What retraction settings did you use? I am having constant cloging issues with my cheap hotend. My issues are on the first layer that has minimal retractions. Large flat print.
The two extra screws holding the heat block in place are there to keep the heat block from rotating/moving when changing out nozzles. As long as those screws are either SST or Ti, there should be minimal heat creep. The Mosquito hotend from Slice Engineering uses four screws to secure their heat block.
Yes, I would be interested to see if those 2 actually do make a impact on the performance of these copies, would be very interesting indeed because then Microswiss might have a really good competition there I just bought a drop in direct drive to my ender 5 plus from Microswiss, and it interests me to see the different options
"The Mosquito hotend from Slice Engineering uses four screws to secure their heat block." Yeah, but those screws are not connected to the heat sink......
I don't get some remarks: - bottoming out to the nozzle to me sounds better than having an edge at the top, since it ensures having no gap between nozzle and heat-break and the top touching the heat-block would give extra area to get heat from it, which you don't really want. - you do want a lot of contact area between heat-break and cold-end, so the 2 grub screws are not ideal if you tighten both of them equally as you could then center the heat-break in the hole, minimizing the contact area. So, tighten one grub screw to the max and the just use the other to fix things vertically without really pressing the heat-break away from the wall of the cold-end at that side.
Why on Earth is everyone saying collet like Cole - et now. 'ˈkälət' It's pronounced much closer to call-et than cole-et, similar to collard greens. Seems to be someone on TH-cam trying to pronounce it like it's spelled and then it's spreading around, never even heard anyone even say it like this until recently..
I am in the process of putting in a mellow heat break into my creality hot end. Was interested in your comments on retraction I heard from another vid the retraction should be very low to stop clogs?
Great video, thanks for comparing and sharing. Would have been great to see the whole spectrum, cheap copy - Mellow clone - genuine Mircoswiss. Yeah looks like the block and heat sink aren't machined, but they would have been drilled and tapped by machine, making the threads as good as any other parts. The thermal behaviour is probably the biggest concern with them. Would also be good to see a successful print from the cheap copy hot end, though I appreciate that could take quite some time to print parts and tweak settings. Great stuff! Happy holidays :D
Those parts, even though ugly, are definitely made from extruded bar stock. The topology of the heater block is giving it away: 4 larger radii show the direction of the extrusion, the small radii ("sharp") corners are the cutting surfaces. The "stone-washed" texture is a result of a process called drumming, sometimes shot-blasting is used too. A cast piece from a steel mold would have much better surface quality, investment casting would have given you a hard skin due to silicone from the casting sand diffusing into the part. I modified a few of those pieces and they are as soft as butter (an have no internal cavities)...
It would be really interesting to see if you can find any difference by putting those 2 extra screws in and see if they really do make a negative impact on the hotend Slice engineering as Waltkat said, use this, and I have a Bondtech direct drive with a mosquito hotend with that type, and it works fantastically well
I've seen videos before, CHEP's video comes to mind immediately, where he test the difference between having those screws in vs having them out. This was on an ender 3 stock hot end but in that set up the difference was negligible and it just made more sense to actually have those screws as it prevents the heater block and the heat sink from being twisted out of alignment. Not sure how much a difference there would be between this and the stock option but I doubt it'd be much if any
Totally new to 3D printing. Recently purchased an Ender 3 Pro from Creality. Now I'm considering a Mellow hotend, a double geared extruder, a 2mm pitch lead screw, rod coupler and backlash nuts. I know tweaks to the Ender, filament and software will have to be addressed. Quality prints are my goal. Am I jumping off a cliff, or am I on the right track? Cheers
I've got videos on pretty much all of those things, except the changed lead screw. It's pretty common to all those things. The only stock thing on my rig at this point is the frame lol.
Awesome! Recently brushing up on silent stepper driver upgrade with the TMC2208 because it seems relatively easy to install with an SKR V1.4. Do you have an opinion and video(s) on these upgrades? I'll take a deeper dive down the "rabbit hole" and check more of your videos out. Cheers
ive only ever used genuine microswiss all metal hotend, microswiss ender 3 direct drive mount, and microswiss copper heatblock. the quality is just hard to pass up.
We know that titanium is a poor conductor of heat and therefore is ideal for a heatbreak, but why do some companies supply boron paste to add to it? now I can understand adding it to the nozzle threads to increase the thermal conductivity to the block but adding it to the heatbrake is like pissing against the wind (pardon my French) or am I missing something? I came across your video as I was looking for a fix for my Micro Swiss as it is riding up and down, I enjoyed your video so +1 Subscription Oh by the way a few people have experimented with the two screws and they don't introduce any heat.
A "Bowden" collect (Drill and install Push to Connect Tube Fitting) and the screw in pneumatic (Threaded Push to connect fitting) fitting are identical in how they work and use essentially the same internal components, The only difference is the components are mounted directly into the heat sink versus mounted in a threaded body. If you were to dismantle a Bowden collect and the threaded push to connect fitting you would see that. As an MFG we have made parts that use both methods, there are pros and cons to both methods. The advantage to many, maybe the ability to chose a replacement if you have issues with the push to connect fitting. Like everything they come in different levels of quality. The push to connect fitting method of installation is really the only difference. The Aluminum parts that are being called cast are most likely just cut and machined bar stock, and then wire brushed to remove burs. I doubt highly they are cast, the cost of a mold would be cost prohibitive.
You should be thinking how expensive is too expensive, not the other way around. Material wise there is really nothing there to justify a high price. You can get an all metal head for $4 now. Only in America would a company take a couple dollars in material, slap on a "Swiss" name, and charge $65 for it.
Forging would require rather expensive molds and you would see a prominent seam. Also, you cant forge parts cheaply where all sides are 90° to each other. Those parts are made from extruded stock (you can see the typical radii on the heater block) and then machined, probably on a NC-lathe (real CNC lathes are rather uncommon in China, except with automotive suppliers). As the surfaces will be pretty shoddy at this price point (high feed rates), drumming with an abrasive agent is the next step before tapping / drilling so the part is de-burred and can be handled / clamped more safely.
The word you're looking for is "Extruded" - here's a URL for the latest one: www.aliexpress.com/item/32971919868.html?spm=a2g0o.cart.0.0.591c3c00llAM6l&mp=1
The double grub screw means there will be less thermal contact between the heat break and the heat sink. Grub screws suck completely. Think about the fact the heat break is smaller than the hole you are putting it in. There is clearance or it wouldn't fit. One screw pushes it to one side where it will touch the inside surface. 2 puts you in danger of it not touching very well on either side. and there can be teetering between the two grub screws inside the given clearance. If you want to cool the heat break, you need excellent thermal contact between it and the heat sink. And when it heats up, the hole grows more than the heat break grows. Meaning more air gap. Being held against one wall with one grub screw is superior in every way imaginable. Grub screws are the worst element of these designs.
These cheap $5 Micro Swiss clones are not worth it. They may work for a print or 2, but will eventually leak filament and clog. If you're going to buy a cheap alternative to the stock hotend, go for an E3D V6 clone with a volcano hotend. Those are less than $10 on aliexpress, and are tried and tested.
Your thinking on the cheaper hotend causing more "heat creep" is incorrect - the Micro Swiss clone has MUCH more surface area mating with the cooling block then the Cheaper model.
I bought one of these when I first got my printer and I didn’t really know anything. I can verify it’s garbage. You may get a good print or two out of them but eventually it will start leaking or other weird issues. It’s also a bit too short for a stock ender 3 v2. The part cooling duct will go lower than the nozzle and you won’t get a good print. I had upgraded my duct so it at least printed for me, but I recommend everyone avoid this hot end for sure.
Those parts are not cast. You are seeing difference in post processing texturing and perhaps anodizing. Additionally, the reason for retightening hot is aluminum expands a lot when hot. This means the thread path the heat break and nozzle are thread into gets longer. It needs to be tight when it's at maximum length/heat. And Micro Swiss did not as far as I can tell take purposeful steps to spread Covid around the world while they tried to stop it from spreading in China. China did that.
Yet again the OverHype about quality ...on Cheap 3d printers and their 'parts'.... geez, who we kidding here ? Recent teastrings have demonstrated that even seriously damaged /mutilated even , nozzles / hotends work Surprisingly well. Only real issue is How much heat creep manifests in a multi hour print. ALL else is PURE sales B.S. PS; your printer needs some real setup work.
You really should have used the exact same spool of filament to see the difference.
May we have links to the items tested? Thanks!
The thing on the top is a collet, not related to any lady named Colette.
the machined heatblock was also cast at some stage of its life
What retraction settings did you use? I am having constant cloging issues with my cheap hotend. My issues are on the first layer that has minimal retractions. Large flat print.
The two extra screws holding the heat block in place are there to keep the heat block from rotating/moving when changing out nozzles. As long as those screws are either SST or Ti, there should be minimal heat creep. The Mosquito hotend from Slice Engineering uses four screws to secure their heat block.
Yes, I would be interested to see if those 2 actually do make a impact on the performance of these copies, would be very interesting indeed because then Microswiss might have a really good competition there
I just bought a drop in direct drive to my ender 5 plus from Microswiss, and it interests me to see the different options
"The Mosquito hotend from Slice Engineering uses four screws to secure their heat block."
Yeah, but those screws are not connected to the heat sink......
The screws make no real difference. I would rather have them. Makes nozzle changes easier.
I don't get some remarks:
- bottoming out to the nozzle to me sounds better than having an edge at the top, since it ensures having no gap between nozzle and heat-break and the top touching the heat-block would give extra area to get heat from it, which you don't really want.
- you do want a lot of contact area between heat-break and cold-end, so the 2 grub screws are not ideal if you tighten both of them equally as you could then center the heat-break in the hole, minimizing the contact area. So, tighten one grub screw to the max and the just use the other to fix things vertically without really pressing the heat-break away from the wall of the cold-end at that side.
Why on Earth is everyone saying collet like Cole - et now. 'ˈkälət' It's pronounced much closer to call-et than cole-et, similar to collard greens. Seems to be someone on TH-cam trying to pronounce it like it's spelled and then it's spreading around, never even heard anyone even say it like this until recently..
He’s not saying cole-et, he’s saying Collect.
I'm looking to find your parts cooler and probe mount. I've looked but could not find. Please link. Thanks!
I am in the process of putting in a mellow heat break into my creality hot end. Was interested in your comments on retraction I heard from another vid the retraction should be very low to stop clogs?
Great video, thanks for comparing and sharing. Would have been great to see the whole spectrum, cheap copy - Mellow clone - genuine Mircoswiss.
Yeah looks like the block and heat sink aren't machined, but they would have been drilled and tapped by machine, making the threads as good as any other parts. The thermal behaviour is probably the biggest concern with them.
Would also be good to see a successful print from the cheap copy hot end, though I appreciate that could take quite some time to print parts and tweak settings.
Great stuff! Happy holidays :D
I was intrigued by your simple fan holder. Can you provide a model ? Thank you.
What fan shroud are you using? I like that. Would you mind sharing a link to the STL file
Those parts, even though ugly, are definitely made from extruded bar stock. The topology of the heater block is giving it away: 4 larger radii show the direction of the extrusion, the small radii ("sharp") corners are the cutting surfaces. The "stone-washed" texture is a result of a process called drumming, sometimes shot-blasting is used too. A cast piece from a steel mold would have much better surface quality, investment casting would have given you a hard skin due to silicone from the casting sand diffusing into the part. I modified a few of those pieces and they are as soft as butter (an have no internal cavities)...
Not looking like it’s cast as the marks on it are tumbler marks used to remove sharp edges they are just using stock bar sizes to reduce the cost
It would be really interesting to see if you can find any difference by putting those 2 extra screws in and see if they really do make a negative impact on the hotend
Slice engineering as Waltkat said, use this, and I have a Bondtech direct drive with a mosquito hotend with that type, and it works fantastically well
I've seen videos before, CHEP's video comes to mind immediately, where he test the difference between having those screws in vs having them out. This was on an ender 3 stock hot end but in that set up the difference was negligible and it just made more sense to actually have those screws as it prevents the heater block and the heat sink from being twisted out of alignment. Not sure how much a difference there would be between this and the stock option but I doubt it'd be much if any
can we get the links to the products ?
Totally new to 3D printing. Recently purchased an Ender 3 Pro from Creality. Now I'm considering a Mellow hotend, a double geared extruder, a 2mm pitch lead screw, rod coupler and backlash nuts. I know tweaks to the Ender, filament and software will have to be addressed. Quality prints are my goal. Am I jumping off a cliff, or am I on the right track? Cheers
I've got videos on pretty much all of those things, except the changed lead screw.
It's pretty common to all those things. The only stock thing on my rig at this point is the frame lol.
Awesome! Recently brushing up on silent stepper driver upgrade with the TMC2208 because it seems relatively easy to install with an SKR V1.4. Do you have an opinion and video(s) on these upgrades? I'll take a deeper dive down the "rabbit hole" and check more of your videos out. Cheers
I have 2208 stepper drivers on my th3d EZ board light. I decided to go with a higher quality board in my rig.
super educational video but the first layer doesn't look good I think your bed level is not good but keep up with the videos love it
Man I was hoping this video didn’t get to the point of “heat creep from the screws “😂😂
can you use the $13 heat sink for the m10 threading with a genuine micro swiss heat break and heater block ?
The $13 hotend parts are not compatible with microswiss parts.
ive only ever used genuine microswiss all metal hotend, microswiss ender 3 direct drive mount, and microswiss copper heatblock. the quality is just hard to pass up.
Really interesting. Great video! Thanks.
The aluminum pieces are not actually cast. They are just bead blasted for whatever reason.
They will be tumbled a process used to remove sharp edges from aluminium
We know that titanium is a poor conductor of heat and therefore is ideal for a heatbreak, but why do some companies supply boron paste to add to it? now I can understand adding it to the nozzle threads to increase the thermal conductivity to the block but adding it to the heatbrake is like pissing against the wind (pardon my French) or am I missing something?
I came across your video as I was looking for a fix for my Micro Swiss as it is riding up and down, I enjoyed your video so +1 Subscription
Oh by the way a few people have experimented with the two screws and they don't introduce any heat.
Between heatbreak and aluminium block to keep that piece of titanium as cool as possible.
A "Bowden" collect (Drill and install Push to Connect Tube Fitting) and the screw in pneumatic (Threaded Push to connect fitting) fitting are identical in how they work and use essentially the same internal components, The only difference is the components are mounted directly into the heat sink versus mounted in a threaded body. If you were to dismantle a Bowden collect and the threaded push to connect fitting you would see that. As an MFG we have made parts that use both methods, there are pros and cons to both methods. The advantage to many, maybe the ability to chose a replacement if you have issues with the push to connect fitting. Like everything they come in different levels of quality. The push to connect fitting method of installation is really the only difference. The Aluminum parts that are being called cast are most likely just cut and machined bar stock, and then wire brushed to remove burs. I doubt highly they are cast, the cost of a mold would be cost prohibitive.
And temperature teste ? The black one are printed in too hight temperature
You should be thinking how expensive is too expensive, not the other way around. Material wise there is really nothing there to justify a high price. You can get an all metal head for $4 now. Only in America would a company take a couple dollars in material, slap on a "Swiss" name, and charge $65 for it.
Yeah minimum wage is a double edged sword.
I think your looking for the word "forged" (best) vs "cast" aluminum.
Forging would require rather expensive molds and you would see a prominent seam. Also, you cant forge parts cheaply where all sides are 90° to each other. Those parts are made from extruded stock (you can see the typical radii on the heater block) and then machined, probably on a NC-lathe (real CNC lathes are rather uncommon in China, except with automotive suppliers). As the surfaces will be pretty shoddy at this price point (high feed rates), drumming with an abrasive agent is the next step before tapping / drilling so the part is de-burred and can be handled / clamped more safely.
The word you're looking for is "Extruded" - here's a URL for the latest one:
www.aliexpress.com/item/32971919868.html?spm=a2g0o.cart.0.0.591c3c00llAM6l&mp=1
I just got a muskito magnum clone, A decent one for about $60 usd
The double grub screw means there will be less thermal contact between the heat break and the heat sink. Grub screws suck completely. Think about the fact the heat break is smaller than the hole you are putting it in. There is clearance or it wouldn't fit. One screw pushes it to one side where it will touch the inside surface. 2 puts you in danger of it not touching very well on either side. and there can be teetering between the two grub screws inside the given clearance. If you want to cool the heat break, you need excellent thermal contact between it and the heat sink. And when it heats up, the hole grows more than the heat break grows. Meaning more air gap. Being held against one wall with one grub screw is superior in every way imaginable. Grub screws are the worst element of these designs.
That is not cast, just cut from bar stock and tumble deburred.
i like the video but you should mix your audio to mono
These cheap $5 Micro Swiss clones are not worth it. They may work for a print or 2, but will eventually leak filament and clog. If you're going to buy a cheap alternative to the stock hotend, go for an E3D V6 clone with a volcano hotend. Those are less than $10 on aliexpress, and are tried and tested.
1.25-1.5 speed, you'll thank me!
1.5x vid speed. You're welcome.
Your thinking on the cheaper hotend causing more "heat creep" is incorrect - the Micro Swiss clone has MUCH more surface area mating with the cooling block then the Cheaper model.
WTF is a Bowden 'collect'?
I think he means collet.
Yeah, just doesn't know how to pronounce it.
I bought one of these when I first got my printer and I didn’t really know anything. I can verify it’s garbage. You may get a good print or two out of them but eventually it will start leaking or other weird issues. It’s also a bit too short for a stock ender 3 v2. The part cooling duct will go lower than the nozzle and you won’t get a good print. I had upgraded my duct so it at least printed for me, but I recommend everyone avoid this hot end for sure.
Those parts are not cast. You are seeing difference in post processing texturing and perhaps anodizing. Additionally, the reason for retightening hot is aluminum expands a lot when hot. This means the thread path the heat break and nozzle are thread into gets longer. It needs to be tight when it's at maximum length/heat. And Micro Swiss did not as far as I can tell take purposeful steps to spread Covid around the world while they tried to stop it from spreading in China. China did that.
Yet again the OverHype about quality ...on Cheap 3d printers and their 'parts'.... geez, who we kidding here ?
Recent teastrings have demonstrated that even seriously damaged /mutilated even , nozzles / hotends work Surprisingly well.
Only real issue is How much heat creep manifests in a multi hour print.
ALL else is PURE sales B.S.
PS; your printer needs some real setup work.