The thing is, if you're an asshole....a racist......a bigot...a power hungry power tripper, you should NOT be allowed to be a cop. Full stop. Too much power.....a gun, and the ability to ruin peoples lives.
lmfao he has the biggest apologist ever speaking for the fucked up police.. these guys the cops would lioe and these mofos would swear it to b TRUE....
I don't like his views, he is as LEFTIST as they come However he does a good job of listening, allowing all sides to air their views and does not actively try to steer the conversation in a direction more suited to his views unlike most of his female colleagues (especially the latino discussion interviewer)
this is literally one side of the story. This is not impartial and thats fine(in this context). Its a discussion by police about policing and we're getting their side of the story.
Go ahead and scroll through Vice and Vice news channels last few months of videos and break them down into topics and youll see how abundantly clear it is what position they take
@@johncole4882 Fair enough. I'm impressed with THIS video. And from the other stuff I've seen from Vice, they tend to lean away from a lot of the viewpoints expressed in this in how they report, which means the people who worked on it get that much more respect from me.
@@bigdickmcgee3293 I more meant the moderator refraining from playing "gotcha" games. In most "journalism" I see, if the interviewer is talking to someone they disagree with, it's pretty obvious by how they ask questions and phrase things. This guy just asked impartial questions and got out of the way.
You are so right. Why is this? Why are there no answers. Oh..I forgot..corruption and that thin blue line...that's the true answer but they won't admit it.
One thing critically wrong wrong with your rant is that you have no idea whether any of it has anything to do with these particular officers. You used anecdotes to make assumptions about their experiences, and the experiences of police officers in general for that matter and this leads to logical fallacy. No one here said anything about avoiding accountability either so your making an argument for it’s own sake without actually hearing them.
@@mrmateojones8368 did you mean to reply to the original comment? There was no rant, no anecdotes, and there is a huge problem with police accountability.
@@abraxasjinx5207 the individual I must’ve been replying to must’ve deleted their comments but no, there really isn’t a “huge” problem, at least not now in 2023, and that victory was hard fought for four decades.
@jarquig Thank you, the cop on the top right mentions that racism exists in all occupations, and he is correct. Where he misses the mark is the implication that policing is the same as plumbing. A plumbers racism is most likely not going to result in the abuse or death of another person, where as a cops can.
@@regularperson9801 what about it? I didn't realize that people are being victimized, abused, and murdered by racist basketball players. Police need to be held to a higher standard because they are given the tools and means to kill others.
If vice did more things like this. I’d watch. I loved old vice when Gavin was still working. Back when it was more punk rock and less social justice warrior. Go watch a Thumbs Up.. now way vice can even say have the things that David Choe says with censorship now. With that said they showed literally all sides here and I feel like I have a better understanding of both sides when before I was in the middle.
And how many cops, LEOs and departments are in America??? Yet in today's videophone era, there's usually between 10-20 incidents a year that make national news involving police misconduct, and when these incidents do happen the media covers it nonstop. Now if misconduct was that widespread across the country and every cop, or even a 4th of them was cooked, there'd be 10s of thousands of videos capturing these cooked acts. Now, I'm not saying there aren't bad cops that should absolutely find another profession, , I'm just saying there's not near as many as the media tries to make them out to be.
Brian Jacobs that is almost always the truth, its always blown out of proportion and its natural for people to generalize a group like Police, and to have back in your mind that thats one bad apple out of how many thousands of police officers in the USA is hard. Its giving some other prospective. But i dont think it should be swept under the rug, its bad whenever force is overused and abused, the least amount of force to remove the treat is always the right move. so to have constructive debate about the issue and how to fix it is always welcomed and is going to lead to change in the future.
Two things that I really wanted to hear asked and I didn’t are: 1. What effect has the War on Drugs had on policing and does it make a difference in your communities? After almost 50 years and $3 trillion dollars, is it time we do something different. 2. What does your department do to identify officers suffering from PTSD and how do they help those officers?
Two very good points! I’m about 8 minutes in to the video at the moment, these are two topics I for the most part clicked the video in the first place. Unfortunate to find out these aren’t answered. 👍🏻
CaliforniaCheez The day no thing didn’t work, the drug crisis is worse then ever more American are dying, millions spend and drug cartels and dealers are still out there making money, alcohol and crack and cigarettes kill by the scores while marijuana kills none. Hell Nixon started the war on drugs to bully minorities and his political opponents.
I don't have an answer for the first, but having worked in EMS and being pretty much part of the club (police, fire and EMS), there are crisis counselor on staff generally in each department to reach out if a particular scene is affecting you in a negative way. Sometimes, if the scene is multiple fatality, or involving children - we are required to meet with counselor before we are allowed to go back in service to assess our mental state. There is little stigma within the station, it's just that they do realize that if we are upset, our delivery of help will be compromised. That said, it does rely on your being honest about how an incident is affecting you. If you fake it through, you won't get continued help. I'm unsure if police have a tendency to fake it through out of concern of being judged by the fellow officers (I didn't see this in EMS but know police can razz each other more). Hope that helps!
A police officer should respond to a suicide as well as medical staff because a person in crisis no longer cares about life. That person in crisis, if deescalated, may be more apt to admit to an officer that they've killed a significant other, a family member, or left kids unattended--and a law officer needs to be on hand for that emergency right then and there.
Aaron L hey you make understandable points that I can empathize with. But the reality is that very few professions carry the risk of acutely (and legally) killing an otherwise healthy person. Any officer who doesn’t understand and empathize with the vital need the public has to have an accurate, detailed, and impartial record of what happens every single time a FREE citizen is killed by the agent of the government of a FREE country like they United States, then they can freely choose a new career. We can mitigate all the issues you mentioned with sensible policy and citizen review boards external to the police department (cut down on camera footage misuse for intradepartmental politics). What we can’t mitigate is the destruction of a life that has been ended by an officer too soon.
@Aaron L Many fast food joints have cameras on their employees all the time. My husband has a camera on him and he works in a sawmill. So why shouldnt cops also be under surveillance?
@@dedaveful As the person stated, as a cop, you can get fired with things as simple as touching somebody, not kidding, so with all those things it just is a little bit odd, but all police officers should have a body cam. Also another reason why it shouldnt be on all the time is if they go to the bathroom, that is really creepy y'know.
Racists in other professions don’t carry guns though bud, so yes there are racists everywhere but I don’t think the cashier at Best Buy is at same risk for killing black men as a cop is.
@@Sooner85 are you saying the racist at best buy should be shooting black ppl? Gun rights are fine but what the person is saying is that an officer has a position of power which includes handling a gun, meaning a racist working that job would be more likely to use the gun (a tool provided by work) to carry out racist actions (shooting black ppl). The best buy worker can be racist and can own a gun but the occupation isn't putting him in a position to use that racism as a weapon, where police as an occupation is giving that as a possibility.
@@stinky324 "are you saying racist at best buy should be shooting black people" In response to: "Most people can go buy guns" In response to: "Racists in other professions don't carry guns" My head hurts...
you know more white people are killed by cops right, this isn't a race thing, its a stress thing, Baltimore did a shoot no shoot simulator and many people fired in every single scenario, many people don't realize how much stress cops are under in these situation, what happened to George Floyd is wrong, but in other situations the cops exhausted many other options. Many officers have died because they waited too long, also you are more likely to be shot by a black officer than a white one, so its it not a race problem, it more of a stress problem.
7:29. The point was missed. "This has always been going on..." "This" he was referring to is not prejudice. "This" is police not being held accountable for acting on that prejudice.
Do you have ANY single instances/examples of that? Just like the majority of the panel said, cops do tell on other cops and a lot of cops do get turned over.
35:08 police dont need to respond to every suicide threat but way too many officers believe that a suicidal person is also homicidal and that is absolutely not true.
@los Angeleno well, if you call 911 for an ambulance the cops show up. That doesn't need to happen in a lot of circumstances but cops like to make everyone feel they are needed.
@Jordon Carlson even if you had social works respond to things like this. Police would have to be there to guarantee life safety. Just like if medics and firefighters are responding to a dangerous situation, life safety for the responders is put into consideration
@Jordon Carlson that might be dangerous. People are unpredictable. Your responding to people who you don't know who can do anything. They can be non violent or they can be. Especially with people who are mentally unstable and domestic violence issues. There's just to many variables to a first responders jobs. For example I've responded to a drunk man who was suicidal. Medics took care of him. And cops were right there with them. N the guy was taken care of.
@Jordon Carlson I agree with you that everyone needs to held accountable. There's certainly people who are first responders that shouldn't be. In your situation in Ontario was it confirmed that they shot him for no reason or is that an assumption on your part. They could have shot him for a reason, I have no idea, I wasn't there. Not every police involved shooting happens for no reason. I think there needs to be a common understanding between both parties. Civilians need to understand what cops have to go through and vice versa. We're all in this together. I think alot of people take what police officers do for granted
@Jordon Carlson with your personal situation do you know how that call came in. I'm not saying they were right to kick your door in but was there any reason to them to be it was necessary to do it. Bc when people call 911 information is given to a dispatcher and then that info is given to responders. So do know why someone called in for a wellness check on you
Lee Adams is an incredible mediator. Thank you bringing hope to our current discourse. And thanks to the officers being cordial in sharing their experiences.
Love this interview so much. So many different perspectives. Everyone so respectful. We need more of this. 🙏 To all the officers who are good human beings, thank you for your service in your community. There are a lot of bad apples out there and I am so proud of you guys who keep your head up and do your job and do the right thing.
Dude the ONLY reason I even opened the comment section was because I was thinking, 'man he looks so much like that guy from 60 days in' haha. Thanks for confirming!!
YES! I was like there's that douche David Duncan. Fake ass dude was acting like a straight clown in jail. Although on this he was saying some really good stuff
Excellent panel & discussion of a very, very crucial matter that impacts our country from coast to coast, north & south, for EVERY person living here in the USA. With much appreciation to you Lee Adams & all those involved at Vice! Thank you.
Wow thought this would be straight police public affair comments but this well needed and informative conversation from the people with real world experience.
it is and with great power comes great responsibility. but that one officer put it wisely, we are all human so it is gonna happen. however, higher standards are needed.
Crazy thing is he said that right after the other younger brother talked about blacks having issues with officers stretches back a long time and their parents have stories as well as grandparents.
@Ama Andreea it's amazing how people find a way to insert "The left, libs, libtards, or Democrats" into every conversation like people's political stance defines who they're as a person.
I respect this dialogue & everyone in it’s perspective, experience, opinion, & most of all Service.. More of these talks have to be had. Maybe next time a few cops & a few members of the community to have a healthy, grown up conversation about the issues plaguing our society today. 👍🏽VICE.
Redant23: It’s a pretty damn complex situation. But no matter what or why, it’s pretty damn obvious that a good portion of the citizens in & of this country, are fed up with how the police for a large part conduct themselves in general.
It all comes down to leadership. Until older generation is out of power does no one realize this. Thats why we have this virus to take out older generation.
I wish Matt spoke more, he was so quiet. He looked like he had a lot of wisdom to share. Sounds humble too. Also loved Louis and Wendy! Louis was def my fav
Maybe when an officer gets fired they should print it in the local news, their name and the reason for termination. Also there should be a national database for police officers who get fired from agencies.
This is what my state nursing board does. Anybody who loses their license or is under disciplinary action gets their name, license number, what they did published and sent out in the regular bulletin and is available to the public.
John Proctor because of the second amendment you have the right to bear arms yourself and not all law enforcement officers are bad and the bad officers don’t overweigh the thousands of fucking CHILD CRIMINALS gang banging and stealing and i see younger and younger kids with guns and it’s sad please don’t @ me again you fucking clown
Because people need to get more educated on both sides. Just because there’s a major issue within the system that needs to be dealt with, doesn’t mean that all hell isn’t breaking loose in the city...I see ugly, ugly %&$@ out there every night, they’re putting up with a lot, and putting their lives on the line. The good ones deserve the highest respect. The other day some street racers caused some accidents and rollovers on the freeway 🤮 I couldn’t imagine going to that scene.
He also had incidents when he was moonlighting as a bouncer. He assaulted some people, but since he was a police officer he never got charged... But he did get fired...
I felt like Matt knows not to say anything especially when it comes to race, cause maybe his experience were good but if he mentions that David would probably attack him cause he’s white.
He knows not to talk just for the sake of talking. Many times in these large group settings other say what you were thinking. It's about meaningful contribution.
This is a great piece, many thanks and respects to Vice for taking the time to put this on. I'm a police officer in DC and I can agree with the officer who said police officers get fired or forced to resign all of the time, it just isn't broadcast. When departments do the right thing, when officers do the right thing, it is rarely known to the public. However, when an officer does the WRONG thing, the whole country knows, and the opinion of most of the public is formed from this. Most people get in to this career for the right reasons. Many days I wonder if it's worth sticking to it, being that it's such a thankless job. I personally felt like I was doing more positive things for my community when I worked fpr a local TV station or when I worked as a bartender.
The part about protecting A-holes with seniority: this is why the police departments in many places are no different than the gangster orgs they are policing. Also the military structure doesn’t help i.e. “brass”
@@jacob2790 They also teach in the departments "it's us against them" so pretty much on average cops hold a huge disdain towards civilians, and if anyone says that's not the case are super naive.
Yeah, middle white America needs to see this. It's all fun and games until it happens to you. I don't know what it's like to be a Black American, but I can tell you I know what it's like to get shat on by the cops and the system that protects it. We need criminal justice reform- the whole lot. This is an American problem. The masses need to see this.
@@LincolnSquareLeonidas we absolutely need reform... tbh I can't even fathom how our " justice" system had been allowed to rot and deteriorate in the way it has. Things that should be considered absolute atrocities are common practice today. I'm sure there is barely anything left of this fossilized horse carcass, but things will never change until we eliminate the for-profit prison system... the very idea of such a system being allowed to exist sounds like something from some movie about a barbaric dystopian future rather than something that real americans would have ever allowed.
The crazy thing is the call to "Defund the Police" was to acknowledge that the Police are ill-equipped to handle multifaceted issues because the "use of force" isn't always necessary. If you listen to explanations by the original BLM that coined the phrase they actually embody everything the Law Enforcement agents stated here as well for new features they would like to see in their departments. I don't know why they named it Defund the Police, where it was more of Defund the Police Use of Force, which our News outlets ran with the prior. People, we ALL want the same thing. I know the extremists on both sides are yelling the loudest, but we have to find a way for the rest of us to have an intelligent dialogue. We have 50 states and it's our duty to listen to each other and form a more perfect union.
Look at blm leaders now🤦♀️buying million dollar mansions in gated communities guarded by police🤦♀️ while the cities they destroyed are in ruins and crime filled because they defunded the police.
Right, and the growing amount of guns in the hands of an increasingly anti-police society plays no role in this what so ever. Its always the other sides fault, never our own.
@stephen Krik We tried all look where it got us and our communities aren't strong enough financially to be a stand alone complex we need one one instead of two stops the name blame game right there
My problem with Tatum is that he acts like all police is the same and there's never any wrong. I'm glad another officer told him that it's never that simple.
Tatum is the most level headed guy of the bunch though and it sounds like his police department got things right. Maybe they should implement what they do throughout the entire nation.
@@SonOftheBattleCry Laws can be rewritten. For funding I'm sure you can easily afford to cut some of your defense budget and spend that on national security instead.
Thank you Vice for allowing police officers to have a voice. It's vitally important that we not only hear from protesters and the general public who have their opinions and beliefs about law enforcement, but to hear from the officers who actually do the job and have insights that you just can't get from people who have never been a cop. Dialogue is an important key to progress.
Perhaps if everyone stopped throwing them under the bus, including their own "leadership," as well as their own brothers and sisters, aunts and uncles telling them theyre all racist oppressors, they wouldn't need to band together and protect each other so much? Stop with the rhetoric and start with the good faith communication.
I can say that in my area (Houston, Tx) we do have an amazing crew of mental health officers! My daughter has a lot of psychiatric issues and I needed her transported to the hospital based on her having heard voices and my concern as could jump from the car on the way to seek help. A regular officer showed up, but because I was very specific during the call that this was a mental health issues, they had a specific unit come to get her and they were able to really de-escalate the situation and handled her in such a way that she actually placed herself in the vehicle and didn't require any use of force. It was the most respectful interaction with police because they had the training on how to handle it.
Imagine just simply sharing those details in order to prevent future need to have to defuse a possible turn of events. And you didn't have to utter the words race or racial segregation etc I love that honestly !! So nice to have educated opinions and discussion while bringing good-ending stories to use as an example in the future. I hope your daughter has been able to overcome her hardships and is well and happy.. Xoxoo
This journalist is great. I would like to see more from journalists like him at vice. I've seen some journalists who set their interviewee up for failure on Vice.
A lot of these comments really prove that some people will hate police no matter what. This was an honest discussion between people of every background and there are some phenomenal points on both sides that I hadn’t considered
These are all officers with many years experience and most were retirement age already... Notice no recruits, and they all seemed to be beat cops. No traffic cops, or CHP, etc. CHP I think actually do a decent job... I'd like to see public defenders and judges get into these conversations, as that is the system these police are feeding. I find it far too easy for police to throw people into the system and then say that person is the court's responsibility.
I’m listening. I’m really trying, but marijuana is still federally illegal. I have no doubts that these guys have arrested people for unjust laws. I guess I’m more angry at the system. Too bad these guys chose to be on the front line of that system. I can’t support a system that is broken and corrupt to its core.
I loved what David (bottom left corner) said about how “ The Greatest Tool Police Officers Have Is Not On Their Belt “. When we think about what qualities make for a good police officer we mostly think of things like strong, assertive, commanding, but I think compassion and empathy are just as important to a well rounded police officer. I think if police departments put more emphasis on looking for and training these qualities into their officers we would have much more effective officers and far less incidents of police violence and shootings.
We dont want pussies on the job. They are dealing with hardcore criminals and you think they gonna be better cops if they show more "empathy and compassion"?
@@XxWatulookinat69xX no you idiot its called being compassionate when its needed instead of being a gun slinging jackass, its not being weak but being smart and assecisng the situation
While police should be/are compassionate and must build a positive relationship with the community, it’s imperative that police officers command respect amongst the community. If all cops were that nice that they could call a speeder the pulled over a friend, it makes the officer and the safety of others around them vulnerable. And as the first reply said, police have to maintain a very advanced and strong mental capability to assess a dangerous situation and resolve and prevent conflict and accidents within their communities and crime scenes. Also, an officers most important tool is easily a radio.
6:54 This dude doesn't get it. Sure, it may be a "human problem" but the cops have a unique responsibility in society. They need to be held to a higher standard AND HELD ACCOUNTABLE.
Police Union closed door negotiations are the problem. The police actually don’t know how to protect and serve only cause friction between themselves and the citizens who pay taxes to keep them employed. They’re way overpaid,under qualified,uneducated in public relations,politics,community resourcing,etc…. We live in a constitutional republic. Not under a totalitarian,tyrannical regime. You can’t enforce something we the people don’t agree is illegal yet somehow police think they are the judge,jury and executioner once they get their badge. More often than not their seen as a threat to a free society,people are scared to even be seen with them for fear of retaliation,if you are stopped by a cop and they’ve killed before,how do we know they won’t kill you? This is the problem with law enforcement. We don’t know who is who and what they will do if given the opportunity.
At 35:10 that is so damn true! Who is going to serve the civilians the best in that situation? A cop, a paramedic, or a firefighter? Great perspectives all around
We as a Society need to be more worried about police mental health. They are the people that are publicly entrusted and payed by our tax payers dollars to protect and serve us the people so policing and monitoring there mental health should be a high priority for any decent society. All police should have a paid for psychologist by the police department and they should be forced to go to mandatory sessions every week. It's for the Laws benefit and ours.
@Jen Jen I saw a TH-cam video last night of a calm cop pull over young woman she said she'd been a cop for a year. He smelled alcohol on her breath. She was going 20 mph over the speed limit. She was so out of it she didn't even pull her car all the way out of the lane. She didn't want the standard test to see if she was drunk (She knew she'd fail). Then she wanted a supervisor. I think she wanted to buy time to put off any tests at the jail. I didn't bother watching the whole video. She was wasted. The cop was cool and calm.
@@kingofdapirates857 exactly my point you didn't see it was an example.. So go on elsewhere. I wasn't even talking to you in the beginning. I won't respond to you after this.
Amazing content! People need to see more of these conversations.. greetings to all these fantastic professionals putting their opinion out there and sharing their own experiences, ready to expose themselves for the sake of common sense! Brave and clever! And I’m not even from the US.
not according to the left wing, who wants to censor anyone who disagrees with them, and imprison anyone who opposes socialism. They're ideological supremacists who dont believe anyone should be permitted to exist outside of their socialist machine.
Thank Vice for creating a space where we can keep dialoguing this conversation. Listening to Floyd's family and BLM leaders in your video a few months back was incredible and taught me a lot. I just started this and am looking forward to hearing the conversation.
This was so well done, the set up allowed for so much nuance. It was also very powerful to learn more about the veterans on the panel. I really appreciated how specific systemic issues were identified by the people who have and do live it everyday on their job. Frustrated with how it was ended, would have loved to hear they’re response to the last question etc Thank you VICE for allowing real conversation
could use more uniformity across police departments - like the cops committing crimes getting thrown under the bus to *protect the good image of the department* because *police are a social contract with the people,* and need to maintain *benevolence.* Police sticking to their own is no better than policies like 'No Snitching' in criminal communities (clarity: not urban communities, not minority communities, etc and so forth).
@@7ngel NWO and China fight your battles. Your youth are brainwashed. Your racism is in youtube streams. It is getting crazy. The whole world doing BLM marches. NWO want America bad.
Officers get fired for many things but they do not get fired for things that result in lawsuits. If you terminate that officer it’s literally an admission of guilt and that admission is all a lawyer would need to start drawing up lawsuits. If you break the law you should be prosecuted, period.
This was not the case in the Derek Chauvin case. He was fired from his department and they most certainly knew the DA was bringing charges. The judge did rule, though, that the jury could *not* know that he was fired.
26:47 This is what I've long guessed about cops: the ones from more crime and poverty-ridden communities are better in general at handling serious confrontations with suspects than those from more well off cities (edit: meant to write communities) due to more hands on experience.
Exactly life experience. It also means they re better swipe to police the communities that gave them those experiences. They know what’s messed up and they should have an input on how to fix and maintain peace. Best case scenario that is.
Probably one of my favorite segments on this channel. I appreciate the perspective of this panel of people. I was especially interested in the opinion of the police unions, defunding and/or shifting work to other agencies. Thanks for your perspective.
while we definately need many more cops like him... if every cop was like him that would be bad as well... you need cops from all different races / classes / sexes and different backgrounds with their own life experiences. switching from all middle class white males to poor black males isnt the solution. but I definately agree that many more black men and women should be applying and more need to be accepted and put into leadership roles, especially in black communities. police need to hire from within their communities and should be a part of the community they serve.
@@Justin-vr5zn I think you are focusing too much on the race and gender aspect of things. I feel the gentleman in the lower left has a better mentality than most officers and that's what's needed and I think that's what @younglion1804 is trying to say.
David dude seems like he's genuinely a good and a smart person hopefully we can find more people like this to be cops people who use there heads and try to humanize themselves to the public.
David Duncan is a fucking joke. Watch his season of 60 days in. I'd hate to be undercover with him. He's truly a POS. Like, spit on his grave when he dies (the sooner the better) POS.
Fantastic effort Vice and to the speakers. Real conversation and real dialogue to cut through the sensationalism. Made possible because it is long form (not sound bites) with multiple points of views. I'd like to see more. The challenge is how to grow the audience for this content vs. The 1min sound bites that crowd out and currently win the attention economy?
This just reinforced what I've been saying for years. If rhe FOP and the head of the unions would come out and publicly condemn the actions of and the bad cop everytime there was a major incident, we wouldn't need to have thia conversation because everyone would see it's not tolerated, they would easily be removed and prosecuted.
@@farzana6676 That's bullshit. If this was done many decades ago, we wouldn't be here now, well before blm or antifa was thought of. That's what your smooth brain doesn't comprehend.
defund is the wrong word. "Restructure" or other words like "Accountability" and training and Psychological test screening really need to be done better. everywhere. NATIONAL STANDARDS>
The police could be run more similar to the military with a higher chain of command with uniformity accountability/ training / education. Create police for police. In the military there are military police that can arrest anybody, even officers. Cops get away with things people shouldn't get away with. There is no accountability and the oath doesn't mean anything to too many cops. There could be more sectors within the police also. A cop should not be "just a cop." Just like the three sectors of the government maybe there needs to be three or more sectors of the police.
Currently, the FBI is conducting an investigation of LASD's shooting towards Andres Guardado, so basically, this tells you the FBI is basically the military police over regular police agencies.
David Duncan is a fucking joke. Watch his season of 60 days in. I'd hate to be undercover with him. He's truly a POS. Like, spit on his grave when he dies (the sooner the better) POS.
So we're just going to ignore that David (bottom row/Left box) was on "60 Days In"? I read through the comments and noticed no one else had mentioned that. To be honest a lot of his character came out during the airing of that TV show. It's interesting to see him on this panel.
Racism is really big in the medical community as well. I work as a nurse and I sometime over hear the other nurses talking about patients of different races in negative ways.
There does need to be more training for certain police departments. But if you want better cops who have more tools to deescalate a situation before it turns violent, you need more funding. Cutting funding means that their is less money for training, equipment, and salaries, so they have to have sub-par recruits, with sub-par training, with sub-par equipment, who will go for their gun faster.
Defunding should be an experiment in one or a couple cities to see if you wouldn't need as many police from the decreased crime of the funding of other programs; going head into defunding all over is shortsighted. Defunding is just reducing the need for cops since the police funding goes into other things that may reduce crime before it happens, basically getting at the root of the problem (other policies that help poor communities and ghettos would be important also), but we don't know enough yet so we need examples and research.
Bruh you’re being dense lookup the budget for cities and police departments get up to 150 mil while other social programs are getting cut year after year . If more funding would work there wouldn’t be a fucking problem
More training More officers (Not a job I'd want much overtime to be available) Not fear based/combat training Confidence competence public safety Mandatory monthly counseling Third party investigation on complaints National reporting systems on complaints/firings Put funding back into federal and state mental facilities/health Bring critical thinking/life skills back in our schools When police departments serve and protect they don't get sued so damn much Taxpayers can pay for officers and social programs not lawsuits/settlements
So you want all of our local and state taxes to go up? Or you want the Federal government to fund all of this? Maybe we should ban all guns first. Then cops won't be afraid of being shot at every opportunity. Then we need to remove the cartels and legalize all drugs. We need to reduce the prison population and reform prisons so that they rehabilitate, rather than create repeat offenders. Then we need to actively destigmatize hatred to police officers. If your brother, father, friend, uncle, etc. breaks the law, they are bad. Not the cops arresting them. Cops taking someone to the ground is not police brutality. It's detaining.
@@chaosXP3RT I don't think that you read what I wrote. Seems you're injecting fallacious arguments 🤔 Think about the effects of having students supported and encouraged to be functioning adults who contribute to their communities Stable confident officers, effectively policing those communities While I do believe that currently our medical and mental "care" industries are more interested in profit/life long patients rather than health...its a goal help people actually be as healthy as they can. Taxpayer money spent shifts Taxpayer money spent on lawsuits can go to schools Taxpayer money spent on school to prison pipeline can go to the schools Taxpayer money spent on a death sentence can go to community mental health centers
@@breachperplex8846 definitely Marijuana We've long taken the approach of restrict and punish when it comes to drugs and alcohol rather than addressing the many underling issues
In 1995 I applied to the Minneapolis police department, I took the written test then went on to the physical ability test then I was interviewed and all the way to a conditional job offer. The last step was take the psychological test and meet with the shrink. I was a good person, I didn't do anything wrong. I wasn't given the final offer because I was to friendly and laid back. I was so hurt I gave up. He referred to me as an overweight white male. I gave up on a dream.
Great conversation! I think it'd be interesting to get these cops together with a group of activists that have specific demands. I think "defund the police" means a lot of things to different people. I think the police have too many jobs at the moment. We cant expect them to do wellness checks, traffic stops, get kids to school, neighborhood patrols, domestic disputes, warrants, etc etc etc. We could get social workers involved and the police could focus on real crime.
Agreed about "defund". I think it was the wrong word to use. Maybe "invest" in (long overdue) social services, education, crisis intervention, long term mental health, jobs, and "restructure" police responsibilities to focus on criminal/violence. Defund is a negative and term to a lot of people; invest is a positive one.
Most activist groups are radicals who believe All Cops Are Bastards and fascists. You can't negotiate with people who hate every fiber of your being; people who hate the very concept of your job.
Yeah but we also have ncos in the army that get a dui and it’s swept under the rug but a PFC fails tape he’s out by the end of the week and we have a female who hasn’t passed a pt test or rifle qualification in a year and a half and she gets promotion waivers above deserving soldiers. I know that’s not everywhere but the standard gets set somewhere
This was an insightful panel with a great group of officers and I commend these folks for their candor and service. A few good points @ 27:37, 29:35, 38.:28
I'm really glad I watched this to the end. It started a bit slow, but once it got warmed up, I think it became clear just how much common ground there actually is between anti-police brutality protesters/activists and these cops. "Defund the Police" has become a really polarizing phrase because it sounds like "abolish the police" (which some people are also arguing for, though it is not as mainstream a position), and a lot of the things that activists actually want changed about policing will require more investment in police equipment like body cameras, personnel to review footage, and training to improve instinctual behavior.
Lately I felt vice kinda had been sleeping on certain viewpoints. Videos like this are probably the most important to doing the most amount of good for the understanding of common everyday people who don’t interact with police officers in a non investigative manner. Thank you so much 🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻
I believe I just fell #IN #LOVE with a police man. The young guy with the baseball cap on, at the bottom left, that was raised poor and understands that community policing is NECESSARY!!! I love this man & the way he thinks. He has HEART & SOUL, and is the DEFINITION of a true #PEACE-#OFFICER!!! ❤️. #RESPECT~. #Great #job, #Vice!!! Greetings from New Orleans. The home of the most corrupt establishment in America. 😊
The media isnt conjuring up hate sir, the hate has been there since before I was even born. Let's be clear that this is the climate that COPS created. If you wake up to earn the hate, then hate is what you'll get period.
You’re right. Police brutality and systemic racism has been around for decades BEFORE technology and mainstream media have advanced. It’s been around even before I was born too. Tatum just wants to throw the blame and go around the topic.
Watch the conversation continue in Part 2 - th-cam.com/video/8mUYFO48cx8/w-d-xo.html
The thing is, if you're an asshole....a racist......a bigot...a power hungry power tripper, you should NOT be allowed to be a cop. Full stop. Too much power.....a gun, and the ability to ruin peoples lives.
2020(G) “Respect and dignity.” Furthermore: (Vice) (Truth & Facts) >-< (Vice) •-• vice.com •-• (South Park Studios) (Truth & Facts) >-< South Park Studios ••• “Respect and dignity, 2020?”
2020(G) “Respect and dignity.” Furthermore:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_sector?wprov=sfti1
👆
oklahoman.com/article/894007/traffic-flows-again-on-i-40-bridge (🔥🔥🔥)
👇
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Private_sector?wprov=sfti1
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voluntary_sector?wprov=sfti1 👈-👉 en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Probation?wprov=sfti1
th-cam.com/channels/wYz2GULEvMPXDbtPCxnl0g.html •••
Great journalism Vice.
That cop was CIA if he a security officer two days ago. CIA and antifa both hate Trump and on the same side. th-cam.com/video/1BtxF-71580/w-d-xo.html
Why are we painting mural of criminals?
This journalist specifically always has great, impartial and thought provoking pieces. This is the journalistic integrity that America deserves.
Sometimes anyway
Lmao America deserves fox and cnn.
Haha riiiight
lmfao he has the biggest apologist ever speaking for the fucked up police.. these guys the cops would lioe and these mofos would swear it to b TRUE....
gabe hosier wow.... You're ignorant
The best part was there was no “ moderater “. They were free to say what they felt saw and heard. Thankyou.
You would probably like Joe Rogan
The American is that a compliment or insult ?
This was EXCELLENT!!!💪💪💪💪💪💪 conversation.
Isn't Lee Adams the moderator?
watching too much news lately?
I've watched this moderator before, he does a great job of not overtalking his guest like most moderators do. He needs more jobs !! Great Video.
His work with the black liberals and black conservatives was really well done
@@vetboy627 yes, from what I've seen he's always fair with his questioning.
I believe news stations would be more effective with moderators like him.
He does very well
@@vetboy627 yeah, I loved that.
I don't like his views, he is as LEFTIST as they come
However he does a good job of listening, allowing all sides to air their views and does not actively try to steer the conversation in a direction more suited to his views unlike most of his female colleagues (especially the latino discussion interviewer)
I'm floored. Absolutely floored.
The journalistic standard and impartiality in this is truly wonderful. I will take VICE over CNN any day. Bravo.
this is literally one side of the story. This is not impartial and thats fine(in this context). Its a discussion by police about policing and we're getting their side of the story.
Go ahead and scroll through Vice and Vice news channels last few months of videos and break them down into topics and youll see how abundantly clear it is what position they take
@@johncole4882 Fair enough. I'm impressed with THIS video. And from the other stuff I've seen from Vice, they tend to lean away from a lot of the viewpoints expressed in this in how they report, which means the people who worked on it get that much more respect from me.
@@bigdickmcgee3293 I more meant the moderator refraining from playing "gotcha" games. In most "journalism" I see, if the interviewer is talking to someone they disagree with, it's pretty obvious by how they ask questions and phrase things. This guy just asked impartial questions and got out of the way.
This production is the exception not the rule. Most Vice producers make pro left anti conservative marxists content. Most of Vice is ultra liberal.
Officers get fired alot they also get rehired alot in other places
And so do bad teachers :(
I wished they had discussed that. I don't recall them discussing that in part 2.
@Moonshiner Jay no but they do help destroy children's viewpoints & level of learning which can in turn create a shitty cop for example
That's a major problem with policing in the USA.
You are so right. Why is this? Why are there no answers. Oh..I forgot..corruption and that thin blue line...that's the true answer but they won't admit it.
Props to these guys coming on VICE. Knowing full well that the audience probably wasn't gonna like them very much. Glad to see some cops on vice.
One thing critically wrong wrong with your rant is that you have no idea whether any of it has anything to do with these particular officers. You used anecdotes to make assumptions about their experiences, and the experiences of police officers in general for that matter and this leads to logical fallacy. No one here said anything about avoiding accountability either so your making an argument for it’s own sake without actually hearing them.
Not true taxpayers just want some insight
Beautiful Podcast
@@mrmateojones8368 did you mean to reply to the original comment? There was no rant, no anecdotes, and there is a huge problem with police accountability.
@@abraxasjinx5207 the individual I must’ve been replying to must’ve deleted their comments but no, there really isn’t a “huge” problem, at least not now in 2023, and that victory was hard fought for four decades.
This profession unlike other professions is unique in the sense that a racist plumber does not have the power of a racist cop.
@jarquig Thank you, the cop on the top right mentions that racism exists in all occupations, and he is correct. Where he misses the mark is the implication that policing is the same as plumbing. A plumbers racism is most likely not going to result in the abuse or death of another person, where as a cops can.
@@regularperson9801 what about it? I didn't realize that people are being victimized, abused, and murdered by racist basketball players. Police need to be held to a higher standard because they are given the tools and means to kill others.
DAMN SKIPPY✔✔
That Asian cop shouldn't even had been in the meeting they have no say in this period
Regular Person cringe
I gotta say that I respect Vice a lot for doing this. They're really making an effort to represent all sides.
Casey5693 I was surprised because of their normal stances on these topics
To bad vice is normally fucking trash
If vice did more things like this. I’d watch. I loved old vice when Gavin was still working. Back when it was more punk rock and less social justice warrior. Go watch a Thumbs Up.. now way vice can even say have the things that David Choe says with censorship now. With that said they showed literally all sides here and I feel like I have a better understanding of both sides when before I was in the middle.
Steve Rosebud new vice is normally complete garbage
I'm continually impressed with Lee's reporting
The dude who said it's been happening for ever and that's it's only coming to the public attention because of 📸 fones and bodycams is 100% right.
When Rodney King took a beating, the world only knew because some guy filmed him with his family VHS camera.
And how many cops, LEOs and departments are in America??? Yet in today's videophone era, there's usually between 10-20 incidents a year that make national news involving police misconduct, and when these incidents do happen the media covers it nonstop. Now if misconduct was that widespread across the country and every cop, or even a 4th of them was cooked, there'd be 10s of thousands of videos capturing these cooked acts. Now, I'm not saying there aren't bad cops that should absolutely find another profession, , I'm just saying there's not near as many as the media tries to make them out to be.
Brian Jacobs that is almost always the truth, its always blown out of proportion and its natural for people to generalize a group like Police, and to have back in your mind that thats one bad apple out of how many thousands of police officers in the USA is hard. Its giving some other prospective. But i dont think it should be swept under the rug, its bad whenever force is overused and abused, the least amount of force to remove the treat is always the right move. so to have constructive debate about the issue and how to fix it is always welcomed and is going to lead to change in the future.
That’s ya boy off the “60 days in” show
60 days in changed David
Two things that I really wanted to hear asked and I didn’t are:
1. What effect has the War on Drugs had on policing and does it make a difference in your communities? After almost 50 years and $3 trillion dollars, is it time we do something different. 2. What does your department do to identify officers suffering from PTSD and how do they help those officers?
Two very good points! I’m about 8 minutes in to the video at the moment, these are two topics I for the most part clicked the video in the first place. Unfortunate to find out these aren’t answered. 👍🏻
The dumbass in ths grey suit doesnt realize hes the reason people hate these thuga
CaliforniaCheez The day no thing didn’t work, the drug crisis is worse then ever more American are dying, millions spend and drug cartels and dealers are still out there making money, alcohol and crack and cigarettes kill by the scores while marijuana kills none. Hell Nixon started the war on drugs to bully minorities and his political opponents.
I don't have an answer for the first, but having worked in EMS and being pretty much part of the club (police, fire and EMS), there are crisis counselor on staff generally in each department to reach out if a particular scene is affecting you in a negative way. Sometimes, if the scene is multiple fatality, or involving children - we are required to meet with counselor before we are allowed to go back in service to assess our mental state. There is little stigma within the station, it's just that they do realize that if we are upset, our delivery of help will be compromised.
That said, it does rely on your being honest about how an incident is affecting you. If you fake it through, you won't get continued help. I'm unsure if police have a tendency to fake it through out of concern of being judged by the fellow officers (I didn't see this in EMS but know police can razz each other more).
Hope that helps!
A police officer should respond to a suicide as well as medical staff because a person in crisis no longer cares about life. That person in crisis, if deescalated, may be more apt to admit to an officer that they've killed a significant other, a family member, or left kids unattended--and a law officer needs to be on hand for that emergency right then and there.
This is 100% the best conversation happening right now about policing
Why would you not want a body camera on you unless you’re doing something wrong?
@Aaron L that's a terrible comparison;
One is your personal life and the other is your career.
And it's not hard to guess which one is which, either.
Well they can’t have it on at all time bc if it’s battery and it takes atleast 30 seconds to turn in
Aaron L hey you make understandable points that I can empathize with. But the reality is that very few professions carry the risk of acutely (and legally) killing an otherwise healthy person. Any officer who doesn’t understand and empathize with the vital need the public has to have an accurate, detailed, and impartial record of what happens every single time a FREE citizen is killed by the agent of the government of a FREE country like they United States, then they can freely choose a new career.
We can mitigate all the issues you mentioned with sensible policy and citizen review boards external to the police department (cut down on camera footage misuse for intradepartmental politics). What we can’t mitigate is the destruction of a life that has been ended by an officer too soon.
@Aaron L Many fast food joints have cameras on their employees all the time. My husband has a camera on him and he works in a sawmill. So why shouldnt cops also be under surveillance?
@@dedaveful As the person stated, as a cop, you can get fired with things as simple as touching somebody, not kidding, so with all those things it just is a little bit odd, but all police officers should have a body cam. Also another reason why it shouldnt be on all the time is if they go to the bathroom, that is really creepy y'know.
Racists in other professions don’t carry guns though bud, so yes there are racists everywhere but I don’t think the cashier at Best Buy is at same risk for killing black men as a cop is.
Most people can go and buy guns!
@@Sooner85 are you saying the racist at best buy should be shooting black ppl? Gun rights are fine but what the person is saying is that an officer has a position of power which includes handling a gun, meaning a racist working that job would be more likely to use the gun (a tool provided by work) to carry out racist actions (shooting black ppl). The best buy worker can be racist and can own a gun but the occupation isn't putting him in a position to use that racism as a weapon, where police as an occupation is giving that as a possibility.
@@stinky324 "are you saying racist at best buy should be shooting black people"
In response to:
"Most people can go buy guns"
In response to:
"Racists in other professions don't carry guns"
My head hurts...
You are a idiot .
you know more white people are killed by cops right, this isn't a race thing, its a stress thing, Baltimore did a shoot no shoot simulator and many people fired in every single scenario, many people don't realize how much stress cops are under in these situation, what happened to George Floyd is wrong, but in other situations the cops exhausted many other options. Many officers have died because they waited too long, also you are more likely to be shot by a black officer than a white one, so its it not a race problem, it more of a stress problem.
7:29. The point was missed. "This has always been going on..." "This" he was referring to is not prejudice. "This" is police not being held accountable for acting on that prejudice.
Do you have ANY single instances/examples of that? Just like the majority of the panel said, cops do tell on other cops and a lot of cops do get turned over.
35:08 police dont need to respond to every suicide threat but way too many officers believe that a suicidal person is also homicidal and that is absolutely not true.
@los Angeleno well, if you call 911 for an ambulance the cops show up. That doesn't need to happen in a lot of circumstances but cops like to make everyone feel they are needed.
@Jordon Carlson even if you had social works respond to things like this. Police would have to be there to guarantee life safety. Just like if medics and firefighters are responding to a dangerous situation, life safety for the responders is put into consideration
@Jordon Carlson that might be dangerous. People are unpredictable. Your responding to people who you don't know who can do anything. They can be non violent or they can be. Especially with people who are mentally unstable and domestic violence issues. There's just to many variables to a first responders jobs. For example I've responded to a drunk man who was suicidal. Medics took care of him. And cops were right there with them. N the guy was taken care of.
@Jordon Carlson I agree with you that everyone needs to held accountable. There's certainly people who are first responders that shouldn't be. In your situation in Ontario was it confirmed that they shot him for no reason or is that an assumption on your part. They could have shot him for a reason, I have no idea, I wasn't there. Not every police involved shooting happens for no reason. I think there needs to be a common understanding between both parties. Civilians need to understand what cops have to go through and vice versa. We're all in this together. I think alot of people take what police officers do for granted
@Jordon Carlson with your personal situation do you know how that call came in. I'm not saying they were right to kick your door in but was there any reason to them to be it was necessary to do it. Bc when people call 911 information is given to a dispatcher and then that info is given to responders. So do know why someone called in for a wellness check on you
Lee Adams is an incredible mediator. Thank you bringing hope to our current discourse. And thanks to the officers being cordial in sharing their experiences.
I hear that! So glad he’s back doing this. The other mediator was god awful.
Love this interview so much. So many different perspectives. Everyone so respectful. We need more of this. 🙏 To all the officers who are good human beings, thank you for your service in your community. There are a lot of bad apples out there and I am so proud of you guys who keep your head up and do your job and do the right thing.
Any cop that drive drunk must be arrested and charged like everyone else. 12:40
Love how they have David Duncan on the call when he blew his cover on season 5 of 60 days in an ruined the whole program for the year.
THANK YOU!!! I knew he looked familiar !
finally someone commented about David.
🤣🤣🤣🤣
Dude the ONLY reason I even opened the comment section was because I was thinking, 'man he looks so much like that guy from 60 days in' haha. Thanks for confirming!!
YES! I was like there's that douche David Duncan. Fake ass dude was acting like a straight clown in jail. Although on this he was saying some really good stuff
Excellent panel & discussion of a very, very crucial matter that impacts our country from coast to coast, north & south, for EVERY person living here in the USA. With much appreciation to you Lee Adams & all those involved at Vice! Thank you.
Wow thought this would be straight police public affair comments but this well needed and informative conversation from the people with real world experience.
So true.
Ama Andreea ACAB
The fact they let things get swept under the rug is disgusting.
it is and with great power comes great responsibility. but that one officer put it wisely, we are all human so it is gonna happen. however, higher standards are needed.
the fact it takes 6 months to enforce the law yet it takes 8 years to legally argue it in court smh
33:00 “we don’t need to be defunded, just pay other people to do the hard work”. That’s where the defunded money is supposed to go!
That dude was a PR guy. Intentional straw man answer.
To a social worker that can't do their jobs? XD What a joke.
'Just turned on a dime'
Shows how unaware the police are of how long people have hated them for.
Crazy thing is he said that right after the other younger brother talked about blacks having issues with officers stretches back a long time and their parents have stories as well as grandparents.
@Ama Andreea it's amazing how people find a way to insert "The left, libs, libtards, or Democrats" into every conversation like people's political stance defines who they're as a person.
@@TonyAtmos seeing how dumb the majority of that party is, being left, it is very easy to tell their political affiliation
Yeah how long people like you. Most people in America besides leftist still respect law enforcement.
@conic9 I don't think your the brightest sitting here trolling on TH-cam
I respect this dialogue & everyone in it’s perspective, experience, opinion, & most of all Service.. More of these talks have to be had. Maybe next time a few cops & a few members of the community to have a healthy, grown up conversation about the issues plaguing our society today. 👍🏽VICE.
....I kept waiting for the, “I respect this dialogue etc., “....but...”
“But”, I totally agree.
But the left does not want discussion, only terror?????
Redant23: It’s a pretty damn complex situation. But no matter what or why, it’s pretty damn obvious that a good portion of the citizens in & of this country, are fed up with how the police for a large part conduct themselves in general.
It all comes down to leadership. Until older generation is out of power does no one realize this. Thats why we have this virus to take out older generation.
"most of all service" as if they're more important?? 🤷
I wish Matt spoke more, he was so quiet. He looked like he had a lot of wisdom to share. Sounds humble too. Also loved Louis and Wendy! Louis was def my fav
Maybe when an officer gets fired they should print it in the local news, their name and the reason for termination. Also there should be a national database for police officers who get fired from agencies.
This is what my state nursing board does. Anybody who loses their license or is under disciplinary action gets their name, license number, what they did published and sent out in the regular bulletin and is available to the public.
Thats a great idea. I'm suprised that in their intense background check that they don't find out about why they got fired.
Brady list
@@sarenawiebe8690 the old white guy in the center said it, it's a r i n g
jennifer nunez what is a Brady list? Does it have anything to do with Brady violation with the defence lawyers?
The term bad apples often seems to be applied when speaking about children and/or police officers.
John Proctor children can kill you too lol high schoolers with guns and in my area even middle schoolers with guns
John Proctor because of the second amendment you have the right to bear arms yourself and not all law enforcement officers are bad and the bad officers don’t overweigh the thousands of fucking CHILD CRIMINALS gang banging and stealing and i see younger and younger kids with guns and it’s sad please don’t @ me again you fucking clown
John Proctor how’s it irrelevant lol you’re irrelevant
Because it's almost a term of endearment. It's reserved for people who the public generally doesn't want to call an outright disgrace and degenerate.
Because people need to get more educated on both sides. Just because there’s a major issue within the system that needs to be dealt with, doesn’t mean that all hell isn’t breaking loose in the city...I see ugly, ugly %&$@ out there every night, they’re putting up with a lot, and putting their lives on the line. The good ones deserve the highest respect. The other day some street racers caused some accidents and rollovers on the freeway 🤮 I couldn’t imagine going to that scene.
"EMT's with their tiny shirt and boots on" lmao
Right lmao y he do them like that
Lol they got the cop from 60 days in who almost got a Latino dude killed during an undercover mission in a prison.
I just said the same thing! He was an idiot on the show
Which one??
@@RebekahEdvalds david
What a fucking clown
I dead ass was just looking him up to make sure I wasn't trippin'. I knew that was him!
What scares me is officers like Derek Chauvin managed to pass the background checks, imagine those who didn’t
@Ama Andreea I've seen you under alot of people comments.....you're a level 1 troll and thats me being nice💀
He also had incidents when he was moonlighting as a bouncer. He assaulted some people, but since he was a police officer he never got charged... But he did get fired...
cloutloud glue stop posting the same thing on every video
People change, no on is the same person from 10 years ago
@@CPAgamer313 who are you?
I’m an officer and it’s not only a small amount of officers doing bad things. It’s much higher than you would think.
Yeah and its not gonna be talked about anywhere in the media. Usually that stuff us covered up
Bottom right corner, saying nothing but looks like he has alot to say.
I feel like you are judging his look ... but I don’t want to assume so maybe I’m wrong
Yeah like he Wana call out the bullshit
i love how the detective just sits and listens haha
He was pointless to the conversation
I felt like Matt knows not to say anything especially when it comes to race, cause maybe his experience were good but if he mentions that David would probably attack him cause he’s white.
He knows not to talk just for the sake of talking. Many times in these large group settings other say what you were thinking. It's about meaningful contribution.
thats what detectuves live for
This is a great piece, many thanks and respects to Vice for taking the time to put this on. I'm a police officer in DC and I can agree with the officer who said police officers get fired or forced to resign all of the time, it just isn't broadcast.
When departments do the right thing, when officers do the right thing, it is rarely known to the public. However, when an officer does the WRONG thing, the whole country knows, and the opinion of most of the public is formed from this.
Most people get in to this career for the right reasons. Many days I wonder if it's worth sticking to it, being that it's such a thankless job. I personally felt like I was doing more positive things for my community when I worked fpr a local TV station or when I worked as a bartender.
The part about protecting A-holes with seniority: this is why the police departments in many places are no different than the gangster orgs they are policing. Also the military structure doesn’t help i.e. “brass”
Youre so right about that militaristic structuring of the police departments should be changed.
@@jacob2790 They also teach in the departments "it's us against them" so pretty much on average cops hold a huge disdain towards civilians, and if anyone says that's not the case are super naive.
@@Saturnia2014 Also the police are being trained to think that every single civilian is a threat, basically making the police more trigger happy.
Unionization is a real issue.
@@marialindell9874 IDF training
This need to be a 5 part series.
Yeah, middle white America needs to see this. It's all fun and games until it happens to you. I don't know what it's like to be a Black American, but I can tell you I know what it's like to get shat on by the cops and the system that protects it. We need criminal justice reform- the whole lot. This is an American problem. The masses need to see this.
Lincoln Square Leonidas 👏👏👏👏👏👏
@@LincolnSquareLeonidas
we absolutely need reform... tbh I can't even fathom how our " justice" system had been allowed to rot and deteriorate in the way it has.
Things that should be considered absolute atrocities are common practice today.
I'm sure there is barely anything left of this fossilized horse carcass, but things will never change until we eliminate the for-profit prison system... the very idea of such a system being allowed to exist sounds like something from some movie about a barbaric dystopian future rather than something that real americans would have ever allowed.
The crazy thing is the call to "Defund the Police" was to acknowledge that the Police are ill-equipped to handle multifaceted issues because the "use of force" isn't always necessary. If you listen to explanations by the original BLM that coined the phrase they actually embody everything the Law Enforcement agents stated here as well for new features they would like to see in their departments. I don't know why they named it Defund the Police, where it was more of Defund the Police Use of Force, which our News outlets ran with the prior. People, we ALL want the same thing. I know the extremists on both sides are yelling the loudest, but we have to find a way for the rest of us to have an intelligent dialogue. We have 50 states and it's our duty to listen to each other and form a more perfect union.
Look at blm leaders now🤦♀️buying million dollar mansions in gated communities guarded by police🤦♀️ while the cities they destroyed are in ruins and crime filled because they defunded the police.
Yes!!
The problem is Law Enforcement culture. Us vs Them. If the Good Apples agree with ANY criticisms, they get disproportionate blowback if not fired.
It's balances power why not
@@memphisr31gn58 huh
Right, and the growing amount of guns in the hands of an increasingly anti-police society plays no role in this what so ever. Its always the other sides fault, never our own.
@stephen Krik We tried all look where it got us and our communities aren't strong enough financially to be a stand alone complex we need one one instead of two stops the name blame game right there
@@Wificationify huh
My problem with Tatum is that he acts like all police is the same and there's never any wrong. I'm glad another officer told him that it's never that simple.
Tatum is the most level headed guy of the bunch though and it sounds like his police department got things right. Maybe they should implement what they do throughout the entire nation.
@@TCELL24 not that simple laws and funding have alot to do
@@SonOftheBattleCry Laws can be rewritten. For funding I'm sure you can easily afford to cut some of your defense budget and spend that on national security instead.
@@TCELL24 laws only get stricter they wont become more lenient
@D Gh Not by yours, since you don't seem to have any. Why are you trying to spin this into a race thing?
Such an important discussion. Why doesn’t this have more views?
A lot of people don’t have the attention span to watch a 40+ min long video nowadays
People rather confirm there agenda
Thank you Vice for allowing police officers to have a voice. It's vitally important that we not only hear from protesters and the general public who have their opinions and beliefs about law enforcement, but to hear from the officers who actually do the job and have insights that you just can't get from people who have never been a cop. Dialogue is an important key to progress.
The last question sums it all up. None of them are willing to call each other out. The Blue Line.
Exactly.
No, its called "the blue shield".
You need to watch part 2 to see their reaction to the question...
Perhaps if everyone stopped throwing them under the bus, including their own "leadership," as well as their own brothers and sisters, aunts and uncles telling them theyre all racist oppressors, they wouldn't need to band together and protect each other so much? Stop with the rhetoric and start with the good faith communication.
It's in the next video; this video cuts before they raise their hands.
This is awesome. Please stay impartial Vice. Just keep being the truth and not anyone’s pawn. I’ve loved your docs for years. No politics
I can say that in my area (Houston, Tx) we do have an amazing crew of mental health officers! My daughter has a lot of psychiatric issues and I needed her transported to the hospital based on her having heard voices and my concern as could jump from the car on the way to seek help. A regular officer showed up, but because I was very specific during the call that this was a mental health issues, they had a specific unit come to get her and they were able to really de-escalate the situation and handled her in such a way that she actually placed herself in the vehicle and didn't require any use of force. It was the most respectful interaction with police because they had the training on how to handle it.
Imagine just simply sharing those details in order to prevent future need to have to defuse a possible turn of events. And you didn't have to utter the words race or racial segregation etc
I love that honestly !! So nice to have educated opinions and discussion while bringing good-ending stories to use as an example in the future. I hope your daughter has been able to overcome her hardships and is well and happy..
Xoxoo
Wow, I thought it was a 20min video and it turns out it was an hour and I watched it all lol. This was very insightful, thanks
43 minutes is an hour?
This journalist is great. I would like to see more from journalists like him at vice. I've seen some journalists who set their interviewee up for failure on Vice.
Hard for me to take David seriously since I've seen him in "60 days in prison" 😭
Dude is a total IDIOT. Emotions and feelings without giving actual facts and instances
I was in to the hole video till I realized who he was and then I wished I could just block him out
@@cu3008 I agree!
I commented the same thing
That’s where I recognized him from lol
A lot of these comments really prove that some people will hate police no matter what. This was an honest discussion between people of every background and there are some phenomenal points on both sides that I hadn’t considered
Atleast these cops get the chance to speak. It would be a different conversation if George and Breonna were present. That's why people hate cops.
These are all officers with many years experience and most were retirement age already... Notice no recruits, and they all seemed to be beat cops. No traffic cops, or CHP, etc. CHP I think actually do a decent job...
I'd like to see public defenders and judges get into these conversations, as that is the system these police are feeding. I find it far too easy for police to throw people into the system and then say that person is the court's responsibility.
I’m listening. I’m really trying, but marijuana is still federally illegal. I have no doubts that these guys have arrested people for unjust laws. I guess I’m more angry at the system. Too bad these guys chose to be on the front line of that system. I can’t support a system that is broken and corrupt to its core.
I really like the moderator. He seems like a fair dude and a guy that cares about the truth.
People act like vice is very liberal but i think they so a pretty good job trying to show everybodys pov
I loved what David (bottom left corner) said about how “ The Greatest Tool Police Officers Have Is Not On Their Belt “. When we think about what qualities make for a good police officer we mostly think of things like strong, assertive, commanding, but I think compassion and empathy are just as important to a well rounded police officer. I think if police departments put more emphasis on looking for and training these qualities into their officers we would have much more effective officers and far less incidents of police violence and shootings.
We dont want pussies on the job. They are dealing with hardcore criminals and you think they gonna be better cops if they show more "empathy and compassion"?
@@XxWatulookinat69xX no you idiot its called being compassionate when its needed instead of being a gun slinging jackass, its not being weak but being smart and assecisng the situation
While police should be/are compassionate and must build a positive relationship with the community, it’s imperative that police officers command respect amongst the community. If all cops were that nice that they could call a speeder the pulled over a friend, it makes the officer and the safety of others around them vulnerable. And as the first reply said, police have to maintain a very advanced and strong mental capability to assess a dangerous situation and resolve and prevent conflict and accidents within their communities and crime scenes. Also, an officers most important tool is easily a radio.
You should see him on 60 days in then 🤣
6:54 This dude doesn't get it. Sure, it may be a "human problem" but the cops have a unique responsibility in society. They need to be held to a higher standard AND HELD ACCOUNTABLE.
wow that was so insightful
Police Union closed door negotiations are the problem. The police actually don’t know how to protect and serve only cause friction between themselves and the citizens who pay taxes to keep them employed. They’re way overpaid,under qualified,uneducated in public relations,politics,community resourcing,etc…. We live in a constitutional republic. Not under a totalitarian,tyrannical regime. You can’t enforce something we the people don’t agree is illegal yet somehow police think they are the judge,jury and executioner once they get their badge. More often than not their seen as a threat to a free society,people are scared to even be seen with them for fear of retaliation,if you are stopped by a cop and they’ve killed before,how do we know they won’t kill you? This is the problem with law enforcement. We don’t know who is who and what they will do if given the opportunity.
At 35:10 that is so damn true! Who is going to serve the civilians the best in that situation? A cop, a paramedic, or a firefighter? Great perspectives all around
We as a Society need to be more worried about police mental health. They are the people that are publicly entrusted and payed by our tax payers dollars to protect and serve us the people so policing and monitoring there mental health should be a high priority for any decent society. All police should have a paid for psychologist by the police department and they should be forced to go to mandatory sessions every week. It's for the Laws benefit and ours.
@Jen Jen I saw a TH-cam video last night of a calm cop pull over young woman she said she'd been a cop for a year. He smelled alcohol on her breath. She was going 20 mph over the speed limit. She was so out of it she didn't even pull her car all the way out of the lane. She didn't want the standard test to see if she was drunk (She knew she'd fail). Then she wanted a supervisor. I think she wanted to buy time to put off any tests at the jail. I didn't bother watching the whole video. She was wasted. The cop was cool and calm.
@@kingofdapirates857 it was an example of a officer driving drunk off duty.. If you don't see that then troll away else where.
@@kingofdapirates857 exactly my point you didn't see it was an example.. So go on elsewhere. I wasn't even talking to you in the beginning. I won't respond to you after this.
Amazing content! People need to see more of these conversations.. greetings to all these fantastic professionals putting their opinion out there and sharing their own experiences, ready to expose themselves for the sake of common sense! Brave and clever! And I’m not even from the US.
It's almost like we can each have our own perspective and still coexist
Hard to coexist when one group likes to put their knees on the neck of civilians, as well as having a history of planting drugs on innocent people.
Yeah we can Until we put guns and riot shields on them
not according to the left wing, who wants to censor anyone who disagrees with them, and imprison anyone who opposes socialism. They're ideological supremacists who dont believe anyone should be permitted to exist outside of their socialist machine.
Thank Vice for creating a space where we can keep dialoguing this conversation. Listening to Floyd's family and BLM leaders in your video a few months back was incredible and taught me a lot.
I just started this and am looking forward to hearing the conversation.
This was so well done, the set up allowed for so much nuance. It was also very powerful to learn more about the veterans on the panel. I really appreciated how specific systemic issues were identified by the people who have and do live it everyday on their job. Frustrated with how it was ended, would have loved to hear they’re response to the last question etc Thank you VICE for allowing real conversation
Damn that's David from 60 days in 🤣🤣
OMG yes it took me a minute to realize it but i was like I know that voice. Then i remembered he was a cop.
Smh, I was just saying that, remember this clown.
Wow
Bruh I was like that dude sound mad familiar...thought he might have pulled me over 🤣🤣
@@andrep91011 you can't forget his face xD he just looks like a person that needs to be punched.
could use more uniformity across police departments - like the cops committing crimes getting thrown under the bus to *protect the good image of the department* because *police are a social contract with the people,* and need to maintain *benevolence.* Police sticking to their own is no better than policies like 'No Snitching' in criminal communities (clarity: not urban communities, not minority communities, etc and so forth).
You are ignoring the fact, that cop was an CIA assassin. CIA and antifa are one and the same. Same ideology. th-cam.com/video/1BtxF-71580/w-d-xo.html
@@madmaxrerisen You're not even from america
@@madmaxrerisen take your meds schizo
@@7ngel NWO and China fight your battles. Your youth are brainwashed. Your racism is in youtube streams. It is getting crazy. The whole world doing BLM marches. NWO want America bad.
@@uwugriffith This is Chinese 50 cent army guy. They want USA civil war. Race baiting and buying out your media. China paid assassins..
Officers get fired for many things but they do not get fired for things that result in lawsuits. If you terminate that officer it’s literally an admission of guilt and that admission is all a lawyer would need to start drawing up lawsuits. If you break the law you should be prosecuted, period.
This was not the case in the Derek Chauvin case. He was fired from his department and they most certainly knew the DA was bringing charges. The judge did rule, though, that the jury could *not* know that he was fired.
firing is not "literally" an admission of guilt. You have no clue what you're talking about
26:47 This is what I've long guessed about cops: the ones from more crime and poverty-ridden communities are better in general at handling serious confrontations with suspects than those from more well off cities (edit: meant to write communities) due to more hands on experience.
16:52 i know im in the small percentage but id still like to hear from that perspective.
Exactly life experience. It also means they re better swipe to police the communities that gave them those experiences. They know what’s messed up and they should have an input on how to fix and maintain peace. Best case scenario that is.
This was dope.. lee does it again.
Probably one of my favorite segments on this channel. I appreciate the perspective of this panel of people. I was especially interested in the opinion of the police unions, defunding and/or shifting work to other agencies. Thanks for your perspective.
Been starving for an educated substantive discussion on these issues. Thanks Vice 🙏🏼
Ken Chesler yes, this is epic!🤗
I really wish they had a Black woman cop speak
@@AFullNelson to get their pov?
@@AFullNelson idiot
I admire Vice for giving policemen a voice
This is good, thank you for making this video and to all the officers who took part. Thank you for your honesty- we need more of THIS
haha omg that cliffhanger question at the end gave me goosebumps. This is great. Can’t wait for part 2!
If every cop was like the man in the lower left, things would be much better.
while we definately need many more cops like him... if every cop was like him that would be bad as well... you need cops from all different races / classes / sexes and different backgrounds with their own life experiences. switching from all middle class white males to poor black males isnt the solution. but I definately agree that many more black men and women should be applying and more need to be accepted and put into leadership roles, especially in black communities. police need to hire from within their communities and should be a part of the community they serve.
The dude was on 60 days in lol so he got to feel what it’s like to be a actual prisoner. As you can see his views are some what different .....
@@Justin-vr5zn I think you are focusing too much on the race and gender aspect of things. I feel the gentleman in the lower left has a better mentality than most officers and that's what's needed and I think that's what @younglion1804 is trying to say.
The dudes an actor hes in 60 days in vice is fake news why would they bring in this crisis actor
Also the dude is a rat hes an idiot I can tell you this much hes an actor
Lee might be the best reporter at Vice right now, keep it up!
David dude seems like he's genuinely a good and a smart person hopefully we can find more people like this to be cops people who use there heads and try to humanize themselves to the public.
David Duncan is a fucking joke. Watch his season of 60 days in. I'd hate to be undercover with him. He's truly a POS. Like, spit on his grave when he dies (the sooner the better) POS.
@@finejustgivemeaname examples please
Christian Ruiz it’s vice news I’m suspicious of all media but this seemed genuine
finejustgivemeaname lol he would prolly feel the same way about your goof ass
Peter Chhan examples of what wy I feel this way I can tell your prolly gonna disagree no matter what so I’ll pass have a good day
Fantastic effort Vice and to the speakers. Real conversation and real dialogue to cut through the sensationalism. Made possible because it is long form (not sound bites) with multiple points of views. I'd like to see more.
The challenge is how to grow the audience for this content vs. The 1min sound bites that crowd out and currently win the attention economy?
This just reinforced what I've been saying for years. If rhe FOP and the head of the unions would come out and publicly condemn the actions of and the bad cop everytime there was a major incident, we wouldn't need to have thia conversation because everyone would see it's not tolerated, they would easily be removed and prosecuted.
Nah, nothing is ever enough for the BLM and Antifa thugs who love being professional victims.
@@farzana6676 oh shut up bigot
@@Solidude4 Loool, shutup racist commie
Exactly. The police union did this to themselves. They have had decades to create better accountability problem.
@@farzana6676 That's bullshit. If this was done many decades ago, we wouldn't be here now, well before blm or antifa was thought of. That's what your smooth brain doesn't comprehend.
Yeah the officers really protect me when they pull me over for having an expired sticker. Thank you officers... such an honor.
defund is the wrong word. "Restructure" or other words like "Accountability" and training and Psychological test screening really need to be done better. everywhere. NATIONAL STANDARDS>
I agree! Because the word "defund" is a negative word to hear. I like Restructure because the word shows change and means organize differently.
I think defund is right cause they spend more than double on the police than they do education or health care
The police could be run more similar to the military with a higher chain of command with uniformity accountability/ training / education. Create police for police. In the military there are military police that can arrest anybody, even officers. Cops get away with things people shouldn't get away with. There is no accountability and the oath doesn't mean anything to too many cops. There could be more sectors within the police also. A cop should not be "just a cop." Just like the three sectors of the government maybe there needs to be three or more sectors of the police.
@@dylancartwright7786 Exactly.
Currently, the FBI is conducting an investigation of LASD's shooting towards Andres Guardado, so basically, this tells you the FBI is basically the military police over regular police agencies.
The officer on the bottom left, David, was a participant in season 5 of 60 Days in
He was the dude that blew everyones cover at the end
😂I was scrolling to see if any o e else noticed. As soon as I seen him I was like ummmm is that...
🐀
He’s a joke. Know what I’m sayin?
David Duncan is a fucking joke. Watch his season of 60 days in. I'd hate to be undercover with him. He's truly a POS. Like, spit on his grave when he dies (the sooner the better) POS.
So we're just going to ignore that David (bottom row/Left box) was on "60 Days In"?
I read through the comments and noticed no one else had mentioned that. To be honest a lot of his character came out during the airing of that TV show. It's interesting to see him on this panel.
I noticed a couple days ago. I had go back and rewatch the ep to make sure I wasn't imagining things😅. Not really a fan of him.
Black cop @ 6 min mark nailed it. Cameras are exposing what's been going on for decades.
@Bryan Nastawa I neither know, nor care, what commie BLMers think or say.
Dude on the bottom right is solid. I wish all cops were like him.
Bottom right or bottom left? The whole bottom row was solid to me.
I like the whole 2 bottom rows
Racism is really big in the medical community as well. I work as a nurse and I sometime over hear the other nurses talking about patients of different races in negative ways.
There does need to be more training for certain police departments. But if you want better cops who have more tools to deescalate a situation before it turns violent, you need more funding. Cutting funding means that their is less money for training, equipment, and salaries, so they have to have sub-par recruits, with sub-par training, with sub-par equipment, who will go for their gun faster.
Defunding should be an experiment in one or a couple cities to see if you wouldn't need as many police from the decreased crime of the funding of other programs; going head into defunding all over is shortsighted. Defunding is just reducing the need for cops since the police funding goes into other things that may reduce crime before it happens, basically getting at the root of the problem (other policies that help poor communities and ghettos would be important also), but we don't know enough yet so we need examples and research.
Stainbine Jahblontski crime won’t ever stop let’s be real
Bruh you’re being dense lookup the budget for cities and police departments get up to 150 mil while other social programs are getting cut year after year . If more funding would work there wouldn’t be a fucking problem
Yolosapien420 you do realize most of the budget goes to salaries, benefits and overtime.
You cannot train an assassin. He was not a cop. He was a trained CIA assassin. th-cam.com/video/1BtxF-71580/w-d-xo.html
More training
More officers
(Not a job I'd want much overtime to be available)
Not fear based/combat training
Confidence competence public safety
Mandatory monthly counseling
Third party investigation on complaints
National reporting systems on complaints/firings
Put funding back into federal and state mental facilities/health
Bring critical thinking/life skills back in our schools
When police departments serve and protect they don't get sued so damn much
Taxpayers can pay for officers and social programs not lawsuits/settlements
So you want all of our local and state taxes to go up? Or you want the Federal government to fund all of this?
Maybe we should ban all guns first. Then cops won't be afraid of being shot at every opportunity. Then we need to remove the cartels and legalize all drugs. We need to reduce the prison population and reform prisons so that they rehabilitate, rather than create repeat offenders. Then we need to actively destigmatize hatred to police officers. If your brother, father, friend, uncle, etc. breaks the law, they are bad. Not the cops arresting them. Cops taking someone to the ground is not police brutality. It's detaining.
@@chaosXP3RT I don't think that you read what I wrote.
Seems you're injecting fallacious arguments 🤔
Think about the effects of having students supported and encouraged to be functioning adults who contribute to their communities
Stable confident officers, effectively policing those communities
While I do believe that currently our medical and mental "care" industries are more interested in profit/life long patients rather than health...its a goal help people actually be as healthy as they can.
Taxpayer money spent shifts
Taxpayer money spent on lawsuits can go to schools
Taxpayer money spent on school to prison pipeline can go to the schools
Taxpayer money spent on a death sentence can go to community mental health centers
Legalized drugs?
@@breachperplex8846 definitely Marijuana
We've long taken the approach of restrict and punish when it comes to drugs and alcohol rather than addressing the many underling issues
C S look you won’t get ride of a lot of violence and overdose deaths till we legalize all drugs and invest in mental health or addiction clinics.
In 1995 I applied to the Minneapolis police department, I took the written test then went on to the physical ability test then I was interviewed and all the way to a conditional job offer. The last step was take the psychological test and meet with the shrink. I was a good person, I didn't do anything wrong. I wasn't given the final offer because I was to friendly and laid back. I was so hurt I gave up. He referred to me as an overweight white male. I gave up on a dream.
Great conversation! I think it'd be interesting to get these cops together with a group of activists that have specific demands. I think "defund the police" means a lot of things to different people. I think the police have too many jobs at the moment. We cant expect them to do wellness checks, traffic stops, get kids to school, neighborhood patrols, domestic disputes, warrants, etc etc etc. We could get social workers involved and the police could focus on real crime.
Agreed about "defund". I think it was the wrong word to use. Maybe "invest" in (long overdue) social services, education, crisis intervention, long term mental health, jobs, and "restructure" police responsibilities to focus on criminal/violence. Defund is a negative and term to a lot of people; invest is a positive one.
Most activist groups are radicals who believe All Cops Are Bastards and fascists. You can't negotiate with people who hate every fiber of your being; people who hate the very concept of your job.
Conduct unbecoming of a Marine is used to remove those that are overweight. That's all that is needed.
Yeah but we also have ncos in the army that get a dui and it’s swept under the rug but a PFC fails tape he’s out by the end of the week and we have a female who hasn’t passed a pt test or rifle qualification in a year and a half and she gets promotion waivers above deserving soldiers. I know that’s not everywhere but the standard gets set somewhere
Go to a real unit without females/overweight
This was an insightful panel with a great group of officers and I commend these folks for their candor and service. A few good points @ 27:37, 29:35, 38.:28
This is one of the best videos i have seen that got points from all sides.
I'm really glad I watched this to the end. It started a bit slow, but once it got warmed up, I think it became clear just how much common ground there actually is between anti-police brutality protesters/activists and these cops. "Defund the Police" has become a really polarizing phrase because it sounds like "abolish the police" (which some people are also arguing for, though it is not as mainstream a position), and a lot of the things that activists actually want changed about policing will require more investment in police equipment like body cameras, personnel to review footage, and training to improve instinctual behavior.
Lately I felt vice kinda had been sleeping on certain viewpoints. Videos like this are probably the most important to doing the most amount of good for the understanding of common everyday people who don’t interact with police officers in a non investigative manner. Thank you so much 🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻
Yooo that’s David from 60 days in...
Dude was a whole snitch too
kyler on himself lol
Which one is David?
Snitch.
The fact that the majority of them didn’t want to acknowledge the problem within their own, says a lot.
I believe I just fell #IN #LOVE with a police man. The young guy with the baseball cap on, at the bottom left, that was raised poor and understands that community policing is NECESSARY!!! I love this man & the way he thinks. He has HEART & SOUL, and is the DEFINITION of a true #PEACE-#OFFICER!!! ❤️. #RESPECT~. #Great #job, #Vice!!! Greetings from New Orleans. The home of the most corrupt establishment in America. 😊
The media isnt conjuring up hate sir, the hate has been there since before I was even born. Let's be clear that this is the climate that COPS created. If you wake up to earn the hate, then hate is what you'll get period.
You’re right. Police brutality and systemic racism has been around for decades BEFORE technology and mainstream media have advanced. It’s been around even before I was born too. Tatum just wants to throw the blame and go around the topic.
Facts
Thank you so much for organizing and hosting this, this is real investigative journalism. Thank you.
Ay! Is the The Officer Tatum?! And David from 60 days in?! Wow. Big fans. Keep up the good work. Same for everyone else there.