Assassin's Creed Has A Huge Protagonist Problem
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 3 ธ.ค. 2022
- Assassin's Creed has had a big protagonist problem for a handful of years now. Ezio Auditore da Firenze is arguably one of the best video game characters of all time. He's iconic, has starred in several games and is seen as the face of the Assassin's Creed franchise. With that said, he's also been a bit of a burden on the series, as players constantly feel the need to relate and compare every protagonist with him. Obviously, the Luke Skywalkers of any franchise will always be iconic, and a standard for future characters, but this problem runs a lot deeper than a simple comparison. It seems that there is a need, from at least a vocal minority of fans, for characters to be inspired by and based off of this character directly. In many ways, this problem stems from creating too good of a character. #assassinscreed #assassinscreedmirage #assassinscreedinfinity
Degenerate Plays
/ @realdegenerateplays
Jill's new website with preserved resin comic book art.
enchantedglamor.com/collectio...
Enchanting ASMR
/ @enchantingasmr1162
Magical Jill
/ @magicaljill
Fiction Fringe
/ @fictionfringe7860
Join the community
/ degeneratejay
/ discord
thedegenera...
/ degenerate-jay-1004669...
/ degeneratejay
/ degeneratejay
www.tiktok.com/@degeneratepla... - เกม
I think that Connors behaviour and serious characteristics was a good choice for the wartime setting
right? the criticism were bullshit
The majority of these games take place in wartime or some sort of revolution
Conner was always miserable & complaining. Ezio is just a more likable character.
@@SpiritOfParadox Yeah well, considering that he was always something of an outsider due to his father, his mother died in front of him when he was just a little boy, he got kicked out and sent to live with a grump cynical old man in hopes of saving his people, culture and way of life from the colonists, which ended up with him having to kill his best friend, and after all the blood, sweat and tears he had to go through, his people got cast out by the very people whose freedom he defended and got left with being called foolish and naive by Juno for his troubles, I think Connor earned the right to be a little whiny considering just how shit his life is compared to Ezio's and hell, even Altair's. The fact that Connor has any hope left and still chooses to fight the good fight is something I find more admirable. He should've gotten a sequel
@@rojaedavis8367 Ezio lost his family in AC2, in fact most AC protagonists start off with losing someone before joining the creed, Connor was just poorly written character.
We went from a charismatic tragic hero to a edgy plank of wood.
Bayek and Edward deserved sequels.
I think they could have easily worked for sequels 100%. Especially would have rather seen another AC pirate game vs them spending forever working on Skull and Bones.
I would have either liked to see a bayek sequel or origins sequel with aya in Rome or Northern Africa during the second triumvirate...even kead8ng up to the birth of christ
Nahh feather and money man are quite one dimensional and boring.
@@RobJarrell63 leading up to the birth of Christ? Aya would be like 70 years old lol that's also not historically accurate as there is little proof that Jesus actually existed in the way he is portrayed. Yes, it's mostly agreed upon that he existed, but the way he existed is still contended.
@ploopy I understand but AC isn't exactly historically correct now is it. I'd still like to see her in Rome during the time of Marc Antony. Or again, the biblical times prior to the birth of christ. Maybe setting up the Roman briton bureaus.
I guess to expand on your point about Edward, he’s the opposite of Ezio. Ezio is a classic hero who goes on the hero’s journey throughout ACII and becomes renowned for his virtuous actions across Italy. Edward, on the other hand, is the reluctant hero. He doesn’t exactly know what he wants with his life, so he starts as a privateer in the West Indies. He leaves behind his wife and the place he’s grown up in to try and find meaning. And he’s damn good at pirating. Blackbeard tells tales around the fire of Kenway, who can clear a Spanish galleon in minutes. He’s a force to be reckoned with. However, the game slowly shows that Edward isn’t content with this life either, as his friends and everyone he’s met either leaves him or dies. All that culminates in the epic scene of him sailing into that tornado. However, throughout the game, he’s also been shown to the Assassins, who Edward is reluctant to be a part of. However, he finds that being with them gives his life meaning as he’s working towards something greater than himself. Until he joins the Assassins, Edward is kind of an asshole. He damn near kills himself drinking, plunders ships and kills thousands of people over his career. He shouldn’t be likable, yet he is. And that’s because inside of him, there’s some good that can be capitalized into making the world better
I really liked Edward.
I could not have said it better myself
Why Edwards journey is fine, I feel like some of the characters in that story as well as the plot itself are bland to the point that you easily forget most of what happened, rendering Edward's arc meaningless.
I'd say the biggest issue (before watching the video) with Ezio is he was so beloved by the fanbase that its hard to top him as a protagonist. He gets three games where his character develops overtime, we see his beginning and his end (in the movie) we like you said three games, spin offs, a movie and in most of the games that came after him his outfit in one shape or form is featured as a legacy item of some kind. How do you top a character whose theme (Ezio's family) is the main theme for every game that comes after?
After watching the video: Seems like we saw and shared the same thoughts on him. And I actually liked and understood Connor didn't bash him or anything as his character is understandable. Why would people compare all these characters from AC games to Ezio whose had three games and so much more to show his life and everyone else got mostly 1 game. (With a few cameos in other games.)
I agree - that's actually an issue is how well Ezio was written. They do reuse his theme in a few games as well through remixing etc. He's also the main character to get crossovers (Fortnite, PUBG, Soul Calibur) and remains the series mascot.
He's the protagonist of 4 games and 2 short films (he's also in Lineage but not the protagonist), there's the game AC: Discovery and the short film Ascendance.
If we go even further, he has comic books, minor or major appearances in other games like Identity and Rebellion, a series of novels, Ezio literally has everything 😂
@@godzillazfrictionthe thing with origins makes sense considering Cleopatra was in ezios family bunker meaning the statues of great assassins, another point is bayek didn’t want a tomb or statue unlike the others because it goes against his whole thing of the “hidden” ones plus he was already in a assassin job all bayek did was start up another one
I feel like Ubisoft should just ditch Ezio’s Family. Not because it is bad, but they are actively trying to sabotage their new protagonists’ potentials by playing the theme in the pause menu. It’s like Ubisoft just says: “Now I know you’re playing another protagonist, but remember this really cool guy we made like over a decade ago?”
@@bluesyrupgc4224 Turbo agree. Which is insane because they didn't do that straight away, Connor and Edward got their own themes, Rogue and onwards they just dropped the ball on that department. Weirdest thing is, I don't remember if Unity and Syndicate had a theme but the RPG trilogy does, each game has its own theme and yet they don't use those themes outside the main menu and a short segment of it when you level up, they just use Ezio's Family for no reason.
Its shame Connor gets so much hate. I love him. Hes like a gentle, calm, giant. Someone I strive to be. His anger is justified and intense whenever it arises, but hes also very kind and just a good person. I think hes great
I also love Connor, ac 3 is in my top 3 for sure
@@RequeesOsas202 agreed
sadly his softer side is mainly shown in the homestead side missions.
@@13thmistral yeah. The entire story of the game in general is just better if you play the homestead missions tbh
People talk about "he's too serious." But if you've heard native humor, it's dry and kinda mostly inside joking. The most fulfilling thing is an inside community and feeling of kinship that is prevalent in native communities. I think I read they had advisors for language and culture of the Mohawk, as a Choctaw, I really enjoy the simple down to earth character, but still striving to do better
Agree with everything said here. It’s even seen with haytham. A flamboyant, charismatic character which funnily enough are characteristics present in ezio. Connor is my favourite character tied with ezio. I love how the absence of his parents during his childhood shows his in personality as an adult, just stone cold
People really need to remember that when they moan about Conor being so cold. hes a young man in AC 3 and all his life hes been through hardship, watching his mother die in front of him and then finding out his dad is essentially is the leader of the guys who did it. like something tells me going through that would make you less flamboyant.
@SharkSprayYTP honestly, I think it's an issue of culture. Dont worry, I'm not saying everyone is racist but I definitely think Renaissance Italy and Italian culture is a flamboyant choice, and more people know and understand those touch stones. Native American culture is the opposite of flamboyant as a culture they are stoic people, there is no flash, they are efficient with their resources and respectful to their environment. Ezio grew up in a major city as a rich noble flirting with a new girl every night at the local bar that's where he got his charms, Connor spent the majority of his childhood learning how to hunt and provide and probably only knew 10 girls his age, also knowing his marriage later in life may be an arranged marriage.
The fact is to make a character that is authentic to each culture they had to go in the directions they went. Their mistake was putting them back to back. If they had put someone like Shay from Rogue in the middle, the transition would be much smoother. Shay has a bit of charm and is funny but he's not flashy like Ezio a large part of his character is how he cares about community more than he cares about the Assassin's brotherhood or the templar order which is a good midpoint to Connor who is basically an assassin out of convenience where as Ezio takes on the Creed as his new family pretty quickly after the death of his father and brothers.
Aiden Pearce is one of my favorite game protagonists of all time due to the fact that he really sells the bit of “a bad guy trying to do good” all while being an interesting analysis into the “revenge-driven anti-hero” archetype.
He’s stoic, he talks to himself, he’s narcissistic, he’s basically a nutjob, but he does his best to make these round out into the best possible outcome he can muster. Every time he’s on screen, he just gives off this presence that things are gonna go down.
Yeah I mean he really is a deconstruction of that trope, Aiden is a selfish asshole throughout the first game
This is why I wish Ubisoft would give each assassin their own series. Some of these writers deserve a chance to flesh out their characters.
Exactllyyy, especially Arno and Edward because who doesn't want more Edward? and I feel like they kinda did Arno dirty by rushing his story and not pacing it properly, I thought he was a good character with potential especially since Shay killed his father and they still do have potential and a sequal with him and shay is definitely possible and would be a great way to flesh out Arno and his journey.
@@ProGamer-lk9qwtrue considering unity was connected to rogue in the story so idk if that counts unity as a sequel to rogue and rogue a sequel to black flag and assassins creed 3
Really the only concern there would be managing and scheduling I think, but I totally agree.
@@chris_elkins2093 Mannnnn when i first saw that part in Unity where it was connected to Rouge. I lost my young ass mind.
Just make 15 different series bro
I've said this forever and I'll always stand by it if Bayek got a triogly or even a sequel he would be just as good as ezio ubisoft even hinted at a sequel at the end of origins makes me mad
Common Hunter W
Too bad Origins wasn't a good game
@@helgenlane it was a better game than most of them
@@Painbodyy how so? It was boring desert grind in boring locations with boring obstacles with boring parkour that's worse than in previous games. It also started the trend for the "new" crap combat.
@@helgenlane It was the most balanced in terms of combat, though. You could still do certain things that you can't do in Odyssey or Valhalla. The locations were also far from boring, but to each their own.
please dont give up on your vids man. in 2019-2020 your channel got me out of a dark place because i had come across someone who feels how i feel about Batman as a character among others and now its evolved so much. we appreciate you bro 💪🏾
Thank you very much for saying this. I don't plan to quit I just have a lot of mental and physical problems that make the channel sometimes hard to do, especially when YT refuses to show this content to most people. I truly appreciate the support and kind words and it makes me happy that in any small way the channel helped you, that means a lot to me.
Same here
The problem I had with Connor wasn't that he was boring, or anything like that, but the fact we didn't get enough time to see his life and how he grew, they skipped a lot of his life for whatever reason.
we lived more with connor than with any other assasins besides ezio what are you talking about lol , he's the only one who we played as a kid besides arno
@@danielcastaneda4975not true, his story ended in the books where he married and had 2 kids and his wife left him. In the end he was alone in his twilight years, with Ezio we literally saw his twilight years and how he died
@@ahmedsachwani2868 that’s was retconed, now is considered Abstergo propaganda. The real story of Connor os that he lives a happy life
@@ahmedsachwani2868 that was fabricated by abstergo. connor stayed married, had 6 kids, his youngest daughter ended up inheriting the eagle vision. there are official comic pages that touches this
@@nuzhatmaliat9258 yeah, I like how the eagle vision she inherits is the real one like bayek, like she sees the wolves through the eyes of the eagle. Like I don’t know why these thiguns aren’t added in the games even as voice files. Like the time Desmond’s son confronts and kills Juno in her new human body
It's Edward for me, I think the AC4 ending is probably the best ending which exemplifies Edward's character development within one game which Ezio had across three games. And some of these characters aren't liked not because they are serious or stoic it's because of the lack of character development.
I still think Altair is the most interesting of all the Assassin's and I'd like to see more characters like him. Not everyone needs some tragic family background to be interesting. Ubisoft was pretty brave to make Altair really arrogant and unlikable at the beginning of the game, but that makes his transformation at the end all the more compelling.
He was also ruthless and intelligent in a way none of the other assassin's were. He's the only one I have no trouble believing is a cold blooded killer and that can be just as interesting as a more conventionally likable character like Ezio if done properly.
Most people sleep on Altair but his redemption arc in AC1 is very strong especially his interactions with Malek as the story moves forward. Going from an arrogant fool and then humbling himself was great.
The thing is though none of the Assassins are supposed to be cold hearted killers; Altair learns to feel somewhat for his victims by the end and is told that it is human and normal. Ezio is taught the same from Mario hence Requiescat in Pace after every assassination.
@@kaathesacolyte2943 I think that's why i like Connor, he is a cold-hearted killer. He's trying to do right in the world but as his mother describes him, he's the son of a violent man and so is a violent one himself.
That feels very Altair-esque to me. It makes the kills that he gives respect to so much more meaningful, because he genuinely respects them. Not trying to give them peace in their last moments. Same with Altair, when they start talking, he genuinely doesn't care. They're just a target, they must be bad. But he then listens and it helps the player realise, something isn't quite right without being completely explicit about it.
The whole "we're not cold hearted, we're the good guys" is really a facade to make the player feel like they're making the right choices.
but as shaun says it best in i think AC:Brotherhood?
"We're assassins. We assassinate people, that's what we do."
100% on Shao Jun! She deserves a AAA entry so bad it hurts...
@Tucker A Not the Russia one though. That one was shit and not very interesting. The setting is terrible too just like colonial america.
The India setting I can certainly get behind though
AC3 is my favourite. I love Connor, he is so underrated. And yes he is serious and angry at times but having done a replay recently, I have noticed that people over claim how serious and angry he is, there are moments of happiness and kindness and even humour from Connor, it is just different to how Ezio did those traits. Connor was just more subtle in a lot of ways.
This is a problem a lot of series definitely have when they continue past iconic characters and try and make new ones
It doesn’t help that the two best games are also ezio games so not only do the characters get compared but the entire game gets compared😂
For me I miss the days of the Animus being used to train up Desmond to be a master Assassin through the bleeding effect. I was so excited during ACIII when they mentioned that Desmond's muscles where being exercised while he was in the Animus. I was so sad when they killed him off and ruined all that build up for me...
I agree. I liked how the games switched from Desmond to his ancestor and you get to see how the modern Assassin's and Templars exist. The 3rd game was the best in using Desmond to go on Assassin missions but they killed him off.
People say Connor is always angry but no one remembers that even ezio in the early game was always angry, he then found people who helped him while Connor had no one. The people he supported even didn’t do him right, as Connor says “they did the right thing but what was right for them”. Also I loved Aiden Pierce and in watch dogs 2 I absolutely hated the protagonist. I found him unbearable. The biggest example is I remember the name of Aiden because he left an impression while I can’t even remember the name of the second protag cause I literally couldn’t care less
Connor remains my favorite Assassin. I still prefer Edward to Ezio, and I identify more with Arno than I'd like. That puts Ezio into fourth place at best for me. They REALLY needed to expand on the lives of the other Assassins, and NOT in expanded media. I still think it's criminal that we have Connor, Arno, Aveline, and Shay all running around during each others' lifetimes, but only Connor and Aveline have ever canonically crossed paths. There's _absolutely_ a good story there, and at this point I trust fans with it more than I do Ubisoft. But just further games with each of the protagonists could've gone over well, I think, even if (like Unity and AC3) it took some time for fans to get over whatever technical gripes they'd have had with the games to see the stories for what they are. Hell, it's just my own personal preference, but give me a dozen games set in Colonial America, and I'm happy (there was SO much great history left on the table for these periods).
There's a TH-camr called Master Assassin, he makes a lot of Assassin's Creed video and one of them was called Assassin's Creed: Vengeance. It's a fanfic video he created where he has Connor, Aveline, Shay, and Arno cross paths with each other. It's actually a pretty good video and would've made an interesting game.
Counterpoint. Arno is French. thats gotta knock, at least 99% of his points off.
Connor totally would’ve helped during the French Revolution.
It's really funny that this is a thing because I literally heard my younger sister badmouthing Arno as a character because he's "french Ezio" and there's actually a lot about his backstory that's very different from Ezio. His personality is definitely similar in some places, but it's hilarious to me that Arno is being attacked from both sides while the sister in question enjoys Kassandra and Eivor who are both very much "well spoken snarky sarcastic rebellious joker" characters as well.
I think the problem is not just funny and quirky characters. Arno was not the best received and he is VERY similar to ezio. But Ezio was not mindlessly driven by emotion like Arno was. So making Arno a more expressive character did not work either. I think they NEED to be an intelligent AND quirky character for them to be popular which was shown with Ezio and Edward.
@@godzillazfriction Arno's motivations aren't the same as Ezio but his mannerisms definitely are. He's the suave dude who knows what to say and how to crack jokes and make the audience smile and laugh. He grew up around wealth and even though he isn't entitled, he blends in with the crowd very well. His personality was clearly inspired by characters like Ezio even if his motivations aren't the same. He's also more focused on one love (Elise) vs being directionless in that department like Ezio ends up being for a lot of his life. Different priorities, but there's a lot of crossover and similarity in how they behave and how their dialogues are written.
I always saw Arno as something like Ezio but with an edgier darker streak to him who could have easily had a negative character arc (the opposite of Ezio who had a positive character arc). Basically Arno should have been the Assassin's Creed version of Anakin Skywalker
Agreed man Dead Kings in terms of story to me was Arno's redemption and I fully believed that we were getting a sequel that took place in Egypt when Napoleon had his campaign. It would have been a interesting link to the first game and would have been a story that follows Napoleon use of the Apple of Eden
I would love to get an Arno sequel during the Napoleonic wars. Seeing the rise and fall of Napoleon through the lens of AC would be glorious
could also be the chance to give Shay a sequel too.
The biggest issue with Conner is not the character but the fact that after Ezio, the player base had certain expectations about what the characters were going to be like.
personally connor was my favorite he felt more like a batman brute type thrown into a world his father created to undo his mistakes
Sam Prior in your comments isn't too bright
My issue with Connor (and the same applies to Aidan Pierce from Watch Dogs) wasnt that he was serious all the time, its just that they didnt make him captivating or entertaining about it.
Even the most serious of fictional characters like Batman, Geralt Of Rivea (who is biologically built to have suppressed emotions because of the rituals) and more recently Wednesday Addams all have some kind of unique charm or a sense of colorful intensity to their personalities that makes you want to follow them.
Connor and Aidan on the otherhand just felt like hollow voids that fill the sterotype of the strong silent type with a revenge plot rather then building off of it.
Here is how Id recommend fixing them
Aiden would have been a more interesting character, if the game dived further into his psychopathy and better yet implement those story elements into the gameplay. Like have him go through a sort of Fight Club meets Mr.Robot kinda character arc. Have his paranoia make him go crazy and end up doing shit that he heavilly regrets or harm someone he cares about.
As for Connor, he is clearly a native american working in a white colonizer world so his arc would have been better if the story pushed more on him dealing with the constant racism and implement it into the gameplay. Like how certain characters and NPCs interact with him because of his skin color or how some shops wont sell him items because of their bigotry unless he wears a mask or some kind of disguise to get in. Connor has a lot of rage towards people like Charles Lee and Haythem Kenway which again they were bare bones about. His anger and rage could have been further explored not just with those two but with witnessing the injustices that are happening to his own people. I think it would have been cool if the three characters had a dynamic similar to Thorffin and Askeladd from Vinland Saga. Especially since both Connor and Thorffin were war torn youths fueled by rage and both Haythem and Charles are very adjecent to the role Askeladd plays in Thorffins story.
Connor became and still is my favorite AC character. He's more relatable to me, cuz he makes mistakes along the way, but keeps pushing through the hardships.
I believe that Bayek was a good mix between stoic and charismatic and majority of both the fans who like the older games and the ones who like the newer ones can agree on
Part of what made Ezio charming was his pride and confidence. Ezio was born in a rich and noble family, and was fully aware of his status, he was an Auditore, and proud of it. But thanks to his enlightened upbringing he wasn't arrogant, he didn't look down on others, and his name alone still had value. This made him confident and charismatic. Other protagonists didn't have these traits, Connor lost everything as a kid, Edward was a nobody tryng to make a name for himself, and Arno was raised as a stable boy. They couldn't have Ezio's pride. But we should also acknowledge that Ezio's story is also a bit clichè, young nobleman that has to avenge his father's murder, where did i hear it before?
I mean that just a lot of assassin's, connor avenging his mother and village, arno avenging his adoptive father, Bayek out to get revenge for the death of his son.
Thanks for the video, it really got me thinking about the handling of “serious” characters as protagonists in fiction. That said, I believe the real issue is simply Ubisoft has a writing problem and they keep flipping between too many character extremes.
It’s not really a societal issue as it is just poor execution of characters and failing to generate fan engagement via the protagonist. Ubisoft mishandled Connor and Aiden Pearce got it worse since he was more caricature than character. Expectedly, Ubisoft just went to other extremes they believed would make for more excitable and engaging protagonists. It’s why Aiden was replaced with Marcus and the other DedSec characters like Wrench, and why they try to make their Assassin protagonists more lively than Connor to engage the players.
It doesn’t help that stoic and serious characters are notoriously easy to mess up. You’ve got to go the extra mile for them or they’ll come across as flat, dull, lifeless, or just all around boring compared to other characters. It might seem unfair, but that’s the reality of it.
Doesn’t mean stoic and serious characters are falling out of fashion or anything in fiction, especially as protagonists. Like you mentioned, there’s Kratos, Batman, Joel from TLOU and many more like them in gaming and beyond who are beloved by people. It’s just all in the execution.
I loved Altaïr and still do.
He starts arrogant and confident, not really listening to others, and slowly starts to open up to Malik and understand how he can have similar goals to his enemies, but opposed means.
You really see how he starts to question what he does but not in a way that stops all his resolve, but pushes him to reform the Assassin Brotherhood after he kills Al-Mualim.
Altaïr is for me a good exploration of a character that learns humility and remains critical without undermining his resolve and conviction.
Shay Cormac is one my top favorite characters in assassin's Creed, it told the story of a young assassin who was like ezio gone rogue after seeing how corrupt and power hungry the American brotherhood became, and shay was forced to grow up forced to morally acknowledge to himself that if he doesn't kill the brotherhood millions will die, I saw a man that was young and clumsy like ezio or arno turn into a cold stoic blooded killer like Altair or Connor Infront of my eyes through out the game. Top 5, or 3 character maybe? For me that is.
First comment I've seen mention shay and I agree. His story is brilliant and he is completely justified in it, I'm currently playing AC 2 and gonna go thru the series but based on my memory shay and Edward are my overall favourite characters in my favourite AC games and ezio I'm still undecided given I remember his story and characterisation the least. Of all the protagonists shay and Edward were the ones who deserved sequels
We're in the minority. I think we need Arno vs. Shay.
I wish we could have gotten an Altaïr trilogy.
"How could I regret the only life I have ever known?"
I'm glad someone talked about this bc all I see online and on TH-cam are people bashing games that aren't Ezio and/or Origins, Odyssey, and Valhalla.
I like Connor, Bayek, and Edward, but honestly my favorite character out of all of the assassins is the og, Altair. He starts off as a talented but incredibly arrogant person but slowly across the course of the first game becomes a humble yet unstoppable master assassin. As far as I'm concerned his character arc is still my favorite.
Also like Edward he was like Jack sparrow
I just get so tired of seeing Ezio fanaticism all over the community
I agree
I think Connor is not appearing in the community is because you play the first misions as Haytham and his character was amazing and he is soo much better than Connor
I would not say he is "soo much better" but he is the more charming character. As I saw from talking to many other fans on discord it seems like Connor can be missunderstood because he is more to difficult crack down and he is more complicated to understand which is can seem unappealing to people who don't pay much attention to it.
@@drarctic3682 Connor was my favorite wish we got a sequel
Because he’s funny?
Wait you like Haytham? I thought everyone hated the guy. He's charming but he ends up really unlikable because of how cold blooded he is.
I couldn't stand Haytham. He wasn't really charming as much as he was full of himself.
Ezio Auditore, for me as a young teenager, was my absolute hero. Not only is he a badass legend, he's also a genuinely good hearted protagonist, from the time he was rebirthed as an Assassin to dying with his creed intact.
But I do appreciate all the other assassins (up to Origins, haven't played Odyssey/Vahalla).
Ezio was in the Renaissance Era, where a lot of art and social norms changed from Altairs Crusade Era, a whole 400 year difference.
Connor and so on are in the 1700s, which was a lot of war and conflict due to advanced technologies and also trade/naval travelling. I actually enjoyed The Kenway Saga (Edward, Haytham, Connor); you can throw in Shay Cormac from Rogue since he impacted both the American and French Brotherhood in a very big way. For the times of 1700s, it was a very serious gloomy time. Of course anyone from that Century wasnt a comedian or an "Ezio".
Ezio extended as long as he did because all the modern day story, for clues and leads to the Apple of Eden for those titles. No game since had a consistent Assassin DNA that lead to a single piece of Eden SINCE Ezio. If anyone could have a sequel, I'd like to see more of Shay. The whole Assassin turned Templar was great! I'd love to see more past Rogue, and maybe even past his part in Unity, where his end might meet the blade of avengeful assassin, whether it be Connor or Arno.
Brilliant timing as I've just finished replaying the Ezio games and started AC3.
When they first come out I loved the Ezio games and thought AC3 and beyond were so boring. Now I'm really enjoying AC3 and looking forward to Black Flag and Rogue
Ac3 is my favorite game of all time
I think we should get to see more of Shay Cormac's life after the seven years war and Haytham's Kenway's early rise up the Templar ranks and why he didn't become an assassin when his father was
I'd actually love that
People play games to feel larger than life, to run across those rooftops and climb buildings we would never dare to in real life. I guess that also applies to our main characters too. People love to watch characters that have complete control of the situation, always making jokes, never cracking under the pressure; but we connect to characters that go through real pain. What makes characters like Ezio and Edward so beloved (at-least in my opinion) isn’t their badass assassin moments, but their reasons for even doing so in the first place. Edward wants to provide for his family, Ezio wants to avenge his family, we connect with those characters because we value those traits in ourselves.
Stoic characters are far more interesting in my opinion, because unlike a character that can be understood by reading between the lines of what they say, we have to think about what isn’t said. For a lot of characters, that means sort of filling in the gaps where authors are too lazy to write. Connor is boring, not because he is stoic and quiet, i actually love and completely understand that, it’s just that he exerts no will of his own over the story (from what I remember at-least, it’s been ages since I’ve actually played the games so forgive me if I’m sort of off about the details) and instead takes orders from whoever’s giving them. Achilles, Washington, Juno, Connor is just a pawn in a larger story. And that’s cool! that could be cool! Let’s explore that further, but we just don’t have much to go off of besides the game we were given. I definitely would love to see a second game about Connor, Edward, Arno, because I feel there’s so much potential within these characters and their games that we have yet to see.
100% agree with you guys, always love to see your AC vids!
Bayek is my favorite. Conner is def a fav and I feel he could have been expanded on. Funny enough I feel that the side missions are what really show Connor's development. Altair would be my 3rd favorite. Watch Dog 1 was actually my fav watch dog.
The homestead missions were amazingin ac3! Like Connor asking the woman "what do you women like?" That made me laugh.
I always thought Connor, Edward, Arno were always the assassins after Ezio that could have had a sequel and were wasted because of it. Connor needed one more game to really see more of the growth from his game and same with Arno. Edward was already liked by many and the novel by Oliver bowden literally shows a perfect roadmap of what you could do done with a sequel for him! Anyway, all in the past now 😂
Man I still really want a sequel for Connor, he develops so much throughout with that just one game
Maybe a TV series would work best?
I think Connor deserved an entire game and a novel at least. I think Haytham is fairly overrated.
I was one of the few that got tired from Ezio by the time Revelations came out. I was attached to him and emotional after watching his end in Embers, however, in combination with very little gameplay updates and Brotherhood and Revelations being glorified DLCs to AC2, Connor and AC3 as a whole really felt like a breath of fresh air for me, in a franchise that now meant, a new game every years with very few moments of excitement in -between. So when I saw Connor, I immediately, liked him more, because he wasn't really Ezio, or "The Chosen one" (for the most part). And considering what he went through, was 100 times more relatable than Ezio, who felt like a mix between Batman and Zorro in Italy. I think the butthurt fanbase of Ezio, were to blame for Ubisoft thinking they should try and recreate the Ezio archetype into almost every single character in the series after. At least, until Origins came out.
Highly agree. Connor was way more relatable and more a tragedy than Ezio's story ever was.
@Stealth Cleric Cool
@@RUN_IT_UP_ Every single thing you say is negative and boring.
@Stealth Cleric To each their own. Connor did what he did because he was obligated to do things that needed to be done. Like Ezio, he didnt want this life but unlike Ezio who technically could've walked away at any time, Connor just couldnt. It reminded me of my life and how I feel obligated to carry out certain responsibilities.
so how exactly did they recreate ezio in every single character in the franchise after ezio? i mean sure unity but they hardly did it in the others
I also think that another problem is that most people focus on Ezio during his younger days, specifically in AC2 and the beginnings of Brotherhood, where Ezio didn’t have much responsibility and was able to be a larger personality whereas later in Brotherhood he has to take on more responsibility and has to see more than just himself and in Revelations where he is a tired old man who is beginning to see behind the curtains and realize that everything he has ever done and accomplished doesn’t mean anything outside of this single act that is his life.
A lot of the leads had potential. The problem is that the character isn’t the focus, the setting is. So we whip from setting to setting without letting the leads breathe. An Arno sequel where you fight Napoleon would be my dream AC game.
The thing about Ezio is that he's the type of character the players (mostly a male audience) want to self-insert into.
Great video jay
Thanks dude I really appreciate it! 🙏
@@DegenerateJay no problem maybe you and Nate can do a deeper dive video on connor and assassin's creed 3 ? keep you're head and making the content you want to make and keep positive
Connor and Arno deserve more development they both had more potential then they were ever given credit for especially if you play more optional parts of the games, Connor I decided was a awful character because someone said he was and I couldn't have been more wrong, Putnam also respected Connor as a soldier
Arno should have a sequel with corrupted Napoleon and rebuilding the Parisian brotherhood. Maybe in France, Egypt & Spain.
Shay should've been the antagonist instead!
@@thegamingprozone1941 Well Napoleon would be more of a character Arno would have a love hate relationship with. Grey morality.
Kinda hard to not compare other protagonists to Ezio since he's the poster boy of AC, but they should've gave some of them sequels
Connor was awesome. I loved his brutality and ferocity. I'd love to play as him again.
Honestly all characters that are not ezio really deserve a second game just because I'd personally love to see where any of their stories could go or be remade 😉
I agree with what you guys say, my favorite Assassin is Connor, and the criticism I see every time is that he is always serious, but if you want to see Connor be more friendly and not that serious play the homestead missions, I love Ezio, but I have grown tired of basically the rest of the charecters are just Ezio, that's just my opinion
I agree. Connor is one of my favorite Assassins especially with the homestead missions.
I will say about Connor, he was very one dimensional. The way he was advertised they wanted him to be a man of action, not of voice. I thought he was supposed to be like Boba Fett, I thought it'd be a good contrast to Ezio and so was pretty excited. The issue I had was the story wasn't written for a 1 dimensional character. We have all these prompts where Connor should feel something and he just doesn't, like serious things that involve him and his people and he just doesn't care, and then he is forced into doing them anyway.
When you put a one dimensional character into a multidimensional story your character just comes off as childish, and in Connors case he struck me as more of an Angry Toddler than a Badass Assassin.
"I want to kill Charles Lee!"
"We know that Connor but we are kind of at war right now and the fate of the whole nation and everyone in it including your people are at risk"
"But I want to Kill Lee!"
"You can kill him after, we have to deal with this first."
"But I want to kill him now!"
If they had put him into a one directional story, where Connor is on a B-Line for Lee, and get rid of the Rev war, get rid of the Risk to his Tribe and just have Lee throwing things in Connors path to try to stop him, it would have been more fitting to his character and I would have liked him more. Connor needed a John Wick like story for his John Wick like personality.
I hope they redo his story, because with the tools they gave him and controlling him in fights, he actually was a badass, it's just his story that gets in the way.
I completely agree with you - people tend to remember Connor a lot more fondly nowadays. And he is a good protagonist, but he is very shallow. That Boba Fett 'man of action' characterisation can work, but not for a story that tries to be as emotional as AC3 does.
Connor's a favorite of mine, but I see your point.
Fun fact about Altair is that besides his game on ds, "Altair's Chronicles", he had another like spinoff title or sequel called bloodlines on Cyprus and he also had a novel "Sacred Crusade" and also in Ezio trilogy. So I think that he got a decent amount of time given to him besides his childhood but I do get your point and agree with ya. Much love to ya man and keep doing great work.
Hey hey, first one of your videos I watched and it was a goodie. I have one grievance however, whilst I agree that most modern AC characters are unfairly compared to Ezio and that Ubisoft is leaning into that too much is also true.
But the reduction of Ezio to a silly Marvel character kinda bugged me. Yeah Ezio is funny and charming and and all that, but that's not why we love him. We love Ezio for his growth, even if we'd pretend that he only had one game, Ezio went from a revenge hungry brat to a wise and mercyful man. His charm made him endearing to all but his wisdom and intelligence are what made us fall in love with him back then not his silly way of handling trauma :))
The first assassin creed game I played was Valhalla, but I recently started playing the og assassin creed games, and I can say that although being a major fan of rpg games, that I enjoy the og assassin creed games than the rpg assassin games.
Damn bro how old are you? My first ac game was brotherhood than 2 than revelations, 3 was my favorite tho
@@skywalker2676 13
Would've been cool to see a Conor trilogy, the setting moving west with each entry
The only protagonist problem I think they have is not giving anyone else a sequel. Edward, and Bayek could've used more time. They could've just sent Aya to Rome and Greece in a new game. Problem is, they don't want to tell good stories, they want historical simulators. The set piece is more important to them.
Edward and shay Cormack *deserved* sequels, criminal they never got one
@@TY-km8hj I agree. Shay should've been hunted down by Arno as well. So many missed opportunities.
@@bish0p3473 facts, I didn't even play unity but knew about arno and even I wanna see that showdown and discussion between 2 men who are both justified. Missed opportunities should be the tagline of AC and ubisoft at this point
@@TY-km8hj I agree. I've often thought they have a lot of nice tries with their ideas, but fail to execute them. Ubisoft = Nice Try.
@@bish0p3473 legit, near enough all of their franchises have just derailed over time. I can't even remember the last ubisoft game I bought
I've seen it on the internet before, but we need a Connor and Arno team up against Shay. the groundwork is all there, it could be so cool.
I know. I kept hearing fans wanting a Connor Arno team up but we never got that, not even in a dlc
they just need to accept not everyone in later games is Ezio, but their story do deserve to be stretch out, because like example Arno Dorian the story kinda has connection to Rogue but sadly they never crossover, i like to think Arno maybe tries to find his Father's Killer and seek Justice like he always does.
Probably the biggest missed opportunity was not doing a crossover game with Arno & Connor vs Shay
Another factor working against Connor is that there’s not as much time given to him and his story as there is for Ezio even just in ACII. The fact ACIII concludes the 2012 doomsday event arc means a lot of time relative to previous games doing missions with Desmond and getting to the point he has to sacrifice himself. It’s awesome to do that kind of stuff with Desmond, but it is taking time away from Connor. Even the climax of the game is centered around Desmond and his choice about whether to protect Earth from the solar flare or not, Connor’s story seems to end with him finally killing Charles Lee.
There’s also Haytham, who you start the game out as and re-enters Connor’s narrative a few hours after switching to Connor as the playable character for more nuanced takes on the Templars and Assassins. He recaptures that Ezio-ness that make people latch onto him more than his son. The game presenting a strained father/son motif with Haytham/Connor and Desmond/William doesn’t help, since again it takes gameplay and cutscene time away from Connor.
Even the tie-in novel, a chance to expand on Connor’s mindset and perspective, is used to depict Haytham’s backstory and perspective on events in the game, like realising he has a son witnessing the Boston Tea Party. If you look for where Connor goes next, there’s just a single comic book issue about a hunt he and his daughter go on where he learns she has the kind of eagle sight Bayek and Kassandra have (being able to see through the eyes of an eagle).
The Tyranny of King Washington DLC, the perfect opportunity to show where Connor goes next, was used to do a What If to break the level of realism the series usually engaged in at that point (where the powers of the apples were less important than the apples being macguffins for the characters in the historical settings to want). It is set after the main story but that’s the framing device and on screen for only a fraction of the DLC’s runtime.
Too add on top of this,
The reason that Assassin's Creed worked so well for its foundational games is that they also kept Desmond Miles around, the moment he was killed off we never really got another good Modern day protagonist to how they learned from the skills of the Assassin's Creed character, the modern day protagonist became Dull
I'm amazed they didn't address any of the modern day protags of Assassin's Creed
@@daxfer2945 I'd say that the modern day protagonist would be Basim from the last game, as for the other Assassin Creed games we have no idea who they are
So many great original characters in assassins creed always wanted squeals with the kenways and shay there story’s deserve it
Arno Vs Shay, it was right there.
This is my first time watching you guys and honestly i agree on a lot of your points. Ezio is one of my favorites and it comes down to the fact that I had time to develope that connection with him because of the multiple games. Truthfully for me when i know its gonna be a different assassin every game it makes me not get to attached to the main character even if i like the way a characters written. But by giving characters multiple games more time to be fleshed out and then once they're done and ready to move on introduce a new generation either maybe before that protagonist or have it follow in a lineage. I love the idea of have previous protagonists mentor new ones the way ezio did, primarily that opens the door for potentially progressive story based multiplayer if you have multiple playable characters, may not be for everyone but i have a few friends that would love running through an AC story as a unit instead of multiplayer being random contracts or hunting down other players.
Conor was always my favourite because he was cold but every now and then, youd see the light side of Conor. Which makes sense given his backstory and what he goes through in the games. I Feel like a Conor sequel wouldve been great.
I liked the ac syndicate because of the dynamic of one brother being the "funny guy" and the other being the one who tries to be more serious.
This happens in a lot of franchises. In the Avatar series Korra got a lot of hate for her "I'm the Avatar, deal with it" attitude and compared that to how Aang didn't want to be the avatar as if Korra being different than Aang made her a bad character
I agree. Nothing wrong with a new character in the same series being different from the first character or the most popular character.
That would be so boring. And each time period and country has their own political and social issues especially for women, black people, indigenous people, etc.
Even new novels expanding on these one game characters beyond where their games left them could go a long way. Assassin’s Creed Forsaken did a lot to flesh out Haytham as a character, and while we got a prequel novel for Bayek in Desert Oath what happened next is often interesting to explore. A novel as well doesn’t rely on voice actors to be available, so maybe something like a short story collection of times when Kassandra’s life intersects with other Assassins, how she interacts with them and perceives the Brotherhood and Templars.
I love the novels, I read most of them except for Origins and Odyssey, the new gen. But I rather play as the characters growing up and becoming their own person, not just read about it.
@@olette495 Desert Oath is like Forsaken in that it’s more of a prequel and explores the beginnings of Bayek’s journey as a Medjay, his relationship with Aya and conflict with the Order of the Ancients.
Have this video some promotion on Twitter. I hate the algorithm there but it's worth a try.
The problem with assassin's Creed is it's like everyone had to come on after Richard Prior. Can't help the disappointment people will feel getting bill burr after. It's that gap in quality and characterisation mere couple years later. This is the kind of shadow greatness creates. they really nailed it with Ezzio
I don’t think Ezio is really the problem: it is that the writers refuse to give the other characters the amount of respect they gave to Ezio.
Edit: I’ve always said that Connor needed a sequel, his story was unfinished imo.
I agree with you guys 100%. I noticed that after Connor all the way up to Bayek, the male protagonists (with the exception of Shay/Adewale’s spin-offs) are in some way a reflection of Ezio. Edward, Arno, Jacob, all 3 of them are far closer to Ezio than Connor I think because the writers shot themselves in the foot and made Ezio the definitive hero. I mean Arno even looks like Ezio for god sakes!
Ezio got three games that allowed us to see his growth in all three of those games, plus the spin offs and more. Those games also showed us his beginning, middle and end, because of this he's character is most fleshed out. If you played all three of ezio's games the playtime roughly comes around 70hrs. Now compared to other games from AC3 to Syndicate their average play time is around 30hrs thats half of what we spent with ezio. Most of the characters in these game go through their beginning, middle and end in those 30hrs or less, which is not enough if compared to ezio, that is at least for the protagonists for these game. However for valhalla the average playtime is around 100hrs and odyssey is around 90hr, yet we don't feel or see that these characters are better than ezio or as good as him. Fans enjoyed the time they played as ezio and got really invested in his story and here Ubisoft saw that they could milk him, so they started using Ezio's family as the main theme of the franchise, its like if marvel used the music from iron man in all the other marvel movies even tho there is no iron man in them and put ironmans suit somewhere in the background. In a way Ubisoft made a character the face of the franchise and chained themselves to never move on from ezio. As they themselve's can't let go of him constantly remixing Ezio's family for every assassins creed game. Rouge didn't even have its own theme song it was just a remix of Ezio's family. Ubisoft needs to let go of Ezio until they don't, I don't think we as fans would let go either. Even now they uploded like 2 remix's of Ezio's family in the last few months.
I agree. They need to stop milking Ezio as the face of the series and the music and give each new game their own personality and identify with their own fleshed out characters
Bayek is my favourite. Ezio is definitely more iconic though.
I was in the minority but I loved Connor and ac3 he was no nonsense and took his mission seriously I could relate to that really hard during my late teen years. Also the game was really deep with the crafting and homestead system and the hunting damn I'm gonna go pick up the remastered version rn
A lot of the more tender character moments for Connor are in the Homestead missions, which are side content so not all players did them. Which is a shame, as Connor having a community around him and being part of one is so lovely to see, that he has people’s backs and they consider him someone who is a very good friend. He even walks one of them down the aisle because he’s so well regarded. It’s a beautiful example of the found family trope.
I love ezio so much, the first game in the series I played was on my ps3 in 2020 was ac1 and I just wanted the second one, after I got it I fell in love with the game just to later find out that there were 10 other games in the series, and now I’ve played and finished everything but Valhalla. Love the content keep it up man.
And the thing that kinda makes me mad is that Ubisoft had the potential to make sequels for certain characters.
Arno: we saw him during the French revolution. What about the Napoleonic wars that happened. Main villain could be shay. You could've had Conner as an old man involved as well. arno could've had a trilogy. With the French revolution. Then the Napoleonic wars. With the story possibility of having Shay and Conner involved. Honestly not giving sequels to assassin's like Arno was a serious missed opportunity.
This is a very interesting video for me lol my favorites are Conner, Arno & Bayek. Been playing since AC1.
Ive been saying they could literally pump out games based around ezio’s ancestors in AC 2 and brotherhood but, i definitely understand what u mean man the uniqueness between characters should be what draws everyone to them Connor should get another game maybe tying arno into it and bring back the damn online pvp modes😂
Damn you for making me watch and enjoy this video 👏 Edit: + 1 subscriber
That whole co-op mechanic sounds pretty cool actually. i just recently beat God of War Ragnarok which executed a similar concept really well. and if a game in AC were to do something like what you've suggested, there'd be a good enough amount of room to bring back the mechanic from AC Brotherhood where you can call an assassin to aid you in a fight or with killing a few guards without raising any suspicion onto yourself.
This is particularly why I'm excited for Mirage. Although we didn't play as him, we saw a lot of development for Basim in Valhalla, and now we get a further exploration in his own game. The last time a character got proper development over multiple projects is really adewale, from AC4 to being playable in freedom cry, to rogue. That's nothing compared to Ezio, but we need to go back to characters getting multiple games to get that much needed development.
I always found characters like bayek and Connor far stronger in the narrative and a lot more, I suppose inspirational. There's a quality to how much strife and grief they can suffer and still find a reason to keep going
I personally think that the reason Ubisoft can’t do character sequels especially now is the open world nature of the newer games. The ability to go through areas and develop gear/abilities in a non linear way kind of killed the concrete storyline that allows for more character development beyond some new armour or a weapon. On top of the open world thing, Ubisoft started writing to have every game in a new time period to avoid the world becoming stale.
As Edwardsucker32 he’s my favorite character he’s easily the most charismatic and fun and he has the best character arc in the series to become a good man but bayek is a good counterpoint he’s a very nice man that’s filled with insatiable bloodlust and rage when it comes down to it
Tbh I love most of them but I get Edward being your fav. I wish we had gotten a sequel with him or another pirate Assassin instead of getting "Skull and Bones" from Ubisoft.
Connor has always been my second favorite Assassin, I never knew why people hated him man
Another reason why Ezio is so popular is that it was also the best era of how the game played.
I really hate how after Ezio they just completely gave up on multi-game stories. Like, Connor would have been a great character to use for multiple games; he was relatively young at the end of his first game (in his 30s), and given the timeline, they could have easily had a sequel set during the French Revolution. They even set it up - Lafayette said something about inviting Connor to his home country. It would have worked really well (I mean, it would have probably run into all the same technical issues as the French Revolution game we actually got, but you know, story wise it would have worked). And if they'd wanted, they could have followed that up with a game set during the War of 1812, with an older Connor (he would have been about the same age as Revelations Ezio), and further explored some of the themes of colonization they touched on in AC3 by featuring Tecumseh (I mean, they could still do that if they wanted, the kind of "older Connor training his daughter" story suggested in the video). And then more recently, Bayek and Aya were perfectly set up for a sequel in the Roman Empire - would have been super cool to see Bayek building up the brotherhood, and to run around Imperial Rome, compare its ancient form to the version we saw in Brotherhood... but I'm pretty sure they'll never even think about doing that.
I’ll probably get a lot of heat for this, but I think the Frye twins deserve a sequel. Since they took down Starrick, now they can rebuild their Brotherhood, which would make for a really interesting game, plus they can fix all the issues with their characters (more so Jacob but Evie has some issues too). Also maybe they could put in Unity’s parkour?? Because for the love of God the parkour in Syndicate is the biggest downgrade to a game I’ve ever played
I think Edward had the best development in a single game
I've played every AC except Syndicate, and I think the characters that fall flattest are those that don't play as well to the Isu storyline and those that add too much modern sentiment in lieu of historically aligned sentiments.
Arno needed a second game to finish his arc. Dead kings was a tease of what he could be. He and the boy in dead kings would be a Kratos and aetrius role, the boy being his trainee and defacto son. He would deal with his grief in the midst of the napoleonic wars as he traveled around Egypt, Germany, and Russia even
I love the Ezio trilogy because it could insert humour and inside jokes with the community while still taking itself serious. Ubisoft kinda lost that by Syndicate.
I’ve always noticed that Everytime I started a new Assassins creed game it took me longer to get attached to the character than i did with ezio
I very much agree with this sentiment, and I think Ubisoft has taken note of this and is trying to rectify it... slightly.
I say slightly because, well, they announced several Assassin's Creed games this past year; all set in various locations, different time periods, and with new protagonists. However, with Assassin's Creed: Mirage, we're getting to understand a character more than we usually would nowadays.
We know the ending of Basim's story in Assassin's Creed: Valhalla, but now we're getting to know the full scope of his time within the order. This sort of development is quite rare for us considering only two prior Assassin's have had anything close to this level of intimacy/character development; i.e., Altair (Assassin's Creed, Assassin's Creed: Bloodlines, and Sections in Assassin's Creed II and Assassin's Creed: Revelations) and Ezio (The Ezio Trilogy, Assassin's Creed: Embers, and Assassin's Creed: China).