Labor is the main reason why It's also the reason why China is rapidly expanding their own navy so quickly They don't have to worry about spending to much to it's workers where everyone in the US is greedy
Bath Iron Works can't recruit new workers in part because of the lack of affordable housing, ridiculously the solution would be to build dedicated housing for shipyard workers, but that is too obvious a solution to pursue.
South Korea, could get involved on American soil with helping United States naval shipbuilding programs, if they were on American soil helping to build like Ollie Burke class ships, and others it may be cheaper to have them do this, you're not losing American jobs, when is one of the agreements that they have to have American workers work at them, so you could build a couple of new ones 100 new and year to make ships quicker.
Hanwa already made an offer to buy Philly Shipyards, both to upgrade and modernize it, officially with the reason being that they want to be able to produce some LNG/Oil Tankers out of there given the heavy export market out of the US, but plenty of speculation is that they might also take on less-sensitive and overdue maintenance for the USN too.
It's worth noting that back in June, there were reports that Hanwa was interested in buy Philly Shipyards to upgrade and modernize them, with the first products planned to be LNG carriers. But given that the US Secretary of the Navy praised the deal, it's been speculated that Hanwa Philly will end up taking on some of the burdens such as overdue maintenance, before possibly working up towards building new ships on US soil, but with a mix of S. Korean and American workers. It's also worth noting that Hanwa also tried to buy a larger US shipyard with plans to upgrade and expand them, but the US said no because it was the only shipyard that can build and maintain CVNs. Now we just need Hyundai and Samsung to also buy a few US shipyards, and Japan's JMU and Mitsubishi to buy some US yards too, and get around the Jones Act restrictions by using a mix of foreign labor and American labor to quickly build new ships for the USN. Technically still made in the USA. They'd become the navy equivalent of Hyundais and Toyotas.
We are getting korea on it to help us but this is a bandaid to the problem not a fix, we need to get new ship building facilities and more experts and insentive programs to get people to learn how to build new ships. Upgrading the ship yards, spending the money to actually upgrade this capability, we need to keep our edge in this department.
This is what happens when you cut military spending in half (as a percentage of GDP) for the last 30 years. We can’t maintain a robust shipbuilding industry if we’re unwilling to spend the money for enough ships to sustain it. And the smaller the industry, the more expensive individual ships become.
Why not take advantage of the much larger ship building capacity of Japan and South Korea to build many more Constellation Class Frigates? Even Australia has unused capacity in Melbourne and Western Australia, although the latter may soon receive a contract for multi purpose frigates ( much larger Hunter Class being built in South Australia. You have allies America. Take advantage of their capabilities even if it means changing rigid laws.
Sometimes I wish I had gone this route. Would have been a cool life I think. I checked salaries and I’m not sure it’s worth changing careers at the moment. But if the government is able to spur massive sustained demand, I’d probably seriously think about it.
Thanks for the forecast! Just a quick off-topic question: My OKX wallet holds some USDT, and I have the seed phrase. (alarm fetch churn bridge exercise tape speak race clerk couch crater letter). What's the best way to send them to Binance?
Funny, doing that time the US Department of Treasure was not the number expenditure in the 1980 where the focus went from shipyards to finance and service industry. Today, the number one expenditure of the Government is not economy/Department of Treasury nor Department of Defense....It is Department of Health Care and Human Service. In addition health care is also a budget line item in every federal department, federal agency and military unit....Just too funny with all these MBA... We have shortage of people who have real advance US Accredited STEM degree still also....A lot of liars with fake STEM Degrees.
The shipyards don't find workers for two major reasons, that is what I think. The first is a societal problem. Modern society looks down upon blue-collar men. Real, physical work, even if it were well paid, is considered unattractive, and the people, mostly men, who do that kind of work are even considered "simple" by many. As a result, young men and women are not going to choose such work as a career path. The second is an economic or, better yet, a socioeconomic reason. Earnings have not kept up with the cost of living, housing, food and amenities, all of which have become very expensive over the last ~40 years. All the while, paychecks have, at best, increased moderately. People who want to make decent money today feel that the only way to do so is a college degree and thus a "brain job."
China made a lot more ships than America. Not just more engineers, more shipsyard workers too. People in Eastern Asia are more hard working with longer hours but less pay. America can't have the shipyards operating someway. Boeing is given the union employees a 38% pay raise. I wish my union could give me the same pay raise. In China, the business owners could just say that you are fired.
China understands security first and money second. But America says money first and then security, and America will pay the price very painfully for this
The problem in U.S is that everything is private and profit even those important to government, security etc but China has different systen where everything important for security is owned by the government and the rest by private corporations, sometimes government owned and private corporations compete like tele-clmmunications, ship building, contruction etc. Thats why they can ramp up production so fast just like Russia, Putin has ramped up production and produting 10 times all of NATO before NATO even managed to decide what to do
Everything rise has a fall and the fall can be either gracefull or ugly depending on the wise or stupid dicisions of leaders. Just like Soviet couldnt stop America's rise cuz it was U.S time to rise plus Soviet was never a true competitor to U.S economically, industrially, militarily etc but China is a true and real competitor in all aspects and U.S cant stop its rise just like Soviet couldnt stop U.S rise, today US has the same reputation soviet all aroud the world other than some western countries
This is exactly why the United States needs to start building up, it's manta ray drone forces, the other thing when they build ships keep it simple stupid, a lot of the ships that the United States is going to mothball could be sold to allied countries and let them refurbish them so they would have a better fleet than they have now the money from these purchases of American ships that are going to be put out the pasture, will offset the Navy's building cost, the other thing all the new military ships, need to be able to keep up with the aircraft carrier, to my mind that means all the future ships need to be nuclear, in that way they can have more of the supplies they need to maintain the patrol with the aircraft carriers, all the fuel that they would need normally for the destroyers like the early bird class, imagine all the new early birds were nuclear some of the newer arleigh burke-class ships, could be taken out one at a time and turned into nuclear, Ollie Burke class ships, and make them more multi-mission ships.
There is a way to get enough people to build the ships and that's the prison system now I will agree not all of them deserve a second chance,but there are 1.5 million people that if given the chance would like a learn a new trade and start the halfway house process,with that we would have a brand new work force to build a maintain our own ships but the government will have to offer this agreement.
This is the sad truth. The shipyards need to increase their recruiting and their apprenticeship programs.
Labor is the main reason why
It's also the reason why China is rapidly expanding their own navy so quickly
They don't have to worry about spending to much to it's workers where everyone in the US is greedy
Bath Iron Works can't recruit new workers in part because of the lack of affordable housing, ridiculously the solution would be to build dedicated housing for shipyard workers, but that is too obvious a solution to pursue.
No money.. No ship...less power... It's for being humble ..
I worked at Marinette Marine shipyard for 31 years I was part of the LCS program
South Korea, could get involved on American soil with helping United States naval shipbuilding programs, if they were on American soil helping to build like Ollie Burke class ships, and others it may be cheaper to have them do this, you're not losing American jobs, when is one of the agreements that they have to have American workers work at them, so you could build a couple of new ones 100 new and year to make ships quicker.
Hanwa already made an offer to buy Philly Shipyards, both to upgrade and modernize it, officially with the reason being that they want to be able to produce some LNG/Oil Tankers out of there given the heavy export market out of the US, but plenty of speculation is that they might also take on less-sensitive and overdue maintenance for the USN too.
It's worth noting that back in June, there were reports that Hanwa was interested in buy Philly Shipyards to upgrade and modernize them, with the first products planned to be LNG carriers. But given that the US Secretary of the Navy praised the deal, it's been speculated that Hanwa Philly will end up taking on some of the burdens such as overdue maintenance, before possibly working up towards building new ships on US soil, but with a mix of S. Korean and American workers. It's also worth noting that Hanwa also tried to buy a larger US shipyard with plans to upgrade and expand them, but the US said no because it was the only shipyard that can build and maintain CVNs.
Now we just need Hyundai and Samsung to also buy a few US shipyards, and Japan's JMU and Mitsubishi to buy some US yards too, and get around the Jones Act restrictions by using a mix of foreign labor and American labor to quickly build new ships for the USN. Technically still made in the USA. They'd become the navy equivalent of Hyundais and Toyotas.
We are getting korea on it to help us but this is a bandaid to the problem not a fix, we need to get new ship building facilities and more experts and insentive programs to get people to learn how to build new ships.
Upgrading the ship yards, spending the money to actually upgrade this capability, we need to keep our edge in this department.
New yards - new training- or just stop.. and go to Korea
This is what happens when you cut military spending in half (as a percentage of GDP) for the last 30 years. We can’t maintain a robust shipbuilding industry if we’re unwilling to spend the money for enough ships to sustain it. And the smaller the industry, the more expensive individual ships become.
Why not take advantage of the much larger ship building capacity of Japan and South Korea to build many more Constellation Class Frigates? Even Australia has unused capacity in Melbourne and Western Australia, although the latter may soon receive a contract for multi purpose frigates ( much larger Hunter Class being built in South Australia.
You have allies America. Take advantage of their capabilities even if it means changing rigid laws.
Yes it's going to be expensive to rebuild the U.S. ship building industry but it's nesicarry the investment needs to be made
Sometimes I wish I had gone this route. Would have been a cool life I think. I checked salaries and I’m not sure it’s worth changing careers at the moment. But if the government is able to spur massive sustained demand, I’d probably seriously think about it.
Thanks for the forecast! Just a quick off-topic question: My OKX wallet holds some USDT, and I have the seed phrase. (alarm fetch churn bridge exercise tape speak race clerk couch crater letter). What's the best way to send them to Binance?
Funny, doing that time the US Department of Treasure was not the number expenditure in the 1980 where the focus went from shipyards to finance and service industry. Today, the number one expenditure of the Government is not economy/Department of Treasury nor Department of Defense....It is Department of Health Care and Human Service. In addition health care is also a budget line item in every federal department, federal agency and military unit....Just too funny with all these MBA... We have shortage of people who have real advance US Accredited STEM degree still also....A lot of liars with fake STEM Degrees.
The shipyards don't find workers for two major reasons, that is what I think.
The first is a societal problem. Modern society looks down upon blue-collar men. Real, physical work, even if it were well paid, is considered unattractive, and the people, mostly men, who do that kind of work are even considered "simple" by many. As a result, young men and women are not going to choose such work as a career path.
The second is an economic or, better yet, a socioeconomic reason. Earnings have not kept up with the cost of living, housing, food and amenities, all of which have become very expensive over the last ~40 years. All the while, paychecks have, at best, increased moderately. People who want to make decent money today feel that the only way to do so is a college degree and thus a "brain job."
China made a lot more ships than America. Not just more engineers, more shipsyard workers too. People in Eastern Asia are more hard working with longer hours but less pay. America can't have the shipyards operating someway. Boeing is given the union employees a 38% pay raise. I wish my union could give me the same pay raise. In China, the business owners could just say that you are fired.
China understands security first and money second. But America says money first and then security, and America will pay the price very painfully for this
America will but our billionaire masters won’t. Feature, not a bug
The problem in U.S is that everything is private and profit even those important to government, security etc but China has different systen where everything important for security is owned by the government and the rest by private corporations, sometimes government owned and private corporations compete like tele-clmmunications, ship building, contruction etc. Thats why they can ramp up production so fast just like Russia, Putin has ramped up production and produting 10 times all of NATO before NATO even managed to decide what to do
Reopen mare island and Charleston,
Everything rise has a fall and the fall can be either gracefull or ugly depending on the wise or stupid dicisions of leaders. Just like Soviet couldnt stop America's rise cuz it was U.S time to rise plus Soviet was never a true competitor to U.S economically, industrially, militarily etc but China is a true and real competitor in all aspects and U.S cant stop its rise just like Soviet couldnt stop U.S rise, today US has the same reputation soviet all aroud the world other than some western countries
This is exactly why the United States needs to start building up, it's manta ray drone forces, the other thing when they build ships keep it simple stupid, a lot of the ships that the United States is going to mothball could be sold to allied countries and let them refurbish them so they would have a better fleet than they have now the money from these purchases of American ships that are going to be put out the pasture, will offset the Navy's building cost, the other thing all the new military ships, need to be able to keep up with the aircraft carrier, to my mind that means all the future ships need to be nuclear, in that way they can have more of the supplies they need to maintain the patrol with the aircraft carriers, all the fuel that they would need normally for the destroyers like the early bird class, imagine all the new early birds were nuclear some of the newer arleigh burke-class ships, could be taken out one at a time and turned into nuclear, Ollie Burke class ships, and make them more multi-mission ships.
There is a way to get enough people to build the ships and that's the prison system now I will agree not all of them deserve a second chance,but there are 1.5 million people that if given the chance would like a learn a new trade and start the halfway house process,with that we would have a brand new work force to build a maintain our own ships but the government will have to offer this agreement.
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