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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 20 พ.ค. 2022
- As a prelude to my Angel Season 5 review, I thought I'd rank some Buffyverse characters using a tier list. Turns out there were a LOT of characters to rank, so this ended up being a three-part video. Enjoy the first one!
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Channel members have access to parts 2 and 3 right now! They will be made publicly available over the next week. Thanks for watching!
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@@ACROBATON Should be a button called JOIN near the subscribe button etc.
@@ACROBATON I think it is a phone thing now you mention it
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I had a big smile on my face and then you mentioned Buffy being kicked out of her own home by the potential brats and INSTANTLY my blood began to boil. Everytime I recall that episode I go from calm and relaxed to raging, pissing, foam at the mouth fury lol.
😅 yeah same but then I remember those same brats getting an earful from Spike
That scene made me hate everyone except Buffy
Because you're one of those who can't understand when Buffy is in the wrong.
@@angelus1738 Except she wasn't wrong, she knew Caleb was hiding something and she was right, he had the scythe.
@@AdzPower Her plan was wrong. The potentials and the scoobies didn't deny Buffy's idea about the scythe. It was a hunch, that much was true, but they never outright said she was wrong. They had an issue with her plan of storming the vineyard and dwindling their forces. And they were right, because the correct play was for Buffy to sneak in and get it alone, thereby avoiding casualties to their team. Buffy was being reckless.
Oh fun, an entire Buffyverse tier list 🥰
"She's 18, and you have the emotional maturity of a blueberry scone" is the quote you're thinking of.
And suddenly I’m angry with how they wrote Giles in season 7 again. He deserved so much better!
I, too, enjoy Angelous over Angel. It’s fine.
But he was written well tho. I always thought Giles was cool, but him in s7 solidified him as one of my favorites. He was the only one with sense. While Buffy was out pushing her friends away, shutting everyone down, and throwing the entire mission for Spike, Giles was the only one with sense who did what had to be done. He was not once wrong in anything he did the entire season, that includes trying to get rid of a liability like Spike and when he went against Buffy in Empty Places when she was going to obliterate her army by trying to bring them all back to the vineyard.
They really shouldn't have chickened out on killing him off and having the First use his face whenever dealing with Buffy.
Would have happily sat and bingewatched an entire two hour video of you talking about these characters, but thank you for splitting them up and forcing me to take a break! It's lovely to hear you talking about Buffy again - especially loved everything you said about Buffy the character and her arc. She really is so deserving of the title and so deserving of the hopeful ending she was given.
Amy not being in S tier is an outrage. The amount of and dedication to method acting it took to stay in that cage for 4 years was simply outstanding. It was a truly awe inspiring performance.
Cordy at the top of the list makes me adore your list, it doesn't matter where you put the rest of them 😂😋
This is so much fun, Liam, thank youuuuuu!! 💞
Don't worry, I volunteer as a human shield by stating that Xander is my favourite character, even if, or possibly because, he is very flawed. So there you have it! 🙋🏻♂️🎯
Great video Liam, really looking forward to watching parts 2 & 3. You should know by now that when it comes to Buffy fandom you're never going to please everyone, and you're most definitely going to offend someone 😂
I’m a Xander fan. I agree with the B ranking.
In my head he was a low A, but then I remembered just how gross he was for the first season and a half. Yeah, B is good.
Anything lower than A is sacrilege. He's pretty much the only core member of the Scooby gang on either show to be ranked that low. And Giles at A tier likewise.
But then this guy thinks making sex jokes is a mortal sin, so what can you expect lol. He says Xander cheating on Cordelia was awful and he showed no contrition? Willow did the same thing and she got no punishment for it. Every bad thing Xander does other characters do and get passes for. It's weird. How he gets shit for Hell's Bells blows my mind. He's the victim in that episode. That was Anya's horrific, misandrist past coming back to haunt her. She deserved what she got. But Xander has to simp for it for the rest of the show? Nauseating.
@@cockoffgewgle4993 Xander is the normal guy, his sins are the most relatable to the audience. The rest of the characters all get so into the mystic side of things, the bad things they do are easier to compartmentalize as fantasy.
It's really hard to relate to Anya having 1'000 years of vengeance history (and a bunch of demons who may want revenge on her now that she's mortal).
It''s hard to relate to Willow almost ending the world or using mind magics on someone.
How do you relate to Buffy's season 5/6 death/revival? How do you relate to mystic dreams and superpowers?
Riley works for a secret military organization that hunts demons.
Giles is part of a centuries old secret organization. He killed one of his friends by summoning a demon.
Andrew gets yelled at by the First Evil.
Spike and Angel are conflicted with suddenly getting a soul.
Xander lies, cheats, is jealous, leaves his bride at the altar, and his dialogue hasn't aged as well as the others (comedy never does). We've all experienced a friend who does one of those things. I
@@kyleellis1825 Most of what I referenced is real life stuff, and much of the "fantasy" side of things gets very much related to. eg. everyone feels sympathy for Buffy for what Angelus does to her. And what Spike does to her.
Faith tries to rape/kill Xander. It barely gets mentioned again. Willow shows the same entitlement to Xander when he gets with Cordelia as Xander does towards Buffy (which people get pissed off about), she has a ragery crying fit at him when she finds out. Like it has anything to do with her.
Oh, and Anya cheats on Xander just for the lols, with a character he hates. All the characters lie, cheat and are jealous at various points.
The funny thing is, he gets treated (by the fans) like female characters often get treated in male-led shows. Which would inevitably result in cries of sexism. A couple of reasons for both: these characters tend to be disconnected from the "fun" action parts of the show, so the audience get bored with them more easily. Xander has no powers. Which intersects with your point about his actions being more real lifey-y, mundane and relatable. The same reasons fans of Breaking Bad get more pissed off at Skyler being a nagging bitch than Walt murdering people.
Also, he's not hot. That would excuse pretty much everything he did in the eyes of an audience lol.
Also, I'll never understand film/TV and society treating rape and sexual assault stuff as worse than murder and other forms of violence. People care more about women being harmed than men, physically or emotionally, they elicit far more empathy. Just how it is.
@@cockoffgewgle4993 I get what you mean, but those characters are not relatable anymore(even if they make the same choices, we attribute the cause to supernatural life). Xander still is the everyman. It's why his sins hurt the most. We can understand making them ourselves.
How do you relate to a slayer/1'000 year old ex demon, secret military agent, secret society member, world's most powerful witch, werefwolf, souled vampire, being a ball of energy?
You may not think he's hot, but society very much disagrees with you. And pretty much everything was forgiven.
BEcause it's more relatable. We all know someone who's been assaulted. Ve don't all know someone who has been murdered
Didn't Angel have the amazing "Not my best entrance" line that I can't find on TH-cam right now? Way better than falling naked from the sky.
Yes! That was so funny.
When did he say this?
Buffy’s character development is easily the best in the series and you are totally right about her being for once a great titular character. Buffy’s my favourite character in the show.
Great ranking Liam
Having Harmony above both Joyce and Darla just seems...wrong lol. I pretty much agree with the rest of your rankings though. :)
Harmony is so hilarious though how can you not love her.
Never heard of a tier list till your video! While I don't agree with a few of your rankings, I understand your reasoning as it makes sense. I like Xander, even though he made some really bad choices that annoyed me.
Clem is clearly the best character in both shows.
#JusticeforSnyder Should have been S-Tier without a second's thought.
If anybody asked me who my favorite characters are on Buffy the Vampire Slayer I will immediately say Buffy and Willow.
Interesting how relatively low-ranked Darla is for you. For a character that starts out so one-note, she soars on Angel the series. In season two of that show, her absolute horror at being human and alive and how she couldn't handle it really resonated with me. I was impressed when she came to terms with her mortality in "The Trial". But even re-vamped, she did finally end up connecting to the part of her that was innately good and selfless. You could have a debate over the extent to which Connor's soul was influencing her at the time, but taken as a whole, Darla as a character, when given the opportunity to make the right choices, did. Her tragedy was that whenever things were done TO her (being sired, being brought back to life by W&H, being revamped by Dru), she heavily leaned into evil. This gives her a quintessentially human quality: "Why should I strive to transcend sin when I was put into this situation by others?" This balancing act between giving up and giving in on the one hand, and overcoming and growing on the other, was magnificently captured by Julie Benz, who IMO was the best actress on Angel the series.
Meh. I like Julie Benz a lot. I don't care for Darla much.
So far, so correct 😌
I guess I’ll wait patiently and find out, but is Angelus his own character?
And the answer is yes. Haha
Xander and Joyce are both A
Harmony and Jenny over Darla,
and Angel lower than S.
You sir are a mad man
Probably the biggest difference between Liam's ranking and mine-if I'd this whole tier list, which I haven't-is that I would put Darla higher. But obviously the point of this video is to see _his_ opinions, so he should put the characters wherever he wants.
I think Cordelia is playing a character in S1
It's easier to form a concrete opinion on characters with less screen time. I love Xander in seasons 2/5/7. Don't really care for him in the other seasons. I liked Cordelia less as she got nicer. Harmony was best used in S4/5 of Buffy. Giles was really good in S1/2/3 and should have been written out in Season 4 coming back in season 7 as the First Evil.
I hated Joyce until Season 3, loved her for 3/4/5. Dawn was really good in season 7, pretty bad in season 5. Hated Angel on Buffy and loved him on his own show. Went from loving to hating Spike by the final season. Loved season 1/2 Willow, HATED season 3/4 willow, started liking her again in season 5/6/7. Oz was awesome in S2/3 and sucked in S4.
Anya #1
Good list but I can’t believe Harmony is ranked higher than Joyce
Season 7 Giles was done dirty by the scripting. I really thought he was not quite the same character as he had been in the previous six seasons.
Because he was supposed to be killed off and used as the face of the First Evil. They chickened out and Anthony Stewart Head is on record saying he really wanted to be the final big bad.
😂🥰🥳
For me :
S : Buffy, Willow, Anya, Faith, Spike, Drusilla, The Mayor, Glory, Wesley, Fred, Snyder, Andrew, Giles
A : Angel, Tara, Harmony, Jenny, Lorne, Jonathan, Mr Trick, Lilah
B : Joyce, Xander, Dawn, Oz, Cordelia (but maybe C), Anne, Lindsay, Jasmin, Darla, Kendra, Warren (but so horrible ), Holtz, Larry
C : Riley, Gunn, The Master, Doyle, Walsh, Adam, Caleb, The First, Kennedy, Scott
D : The Anointed one, Connor, Forrest, Hank Summers, Parker
You forgot Knox who deserve to be at the bottom of the barrel 😤 Never have I despised a character the MOST right before they exited 😒
@@RitsychServare exactly, maybe the worst...
Where is Giles?
@@catarinemarques231 I forgot to mention him but that's done!
Joyce is meant to ground Buffy and make her more of a normal person
I think the fandom consensus for Willow is that she is Bi and not just lesbian and I prefer that as it means her love with Oz was just as real while it was happening as her live for Tara
Except that the next seasons are just hammering in the fact that she's not into boys at all.
The problem here is that there are lesbians getting "crushes" or dating men before they get out of the closet irl, but I don't think any of them could be as genuine as the relationship between Willow and Oz. So while I want to consider her a bisexual woman and I mostly do, she doesn't consider herself one and that makes me uncomfy to put a label on a character that insist to be called otherwise.
Guess that's the biphobia for you.
@@mayadargeon2172 I think, at least the community I am in, seemed to think its cause Whedon probably didn't know what Bi was
@@mayadargeon2172 yeah I'd say, that is potentially writers' main error for making the character seem inconsistent throughout the series. It's like, maybe in the earlier script, she was to turn "lesbian" by season 4 that the cause of it had to do with doing more magic but then season 2 finale would've done the trick but nothing hinted at it. Lol This is where the inconsistency seems to be apparent. Somehow, nothing hinted in the character as "lesbian repressed" that would be easily overlooked in earlier seasons until 4th. I mean, the magic didn't seem to directly connect her to it. That's how I see it.
@@mayadargeon2172 I’ve read that the network flat out refused to allow anyone to use bisexual as a term back then. And as a bisexual woman who watched the show live, I’d never heard the word at that point in my life, so I don’t think you can blame it on whedon so much as society and tv at large. Buffy really isn’t close to the only show with rep that was progressive at the time but which looks regressive to modern viewpoints.
@@miriam8376 I completely agree. Even many modern shows have trouble with bi-vs-gay distinction. During S2 of _Legends of Tomorrow_ there were multiple lines of dialogue that implied Sara was strictly gay; fortunately in S3 they remembered she was actually bi. _The Boys_ calls out this exact issue in 2x05: a celebrity who is bisexual is told by in-universe marketing people that "lesbian is an easier sell. A bit more cut and dry".
Loved your ranking so far. I agree with everything...except for one thing. Cordelia. I would put her a couple of pegs down. For me, she didn't really win me over and I never really bought her Angel character arc. But I know though that I am in a minority here. I guess what influenced me a bit, is all those talk shows I saw her in back in the day. I realised Charisma is exactly the character she was playing...