Hi folks and Ashley and thanks for showing my clip and yes I'm still alive and so is my dog. Thanks for the analysis and maybe I could of kept looking but I don't know if I did because I have no recollection of the accident and very sketchy recollection of what happened afterwards and can't remember any of what they asked me in that clip. I was breathalysed after the accident and found to be negative, we had been to the pub (me and my partner/girlfriend) for some food earlier in the evening. The guy with my car rear wheel in his hand was the National Express coach driver, the rear offside wheel plus suspension had been ripped off when he hit me and he was removing it from the road and I've estimated his average speed over the distance using S = D/T (speed = distance divided by time) and he was doing at least 70mph. The car is a Ford Fiesta for those asking and its the new Ford Sync feature that calls for help in an accident using your mobile phone that its paired to, this feature is available in ALL new Fords now and I have it enabled in my replacement 19 plate Ford Fiesta. Now for the police, their conduct I can say was questionable to say the least after the paramedic had dealt with me (I wasn't sent to hospital despite having a head injury). They gave me a lift home in the back of their car with my dog sat on my lap unrestrained, clearly breaking the law and I only remembered the next day what they had done. The coach driver later I was told by the police wasn't prosecuted for anything, driving without due care and attention should of been the least he was charged with as he hit me from behind and Ashley was correct in the direction he came from as his coach was the Nottingham to Leicester service. Lastly I went to A&E a few days later when my g/f took me to be checked over and even though I was still a bit rough they said I was OK to go home, I was actually concussed and confused for a week, I wasn't snoring honestly either that must of been the way I was slumped unconscious, stay safe everyone and drive safely. An extra note I have contacted Ashley after he made this video to tell him most of what I've told you all above, I did miss his email for some unknown reason probably missed it among all the spam we all get but spotted it later unread. Another note the coach company have said there is NO dashcam footage available from the brand new coach, surprise, surprise I wonder why? but I can remember it was so severely damaged at the front it was suspended towed away I still have that image in my head. Another note my dashcam is NEVER set looking straight ahead but points over to the right more which means it actually shows more of the right than normal plus this also advocates the purchase of Gap insurance on new/newish cars as I got the FULL purchase price back to enable me to get my 19 plate replacement Ford Fiesta about 3 months later. Sorry keep adding to this, please don't give the coach driver too hard a time. He did later actually decide to dial 999 (bit too late) and was in a later clip heard outside my car talking to them BUT he did say I was coming round and I maybe didn't need an ambulance!!!! and later he can be heard telling his passengers to get back on the coach and stop looking I suspect he may of thought he'd killed me and was too scared to look but I'm just guessing at that. When the police asked him even later what happened he told them I'd pulled out in front of him!!!!! its all on my dashcam as it kept recording sound and video. Last comment honestly: Driving background, I passed first time when I was 18 and was taught by an ex police driving instructor (way back when it was just practical with questions at the end) my examiner it turns out was the chief examiner. Was a courier for Securicor for 5 years, then drove long wheelbase Landrovers with trailer in the army as a Company Signaller, won an army driving competition with a trailer on as well and did have combat driving instruction as part of my driving for a front line Regiment and off road driver training. Not saying I'm the perfect driver, nobody is but I'm better than some I've come across over the years but like everyone I strive to do better, stay safe folks and thanks for all the comments and for being gentle, drive safely.
Looking at streetview on Google maps shows the coaches entrance is light controlled so I feel he probably got let off on a technicality as he was probably within the speed limit and using the correct lane. I feel you were in an impossible situation and couldn't have reasonably seen or expected this so it's good to hear that you and your dog survived the incident. Would expect the local authority to change the safety at this roundabout - for instance having your entrance traffic light controlled also or imposing a lower and safer speed limit before the entrance the coach took.
Glad you are ok, that’s crazy that there is “no footage”. After reviewing your dashcam footage I’m disappointed the police didn’t request the footage from national express as part of an investigation… would be interested to see the excuse of why it’s missing if it was officially requested as evidence
I am an ex NHS Paramedic and ex National Express Coach Driver. This is shocking because the attending police in this are incompetent on many counts. Firstly their suspicion is focused on the wrong person mainly because car was hit from rear . Would like to know if they also breath tested the coach driver? Second, mechanism of injury would denote car driver needs medical attention, it`s not their call to say he was alright they are not medical professionals. He was clearly confused and had no idea what was going on. Right, so breath test normal
2:02 How many drive past indeed! In Germany they could all be prosecuted for 'failing to give aide in an accident'. There is a reason you have to do an extended 1st Aid course before you can get your driving licence there.
That is an amazing modern feature on cars. Such a comfort when driving to know it's there. I do think the operators need retraining; or something needs adding so they automatically send ambulance to the scene.
@@JamesWilson01 why would he need to get his story straight? He wasn't in the wrong 🤣 useless pissed up cammer, though... Also, it was a national express coach, passengers would've been calling 999. Granted, if you hit a corner too fast on a country road then this feature would be useful
That's a really scary accident. On my first watch-through I was hawk-eyed in trying to predict what was gonna happen. From the dash-cam's POV there was 0 way to see the coach before entering the roundabout. I do get the impression the cammer could've seen the bus if he had been checking that side of the roundabout as he was emerging, but you wouldn't exactly expect a bus to come flying into a roundabout the way that it did. Incredibly scary stuff, always remain observant, especially during the calm hours of the night. Hope everyone and the dog are still okay!
No way the cammer could have seen the bus or we would have seen it as we can see that entrance to the roundabout for a long way back. You would also have been hit by this coach.
Not boasting, but I spent 16 years as a professional DJ. All my journeys home were at night, and I never once had an acccident, received a speeding ticket, or had a breakdown. I was regularly stopped by the police, a van out at night with no logo on the side, no phone numbers. Gotta be a wrong 'un. They even asked me to unload all my equipment in the rain. "Have you got a warrant" stopped that. Mind you I did come across some horrific accidents, and was glad I carried a First Responders Kit with me at all times.
@@joeytje50 One:- A First Responder drives better than an untrained civilian. Did you miss that bit? Two: I have been driving 53 years and have NEVER had an accident. Did you miss that bit? Three:- I carried a full First Resonders Kit at all times, unlike YOU. Did that get by as well? You must be a lousy driver if you miss those points in a simple post. But then I see you are a computer gamer, so maybe not even a driver/rider yet, so one can't expect too much from a kid.
my honest opinion, that coach driver was driving well in excess of any safe speed on that roundabout. Inveralmond Roundabout near me is a 30 and its sandwiched between the A9 which is as 70, the Industrial Estate being a 30 and the so called Triangle (a triangular spot of land mostly used for car sales across for SSE Offices) which is a 40. if the coach is straight lining it and he wasn't visible on the approach to the round about like what it seems in the video. i put this one squarely on the coach driver even if your viewer had only had 1 drink if anything
I'm a bus driver and I could not imagine driving a coach at that speed on a roundabout, even if minimal turning was necessary. At that time also there's no way he would have been running late (not that speeding is ever acceptable) so he obviously expected the road to be clear like it probably had been every other time he did it without incident. Typical complacency. Equally shocking is the cars that just cruise on past, but perhaps they could be forgiven if the coach driver and passengers were outside and the situation looked under control. I'd still have stopped though personally. Finally and what absolutely appalls me is that nobody went to the car after the incident, not the driver nor any passengers of the coach. What in the world were they thinking!? This guy has just been hit at high speed by a 14 tonne coach and he's going to be sitting in the drivers seat twiddling his thumbs? He could have been dying and nobody bothered to run over and open the door to give him immediate assistance. What has this world come to.
@Advanced Driving Well as a coach/bus driver you have to undergo training and part of that says in the event of an accident ensure any injured parties airways are clear. At the least he should have done that and been there to speak to and reassure the person if he'd been conscious. Thank goodness everybody walked away from this one and hopefully nothing like that happens again.
@Advanced Driving Precisely, dont stop unless you have to, you could get done not only by the police but also from any injuries you could have caused. Its purely what happens nowadays in this blame claim negligence easy pickings society, otherwise any sane person would have stopped. Do know a traffic cop, he stated the other week if he seen an accident they will stop. If accident had already happened, it dont pay to get involved and drive straight past. I would think same applies to general public after the event.
I've been traveling through the UK on multiple occasions. In a certain period, it was twice a week, delivering goods from The Netherlands to the greater Birmingham area, always taking the evening chunnel train, so basically driving in the UK at night. The last bit was always single carriageway, with quite a lot of roundabouts. Stopping or slowing down enough to get a proper look (keep in mind I drove lefthand drives) saved my life on many occasions: coaches, delivery vans, HGV's *_don't seem to slow down in the wee hours._*
The coach driver must’ve been going at a ridiculous speed to of hit the car because there’s no sign of the coach from the road at the last point of sight before they enter the roundabout but then within about 2 seconds the coach hits them
That coach was absolutely flying, it would most likely have had dashcams and definitely would have had a tachograph which would have said how fast he was going.
This roundabout is controlled by traffic lights from where the coach comes out from and also this road is national speed limit, he probably had green light and thought it was safe to go, look at the map view in this video you can clearly see traffic lights and no giveaway line
That got my blood pressure up…..scary stuff. I rewound it so many times and I cannot see the coach, nor its headlights at all so it must have entered that roundabout at high speed. I totally agree with you saying it ‘straight-lined’ the roundabout. It must have to not be seen then next minute hit that car in that way. Shocking stuff but great tech on the car to call 999 knowing there has been a collision. I find it strange they’ve sent the clip in and then ignore you after that. Anyway, congrats on 100k Ash 💯😃👍🏻
You can maybe just about see the coach through the bushes at 0:53 on the far right side of the screen. Helps if you go frame by frame with , and . But yeah, it looks like the coach entered that roundabout going at least 70mph.
@@CristiNeagu it's the sorta thing where, if you're lucky enough, you look that way at just the right moment and catch it and can stop. There's no way I could fault them though, this is 1am at night, a low traffic time, the place looks empty and they entered the roundabout in what seems to have been a sensible way for the conditions. Just before the collision you can see the lights of the coach but, bloody hell, that's not the kind of impact you'd get from roundabout speeds. I give it 90% chances the coach just blatantly was doing 60-80 trying to cut straight through.
It is clearly obvious that the coach was travelling at a rate of knots! I highly commend the drivers of the coach company seen which I won't mention; but this driver clearly took an extreme chance and essentially used the 16 tonne vehicle like it's a tonka car. I seriously hope the coach driver got prosecuted as those coaches are littered with cameras and I also hope that he watches this video. Thank you for sharing Ashley & I hope the car driver and the dog are both okay!
The coach was on a 70mph road approaching a traffic light controlled roundabout (probably) with a green light. In the 3 seconds it took for the Fiesta to go onto the roundabout and be hit a vehicle travelling at 70mph would go 102.67 (92.4m) yards, a vehicle travelling at 60mph would travel 88 yards (79m). The visible distance the Fiesta could see down the other approach road was less than either of these two figures because trees and shrubs block the view of any headlamps approaching at speed. The Fiesta's headlamps were pointing away from the Coach driver and the tail lights would be partly obscured. I think it is hard to blame either driver for this but there is certainly a problem with the design of the roundabout traffic control system and the presence of intervening foliage that needs to be cut back and maintained in a cut back position.
@@Velodrone To my knowledge a coach has a max speed limit of 60mph even on a motorway or dual carriage way. I also doubt that a brand ne coach came with no dash cam. If I was his boss I think I would have sacked him for what appears to me danageroous driving as he should have been able to stop in the distance he can see.
@@martinconnelly1473 some ones done some pixel counting to get information like that I think you have. There was a Scott Manley video recently about Astra and a rocket launch mentioning pixel counting to get velocity information.
5:02 - you can just see headlights appearing about 2 seconds before the accident, which I think sheds some light over the distance covered, being that when the cammer entered the round about there appeared to be nothing in the road to the right at all.
hi ashley, ive been learning to drive for a few weeks now and have had 6 hours with an instructor and about 4 or 5 private practice. your analysis videos have boosted my confidence a lot in knowing what hazards to look for. (also helped me pass my theory with 50/50) thanks!
Nice work with the theory, I think got 48, I passed my driving test fairly recently (1st time 6months of driving and 2 minors). If I were to give key tips I would say make sure you always try to plan ahead. Also don’t overthink things since if you got 50/50 in the theory you clearly have good knowledge of driving and probably good common sense so trust what you think is right in each scenario. As you’ve only had about 10 hours you’ve got a while to go but good luck with the test let me know how it goes if you remember 😅
Good luck with your future driving guys, I passed first time at 18 when it was just a practical test and questions at the end by the examiner I found out I'd had the chief examiner conduct my test, jeez. My driving instructor was an ex police driving instructor so he knew his stuff and what he taught me I've carried with me throughout my years driving but you NEVER stop learning. Don't be put off by my unfortunate 'one off' incident, I drive like I've always been taught to drive even now I don't slouch when speed is needed to avoid something so don't think from this short clip I'm a doddery old bloke that poodles along at 30 mph all the time (I actually drove for the army a long base landrover and drove as a courier later).
@@mikesheldon1957 Thank you very much for the advice. Although seeing these 'one off' incidents does worry me sometimes I understand they are rare and as long as you do all you can to prevent them it is highly unlikely they will cause serious damage to you, also going slow can be just as bad as going too fast. I'm continuing to learn as I watch Ashley's videos and am trying to improve my rev matching. Don't worry, I never thought you were an old bloke that poodles along at 30 mph 😅
The cammer has actually seen and commented on the video now. He said he went for the gap insurance and got the full price back that he purchased the car
By my rough estimate there is about 4-5 seconds between when we last see the road the coach presumably comes from, and the point of impact. That coach must have been going stupid quick to travel that distance in so little time.
My thought as well, I looked up the coordinates, and the coach would have been at least 110 m away when the camera lost sight of the direction it was coming from, which puts the speed at 70 mph (115kmh), probably more
That bus driver should be prosecuted ASAP! A professional driver should have higher standards than those... And yes, I still don't know where the bus came from, so yes, stupid quick...
You can clearly see the bus in a couple of frames enter beneath the last road light at 4:59, if you dont have the benefit of my eyes to see it then just use the 1/4 speed
Wow, that coach must have been going at some speed as we simply cannot see it on approach! Might be worth pitching in my views and 'borrowing' a clip, referencing this video?
Hi Dan! Absolutely, feel free. I actually had an email from someone who supposedly investigated the incident for national express and his conclusion was the driver of the coach was not at fault. However, this email cannot be verified as genuine. I'll look forward to your take on things.👊
With a huge amount of "leeway" the bus was going minimum 50mph - entrance to the roundabout from the bus's side, to the point of impact, is about 55 metres. To cover that in 2.5 seconds is 50mph. Way fast for a coach on a roundabout no matter what. I reckon though the coach came from at least the point where the overhead traffic lights are from their side, all the way to the point of the collision, which is roughly 80 metres, which over a time of 2.5 seconds would mean a minimum of 70mph. Take those numbers with a pinch of salt however as I'm just basing this off of measurements on Google Maps which may not be precise, and the coach could of course have entered from different points etc. Long story short - there is no doubt at all that the coach is at fault. Disappointing to see from a "professional driver".
“Don’t get involved” seems to be the norm here. I witnessed a car being force into the offside crash barrier on the A21 some years ago. The car did a full 360 and ended up against the near side crash barrier. I was about 1/2 a mile back when this happened. IT WAS RUSH HOUR AND I WAS THE ONLY VEHICLE THAT STOPPED!
In France it’s the law that if it’s possible with no risk to yourself you must stop and offer assistance. Severe penalties for ignoring someone in need and just driving on.
@@davidk3729 ii was driving sixty miles per hour on a dual carriageway late at night several years ago, a jaguar came flying past me at god knows what speed didn't even swerve at the roundabout just ploughed into it and took off. the car was smashed to bits the driver was dead, i stopped called the police and waited until they arrived. the policeman breathalysed me and accused me of racing the jag driving in my ford escort. they hounded me for weeks even coming to my place of work to get me to admit to racing the jag. i had to get a solicitor to make them back off. i would never stop as witness to an accident ever again
Same a few weeks ago. Busy motorway, and as I was driving along I suddenly noticed a car up on the embankment, every single body panel crumpled, with nobody in sight. As I drove past I wondered whether it had happened earlier and the vehicle hadn't been recovered yet. But then I wondered if it had just happened and the occupants were unconscious or trapped. So I made a late decision to stop, had a half mile trek back up the hard shoulder to the accident scene, and discovered the accident *had* just occurred! Yet not one of the at least dozen vehicles who would have witnessed a significant collision stopped. And not a single vehicle in the time it took me to run half a mile back up the hard shoulder either. Fortunately the sole occupant was ok, but how long would he have laid unconscious, trapped or dead had he not been ok. It really upset me how nobody cared, I'm genuinely scared now of being in a solo vehicle crash because apparently if you're not able to get assistance yourself, nobody will come to your aid.
Hope everyone involved was okay, especially the little doggy 🐶 Makes you realise how much you need to keep your observations up, even during the night when things seem quiet. Congratulations on 100K, Ashley - a very well deserved milestone! 🥳
It seems clear the coach driver went to "straight-line" that roundabout. It's the early hours, the roads are deserted, he's just come flying down a derestricted road with his foot on the floor and was tempted to chance it. He should be looking for another job, preferably stacking shelves.
From my experience, the onset of darkness( nighttime) seems to be like a green light to start speeding for many drivers, coach drivers included. Obviously reflects the perceived chance of being caught by the Police or speed cameras.
I'm baffled by how this collisions could even happen. You can see that the road on the right is clear at 0:53 when the dashcam vehicle enters the roundabout. So how can another vehicle even collide with with ? Honestly at that point, you expect an Audi RS3 to have taken the roundabout like a maniac, not a fleeping coach ! And I do agree with Ashley that you should keep checking as you're crossing the roundabout but in this case, I don't think it is reasonnable to expect someone to have the time to spot the coach and react in time. A the speed the coach was doing, he was probably moving more that 20 meter / second.
70mph is about 31m/s 60mph is about 26.5m/s. The visible distance from the cammer's entry on to the roundabout to the vertical support of the traffic light gantry is about 65m (Google Maps measurement). So the 3 seconds from going onto the roundabout and being hit puts a vehicle travelling at 60mph beyond the light gantry and into the area where the foliage blocks the view.
Late 53 secs cam car hasnt reached stop line approx a couple of yards to go. But at that point the road on right goes out of view, with that in mind assuming coach had entered at that point it could have already travelled 10M at approx 45-50mph, cam car literally dawdling pulling out unaware of surroundings.
@@martinconnelly1473 I'd say the coach driver probably had their foot to the floor on entering the roundabout and thus probably hit it at 100 km/h. That is the speed EU registered coaches are required to have their limiters set to, not sure if the UK has repealed or amended their implementation of that directive in national legislation in which case it would be the same. Like any EU directive it only takes effect when the sovereign legislature of the member state actually makes it law in their jurisdiction and they would need to repeal or amend that to change it as it is their own law at that point.
I’ve approached that very roundabout at 70, the lights stay green late at night, it’s a “shall I chance it?” moment. There’s a slight bend before the lights, so I think at 80mph this is just about possible.
Jesus! I’ve replayed this several times and I’m still convinced it’s a special effect. Where the hell did it come from! ?? Wow. Good to hear all are okay xxx
I have driven HGV's at night for a living and it is a different world especially between 00.00 and 04.00. This is when the rules of the road don't seem to apply in the majority of cases away from the relatively safe motorways. Dual carriageway racing, U turning Taxi's, and red lights don't apply all come out at night.
Given it was a National Express coach, I wonder if it’s worth asking them for their footage for a follow up video? (Also, in the interests of public confidence in their company, it would be good to get an update of what disciplinary measures they took against that driver).
That is crazy how fast that coach must have been travelling. I especially love how not only other road users don't stop to check but also the coach driver didn't get out to check if the cammer was ok. Like top job mate, you could have killed someone and you can't even get out to see if the person you crashed into is ok.
the victim has his statement above, and says the coach driver was out and checking on him - but of course, it should be mentioned you are assuming the coach driver wasn't also hurt in the crash.
@@XaviRonaldo0 How somebody 'looks' is irrelevant. Don't under estimate the effect of shock, you can easily move a wheel on dazed autopilot trying to help, but not thinking clearly. *And* that was after a period of time when the police had arrived. The coach driver is an involved party, so probably isn't the best to render aid. The shame lies entirely with other drivers who all drove past and didn't offer assistance.
Thanks for explaining and educating here but i doubt this would've ended any different...... that bus driver was going WAY too fast! I do look out for telltale signs like lights and all that at night during the lesser traffic hours but this bus probably would've hit me too..... he was nowhere to be seen.....
Omg!!! I actually had tears in my eyes whilst watching the video. You're right Ash, upsetting images but so pleased by what modern technology can do in certain circumstances. Thanks for sharing.
I'm not sure what was worse, the speed that coach must have been going (like others commenting I was also trying to look out for it approaching) or the fact that loads of people just drove by without helping. I hope both cammer and dog were OK. On a separate note, congratulations for reaching 100k, you deserve it
Absolutely, unless there were already other vehicles stopped to help. Unless you're a medical professional you're more likely to be a hindrance rather than a help if there are already many people helping.
I'm not going to speculate on this one, but one of the things i've noticed, and which Ashley has covered, is that people seem to think that it's ok to speed onto a roundabout and expect people already on the roundabout to give way just because you entered at high speed at where entering from their right hand side.
As long as entered without impeding any other vehicle, vehicles already on the roundabout have right of way, it doesn't matter if the other vehicle is approaching from the right.
@@CBikeLondon Yes we know that, the previous posters comment was mentioning the fact that plenty of drivers don't seem to realise that, and think they can fly into a roundabout at a million miles an hour, and expect any traffic that has or will enter from their left to stay out their way. They seem to expect said traffic to look half a mile down their approach road and wait even if that traffic would have finished entering the roundabout before they arrive. This type of driving, as well as dangerous negatively affects traffic flow, but those sort of drivers don't think or care.
Congratulations on the 100k I hope you get an update from the driver on this one at some point because a lot remains unknown.. But that coach must have been going a fair rate. And the number of cars that seem to ignore the crash is a tad shocking...
That was scary to hear the obstructed breathing, a clear sign of someone being unconscious. All drivers - not just new ones - should be taught how to maintain an open airway when something like this happens to another motorist. Something so simple could save a life.
For those wanting to know how you maintain a open airway in a unconscious seated person. You gently raise the head from its slumped forward position to a neutral position as if they were looking straight ahead. You continued to hold the head until a emergency worker is prepared to take over or the person comes around. My background is a motorsport marshal.
I’m really pleased you and your dog are ok. IMHO of 50 years on 2 and 4 wheels , the coach driver was completely at fault. He was definitely going at a excessive speed on a approach to roundabout and from his lardy seating position he would have had a superior outlook. He definitely would seen the other vehicle on approach and chose not to be cautious! Because the lack of footage and the fact that technically he had right of way precluded appropriate conviction ! The police/cps chose not to because they’re busy collecting fines for misdemeanours and releasing criminals! What really boils my piss is he got let off on what could have been a much more serious situation !
Thank you for your analysis and advice on this. Most of us would of probably been involved in accident like this if we were in this situation but now I have that extra bit of knowledge to prevent it. Thank you, your saving lives.
Just your friendly local road safety engineer here. That road layout is insane, it invites exactly this sort of straight lining at high speed. The UK desperately needs to adopt Dutch style turbo roundabouts for these huge junctions
This is exactly what I thought, looking on Google Maps the main road, which I believe is a national speed limit, is traffic light controlled while the road that the viewer pulls out of is not. Markings on the road don't match that of a roundabout! I'm sure this is a regular accident spot :(
As a learner driver I DETEST these kinds of roundabouts with a passion. Confusing and I always go the wrong way or in the wrong lane. It's too difficult to follow where I'm supposed to be going unless I learn the junction beforehand. I know of no other type of junction where I need to be familiar with it to navigate it safely. It should be intuitive, but it's not and it's dangerous. Dutch turbo roundabouts all the way!
Congrats on the 100k subscribers! Wow. That was a shock. I am glad the cammer sounded alright when the police officer was talking to him. I hope both him and his dog are well. The last bit where the wheel of the car was carried over to the side, spoke volumes about the damage the cammers car must have taken.
Knowing this roundabout there are traffic lights on some of this roundabout. That includes the A46 southbound, which is where the coach appears to have come from. I wonder if the coach tried to beat the lights.
The most interesting bit of the video for me was the auto connection with emergency services. my car has this tech it is reassuring to see it in action. Glad that your viewer was not injured.
I hope the driver is ok, I have a Honda Jazz and that also has an emergency call function, although I can also use it manually by pushing a red button near the rearview mirror. I must say though that I disagree with Ashleys assessment that the driver could have done something different...No he couldn't! The roundabout was completely clear when the driver got to the entrance to the roundabout he should then look forward to make sure there are no vehicles entering the roundabout at the same time as him, besides at the speed that asshole coach driver was driving at, there was no chance the car driver could have even reacted, let alone have time to put his foot down, the car to start accelerating away etc. No, the blame lies squarely with the coach driver. Period.
Yeah, I completely agree. Sure, the driver could have kept checking that side, but even if they did spot the coach, there would not have been enough time to avoid the accident. You would barely have time to register the coach coming in, let alone predict where they were headed and brake or speed up...
@@raymondbenjamins5884 you could put your foot down and run away with an automatic transmission, but that's assuming looking right instead of where you're going, which would be ridiculous in this case, I'd never expect someone, nevermind such a large vehicle, to come so fast through there after me entering the roundabout, to catch me while I'm still there... Fucking scary stuff, but I've seen a lot of no less dangerous things done by drivers already, it's even more scary how much of this is done by so called professional drivers, or at least people who drive a lot.
That’s a very brave thing you’ve done there mate, to admit that you have a Honda Jizz, sorry, Jazz. Not something I would’ve been brave enough to do. Respect.✋🏼
That was quite a scary accident, especially due to the fact that there was absolutely no indication of another vehicle when entering the roundabout. Also congratulations on 100k subscribers!
Where an earth did the coach come from? It was nowhere to be seen from approaching the roundabout to entering the roundabout. Only at the point of impact was it seen. Can’t even see any glow of headlights or anything. Coach driver must of done something wrong somewhere.
I have driven on this roundabout quite a few times as its very near family. All the roads that join the roundabout apart from the one the cammer joins from are quite fast moving dual carriageways. The road the cammer joins from is also the only one that isn't traffic light controlled. For me, the coach driver has seen the green light on his approach and not slowed down as much as he should, if at all, to take into account he is going over a roundabout. He's probably just treated it as a straight through road. Very dangerous regardless of the checks our cammer was carrying out in my opnion. Scary scary stuff
Shocking that none of the passers-by stopped. I think you would have to have been looking in exactly the right direction at the right time to spot that coach. It was travelling so fast to not be visible on the approach. I wonder if the driver was trying to get home before his clock ran out?
Not surprising, given there was a coach and its passengers behind the camera. You would have thought one of them would have checked on the driver - but the coach driver seems to have told everyone he was okay, when clearly, he wasn't.
I believe this accident was caused by the poor road design. If you look at the junction on Google Maps you see that the approach that the coach took is traffic light controlled , even the picture in the video at 5:40 shows the traffic light gantry and the road markings don't match that of a roundabout. The entry to the junction from Martin Drive is not traffic light controlled. I don't see any speed signs so potentially this is a 70Mph dual carriageway and if the lights were green the coach did nothing wrong. The driver coming out of Martin Drive had an obscured view and I don't believe he was at fault either. I suspect this junction is a regular accident spot.
What a piece of work that bus driver was. Professional driver and he doesn't immediately get out to check that he hasn't killed that man, who's breathing was clearly heavily obstructed when he was unconscious. Hey, at least he moved that wheel off the road though. Top job, mate.
Very unfortunate and bad luck but good to hear they all survived. My speculation is that the coach driver knows the roundabout well and has, as you speculated, straight-lined it. If this is the case, then on approach, he would be concentrating on any possible vehicle coming from his right and ready to brake or accelerate. Unfortunately he would be less prepared for a vehicle entering from the left! The poor car driver was perhaps, in the peace and quiet of the night, a bit lax in his observation and not expecting the unexpected!
Congrats on 100k. Watched this 10 times and cant believe how the bus comes from nowhere. I guess there is an aspect where the bus driver is checking right but going so quickly does not see what's in front. Also by the time car is on roundabout the bus is in the blind spot
As you say - interesting to see/hear how these things work when triggered by the accident. Reassuring that it did get quickly connected through to the police and they were there in only a few minutes (6-7?). The appalling thing, other than the obvious speed of the coach, is he didn't stop! How on earth has he got to his next stop/depot and not had to explain away the damage! One of the coppers appeared to retrieve a wheel - if that was torn from the car, the damage to the coach surely was substantial too.
@@nickeustace9495 Of course I did, Ashley also mentioned it a number of times. My observations were on the car calling out automatically, which pleases me as I have a similar system on my car and was interested to see how it worked and how the call was dealt with. My confusion of coach driver vs police recovering the wheel was based on the timing between the accident and any action, or movement outside the car, let alone the wheel being recovered. It appeared to be several minutes for the police to be there (which didn't seem bad all things considered) but a few more minutes before the chap with the wheel, who I didn't look at closely enough. What surprised me was why no one seemed to go check on the driver sooner than the police, especially the coach driver. But the driver of the cam car explained that in his response... that it could have been the coach driver thought he'd not survived it!
If you are first on the scene of an accident and an occupant is unconscious, head slumped and may be snoring. There airway is compromised which is really not good. To open and maintain an airway in a unconscious seated person. You gently raise the head from its slumped forward position to a neutral position as if they were looking straight ahead. You continued to hold the head until a emergency worker is prepared to take over or the person comes around. This simple step can save a life. My background is a motorsport marshal.
Unless theres some kind of technical malfunction in the vehicle or the traffic lights then yes, we don't need people in charge of a murder bus driving around
Very surprised the driver was not taken to A&E. The one big accident I had, I was taken to hospital because the paramedic thought I might have had a heart attack, I hadn't but was glad to be in hospital when the shock kicked in a little later! Glad to hear both man and dog are well.
Am no expert Neil but I don't believe the driver of the car could have done much to avoid collision, thanks for videos find them informative, have been driving many years Including HGV but still learning. Regards Geoff.
Well done for the 100k mate, I've been here since you were on 30 odd - you are still one of my favourite channels. Learnt a lot and my style of driving is pretty dam John these days
Good situational awareness is always warranted, our view of the area is very limited by the forward facing camera. With that caveat, it is my impression of the limited information available that there was not much if anything he could have done to mitigate.
I posted this on the blackbeltbarrister channel............I have watched this several times on Ashley's channel & I commented on it then but this coach did come from nowhere & I would hazard a guess that it was doing somewhere between 60 / 70mph when hitting that roundabout with the distance it covered. I have found that stretch of road, it is where the A46 meets the A607 on the Leicester Western Bypass at Syston & I have done an estimated calculation of what I think that coach covered in about a 4 to 5 second timeline. From not seeing that coach at all in the footage it was approx. 151m or 496ft away & you cover 88ft per second at 60mph which is 352ft that gives some indication. That coach was straight lining that roundabout off the A46 onto the A607 & was probably in the second lane of the four & the driver of the car was a very lucky man & the coach driver should be prosecuted !
That was absolutely terrifying, but I do think it's the coach driver's fault. Being on the right means you get right of way but you need to give drivers an opportunity to actually see you. None of us, i hope, drive with our eyes glued to the right. You, hopefully glance right, then forward, then right. If the coach driver was going at a sensible speed, at 0:55 when the car driver enters the roundabout, if the coach was entering at the same time, there would be enough time for them to pass each other safely. It's quite a distance between the two exits. Also you don't see the coach headlight beam until the end of 0:55. You only see the coach headlights at 0:56 and then 0:57 is when he crashes into the car. With how fast things are happening, I don't think the coach driver would have been able to stop if someone was coming round the roundabout on their right, therefore he coach speed was not sensible. Sometimes i wonder if coach and lorry drivers think they are immortal with the way they drive their vehicles. Some of you might say it's traffic light regulated, but then ambulances, fire brigade and police cars may jump lights , and had there been an emergency vehicle coming on the right, the coach would have ploughed into them too.
Generally speaking most roundabouts do not have a speed limit imposed on them. You do not see speed limits actually on the roundabout. Logically if two 30 mph roads intersect at a roundabout it is reasonable to believe a 30 mph speed limit exists on the four exit roundabout. However if a 30 mph road intersects a national speed limit road at a similar roundabout what would be the speed limit on that? 30 mph 60 mph or 70 mph as the carriageway is now divided. I do not think a speed limit can be legally enforced on most roundabouts other offences may be enforced in my opinion.
You don't need a speed limit for a roundabout, since you have to slow down to be physically able to cross it properly, you cannot expect a driver who is willing to straight line/ cut 3 lanes, to have slowed down just because there was a speed limit sign.
@@jcskyknight2222 Unfortunately, almost 90% of dashcam footage is of someone driving too fast into a roundabout and wondering why someone pulled out on them. It needs to be enforced. 20mph limit for all roundabouts. Put few cameras up and watch accidents plummet.
@@Chrisallengallery The reality is not speed per se it is whether people drive sensibly. There are numerous laws under which a prosecution might be successfully brought against errant drivers on roundabouts. One of the major failings of road safety in the UK is the excessive weight placed on speed almost to the exclusion of all the other causes of accidents. If you listen to Ashley's comments a huge number are on a wide range of poor driving practices.
I drove up to Scotland last summer, passing through East Ayrshire very late, about 10/11pm, on either the A70 or A713, can’t quite remember. I do remember that it wasn’t dual carriageway. I ended up being followed by a smallish local bus that must have been on it’s last run for home, because it was in a real rush and kept tight up with me even though I was doing the road speed. When we came to a roundabout, it overtook me on the roundabout, and disappeared off into the night over the next few bends. Night driving certainly can be unpredictable and hazardous.
I've scanned through the comments written by the poor driver and I'm glad to hear they're alright, but as an hgv driver, our big heavy vehicles are speed limited for reasons like this, why aren't coaches limited, why can they barrel along at 70+ mph, when they can and do dwarf other vehicles and can be of similar weights when fully loaded with passengers and luggage 🤔
The coach, at that time of the morning, almost certainly had no passengers, so it was able to travel faster than if it had been fully laden. Ashley's explanation for the route the coach driver was taking through the roundabout seems the only logical explanation, given the estimated speed of the coach when he hit the car.
Did the maths on what roughly the speed the coach would have been doing. So just after 0:52, from the time that large gantry on the right-hand side disappears off frame to when the coach hits, it's 3.66 seconds. The distance to that gantry is 68 meters from the camera vehicle. For the coach to have hit the car since the gantry went of screen it must have travelled that 68 meters in 3.66 seconds, which equates to the coach doing at least 67.1kmh or 41.6mph. Obviously the coach isn't visible at the gantry when the camera car, which means it's impossible to tell how far back the coach was from the gantry when it went off screen, so the coach would have had to have been travelling faster.
Even knowing an accident was coming had no clue, that coach was clearly going way to fast entering that round-a-bout, hope you get an update from the driver soon.
Ashley is right, the driver could have possibly made a little more progress once he saw it clear. However, lets just say for arguments sake, that the car driver had broken down at the same spot he was hit, should the coach driver had seen him in good time? The sound of the horn was very late as well. What I believe may have happened is the coach driver could have possibly been distracted by something or nodding off. I find it very strange he never saw the car until the moment of impact. A very strange one is this. No sign of the coach approaching from his lights or anything and 70 mph would be way to excessive to approach the roundabout safely also considering road/weather conditions, wet. Good to see everyone concerned has made recovery.
People need to understand that driving as fast as you can does not equate to good driving. The speed that coach must have been doing to not be able to avoid the car even if the car lane changed without observations is obscene for a roundabout, and the view is clear for the coach from a long way back. It might have been going so fast if it hit the roundabout at 60 or so that it appeared after the cammers observation to change lanes. Sometimes it takes an accident to change the way you drive. For me it was having a child and being responsible for them. I shudder to think about the way I used to drive and the children and other people I was putting at risk. I just hope that by watching things like this more people change their ways before they get hurt, or hurt someone else
True,the average driver has no skills to drive fast.They are generally taught to pass a simple driving test. It takes years of gaining knowledge,experience and discipline to be able to drive well at higher speeds.Higher speeds on public roads,means keeping to the speed limits,although driving at below the speed limit,in some situations can be dangerous. Drivers with these skills are few and far between,unfortunately. Alway ask yourself,can I stop? It's not what you can see that kills you it's what you can't see...slow down,was the mantra a police instructor told me,38 years ago!,I am 59 now. I have applied that rule for all those years. I am still learning.
@@nearlyretired7005 No. What I am saying is that "ironically, had the cammer been driving as fast as he could through this roundabout, this collision wouldn't have happened."
I always expect drivers to be going a bit faster at night but you're still expecting a certain degree of forethought and safety in others driving. This video has definitely been a good reminder about subconscious blind-spots and I'll be making sure to keep eyes on all sides of the road, regardless of others expected speeds
The standard of driving from National Express coach drivers is appalling. Last time I used one he jumped three red lights, these weren’t lights that only just changed but were hard reds. I constantly see them approaching roundabouts far too fast, on many occasions have done emergency stops on roundabouts because they come onto them at full speed as well. I’ve even had one who kept blocking me from safely overtaking when I was on my motorbike behind them. They seem to employ the worst people.
I drive for a living and regularly see drivers from this coach company speeding excessively. Oldham Rd Manchester is a 30mph speed limit and one of their coaches who overtook me last week must have been doing between 45-50mph. I've thought about this before and wondered if they have some kind of dispensation from adhering to the traffic laws because if I drove like this every day, I'm sure I would have lost my license by now.
This is absolutely horrifying. The bus just appeared out of nowhere, must have been travelling at a serious rate of knots. That is the epitome of unprofessional.
Some good tips Ashley, normally I treat traffic islands as potential impact traps. Eyes always on a swivel and brain on high alert. More so than normal driving. Roundabouts are oftrn misunderstood and abused. As a 30 plus year driver I still find your videos a great education and reminder. Cheers for the continued education.
The British need speed cameras in sensitive places like that so the reckless bus driver cannot fly through it in the first place. Roundabout should be max 30-40 km/h
A bad accident indeed, the sound of his stertorous breathing indicating upper airway obstruction was very worrying. I was relieved to hear that he responded when someone finally got to him to check him out, which showed that he was clearly concussed. Am surprised that he was not kept in hospital overnight for observation, I suspect that A+E did not receive the full story. Should anyone come to someones aid they can give vital information to the ambulance crew when they arrive. You may feel that you don't have much to tell them about what you observed but that bit of information can sometimes make a vital difference to their over all assessment, so don't ever be afraid to approach the crew with your information, they will log it and pass it on to A+E. Good posting Ashley. ( Chuckabutty, retired Paramedic).
I timed the footage, if that was the correct speeds, then the bus was going way too fast and was at fault. Yes, the cam probably should have checked more, but honestly, I don't think that would have mattered much considering the speed and non-observation from the bus driver. The cam was in the roundabout first and for quite a bit without any other vehicles, and I calculated that out based on the footage speed to the edge of the screen with angles....so either the bus was going far above the speed limit for that area, or they ignored the car entirely.
I've watched the clip in slow motion many times now and you don't see the headlights or the coach, even when the cammer has crossed the give way line. If the coach driver was alert, he'd have plenty of time to see the car and start braking...but it appears that he didn't do this sufficiently enough so my conclusion here, is that he was half asleep. It'd be interesting to see his tacho records for that moment and see what speed he was doing, whether he had lifted on the approach to the island. I do hope the cammer is ok and that poor doggie has recovered.
Wow that was so scary to see. I hope the driver and his dog are OK. It makes realise no matter what time day or night try and always be on look out. Thanks for sharing Ashley. 😁
Boggles the mind that people just drove past. There's also extremely low chance that the coach was A empty and B had anyone take any meaningful injuries. This means that several people were perfectly able to attend to this individual and their dog but just chose not to. Had he been killed, every person involved and who had chosen to ignore this while not imprisoned or arrested would have been held accountable.
Yh the one thing I was thinking as the the bit of the video with the emergency call occurs was that no one came to check on the driver of the vehicle.... chances of the coach being empty are low, but not impossible, but chances of the coach driver being incapacitated are low but not impossible. Chances of both occuring are...... so low as to not be likely.... EDIT:: at the end you actually see the coach driver clearing the wheel so very much not incapacitated... why the huge delay to check on the other driver? Maybe the realisation they were seriously at fault and would be out of a job hindered their thought process? So yh... not impressed at all with respect to the coach driver's attitude to driving, or other road users -- I use national express a lot around the Leicestershire area so I hope they don't drive for them anymore!!
From my analysis of the footage and map/street view. At approx. 53secs you loose sight of the A46 road and where the bus is coming from, at about 56secs you can clearly see the bus headlights reflecting off the roundabout curbing, and at 57sec collision. Given the point from where the car driver couldn't have see the bus from the right to the collision point is around 4secs, and working a distance via google maps and road view if the bus was just at the 53sec mark, would give around 130yards, giving a speed of the bus around 66 mph average. I would hypothesise that the bus was approaching @70mph, then lifted off and slowed, expecting to straight line the roundabout, probably expected the car driver to have cleared by the time the bus had reached that point, realised too late the car was moving slower than anticipated, breaking and sounding horn and probably hitting the rear of the car at around 40mph.
What? The roundabout was clear, he made sure there are no cars on the roundabout, then looked forward to make sure there were no cars coming on the roundabout. He was fully in the right. The beauty of hindsight!
@@letter1014 yeah, I dont disagree. I was going on Ashley's comments that the 1 thing he could have done is have continuing awareness and maybe accelerating or braking out of the way could have saved an accident / reduced the severity, but like you say.... hindsight
The coach driver hesitated to call the emergency services, and even said, "No need for an ambulance, he is regaining consciousness." ???? Being knocked out is literal brain damage. There is no safe way to be hit in the head to the point of unconsciousness. I was in an accident, very low-speed, all conscious, I didn't even have pain or bruising from the seatbelt. An ambulance was still sent out, even though none of us needed a look over.
I wonder if you or the driver could submit a freedom of information notice to the coach company and get the coach dash cam footage. Almost certain it was travelling too quick and trying to straight line the roundabout to save a few seconds travel time
FOI wouldn't apply in this instance, however, I would have expected the police to investigate this more thoroughly, including checking any video footage and tachograph records
And yet there are still some people who think joyriding, reckless driving and speeding is "perfectly fine" if you do it in the early hours because "there's no other traffic on the road".
Yeah, I do like driving during those early hours because of the little traffic, but it can also be extremely scary when you encounter someone who doesn't take proper care because they assume there's nobody around.
Am sure in the video for a split second you can see the coach on the far right beside the trees just as the car was onto the roundabout. Its there but very split second. But yeah the coach driver was entering the roundabout far to fast even though the road was really quiet doesnt mean you can drive like and ass
well the cam car needs to give way to the right. there is no actual speed limit to joining a roundabout unless road has a speed limit on it so the coach can enter at that speed if it doesnt need to give way to traffic from its right. how many cars that get hit in the rear quarter on a mini roundabout by a car they should of given way too, actually dont get the blame? hardly any. and scale wise, its similar to a mini roundabout crash situation, the size of the roundabout is bigger but the speeds are higher making it similar. it is an accident, there is blame on both sides, which is why its so important to make sure its clear to go, it can be so straight forward at night just to look and go "its fine" and miss something by assuming its clear. the coach driver should of entered at a slower speed but the cam car could of slowed down even more to make sure it was clear. the lawyers will see it as the cam car was to give way no matter the speed of the coach so probably blame them mostly for the incident.
For anyone curious, the car seems to be a Ford Fiesta, most modern fords will have this emergency call system. Also, can someone do some estimating on how fast the coach was going? I know on Google maps you can measure distance so I wonder if you can use that to determine average speed? My guess would be at least 60MPH
The speed that coach must have been coming onto the roundabout is infuriating. Ridiculous. People really should stop driving faster at night and assume nobody is around. See it all the damn time and it's drivers like this that cause accidents like this. Not watched the full video yet, but I hope police saw this footage, they have no business being behind the wheel of such a vehicle.
As an aside, my current vehicle, a 64 reg Ford Focus C Max Grand (then just a year old, with 9K mileage on the clock), was involved in an accident half an hour after I'd picked it up for the first time from the dealers in Burnley. It was in January 2016, the road conditions were poor, there was a combination of ice, sleet on snow on the A56 and M66 roads on my return to Whitefield, near Bury. Coming down the hill near Heap Bridge Bury in the M66, I was only travelling at 50 mph due to the poor conditions, and the unfamiliarity of the new car. in front of me, around 600 to 800 yards away, I could see a silver MPV spinning around in the middle of the motorway, the vehicle driver managed to regain control and drive away. A Citroen Picasso 200 yards of me saw this and braked to avoid a collision, and was promptly rammed by a white Beemer X 5, whose airbags were then deployed. By this time I'd managed to stop and pull over to the hard shoulder, only to be rammed by a silver Merc that braked too hard and due to the camber of the road, it skidded, veered and smashed into the back of my recently acquired car. I was OK, but the car was off the road for 6 weeks for repairs costing nearly £10K, the Merc driver was found to be at fault for the accident. Also the impact of the accident meant the frame of my driver's seat had been bent and had to be replaced. Since I'd only just purchased the car, I hadn't had time to activate the Ford Sync system, nowadays I have it connected at all times when driving.
While the viewer could have done more, it was obvious from the first time I saw the impact that the coach driver was completely reckless. That roundabout is quite big, so the speed the coach must have been going to cover that distance in such a short time was absurd.
It's for exactly this type of incident that I often feel roundabouts should have a lower speed limit on approach and through the roundabout than the rest of the road they are on. Possibly also various traffic calming measures on the approach such as rumble strips, a gentle S curve or whatever. Leaving it wide open for drivers to negotiate the roundabout governed only by the laws of physics on a 50-70 mph dual carriageway for example, is just asking for trouble and results in the sorts of incidents we see here.
Bloody hell, modern technology is amazing. Lots of talk of IoT being the devil thanks to privacy concerns. But your car autocalling emergency services if you crash can literally save lives, holy cow
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Hi folks and Ashley and thanks for showing my clip and yes I'm still alive and so is my dog. Thanks for the analysis and maybe I could of kept looking but I don't know if I did because I have no recollection of the accident and very sketchy recollection of what happened afterwards and can't remember any of what they asked me in that clip. I was breathalysed after the accident and found to be negative, we had been to the pub (me and my partner/girlfriend) for some food earlier in the evening. The guy with my car rear wheel in his hand was the National Express coach driver, the rear offside wheel plus suspension had been ripped off when he hit me and he was removing it from the road and I've estimated his average speed over the distance using S = D/T (speed = distance divided by time) and he was doing at least 70mph. The car is a Ford Fiesta for those asking and its the new Ford Sync feature that calls for help in an accident using your mobile phone that its paired to, this feature is available in ALL new Fords now and I have it enabled in my replacement 19 plate Ford Fiesta.
Now for the police, their conduct I can say was questionable to say the least after the paramedic had dealt with me (I wasn't sent to hospital despite having a head injury). They gave me a lift home in the back of their car with my dog sat on my lap unrestrained, clearly breaking the law and I only remembered the next day what they had done. The coach driver later I was told by the police wasn't prosecuted for anything, driving without due care and attention should of been the least he was charged with as he hit me from behind and Ashley was correct in the direction he came from as his coach was the Nottingham to Leicester service. Lastly I went to A&E a few days later when my g/f took me to be checked over and even though I was still a bit rough they said I was OK to go home, I was actually concussed and confused for a week, I wasn't snoring honestly either that must of been the way I was slumped unconscious, stay safe everyone and drive safely.
An extra note I have contacted Ashley after he made this video to tell him most of what I've told you all above, I did miss his email for some unknown reason probably missed it among all the spam we all get but spotted it later unread. Another note the coach company have said there is NO dashcam footage available from the brand new coach, surprise, surprise I wonder why? but I can remember it was so severely damaged at the front it was suspended towed away I still have that image in my head. Another note my dashcam is NEVER set looking straight ahead but points over to the right more which means it actually shows more of the right than normal plus this also advocates the purchase of Gap insurance on new/newish cars as I got the FULL purchase price back to enable me to get my 19 plate replacement Ford Fiesta about 3 months later.
Sorry keep adding to this, please don't give the coach driver too hard a time. He did later actually decide to dial 999 (bit too late) and was in a later clip heard outside my car talking to them BUT he did say I was coming round and I maybe didn't need an ambulance!!!! and later he can be heard telling his passengers to get back on the coach and stop looking I suspect he may of thought he'd killed me and was too scared to look but I'm just guessing at that. When the police asked him even later what happened he told them I'd pulled out in front of him!!!!! its all on my dashcam as it kept recording sound and video.
Last comment honestly: Driving background, I passed first time when I was 18 and was taught by an ex police driving instructor (way back when it was just practical with questions at the end) my examiner it turns out was the chief examiner. Was a courier for Securicor for 5 years, then drove long wheelbase Landrovers with trailer in the army as a Company Signaller, won an army driving competition with a trailer on as well and did have combat driving instruction as part of my driving for a front line Regiment and off road driver training. Not saying I'm the perfect driver, nobody is but I'm better than some I've come across over the years but like everyone I strive to do better, stay safe folks and thanks for all the comments and for being gentle, drive safely.
Thanks for the update, glad to hear you are alright!
Looking at streetview on Google maps shows the coaches entrance is light controlled so I feel he probably got let off on a technicality as he was probably within the speed limit and using the correct lane. I feel you were in an impossible situation and couldn't have reasonably seen or expected this so it's good to hear that you and your dog survived the incident. Would expect the local authority to change the safety at this roundabout - for instance having your entrance traffic light controlled also or imposing a lower and safer speed limit before the entrance the coach took.
Your a lucky man, thanks for sharing
Glad to hear that you're both alright!
Glad you are ok, that’s crazy that there is “no footage”. After reviewing your dashcam footage I’m disappointed the police didn’t request the footage from national express as part of an investigation… would be interested to see the excuse of why it’s missing if it was officially requested as evidence
I am an ex NHS Paramedic and ex National Express Coach Driver. This is shocking because the attending police in this are incompetent on many counts. Firstly their suspicion is focused on the wrong person mainly because car was hit from rear . Would like to know if they also breath tested the coach driver? Second, mechanism of injury would denote car driver needs medical attention, it`s not their call to say he was alright they are not medical professionals. He was clearly confused and had no idea what was going on. Right, so breath test normal
2:02 How many drive past indeed!
In Germany they could all be prosecuted for 'failing to give aide in an accident'. There is a reason you have to do an extended 1st Aid course before you can get your driving licence there.
Look on TH-cam "Germany rescue lane" Just shows how much better the germans are at driving.
Well, not an extended course. It's pretty much just a one day crash course. But it's still much better than the nothing at all we have here.
Bloody hell, lucky to survive that. Also lucky to have that robot 999 call. Congrats on the 100k.
That is an amazing modern feature on cars. Such a comfort when driving to know it's there. I do think the operators need retraining; or something needs adding so they automatically send ambulance to the scene.
How was it lucky? The coach driver would've called 999 😂🤣😂
@@johnbower7452 Yeah, police and ambulance would seem more sensible if no one's responding. Cool tech though!
@@ZJS0113 When, do you think? Before or after he'd had time to get his "story" straight?
@@JamesWilson01 why would he need to get his story straight? He wasn't in the wrong 🤣 useless pissed up cammer, though...
Also, it was a national express coach, passengers would've been calling 999. Granted, if you hit a corner too fast on a country road then this feature would be useful
That's a really scary accident. On my first watch-through I was hawk-eyed in trying to predict what was gonna happen. From the dash-cam's POV there was 0 way to see the coach before entering the roundabout. I do get the impression the cammer could've seen the bus if he had been checking that side of the roundabout as he was emerging, but you wouldn't exactly expect a bus to come flying into a roundabout the way that it did. Incredibly scary stuff, always remain observant, especially during the calm hours of the night. Hope everyone and the dog are still okay!
No way the cammer could have seen the bus or we would have seen it as we can see that entrance to the roundabout for a long way back. You would also have been hit by this coach.
Not boasting, but I spent 16 years as a professional DJ. All my journeys home were at night, and I never once had an acccident, received a speeding ticket, or had a breakdown. I was regularly stopped by the police, a van out at night with no logo on the side, no phone numbers. Gotta be a wrong 'un. They even asked me to unload all my equipment in the rain. "Have you got a warrant" stopped that. Mind you I did come across some horrific accidents, and was glad I carried a First Responders Kit with me at all times.
@@Demun1649 "Not boasting but" would imply you would come to a point, other than the boasting. What's your point exactly?
@@joeytje50
One:- A First Responder drives better than an untrained civilian. Did you miss that bit?
Two: I have been driving 53 years and have NEVER had an accident. Did you miss that bit?
Three:- I carried a full First Resonders Kit at all times, unlike YOU. Did that get by as well?
You must be a lousy driver if you miss those points in a simple post. But then I see you are a computer gamer, so maybe not even a driver/rider yet, so one can't expect too much from a kid.
my honest opinion, that coach driver was driving well in excess of any safe speed on that roundabout. Inveralmond Roundabout near me is a 30 and its sandwiched between the A9 which is as 70, the Industrial Estate being a 30 and the so called Triangle (a triangular spot of land mostly used for car sales across for SSE Offices) which is a 40. if the coach is straight lining it and he wasn't visible on the approach to the round about like what it seems in the video. i put this one squarely on the coach driver even if your viewer had only had 1 drink if anything
I'm a bus driver and I could not imagine driving a coach at that speed on a roundabout, even if minimal turning was necessary. At that time also there's no way he would have been running late (not that speeding is ever acceptable) so he obviously expected the road to be clear like it probably had been every other time he did it without incident. Typical complacency. Equally shocking is the cars that just cruise on past, but perhaps they could be forgiven if the coach driver and passengers were outside and the situation looked under control. I'd still have stopped though personally. Finally and what absolutely appalls me is that nobody went to the car after the incident, not the driver nor any passengers of the coach. What in the world were they thinking!? This guy has just been hit at high speed by a 14 tonne coach and he's going to be sitting in the drivers seat twiddling his thumbs? He could have been dying and nobody bothered to run over and open the door to give him immediate assistance. What has this world come to.
@Advanced Driving Well as a coach/bus driver you have to undergo training and part of that says in the event of an accident ensure any injured parties airways are clear. At the least he should have done that and been there to speak to and reassure the person if he'd been conscious. Thank goodness everybody walked away from this one and hopefully nothing like that happens again.
@Advanced Driving Precisely, dont stop unless you have to, you could get done not only by the police but also from any injuries you could have caused.
Its purely what happens nowadays in this blame claim negligence easy pickings society, otherwise any sane person would have stopped. Do know a traffic cop, he stated the other week if he seen an accident they will stop. If accident had already happened, it dont pay to get involved and drive straight past. I would think same applies to general public after the event.
@Advanced Driving Helping involves calling someone who does know first aid, not just sitting around gawking
@@jmurray01 That`s correct, First aid training is part of CPC training with coach drivers have to do
I've been traveling through the UK on multiple occasions. In a certain period, it was twice a week, delivering goods from The Netherlands to the greater Birmingham area, always taking the evening chunnel train, so basically driving in the UK at night. The last bit was always single carriageway, with quite a lot of roundabouts. Stopping or slowing down enough to get a proper look (keep in mind I drove lefthand drives) saved my life on many occasions: coaches, delivery vans, HGV's *_don't seem to slow down in the wee hours._*
That’s shocking, I would love to see the dash camera footage from the coach who I suspect the driver didn’t approach the roundabout with any caution.
The coach driver must’ve been going at a ridiculous speed to of hit the car because there’s no sign of the coach from the road at the last point of sight before they enter the roundabout but then within about 2 seconds the coach hits them
That coach was absolutely flying, it would most likely have had dashcams and definitely would have had a tachograph which would have said how fast he was going.
@@Qwerty-bs3pt At 0:56 you can hear the horn from the coach, as the car pulls out in front of him.
This roundabout is controlled by traffic lights from where the coach comes out from and also this road is national speed limit, he probably had green light and thought it was safe to go, look at the map view in this video you can clearly see traffic lights and no giveaway line
I doubt national express will be releasing it any time soon!
That got my blood pressure up…..scary stuff. I rewound it so many times and I cannot see the coach, nor its headlights at all so it must have entered that roundabout at high speed. I totally agree with you saying it ‘straight-lined’ the roundabout. It must have to not be seen then next minute hit that car in that way. Shocking stuff but great tech on the car to call 999 knowing there has been a collision. I find it strange they’ve sent the clip in and then ignore you after that. Anyway, congrats on 100k Ash 💯😃👍🏻
You can maybe just about see the coach through the bushes at 0:53 on the far right side of the screen. Helps if you go frame by frame with , and .
But yeah, it looks like the coach entered that roundabout going at least 70mph.
The cammer has replied on the comments.
@@CristiNeagu ahh I’ll have another look.
@@PedroConejo1939 thx 👍🏻
@@CristiNeagu it's the sorta thing where, if you're lucky enough, you look that way at just the right moment and catch it and can stop. There's no way I could fault them though, this is 1am at night, a low traffic time, the place looks empty and they entered the roundabout in what seems to have been a sensible way for the conditions. Just before the collision you can see the lights of the coach but, bloody hell, that's not the kind of impact you'd get from roundabout speeds. I give it 90% chances the coach just blatantly was doing 60-80 trying to cut straight through.
It is clearly obvious that the coach was travelling at a rate of knots! I highly commend the drivers of the coach company seen which I won't mention; but this driver clearly took an extreme chance and essentially used the 16 tonne vehicle like it's a tonka car. I seriously hope the coach driver got prosecuted as those coaches are littered with cameras and I also hope that he watches this video. Thank you for sharing Ashley & I hope the car driver and the dog are both okay!
The cammer is Marathonman_26 and has confirmed in the comments that both he and the dog are OK
The coach was on a 70mph road approaching a traffic light controlled roundabout (probably) with a green light. In the 3 seconds it took for the Fiesta to go onto the roundabout and be hit a vehicle travelling at 70mph would go 102.67 (92.4m) yards, a vehicle travelling at 60mph would travel 88 yards (79m). The visible distance the Fiesta could see down the other approach road was less than either of these two figures because trees and shrubs block the view of any headlamps approaching at speed. The Fiesta's headlamps were pointing away from the Coach driver and the tail lights would be partly obscured. I think it is hard to blame either driver for this but there is certainly a problem with the design of the roundabout traffic control system and the presence of intervening foliage that needs to be cut back and maintained in a cut back position.
@@martinconnelly1473 light controlled or not, 70mph is an insane speed to take a roundabout at, even in car, never mind a coach.
@@Velodrone To my knowledge a coach has a max speed limit of 60mph even on a motorway or dual carriage way. I also doubt that a brand ne coach came with no dash cam. If I was his boss I think I would have sacked him for what appears to me danageroous driving as he should have been able to stop in the distance he can see.
@@martinconnelly1473 some ones done some pixel counting to get information like that I think you have.
There was a Scott Manley video recently about Astra and a rocket launch mentioning pixel counting to get velocity information.
5:02 - you can just see headlights appearing about 2 seconds before the accident, which I think sheds some light over the distance covered, being that when the cammer entered the round about there appeared to be nothing in the road to the right at all.
hi ashley, ive been learning to drive for a few weeks now and have had 6 hours with an instructor and about 4 or 5 private practice. your analysis videos have boosted my confidence a lot in knowing what hazards to look for. (also helped me pass my theory with 50/50) thanks!
Nice work with the theory, I think got 48, I passed my driving test fairly recently (1st time 6months of driving and 2 minors). If I were to give key tips I would say make sure you always try to plan ahead. Also don’t overthink things since if you got 50/50 in the theory you clearly have good knowledge of driving and probably good common sense so trust what you think is right in each scenario.
As you’ve only had about 10 hours you’ve got a while to go but good luck with the test let me know how it goes if you remember 😅
Good luck with your future driving guys, I passed first time at 18 when it was just a practical test and questions at the end by the examiner I found out I'd had the chief examiner conduct my test, jeez. My driving instructor was an ex police driving instructor so he knew his stuff and what he taught me I've carried with me throughout my years driving but you NEVER stop learning. Don't be put off by my unfortunate 'one off' incident, I drive like I've always been taught to drive even now I don't slouch when speed is needed to avoid something so don't think from this short clip I'm a doddery old bloke that poodles along at 30 mph all the time (I actually drove for the army a long base landrover and drove as a courier later).
@@mikesheldon1957 Thank you very much for the advice. Although seeing these 'one off' incidents does worry me sometimes I understand they are rare and as long as you do all you can to prevent them it is highly unlikely they will cause serious damage to you, also going slow can be just as bad as going too fast. I'm continuing to learn as I watch Ashley's videos and am trying to improve my rev matching.
Don't worry, I never thought you were an old bloke that poodles along at 30 mph 😅
This is the kind of accident that scares me, especially when taking my kids about. I hope driver made a full recovery and that insurance was sorted.
The cammer has actually seen and commented on the video now. He said he went for the gap insurance and got the full price back that he purchased the car
By my rough estimate there is about 4-5 seconds between when we last see the road the coach presumably comes from, and the point of impact.
That coach must have been going stupid quick to travel that distance in so little time.
That was exactly my impression when I saw the footage of the actual accident, I was thinking "Where did they come from?"
@@inyobill no matter how many times I replay it I can't see the coach
My thought as well, I looked up the coordinates, and the coach would have been at least 110 m away when the camera lost sight of the direction it was coming from, which puts the speed at 70 mph (115kmh), probably more
That bus driver should be prosecuted ASAP! A professional driver should have higher standards than those... And yes, I still don't know where the bus came from, so yes, stupid quick...
You can clearly see the bus in a couple of frames enter beneath the last road light at 4:59, if you dont have the benefit of my eyes to see it then just use the 1/4 speed
Wow, that coach must have been going at some speed as we simply cannot see it on approach! Might be worth pitching in my views and 'borrowing' a clip, referencing this video?
Hi Dan! Absolutely, feel free. I actually had an email from someone who supposedly investigated the incident for national express and his conclusion was the driver of the coach was not at fault. However, this email cannot be verified as genuine. I'll look forward to your take on things.👊
@@ashley_neal Will do! that email sounds a little odd! I have some clear views on this! 👊
With a huge amount of "leeway" the bus was going minimum 50mph - entrance to the roundabout from the bus's side, to the point of impact, is about 55 metres. To cover that in 2.5 seconds is 50mph. Way fast for a coach on a roundabout no matter what.
I reckon though the coach came from at least the point where the overhead traffic lights are from their side, all the way to the point of the collision, which is roughly 80 metres, which over a time of 2.5 seconds would mean a minimum of 70mph.
Take those numbers with a pinch of salt however as I'm just basing this off of measurements on Google Maps which may not be precise, and the coach could of course have entered from different points etc.
Long story short - there is no doubt at all that the coach is at fault. Disappointing to see from a "professional driver".
“Don’t get involved” seems to be the norm here. I witnessed a car being force into the offside crash barrier on the A21 some years ago. The car did a full 360 and ended up against the near side crash barrier. I was about 1/2 a mile back when this happened. IT WAS RUSH HOUR AND I WAS THE ONLY VEHICLE THAT STOPPED!
In France it’s the law that if it’s possible with no risk to yourself you must stop and offer assistance. Severe penalties for ignoring someone in need and just driving on.
@@davidk3729 ii was driving sixty miles per hour on a dual carriageway late at night several years ago, a jaguar came flying past me at god knows what speed didn't even swerve at the roundabout just ploughed into it and took off. the car was smashed to bits the driver was dead, i stopped called the police and waited until they arrived. the policeman breathalysed me and accused me of racing the jag driving in my ford escort. they hounded me for weeks even coming to my place of work to get me to admit to racing the jag. i had to get a solicitor to make them back off. i would never stop as witness to an accident ever again
Same a few weeks ago. Busy motorway, and as I was driving along I suddenly noticed a car up on the embankment, every single body panel crumpled, with nobody in sight. As I drove past I wondered whether it had happened earlier and the vehicle hadn't been recovered yet. But then I wondered if it had just happened and the occupants were unconscious or trapped.
So I made a late decision to stop, had a half mile trek back up the hard shoulder to the accident scene, and discovered the accident *had* just occurred! Yet not one of the at least dozen vehicles who would have witnessed a significant collision stopped. And not a single vehicle in the time it took me to run half a mile back up the hard shoulder either. Fortunately the sole occupant was ok, but how long would he have laid unconscious, trapped or dead had he not been ok. It really upset me how nobody cared, I'm genuinely scared now of being in a solo vehicle crash because apparently if you're not able to get assistance yourself, nobody will come to your aid.
What part of the A21?
Hope everyone involved was okay, especially the little doggy 🐶 Makes you realise how much you need to keep your observations up, even during the night when things seem quiet. Congratulations on 100K, Ashley - a very well deserved milestone! 🥳
This video is exactly why we have to look out for each other on the road. I hope driver and puppy are doing okay!
It seems clear the coach driver went to "straight-line" that roundabout. It's the early hours, the roads are deserted, he's just come flying down a derestricted road with his foot on the floor and was tempted to chance it. He should be looking for another job, preferably stacking shelves.
Given that it was probably the bloke carrying the wheel at the end, I'd avoid employing him where food is concerned. He's had enough of it.
Or mopping a prison floor nearly
From my experience, the onset of darkness( nighttime) seems to be like a green light to start speeding for many drivers, coach drivers included. Obviously reflects the perceived chance of being caught by the Police or speed cameras.
No. He’ll probably pull the pallet lifters around too fast and hit someone.
Incredibly disrespectful comment to retail staff. No need for it.
100K, Well done ashley!
Congratulations on 100k. You helped me pass my test 4 years ago but I still watch to keep sharp
I'm baffled by how this collisions could even happen. You can see that the road on the right is clear at 0:53 when the dashcam vehicle enters the roundabout. So how can another vehicle even collide with with ? Honestly at that point, you expect an Audi RS3 to have taken the roundabout like a maniac, not a fleeping coach !
And I do agree with Ashley that you should keep checking as you're crossing the roundabout but in this case, I don't think it is reasonnable to expect someone to have the time to spot the coach and react in time. A the speed the coach was doing, he was probably moving more that 20 meter / second.
70mph is about 31m/s 60mph is about 26.5m/s. The visible distance from the cammer's entry on to the roundabout to the vertical support of the traffic light gantry is about 65m (Google Maps measurement). So the 3 seconds from going onto the roundabout and being hit puts a vehicle travelling at 60mph beyond the light gantry and into the area where the foliage blocks the view.
Late 53 secs cam car hasnt reached stop line approx a couple of yards to go. But at that point the road on right goes out of view, with that in mind assuming coach had entered at that point it could have already travelled 10M at approx 45-50mph, cam car literally dawdling pulling out unaware of surroundings.
@@martinconnelly1473 I'd say the coach driver probably had their foot to the floor on entering the roundabout and thus probably hit it at 100 km/h. That is the speed EU registered coaches are required to have their limiters set to, not sure if the UK has repealed or amended their implementation of that directive in national legislation in which case it would be the same. Like any EU directive it only takes effect when the sovereign legislature of the member state actually makes it law in their jurisdiction and they would need to repeal or amend that to change it as it is their own law at that point.
I’ve approached that very roundabout at 70, the lights stay green late at night, it’s a “shall I chance it?” moment. There’s a slight bend before the lights, so I think at 80mph this is just about possible.
Jesus! I’ve replayed this several times and I’m still convinced it’s a special effect. Where the hell did it come from! ?? Wow. Good to hear all are okay xxx
I have driven HGV's at night for a living and it is a different world especially between 00.00 and 04.00. This is when the rules of the road don't seem to apply in the majority of cases away from the relatively safe motorways. Dual carriageway racing, U turning Taxi's, and red lights don't apply all come out at night.
Given it was a National Express coach, I wonder if it’s worth asking them for their footage for a follow up video? (Also, in the interests of public confidence in their company, it would be good to get an update of what disciplinary measures they took against that driver).
THIS!!
Well, it wasn't the coach driver's fault, so none. 😂🤣😂🤣
@@ZJS0113 How?
@@Maxiligamer he's coming from the cammer's right at a roundabout... 🤣
According to National Express there is no footage...
That bus just spawned in out of nowhere
Not possible.
@@lilybot5842you don’t say mate
That is crazy how fast that coach must have been travelling. I especially love how not only other road users don't stop to check but also the coach driver didn't get out to check if the cammer was ok. Like top job mate, you could have killed someone and you can't even get out to see if the person you crashed into is ok.
the victim has his statement above, and says the coach driver was out and checking on him - but of course, it should be mentioned you are assuming the coach driver wasn't also hurt in the crash.
@@kenbrown2808 the coach driver is the one seen carrying the wheel. Other than being morbidly obese he was fine
@@XaviRonaldo0 yes, but darth just assumed that.
@@XaviRonaldo0 How somebody 'looks' is irrelevant. Don't under estimate the effect of shock, you can easily move a wheel on dazed autopilot trying to help, but not thinking clearly. *And* that was after a period of time when the police had arrived. The coach driver is an involved party, so probably isn't the best to render aid. The shame lies entirely with other drivers who all drove past and didn't offer assistance.
Thanks for explaining and educating here but i doubt this would've ended any different...... that bus driver was going WAY too fast! I do look out for telltale signs like lights and all that at night during the lesser traffic hours but this bus probably would've hit me too..... he was nowhere to be seen.....
Omg!!! I actually had tears in my eyes whilst watching the video. You're right Ash, upsetting images but so pleased by what modern technology can do in certain circumstances. Thanks for sharing.
I'm not sure what was worse, the speed that coach must have been going (like others commenting I was also trying to look out for it approaching) or the fact that loads of people just drove by without helping. I hope both cammer and dog were OK.
On a separate note, congratulations for reaching 100k, you deserve it
Absolutely, unless there were already other vehicles stopped to help. Unless you're a medical professional you're more likely to be a hindrance rather than a help if there are already many people helping.
I'm not going to speculate on this one, but one of the things i've noticed, and which Ashley has covered, is that people seem to think that it's ok to speed onto a roundabout and expect people already on the roundabout to give way just because you entered at high speed at where entering from their right hand side.
As long as entered without impeding any other vehicle, vehicles already on the roundabout have right of way, it doesn't matter if the other vehicle is approaching from the right.
Pretty obvious the roundabout was clear at the drivers point of entry. Clear case of coach speeding. Just very pleased the dog was ok.
It is that, I have priority so I am going to steam in mentality. Coach driver needs some training at the least.
@@davidsomething4867 Except he didn't have priority.
@@CBikeLondon Yes we know that, the previous posters comment was mentioning the fact that plenty of drivers don't seem to realise that, and think they can fly into a roundabout at a million miles an hour, and expect any traffic that has or will enter from their left to stay out their way. They seem to expect said traffic to look half a mile down their approach road and wait even if that traffic would have finished entering the roundabout before they arrive. This type of driving, as well as dangerous negatively affects traffic flow, but those sort of drivers don't think or care.
Congratulations on the 100k
I hope you get an update from the driver on this one at some point because a lot remains unknown..
But that coach must have been going a fair rate.
And the number of cars that seem to ignore the crash is a tad shocking...
Congrats on the 100k. Your videos have improved my driving massively over the last 18 months or so. Thanks
That was scary to hear the obstructed breathing, a clear sign of someone being unconscious. All drivers - not just new ones - should be taught how to maintain an open airway when something like this happens to another motorist. Something so simple could save a life.
For those wanting to know how you maintain a open airway in a unconscious seated person. You gently raise the head from its slumped forward position to a neutral position as if they were looking straight ahead. You continued to hold the head until a emergency worker is prepared to take over or the person comes around. My background is a motorsport marshal.
As an animal nurse I was "Oooh No, thats not good" at the sound of that snore😅 Someone go do something! Get his head up- carefully!
The snoring is terrifying.... Was told by a motorcycle instructor that's a symptom of a traumatic brain injury.
I’m really pleased you and your dog are ok. IMHO of 50 years on 2 and 4 wheels , the coach driver was completely at fault. He was definitely going at a excessive speed on a approach to roundabout and from his lardy seating position he would have had a superior outlook. He definitely would seen the other vehicle on approach and chose not to be cautious! Because the lack of footage and the fact that technically he had right of way precluded appropriate conviction ! The police/cps chose not to because they’re busy collecting fines for misdemeanours and releasing criminals! What really boils my piss is he got let off on what could have been a much more serious situation !
Thank you for your analysis and advice on this. Most of us would of probably been involved in accident like this if we were in this situation but now I have that extra bit of knowledge to prevent it. Thank you, your saving lives.
Just your friendly local road safety engineer here.
That road layout is insane, it invites exactly this sort of straight lining at high speed. The UK desperately needs to adopt Dutch style turbo roundabouts for these huge junctions
This is exactly what I thought, looking on Google Maps the main road, which I believe is a national speed limit, is traffic light controlled while the road that the viewer pulls out of is not. Markings on the road don't match that of a roundabout! I'm sure this is a regular accident spot :(
As a learner driver I DETEST these kinds of roundabouts with a passion. Confusing and I always go the wrong way or in the wrong lane. It's too difficult to follow where I'm supposed to be going unless I learn the junction beforehand. I know of no other type of junction where I need to be familiar with it to navigate it safely. It should be intuitive, but it's not and it's dangerous. Dutch turbo roundabouts all the way!
Congrats on the 100k subscribers!
Wow. That was a shock. I am glad the cammer sounded alright when the police officer was talking to him. I hope both him and his dog are well. The last bit where the wheel of the car was carried over to the side, spoke volumes about the damage the cammers car must have taken.
Knowing this roundabout there are traffic lights on some of this roundabout. That includes the A46 southbound, which is where the coach appears to have come from. I wonder if the coach tried to beat the lights.
The most interesting bit of the video for me was the auto connection with emergency services. my car has this tech it is reassuring to see it in action. Glad that your viewer was not injured.
I hope the driver is ok, I have a Honda Jazz and that also has an emergency call function, although I can also use it manually by pushing a red button near the rearview mirror. I must say though that I disagree with Ashleys assessment that the driver could have done something different...No he couldn't! The roundabout was completely clear when the driver got to the entrance to the roundabout he should then look forward to make sure there are no vehicles entering the roundabout at the same time as him, besides at the speed that asshole coach driver was driving at, there was no chance the car driver could have even reacted, let alone have time to put his foot down, the car to start accelerating away etc. No, the blame lies squarely with the coach driver. Period.
Yeah, I completely agree. Sure, the driver could have kept checking that side, but even if they did spot the coach, there would not have been enough time to avoid the accident. You would barely have time to register the coach coming in, let alone predict where they were headed and brake or speed up...
@@raymondbenjamins5884 you could put your foot down and run away with an automatic transmission, but that's assuming looking right instead of where you're going, which would be ridiculous in this case, I'd never expect someone, nevermind such a large vehicle, to come so fast through there after me entering the roundabout, to catch me while I'm still there...
Fucking scary stuff, but I've seen a lot of no less dangerous things done by drivers already, it's even more scary how much of this is done by so called professional drivers, or at least people who drive a lot.
That’s a very brave thing you’ve done there mate, to admit that you have a Honda Jizz, sorry, Jazz. Not something I would’ve been brave enough to do. Respect.✋🏼
@@qasimmir7117 🤣🤣 it could have been worse, it could have been a Nissan Juke 😉
@@qasimmir7117 thank you I’m glad you acknowledge my bravery!
Congratulations Ashley for 100k subscribers. Keep up the good work of educating drivers 👍
That was quite a scary accident, especially due to the fact that there was absolutely no indication of another vehicle when entering the roundabout.
Also congratulations on 100k subscribers!
That automated service and ringing the emergency services is fantastic! Glad the driver and dog are ok 👍🏻
Where an earth did the coach come from? It was nowhere to be seen from approaching the roundabout to entering the roundabout. Only at the point of impact was it seen. Can’t even see any glow of headlights or anything. Coach driver must of done something wrong somewhere.
Yeah, It's like a ghost
was pretty much looking at that exist wondering if something was there.
Nothing till pretty much horn sounded couple seconds later.
I have driven on this roundabout quite a few times as its very near family. All the roads that join the roundabout apart from the one the cammer joins from are quite fast moving dual carriageways. The road the cammer joins from is also the only one that isn't traffic light controlled. For me, the coach driver has seen the green light on his approach and not slowed down as much as he should, if at all, to take into account he is going over a roundabout. He's probably just treated it as a straight through road. Very dangerous regardless of the checks our cammer was carrying out in my opnion. Scary scary stuff
Shocking that none of the passers-by stopped. I think you would have to have been looking in exactly the right direction at the right time to spot that coach. It was travelling so fast to not be visible on the approach. I wonder if the driver was trying to get home before his clock ran out?
Not surprising, given there was a coach and its passengers behind the camera. You would have thought one of them would have checked on the driver - but the coach driver seems to have told everyone he was okay, when clearly, he wasn't.
I believe this accident was caused by the poor road design. If you look at the junction on Google Maps you see that the approach that the coach took is traffic light controlled , even the picture in the video at 5:40 shows the traffic light gantry and the road markings don't match that of a roundabout. The entry to the junction from Martin Drive is not traffic light controlled. I don't see any speed signs so potentially this is a 70Mph dual carriageway and if the lights were green the coach did nothing wrong. The driver coming out of Martin Drive had an obscured view and I don't believe he was at fault either. I suspect this junction is a regular accident spot.
What a piece of work that bus driver was.
Professional driver and he doesn't immediately get out to check that he hasn't killed that man, who's breathing was clearly heavily obstructed when he was unconscious.
Hey, at least he moved that wheel off the road though. Top job, mate.
also you would assume there’s at least a few passengers on the coach, i think it was national express?
Very unfortunate and bad luck but good to hear they all survived. My speculation is that the coach driver knows the roundabout well and has, as you speculated, straight-lined it. If this is the case, then on approach, he would be concentrating on any possible vehicle coming from his right and ready to brake or accelerate. Unfortunately he would be less prepared for a vehicle entering from the left! The poor car driver was perhaps, in the peace and quiet of the night, a bit lax in his observation and not expecting the unexpected!
Congrats on 100k. Watched this 10 times and cant believe how the bus comes from nowhere. I guess there is an aspect where the bus driver is checking right but going so quickly does not see what's in front. Also by the time car is on roundabout the bus is in the blind spot
Just posted to my Driving School page, a great lesson in how to deal with an empty junction.
As you say - interesting to see/hear how these things work when triggered by the accident. Reassuring that it did get quickly connected through to the police and they were there in only a few minutes (6-7?). The appalling thing, other than the obvious speed of the coach, is he didn't stop! How on earth has he got to his next stop/depot and not had to explain away the damage! One of the coppers appeared to retrieve a wheel - if that was torn from the car, the damage to the coach surely was substantial too.
The coach did stop. The guy retrieving the wheel is wearing a National Express uniform.
@@Meal-deal555 Thanks for the correction. I hadn't noticed that, just assumed (incorrectly) that as it was later than the police arriving it was them.
@@tonypowell2165 Did you not notice the huge white coach didn't go past the car?
@@nickeustace9495 Of course I did, Ashley also mentioned it a number of times. My observations were on the car calling out automatically, which pleases me as I have a similar system on my car and was interested to see how it worked and how the call was dealt with. My confusion of coach driver vs police recovering the wheel was based on the timing between the accident and any action, or movement outside the car, let alone the wheel being recovered. It appeared to be several minutes for the police to be there (which didn't seem bad all things considered) but a few more minutes before the chap with the wheel, who I didn't look at closely enough. What surprised me was why no one seemed to go check on the driver sooner than the police, especially the coach driver. But the driver of the cam car explained that in his response... that it could have been the coach driver thought he'd not survived it!
If you are first on the scene of an accident and an occupant is unconscious, head slumped and may be snoring. There airway is compromised which is really not good. To open and maintain an airway in a unconscious seated person. You gently raise the head from its slumped forward position to a neutral position as if they were looking straight ahead. You continued to hold the head until a emergency worker is prepared to take over or the person comes around. This simple step can save a life. My background is a motorsport marshal.
Motorsport marshal. Dang and Motorsport can be bloody dangerous at that. But it's a great deal more safer then it used to be thankfully.
That coach driver needs sacking
Unless theres some kind of technical malfunction in the vehicle or the traffic lights then yes, we don't need people in charge of a murder bus driving around
And you need coaching.
@@lilybot5842 That doesn't even make sense.
@@OutrageDuck69 nor does ur opinion
Very surprised the driver was not taken to A&E. The one big accident I had, I was taken to hospital because the paramedic thought I might have had a heart attack, I hadn't but was glad to be in hospital when the shock kicked in a little later!
Glad to hear both man and dog are well.
Am no expert Neil but I don't believe the driver of the car could have done much to avoid collision, thanks for videos find them informative, have been driving many years
Including HGV but still learning. Regards Geoff.
Well done for the 100k mate, I've been here since you were on 30 odd - you are still one of my favourite channels.
Learnt a lot and my style of driving is pretty dam John these days
My god, it's like that coach just teleports in! Must have been flooring it, not expecting anybody there at that time.
That technology is deeply impressive.
Good situational awareness is always warranted, our view of the area is very limited by the forward facing camera. With that caveat, it is my impression of the limited information available that there was not much if anything he could have done to mitigate.
I posted this on the blackbeltbarrister channel............I have watched this several times on Ashley's channel & I commented on it then but this coach did come from nowhere & I would hazard a guess that it was doing somewhere between 60 / 70mph when hitting that roundabout with the distance it covered. I have found that stretch of road, it is where the A46 meets the A607 on the Leicester Western Bypass at Syston & I have done an estimated calculation of what I think that coach covered in about a 4 to 5 second timeline. From not seeing that coach at all in the footage it was approx. 151m or 496ft away & you cover 88ft per second at 60mph which is 352ft that gives some indication. That coach was straight lining that roundabout off the A46 onto the A607 & was probably in the second lane of the four & the driver of the car was a very lucky man & the coach driver should be prosecuted !
Congrats on the 100K subscribers 💯
That was absolutely terrifying, but I do think it's the coach driver's fault. Being on the right means you get right of way but you need to give drivers an opportunity to actually see you. None of us, i hope, drive with our eyes glued to the right. You, hopefully glance right, then forward, then right. If the coach driver was going at a sensible speed, at 0:55 when the car driver enters the roundabout, if the coach was entering at the same time, there would be enough time for them to pass each other safely. It's quite a distance between the two exits. Also you don't see the coach headlight beam until the end of 0:55. You only see the coach headlights at 0:56 and then 0:57 is when he crashes into the car. With how fast things are happening, I don't think the coach driver would have been able to stop if someone was coming round the roundabout on their right, therefore he coach speed was not sensible. Sometimes i wonder if coach and lorry drivers think they are immortal with the way they drive their vehicles. Some of you might say it's traffic light regulated, but then ambulances, fire brigade and police cars may jump lights , and had there been an emergency vehicle coming on the right, the coach would have ploughed into them too.
There seriously needs to be a slower speed limit on roundabouts. People can hit them at 50-60 mph and expect to stop when someone pulls out!
Generally speaking most roundabouts do not have a speed limit imposed on them. You do not see speed limits actually on the roundabout. Logically if two 30 mph roads intersect at a roundabout it is reasonable to believe a 30 mph speed limit exists on the four exit roundabout. However if a 30 mph road intersects a national speed limit road at a similar roundabout what would be the speed limit on that? 30 mph 60 mph or 70 mph as the carriageway is now divided. I do not think a speed limit can be legally enforced on most roundabouts other offences may be enforced in my opinion.
@@keith6400 You just put the limit prior to the roundabout entry. At the least drop them down to 40 mph.
You don't need a speed limit for a roundabout, since you have to slow down to be physically able to cross it properly, you cannot expect a driver who is willing to straight line/ cut 3 lanes, to have slowed down just because there was a speed limit sign.
@@jcskyknight2222 Unfortunately, almost 90% of dashcam footage is of someone driving too fast into a roundabout and wondering why someone pulled out on them. It needs to be enforced. 20mph limit for all roundabouts. Put few cameras up and watch accidents plummet.
@@Chrisallengallery The reality is not speed per se it is whether people drive sensibly. There are numerous laws under which a prosecution might be successfully brought against errant drivers on roundabouts. One of the major failings of road safety in the UK is the excessive weight placed on speed almost to the exclusion of all the other causes of accidents. If you listen to Ashley's comments a huge number are on a wide range of poor driving practices.
I drove up to Scotland last summer, passing through East Ayrshire very late, about 10/11pm, on either the A70 or A713, can’t quite remember. I do remember that it wasn’t dual carriageway.
I ended up being followed by a smallish local bus that must have been on it’s last run for home, because it was in a real rush and kept tight up with me even though I was doing the road speed. When we came to a roundabout, it overtook me on the roundabout, and disappeared off into the night over the next few bends.
Night driving certainly can be unpredictable and hazardous.
I've scanned through the comments written by the poor driver and I'm glad to hear they're alright, but as an hgv driver, our big heavy vehicles are speed limited for reasons like this, why aren't coaches limited, why can they barrel along at 70+ mph, when they can and do dwarf other vehicles and can be of similar weights when fully loaded with passengers and luggage 🤔
They are limited to 65 mph (or should be, by law, after 1996, for vehicles first registered after 1987).
The coach, at that time of the morning, almost certainly had no passengers, so it was able to travel faster than if it had been fully laden. Ashley's explanation for the route the coach driver was taking through the roundabout seems the only logical explanation, given the estimated speed of the coach when he hit the car.
Did the maths on what roughly the speed the coach would have been doing.
So just after 0:52, from the time that large gantry on the right-hand side disappears off frame to when the coach hits, it's 3.66 seconds.
The distance to that gantry is 68 meters from the camera vehicle.
For the coach to have hit the car since the gantry went of screen it must have travelled that 68 meters in 3.66 seconds, which equates to the coach doing at least 67.1kmh or 41.6mph.
Obviously the coach isn't visible at the gantry when the camera car, which means it's impossible to tell how far back the coach was from the gantry when it went off screen, so the coach would have had to have been travelling faster.
Even knowing an accident was coming had no clue, that coach was clearly going way to fast entering that round-a-bout, hope you get an update from the driver soon.
Ashley is right, the driver could have possibly made a little more progress once he saw it clear. However, lets just say for arguments sake, that the car driver had broken down at the same spot he was hit, should the coach driver had seen him in good time? The sound of the horn was very late as well. What I believe may have happened is the coach driver could have possibly been distracted by something or nodding off. I find it very strange he never saw the car until the moment of impact. A very strange one is this. No sign of the coach approaching from his lights or anything and 70 mph would be way to excessive to approach the roundabout safely also considering road/weather conditions, wet. Good to see everyone concerned has made recovery.
People need to understand that driving as fast as you can does not equate to good driving. The speed that coach must have been doing to not be able to avoid the car even if the car lane changed without observations is obscene for a roundabout, and the view is clear for the coach from a long way back. It might have been going so fast if it hit the roundabout at 60 or so that it appeared after the cammers observation to change lanes.
Sometimes it takes an accident to change the way you drive. For me it was having a child and being responsible for them. I shudder to think about the way I used to drive and the children and other people I was putting at risk. I just hope that by watching things like this more people change their ways before they get hurt, or hurt someone else
True,the average driver has no skills to drive fast.They are generally taught to pass a simple driving test.
It takes years of gaining knowledge,experience and discipline to be able to drive well at higher speeds.Higher speeds on public roads,means keeping to the speed limits,although driving at below the speed limit,in some situations can be dangerous.
Drivers with these skills are few and far between,unfortunately.
Alway ask yourself,can I stop?
It's not what you can see that kills you it's what you can't see...slow down,was the mantra a police instructor told me,38 years ago!,I am 59 now.
I have applied that rule for all those years. I am still learning.
That may be true, but ironically, had the cammer been driving as fast as he could through this roundabout, this collision wouldn't have happened.
@@nearlyretired7005 No. What I am saying is that "ironically, had the cammer been driving as fast as he could through this roundabout, this collision wouldn't have happened."
@@CristiNeagu
Well,yes I agree you are right!
He would never have been hit by the coach,by the time the coach arrived he would have been gone!
I always expect drivers to be going a bit faster at night but you're still expecting a certain degree of forethought and safety in others driving. This video has definitely been a good reminder about subconscious blind-spots and I'll be making sure to keep eyes on all sides of the road, regardless of others expected speeds
The standard of driving from National Express coach drivers is appalling. Last time I used one he jumped three red lights, these weren’t lights that only just changed but were hard reds. I constantly see them approaching roundabouts far too fast, on many occasions have done emergency stops on roundabouts because they come onto them at full speed as well.
I’ve even had one who kept blocking me from safely overtaking when I was on my motorbike behind them. They seem to employ the worst people.
I drive for a living and regularly see drivers from this coach company speeding excessively. Oldham Rd Manchester is a 30mph speed limit and one of their coaches who overtook me last week must have been doing between 45-50mph. I've thought about this before and wondered if they have some kind of dispensation from adhering to the traffic laws because if I drove like this every day, I'm sure I would have lost my license by now.
Congratulations on the 100k!!
This is absolutely horrifying. The bus just appeared out of nowhere, must have been travelling at a serious rate of knots. That is the epitome of unprofessional.
Some good tips Ashley, normally I treat traffic islands as potential impact traps. Eyes always on a swivel and brain on high alert. More so than normal driving. Roundabouts are oftrn misunderstood and abused. As a 30 plus year driver I still find your videos a great education and reminder. Cheers for the continued education.
The British need speed cameras in sensitive places like that so the reckless bus driver cannot fly through it in the first place. Roundabout should be max 30-40 km/h
We have enough speed cameras thank you.
@@damedusa5107 No we really don't
A bad accident indeed, the sound of his stertorous breathing indicating upper airway obstruction was very worrying. I was relieved to hear that he responded when someone finally got to him to check him out, which showed that he was clearly concussed. Am surprised that he was not kept in hospital overnight for observation, I suspect that A+E did not receive the full story. Should anyone come to someones aid they can give vital information to the ambulance crew when they arrive. You may feel that you don't have much to tell them about what you observed but that bit of information can sometimes make a vital difference to their over all assessment, so don't ever be afraid to approach the crew with your information, they will log it and pass it on to A+E. Good posting Ashley. ( Chuckabutty, retired Paramedic).
CCTV and tachograph, both fitted to coach, will be able to answer a lot of questions.
I timed the footage, if that was the correct speeds, then the bus was going way too fast and was at fault. Yes, the cam probably should have checked more, but honestly, I don't think that would have mattered much considering the speed and non-observation from the bus driver. The cam was in the roundabout first and for quite a bit without any other vehicles, and I calculated that out based on the footage speed to the edge of the screen with angles....so either the bus was going far above the speed limit for that area, or they ignored the car entirely.
I've watched the clip in slow motion many times now and you don't see the headlights or the coach, even when the cammer has crossed the give way line. If the coach driver was alert, he'd have plenty of time to see the car and start braking...but it appears that he didn't do this sufficiently enough so my conclusion here, is that he was half asleep. It'd be interesting to see his tacho records for that moment and see what speed he was doing, whether he had lifted on the approach to the island.
I do hope the cammer is ok and that poor doggie has recovered.
I'd say he was just going so fast he was unable to stop in time, remember those things have quite a long stopping distance, the driver didn't.
Wow that was so scary to see. I hope the driver and his dog are OK. It makes realise no matter what time day or night try and always be on look out. Thanks for sharing Ashley. 😁
Boggles the mind that people just drove past. There's also extremely low chance that the coach was A empty and B had anyone take any meaningful injuries. This means that several people were perfectly able to attend to this individual and their dog but just chose not to. Had he been killed, every person involved and who had chosen to ignore this while not imprisoned or arrested would have been held accountable.
Yh the one thing I was thinking as the the bit of the video with the emergency call occurs was that no one came to check on the driver of the vehicle.... chances of the coach being empty are low, but not impossible, but chances of the coach driver being incapacitated are low but not impossible. Chances of both occuring are...... so low as to not be likely....
EDIT:: at the end you actually see the coach driver clearing the wheel so very much not incapacitated... why the huge delay to check on the other driver? Maybe the realisation they were seriously at fault and would be out of a job hindered their thought process? So yh... not impressed at all with respect to the coach driver's attitude to driving, or other road users -- I use national express a lot around the Leicestershire area so I hope they don't drive for them anymore!!
From my analysis of the footage and map/street view. At approx. 53secs you loose sight of the A46 road and where the bus is coming from, at about 56secs you can clearly see the bus headlights reflecting off the roundabout curbing, and at 57sec collision. Given the point from where the car driver couldn't have see the bus from the right to the collision point is around 4secs, and working a distance via google maps and road view if the bus was just at the 53sec mark, would give around 130yards, giving a speed of the bus around 66 mph average. I would hypothesise that the bus was approaching @70mph, then lifted off and slowed, expecting to straight line the roundabout, probably expected the car driver to have cleared by the time the bus had reached that point, realised too late the car was moving slower than anticipated, breaking and sounding horn and probably hitting the rear of the car at around 40mph.
Poor bloke. Yes there was a bit more that can be done by the cammer, but the "professional" coach driver should not have caused that accident
What? The roundabout was clear, he made sure there are no cars on the roundabout, then looked forward to make sure there were no cars coming on the roundabout. He was fully in the right. The beauty of hindsight!
@@letter1014 yeah, I dont disagree. I was going on Ashley's comments that the 1 thing he could have done is have continuing awareness and maybe accelerating or braking out of the way could have saved an accident / reduced the severity, but like you say.... hindsight
The coach driver hesitated to call the emergency services, and even said, "No need for an ambulance, he is regaining consciousness." ????
Being knocked out is literal brain damage. There is no safe way to be hit in the head to the point of unconsciousness.
I was in an accident, very low-speed, all conscious, I didn't even have pain or bruising from the seatbelt.
An ambulance was still sent out, even though none of us needed a look over.
I wonder if you or the driver could submit a freedom of information notice to the coach company and get the coach dash cam footage. Almost certain it was travelling too quick and trying to straight line the roundabout to save a few seconds travel time
FOI wouldn't apply in this instance, however, I would have expected the police to investigate this more thoroughly, including checking any video footage and tachograph records
@@mickcy9954 Fair enough. I wasn't sure. Glad you have clarified it wouldn't apply.
OMG!! I've watched this video again and again, but I just didn't see the coach approaching at all!! Glad everyone is OK.
And yet there are still some people who think joyriding, reckless driving and speeding is "perfectly fine" if you do it in the early hours because "there's no other traffic on the road".
Yeah, I do like driving during those early hours because of the little traffic, but it can also be extremely scary when you encounter someone who doesn't take proper care because they assume there's nobody around.
Am sure in the video for a split second you can see the coach on the far right beside the trees just as the car was onto the roundabout. Its there but very split second. But yeah the coach driver was entering the roundabout far to fast even though the road was really quiet doesnt mean you can drive like and ass
Totally wrong to call this an "accident" when clearly someone was at fault for this avoidable collision.
well the cam car needs to give way to the right. there is no actual speed limit to joining a roundabout unless road has a speed limit on it so the coach can enter at that speed if it doesnt need to give way to traffic from its right. how many cars that get hit in the rear quarter on a mini roundabout by a car they should of given way too, actually dont get the blame? hardly any. and scale wise, its similar to a mini roundabout crash situation, the size of the roundabout is bigger but the speeds are higher making it similar.
it is an accident, there is blame on both sides, which is why its so important to make sure its clear to go, it can be so straight forward at night just to look and go "its fine" and miss something by assuming its clear.
the coach driver should of entered at a slower speed but the cam car could of slowed down even more to make sure it was clear. the lawyers will see it as the cam car was to give way no matter the speed of the coach so probably blame them mostly for the incident.
For anyone curious, the car seems to be a Ford Fiesta, most modern fords will have this emergency call system.
Also, can someone do some estimating on how fast the coach was going? I know on Google maps you can measure distance so I wonder if you can use that to determine average speed?
My guess would be at least 60MPH
The speed that coach must have been coming onto the roundabout is infuriating.
Ridiculous. People really should stop driving faster at night and assume nobody is around. See it all the damn time and it's drivers like this that cause accidents like this.
Not watched the full video yet, but I hope police saw this footage, they have no business being behind the wheel of such a vehicle.
As an aside, my current vehicle, a 64 reg Ford Focus C Max Grand (then just a year old, with 9K mileage on the clock), was involved in an accident half an hour after I'd picked it up for the first time from the dealers in Burnley. It was in January 2016, the road conditions were poor, there was a combination of ice, sleet on snow on the A56 and M66 roads on my return to Whitefield, near Bury. Coming down the hill near Heap Bridge Bury in the M66, I was only travelling at 50 mph due to the poor conditions, and the unfamiliarity of the new car. in front of me, around 600 to 800 yards away, I could see a silver MPV spinning around in the middle of the motorway, the vehicle driver managed to regain control and drive away. A Citroen Picasso 200 yards of me saw this and braked to avoid a collision, and was promptly rammed by a white Beemer X 5, whose airbags were then deployed. By this time I'd managed to stop and pull over to the hard shoulder, only to be rammed by a silver Merc that braked too hard and due to the camber of the road, it skidded, veered and smashed into the back of my recently acquired car.
I was OK, but the car was off the road for 6 weeks for repairs costing nearly £10K, the Merc driver was found to be at fault for the accident. Also the impact of the accident meant the frame of my driver's seat had been bent and had to be replaced. Since I'd only just purchased the car, I hadn't had time to activate the Ford Sync system, nowadays I have it connected at all times when driving.
While the viewer could have done more, it was obvious from the first time I saw the impact that the coach driver was completely reckless. That roundabout is quite big, so the speed the coach must have been going to cover that distance in such a short time was absurd.
It's for exactly this type of incident that I often feel roundabouts should have a lower speed limit on approach and through the roundabout than the rest of the road they are on. Possibly also various traffic calming measures on the approach such as rumble strips, a gentle S curve or whatever. Leaving it wide open for drivers to negotiate the roundabout governed only by the laws of physics on a 50-70 mph dual carriageway for example, is just asking for trouble and results in the sorts of incidents we see here.
Hard to listen to the poor dog! hope everyone involved was okay!
Breaks my heart when I hear dogs crying.
Bloody hell, modern technology is amazing. Lots of talk of IoT being the devil thanks to privacy concerns. But your car autocalling emergency services if you crash can literally save lives, holy cow