Vitamin K2 GAME-CHANGING Human Study
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 26 ส.ค. 2024
- An important Vitamin K2 human study has just been published, with important findings for our health. This video takes a deep dive into the paper
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I have no problem in ignoring this study. I have some practice in ignoring bias studies.
I'll just add the following. I usually find it very useful to know who financed the study. Often times this can tell more than the findings.
Amen! There is a lot of corruption and outright fraud involved in most of these "studies". Sponsored by your friendly and caring pharmaceutical companies.
Hello Dr. Stanfield, thank you for amazingly insightful videos. Personally i have been taking Vitamin K2 (with MK 7), with Vitamin D3 for the past year. Fortunately I no longer have any high blood pressure headaches any longer, and my BP is 118/70 at age 68. Dr. Stanfield, what you are advocating in your videos work beautifully. Have a Great week, Dr. Stanfield.
thanks for sharing
What else have you been doing to help reduce blood pressure?
@Materialworld4 Could you share what else did you take or do to lower your blood pressure?
?
MK-4 is the real vitamin K2 in humans and animals.
I take vitamin K2 for my bones (will check later to see if it's the MK7 variant) along with vit D, and do LOTS of exercise, every day, twice a day. I'm a T3 paraplegic and since I've started my routine I've been able to stand longer.
I am curious if you have seen any benefit from B vitamins (especially B3 and B12). Thanks!
Why do you exercise so much?
@@datt5698 As far as I know, exercise is the number one thing known to extend healthspan other than avoiding loading up on lots of salty, oily food.
@@jefflittle8913 well I've taken niacin, NR and NMN and honestly don't notice a difference, but keep taking the NR anyway for the NAD
@@datt5698 cause I've heard exercise that gets your heart pumping and you out of breath, releases lots of stuff in your body for repair etc, and since I stand twice a day, morning and night, I like to exercise before (and the odd time after) I stand. And I wouldn't be surprised if that's helping me the most
In my pharmacy practice, patients with unresponsive vitamin D supplementation benefited greatly when K2 was added. We also recommended magnesium supplements.
Thanks for sharing. how do you measure if a patient is 'unresponsive' to vitamin D supplements?
@@DrBradStanfield the Dr. would retest in 6mo. If he hadn’t already prescribed K2 we would suggest it usually after the next retest, if still below 30ng/ml.
In which way did they benefit Dennis? Thanks in advance.
@@tracymullane8818 K2 and magnesium both increase D blood levels. K2 has also been shown to help D push calcium into bone rather than blood endothelium.
I'm finding that I can tolerate more Magnesium than I used to as I increased Vit D and MK2.
So many vids only selling "good news" or suitables news, that is really so good to find someone so reliable and unbiased as you, Dr. Standfield. I can always be sure and trust all the information given in this channel. Very thankful.
Did it not occur to the investigators that the "recommended" dose of D3 is very low? It would be interesting to see similar study done with 150 to 250 mcg of D3 rather than 25 mcg, especially at the latitude at which the study was conducted may indicate that the population is vitamin D deficient. In addition, magnesium seems to be involved in the process as well. That was completely ignored. What else did they leave out?
It seems to me that while their method was excellent, their hypothesis was probably inadequate. This, of course, is just the opinion or an ordinary person, not a scientist.
The rda is the amount you need in order to avoid symptoms of a deficiency. Something like that. But upper end are much different. I think there are tox papers that show the upper limits of every substance before toxicity. I'm sure it would be very high on a vitamin you get from the sun in 15 mins a day. Sun all day would be a large amount I assume.
@ken wezeman excellent replies sir , I totally agree, especially with the Vitamin D3 dosage
These people should have been given a higher dose of Vitamin D3, closer to 20,000-30,000 IU for at least a month to top them up to a high level then drop the dosage to maintain that level.
The Vitamin D dose is meaningless. You need to get people to a specific target Vit D blood value. You can't compare someone already on a high level and taking 6000 I.U. per day with someone on a critically low level taking 6000 I.U. Would take months or years to get them to the same level.
I agree.
IMO, it’s “excess” insulin that causes the heart vessels to be inflamed...the calcium is the result of the inflammation. I am also a K2 user, but I also believe minimizing your insulin is key to minimize the inflammation. Until you stop the root cause of inflammation, the K2 apparently (from this study) is not effective. Yes I am a very low carb advocate…ie less than 20 total, this diet has been life changing in repairing my metabolism.
I was going to say the same thing. There is no mention of diet.
Insulin may indeed be unrated.
I am wondering about dairy consumption, as well as sugar and industrial seed oil consumption.
Dairy seems to be the slightly bigger elephant in the room, since it offers an historically unprecedented amount of Calcium imbalance. On the other hand, high carb is a new thing, about 10k years old experiment. And industrial liquid transfats, we know are new and endothelialy inflammatory.
Good point, if people don’t change their eating habits no supplements will magically appear to do anything. I’m not a keto fan ( you don’t have to go keto to get insulin and A1C under control ) but I agree.
@@dennisgarber All very good points that should be considered.
I can't exercise without some carbs. I prefer 75g a day.
I absolutely love that you're doing vids about studies that disappoint. A true researcher. And what an amazing study it is! Oh the Scandinavian quality and attention to detail si refreshing! Especially after the Chinese-Indian disaster study on NMN.
Thank you so much Brad! Mad respect!
I agree. Alot of TH-cam posters are selling hope and hype! I prefer transparency and honesty. Generally speaking, the red pill is preferable.
@@baigish100 absolutely. Well, for who's got a spine and some guts to swalow it.
70 and 20 percent blocked carotid arteries, looking at top shelves in supermarket made me dizzy. Took k2 and d3 for6 months , ok so stopped , dizziness came back. Restarted k2 and d3 ,I’m ok again. John Rolfe
I wish they had used the MK-4 version which is what I take specifically for bone health.
MK-4 stops and reverse bone loss, grows stronger bones and reduces fractures more than 80%.
MK-7 has never been shown to reduce fractures.
The use of MK-4 is supported by more than 28 clinical trials with over 7,000 volunteers.
True , looks like each has it's own strength
They also shouldn't use vitD..it depletes retinol , messes with copper mechanisms and takes calcium offf bones..k2 alone would work we already have studies showing that
I agree, we need a study with Mk4
your right about the proven results with the mk4. unfortunately there's nothing available in 🇦🇺 so will order it from 🇺🇸
@@pluto4D Australian emu oil has MK4
Keeping in mind that calcification is usually a slow process that progresses over decades, choosing arotic valve calcification regression as an indicator for D/K² effectiveness was a tall order! Perhaps a starting point should be improvements in carotid artery intima - which is cheaper to monitor and a good proxy to the hypothesis of GLA matrix theory.
The problem was they used MK7 instead of MK4 and didn't use magnesium. It kills me that people with go through all the trouble of designing and executing a study without properly looking into the subject.
In 2018, I had a pain in my chest after a workout.
I mentioned this to my Doctor, who sent me for a treadmill stress test.
The test discovered some anomalies, I was scheduled for a full workup, cat scan etc..
in the two weeks waiting for this appointment, as a precaution, I started taking vit k2 w/D3, followed 30 mins after with cayenne pepper capsules 3x/day
12 days into this regimen, while lying on the sofa, with my chin to my chest, I heard and felt what sounded like a washing machine in my chest for several seconds, followed by a "whoosh"
My very next breath was 20% greater than before,
The cat scan workup found no heart obstructions.
I know a dodged a bullet.
What should I search to learn why this protocol might be helpful?
THAT is an incredible story!
Very, very interesting, indeed.
Thanks for sharing.
I always worry about plaque breaking loose and clogging up a smaller diameter but good for you.
While these results are definitely disappointing, I love seeing null results getting published!
Why do you love seeing null results getting published?
@@Pakistan-Icecream for way too long in a academia there's been a skewed pressure towards publishing positive results-that's where all the money and prestige is. To the point where many researchers wouldn't even go to the effort of doing a writeup if their study ended up with null findings. Which is a huge problem, because knowing if something DOESN'T work is also super important!
@@DistilledScience I take vitamin D3 and K2-MK7 with magnesium malate supplement every morning and it hasn't made me feel worse.
One flaw in the study. They didn't report on Vitamin D levels before the start of the study, if the two groups had similar levels before the study and if the levels were adequate. In the supplementation material they just report the Vit D levels increased in the treatment group, but not in the control, which is obvious. Any trial supplementing Vit D should measure base line and divide groups by that and then supplement to reach a specific target level. Or in this case, get people to a specific target level first in both groups and then add MK7.
You can’t stop a supplement after every trial. Keep taking it.
I took 220mcg of K2 as MK7 for 10 years with high cholesterol but my coronary artery calcium score is zero.
I think it’s got more to the puzzle Dr Brad
to this, like inflammatory markers in elderly and how their overall health and diet status is.
Maybe adding fasting to remove senescent cells. Removing GMO oils from seeds, sugar & flour alcohol and I’m sure the K2/D3 combo will do it’s job better.
Reduce ROS with a NADH supplement.
It’s the senescent cells, inflammation and ROS that’s causing the calcium to build up. So you must remove the cause and the add K2/D3
These studies are not holistic enough
Also, this study only gave their subjects 25 ug vitamin D... no one will benefit anything from only 25 ug especially if they are elders because elderly people need higher doses of vitamin d before their body takes it in... they should have had at least 125 ug or even +200 ug of vitamin d...
Ans the k2 dose seemed like an overdose.. so they were under dosing vitamin D and overdosing vitamin k2.. 💩🍩
I have been taking K2/D3 since 2019. It hasn’t caused any problems so I think I will continue.
Thanks for sharing
Same here about 2014 myself
I went into cardiac arrest about 6 years ago. I had 4 stents put into my heart arteries. I have been taking VK2 MK7 ever since along with a Statin. I was not over weight with normal col levels. Have had no issues since so I am hopeful that it will help prevent a further blockage.
You may want to take closer to 300mcg of Vitamin K2 as statins really rob the body of K2. 200mcg is more standard for non statin users
66 yo Male with no previous heart issues. On a statin for 25 years. Self terminated statins due to severe tendon issues. Heart calcium score 6 years prior (on statins) 550. Follow-up six years later, scored 900. Also started to notice heart seemed to "labor" at night when I laid down to sleep. It was as if my heart was partially calcified. Went to cardio doctor and he wanted to put me back on statin. I asked him what his statin would do that 2.5 decades on simvastatin didn't do. He could not answer. I suggested a nuke stress test and he agreed. I passed this treadmill with zero issues. I fired my cardio doctor and then went keto and dropped 40 lbs and began high doses of Mena K2 and EDTA along with higher doses of vitamin D. I also found a cardiac study out of Leiden Holland which indicated long term statin use resulted in increased coronary calcium score. A year later my heart is totally back to normal. Zero effort when I lay down. I often cannot even tell it is beating after a minute or two. I am a believer. Will maintain dosage from now on.
Thank you very much Brad for publicizing these negative studies. There's a lot of hype bias in the longevity community which stacks on top of publication bias.
The publication bias toward association is really a serious matter. Good job for the researchers and the journal!
I know what K2 is supposed to achieve when taken with higher doses of D3, but what is the purpose of the D3 in this study, with already calcified blood vessels? Is the D3 needed to “pull/remove” the existing calcification before the K2 moves it to the bones? If so, that seems like quite a low dose of D3. It would be interesting to see it repeated with at least 100mcg (4000IU) instead.
My question as well. I thought that to much vitamin d could possibly increase calcium. I had high calcium levels so I used the vitamin k2, and high great results.
Before you get magnesium you also need calcium but before you get calcium you also need Vitamin K2. I would love to see what the vitamin and mineral levels of the 365 men who participated in the study. It would shed more light and also to see what their diet included. It also only tested MK7 but it would be nice to see the combination of MK4 too.
You don't need calcium to take magnesium, you can be sure you have a deficit of mag like everyone else. Calcium supplementation is only beneficial to pregnant people and fast growing kids.
@@HellGod67 Calcium supplementation is beneficial for people who lack food sources of bioavailable Calcium and Vitamin K2 in their diet. Too much Bone Resorption (Osteoclasts) over time without enough Calcium may lead to a deficiency, then to Osteoporosis or Osteopenia. This occurs because the calcium in bones are a reserve for calcium needs by the body and need to be built up again by Osteoblasts . Calcium without K2 will lead to Calcification over time. The body is in a constant state of Bone Remodeling.
I am not a doctor, but watching other doctors videos, it is strange for me that the vitamin D dosage is extremely low. Im other doctor's opinion 250mcg/d would be more interesting to study. The vitamin K2 MK7 is manufactured in two different molecules. The efficient one is K2 MK7 (All) trans. The usual RDA is about 200-225mcg/d, but specialists also suggest to take vitamin K2 MK4 1000mcg/d and also K1 and not only these vitamins, but magnesium as well. This study is probably well prepared, but seems to be far from reality.
Dr Stanfield, I hope some of the following might be useful to you or others. In June of 2019, I found my Vitamin D level to be 22 ng/ml. My doc requested that I take 5000IU, per day. A month later, my brother told me (I was 65 then) that a good friend of his dropped dead of a heart attack while jogging despite having never had any symptoms. We both decided a calcium scan was in order and we were both quite high. Mine was over 900 despite no symptoms ever, never being overweight and eating what I thought was a decent diet for decades. Turned out I needed 2 stents and that took place in Oct 2019. Prior to that my 2 minute heart rate recovery was about 45 bpm, a number I believed was decent, if not great. In Nov 2020, my Vitamin D was 52 and in Feb 2022 it was 62. I've cut to 3000IU during the summer months. All along I've been on 20mg of Benazepril a day because I did have somewhat elevated high bp for years prior (although I now believe much of that was white coat issues). I introduced K2 at 180mcg about 1.5 years ago. Several weeks ago, I started taking my Mg at night and my sleep suddenly and noticably improved. Shortly thereafter, my blood pressure dropped from averaging 120/70 to more like 110/65. My doc asked me to cut my Benazepril to 10mg per day. I did that 3 weeks ago and my bp over that time has averaged 110/64 with a pulse of 58. I take those readings at different times during the day. So, reducing my bp med has NOT resulted in an increase in my bp. Will be contacting my doctor soon to see what's next. Over the last year, my 2 minute heart rate recovery has consistently been in the 65-70 range. Does K2 MK7 have anything to do with improvements? I don't know but I will continue to take it and keep reading. At some point, I may get another calcium scan but my heart rate recovery score makes me feel good about my current situation.
What looks like a giant neon red-flag to me is the pathetic dosage of Vitamin D at 25mcg (1000 IU). Seriously?! Did they even test for Vit-D serum levels in these patients? If so, I didn't catch it in a quick scan of the text. Given the high prevalence of Vit-D deficiency in the developed world -- particularly in the elderly population -- you might as well not even bother with the Vit-D at all at that dosage. Frankly, it almost seems like they intentionally designed this study to fail.
Agree. 5000iu’s seems to be a minimum nowadays.
I hear you. I’m 75 and live in mi. And when I go out side I don’t think I get any sun. I take 5,000 IUs and haven’t overdosed since I started it about 3+ years ago. My neighbors in my senior apartment are surprised I don’t have ANY medicine prescriptions. Hope I’m on the right track. 🎃
Agreed.
Wasn’t it the NEJM editor who resigned and stated something along the lines of “the data/science can no longer be trusted”? That was over 10 years ago.
@@ts3063 You might be thinking of Dr. Marcia Angell, former editor of the NEJM, who wrote the 2004 book, _"The Truth About the Drug Companies."_ Or Dr. Ben Goldacre, who wrote his own version of the same thing, _"Bad Pharma,"_ in 2013. More recently, there was a peer-reviewed OpEd in the BMJ last spring called _"The Illusion of Evidence Based Medicine."_
The vitamin D dose they use (25 μg / 1000 UI) is quite low and it's not stated whether this is D3 or D2. It would be nice if the paper had included the 25(OH)D3 serum levels of the participants. I'll certainly continue with my current regime of 125 μg (5000 UI) D3 plus 360 μg K2 MK-7 (and a mix of other K2s) combined with regular 25(OH)D3 and calcium testing.
I'm not an expert. But doesn't vitamin D itself increase the calcium absorption from the digestive tract, and therefore increase the blood calcium levels, whereas K2 helps transporting calcium OUT of the blood? In that case, wouldn't it make sense to do a trial with high vit K2 intake, but only average vit D intake, if the goal is to reduce blood calcium levels? Thanks for clarifying! :)
I like others here believe vitamin K2 MK4 should have been tested here too. More studies back up it's effectiveness than that of MK7. The only supposed benefit of MK7 in comparison is that it is slow acting throughout the day but is that a good thing when other vitamins such as D3 are readily absorbed? I get the theory that if it's absorbed at a slower rate it should have more time to act and decalcify but wouldn't we want something readily absorbed with vitamin D3 so it can be quick to transport the calcium like MK4? If MK4 has already been proven to decalcify and it absorbs quicker why are we turning our attention away from this and focusing on a slower absorbing K2 in MK7? This study showed no results so maybe we can run MK4 in a similar trial set up.
My research has shown that the mk 4 version of K2 is better. I take 5,000 mcg a day of Mk4 and despite crazy high cholesterol and apoB and lipoA, my cardiac calcium ct scan has shown zero in two tests. Perhaps the research should use higher dose mk4, but I do agree that there are ,
M
perhaps we should wait for a trial that involves K2 MK-4 rather than K2 MK-7. it would be interesting to compare the results.
Amazing that MK-4 was not even mentioned!
My understanding of calcium in the arteries is that it is part of a healing process that begins with a lesion and then ends with the use of calcium as a protective coating for the lesion.
Atherosclerosis is a complicated process, but essentially we don't want calcium to build up and block the blood vessels
I was a bit harsh on you in a comment a little while ago. I am actually quite impressed with your analysis of the information you share about studies etc. You keep it real and factual, and your stated mission in what you are doing with this channel, is very admiring to me and you are a man after my own heart, and that is to help humanity with good nutritional information. Yu work hard to cut through the crap! And there is sooooo much of it to cut trough online. BIG Thumps up to you, and I apologize for my reaction to a certain video you posted!
Might be more prevention than cure, which is what I'm into. Thanks doc, because of you I got started, heart disease runs in my family
An interesting analysis might be comparing Japanese populations that consume natto regularly, to Japanese populations that do not in terms of calcification of arteries and valves. My understanding it, only about 60% of Japanese regularly consume natto (a very strong source of Viamin k2), the population largely in the north of Japan. As always, a great presentation.
This is a very good idea, because their is every indication that eating large amounts of fermented food is the primary cause of stomach cancer in Korean and other populations in the far east. If it is conclusively proven that their is no benefit from the high concentrations of K2 in natto, then it certainly would not be worth the increase in the chance of developing stomach cancer.
Judging by the number of TH-cam channels advocating the use of fermented foods to feed the microbiome it seems there must be a movement toward the use of fermented foods despite the fact that we have refrigeration. Of course the fact that populations that use lots of fermented foods have such a greater incidence of stomach cancer is never mentioned on these channels, and it may not even be known by the various advocates.
Natto is also a source of nattokinase. Which might have some beneficial effect in that direction as well...
One of the owners of NYrture New York Natto recently told me a Japanese study of natto showed those who consume a serving of natto 3-4x week (which averaged out to consuming 200-250 mcg every day of mk-7) faired better than those who only consumed 1 serving a week.
Thank you, I was going to ask about that. Nattokinase seems very promising.
Natto also contains high levels of PQQ, not well understood but boosts mitochondrial function at least, obviously heart beneficial. I'll continue both daily Natto & K2-mk7 D3. Thanks Dr. Brad!
I think it's possible that it's MK4 that's the active form of vitamin K2.
And that MK7 works by being converted in the body to MK4 (by replacing the tail. This mechanism exists.)
The reason MK7 stays in the serum for so long would then be that the conversion is so slow.
While MK4 disappears fast to where it's needed.
I haven't seen any good research about this.
The supplement firms seems to prefer MK7, and haven't any interest in MK4 for commercial reasons.
I've read that vitamin D3, K2, and magnesium helps to direct the calcium, to go into the bones and teeth instead of into the soft tissue, and in the blood. So I will keep taking the supplements. Hoping for the best. Thanks for the videos.
Thanks for sharing @wiz
Yep
There’s more than just MK-7 under the umbrella of K2. I’m not totally convinced that this study represents the possible impact of MK-4, MK-6, and/or MK-9
Interesting! I wonder if anyone will do more studies on these other forms. Good comment. 👍
I'm surprised that there was no distinction made between MK-4 and MK-7 in this K2 study. I would think it would be the MK-4 form of K2 that would have an anti-plaque effect, not the MK-7.
Can you explain the difference between the MK-4 and MK-7 forms. Mine is MK-7, so now I am nervous.
@@HappyLife-wv5ms Both have supposed benefits, MK4 has far more evidence backing it though, actually proven to have significant impact on bone health. Only downside is it has shorter half life so has to be taken at least 3 times a day.
We can't expect much effect from such a low dose of vitamin D. That also diminish the effect of vitamin k2, since they then has less vitamin K Dependent Proteins to work with.
I would expect so see a result from 4000 IU of vitamin D, not 1000 IU, as in this study.
I think it's sad when they do this much work and not get it right.
I agree. I take a daily combo of vitamin D3 4000 units, K2-MK7 tablet 100 units and a magnesium malate supplement.
Right!?!? Here's another K2 study from Microbiome Labs with more in depth benefits (27 thru 37:00 min mark) as well. Worth every minute
th-cam.com/video/5-KGceRenn4/w-d-xo.html
I can agree with that. Even 4000 IU might be to low to see results. I have other studies on low dose of vitamin D3 and showed no results. Maybe they increase it to 10000 IU . When using 1000 IU of vit d would hardly be enough to bring you out of defiencies
I will continue to eat 50 g of natto every day like I have for 20 years. Great summary.
I ❤️ Natto!
Where do you get it?
@@niellalien I order mine from NYture in Brooklyn. Shipping is around $20 and each jar is $12. Order at least 4 jars at a time but not too many because they’re best not too old. I get the organic with turmeric. I only eat a little bit every day.
@@niellalien Japanese supermarkets. Each 50 g tub has about .9 mg of K2-MK7 and 20 mg polyamines. Three tubs for about 2$US.
I have not seen the complete study so I am thinking about the possibility that NO dietary considerations were included in the study. I think it's quite possible that a diet high in processed carbs and/or sugar could override any benefits that K2 provides. A whole-food, low carb diet combined with K2 could have much different results!
excellent idea - this was also the first thing I thought. Would be interesting to see possible different outcomes when comparing people on SAD with Keto/Paleo etc....
Hi Tim, quite possibly. However at this stage, all we have to go on is speculation regarding your hypothesis unfortunately...
I am proud of this doctor's analysis. A normal doctor would abandon K2 and D, rather than point out the more likely possibility that there are more factors that need to be added. Most things in biology and in the real world are more than 2 or 3 things to get a result.
Heck to properly paint 1 wall you need up to 40 items : good paint, several types of patching, several types of knives, several types of sanding equipment, special lighting consisting of 3 types of lamps, power and hand sanders, cords and hoses leading to a vaccum system, drops, several types of tape and paper, door plastic, rollers, roller slaves, paint filters, respirators, special clothing, caulk, caulk guns, tray liners, at least one tray, at least one 4 inch roller and sleeve, ear plugs, cleanup area, temporary equipment storage area, usually several types of paint (flat ceiling paint, special primers, wall paint, alkyd urethane trim enamels,) feather fill, at least one new brush pencils, screw drivers, wrenches, and more. Then you have the FDA who tries one tool at a time hoping to solve a complex biological problem.
I hope that they find the missing variable or variables. I would start at looking at the communities that have used K2 and D3 and have documented the reversal. Hflc, most likely. Was it low vegetable oils, low insulin, more liver and fish, more exercise, lower sugar, lower carbs, lower junk foods, along with bumping up the K and D?
I also wonder how Dairy plays into it all. Some hflc people avoid dairy and others use dairy as a crutch. I personally think dairy is an evolutionarily new food and people get way too much calcium that our ancestors did not get, which likely needs to cut out or balanced by large amounts of zinc and magnesium, as these compete in the body.
@@DrBradStanfield Something must have gone wrong because...
Where stays the Rotterdam study with this result now???
"A whole-food, low carb diet "
Whole food sure, low carb? Based on what evidence, where? Talking quality carbs, not garbage processed crap of course.
Thank you Dr. Stanfield for another fantastic video. I have been supplementing with vitamin K2 with D3 in MCT oil for a little over a year now as I was hoping it would help with the formation of calcium kidney stones. I am an RN and always interested in new therapies to help my family and patients that I care for. Stay well Sir.
Thanks for sharing
How is that going for you?
@@18Rhapsody Really well! I am still doing this routine daily and I have had zero kidney infections👍
And no kidney stones either😄
@@michellegiacomoni3249 thank you for the response
My husband gets kidney stones.. he had an injury to one side when he was younger but maybe this will help!
I still think mk4 is higher potency and faster acting then mk7 . The life extension “Super K “ supplement has K1 mk4 and mk7. Correct me if I’m wrong, but can’t vitamin d cause calcium to build up in the arteries? Correct me if I’m again wrong, but I thought vitamin d can cause calcium to absorb in the blood. but you still need vitamin K to send that calcium to the bones? I guess I’m suggesting they should have used mk4 since I was under the belief that it’s faster acting and can be taken at higher dosages. I guess I’m also suggesting The vitamin d may have counteracted the effect of vitamin k mk7
Exactly, I think MK4 is the one that decalcifies plaque and not mk7. You'll find contradictory information regarding this. The people who go on keto/carnivore diets that lower their CAC are eating lots of animal meats, which contain K2 mk4 and not mk7; since mk7 is found in plants/bacteria. Honestly, I would cover all bases and use mk4 and mk7 because I've seen anecdotes from people saying mk7 reversed calcification, so who knows. I'm currently using both and so far my teeth are whiter, so something is happening.
Thank you for a balanced, scientific readout of the study.
Dr Brad,
Please comment on:
1) the levels of D3 and Magnesium (lipids) of the cohort before and after the trial period. This is essential to show that the supplementation (for the test group) actually increased the lipid values and therefore the trial could reasonably show a benefit (or not) of such increase. As the alternative of no increase in lipid values in the test group from supplementation means there will be no visible benefits. Result: Trial failed due to faulty method.
The trial is missing Magnesium - all the studies I have read require 3 "ingredients: Vit D3 + Magnesium + K2 (MK4 + Mk7).
Mechanism: The 3 supplements when adequate operate in consort to "shepherd" calcium to the bones and teeth away from soft tissue and I suggest perhaps aortic valves (the purpose of the trial). This is known mechanism.
So key questions are;
- does it do this for aortic valves calcium? (purpose of trial I assume).
- is the duration of the trial sufficient to achieve a meaningful result - as the process of reversing calcium may be slow. Result: Trial did fail due to faulty method (my opinion).
My perception for these supplements to make a significant difference you need to have lipid D3 a lot higher than is the usual minimum trotted out. (30)
Moreover, magnesium adequacy is critical for success.
I am guessing that the people managing this trial may have allowed some faulty method to creep in and so trial conclusion was a meaningless waste of effort and money.
It just depends upon your response to my comments. Maybe these items and more were covered - I suggest you should have included them (I stopped listening when you started discussion the conclusion).
I am thinking that when there are such obvious flaws (my opinion) in a trial; I always wonder why?
.
Vitamin K2 is created via the microbiome gut bacteria, perhaps there is some pairing agents that are also created that make it more effective. Perhaps we should focus on building a healthy microbiome and get the Vitamin K2 downstream.
Red light spectrum on gut area increases gut biome, (dr jack Kruse podcasts )
@@markhedger6378 what kind of light did you get? I am thinking of getting one.
@@tnijoo5109 also nir is not visible to human eyeso appears not working but it is, sunlight on bere skin is more effective, at all times of the day
What i take from this and all the replies and similar channels and studies is that science literally understands about 1% of the body and how it works!
We should use data ro look at any outliers and see what factors we are missing and redo the trial with those factors. Such as diet fasting , stress,exercise, bone density. The idea of studies should be to collect data and find patterns. And then use follow-up focus studies to investigate efficacy, dosage and side effects.. we need studies just to find effects and then figure out how it works..
Very interesting study. Yah I like taking D3/K2 but more for OP prevention rather than cardiavascular calcification. Most healthy-eating, slim, fit folks should be ok from a cardiorespiratory point of view but often may lack bone density later in life
Hi Dr Stanfield, the doses on the K2 and D3 seemed very low. I'm working with. D3 at 18000 iu which gives me a 92 on the Hudroxy25 and K2 as MK7 at 280 mcg. Keep up the wonderful work, we are all learning
my thoughts exactly.. 1000iu vitamin D is pretty much nothing.
Am taking VitD3 60k iu once a week without k2, it seems VitK is also needed for decalcification, am I right Sir
@@basuh7526 I would not take so much d3 without k2.. regardless I would suggest you to check your d3 levels via blood test, I took 30k iu for 2.5 months and my blood level got to 150 ng/ml which is way too high, at 150 and up your chance of getting too much calcium is getting high.. My ideal would be about 100ng/ml
@@OzAdi hi sir my hydroxy25 is 26ng/ml , it's little less & calcium is 10mg/dl it's okay level, I was taking VitD 400 iu & now it's 60,000 iu/week, it seems it's okay
@@basuh7526 I thought it was 60k a day, sorry..
Yes, I will continue to use. K2 from MK7. I need to build bone and I continue to believe it could prevent build up.Arterial calcification.
The problem is almost always informational, we have to find ways to signalize something that our bodies seems to forget. And this doesnt mean that it must come from an external source.
I will continue taking K2/ MK7 and D3 just because it reduced my cholesterol level a bit from 5.7 to 5 or from 220 to 195 without diatary changes. After covid my cholesterol levels went abnormally high! I'm not alone I noticed
@Alfred Weber Take then nicotinic acid ( vitamin B3 ) Because that's the only supplement I can think of I took while traveling. Is your K2 MK7 variant? Not all K2 MK7 are equal , some are not stable or true MK7. Always get K2VITAL or MenaQ7 branded ones , those 2 are the only stable form of K2 MK7 variant
There is plenty I can recommend to target cholesterol, but I took the above while traveling and just had them.
I just had a test and my cholesterol went down further to 4.5 or 174 without diatary changes and less activity.
Most of my family after covid suddenly had high cholesterol.
Let me know if I can help . I was researching this industry over 20 years .
I am undergoing a high vit D3 (15,000 UI Daily) therapy to treat MS and am therefore also supplementing K2 MK7 and will continue to, i was surprised by the outcome of this study because one expects K2 to reduce the progression of calcium accumulation in the valve
"Given that vitamin D3 is an immunoregulating hormone and can be considered safe when supplementing it together with K2, Table 1 provides a rough guideline on how to raise vitamin D levels to desired values. Supplementation of magnesium (200-250 mg/day) should also be considered, as all enzymes that metabolize vitamin D seem to require magnesium..."
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7406600/
I started with a calcium scan last year and will get one yearly to see if my supplementation will help. I will continue 300 micros a day of K2.
I have heard that dangerous atherosclerotic plaque is the soft plaque, and that calcification indicates more stable (older) plaque that is less likely to rupture and cause obstruction. I have also heard that statins can cause an increase in one’s coronary calcium score over time, and that this is a good thing as it indicates that one’s plaque is stabilizing. If this is true, how does vitamin K2 play into this process?
I took K2 and D3, daily, for two years. My CAC scores increased from 73 to 145.
They are not likely to help in the absence of dietary changes.
Hi Peter. My CAC went from 103 to 125 in three years. I too took K2 and D3 daily. Also during those years I did LCHF diet and maintained near ideal body weight, high HDL, very low triglycerides, A1c and hs-CRP. I agree with Alan M nearby. Oh and toss in ample cycling and walking.
@@garyhiland6013 Yes. I did and do, all those things as well. One good thing about CAC is that calcified plaque is very safe. It is the sticky stuff that is very dangerous. I recently had a Cardiorisk CIMT done and they said my arterial condition was equal to someone 37 years old. So I got that going for me...
We know most bioavailable vitamins and minerals come from animal products, when they do the same test with mk4 i think it could be much more valuable. Also different doses too, with enough D3 maybe 1-2mg of mk4
D3 supplementation can be dangerous, look it up and it'ds connection to cerulopkqsmun...i regret it
Dr. Brad Stanfield, the message behind your video made me cry. I take vitamin K2 with Vitamin D3 in the hope it would prolong my longevity and you have dashed my hopes.
I have a difficult time with these types of studies. What kind of diet did these people have during the study? Did any of them have any subclinical vitamin deficiencies? You really cannot expect that taking one vitamin can reverse something like established stenosis. I will always take K2-7 and vitamin D3. I had a severe D3 deficiency in 2009. My D level was at 6ng. I had read a book and went to a doctor and asked for a test. At the time I had high blood pressure, Thyroid issues, and condromalacia in both knees. I hurt all over and had total brain fog. After taking D3 and K2 I got my level to over 100ng. and all my issues were resolved. I upped both my D3 and K2 when I heard about some of the studies doctors were posting on the internet about how patients with covid-19 who had to be hospitalized were all Vit. d deficient. I have not had covid or even a cold since then. My granddaughters have had colds and I hold them and read to them and I still never even get so much as a sniffle. I am 70 and will always take these supplements no matter what any study says.
Hi Dr. Brad. Thanks for your great suggestive video. I personally take K2 with D3 and will continue.
Thanks for sharing!
Perhaps magnesium should be stacked with the D & K2?
Bro just stop lmfao it doesnt work
@@Vingalinga lol!
Very good idea!
@@Vingalinga you know what they inject first intravenously during a heart attack? MgCl….just saying…
It would be interesting to do this study with K2 alone. D3 after all does instruct the kidneys to retain more calcium in the bloodstream.
I will tell you what cleaned out my arteries - ascorbic acid buffered with potassium and Lactobacillus plantarum unblocked my heart within 3 weeks. But I will continue to take MK7 to get the calcium where is should be and not free flowing in my blood or glued to my arteries and I get enough D3 spending an hour each day in the sun.
Thank you doctor Brad for your help. I have a 91 year old father who had a ischemic stroke 7 years ago he's on blood pressure medication as well as lipitor and metformin. I am supplementing him with alpha lipoic 600 mg acid, essential amino acids 10 grams, resveritrol 1 gram, curcumin one gram, gotu kola one gram, and astragalus one gram, bi daily Aakg 3600 MG He does show positive increase cognitive ability as well as "healthier appearing skin" . Increased motor function in stroke damaged extremities ?? Very enthusiastic!
OMG, LIPITOR almost killed my Dh, he was advised to get off ASAP, does MORE harm, check out Dr 3ric B3rg on YT it eats you up.
Sorry to hear my dads been on it for quite some time and all well so far. I agree with dieting to avoid stating is the way yo go but not every case is the same as you know. Godbless amd I hope to be in the future with good health and God's love ❤
Thank you for your reply 🙏
Seems like reverse-aging studies are making major breakthroughs on a monthly basis; amazing!
I wonder who funded the research study?
Thus wouldntve been a factor for me, until covid
Study worth repeating with MK4?
thank you again for sharing and explaining the latest studies
My pleasure!
I've always thought that supplementation is a somewhat simplistic, magic-bullet approach. As pointed out, one possibility is that the calcification process is too complex to be blunted by vitamin K2 and Vitamin D supplements alone. I get my K2 primarily from natto and also consume good amounts of red meat and high K2 cheeses while my vitamin D intake is primarily from fatty fish and eggs plus I'm an avid fisherman and hiker so I spend a lot of time in the Southern California sunshine.
I understand it would be very difficult to do a large study of the type described in the video using those criteria, but I can't help but wonder/hope that the calcification process is complex in a way that getting one's vitamins and nutrients from whole foods rather than supplements might be the key.
what i high k2 cheese?
Real Dutch Gouda? Read that, somewhere.
Thank you dr Brad for reporting on this great study. As I have elevated calcification noted on my CAC scan, I was also hoping K2 may help reduce progression. I have been taking D3 and K2 for the past few years and have noticed a massive improvement with my immune system. I don’t know if this is a coincidence with social distancing during COVID, but have gone from being sick approx 1week out of 4 to not having being sick in almost 3years (with the exception of COVID with mild symptoms). I will continue taking D3/K2 for this reason. Cheers
There should be direction from some expert source on how much K2 to take when you take a lot of anti-oxidants as they are blood thinners and K2 is a blood clotting so it equalizes. I get my blood tests often so I know my blood was too thin without extra K. Few doctors think about this or know what to say when you go outside the box. 125 mcg? I laugh at this puny amount. Also take 10,000iu of D. I am sure I will get no red heart for this from Dr Stanfield but maybe a scolding?
Aside from arterial calcification, vitamin K2 is very important for the health of the gut microbiome.
I just started to take k7. Very hopeful even though my BP and heart is normal at 61 yr old. Bad family heart disease though.
i started with a calc score of 700. took large doses of K2 and D3 for a year. had another calc score done and it doubled to 1400. calcium aint the problem. damage and inflamation to the interior of the blood vessels is what necessitates the plaque buildup. four months later i had a gangrenous appendix removed. damage to the ateries from the infection is likely the culprit in my calc score doubling. lack of K2 and D3 was NOT my problem. i hope my score now goes down. i think this is a wrong approach. damage to the arterial walls from sugar, seed oils and low grade infection of the mouth, etc, are the problem in my estimation. be well. the body is working as it should.
Thanks for sharing...
Hello Dr Stanfield, I've read in other articles that Vitamin K2 has a half life of about three days, I believe that is for a dose of 100mcg. That being said, why would you have to take that daily if its still in your system after several days? I have started doing K2 100mcg on Monday and then again on Thursdays
Yeah, I don’t think everyday is necessary. I’m taking every other day (100mcg), but think I’ll do every third day like you. I do think it might be causing some anxiety/high blood pressure/shallow breathing issues. But I also feel like it’s increasing my testosterone or libido in combination with Vitamin D and also reducing plaque on my teeth because my dental hygienist doesn’t have to scrape my teeth anymore.
I'm not sure how you can keep attrack of all of these papers and studies but it's very admirable, Doc 👌🤛
Since there don't seem to be major side effects I'll still be taking it for my skin health
Thank you for presenting the study even though it didn't show the desired results 💛
Thanks for the informative video. Two observations immediately sprang to mind - firstly I’ve read various reports saying K2 MK4 is more effective for cardiovascular protection, also the D3 supplementation seemed very low. It would be interesting to see the results of a similar study using MK4 and higher D3.
MK4 is better
Excellent analysis as usual Brad thanks, saves me reading all those trial papers 😁, Btw for me one of the reasons for the Mediterrainian countries having a low instance of heart disease is 8n my opinion totally to do with the lifestyle and the diet is only one factor in this. I think its called the French paradox? areas in mid/southern France the population eat lots of butter duck/ geese fat and masses of stinky cheese ( as blue as possible) and of course barrels of local Cab Sauvingon, ahh heaven! Now check the heart disease around there !
This was for MK-7. Should've been done on MK-4. MK-4 gets absorbed. MK-7 stays in the blood longer because the body has no use for it.
The reason there was little improvement in the study was because a dosage of 25IU of D3 in entirely too low. The dosage for D3 should have been 5,000IU minimum. These two vitamins work together as a team. I've been taking 10,000 IU for 20 years now with absolutely zero side effects.
Very good video, I would love to see more on this. As for the trial, I believe the parameters were incorrect, or more accurately incomplete. Vitamin D3 and K2 work WITH magnesium and vitamin A (and most probably more) in a supportive, "group" effort. Kudos for the study looking at 2 factors (D3 and K2), but recommend acknowlegement of how vitamins work together, and continued examination of the many combinations possible.
Also, be aware that the forms of D3 and K2 may need to be different to achieve decalcification: what about trying sunlight and natto as sources instead of the supplements they used?
And don't rule out the probability of additional, unknown factors waiting to be identified. Just consider what was known in 1922 and what is now known in 2022. By 2122 it may be a whole new set of known vitamins or as-yet-un-named-vitamins and chemicals that work together.
I'll make a note in my calendar to check then.
To Dr Stanfield, Thank you for this video. This is a general question regarding Vitamin K 2 in terms of MK4 and MK7. Chris Masterjohn mentions the positions of these forms in the chylomicron itself, and how based on their position (in the middle or on the outside) will affect which form is absorbed first. Does physiology really work this neatly or am I am misunderstanding this? Thank you for all your concise and extremely useful videos!
The vitamin D dose is too low. It should be at least ten times that.
I take 200 mkg of K2 mk7 daily, and supplement with D3 seasonally. My objective is to replicate the blood serum level of a typical Japanese, without consuming natto, which I dislike the taste of. The hope is that I might have a calcium deposition pattern that conforms to Japanese norms more than American norms. It is not about longevity, but life span.
Maybe the Vit D they used was too low?
Thank you, Dr. Stanfield for all your work. My wife and I are in our mid-late 60's. Currently we take 4k IU D3 and 200mcg K2 MK-7 daily. One study, although disappointing, will not change that.
Hopefully the next study results will be more favorable.
Robust in statistics refers to estimators used to do the calculations and data diagnostics not the experimental treatment design. Robust estimators resist the pull of data outliers and other anomalies in data not perfectly normal which can decrease the power of a test to detect treatment effects.
Oxidation of the LDL particles get in between the endothelial walls passing on that oxidative stress to the vascular system... K2 takes calcium out of the soft tissue and brings it to the bone 🦴
I always recommended vitamin A as well, has this been disproven as an important cofactor? We said it was like a triangle, D,K2 and A formed a strong support for the bones.
The problem is that you are focusing on MK-7 but the real vitamin that has shown benefits is the MK-4 version. It is the only one that is used by the liver right away after being ingested. MK-7 gets converted to MK-4 (apparently, but what if the conversion process is not working anymore?) and K1 gets converted to MK4 (vitamin K2-MK4, to be more specific).
I really recommend to read the article made by chrismasterjohnphd as it will really help to understand between MK4-MK7-MK9 versions. It goes really in depth. (It's called The ultimate vitamin K2 resource, google it you will find it, I can't post the link here since YT doesn't allow me)
My personal experience also confirmed that MK7 does nothing to me, but MK-4 does. For example, when I tried high doses of MK-4 (600 ug - 1200 ug per day) I had no more muscle pain after ingesting it, whereas if I tried MK-7 version the muscle pain would still remain. So personnally I'm not surprised to see those kinds of result from a study.
Thank you for the article reference.
Excellent vid, Dr. Stanfield. I'm 61, have been taking D3 5000 I.U. & K2 (MK7) 150 mcg. I had a recent CAC score of zero.
How long have you been on this regimen? Do you intend to continue taking them in those dosages?
I’m on 5000iu D3 and 100 mcg k2(mk7) for almost 1 yr. I also take a calcium/mag in powder form (1g total) . I intend to go on doing this indefinitely or until such time I sense I got to stop . I’m 65.
Too much sugar/carbs ->high insulin -> inflammation-> "cholesterol bandage" in coronary arteries.
Good video, more information needed on general health benefits of Vitamin D and K2, all I know is that in 2 years of Covid, I have not had any respiratory illness and I'm mid 50's and take Vitamin D and K2 plus a few other supplements, glad I found Quercetin, it seems to have really helped with Hayfever for self and everyone else I recommended it to.
Thanks for sharing
Thank you, Dr Brad, for your honesty in discussing this research so forthrightly. And thanks to the authors who were happy to publish a paper with negative or null findings. I think we too easily regard research that fails to support a hypothesis as 'failed research'.
I felt, relying just on the wording I saw in the document that there was some terminological and possibly conceptual confusion in the study. This hinges on the word, 'progression' of the calcification. What was actually sought, observed, and reported I do not know, as you went through the findings very rapidly without leaving the quantitative tables displayed long enough to examine them.
'Progression' of a deleterious condition implies the damaging effect is getting worse. Did the researchers (and you) primarily look for increase in the calcification of the valve rather than reversal of the condition in there comparison of the treatment and control groups. Failure to reverse the condition, while a disappointment, is quite different from inhibiting or slowing the progression of the problem. Were there no significant difference in the progress or worsening of the disease between the two groups, that would justify the conclusion that the K2 and D as used failed to halt its 'progression'.
Excellent points. This question really deserved a response. I hope Brad will reconsider and actually acknowledge with a response other than merely liking your comment as he just did. Makes it appear that he doesn't really read the comments, other than maybe the first few.
Just a note - a lot of channels do this... they ask for comments as if they're interested (without reading them) only because YT will bump them up higher in the 'suggested videos' algorithm based on the higher number of comments their video(s) receive. It's strictly to build their channel $, not because they really want to hear from their viewers.
@@L.J.01 I'm afraid you're right. I suspect Brad reads the first few comments & occasionally responds with a "Thanks for sharing," and after that randomly scrolls through hit-or-miss style, bestowing a heart on a few. His reminder to leave comments appears pretty much meaningless except to up his You Tube ratings.
@@L.J.01 you are right
Yes, I’m still going to eat my natto. I have been getting my teeth cleaned regularly and my hygienist commented that my inflammation had gone down significantly. Also, I just had my teeth x-ray’d from a 3-yr hiatus of getting x-rays. I have no cavities! I usually get cavities every year before I started eating natto. Also, my back pain is now almost non-existent.
Would love to know their intracellular magnesium status. Also hair tissue mineral analysis would be amazing to see in these patients. An over all picture of mineral balance to see the patterns & lowered enzymatic function. Also thyroid status & cholesterol levels to be measured & given light for the production of vitamin D as most with VDR genetic snps cannot adequately convert oral D3 into the active form/ even touch cholesterol conversion. A chelation study would be also interesting to see in this pathogenesis.
Thank you Dr. Brad for this information. Since 2 years I had Cholesterol and my doctor wanted to prescribe me medication, I refused. Every 6 months I had to do a blood test to supervise the cholesterol, it was going higher every time, then I saw the publicity about K2 MK-7, I decided to try it with Vit D3 and I did intermittent fasting. 3 months later I had to do the blood test in January 2022 . When the doctor called me for the result, she said that I don't have anymore cholesterol, I really couldn't believe what I was hearing, I was so happy for that, but I really don't know if this is because of the K2 MK-7 or the intermittent fasting? Anyway, I am still taking it + Vit D3 2000IU and magnesium too.
You should go to 5,000 IU or more per day of vitamin D. There are some 5k IU with K2 supplements in one dose, instead of taking the two separately.
@@EMichaelBall 5000 IU of D3 is not allowed to be sold OTC in many countries.
Thanks Doctor for your videos. If this study's findings are true and Vitamin K-2 does not help with arterial calcification, then what are the implications for persons taking Vitamin D3? Without taking a substance to mitigate the Calcium build-up (e.g., Vitamin K2), does Vitamin D3 promote arterial calcification?
Vitamin D has a U-shaped all-cause mortality curve. If you are deficient (if you are not supplementing this is very likely, the curve is much steeper than if you have an excess). I don't know the breakdown by mortality type.
I have beeb taking K2 MK7 with Vitamin D3 twice daily for about 10 months with no side effects. I'll be getting a bone density scan in November and may have some correlative data to present at that time. Thee body is a customized pharma chemical plant basically which is affected by the ageing process along with eating and exercise habits. I'm almost 80 years old and also take Hyaluronic Acid twice daily for Arthritis in my hands and shoulders and arthritic pain is gone. I also take a daily broad spectrum vitamin pill. I have excellent mobility, blood pressure and mobility.