stolen nearly everything the illuminate had and 'liberated it', the powerful alloys and shields the covenant have the advantage will only last a long as it proves too much to be an enigma to them and or cost factor (only reason super earth wouldn't build an advantage). Which isn't long considering how technologically advanced the illuminate where. If Super Earth had the capacity to make Spartans and they saw the price tag either one of two things happen. 1. They never commission a spartan due to price tag along as thousands of helldivers and their replacements would be cheaper and get the job done. 2. They economically make as many people Spartans as possible, against their will... for freedoms sake. And finally: there is a non zero chance Super Earth froze all the veterans from the first war and are continuously thawing them out now. As for species advantage Grunts - a worst target than standard bots. Bots are able to rip humans apart too and have immense numbers, networking and are not cowardly. Jackals - Illuminate in the first war had extremely capable snipers so far they have not been spotted from the vangaurd force invading. For agility the helldivers have to deal with leaping bugs that are aware enough to dodge shots or react fast enough to catch and return grenades to the helldivers. Elites - toughness wise they're probably close to a berserker and helldivers have the capacity to mag dump enough ammo to take those out. Tactically they're probably as tricky as a stalker and those are very deadly. Helldivers already have anti shield weaponry in plasma weapons and they effectively are miniature fuel rod guns able to wipe out small squads at a time as a baseline plasma rifle, we haven't seen any heavier plasma weapons in the helldiver core but they can and will likely exist. Brutes/Hunters - Nearly every bug bigger than a car is probably a lot tougher than a brute, never seen an anti tank rocket bounce off a brute before. There been documented cases of anti tank rounds bouncing off the larger bugs or causing minimal damage.
here are my extra notes on this, I dug *a lot* of this from the deepest pits of lore. first of all, liches, they are basically a flying scarab, it has heavy weapons one all sides and the same plasma turret. also a bonus for the helldivers, stealing the convents weapons and vehicles, this would give helldivers a huge advantage against the covenant. also the covenant has a whole list of other vehicles other than the ones you mentioned: locusts are mini scarabs that could do reasonable damage, specters and prowlers are equal to the warthog, the brute choppers are bike cars that have a huge spiked wheel on the front, the shadow transport literally appeared in one mission and is a ground transport similar to a bus that has 2 shade turrets and can carry up to 2 ghosts, the seraph is a space fighter that is capable of destroying entire UNSC (humans) dropship squads solo, the vampire is another flying ship made for air to ground combat and uses giant needler cannons to destroy ground units, a grunt goblin is a mech suit built by grunt which uses a hunter's plasma cannon along with a double barrel needler. keep in mind that super earth could steal every single one of these. the needler and other needle related tech could be used by super earth to create stronger weapons utilizing the explosive power of the blamite (yes that's the real name) crystal's combine explosion to their advantage.
The covenant would stomp them out most likely. The Hunters would probably be their best aspect. But the brutes would probably be a large detriment to the Covenant.
@Lyleecow i feel like it wouldn't be a full stomp since they are both very familiar with plasma weaponry, both also utilize shields and invisibility too. Illuminate probably have the better overall knowledge as they know how to utilize black matter and how to travel thru black holes in shit. I'm not saying that will win them the war but the illuminate are definitely no slouches
Considering helldivers can get shot in the chest by a tank shell and survive and fight at 100% effectiveness with a simple stim they could definitely tango with some covenant troops Not to mention every helldiver could get there own personal shield generator something the unsc only gave out to a few select units and Spartans I would say helldivers are between odst’s and Spartans in terms of lethality
Honestly Super Earth would throw Helldivers at any problem they encounter and with sheer amount of them problem would be probably solved. In this moment there's already 2.3 bilion Helldivers dead just in the Second Galactic War (and nearly 100bilion of their enemies). Super Earth must have insane resources. Also the ability to FTL jump into any place in the galaxy in an instant is just op.
Helldivers are gonna do a backflip bazooka trickshot and scream freedom destroying an entire battalion of covenant. But will then in the same breath die in the most stupidest most unexpectedly mundane way afterward. Like there comrade’s landing pod falling right on top of them.
Here's the issue with the covenants navy. If one of their ships gets destroyed it's a huge lose versus the helldiver's are able to recover from their loses way way faster. It's not a matter of power but a matter of does the covenant have the ability to defeat the industrial juggernaut of the helldiver's and I genuinely don't think so
On top of that. That's assuming the covenant even have their shipyard which can't really move so it's stuck in their universe which would mean the covenant would have no support once they enter helldiver's universe. In addition your argument that elites would just close in cus helldiver's are using explosives is 100% idiotic cus did you forget the divers are willing to blow them selves up to kill and enemy than they are to save their own skin. The covvies don't get reinforcements like the divers do and the sentries alone would smoke anything from the sky. You obviously have never seen sentry spam in defense missions. The covenant may have the weapons tech and numbers advantage but without an actual line of supplies their numbers would eventually be dwindled down by fanatics that have an unlimited economy behind them with a near endless supply of weapons to choose from. I will however give you credit that AT FIRST the covvies would appear to smoke the divers but the would retreat recover and kick their asses out of the galaxy
Oh and I forgot ftl travel is way faster in hd2 than in halo so even if the covvies try to chase important ships down they would not be able to catch up since their ftl requires time for prep
@@SageTheSahash Also Helldivers DO outnumber the Covanent because they rule over the whole Milky way while the Covanent only rule of the Orion arm of the milky way
@@Tengu-Atlas i also forgot to mention super earth has a nasty habit of adapting to the enemy. Plasma based weapons cool were are gonna make anti plasma armor. Energy shields? Cool ours not only works better but we have stronger arms to knock out theirs. A wraith would get 1 shotted by quasars. The only chance the covvies have is naval battles but going back to what I said the covvies would have a very limited amount of ships meanwhile super earth can casually just create a black hole
couldn't be farther from the truth. The covenant lost the unyielding heirophant and shrugged it off as barely a footnote. FTL travel doesn't mean much against a space-faring army with hundreds of times your firepower and durability. It just means you get to zoom to your death faster. If we only account for the forces we have knowledge of, the SEAF does not have as big a chance as many people here think it does.
The biggest difference is the FTL technology. Helldiver universe has an instant FTL jump compared to wormhole type in halo universe. So yeah if the laser canon of the super destroyer CAN damage the shield, then it would be random jump onto the covenant ship following with helldivers drops.
I could totally imagine an super destroyer FTL jumping inside a Covenant ship while being filled with hellbombs to the brim. Tech is more expensive than helldivers, but still, just consider the amount of equipment left on a planet after every mission. Losing one of the smallest available ships to a Covenant ship is a no brainer, especially for these super fanatics.
Hard to take the covenants odds seriously when a group of four helldivers can fry dozens of scarab sized threats in a single mission and can freely deploy shield packs capable of blocking tank shells as well as wear armour heavy enough to eat direct missile strikes, even in space all they need to do is turn the ship sideways and fire the hellpods and barrages for boarding parties as up and down is a dead concept in the void, then the ship can disappear with their much faster more reliable ftl while the squad ransacks the insides of the ship like the blood soaked lunatic zealots they are, then stacking on the having the numbers to fight a three pronged war of attrition against cyborgs literal swarms of man sized bugs and an outer galactic threat with teleportation shields mind controlling nanites and world consuming wmds. And that is completely dismissing the concept of the rest of seaf as we know little of their true scale and ability
I imagine a mission boarding Covenant ship will be overloading the Anti matter reactor with extraction not being that important in their strategy planning.
@@スフィアマスター I’m sure their will be an extraction plan, probably high jacking a drop ship of some form, but it would be a hell of a ride getting out with no guarantees, h divers me be ultimately expendable but super earth isn’t the unsc, they will have a plan to get them back if they can manage to get out fast enough
Good luck getting a hellpod to breach covenant shielding, or orienting a SD to drop them and getting the squad ready before a single torpedo from a covenant fighter, let alone one of a Cruiser or ship, shatters it. Talking about ground battles is a moot point of the covenant doesn't bother with them. Naval Superiority has to be contended with before all else is considered, and in that regard, the SEAF has a very, very tough fight on their hands.
@@cal928 I mean with how often throughout the series we board covenant ships, I can’t particularly see it as that big of an ask, basically do it once per game. Getting a group of divers onboard to rip and tear seems a simple job
@@Shadow-sword you do it once in the trilogy- after it’s already landed. Every other time you’re either teleported into the center or it’s been taken over by the flood. The boarding of the SDV in Reach cost a frigate. So a super destroyer attempting to launch a bunch of pods not only has to take the shields down first (it can’t. Because any basic covenant weaponry would shred it within seconds,) but it then has to fire the pods and hope they don’t get blown up first or hit a thick section of hull and get stuck. and even if it punches a hole through, that area now has no oxygen, and I don’t see O2 tanks on those divers.
There is a line that I haven’t seen anyone mention, if you interact with the weapons officer aboard your super destroyer, there’s a chance she says something along the lines of “there’s enough ordinance on this super destroyer to destroy a small moon” and there are millions of these super destroyers. Not only that but the super destroyer is a relatively small faction of the SEAF navy
I think Super Earth would handle the covenant much better than the UNSC simply because they have the numbers and are already used to fighting galactic spanning wars with aliens where as the UNSC was already crippled from internal strife and was in no state to fight the covenant when they arrived
Helldivers are the Spartans of Super Earth. They're sent on high priority missions that the standard SEAF soldier can't handle. It's why Helldivers are only sent in teams of 4, because they're that capable and efficient with doing their job. It's why they also have a dedicated Super destroyer for their forces due to their speciality. Yes, there can be 200,000 thousand Helldivers on a single planet but considering the enemies of Super Earth, that's probably how powerful their enemies are. We cna assume that for every 4 Helldivers, there are 40 SEAF soldiers, meaning Super Earth wins by attrition and the unconventionality of the Helldivers. Not to mention the numbers of Specialist Helldivers, like scout divers, Ghost Divers etc
You talk about jamming signals, which has a point, but there are on-ground callin's like the SEAF artilery that can be used without connection to a Destroyer. Plus it depends on how strong the jamming may be. Having pinpoint calls thanks to stratagems allows for a lot of jamming being possibly useless, outside of close proximity to a jammer as we see with the automotons.
To be fair, helldiver's Super destroyer are just for fire support as most if not all of their weapons are for ground engagement, i dont think we've seen propper S.E.A.F. warships yet My headcanon is that Super Earth's navy gets space superiority on a planet and then the helldivers join in to dive instead of having super destroyers fight in space battles
glass the planet, send out carriers and other aerial assualt vehicles to defend the carrier while its glassing the planet, dont even forget the brutes, helldivers are gonna get ripped apart by em, reach was about super earths size so this should be easy
The conviction of the covenant to their great journey seems weak comparer to the blind zeal of divers. I actually thing super earths inexplicable vice like grip on the perception of its fighters and willingness to gaslight its fighters into doing anything would result in super earth winning any engagement with a near peer adversary.
Helldivers are all ground game really. They have capable ships but they are basically the same as UNSC ships… and I think we know how that goes. And ground game doesn’t matter against the covenant when they can retreat and glass the entire planet. If the covenant didn’t break itself with the great schism humanity wouldn’t last. Helldivers will get steamrolled by the covenant
I don't think people realize just how hopeless the Human-Covenant war was for humanity. Reach was the best defended planet outside of Sol by a country mile, and the UNSC could provide little resistance to the Covenant once they sent a proper fleet. The "3-1 odds" thing for space combat doesn't mean the UNSC destroyed one covenant ship for every three, it's that the UNSC required three times the amount of ships to even hope for a victory. The Covenant would glass Super Earth within a similar time frame to the Human Covenant war.
And I don't think you realize the loony toons levels of insanity that is super earth. Lemme put this into perspective for you Super Earth already won a Covenant-equivalent empire, the Illuminate. You can compare Illuminate technology to covenant and see they are comparable, even physiologically the Illuminate are somewhat similar to the elites, just *squid* Super Earth beat them in a war so hard that the illuminate got completely demilitarized, stripped of their tech, and were literally kicked out of the galaxy in the space equivalent of a rowboat with a hole in it. Super earth did this, while fighting communist terminators and the "we have zerg at home" Super Earth won all fronts in the first Galactic war *This was in 2084* The first galactic war was from 2040 to 2084. Their main assault rifle, was an AR-15 BASED PLATFORM They took over the ENTIRE GALAXY in your lifetime. That same super earth now has the ability to make a planet into a black hole, is experimenting with putting that blackhole in a gun (if the leaks are to be believed), has better FTL travel than the covenant because they dump oil in the engine, Essentially has a death star in the form of the DSS, which that alone could at least do a number on High Charity considering they tested it by BLOWING UP A MOON, and on top of backwards engineering advanced alien tech in a matter of days to weeks, and being able to mass produce everything at a retarded rate, they have a military so brainwashed dedicated that the most zealot of elites gets an inferiority complex, while your average brute wonders why their first reaction to being thrown into a wall is to scream "FOR DEMOCRACY!" before failing 5 times to enter a stratagem code, shoot his team mates and then blow up the whole place conveniently missing that one single brute. Super Earth runs on insanity, loony tunes logic, and literal weaponized stupidity. They borederline function like the Orks the covenant are not winning.
No. They would not. For one simple reason; In order to get boots on the ground, you first need to keep ships in orbit. And it took the UNSC 70 ships vs 8 Covenant ships, and pretty much lost. UNSC ships are made for space combat. SEAF ships are not. SEAF ships are made to bombard planets below them, not engage other ships. You cant send Helldivers onto planets if your ships cant even stay in orbit for more than half a minute.
I actually agree for the most part, however, there is also the chance that super earth either reverse engineers or just steals covenant weaponry (don't know much about covenant weaponry so feel free to tell me if there is something wrong) I also think it would have a new type of effect when your in covenant space or if the covenant are invading, (please check Bad Timing - Helldivers 2 to see what the effects would be) it would probably be another thing like the automatons, helldivers push them out the first time, they come back with greater force and then it becomes an absolute clusterfuck, and since the illuminate aren't here yet there is also that, that the helldivers must worry about to when they come back, so it would be a war on 4 fronts, so not great, but also the illuminate, covenant, automatons, and terminids would be fighting each other so there is that we must take into account, so probably just a stalemate if I am to be honest.
@belbekstrullour4996 as cool as the 4 front thing is i believe this is a hypothetical 1v1 covenant vs super earth not counting the other factions on either side. Also gotta count the whole seaf navy as helldiver super destroyers don't engage in navy combat at all. Plus because of their FTL capabilities they can instantly spawn over whoever ot whatever they want to destroy
About the whole stealing tech stuff, the covenant are very well versed in that. The covenant only had one jackal shield be reverse engineered in the human covenant war. Once the covenant see how good the FTL drives are, I’m sure they’d snag some for themselves, the only reason they never did in the human covenant war was because they didn’t have to, as they had better tech than the humans, which makes the covenant verses super earth much more contested. Not to mention their plasma cannons and glassing beams thst can put rounds clean into super earth cruisers and destroyers. And not to mention that the covenant’s elite forces can eliminate a whole spartan team, much more trained and equipped compared to the helldivers. So I’m personally going to say that this is much more nuanced than people may think
In the Halo Universe, the biggest reason as to why humanity kept losing was because of their inability to maintain space superiority. They only won due to the anger of a man in a green suit of armor and his blue vtuber model (accurate, but I'm making a joke here too). Given the unknown amount of SES Cruisers and every Super Destroyer being essentially the equivalent of the UNSC's Halberd-class destroyers or possibly some lower class UNSC cruisers such as an unmodified Halcyon-class (do some lore digging and compare it to the super destroyer), it would be unlikely that SEAF would be able to maintain space superiority. High Charity, the fleet that destroyed Reach, and the fleet around the unyielding heirophant could be estimated to be over 2000 ships and that's of the higher tier Covenant cruisers. So assuming the covenant have space superiority over a planet but decide not to glass it (such as their is a special forerunner artifact on the planet), the planet is essentially blocked off from the rest of Humanity. Helldivers would have no strategems available to call in and would only bring to the fight what they could transport on Eagle's (assuming they aren't tasked with air superiority which is mostly an irrelevant factor when space superiority is a far more determinate outcome of Sci fi conflicts), pelicans, and ground assets leaving them without deployable turrets, call in weapons, and orbital strategems. Meanwhile the covenant have full access to their orbital support with some aerial assets available since the SEAF air force would contest the skies, the Helldivers and SEAF on a single planet would be able to out up a hell of a fight before losing. Ultimately, when it comes to a planetary invasion, the space battle would essentially be an overwhelming victory for the Covenant while the every planetfall operation would result in pyrrhic victories for the Covenant. Should this war fight all the way to Super Earth, I do believe that the covenant would ultimately succeed, but would take tons of time to economically, and militarily recover from this conflict leaving them perfectly vulnerable to other factions such as the illuminate. EDIT: doing some research of my own and it appears that Super Destroyers are far weaker than a UNSC Halberd and unmodified Halcyon. Moreover when comparing the numbers and observations they cannot even stand toe to toe against a UNSC Paris class as seen in my 2nd comment below.
It sucks that they don't elaborate on the liberty class cruisers in the Helldivers' verse but it's hard to say the covenant would outright when because "big ships". They state that every orbital attack the super destroyer has but stronger plus FTL capabilities. If they are purely focusing on space battles you could argue that if they get a foothold on a planet they could setup orbital guns like the Helldivers did for that one major order (i forget which one). The liberty cruisers are faster than the covanent ships and have weapons that can take down their shielding which the UNSC had trouble with so it's hard to say super earth gets beat in space outright
@@Tengu-Atlas I can agree with the FTL, but offensively and defensively, i do not believe the SEAF navy can survive unless the Liberty-class cruisers are more impressive than General Brasch and his incredible service record. In Halo, one of the first space battles was between a UNSC Paris-class frigate and a CRS-class Covenant light cruiser. The Paris boasts 60cm of Titanium-A armor (Closest known IRL permutation is Titanium-50), with a MAC gun which can launch 600 ton depleted uranium rounds at velocities faster than a 380mm round from a Super Destroyer and is also armed with 3 shiva class nukes. Although no direct numbers for Shiva's are stated, its sister class, the Havok, is a relatively newer and improved tactical nuke with a yield of 30 megatons (30,000,000 tons of TNT) so for the sake of this argument, I am going to say that Shiva's have a yield of 15 megatons (15,000,000 tons of TNT) (For reference, the Tsar Bomba was the biggest IRL nuke detonated at 50 megatons which is 50,000,000 tons of TNT). The CRS was hit with 2 MAC rounds which weakened its shields and was still hit by a shiva and didn't die. The Paris was hit with a handfull of plasma torpedos which heavily damaged the Paris with crew damage reports stating 1 torpedo can burn through 56cm of Titanium A armor. The Paris was designed for combat against human insurrectionists so is fairly durable against kinetic weaponry, but incredibly weak against plasma weaponry. A SEAF Super Destroyer (referred to as SD from here on out) has the dimensions of 170x80 meters not counting height and carries hellbombs which are the most destructive explosive armament aboard an SD. Upon visual comparisons with IRL nuclear tests and in-game hellbombs, hellbombs appear to have an explosive yield of 1.5 kilotons (1,500 tons of TNT). For reference, one of the nukes used in WW2 had a yield of 15 kilotons (15,000 tons of TNT). The average height of a human being is 1.7 meters tall and a hellbomb appears to be 1 meter tall compared to a human and about 0.5 meters wide when comparing with Helldiver player models. Doing some math, you can fit around 330 hellbombs (1 hellbomb per 1 meters length = 170 hellbombs, 1 hellbomb per 0.5 meters width = 160 hellbombs, 170+160=330; Side note, this number makes no sense since you need to account for open space in the hanger, bridge, armories, hellpod storage, helldiver cryo pods, ammo storage for 380's, 120's, 500kgs, 50 Cals, Rockets, Mechs, etc... but we'll use this value for the argument) in one SD. 330 hellbombs when exploded at the same place at the same time would have a yield of 330 kilotons (330,000 tons of TNT) which is significantly less than a shiva class tactical nuke. Now I've already made the comparison for the 380mm cannon as the MAC is, numbers wise, far superior than the 380 so we can talk about the laser cannon and the railcannon. The railcannon despite being able to fire a round at a high velocity, it can only one-shot Bile Titans, Hulks, tanks, and anything smaller. We are talking about naval combat here against a ship that can survive a 15 megaton explosion so unless the railcannon was converted into a minigun and fired a denser round at a higher velocity, it won't make any meaningful damage against a single CRS. As for the Orbital laser gun, comparing it to covenant glassing which can burn hotter and wider than the orbital laser, it is considerably weaker than covenant armaments, but is one of the best bets against covenant shield technology assuming an SD can stay alive for long enough to deplete a shield that can withstand a 15 megaton explosion. Now in terms of an SD's armor, it can't survive a single round from an automaton surface-to-orbit gun (as seen when orbiting a hostile automaton planet). The orbital guns they use appear to fire a round that is visually similar to a 380mm round (you can climb on top of the guns in the "destroy orbital cannon" missions and see the round used). Although no density, mass, volume, velocity, material, or overall energy values are given, it does have enough energy to leave the atmosphere of a planet and still be able to one-shot an SD. Not to mention the lack of energy shielding SD's have. And of course due to a relatively large lack of lore in the HD2 universe, there are unknown variables when it comes to the armor material and density used on SDs. With SD's being unable to survive what appears to be a 380mm round fired at a velocity faster than a planet's escape velocity and doesn't even have enough explosive energy to even bother the CRS's energy shields, the entire fleet of SEAF SD's seems unable to stand against a single covenant fleet. For any chance of the SEAF Navy to survive a naval engagement with the covenant, as I said in the beginning of this comment, those Liberty-class cruisers need to be more impressive than General Brasch himself to stand any chance against a CRS-class light cruiser. Most of my information comes from Halopedia, the official wiki for Halo lore, IRL nuclear tests post WW2, and visual observations made in Helldivers 2 on both the bug and bot front.
Don't forget - We would have lost the war if not the Great Schism, They found Earth and obliterated most of the defenses with a small mining fleet with guard detail for the Prophet....
@puggyjman1073 fair points all around I'm just not sure where you got the information that SDs get destroyed by a single orbital gun shot. Yes they get destroyed in orbit but we never see how many they are shot with specifically. So that is just pure speculation on your part. Otherwise there is just not enough information on the liberty class cruisers so it's hard to know other than superior FTL and possible shield capabilities. I think SDs are just perfect for their job since Super Earth is more focused on conquering and taking over planets for their industry and resources unlike the covanent who are motivated by Forerunner artifacts. The real problem regardless of fire power is just that helldivers have numbers since they rule over the whole milky way while the covanent resides over the Orion arm. If Super Earth can utilize their numbers and guerrilla tactics with their superior FTL they have a chance of winning plus they have the DDS now and more stuff on the way
@watch.v-dQw4w9WgXcQ The UNSC basically crippled themselves before hand tho dealing with the insurrectionist so the UNSC were always on the back foot. I wondered how they would've held up at full power or if they didn't send their spartans (mostly the IIIs) on suicide missions so often
On the ground, I give it to Helldivers for how closely they work with the Super Destroyers. Plasma and Laser weapons are readily available, so they could deal with shields fairly well. But in terms of pure Naval power and military command, Covenant all the way. And I think that's the deciding factor given how it went for the UNSC. Still, none of this matters if General Brasch and John Helldiver are on the field.
There are two things I think that would guarantee the extinction of the Covenant if they were to ever attempt to fight Super Earth. First off is the sheer amount of variables considered when fighting Helldivers. The Covenant could probably adapt and counter regular SEAF soldiers after learning their tactics and how durable (or not) they are. Against a squad of Helldivers, ir even a single one, there are no guarantees. Not a single ounce of predicability. Every single diver crafts and perfects their singular preferred loadout before each mission. There are so many different ways a Helldiver could kill you that just having one land in your vicinity drastically reduses your statistic probability of success as a Covenant soldier. You would never know exactly what kind of danger is heading your way until you actually see the Helldiver, and by then it's a good chance it's far too late for the enemy. Secondly, Super Earth society has drilled the love of Managed Democracy, Freedom and Liberty into the minds of every single member of their considerably sized armed forces and Navy, and most likely almost every civilian. The Helldiver Corps is a fanatical, zealous and blindly loyal branch of SEAF. A Helldiver will sacrifice themselves without a second thought in order to win a battle, or even a single fight. Combine that with the appearance of their armor, their ability to use stims to shrug off otherwise fatal wounds and even enhance themselves temporarily, and the unpredictability of just how a Helldiver will go about trying to eliminate you...the Covenant would lose because fighting Super Earth would be just too much. Too much loss, too much uncertainty, too much broken morale. They wouldn't stand a chance.
2:25 what? 25ml? Lol i think we hit that number of dead helldivers in the first week❤😂 super earth has 100 yrs of frozen helldivers on all 200+ planets of they'r domain so numbers are really off here, plus we don't really know about birth rate of both parties, but 25ml is super low.
Helldivers seem very reliant on orbital supremacy, if they can get that then yes. Helldivers wield more power than even the most experience Spartan, but have a fraction of the lifespan.
@dotmadhack life expectancy is different than life span, the life span of a gunner in Vietnam is about like 2 seconds 💀. So not only do Helldivers face worse odds than that but they have double the life expectancy than the U.S did in Vietnam
The covenant wins easy, estimates put their empire size anywhere from 1000-10000 planets, meaning they have a population that likely reaches far into the trillions, they also have more firepower, more manpower, larger ships, more advanced technology, 1000s of years of combat experience, and more, and the big one, strong energy shielding for ships and infantry. Helldivers Federation of Super Earth, has an empire consisting of 261 planets grouped into 55 Sectors, they have less advanced tech, are considered highly expendable given the tactics used by commanders (meat waves) and have relatively weak ships for space combat. There isn’t any population size mentioned in game, so we can’t say exactly how much, but being realistic we can probably say they have a population in the low trillions, and that is with 261 planets, the covenant has anywhere from 1000-10000. Also the covenant isn’t stupid, a lot of the comments i see are based on the idea that the covenant won’t use glassing, when in reality they definitely would, it would not take long for the covenant to glass most of the less defended planets under the control of Super Earth. In conclusion The covenant would steamroll through super Earth, using their naval superiority to weaken logistics, destroy super earths highly inferior navy and also glass most the planets. Super Earth would fare better in ground combat, but overall would struggle given the technological and manpower advantage the covenant has. The meat wave and high logistics tactics that super Earth relies on would not work against an enemy that uses the same tactic but has an empire 10 to 100x larger and more advanced. This match up isn’t even fair, the UNSC got absolutely steam rolled by the covenant, and they arguably have better technology and tactics than super Earth, however less manpower and output.
First of all glassing isn't instantaneous and takes from days to a week depending on what ships they are using. Super earth's FTL is superior to the covanent's and would just instantly teleport ships to stop them. The SEAF has liberty class cruisers designed for space battles and the DSS which can also use FTL. While the covanent's empire is impressively large they only occupy the Orion arm of the milky way while S.E. empire spans the whole milky way. So the numbers are in S.E.'s favor and since they are so fanatical and patriotic everyone one is getting military training at least! While the covanent have some planets and species that only make equipment for that and aren't combatants. Helldivers are a formidable enemy highly trained well equipped and arent stupid. The only stupid ones are the ppl that will underestimate them and get fucked over
@ Nah they still losing, FTL isn’t decisive in this war, and that is really the only advantage they have over the covenant, FTL undoubtedly requires a ton of “fuel”, fuel that won’t exist when the Covenant destroys the supply lines and glasses most of the planets. As of the launch of Helldivers 2, there are 55 sectors with a total of 261 planets. (counting Super Earth), 261 planets won’t be enough the fight the 1000s of planets under covenant control and the 1000s of year the covenant has had to develop and populate said plants. The covenant has more numbers, and better tech, they would win undoubtedly.
General Brasch defeated an entire covenant fleet with a peacemaker. Then he pulled the trigger
Facts
And his trusty Senator
Nice joke, but Master Chief achieved more.
Don't forget Sergeant Major Avery Johnson. He only had two sticks and a rock. And he had to share the rock.
this is your local Truth Enforcer and it is Safe to say that this comment has been approved by the ministry of truth
Friendly reminder that Helldivers are only a VERY small part of the larger SEAF
Helldivers are special forces essentially, their primary job is to disrupt enemy operations and supply lines, while SEAF regular forces grind down the enemy.
The combination of Helldiver asset and capability denial and SEAF regular forces conventional warfare slowly but surely grinds down their enemies into dust one planet at a time.
Frindly rimindir thit hilldivirs iri inly i viry smill pirt if the larger siif
We still win 😎
@@patofeliz2862 Mmmmmno.... No you dont....
@@Keemperor40K Until you realise even the UNSC won on the ground....
Last i checked the UNSC still got their teeth kicked in.
Literally the glitched shield pack that blocked ALL melee attacks a couple weeks ago was confirmed as canon and part of “general brasch’s personal stash”
I forgot this cuz it was so stupid but it's true lol
that's canon now so GG to other sci fi factions. lol.
Literally couldn't protect against a ship bound plasma lance or glassing beam
@The_Ragequit_Cannon Proof? Cause from what I've seen those shield packs could defend against anything
@@sparkls4492 How about the fact that a literal cannon that both explodes and burns/melts targets, that is found on a ship many times bigger than even the biggest enemy we currently have in the game?
Today, there are 200 million helldivers KIA in Jin Xi sector ALONE. Thats one TERMINID sector. There is Hydra and Lacalle Sectors, which both have about 320 million Helldiver casualties alone. And thats just 3 sectors.
Malevelon Creek had 170 million casualties
There are much more helldivers on standby than just 400 million
Good lord imagine how big the Federal Army proper is! They’d potentially drown the bloody Imperial Guard from Warhammer 40k!
pretty sure the total death count is well past 2 billion
but yes this is a great point
Yup the numbers are far higher
And then we look at the enemy kia. As many divers as we've lost its still nearly 100 to 1 lose ratio.
Helldivers actually fought snipers in HD1. It was one of the illuminate units.
If a beam of nanomachines counts as sniper
@@Turinnn1 yes
Those goddamn turrets are snipers as well
@@Turinnn1 they DID have a sniper unit tho. You would see a laser targeting you off screen for a very brief moment before they fired.
@@Turinnn1yes it does, and it might be more lethal than jackals
BTW, Helldivers have even more easier access to plasma weaponry than the UNSC. Even energy shields are not problem for Helldivers in terms of mass producing.
agreed (a random major order will let us gain access to even more plasma weaponry and shielding)
@@heerosefffinchannel5387that would actually be a fire warbond, imagine an exosuit with a laser cannon and a quasar cannon
The super earth simpage is real with this one... There there kiddo im suuuuure they would win mhm mhm mhm....
The people that can barely stop a few insects and car assembly drones..... LOL!
@@brentonherbert7775 sounds undemocratic.... Deploy the odsts.
@@brentonherbert7775 You couldn't even think of any good arguments so you preferred to go straight to treating others as if they were children, that is certainly the attitude of a child.
One thing to not overlook is a Helldiver’s religious, fanatical loyalty to Super Earth. They aren’t afraid of death, and they will fight tooth and nail obeying any order given. If one diver falls, their comrades aren’t dismayed or affected at all really. Every soldier is expendable, all for the glory that is Managed Democracy🫡
Technically the Covenant also had zealously loyal soldiers as well, but the Helldivers would still have the advantage in that category. The Covenant had civil wars like the Unggoy rebellion, and there was also animosity between some of the species (most notably Sangheli vs Jiralhanae), whereas Super Earth’s government seem to be much more efficient at maintaining morale. Only the Chaosdivers seem to pose any real threat, and even then they technically fight for the people of Super Earth if not their government.
@@JC-eo2qe The cyborg/automaton faction is a result of civil rebellions against super earth, and one common mission on bug planets is to destroy illegal broadcast towers...that bugs wouldn't be able to build or use at all. Likely there is much more dissent and civil unrest than super earth would have you believe, but they are masters of propaganda so we'll never know the truth.
Chaosdivers are just non-canon player bullshit.
What happens to this loyalty when super earth gets glassed?
@@StickmanAdam lol, merely glassed? Did you see what the Helldivers did to Meridia when it decided to stop being a tropical paradise and catered to the bugs?
@@StickmanAdam sacrificing super earth itself to save the glorious ideal of super earth seems like exactly the kind of doublethink the HD universe would be perfectly okay with.
Super Earth won a three-way war despite being outnumbered, outgunned, and outsmarted. They adapted faster than most sci-fi factions, reverse-engineering technology within weeks and using it to their advantage on a large scale. Their Helldivers' FTL capability was several times faster than the Covenant's, giving them the edge in battles. Even if the Covenant had the chance to exploit the technology, their history of rebellions and parasitic infestations would make it difficult for them to do so effectively, especially if the planet had Forerunner artifacts.
Comparing the feats of Super Earth and the Covenant, the gap is too significant. Super Earth transitioned from a nuclear wasteland to a galactic superpower in less than a century, while the Covenant, despite having overwhelming advantages, struggled to maintain control over a single galactic arm over thousands of years using second-hand technology.
"Several times faster" is an understatement. Super Earth FTL is instantaneous. It's honestly Forerunner-tier, lol. UNSC slipspace drives afaik have rates measured in "lightyears per day". It's laughable in comparison.
@@AmandaFessler yup. Super Earth would repel the forces of the USNC with ease unless SEAF is banned and can only rely on hell divers for the battle for whatever reason.
You really cant compare the the Halo enemy to the Helldivers enemies lol. You are very much underestimating the Halo lore. For example the Terminids do spread fast but the Halo Flood spread even faster, they can literally infect you via airborne particle spores. The Bots are very advance but the Forerunners make them look like child play, they literally had universe scale killing weapons lol.
The UNSC actually has better tech then Super Earth, they have better ships, better trained forces, better equipment, MUCH better vehicles. For example the mechs; The UNSC Mantis has superior Gauss chainguns, carries more ammunition, is faster, more durable and has shielding. Their fighter jets carry very similar armaments with nukes and bombing runs but their space artillery is significantly stronger, a MAC canon makes Super Earths 380 barrage and 500kg bombs look bad lol. The only thing the Hell Divers have them beat is their numbers but the UNSC did have a very LARGE military too and even with the better tech, literal super soldiers and reverse engineering Covenant weapons they still technically lost, they only survived because of the Flood and the Banish Rebellion.
Yes Super Earth has supposedly faster ships but even they cant fly thru enemy lines, the Covenant literally jumped to earth, messed it up and then left just as quick.
I don’t know if i’d say outsmarted. Super earth is ran by a super computer
@@AdamSmasher-Official Wait, really? When was THAT revealed? I thought it was an "elected" president with the political power of a king or emperor.
One thing I haven't seen anyone mention is that: sure, there was at the peak player base, 500,000 concurrent players, that was from probably around a million if not more different people. Which would mean over a million Super Destroyers, and if the Super Destroyers only make up a smaller fraction of the SEAF Navy, I can't even imagine just how many of the Liberty class ships there are, not to mention the millions of Eagle-1s and Pelican-1s that would come with the millions of Super Destroyers. Basically, their navy is absolutely enormous.
And yet made of glass, considering the ships can be shot out of the air by bugs.
@@VeryScarySmileships only explode when above bot occupied planets
@cookieman5112 yeah, I admit I misremembered that
@@VeryScarySmile And even then the helldiver superdestroyer is a support craft. It's not meant to be fighting in a naval engagement at all. Considering that superearth likely isn't stupid they will probably design ships for naval combat, if they don't already have any, and make better ships for naval combat.
@@cookieman5112super destroyers are basically space C-130
Fellow Halo lover here, a couple of points.
1. I don't deny a battle with a covenant destroyer would be very difficult, but there is a way to get around the shields. A covie starship has to drop its shields to fire its cannons. So timing shots would have to be perfect.
2. The covenant don't glass every single planet, only significant ones. Even by covenant standards, glassing takes a massive amount of energy.
3. I would lightly counter the claim of ghosts being good on all terrain. Because of the height off the ground, no contact with the ground and speed, they would be less effective on the rocky and jungle planets.
It would be heavy casualties on both sides, but I ultimately think the Helldivers would win for a few reasons.
1. They do have the technology to beat the covenant.
Helldivers have little regard to their own survival or friendly fire, if it means defeating the enemy.
3. We know Super Earth is adept at reverse engineering enemy tech, and it's not as big a leap for them as it would be the UNSC. Plus the abundance of resources at the Divers' disposal would mean anything developed would rapidly reach the whole fleet.
The only way I see the covenant winning is by being fast in destroying the Divers, before they have a chance to learn and engineer any countermeasures.
imagine the covenant seeing bunch of helldivers stand back up from over-dozing the stim they carried. even the fanatic like Covenant would feel a slight fear of "zombie-like" human charging at them, bombarding high explosive / napalm along the way regard of their safety.
literally fighting Korps of KRIEG at that point.
I think that the space battles against the Covenant would be like the Cario station in Halo 2 but in reverse. The Super Destroyers would take every opportunity to fire Hellpods in an attempt to board the ship, the Helldivers look for any weak spots while engaging in gunfire with the Coventant, then assemble one or more Hellbombs. Run to the ship's bay, rescue whoever is left alive in a Pelican and repeat.
assuming the SEAF is banned for this battle then sure the Covenant might win but is all of the Super Earth forces are able to be used then the SE wins 10 times out of 10. hell divers are not the main fight force. they are special forces designed to hit key targets or break enemy lines that have halted the SEAF.
As a Halo lover, you seem to be forgetting a few key facts about the Covenant and the UNSC.
1. The UNSC were losing and never would have won if it wasnt for the Flood and Banish Rebellion during the war. In fact the UNSC never even fought the full force of the Covenant, they always only fought small portions of them at a time. The Covenant military was INSANE in numbers.
2. The Covenant will gladly glass a planet if it means an easy victory.
3. The UNSC tech is actually arguably better then the Helldivers. Their space ships are better, their super solder units are far superior, their air strikes are actually very similar but the UNSC definitely have the Divers beat in terms of heavy vehicles. For example the UNSC Mantis is better then the Divers Mechs in every way; faster, more durable with shielding, gauss chain guns are better then normal chain guns they even carry more ammunition. The UNSC vehicles are actually on par if not even better then the bots tanks. The only thing the Divers are potentially better is their weapon range of high penetration and plasma weaponry but honestly if a Spartan Laser cant turn the war for the UNSC then neither of those are gonna help the Divers lol.
4. Yes Super Earth is quick at reverse engineering but so was the UNSC, they literally reverse engineered the shields and cloaking from them and they even knew and studied the covenant weapons and vehicles and trained their soldiers to use them. Buck's ODST squad from Halo knew how to fly Phantoms however ironically the best equipment for them was actually their ballistics, like the MAC canon was actually effective against Covenent cruisers. Super earths biggest weakness is their space ships and if they cant survive space then all it takes if the Covenant to simply glass the planets.
5. I honestly believe the Helldivers could beat the Banish but they dont stant a chance against the Covenant at full strength let alone a flood infestation or a Forerunner attack.
To the comment above, yes the mantis, cloaking, and shields may have been better in performance. But difference I assume is that Helldivers mechs and equipment were more likely designed with mass production as a priority.
Short answer: Yes
Long Answer: Super Earth conquered the galaxy in a 3 front war by 2084. Helldivers would crush the covenant
To offer a few major corrections
1: Super Destroyers are not the only ship in the SEAF, they're just the only ones Helldivers use.
2: Helldivers only deploy when it's clear enough to deploy, the SEAF is the front line grunts while Helldivers are spec-ops
3: Super Earth has access to plasma and energy weapons, along with energy shield bubbles that can survive literal mini nukes
4: Super Earth is, REALLY GOOD at backwards engineering pretty much anything
5: Super Earth is really good at wars of attrition. They can basically imperial guard the covenant
6: Mech go brrt
7: Dark Fluid exists. That's just it I am yet to see the covenant defeat literal black holes
The covenant will put up a fight, but super earth is basically the inverse of the UNSC, it's humanity as the dominant species in the galaxy that has the history and capability to punch up effectively. The covenant would find themselves with just as much hell as they could potentially give. But the one thing super earth has that the covenant are not prepared for: Humanity in halo was struggling in the moral department. They had to push so much propaganda and keep the whole war secret just to lose at a manageable rate. Super Earth has an almost unbreakable moral. And moral is an invaluable tool in a war.
While i am a huge halo fan, i agree! Illuminate alone are the covenant grade enemy (in some aspects, even more advanced) and Super Earth did defeat them, terminids and cyborgs at the same time.
Not to mention that the Covenant only mostly conquered one *ARM* of the galaxy whereas Super Earth has managed to fight across the *ENTIRE* galaxy.
Would also like to point out that if the covenant get out of hand and start taking planet, super earth will just destroy its own planets instead of letting them be lost.
@@Blindstrike01 true I don't think the covenant are ready for the literal black hole
Somehow Super Earth does planet destruction better because *forbidden grape soda*
The only thing that the Covenant has better than Super Earth are the infantry units. But yeah, Covenant is most likely to lose.
The main difference between the Helldivers and the ODST is the descent capsule. The ODST capsule descends at high speed but they are maneuverable and at approximately 3 kilometers high it activates the parachute, reducing its speed to about 100 kilometers per hour, enough distance for a gunner with good aim to shoot them down. The Hellpods descend with additional propulsion when fired instead of having a rocket, so once you fire them you cannot change the trajectory, you will have a 3 meter bullet traveling at mach 5 and only about 50 meters from the ground the The retro-thrusters will be activated to control the fall a little, which is why a beacon is needed to indicate where to fire the Hellpods. But still in physical terms if a Hellpod falls on something it would be equivalent to being crushed by a cargo ship due to the kinetic energy.
It’s effectively kinetic artillery, which is also canon with that use lol.
Me during a Support Dive as replacement for a dead Diver-
"That a gigantic bug over there? Ima land on it's head."
Super Earths navy obviously doesn’t just consists of Super Destroyers though, they’re made for low orbit engagements not naval combat SEAF navy must be even more massive
Keep in mind that Super Destroyers are used almost exclusively by the Helldivers Corps., and they are considered the special forces units. Special forces only make up a fraction of the forces in a single branch of the military i.e. Navy and Army. So that means that the number of Super Destroyers would only make up a fraction of the total vessels used by the SEAF.
@martechi4236 has an amazing series of videos of how Super Earth fleet might look like, they're beautiful and fill the gaps that arrowhead is not currently interesting in filling.
But the DSS is basically going to be a Death Star and Super Earth has already made black holes (we think) out of planets, so Super earth is no slouch in the scorched planet policy field.
@xdlol1177 *Does head math on numbers of proper SEAF Army and Navy numbers*
Sweet Liberty…
@@duncanharrell5009 If you think about it, the SEAF Navy most likely beat back the Automaton armada in space and blockaded most of their ships to allow Divers to retake the planets.
@@xdlol1177 it wasn't easy by any means but we got it done. for sweet liber-tea!
Hold on. This video took the Helldivers into account, but what about the greater SEAF? For all we know, for every helldiver, Super Earth has at least 100 SEAF soldiers. While they are without a doubt squishier, less trained, and less well armed than Helldivers, they still do use the standard liberator, which we know rips lighter bugs and bots apart, and likely do use support weapons and stratagems, just on a much, much smaller scale. I think if we take the SEAF and Helldiver corps into account, it may not even be a question. I think Super Earth would roll over the Covenant if the full force of the SEAF was deployed. And that's not taking into account how fast the Ministry of Science adapts to threats, and how easily they weaponize superior alien tech through samples, as we've seen via the Illuminate. Gaining ground from Super Earth would be downright impossible for the covenant, and the longer a war with Super Earth drags out, the more they adapt and the more effective it becomes at combatting whatever threat its faced with.
I've seen the bodies of seaf troopers with the scythe and whatever the primary laser beam is called so normal seaf troops can get better weapons
There are bodies of SEAF troops dead next to a destroyed devastator with a shovel jammed into its chest. SEAF troops are prepared to go full Kreig on robots twice their size.
@@AezryaKitsunei don’t think SE would even only limit them that, for all we know they would fund their main force SEAF like how US army arms theres, a ton of guns and vehicles.
In game dialogue confirms that Strategems are reserved for Helldiver use only
And tbh if it's that they invade the helldiver universe they also are fighting the bugs and bots too lol
I bet on super earth Because in the first game, they managed to beat the faction that was hundreds of years more advanced while fighting to other enemies
To be fair, they fought, a splinter faction of super earth, oversized bugs, and peace loving space squids.
@@gabusdeuxthose peace loving squids had actual mind control powers and a planet destroying device they’d use if they reached Super Earth (non-cannon since SE won the first war story wise but losing shows they blow it up)
@@pyromancingking well actually the war started because of the planet destroying bombs
@@carlosvicenty-9856Iraq: yep we do indeed had WMD
@@gabusdeux those "peace loving squids" were not only leagues more technologically advanced than the covenant, but also had psychic powers to boot. They are basically the love child of the Tau and Eldar from warhammer 40k
Its worth noting that Super Earth specializes in fighting numerically superior forces. They also undoubtedly have a number of larger ships built for space combat rather than ground support.
Nah, Helldivers are used to fighting numerically superior foes, but humanity in the Helldiver's universe has near 40k levels of population. Helldivers are special forces and the SEAF in general is nearly incomprehensibly massive.
@lorehammer40k4 the reason nobody wins when 40k is because they fight on all fronts. Humanity was fighting a three front war including a species that literally breeds faster than cockroaches and a species that is far older and has had far more time to reproduce. The cyborgs were far fewer in number yes, but they diverted a third of SE's forces away from the other fronts.
In short Super earth won a war that was harder (or at least on par with) Humanity's war in warhamer 40k. Super earth would crush in this fight no contest.
Covenant ships will still outperformed the super earth ships
@@onikai7055 maybe, but if super earth's dinky little troop carriers can give them a run for their money due to shear numbers, what can SE cruisers, battleships and aircraft carriers do in similarly massive numbers?
Also SE territory is massive. Even if the covenant destroyed the entire SE navy in the early war, SE would copy covenant tech and make a better fleet before the covenant could glass every world.
@ I doubt it lol the covenant had 800 worlds so yea
Biggest issue is we don’t know Super Earths naval to naval capability. But we know the funding is there. Each individual helldiver has their own ship. That’s fucking insane. I cannot imagine the scale of the rest of the navy
"The cost of a single Helldiver Deployment is equal to the cost of a single 'Liberty' Class Cruiser."
So the knowledge that there are other types of ships since we fight on a 'Super Destroyer' and the Eagle is effectively the fighter craft of choice here, safe to say that Super Earth DOES have a competent and diversified Space Navy.
Not really. A super destroyer has an entire truckload of helldivers. It's just that the one that's currently thawed out is in command
@ canonically I can’t remember nor know how that works or if it’s a gameplay mechanic or whatever
@@armyboybrodie That is exactly how it works in canon. The next thawed Helldiver inherits the deceased's rank, ship, and strategems.
Because of how slow the Covenant are to adopt new technology and how extremely militarized super Earth is to the point of trying to weaponize nearly anything and everything. The Helldivers would very quickly start adopting and advancing their technology to match or surpass the Covenant after they get their hands on some wreckages/samples. After a year or less of combat they would likely start overtaking the Covenant unless the Covenant started treating them like the flood and just glassed everything and anything.
Glassing the surface of Super Earth won't kill us. It will only make us angrier
@@brandonjew1397 exactly why the flood will follow
They have yet to mass produce Illuminate weaponry for their basic helldivers.
I think the helldivers can take out the flood...@@JustinRVG101
@@brandonjew1397slipspace rupture detected.
2:07 this is quite literally the worst possible approach to quantifying in-universe military strength I’ve ever seen in my entire life.
Covenant would literally wipe the whole verse, the imu- idk the blue things would be kinda a problem. Get the Helldivers past the UNSC 2553😂
The issue with comparing the super earth space navy (SESN?) to the covenant navy is our perspective as players.
We effectively only ever engage planets where we have total space superiority, the automatons are forced to fire at us planetside.
We are also the specialized orbital shock troops, one branch of the army.
We don't see SEAF because we're the vanguard, we're ahead of them, we don't see the navy because they are our vanguard.
TLDR: We can't compare space born assets because we never see them, and the super destroyer is a dedicated orbital bombardment craft.
You're right, we don't know anything concrete about the SEAF navy ships, but I believe it's possible to speculate about them based on information already present in the game.
1: The possibility of them having shields is high, since it is a common technology of Super Earth, and they have the advantage of not needing to lower their shields to shoot.
2: Super Destroyers are extremely numerous ships, and they only represent a fraction of the Navy, so it is possible that the other ships exist in equally large or even greater numbers.
3: Super Earth has access to several energy weapons, such weapons could give them greater ease in dealing with Covenant shields that the UNSC lacked.
4: Finally, there is also a high chance that they are very agile ships, since Super Destroyers have the ability to turn and move at extreme speeds through the orbit of planets.
@@LipeSun What makes you believe that their shielding would be on par with the covenant? Who’s ships could regularly tank into the triple digits of megaton yields and keep fighting.
The covenant had the industry to produce millions of ships, and they did.
Nothing to me suggests that SE plasma is on the same level as Covenant plasma, which can burn through armor with glancing shots, and with direct impact can burn through meters of treated titanium alloy.
Plasma Torpedoes could track SE ships endlessly without halting, don’t know if they’d be agile enough to outrun it forever.
@@zenoohshit5498 I won't say for sure that I believe the shields of the SE ships are equivalent to those of the Covenant, but I will say for sure that they could at least withstand a few hits, and I say this based on personal shields (which are better than the Covenant's), in the vast majority of cases, Covenant personal shields can only withstand one hit from an anti-tank weapon before falling, and often the user dies with it, Meanwhile, Helldivers' shield backpacks are capable of withstanding a tank hit before falling and still keeping the wearer alive with little to no injuries, If personal shields can be this strong, then I imagine ship-sized shields should be able to withstand at least a few hits from some of the Covenant ships before being disabled.
The Super Earth industry is also capable of producing hundreds of thousands of ships, given the size of the Super Destroyer fleet and the fact that huge numbers of them have already been destroyed, but this doesn't seem to be a bother to SE.
Plasma weapons may not be on the same level as the Covenant's, but they are certainly not far behind, because they can burn through the armor of Devastators, whose armor is approximately equivalent to the armor of a Hanvee, Furthermore, they have an area effect, allowing them to take down several enemies at once.
Lastly, Super Destroyers are capable of circling an Earth-sized planet in a few seconds, I don't know how fast Covenant plasma missiles are, but I doubt they'll be able to keep up with this for long.
@@LipeSunYou can't really compare a mass produced infantry shielding with capital ship grade shielding that is able to tank multiple nukes and some withstanding orbital Mac platforms that fire at 4% of the speed of light.
Also in consideration that the Covie infantry shields get stronger by rank.
Game mechanics being lore is a double edge sword, one hand you get funny casualty numbers and the other you get SE Super Destroyers getting blasted out the sky with pretty unimpressive firepower.
@@snimon5824 I can indeed compare if I am going to theorize the strength of the shield as it goes up in level, the shield backpack can withstand a tank shot and quickly recharge afterwards, the shield generator is not much bigger but can withstand the combined firepower of a small army for quite some time, a ship-sized shield doesn't need to be equivalent to the Covenant's, just resisting a few shots from their weapons would already be a good advantage for Super Earth.
IIRC not even the highest ranking soldiers' personal shields can withstand a tank shell.
I wouldn't call the Automatons' orbital weapons "unimpressive firepower", They're not super impressive, but for cannons of that size, being able to fire into orbit and cause damage to ships with titanium hulls is something to be recognized for.
just gonna point iut about helldivers againts snipers
helldivers do have expierince against snipers
illuminates
theres also reason why a counter sniper weapom exist ingame
Invisible snipers to my memory as well, hated those guys
Imagine planet with 20,000 players on it. It's 20k super destroyers in orbit. Each with hundreds of frozen divers and we don't even know what other space assets SE navy has.
And we didn't glass a planet. We turned it into freaking black hole that is not a portal.
Of course for balancing reasons we only get up to 5 of them before we're at the mercy of cooldowns.
But that's still a potential *minimum* of 100k helldivers.
@@mitchellbarton7915 minus the at least 10k+ that will be friendly fire incidents. But it's still a lot! 😅
The DSS now too
You have to remember that super destroyers are just space C-17s. They're entirely meant for helldiver support. They arent the F35s of the helldiver universe
C-17’s don’t give troops support. Super Destroyers are like the AC-130’s, or more of a bomber maybe.
@Handle4712 You cant jump an AC 130
Why are you going off player number? Look at the amount of Helldivers deaths. That gives you an amount of Helldivers that cannon.
Because there’s a difference between how many personnel were killed over a period of time and the limit of active personnel a military can logistically support and deploy at any given moment
@@yunggaryy3088ya but when more than 1 Billion deaths in less than a year of war, is considered more than acceptable. I think the scale of super earths military is much higher than that.
@@imjezzo1989 You cant take video game mechanics into conversations like this lmao. that is video game. there is not a HUGE ammount of lore in helldivers. if you really want to take mechanics of games into account then every spartan killed in multiplayer since Halo CE is canon and lends to the overall numbers of just spartans alone. You HAVE to separate game mechanics from lore.
@@freed991 There is the difference that helldiver's in game statistics, community choices, and if they win or lose is actually consideded for the games lore. Like when the helldiver resupply missions happened and you needed to defend the launch pods with frozen helldiver's. It shapes the story and the numbers are always changing. It's a fluid campaign. Halo instead is a strict cannon with a known amount of gen 2 and three Spartans (ignore the last spartan threes to leave onyx. As far as I know we don't know much about them yet) but the multiplayer is completely separated from the actual lore of the games itself. It's not really a fair comparison to make because both games are doing cannon in different ways.
Sorry if this was a hard to understand ramble
@freed991 cry harder buddy. Multiplayer isnt canon. All of helldivers is canon.
the ftl jumps of the super destroyaers are just about instantaneous right? while the covenant have naval superiority, the helldiver's ability to mobilise quickly gives them a tremendous edge. allowing for hit and run tactics in massive amounts.
So basically guerrilla warfare space edition
Yes
@@shawnna1398also they somehow won without ftl with an enemy that has one while in 3 front war
Honestly, I when I first saw this video months back, I was leaning towards "no".
But after seeing how important good FTL is, the SEAF have a HUGE advantage here... their FTL-capabilities literally beat out nearly any other Sci-Fi Universe.
It's faster and more reliable than the UNSC, Covenant, and even 40k's solution to cross-galactic travel.
Even if the Covies slipspace in a fleet that would crush a smaller SEAF force, they literally just go 'boop', and all them ships are gone.
The only issue would come is if the Covenant discovered Super-Earth..
though the SEAF have a massive mobility advantage, that isn't so useful, if you're required to defend the planet.
This is a common theme in such setting wars.
The sheer mobility of the Helldivers allows them victories that entire settings, including Warhammer 4o,ooo could only dream of. This alone would be a massive advantage, but the Helldivers are no pushovers, despite being just human.
Something I didn't see mentioned before:
FTL is very near instantaneous in Helldivers.
Slipspace travel still takes quite a while. Reach and CE are months apart, but the Covenant is significantly faster than the UNSC at Slipspace travel and the Forerunners were quite close to instantaneous travel (as seen in H4)
That by itself is a massive advantage in space engagements.
Halo Reach fell on August 30, 2552. Halo CE started September 19, 2552. Thats not Months lol thats days and thats because there was actually multiple conflicts in between the 2 games. Yes Super Earth has faster ships but they are very weak, we can literally see them get taken out from the planets and their space armaments arnt very impressive. The UNSC ships have them beat especially with MAC cannons.
Super Earth ships also cant travel past enemy lines which could mean they actually cant travel that fast and just have lots of 'clone ships' or they simply cant penetrate enemy space defenses. Whereas a very small Covenant fleet accidentally traveled straight to earth, absolutely destroyed their defenses then left just as quick lol.
@@phatdogwhile you are technically right about seeing ships get taken out those are super destroyers which are mainly built to provide orbital support and isn't one of their mains warships they use for fleet battles
@@phatdogahh yes cuz a planet surface gun able to shoot something from atmo is weak, ever thought of those scenes you see when a SD explodes, consider that the automaton gun is just that strong and not because the SD is weak?
@@unloyal4847maybe part of what he’s trying to say is true. Covenant ships were notorious for decimating titanium armor and metals as they were basically shooting stars at the unsc. So, even if super earth has bigger ships than the liberty class destroyer, that doesn’t change that the covenant have super earth bested in terms of tech. Also, guerrilla space warfare won’t work for super earths ships either, as the covenant have energy shields on their ships which can block attacks from super earth ships.
@@thetacticalguy62 Underestimated Super Earth, big time.
Black Hole go Brrrrrrrr
Money is on super earth with the covenant probably saying “these guys are more fanatical zealots than us…” obviously in Halo they have ODST but now imagine every single one of them has a personal arsenal of calling in mini nukes artillery powerful weapons, and suddenly every piece of land your conquering can’t be fortified because your playing a game of hide and seek trying to find a squad of shock troopers that are destroying important strategic assets to your war effort. I’d imagine some missions for helldivers would be “deliver this havoc nuke to that covenant carrier” and they’d have ships land on top to drop pod on. Worst case scenario Super Earth finds the home world for each alien species and tells the Helldivers “your mission is to drill this liquid into their planet” and suddenly the planet is breaking apart becoming a black hole
Nay, Who'd work the mines if their home planets are destroyed?
Canonically each super destroyer has enough weapons to glass a full on moon.
@@karal_the_crazy Does? i see people saying all sorts of crazy stuff super earth has but there is little to no lore for hell divers and most of it seems like head cannon or video game mechanics. Covenant easily steam rolls the hell divers
@ actually this one is in the game. I think it is one of the people on the ship
@@karal_the_crazyto be specific, one Super Destroyer can level a small moon not a full moon
So it would be like fighting the Bots but if they had shield packs, the tanks were faster, and the ships were more agile with less armor.
so basically the illuminate
@@monkeyman4346 I was about to write that 😂
@@monkeyman4346less mind controll and magic though
@@Shadow-sword what I was rhinking
Basically if the Illuminate were religious zealots who don't have any magic.
A lot of the comments here mention, SEAF forces, helldivers is only spec-ops, super earth is really good at reverse engineering tech, etc.
I don't see any comments mentioning General Brasch. Pretty much the master chief of helldivers. (Lore accurate master chief) not game master chief
We've seen the training that Helldivers take, they're literally just expendable soldiers to throw on suicide guerrilla warfare missions. Yes they are trained and some survive to be very experienced like General Brasch but they are by no means anywhere near as trained or equipped like a Spartan lol. And to put it in perspective the Spartans were thrown on suicide missions too just like Helldivers but they basically never returned and only stalled the Covenant. The UNSC never fought the full might of the Covenant and only survived the war because of the Banish Rebellion and the Flood.
@@phatdog yeah, but there are billions of helldivers and about 2000ish spartans. Makes no sense comparing them. Also, spartans are expensive to make and takes time. Helldivers are just hot-headed fanatics that grow on every tree. They are super expendable.
@@phatdog The fact that their training is poor does not take away from their role as “Special Forces” that Super Earth gives them, however questionable it may be...
@@phatdog In Training? Without a doubt, but in Equipment?? They are more equal than you think: The Helldivers have a wide arsenal of weapons and armor, ranging from kinetic and laser weapons equal in capacity to those of the UNSC [the latter having unlimited ammunition], Plasma weapons that rival those of the Covenant and armor that does not have to envy much to the Spartan armor in terms of damage absorption, all this Without counting that each Helldiver Captain receives command of a *Planetary Siege Ship* with Subliminal capacity and practically Instant FTL and enough firepower to level a Small City several times.
The unsc is also very good at reverse engineering, they had forerunner engines and shields in a few years. They just didn't have room to breath because the convenent glassed most of their planets before they knew what was going on, and insurgent colonies were also a problem. The unsc was on the road to becoming an empire comparable to the SEAF. The convenent just hit them just before they got there. If the convenent got to the humans maybe a hundred years later they wouldn't have a chance.
The Covenant are about to behold what true zealotry looks like
A few corrections here:
1. Super Earth definitely has more to their navy than Super Destroyers and Cruisers. They can contend with Automaton space fleets, which when viewed from the ground consist of ships that make Super Destroyers look like toys. And that's not even counting the shadows of Illuminate ships you can sometimes see in skyboxes. Super Earth is hardly lacking in the space fighting department.
2. Super Earth has *rudimentary* energy shields. I wouldn't say they're as good as the Covenant, but they can definitely both bring and break through energy shields. Their application in the space fighting field, though, is definitely lesser, since Orbital Cannons can actually take out Super Destroyers meaning they don't have energy shields/don't have good energy shields. Maybe they only use them on Cruisers and up?
3. A Helldiver is likely approaching being comparable to a Spartan in capability, although obviously not quite as good. Their armor, although fairly meh in game, is canonically made of the same stuff the armor on the Super Destroyer is made of, so some kind of advanced light yet durable alloy like the Spartans. They can use experimental and totally not addictive stims to shrug off grievous injury and boost their physical capability - without which they can already carry and run with dozens of kilos of weapons, grenades, ammo and armor.
4. Unlike the Spartans, Helldivers are not the product of a specific, dedicated and expensive program with only a handful of participants. Helldivers are just young, hot-blooded individuals who volunteer from within the SEAF forces, and, if they survive more than 2 seconds on their downright suicidal Special Ops missions, are damn good at what they do. And given the base SEAF is massive, likely encompassing every aspect of Super Earth life, there's always fresh blood for the Helldivers and the SEAF in general.
5. The success of the Helldivers and SES implies a strategic flexibility beyond that of the UNSC's, meaning they can fight a galactic war in a nimbler and more adaptive manner, which is the main weakness of the Covenant.
6. The difference in morale and war manpower between UNSC and SEAF is incomparable. The whole empire is an army, and one willing to die for Super Earth. This is how they contended with 3 separate invasions by the Cyborgs, Illuminate and Terminids. In fact, given that Super Earth beat Covenant-Lite (the Illuminate) whilst fighting 2 other civilisations 100 years ago, I'd say they're equipped to fight the Covenant.
I think you need to research the sheer scale of the Covenant. They make the illiminate look like a small invasion fleet. The Flood is also significantly more deadlier then the Terminids and the Forerunners and far superior then the bots in every way, they literally have galaxy wide super weapons.
@@phatdog Fighting a 3 war front against 3 completely different opponents. 1 massive rebellion leading to death machine human hybrids than would cut a covvie in half very painfully, 1 peaceloving hyperadvanced race of hyperintelligent beings, and 1 lot of intelligent bugs that HAD star to star capability. This was 100 years ago and Super Earth fought every one of them, AND WON with arguably, less superior tech now. The covenant have the numbers, but they aren't completely fanatic nor completely perfect in speed of most aspects. The flood are pretty easily countered thanks to this thing called helmets. Helldivers have access to Corrosive Gas which will ERADICATE spores. Helldivers can deploy anywhere on a planet's surface in no time at all and can hot drop into a hive. They can complete suicide missions with 24 or less divers. The Flood are formidable, but Super Earth thrives in being the "underdog"
@@glazredfield9489first, how do you know that corrosive gas will counter the flood, it’s basically big bug spray. Second, the flood also have infection forms which will bypass the armor of anyone, even Spartans. Third, if a helldivers comes into the ship with contaminated armor, then the spores will infect at least one person on the ship, and yes, there can be cleaning of the armor before a helldiver re-enters a ship but let’s be honest, at least one person out of the millions in the SEAF will be ignorant and let it happen, which will result in infighting, and then it is just high charity all over again. Not to mention flood dispersal pods which can be a sort of countermeasure to the helldivers. Not to mention the gravemind can be formed in not too long of a time, and if the infestation gets to that point, super earth better pray to the Statue of Liberty because they are not getting out of that. Not to mension that pressure plus the covenant will decimate the SEAF’s morale, leading to a victory for the flood.
@phatdog the illuminate soldiers killed in hd1 alone are roughly 10% of all covenant population
also your wrong about the Helldiver is likely approaching being comparable to a Spartan in capability depends heck helldivers not close to spartains 3. they close to odst but even not fully close odst still 10x better in everyway because train for it so think helldivers which are the elite were trained and get gun and instant into war... yah... spartains make odst look like toys... and 3s... 2s.. make all spartains look toys... spartains close warhammer super solider and should say alot example mastercheif is not fastest,strongest,more skill etc spartain 2 but the luckest but being spartain 2 mc for example (Can deadlift at least 3 times his own body weight, and deadlifted 500 kilograms as a test. Kicked a man wearing an exoskeleton comparable in mass to Mjolnir armor 8 meters away) | Class 10 with MJOLNIR armor and keep in mind 3x there body weight and hes with his armor is around a 1 ton and for example class 10 is The weight of an adult elephant. Casually flips overturned 3 ton Warthog jeeps single-handedly. One Spartan moved a large stone monolith while also fighting back the pain of losing half of his left arm lol and his durablity (Renders him virtuously impervious to all UNSC and Covenant infantry weapons, this includes Spartan Lasers, Wraith Mortars, and Scarab beam), at least Small City level with Bubble Shield (Repels all projectiles and nearly all explosions outside the bubble shield. Withstood a several Megaton Nuclear explosion) and striking strength Wall level (A 14-year old John accidentally pummeled several ODSTs to death without even realizing it and launched one of them 30 feet with a few punches) and keep mind again odst make helldivers look childplay helldivers but train.. like special forces Is also comparable to Holly Tanaka, who effortlessly smashed through rock this big with a Spartan charge) i cant find the picture but this pictur vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:FanofRPGs/Spartan_Ramming_Strength and can (Comparable to Cal-141, who deadlifted 5 tonnes Superhuman movement speed (Ran half a kilometer in 17 seconds; nearly 106 kilometers per hour, but tore his Achilles tendon doing it) with Subsonic combat speed (Can react to stun rounds) | Superhuman movement speed (Should be faster than before), higher with Speed Amps, with Supersonic combat speed (Can react to bullets and Covenant plasma projectiles. Has barely dodged handgun fire at point-blank range. Viewed combat with the ODST's in slow motion) higher with Cortana (With her help, he reacted to a projectile he'd be unable to normally)... yep... sorry these spartain 2 helldiver dont comapire and spartains 3 like half that.. only execption spartain 3 who close to spartain 2 and noble 6.. and close mc both hyper leathal vector and few things , Can see Invisible beings and X-Ray/Thermographic Vision with Promethean Vision so alot more to spartains then think... im sorry helldivers very good sci fire... when comes halo.. halo outclass most helldiverse verse tect,power name it all.. but still be pretty good but halo is just that and dont me started ai... any of ai break the helldiverse verse into nothingless.. ai like cortna hack all of super earth forces,and robots.. at same time without even trying... that power ai... im sorry nah.
Some things that aren’t mentioned are super destroyers can move around a planet in seconds and it was stated that one super destroyer has enough firepower to destroy a small moon
And they also cant shoot at any ship "above" them
@@shoulderpyro in space that isn't that much of a down side when you can just rotate 180 degrees upside down there nothing stoping you from doing that in space plus most covenant weapons are on the sides or bottom so your probably better off attacking from the covenant relative above so they can't shoot back immediately
*UNSC:* "Super earth has freed us!"
"I wouldnt say freed. More like... Under managed democracy..."
Remember that canonically superearth beat the illuminate while in a three front war with termanids and automatons.
Cyborgs*
@frenchsoldier8485 what makes you think I'm talking about helldivers1.
We all know where HD2 is going.
@@millerrepin4452 Canonically, they haven't won yet
@@frenchsoldier8485 And you think super earth losing is a possibility? Really sounding like a bug/bot/alien squid sympathizer here...
@@bigmannn2443 **loads pistol with democratic intent**
A major factor few latch onto here: When your FTL moves you around at warp 9.999999, against most possible rivals in a sci-fi battle you get to choose every space engagement. Hell save the covies if the SEAF figured out how to practice tactical use of the alcubierre drive to blink their ships around.
I would like to point out 2 things.1) the super destroyers purpose is low orbit ordinance delivery so it would not fight "battle cruiser" kind of ships and 2) knowing super earth the black liquid(same as the one in meridia) would be used in sone kind of torpedo to make energy shields stop working
Super Earth loves to “burrow” tech and reverse engineer them, take out a covenant ship and they’ll make it 10x better and would mass produce then enough that would even make 40k manifactorum blush
Yeah, no. Helldivers can barely harness illuminate technology. They still don't even know how it works. That and the fact that the imperium is much bigger than super earth.
The illuminate and covenant are undeniably more advanced.
That’s completely inaccurate, a lot of covenant technology derives from the nearly 100 thousand year old civilization known as the forerunners, which were basically gods with all of the power they had. If super earth can’t figure out how to replicate a illuminate jet pack they can’t even come close to replicating a covenant ship
@117instello Facts. People over wank super Earth's and helldiver capabilities. The covenant should still win, but anything could happen.
Holy crap the helldivers glazing is insane
The DSS station that Super Earth just now built has shown itself to blow up moons. The discussion is completely over with super earth stomping the covenant now.
@@joshuamitchell5018Let's not exaggerate here, it was said that DSS destroyed a small moon, and we don't know how exactly it did it, so we can't assume that it can do it consecutively and if the same could be done with Covenant ships
@@joshuamitchell5018 the UNSC already had that firepower equivalent with a NOVA nuke. need to know defensive capabilities of the DSS, otherwise concentrated fire isn't going to work on a fleet of hundreds of ships
I feel like it's worth mentioning that the Automatons also have their own spacefaring Navy. Outside of their first Out-Of-Nowhere surprise attack, their Navy hasn't made significant progress towards Super Earth, often times being held back and slowly losing ground to SEAF and Helldiver operations
As for the Super Destroyer, I personally think that a full Laser Strike from the Destroyer's Laser Cannon could punch a hole in the Covenant's shields, thus allowing them to damage the Covenant Ships with their other weapons
They could also just, like, launch pre-armed Hellbombs at the Covenant
helldivers would put the covenant on another one of their super earth montages and if they were too lazy, John Helldiver would easily put the Covenant on a hospital bed
covenant would make all of super earth hide
lets say they do decide to glass a planet in HD2 the problem is when they try they will have to deal with surface to orbit anti ship guns and given the fact the illuminate most likely had shielding similar to the covenant its no stretch to think they could down their ships.
I doubt any orbital weapon the they have can stop a battlecruiser, let alone an Assault Carrier. These are the ships that can withstand a 30 megaton nule without any problems.
It’s worth mentioning that the Super Destroyers that the Helldivers utilise are designed almost entirely for ground support, (as emphasised by all its weapons on its underbelly). It’s also worth mentioning that the Super Destroyer we see in game is reserved exclusively for the Helldivers. The actual naval power would come from the SEAF. Although there isn’t much information regarding them, it’s safe to assume that a frontline has the most action, (if you look on the horizon of some Helldiver missions you can see massive fires indicating the actual frontline).
Point in being that the Covenant would be going against a foe which is equally if not more fanatic, (don’t put me in a freedom camp), that has the tools required to defeat the Covenant or at put them in a stalemate. Unlike the UNSC which did not have that Libertea… get it? Funny joke? Right guys?
A big problem with the super destroyer is that its not meant for space combat, all the weapons are on the front and those are meant for orbital attacks
Yup, super destroyers are planetary assault ships, while space combat is the liberty class cruisers specialty. The only thing we know about them is they are as expensive as a super destroyer operation. You can actually see some on automaton planets and, in some cases, crashing down to the surface of a planet when you are doing an automaton mission.
Maneuver the super destroyer on top of the ships?
@@bbunkey what you’re forgetting is that no enemy will voluntarily let you go ontop of them to attack, a super destroyer would be absolutely obliterated before they would have any chance to do that
@@aurorahasfallenon top is kinda a redundant concept in space, you just sorta lean left then fire all the canons and lasers as they are now bellow you
@@Shadow-sword I’d assume due to the ships artificial gravity, all the crew would be leaning awkwardly and that’d make it harder for them to fire their weapons, but I’m no expert on sci fi space tactics lol
The way helldivers send small squads of troops willing to sacrifice themselves for any objective necessary combined with a seemingly unending number of ground troops I believe ground warfare would be near impossible for the covenant. Space warfare is a bit different due to a lack of knowledge. However I believe even though super destroyers are mostly an orbit to ground type vehicle they could likely perform space to space combat fairly well. The level of penetrative capabilities some strategems possess could be used for devastating the energy shield. The ems strike, railcannon, and laser come to mind. So we don't know the capability of super destroyer captains, pilots, and weapons officers, but I believe they could develop strategies to target the larger vessels while having pelicans and eagles performing defensive combat space patrols. Helldivers would definitely suggest aiming the hellpod system into the covenant ships and if successful would willingly sacrifice themselves to destroy power infrastructure or disable shielding to be rescued while higher damage strategems make quick work of exposed power cores. I don't think it would be any easy battle, but just remember. The helldivers turned meridia into a black hole through sheer numbers and determination.
Spartans are literally extremely trained super soldiers and better then Helldivers in every way. They were dropped into enemy territory in large numbers and still lost. The UNSC never actually fought the Covenants full force only small portions of it, in fact they only survive the war because of the Banish Rebellion and the Flood attack.
We see Super Earth ships getting blown up from single hits from planetary guns implying they are very weakly armored and feature no shielding. The UNSC ship armaments actually make the Helldivers ships look very tiny too. MAC cannons are SIGNIFICANTLY bigger then the railcanon. They also feature Hellfire missile barrages and have jets that can drop nuke payloads.
The UNSC has ODST drop pods which are basically identical to the Helldiver pods and they werent very effective at all against the Covenant ships, good idea tho and was used a few times in the Halo war.
The covenants ground units make the Bots vehicles look like toys. And if you cant put up a fight against them in space then I'm sorry to say but their Glassing beam laser is significantly more deadly then the Helldivers one and they will show no mercy at terraforming planets from space.
I would like to:
1: See some spurces that would incline you to believe that the Covenant weapons are so much more powerful than Helldivers ones. You can’t? Well thats fine because:
2: Glassing a planet requires massive amounts of energy from the Covenant to use at a time, and can only be done every so often. Those weak, insignificant Rail Cannons can be used every few MINUTES! I dont think any shields in the Covenant arsenal can handle an every minute barrage of Rail Cannons. And thats just one Super Destroyer. How about thousands, if not millions? Numbers subdue stronger foes with ease:
3: The number of canon Helldivers and thus Super Destroyers is kind of insane. There are so many Super Destroyers that the Helldivers would have both complete air to air superiority and also air to ground superiority. If you really think the Covenant are so strong then how do you think they would fare in a 1vs3 fight against the flood, UNSC and the forerunners? They would get stomped! But the SEAF and by extension Helldivers beat back 3 races and won despite being initially weaker in literally every way. This is like the UNSC beating back every race in the halo universe. Stop coping just because you like Halo, your arguements don’t even use facts and it sounds poorly put together and mostly illogical. The Helldivers and SEAF win. End if story. They are just a better UNSC in every possible way. And before you say; “bUt WhAt AbOuT tHe SpArTaNs!1!1!1! AnD mAc GuN!1!!1!1” Yeah, what about them? Neither did anything other than help the UNSC lose the war slower, while SEAF tech turned the tide of their war against THREE DIFFERENT MORE ADVANCED RACES!!! The Helldivers win no diff. Come at me id you dare, Halo scrub comment warriors.
@@Overhawk_Red1214 you obviously didn't read my reply properly then :)
1) Covenant weaponry is made up from multiple different species all of which are more advanced then humanity. Not only that but they have reverse engineered forerunner artifacts and since you dont know much about them let me make it real simple, they made galaxy wide weapons that can kill to a molecule level. The Covenant obviously didn't access that particular weapon but they did get their smaller weapons. Plasma based weapons burn, they literally melt thru armor to the point that no material the UNSC had was resistant to it so all they could do was put on some layers and hope the user survives by a miracle. And when I say melt thru armor I mean the ships were literally designed to be as thick and bulky as they could but even that wasn't enough.
2) Yes glassing a planet does take a lot of resources but guess what? They have that in plenty as they are literally a galaxy wide threat that have entire planets simply dedicated to making fuel etc etc. The UNSC have rail canons to, they call them MAC cannons and are MUCH bigger then anything Super Earth has shown yet. They were were basically their only winning asset in space combat but would require 4+ ships to take out one Covenant cruiser which number in millions.
3) you brag about the covenant struggling against the flood, unsc and forerunner. Your wrong they were fighting a 1v5! and still managed to achieve their goal but were only stopped due to plot armor with the Flood (A parasite hell bent of infecting all living things) of all things forming and alliance lol. You brag that the Helldivers held back 3 factions, to which yes they did but with HD2 now out do you mind telling me how that war is going again? Last time I checked the bots are getting awfully close to Super Eartj now and the bugs havnt been able to be pushed back at all. Also the illuminate who were supposedly wiped out are back again even stronger. You can actually very easily compare those 3 factions to the Halo universe however I'm sorry to say but the Halo universe makes them look easy. First of the illuminate and the forerunner is nice and easy, when has the illuminate ever developed a galaxy wide super weapon that can kill any living creature down to the molecule level? Second the Terminids vs the Flood. The flood can infect an entire planet within weeks using only airborne spores, also remember those galaxy wide weapons I told you about? Yeah the flood forced them to use it twice! Covenant vs Bots, yeah those bots striders have nothing to fight against the Halo Scarab, the Covenant even have air superiority, planet terraforming glassing beams and ground units that are literally bred to hack, reverse engineer and destroy any tech.
4) "your arguements don’t even use facts and it sounds poorly put together and mostly illogical" you didnt list a single example of how they would win apart from them having "numbers" despite the Covenant literally having more numbers lol.
"They are just a better UNSC in every possible way" cool, name an example then? Because I literally just listed everything that the UNSC beats them at.
" mAc GuN!1!!1!1” Yeah, what about them? Neither did anything other than help the UNSC lose the war " The MAC gun is literally bigger then any of the Helldivers ships weaponry lmao 🤣the fact that it takes multiple of them to take out 1 Covenant Cruiser implies Super Earth has nothing. Before you go and say the new Super Earth Space station has better weaponry well I encourage you to WATCH THE HALO 2 INTRO CUTSCENE. You'll see that the UNSC actually has multiple of those and still lost to a small Covenant invasion fleet.
Bonus) You fail to realize that Super Earth and the Halo UNSC are actually pretty similar, only problem is that the UNSC are stronger. They too held a majority of the galaxy with plenty of resources and manpower. They actually even had more superior weaponry for example the MAC canon I said earlier, their support cruisers actually feature more weaponry variety then the Helldivers ships. They also had more air support like like a lot more and they too had plenty of nukes as well lol and they had FAAAR more ground vehicle support. A perfect example of the difference in tech is the Halo Mantis vs the Helldivers mech, Halo's one features much larger caliber rounds, more munition, is faster, features shielding tech and has thicker armor.
As for ground forces SEAF soldiers could be argued as similar to UNSC soldiers, however as for the Divers themselves they're more along the lines of the Halo ODST's with the only difference is that the Divers have access to better tech but overall worst training (They are literally canon fodder in lore sent in to do Guerrilla tactics to take out key objectives). But the UNSC have an even stronger unit aka the Spartans who are far better trained, augmented beyond doubt, have stronger armor, more speed and a hella alot more strength. But despite all that even they were still not good enough to survive the onslaught of the Covenant. As for weaponry, the UNSC rifles and SMG's all feature similar munition to Helldivers, the UNSC actually have a railgun and laser based weaponry too.
Now what I need you to understand is that despite the UNSC having very similar and in some cases superior circumstances then Super Earth, even with all that they weren't even able to put a dent in the Covenant forces as in the only thing they could achieve in the entire war was SURVIVE long enough for the Covenant to have to spread its forces in a 5 way battle. The UNSC were losing massively and only survived the war because of the Banish rebellion, the Sangheili rebellion, the Flood emergence and the Forerunner defense systems.
I think an orbital rail gun would probably do the trick against a hunter just based on what it does to chargers. Good video dude.
2 things i like to consider when talking about different lores conflicting in video games.
1. Video game mechanics vs real lore, people tend to forget that in books, cut scenes, and general lore is more accurate then just looking at how things work in gameplay, some full fledged spartans have actually died to things that would never kill chief in game, and how enemies feel to fight in helldivers is far different to how they feel to fight in halo. For instance, armor just works fundamentally differently. The diligence counter sniper would likely 1 shot a brute, but the dmr from halo does not
2. Especially with video games, we have little way of knowing the true extent of the lore, you brought this up with both games we have very little real information on the true number of soldiers, but one thing you should address is that looking at active players in helldivers, isn't the best representation of helldivers number, after all they won the first galactic war, helldivers 1 canonically happened. That means super earth has dozens of fully colonized planets, they were defence missions afterall. With that population of under super earth claiming they have 2 million helldivers feels off, and that's ignoring the obvios lack of mention for the SEAF, and like you, i too grew up with halo. So i am also very biased. But i also like to look at all sources to make the most accurate assumptions in these cases.
Another thing that someone else mentioned is that the game in helldivers 2 is a bit more accurate than the game in halo. I think I heard somewhere that all deaths in hd2 is canon, so we know AT LEAST how many helldivers have died
@@jonothanrennert3098 so that would mean that the number of active players is the size of the HDs assuming all of the player stats are canon like the deaths.
The elite piloting the wraith watching the sky as a targeting laser lines up directly on its center mass(its about to be shot with a hunk of tungsten flying mock 7 from orbit)
All the Helldiver ships were annhilated 100,000km away by a plasma lance. They souldnt even make planetfall.
The Elite hits the Wraith's boosters, swings around as the Diver misses, and vaporizes them just as they're emerging from the ground with a plasma mortar. The Elite then waits for another, pleased with its kill total of ten so far.
@@BizarreCoyote he is talking about the railgun orbital. A wraith is not dodging that
@@voidtempering8700 eh I could see a few being hit then the covenant instantly getting jumped on by ship's that can near instantly cover any distance. Also super destroyers are not space combat ships, that's what the rest of the military is for
@@jacobfast1425 Only their FTL is near instantaneous, if a Covenant ship invades, or if they mount a large attack, even weaker Covenant ships would have very good odds at taking multiple ships.
Super Earth would immediately enslave the covenant engineers in the most brutal and inhumane way possible.
Every piece of covenant technology they could force them to create would be shipped straight off an assembly line and onto super destroyers.
Any recoverable tech and especially those fancy vehicles would be reverse engineered by the end of the year.
The Helldivers already have an ungodly amount of fire support even without co-opting covenant tech, but stealing designs like energy swords, shields, or higher power plasma weaponry would make the covenant just another faction on the galactic map.
Honestly, outnumbering Covenant Cruisers with smaller, offensive-minded Destroyers is probably a great idea. Destroyer laser weapons on mass would be ideal for taking down Covenant shield technology, and Super Earth could theoretically create ship-grade plasma weaponry for later stages of the war. Assuming the Covenant have better FTL technology, a Super Earth fleet could likely afford to be jumped, lose a few destroyers, and then retaliate. As long as Super Earth's propaganda machine can withstand the loss of multiple destroyers per cruiser engagement, they're probably better equipped than the UNSC is. Super Earth could afford the cruel cost of void warfare better than the UNSC.
Amusingly on the ground, Super Earth forces have readier access to anti-shield technology in the form of their own plasma and laser weapons. What super earth lacks in spartan-grade super soldiers, it probably makes up for with technological flexibility and a more powerful propaganda machine that is even more unified than the covenant's theocracy.
TL;DR: SEAF has a more flexible and robust wartime economy and mindset than the UNSC.
One more thing to add: Essentially, the UNSC lost the conventional war against the Covenant. So "definitely better than the UNSC" doesn't necessarily mean Super Earth wins. I assume we're taking the muguffin's out of the equation: The Halo arrays, the Ark, the Flood, etc. The Covenant was defeated more by a comedy of errors, civil war, forerunner technology, and getting High Charity eaten by the Flood.
I would like to add here, Super Earth's FTL Technology is far superior to the Covenant's, like, infinitely superior, besides, Super Destroyers are not even combat ships, Super Earth has ships specially designated for combat that should come in numbers equally large or even larger than the Super Destroyers
Super earth's FTL is instantaneous. It pretty much can't be any faster than that. Any planet Covenant attacks, super earth will respond extremely quickly.
@vineveer4358 another things is super destroyers could definitely support in naval combat if needed but that's not their job. Notice how in game when fighting the Automatons there is never a ship in sight shooting Super destroyers down. The Helldivers Navy clears what airspace so that the Helldivers can work. If the airspace wasn't clear it's safe to say that the Helldivers wouldn't be fighting there in the first place. The Seaf is the Hammer while the Helldivers are the scapel as they have described
A super destroyer is not a combat ship. It's an orbital support ship.
If the Covenant were to invade Super Earth, or any of the other planets under SEAF control, I think they would be dealing with a nightmare. Helldivers are literally fearless. They think they never die. They're expendable, yes but there are records of Super Helldive missions against the Automatons being completed with 0% casualties. If 1 to 4 Helldivers can do that, imagine what more divers like that could do to a Covenant army on the ground. As for their ordnance, they have the opportunity to be equipped with weapons far more devastating and convenient than the Covenant and the UNSC. Each of them can carry more firepower than any of the Covenant ground units. They have the capacity to be equipped with the tools to fight the deadliest vehicles head-on and still come out on top. One single Helldiver with a Heavy machine gun (which is essentially just a full auto AMR) and a shield pack can wipe out a squad of elites before he goes down. It's crazy what these brainwashed maniacs are capable of.
Now, in space, there's no doubt that the Covenant would probably eradicate their ships. The only way they would secure their victory against the SEAF is to wipe out their navy first. The super destroyers carry and nurture the firepower that the Helldivers need to carry out and complete their missions, so if they don't have that, they will have to rely on what they have left on the planet. Like I said before though, Helldivers have ground superiority big time. The Covenant will be forced to spend a lot of resources on a ground war if they wish to parttake in one against the SEAF. At that point they would have to recover once they do take over a planet. The longer they take to do that, the larger the SEAF's retaliatory force will be.
That is how it went on Halo as well, humans won ground battles but got smoked in space.
All great points i agree with but remember that the SEAF navy do have purely Naval combat ships called the Liberty Class cruisers which have a fair bit more firepower than the Super Destroyers. Yes the lure on them are sparse but since they will most likely have way more of the Liberty Cruisers than Destroyers it will not be easy to reach a Helldiver and their Super Destroyer
Not sure if this was added, but the Orbital Railcannon strike sounds and acts like what a MAC in the Halo series does. So that could even the odds on getting rid of the Covenant naval shields during combat.
The Helldivers would be able to shred vehicles, support weapons like the R.R., railgun, autocannon, etc. can bust open a hulk just fine. The R.R. can 2 hit a factory strider too.
Edit: R.R. (Recoiless Rifle) could delete a mechanized bile titan thing.
Scarabs are a bit bigger than a factory strider, and slightly better armed. They often carry troops with them like a giant IFV, so not unlike the strider. That being said, a squad of helldivers should still be able to bring one down. Even if it can survive a few recoilless rifle rounds and 500kg bomb hits, I doubt it'd survive a 380mm barrage.
Kind of unrelated but I would absolutely kill for a ring world in Helldivers 2 just on a base level that'd be so fucking cool
My take away, bring a Railgun. I’m sure they will pop like grapes, just as the devastators.
12:41 gave me chills💀💀
Okay the covenant as much as I love halo are boned againts super earth because we know how this goes it’s called the first galatic war. The covenant had their hands full with Odsts and Spartans as limited as they were helldivers especially the fact 90% of all engagements end in helldivers accomplishing the mission would overwhelm any covenant strategy. Furthermore super earth has had a century to prepare for a round two with the squids or the illuminate. Arguably even more advanced than the covenant more leaning towards forunner level. Yet were wiped off the face of the galaxy wil super earth faught two other factions. Super earth has two legendary soilders in general Brasch ,and John helldiver who rival the master chief ,the numbers in space and on the ground, the experience fighting multiple factions, as well as technology to turn planets into black holes, create sector missile defense systems, and bio warfare that can stop invasions of solar systems. It’s just one is a semi realistic stylized stained glass empire, the other is a comically over powered war machine. I can’t say super earth isn’t coming out on top
You kinda forget... Heldivers 2 already beat our existing enemies by a ratio of 1 - 40... and every time is 4 Helldiver vs a regiment size of enemy force...
1-40? More like 1-300/600
Nah, I'd extract
⬆️➡️⬇️⬇️⬇️
I think that SEAF would be able to win but it would take a long and grueling time
At first, I would've said "no". I didn't even think the SEAF would've been able to defeat the UNSC when the game first dropped.
Buuuut everything that happens in HD2's gameworld is cannon. All of the Divers, all of the Deaths. And that's hundreds of millions of divers dead, with no one batting an eye.
The thing that kinda has me leaning towards the SEAF winning is their FTL-Tech. It's stupid-OP, and beats out even the Covenant and 40K races in terms of how fast and reliable it is.
There hasn't been any lore shown about wind-up or preparation times, or if the actual travel-time takes days.. as far as we know, if a Super Destroyer wants to go from one end of the galaxy to another; the MF just presses a button and 'poof'. There it is.
Helldiver's using fire weapons And gas weapons would be funny. Watching grunts running around on fire or gassed covenant troops walking around randomly, blind firing at random. In the halo universe. The grunts and smaller troops can be spooked or scared easy.The helldivers could dark fluid planets or use bug spores against the covenant. There's nothing the covenant could do to stop bug spores from traveling in space and spreading from planet to planet.yes they could glass a planet once the bug spores start making outbreaks of bugs. Also the bugs and bots will be attacking them also. Also the helldiver's are starting to make a space station. So we gotta consider that.
Firstly; We don't have the dark fluid anymore. It was being studied, and was used in an emergency to collapse Meridia. They flat out told us that we have no more Dark Fluid after the operation. People arguing this need to fucking read the messages from High Command.
Secondly; this is Covenant vs Helldivers. No one else. The Super Destroyer is a terrible ship, and will be ripped apart by even the smallest of Covenant ships.
Thirdly; now that we have said station, we have seen it is *hilariously* inept at combat operations. The populace is sending the damn thing to places where we can't bother going *just to get it out of our way.*
I'm pretty sure one Liberty-class cruiser is as expensive as one Helldiver operation. This is pretty much a confirmation that they are similar in numbers. Also, they are way more specialised for space warfare, using lasers and maybe fighters. Considering the fact that Super Earth has access to way more resources and has a gigantic industry compared to the UNSC, while equipping their forces with energy weapons and advanced navigational technology, I say the Covenant is facing an actual threat. The never ending waves of the SEAF, the fast response time from the side of Super Earth and the heavy use of combined arms would probably overwhelm them.
Super destroyer are specifically for ground support only so they wouldn't even likely engage other ships at all.
This is where cruisers would step in to deal with it, the cruisers routinely deal with automaton appox. 1km 'carriers' at the moment which is armed with an equally long rail cannons. One scary factor that super earth has over covenant and UNSC is instantaneous galactic wide FTL. Super Earth can swarm and level every fueling depot, farm, city, population center, government center, knowledge center and food source the covenant has then leave before the first defense ships arrive to deal with them.
Inversely Covenant throw pretty large fleets at problems and in a head on scenario super earth would struggle to repel any single fleet alone but as mentioned before the helldiver core can make sure they get starved and covenant seemingly while not needing materials as often have a food problem.
Finally more possible fun factors:
There's a non zero chance super earth is earth original, its quite possible one was destroyed in the past and they just moved it to another earth like planet.
Super Earth intentionally started this war as a depopulation method.
WH40k imperium guard once deployed average lifespan is 14 minutes, A Helldiver is 12 seconds. In spite of this they're racking up easily over 100:1 kill ratios.
Do not underestimate anyone who can call an air strike or orbital strike on demand with nearly zero hassle. UNSC has to do paperwork for every strike, organize. supply, and plan for it. The covenant never ever seemingly get anything sent out fast enough anytime a spartan shows up to kick the hornets nest. Chief mows them all down and reinforcements are never sent in the required numbers to fill in the holes.
Super Earth has zero problems throwing helldivers to fix the problem, and they are considered the special forces, a drop in the bucket to the poorly armed PDF and the SEAF troopers. At some point we have to reconcile the sheer vast number of helldivers and earth citizens at super earth's disposal.
Morally Super Earth would destroy planets and make species extinct the only reason they did not eliminate two of the three species in the last war is they had uses. Bugs as FTL fuel and Bots as free labor. Majority of the covenant species would likely be forced on the dinner menu if edible, or wiped out entirely as they're not going to provide any better services than the bots or bugs currently do.
I also wouldn't put it past super earth to sacrifice a dying super destroyer to sublight (we're talking about a ship that can orbit a planet under a minute at sublight) into a covenant ship and with that much ordnance aboard that is bound to cause a lot of damage.
Finally Super Earth is quite capable of stealing tech. They have stolen nearly everything the illuminate had and 'liberated it', the powerful alloys and shields the covenant have the advantage will only last a long as it proves too much to be an enigma to them and or cost factor (only reason super earth wouldn't build an advantage). Which isn't long considering how technologically advanced the illuminate where.
If Super Earth had the capacity to make Spartans and they saw the price tag either one of two things happen. 1. They never commission a spartan due to price tag along as thousands of helldivers and their replacements would be cheaper and get the job done. 2. They economically make as many people Spartans as possible, against their will... for freedoms sake.
And finally: there is a non zero chance Super Earth froze all the veterans from the first war and are continuously thawing them out now.
As for species advantage
Grunts - a worst target than standard bots. Bots are able to rip humans apart too and have immense numbers, networking and are not cowardly.
Jackals - Illuminate in the first war had extremely capable snipers so far they have not been spotted from the vangaurd force invading. For agility the helldivers have to deal with leaping bugs that are aware enough to dodge shots or react fast enough to catch and return grenades to the helldivers.
Elites - toughness wise they're probably close to a berserker and helldivers have the capacity to mag dump enough ammo to take those out. Tactically they're probably as tricky as a stalker and those are very deadly. Helldivers already have anti shield weaponry in plasma weapons and they effectively are miniature fuel rod guns able to wipe out small squads at a time as a baseline plasma rifle, we haven't seen any heavier plasma weapons in the helldiver core but they can and will likely exist.
Brutes/Hunters - Nearly every bug bigger than a car is probably a lot tougher than a brute, never seen an anti tank rocket bounce off a brute before. There been documented cases of anti tank rounds bouncing off the larger bugs or causing minimal damage.
Great video!
I think Super eadth is a stronger verson of the UNSC, and that they would dominate the covies, and even board their ships
here are my extra notes on this, I dug *a lot* of this from the deepest pits of lore. first of all, liches, they are basically a flying scarab, it has heavy weapons one all sides and the same plasma turret. also a bonus for the helldivers, stealing the convents weapons and vehicles, this would give helldivers a huge advantage against the covenant. also the covenant has a whole list of other vehicles other than the ones you mentioned: locusts are mini scarabs that could do reasonable damage, specters and prowlers are equal to the warthog, the brute choppers are bike cars that have a huge spiked wheel on the front, the shadow transport literally appeared in one mission and is a ground transport similar to a bus that has 2 shade turrets and can carry up to 2 ghosts, the seraph is a space fighter that is capable of destroying entire UNSC (humans) dropship squads solo, the vampire is another flying ship made for air to ground combat and uses giant needler cannons to destroy ground units, a grunt goblin is a mech suit built by grunt which uses a hunter's plasma cannon along with a double barrel needler. keep in mind that super earth could steal every single one of these. the needler and other needle related tech could be used by super earth to create stronger weapons utilizing the explosive power of the blamite (yes that's the real name) crystal's combine explosion to their advantage.
Thing about us divers is that we really fighting aliens in a while, and super earth is constantly changing and upgrading
Now I wonder what would happen if the illuminate and the covenant fought.
The covenant would stomp them out most likely. The Hunters would probably be their best aspect. But the brutes would probably be a large detriment to the Covenant.
@Lyleecow i feel like it wouldn't be a full stomp since they are both very familiar with plasma weaponry, both also utilize shields and invisibility too. Illuminate probably have the better overall knowledge as they know how to utilize black matter and how to travel thru black holes in shit. I'm not saying that will win them the war but the illuminate are definitely no slouches
Considering helldivers can get shot in the chest by a tank shell and survive and fight at 100% effectiveness with a simple stim they could definitely tango with some covenant troops
Not to mention every helldiver could get there own personal shield generator something the unsc only gave out to a few select units and Spartans
I would say helldivers are between odst’s and Spartans in terms of lethality
Honestly, the amount of weapons a Hell Diver has access to would crush any ground force the covenant fields. Space battles? Im unsure
Honestly Super Earth would throw Helldivers at any problem they encounter and with sheer amount of them problem would be probably solved. In this moment there's already 2.3 bilion Helldivers dead just in the Second Galactic War (and nearly 100bilion of their enemies). Super Earth must have insane resources. Also the ability to FTL jump into any place in the galaxy in an instant is just op.
Helldivers are gonna do a backflip bazooka trickshot and scream freedom destroying an entire battalion of covenant. But will then in the same breath die in the most stupidest most unexpectedly mundane way afterward. Like there comrade’s landing pod falling right on top of them.
Here's the issue with the covenants navy. If one of their ships gets destroyed it's a huge lose versus the helldiver's are able to recover from their loses way way faster. It's not a matter of power but a matter of does the covenant have the ability to defeat the industrial juggernaut of the helldiver's and I genuinely don't think so
On top of that. That's assuming the covenant even have their shipyard which can't really move so it's stuck in their universe which would mean the covenant would have no support once they enter helldiver's universe. In addition your argument that elites would just close in cus helldiver's are using explosives is 100% idiotic cus did you forget the divers are willing to blow them selves up to kill and enemy than they are to save their own skin. The covvies don't get reinforcements like the divers do and the sentries alone would smoke anything from the sky. You obviously have never seen sentry spam in defense missions. The covenant may have the weapons tech and numbers advantage but without an actual line of supplies their numbers would eventually be dwindled down by fanatics that have an unlimited economy behind them with a near endless supply of weapons to choose from. I will however give you credit that AT FIRST the covvies would appear to smoke the divers but the would retreat recover and kick their asses out of the galaxy
Oh and I forgot ftl travel is way faster in hd2 than in halo so even if the covvies try to chase important ships down they would not be able to catch up since their ftl requires time for prep
@@SageTheSahash Also Helldivers DO outnumber the Covanent because they rule over the whole Milky way while the Covanent only rule of the Orion arm of the milky way
@@Tengu-Atlas i also forgot to mention super earth has a nasty habit of adapting to the enemy. Plasma based weapons cool were are gonna make anti plasma armor. Energy shields? Cool ours not only works better but we have stronger arms to knock out theirs. A wraith would get 1 shotted by quasars. The only chance the covvies have is naval battles but going back to what I said the covvies would have a very limited amount of ships meanwhile super earth can casually just create a black hole
couldn't be farther from the truth. The covenant lost the unyielding heirophant and shrugged it off as barely a footnote. FTL travel doesn't mean much against a space-faring army with hundreds of times your firepower and durability. It just means you get to zoom to your death faster. If we only account for the forces we have knowledge of, the SEAF does not have as big a chance as many people here think it does.
dont forget that super earth has the ability to turn planets into black holes
Well we basically are at this point
The biggest difference is the FTL technology. Helldiver universe has an instant FTL jump compared to wormhole type in halo universe. So yeah if the laser canon of the super destroyer CAN damage the shield, then it would be random jump onto the covenant ship following with helldivers drops.
I could totally imagine an super destroyer FTL jumping inside a Covenant ship while being filled with hellbombs to the brim. Tech is more expensive than helldivers, but still, just consider the amount of equipment left on a planet after every mission. Losing one of the smallest available ships to a Covenant ship is a no brainer, especially for these super fanatics.
Hard to take the covenants odds seriously when a group of four helldivers can fry dozens of scarab sized threats in a single mission and can freely deploy shield packs capable of blocking tank shells as well as wear armour heavy enough to eat direct missile strikes, even in space all they need to do is turn the ship sideways and fire the hellpods and barrages for boarding parties as up and down is a dead concept in the void, then the ship can disappear with their much faster more reliable ftl while the squad ransacks the insides of the ship like the blood soaked lunatic zealots they are, then stacking on the having the numbers to fight a three pronged war of attrition against cyborgs literal swarms of man sized bugs and an outer galactic threat with teleportation shields mind controlling nanites and world consuming wmds. And that is completely dismissing the concept of the rest of seaf as we know little of their true scale and ability
I imagine a mission boarding Covenant ship will be overloading the Anti matter reactor with extraction not being that important in their strategy planning.
@@スフィアマスター I’m sure their will be an extraction plan, probably high jacking a drop ship of some form, but it would be a hell of a ride getting out with no guarantees, h divers me be ultimately expendable but super earth isn’t the unsc, they will have a plan to get them back if they can manage to get out fast enough
Good luck getting a hellpod to breach covenant shielding, or orienting a SD to drop them and getting the squad ready before a single torpedo from a covenant fighter, let alone one of a Cruiser or ship, shatters it. Talking about ground battles is a moot point of the covenant doesn't bother with them. Naval Superiority has to be contended with before all else is considered, and in that regard, the SEAF has a very, very tough fight on their hands.
@@cal928 I mean with how often throughout the series we board covenant ships, I can’t particularly see it as that big of an ask, basically do it once per game. Getting a group of divers onboard to rip and tear seems a simple job
@@Shadow-sword you do it once in the trilogy- after it’s already landed. Every other time you’re either teleported into the center or it’s been taken over by the flood. The boarding of the SDV in Reach cost a frigate. So a super destroyer attempting to launch a bunch of pods not only has to take the shields down first (it can’t. Because any basic covenant weaponry would shred it within seconds,) but it then has to fire the pods and hope they don’t get blown up first or hit a thick section of hull and get stuck. and even if it punches a hole through, that area now has no oxygen, and I don’t see O2 tanks on those divers.
There is a line that I haven’t seen anyone mention, if you interact with the weapons officer aboard your super destroyer, there’s a chance she says something along the lines of “there’s enough ordinance on this super destroyer to destroy a small moon” and there are millions of these super destroyers. Not only that but the super destroyer is a relatively small faction of the SEAF navy
I think Super Earth would handle the covenant much better than the UNSC simply because they have the numbers and are already used to fighting galactic spanning wars with aliens where as the UNSC was already crippled from internal strife and was in no state to fight the covenant when they arrived
Helldivers are the Spartans of Super Earth. They're sent on high priority missions that the standard SEAF soldier can't handle. It's why Helldivers are only sent in teams of 4, because they're that capable and efficient with doing their job. It's why they also have a dedicated Super destroyer for their forces due to their speciality. Yes, there can be 200,000 thousand Helldivers on a single planet but considering the enemies of Super Earth, that's probably how powerful their enemies are. We cna assume that for every 4 Helldivers, there are 40 SEAF soldiers, meaning Super Earth wins by attrition and the unconventionality of the Helldivers. Not to mention the numbers of Specialist Helldivers, like scout divers, Ghost Divers etc
I think the covenant wouldnt last long with the extreme tenacity of the SEAF
You talk about jamming signals, which has a point, but there are on-ground callin's like the SEAF artilery that can be used without connection to a Destroyer. Plus it depends on how strong the jamming may be. Having pinpoint calls thanks to stratagems allows for a lot of jamming being possibly useless, outside of close proximity to a jammer as we see with the automotons.
To be fair, helldiver's Super destroyer are just for fire support as most if not all of their weapons are for ground engagement, i dont think we've seen propper S.E.A.F. warships yet
My headcanon is that Super Earth's navy gets space superiority on a planet and then the helldivers join in to dive instead of having super destroyers fight in space battles
That's probably how it works
glass the planet, send out carriers and other aerial assualt vehicles to defend the carrier while its glassing the planet, dont even forget the brutes, helldivers are gonna get ripped apart by em, reach was about super earths size so this should be easy
The conviction of the covenant to their great journey seems weak comparer to the blind zeal of divers. I actually thing super earths inexplicable vice like grip on the perception of its fighters and willingness to gaslight its fighters into doing anything would result in super earth winning any engagement with a near peer adversary.
Helldivers are all ground game really. They have capable ships but they are basically the same as UNSC ships… and I think we know how that goes. And ground game doesn’t matter against the covenant when they can retreat and glass the entire planet. If the covenant didn’t break itself with the great schism humanity wouldn’t last. Helldivers will get steamrolled by the covenant
This video is proof we need the Xbox players to join the fight
K so it appears nobody understands how actually devastating the entire Covenant fleet would be to the Helldivers verse
I would watch an animation of the SEAF & Helldivers & ODST vs The Covenant, with Master Chief leading a squad of both Helldivers & Helljumpers.
The covenant watching super earth fucking turning them into spaghetti with dark fluid:
I don't think people realize just how hopeless the Human-Covenant war was for humanity. Reach was the best defended planet outside of Sol by a country mile, and the UNSC could provide little resistance to the Covenant once they sent a proper fleet. The "3-1 odds" thing for space combat doesn't mean the UNSC destroyed one covenant ship for every three, it's that the UNSC required three times the amount of ships to even hope for a victory.
The Covenant would glass Super Earth within a similar time frame to the Human Covenant war.
the only reason they didn't glass reach after getting the things they were looking for is because they thought 6 deserved to die honourably
And I don't think you realize the loony toons levels of insanity that is super earth.
Lemme put this into perspective for you
Super Earth already won a Covenant-equivalent empire, the Illuminate. You can compare Illuminate technology to covenant and see they are comparable, even physiologically the Illuminate are somewhat similar to the elites, just *squid*
Super Earth beat them in a war so hard that the illuminate got completely demilitarized, stripped of their tech, and were literally kicked out of the galaxy in the space equivalent of a rowboat with a hole in it. Super earth did this, while fighting communist terminators and the "we have zerg at home"
Super Earth won all fronts in the first Galactic war
*This was in 2084*
The first galactic war was from 2040 to 2084. Their main assault rifle, was an AR-15 BASED PLATFORM
They took over the ENTIRE GALAXY in your lifetime.
That same super earth now has the ability to make a planet into a black hole, is experimenting with putting that blackhole in a gun (if the leaks are to be believed), has better FTL travel than the covenant because they dump oil in the engine, Essentially has a death star in the form of the DSS, which that alone could at least do a number on High Charity considering they tested it by BLOWING UP A MOON, and on top of backwards engineering advanced alien tech in a matter of days to weeks, and being able to mass produce everything at a retarded rate, they have a military so brainwashed dedicated that the most zealot of elites gets an inferiority complex, while your average brute wonders why their first reaction to being thrown into a wall is to scream "FOR DEMOCRACY!" before failing 5 times to enter a stratagem code, shoot his team mates and then blow up the whole place conveniently missing that one single brute.
Super Earth runs on insanity, loony tunes logic, and literal weaponized stupidity. They borederline function like the Orks the covenant are not winning.
@@deadshot-8856 you did good 6
No. They would not. For one simple reason;
In order to get boots on the ground, you first need to keep ships in orbit. And it took the UNSC 70 ships vs 8 Covenant ships, and pretty much lost. UNSC ships are made for space combat. SEAF ships are not. SEAF ships are made to bombard planets below them, not engage other ships. You cant send Helldivers onto planets if your ships cant even stay in orbit for more than half a minute.
I actually agree for the most part, however, there is also the chance that super earth either reverse engineers or just steals covenant weaponry (don't know much about covenant weaponry so feel free to tell me if there is something wrong) I also think it would have a new type of effect when your in covenant space or if the covenant are invading, (please check Bad Timing - Helldivers 2 to see what the effects would be) it would probably be another thing like the automatons, helldivers push them out the first time, they come back with greater force and then it becomes an absolute clusterfuck, and since the illuminate aren't here yet there is also that, that the helldivers must worry about to when they come back, so it would be a war on 4 fronts, so not great, but also the illuminate, covenant, automatons, and terminids would be fighting each other so there is that we must take into account, so probably just a stalemate if I am to be honest.
Here before the incident
@belbekstrullour4996 as cool as the 4 front thing is i believe this is a hypothetical 1v1 covenant vs super earth not counting the other factions on either side. Also gotta count the whole seaf navy as helldiver super destroyers don't engage in navy combat at all. Plus because of their FTL capabilities they can instantly spawn over whoever ot whatever they want to destroy
@@Tengu-Atlas didn't wanna bring anything in that we don't fully know about, cause it is impossible to calculate that.
About the whole stealing tech stuff, the covenant are very well versed in that. The covenant only had one jackal shield be reverse engineered in the human covenant war. Once the covenant see how good the FTL drives are, I’m sure they’d snag some for themselves, the only reason they never did in the human covenant war was because they didn’t have to, as they had better tech than the humans, which makes the covenant verses super earth much more contested. Not to mention their plasma cannons and glassing beams thst can put rounds clean into super earth cruisers and destroyers. And not to mention that the covenant’s elite forces can eliminate a whole spartan team, much more trained and equipped compared to the helldivers. So I’m personally going to say that this is much more nuanced than people may think
Also, I thought were taking about just the covenant vs super earth, no fighting between bots and hingeheads
In the Halo Universe, the biggest reason as to why humanity kept losing was because of their inability to maintain space superiority. They only won due to the anger of a man in a green suit of armor and his blue vtuber model (accurate, but I'm making a joke here too).
Given the unknown amount of SES Cruisers and every Super Destroyer being essentially the equivalent of the UNSC's Halberd-class destroyers or possibly some lower class UNSC cruisers such as an unmodified Halcyon-class (do some lore digging and compare it to the super destroyer), it would be unlikely that SEAF would be able to maintain space superiority.
High Charity, the fleet that destroyed Reach, and the fleet around the unyielding heirophant could be estimated to be over 2000 ships and that's of the higher tier Covenant cruisers.
So assuming the covenant have space superiority over a planet but decide not to glass it (such as their is a special forerunner artifact on the planet), the planet is essentially blocked off from the rest of Humanity.
Helldivers would have no strategems available to call in and would only bring to the fight what they could transport on Eagle's (assuming they aren't tasked with air superiority which is mostly an irrelevant factor when space superiority is a far more determinate outcome of Sci fi conflicts), pelicans, and ground assets leaving them without deployable turrets, call in weapons, and orbital strategems.
Meanwhile the covenant have full access to their orbital support with some aerial assets available since the SEAF air force would contest the skies, the Helldivers and SEAF on a single planet would be able to out up a hell of a fight before losing.
Ultimately, when it comes to a planetary invasion, the space battle would essentially be an overwhelming victory for the Covenant while the every planetfall operation would result in pyrrhic victories for the Covenant.
Should this war fight all the way to Super Earth, I do believe that the covenant would ultimately succeed, but would take tons of time to economically, and militarily recover from this conflict leaving them perfectly vulnerable to other factions such as the illuminate.
EDIT: doing some research of my own and it appears that Super Destroyers are far weaker than a UNSC Halberd and unmodified Halcyon. Moreover when comparing the numbers and observations they cannot even stand toe to toe against a UNSC Paris class as seen in my 2nd comment below.
It sucks that they don't elaborate on the liberty class cruisers in the Helldivers' verse but it's hard to say the covenant would outright when because "big ships". They state that every orbital attack the super destroyer has but stronger plus FTL capabilities. If they are purely focusing on space battles you could argue that if they get a foothold on a planet they could setup orbital guns like the Helldivers did for that one major order (i forget which one). The liberty cruisers are faster than the covanent ships and have weapons that can take down their shielding which the UNSC had trouble with so it's hard to say super earth gets beat in space outright
@@Tengu-Atlas I can agree with the FTL, but offensively and defensively, i do not believe the SEAF navy can survive unless the Liberty-class cruisers are more impressive than General Brasch and his incredible service record.
In Halo, one of the first space battles was between a UNSC Paris-class frigate and a CRS-class Covenant light cruiser.
The Paris boasts 60cm of Titanium-A armor (Closest known IRL permutation is Titanium-50), with a MAC gun which can launch 600 ton depleted uranium rounds at velocities faster than a 380mm round from a Super Destroyer and is also armed with 3 shiva class nukes.
Although no direct numbers for Shiva's are stated, its sister class, the Havok, is a relatively newer and improved tactical nuke with a yield of 30 megatons (30,000,000 tons of TNT) so for the sake of this argument, I am going to say that Shiva's have a yield of 15 megatons (15,000,000 tons of TNT) (For reference, the Tsar Bomba was the biggest IRL nuke detonated at 50 megatons which is 50,000,000 tons of TNT).
The CRS was hit with 2 MAC rounds which weakened its shields and was still hit by a shiva and didn't die.
The Paris was hit with a handfull of plasma torpedos which heavily damaged the Paris with crew damage reports stating 1 torpedo can burn through 56cm of Titanium A armor.
The Paris was designed for combat against human insurrectionists so is fairly durable against kinetic weaponry, but incredibly weak against plasma weaponry.
A SEAF Super Destroyer (referred to as SD from here on out) has the dimensions of 170x80 meters not counting height and carries hellbombs which are the most destructive explosive armament aboard an SD. Upon visual comparisons with IRL nuclear tests and in-game hellbombs, hellbombs appear to have an explosive yield of 1.5 kilotons (1,500 tons of TNT). For reference, one of the nukes used in WW2 had a yield of 15 kilotons (15,000 tons of TNT). The average height of a human being is 1.7 meters tall and a hellbomb appears to be 1 meter tall compared to a human and about 0.5 meters wide when comparing with Helldiver player models.
Doing some math, you can fit around 330 hellbombs (1 hellbomb per 1 meters length = 170 hellbombs, 1 hellbomb per 0.5 meters width = 160 hellbombs, 170+160=330; Side note, this number makes no sense since you need to account for open space in the hanger, bridge, armories, hellpod storage, helldiver cryo pods, ammo storage for 380's, 120's, 500kgs, 50 Cals, Rockets, Mechs, etc... but we'll use this value for the argument) in one SD. 330 hellbombs when exploded at the same place at the same time would have a yield of 330 kilotons (330,000 tons of TNT) which is significantly less than a shiva class tactical nuke.
Now I've already made the comparison for the 380mm cannon as the MAC is, numbers wise, far superior than the 380 so we can talk about the laser cannon and the railcannon.
The railcannon despite being able to fire a round at a high velocity, it can only one-shot Bile Titans, Hulks, tanks, and anything smaller. We are talking about naval combat here against a ship that can survive a 15 megaton explosion so unless the railcannon was converted into a minigun and fired a denser round at a higher velocity, it won't make any meaningful damage against a single CRS.
As for the Orbital laser gun, comparing it to covenant glassing which can burn hotter and wider than the orbital laser, it is considerably weaker than covenant armaments, but is one of the best bets against covenant shield technology assuming an SD can stay alive for long enough to deplete a shield that can withstand a 15 megaton explosion.
Now in terms of an SD's armor, it can't survive a single round from an automaton surface-to-orbit gun (as seen when orbiting a hostile automaton planet). The orbital guns they use appear to fire a round that is visually similar to a 380mm round (you can climb on top of the guns in the "destroy orbital cannon" missions and see the round used). Although no density, mass, volume, velocity, material, or overall energy values are given, it does have enough energy to leave the atmosphere of a planet and still be able to one-shot an SD. Not to mention the lack of energy shielding SD's have. And of course due to a relatively large lack of lore in the HD2 universe, there are unknown variables when it comes to the armor material and density used on SDs.
With SD's being unable to survive what appears to be a 380mm round fired at a velocity faster than a planet's escape velocity and doesn't even have enough explosive energy to even bother the CRS's energy shields, the entire fleet of SEAF SD's seems unable to stand against a single covenant fleet. For any chance of the SEAF Navy to survive a naval engagement with the covenant, as I said in the beginning of this comment, those Liberty-class cruisers need to be more impressive than General Brasch himself to stand any chance against a CRS-class light cruiser.
Most of my information comes from Halopedia, the official wiki for Halo lore, IRL nuclear tests post WW2, and visual observations made in Helldivers 2 on both the bug and bot front.
Don't forget - We would have lost the war if not the Great Schism, They found Earth and obliterated most of the defenses with a small mining fleet with guard detail for the Prophet....
@puggyjman1073 fair points all around I'm just not sure where you got the information that SDs get destroyed by a single orbital gun shot. Yes they get destroyed in orbit but we never see how many they are shot with specifically. So that is just pure speculation on your part. Otherwise there is just not enough information on the liberty class cruisers so it's hard to know other than superior FTL and possible shield capabilities. I think SDs are just perfect for their job since Super Earth is more focused on conquering and taking over planets for their industry and resources unlike the covanent who are motivated by Forerunner artifacts. The real problem regardless of fire power is just that helldivers have numbers since they rule over the whole milky way while the covanent resides over the Orion arm. If Super Earth can utilize their numbers and guerrilla tactics with their superior FTL they have a chance of winning plus they have the DDS now and more stuff on the way
@watch.v-dQw4w9WgXcQ The UNSC basically crippled themselves before hand tho dealing with the insurrectionist so the UNSC were always on the back foot. I wondered how they would've held up at full power or if they didn't send their spartans (mostly the IIIs) on suicide missions so often
On the ground, I give it to Helldivers for how closely they work with the Super Destroyers. Plasma and Laser weapons are readily available, so they could deal with shields fairly well. But in terms of pure Naval power and military command, Covenant all the way. And I think that's the deciding factor given how it went for the UNSC. Still, none of this matters if General Brasch and John Helldiver are on the field.
The Covenant deploys a lot of AAA though. A Super Destroyer probably wouldn’t be able to sit 1km above an AO like they do in game.
There are two things I think that would guarantee the extinction of the Covenant if they were to ever attempt to fight Super Earth.
First off is the sheer amount of variables considered when fighting Helldivers. The Covenant could probably adapt and counter regular SEAF soldiers after learning their tactics and how durable (or not) they are. Against a squad of Helldivers, ir even a single one, there are no guarantees. Not a single ounce of predicability. Every single diver crafts and perfects their singular preferred loadout before each mission. There are so many different ways a Helldiver could kill you that just having one land in your vicinity drastically reduses your statistic probability of success as a Covenant soldier. You would never know exactly what kind of danger is heading your way until you actually see the Helldiver, and by then it's a good chance it's far too late for the enemy.
Secondly, Super Earth society has drilled the love of Managed Democracy, Freedom and Liberty into the minds of every single member of their considerably sized armed forces and Navy, and most likely almost every civilian. The Helldiver Corps is a fanatical, zealous and blindly loyal branch of SEAF. A Helldiver will sacrifice themselves without a second thought in order to win a battle, or even a single fight. Combine that with the appearance of their armor, their ability to use stims to shrug off otherwise fatal wounds and even enhance themselves temporarily, and the unpredictability of just how a Helldiver will go about trying to eliminate you...the Covenant would lose because fighting Super Earth would be just too much. Too much loss, too much uncertainty, too much broken morale.
They wouldn't stand a chance.
Helldivers are a moot point when talking about the covenant navy. You actually have to have a ground battle to fight if you want to use ground forces.
2:25 what? 25ml? Lol i think we hit that number of dead helldivers in the first week❤😂 super earth has 100 yrs of frozen helldivers on all 200+ planets of they'r domain so numbers are really off here, plus we don't really know about birth rate of both parties, but 25ml is super low.
Helldivers seem very reliant on orbital supremacy, if they can get that then yes. Helldivers wield more power than even the most experience Spartan, but have a fraction of the lifespan.
@dotmadhack life expectancy is different than life span, the life span of a gunner in Vietnam is about like 2 seconds 💀. So not only do Helldivers face worse odds than that but they have double the life expectancy than the U.S did in Vietnam
general brash could probably solo the covenant (not super earth propaganda)
(it is)
The covenant wins easy, estimates put their empire size anywhere from 1000-10000 planets, meaning they have a population that likely reaches far into the trillions, they also have more firepower, more manpower, larger ships, more advanced technology, 1000s of years of combat experience, and more, and the big one, strong energy shielding for ships and infantry.
Helldivers Federation of Super Earth, has an empire consisting of 261 planets grouped into 55 Sectors, they have less advanced tech, are considered highly expendable given the tactics used by commanders (meat waves) and have relatively weak ships for space combat.
There isn’t any population size mentioned in game, so we can’t say exactly how much, but being realistic we can probably say they have a population in the low trillions, and that is with 261 planets, the covenant has anywhere from 1000-10000.
Also the covenant isn’t stupid, a lot of the comments i see are based on the idea that the covenant won’t use glassing, when in reality they definitely would, it would not take long for the covenant to glass most of the less defended planets under the control of Super Earth.
In conclusion The covenant would steamroll through super Earth, using their naval superiority to weaken logistics, destroy super earths highly inferior navy and also glass most the planets.
Super Earth would fare better in ground combat, but overall would struggle given the technological and manpower advantage the covenant has.
The meat wave and high logistics tactics that super Earth relies on would not work against an enemy that uses the same tactic but has an empire 10 to 100x larger and more advanced.
This match up isn’t even fair, the UNSC got absolutely steam rolled by the covenant, and they arguably have better technology and tactics than super Earth, however less manpower and output.
First of all glassing isn't instantaneous and takes from days to a week depending on what ships they are using. Super earth's FTL is superior to the covanent's and would just instantly teleport ships to stop them.
The SEAF has liberty class cruisers designed for space battles and the DSS which can also use FTL. While the covanent's empire is impressively large they only occupy the Orion arm of the milky way while S.E. empire spans the whole milky way. So the numbers are in S.E.'s favor and since they are so fanatical and patriotic everyone one is getting military training at least! While the covanent have some planets and species that only make equipment for that and aren't combatants.
Helldivers are a formidable enemy highly trained well equipped and arent stupid. The only stupid ones are the ppl that will underestimate them and get fucked over
@ Nah they still losing, FTL isn’t decisive in this war, and that is really the only advantage they have over the covenant, FTL undoubtedly requires a ton of “fuel”, fuel that won’t exist when the Covenant destroys the supply lines and glasses most of the planets.
As of the launch of Helldivers 2, there are 55 sectors with a total of 261 planets. (counting Super Earth), 261 planets won’t be enough the fight the 1000s of planets under covenant control and the 1000s of year the covenant has had to develop and populate said plants.
The covenant has more numbers, and better tech, they would win undoubtedly.