I ran into this once and desperately needed to scan something. Went and bought ink only to get home and.... it was out of color ink too. It needed both black AND color ink just to scan to a pdf. I was so livid I just threw the thing away. Also, I wasn't really "out of ink" - the ink cartridges had just expired.
Had a multifunction printer/scanner that would not let me scan with low ink once. I put painters tape on the cartridge where the ink level was detected. Printer thought the cartridge was full and then let me scan. Scanning worked just fine without ink... imagine that.
It is very typical to buy cartiges that are incompatible or third party disguised as official or even official that went bad and are still sold. This is the reason why I legit stay away from printers, but recently I came into a project where I need to print different cards so good luck to me for that I need to find a printing service from abroad to do this for me because the local ones are overpriced heavily.
Buy a brother laser jet printer . There like 200. Bucks.. this is the Model i use HL H3210cw Awesome printer . Ink last long long time and it excepts aftermarket cartridges.
You could accidentally scan the wrong document if the printer doesn't have our proprietary 100 dollar ink cartridge in it. How, you ask? Don't worry your pretty little head, dear customer. Just trust that we have your best interests at heart and something terrible could happen if that cartridge isn't in there.
If I remember it correctly, it is not just the case with HP, either EPSON/CANON all in one printer/copy/scanner also have that problem, I forgot which one. The problem was there since at least 2010. Resulting I never buy all in one again my entire life.
The biggest kick for them would be a court ruling "If someone needs an ink to scan on your printer, you should provide it, free of charge, on all affected models". Imagine their face when.
I'm no expert, but I'm pretty sure this issue is one that can be fixed with a firmware update. If that is the case, then I suspect that that is what HP will do if it looks like they're going to lose this lawsuit.
@@MrSaywutnow That's what they probably do when push comes to shove. It would be somewhat tedious to update ALL firmwares for all printers since time immemorial, but, you right, it would be cheaper. But we can dream).
Sure they make their markup on ink, but they could probably provide ink for every printer still operating and still not break the bank. Ink is stupidly cheap. Got a fair printer a while ago and get refills for 50 cents now. The guy who sells it marks it up several 100%.
It even gets better! One of my office HP printers was "deactivated" until I signed up for an "Instant Ink" subscription. I now prohibit the purchase of any HP product for my company. I hope they do get sued!
If you factory reset the printer you can use non instaink I was so angry when mine tried to pull that bullshit I about to take a bat to it. I got my printer for free lol
i got tired of wasting 60 dollars to make 2 prints every month. so i went and got a cannon. havent had a problem in over a year. granted ink jet vs laser printer prob also makes a difference. but the instant ink thing would come up. i think i had to click custom install or what ever to choose an option that said no.
Wish court cases like these could be over within 30 minutes because it looks blatantly obvious HP are in the wrong. After that they should be slapped with a fine big enough to not wanting to do it again.
They should be required to offer a free firmware update that restores the missing functionality, on top of a big fine and consumer compensation for a significant % of the price of each printer sold with this software lock in it.
This sort of stuff is called a Corporatism, which is just a nicer, sounding word than Fascism. Suing a corporation or loving fines against a corporation is worthless. Unless, and until people within those corporations are thrown in prison where they belong and have all of their ill-gotten gains confiscated, the American people will continue to get screwed blue and tattooed by these corporate gangsters.
@@Jangocat Not only that, but if in the future they want to discontinue creation of the ink for that particular model, it would then in fact force you to purchase another product to replace it since you cannot use any of the features of the device. That is not to say you would then make the conscious decision to purchase one of their products, but the options are limited and is a pretty good chance that end up with one of their devices again. This all to give them the ability to force consumers hands to either purchase in to avoid the purchase of another product, or to phase out products against the consumers desires both appear to be malicious in nature. While I understand their company has a desire for an increased revenue stream, creating an intentional artificial issue in order to fleece customers for money instead of simply producing products that generate a positive relationship with the consumer who then choose to spend money with your company of their own free will does in fact to me sound like something worth a lawsuit.
oh that we already had they then trigger a bug external and therefore get the data proof them wrong ? nearly impossible , since its useally a background system
i had a HP printer that needed ink yo fn scan, i drove over it, when i realized it needed $70 worth of ink that slowly degrades even if I dont use the printer portion. f HP, buy Brother
A 3d printer that ejects molten plastic in hundreds of different layers to create a three-dimensional object based off a digital model has given me far less frustrations than any HP printer I've used.
I never thought of that but you are right... I've never had an issue with my 3D printer once where I have to take apart my work HP printer at least once a week...
@@TechyBen Isn't that their automatic cartridge ordering option you need to sign into initially to activate some of their printers? It orders new carts when yours get low at their full HP retail price...
If their employee posts were ACTUALLY just opinions, then those employees would be able to post, with company accounts and on company time, anything they wanted (within the law). Political positions, diet tips, product reviews on other brands, the weather they're experiencing and whose fault the rain/sun is, flat-Earth conspiracies... - And they certainly would not be limited to using copy-paste scripts written by the company's lawyers.
My family and I were regular HP customers in the early 2000s. At one point we bought a brand new inkjet printer and put a cartridge in. It wouldn't print, so I took the cartridge out and put it in again. The printer now showed that the reinserted cartridge was empty and refused to print. A new cartridge was going to cost $50. I ended up putting the printer aside and figured I'd get back to it at some point. Then later I read that this was all part of their DRM ink cartridge strategy. The printer had recorded a serial number associated with my cartridge and to prevent me from refilling it, the printer was rendered inoperable with that particular cartridge. So there I was with a brand new printer with a full ink cartridge, yet was completely disabled from printing for good, until I bought a new cartridge. I didn't feel like spending hours on the phone with some company who stabbed me in the back, so I just let it go. But I vowed to never buy an HP product again. It's been about 15 years and I've held steadfast.
Thanks for letting me know this, now when my cartridge runs empty I will NOT take it out of the printer, I will just drill a hole on the top and fill it up with a syringe.
wife's prius had to have a full tank for the technician to replace the windshield which also seemed to prevent the car from starting the day it cracked (was able to bypass it easily once I figured out how...)
@@Fulmynato Oh God, I just remembered the BMW subscription seat heaters. Every damn company is trying to turn their product into a subscription service. It's disgusting.
I moved to another country with my HP all-in-one. Since I am printing, I used to buy the ink cartridges. In my new home, I was looking for my usual ink, but didn't find it. When I checked for printer model, I finally got the physically exact same cartridge with a different number. Installed at home - you guessed it already - a message popped up that I have to use original HP ink. Long story short, I called support and explained the case, he said that I would need to buy a new printer as the country code is different. This is to prevent cross-border sales. I said: OK, I gonna buy a new one! And I did. From Brother. No such BS there, works fine and I have Brother printer and All-in-one for last 10 years... No more HP products!
At this point I am surprised no company tried to advertise their all-in-one printers with: - can scan without ink or paper - can print B/W without color ink - can print color without B/W ink
My Brother all on one can scan and fax even if there is no toner cartridge. It can also print if there is no phone line for the fax function. But I doubt they go out of their way to advertise it.
@@gabetechinc True, you just don't get a solid black from overprinting CMY, even though that's theoretically what you should get. The combination of the three inks doesn't cover the entire spectrum perfectly. That's why they call it CMYK, where K is the black ink. Professional printing often also uses "spot colours" to give a richer tone than the combination of standard colour inks would produce.
"Will attempt to print no matter what the ink levels are." Sometimes you just need something that's legible and don't need every single color fully vibrant.
@@ZeroMercuri One of the valuable features of old dot-matrix and daisy-wheel printers was that they could still produce legible output even with a worn-out ribbon. It would just gradually fade out. You replaced it when you wanted to make a particularly good impression with a bold, black printing.
It's not a scanner, it's a scammer! Anyone else completely and utterly frustrated by the fact that every one of these class-action lawsuits against printer companies seem to go absolutely nowhere?
Or that the settlement seems to get paid off in "10% off your next purchase" coupons, meaning that the plaintiff actually PROFITS from the settlement: either the members of the class use the coupons, buying MORE stuff from the company that wronged them, or they don't use the coupons, meaning the plaintiff is only out the cost of printing.
Or do better research and don't buy them in the first place? I think HP should ship their printers with actual shit. If people still buy their crap, they deserve to suffer.
I had a printer that ran out of blue and refused to make black and white copies even though it had black ink. Printer companies are some of the worst scammers around.
@@oldogre5999The one I had had black separate and the three colors they mixed so there was four. Just some shady printer company stuff like selling a printer for $40 dollars and charging $40 per cartridge.
That's not a scam its part of the tech. The head is not separated on inkjet printers, so running it on empty will damage the device. On laser printers they cannot calibrate either, so you'd get comprimised quality.
We removed and replaced all HP peripherals from our Fortune 500 company GLOBALLY about 7 years ago. Imagine the Exec that HP garbage pissed off for us to invest such a huge amount of money just to REPLACE HP products. 😂
I killed piles of DeskJets back then. The things would get to a point where they just refused to feed paper (or feed 10 sheets at a time). Nothing could be done to change their minds about it short of changing the feed rollers every 2 years. 🙄 I'm just glad that we, as a society, have gotten to the point that printers are _almost_ obsolete.
Using as main printer HP LaserJet 1020 and works better than trains. As its laser there is way less problems. But latest smart ink scanner crap.. They are from Hell.
and they can also refuse to print if it runs out of one ink color "sorry i can't print your document in black and white because you're out of cyan ink"
Lol printer dont decide that. There's a level float in the cartridge. When not enough liquid to make it float it makes contact a th a metal strip causing a circuit etc etc. Lol
@@terryarmbruster9719 who cares? the product belongs to the person who bought it, not the company that made it. it should give a text message warning the user that it thinks the ink is low or that it needs cyan ink to print black or whatever, but then allow you to continue anyways, so you can decide whether or not its "inability" to print is bullshit. you should be allowed to at least try to print, even if it doesn't work because there's not enough ink, because a lot of the time there WILL be enough but it still wont let you.
I’m an IT professional and I used HP printers a lot in the past, they were really good. I stopped using or recommend HP printers to my clients many years ago, I estimate in the past 4 years I made HP lose many hundreds of printers in sale by steering everybody away from their printers. Maybe it doesn’t sound like much but I’m guessing there are others like me.
Same. The shop I worked for for years was going mainly Brother when I started, but we switched over to HP fairly quickly as we started getting asked more for colour lasers... I pushed for that, and we ended up being HP only for about 10 years. I started moving away from HP about 3 or 4 years ago too. We did get an HP at my church during Coronavirus but supply was part of that (and Pagewide seemed like a cool idea - unfortunately they appear to have stopped making those). I hadn't really thought about printers much until a few weeks ago when we had issues at work (not IT anymore) and I started looking at options to present to the boss... Epson had been running ads for their Ecotank in mobile games I'd been playing just before that, and after some research, it looks like I'm going to be an Epson fanboy for a while (both Ecotank and regular cartridge types appear cheaper to run than several competitors).
I use HP, but I use either refilled ink cartridges that I buy online, or refill the cartridges myself. Sometimes the refilled cartridges do not work due to the HP software, in which case I use the refilled ones.
All it takes is for politicians to be victim to this nonsense and mark my words they will go after these companies, demand that the IDIOTS coming up with these ideas are fired, and magically everything will be great
My wife runs a company and a few weeks ago the HP printer (maybe 1 year old) decided that the 3rd party cartridges were no longer accepted by them and the printer locked up. That was a serious hindrance for the business and on top of that the insulting attitude HP gave us trying to get it working. We refused pay the ransom they wanted to unlock it and just got a Brother. We are so done with HP's BS.
Remember in a Competitive market if they value your freedom of buying third party ink even though the printer cost more I be better off buying the expensive printer to get more freedom rather buying a cheap printer with evil drm on their system I rather see the companies who use DRM go in bankrupt and learn a lesson why you do not screw your customer s over this.
Always uncheck auto updates when installing! HP's latest firmware caused this! To make it even worse they do not allow you to go back to previous firmware. 😢
That's nice. Friends HP printer decided his legit, registered and working ink subscription "didn't exist" (I checked everything, everything worked, clicked print, it failed "no account" even though it printed accounts on the printer, showed on the drivers and showed on the website + showed all 3 were communicating and connected). I said "no fault no fix" and walked out. They never called back.
HP has been doing this for 20y already. What's worse is that when you eventually replace the empty cartridge, let's say the black one, and the color one is already low, during the initial sequence, the printer will flush both print heads with ink, leaving you with the possibility that the color cartridge will be drained because of it, so you'll still be unable to scan unless you also buy a new color cartridge. It's probably one of the biggest legalized scams ever. HP must have made billions off of their unfathomably loyal customer base...
This is why people need to switch to refillable tank printers. Cartridges are a scam and alwayse have been. Anyone who grew up with printer ribbon style "cartridge" printers knows this. Luckily you could usually get the ribbon printer cartridges reinked.
@@CK8smallville I know, I used to be a printer technician in a previous life. You can check if your printer driver has separate settings for black/white and grayscale. If you specify B/W, the printer shouldn't be using color ink. Grayscale is intended for printing fine graphics that look like black and white and adds color ink to the mix to be able to print in greater detail. B/W might also be called 'monochrome' in the settings.
@@skilletpan5674 I hear ya. The problem with ink jet printers is that print heads and ink are already specifically designed to work `optimally together`. If you take ink from other brands or the cheap refill stuff, you'll clog up the print heads in no time, if it already works to start with. It's kind of counter-intuitive, but in the long run it's actually cheaper to just buy the friggin' ink from the manufacturer. I've yet to come by any brand of ink jet printers where this isn't the case.
It is actually cheaper for me to replace my color laser printer from HP that I paid $254 for than to replace the toner cartridges inside of it. I figure I will just get a new printer every 5 years or so and it works out ok as I don't print that much. Stupid toner is $100 pop to replace the four inside of it. Inkjet printers were worse for me since I print so little it always needed to be cleaned when I turned it on depleting the ink faster. If I want a color photo I get it printed at walmart for a buck or so.
I'm currently being held hostage by the HP INSTANT INK program. (Don't get it!) They tried to tell me I should get 1000+ pages out of the cartridges and I laughed in his face. As an artist I'm printing full color pages and I get maybe 30 sheets. Because I'm in Canada it takes 2 weeks + for new ink to get to me from their US warehouse. I'm also not actually sent ink half the time as the printed will stop when one color runs out (my print is half printed with missing yellow and is unusable) but because the other ink levels are still not out - it warns me to not change the cartridge even though I can no longer print what I need to. The program is based on an allotted amount of prints (mine is 100 per month) and I'm unable to print this as I never have enough ink. There is a youtuber who cut a new ink cartridge open to see the ink levels - It's SUCH a scam. It's a slightly inked sponge in there. Maybe 5c worth of ink. HP needs to be cancelled.
Google, "reset printer cartridge ". It worked for me and my model. Former tech made a step by step video to reset the log on the cartridge. I get 2.5x's the pages now and replace it when it really is out of ink. Can you believe I was recycling cartridges that were more than half full? In an ironic twist, I actually spring for the real ink now because the quality is better.
in the old HP cartridge, like HP Deskjet 400 from the 90's they have a bag that either slowly shrunk or slowly inflate as we use it. and the ink are very concentrated. i remember print stacks upon stacks of spreadsheet on a single hp cartridge. apparently hp choose to copy canon and use sponge.. the sponge are always almost dry. but you can use syringe to refill it.
Try swapping to either a Epson 'Ecotank' (you fill the tanks yourself from bottles of ink... OR go Laser printer (toner cartridges LAST WAY LONGER and, often CAN BE refilled... WAY LESS HASSLES! 👍 😎🇬🇧
Its baffling how anti consumer a lot of companies have become after the 2000s, I used to like HP products too until I started experiencing issues like this one, or the one where the printers wouldn't accept refilled cartridges, but the real joke is on them because I then became anti HP and neither I nor my friends or family, have ever purchased HP products since the late 2000s.
Yeah, I never had issues that were anything like this with printers in the 90s and early 2000s. I even had a scanner that came with a free copy of photoshop. Things have changed.
HP started their ink cartridge shenanigans before the 2000s because I ordered half a dozen printers for work in 1998 right when they rigged their printers to play these tricks.
In 1997, I went to a computer conference which included a forum on refilling ink. HP cartridges used a balloon for pressure. Shortly before the conference, HP reengineered the cartridge so that if you used the best location to insert the ink needle, you would almost certainly puncture the balloon. The HP rep, of course, said it was to "improve the quality of the customer experience" NOT to improve the bottom line, and managed to keep a straight face. He refused to answer how it improved the customer experience of reinking.
So maybe this was the reason then why refilled cartridges never worked properly😮 I had the HP PSC 1410 back then and we bought refill kits to refill the cartridges. I remember at the beginning it worked with limited success but then it did not work anymore no matter how much ink I filled into it and no matter if tried to wipe the nozzles with alcohol to make sure it is not stopper because of dry ink. I got really frustrated and once I even cracked a cartridge open to realize the sponge inside it was filled with my ink, it just failed to work properly in the printer because how the cartridge was designed.
I've read about the same allegations with some printers in Australia. At least here (in Australia) we have a consumer protection clause called "fit for purpose". If an all in one printer and scanner can't scan without ink, then the product is not fir for purpose and the customer is entitled to a full refund.
can you buy those HP all in one printers in australia ? If the australian version does not have the "scan only when ink is present" limitation, it basically proves HP does it on purpose.
@@bschwand The HP Envy line of all-in-ones is available in Australia. So either this has passed completely under the radar because nobody has complained about it yet, or the units sold in Australia have different firmware installed so that it is compliant with Australian Consumer Law.
Austria here, have an OfficeJet 7612 because of the scanner... Have to buy a new printer because ink is empty, but will keep it as a scanner 🙂 Consumer Protection rulez!
@@bschwand OF COURSE they do! They read the letter of the law, during design of most any product nowadays, they break up the design to sell the parts piecemeal in a push for "function as a service." When they design the software to allow only the functions they must allow according to the vaguely written laws and the terrible consumer protections in the US, they essentially run roughshod over all of us until someone is pissed off enough to pursue litigation. Unfortunately, they can buy the services for much more expensive lawyers, so I don't anticipate this will result in much of anything except maybe a fat, quiet settlement outside of court. This is fast becoming the premier practice of companies. Game developers and DLC, John Deere and service packages, Cars and various trim packages, even youth sports are turning into "pay to play." It's as if some form of Satan woke up one day and said, how can we screw every single consumer out of the maximum amount of cash that we can get away with before we get our hands slapped? And when that happens...how do we purchase the government regulators in order to vote for policies that stop the hand slapping. It's disgusting and it is all targeted at making already bursting at the seams investors even richer and fatter!
The employee probably just took the whole answer as a text block from a support database, pre written by some law weasels. The main problem is see is why are they even talking about what the person posted there, they are trying to shoot or interpret the messenger but that doesn't change the message. If the person would have written "pretty pink unicorns" it wouldn't have changed the fact that the printer scanner combo shuts down completely if there is no ink inside. They should have asked "ok so if that statement is an opinion and not necessarily correct , then how do you fix the real existing problem that this device turns into a brick the moment there is no ink cartridge inside" They couldn't have done it because its not just an opinion, its a fact that is not affected by the person who states it.
Exactly, and even then it is completely bs as an employee is acting as an agent of the company and isn't expressing some random opinion about politics or the weather. But I see it is the normal game lawyers play in throwing stuff against the wall and seeing if it sticks.
@@rawrou moreso... likely has a long list of boilerplate messages to copy/paste to respond to them... which were written by slimy managers with approval from their slimy lawyers to allow the company to slip out of lawsuits.
That's not even to mention that as soon as you put ink into it, it needs to "calibrate" and spend half of your inks to make a useless "test page", forcing you to buy more ink sooner.
The nice thing about a lawsuit like this is that everyone involved...everyone..., from the Judge down to the court stenographer, has run into an issue just like this. Frantically trying to print something late at night, with a deadline looming in the morning, and the printer won't print your B/W document because the half-full magenta cartridge is reading low...or some other such scammy nonsense. And my guess is that they are all still pissed, lol.
i have a samsung C480FW all in one and it doesnt want to let you print in b&w if a color toner is empty, but i have managed to get it to do it by repeatedly trying to print and cancelling the warning. eventually it will print in b&w. luckily it takes knock off ebay toner carts that are dirt cheap ($60 for 1 black and 3 color) without any errors. not sure if they still do, the one i have was a $99 one day Frys special years ago.
it's cheaper to buy brand new printer from another company after such infuriating disasters. just check "customer reviews" about refilling new model before buying.
My HP printer has empty color cartridges and prints black and white, but you have to tell it to print in monochrome in the print setup. Not sure what your issue is.
Also, don't forget that even though you have ink in the device and you just use it for scanning, when you turn it on, it'll probably do its little head check and waste 5% of your ink even though you just wanted to scan with it.
Every time I turn off my hp printer for any reason, the printer insists on doing a "realignment" then uses my precious ink (that is evidently mixed with gold) printing out a page that then has to be scanned. Once twice or three times. $62 for a cartridge when the whole printer was $45. Crooks.
I hate multifunction devices and avoid getting them to the extent I am able. I especially hate HP products and will do without if HP is my only option.
HP can design combo printers not to scan without ink - and I can design my home to function without HP printer products. Shame because they used to have good products.
I used to know somebody that worked at HP labs. He said that they had a lot of problems evolving their printer software. Lots of legacy problems and IBM being a newcomer to that game was giving them a hard time.
I still firmly believe ink jet printers and ink are a scam. Forever use my B&W laser printer. If we need color, I'll go to my local print shop and support their business, but that's rare.
Pretty much yeah. Inkjets only work well if you use them all the damn time, which means you'll be spending a small fortune on ink. Unless off course you hack the cartridges to be refillable, which most people can't be bothered to do. A basic B&W laser printer is perfectly good for most office tasks, and will keep working flawlessly even if you only use it once a year. And on top of that the toner takes forever to run out. I had an Epson inkjet printer, and I HATED that thing. After a few years I could count myself lucky if it would print a few pages of text without first requiring a sizeable blood sacrifice to the spiteful ink gods.
I have a 10 year old B/W laser printer with the original toner, printing once every 6 months, and it still works flawlessly. Before that I had tried ink printers, and I agree, they are borderline scams, getting empty and drying up in a ridiculously short time. If somebody is asking me what kind of printer he/she should buy, I tell them to buy a laser printer unless he/she really-really needs to have color printing on a regular basis.
I bought an Epson all-in-one with the reservoirs for ink instead of cartridges, and it's been one of the best buys I've ever made. I've had it for 3 years, and have had to buy ink exactly once, costing me $5.77. HP can burn.
@@gorfgorf I've heard of that issue but it only seems to occur if you don't use your printer often enough and are always running clean cycles also there are some models where you can replace the sponge we had an ET-4700 it was mid for an ecotank printer I've come to the conclusion that a nice high-quality laser jet printer black only for home use is the best way to go and if you need to print in color just go to an office supply store and let them deal with the headache of repairs and maintenance
I just saw a video about the Epson all in one w/ink reservoirs. The scam is real in regards to ink cartridges. Now that I’ve seen your post, I’ll be buying it👍🏼
@@satin227 My brother B&W printer won't die! I've had it for years, only using the included special half cartridge that's included with the printer. It's really a totally different ball game compared to inkjet. Companies just need to stop being so greedy. My HP prints slowly but it's amazing quality. The ink is such a scam. Our reality - " Printers are great - if you don't use them often." :(
I remember when HP was run by engineers. Their products were the best you could buy. I've had DeskJets, LaserJets, and their computers. My whole business ran on HP. Now their products are crap, I 100% avoid them, and now they've gotten even worse as they do unnecessary stuff like this in order to nickle-and-dime people to death. Now I buy Brother and build my own computers for less.
Companies slowly tend towards soft-skill people at the top over time and end up with weaseling mealy-mouthed cost cutting trash because of it. Most if it comes back to public companies being legally forced to maximize shareholder value rather than the long-term interests and health of customers and the company. It is one of the worst legal decisions of all time. Lawyers and judges sure know how to stick their noses in things far beyond their comprehension and mess them up.
Something tells me that if they lose, the next model will automatically print everything you scan with the option of also saving a digital copy. That way, not only can they require ink to be present when scanning, they also burn through ink cartridges at alarming rates.
I took a look at a friend's HP that stopped working a few months back. Turns out, they were enrolled in some sort of HP subscription that sends them ink. I eventually figured out that their CC tied to the account became expired and the entire unit was disabled. Took me a while to figure out because I never thought in a million years a company would be allowed to even do that.
That's wild, sounds like I made a good choice to avoid hp instant. I didn't want my head to go oh 10 cents everytime I click print, just wanna do it without thinking. Dividing $50 (for the 4 bottles) by 6,000 the stated output of epson ecotank bottles is less than 1 cents per page. Hp instant ink is like a huge scam with a giant markup.
I'm basically *THE* computer guy in my area. I have advised hundreds of people just in the past year that they should never buy HP printer products again. I've been moving them to Epson EcoTank and Brother MFC laser and ink tank printers as the HP printers become problematic. Even without the cartridge nonsense, you're lucky if your HP printer works at all. People with 10+ year old HPs that work get firmware updates turned off and I tell them to hold on to them as long as possible.
The Eco Tank is excellent but if a jet gets blocked ignore all the "advice" about unblocking it. Simply blow through the tube connected to the jet. If that fails, squirt distilled water through it.
Probably the best decision my family made was switching from HP printer/scanner with cartridges to a Brother one that uses refillable built-in ink compartments. Around 2 years ago, my family decided to open a watchmaker workshop and with that came the need to print a lot. Around the same time, our 5 year old HP printer/scanner broke down. So we had an option to spend around 50$ for a new HP printer or buy a more reliable Brother scanner that cost us around 250$. My family was pretty sceptical about the idea of buying such an expensive printer, but i was like *It's higher quality, more reliable and despite the price, we'll save up way more on ink than with HP" As of today, it was a good decision on our side. Despite the sheer amount of paperwork needed to be printed out on a monthly basis, after 2 years we still haven't ran out of ink we received with the Brother printer, when after calculating, we would have to buy a brand new set of HP cartridges every month, which would cost us roughly 50$ every time. We have saved around 1200$ over those 2 years and all we did was buying a more expensive printer.
A Brother came with a business I bought about a year ago. Probably do about 30 prints a day and I don't think the ink level in the compartments has moved at all.
@@yd8104 It probably did move at least a bit. I myself will have to buy more ink in a few months. Here's the deal tho, Brother doesn't scam you on ink, at least not with those refillable printers. HP has a plethora of scams just so you have to buy more overpriced cartridges: -using of color ink in black and white prints so you run out of it faster -DRM chips that prevent you from using non-HP cartridges or refilled ones in your printer -programmed limit on how much you can print with a single cartridge, meaning that usually you end replacing still half full cartridges
After making several attempts to use my HP printer to only print black (which is all I've ever needed it for) it continued to tell me that brand new cartridges that you could audibly hear were full of ink - were empty. I found that the cartridges never actually survey ink level, they just count how many pages were printed in general. Even though my default settings were "Black Ink Only" and all color was turned off, it continued to ask for new cartridges. I hate the waste of all that perfectly good ink, and much worse, I despise the principle of the matter that HP tries to control you with products you purchased for yourself and wrongfully cons you into purchasing more unnecessary ink cartridges. I ended up destroying the printer beyond recognition with a hammer and considered shipping the mangled mess to HP just for S&G but just needed it out of my sight before I had a stroke over it.
There's an often-hidden setting for "rich black" that has to be disabled, or the printer will use all four colors to print black in order to make the black print darker. (Black-only ink prints tend to be dark-gray and not actually "black.")
Probably because they sell the printers dirt cheap. My family never had a printer and I've only bought one years after moving out. I bought an HP printer because I didn't know any better, because if you've never heard of their scumbaggery, it seems like a good deal. I still have it and hate it with a passion. At one point I looked up if their CEO lives nearby, because I wanted to throw that thing into his yard.
Many other choces beside HP. I will not buy HP because of stuff like this. IBM once ruled the PC market and doing stunts like this caused them to dissapear from that market.
@@ChemEDan He's way overthinking things. His rules seem so arbitrary too. Ethical responsibility based on how much use he gets out of the machine? Never heard of such a convoluted code of ethics.
I bought an HP 6100 all-in-one in 2002, at full retail. Years later, when I decided to abandon the inkjet printer for laser, I too was infuriated to find I could no longer use the scanner because of the empty print cartridge. I eventually took the once expensive, now useless machine to the local thrift store. So, HP, that was it. I’ve never bought an HP product since and I’m finished with you forever. My “new” Fujitsu scanner does the job you wouldn’t let me do with a machine I paid for. Asinine policy. Idiotic corporation.
I lost the CD with the drivers and could never get the printer to work with the next Windows version. There was also no online update so that was the end for me. Never looked back at HP, think I still have a laptop of their design and a monitor, both terrible.
At the same time they brag about being good to the environment. The contrary is true. If you build durable machines people like to use you can be proud.
Took mine to the gravel pit and rebuilt it with a 30-06. Very satisfying. No more HP for me. Edit. There is some video of an unhappy soldier in the sand box rebuilding his units HP all in one with an M60
Completely agree Louis. We need a high-profile lawsuit to put a stop to this shady practice from all companies. I have used HP printers since their first laser printers. Up until now I have been happy with them and have recommended them. My latest acquisition was an HP7740 All-In-One. Not only does it refuse to print black only when low on any colour, a recent software update demands that I have an HP account to scan. I don't want an HP account and I would like to know what data such an account would harvest and what it is used for?
@@AndMod Have to agree with you given how many class action lawsuits related to ink HP has paid out on. At least in a few of them the judges went further and enjoined them from continuing the practice and I believe that includes not being able to refill the cartridges beyond allowing them to void the warranty for doing it.
If people want to stop a company from doing things like this, they need to be sure the news of the lawsuit is picked up by the media and spread widely. If no one knows about the lawsuit, there's no reason to stop the practice.
@@peterclarke3020 If any judgement is just a single fine then NO company will stop whatever the practice is. Most major companies just factor in the fines as cost of business. Bc the fine is like maybe once every couple months to maybe once a year. With it NOT being based on the amount of times it's done or overall profits. So miniscule and not worth them actually fixing it. If it started reasonable for smaller businesses but then double PER offense and double again PER immediate to reasonable period repeats. Maybe they would do something. At least to break it up. Just like rich aholes where if a penalty ios just s standard fee amount instead of scaled off income/net worth then it's only for the poor. No rich person cares about even a dozen $100 fines when they make that much a minute, passively.
I used to be an HP printer technician and seeing this video surprises me. Not only have normal every day people been affected by this but actual businesses like doctors' offices and government agencies. When I would deliver them their ink/toner (yes, some toner based MFPs would do the same thing) they would ask me why it does that and I knew why and always recommended that they switched to either a Canon or Lexmark printer so they can use their printers. HP isn't making a profit off their printers like they used to so they're trying to gouge as much from the ink as possible. Edit: I made a booboo in my sentence
@@cherryjuice9946probably depends on the type, i use a canon laser and 2 of the cartridges are empty, still keeps printing, it complains but still prints (color still works as well, eventually it will fully run out, but the printer doesnt care)
Both these companies are known to do this just as well, they lose money on Inkjets to make up the sales in ink so they use these types of tactics to get money just like other tactics that just keep getting worse. I try and push people who need printers into laser jets or if they want cheap at least try and get a device that's more open to easily allowing you to use your own type of ink cartridges or the refill types but sadly that's becoming even harder as time goes on.
HP is the rolls Royce of printers, every time it starts up it uses ink "to clean itself", it uses unnecessary ink to empty the cartridge quickest so you can buy buy buy
@@adelphus515And the price of the HP ink is the price of a new printer, I could only afford getting the black cartridge that cost me more than a quarter of the printer's price, put that in yo pipe and smoke it.
I was a HUGE HP fanboy for decades. I would only buy HP calculators (48GX got me through my BSEE), computers, and printers. Then I got sick and damn tired of my inkjets breaking after about 2-yrs of medium-duty use. Parts always cost more than just buying a new printer. And of course the new printer would require a different printer cartridge than the spares I had on hand. So the former cartridge supply would be a total waste. Bought a Brother color laser printer, and love it way more than any HP I ever had. I've divorced HP for good.
Canon is the same thing. When my mother passed away I popped the cartridges out of her printer and put them in bags so they wouldn't dry out (or leak inside). A few days later, I needed to scan some family photos while at her house and the "scanner" refused to do it without the carts installed. I _think_ my similar model Canon will scan with _empty_ carts, but not NO carts.
This is why I have the simplest black and white printer possible it may not be flashy but it always works/there is not much that can go wrong with it. I gave up my fancy printer when I was trying to print a black and white resume the morning of a job interview and it wouldn't print because it was out of yellow ink. I find it ironic that the printer manufacturers destroyed their business for years because of their greed.
Well he forgot fax, that's a very important function, so his numbers were technically off. Also I love how people on support forums completely don't answer questions, like the dude who has the little "hp support agent icon" says in his post blah blah blah without the cartridge the printer will not "print", nobody asked if it could print. Support agents are retarded, well that or google translate is retarded, who knows, who cares.
@@babbagebrassworks4278 so glad someone came to my rescue on that one. I could a swore they technically did something else than just fax, scan, print, maybe email? Ehh
I worked in the industry for years, not at HP. Talked to many guys who worked for HP and previously worked for HP. A very long time ago they produced high quality reasonably priced products. Then a new CEO came in who only cared about profit margins and shareholder value. A ton of policy changes came by over the years. Most of the quality people got fed up and left for better jobs. Now HP makes mostly overpriced junk. Am sad to hear they made a scanner than requires ink, but also not surprised. It fits in their motif now. It was Meg Whitman, who is now an American ambassador to Kenya.
Hard to believe all the excellent analytical equipment, laser printers, plotters, and flatbed scanners came from HP given the shady practices they've used for a couple decades now
@@SomeoneNone123 If I had to guess it's probably an installation thing. Personal favorite is the "environment setting" that automatically disables two sided printing(don't think that was an HP but just about punched a solid metal door).
Got tired of ink jet plugging so went looking for a laser printer. First criteria was didn't require an account to print, or indeed an internet connection to print. That immediately eliminated the most problematic brands.
I worked for Compaq when they were taken over by HP. In the first 2 mins of the video explaining the takeover the new CEO said “you will learn to love ink” my contract expired a week later and I walked.
I had one of those HP's- they scammed me for months charging for ink cartridges they never sent, then when I noticed and made them stop, the friggin scanner stopped working. Incredibly infuriating and I threw it in the garbage and will never touch another HP product.
ESG responsible company - integrity & accountability & operating responsibly & sustainably; the climate change & betterment of society statement, yet ignoring the purpose of ESG for .... Maybe a tree pops up once it's buried at landfill site.
I was warned Brother does the same thing, so I bought a Cannon. Sadly, the Cannon did the same thing, and even much worse. It routinely would dump ink and would pretend it must do that to "clean the heads". However, it does that when you plug brand new cartridges in, so they aren't really cleaning anything, just dumping my expensive ink. ( I had an old printer from the 1990's that never behaved like that, and same print quality, so I doubt it's necessary to dump all the ink for head cleanings). On the Cannon, it didn't matter if I never printed a single page, the printer would burn through all colors in about 3 months. That was over $100 of ink, and not a single page printed. Do that several times a year and you'll hate Cannon as much as HP. Also, their customer support is just as bad as what was displayed by this HP employee.
@@cherryjuice9946 I remember when you had to tell the printer to clean the heads after it started printing with missing lines, and when you had to do manual color alignments...
When I consider a product these days the first place I go is the company's help page. Forget reviews, or any other thing that can be misleading, the best way to judge a product ,as well as a company, is to investigate how their service resolution is done.
I remember when I couldn't get my printer to print using only black and white when one of the color cartridges ran out and hp support told me that even though I just wanted to use only the black cartridge that it was designed in such a way that all cartridges must have ink in order to run, looks like theyre taking that argument to the next level when it comes to the scanning function. I could only imagine the outrage if a car manufacturer made vehicles that would refuse to start if it runs out of window washer fluid lol
Even when you print in black and white, it still mixes a little color into the black each time. I printed a ton of pages in black and white one time and watched the color levels drop every few pages.
@@darek4488 thats slightly different because the AD-Blue (DEF) is an emissions requirement, and usually they will start but the vehicle is in a severe limp mode
I remember my dad buying an hp deskjet 500c back in the early 90s. It was amazing compared to the old dotmatrix printer we had. It was so quiet in comparison and had much better print quality. Even back then the on brand cartridges where way over priced but there where so many options for 3rd party ink back then. I was able to print loads of stuff out for school without worrying over how much it would cost. Since ink drm kicked in things have gotten much worse. I hope HP burns.
somewhere about that time, my family purchased a printer for our new AIO pc. i forgot which brand we got, but we basically boiled it down to look at the price for ink cartridges. at the time, ink cartridges actually varied in price depending on the brand you go for. so obviously, we went for the printer with the cheapest cartridges. 2 or 3 replacements later, we found an ink refiller kit, which we tried out. it worked maybe 2 times, then the sponge that holds the ink got super dry. at that point, the cartridge started leaking all over the place, so replacement was needed nowadays, when i looked at printers since i kinda needed one, i see all the cartridges are practically the same price, regardless of brand. which now just makes me not want one at all
I just hope more people see this. I refuse to buy any HP or Apple products and have done so for a number of years. I hate companies that practice this type of blackmail with product design that ties you into their exclusivity. I much prefer open source products where individuals can get involved and applications and accessories are available from multiple sources. 👍
Open source and HP printers are still a problem. They depend on a web-based configuration (cups) that is intentionally unclear about problems and requires a per machine installation of drivers and activation of the printer using it's internal unique id number.
well thats only 1 way , but what if it fails we need new laws for a new time - that laws that dont go in favor of a company - also that are not small companys they are big and they have money, that makes 1 reason more not to allow this
I already don't consider Apple because of their walled garden software model. Repair issues (what Louis' videos are usually about) are only the cherry on top.
As a former HP tech support. We are trained to respond in verbatim for concerns regarding the scanning feature w/o ink. This is how they packaged the AiO and unfortunately it is not mentioned on the box.
It would be a good idea to subpoena the design specs and the software development team emails, notes and testing to see EXACTLY what was planned and developed.
I'm sure security concerns would block that motion almost immediately, well unless the judge was willing to review in-depth then heavily redact them, but you never know. This issue might have annoyed the judge at some point, just don't tell HP that lol.
its blatantly obvious. the chip in the cartridge completes system check and if system check complete then machine can be in the "ready" state. technically you should be able to bypass it. or edit the rom to not do the check
A laser printer makes much more sense for occasional home use. We used to have an inkjet printer at home and every time someone needed to print anything, the printer wouldn't work because the ink had dried out and clogged the print head.
I agree. I do very little home printing. When I used inkjet printers, the ink always dried out or clogged the jets, so it was costing $$$ to replace barely used but dried out ink. I switched to a Canon B&W laser printer/scanner and it's been flawless for years. It took me 5 years to go through the small laser toner cartridge that it came with.
No no, it’s fine. Just put in a new ink cartridge that’s the cost of the printer itself and after the “cleaning” process it will need to be replaced immediately yet again.
Worked retail and we sold lots of printers, its actually cheaper to just buy a new printer everytime it runs out of ink... we basically always had cheap HP printers on sale for $29.99 sometimes as low as $19.99, that included ink, while the replacement ink was $49.99+. Another thing is that even if you did buy extra ink and not open it, they had chips that would prevent them from working after the arbitrary best before date, I learned that because we had to check the dates on the packaging constantly to make sure we did not sell a perfectly fine ink cartridge that would not work due to being over the best before date.
I just clean the print head. Managed to clean one that hasn't been used in about 4 years cause it was clogged. It was still a pain in the ass, but doable. If they'd just design them better in general then I wouldn't have 3 unusable ones sitting on a table because one ran out of GRAY INK and the other 2 ran out of cyan or something. Like seriously why the hell does it require gray ink
What I did when the umpteenth jet ink printer at home stopped working because of dry ink or something, is buying a brother laser printer and a canon scanner. I think having the two functions separated as devices is better. A dedicated scanner is better to keep near the desk / PC and the printer in the living room because nowadays most documents are available on phone and can be sent to print over wifi. Bonus, I got a lot of laser printer for free because some people have no idea how to troubleshoot, most times it was just something that got stuck in the paper tray.
I mostly agree. But personally I prefer Epson scanners. Canon is very restrictive with their specifications. Usually that means the scanner will be obsolete before it has decent support on Linux and it may lose function at any time due to obscure bugs and the developers hating those devices. I have had/witnessed technical problems with Canon devices in ALL price classes (20 bucks up to 20 mega bucks).
It would be great if every manufacturer started writing the cost of required maintenance, spare parts/refills and their planned lifespan for the device, showing actual interest in customer satisfaction instead of the BS they currently do But when they eventually lose this case, they will probably just go "oh sorry, we can't do an firmware update to fix this, it has to be sent in" despite HP presumably filling the onboard flash with software to detect third-party ink cartridges and what ink serial numbers are banned
The best thing I did was take my printer and throw it off the balcony to its demise in a billion pieces (of course nobody was in danger of that!) The printing & ink industry is a huge SCAM.
HP makes big bucks on selling the ink cartridges. It only cost HP less than a dollar which they sell for $30 or more. I remember when HP was giving away printers knowing they will get their money back in spades sell the cartridges. I bought a Canon laser printer years ago and have printed thousands of labels and document and only had to replace the cartridge twice
HP is Printer Apple. They are the poster child for the dystopian evil corporation. I banned the brand from my household when they brought out the subscription printing model... but I already had the printer, so I kept it. But I literally had to buy new cartridges every other time I wanted to print... which is a great way to plug your subscription ink service! I now have an Epson Eco-tank that came with a full LITER of ink. I've had it for like 9 months and I'm not even close to empty, despite printing many times more than I did on the HP (because the ink was so prohibitively expensive). And if your ex wanted the printer, she would have gotten it.
That is why I have Brother all in one printer/scanner/copier with separate ink tanks that I can refill individually. Works very well, no issues at all 3 years and counting! Never had any issues like this!
I hate my Brother! If I want to print in black, I need all the colours to print. If Im low in anything, once I turn the printer on and it initialises or whatever, the low ink gets used up (even if say 1/4 left).
Yeah I bought the 710 model a week or two ago. seems ok for the price. Scans are ok quality as well. There's also canon and epson that do ink tanks. I'm sure there's more but companies like HP are boneheads and they'll refuse to change because they have a loyal user base who'll just keep using them like lawyers etc.
@sjsz06 there are no reports online or in the brother documentation that suggest or state a requirement for ink. Only a low ink/refill when printing message. The trouble shooting page for "i can't print" makes no mention of low/no ink.
I had an HP 3-in-one that worked fine as a scanner with empty ink cartridges for several years. And then about 3 years ago, after a software update, it ceased to function without a new cartridge. I am happily printing now with my Xerox laser printer and separate Canon scanner. HP can go pound sand.
Yeah, thats also why I try to never let my accessories update unless there is a clear need. Possible security risk, but in my experience (example, Bioshock on Steam) if someone had worked for literal years and a patch can’t actually say what the improvement is, its better to NOT update.
A similar situation for me. I print with my Samsung laser printer & scan with my old ink-less Canon 3-in-1. Thank you Canon for making printing, scanning & photocopying independent functions
Got a HP printer like that, but either it is too old or running on different drivers that i haven’t run into this issue. Printer is very picky when it want print properly so at some point i redownloaded its driver from the HP website and seems to fixed it. After many years, i think the gears got out of sync and gives me a “paper stuck” message until i push back on the gear that is sticking out. Scanner still working great.
A few years back, Lexmark printers had a date stamp embedded in their toner cartridges. If the toner had no been fully used by a certain time, the printer refused to function until the toner cartridge was replaced, whether empty or not. An interesting ploy to force users to continue buying consumables on rarely used devices.
While we talk about Lexmark: my laser printer had cost about 350€. After a couple of years the power supply failed. I called them and asked for repair options - they graciously offered to give me an estimate for 400€ - just the estimate, repair will cost an undisclosed amount on top. Next day I drove that thing to the dump and ordered a comparable Brother laser printer for about half that amount. I had this Brother printer for more than twice that time now, I'm not looking back.
I'm with you, HP should take a considerable loss, and either be forced to roll out firmware update to remedy it, Or risk getting sued again. Side note: I really enjoy the calm commentary, but now my YT, PC, and TV's volume is at a level that would wake my neighbor if I play a video from another creator.
I had a Kodak printer years ago that REFUSED to print in black and white when I had plenty of black ink because one of the color cartridges was low (not empty, and not needed for b&w). These companies are evil.
I still remember when I found out that printer companies do often make the ink cartridge amount left readings purposefully quite inaccurate. It can say you are essentially out of whatever particular ink, but you in fact still have pages and pages of that Ink left. Best thing you can do, assuming your printer let's you, if it's says your out, override and keep printing until you can notice it actually is out, usually comes in the form of light color or inaccurate colors.
meanwhile police says : alexa is already storing your data at amazon oh really at amazon so and why the police said so ? amazon is a company not the police
Printers usually estimate ink levels based on print volume and percent of each page being printed, as there's no realistic way to measure the ink level directly short of weighing it with a scale that works at the microgram/picogram level, which would cost way more than the printer. So, they're always overestimating just off that, and that doesn't even get into the financial incentive to be even less accurate.
@@OddlyIncredibleThey could also simply use a light based sensor inside the printer. That's what I always assumed they were doing. But, I accept the premise that it's generally by page counts. I don't think it's quite that simple though.
@@AshiStarshade Some printers did/do use optical level sensing (and I had an old Brother inkjet like 15 years ago that did this - faking it out on remaining ink levels was a simple case of putting tape over the level sensor), but that's pretty rare because it's a lot more expensive to implement an optical sensor/detector versus a cheap EEPROM/NVRAM chip that can hold a number read from and handed to it by the printer's controller.
@@OddlyIncredible also it makes it more tamper proof as you said and I would also think it allows the printer company to know more precisely how much "ink" is in each card they're selling making statistics easier
Something like this happened to me years ago. I can’t remember if it was an HP or not, but I realized I could not use the scanner without ink. So I wrapped everything back up, stuffed it in the box, and took it back to Best Buy to return it. I don’t play that game. I don’t like being forced into stuff just for the sake of profit, especially with how much of a scam printer cartridges are.
It's cases like this that make me wish courts sued for a PERCENTAGE not a gross sum - i.e. suing the company say fifty million sounds decent, but they can take that - suing them for say 10% of their yearly earnings is a whole other ballgame
I think they should actually have to give whatever they received fraudulently back. Just like you were I would. I don't understand why these corporations get a fine but don't have to return the stolen goods. Basically this is theft. They're stealing our money by forcing us to have ink and a scanner when we don't need it. They should have to return a percentage of their cartridge sales. We've got to stop letting these companies keep their stolen goods. They have to return them and then get fined on top of it.
This is a lawsuit from the consumer, so it's not going to be a significant judgement unless it's turned into a class-action suit. What we need is some law declaring this deliberate sabotage, with _criminal_ penalties.
They abso-bloody-lutely should get in trouble for this. I don't know what's more ridiculous: the fact that a scanner needs ink to function, their lame excuses in court, or the fact that we need a damn court to bring attention to this in the first place.
The very same happened with me also many years ago: No ink = no scanning. My verdict with 86 billion braincells as the jury: I'm never again in my life buying any product with the brand HP or related. Working as an IT consultant for some companies and also for many friends, this has a little bit more impact, than one would anticipate. I am even avoiding Keysight test equipment in my electronic labs, they used to be once Agilent, and HP earlier. Not sure how these companies exactly related now, I'm lazy to look up, but if only one milligram of the parent company's business mentality has been inherited, it's a good, well-founded decision.
@@dwschout All the EcoTank EPSONs purchased the past few years are using ink from bottles, the ink is dirt cheap, and no problems (theoretically impossible to block) using any other brand of ink.
@nick066hu Also if you think it's impossible to block, then you aren't aware of print nozzle tolerances. They design the printhead to take a specific type of ink and to clog, or simply run straight through, if it's off by too much of that variance.
@@dwschout the nozzle has to be some size , right? what this has to do with greedy deliberate blocking, with engineer-hours, know-how spent on squeezing everything out of the unsuspecting customer ? Btw. I witnessed printing of thousands of square meters during years with all kind of inks, I remember using at least four different brands of inks, even brandless bought in gallons from china.
@nick066hu so because you got lucky then that negates the literal thousands people went through because of the cheap inks? The fact that all of reality disagrees with you should be enough to show you are exaggerating. How many printheads had to be replaced across all that printing? Was it printed on 20# all purpose paper, or even worse recycled, or was it on specialty paper?
I had an HP printer that had separate black and color cartridges. The color cartridge went low but I could not print with black ink only until the color cartridge was replaced. That was the last HP device that I purchased.
I had this problem also. Like if you have a paper due for college or whatever you should be able to print the paper in black-and-white if the paper doesn't need color charts or photos. Now I have a Brother B&W laser printer and it's better and more economical.
I vowed never to buy another HP printer ever again after I found out that the reason my printer was always out of yellow ink was because they print yellow under the black on black and white print jobs. The printer wouldn't print black and white if the yellow cartridge was empty.
In courtrooms where justice and truth entwine, A lawsuit against HP, a story does shine, Over a scanner that demands ink to run, Their defense, they claim, is second to none. The plaintiff's frustration, it's plain to see, A scanner that's held them in legal decree. For when ink runs dry, the device turns cold, Leaving their documents left untold. HP's defense, they boldly declare, Is a tale that seems utterly rare, They argue it's about quality, not a scheme, To profit from ink in this scanning regime. Their scanners, they say, are designed with care, To ensure every scan is pristine and rare. Ink ensures clarity, a standard upheld, In every document, every story, it's spelled. Yet, the plaintiff contends, it's a ploy to entwine, Consumers in a cycle, a costly design. To sell more ink, to increase the sale, While the scanner's demand feels like a travail. In this legal battle, a question so grand, Do they seek quality or profits at hand? The courtroom awaits, the verdict's suspense, In the clash of principles, where arguments commence. In this tale of technology, ink, and dispute, A lesson emerges, one not to dilute, The balance of profit and the consumer's plight, In the world of commerce, where ethics take flight.
@@Hulkeq2corporations are the worst of people. You take any individual person in any position of any big corp and make them take a moral decision, they almost always will take the correct one. Take the corp you drew those people from, and suddenly they will always take the worst route possible.
HP has done this forever I once owned a plotter printer and the one thing I remember from that experience is never upgrade your firmware never attach it to the network always print from a USB key and that's it if it works fine when you print it don't upgrade it in any way shape or form
I can't wait to see the outcome of this lawsuit. Keep up the good work Louis! You are a man of honor and integrity and the world needs more men like you!
I ran into this well over a decade ago; the answer is Linux. Simple Scan works no matter what, HP, Samsung, Epson, Lexmark, etc. I've even used a paperclip to fool the printer into thinking there's a ink cartridge present so I could use the fax function.
You shouldn't have to do this to use a product you bought especially if it is not the printer. Although nice trick. I decided to go to epson Eco tank printers and I never regretted the change!
The linux drivers for both HP and Brother are so much better than Windows, when the spooler has an error i can actually go figure out what the error is and get my print to work rather than just sitting there and looking at useless window panes that tell me nothing.
I have 2 HP all in one printer/scanners running under Linux Mint. One runs happily with Linux Simple Scan, but with the other it will not connect, so I have to use the old xsane program for scanning, I don't know why, but it works!
My HP LaserJet M1120n MFP (purchased in 2008) has been fed "compatible" (cheap) cartridges all it's life and it's still going strong. If possible they'll bury it with me...
I switched to laser because of the price of liquid ink and how few printouts they provide. Sure, a toner cartridge seems expensive but it will printer several reams of paper where an ink jet will only printer around 100 sheets if you’re lucky.
The revolt hasn’t and won’t completely die out. Those of us who’ve been cheated by these companies refuse to buy from HP again (and other companies that display this greedy behavior). It isn’t much but it’s a start!
HP have always been the most expensive to replace the ink cartridges. I advise anyone who asks me about printers, NOT to buy HP cos of their refueling costs. As a printer, they appear to work fine, but the price of the ink cartridges is absurd for what is actually in the little thing!
I just recently got rid of an HP Officejet 6600. While it was a great quality printer, almost every time you booted it up it would run this maintainance task. I understand that printers do that and use the ink to lubricate the rails and such but this would go on for 15+ minutes all the while I could literally hear it dumping out ink inside the printer. Not a shocker that it needed new cartridges almost every 3 weeks. When I finally got rid of it I had a look inside and I saw this little area to the right, kind of similar to a laser printer maintenance box, that was just filled with years of wasted ink. Certainly not being used to lubricate anything. Replaced it with a Canon inktank and havent looked back. 1,000,000 times better than the HP.
I have a Canon Pixma that seems to waste ink like that. I didn't know canon released a tank printer. I thought Epson was the only one that has done that. Interesting.
I just stopped buying printers. Last All-in-one I bought from Canon required an ink change when we never used the printer, it appeared to be on a timer. They chipped the cartridge so you can't just flip out the same cartridge, you have to use a new one, while the old one is still full. Then the printer broke. I'm DONE!
This is just proof of the point that if you do not address these problems early then companies only get more abusive with their tactics. They should have been sued when they made it so you could not print black and white when any of the color ink cartridges ran out. When I even think of an HP printer, the “Office Space” movie plays in my head.
I agree but there was a good reason for government interests to overlook this because yellow ink was used for a special fingerprint encoding. (think a yellow noise pattern that can actually be decoded to determine a unique serial-number like code associated for that particular printer) I'm sure there are better stenographic techniques now.
I addressed the problem two decades ago. They continued like nothing happened. Well, I didn't go to court just abandon their printers / office combos. Especially sad because Hewlett Packard was once the greatest company and awesome customer support.
That can't print black without color ink isn't even the worst thing hp does. If you install a brand new full cartridge into an hp printer and you take it out and put it back in the printer will refuse to accept the cartridge again even if it's full and never been used.
I just got my hands on an old Canon printer that is widely still supported by the aftermarket ink community. I don't know what else to call them so I'm just going to call them that. And I have a third party ink cartridge on the way right now. I'm never going to have to pay ink prices for ink again
Wait for the Canon to self destruct itself after some time over the warranty period. After years of using Canon's I've decided to throw them out because they all stopped working after ~2 years. Got a Brother s/w laser and I'm more than happy with it.
@@VioFax Having said that, people are used to loss-leader prices on printers, which the manufacturers make up for by scalping you on the ink. Lots of people will just look at the basic price and a Brother is three times the price. Thankfully, I can just use my work photocopier for things like this, and Adobe Scan works well for most stuff nowadays.
@@rtbear674 there is no software to update. It was just a driver that I got off of a third party website and it just works running it in Windows 7 compatibility mode
I know one thing for a fact. I will never again spend a penny with HP. And it's exactly for ridiculous reasons like this. I've got brother and Epson equipment that all works great but I've got two HP printer scanners in the closet that are complete junk. Never again
As an IT pro (system engineer), one of the easiest thing we can prove is how cheaper it always is to replace a HP printer with literally anything else.
It's cheaper to buy a new HP color laserjet printer than it is to buy toner for one. I'm reading from HP's website right now: HP Color LaserJet Enterprise M455dn costs $539. The replacement toner for yellow, cyan, magenta, and black adds up to $897.96. How psychotic is that? Make it make sense.
@@OuroborosChoked you will get half (or less) filled toners (starter pack) with your new printer. But yes it seems they don't make much profit on the printers, as they are only the means to sell you toner and ink.
@@OuroborosChoked New ones have 1/3 to 1/2 cartridges. They usually say how many pages. I always make a spreadsheet for printers to determine the purchase cost AND the cost per page for colour and mono. The replacement cartridges cost per page can vary wildly, even at the same printer price.
Thank God that the UK is groundbreaking and looking out for consumers around the world, with their recent RIGHT TO REPAIR legislation. The law will require manufacturers to make spare parts available for electrical appliances within two years of all model launches. That includes all electronic personal devices such as cell phones, laptops, tablets, etc. i.e. no more hardwired batteries. Clearly breaking the manufacturers' game that electronics are disposable as soon as something goes wrong, reducing electronic waste, and consumer gouging - a new $800 cell phone because a $1 component fried.
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I ran into this once and desperately needed to scan something. Went and bought ink only to get home and.... it was out of color ink too. It needed both black AND color ink just to scan to a pdf.
I was so livid I just threw the thing away.
Also, I wasn't really "out of ink" - the ink cartridges had just expired.
It's a fucking scam
This just happened to me like a month or two ago, I was so pissed! It's crazy how they play us like this..
Had a multifunction printer/scanner that would not let me scan with low ink once. I put painters tape on the cartridge where the ink level was detected. Printer thought the cartridge was full and then let me scan. Scanning worked just fine without ink... imagine that.
It is very typical to buy cartiges that are incompatible or third party disguised as official or even official that went bad and are still sold.
This is the reason why I legit stay away from printers, but recently I came into a project where I need to print different cards so good luck to me for that I need to find a printing service from abroad to do this for me because the local ones are overpriced heavily.
Buy a brother laser jet printer . There like 200. Bucks.. this is the Model i use HL H3210cw
Awesome printer .
Ink last long long time and it excepts aftermarket cartridges.
a bit surprised HP didn't lean into "you need ink to scan for consumer safety."
Don't give them any fucking ideas
You could accidentally scan the wrong document if the printer doesn't have our proprietary 100 dollar ink cartridge in it.
How, you ask? Don't worry your pretty little head, dear customer. Just trust that we have your best interests at heart and something terrible could happen if that cartridge isn't in there.
but muh SAFETY brah
@@rossmanngroup Without ink the scanlaser could overheat and explode.
If I remember it correctly, it is not just the case with HP, either EPSON/CANON all in one printer/copy/scanner also have that problem, I forgot which one. The problem was there since at least 2010. Resulting I never buy all in one again my entire life.
The biggest kick for them would be a court ruling "If someone needs an ink to scan on your printer, you should provide it, free of charge, on all affected models".
Imagine their face when.
I'm no expert, but I'm pretty sure this issue is one that can be fixed with a firmware update.
If that is the case, then I suspect that that is what HP will do if it looks like they're going to lose this lawsuit.
man you really are a buzzkill lmao@@MrSaywutnow
@@MrSaywutnow That's what they probably do when push comes to shove. It would be somewhat tedious to update ALL firmwares for all printers since time immemorial, but, you right, it would be cheaper.
But we can dream).
Sure they make their markup on ink, but they could probably provide ink for every printer still operating and still not break the bank. Ink is stupidly cheap.
Got a fair printer a while ago and get refills for 50 cents now. The guy who sells it marks it up several 100%.
That would be amazingly hilarious, until they then increase the price of the MFP to offset the ink they're mandated to provide.
It even gets better! One of my office HP printers was "deactivated" until I signed up for an "Instant Ink" subscription. I now prohibit the purchase of any HP product for my company. I hope they do get sued!
If you factory reset the printer you can use non instaink I was so angry when mine tried to pull that bullshit I about to take a bat to it. I got my printer for free lol
i got tired of wasting 60 dollars to make 2 prints every month. so i went and got a cannon. havent had a problem in over a year.
granted ink jet vs laser printer prob also makes a difference. but the instant ink thing would come up. i think i had to click custom install or what ever to choose an option that said no.
We use ink tanks since 1990s. They even sell ink tanks officially now if you're into printing atleast weekly
You guys want to buy a xerox? I got a bunch of them. In Phoenix AZ
Damn bro, a bit Naval don't you think?
@@Kittsuera
Wish court cases like these could be over within 30 minutes because it looks blatantly obvious HP are in the wrong. After that they should be slapped with a fine big enough to not wanting to do it again.
HP will pay huge bribes.
I believe lawsuits should be a double digit percentage of the companies GROSS profits. Make it hurt.
The "court" as to drag this years to be entertained, that's what the judge is there for to be entertained...
They should be required to offer a free firmware update that restores the missing functionality, on top of a big fine and consumer compensation for a significant % of the price of each printer sold with this software lock in it.
10% of annual revenue (not earning after taxes) should be the guide, like the EU did with Microsoft and Apple.
You know something's wrong when companies start using the courts as a bug reporting system.
It's not a bug it's intentionally malicious. Ink is where they make their money.
It's not a big it's a feature
This sort of stuff is called a Corporatism, which is just a nicer, sounding word than Fascism. Suing a corporation or loving fines against a corporation is worthless. Unless, and until people within those corporations are thrown in prison where they belong and have all of their ill-gotten gains confiscated, the American people will continue to get screwed blue and tattooed by these corporate gangsters.
@@Jangocat Not only that, but if in the future they want to discontinue creation of the ink for that particular model, it would then in fact force you to purchase another product to replace it since you cannot use any of the features of the device. That is not to say you would then make the conscious decision to purchase one of their products, but the options are limited and is a pretty good chance that end up with one of their devices again. This all to give them the ability to force consumers hands to either purchase in to avoid the purchase of another product, or to phase out products against the consumers desires both appear to be malicious in nature. While I understand their company has a desire for an increased revenue stream, creating an intentional artificial issue in order to fleece customers for money instead of simply producing products that generate a positive relationship with the consumer who then choose to spend money with your company of their own free will does in fact to me sound like something worth a lawsuit.
oh that we already had they then trigger a bug external and therefore get the data
proof them wrong ? nearly impossible , since its useally a background system
i had a HP printer that needed ink yo fn scan, i drove over it, when i realized it needed $70 worth of ink that slowly degrades even if I dont use the printer portion. f HP, buy Brother
This is the way!
So say we all
Brother is worse
@@TravisStamperabout the same
Same here. The HP went into the garbage after the last ink cartridge emptied.
A 3d printer that ejects molten plastic in hundreds of different layers to create a three-dimensional object based off a digital model has given me far less frustrations than any HP printer I've used.
I second that bro!.. geez
@@darkmatterisgrey its funny cuz its true.
The filaments pretty open source and sometimes cheaper than proprietary HP printer ink too
I never thought of that but you are right... I've never had an issue with my 3D printer once where I have to take apart my work HP printer at least once a week...
pov when 6kg of plastic string cost the same as couple ml of ink in cartridge
They are trying to make it pass as "an opinion" when it's clearly a "design decision", I hope they are brought to their knees by justice.
It’s their opinion you should just transfer your entire bank account to theirs.
I want to see the company go out of business and the executives responsible for pushing this as part of the design hanged.
"It's an opinion that we have to supply a product to customers that send us a payment..."
@@TechyBen Isn't that their automatic cartridge ordering option you need to sign into initially to activate some of their printers? It orders new carts when yours get low at their full HP retail price...
If their employee posts were ACTUALLY just opinions, then those employees would be able to post, with company accounts and on company time, anything they wanted (within the law). Political positions, diet tips, product reviews on other brands, the weather they're experiencing and whose fault the rain/sun is, flat-Earth conspiracies...
-
And they certainly would not be limited to using copy-paste scripts written by the company's lawyers.
My family and I were regular HP customers in the early 2000s. At one point we bought a brand new inkjet printer and put a cartridge in. It wouldn't print, so I took the cartridge out and put it in again. The printer now showed that the reinserted cartridge was empty and refused to print. A new cartridge was going to cost $50. I ended up putting the printer aside and figured I'd get back to it at some point. Then later I read that this was all part of their DRM ink cartridge strategy. The printer had recorded a serial number associated with my cartridge and to prevent me from refilling it, the printer was rendered inoperable with that particular cartridge. So there I was with a brand new printer with a full ink cartridge, yet was completely disabled from printing for good, until I bought a new cartridge. I didn't feel like spending hours on the phone with some company who stabbed me in the back, so I just let it go. But I vowed to never buy an HP product again. It's been about 15 years and I've held steadfast.
Ditto, same, no hp since 2007
Same, and I have 0 regrets.
Thanks for letting me know this, now when my cartridge runs empty I will NOT take it out of the printer, I will just drill a hole on the top and fill it up with a syringe.
@@alienlatino2945 It probably has a miniature camera inside it to transmit your photo to HP so that they can file charges.
@@utubewillyman ha! It wouldn't surprise me that if HP could do that they probably would
How I want the HP executives to find themselves in their cars when they realize their doors don't work when their fuel tank is empty...
probably they have a BMW company car and already paying a montly fee to use seat heaters
wife's prius had to have a full tank for the technician to replace the windshield which also seemed to prevent the car from starting the day it cracked (was able to bypass it easily once I figured out how...)
OMG, I just orgasmed.
if air freshener expired.
@@Fulmynato Oh God, I just remembered the BMW subscription seat heaters.
Every damn company is trying to turn their product into a subscription service. It's disgusting.
I moved to another country with my HP all-in-one. Since I am printing, I used to buy the ink cartridges. In my new home, I was looking for my usual ink, but didn't find it. When I checked for printer model, I finally got the physically exact same cartridge with a different number. Installed at home - you guessed it already - a message popped up that I have to use original HP ink. Long story short, I called support and explained the case, he said that I would need to buy a new printer as the country code is different. This is to prevent cross-border sales. I said: OK, I gonna buy a new one! And I did. From Brother. No such BS there, works fine and I have Brother printer and All-in-one for last 10 years... No more HP products!
This is like your car doors refusing to unlock because you have a flat tire.
Don't give Elon ideas. 😒
But will the trunk even unlock so you can have access to the jack, tire iron and spare tire???🤔😂🤣😆
@@fookingsog nope. car is unsafe to drive and you can not be let to enter.
Not wrong.
Either that or "unable to drive because one of the headlamp needs replacement"
At this point I am surprised no company tried to advertise their all-in-one printers with:
- can scan without ink or paper
- can print B/W without color ink
- can print color without B/W ink
I’m pretty sure you usually need black ink to print a color image
My Brother all on one can scan and fax even if there is no toner cartridge. It can also print if there is no phone line for the fax function. But I doubt they go out of their way to advertise it.
@@gabetechinc True, you just don't get a solid black from overprinting CMY, even though that's theoretically what you should get. The combination of the three inks doesn't cover the entire spectrum perfectly. That's why they call it CMYK, where K is the black ink. Professional printing often also uses "spot colours" to give a richer tone than the combination of standard colour inks would produce.
"Will attempt to print no matter what the ink levels are." Sometimes you just need something that's legible and don't need every single color fully vibrant.
@@ZeroMercuri One of the valuable features of old dot-matrix and daisy-wheel printers was that they could still produce legible output even with a worn-out ribbon. It would just gradually fade out. You replaced it when you wanted to make a particularly good impression with a bold, black printing.
It's not a scanner, it's a scammer!
Anyone else completely and utterly frustrated by the fact that every one of these class-action lawsuits against printer companies seem to go absolutely nowhere?
Fuckin A man.
Or that the settlement seems to get paid off in "10% off your next purchase" coupons, meaning that the plaintiff actually PROFITS from the settlement: either the members of the class use the coupons, buying MORE stuff from the company that wronged them, or they don't use the coupons, meaning the plaintiff is only out the cost of printing.
Justice is dead. It died a long time ago.
Or do better research and don't buy them in the first place? I think HP should ship their printers with actual shit. If people still buy their crap, they deserve to suffer.
@@jumboshrimps4498
"Do better research"
Name *ONE* goddamned printer that doesn't have predatory practices.
One.
I had a printer that ran out of blue and refused to make black and white copies even though it had black ink. Printer companies are some of the worst scammers around.
I remember Canon printers at an old job doing something similar.. HP and Canon should be avoided by all, going forward.
@@oldogre5999The one I had had black separate and the three colors they mixed so there was four. Just some shady printer company stuff like selling a printer for $40 dollars and charging $40 per cartridge.
MaKeS bEtTeR bLaCk
That's not a scam its part of the tech. The head is not separated on inkjet printers, so running it on empty will damage the device.
On laser printers they cannot calibrate either, so you'd get comprimised quality.
@@Serfdomftw How is it running on empty if it's not being used?
30 years ago, I loved HP. You couldn't kill a HP DeskJet or LaserJet.
But since 15 years HP is just a running gag in any company I worked!
Epson is still one of the best printer option until now (I hope it never disappoint the consumer forever)
We removed and replaced all HP peripherals from our Fortune 500 company GLOBALLY about 7 years ago. Imagine the Exec that HP garbage pissed off for us to invest such a huge amount of money just to REPLACE HP products. 😂
I killed piles of DeskJets back then. The things would get to a point where they just refused to feed paper (or feed 10 sheets at a time). Nothing could be done to change their minds about it short of changing the feed rollers every 2 years. 🙄
I'm just glad that we, as a society, have gotten to the point that printers are _almost_ obsolete.
I and my wifes family still operate HP laserjet 1018-s. The one I have is from my last workplace where it was thrown a couple meters, it still works.
Using as main printer HP LaserJet 1020 and works better than trains. As its laser there is way less problems.
But latest smart ink scanner crap.. They are from Hell.
And keep in mind, "low ink" on these printers is completely up to the printer to decide, whether there is low ink or not.
By the time it’s done with the self cleaning feature needed to avoid streaks and off colors required for a new ink cartridge it’s already low again.
and they can also refuse to print if it runs out of one ink color "sorry i can't print your document in black and white because you're out of cyan ink"
Lol printer dont decide that. There's a level float in the cartridge. When not enough liquid to make it float it makes contact a th a metal strip causing a circuit etc etc. Lol
@@terryarmbruster9719 who cares? the product belongs to the person who bought it, not the company that made it. it should give a text message warning the user that it thinks the ink is low or that it needs cyan ink to print black or whatever, but then allow you to continue anyways, so you can decide whether or not its "inability" to print is bullshit. you should be allowed to at least try to print, even if it doesn't work because there's not enough ink, because a lot of the time there WILL be enough but it still wont let you.
But it’s dangerous!
To their bottom line. @@Deltexterity
I’m an IT professional and I used HP printers a lot in the past, they were really good. I stopped using or recommend HP printers to my clients many years ago, I estimate in the past 4 years I made HP lose many hundreds of printers in sale by steering everybody away from their printers. Maybe it doesn’t sound like much but I’m guessing there are others like me.
Same. The shop I worked for for years was going mainly Brother when I started, but we switched over to HP fairly quickly as we started getting asked more for colour lasers... I pushed for that, and we ended up being HP only for about 10 years. I started moving away from HP about 3 or 4 years ago too. We did get an HP at my church during Coronavirus but supply was part of that (and Pagewide seemed like a cool idea - unfortunately they appear to have stopped making those).
I hadn't really thought about printers much until a few weeks ago when we had issues at work (not IT anymore) and I started looking at options to present to the boss... Epson had been running ads for their Ecotank in mobile games I'd been playing just before that, and after some research, it looks like I'm going to be an Epson fanboy for a while (both Ecotank and regular cartridge types appear cheaper to run than several competitors).
I too am in IT, and used to love and recommend HP devices... but the last few years, I cannot recommend them... or any brand of inkjet printer.
Better have a warranty on those goddamn things...
I use HP, but I use either refilled ink cartridges that I buy online, or refill the cartridges myself. Sometimes the refilled cartridges do not work due to the HP software, in which case I use the refilled ones.
Doing god's work 7
Judge: OK clerk, scan these pages so we can get on with this case.
Clerk: Sorry we're out if ink...
😂
All it takes is for politicians to be victim to this nonsense and mark my words they will go after these companies, demand that the IDIOTS coming up with these ideas are fired, and magically everything will be great
My wife runs a company and a few weeks ago the HP printer (maybe 1 year old) decided that the 3rd party cartridges were no longer accepted by them and the printer locked up. That was a serious hindrance for the business and on top of that the insulting attitude HP gave us trying to get it working.
We refused pay the ransom they wanted to unlock it and just got a Brother.
We are so done with HP's BS.
Unfortunately HP won't care as you were buying third party cartridges, so they don't see themselves as having lost a customer.
@@adventtrooper They also seem to think that we should look for another brands when purchasing laptops and/or monitors. We'll be happy to oblige.
Remember in a Competitive market if they value your freedom of buying third party ink even though the printer cost more I be better off buying the expensive printer to get more freedom rather buying a cheap printer with evil drm on their system I rather see the companies who use DRM go in bankrupt and learn a lesson why you do not screw your customer s over this.
Always uncheck auto updates when installing! HP's latest firmware caused this! To make it even worse they do not allow you to go back to previous firmware. 😢
That's nice. Friends HP printer decided his legit, registered and working ink subscription "didn't exist" (I checked everything, everything worked, clicked print, it failed "no account" even though it printed accounts on the printer, showed on the drivers and showed on the website + showed all 3 were communicating and connected). I said "no fault no fix" and walked out. They never called back.
HP has been doing this for 20y already. What's worse is that when you eventually replace the empty cartridge, let's say the black one, and the color one is already low, during the initial sequence, the printer will flush both print heads with ink, leaving you with the possibility that the color cartridge will be drained because of it, so you'll still be unable to scan unless you also buy a new color cartridge. It's probably one of the biggest legalized scams ever. HP must have made billions off of their unfathomably loyal customer base...
Its not only HP. My Brother is the same. I can’t print in black unless all colours are there. I except all manufacturers do the same.
This is why people need to switch to refillable tank printers. Cartridges are a scam and alwayse have been. Anyone who grew up with printer ribbon style "cartridge" printers knows this. Luckily you could usually get the ribbon printer cartridges reinked.
@@CK8smallville I know, I used to be a printer technician in a previous life.
You can check if your printer driver has separate settings for black/white and grayscale. If you specify B/W, the printer shouldn't be using color ink. Grayscale is intended for printing fine graphics that look like black and white and adds color ink to the mix to be able to print in greater detail. B/W might also be called 'monochrome' in the settings.
@@skilletpan5674 I hear ya. The problem with ink jet printers is that print heads and ink are already specifically designed to work `optimally together`. If you take ink from other brands or the cheap refill stuff, you'll clog up the print heads in no time, if it already works to start with.
It's kind of counter-intuitive, but in the long run it's actually cheaper to just buy the friggin' ink from the manufacturer. I've yet to come by any brand of ink jet printers where this isn't the case.
It is actually cheaper for me to replace my color laser printer from HP that I paid $254 for than to replace the toner cartridges inside of it. I figure I will just get a new printer every 5 years or so and it works out ok as I don't print that much. Stupid toner is $100 pop to replace the four inside of it. Inkjet printers were worse for me since I print so little it always needed to be cleaned when I turned it on depleting the ink faster. If I want a color photo I get it printed at walmart for a buck or so.
I'm currently being held hostage by the HP INSTANT INK program. (Don't get it!) They tried to tell me I should get 1000+ pages out of the cartridges and I laughed in his face. As an artist I'm printing full color pages and I get maybe 30 sheets. Because I'm in Canada it takes 2 weeks + for new ink to get to me from their US warehouse. I'm also not actually sent ink half the time as the printed will stop when one color runs out (my print is half printed with missing yellow and is unusable) but because the other ink levels are still not out - it warns me to not change the cartridge even though I can no longer print what I need to. The program is based on an allotted amount of prints (mine is 100 per month) and I'm unable to print this as I never have enough ink. There is a youtuber who cut a new ink cartridge open to see the ink levels - It's SUCH a scam. It's a slightly inked sponge in there. Maybe 5c worth of ink. HP needs to be cancelled.
Google, "reset printer cartridge ". It worked for me and my model. Former tech made a step by step video to reset the log on the cartridge. I get 2.5x's the pages now and replace it when it really is out of ink. Can you believe I was recycling cartridges that were more than half full? In an ironic twist, I actually spring for the real ink now because the quality is better.
I'm sorry you had to experience the HP curse firsthand. My condolences. May your future bring better choices and results.
in the old HP cartridge, like HP Deskjet 400 from the 90's they have a bag that either slowly shrunk or slowly inflate as we use it. and the ink are very concentrated. i remember print stacks upon stacks of spreadsheet on a single hp cartridge. apparently hp choose to copy canon and use sponge.. the sponge are always almost dry. but you can use syringe to refill it.
That youtuber cut Cannon cartridge
Try swapping to either a Epson 'Ecotank' (you fill the tanks yourself from bottles of ink... OR go Laser printer (toner cartridges LAST WAY LONGER and, often CAN BE refilled... WAY LESS HASSLES! 👍
😎🇬🇧
Its baffling how anti consumer a lot of companies have become after the 2000s, I used to like HP products too until I started experiencing issues like this one, or the one where the printers wouldn't accept refilled cartridges, but the real joke is on them because I then became anti HP and neither I nor my friends or family, have ever purchased HP products since the late 2000s.
Yeah, I never had issues that were anything like this with printers in the 90s and early 2000s. I even had a scanner that came with a free copy of photoshop. Things have changed.
It's almost as if government stopped consumer-protection practices
HP started their ink cartridge shenanigans before the 2000s because I ordered half a dozen printers for work in 1998 right when they rigged their printers to play these tricks.
In 1997, I went to a computer conference which included a forum on refilling ink. HP cartridges used a balloon for pressure. Shortly before the conference, HP reengineered the cartridge so that if you used the best location to insert the ink needle, you would almost certainly puncture the balloon. The HP rep, of course, said it was to "improve the quality of the customer experience" NOT to improve the bottom line, and managed to keep a straight face. He refused to answer how it improved the customer experience of reinking.
So maybe this was the reason then why refilled cartridges never worked properly😮 I had the HP PSC 1410 back then and we bought refill kits to refill the cartridges. I remember at the beginning it worked with limited success but then it did not work anymore no matter how much ink I filled into it and no matter if tried to wipe the nozzles with alcohol to make sure it is not stopper because of dry ink. I got really frustrated and once I even cracked a cartridge open to realize the sponge inside it was filled with my ink, it just failed to work properly in the printer because how the cartridge was designed.
I've read about the same allegations with some printers in Australia. At least here (in Australia) we have a consumer protection clause called "fit for purpose". If an all in one printer and scanner can't scan without ink, then the product is not fir for purpose and the customer is entitled to a full refund.
can you buy those HP all in one printers in australia ?
If the australian version does not have the "scan only when ink is present" limitation, it basically proves HP does it on purpose.
@@bschwand The HP Envy line of all-in-ones is available in Australia.
So either this has passed completely under the radar because nobody has complained about it yet, or the units sold in Australia have different firmware installed so that it is compliant with Australian Consumer Law.
Austria here, have an OfficeJet 7612 because of the scanner...
Have to buy a new printer because ink is empty, but will keep it as a scanner 🙂
Consumer Protection rulez!
🍻
@@bschwand OF COURSE they do! They read the letter of the law, during design of most any product nowadays, they break up the design to sell the parts piecemeal in a push for "function as a service." When they design the software to allow only the functions they must allow according to the vaguely written laws and the terrible consumer protections in the US, they essentially run roughshod over all of us until someone is pissed off enough to pursue litigation. Unfortunately, they can buy the services for much more expensive lawyers, so I don't anticipate this will result in much of anything except maybe a fat, quiet settlement outside of court. This is fast becoming the premier practice of companies. Game developers and DLC, John Deere and service packages, Cars and various trim packages, even youth sports are turning into "pay to play." It's as if some form of Satan woke up one day and said, how can we screw every single consumer out of the maximum amount of cash that we can get away with before we get our hands slapped? And when that happens...how do we purchase the government regulators in order to vote for policies that stop the hand slapping. It's disgusting and it is all targeted at making already bursting at the seams investors even richer and fatter!
Imagine walking into a store and the owner yells from the back
"I'm not responsible for what that employee says or does!"
The employee probably just took the whole answer as a text block from a support database, pre written by some law weasels.
The main problem is see is why are they even talking about what the person posted there, they are trying to shoot or interpret the messenger but that doesn't change the message. If the person would have written "pretty pink unicorns" it wouldn't have changed the fact that the printer scanner combo shuts down completely if there is no ink inside. They should have asked "ok so if that statement is an opinion and not necessarily correct , then how do you fix the real existing problem that this device turns into a brick the moment there is no ink cartridge inside"
They couldn't have done it because its not just an opinion, its a fact that is not affected by the person who states it.
Exactly, and even then it is completely bs as an employee is acting as an agent of the company and isn't expressing some random opinion about politics or the weather. But I see it is the normal game lawyers play in throwing stuff against the wall and seeing if it sticks.
@@rawrou moreso... likely has a long list of boilerplate messages to copy/paste to respond to them... which were written by slimy managers with approval from their slimy lawyers to allow the company to slip out of lawsuits.
That's not even to mention that as soon as you put ink into it, it needs to "calibrate" and spend half of your inks to make a useless "test page", forcing you to buy more ink sooner.
The nice thing about a lawsuit like this is that everyone involved...everyone..., from the Judge down to the court stenographer, has run into an issue just like this. Frantically trying to print something late at night, with a deadline looming in the morning, and the printer won't print your B/W document because the half-full magenta cartridge is reading low...or some other such scammy nonsense. And my guess is that they are all still pissed, lol.
i have a samsung C480FW all in one and it doesnt want to let you print in b&w if a color toner is empty, but i have managed to get it to do it by repeatedly trying to print and cancelling the warning. eventually it will print in b&w. luckily it takes knock off ebay toner carts that are dirt cheap ($60 for 1 black and 3 color) without any errors. not sure if they still do, the one i have was a $99 one day Frys special years ago.
it's cheaper to buy brand new printer from another company after such infuriating disasters.
just check "customer reviews" about refilling new model before buying.
My HP printer has empty color cartridges and prints black and white, but you have to tell it to print in monochrome in the print setup.
Not sure what your issue is.
Also, don't forget that even though you have ink in the device and you just use it for scanning, when you turn it on, it'll probably do its little head check and waste 5% of your ink even though you just wanted to scan with it.
Every time I turn off my hp printer for any reason, the printer insists on doing a "realignment" then uses my precious ink (that is evidently mixed with gold) printing out a page that then has to be scanned. Once twice or three times. $62 for a cartridge when the whole printer was $45. Crooks.
@@maggiemmoore I pay 2$ for 4 bottles of ink and just recharge the cartridges.
@@guiguito5505 Where do you buy it?
I hate multifunction devices and avoid getting them to the extent I am able.
I especially hate HP products and will do without if HP is my only option.
@@guiguito5505 Do share details please.
HP can design combo printers not to scan without ink - and I can design my home to function without HP printer products. Shame because they used to have good products.
don't worry none of their products today is any good
I used to know somebody that worked at HP labs. He said that they had a lot of problems evolving their printer software. Lots of legacy problems and IBM being a newcomer to that game was giving them a hard time.
When I was working at Walmart, I had to actively push people away from the HPs because I was sick of them complaining about things I can't control.
I still firmly believe ink jet printers and ink are a scam. Forever use my B&W laser printer. If we need color, I'll go to my local print shop and support their business, but that's rare.
Pretty much yeah. Inkjets only work well if you use them all the damn time, which means you'll be spending a small fortune on ink. Unless off course you hack the cartridges to be refillable, which most people can't be bothered to do. A basic B&W laser printer is perfectly good for most office tasks, and will keep working flawlessly even if you only use it once a year. And on top of that the toner takes forever to run out.
I had an Epson inkjet printer, and I HATED that thing. After a few years I could count myself lucky if it would print a few pages of text without first requiring a sizeable blood sacrifice to the spiteful ink gods.
Hacking to save money on something you own kind sir? Why that’s a capital offense! @@fnorgen
@@fnorgen My canon PIXMA has a sponge that automatically purges ink so you don't have to clean printheads :)
I have a 10 year old B/W laser printer with the original toner, printing once every 6 months, and it still works flawlessly. Before that I had tried ink printers, and I agree, they are borderline scams, getting empty and drying up in a ridiculously short time. If somebody is asking me what kind of printer he/she should buy, I tell them to buy a laser printer unless he/she really-really needs to have color printing on a regular basis.
@@bleekcer monochrome laser printers FTW
I bought an Epson all-in-one with the reservoirs for ink instead of cartridges, and it's been one of the best buys I've ever made. I've had it for 3 years, and have had to buy ink exactly once, costing me $5.77.
HP can burn.
love my Epson Ecotank.
you paid for the ink up front. They sound great until you learn about the irreplaceable ink sponge.
@@gorfgorf I've heard of that issue but it only seems to occur if you don't use your printer often enough and are always running clean cycles also there are some models where you can replace the sponge we had an ET-4700 it was mid for an ecotank printer I've come to the conclusion that a nice high-quality laser jet printer black only for home use is the best way to go and if you need to print in color just go to an office supply store and let them deal with the headache of repairs and maintenance
I just saw a video about the Epson all in one w/ink reservoirs. The scam is real in regards to ink cartridges. Now that I’ve seen your post, I’ll be buying it👍🏼
@@satin227 My brother B&W printer won't die! I've had it for years, only using the included special half cartridge that's included with the printer. It's really a totally different ball game compared to inkjet. Companies just need to stop being so greedy. My HP prints slowly but it's amazing quality. The ink is such a scam. Our reality - " Printers are great - if you don't use them often." :(
I remember when HP was run by engineers. Their products were the best you could buy. I've had DeskJets, LaserJets, and their computers. My whole business ran on HP. Now their products are crap, I 100% avoid them, and now they've gotten even worse as they do unnecessary stuff like this in order to nickle-and-dime people to death. Now I buy Brother and build my own computers for less.
Good old times when HP was officially known as Hewlett Packard.
@@karl-erikkald8876 My HP41C was my prized possession in college in the 80s. Nothing else came close at that time.
Companies slowly tend towards soft-skill people at the top over time and end up with weaseling mealy-mouthed cost cutting trash because of it.
Most if it comes back to public companies being legally forced to maximize shareholder value rather than the long-term interests and health of customers and the company. It is one of the worst legal decisions of all time. Lawyers and judges sure know how to stick their noses in things far beyond their comprehension and mess them up.
$ 30.00 per cartridge is a bit more than a nickle and dime.
They used to have the best laser printers.
Something tells me that if they lose, the next model will automatically print everything you scan with the option of also saving a digital copy. That way, not only can they require ink to be present when scanning, they also burn through ink cartridges at alarming rates.
At this point I would not be even surprised, sadly
I took a look at a friend's HP that stopped working a few months back. Turns out, they were enrolled in some sort of HP subscription that sends them ink. I eventually figured out that their CC tied to the account became expired and the entire unit was disabled. Took me a while to figure out because I never thought in a million years a company would be allowed to even do that.
That's wild, sounds like I made a good choice to avoid hp instant. I didn't want my head to go oh 10 cents everytime I click print, just wanna do it without thinking. Dividing $50 (for the 4 bottles) by 6,000 the stated output of epson ecotank bottles is less than 1 cents per page.
Hp instant ink is like a huge scam with a giant markup.
It is harder to NOT sign up for Instant ink AND HP+ when setting up a printer. Look up the terms of HP+. Whose printer is it?
Because common decency has left Hp, unlike people like you who don't think that way
I'm basically *THE* computer guy in my area. I have advised hundreds of people just in the past year that they should never buy HP printer products again. I've been moving them to Epson EcoTank and Brother MFC laser and ink tank printers as the HP printers become problematic. Even without the cartridge nonsense, you're lucky if your HP printer works at all. People with 10+ year old HPs that work get firmware updates turned off and I tell them to hold on to them as long as possible.
Epson and Brother for the win
Heyyy the EcoTank gang is growing
Firmware updates are the poison of the IT world. I’d only ever perform one as part of a last rites ceremony.
The Eco Tank is excellent but if a jet gets blocked ignore all the "advice" about unblocking it. Simply blow through the tube connected to the jet. If that fails, squirt distilled water through it.
@@hugegamer5988 Hitler tried to update firmware once
Probably the best decision my family made was switching from HP printer/scanner with cartridges to a Brother one that uses refillable built-in ink compartments.
Around 2 years ago, my family decided to open a watchmaker workshop and with that came the need to print a lot. Around the same time, our 5 year old HP printer/scanner broke down. So we had an option to spend around 50$ for a new HP printer or buy a more reliable Brother scanner that cost us around 250$. My family was pretty sceptical about the idea of buying such an expensive printer, but i was like *It's higher quality, more reliable and despite the price, we'll save up way more on ink than with HP"
As of today, it was a good decision on our side. Despite the sheer amount of paperwork needed to be printed out on a monthly basis, after 2 years we still haven't ran out of ink we received with the Brother printer, when after calculating, we would have to buy a brand new set of HP cartridges every month, which would cost us roughly 50$ every time. We have saved around 1200$ over those 2 years and all we did was buying a more expensive printer.
Yep. We changed to a semi-professional Brother several years ago and have no regrets. I have had my printer for 7 years and it's still going strong.
A Brother came with a business I bought about a year ago. Probably do about 30 prints a day and I don't think the ink level in the compartments has moved at all.
@@mattpayne3349 How is that even possible?
@@yd8104 Big tanks and not doing a million stupid things specifically to waste your ink so you have to buy more sooner, I suspect.
@@yd8104 It probably did move at least a bit. I myself will have to buy more ink in a few months. Here's the deal tho, Brother doesn't scam you on ink, at least not with those refillable printers.
HP has a plethora of scams just so you have to buy more overpriced cartridges:
-using of color ink in black and white prints so you run out of it faster
-DRM chips that prevent you from using non-HP cartridges or refilled ones in your printer
-programmed limit on how much you can print with a single cartridge, meaning that usually you end replacing still half full cartridges
After making several attempts to use my HP printer to only print black (which is all I've ever needed it for) it continued to tell me that brand new cartridges that you could audibly hear were full of ink - were empty. I found that the cartridges never actually survey ink level, they just count how many pages were printed in general. Even though my default settings were "Black Ink Only" and all color was turned off, it continued to ask for new cartridges. I hate the waste of all that perfectly good ink, and much worse, I despise the principle of the matter that HP tries to control you with products you purchased for yourself and wrongfully cons you into purchasing more unnecessary ink cartridges.
I ended up destroying the printer beyond recognition with a hammer and considered shipping the mangled mess to HP just for S&G but just needed it out of my sight before I had a stroke over it.
There's an often-hidden setting for "rich black" that has to be disabled, or the printer will use all four colors to print black in order to make the black print darker. (Black-only ink prints tend to be dark-gray and not actually "black.")
It would have been great if you had sent it to them with a camera that activates when they open it.
Except on old b&w inkjet printers, where the black ink is truly black, because it's the only color of ink in the printer.
HP has been legendary for this kind of thing over the last couple of decades. It’s a wonder that they are still in business.
.
They get away with it, this is why I guess 🤷🏼♀️
Probably because they sell the printers dirt cheap.
My family never had a printer and I've only bought one years after moving out.
I bought an HP printer because I didn't know any better, because if you've never heard of their scumbaggery, it seems like a good deal.
I still have it and hate it with a passion.
At one point I looked up if their CEO lives nearby, because I wanted to throw that thing into his yard.
Many other choces beside HP. I will not buy HP because of stuff like this. IBM once ruled the PC market and doing stunts like this caused them to dissapear from that market.
Canon does it too. Printer won't scan because there's no ink.
They are still in business because every mf still buy it 🤦🏻
Give her back the printer Louis 😅 just don’t give her any ink
She sent it, her loss
That sounds like a funny euphemism.. Dont give her any "INK". Especially white ink
Yeah... Louis overshared way too much in this one
@@Secret_Squirrel_Scottishgamer HP induces 'ink-seeking behavior' in their customers
@@ChemEDan He's way overthinking things. His rules seem so arbitrary too. Ethical responsibility based on how much use he gets out of the machine? Never heard of such a convoluted code of ethics.
I bought an HP 6100 all-in-one in 2002, at full retail. Years later, when I decided to abandon the inkjet printer for laser, I too was infuriated to find I could no longer use the scanner because of the empty print cartridge. I eventually took the once expensive, now useless machine to the local thrift store.
So, HP, that was it. I’ve never bought an HP product since and I’m finished with you forever. My “new” Fujitsu scanner does the job you wouldn’t let me do with a machine I paid for.
Asinine policy. Idiotic corporation.
you should have thrown it away
I lost the CD with the drivers and could never get the printer to work with the next Windows version. There was also no online update so that was the end for me. Never looked back at HP, think I still have a laptop of their design and a monitor, both terrible.
At the same time they brag about being good to the environment. The contrary is true. If you build durable machines people like to use you can be proud.
Took mine to the gravel pit and rebuilt it with a 30-06. Very satisfying. No more HP for me. Edit. There is some video of an unhappy soldier in the sand box rebuilding his units HP all in one with an M60
The end of the all for one and one for all
Completely agree Louis. We need a high-profile lawsuit to put a stop to this shady practice from all companies. I have used HP printers since their first laser printers. Up until now I have been happy with them and have recommended them. My latest acquisition was an HP7740 All-In-One. Not only does it refuse to print black only when low on any colour, a recent software update demands that I have an HP account to scan. I don't want an HP account and I would like to know what data such an account would harvest and what it is used for?
People just need to stop buying HP printers
I said F it to needing HP login and use NAPS to scan.
Getting sued is probably cheaper for them than to stop this practice of forcing consumers to buy their inks to continue to use the machine.
@@AndMod Have to agree with you given how many class action lawsuits related to ink HP has paid out on. At least in a few of them the judges went further and enjoined them from continuing the practice and I believe that includes not being able to refill the cartridges beyond allowing them to void the warranty for doing it.
The fines need to be punitive, as this ‘sharp practice’ needs to be stamped out.
If people want to stop a company from doing things like this, they need to be sure the news of the lawsuit is picked up by the media and spread widely. If no one knows about the lawsuit, there's no reason to stop the practice.
@@peterclarke3020 If any judgement is just a single fine then NO company will stop whatever the practice is. Most major companies just factor in the fines as cost of business. Bc the fine is like maybe once every couple months to maybe once a year. With it NOT being based on the amount of times it's done or overall profits.
So miniscule and not worth them actually fixing it. If it started reasonable for smaller businesses but then double PER offense and double again PER immediate to reasonable period repeats. Maybe they would do something. At least to break it up.
Just like rich aholes where if a penalty ios just s standard fee amount instead of scaled off income/net worth then it's only for the poor. No rich person cares about even a dozen $100 fines when they make that much a minute, passively.
No one is forcing you. Stop using the F brand. Let them dig their own grave
I used to be an HP printer technician and seeing this video surprises me. Not only have normal every day people been affected by this but actual businesses like doctors' offices and government agencies. When I would deliver them their ink/toner (yes, some toner based MFPs would do the same thing) they would ask me why it does that and I knew why and always recommended that they switched to either a Canon or Lexmark printer so they can use their printers. HP isn't making a profit off their printers like they used to so they're trying to gouge as much from the ink as possible.
Edit: I made a booboo in my sentence
My Cannon does the same thing. Stay away from them.
This isn't Reddit. We don't give a flying fuck about why you had to edit your comments.
@@cherryjuice9946probably depends on the type, i use a canon laser and 2 of the cartridges are empty, still keeps printing, it complains but still prints (color still works as well, eventually it will fully run out, but the printer doesnt care)
Handling Official Documents and Preventing Forgeries, these lab protocols need stay out of our printers.
Both these companies are known to do this just as well, they lose money on Inkjets to make up the sales in ink so they use these types of tactics to get money just like other tactics that just keep getting worse. I try and push people who need printers into laser jets or if they want cheap at least try and get a device that's more open to easily allowing you to use your own type of ink cartridges or the refill types but sadly that's becoming even harder as time goes on.
HP is the rolls Royce of printers, every time it starts up it uses ink "to clean itself", it uses unnecessary ink to empty the cartridge quickest so you can buy buy buy
Every single inkjet printer does that...
@@adelphus515That doesn't really make it any better
I’m pretty sure every modern printer does this. The problem is that they lock certain features like the scanner via software lock.
@@adelphus515And the price of the HP ink is the price of a new printer, I could only afford getting the black cartridge that cost me more than a quarter of the printer's price, put that in yo pipe and smoke it.
I noticed that to, i started pulling the cartridges out before they clean.
I was a HUGE HP fanboy for decades. I would only buy HP calculators (48GX got me through my BSEE), computers, and printers. Then I got sick and damn tired of my inkjets breaking after about 2-yrs of medium-duty use. Parts always cost more than just buying a new printer. And of course the new printer would require a different printer cartridge than the spares I had on hand. So the former cartridge supply would be a total waste. Bought a Brother color laser printer, and love it way more than any HP I ever had. I've divorced HP for good.
That HP48 calculator was of a different HP...
The HP that I grew up with isn't the scamming low life HP that exists today. Just say no to everything HP, you'll be better for it.
In the 90s the cool kids called HP PCs Hazard! Problems.
HP has been trash since inkjets became a thing in the early 90s. So either you’re in your 50s or live in a fantasy land.
Literally no tech corporation is what it was 20 years ago.
@@CobaltLobster You know HP used to make things that aren't printers or PC's, right? Or you just can't help being a shitty person? Which is it?
HP has ALWAYS been terrible.
Canon is the same thing. When my mother passed away I popped the cartridges out of her printer and put them in bags so they wouldn't dry out (or leak inside). A few days later, I needed to scan some family photos while at her house and the "scanner" refused to do it without the carts installed.
I _think_ my similar model Canon will scan with _empty_ carts, but not NO carts.
This is why I have the simplest black and white printer possible it may not be flashy but it always works/there is not much that can go wrong with it. I gave up my fancy printer when I was trying to print a black and white resume the morning of a job interview and it wouldn't print because it was out of yellow ink. I find it ironic that the printer manufacturers destroyed their business for years because of their greed.
I have it too BUT ig breaks after you print like 100 pages...
No they haven’t destroyed their business. They’ve done extremely well because most people fall for the scams.
Mine has worked for years 1000+ pages. I study the weather as a hobby and I print alot of weather maps/notes/radar-satelite images.
Of course it's out of yellow ink. How else is it supposed to print the identification dots on every page?
Remember when a printer would let you print in grayscale without colored ink, and all it took was a checkbox on the print page?
I appreciate the 33 vs 66% debate as this is precisely how my brain would have viewed the scanner as well
Well he forgot fax, that's a very important function, so his numbers were technically off. Also I love how people on support forums completely don't answer questions, like the dude who has the little "hp support agent icon" says in his post blah blah blah without the cartridge the printer will not "print", nobody asked if it could print. Support agents are retarded, well that or google translate is retarded, who knows, who cares.
@@MatthewHolevinski print/scan/fax are 33/33/33, if he only uses scan that's 33.
@@RareEarthSeries got me :) I wasn't actually paying attention 👍
25% if it is a Black and colour printer? or 16.7% if you regard each colour as one function.
@@babbagebrassworks4278 so glad someone came to my rescue on that one. I could a swore they technically did something else than just fax, scan, print, maybe email? Ehh
I worked in the industry for years, not at HP.
Talked to many guys who worked for HP and previously worked for HP. A very long time ago they produced high quality reasonably priced products. Then a new CEO came in who only cared about profit margins and shareholder value. A ton of policy changes came by over the years. Most of the quality people got fed up and left for better jobs. Now HP makes mostly overpriced junk.
Am sad to hear they made a scanner than requires ink, but also not surprised. It fits in their motif now.
It was Meg Whitman, who is now an American ambassador to Kenya.
Amen!
Carly ran it into the ground.
Does HP sell scanners (only a scanner)? Well, well, well. The answer is yes and they're all above $300.
HP is the only company that has ever caused me to throw an office chair across a room.
What was the reason? Please tell the tale!
@@SomeoneNone123ink
I hated working there too.
Hard to believe all the excellent analytical equipment, laser printers, plotters, and flatbed scanners came from HP given the shady practices they've used for a couple decades now
@@SomeoneNone123 If I had to guess it's probably an installation thing. Personal favorite is the "environment setting" that automatically disables two sided printing(don't think that was an HP but just about punched a solid metal door).
Things like this should warrant more than a fine. It should warrant a legal finding rendering such villainy actionably illegal.
Yes, it certainly should be more than just a fine, because it's literally FRAUD!
Total and complete shut-down of the company! Make the investors lose their shirts for investing in such scum.
Whack the investors and watch this kind of chicanery come to a screeching halt.
.
Got tired of ink jet plugging so went looking for a laser printer. First criteria was didn't require an account to print, or indeed an internet connection to print. That immediately eliminated the most problematic brands.
I worked for Compaq when they were taken over by HP. In the first 2 mins of the video explaining the takeover the new CEO said “you will learn to love ink” my contract expired a week later and I walked.
meaning new ceo had this dumb ink scam planned out
I had one of those HP's- they scammed me for months charging for ink cartridges they never sent, then when I noticed and made them stop, the friggin scanner stopped working. Incredibly infuriating and I threw it in the garbage and will never touch another HP product.
Never again will I make the mistake of buying HP! Even if they manage to lie their way out of the court case, the customer will judge them.
ESG responsible company - integrity & accountability & operating responsibly & sustainably; the climate change & betterment of society statement, yet ignoring the purpose of ESG for .... Maybe a tree pops up once it's buried at landfill site.
I was warned Brother does the same thing, so I bought a Cannon. Sadly, the Cannon did the same thing, and even much worse. It routinely would dump ink and would pretend it must do that to "clean the heads". However, it does that when you plug brand new cartridges in, so they aren't really cleaning anything, just dumping my expensive ink. ( I had an old printer from the 1990's that never behaved like that, and same print quality, so I doubt it's necessary to dump all the ink for head cleanings).
On the Cannon, it didn't matter if I never printed a single page, the printer would burn through all colors in about 3 months. That was over $100 of ink, and not a single page printed. Do that several times a year and you'll hate Cannon as much as HP. Also, their customer support is just as bad as what was displayed by this HP employee.
@@cherryjuice9946 I remember when you had to tell the printer to clean the heads after it started printing with missing lines, and when you had to do manual color alignments...
@@pontiacg445 I remember that too, but those days are gone. They've turned that into a money making idea now and have taken control from the user.
When I consider a product these days the first place I go is the company's help page. Forget reviews, or any other thing that can be misleading, the best way to judge a product ,as well as a company, is to investigate how their service resolution is done.
I remember when I couldn't get my printer to print using only black and white when one of the color cartridges ran out and hp support told me that even though I just wanted to use only the black cartridge that it was designed in such a way that all cartridges must have ink in order to run, looks like theyre taking that argument to the next level when it comes to the scanning function. I could only imagine the outrage if a car manufacturer made vehicles that would refuse to start if it runs out of window washer fluid lol
Cars that don't run wither washing fluid. What a great idea !
It will be a reality soon. For your safety !
Or will stop working when the ash tray fills up and emptying the ash tray afterwards has no effect...
Even when you print in black and white, it still mixes a little color into the black each time. I printed a ton of pages in black and white one time and watched the color levels drop every few pages.
It is a thing already. There are diesel cars now who refuse to start with an empty Ad-blue fluid tank.
@@darek4488 thats slightly different because the AD-Blue (DEF) is an emissions requirement, and usually they will start but the vehicle is in a severe limp mode
I remember my dad buying an hp deskjet 500c back in the early 90s. It was amazing compared to the old dotmatrix printer we had. It was so quiet in comparison and had much better print quality. Even back then the on brand cartridges where way over priced but there where so many options for 3rd party ink back then. I was able to print loads of stuff out for school without worrying over how much it would cost. Since ink drm kicked in things have gotten much worse. I hope HP burns.
Ink DRM needs to die.
somewhere about that time, my family purchased a printer for our new AIO pc. i forgot which brand we got, but we basically boiled it down to look at the price for ink cartridges. at the time, ink cartridges actually varied in price depending on the brand you go for. so obviously, we went for the printer with the cheapest cartridges. 2 or 3 replacements later, we found an ink refiller kit, which we tried out. it worked maybe 2 times, then the sponge that holds the ink got super dry. at that point, the cartridge started leaking all over the place, so replacement was needed
nowadays, when i looked at printers since i kinda needed one, i see all the cartridges are practically the same price, regardless of brand. which now just makes me not want one at all
I just hope more people see this. I refuse to buy any HP or Apple products and have done so for a number of years. I hate companies that practice this type of blackmail with product design that ties you into their exclusivity. I much prefer open source products where individuals can get involved and applications and accessories are available from multiple sources. 👍
Open source and HP printers are still a problem. They depend on a web-based configuration (cups) that is intentionally unclear about problems and requires a per machine installation of drivers and activation of the printer using it's internal unique id number.
well thats only 1 way , but what if it fails
we need new laws for a new time - that laws that dont go in favor of a company - also that are not small companys they are big and they have money, that makes 1 reason more not to allow this
I already don't consider Apple because of their walled garden software model. Repair issues (what Louis' videos are usually about) are only the cherry on top.
As a former HP tech support. We are trained to respond in verbatim for concerns regarding the scanning feature w/o ink. This is how they packaged the AiO and unfortunately it is not mentioned on the box.
It would be a good idea to subpoena the design specs and the software development team emails, notes and testing to see EXACTLY what was planned and developed.
I'm sure security concerns would block that motion almost immediately, well unless the judge was willing to review in-depth then heavily redact them, but you never know. This issue might have annoyed the judge at some point, just don't tell HP that lol.
its blatantly obvious. the chip in the cartridge completes system check and if system check complete then machine can be in the "ready" state. technically you should be able to bypass it. or edit the rom to not do the check
Corporate Extortion is enough to push great customers over the edge, and turn a loyal customer into a loyal enemy. Great content!
A laser printer makes much more sense for occasional home use. We used to have an inkjet printer at home and every time someone needed to print anything, the printer wouldn't work because the ink had dried out and clogged the print head.
I agree. I do very little home printing. When I used inkjet printers, the ink always dried out or clogged the jets, so it was costing $$$ to replace barely used but dried out ink.
I switched to a Canon B&W laser printer/scanner and it's been flawless for years. It took me 5 years to go through the small laser toner cartridge that it came with.
No no, it’s fine. Just put in a new ink cartridge that’s the cost of the printer itself and after the “cleaning” process it will need to be replaced immediately yet again.
Worked retail and we sold lots of printers, its actually cheaper to just buy a new printer everytime it runs out of ink... we basically always had cheap HP printers on sale for $29.99 sometimes as low as $19.99, that included ink, while the replacement ink was $49.99+. Another thing is that even if you did buy extra ink and not open it, they had chips that would prevent them from working after the arbitrary best before date, I learned that because we had to check the dates on the packaging constantly to make sure we did not sell a perfectly fine ink cartridge that would not work due to being over the best before date.
I have 2 used but working HP LaserJet 1320 printers I got for free from business downsizings. I feel like I am set for life on home printing.
I just clean the print head. Managed to clean one that hasn't been used in about 4 years cause it was clogged. It was still a pain in the ass, but doable. If they'd just design them better in general then I wouldn't have 3 unusable ones sitting on a table because one ran out of GRAY INK and the other 2 ran out of cyan or something.
Like seriously why the hell does it require gray ink
What I did when the umpteenth jet ink printer at home stopped working because of dry ink or something, is buying a brother laser printer and a canon scanner. I think having the two functions separated as devices is better.
A dedicated scanner is better to keep near the desk / PC and the printer in the living room because nowadays most documents are available on phone and can be sent to print over wifi.
Bonus, I got a lot of laser printer for free because some people have no idea how to troubleshoot, most times it was just something that got stuck in the paper tray.
I mostly agree. But personally I prefer Epson scanners. Canon is very restrictive with their specifications. Usually that means the scanner will be obsolete before it has decent support on Linux and it may lose function at any time due to obscure bugs and the developers hating those devices. I have had/witnessed technical problems with Canon devices in ALL price classes (20 bucks up to 20 mega bucks).
It would be great if every manufacturer started writing the cost of required maintenance, spare parts/refills and their planned lifespan for the device, showing actual interest in customer satisfaction instead of the BS they currently do
But when they eventually lose this case, they will probably just go "oh sorry, we can't do an firmware update to fix this, it has to be sent in" despite HP presumably filling the onboard flash with software to detect third-party ink cartridges and what ink serial numbers are banned
The best thing I did was take my printer and throw it off the balcony to its demise in a billion pieces (of course nobody was in danger of that!) The printing & ink industry is a huge SCAM.
They now have a proper term for it.... "Managed Print Services" or "MPS". No Joke!!!🙄
Wow I felt strangely relieved after imagining throwing HP and a few other products off a balcony. Wish it was me throwing it off (no sarcasm).
Office space ftw
HP makes big bucks on selling the ink cartridges. It only cost HP less than a dollar which they sell for $30 or more. I remember when HP was giving away printers knowing they will get their money back in spades sell the cartridges. I bought a Canon laser printer years ago and have printed thousands of labels and document and only had to replace the cartridge twice
Sledge hammer... open field... the final straw...
Wait, wasn't that a scene from a movie? 😂
HP is Printer Apple. They are the poster child for the dystopian evil corporation. I banned the brand from my household when they brought out the subscription printing model... but I already had the printer, so I kept it. But I literally had to buy new cartridges every other time I wanted to print... which is a great way to plug your subscription ink service!
I now have an Epson Eco-tank that came with a full LITER of ink. I've had it for like 9 months and I'm not even close to empty, despite printing many times more than I did on the HP (because the ink was so prohibitively expensive).
And if your ex wanted the printer, she would have gotten it.
As a tech, I have to deal with this issue all the time.
I hate being forced to give good people bad news.
As a tech, you could maybe show people how to scan documents with their phones.
That is why I have Brother all in one printer/scanner/copier with separate ink tanks that I can refill individually. Works very well, no issues at all 3 years and counting! Never had any issues like this!
I hate my Brother! If I want to print in black, I need all the colours to print. If Im low in anything, once I turn the printer on and it initialises or whatever, the low ink gets used up (even if say 1/4 left).
Yeah I bought the 710 model a week or two ago. seems ok for the price. Scans are ok quality as well. There's also canon and epson that do ink tanks. I'm sure there's more but companies like HP are boneheads and they'll refuse to change because they have a loyal user base who'll just keep using them like lawyers etc.
Open it up and clean/replace the 'sponge' that soaks up waste ink or your printer will eventually stop working
Have you tried to scan with no ink? I have a brother printer that acts just like the described HP.
@sjsz06 there are no reports online or in the brother documentation that suggest or state a requirement for ink. Only a low ink/refill when printing message. The trouble shooting page for "i can't print" makes no mention of low/no ink.
I had an HP 3-in-one that worked fine as a scanner with empty ink cartridges for several years. And then about 3 years ago, after a software update, it ceased to function without a new cartridge. I am happily printing now with my Xerox laser printer and separate Canon scanner. HP can go pound sand.
Yeah, thats also why I try to never let my accessories update unless there is a clear need. Possible security risk, but in my experience (example, Bioshock on Steam) if someone had worked for literal years and a patch can’t actually say what the improvement is, its better to NOT update.
A similar situation for me. I print with my Samsung laser printer & scan with my old ink-less Canon 3-in-1. Thank you Canon for making printing, scanning & photocopying independent functions
Got a HP printer like that, but either it is too old or running on different drivers that i haven’t run into this issue. Printer is very picky when it want print properly so at some point i redownloaded its driver from the HP website and seems to fixed it. After many years, i think the gears got out of sync and gives me a “paper stuck” message until i push back on the gear that is sticking out. Scanner still working great.
Canot... Just wait until there's an OS update and your perfectly fine scanner gets no compatible drivers made for it. This is Cannon's M.O.
A few years back, Lexmark printers had a date stamp embedded in their toner cartridges. If the toner had no been fully used by a certain time, the printer refused to function until the toner cartridge was replaced, whether empty or not. An interesting ploy to force users to continue buying consumables on rarely used devices.
If you only print once in a great while, buy a laser printer. Toner doesn't have an expiration date.
@@OddlyIncredible - Unless the manufacturer decides it does, and codes the printer to stop working completely if the toner is "out of date."
While we talk about Lexmark: my laser printer had cost about 350€. After a couple of years the power supply failed. I called them and asked for repair options - they graciously offered to give me an estimate for 400€ - just the estimate, repair will cost an undisclosed amount on top. Next day I drove that thing to the dump and ordered a comparable Brother laser printer for about half that amount. I had this Brother printer for more than twice that time now, I'm not looking back.
I'm with you, HP should take a considerable loss, and either be forced to roll out firmware update to remedy it, Or risk getting sued again.
Side note: I really enjoy the calm commentary, but now my YT, PC, and TV's volume is at a level that would wake my neighbor if I play a video from another creator.
they already did that once the recent outrage is that they reversed that update!
I had a Kodak printer years ago that REFUSED to print in black and white when I had plenty of black ink because one of the color cartridges was low (not empty, and not needed for b&w). These companies are evil.
That's the same reason my Epson inkjet went to the scrapyard as well and I refuse to buy anything Epson
HP needs to go the way of Kodak.
I still remember when I found out that printer companies do often make the ink cartridge amount left readings purposefully quite inaccurate. It can say you are essentially out of whatever particular ink, but you in fact still have pages and pages of that Ink left. Best thing you can do, assuming your printer let's you, if it's says your out, override and keep printing until you can notice it actually is out, usually comes in the form of light color or inaccurate colors.
meanwhile police says : alexa is already storing your data at amazon
oh really at amazon so
and why the police said so ? amazon is a company not the police
Printers usually estimate ink levels based on print volume and percent of each page being printed, as there's no realistic way to measure the ink level directly short of weighing it with a scale that works at the microgram/picogram level, which would cost way more than the printer. So, they're always overestimating just off that, and that doesn't even get into the financial incentive to be even less accurate.
@@OddlyIncredibleThey could also simply use a light based sensor inside the printer. That's what I always assumed they were doing. But, I accept the premise that it's generally by page counts. I don't think it's quite that simple though.
@@AshiStarshade Some printers did/do use optical level sensing (and I had an old Brother inkjet like 15 years ago that did this - faking it out on remaining ink levels was a simple case of putting tape over the level sensor), but that's pretty rare because it's a lot more expensive to implement an optical sensor/detector versus a cheap EEPROM/NVRAM chip that can hold a number read from and handed to it by the printer's controller.
@@OddlyIncredible also it makes it more tamper proof as you said and I would also think it allows the printer company to know more precisely how much "ink" is in each card they're selling making statistics easier
Something like this happened to me years ago. I can’t remember if it was an HP or not, but I realized I could not use the scanner without ink. So I wrapped everything back up, stuffed it in the box, and took it back to Best Buy to return it. I don’t play that game. I don’t like being forced into stuff just for the sake of profit, especially with how much of a scam printer cartridges are.
Imagine that....HP being proprietary and/or engaging in other shitty behavior! Shocking! Hi Blackberry!
Like Texas outlawing abortions and censoring education ?
You probably don’t even own the printer legally and hacking the scanner to work without ink is a capital offense.
Don't think Blackberry ever claimed they didn't run a proprietary OS. Blackberries functioned exactly as buyers expected them to function.
@@notanothershrubberyThey mean the cat lol
It's cases like this that make me wish courts sued for a PERCENTAGE not a gross sum - i.e. suing the company say fifty million sounds decent, but they can take that - suing them for say 10% of their yearly earnings is a whole other ballgame
I think they should actually have to give whatever they received fraudulently back. Just like you were I would. I don't understand why these corporations get a fine but don't have to return the stolen goods. Basically this is theft. They're stealing our money by forcing us to have ink and a scanner when we don't need it. They should have to return a percentage of their cartridge sales. We've got to stop letting these companies keep their stolen goods. They have to return them and then get fined on top of it.
This is a lawsuit from the consumer, so it's not going to be a significant judgement unless it's turned into a class-action suit. What we need is some law declaring this deliberate sabotage, with _criminal_ penalties.
They abso-bloody-lutely should get in trouble for this. I don't know what's more ridiculous: the fact that a scanner needs ink to function, their lame excuses in court, or the fact that we need a damn court to bring attention to this in the first place.
The very same happened with me also many years ago: No ink = no scanning. My verdict with 86 billion braincells as the jury: I'm never again in my life buying any product with the brand HP or related. Working as an IT consultant for some companies and also for many friends, this has a little bit more impact, than one would anticipate.
I am even avoiding Keysight test equipment in my electronic labs, they used to be once Agilent, and HP earlier. Not sure how these companies exactly related now, I'm lazy to look up, but if only one milligram of the parent company's business mentality has been inherited, it's a good, well-founded decision.
If you are a tech consultant then you should know that Epson does the same thing once you have put ink in the printer at least once.
@@dwschout All the EcoTank EPSONs purchased the past few years are using ink from bottles, the ink is dirt cheap, and no problems (theoretically impossible to block) using any other brand of ink.
@nick066hu Also if you think it's impossible to block, then you aren't aware of print nozzle tolerances. They design the printhead to take a specific type of ink and to clog, or simply run straight through, if it's off by too much of that variance.
@@dwschout the nozzle has to be some size , right? what this has to do with greedy deliberate blocking, with engineer-hours, know-how spent on squeezing everything out of the unsuspecting customer ? Btw. I witnessed printing of thousands of square meters during years with all kind of inks, I remember using at least four different brands of inks, even brandless bought in gallons from china.
@nick066hu so because you got lucky then that negates the literal thousands people went through because of the cheap inks? The fact that all of reality disagrees with you should be enough to show you are exaggerating. How many printheads had to be replaced across all that printing? Was it printed on 20# all purpose paper, or even worse recycled, or was it on specialty paper?
I had an HP printer that had separate black and color cartridges. The color cartridge went low but I could not print with black ink only until the color cartridge was replaced. That was the last HP device that I purchased.
I had this problem also. Like if you have a paper due for college or whatever you should be able to print the paper in black-and-white if the paper doesn't need color charts or photos. Now I have a Brother B&W laser printer and it's better and more economical.
i had one that had a separate color for blending all in the same cartridge, if the yellow ran out... nothing would function.
I vowed never to buy another HP printer ever again after I found out that the reason my printer was always out of yellow ink was because they print yellow under the black on black and white print jobs. The printer wouldn't print black and white if the yellow cartridge was empty.
In courtrooms where justice and truth entwine,
A lawsuit against HP, a story does shine,
Over a scanner that demands ink to run,
Their defense, they claim, is second to none.
The plaintiff's frustration, it's plain to see,
A scanner that's held them in legal decree.
For when ink runs dry, the device turns cold,
Leaving their documents left untold.
HP's defense, they boldly declare,
Is a tale that seems utterly rare,
They argue it's about quality, not a scheme,
To profit from ink in this scanning regime.
Their scanners, they say, are designed with care,
To ensure every scan is pristine and rare.
Ink ensures clarity, a standard upheld,
In every document, every story, it's spelled.
Yet, the plaintiff contends, it's a ploy to entwine,
Consumers in a cycle, a costly design.
To sell more ink, to increase the sale,
While the scanner's demand feels like a travail.
In this legal battle, a question so grand,
Do they seek quality or profits at hand?
The courtroom awaits, the verdict's suspense,
In the clash of principles, where arguments commence.
In this tale of technology, ink, and dispute,
A lesson emerges, one not to dilute,
The balance of profit and the consumer's plight,
In the world of commerce, where ethics take flight.
You cannot "expect" a corporate to be honest. You need to have strict rules for them to be honest
Proving corporations are people too.
Dishonest I can somewhat forgive. Devious calls for retribution.
They won't ever be honest - just forced not to break the law.
@@Hulkeq2corporations are the worst of people.
You take any individual person in any position of any big corp and make them take a moral decision, they almost always will take the correct one.
Take the corp you drew those people from, and suddenly they will always take the worst route possible.
I'm surprised its taken this long for them to sued. Its been going on for ages.
It costs money and time people don't have, especially not when it comes to an established company with their own legal team
HP has done this forever I once owned a plotter printer and the one thing I remember from that experience is never upgrade your firmware never attach it to the network always print from a USB key and that's it if it works fine when you print it don't upgrade it in any way shape or form
I can't wait to see the outcome of this lawsuit. Keep up the good work Louis! You are a man of honor and integrity and the world needs more men like you!
I ran into this well over a decade ago; the answer is Linux. Simple Scan works no matter what, HP, Samsung, Epson, Lexmark, etc. I've even used a paperclip to fool the printer into thinking there's a ink cartridge present so I could use the fax function.
You shouldn't have to do this to use a product you bought especially if it is not the printer. Although nice trick. I decided to go to epson Eco tank printers and I never regretted the change!
The linux drivers for both HP and Brother are so much better than Windows, when the spooler has an error i can actually go figure out what the error is and get my print to work rather than just sitting there and looking at useless window panes that tell me nothing.
I have 2 HP all in one printer/scanners running under Linux Mint. One runs happily with Linux Simple Scan, but with the other it will not connect, so I have to use the old xsane program for scanning, I don't know why, but it works!
I love that there is now finally a consumer revolt against the ink mafia. The ink mafia is why I switched to Laser printers and never looked back.
My HP LaserJet M1120n MFP (purchased in 2008) has been fed "compatible" (cheap) cartridges all it's life and it's still going strong. If possible they'll bury it with me...
I switched to laser because of the price of liquid ink and how few printouts they provide. Sure, a toner cartridge seems expensive but it will printer several reams of paper where an ink jet will only printer around 100 sheets if you’re lucky.
@@stumpybear60 yes and the toner never dries out either.
The revolt hasn’t and won’t completely die out. Those of us who’ve been cheated by these companies refuse to buy from HP again (and other companies that display this greedy behavior). It isn’t much but it’s a start!
HP have always been the most expensive to replace the ink cartridges. I advise anyone who asks me about printers, NOT to buy HP cos of their refueling costs. As a printer, they appear to work fine, but the price of the ink cartridges is absurd for what is actually in the little thing!
I just recently got rid of an HP Officejet 6600. While it was a great quality printer, almost every time you booted it up it would run this maintainance task. I understand that printers do that and use the ink to lubricate the rails and such but this would go on for 15+ minutes all the while I could literally hear it dumping out ink inside the printer. Not a shocker that it needed new cartridges almost every 3 weeks. When I finally got rid of it I had a look inside and I saw this little area to the right, kind of similar to a laser printer maintenance box, that was just filled with years of wasted ink. Certainly not being used to lubricate anything.
Replaced it with a Canon inktank and havent looked back. 1,000,000 times better than the HP.
I have a Canon Pixma that seems to waste ink like that. I didn't know canon released a tank printer. I thought Epson was the only one that has done that. Interesting.
@@caddyguy5369 Almost all of them have... HP, Canon, Epson, Brother etc all have ink-tank printers now
I just stopped buying printers. Last All-in-one I bought from Canon required an ink change when we never used the printer, it appeared to be on a timer. They chipped the cartridge so you can't just flip out the same cartridge, you have to use a new one, while the old one is still full.
Then the printer broke. I'm DONE!
This is just proof of the point that if you do not address these problems early then companies only get more abusive with their tactics. They should have been sued when they made it so you could not print black and white when any of the color ink cartridges ran out. When I even think of an HP printer, the “Office Space” movie plays in my head.
I agree but there was a good reason for government interests to overlook this because yellow ink was used for a special fingerprint encoding. (think a yellow noise pattern that can actually be decoded to determine a unique serial-number like code associated for that particular printer) I'm sure there are better stenographic techniques now.
@@jnbsp3512 is this still a thing, always thought this was some kind of urban legend conspiracy theory
I addressed the problem two decades ago. They continued like nothing happened. Well, I didn't go to court just abandon their printers / office combos. Especially sad because Hewlett Packard was once the greatest company and awesome customer support.
That can't print black without color ink isn't even the worst thing hp does. If you install a brand new full cartridge into an hp printer and you take it out and put it back in the printer will refuse to accept the cartridge again even if it's full and never been used.
I learned two things, 1. HP is full of it, and 2. Louis needs to get better at reading red flags. :D Love you, dude.
It's a hazard of mostly working with things.
I just got my hands on an old Canon printer that is widely still supported by the aftermarket ink community. I don't know what else to call them so I'm just going to call them that. And I have a third party ink cartridge on the way right now. I'm never going to have to pay ink prices for ink again
Wait for the Canon to self destruct itself after some time over the warranty period. After years of using Canon's I've decided to throw them out because they all stopped working after ~2 years. Got a Brother s/w laser and I'm more than happy with it.
@@VioFax Having said that, people are used to loss-leader prices on printers, which the manufacturers make up for by scalping you on the ink. Lots of people will just look at the basic price and a Brother is three times the price. Thankfully, I can just use my work photocopier for things like this, and Adobe Scan works well for most stuff nowadays.
@@mshaftenberg no this is an older Cannon printer. I'm talking like Windows 7 cannon printer
If it works, just never update anything, software, firmware, etc. I got a machine that turned into trash by software updates.
@@rtbear674 there is no software to update. It was just a driver that I got off of a third party website and it just works running it in Windows 7 compatibility mode
I know one thing for a fact. I will never again spend a penny with HP. And it's exactly for ridiculous reasons like this. I've got brother and Epson equipment that all works great but I've got two HP printer scanners in the closet that are complete junk. Never again
As an IT pro (system engineer), one of the easiest thing we can prove is how cheaper it always is to replace a HP printer with literally anything else.
It's cheaper to buy a new HP color laserjet printer than it is to buy toner for one. I'm reading from HP's website right now:
HP Color LaserJet Enterprise M455dn costs $539.
The replacement toner for yellow, cyan, magenta, and black adds up to $897.96.
How psychotic is that? Make it make sense.
@@OuroborosChoked you will get half (or less) filled toners (starter pack) with your new printer. But yes it seems they don't make much profit on the printers, as they are only the means to sell you toner and ink.
@@OuroborosChoked
New ones have 1/3 to 1/2 cartridges. They usually say how many pages. I always make a spreadsheet for printers to determine the purchase cost AND the cost per page for colour and mono. The replacement cartridges cost per page can vary wildly, even at the same printer price.
The other thing that pisses me off is refusing to support older printers.
I agree
Thank God that the UK is groundbreaking and looking out for consumers around the world, with their recent RIGHT TO REPAIR legislation. The law will require manufacturers to make spare parts available for electrical appliances within two years of all model launches. That includes all electronic personal devices such as cell phones, laptops, tablets, etc. i.e. no more hardwired batteries. Clearly breaking the manufacturers' game that electronics are disposable as soon as something goes wrong, reducing electronic waste, and consumer gouging - a new $800 cell phone because a $1 component fried.
did you say thx to EU yet? 😆