I think you have found a great bike, no matter what. I’m very impressed with your groupset find, and if needed, I shim out band on front derailleurs if I do a bike build with donor bike components. You can aways use a bigger band on for a smaller tubed bike, but it’s hard going the other way😊 on another note, I buy so many second hand bikes from the internet marketplaces, and I have never, not once, screwed with the serial number on any bike. I keep all messages and screen shots of all bikes I purchase, or sell. I also obtain a signed/ give a signed note with owners details and phone number stating the type of bike, colour and price paid for the bike, if I buy second hand at a garage sale/ flea market/ swap meet/ or car boot sale. I find everyone that I’ve dealt with has been more than happy to oblige. If I ended up having a situation where the police stopped me and said I was on a stolen bike they would be free to take it, and I would provide all additional information that I have about the bike ( as stated above) but I feel that that situation would be very unlikely to occur. That would be my actions in that scenario. I act with integrity, and I feel that I wouldn’t ever have a problem that I would feel I’d acted with wrongdoing😊
I really like the detail of your investigation on this one. Since discovering your channel a couple of years ago I’ve begun searching for and working on vintage bikes myself. Your videos are so informative. Thanks for all you do.
I have similar era bike. Mistral with Tange precision tubing. With exactly the same groupset but with integrated levers - shifters and 29.5 mm seatpost (measured). It was with 26-36-46 rings and 28 in the back 7 speed cassette. All Ritchey stuff - seatpost, quill 1-1/8 120mm length (very low and racing position) and handlebar
I have a Team Racing I bought in Moab from a pro racer in 1993. This looks like my frame. Smaller diameter seat tube on mine. Braze on for front derailleur pulley. At some point I cut off all the cable management! Never built it back up as I had planned to. Tange Ultimate Ultralite tubing. Mine was all top of the line Sun tour grease guard XC Pro. Scott suspension fork. No serial number on the frame. Just ‘Pro’ on the rear dropout. Dark purple paint with ‘Scott’ in solid fluorescent orange on the down-tube and ‘Team Racing’ on the top tube in the same orange. Or maybe ‘Scott’ on the top tube. Can’t remember.
This one is still up for debate but I do still think it was a top Scott frame. I do have a 1993 Scott Pro Racing frame tucked away somewhere though 😌 and the XTR group to match.
@@MonkeyShred I read somewhere in another online discussion that the two top frames of the year (1991 or 1992) were the Team Racing and the Pro Racing. The very top Pro had brazing in the rear triangle and the Team was all welding. Mine has brazing holding the rear dropouts to the chainstays and seat(?)stays. The guy I bought it from said it was a racing frame straight from Scott as he was a sponsored rider. He worked at a bike shop when I was there to ride the Slickrock. The dropouts had 'A Pro' on them. No evidence of a serial number anywhere under factory paint. Graphics definitely said Team Racing though.
If you Google 1991 Scott team racing, there is a nice example on retro bike. Its black, and the owner says he hs had it from new and that the original richy stem weld snapped.
"Ground off serial numbers" -- what could that be? :-) I have a mint 2001 Scott Purgatory -- not a high spec model, but rides really nicely. It was a gift from my parents in the UK, but seconds after getting it I left for France then Australia, so it stayed in as-new condition for 4 years, then I had it sent with other items to Australia, and it hasn't seen a rain day in the 16 years since! I put a rigid fork on it, replaced the grips, and put some decent Shimano V Brakes on it, other than that it is all original and gleaming. It's set up for rides with the family on commuter tyres. ... only mention it as it also has all 3 cables over the top tube, which I think is a really nice feature, a bit like riding a guitar!
I was just about to say are you sure its not a Marin because they did the same colour scheme back then. But then I saw that picture of the Scott at the end lol ....good luck pal and I can't Waite to see the finished product 👍
Old video, but the Scott Racing models didn't have braze-ons for mudguards on the rear dropouts (or the forks), so I think this is not a Racing, although the cable routing and the rear cable stop looks correct.
Rather than going at it with sanding paper and sanding disc, why didn't you try paint remover? If there had been any numbers left, you might have been able to make them out. Otherwise, I agree with the others, it was probably a stolen bike at one time and that's why the respray, etc.
Going by our chats and comparing with my Team Racing 1993, I do think it's a merge of a few different bikes. The forks definitely match mine, but the frame is different, and I think the group was added later. Still a class bike though! Respray it and speak to Gil at Retro decals and it'll look the part.
They must have changed things round each year, and different from the catalogue you have (for some reason). The top tube guides are what threw me looking at the catalogue but the 92 Team Racing I've linked looks exactly the same as this. Weird.
wonder if it's hiding decals underneath? Not sure if they painted logos or stickered but I'd get some acetone, a heat gun and a plastic paint scrapper to get to the original paint somehow.
The ground serial number screams stolen! Maybe stolen and recovered? Either way I wouldn’t worry too much about it. Try this to reveal the serial number, depending on how much metal was removed, polish the place where the number should be with fine wet and dry sand paper then with a brush wipe on some battery acid, it might just show up the stamping. It’s worth a go. But be very careful with the acid!!! Don’t get it on your skin and neutralise it when your done with water.
I, too, found this interesting and about the missing serial numbers, another possibility could be that whoever doctored this bike bought it used at a flea market or a thrift store, and without truly knowing the provenance, might've figured better to remove them than ever be caught with a 'stolen' bike. Just a thought, not knowing one way or the other, but there are so many bikes out there and bikes can easily have a sketchy history.
Robb Chastain I buy so many second hand bikes from the internet marketplaces, and I have never, not once, screwed with the serial number on any bike. I keep all messages and screen shots of all bikes I purchase, or sell. I also obtain a signed/ give a signed note with owners details and phone number stating the type of bike, colour and price paid for the bike, if I buy second hand at a garage sale/ flea market/ swap meet/ or car boot sale. I find everyone that I’ve dealt with has been more than happy to oblige. If I ended up having a situation where the police stopped me and said I was on a stolen bike they would be free to take it, and I would provide all additional information that I have about the bike ( as stated above) but I feel that that situation would be very unlikely to occur. That would be my actions in that scenario. I act with integrity, and I feel that I wouldn’t ever have a problem that I would feel I’d acted with wrongdoing😊
I would say that if u hit out bottom fork bearing cup, as it looks like it was on when it was painted, original colour should be under it. Also i think numbers were ground of and it was repainted and restickered as it was stolen and sold on....
Really hard to know for sure but likely stolen, serial ground and repainted. Components can’t tell you much as they can be swapped out, upgraded downgraded over the years. You can ping the tubing to hear if it’s butted.. my 94 Kona Kilauea has an obvious sound difference as you approach the center of the tubes where they get thinner, I believe it was triple butted. The fluorescent fork is probably the best lead.. I had a Scott with one many years back but don’t recall the model.
@ 01:05 - I suggest if you're looking at fluoro colours that you take both oldshovel's (at 3:10 of his video) and my word for it that spray.bike's fluoro offerings are *_very_* grainy indeed. I can well believe he used 4 cans/coats of clear (and no small amount of sanding) to get the glossy finish he was looking for. Which is fine if you're sponsored by them, but £40 for clear coat alone is insane. Their matte colours are OK, though. For reference, I went with a neon yellow and matte black scheme, with one coat of clear. It came out alright to begin with but very quickly attracted marks/dirt. One year on it looks horrendous. I can send you pics then and now, if you like. But honestly, for the nigh-on £80 it will cost you in cans (not to mention the effort), I advise you to get it done professionally instead. It's not me dissing the company; I genuinely hope they improve. But as it stands the neon product isn't _right_ yet. Just a heads-up.
Thanks for the advice! Maybe I'll have to try my sweet talking skills on them ha! Sanding a grainy bike can't be too much hassle though ;) I messed up on a whole car and had to sand that back haha. No but seriously, it is a lot of cost so I appreciate the advice and experience with that paint. Halfords fluro pink is quite powdery too if I remember. I have a can spare so I'll give that a try and see what result I can get.
Yes, I have the other Team Racing that Mark had mentioned. I resprayed it with spray.bike and the fluro yellow is a bit grainy/powdery - but the colour is great!
No worries, and yes, if I was in your position with subs/view-count I would _definitely_ contact them about sponsoring a project. I'd be very surprised if they said 'No'. Overall, I think the spray.bike concept is cool and it's a nice DIY project to encourage people to try, at least once - just stick to the mattes and get a minimum 2 cans of clear :-p
I'm tipping it's a 1959 original model Barbie Doll, and he's just checking for serial numbers before giving it a clean, having her powder coated, and seeking out genuine accessories. Just a hunch.
Just spread the frame back out thats just from the wrong hub spacing most common mistake that bends the frame the bottom of the dropout is probably gonna need to be bent back after you straighten out the frame its a scott you should restore it just off that basis they werent made of recycling yet
If you look at this post it will show the team racing had a 30.2 seat post and a 26.8? Unless it was renamed out due to stuck post? Looks like a restoration my friend 😉 www.retrobike.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=333301
MonkeyShred - I actually have a soft spot for Scott having had my Scott San Diego hybrid stolen in the nineties. I still to this day keep my eye out for it and woe betide the man in the saddle if that day comes.
FYI, this is a link to the 92 Scott Team Racing that I believe the bike to be: www.retrobike.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=272277&p=3032847#p3032847
MonkeyShred...it’s totally the ‘92
Definite possibility.. especially with that fork. Nice find regardless.
I think you have found a great bike, no matter what. I’m very impressed with your groupset find, and if needed, I shim out band on front derailleurs if I do a bike build with donor bike components. You can aways use a bigger band on for a smaller tubed bike, but it’s hard going the other way😊 on another note, I buy so many second hand bikes from the internet marketplaces, and I have never, not once, screwed with the serial number on any bike. I keep all messages and screen shots of all bikes I purchase, or sell. I also obtain a signed/ give a signed note with owners details and phone number stating the type of bike, colour and price paid for the bike, if I buy second hand at a garage sale/ flea market/ swap meet/ or car boot sale. I find everyone that I’ve dealt with has been more than happy to oblige. If I ended up having a situation where the police stopped me and said I was on a stolen bike they would be free to take it, and I would provide all additional information that I have about the bike ( as stated above) but I feel that that situation would be very unlikely to occur. That would be my actions in that scenario. I act with integrity, and I feel that I wouldn’t ever have a problem that I would feel I’d acted with wrongdoing😊
Fun bit of research on this one... I look forward to the end result.
I might have to save the fluro fade for another bike IF this is a Team Racing
I really like the detail of your investigation on this one. Since discovering your channel a couple of years ago I’ve begun searching for and working on vintage bikes myself. Your videos are so informative. Thanks for all you do.
It's a bloody awesome channel with criminally low followers. Tell your friends :-)
Bike was stolen, had the serial number ground off, some parts swapped and been repainted to conceal it?
It appears that way doesn't it. :(
Hopefully it's was just loved and resprayed
Well it’s a 50/50 a bike thief wouldn’t go out and buy decals but then again we’ll never know 🤷🏽♂️
@@Cycleinc could have been just damaged paint (especially the BB from the grinding) when it was resold, with the new owner dolling it up again.
could have been sanded off during prep for repaint but unknowing PO as well.
I have similar era bike. Mistral with Tange precision tubing. With exactly the same groupset but with integrated levers - shifters and 29.5 mm seatpost (measured). It was with 26-36-46 rings and 28 in the back 7 speed cassette. All Ritchey stuff - seatpost, quill 1-1/8 120mm length (very low and racing position) and handlebar
I have a Team Racing I bought in Moab from a pro racer in 1993. This looks like my frame. Smaller diameter seat tube on mine. Braze on for front derailleur pulley. At some point I cut off all the cable management! Never built it back up as I had planned to. Tange Ultimate Ultralite tubing. Mine was all top of the line Sun tour grease guard XC Pro. Scott suspension fork. No serial number on the frame. Just ‘Pro’ on the rear dropout. Dark purple paint with ‘Scott’ in solid fluorescent orange on the down-tube and ‘Team Racing’ on the top tube in the same orange. Or maybe ‘Scott’ on the top tube. Can’t remember.
This one is still up for debate but I do still think it was a top Scott frame. I do have a 1993 Scott Pro Racing frame tucked away somewhere though 😌 and the XTR group to match.
@@MonkeyShred I read somewhere in another online discussion that the two top frames of the year (1991 or 1992) were the Team Racing and the Pro Racing. The very top Pro had brazing in the rear triangle and the Team was all welding. Mine has brazing holding the rear dropouts to the chainstays and seat(?)stays. The guy I bought it from said it was a racing frame straight from Scott as he was a sponsored rider. He worked at a bike shop when I was there to ride the Slickrock. The dropouts had 'A Pro' on them. No evidence of a serial number anywhere under factory paint. Graphics definitely said Team Racing though.
@@f1flick www.ebay.co.uk/itm/234969940068 I’ve been watching this bike for months and I’ve just realised it’s the one you are talking about ✌️
If you Google 1991 Scott team racing, there is a nice example on retro bike.
Its black, and the owner says he hs had it from new and that the original richy stem weld snapped.
I've just seen that thanks. Slightly different colour scheme in 1991 mind.
"Ground off serial numbers" -- what could that be? :-)
I have a mint 2001 Scott Purgatory -- not a high spec model, but rides really nicely. It was a gift from my parents in the UK, but seconds after getting it I left for France then Australia, so it stayed in as-new condition for 4 years, then I had it sent with other items to Australia, and it hasn't seen a rain day in the 16 years since! I put a rigid fork on it, replaced the grips, and put some decent Shimano V Brakes on it, other than that it is all original and gleaming. It's set up for rides with the family on commuter tyres. ... only mention it as it also has all 3 cables over the top tube, which I think is a really nice feature, a bit like riding a guitar!
Thumbs up for the guitar! :)
I got two bikes that have a black primer/basecoat under the topcoat. Also both have metallic colors. Just throwing my few cents in the mix.
great scott!
I was just about to say are you sure its not a Marin because they did the same colour scheme back then.
But then I saw that picture of the Scott at the end lol ....good luck pal and I can't Waite to see the finished product 👍
So much bodge by the previous owner. Looks like it was stolen. Nevertheless, an interesting find.
I had a Scott back in the late 90s. All the welding brassed
Brassed?
Really enjoying the sleuthing you did in this vid. Sounds like you've got a stolen bike that had some bodge repairs done.
Old video, but the Scott Racing models didn't have braze-ons for mudguards on the rear dropouts (or the forks), so I think this is not a Racing, although the cable routing and the rear cable stop looks correct.
Rather than going at it with sanding paper and sanding disc, why didn't you try paint remover? If there had been any numbers left, you might have been able to make them out. Otherwise, I agree with the others, it was probably a stolen bike at one time and that's why the respray, etc.
Oh that flap disc had basically no sanding capability left on it. Sparks would have flown otherwise. Those numbers were long gone :(
Going by our chats and comparing with my Team Racing 1993, I do think it's a merge of a few different bikes. The forks definitely match mine, but the frame is different, and I think the group was added later. Still a class bike though! Respray it and speak to Gil at Retro decals and it'll look the part.
They must have changed things round each year, and different from the catalogue you have (for some reason). The top tube guides are what threw me looking at the catalogue but the 92 Team Racing I've linked looks exactly the same as this. Weird.
Yeah, I've seen that with other manufacturers too. Tricky to narrow down to a single year as they can change through the year.
wonder if it's hiding decals underneath? Not sure if they painted logos or stickered but I'd get some acetone, a heat gun and a plastic paint scrapper to get to the original paint somehow.
Brilliant channel mate.how would i go about finding out what exact model my old carrera mountain bike is.?
If its got shimano parts, use the date code to get a rough date and then look through brochures. Most can be found online. 👍
The ground serial number screams stolen! Maybe stolen and recovered? Either way I wouldn’t worry too much about it. Try this to reveal the serial number, depending on how much metal was removed, polish the place where the number should be with fine wet and dry sand paper then with a brush wipe on some battery acid, it might just show up the stamping. It’s worth a go. But be very careful with the acid!!! Don’t get it on your skin and neutralise it when your done with water.
I, too, found this interesting and about the missing serial numbers, another possibility could be that whoever doctored this bike bought it used at a flea market or a thrift store, and without truly knowing the provenance, might've figured better to remove them than ever be caught with a 'stolen' bike. Just a thought, not knowing one way or the other, but there are so many bikes out there and bikes can easily have a sketchy history.
Robb Chastain I buy so many second hand bikes from the internet marketplaces, and I have never, not once, screwed with the serial number on any bike. I keep all messages and screen shots of all bikes I purchase, or sell. I also obtain a signed/ give a signed note with owners details and phone number stating the type of bike, colour and price paid for the bike, if I buy second hand at a garage sale/ flea market/ swap meet/ or car boot sale. I find everyone that I’ve dealt with has been more than happy to oblige. If I ended up having a situation where the police stopped me and said I was on a stolen bike they would be free to take it, and I would provide all additional information that I have about the bike ( as stated above) but I feel that that situation would be very unlikely to occur. That would be my actions in that scenario. I act with integrity, and I feel that I wouldn’t ever have a problem that I would feel I’d acted with wrongdoing😊
No idea but looks nice looking bike
I think the Scott Boulder had that cable routing.
Doubt they were that oversize 30.0mm seatpost though
What size is the original rear spacing?
130mm would be around 1987 after which it went to 135
135 spacing
Mate do u sell your bikes when your done restoring them id really like to own one i live in the uk
I do. I've already answered you twice with that question.
Looks like the seat tube is ovalised at the bottom ? I think this is s tange ultimate (?) Thing ?
I would say that if u hit out bottom fork bearing cup, as it looks like it was on when it was painted, original colour should be under it. Also i think numbers were ground of and it was repainted and restickered as it was stolen and sold on....
Seems to be the general thoughts of everyone. Stolen, ground off and repainted.
Seems like you're going to have to very carefully sand the top layer of paint away if you want any confirmation as to what it is.
I can give it a go. There may be some remnants of the original decals.
Really hard to know for sure but likely stolen, serial ground and repainted. Components can’t tell you much as they can be swapped out, upgraded downgraded over the years. You can ping the tubing to hear if it’s butted.. my 94 Kona Kilauea has an obvious sound difference as you approach the center of the tubes where they get thinner, I believe it was triple butted. The fluorescent fork is probably the best lead.. I had a Scott with one many years back but don’t recall the model.
The tubing definitely "sounds" thin whenever I tap it... if that even makes sense. I'll see if I can tell a difference further along the tubes.
@ 01:05 - I suggest if you're looking at fluoro colours that you take both oldshovel's (at 3:10 of his video) and my word for it that spray.bike's fluoro offerings are *_very_* grainy indeed. I can well believe he used 4 cans/coats of clear (and no small amount of sanding) to get the glossy finish he was looking for. Which is fine if you're sponsored by them, but £40 for clear coat alone is insane. Their matte colours are OK, though.
For reference, I went with a neon yellow and matte black scheme, with one coat of clear. It came out alright to begin with but very quickly attracted marks/dirt. One year on it looks horrendous. I can send you pics then and now, if you like.
But honestly, for the nigh-on £80 it will cost you in cans (not to mention the effort), I advise you to get it done professionally instead. It's not me dissing the company; I genuinely hope they improve. But as it stands the neon product isn't _right_ yet. Just a heads-up.
Thanks for the advice! Maybe I'll have to try my sweet talking skills on them ha! Sanding a grainy bike can't be too much hassle though ;) I messed up on a whole car and had to sand that back haha. No but seriously, it is a lot of cost so I appreciate the advice and experience with that paint. Halfords fluro pink is quite powdery too if I remember. I have a can spare so I'll give that a try and see what result I can get.
I've just done a bike with spray.bike (not fluoro). The paint is formulated to be matte and that's how I've left it. Very pleased with the results.
Yes, I have the other Team Racing that Mark had mentioned. I resprayed it with spray.bike and the fluro yellow is a bit grainy/powdery - but the colour is great!
No worries, and yes, if I was in your position with subs/view-count I would _definitely_ contact them about sponsoring a project. I'd be very surprised if they said 'No'.
Overall, I think the spray.bike concept is cool and it's a nice DIY project to encourage people to try, at least once - just stick to the mattes and get a minimum 2 cans of clear :-p
Yep, if I had my time over it'd be mattes only. If you get a chance and/or remember let us know how the paintjob holds up over time.
The seat tube is externally butted.
Ah is that the technical name for it? Cheers.
On your workbench at 17:30 is that a naked Barbie doll in a plastic bag ? What's going on ?
I'm tipping it's a 1959 original model Barbie Doll, and he's just checking for serial numbers before giving it a clean, having her powder coated, and seeking out genuine accessories. Just a hunch.
@@StoccTube but where's ken ? Out on his MTB on Cannock Chase ?
I don't know how you're seeing a Barbie in that haha. Sorry to disappoint. It's just mess!
klein used to use spinner tfo forks.
So what you're saying is it's basically a Klein? Sweet, get the fluro out and sell it for 4 figures ;)
@@MonkeyShred pretty much :D
here's a link to a post about seat post size on those: www.retrobike.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=333301
Just spread the frame back out thats just from the wrong hub spacing most common mistake that bends the frame the bottom of the dropout is probably gonna need to be bent back after you straighten out the frame its a scott you should restore it just off that basis they werent made of recycling yet
If you look at this post it will show the team racing had a 30.2 seat post and a 26.8? Unless it was renamed out due to stuck post? Looks like a restoration my friend 😉
www.retrobike.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=333301
anybody else cringe at 11.27 when he cuts the grip towards his wrist
Don't worry. I have a spare.
Stolen bike.
99% likely. Why else would you grind off the serial numbers :(
MonkeyShred ...Certainly not to reduce weight.
I would agree with this theory based on the frame serial number being ground out.
MonkeyShred - I actually have a soft spot for Scott having had my Scott San Diego hybrid stolen in the nineties. I still to this day keep my eye out for it and woe betide the man in the saddle if that day comes.