Ashley's Analysis | Didn't see that coming
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 ก.ย. 2024
- My viewer had no recollection of how this collision happened. What caused him to miss this coach whilst he was emerging on a roundabout? WARNING: some may find this footage upsetting.
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Hi folks and Ashley and thanks for showing my clip and yes I'm still alive and so is my dog. Thanks for the analysis and maybe I could of kept looking but I don't know if I did because I have no recollection of the accident and very sketchy recollection of what happened afterwards and can't remember any of what they asked me in that clip. I was breathalysed after the accident and found to be negative, we had been to the pub (me and my partner/girlfriend) for some food earlier in the evening. The guy with my car rear wheel in his hand was the National Express coach driver, the rear offside wheel plus suspension had been ripped off when he hit me and he was removing it from the road and I've estimated his average speed over the distance using S = D/T (speed = distance divided by time) and he was doing at least 70mph. The car is a Ford Fiesta for those asking and its the new Ford Sync feature that calls for help in an accident using your mobile phone that its paired to, this feature is available in ALL new Fords now and I have it enabled in my replacement 19 plate Ford Fiesta.
Now for the police, their conduct I can say was questionable to say the least after the paramedic had dealt with me (I wasn't sent to hospital despite having a head injury). They gave me a lift home in the back of their car with my dog sat on my lap unrestrained, clearly breaking the law and I only remembered the next day what they had done. The coach driver later I was told by the police wasn't prosecuted for anything, driving without due care and attention should of been the least he was charged with as he hit me from behind and Ashley was correct in the direction he came from as his coach was the Nottingham to Leicester service. Lastly I went to A&E a few days later when my g/f took me to be checked over and even though I was still a bit rough they said I was OK to go home, I was actually concussed and confused for a week, I wasn't snoring honestly either that must of been the way I was slumped unconscious, stay safe everyone and drive safely.
An extra note I have contacted Ashley after he made this video to tell him most of what I've told you all above, I did miss his email for some unknown reason probably missed it among all the spam we all get but spotted it later unread. Another note the coach company have said there is NO dashcam footage available from the brand new coach, surprise, surprise I wonder why? but I can remember it was so severely damaged at the front it was suspended towed away I still have that image in my head. Another note my dashcam is NEVER set looking straight ahead but points over to the right more which means it actually shows more of the right than normal plus this also advocates the purchase of Gap insurance on new/newish cars as I got the FULL purchase price back to enable me to get my 19 plate replacement Ford Fiesta about 3 months later.
Sorry keep adding to this, please don't give the coach driver too hard a time. He did later actually decide to dial 999 (bit too late) and was in a later clip heard outside my car talking to them BUT he did say I was coming round and I maybe didn't need an ambulance!!!! and later he can be heard telling his passengers to get back on the coach and stop looking I suspect he may of thought he'd killed me and was too scared to look but I'm just guessing at that. When the police asked him even later what happened he told them I'd pulled out in front of him!!!!! its all on my dashcam as it kept recording sound and video.
Last comment honestly: Driving background, I passed first time when I was 18 and was taught by an ex police driving instructor (way back when it was just practical with questions at the end) my examiner it turns out was the chief examiner. Was a courier for Securicor for 5 years, then drove long wheelbase Landrovers with trailer in the army as a Company Signaller, won an army driving competition with a trailer on as well and did have combat driving instruction as part of my driving for a front line Regiment and off road driver training. Not saying I'm the perfect driver, nobody is but I'm better than some I've come across over the years but like everyone I strive to do better, stay safe folks and thanks for all the comments and for being gentle, drive safely.
Thanks for the update, glad to hear you are alright!
Looking at streetview on Google maps shows the coaches entrance is light controlled so I feel he probably got let off on a technicality as he was probably within the speed limit and using the correct lane. I feel you were in an impossible situation and couldn't have reasonably seen or expected this so it's good to hear that you and your dog survived the incident. Would expect the local authority to change the safety at this roundabout - for instance having your entrance traffic light controlled also or imposing a lower and safer speed limit before the entrance the coach took.
Your a lucky man, thanks for sharing
Glad to hear that you're both alright!
Glad you are ok, that’s crazy that there is “no footage”. After reviewing your dashcam footage I’m disappointed the police didn’t request the footage from national express as part of an investigation… would be interested to see the excuse of why it’s missing if it was officially requested as evidence
That's a really scary accident. On my first watch-through I was hawk-eyed in trying to predict what was gonna happen. From the dash-cam's POV there was 0 way to see the coach before entering the roundabout. I do get the impression the cammer could've seen the bus if he had been checking that side of the roundabout as he was emerging, but you wouldn't exactly expect a bus to come flying into a roundabout the way that it did. Incredibly scary stuff, always remain observant, especially during the calm hours of the night. Hope everyone and the dog are still okay!
No way the cammer could have seen the bus or we would have seen it as we can see that entrance to the roundabout for a long way back. You would also have been hit by this coach.
Not boasting, but I spent 16 years as a professional DJ. All my journeys home were at night, and I never once had an acccident, received a speeding ticket, or had a breakdown. I was regularly stopped by the police, a van out at night with no logo on the side, no phone numbers. Gotta be a wrong 'un. They even asked me to unload all my equipment in the rain. "Have you got a warrant" stopped that. Mind you I did come across some horrific accidents, and was glad I carried a First Responders Kit with me at all times.
@@Demun1649 "Not boasting but" would imply you would come to a point, other than the boasting. What's your point exactly?
@@joeytje50
One:- A First Responder drives better than an untrained civilian. Did you miss that bit?
Two: I have been driving 53 years and have NEVER had an accident. Did you miss that bit?
Three:- I carried a full First Resonders Kit at all times, unlike YOU. Did that get by as well?
You must be a lousy driver if you miss those points in a simple post. But then I see you are a computer gamer, so maybe not even a driver/rider yet, so one can't expect too much from a kid.
my honest opinion, that coach driver was driving well in excess of any safe speed on that roundabout. Inveralmond Roundabout near me is a 30 and its sandwiched between the A9 which is as 70, the Industrial Estate being a 30 and the so called Triangle (a triangular spot of land mostly used for car sales across for SSE Offices) which is a 40. if the coach is straight lining it and he wasn't visible on the approach to the round about like what it seems in the video. i put this one squarely on the coach driver even if your viewer had only had 1 drink if anything
I'm a bus driver and I could not imagine driving a coach at that speed on a roundabout, even if minimal turning was necessary. At that time also there's no way he would have been running late (not that speeding is ever acceptable) so he obviously expected the road to be clear like it probably had been every other time he did it without incident. Typical complacency. Equally shocking is the cars that just cruise on past, but perhaps they could be forgiven if the coach driver and passengers were outside and the situation looked under control. I'd still have stopped though personally. Finally and what absolutely appalls me is that nobody went to the car after the incident, not the driver nor any passengers of the coach. What in the world were they thinking!? This guy has just been hit at high speed by a 14 tonne coach and he's going to be sitting in the drivers seat twiddling his thumbs? He could have been dying and nobody bothered to run over and open the door to give him immediate assistance. What has this world come to.
@Advanced Driving Well as a coach/bus driver you have to undergo training and part of that says in the event of an accident ensure any injured parties airways are clear. At the least he should have done that and been there to speak to and reassure the person if he'd been conscious. Thank goodness everybody walked away from this one and hopefully nothing like that happens again.
@Advanced Driving Precisely, dont stop unless you have to, you could get done not only by the police but also from any injuries you could have caused.
Its purely what happens nowadays in this blame claim negligence easy pickings society, otherwise any sane person would have stopped. Do know a traffic cop, he stated the other week if he seen an accident they will stop. If accident had already happened, it dont pay to get involved and drive straight past. I would think same applies to general public after the event.
@Advanced Driving Helping involves calling someone who does know first aid, not just sitting around gawking
@@jmurray01 That`s correct, First aid training is part of CPC training with coach drivers have to do
It is clearly obvious that the coach was travelling at a rate of knots! I highly commend the drivers of the coach company seen which I won't mention; but this driver clearly took an extreme chance and essentially used the 16 tonne vehicle like it's a tonka car. I seriously hope the coach driver got prosecuted as those coaches are littered with cameras and I also hope that he watches this video. Thank you for sharing Ashley & I hope the car driver and the dog are both okay!
The cammer is Marathonman_26 and has confirmed in the comments that both he and the dog are OK
The coach was on a 70mph road approaching a traffic light controlled roundabout (probably) with a green light. In the 3 seconds it took for the Fiesta to go onto the roundabout and be hit a vehicle travelling at 70mph would go 102.67 (92.4m) yards, a vehicle travelling at 60mph would travel 88 yards (79m). The visible distance the Fiesta could see down the other approach road was less than either of these two figures because trees and shrubs block the view of any headlamps approaching at speed. The Fiesta's headlamps were pointing away from the Coach driver and the tail lights would be partly obscured. I think it is hard to blame either driver for this but there is certainly a problem with the design of the roundabout traffic control system and the presence of intervening foliage that needs to be cut back and maintained in a cut back position.
@@martinconnelly1473 light controlled or not, 70mph is an insane speed to take a roundabout at, even in car, never mind a coach.
@@Velodrone To my knowledge a coach has a max speed limit of 60mph even on a motorway or dual carriage way. I also doubt that a brand ne coach came with no dash cam. If I was his boss I think I would have sacked him for what appears to me danageroous driving as he should have been able to stop in the distance he can see.
@@martinconnelly1473 some ones done some pixel counting to get information like that I think you have.
There was a Scott Manley video recently about Astra and a rocket launch mentioning pixel counting to get velocity information.
“Don’t get involved” seems to be the norm here. I witnessed a car being force into the offside crash barrier on the A21 some years ago. The car did a full 360 and ended up against the near side crash barrier. I was about 1/2 a mile back when this happened. IT WAS RUSH HOUR AND I WAS THE ONLY VEHICLE THAT STOPPED!
In France it’s the law that if it’s possible with no risk to yourself you must stop and offer assistance. Severe penalties for ignoring someone in need and just driving on.
@@davidk3729 ii was driving sixty miles per hour on a dual carriageway late at night several years ago, a jaguar came flying past me at god knows what speed didn't even swerve at the roundabout just ploughed into it and took off. the car was smashed to bits the driver was dead, i stopped called the police and waited until they arrived. the policeman breathalysed me and accused me of racing the jag driving in my ford escort. they hounded me for weeks even coming to my place of work to get me to admit to racing the jag. i had to get a solicitor to make them back off. i would never stop as witness to an accident ever again
Same a few weeks ago. Busy motorway, and as I was driving along I suddenly noticed a car up on the embankment, every single body panel crumpled, with nobody in sight. As I drove past I wondered whether it had happened earlier and the vehicle hadn't been recovered yet. But then I wondered if it had just happened and the occupants were unconscious or trapped.
So I made a late decision to stop, had a half mile trek back up the hard shoulder to the accident scene, and discovered the accident *had* just occurred! Yet not one of the at least dozen vehicles who would have witnessed a significant collision stopped. And not a single vehicle in the time it took me to run half a mile back up the hard shoulder either. Fortunately the sole occupant was ok, but how long would he have laid unconscious, trapped or dead had he not been ok. It really upset me how nobody cared, I'm genuinely scared now of being in a solo vehicle crash because apparently if you're not able to get assistance yourself, nobody will come to your aid.
What part of the A21?
It seems clear the coach driver went to "straight-line" that roundabout. It's the early hours, the roads are deserted, he's just come flying down a derestricted road with his foot on the floor and was tempted to chance it. He should be looking for another job, preferably stacking shelves.
Given that it was probably the bloke carrying the wheel at the end, I'd avoid employing him where food is concerned. He's had enough of it.
Or mopping a prison floor nearly
From my experience, the onset of darkness( nighttime) seems to be like a green light to start speeding for many drivers, coach drivers included. Obviously reflects the perceived chance of being caught by the Police or speed cameras.
No. He’ll probably pull the pallet lifters around too fast and hit someone.
Incredibly disrespectful comment to retail staff. No need for it.
5:02 - you can just see headlights appearing about 2 seconds before the accident, which I think sheds some light over the distance covered, being that when the cammer entered the round about there appeared to be nothing in the road to the right at all.
Shocking that none of the passers-by stopped. I think you would have to have been looking in exactly the right direction at the right time to spot that coach. It was travelling so fast to not be visible on the approach. I wonder if the driver was trying to get home before his clock ran out?
Not surprising, given there was a coach and its passengers behind the camera. You would have thought one of them would have checked on the driver - but the coach driver seems to have told everyone he was okay, when clearly, he wasn't.
I'm baffled by how this collisions could even happen. You can see that the road on the right is clear at 0:53 when the dashcam vehicle enters the roundabout. So how can another vehicle even collide with with ? Honestly at that point, you expect an Audi RS3 to have taken the roundabout like a maniac, not a fleeping coach !
And I do agree with Ashley that you should keep checking as you're crossing the roundabout but in this case, I don't think it is reasonnable to expect someone to have the time to spot the coach and react in time. A the speed the coach was doing, he was probably moving more that 20 meter / second.
70mph is about 31m/s 60mph is about 26.5m/s. The visible distance from the cammer's entry on to the roundabout to the vertical support of the traffic light gantry is about 65m (Google Maps measurement). So the 3 seconds from going onto the roundabout and being hit puts a vehicle travelling at 60mph beyond the light gantry and into the area where the foliage blocks the view.
Late 53 secs cam car hasnt reached stop line approx a couple of yards to go. But at that point the road on right goes out of view, with that in mind assuming coach had entered at that point it could have already travelled 10M at approx 45-50mph, cam car literally dawdling pulling out unaware of surroundings.
@@martinconnelly1473 I'd say the coach driver probably had their foot to the floor on entering the roundabout and thus probably hit it at 100 km/h. That is the speed EU registered coaches are required to have their limiters set to, not sure if the UK has repealed or amended their implementation of that directive in national legislation in which case it would be the same. Like any EU directive it only takes effect when the sovereign legislature of the member state actually makes it law in their jurisdiction and they would need to repeal or amend that to change it as it is their own law at that point.
I’ve approached that very roundabout at 70, the lights stay green late at night, it’s a “shall I chance it?” moment. There’s a slight bend before the lights, so I think at 80mph this is just about possible.
I’m really pleased you and your dog are ok. IMHO of 50 years on 2 and 4 wheels , the coach driver was completely at fault. He was definitely going at a excessive speed on a approach to roundabout and from his lardy seating position he would have had a superior outlook. He definitely would seen the other vehicle on approach and chose not to be cautious! Because the lack of footage and the fact that technically he had right of way precluded appropriate conviction ! The police/cps chose not to because they’re busy collecting fines for misdemeanours and releasing criminals! What really boils my piss is he got let off on what could have been a much more serious situation !
I drove up to Scotland last summer, passing through East Ayrshire very late, about 10/11pm, on either the A70 or A713, can’t quite remember. I do remember that it wasn’t dual carriageway.
I ended up being followed by a smallish local bus that must have been on it’s last run for home, because it was in a real rush and kept tight up with me even though I was doing the road speed. When we came to a roundabout, it overtook me on the roundabout, and disappeared off into the night over the next few bends.
Night driving certainly can be unpredictable and hazardous.
Very unfortunate and bad luck but good to hear they all survived. My speculation is that the coach driver knows the roundabout well and has, as you speculated, straight-lined it. If this is the case, then on approach, he would be concentrating on any possible vehicle coming from his right and ready to brake or accelerate. Unfortunately he would be less prepared for a vehicle entering from the left! The poor car driver was perhaps, in the peace and quiet of the night, a bit lax in his observation and not expecting the unexpected!
That technology is deeply impressive.
Good situational awareness is always warranted, our view of the area is very limited by the forward facing camera. With that caveat, it is my impression of the limited information available that there was not much if anything he could have done to mitigate.
Congrats on the 100k subscribers!
Wow. That was a shock. I am glad the cammer sounded alright when the police officer was talking to him. I hope both him and his dog are well. The last bit where the wheel of the car was carried over to the side, spoke volumes about the damage the cammers car must have taken.
Very surprised the driver was not taken to A&E. The one big accident I had, I was taken to hospital because the paramedic thought I might have had a heart attack, I hadn't but was glad to be in hospital when the shock kicked in a little later!
Glad to hear both man and dog are well.
Thank you for your analysis and advice on this. Most of us would of probably been involved in accident like this if we were in this situation but now I have that extra bit of knowledge to prevent it. Thank you, your saving lives.
Congrats on the 100k. Your videos have improved my driving massively over the last 18 months or so. Thanks
Even knowing an accident was coming had no clue, that coach was clearly going way to fast entering that round-a-bout, hope you get an update from the driver soon.
I'm glad you pointed out the headlights as I was going to point that out
There seriously needs to be a slower speed limit on roundabouts. People can hit them at 50-60 mph and expect to stop when someone pulls out!
Generally speaking most roundabouts do not have a speed limit imposed on them. You do not see speed limits actually on the roundabout. Logically if two 30 mph roads intersect at a roundabout it is reasonable to believe a 30 mph speed limit exists on the four exit roundabout. However if a 30 mph road intersects a national speed limit road at a similar roundabout what would be the speed limit on that? 30 mph 60 mph or 70 mph as the carriageway is now divided. I do not think a speed limit can be legally enforced on most roundabouts other offences may be enforced in my opinion.
@@keith6400 You just put the limit prior to the roundabout entry. At the least drop them down to 40 mph.
You don't need a speed limit for a roundabout, since you have to slow down to be physically able to cross it properly, you cannot expect a driver who is willing to straight line/ cut 3 lanes, to have slowed down just because there was a speed limit sign.
@@jcskyknight2222 Unfortunately, almost 90% of dashcam footage is of someone driving too fast into a roundabout and wondering why someone pulled out on them. It needs to be enforced. 20mph limit for all roundabouts. Put few cameras up and watch accidents plummet.
@@Chrisallengallery The reality is not speed per se it is whether people drive sensibly. There are numerous laws under which a prosecution might be successfully brought against errant drivers on roundabouts. One of the major failings of road safety in the UK is the excessive weight placed on speed almost to the exclusion of all the other causes of accidents. If you listen to Ashley's comments a huge number are on a wide range of poor driving practices.
For anyone curious, the car seems to be a Ford Fiesta, most modern fords will have this emergency call system.
Also, can someone do some estimating on how fast the coach was going? I know on Google maps you can measure distance so I wonder if you can use that to determine average speed?
My guess would be at least 60MPH
The British need speed cameras in sensitive places like that so the reckless bus driver cannot fly through it in the first place. Roundabout should be max 30-40 km/h
We have enough speed cameras thank you.
@@damedusa5107 No we really don't
Also good job, Ford; the automated call feature could have saved a life that night, if it were any more severe. I have something similar in my Toyota and this clip has reminded me why it's a good thing.
While the viewer could have done more, it was obvious from the first time I saw the impact that the coach driver was completely reckless. That roundabout is quite big, so the speed the coach must have been going to cover that distance in such a short time was absurd.
As an aside, my current vehicle, a 64 reg Ford Focus C Max Grand (then just a year old, with 9K mileage on the clock), was involved in an accident half an hour after I'd picked it up for the first time from the dealers in Burnley. It was in January 2016, the road conditions were poor, there was a combination of ice, sleet on snow on the A56 and M66 roads on my return to Whitefield, near Bury. Coming down the hill near Heap Bridge Bury in the M66, I was only travelling at 50 mph due to the poor conditions, and the unfamiliarity of the new car. in front of me, around 600 to 800 yards away, I could see a silver MPV spinning around in the middle of the motorway, the vehicle driver managed to regain control and drive away. A Citroen Picasso 200 yards of me saw this and braked to avoid a collision, and was promptly rammed by a white Beemer X 5, whose airbags were then deployed. By this time I'd managed to stop and pull over to the hard shoulder, only to be rammed by a silver Merc that braked too hard and due to the camber of the road, it skidded, veered and smashed into the back of my recently acquired car.
I was OK, but the car was off the road for 6 weeks for repairs costing nearly £10K, the Merc driver was found to be at fault for the accident. Also the impact of the accident meant the frame of my driver's seat had been bent and had to be replaced. Since I'd only just purchased the car, I hadn't had time to activate the Ford Sync system, nowadays I have it connected at all times when driving.
The coach driver hesitated to call the emergency services, and even said, "No need for an ambulance, he is regaining consciousness." ????
Being knocked out is literal brain damage. There is no safe way to be hit in the head to the point of unconsciousness.
I was in an accident, very low-speed, all conscious, I didn't even have pain or bruising from the seatbelt.
An ambulance was still sent out, even though none of us needed a look over.
Poor bloke. Yes there was a bit more that can be done by the cammer, but the "professional" coach driver should not have caused that accident
What? The roundabout was clear, he made sure there are no cars on the roundabout, then looked forward to make sure there were no cars coming on the roundabout. He was fully in the right. The beauty of hindsight!
@@letter1014 yeah, I dont disagree. I was going on Ashley's comments that the 1 thing he could have done is have continuing awareness and maybe accelerating or braking out of the way could have saved an accident / reduced the severity, but like you say.... hindsight
Wow that was so scary to see. I hope the driver and his dog are OK. It makes realise no matter what time day or night try and always be on look out. Thanks for sharing Ashley. 😁
The car driver has added a comment with the outcome of incident now. Any chance this can made a sticky post Ashley.
Those emergency contact systems are fantastic. I have attended many incidents that have been alerted by such systems that may otherwise have gone unreported for a considerable time, even hours. For those who drive alone, especially at unusual hours and/or on very quiet roads there are even phone apps that can perform a similar function, and be set to call emergency services or a partner, home, office etc.
Regardless of the speed of the coach, which should have been electronically limited to 60 mph, it should have been visible to the driver. Unlike a driver, a regular dashcam cannot move eyes or head to change view. There are about 3 seconds from the point where the driver could have probably stopped safely before entering the roundabout to the point of impact. At 60 mph that means a distance of about 80m to the coach. By coincidence, those 3 secs start at the same time as the camera loses view of the road the coach would have used to enter the roundabout. So the coach may well have been visible at the beginning of those crucial 3 seconds.
"Looked but did not see" is a common factor in collisions, and could be one here, but that does nothing to excuse the course and speed of the coach driver, regardless of the time of morning. A proper approach, at a proper speed, maintaining a correct lane throughout would have turned this into a near-miss at worst, even if the cammer had pulled out as he did and had not looked at all.
Boggles the mind that people just drove past. There's also extremely low chance that the coach was A empty and B had anyone take any meaningful injuries. This means that several people were perfectly able to attend to this individual and their dog but just chose not to. Had he been killed, every person involved and who had chosen to ignore this while not imprisoned or arrested would have been held accountable.
Yh the one thing I was thinking as the the bit of the video with the emergency call occurs was that no one came to check on the driver of the vehicle.... chances of the coach being empty are low, but not impossible, but chances of the coach driver being incapacitated are low but not impossible. Chances of both occuring are...... so low as to not be likely....
EDIT:: at the end you actually see the coach driver clearing the wheel so very much not incapacitated... why the huge delay to check on the other driver? Maybe the realisation they were seriously at fault and would be out of a job hindered their thought process? So yh... not impressed at all with respect to the coach driver's attitude to driving, or other road users -- I use national express a lot around the Leicestershire area so I hope they don't drive for them anymore!!
Wow 4 minutes after the call the responders turned up that was really quick
It would be really interesting to see footage from the coach!
One thing not mentioned - there are traffic lights on the A46 (On which the Coach approached) but not on the side road on which the cammer was driving. So maybe the coach driver had a green light and thought he was clear. I've never seen such an arrangement. I know a green light still means you have to be cautious, but who really checks when the lights are green? Assuming the lights aren't "peak hours only" and were on at the time, this is a major contributor to this accident.
OMG!! I've watched this video again and again, but I just didn't see the coach approaching at all!! Glad everyone is OK.
Congratulations on the 100k!!
The title is very appropriate. That was a surprise at 1.00 am! That driver had no chance but what a perfect scenario for the emergency call system. Hope both are ok
Glad that everyone’s alright. It’s reasonable to conclude based on the footage and your analysis that the coach at a minimum did not drive with due care and attention. It’s one of those unfortunate incidents where even in hindsight one would wonder what could I have done differently under the circumstances. Good learning that we got to be always aware of what’s around and behind the car. Time to make dash cams mandatory.
I can't quite believe this but I'm actually going to say something in the coach driver's defence. On google street view there seems to be a single sign around 0.2 miles back indicating that the junction is a roundabout. Shortly after that there is a sign indicating you should use the left lane to go left or straight on, and the right lane to go right or straight on (note there are only two lanes here). Shortly after that there are countdown signs and a warning sign for the traffic lights. Then after that you get another sign indicating which of the two lanes you should be in, but no indication that you might head left or right. Then the next countdown signs. Now the left lane splits into two, giving us three lanes with some arrows on to tell you which lane to be in. Now the right most lane splits in two giving us the four lanes, again some arrows on the floor and a sign with the arrows repeated on them. The last countdown signs. Some markings on the road telling you which lane you should be in for which route. Then the traffic lights at the entrance to the roundabout.
Now I don't know about you, but that's a hell of a lot to take in in around 0.2 of a mile, in the dark. I could fully see the bus driver forgetting it was a roundabout, realizing it was a roundabout but the light is green, then finally spotting a (dark coloured?) car on the roundabout.
In aviation one of the major contribution to crashes is pilot workload, ie too many things happening at once. I can't help but think the junction design itself here played a massive part in the collision.
TL;DR? Yeah, sort of my point 🤣
The speed that coach must have been coming onto the roundabout is infuriating.
Ridiculous. People really should stop driving faster at night and assume nobody is around. See it all the damn time and it's drivers like this that cause accidents like this.
Not watched the full video yet, but I hope police saw this footage, they have no business being behind the wheel of such a vehicle.
Be VERY interesting to see the Coach dash cam and black box data! I hope the driver has requested it (or his solicitor has)
I know the roundabout... It's known locally as the Hobby Horse Island, just north of Leicester. The coach was coming from the north towards Leicester. This is the first roundabout the coach will have encountered after joining the A46 having left Nottingham. It's a national speed limit dual carriageway at that point and the roundabout has traffic lights on the entry where the coach came from. The viewer only has a give away from a local road, no traffic lights. A vehicle joining the roundabout from where the coach came from has 2 main routes to choose - 2nd exit /straight on to go into Leicester on the A607 or 3rd exit /right to join the Leicester Western By pass A46 and head towards the M1. The coach would have been going straight on into Leicester. It would have approached going at the national speed limit and may have seen green lights from far off and decided to go for it. The roundabout is a wide one at the that point...2, if not 3 lanes just to take that 3rd exit. That give way from where the viewer entered is probably the most dangerous part of the roundabout because traffic approaching from the right could be going very fast and entry is not controlled by traffic light. The other 3 roads entering the roundabout all have traffic lights. I'm not surprised this kind of accident has happened and this is a reminder for us all to take extra care when the roads are relatively clear very late at night.
I assume that the star ship enterprise beamed down a moving bus from its location to the roundabout because that bus was nowhere to be seen when the car entered the roundabout.
Anticipation wasn't clearly used in this instance, i assume coach driver approached the roundabout seeing nothing coming from his right so didn't attempt to brake as there was no reason to do so and has just accelerated into the roundabout, hence why you couldn't see the coach in the video until the collision was heard.
Anticipation, and thinking ahead is key on the roads
Good video Ashley that was a bit of a shocker my parents where big Liverpool fans such a shame they are not with me now
A brilliant analysis.
Congratulations on 100k. 👍🏼
I’d like to see the coach footage for that accident.
I’ve got to disagree with Ashley on this occasion, given that the bus wasn’t even in view at the time of entering the roundabout, even if the driver had glanced out of their window, chances are, they wouldn’t have had the reaction time to avoid it given the probable excessive speed the bus was travelling at. The driver will have been focussing on the remaining exits of the roundabout. Yes be aware of traffic on all exits but in this context the driver couldn’t have done anything better
Agreed. I think its a little unfair on the person who sent it in actually. Also, for all we know the viewer did see it tried to react but wasn't able to.
I've watched this back 4 or 5 times in slow mo. Even accounting for the limited peripheral view afforded by the camera... There was absolutely no indication of an approaching vehicle. And given the distance into the roundabout and times... I'm not sure (in this particular incident) continued observation by our driver would've affected outcome. He didn't really have anywhere to go and was hit within 2 seconds of crossing the give way line. Maybe an F1 car could've accelerated quickly enough to escape, but not a normal car. I can't see how this happened if that coach was doing any less than 90.
That was absolutely F#%*ing horrendous.
As the camer entered the roundabout there was nothing coming from the right and to then get T-boned at that point tells you that the coach was flat out going at motorway speeds when he approached the Roundabout.
Also someone reacting with emergency stop braking doesn’t have time to worry about sounding their horn while they are braking, that fact that the coach was blasting the horn a fraction of a second before the impact is also worrying.
If some one has time to sound their horn after hitting the brakes and realising that they are not going to be able to stop, it means that they were going one hell of a speed in the 1st place.
Couch must have been going some speed to enter the roundabout after the car was already in the roundabout going by the cars camera.
Surely that coach was doing in excess of 70 mph he was never visible until impact. My guess is the coach driver as well as speeding was doing something to distract him. This is not an accusation it's a theory.
When I first saw this video my split second reaction when the car crossed three lanes on a roundabout was apprehension. Don't know why but it was and then we saw the collision. Is it OK to do this on an empty roundabout or what we think is.
How do you know the coach did not come from behind your viewer ?
christ on a bike that bus must have been travelling... from not visible to collision in just a few seconds - awful driving and not much the car driver could do
People not stopping whole the driver is out cold, nobody coming to check for a while, makes me very mad.
I was t-boned last year and thing that upset me the most was that no one stopped to check that we were ok other than one chap who stopped to complain that we needed to move the car as it was an obstruction.
@@tides2002 sorry that happened to you :(
I couldn't see anything beforehand, and he/she seemed to be driving reasonably. I would have been taken out in a similar manner. What could have prevented the impact? I am asking from a need to know, as I've only been driving for a few years and so some experienced input would help me.
TBH I wouldn't have avoided the impact in this situation either
Thats disgusting that a so called professional (coach driver) didn't stop.
I think the coach driver did stop (he's kinda obliged to, under the law) possibly the person shifting the wheel at the end of the clip?
Pretty sure he will have stopped, as there is no mention of him not stopping, and no sign of the bus driving away on the video. Although I would have expected the bus driver to be the first to check on the driver. Maybe he was hurt himself or checking on the passengers.
Great video! But at 6:48 where did the guy in blue coat go? His never came out the other side of your head? X filrs music needed!
if you freeze at 0:48 when the driver is next to the nsl sign why is so much folliage not cut back at junctions? instead of speed humps and cameras there are far more safety measures councils could do.
A lot of people will drive close to the speed limits at that time of the night because generally the roads are clear, and it looked like the limit on the roundabout was national. Surely the coach will also have a tracker and/or camera too, so it would be interesting to see the other side of this.
But the main thing that concerned me was the fact that no one stopped, WHAT THE HELL IS WRONG WITH PEOPLE? If I saw an incident like this, I could never drive past without knowing that I have helped if possible and know that further help is on the way.
damn thats so bad, glad that he was at least responsive after that. would love to hear the outcome of that crash, as the driver of that coach was not driving anywhere near how a professional driver should be. the cammer could have definitly looked out more, but by the time of the impact there wouldnt have been anytime to do anything. the only thought i had was that the cammer could have diven faster, but that seems daft to suggest that.
Observing this junction in Google Maps (52.6991, -1.0955 as per the audio), every single access is traffic light controlled except for the one where the collision took place. Not to excuse the bus driver and their appalling driving, but someone coming from a signalised access could wrongly assume that all conflicting traffic is stopped at a red. That intersection is a potential hazard.
Just read the comment by Marathonman and I am very glad that both he and his dog are OK(ish). He had concussion so should have been taken to hospital, not home in the back of the police car- that was disgraceful as head injuries need proper investigation, as there can be delayed effects.
As to the accident itself, I could not see any more than other viewers of this channel. There is the possibility that the position of the coach on impact might have been due to an avoidance manoeuvre- the driver must have spotted the car as the horn could be heard, although I think that straight-lining at high speed is more likely seeing the amount of damage caused.
I am suspicious about the lack of dashcam footage from the coach. Even the service buses in my area have forward facing cameras.
As a former shift worker, I know that the human body and mind is not at a peak during the wee small hours and this may have been contributory. I try to avoid late night driving wherever possible.
An excellent, but very disturbing video.
Classic National Express coach, had one pass me at nearly 75 last night then try to cut in to make their junction. The company is a joke.
So glad Ashley concentrated on the way the driver could do better. Bad drivers exist. I can’t change that. I just want to know how to drive around them.
I know this roundabout so well. The coach driver would have had to cut across all the lanes on it to avoid having to turn the steering wheel at all to get all the way from one side to the other. Unfortunately the only entrance to the roundabout without traffic lights is the one the car driver entered it from. Also unfortunate is that the route taken by the coach is only available on that part of the roundabout as the others have barriers that get in the way. He must’ve really been gunning it too, and with passengers on the bus. Shocking.
I really hope all are okay, this guy and his pupper make a full recovery but man, what a close one. Modern tech is truly phenominal
Cammer commented that all, including pupper, are ok
Glad driver and his dog are fine, and for his comment(s).
Thinking about the use of the horn, as in many accidents, it appears to be too late! Just my thoughts.
I have this tech, it's great to see it work. it's chilling to hear the distinctive 'snoring' noise of someone unconscious with I presume their head falling forward compromising their airway and the dog yelping while people just drive by. Glad to see in the comments they were both ok.
I watched it over and over does the camera vehicle see the coach and panic?
He comes to a complete stop just before impact which to me suggests he panicked as he’s spotted it coming.
I personally think that the coach driver doesn’t check on the driver immediately is probably down to checking on his passengers, they would be injured from the harsh braking and be thrown out of their seats.
I don’t think he’s doing anywhere near 70mph how the camera vehicle is claiming, just because the coaches stopping distance in such a short distance and there’s very minor damage to the front of that coach. If he was doing 70mph the coach would have definitely come into camera view after the car came to a stop.
One thing from the position of the coach it’s clear that he’s straight lined that roundabout but looking at the map you provided and the angle of the exit road it suggests that the coach also may have swerved to try and avoid the car. There’s no way he would have made it safely onto the exit from that lane you pointed out at a considerable speed.
I personally think that the driver of the coach was too complacent he’s done that route every day at that time of morning, so he’s thinking it’s safe to enter at speed which is completely wrong and dangerous hence why we are seeing this video.
Sandra bullock driving that bus?
It just proves again that seeing your right side clear on a roundabout doesn't make it safe. Give way to the right but keep an eye on the left. Someone might not see you and thus not give way to you, especially if you plow onto the roundabout at the last second.
I'd say the coach driver may have moved over a lane or two to try to avoid the impact, but he was definitely travelling way too fast through that roundabout and was likely planning on using at least 2 lanes to get through anyway.
Greetings from NEC car show
When I got my new car Trying various switches
'Emergency Service can I help"
"um No fat Finger"
"OK you do not need assistance"
"UMMM NO How do I switch this off"
"OH I do that "
It's unbelievable how many drive past! I've come across accidents before the emergency services have arrived on a number of occasions (not as severe as this fortunately) and my first instinct is to go and check everyone is OK. There was one occasion late at night where a motorcyclist had been knocked off and was lying in the road. I parked my car across the road in front of him as people were just driving around him! When the Police arrived, they thought I'd knocked him off due to the position of my car, which did cause some confusion!
I find it appalling & outrageous to be honest how the Coach Driver wasn’t prosecuted over it. I have seen how Coach Drivers go too fast into a roundabout and they don’t slow down enough on approach. Those vehicles have to be slowed down earlier than a Light Car or Van does! The main thing is, is that the driver who was hit is alright, but things could have been a whole lot worse!
That really was shocking and totally unexpected as there is no sign of the coach at all until impact. Hopefully the Police will have the tachograph information from the coach and it's camera footage to determine a proper outcome.
That sure seemed like a thing that would give someone a heart attack.
Time between entering the roundabout and the coach sounding it's horn was sure quite short (counted about 2 seconds) meaning that coach was sure traveling quite fast proberbly so speed of the coach does seem to be a factor...
Given the lateness of the coach driver's reaction, the time of day and their excessive speed, I wouldn't rule out the possibility of a SVRI (sleep related vehicle incident).
I don't believe for a single second that National Express don't have dash cam footage of the road and the driver's cab.
That’s clever technology, for the amount of people driving by and not helping it was lucky he had it! That coach must of really been going some speed over that roundabout. Some coach drivers do drive fast. Hopefully the chap and his dogs ok and the coach driver prosecuted for driving without due care.
I’m guessing the coach driver didn’t stop, so thank god for modern technology!
It’s absolutely disgusting how many drive past when you can hear him struggle to breathe / obstructed airway. Those who drove past could have performed very basic first aid to ensure his airway stays open (yes there is a risk of spinal injury but still being able to breathe out trumps that).
I think 99% of drivers would have continued on like this viewer did. But for me that bus must have been doing 60mph+ and never even attempted to slow at the roundabout.
I would've been one of that 99% for sure. Would've got hit just like that cammer
Reviewed the 10 seconds before 1:00 four times now & damn, how fast must that coach have been going?
amazing technology... this could be described as a robot saving a human life...
it is an automated system, which in this case worked pretty well, do we know the make of the car?
It's a Ford, one of the new ones. All new Fords have it. Pretty sure the new Golf and some Toyota's have it too now
Thatooks like a Really good system to have to contact the Emergency services. Did the coach have headlights on as you can't see it in the video 🤔
Really hope the drive and his dog are OK 👍
100% the fault of the coach driver. during the 90s my dad ran a minibus/coach company and I remember him having to sack a driver due to numerous complaints about him scaring passengers. Really good drivers take pride in their profession, take pride in their abillity to maximise passenger comfort. Passengers should not have to worry or even think about their safety on the road.
Watched the impact and the seconds prior to it at least a dozen times
There is no evidence of the coach approaching at all
It’s as though it just spawns there like something out of a computer game
The rate of progress of the coach must have been quite phenomenal to be able to arrive on the scene and cause such damage whilst effectively remaining invisible until after the collision.
See people entering round abouts at excessive speeds all the time. They seem to think its their right of way. No regard at all for any other road users.
You can't watch this and not feel -- yes, relieved at how lucky the cammer was to survive -- but also the massive injustice that a professional driver in charge of a 60 seat coach can get away with driving so irresponsibly.
I don't think the cammer was the only really lucky person that night!
Don't want to stereotype or anything but late night coach drivers are a bit of a different breed
Glasgow to Edinburgh at those sort of times you are holding onto the seat in front of you. They do not slow when going all the way around roundabouts, had no idea how fast they 'could' could go round them, you are thrown to the side.
Bloody hell, lucky to survive that. Also lucky to have that robot 999 call. Congrats on the 100k.
That is an amazing modern feature on cars. Such a comfort when driving to know it's there. I do think the operators need retraining; or something needs adding so they automatically send ambulance to the scene.
How was it lucky? The coach driver would've called 999 😂🤣😂
@@johnbower7452 Yeah, police and ambulance would seem more sensible if no one's responding. Cool tech though!
@@ZJS0113 When, do you think? Before or after he'd had time to get his "story" straight?
@@JamesWilson01 why would he need to get his story straight? He wasn't in the wrong 🤣 useless pissed up cammer, though...
Also, it was a national express coach, passengers would've been calling 999. Granted, if you hit a corner too fast on a country road then this feature would be useful
2:02 How many drive past indeed!
In Germany they could all be prosecuted for 'failing to give aide in an accident'. There is a reason you have to do an extended 1st Aid course before you can get your driving licence there.
Look on TH-cam "Germany rescue lane" Just shows how much better the germans are at driving.
Well, not an extended course. It's pretty much just a one day crash course. But it's still much better than the nothing at all we have here.
Wow, that coach must have been going at some speed as we simply cannot see it on approach! Might be worth pitching in my views and 'borrowing' a clip, referencing this video?
Hi Dan! Absolutely, feel free. I actually had an email from someone who supposedly investigated the incident for national express and his conclusion was the driver of the coach was not at fault. However, this email cannot be verified as genuine. I'll look forward to your take on things.👊
@@ashley_neal Will do! that email sounds a little odd! I have some clear views on this! 👊
With a huge amount of "leeway" the bus was going minimum 50mph - entrance to the roundabout from the bus's side, to the point of impact, is about 55 metres. To cover that in 2.5 seconds is 50mph. Way fast for a coach on a roundabout no matter what.
I reckon though the coach came from at least the point where the overhead traffic lights are from their side, all the way to the point of the collision, which is roughly 80 metres, which over a time of 2.5 seconds would mean a minimum of 70mph.
Take those numbers with a pinch of salt however as I'm just basing this off of measurements on Google Maps which may not be precise, and the coach could of course have entered from different points etc.
Long story short - there is no doubt at all that the coach is at fault. Disappointing to see from a "professional driver".
I am an ex NHS Paramedic and ex National Express Coach Driver. This is shocking because the attending police in this are incompetent on many counts. Firstly their suspicion is focused on the wrong person mainly because car was hit from rear . Would like to know if they also breath tested the coach driver? Second, mechanism of injury would denote car driver needs medical attention, it`s not their call to say he was alright they are not medical professionals. He was clearly confused and had no idea what was going on. Right, so breath test normal