Do you remember that quote where Darth Treia said that modern Sith were like children playing with toys compared to ancient Sith? I feel like these true Sith would have reflected that
I believe Traya specifically referenced Master Sith Deulist Tulak Hord as I believe they were talking about lightsaber deuling.. which is like comparing an ant to god himself. Though, I'm sure other aspects of the ancient Sith were equally as terrifying.
Imagine a Sith Empire so outrageously horrifying, the Force itself bleeds. Imagine an army of Darth Sion acolytes. An army of Darth Nihilus knockoffs. Imagine a galaxy wide Malachor V.
Well a galaxy wide Malachor V would probably mean the death of the Force and Nihilus. Even though Nihilus would be nigh unstoppable, he would run out of beings to feed on thus ending his own existance.
Or a new Sith Emperor powerful enough to siphon the life others, enough to turn them to ash. Powerful enough to create an army of Darth Sions. Or an army of Husk-like beings from Mass Effect. A being powerful enough to destroy entire First Order armadas with just a mere will to destroy. Powerful enough to permanently sever the Force from another being. A being who wanted the Galactic Empire to bleed to death. One who wants to end the lives of all Jedi. A being powerful enough to be completely non-corporeal.
@@theromuluanhunter6976 pretty sure dread gods like Vitiate exist in Otherspace. Only the will of The Celestials and Universe itself keep such horrors at bay. Imagine a council of beings on par with DE Palpatine with their overlords having power that exceeds FotJ Luke's by a factor of 3 or more ? Without the aid of The Celestials and ancient courageous races, the galaxy would have surely been turned into an eternal graveyard of worlds and dying stars...
It's almost like legend's had passionate content creators unlike Disney canon. Now I'm no fool legend's had it's issues but so does every lore for world's (unless it's Lord of the rings because tolkein is a damn genius) despite its flaws though legend's was great at world building and adding new ships, technology and understand of the force to it. The old republic era in particular is arguably the best part of legends canon and it pisses me off that Disney is now going to butcher that era now like they did with the post endor era with their shitty movies.
The thing is. What he sais in the video is exactly what came to happen. I really don't understand how you can hate on something for not being what you want then describing exactly what it was as you ideal story. The empire was ruthless. It was dark and it only got less aggressive because of the influence of Revan. So in a way revan achieved what he actually wanted in the end. This was drew Karpishyyn's message and all of you just looked past it. Revan saved the galaxy when he was on Dromund Kaas by sacrificing himself. From there a message was sent to the other sith. They were exposed to other ideas and for Vitiate, vitiate never thought revan's will would be powerful enough to manipulate him to make peace with the republic.
@@kiyanhakim384 That's not the same as the original idea of the "True Sith" though. The True Sith were envisioned to be somewhat akin to an animalistic representation of the Dark Side. Imagine an entire faction of figures like Darth Nihilius. No longer beings, but nothing more than pure manifestations of dark side energy. Destruction being the only thing they understand. A sort of final end-point for anyone who has fully embraced the dark side....basically what Palpatine couldn't even achieve, lest he no longer becomes Palpatine. The idea of being fully consumed by the dark side has always been in Star Wars as well. It's the reason why Count Dooku looks nothing like Sidious or why the player character's skin color changes in KOTOR as they become more and more evil. So the True Sith would be the final point where one has completely gone over to the dark side, to the point where they aren't even a living being anymore. That's basically what KOTOR 2 was building up to. Only for SWTOR to make the true Sith out to be no more than a Galactic Empire knockoff with a few slight differences (namely the faux peace treaty with the Republic and the Cold War nonsense).
I can't imagine Revan's reaction after he fully remembered those guys and realizing he played himself after destroying the Forge, the Galaxy would have been consumed in a massive oof
(At the Jedi Council) Revan: So you guys remember the starforge? Ya I just got my memories back as to why I wanted that. Ha ha.... ya we’re boned. So I’m just going to go on vacation, good luck with the the true sith.
xX Valtiel Xx Revan: Oh yeah. There’s these Three Sith that will show up soon. One is an Old Master of mine & the other two are a Taste of what The True Sith are. Bye! 👋🏻
Not quite. Kreia mentions how he was careful to preserve the factories on conquered worlds, it was Malak who started to just burn anywhere that resisted with the ability to make weapons. He didn't want to rely on the star forge, probably because he knew he couldn't hold them off if they decided to take the star forge at all costs. Or considering how the star forge responds to dark side will, it might have even become disobedient in the presence of True Sith.
This. Just this. This is what I envisioned all that time before SWTOR dropped and dashed my hopes. The answer to the question 'What would scare a hardy war veteran like Revan so badly that going Sith was a GOOD idea?'
You give SWTOR too much shit. Think about it. SWTOR could never do this. Its not an interesting plot for the MMO. It would only ever work as single player. And in fact later on SWTOR did exactly this. Zakuul was much like true sith. Unstoppable war machine that mere encounter with dragged Jedi Grandmaster to the dark side so that they can have any hope of winning. And SWTOR presented a very interesting vision of deformed, fractured, muddled down sith, showed you the what if if Bane wasnt around. What if Sith moved away from their traditions and made actual liveable tho still terrible society.
@@xelloskaczor5051 People who haven't played FF14 commenting on what MMO storytelling is and isn't capable of will never not perplex me. Because I used to be there, and I know better now
@@heinzguderian9980 It's cropped. In the full picture you see a bridge between the notes, making it look like a face. I call it the 'You are in big Treble' Grin.
These Sith sound insane. Almost like they've been possessed under the insidious minds of The Old Ones from "Supernatural Encounters". There is no plan of conquest and stability, just death, chaos, and terror.
The true Sith honestly seem like well. Star Wars Darkspawn, or more hardcore Vong. A teeming overwhelming enemy bent on corruption and destruction and nothing else. Hitting Galaxy with such reckless all consuming hate that the only option the current Chosen One could see was to become a monster himself and forge the Galaxy into a war machine.
the current chosen one isn't revan, it is the exile.... the one that could ignore the calling to become a sith lord from the destruction of malak-whore
Really love your clarity on the true and original vision for Revan. In TOR, Revan explains that he was just a puppet that killed for Vitiate, nothing more than Mandalore the Ultimate was. KOTOR1 and 2 establish Revan became aware of ths threat and, as explained in the video, prepared as Revan felt necessary via his Sith and the Star Forge. It's not even a front to deceive the True Sith either, he says with pure confidence to the Sith strike team that he was just a puppet. Complete retcon, bad one at that. He also loses alongside Exile due to Scourge deciding to ride with the losing side of his visions rather than the winning ones out of likely fear and self preservation or just ignorance. I believe Revan had planned to kill their leader (Vitiate), thus causing internal struggle for command as Sith typically have, and return to the Republic as he said he would after they and the Mandalorians had prepared and clean up the rest of the True Sith. HK-47 and his army of reprogrammed HK-51 would have certainly added some power to their army too.
Omega The Myth Revan expected to face a man or at least a monster that lead the true Sith. But instead he walked into the domain of The Devil and was reminded that their are far scarier things than Sith in the universe. There's things like Vitiate. Disgustingly powerful entities that use everything around them as tools and nothing more. Life and death are inconsequential. Your suffering is what they desire. And in either state your in (dead or alive) their desires will be met...
@@blackshogun272 Scourge envisioned them with winning but did not hold out hope for those outcomes. Hope is the driving power of Star Wars most of the time. Vitiate, while powerful, is not as alien as something like Nihilus.. even the Exile is rather alien. They stood a chance, but were brought down by the one not prepared and afraid.
@X X Also, similar to how Anakin fears and acts according to his visions, causing them to be more than just visions.. the same could have happened with Scourge. The downfall of Revan and Exile was to pave way for a new story of The Old Republic, not because they were entirely incapable.
Case in point, no vision is set in stone. Visions clouded by failure and the dark side should not be focused on and feared or else they come to fruition. There is no singular outcome, there is many. Scourge, like Anakin, feared what he had seen, and did not hold out hope for what could have been. Hope is power in Star Wars.
My favourite Character in SW I was gutted at what they did to her... Regardless fans always mention Nihilus as a powerhouse (as they should) but The Exile was easily on the same level if not more.
Ik this is petty but I never liked the fact that they made the exile a female, imo it makes more sense in KOTOR 2 for the exile to be male because of certain things like Atria's hate for the exile being a "I hate you because I love you and you betrayed me" rather than just random hate. Before you say it yes you could say that atris is a lesbian for female exile but gays atleast in legend's canon aren't very common much like in real life and I don't mean to make anyone angry here but this is just my opinions.
@@coinkidink9997 Um, not on the level of Nihilus. If Exile had been consumed by the dark, then yeah probably. The Exile defeated him because they are the same and his tricks do not work on her.
@@delta2372 That's why I play as the male exile lol. Yeah, when you play as the male, it is often implied that Atris had feelings for you. And plus the whole "you were able to cut yourself from the force" hate. If I remember correctly, when you play as the female exile, there were no signs that Atris felt in love with you. I guess Atris was just jealous or despised the female exile, because she was able to cut her connections from the force. And we all know how the Jedi (or Sith) cling or become dependend to the force to this point, where they rather die than let go of it. That's why the four Jedi Masters died on Dantooine when Kreia took away the force from them.
@@niki_mafioso39 exactly plus, the male exile interactions with the companions are Abit more interesting imo and I find it stupid that the exile is canonically female all so the boring disciple can rebuild the Jedi, I would take the handmaiden becoming the new Jedi grandmaster or visas any day of the week over him, plus I find the guy to be boring
AlcGmn this idea of "True Sith" don't sound like Sith but the Esh-Ka from The Old Republic and they were more dangerous than the Rakata because they were basically everything Geetsly explained his version of the true Sith were. Due to the Rakata having a Star Forge (a gift from The Dark Architects) they overwhelmed the Esh-Ka to near extinction and imprisoned the remnants of their race in the prison planet of Belsavis. That's the world that held the World Razer down; fore if it were to escape, its fury would shatter a thousand worlds. But anyways, the Rakata, as evil as they were, seem casual when compared to this "Bloodlust Sith Empire". But on a real note, the Yuuzhan Vong and several other factions would pummel these rabid Sith into paste before they ever got the chance to spread blood for the blood god 😂
@@blackshogun272 The Esh-Ka were actually Fanatic Purifiers: a civilization whose entire existence and culture revolves around annihilating all other forms of sentient life in existence. That alone makes them pretty damn scary. You cannot bargain with them. You cannot have an understanding with them. You can only wait until they launch their next "war of purification". The Rakata were pretty damn terrible. They were the former slaves of a near omnipotent precursor race who became galactic slavers themselves when their masters vanished. They were known for having a culture so xenophobic that they considered all species of the galaxy to merely be their unclaimed property and believed their empire would outlive the stars and endlessly expand into infinity. But by comparison to the Esh-Ka, the Rakata look like nice old people offering you tea and crumpets. You have to be pretty monstrous to make literal galactic slavers look good by comparison. The entire Star Wars galaxy is actually fortunate that the Rakata ended the Esh-Ka's empire, or else modern day Star Wars would just be the Esh-Ka waging an endless campaign of complete and utter genocide across the universe. A lot like 40k actually lol.
I knew I wasn't the only person disappointed with the so-called "Sith" in SWTOR. They felt just as you stated, "an Empire knockoff". After all the build-up in KOTOR 2, it was a complete and total let-down. Sure, if you never played KOTOR or KOTOR 2, then the Sith in SWTOR probably do look cool, but Kreia and Revan really did make them out to sound much darker than an Empire knockoff. Seeking not conquest, but absolute destruction. It's the way of the true Sith as well. It harkens back to the Darwinian foundations of the Sith, the strong ruling over everyone until they are stripped of their power by those lesser than them. But ultimately it's a cycle of self-destruction. Thus the ultimate form of this would be the destruction of the galaxy. The SWTOR Sith are little more than the Sith seen in the first KOTOR. Bickering amongst each other with petty political struggles. KOTOR 2 showed a side of the dark side that is rarely touched upon. KOTOR 2 showed the dark side as the disease that it is. A manifestation of death and war itself (i.e. Malachor) and something that is almost a living entity. We saw echos of this in characters like Darth Nihilius who was so consumed by the dark side that he ceased to be a living being anymore. SWTOR really ruined that image.
The Bioware of today is not the Bioware from the 2000's and on top of that it seems they have a huge Ego problem from the way they put down KOTOR 2 in the revan novel bur it also seems like they hate their own accomplishments given how they also put down Revan in BOTH the Novel AND TOR.
I barely know anything about the story of the Old Republic MMO, so hearing this was what was planned for KOTOR III makes me wish there had been one even more.
Just replacing Revan’s empire with the Sith Empire of ToR was a lateral move. These True Sith sound so terrible that you can see why Revan did what he did to have a chance of stopping them.
A sith vs sith war is would have been pretty badass, not only that but we would have gotten the 3 heroes of all 3 Kotor games to join forces and fight the true Sith.
holy fuck that would be awesome and it could be made to make a lot of sense like why the emperor was pulling resources a way from one empire he had and giving it to another empire rather than just bringing them both together under his rule i mean they had some differing ideology but hes the emperor his word is law and he could have just said ya these are the new rules and anyone who disagrees dies, but if you are in it for the sake of creating more chaos it would make more sense
it wouldnt have worked as well. Because MMO's never end. They have to keep the ball rolling. And Vitiate has the same origin as true sith would have. Word for word exact same. Took people from korriban, brought them to unknown system, cultivated civilization there. Makes no sense to replay that. And defeating something like True Sith is way more final than beating some upstart Eternal Empire. And quit frankly Vitiate was the ultimate True Sith, Palpatine before Palpatine, seeking to erase all life. You wanna another group of dipshit with exact same idea? Nah.
I love this look at revan. It paints him as such a visionary and he actually wanted to save the galaxy as a whole not just take it over... hearing in KOTOR 2 that Revan leaves the republic industries, this line of thinking makes even more sense.
I kinda hoped we would get this with the new movies. A vast sith empire in the outer regions. Could have made Rey a decendent of bastilla and/or Revan. But instead we got a worse version of dark empire. Whatta shame.
the whole new trilogy is more action than story, and it keeps overusing silly archetypes and overused plot devices to the point i can't invest in it. the whole galaxy is on the line every time and it gets.. like.. can we just get something new? destroying planets gets old. i'm more interested in seeing the journey rather than a sudden reveal of "oh look they have huge fleets and planet destroyer planets now for some reason"
@@harrambou9468 nah, the action is enjoyable for me. i mean the choreography is horrendous, and it looks more like the actors are just improvising or having a LARPing session, but when you get past that it's possible to enjoy the pretty colors and action scenery. lol. might be asking a lot for some people.
Ah if only the MMO took place after KotOR 3 Then we could have had both. Even if they did stick with this take on the True Sith in the MMO it would be a lot harder to make several remotely compelling stories about them so that's probably one reason why they changed it. Just a shame we lost the fulfillment of the build-up in the first 2 games.
I think this take on Revan is compelling- the problem is that it might not lead naturally to the film era. That would require some creativity to accomplish. Perhaps the True Sith could be that potently dark but they would either A) be fewer than Revan thought, casting a big shadow in their inevitable decline (like a cancer stricken with hyper-cancer) or B) the True Sith have some fatal, unexpected flaw- -something Revan wasn’t able to predict in his grab for power, something requiring an unexpected ally. But I doubt we’ll get that rewrite *shrug*
The concepts are very interesting, but the problem is a faction/group of chaotic nihilistic individuals. The A team of psychopaths, how do you make a team of serial killers who have no regard for anything work together? That Darth Traya uses Sion and Nihilus to get to her nihilistic goals, ok, she's deceiving everybody, including herself. But that people would cooperate when they can't rely on anything even themselves? Hard to make it believable!
I think this story can really fit with just a bit of restructure and retcons. The Swtor empire could very well be a evolved version of the true sith empire just buy having Revan defeat them and having someone like vitiate survive and inherite the true sith empire remains. No killing Meetra and crazy Swtor Revan DLC.
I like this better than the version we got. It helps Revan make sense. The way characters talk about Revan he seems like a tactical genius, which means he had to have a better reason to become the dark lord of the sith than just wanting power he didn’t need.
After watching this, I feel like retconning Vitiate/Valkorian to originally be a member of the Sith species is a mildly redeeming factor for how much of the original story they changed.
Honestly, I still think SWTOR's canon could actually work with this story, if you look at it in a different light. The true sith were preparing - Almost ready - When Vitiate... consumed them. Completely annihilating the entire faction, and then basically leaving. Revan goes to confront him - Expecting a normal sith - And gets completely destroyed by this now true demi-god. Vitiate understands that Revan is exceedingly useful, and thus captures him. With the dread masters imprisoned and then killed, and the true sith lords having been consumed by vitiate, A new, more tempered, sith empire continues with the invasion plans, under the command of Vitiate. But Vitiate just doesn't give a fuck if they die, because he's just over there on Zakuul pursuing the ultimate goal of the dark side: To be the one true ruler of the galaxy. So he doesn't really try to push the sith empire into winning, because he's just being greedy and playing everyone. It... works. To an extent. Timelines and stuff would probably have to change slightly, but would it really be that odd? In-fighting is the sith way. If Vitiate just ate all of the true sith.... It would realistically mess up everything Revan was expecting to encounter.
And this thing went on to inspire the Youzong Vong, an Extra Galactic Alien Species that desired to Shed Blood, Slaughter, Maim and Kill, just to please their Gods
Oddly enough, I think the concept of Vitiate would have suited the original idea of these True Sith well, given the horrifying method of how he attained his extended lifespan much like Nihilus (only far more effective). I could easily see the true Sith rounding up the remainders of who they saw as weak and offer them up as a sacrifice to Vitiate like some sort of god-king Sith of death, the head of their empire of strife and power. I mean, they almost sound like an insane, Lovecraftian cult obsessed with death and strife that could use a figurehead like that.
I simply loved this! In canon, I think the only Sith we get to at least *resemble* this thinking is Momin. He trapped events, burnt worlds, made a doorway to a new dimension. As for their way of thinking, Malgus and Marr stand as Legends' best examples. I know I used these 2 a lot in my comments lately, but in order to really win, the Sith had to get rid of their infighting. Marr developed on this. Malgus was one of the perfect Sith, as he saw both orders as petty dog packs, one more powerful, but lashing out at their own. He left and possibly did more spiritual damage to some places than the physical damage the Sith Empire could do to entire star systems. This just shows how powerful the Sith could have been had they focused on their 2 greatest weaknesses.
Krayt is a joke. Once he summoned the ghosts of three Sith Lords to seek council. Darth Bane was mad because he broke the rule of two. Darth Andeddu thought he's too dumb for his wisdom. Darth Nihilus tried to be helpful, but Krayt doesn't understand ancient Sith😂
They sound like the Dread-Lords from The Old Republic actually, which weren't actually supported by Darth Vitiate's Sith Empire and also according to what I remember might have wanted to destroy the Force along with all life in the galaxy. It's possible that ultimately the True Sith were exiled by the Sith who craved more worldly pleasures such as economic wealth and other lustful self-indulgences, rather then the destruction of the Force. It is possible that most typical Sith felt that, the Force least served the vita role of being their only path to gaining all their pleasure based desires.
Thanks to YOU sir, I NOW know why I don't really like the story of the Old Republic game. They made the true sith empire AND Revan(along with the crew of the Ebon Hawk from both Knights of the Old Republic games SPOILER ALERT because when Revan and The Exile disappeared NONE of the crew tried to look for him or get the army ready or train new Jedi they just sat around hoping they would come back until the emperor showed up killing everyone) look boring and stupid (copy and paste overpowered villian and make him the emperor of a galaxy wide army just like Emperor Palpatine). This explanation of what SHOULD HAVE HAPPENED with Knights of the Old Republic but it NEVER happened is just WRONG! This could make millions of dollars for the writers and star Wars in general. Revan isTHE SMARTEST PERSON IN STAR WARS HISTORY to make the good guys the bad guys to save everyone is SPECTACULAR STRATEGY.
i mean there's that, but then how do you go about shifting that narrative back into the Star Wars that started it all? this is just food for thought. Not a critique or provocation ^^
@@ForestRaptor I suggest bringing in ALL the writers from Knights of the Old Republic games, and anyone that truely cares about the Star Wars storyline, and continuity and not just about making money. Then asking THEM what they want to do with the story. And have them make a TV show based on it. Then fire everyone at Disney that is ruining Star Wars right now with the bad movie's by messing up the continuity and the characters of the story.
@@darthnox7958 THAT'S A FACT! HK-47 ACTUALLY survived for thousands of years ALL the way up to the era of Palpatine he was inside of a ship on Mustafar while Anakin and Obiwan were fighting(look up "How HK47 survived on Mustafar during the Clone Wars" by Star Wars comics). So they could use HK-47 to help incorporate the story of Revan and the Exile and the TRUE sith into the Modern era. Perhaps Ahsoka could free him and she could learn some of the Exile and Revans techniques to HELP beat Vader(she doesn't have to kill him she could have a force vision to see his redemption with Luke)😊💯 talk about fan service lol. But my original point is that HK-47 should NOT have been the ONLY one looking for Revan and the Exile THE ENTIRE CREW and the Galaxy should have been searching when they discovered the two GREATEST MILITARY and Jedi/sith minds were missing while KNOWING (based on the information Kreia told the Exile she would have told everyone the True sith were STILL out there) there was still a great threat to the Galaxy. But the Old Republic story didn't do that for whatever reason.
@@JJoh4040 i understand your point but I'm pretty sure that no one else knew where revan went so they just decided to keep doing their own thing, but we know that carth and bastilla tried to learn where he went(kotor 2 restored content mod), mission and zalzabar probably thought about it but they had no idea where he went, juhani and jole same thing.
I... actually prefer the version we got. The Sith Empire tried sorcery and all sorts of horrors in the past, many times really and the Jedi held to the light, Vitiate seemed to realize this with his Empire. Its like Scourge said, they needed to evolve and change. And the Empire we got felt like a good in between the Old Sith and the New Sith, an Empire that has technology and order like an Empire, and still connected to the sorcerous ways of the past with the Sith Sorcerers. While something like an enhanced version of the old sith would have been cool I think the one we got lays a better groundwork for what the New Sith and later Brotherhood were like, and a good base for someone like Palpatine to use for his empire.
I’ll say, with the Onslaught update, Loyal Imperial players get to show the true threat the Sith can bring. No more God-powered Emperor, just raw military might. Endangering Civilians/Resorces and causing a decisive win against a key Republic shipyard though unity, far better than Kaan’s joke of an Empire...
The fact that Revan was technically still a good guy and only became a Sith to save the galaxy from destruction and not for some power hungry reason shows how great he was
The plan becomes silly when you realize it was basically Revan going "yo dog, I heard you don't want to be conquered by a sith empire, so I made a sith empire to conquer you so you don't get conquered by a sith empire
As much as I really love both these ideas, it would be hard to speculate how it would play out given how Disney owns the property now. Ex. The Vong invasion books came out before Disney had a chance to get their hands on them and so in the EU we have that and in Disney’s version we’re stuck with the events of the Force Awakens.
Well, as someone who’s introduction to Star Wars Expanded Universe was literally the SWTOR “Deceived” trailer, as someone who was so psyched to play as a Sith Sorcerer back in the day, and as someone who’s only recently gotten back into SWTOR after so many years, I can safely say…. They really, REALLY should have gone with this. I love being Darth Nox, but this puts everything I’ve done to shame.
They could blend this with swtor maybe have vitiate being the son of one of the strongest true Sith who happened to survive kotor 3 bc while I dislike swtors treatment of Revan I like a lot of the characters like malgus and the concept of the eternal empire
Nigel Walker in an cancelled Star Wars novella for the EU, it is implied that Tenebrae/Vitiate/Valkorion was a dark entity from Otherspace that escapes the wrath of The Celestials long enough to resurface and bring death/chaos for its slain evil gods. That would explain why he was so absurdly powerful with The Force. Darth Nihilus and Palpatine seem hella OP and shit but during the Cosmic Wars that waged between the creations of the Celestials and the Stygian Armies of Otherspace and their evil gods, you had entities like Nihilus and Palpatine as commanders for these horrific beings. Beings like Vitiate in Otherspace would be worshipped as dark kings who'd wage war on the other devilish monarchs of that abominable twilight realm. Like, I'm making these guys sound Op but when compared to the beings that actually made them, and to the entities that made "them" (their gods) they are nothing but fog to be blown away with a hand flicker.
@@blackshogun272 Sounds pretty cool and unique, they should have gone with that instead. Thing is, SW:TOR doesn't need Revan or his storyline for it's existance. The great parts of the MMO can exist without tarnishing him or The Exile.
@@coinkidink9997 we'll just have look past the Revan thing since his influence in the story is almost zilch unless you start taling events from Maelstrom Prison Fp, The Foundry, or the Operation they made too. Anyways, what I'm trying to say is he doesn't influence the storyline and onward expansions in any way truly. But as for the idea about the info I typed in my last comment; it'd be pretty hard making a Star Wars game like that since they'd either half to: A. Give the player the ability to play as a Celestial B. Make an interesting story during the Cosmic Wars that doesn't have the Celestials/Firstborn races doing a "hakai" on every enemy. The blasphemous horrors that lurked in Otherspace (Dark Illathurion) are the living definition of OP nightmares and terror. C. Display the more powerful beings from Supernatural Encounters greatly in design but shortly in presentation. These beings should be too much for the mortal races to comprehend and (psychologically) survive gazing upon them. D. Show an actual massacre in a Star Wars game. The Cosmic Wars were 50% war and 50% one-sided slaughter for some factions... *Looks intently at Lo'htek*
Revan, the Exile, and Scourge could have just succeeded to strike down Vitiate to the point it takes him the hundreds of years to resurface in SWTOR for the first time. Instead, they don't give them any sort of closure. Revan could have died happily and came back in SWTOR as an aiding specter advising the main character. This would still fulfil the fan service quota that drove Revan to be in SWTOR whatsoever.
What happens to Revan is essentially a lesser of what happens to Anakin. At least Anakin got to destroy Emperor Palpatine's first body.. Revan didn't even get that for Vitiate.
You think that Revan's Sith Empire would act like TOR's Sith Empire? It would be an interesting what-if scenario seeing the Reconstituted Sith Empire against the True Sith.
I mean... is it really any more interesting than what we did get? This sounds like the "true sith" were just psychotically evil beings. They're just another Chaos, except probably less complex due to not having God's and cultists and shit like that. I gets it's edgier, but I appreciate a character like Darth Malgus - a Sith with a vision - a lot more than just some evildoer bent on destroying everything.
This was your best episode (for me) yet. You answered so many questions about Revan that have been stewing in my brain, and even some I hadn’t thought to ponder. So good. I just couldn’t wrap my head around exactly why Revan had to have HIS own Sith Empire. Nor could I comprehend why he felt it was necessary to take down the Republic first, followed by the (true) Sith Empire. It just never occurred to me his plan was to conquer The Republic and reconstitute all of it (well, at least it’s war fighting component) as an even larger Sith Empire consisting of the former Republic and his Sith Empire - of course, under his control. I couldn’t grasp that under his plan there would actually be two simultaneous Sith Empires in existence - the bad True Sith and the good Revan Sith, Revan’s Sith Empire consisting of his original one and the conquered Republic one. So simple now! I understood he’d have to conquer The Republic to use its resources (and his) to battle the True Sith. However, I thought somehow he’d have turned back to the Light Side and converted his Sith Empire to the Light as well. But as I played this through, it just never added up in my head. This is brilliant! Thank you, as I can get back to enjoying the Revan saga again. Now that I have the correct ‘big picture’ of Revan’s plot, I can properly understand why events occur as they do within his storyline. Laf, everyone else is probably thinking I’m a dope, but maybe it had something to do with not being a gamer and that I’ve been piecing together the plot primarily through Lore channels like Geetsly’s, 100% Star Wars, and others. One question: When Malak became the Sith ruler, presumably that was of Revan’s Sith Empire. I thought somewhere down the line, Malak declared himself Dark Lord of the Sith. Did Malak, with his Sith empire, also take over the True Sith Empire, or was the True Sith Empire still its own entity, independent of Malak’s? That is, were there two separate Sith Empires while Malak was a Dark Lord of the Sith? I guess another question: if there were two separate Sith factions, who was the leader of The True Sith, and were there any interaction between his and Malak’s empires?
War crime empire seeking the destruction of the force itself, Now *THAT* is how sith should have been. Also it would have put a special twist to what kreia tryed to do, teach the exile what true sith are.
I already knew this as I spent literal thousands of hours playing KOTOR I & II trying every single different path and build. KOTOR III would of been epic and instead gave us SWTOR which wasn't what I expected and not a true sequel to KOTOR II. Now we got Disney that wants to fuck all the good shit that the Old Republic stories are. Sucks to be a Star Wars fan now.
I like it, but I also like the Sith Empire from SWTOR(save for the designs and ideology, that could be more original, rather than an almost carbon copy of the Galactic Empire). I feel that it could've been introduced as some other force actually. Like, there would be that Vitiate's brigade, but there would also be another fragment of the old Sith Empire that survived.
The idea was that Sidious took cues from Emperor Vitiate's sense of style and taste in designing his own Galactic Empire, so that explains the similarities.
Great video. Loving the Revan and KOTOR content you’ve been doing recently. Based on what you believe the True Sith would have been, what do you think would have happened after KOTOR 2 and/or during the events of 3?
Revan probably had gone to Drummond Kaas alone to pick off True Sith higherups, gather information, and return as promised in KOTOR2 to the Republic, Mandalorians, and the HK Army after they had prepared for war. It's not like he's gonna walk in there with the Exile and bring down the *entire* empire. As for the game, I believe you would be playing as both Revan and the Exile at certain points, making choices and interactions with both main characters.
Omega The Myth if someone even comparable to Vitiate is the Sith Emperor or reigning Dark Lord, the dude is still fucked. Like he won't be directly serving him like TOR like to cram down our throat, but he'd probably be indirectly through his actions and decisions. But that all depends on if they make the leader of hidden Sith for KOTOR 3 an almost nigh-omnipotent dark side entity...
@@darthnox7958 I know, i've read it. But I mean what would have happened if the concept of Kotor 3 had been made, instead of what we see in Old Republic.
So Mando-Vong-Sith philosophies on steroids or something much worse. Btw I think they had to change the Sith because otherwise the Jedi Order would have had to have died forevermore and become Revan's Sith or the whole galaxy would be dead by the time of the movies.
Considering BioWare's other works specifically Mass Effect I can see the true Sith being somewhat akin to the Reapers being more like a force of nature than a traditional army and each of the True Sith being a Nihilus light being more like force vampires consuming all in their path. I can even see the Light and Dark side options being more akin to the Paragon and Renegade neither option being bad in the face of oblivion.
This is the deep, psychological thinking about good, evil and balance on a galaxy wide scale that I miss from Legends. Watching the shallow sequels make me miss it even more.
It is the beauty of Star Wars Legends and why it needs to be continued. It is why Star Wars Legends needs more support and why more people need to support the Star Wars Legends movement.
@@JediAcolyte94 Disney will never give anyone license to use their characters. Especially when they might tell interesting stories for mature audiences that overshadow their toy and theme park driven stories.
@@Ben-Ken They can still continue Star Wars Legends as its own separate continuity with more stories. That is what Legends fans have been wanting since the rebranding. That is why the Star Wars Legends billboard thing happened.
Revan will always be my most favorite lightsaber wielding chad. Revan: a Star Wars story, if only we had competent people makin this stuff on the big screen
I so prefer this version of the sith over canon. I have a copy of the book of the sith at home and it mentioned the sith purebloods and how extreme they were. I've always liked the darker parts of star wars like the yuzhong vong and its a shame canon just ignores it.
Kotor and Kotor 2 left such an impact in my life that I constantly return and find more amazing things about this era in a galaxy far far away. In the restored content of KOTOR 2 there's a conversation between Visas Marr and Mandalore that I will always remember. The first time a Mandalorian a veteran of the Mandalorian wars an enemy and a friend to Revan looked back to those days of glory in battle, the thousands killed, the worlds burned with pride then with one bit of nostalgia his mind shattered in a brief moment of despair and insanity and the realisation that all along his people were used as puppets for the true sith. What was amazing was that it wasn't revealed to be the sith, none of the characters knew except Revan who was not present to give answers. The whole thing was wrapped in a dark mystery that left me in dread. What could be more terrifying than the unknown? Had we gotten a fully finished KOTOR 2 back then you can be me and many people would have been so excited for a KOTOR 3
And this my friends, is the remnants of something that could have been more. But is now just wasted potential and miss opportunities. Would have brought great satisfaction to the fans, as well as filling some pockets with loads.
Goddamn, If we had a KOTOR 3 with the True Sith as the antagonist, That would truly flush out revans legacy and the weight of what he has done. Revans war with the republic wasn’t a conquest… it was an Inoculation, An inoculation commuted by not a wholly evil man, But by a noble soul who made the grandest of sacrifices. It’d definitely be a more beautiful end for Revans story
The fact we never got the obsidian Kotor 3, is one of the great tragedies of the era. I spent years searching for and looking for Kotor 3, still vent outta shape about it
Disney would have had such a successful sequel trilogy if they had went this route for their villains, if they didn’t desire to conquer the galaxy but to reign death upon them.
It is sad that we never got to see Kotor 3 and I wonder how it would have unfolded, how Revan and the Exile would be apart of it. But we will never know and that is a greater tragedy than the tale of Darth Plagueis the wise. But really Revan is the a total badass
Getting real vong vibes from that sith empire. I think they may have been inspired from that, because that does retell the vong wars from a new point of view.
would've been cool for the True Sith to have been something like the Eternal Empire, where it was an empire of Sith established away from the main one by Vitiate,
This is by far the better story, not that Swtor's story isn't good but it and the Revan novel did the protagonists of the kotor games really dirty, Meetra seemingly being reduced to a basic af jedi knight for one, not the master of the force and the founder of the jedi order that would end with the clone wars that she so obviously was made out to be, just as a single example.
I bring this up now with the Kotor remake looming on the horizon so that if they DO decide to make kotor 3 and retcon the swtor stories (cross your fingers) they pay closer attention to the looming threats and character development of those already established points in the kotor games
Honestly, I prefer the SWTOR version. A Sith empire styled on the Shadows of B5 would make good antagonists, but would not make a playable faction or a sustainable society. We do hear echoes of this idea in some of the ideologies ascribed to the SWTOR Sith empire, and that ads to their flavor. In particular I see this as the vision of Darth Jadis, the traitorous dark lord who orchestrated a terrorist campaign against the empire itself. He believed in “the democratization of fear”. That horror and degradation were “gifts” that should be share with the entire galaxy, as it would ultimately make people stronger to face such hardships. It makes sense to me that such destructive ideologies would exist in tension with more constructive ideologies inside a stable Sith empire. One side emphasizing tradition, conviction and loyalty while the other preaches “chaos and evolution” in the model of the Shadows.
Sooo.... total war with no other goal than combat itself. Doesnt that just make them old school Mandalorians with spooky Force powers? Tbh, I kinda like TOR Sith, mainly because they're really a (unknowing) death cult serving a would-be deity
So the original version of the True Sith wanted... Warhamer 40k. That's what 40k is. A galaxy of chaos, bloodshed, and perpetual war. That is kind of hilarious.
Kotor 3 would have been fucking epic. They would have cemented Revan as one of the absolute most powerful force users ever if they could have done it the way they originally intended. Instead we got SWTOR and Revan got ruined.
The original sith were conquered by a bunch of rogue Jedi without support of any army or some fancy super weapon. That’s all you need to know of how “terrifying” the original sith were as a species...
The description of the True Sith sounds more like the Yuuzhan Vong's pain&death religion but with the ability to use the Force. The Vong's practice was rejected by the Force making their presence a void in the Force. The True Sith could be a remnant religion of the Rakatan Infinite Empire in which they captured millions of Force sensitive individuals and consumed them. If the Force is Life, then the True Sith is more like an Anti-Life so the Force would had rejected them as well making them like the Yuuzhan Vong. In resolving the KOTOR timeline with the True Sith being the Vong, I can see the Vong making an initial incursion into the galaxy thousands of yrs ago but was somehow repelled by the Rakatan&Gree Empires. They made another attempt some thousands of yrs later by using the Mandalorians to weaken the Old Republic and Revan learning of their existence. With Revan creating his own Sith empire, the Vong left to try again over some thousands of yrs later after the Galactic Empire has fallen to the Rebellion.
![[LIVE] : ONE ลุมพินี 84 วันนี้!! คู่เอก "ก้องศึก vs เมืองไทย"](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/3kuzsAIDf1c/mqdefault.jpg)
Do you remember that quote where Darth Treia said that modern Sith were like children playing with toys compared to ancient Sith? I feel like these true Sith would have reflected that
I believe Traya specifically referenced Master Sith Deulist Tulak Hord as I believe they were talking about lightsaber deuling.. which is like comparing an ant to god himself. Though, I'm sure other aspects of the ancient Sith were equally as terrifying.
Sidious,Vader, Krayt all stronger than most of the ancient .
@@antoniobrownbestwrinthegam8867 Strong yes... but not as dark.
@@ForestRaptor Sidious was literally described as being a blackhole of darkside energy. He is easily the darkest and strongest sith lord of all time.
@@antoniobrownbestwrinthegam8867 *sad vitiate noises*
Imagine a Sith Empire so outrageously horrifying, the Force itself bleeds.
Imagine an army of Darth Sion acolytes. An army of Darth Nihilus knockoffs.
Imagine a galaxy wide Malachor V.
I'd pay to play, watch, and read that!
Warhammer 40k but Star Wars
Well a galaxy wide Malachor V would probably mean the death of the Force and Nihilus. Even though Nihilus would be nigh unstoppable, he would run out of beings to feed on thus ending his own existance.
Or a new Sith Emperor powerful enough to siphon the life others, enough to turn them to ash. Powerful enough to create an army of Darth Sions. Or an army of Husk-like beings from Mass Effect. A being powerful enough to destroy entire First Order armadas with just a mere will to destroy. Powerful enough to permanently sever the Force from another being. A being who wanted the Galactic Empire to bleed to death. One who wants to end the lives of all Jedi. A being powerful enough to be completely non-corporeal.
@@theromuluanhunter6976 pretty sure dread gods like Vitiate exist in Otherspace. Only the will of The Celestials and Universe itself keep such horrors at bay. Imagine a council of beings on par with DE Palpatine with their overlords having power that exceeds FotJ Luke's by a factor of 3 or more ? Without the aid of The Celestials and ancient courageous races, the galaxy would have surely been turned into an eternal graveyard of worlds and dying stars...
I prefer this... Over our current cannon makes sense to me and actually is kind of terrfying.
That's the beauty of Star Wars Legends and why Star Wars Legends needs more people supporting it and the Star Wars Legends movement.
You know they did a great job building up a villain when you get to the point that you so anxious as to when they're going to reveal themselves!!
It's almost like legend's had passionate content creators unlike Disney canon.
Now I'm no fool legend's had it's issues but so does every lore for world's (unless it's Lord of the rings because tolkein is a damn genius) despite its flaws though legend's was great at world building and adding new ships, technology and understand of the force to it.
The old republic era in particular is arguably the best part of legends canon and it pisses me off that Disney is now going to butcher that era now like they did with the post endor era with their shitty movies.
@@delta2372 I think Disney is just pretending that the ST didn't happen either because they knew it sucked 😂.
impossible to make since canon star wars has to follow disney rule nr.1 that is PG-13
Try to imagine a war between Revan‘s Sith Empire and the True Sith. I can't even comprehend what it would do to the galaxy. And the Force...
Now that's an idea
It would probably due to the galaxy what the war in heaven did to the milky way in 40k.
I way prefer this version, it makes the story so much more original and feel less like a clone of the Galactic Empire
Kraz agreed!
That's the beauty of Star Wars Legends and why more people need to support it and the Star Wars Legends movement.
The thing is. What he sais in the video is exactly what came to happen. I really don't understand how you can hate on something for not being what you want then describing exactly what it was as you ideal story. The empire was ruthless. It was dark and it only got less aggressive because of the influence of Revan. So in a way revan achieved what he actually wanted in the end. This was drew Karpishyyn's message and all of you just looked past it. Revan saved the galaxy when he was on Dromund Kaas by sacrificing himself. From there a message was sent to the other sith. They were exposed to other ideas and for Vitiate, vitiate never thought revan's will would be powerful enough to manipulate him to make peace with the republic.
@@kiyanhakim384 Yeah. I do not understand why people are complaining.
@@kiyanhakim384 That's not the same as the original idea of the "True Sith" though. The True Sith were envisioned to be somewhat akin to an animalistic representation of the Dark Side. Imagine an entire faction of figures like Darth Nihilius. No longer beings, but nothing more than pure manifestations of dark side energy. Destruction being the only thing they understand. A sort of final end-point for anyone who has fully embraced the dark side....basically what Palpatine couldn't even achieve, lest he no longer becomes Palpatine. The idea of being fully consumed by the dark side has always been in Star Wars as well. It's the reason why Count Dooku looks nothing like Sidious or why the player character's skin color changes in KOTOR as they become more and more evil. So the True Sith would be the final point where one has completely gone over to the dark side, to the point where they aren't even a living being anymore. That's basically what KOTOR 2 was building up to. Only for SWTOR to make the true Sith out to be no more than a Galactic Empire knockoff with a few slight differences (namely the faux peace treaty with the Republic and the Cold War nonsense).
I fear no man. But that faction.
It scares me.
Darth Revan same
you are the true hero My Lord
Aj Bagniewski thank you
Lord Azreal Lais is that war hammer 40K I hear?
So uncivilized
I can't imagine Revan's reaction after he fully remembered those guys and realizing he played himself after destroying the Forge, the Galaxy would have been consumed in a massive oof
(At the Jedi Council)
Revan: So you guys remember the starforge? Ya I just got my memories back as to why I wanted that. Ha ha.... ya we’re boned. So I’m just going to go on vacation, good luck with the the true sith.
@@DaddyHensei *Jedi Council:* the *WHAT?!*
xX Valtiel Xx Revan: Oh yeah. There’s these Three Sith that will show up soon. One is an Old Master of mine & the other two are a Taste of what The True Sith are. Bye! 👋🏻
Not quite. Kreia mentions how he was careful to preserve the factories on conquered worlds, it was Malak who started to just burn anywhere that resisted with the ability to make weapons. He didn't want to rely on the star forge, probably because he knew he couldn't hold them off if they decided to take the star forge at all costs. Or considering how the star forge responds to dark side will, it might have even become disobedient in the presence of True Sith.
@@thatoneguy9615 i mean, it was a joke
Bioware devs: "hey EA we want to make KOTOR 3 but we want to team up with obsidian to do it is that cool?"
EA: "nah fuck that make an MMO instead"
I hate that book and MMO for shitting all over KOTOR.
I like the MMO
@@Nephalem2002 Agreed.
This. Just this. This is what I envisioned all that time before SWTOR dropped and dashed my hopes. The answer to the question 'What would scare a hardy war veteran like Revan so badly that going Sith was a GOOD idea?'
You give SWTOR too much shit. Think about it. SWTOR could never do this. Its not an interesting plot for the MMO. It would only ever work as single player. And in fact later on SWTOR did exactly this. Zakuul was much like true sith. Unstoppable war machine that mere encounter with dragged Jedi Grandmaster to the dark side so that they can have any hope of winning.
And SWTOR presented a very interesting vision of deformed, fractured, muddled down sith, showed you the what if if Bane wasnt around. What if Sith moved away from their traditions and made actual liveable tho still terrible society.
@@xelloskaczor5051 People who haven't played FF14 commenting on what MMO storytelling is and isn't capable of will never not perplex me. Because I used to be there, and I know better now
Fans are the true Empire. Unstoppable in their quest for knowledge
Why is your profile picture just two d's (or b's)?
@@heinzguderian9980 It's cropped. In the full picture you see a bridge between the notes, making it look like a face. I call it the 'You are in big Treble' Grin.
Which is hilarious, because I've literally just been watching videos for hours
These Sith sound insane. Almost like they've been possessed under the insidious minds of The Old Ones from "Supernatural Encounters". There is no plan of conquest and stability, just death, chaos, and terror.
Lovecraftian almost.
@@StarboyXL9 Jon Bongiorno surely had a lotta influence from Lovecraft; Supernatural Encounters is nutz. But in a good way 🤣
What a fucking absolute Chad. A fellow lover of Supernatural Encounters! Make sure to pick up the Extended Edition when it comes out soon.
Yes. Thats why they couldnt exist in an MMO.
But for a book, movie, single player game, that's literally the perfect enemy.
That means they are no Sith, lol. Just Dark Side obsessed animals.
The true Sith honestly seem like well. Star Wars Darkspawn, or more hardcore Vong. A teeming overwhelming enemy bent on corruption and destruction and nothing else. Hitting Galaxy with such reckless all consuming hate that the only option the current Chosen One could see was to become a monster himself and forge the Galaxy into a war machine.
Yeah, I can see where Bioware got most of their influence from with Kotor. The story foundations for their future games are quite clear with Kotor
the current chosen one isn't revan, it is the exile.... the one that could ignore the calling to become a sith lord from the destruction of malak-whore
@@vincentcorvus3063 Too bad it's not the same bioware running TOR
Really love your clarity on the true and original vision for Revan.
In TOR, Revan explains that he was just a puppet that killed for Vitiate, nothing more than Mandalore the Ultimate was. KOTOR1 and 2 establish Revan became aware of ths threat and, as explained in the video, prepared as Revan felt necessary via his Sith and the Star Forge. It's not even a front to deceive the True Sith either, he says with pure confidence to the Sith strike team that he was just a puppet. Complete retcon, bad one at that.
He also loses alongside Exile due to Scourge deciding to ride with the losing side of his visions rather than the winning ones out of likely fear and self preservation or just ignorance. I believe Revan had planned to kill their leader (Vitiate), thus causing internal struggle for command as Sith typically have, and return to the Republic as he said he would after they and the Mandalorians had prepared and clean up the rest of the True Sith. HK-47 and his army of reprogrammed HK-51 would have certainly added some power to their army too.
Omega The Myth Revan expected to face a man or at least a monster that lead the true Sith. But instead he walked into the domain of The Devil and was reminded that their are far scarier things than Sith in the universe. There's things like Vitiate. Disgustingly powerful entities that use everything around them as tools and nothing more. Life and death are inconsequential. Your suffering is what they desire. And in either state your in (dead or alive) their desires will be met...
@@blackshogun272 Scourge envisioned them with winning but did not hold out hope for those outcomes. Hope is the driving power of Star Wars most of the time. Vitiate, while powerful, is not as alien as something like Nihilus.. even the Exile is rather alien. They stood a chance, but were brought down by the one not prepared and afraid.
@X X Did you read the book? Scourge envisioned more than one scenario.
@X X Also, similar to how Anakin fears and acts according to his visions, causing them to be more than just visions.. the same could have happened with Scourge. The downfall of Revan and Exile was to pave way for a new story of The Old Republic, not because they were entirely incapable.
Case in point, no vision is set in stone. Visions clouded by failure and the dark side should not be focused on and feared or else they come to fruition. There is no singular outcome, there is many. Scourge, like Anakin, feared what he had seen, and did not hold out hope for what could have been. Hope is power in Star Wars.
The worst part is how they ended the story of the Exile
You should actually make a video about her
My favourite Character in SW I was gutted at what they did to her... Regardless fans always mention Nihilus as a powerhouse (as they should) but The Exile was easily on the same level if not more.
Ik this is petty but I never liked the fact that they made the exile a female, imo it makes more sense in KOTOR 2 for the exile to be male because of certain things like Atria's hate for the exile being a "I hate you because I love you and you betrayed me" rather than just random hate.
Before you say it yes you could say that atris is a lesbian for female exile but gays atleast in legend's canon aren't very common much like in real life and I don't mean to make anyone angry here but this is just my opinions.
@@coinkidink9997 Um, not on the level of Nihilus. If Exile had been consumed by the dark, then yeah probably. The Exile defeated him because they are the same and his tricks do not work on her.
@@delta2372 That's why I play as the male exile lol. Yeah, when you play as the male, it is often implied that Atris had feelings for you. And plus the whole "you were able to cut yourself from the force" hate.
If I remember correctly, when you play as the female exile, there were no signs that Atris felt in love with you. I guess Atris was just jealous or despised the female exile, because she was able to cut her connections from the force. And we all know how the Jedi (or Sith) cling or become dependend to the force to this point, where they rather die than let go of it. That's why the four Jedi Masters died on Dantooine when Kreia took away the force from them.
@@niki_mafioso39 exactly plus, the male exile interactions with the companions are Abit more interesting imo and I find it stupid that the exile is canonically female all so the boring disciple can rebuild the Jedi, I would take the handmaiden becoming the new Jedi grandmaster or visas any day of the week over him, plus I find the guy to be boring
And that is why Revan's Sith Empire did nothing wrong.
That's exactly what an Imperial officer would say.
@@heinzguderian9980 that's exactly what a brainwashed rebel would say
Piediepew that’s exactly what a Sith Lord would say.
That’s exactly what a droid would say... now where’s your owner?
@Caeda Lowell that's exactly what something not canon would say
They sound as if the Vong had a Force tradition.
AlcGmn this idea of "True Sith" don't sound like Sith but the Esh-Ka from The Old Republic and they were more dangerous than the Rakata because they were basically everything Geetsly explained his version of the true Sith were. Due to the Rakata having a Star Forge (a gift from The Dark Architects) they overwhelmed the Esh-Ka to near extinction and imprisoned the remnants of their race in the prison planet of Belsavis. That's the world that held the World Razer down; fore if it were to escape, its fury would shatter a thousand worlds.
But anyways, the Rakata, as evil as they were, seem casual when compared to this "Bloodlust Sith Empire". But on a real note, the Yuuzhan Vong and several other factions would pummel these rabid Sith into paste before they ever got the chance to spread blood for the blood god 😂
The Vong did have a Force tradition, they used to be able to touch the Force.
@@blackshogun272 The Esh-Ka were actually Fanatic Purifiers: a civilization whose entire existence and culture revolves around annihilating all other forms of sentient life in existence.
That alone makes them pretty damn scary. You cannot bargain with them. You cannot have an understanding with them. You can only wait until they launch their next "war of purification".
The Rakata were pretty damn terrible. They were the former slaves of a near omnipotent precursor race who became galactic slavers themselves when their masters vanished. They were known for having a culture so xenophobic that they considered all species of the galaxy to merely be their unclaimed property and believed their empire would outlive the stars and endlessly expand into infinity. But by comparison to the Esh-Ka, the Rakata look like nice old people offering you tea and crumpets.
You have to be pretty monstrous to make literal galactic slavers look good by comparison. The entire Star Wars galaxy is actually fortunate that the Rakata ended the Esh-Ka's empire, or else modern day Star Wars would just be the Esh-Ka waging an endless campaign of complete and utter genocide across the universe. A lot like 40k actually lol.
I knew I wasn't the only person disappointed with the so-called "Sith" in SWTOR. They felt just as you stated, "an Empire knockoff". After all the build-up in KOTOR 2, it was a complete and total let-down. Sure, if you never played KOTOR or KOTOR 2, then the Sith in SWTOR probably do look cool, but Kreia and Revan really did make them out to sound much darker than an Empire knockoff. Seeking not conquest, but absolute destruction. It's the way of the true Sith as well. It harkens back to the Darwinian foundations of the Sith, the strong ruling over everyone until they are stripped of their power by those lesser than them. But ultimately it's a cycle of self-destruction. Thus the ultimate form of this would be the destruction of the galaxy. The SWTOR Sith are little more than the Sith seen in the first KOTOR. Bickering amongst each other with petty political struggles. KOTOR 2 showed a side of the dark side that is rarely touched upon. KOTOR 2 showed the dark side as the disease that it is. A manifestation of death and war itself (i.e. Malachor) and something that is almost a living entity. We saw echos of this in characters like Darth Nihilius who was so consumed by the dark side that he ceased to be a living being anymore. SWTOR really ruined that image.
The Bioware of today is not the Bioware from the 2000's and on top of that it seems they have a huge Ego problem from the way they put down KOTOR 2 in the revan novel bur it also seems like they hate their own accomplishments given how they also put down Revan in BOTH the Novel AND TOR.
Shoutout to anyone who's watched Babylon 5 and shuddered reflexively when the Shadows were mentioned
I barely know anything about the story of the Old Republic MMO, so hearing this was what was planned for KOTOR III makes me wish there had been one even more.
Just replacing Revan’s empire with the Sith Empire of ToR was a lateral move. These True Sith sound so terrible that you can see why Revan did what he did to have a chance of stopping them.
*What scares the Jedi?* Revan:.......
A sith vs sith war is would have been pretty badass, not only that but we would have gotten the 3 heroes of all 3 Kotor games to join forces and fight the true Sith.
I think the "true sith" should have replaced the eternal empire in swtor
Agreed.
If they ever remake The Old Republic into canon, they should do that instead.
holy fuck that would be awesome and it could be made to make a lot of sense like why the emperor was pulling resources a way from one empire he had and giving it to another empire rather than just bringing them both together under his rule i mean they had some differing ideology but hes the emperor his word is law and he could have just said ya these are the new rules and anyone who disagrees dies, but if you are in it for the sake of creating more chaos it would make more sense
it wouldnt have worked as well. Because MMO's never end. They have to keep the ball rolling. And Vitiate has the same origin as true sith would have. Word for word exact same. Took people from korriban, brought them to unknown system, cultivated civilization there. Makes no sense to replay that. And defeating something like True Sith is way more final than beating some upstart Eternal Empire.
And quit frankly Vitiate was the ultimate True Sith, Palpatine before Palpatine, seeking to erase all life. You wanna another group of dipshit with exact same idea? Nah.
@Tom Ffrench still gonna be legends sorry personally I don't care much for Disney canon but there's alot of weird in both timelines
The True Sith: The Galaxy will end by my hand! No jedi could possibly stop us.
Revan: What if I were a Sith instead?
True Sith: I'm sorry, WHAT!?
True Sith: Noooo you can't just make the Jedi into Sith first!
Revan: Haha Malachor V go brrrr
I love this look at revan. It paints him as such a visionary and he actually wanted to save the galaxy as a whole not just take it over... hearing in KOTOR 2 that Revan leaves the republic industries, this line of thinking makes even more sense.
I kinda hoped we would get this with the new movies. A vast sith empire in the outer regions. Could have made Rey a decendent of bastilla and/or Revan. But instead we got a worse version of dark empire. Whatta shame.
Wasted opportunity
Could've had valkorion, true sith, and all of the sith followers or something. Would've been Badass compared to having palps back.
the whole new trilogy is more action than story, and it keeps overusing silly archetypes and overused plot devices to the point i can't invest in it. the whole galaxy is on the line every time and it gets.. like.. can we just get something new? destroying planets gets old. i'm more interested in seeing the journey rather than a sudden reveal of "oh look they have huge fleets and planet destroyer planets now for some reason"
@@Rin-qj7zt not even the action is good tho
@@harrambou9468 nah, the action is enjoyable for me. i mean the choreography is horrendous, and it looks more like the actors are just improvising or having a LARPing session, but when you get past that it's possible to enjoy the pretty colors and action scenery. lol. might be asking a lot for some people.
Ah if only the MMO took place after KotOR 3
Then we could have had both. Even if they did stick with this take on the True Sith in the MMO it would be a lot harder to make several remotely compelling stories about them so that's probably one reason why they changed it. Just a shame we lost the fulfillment of the build-up in the first 2 games.
I NEED MORE KOTOR!!!!!!! I just began playing it a month ago and I love it! Please make Old Republic stuff as much as you can!
I will never get tired of new people being introduced to the series and loving it. 17 years later and it’s still a masterpiece.
You can really tell a game is timeless when you see comments like this
I think this take on Revan is compelling- the problem is that it might not lead naturally to the film era. That would require some creativity to accomplish. Perhaps the True Sith could be that potently dark but they would either A) be fewer than Revan thought, casting a big shadow in their inevitable decline (like a cancer stricken with hyper-cancer) or B) the True Sith have some fatal, unexpected flaw- -something Revan wasn’t able to predict in his grab for power, something requiring an unexpected ally. But I doubt we’ll get that rewrite *shrug*
The concepts are very interesting, but the problem is a faction/group of chaotic nihilistic individuals. The A team of psychopaths, how do you make a team of serial killers who have no regard for anything work together? That Darth Traya uses Sion and Nihilus to get to her nihilistic goals, ok, she's deceiving everybody, including herself. But that people would cooperate when they can't rely on anything even themselves? Hard to make it believable!
I think this story can really fit with just a bit of restructure and retcons. The Swtor empire could very well be a evolved version of the true sith empire just buy having Revan defeat them and having someone like vitiate survive and inherite the true sith empire remains. No killing Meetra and crazy Swtor Revan DLC.
I like this better than the version we got. It helps Revan make sense. The way characters talk about Revan he seems like a tactical genius, which means he had to have a better reason to become the dark lord of the sith than just wanting power he didn’t need.
After watching this, I feel like retconning Vitiate/Valkorian to originally be a member of the Sith species is a mildly redeeming factor for how much of the original story they changed.
That was never a retcon. His first body was always a pureblood
Honestly, I still think SWTOR's canon could actually work with this story, if you look at it in a different light.
The true sith were preparing - Almost ready - When Vitiate... consumed them.
Completely annihilating the entire faction, and then basically leaving.
Revan goes to confront him - Expecting a normal sith - And gets completely destroyed by this now true demi-god.
Vitiate understands that Revan is exceedingly useful, and thus captures him.
With the dread masters imprisoned and then killed, and the true sith lords having been consumed by vitiate, A new, more tempered, sith empire continues with the invasion plans, under the command of Vitiate.
But Vitiate just doesn't give a fuck if they die, because he's just over there on Zakuul pursuing the ultimate goal of the dark side: To be the one true ruler of the galaxy.
So he doesn't really try to push the sith empire into winning, because he's just being greedy and playing everyone.
It... works. To an extent.
Timelines and stuff would probably have to change slightly, but would it really be that odd?
In-fighting is the sith way.
If Vitiate just ate all of the true sith....
It would realistically mess up everything Revan was expecting to encounter.
Please don't ever change your format. Your videos are beautiful and very informative. Keep up the good work man, I know I appreciate it.
And this thing went on to inspire the Youzong Vong, an Extra Galactic Alien Species that desired to Shed Blood, Slaughter, Maim and Kill, just to please their Gods
We need KOTOR III so bad.
Agreed.
more like we need kotor 2 COMPLETE
Oddly enough, I think the concept of Vitiate would have suited the original idea of these True Sith well, given the horrifying method of how he attained his extended lifespan much like Nihilus (only far more effective). I could easily see the true Sith rounding up the remainders of who they saw as weak and offer them up as a sacrifice to Vitiate like some sort of god-king Sith of death, the head of their empire of strife and power. I mean, they almost sound like an insane, Lovecraftian cult obsessed with death and strife that could use a figurehead like that.
I simply loved this! In canon, I think the only Sith we get to at least *resemble* this thinking is Momin. He trapped events, burnt worlds, made a doorway to a new dimension. As for their way of thinking, Malgus and Marr stand as Legends' best examples. I know I used these 2 a lot in my comments lately, but in order to really win, the Sith had to get rid of their infighting. Marr developed on this. Malgus was one of the perfect Sith, as he saw both orders as petty dog packs, one more powerful, but lashing out at their own. He left and possibly did more spiritual damage to some places than the physical damage the Sith Empire could do to entire star systems. This just shows how powerful the Sith could have been had they focused on their 2 greatest weaknesses.
Krayt is a joke. Once he summoned the ghosts of three Sith Lords to seek council.
Darth Bane was mad because he broke the rule of two.
Darth Andeddu thought he's too dumb for his wisdom.
Darth Nihilus tried to be helpful, but Krayt doesn't understand ancient Sith😂
They sound like the Dread-Lords from The Old Republic actually, which weren't actually supported by Darth Vitiate's Sith Empire and also according to what I remember might have wanted to destroy the Force along with all life in the galaxy. It's possible that ultimately the True Sith were exiled by the Sith who craved more worldly pleasures such as economic wealth and other lustful self-indulgences, rather then the destruction of the Force. It is possible that most typical Sith felt that, the Force least served the vita role of being their only path to gaining all their pleasure based desires.
Thanks to YOU sir, I NOW know why I don't really like the story of the Old Republic game. They made the true sith empire AND Revan(along with the crew of the Ebon Hawk from both Knights of the Old Republic games SPOILER ALERT because when Revan and The Exile disappeared NONE of the crew tried to look for him or get the army ready or train new Jedi they just sat around hoping they would come back until the emperor showed up killing everyone) look boring and stupid (copy and paste overpowered villian and make him the emperor of a galaxy wide army just like Emperor Palpatine). This explanation of what SHOULD HAVE HAPPENED with Knights of the Old Republic but it NEVER happened is just WRONG! This could make millions of dollars for the writers and star Wars in general. Revan isTHE SMARTEST PERSON IN STAR WARS HISTORY to make the good guys the bad guys to save everyone is SPECTACULAR STRATEGY.
i mean there's that, but then how do you go about shifting that narrative back into the Star Wars that started it all? this is just food for thought. Not a critique or provocation ^^
@@ForestRaptor I suggest bringing in ALL the writers from Knights of the Old Republic games, and anyone that truely cares about the Star Wars storyline, and continuity and not just about making money. Then asking THEM what they want to do with the story. And have them make a TV show based on it. Then fire everyone at Disney that is ruining Star Wars right now with the bad movie's by messing up the continuity and the characters of the story.
Actually hk 47(the best droid ever) went to search for Revan almost immediately, and then he waited for 300 years
@@darthnox7958 THAT'S A FACT! HK-47 ACTUALLY survived for thousands of years ALL the way up to the era of Palpatine he was inside of a ship on Mustafar while Anakin and Obiwan were fighting(look up "How HK47 survived on Mustafar during the Clone Wars" by Star Wars comics). So they could use HK-47 to help incorporate the story of Revan and the Exile and the TRUE sith into the Modern era. Perhaps Ahsoka could free him and she could learn some of the Exile and Revans techniques to HELP beat Vader(she doesn't have to kill him she could have a force vision to see his redemption with Luke)😊💯 talk about fan service lol. But my original point is that HK-47 should NOT have been the ONLY one looking for Revan and the Exile THE ENTIRE CREW and the Galaxy should have been searching when they discovered the two GREATEST MILITARY and Jedi/sith minds were missing while KNOWING (based on the information Kreia told the Exile she would have told everyone the True sith were STILL out there) there was still a great threat to the Galaxy. But the Old Republic story didn't do that for whatever reason.
@@JJoh4040 i understand your point but I'm pretty sure that no one else knew where revan went so they just decided to keep doing their own thing, but we know that carth and bastilla tried to learn where he went(kotor 2 restored content mod), mission and zalzabar probably thought about it but they had no idea where he went, juhani and jole same thing.
I... actually prefer the version we got. The Sith Empire tried sorcery and all sorts of horrors in the past, many times really and the Jedi held to the light, Vitiate seemed to realize this with his Empire. Its like Scourge said, they needed to evolve and change. And the Empire we got felt like a good in between the Old Sith and the New Sith, an Empire that has technology and order like an Empire, and still connected to the sorcerous ways of the past with the Sith Sorcerers. While something like an enhanced version of the old sith would have been cool I think the one we got lays a better groundwork for what the New Sith and later Brotherhood were like, and a good base for someone like Palpatine to use for his empire.
Kotor 3 needs to happen. It's just too big of an opportunity to not be told.
I’ll say, with the Onslaught update, Loyal Imperial players get to show the true threat the Sith can bring. No more God-powered Emperor, just raw military might. Endangering Civilians/Resorces and causing a decisive win against a key Republic shipyard though unity, far better than Kaan’s joke of an Empire...
Dar-Nak Kallig Darth Malgus is what a true Sith warrior should aspire to...
Good.
The fact that Revan was technically still a good guy and only became a Sith to save the galaxy from destruction and not for some power hungry reason shows how great he was
The plan becomes silly when you realize it was basically Revan going "yo dog, I heard you don't want to be conquered by a sith empire, so I made a sith empire to conquer you so you don't get conquered by a sith empire
Except the True Sith didn't have a mind to "conquer" anything. They had their eyes set on eternal suffering for sufferings sake
As much as I really love both these ideas, it would be hard to speculate how it would play out given how Disney owns the property now. Ex. The Vong invasion books came out before Disney had a chance to get their hands on them and so in the EU we have that and in Disney’s version we’re stuck with the events of the Force Awakens.
Interesting. This is new to me. Sounds like what may have happened to the vong. The KILLED the force in their galaxy. Pretty intense.
Dude that's fucking nuts. I would have loved that
Well, as someone who’s introduction to Star Wars Expanded Universe was literally the SWTOR “Deceived” trailer, as someone who was so psyched to play as a Sith Sorcerer back in the day, and as someone who’s only recently gotten back into SWTOR after so many years, I can safely say….
They really, REALLY should have gone with this. I love being Darth Nox, but this puts everything I’ve done to shame.
They could blend this with swtor maybe have vitiate being the son of one of the strongest true Sith who happened to survive kotor 3 bc while I dislike swtors treatment of Revan I like a lot of the characters like malgus and the concept of the eternal empire
Nigel Walker in an cancelled Star Wars novella for the EU, it is implied that Tenebrae/Vitiate/Valkorion was a dark entity from Otherspace that escapes the wrath of The Celestials long enough to resurface and bring death/chaos for its slain evil gods. That would explain why he was so absurdly powerful with The Force. Darth Nihilus and Palpatine seem hella OP and shit but during the Cosmic Wars that waged between the creations of the Celestials and the Stygian Armies of Otherspace and their evil gods, you had entities like Nihilus and Palpatine as commanders for these horrific beings. Beings like Vitiate in Otherspace would be worshipped as dark kings who'd wage war on the other devilish monarchs of that abominable twilight realm. Like, I'm making these guys sound Op but when compared to the beings that actually made them, and to the entities that made "them" (their gods) they are nothing but fog to be blown away with a hand flicker.
@@blackshogun272 Sounds pretty cool and unique, they should have gone with that instead.
Thing is, SW:TOR doesn't need Revan or his storyline for it's existance. The great parts of the MMO can exist without tarnishing him or The Exile.
@@coinkidink9997 we'll just have look past the Revan thing since his influence in the story is almost zilch unless you start taling events from Maelstrom Prison Fp, The Foundry, or the Operation they made too. Anyways, what I'm trying to say is he doesn't influence the storyline and onward expansions in any way truly. But as for the idea about the info I typed in my last comment; it'd be pretty hard making a Star Wars game like that since they'd either half to:
A. Give the player the ability to play as a Celestial
B. Make an interesting story during the Cosmic Wars that doesn't have the Celestials/Firstborn races doing a "hakai" on every enemy. The blasphemous horrors that lurked in Otherspace (Dark Illathurion) are the living definition of OP nightmares and terror.
C. Display the more powerful beings from Supernatural Encounters greatly in design but shortly in presentation. These beings should be too much for the mortal races to comprehend and (psychologically) survive gazing upon them.
D. Show an actual massacre in a Star Wars game. The Cosmic Wars were 50% war and 50% one-sided slaughter for some factions...
*Looks intently at Lo'htek*
Revan, the Exile, and Scourge could have just succeeded to strike down Vitiate to the point it takes him the hundreds of years to resurface in SWTOR for the first time. Instead, they don't give them any sort of closure. Revan could have died happily and came back in SWTOR as an aiding specter advising the main character. This would still fulfil the fan service quota that drove Revan to be in SWTOR whatsoever.
What happens to Revan is essentially a lesser of what happens to Anakin. At least Anakin got to destroy Emperor Palpatine's first body.. Revan didn't even get that for Vitiate.
You think that Revan's Sith Empire would act like TOR's Sith Empire? It would be an interesting what-if scenario seeing the Reconstituted Sith Empire against the True Sith.
There is no peace without the passion to create
I mean... is it really any more interesting than what we did get? This sounds like the "true sith" were just psychotically evil beings. They're just another Chaos, except probably less complex due to not having God's and cultists and shit like that.
I gets it's edgier, but I appreciate a character like Darth Malgus - a Sith with a vision - a lot more than just some evildoer bent on destroying everything.
This was your best episode (for me) yet. You answered so many questions about Revan that have been stewing in my brain, and even some I hadn’t thought to ponder. So good.
I just couldn’t wrap my head around exactly why Revan had to have HIS own Sith Empire. Nor could I comprehend why he felt it was necessary to take down the Republic first, followed by the (true) Sith Empire. It just never occurred to me his plan was to conquer The Republic and reconstitute all of it (well, at least it’s war fighting component) as an even larger Sith Empire consisting of the former Republic and his Sith Empire - of course, under his control.
I couldn’t grasp that under his plan there would actually be two simultaneous Sith Empires in existence - the bad True Sith and the good Revan Sith, Revan’s Sith Empire consisting of his original one and the conquered Republic one. So simple now! I understood he’d have to conquer The Republic to use its resources (and his) to battle the True Sith. However, I thought somehow he’d have turned back to the Light Side and converted his Sith Empire to the Light as well. But as I played this through, it just never added up in my head.
This is brilliant! Thank you, as I can get back to enjoying the Revan saga again. Now that I have the correct ‘big picture’ of Revan’s plot, I can properly understand why events occur as they do within his storyline. Laf, everyone else is probably thinking I’m a dope, but maybe it had something to do with not being a gamer and that I’ve been piecing together the plot primarily through Lore channels like Geetsly’s, 100% Star Wars, and others.
One question: When Malak became the Sith ruler, presumably that was of Revan’s Sith Empire. I thought somewhere down the line, Malak declared himself Dark Lord of the Sith. Did Malak, with his Sith empire, also take over the True Sith Empire, or was the True Sith Empire still its own entity, independent of Malak’s? That is, were there two separate Sith Empires while Malak was a Dark Lord of the Sith?
I guess another question: if there were two separate Sith factions, who was the leader of The True Sith, and were there any interaction between his and Malak’s empires?
This is basically Darth Malgus' ideology.
War crime empire seeking the destruction of the force itself, Now *THAT* is how sith should have been.
Also it would have put a special twist to what kreia tryed to do, teach the exile what true sith are.
Much, MUCH better than Swtor. I'm interested where you got the bit of info on the True Sith being formed from a cult of Sadow though
This just makes them sound like the Vong.
Sith Vong.
I already knew this as I spent literal thousands of hours playing KOTOR I & II trying every single different path and build. KOTOR III would of been epic and instead gave us SWTOR which wasn't what I expected and not a true sequel to KOTOR II. Now we got Disney that wants to fuck all the good shit that the Old Republic stories are. Sucks to be a Star Wars fan now.
I like it, but I also like the Sith Empire from SWTOR(save for the designs and ideology, that could be more original, rather than an almost carbon copy of the Galactic Empire).
I feel that it could've been introduced as some other force actually. Like, there would be that Vitiate's brigade, but there would also be another fragment of the old Sith Empire that survived.
The idea was that Sidious took cues from Emperor Vitiate's sense of style and taste in designing his own Galactic Empire, so that explains the similarities.
7:13 Finally! Someone referenced Babylon 5!
this is the best thing in star wars ive ever heard
These guys sound like Greek era Kratos. An army like that, Revan was right to be afraid
Great video. Loving the Revan and KOTOR content you’ve been doing recently.
Based on what you believe the True Sith would have been, what do you think would have happened after KOTOR 2 and/or during the events of 3?
Revan probably had gone to Drummond Kaas alone to pick off True Sith higherups, gather information, and return as promised in KOTOR2 to the Republic, Mandalorians, and the HK Army after they had prepared for war. It's not like he's gonna walk in there with the Exile and bring down the *entire* empire.
As for the game, I believe you would be playing as both Revan and the Exile at certain points, making choices and interactions with both main characters.
Omega The Myth if someone even comparable to Vitiate is the Sith Emperor or reigning Dark Lord, the dude is still fucked. Like he won't be directly serving him like TOR like to cram down our throat, but he'd probably be indirectly through his actions and decisions. But that all depends on if they make the leader of hidden Sith for KOTOR 3 an almost nigh-omnipotent dark side entity...
There is a novel (darth revan novel) that explains what happened
@@darthnox7958 I know, i've read it. But I mean what would have happened if the concept of Kotor 3 had been made, instead of what we see in Old Republic.
@@darthnox7958 The novel fucking sucks.
So Mando-Vong-Sith philosophies on steroids or something much worse. Btw I think they had to change the Sith because otherwise the Jedi Order would have had to have died forevermore and become Revan's Sith or the whole galaxy would be dead by the time of the movies.
When you said scar in the force, all I could think of was how Kreia/Treya described the Exile as a wound in the Force
vitiate as a character perfectly matched the idea of the true sith
Considering BioWare's other works specifically Mass Effect I can see the true Sith being somewhat akin to the Reapers being more like a force of nature than a traditional army and each of the True Sith being a Nihilus light being more like force vampires consuming all in their path.
I can even see the Light and Dark side options being more akin to the Paragon and Renegade neither option being bad in the face of oblivion.
Or the darkspawn of dragon age
This is the deep, psychological thinking about good, evil and balance on a galaxy wide scale that I miss from Legends. Watching the shallow sequels make me miss it even more.
It is the beauty of Star Wars Legends and why it needs to be continued. It is why Star Wars Legends needs more support and why more people need to support the Star Wars Legends movement.
@@JediAcolyte94 Disney will never give anyone license to use their characters. Especially when they might tell interesting stories for mature audiences that overshadow their toy and theme park driven stories.
@@Ben-Ken They can still continue Star Wars Legends as its own separate continuity with more stories. That is what Legends fans have been wanting since the rebranding. That is why the Star Wars Legends billboard thing happened.
@@JediAcolyte94 we can only hope. Disney needs to let talented people work without interference.
@@Ben-Ken Indeed they do but the problem now is that Star Wars Legends isn't being continued despite a large portion of the SW fandom wanting it too.
Revan will always be my most favorite lightsaber wielding chad. Revan: a Star Wars story, if only we had competent people makin this stuff on the big screen
I so prefer this version of the sith over canon. I have a copy of the book of the sith at home and it mentioned the sith purebloods and how extreme they were. I've always liked the darker parts of star wars like the yuzhong vong and its a shame canon just ignores it.
That's because hollywood has a habit of hiring ppl to work on IP that they have never heard of half the time let alone seen/read...
Kotor and Kotor 2 left such an impact in my life that I constantly return and find more amazing things about this era in a galaxy far far away. In the restored content of KOTOR 2 there's a conversation between Visas Marr and Mandalore that I will always remember. The first time a Mandalorian a veteran of the Mandalorian wars an enemy and a friend to Revan looked back to those days of glory in battle, the thousands killed, the worlds burned with pride then with one bit of nostalgia his mind shattered in a brief moment of despair and insanity and the realisation that all along his people were used as puppets for the true sith. What was amazing was that it wasn't revealed to be the sith, none of the characters knew except Revan who was not present to give answers. The whole thing was wrapped in a dark mystery that left me in dread. What could be more terrifying than the unknown?
Had we gotten a fully finished KOTOR 2 back then you can be me and many people would have been so excited for a KOTOR 3
And this my friends, is the remnants of something that could have been more. But is now just wasted potential and miss opportunities. Would have brought great satisfaction to the fans, as well as filling some pockets with loads.
Goddamn, If we had a KOTOR 3 with the True Sith as the antagonist, That would truly flush out revans legacy and the weight of what he has done.
Revans war with the republic wasn’t a conquest… it was an Inoculation, An inoculation commuted by not a wholly evil man, But by a noble soul who made the grandest of sacrifices.
It’d definitely be a more beautiful end for Revans story
The fact we never got the obsidian Kotor 3, is one of the great tragedies of the era. I spent years searching for and looking for Kotor 3, still vent outta shape about it
Disney would have had such a successful sequel trilogy if they had went this route for their villains, if they didn’t desire to conquer the galaxy but to reign death upon them.
I find it funny how he was saying that beginning part while the rise of skywalker poster was up 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
The true sith version of things sounds like a beautiful finality and a springboard for new beginnings.
It is sad that we never got to see Kotor 3 and I wonder how it would have unfolded, how Revan and the Exile would be apart of it. But we will never know and that is a greater tragedy than the tale of Darth Plagueis the wise. But really Revan is the a total badass
It's something the screenplay for Duel of the Fates could have really ran with!
Getting real vong vibes from that sith empire. I think they may have been inspired from that, because that does retell the vong wars from a new point of view.
that wouldve been terrfying but i see why it wasn't used in SWTOR, since you can play as a Sith.
would've been cool for the True Sith to have been something like the Eternal Empire, where it was an empire of Sith established away from the main one by Vitiate,
Okay, what we got is interesting and all, but that? That is the kind of Star Wars storytelling that made the galaxy so great!
This is by far the better story, not that Swtor's story isn't good but it and the Revan novel did the protagonists of the kotor games really dirty, Meetra seemingly being reduced to a basic af jedi knight for one, not the master of the force and the founder of the jedi order that would end with the clone wars that she so obviously was made out to be, just as a single example.
I bring this up now with the Kotor remake looming on the horizon so that if they DO decide to make kotor 3 and retcon the swtor stories (cross your fingers) they pay closer attention to the looming threats and character development of those already established points in the kotor games
Honestly, I prefer the SWTOR version. A Sith empire styled on the Shadows of B5 would make good antagonists, but would not make a playable faction or a sustainable society. We do hear echoes of this idea in some of the ideologies ascribed to the SWTOR Sith empire, and that ads to their flavor. In particular I see this as the vision of Darth Jadis, the traitorous dark lord who orchestrated a terrorist campaign against the empire itself. He believed in “the democratization of fear”. That horror and degradation were “gifts” that should be share with the entire galaxy, as it would ultimately make people stronger to face such hardships.
It makes sense to me that such destructive ideologies would exist in tension with more constructive ideologies inside a stable Sith empire. One side emphasizing tradition, conviction and loyalty while the other preaches “chaos and evolution” in the model of the Shadows.
I like both marry the two together fantastic life rarely moves in a straight line
This gave me chills
Chills bro
Me !!!! Afraid????? Nooooooo way! Ali the forces! Make a line of defence along the out rims! Scared me ???? Prepare the skyforge!!!!
Sooo.... total war with no other goal than combat itself. Doesnt that just make them old school Mandalorians with spooky Force powers? Tbh, I kinda like TOR Sith, mainly because they're really a (unknowing) death cult serving a would-be deity
So the original version of the True Sith wanted... Warhamer 40k. That's what 40k is. A galaxy of chaos, bloodshed, and perpetual war. That is kind of hilarious.
Yeah, I had that impression as well. But imagine if star wars changed into that? I would really like to see how zealous the Jedi can become
The true sith by end of video were sounding like the Rakata
Kotor 3 would have been fucking epic. They would have cemented Revan as one of the absolute most powerful force users ever if they could have done it the way they originally intended. Instead we got SWTOR and Revan got ruined.
Darth traya describes revan's sith empire as more of a dark reflection of the republic.
When it says 2 minutes ago 😂
The original sith were conquered by a bunch of rogue Jedi without support of any army or some fancy super weapon. That’s all you need to know of how “terrifying” the original sith were as a species...
The description of the True Sith sounds more like the Yuuzhan Vong's pain&death religion but with the ability to use the Force. The Vong's practice was rejected by the Force making their presence a void in the Force. The True Sith could be a remnant religion of the Rakatan Infinite Empire in which they captured millions of Force sensitive individuals and consumed them. If the Force is Life, then the True Sith is more like an Anti-Life so the Force would had rejected them as well making them like the Yuuzhan Vong. In resolving the KOTOR timeline with the True Sith being the Vong, I can see the Vong making an initial incursion into the galaxy thousands of yrs ago but was somehow repelled by the Rakatan&Gree Empires. They made another attempt some thousands of yrs later by using the Mandalorians to weaken the Old Republic and Revan learning of their existence. With Revan creating his own Sith empire, the Vong left to try again over some thousands of yrs later after the Galactic Empire has fallen to the Rebellion.
They're not even death. They're beyond death. Anti-life fits them well.
The first few sentences of this video are why I'm afraid to start writing my story from notes ';w;'
Don't force me to decide between this and swtor. I cant, I just cant. I love it both. Can we make it like two seperate timelines or something?