I honestly think Parry characters, when balanced properly, are incredibly important additions to the roster. They force opponents to play honest and commit to the fundamental tool of all fighting games: the read. Too many players rise through the ranks without ever properly learning how to read their opponents, and so they get hard stuck in "good but not great" tiers until they either learn what they've been missing or drop out. Enter the Parry Character, your number one coach in learning how to read enemies and recognize patterns.
I think kind of ironically, they wind up having an inverse effect, where to play the parry character youre riding the struggle bus. And while they are difficult to fight and bemoaned by mid-level players, once you get to high tier where youre fighting an actually good player and the parrying strategy and mindgame is truly in play, it becomes very blatant how weak parry is as a wincon and youre really proving your worth if youre still playing them at the highest level.
@@DarumaFGC Well yeah, but it's also a learning opportunity. *In order* to get out of the tiers where counter-offense is king, you need to learn how to have a balanced offense. Learning how to play a parry character means learning how to beat a parry character, and in seeing the flaw in the technique you see the truth of the game.
As an Strive Anji player, I can attest to that I find Sol and Ramlethal some of the easiest characters to parry. They have so strong normals, they just _can't_ keep themselves from pressing dem buttons.
Parry is a lot like grappler. The pressure of the option is what gives them power. This is also exactly why they are great characters for funny videos.
Parry is kinda like grappler but defensive, either way the idea is the same: if you guess right once, often times the enemy's mental stability is instantly crumbled
@@DarumaFGC Now imagine a character that is 100% parry archetype, as in built entirely around parrying and moves that synergise with it towards punishing bad calls. I can think of some really trollish combinations such as; projectile reflecting block, projectile destroying projectiles, riposting regular attacks(as in swiftly chaining from parrying into a regular attack), a damage reversal super(for turning an opponent's high damage attacks back on them), block punishing grab(to prevent the opponent from waiting out the timer) and high damage( but set up dependent) ex attacks(to further punish mistakes) in the same character.
Regarding the ego thing about parrying - honestly yeah lol I initially picked up Hakumen because I love masked characters, I ended up staying with him because the frustrated noises that came from my friends whenever I hit a parry lit neurons in my brain.
"Parries are about Ego" you're absolutely right. Parries are my favorite kind of move, I'm an Anji main and catching something with spin into a 50% combo makes me feel like the coolest person alive. It's an ego boost, not to mention Parry Super, that shit makes my day. I also do love winning on many different interactions
I didnt realise until making this video just how bizarre anjis parry super really is. While it might seem like demanding a lot, id really like for it to vaccuum. I had many instances recording this where someone would fall out mid super, hit the parry with a jump in then fly over my head, etc. But i love parry supers. Jin astral in blazblue is one of my favourite moves to land ever, since it is quite literally an instant kill parry
Imma say, I am a Ky main, and I LOVE fighting against anji actually because it is also satisfying to deny you your parry with a grab or then backdash with a longer reaching move.
Can't discuss parry characters without talking about the godfather of parry characters: Geese Howard There is truly nothing like hitting a parry with geese and hearing him yell "PREDICTABOL" That does so much mental damage to people that it can make them second guess their options
He has a great parry, but i would consider him a boss character, for reasons ill get more into in a video about that archetype. But in shorthand, hes built to punish the mechanics of kof. Like you might be used to shorthopping over a power wave but that will make you eat a double reppuken, etc, etc. Hes built from the ground up to counter the universal systems in SNK games.
Definitely one of mine favorite archetypes in this video. I don't know if it is a to much unknown archetype, but what about the Set Play characters? I always get kind confused about that one since is not a archetype that you can say: Hey! This character is a full Set Play character
For larger archetypes, i plan on giving them an "arc" for these videos, originally it was going to be a month but, these are surprisingly difficult to put out with that level of regularity. But archetypes like rushdown, grappler, shoto, zoner and setplay characters will all be broken down into multiple smaller archetypes that come under their umbrella. Since we have characters like ACR testament, Rev2 Jack-O & strive millia all being setplay characters who use completely different kinds of setplay, jack-o is a summoner, Testament lays down traps that linger on screen until theyre interacted with, while millia just has a disk that stays on you while you wake up. So setplay will get covered, it will just be broken up into multiple archetypes and not just a singular one, since a lot of these characters technically do setplay but play completely differently
@@DarumaFGC Got it! This makes a lot of more sense that it can be broken down in more multiple archetypes. In theory mine archetype in fighting games is this one, but even so, it just end up been a coincidence with mine characters, normaly what happens is that I just pick a character that I find interesting, and it end up been a kinda of a set play character, at least is what people tell me they are. In my case, I use characters like: Kazuya(Tekken 7); Kotal Kahn(MK11); Rainbow Mika(SFV); Marisa(SF6); Witch this last one I see the set play in the corner, where she wins the game, but still been at the same time the Bully archetype that you already covered, definitely you're right on get a time on this archetype LOL. Anyways, congrats for the videos. I really like the series
@@henriner well, o know that a lot of competitive players talk about that "archetype", lord knight is one of those. But it seems that leaves to me is wait for the video here talking about that
Welcome to archetype aechive, we have Midrange: "i have a big stick and i'm gonna use it" Bully: "NO" Brawler: "this is a single player beat em up game now and you are the NPC" Item throw: "after 1000 rolls i finally got the item that will guarantee i lose this round... Yeahhh!!!" Boxer: "king in the ring, dies in the sky" Parry: "UNO reverse card"
Anji player here, I appreciate the accurate breakdown of Anji's spin as his true mixup (as opposed to Fuujin) and the idea of ego dictating how parry players operate. Personally, I enjoy Anji's spin incorporating situational awareness into how it functions; you have that second of a successful dodge to assess the gamestate and what kind of attack hit you. A close heavy attack? A cS into 5H, probably. A crouching attack? You get a cS into 2H confirm on all but a handful of obscure moves. A light? You'll have to settle for a throw. A projectile? The game doesn't freeze like when you dodge a strike, but you can try to buffer in a cheeky parry or low-profile move if you think your opponent is going to aggress. I love how Anji's playstyle in Strive exemplifies him as a trickster, the type of flashy character who commits to unnecessary flourishes to his own detriment but definitely knows more than he shows.
I think letting you skip fujin into the follow ups was a huge deal for anji, and finally made him feel like a comlplete character since now he has some of the most ridiculously specific scenarios you can set up by like canceling a spin into the jumping projectile or even spinning through a gunflame quite late and getting to jump in on sol with the K follow up, theres a lot more intrigue to him now where much was missing before.
Muse Dash as the example rhythm game? Dare I say, based? Also excellent analysis across the board, especially the psychological elements at play. We can always use more people that actually know how to express complex concepts effectively.
Its my goal to provide universally agreeable, sharp definitions for words the FGC often throws out meaninglessly like "brawler" or to provide some kind of clear archetype that links characters across games when they dont currently have one they're agreed upon being called. Hopefully it leads to more productive discussions, better knowledge bases for these concepts as a whole, and my main hope is that eventually it all adds up to making the space a lot easier for beginners to hop into.
Ah "BlazBlue Central Fiction" is a game that is arguably just as complex as "Guilty Gear XRD Revelator," with the game like Revelator having legacy skill, meaning if you haven't stuck with the game since the original back in 2008 you have a MASSIVE hill to climb in learning frame data for each character's normals, gatlings, and overall mobility options that can be used on offense and neutral. Then there are the game's plentiful system mechanics, such as having a half a dozen options on defense that you need to master such as having four ways to block based on specific scenarios for example, and the game having a multitude of wake up options with each having a specific use, and that's not even going into the Drive mechanic, which is a unique action for each character, which there are OVER 35 of, which MOST of the cast plays VASTLY DIFFERENT from each other. Mainline BlazBlue games were HUGE in japan, with it being popular in many Japanese arcades, and as Majin Obama stated in a podcast with Blasted Salami that the series had at one point been up there even with the almighty Tekken in terms of popularity. With many veterans like Dogura ( who is one of the best players in Guilty Gear who uses Slayer) and Fenrich ( who is arguably the best BB player, and currently one the best in DBFZ) representing the series for a long time . Sadly, The series just never took off over here in the west. However, the lack of popularity nationwide doesn't equate to the game's quality.The fact that is arguably the most unique AND complex 2D fighter on the market, but isn't talked about hardly at all in the west was always baffling to me. Especially when I read comments, and watch videos of people in the FGC complaining about how boring fighting games have gotten recently, or how easy it has become and yet will REFUSE to give the game a try. Thankfully, that seems to be changing, for instance Lord Knight, a tournament player who plays a variety of different fighting games recently made a fighting game tier list and put "BlazBlue Central Fiction" near the top, as well as popular Guilty Gear content creators like Majin Obama saying on blasted salami's podcast that "BlazBlue Central Fiction" is HARDER than Guilty Gear Xrd. Even Punk, argueably the best Street Fighter 5 player says BlazBlue is one of his favorite fighting game series. For those who want to see high level game play in order to get a grasp of how hype this game can potentially be for you, I'd recommend a video titled "BlazBlue: Chrono Phantasma Grand Finals - Evo 2014" on youtube, and while the game represented there is not Central Fiction, I think it works, since Central Fiction is more of an evolution of Chrono Phantasma any way. Other channel's include "Burst Recap" and "Jourdal" for more high level Japanese play. Finally, BB TAG and mainline BlazBlue games are two SEPARATE things all together, with BBTAG having it's own set of rules with the system mechanics, and SIMPLIFYING ALL of the characters. It's for these reasons that you can't approach "BlazBlue Central Fiction" in the same way that you would BBTAG. Glad to see a another youtuber give the game some recognition. Even if it is in a broader context.
Id like to at some point give the game its dues, but with the franchise being dead in the water and my fairly low subcount, any spotlight i put on it now, is just a revenue loss for me. But in my opinion its easily the fighting game with the most depth, i dont think rev2 is even close. And its likely still my favourite too, although kofxv and sf6 are hot on its heels lately.
Still upset they gutted Baiken's parry in strive. Xrd was my entry into the series and Baiken was the perfect character for me. Cool combos, great lines, extremely satisfying parry, execution, great theme and design - she had everything,
Sorry for the wait! News cycle will be dry and besides some match coverage I don't think there's any news I'd like to cover that could come from Evo, so we have another block of around 3-4+ archetype archives before some other video I wanna make grabs my attention
@@DarumaFGC PRAISE BE!!!!! i love these archetype archives they make me rethink not only characters i enjoy but also might enjoy and ones i design as well
My favorite parry character is asuka... Because everyone ALWAYS miss time their attacks since her parry has a huge varying active time... Sometimes i hold it for a sec then i suddenly counterhit them... Other times i just let the whole parry rip, then they attack into it, giving me free damage.
She's really unique, I hope when she's revealed for Tekken 8 they round her out a bit more, cause she's always super popular with fans but rarely sees competitive results of any note
@@DarumaFGC She was already revealed on Tekken 8 and She was playable on the cnt, i played her and She Is a blast, ngl her kit Is even more Easy to use and strong now
While not really an archetype, since most characters with heals play completely differently, heals will absolutely get a move type archive. Since the strategy behind them is very interesting
I love the Parry character, and while I'm no good at them my second favorite is Grapplers. Nothing feels as good as seeing a player who is CLEARLY better than you know they STILL have to respect the options you have when employed correctly. Hakumen might be my favorite fighting game character of all time now, just because of the moments someone didn't respect my wake-up yukikaze when I'm on the magic pixel
Its so sad to see blazblue quietly die off when quite likely the next mainline installment wouldve been bonkers, fingers crossed the next title mori is working on gets half as storied a history.
I love characters with parries, so much that I enjoy playing Remy with his crappy parry and feel like a god when I do pull off the full thing. I also would say that parry characters aren't actually about ego but getting rid of my own ego and focusing on the opponent instead. I noticed that, once I have some experience, when I look at the opponent on the screen instead of myself, I can play better than normal. And parry characters kinda require that you read what the opponent does and not yourself.
4:15 As an Anji player, that's me. I like to play long sets, I'm talking 20+ games. I enjoy slowly conditioning my opponent, playing on deeper levels of yomi. I've seen a few players mindbreak and flail near the end of a set, clearly frustrated that they got hit by roundstart grab.
They can be up there, though because of the sheer raw number of steps you can be playing ahead of your opponent, certain kinds of zoner or "speed" character would place higher on my list for biggest brain characters
I really hope we'll see a puppet character episode some day, i say that as a puppet char player, but im sure a lot of people would appreciate shedding some light on this otherwise obscure archetype Ps. I appreciate the use of Risk Of Rain
Haha, spotting risk of rain 1 music of your own accord is crazy. Respect. Puppet characters will actually be getting an "arc" for archetype archive. Since the strategy behind a puppet that is disjointed, and one that isnt, is totally different, same for ones that can be hit and ones that cant. But absolutely, theyre underconsidered, underrepresented, and underappreciated. So theyll get lots of TLC from me.
Dont worry, your prayers are heard, its still a bit aways though! New videos releasing on both saturday and monday! It looks like after theyre released i might be doing episode 1 of ability archive before Archetype Archive continues, so stay tuned for that!
Whenever there’s a parry character in a game I main them, I love the archetype and wish it was a universal archetype. Even if I’m loosing my mind on a 10 game loose streak, and ponder changing mains, my fun for the game is shot through the roof if I land a counter. Like it’s the embodiment of the highest highs and lowest lows. If you can’t make a read, then you’re about to hate the next few minutes, but if you can get reads and counters then you’ll have more fun you’ve ever had in fighting games.
Its a very very interactive winstate. Which is fun since interaction is really the best part of fighting games. During season 2 im gonna cover some of the non interactive archetypes. Which, kinda annoyingly, are extremely strong. Look forward to it!
I don't understand how JP's parry/counter defines his neutral and offense? I don't think I've ever seen a good JP player use it in neutral or during their own offense. Only when he's in defensive situations.
To be effective, even though his win condition is zoning, he does need to close the gap from time to time, whether that is just for mindgames sake or to get the payout of his 2 bar super, but after a failed portal jump mix, post-knockdown, or in his corner pressure, his blockstrings are really short and difficult to enforce. He wouldnt be scary to deal with in the corner if he didnt have it, but having it is crucial. As for in pure neutral, probably the single most common use for his parry, is to punish a jump in from someone who has jumped over a feinted attack. Or its also not unusual to see EX parry beat out a throw attempt too. Parrys really important or he just falls apart. Even if its obviously not as common as his ground spikes or even his command grab
It's sad that Baiken became a character with a parry in Strive,from being a parry character in older Guilty Gear. She became a typical rushdown character in strive, from a unique defensive character in past games. Going from ac+r Anji to what we get in Strive is a disappointment. Anji went from "attack is the best defense" with his auto parries in ac+r, to "u w u pleae don't prc my spin" in Strive. And thats only about their parry mechanics,don't let me get into how Strive gutted and butchered ac+r Anji's other special moves 😂.
Because of the specific way guard point works in both guilty gear and blazblue, it left ACR anji as much more of a true mixup character than just a parry character, since not only is his butterfly significantly more potent but he creates a ton of true 50/50's with guard point, which he got rinsed of in strive to become a parry character, similarly with baiken, whos best remnant of her old get off me tools, is her tatami mat maybe being better than ever, and i do like her new tether mechanic, i think its a really smart tradeoff for such potent oki to give the opponent higher reward than you if they guess right out of your setplay. But i would agree, she is absolutely now a "character with a parry" and not a parry character. Given how weak this wincon is, and simultaneously how sparse these characters actually are, i had it in my head most fighting games have parry characters before making this, then while gathering footage, felt extremely limited by what I could and couldnt show. I would really like to see some of the modern fighting games give out stronger, more interesting parry characters with unique systems. Cause for as popular as these guys are, tournament results as them are pretty rare and you dont find too many of them (besides rev2 baiken in particular) recieving mass complaints from the community for their power level.
parry isn't an archetype bro. anji is a rushdown, jiren is defensive, hakumen is mid-ranged footsies, and baiken is literally a rat. none of them have the same archetype, but they all have parries. it's just a move dude, not an archetype hell, they aren't even similar moves. anji uses his parries to get in, jiren uses them to punish bad neutral, hakumen uses them for meter, and baiken uses them to weasel her way out of any danger. how can people sharing a simple idea of a move, using completely different moves with different applications and different play styles be in the same archetype?
When i make these videos or when i look at characters, as im sure youll agree, i start from the idea that characters are all designed with some kind of pointed vision with how they should play. This can go even as far as affecting the inputs they have to use, like charge inputs and full wheels. And i look at characters on the basis of what they look like if you imagine all of their moves used at once in every scenario, which ones are designed to be more omnipresent, how they function, and if theres a clear overall picture their moves paint. This is why i delineated at the start that theres a clear difference between a parry character, and a character with a parry. For some characters. Their ability to eat through your offense is used to reset fullscreen or to give them something instead of a reversal for wakeup scenarios, its a part of their defensive strategy. They then become a parry character when its the core of their offense. Anji just doesnt emulate the nigh endless pressure of a rushdown character because even if the opponent makes no guesses, your pressure ends extremely quickly, its not gapless at all nor is it relentless, he gets pushed back very quickly and reset to neutral and has to take a severe gamble to reclose that gap, compared to someone like chip, jam, giovanna, valkenhayn, etc, he looks nothing like them in practice or in theory. Same sort of thing goes for baiken. Leroy and hakumen (i would agree jiren is just built to be defensive, but thats because hes designed to be like himself in the anime, hes not designed as a fighting game character first, and has a very low cohesion kit that doesnt really work as a result, nor is it part of an "archetype" cause you couldnt point to someone that plays like him) Even though these characters have aspects of midrange, they cant live and breathe it the same way an actual midranger does, mostly because they are really, really bad at forcing you to approach, they have no ranged options and have to play aggressively to make up for it, and their offense is either given to them by landing a parry during the opponents offense, or by enforcing fake pressure due to the fact that if the opponent tries to mash out of the gaps in their strings, they can eat a parry instead, which creates respect and forces them to hold the pressure. (P.s. not mentioned in the video, but guard point is the same thing as a parry as far as logistics go, you have to call out a specific high/low option and are rewarded by eating through your opponents offense, which deepens both XRD anji and baikens parry character status) That is just my reasoning behind my decisions. While there are still interesting things to argue, like while baiken isnt able to force an approach, her runaway is fantastic, and she can technically just use her guard cancels to weasel out of pressure, instead of run her own, these scenarios are in my opinion, matchup specific, plus, even if i was to say that makes her not a parry character, i dont think a rat is an archetype, since youd be fair strained to point me to other characters who have such a unique mechanic as her just freely escaping pressure if its not specifically formed to be anti-baiken pressure. So it would just leave her as a unique character, and one not placed in an archetype, which i wouldnt really say is true since while the minutiae can be very intricate and theres a lot of depth to fighting her, i dont think anything i said strategy wise in this video, doesnt apply to playing as her, or against her, i would say it still holds true. Thanks for the comment and its fine if you still disagree with me on this, i think its insightful even if it winds up with neither person changing their minds to have these discussions and it gives me insight into how i should treat certain topics in future videos about archetypes. If youd like to know more about my decision making i have a "what is an archetype" video that goes over all my decision making in broad strokes, but i thought it would be good to respond to this comment in particular going into my thoughts on the specific examples you used. Since it seemed you had a lot of thoughts on this matter.
I’ve never used Hakumen’s counter for meter, it’s really to get a free combo or just push the enemy away with 6D. Even then I’ll just 214A to get close or 214D to start a combo (if I already have enough meter). Though I should probably try using it for meter I probably won’t cuz dmg sounds better.
One of if not my favorite version of a parry character is sir nighteye from my hero ones justice 2. His main gimmic is his counter which when triggered does a little damage but specifically triggeres his quirk. His quirk allows him to “predict” every attack the opponent does which shows their input before it happens. It gives him a snowball type play style where if you keep countering you’ll just keep winning but also let’s you play in insanely weird ways
I really appreciate bandai trying new things with their copy paste arena fighter games, although i distinctly remember really enjoying the 2d equivalent of the ninja storm games on psp, and honestly wouldnt mind at all if they tried a few more of those, to make a game a little bit more truly competitive.
go ahead, guess if my A17 is gonna use bubble or overhead, i dare you, mash after my blockstring is over, itd make my day (yes i know he is a rekka character but shhhhhh)
atleast in dbfz, parries and grapples are at their most dangerous after the blockstring, either you got your ass yoinked or they got you in another blockstring cause you got scared
I purposefully play anji like I am on loads of crack It works like a charm because people never know what 300 IQ play (read: crazy ass uncalculated) appraoch I am gonna do next time, and I can always say that it was all planned if it works Yeah, I did just combo my hit cS into my parry super and wasted 50 meter but by god if you aren't in their head after doing that nothing will get in their head
Just sayin as a hukamen main. that shit is not balanced man even at low levels if you even know how to partly time your parries well the enemy is fucked. especially if you fight a mixup and do parry the moment you get back up. ( aslong they don't nice the pattern ) expecially when you realise HE HAS A PARRY that instakills, a parry moves him forward a lil too far for some people, a Super parry that hits like a truck, and not only that he has obscene meter game.
Id like to do a vid on tekkens weird relationship to archetypes sometime, i like that most characters have 1 aspect to them that completely eclipses the rest of the cast, and then the rest of their tools are roughly the same as anyone else, but most people dont really look at the game that way, since it manages to feel mostly balanced regardless
I love belligerent bully characters and dominating parry characters, and one day they made a beautiful baby named Geese Howard. I am also one hundred percent fueled by ego and only gel with a character when I can absolutely dunk on somebody by reading a move they were going to throw out sometime next week. something something predictable
You might like boss characters as an archetype, and not purely these specific playstyles. I'll go into it in more detail in a video specifically about them, but boss characters generally have some in-built counters to the game-in-question's system mechanics, so theres some boss characters who are zoners because of a system mechanic like assault in under-night. Where Hilda and Vatista have zoning options that specifically aim at the angle assault sends you forward and make it impossible to rely on the games system mechanics like vorpal since you can be punished for charging that too. Which is why things like Geese's double reppuken exist, to prevent short hopping over and forcing you to hard dedicate to a hyper hop, which geese can promptly punish severely. Which is really similar to why Omega Rugal has so many zoning and parry options too.
@@DarumaFGC Honestly, you're probably right. My favorite characters ever are Gargos from KI, Sephiroth in Ultimate, and the Brolies in Fighterz. Shout-outs also go to 3S makoto and Strive Leo, but that's just because there's something so hilarious about using gorilla powers that bypass whatever the heck my opponent is actually trying to accomplish. Question then is I guess what makes the difference between a "gorilla" and a "boss" 🤔
@@FomiteGaming if it does continue to be relevant ill maybe make a video purely about the term "gorilla" but in my archetype archive for the brawler i discuss it in a good amount of detail, gorilla isnt an archetype and instead a derogatory term for a specific playstyle where youre almost permanently in active frames for one move or another. I discuss how to play like that and how to do that well in that video, but also show examples of characters like Sol being played extremely disciplined with moves only being used with a purpose behind them. And discuss a bit the strengths and weaknesses of both.
@@DarumaFGC I completely forgot you mentioned it in the brawler video, that's my bad lol Maybe you could mention how certain archetypes could be seen as "gorilla" in one form or another, especially when in boss characters for example their buttons can seem very scary and very oppressive. If you think you gave enough attention to the idea of gorilla stereotyping I wouldn't worry about it though, you're already putting in a ton of work
@@FomiteGaming im always listening to my fans at the end of the day and any and all feedback, suggestions, requests and queries are all considered and come into what i choose to do with the channel and how i choose to do it, so even if it wont be immediately apparent, your input lets me know where to put further emphasis on topics, what is worthy of a video, have i underexplained something, etc. At the end of the day all of you guys in my comments have a lot of sway over how this stuff comes out.
I really like the big loud parries in sfv that try and emulate the 3S sound effect, that ryu and gill have, but they dont wind up being parry characters so i didnt include any of that stuff in
Ill go into it more in another video, but i consider geese a boss character, and not a parry character. Hes designed from the ground up to play anti-SNK, and the parry is just part of that. Same goes for characters like goenitz and rugal, all people designed to eat quarters rather than be part of a fighting game archetype. Hope you look forward to the geese coverage.
Hm, would you consider characters with emphasized armor as parry characters? Midori in Fantasy Strike has a strong parry: if hit during the active frames, no damage, throws out a fast attack, usually punishing whatever hit. On that punish hitting, he gets a buff: he will automatically do a special throw if in range of the opponent. His super art has 0 startup and transforms him into a Dragon who has moves with infinite super armor. So a common strategy with full meter is to read an attack (eg, predict oki when waking up), reversal transform to Dragon, reversal from that to start a long range command grab with infinite super armor.. his overall gameplan depends on hitting you when you think you're hitting him. So I think he's a parry character as opposed to say, "an install character" or "snowball", curious what others think
I mostly move armored moves into the bully category, characters whose gameplan specifically is to say "no" to the opponents gameplan. With a whole kit of anti-whatever moves, be it anti-fireball, anti--low, anti-air. etc. More on that idea in the bully video to explain my thesis.
I love Geese and other characters with great Powerful feeling parries none of this SF parries give me those SNK giga flip parries. Also you never mentioned Geese man's literally got 4 fucking
One of my favourite parries ever is SFV Ryu's VT2, amazing animation, very satisfying wallbounce and it confirms into either a cool DP or critical art, but being a V trigger parry, it's basically useless, since people aren't going to take risks when you have 20 seconds where you can parry them for 50%. I also love Jins Astral super in Blazblue, parrying anything into a literal instant kill is unbelievable. But I'd agree, SNK overall do them best for both practicality and impact. Not to mention geeses parry in Tekken too
I really really like Answers dumb parry equivalents in XRD rev 2, and hope to see him return but simplified to some degree in strive. I think the lame thing about both kohaku and answer is how situational their moves are, and seeing them work more universally would be very, very cool
As for the "ego", this applies to all players who like to win by dominating. Why does no one say that perry is the same as dp, blitz shield or any other reversal. And a good opponent, who knows the matchup, will not let you parry yourself just like that, in short, that's all bullshit.
I did say its a weak win condition, theres definitely discussion to be had on why a DP is a very strong move to have, but a parry is relatively weak, not least of which being that DP is a true reversal and beats throws, while the vast majority of the time, parries are specifically designed to be weak to throws. But yes, ego, pattern recognition and mind game are all inextricably linked to fighting games and are all massively important to even landing a parry in the first place, i dont really see a way you could argue around that.
Asuka is too, but while leroy could play without it, i think the intense strength of his parries are inextricable as to his strength competitively, theyre a real core to why hes strong at high level, and largely because they let him play against characters like geese and akuma where others cant
Unfortunately Jiren is so lamely designed (both visually and mechanically) as well as the fact he was strongest due to glitched interactions, that eventually got patched out, he didnt really make the cut.
It ties his kit together but you often go full sets without seeing it land, it's not as imperative as I'd like for it to be to definitively say he's a parry character, even though it's visibly important
Wish i could fit everyone! Maybe someday ill have a team for editing so putting in more characters and games will be way easier, but currently thats just in my dreams for now.
Parry = defensive state that neutralizes damage or creates an advantageous situation for the defender Counter = Special state or stance that causes an attack when interacted with What attack comes out when you parry in SF3 or 6? What attack comes out when you use Baiken's 'parry'? Yall fucking up the terminology.
The deliniation just isn't useful here, counter is specifically a term used for when you hit someone throughout the duration of a move, and there's a whole other archetype specifically based on that, including characters like Chun Li, Shaheen, Johnny, etc. And while some of the characters in this video don't immediately damage the opponent when their parry is landed, like Anji, or Baiken, other ones do, does that really change their archetype or the name of the archetype? It's just confusing to name these guys counter characters instead of parry characters. It conveys the idea significantly cleaner.
@@DarumaFGC what you’re talking about is a counter hit. And I 100% don’t agree with you purely because I know the difference and the terms have clear distinctions. If you don’t want to go by that, that’s fine. But in terms of what the word parry means versus counter, you’re wrong and this video is wrong. It’ll just perpetuate the wrong term and there is nothing I can do about it except stand on the technical distinction.
I feel like your ego definition is a bit broad, especially for category 3. Can you explain how liking more interactions in a fight is an ego-driven style in a way that doesn't also make literally all other styles also ego-driven? I don't disagree fundamentally and types 1 and 2 I think you're right stem from ego more directly
There's a smugness to it, picking a 5-touch character in a 3-touch game, is just saying "I'm better than you" to your opponent. Albeit, this is something that only comes into play at a very high level, where damage is actually optimal. But it does mean you have faith in your ability to guess correctly MUCH more times than your opponent, plus when you factor in the actual method by which you win as a parry character, which is dedicating to hard reads, it's a concoction that adds up to it.
@@DarumaFGC Ah right, there's the variable I was missing. I was imagining it mutual, that you by virtue of how your character works can TURN a 3-touch game into a 5-touch game for both sides (maybe they just can't get in well enough to do optimal combos or you have unique but limited combo breaking options), which would then not be ego-driven. But it's haughty to believe you can 5-touch 3-touchers consistently yeah, that's ego play.
I was playing strive and then I fought against a Baiken that parried me to death in a round, but with the knowledge that he would try to parry I proceeded to play a little slower so the parry timing was off and I got the combo consistently.
@DarumaFGC long story short, the whole thing is about building up a strong striker player in soccer. And the guy heading the Blue Lock project that the story is about believes the key to that is a strong... well, ego. The kind of person who would rather get a hat trick and score tons of points himself, even if team play is the supposed 'better' strategy
Ill go into him in depth in the boss character video, because i think rather than to play a straightforward "will he/wont he parry" game, he instead is designed from the ground up to play anti-SNK, the parry is part of that but much like other SNK bosses he has extremely strong projectiles that you cant short hop forward through, forcing you to hard dedicate, and then he can just blow you up with anti air etc. While hes been toned down in playable appearances (somewhat) hes literally just designed to eat your money, and id say the same of bison, shao khan, etc. Ill go into it deeper in the boss character video though, which should be soonish if these comments are implying a demand for geese
As a Strive Anji player, I'm glad that he's getting a bit of a spotlight here. That said, I really feel like his AC+R form is much more indicative of a Parry playstyle, as his Guard Points are a lot more engaging than just Anji's spin in Strive. Anji could throw moves with guard points and practically have a dance between them and the opponent, where if the opponent tries to step out of the gap that Anji makes he can keep going and punish the opponent for doing so. It sounds more like an armor character, but I still find it to fit a bit closer to a Parry Character. To me, Anji in Strive feels more just like a bluffing character, that is to start with safe strings and build up a lot of RISC and meter, then to open them up once the opponent is paralyzed into blocking. Spin is a supplement for Anji to further call out an opponent, either after conditioning them to get impatient and throw something out or just in general as a means to dissuade approaches. It's complicated, but I like what your video covers here.
I try my best to make my videos both as broad and as relevant as I can, so I try and cover their major presence in modern games, particularly iconic characters, or in ACR/XRD Baikens case, exceptions to the rule or outsider examples of the playstyle. And I try only take one character from each game, so the footage doesn't wind up too repetitive, so for me it wound up being more pressing to cover Baiken. But I do agree with all you've said, but while guard point is functionally identical to a parry, it would've been a lot of work to include a section fully explaining guard point and showing it off fully too.
I fucking love parry character. Anji, Hakumen, Kasumi Todoh, Geese Howard (he technically counts as a chameleon but I play him as a parry character) etc etc etc I love them all. So fucking fun
You ask about archetypes to focus on, so I actually have one I never see mentioned, save to denigrate a certain playstyle as "turtling", and that's the defensive character. Often charge characters (thanks to stand-outs like Guile), but the characters that focus heavily on defense and punishing pokes and whiffs as their primary form of dealing damage. Usually come with short but hard hitting combos and better than average reach with quick start-ups (but usually longer than average recoveries), this is an archetype that seems to be disappearing from fighting games, save for a few hold-outs... much to my annoyance, or finding their kits retooled to make them more offensive (see: Blanka). I'd really like to see this one addressed in some way.
I think turtling is more of a playstyle than a toolkit, it was realised after very early competitive history of sf2 that guiles turtling was degenerately strong at a competitive level, so a lot of the balance was pushed away from him PURELY relying on flash kick and booms, and he's been forced to play much more aggressively ever since. Turtling is still something to mix in mid round and use and consider as part of your toolkit, and not only as a charge character but sometimes as shotos and all sorts, but for sure I'll discuss charge characters sometime soon. They're very interesting because they're so strong defensively and have to turn that defense into offence
Ayy yall, if you're new to fighting games, or on that sf6 grind, don't click off this shit. This man has some sauce that is fighting game universal, he is speaking HIGH KEY facts.
In the old guilty gears, catch just referred to eating literally anything with active frames, so in effect it's a parry, as is guard point on someone like XX Anji or KOF Maxima, since you dedicate to blocking a high or low move and attack by blocking that attack, the effect is the same even if the methods different.
I think that there are 2 things in this video: counter and parry characters. To me a counter is kinda automatic, your opponent tries to hit you you get a counter that triggers automatically. A parry is find it similar to a dodge in the sense that your opponents is left wide open for an attack but your are free to choose what to with that opening. Coming from DBFZ Videl has a dodge that can make enemies whiff and you can get a medium starter combo. But also you’ve got Jiren that has 2 counters, 1 for hits only, and the other for any attack and then trigger a certain counterattack kinda immediately. Idk what to do with this info but while being similar I think that they also can work separately. Or not, with UI Goku having a dodge that transports him next to the opponent but also a lvl1 counter that ALSO transports him next to the opponent but this one actually has a automatic attack attached to it when triggered
At the end of the day it winds up the same in affect, and a lot of these characters have both, so its not really worth subdividing the archetype. Its more just the case that you have more options to use a dodge against than you do an out and out parry
I don't think being able to parry deserves its own category. I feel that characters that can parry have tools that better describe their playstyle EDIT: After watching the video, the only characters I can truly put in this category are hakumen and xx baiken. Baiken past xx becomes less reliant of the parry mechanic and the parry on anji's spin does so little for him as a character that I only ever see spin as movement. I have neither utilized it or seen it utilized as a significant part of his game plan outside of low elo knowledge checkers
I go over this better in my facilitation video "what is an archetype" where i define how these decisions are made, but i think theres a fine, but very sharp and obvious line between characters who have a parry purely for defence, and ones who need their parry for their offense, without their parries these characters become extremely incomplete and somewhat unplayable, its important enough it defines them.
my favorite parry character is and forever will be hakumen it feels so good to land and since it's on one button and I don't have to react super quick if I get it it feels pretty effective even though I can't convert it at my level
Id probably use the term snowball character, but these will definitely appear soon. They were actually on this weeks poll, but lost to the trap character. The strategy behind them is extremely interesting.
Its pretty complicated and i could do a video just on XX and XRD baiken, but yeah she can do that off any block, but if she does it to a jab or something its unsafe.
Its a weird one, because it absolutely has a skill bell curve. Meaning that it gets really really good in silver/gold ranks, and then when you get to diamond/platinum ranks, it immediately has an extremely harsh fall off in viability. Since players in the top 10% are much much better at both the mindgame and the actual mechanical gameplan of their character.
Yeah man, asuka jun and my girl baiken be the funniest characters i've played, the sheer joy of UNO REVERSE an easy read, it got to a point where when i play them against my Friends and i do a parry we all go "OOOOHHLEEH" during the animation 😂
@@DarumaFGC as a coffee addict my self, azucena gonna replace lucky Chloe as my new mainalonf asuka and Lili, ready to piss other people off with all those parry
Thanks for the video!!! Loved it!! My best friend is bringing Injustice 2 to my house today and i'm gonna try Black Canary and her super fun parrys today, i'll have the advice of this video in mind hahaha
Hope it helps somewhat! This was a lot more based in general strategy and theory than the other AA episodes thus far, so its a bit of a departure and experiment vs the rest of my content, but im glad its been well recieved thus far!
Hakumen’s like a mix of a brawler, midranger and parry character. When you have meter he plays like a brawler where you use his A and B normals, as well as 214A and 623A to keep your pressure going or just to get in. Most of the game you’ll use his normals like 4C, j.C keep space and gain meter as well as beat zoners. Then his counters tie it all together by disrupting the enemies offense and preventing the enemy from playing aggressive. Maybe more of just a footsies character than a midranger but I play him like one depending on the opponent.
Hes already very good and obviously very unique and tied together, so im not suggesting any changes, but because of how slow the meter gain is and the fact that while you do have to play very defensively at the start of each round, hes defined by just how slow his meter regenerates, and that would prevent me placing him in another archetype. Since to play him at a high level and prevent the opponent running all over you, you have to be willing to throw out quarter circle A and D often when 1/2 bars of meter is all youve got. In that way, while spacing is very important, i wouldnt really consider him a footsies character since someone like chun li is actually the winning party in the situation when shes shimmying back and forth, while hakumens shimmying is when hes on the backfoot, and hes on the defensive to buy time
I play Sol in ACPR but I want to learn Baiken and yes you are absolutely correct, getting to say "No you dont" is very satisfying to me. Some random thoughts on shotos relevant to the series as a whole that you have definitely already considered but I am typing anyway. Having a fireball, dragon punch and move that brings you up and forward doesn't really say anything about what the character actually Does, does it? You could fit those three moves into the toolkit of any archetype and they would still be that archetype and a shoto. Mostly just a thought I had. Also Terry, Rock, Sol and Ragna are Terrys. They are similar to but distinct from shotos. This is one of the sillier hills I will die on.
I will not remove you from your silly hill, even though ive already named these dudes as brawlers in my brawler video, but youre free to have your own name and call them terrys if you wish. But yes i have my own (already EXTREMELY controversial, if comments are anything to go by) thoughts on shotos, and the awful, terrible, very bad term "anime shoto" and i have come to the conclusion that to be a shoto, you not only need a DP, a fireball, and a COUNTER-PROJECTILE tatsu (sorry ken), but you need to wholly rely on these moves and have little to nothing else going on. Because i think the defining trait of the shoto, and one i think Ryu would agree with me on, is honesty. I think shoto not only should be, but has to be the only fighting game archetype where honesty must be inherent, because the instant you start adding mixups and such, it becomes really difficult to convincingly point to someone and say "he plays like ryu" and they becomes a character that shoto players dont want to play, and that shoto-counter strategy doesnt apply to. Honesty in this case is referring to the idea that DP, Tatsu, and Projectile are all clear, single-purpose moves, that have incredibly obvious and simple use cases. Ill go into this further in a very large video all about these characters, and actually splitting some famous examples of these in twain, and akuma will be getting his own archetype he shares with some probably unexpected characters. So stay tuned for all that jazz and be sure to read the comments on that one, youll see people atop many silly hills there too i assure you.
@@DarumaFGC It's more that I think that a grounded fireball, some sort DP, rushpunch, flipkick and jumping punch is something different than what shotos are even if they are of course overlapping. Anyway I think defining the shoto by those three moves and honesty is interesting even if I am not sure I agree with you. I think I am sticking with that the term "shoto" mostly just describes what their moves are but not what they do. I think "This is a shoto who is a zoner" which gives you both an idea of their special moves and their playstyle is more useful than splitting hairs on what is and is not a shoto. The Honest Character is definitely an archetype though, but you can have honest characters that are shotos and honest characters that are not shotos.
Hakumen to me is like one of the all time best designed fighting game kits. His damage might be on the extreme side but for the game that blazblue is he plays a shockingly honest and fair game, you tend to come out feeling like the more technically skilled player in a match, rather than say a more mind game focused character where you feel a different sort of satisfaction since you succesfully confused the life out of your opponent
Nearly everyone in plus r is a super experimental and weird version of an pre existing archetype or at the time, a brand new one. Id like to do videos on the design of the game someday because how much certain things like sol having sidewinder and such fundamentally change his character is really really interesting and yet discussion on it is little to none.
I honestly think Parry characters, when balanced properly, are incredibly important additions to the roster. They force opponents to play honest and commit to the fundamental tool of all fighting games: the read. Too many players rise through the ranks without ever properly learning how to read their opponents, and so they get hard stuck in "good but not great" tiers until they either learn what they've been missing or drop out. Enter the Parry Character, your number one coach in learning how to read enemies and recognize patterns.
I think kind of ironically, they wind up having an inverse effect, where to play the parry character youre riding the struggle bus. And while they are difficult to fight and bemoaned by mid-level players, once you get to high tier where youre fighting an actually good player and the parrying strategy and mindgame is truly in play, it becomes very blatant how weak parry is as a wincon and youre really proving your worth if youre still playing them at the highest level.
@@DarumaFGC Well yeah, but it's also a learning opportunity. *In order* to get out of the tiers where counter-offense is king, you need to learn how to have a balanced offense. Learning how to play a parry character means learning how to beat a parry character, and in seeing the flaw in the technique you see the truth of the game.
@@Narokkuraithe way this is worded is some true sensei type wisdom fr
As an Strive Anji player, I can attest to that I find Sol and Ramlethal some of the easiest characters to parry. They have so strong normals, they just _can't_ keep themselves from pressing dem buttons.
Forget it, I'm gonna destroy all Izanamis, Carls, Reliuss, Hakumens, Nines, and other Susano'os.
- A Susano'o Berserk player
Parry is a lot like grappler. The pressure of the option is what gives them power. This is also exactly why they are great characters for funny videos.
And also why even when they make a correct hard read, they can be bemoaned as paint drinking crayon eating morons
Parry is kinda like grappler but defensive, either way the idea is the same: if you guess right once, often times the enemy's mental stability is instantly crumbled
@@DarumaFGC Now imagine a character that is 100% parry archetype, as in built entirely around parrying and moves that synergise with it towards punishing bad calls. I can think of some really trollish combinations such as; projectile reflecting block, projectile destroying projectiles, riposting regular attacks(as in swiftly chaining from parrying into a regular attack), a damage reversal super(for turning an opponent's high damage attacks back on them), block punishing grab(to prevent the opponent from waiting out the timer) and high damage( but set up dependent) ex attacks(to further punish mistakes) in the same character.
I think part of why I love playing these guys is because it's just so damn satisfying to punish your opponent for being greedy with a hard-read.
They really do feel right at home amidst the fgc mental chess match going on. Hard reads are unbelievably hype and satisfying
Regarding the ego thing about parrying - honestly yeah lol
I initially picked up Hakumen because I love masked characters, I ended up staying with him because the frustrated noises that came from my friends whenever I hit a parry lit neurons in my brain.
It is crazy how good any single parry feels to pull off
That feeling with Hakumen when you get a good read, pop overdrive and delete over 80% of their hp.....simply sublime.
"Parries are about Ego" you're absolutely right. Parries are my favorite kind of move, I'm an Anji main and catching something with spin into a 50% combo makes me feel like the coolest person alive. It's an ego boost, not to mention Parry Super, that shit makes my day. I also do love winning on many different interactions
I didnt realise until making this video just how bizarre anjis parry super really is. While it might seem like demanding a lot, id really like for it to vaccuum. I had many instances recording this where someone would fall out mid super, hit the parry with a jump in then fly over my head, etc. But i love parry supers. Jin astral in blazblue is one of my favourite moves to land ever, since it is quite literally an instant kill parry
@@DarumaFGC totally agree, his super needs some quality of life fixes considering how it already requires a read. Nice series btw! Big fan
@@kaleidoslug7777 cheers man, ill keep making them till you guys stop watching them, so hope they keep being as interesting 🍻
My favorite thing is partying people's reversal in the middle of my own pressure
Imma say, I am a Ky main, and I LOVE fighting against anji actually because it is also satisfying to deny you your parry with a grab or then backdash with a longer reaching move.
Can't discuss parry characters without talking about the godfather of parry characters: Geese Howard
There is truly nothing like hitting a parry with geese and hearing him yell "PREDICTABOL"
That does so much mental damage to people that it can make them second guess their options
He has a great parry, but i would consider him a boss character, for reasons ill get more into in a video about that archetype. But in shorthand, hes built to punish the mechanics of kof. Like you might be used to shorthopping over a power wave but that will make you eat a double reppuken, etc, etc. Hes built from the ground up to counter the universal systems in SNK games.
Definitely one of mine favorite archetypes in this video. I don't know if it is a to much unknown archetype, but what about the Set Play characters? I always get kind confused about that one since is not a archetype that you can say: Hey! This character is a full Set Play character
For larger archetypes, i plan on giving them an "arc" for these videos, originally it was going to be a month but, these are surprisingly difficult to put out with that level of regularity. But archetypes like rushdown, grappler, shoto, zoner and setplay characters will all be broken down into multiple smaller archetypes that come under their umbrella. Since we have characters like ACR testament, Rev2 Jack-O & strive millia all being setplay characters who use completely different kinds of setplay, jack-o is a summoner, Testament lays down traps that linger on screen until theyre interacted with, while millia just has a disk that stays on you while you wake up. So setplay will get covered, it will just be broken up into multiple archetypes and not just a singular one, since a lot of these characters technically do setplay but play completely differently
@@DarumaFGC Got it! This makes a lot of more sense that it can be broken down in more multiple archetypes. In theory mine archetype in fighting games is this one, but even so, it just end up been a coincidence with mine characters, normaly what happens is that I just pick a character that I find interesting, and it end up been a kinda of a set play character, at least is what people tell me they are. In my case, I use characters like: Kazuya(Tekken 7); Kotal Kahn(MK11); Rainbow Mika(SFV); Marisa(SF6); Witch this last one I see the set play in the corner, where she wins the game, but still been at the same time the Bully archetype that you already covered, definitely you're right on get a time on this archetype LOL. Anyways, congrats for the videos. I really like the series
set play is a thing characters do, but it's not an archetype
@@blastfgc2570i'm pretty sure none of those are setplay characters bro
@@henriner well, o know that a lot of competitive players talk about that "archetype", lord knight is one of those. But it seems that leaves to me is wait for the video here talking about that
Welcome to archetype aechive, we have
Midrange: "i have a big stick and i'm gonna use it"
Bully: "NO"
Brawler: "this is a single player beat em up game now and you are the NPC"
Item throw: "after 1000 rolls i finally got the item that will guarantee i lose this round... Yeahhh!!!"
Boxer: "king in the ring, dies in the sky"
Parry: "UNO reverse card"
Very good summary of the videos thus far!
Bully:"I heard you were having fun, stop that"
Trapper: “You know that part of the stage? It’s mine now! There’s no escape!”
One Shot: *(anime protagonist comeback)*
Demon: GET BACK ON THE FLOOR!
Thanks to Geese Howard, I love Parrys.
“PREDICTABO!!”
That man is a menace
Anji player here, I appreciate the accurate breakdown of Anji's spin as his true mixup (as opposed to Fuujin) and the idea of ego dictating how parry players operate. Personally, I enjoy Anji's spin incorporating situational awareness into how it functions; you have that second of a successful dodge to assess the gamestate and what kind of attack hit you. A close heavy attack? A cS into 5H, probably. A crouching attack? You get a cS into 2H confirm on all but a handful of obscure moves. A light? You'll have to settle for a throw. A projectile? The game doesn't freeze like when you dodge a strike, but you can try to buffer in a cheeky parry or low-profile move if you think your opponent is going to aggress. I love how Anji's playstyle in Strive exemplifies him as a trickster, the type of flashy character who commits to unnecessary flourishes to his own detriment but definitely knows more than he shows.
I think letting you skip fujin into the follow ups was a huge deal for anji, and finally made him feel like a comlplete character since now he has some of the most ridiculously specific scenarios you can set up by like canceling a spin into the jumping projectile or even spinning through a gunflame quite late and getting to jump in on sol with the K follow up, theres a lot more intrigue to him now where much was missing before.
nothing beats the massive psychological damage you inflict when you parry their wakeup DP twice in a row
Muse Dash as the example rhythm game? Dare I say, based? Also excellent analysis across the board, especially the psychological elements at play. We can always use more people that actually know how to express complex concepts effectively.
Its my goal to provide universally agreeable, sharp definitions for words the FGC often throws out meaninglessly like "brawler" or to provide some kind of clear archetype that links characters across games when they dont currently have one they're agreed upon being called. Hopefully it leads to more productive discussions, better knowledge bases for these concepts as a whole, and my main hope is that eventually it all adds up to making the space a lot easier for beginners to hop into.
Ah "BlazBlue Central Fiction" is a game that is arguably just as complex as "Guilty Gear XRD Revelator," with the game like Revelator having legacy skill, meaning if you haven't stuck with the game since the original back in 2008 you have a MASSIVE hill to climb in learning frame data for each character's normals, gatlings, and overall mobility options that can be used on offense and neutral. Then there are the game's plentiful system mechanics, such as having a half a dozen options on defense that you need to master such as having four ways to block based on specific scenarios for example, and the game having a multitude of wake up options with each having a specific use, and that's not even going into the Drive mechanic, which is a unique action for each character, which there are OVER 35 of, which MOST of the cast plays VASTLY DIFFERENT from each other.
Mainline BlazBlue games were HUGE in japan, with it being popular in many Japanese arcades, and as Majin Obama stated in a podcast with Blasted Salami that the series had at one point been up there even with the almighty Tekken in terms of popularity. With many veterans like Dogura ( who is one of the best players in Guilty Gear who uses Slayer) and Fenrich ( who is arguably the best BB player, and currently one the best in DBFZ) representing the series for a long time . Sadly, The series just never took off over here in the west. However, the lack of popularity nationwide doesn't equate to the game's quality.The fact that is arguably the most unique AND complex 2D fighter on the market, but isn't talked about hardly at all in the west was always baffling to me. Especially when I read comments, and watch videos of people in the FGC complaining about how boring fighting games have gotten recently, or how easy it has become and yet will REFUSE to give the game a try. Thankfully, that seems to be changing, for instance Lord Knight, a tournament player who plays a variety of different fighting games recently made a fighting game tier list and put "BlazBlue Central Fiction" near the top, as well as popular Guilty Gear content creators like Majin Obama saying on blasted salami's podcast that "BlazBlue Central Fiction" is HARDER than Guilty Gear Xrd. Even Punk, argueably the best Street Fighter 5 player says BlazBlue is one of his favorite fighting game series. For those who want to see high level game play in order to get a grasp of how hype this game can potentially be for you, I'd recommend a video titled "BlazBlue: Chrono Phantasma Grand Finals - Evo 2014" on youtube, and while the game represented there is not Central Fiction, I think it works, since Central Fiction is more of an evolution of Chrono Phantasma any way. Other channel's include "Burst Recap" and "Jourdal" for more high level Japanese play.
Finally, BB TAG and mainline BlazBlue games are two SEPARATE things all together, with BBTAG having it's own set of rules with the system mechanics, and SIMPLIFYING ALL of the characters. It's for these reasons that you can't approach "BlazBlue Central Fiction" in the same way that you would BBTAG.
Glad to see a another youtuber give the game some recognition. Even if it is in a broader context.
Id like to at some point give the game its dues, but with the franchise being dead in the water and my fairly low subcount, any spotlight i put on it now, is just a revenue loss for me. But in my opinion its easily the fighting game with the most depth, i dont think rev2 is even close. And its likely still my favourite too, although kofxv and sf6 are hot on its heels lately.
Bbtag made my boy Hakumen garbage 😭😭
Still upset they gutted Baiken's parry in strive. Xrd was my entry into the series and Baiken was the perfect character for me. Cool combos, great lines, extremely satisfying parry, execution, great theme and design - she had everything,
(gasps for air) god...finally...i've been starving for archetype archive for so long...it is finally here...
Sorry for the wait! News cycle will be dry and besides some match coverage I don't think there's any news I'd like to cover that could come from Evo, so we have another block of around 3-4+ archetype archives before some other video I wanna make grabs my attention
@@DarumaFGC PRAISE BE!!!!! i love these archetype archives they make me rethink not only characters i enjoy but also might enjoy and ones i design as well
My favorite parry character is asuka... Because everyone ALWAYS miss time their attacks since her parry has a huge varying active time... Sometimes i hold it for a sec then i suddenly counterhit them... Other times i just let the whole parry rip, then they attack into it, giving me free damage.
When you Land that sweet b1+3 on kicks or F1+3 on punches It Just hits different
She's really unique, I hope when she's revealed for Tekken 8 they round her out a bit more, cause she's always super popular with fans but rarely sees competitive results of any note
@@DarumaFGC She was already revealed on Tekken 8 and She was playable on the cnt, i played her and She Is a blast, ngl her kit Is even more Easy to use and strong now
I'll will be waiting for the Healer archetype in the next future
While not really an archetype, since most characters with heals play completely differently, heals will absolutely get a move type archive. Since the strategy behind them is very interesting
I love the Parry character, and while I'm no good at them my second favorite is Grapplers. Nothing feels as good as seeing a player who is CLEARLY better than you know they STILL have to respect the options you have when employed correctly. Hakumen might be my favorite fighting game character of all time now, just because of the moments someone didn't respect my wake-up yukikaze when I'm on the magic pixel
Its so sad to see blazblue quietly die off when quite likely the next mainline installment wouldve been bonkers, fingers crossed the next title mori is working on gets half as storied a history.
I love characters with parries, so much that I enjoy playing Remy with his crappy parry and feel like a god when I do pull off the full thing.
I also would say that parry characters aren't actually about ego but getting rid of my own ego and focusing on the opponent instead. I noticed that, once I have some experience, when I look at the opponent on the screen instead of myself, I can play better than normal. And parry characters kinda require that you read what the opponent does and not yourself.
every sam sho and last blade 2 character is a parry character
Hell yeah! Been waiting for this one!
Love your content as always!
Glad you enjoyed it! 🍻 More coming soon-ish, just slightly less often than weekly!
4:15 As an Anji player, that's me. I like to play long sets, I'm talking 20+ games. I enjoy slowly conditioning my opponent, playing on deeper levels of yomi. I've seen a few players mindbreak and flail near the end of a set, clearly frustrated that they got hit by roundstart grab.
Reaaallly commin in yomi, especially after a long time with nobody hitting the other person
The parry character archetype got to be the most big brain archetype
They can be up there, though because of the sheer raw number of steps you can be playing ahead of your opponent, certain kinds of zoner or "speed" character would place higher on my list for biggest brain characters
Im a baiken main and i lobotomised myself so i can parry more
I really hope we'll see a puppet character episode some day, i say that as a puppet char player, but im sure a lot of people would appreciate shedding some light on this otherwise obscure archetype
Ps. I appreciate the use of Risk Of Rain
Haha, spotting risk of rain 1 music of your own accord is crazy. Respect. Puppet characters will actually be getting an "arc" for archetype archive. Since the strategy behind a puppet that is disjointed, and one that isnt, is totally different, same for ones that can be hit and ones that cant. But absolutely, theyre underconsidered, underrepresented, and underappreciated. So theyll get lots of TLC from me.
@@DarumaFGC this fills me with joy, godspeed Daruma
I still haven't lost hope, one day
Dont worry, your prayers are heard, its still a bit aways though! New videos releasing on both saturday and monday! It looks like after theyre released i might be doing episode 1 of ability archive before Archetype Archive continues, so stay tuned for that!
@@DarumaFGC so god is real after all, dont worry about it mang im just glad You're doing this kind of content in general, keep it up
Whenever there’s a parry character in a game I main them, I love the archetype and wish it was a universal archetype. Even if I’m loosing my mind on a 10 game loose streak, and ponder changing mains, my fun for the game is shot through the roof if I land a counter. Like it’s the embodiment of the highest highs and lowest lows. If you can’t make a read, then you’re about to hate the next few minutes, but if you can get reads and counters then you’ll have more fun you’ve ever had in fighting games.
Its a very very interactive winstate. Which is fun since interaction is really the best part of fighting games. During season 2 im gonna cover some of the non interactive archetypes. Which, kinda annoyingly, are extremely strong. Look forward to it!
I don't understand how JP's parry/counter defines his neutral and offense? I don't think I've ever seen a good JP player use it in neutral or during their own offense. Only when he's in defensive situations.
To be effective, even though his win condition is zoning, he does need to close the gap from time to time, whether that is just for mindgames sake or to get the payout of his 2 bar super, but after a failed portal jump mix, post-knockdown, or in his corner pressure, his blockstrings are really short and difficult to enforce. He wouldnt be scary to deal with in the corner if he didnt have it, but having it is crucial.
As for in pure neutral, probably the single most common use for his parry, is to punish a jump in from someone who has jumped over a feinted attack. Or its also not unusual to see EX parry beat out a throw attempt too. Parrys really important or he just falls apart. Even if its obviously not as common as his ground spikes or even his command grab
i require a video about Snowball characters. my favorite archetype.
They've lost a few polls in the membership, but they'll come eventually for sure
It's sad that Baiken became a character with a parry in Strive,from being a parry character in older Guilty Gear.
She became a typical rushdown character in strive, from a unique defensive character in past games.
Going from ac+r Anji to what we get in Strive is a disappointment. Anji went from "attack is the best defense" with his auto parries in ac+r, to "u w u pleae don't prc my spin" in Strive. And thats only about their parry mechanics,don't let me get into how Strive gutted and butchered ac+r Anji's other special moves 😂.
Because of the specific way guard point works in both guilty gear and blazblue, it left ACR anji as much more of a true mixup character than just a parry character, since not only is his butterfly significantly more potent but he creates a ton of true 50/50's with guard point, which he got rinsed of in strive to become a parry character, similarly with baiken, whos best remnant of her old get off me tools, is her tatami mat maybe being better than ever, and i do like her new tether mechanic, i think its a really smart tradeoff for such potent oki to give the opponent higher reward than you if they guess right out of your setplay. But i would agree, she is absolutely now a "character with a parry" and not a parry character.
Given how weak this wincon is, and simultaneously how sparse these characters actually are, i had it in my head most fighting games have parry characters before making this, then while gathering footage, felt extremely limited by what I could and couldnt show. I would really like to see some of the modern fighting games give out stronger, more interesting parry characters with unique systems. Cause for as popular as these guys are, tournament results as them are pretty rare and you dont find too many of them (besides rev2 baiken in particular) recieving mass complaints from the community for their power level.
parry isn't an archetype bro. anji is a rushdown, jiren is defensive, hakumen is mid-ranged footsies, and baiken is literally a rat. none of them have the same archetype, but they all have parries. it's just a move dude, not an archetype
hell, they aren't even similar moves. anji uses his parries to get in, jiren uses them to punish bad neutral, hakumen uses them for meter, and baiken uses them to weasel her way out of any danger. how can people sharing a simple idea of a move, using completely different moves with different applications and different play styles be in the same archetype?
When i make these videos or when i look at characters, as im sure youll agree, i start from the idea that characters are all designed with some kind of pointed vision with how they should play. This can go even as far as affecting the inputs they have to use, like charge inputs and full wheels. And i look at characters on the basis of what they look like if you imagine all of their moves used at once in every scenario, which ones are designed to be more omnipresent, how they function, and if theres a clear overall picture their moves paint.
This is why i delineated at the start that theres a clear difference between a parry character, and a character with a parry. For some characters. Their ability to eat through your offense is used to reset fullscreen or to give them something instead of a reversal for wakeup scenarios, its a part of their defensive strategy. They then become a parry character when its the core of their offense. Anji just doesnt emulate the nigh endless pressure of a rushdown character because even if the opponent makes no guesses, your pressure ends extremely quickly, its not gapless at all nor is it relentless, he gets pushed back very quickly and reset to neutral and has to take a severe gamble to reclose that gap, compared to someone like chip, jam, giovanna, valkenhayn, etc, he looks nothing like them in practice or in theory.
Same sort of thing goes for baiken. Leroy and hakumen (i would agree jiren is just built to be defensive, but thats because hes designed to be like himself in the anime, hes not designed as a fighting game character first, and has a very low cohesion kit that doesnt really work as a result, nor is it part of an "archetype" cause you couldnt point to someone that plays like him)
Even though these characters have aspects of midrange, they cant live and breathe it the same way an actual midranger does, mostly because they are really, really bad at forcing you to approach, they have no ranged options and have to play aggressively to make up for it, and their offense is either given to them by landing a parry during the opponents offense, or by enforcing fake pressure due to the fact that if the opponent tries to mash out of the gaps in their strings, they can eat a parry instead, which creates respect and forces them to hold the pressure. (P.s. not mentioned in the video, but guard point is the same thing as a parry as far as logistics go, you have to call out a specific high/low option and are rewarded by eating through your opponents offense, which deepens both XRD anji and baikens parry character status)
That is just my reasoning behind my decisions. While there are still interesting things to argue, like while baiken isnt able to force an approach, her runaway is fantastic, and she can technically just use her guard cancels to weasel out of pressure, instead of run her own, these scenarios are in my opinion, matchup specific, plus, even if i was to say that makes her not a parry character, i dont think a rat is an archetype, since youd be fair strained to point me to other characters who have such a unique mechanic as her just freely escaping pressure if its not specifically formed to be anti-baiken pressure. So it would just leave her as a unique character, and one not placed in an archetype, which i wouldnt really say is true since while the minutiae can be very intricate and theres a lot of depth to fighting her, i dont think anything i said strategy wise in this video, doesnt apply to playing as her, or against her, i would say it still holds true.
Thanks for the comment and its fine if you still disagree with me on this, i think its insightful even if it winds up with neither person changing their minds to have these discussions and it gives me insight into how i should treat certain topics in future videos about archetypes. If youd like to know more about my decision making i have a "what is an archetype" video that goes over all my decision making in broad strokes, but i thought it would be good to respond to this comment in particular going into my thoughts on the specific examples you used. Since it seemed you had a lot of thoughts on this matter.
I’ve never used Hakumen’s counter for meter, it’s really to get a free combo or just push the enemy away with 6D. Even then I’ll just 214A to get close or 214D to start a combo (if I already have enough meter). Though I should probably try using it for meter I probably won’t cuz dmg sounds better.
what's the song that started playing around 9:50?
Snowland - SF3 3RD Strike
One of if not my favorite version of a parry character is sir nighteye from my hero ones justice 2. His main gimmic is his counter which when triggered does a little damage but specifically triggeres his quirk. His quirk allows him to “predict” every attack the opponent does which shows their input before it happens. It gives him a snowball type play style where if you keep countering you’ll just keep winning but also let’s you play in insanely weird ways
I really appreciate bandai trying new things with their copy paste arena fighter games, although i distinctly remember really enjoying the 2d equivalent of the ninja storm games on psp, and honestly wouldnt mind at all if they tried a few more of those, to make a game a little bit more truly competitive.
go ahead, guess if my A17 is gonna use bubble or overhead, i dare you, mash after my blockstring is over, itd make my day (yes i know he is a rekka character but shhhhhh)
atleast in dbfz, parries and grapples are at their most dangerous after the blockstring, either you got your ass yoinked or they got you in another blockstring cause you got scared
Especially after this new update... vegito getting a command grab cancel out of his parry is the most rididulous thing ive ever seen
@@DarumaFGC this entire update is crazy, half the characters getting a level 5 at limit break, almost everyone getting buffed, its crazy man
Hot take: Losing Lei Wulong for Leeroy is bullshit, Leeroy should have stayed a DLC character.
Another arch vid, whoo! 🙌
We love to see the excitement 🍻
I purposefully play anji like I am on loads of crack
It works like a charm because people never know what 300 IQ play (read: crazy ass uncalculated) appraoch I am gonna do next time, and I can always say that it was all planned if it works
Yeah, I did just combo my hit cS into my parry super and wasted 50 meter but by god if you aren't in their head after doing that nothing will get in their head
Just sayin as a hukamen main. that shit is not balanced man even at low levels if you even know how to partly time your parries well the enemy is fucked. especially if you fight a mixup and do parry the moment you get back up. ( aslong they don't nice the pattern ) expecially when you realise HE HAS A PARRY that instakills, a parry moves him forward a lil too far for some people, a Super parry that hits like a truck, and not only that he has obscene meter game.
YES MY FAVORITE TYPE OF CHARACTERS!!!! DEFENSE ALL DAY BABY!!!
Parry characters rule
you know you make a video about parry fighter but dont add the most parry heavy character in all fighting game aka old man gen fu from dead or alive.
You main baiken for her parry,
I main baiken because she is hot,
We are not the same
Man this is great content and a great video. Shocked you channel is not bigger.
Thanks a lot! 🍻 doing my best to grow my channel as much as i can
Fundamentally broken archetype. Shouldn't exist. Characters like Asuka in tekken make some MU literally unplayeble.
Id like to do a vid on tekkens weird relationship to archetypes sometime, i like that most characters have 1 aspect to them that completely eclipses the rest of the cast, and then the rest of their tools are roughly the same as anyone else, but most people dont really look at the game that way, since it manages to feel mostly balanced regardless
I love belligerent bully characters and dominating parry characters, and one day they made a beautiful baby named Geese Howard.
I am also one hundred percent fueled by ego and only gel with a character when I can absolutely dunk on somebody by reading a move they were going to throw out sometime next week.
something something predictable
You might like boss characters as an archetype, and not purely these specific playstyles. I'll go into it in more detail in a video specifically about them, but boss characters generally have some in-built counters to the game-in-question's system mechanics, so theres some boss characters who are zoners because of a system mechanic like assault in under-night. Where Hilda and Vatista have zoning options that specifically aim at the angle assault sends you forward and make it impossible to rely on the games system mechanics like vorpal since you can be punished for charging that too. Which is why things like Geese's double reppuken exist, to prevent short hopping over and forcing you to hard dedicate to a hyper hop, which geese can promptly punish severely. Which is really similar to why Omega Rugal has so many zoning and parry options too.
@@DarumaFGC Honestly, you're probably right. My favorite characters ever are Gargos from KI, Sephiroth in Ultimate, and the Brolies in Fighterz.
Shout-outs also go to 3S makoto and Strive Leo, but that's just because there's something so hilarious about using gorilla powers that bypass whatever the heck my opponent is actually trying to accomplish.
Question then is I guess what makes the difference between a "gorilla" and a "boss" 🤔
@@FomiteGaming if it does continue to be relevant ill maybe make a video purely about the term "gorilla" but in my archetype archive for the brawler i discuss it in a good amount of detail, gorilla isnt an archetype and instead a derogatory term for a specific playstyle where youre almost permanently in active frames for one move or another. I discuss how to play like that and how to do that well in that video, but also show examples of characters like Sol being played extremely disciplined with moves only being used with a purpose behind them. And discuss a bit the strengths and weaknesses of both.
@@DarumaFGC I completely forgot you mentioned it in the brawler video, that's my bad lol
Maybe you could mention how certain archetypes could be seen as "gorilla" in one form or another, especially when in boss characters for example their buttons can seem very scary and very oppressive.
If you think you gave enough attention to the idea of gorilla stereotyping I wouldn't worry about it though, you're already putting in a ton of work
@@FomiteGaming im always listening to my fans at the end of the day and any and all feedback, suggestions, requests and queries are all considered and come into what i choose to do with the channel and how i choose to do it, so even if it wont be immediately apparent, your input lets me know where to put further emphasis on topics, what is worthy of a video, have i underexplained something, etc. At the end of the day all of you guys in my comments have a lot of sway over how this stuff comes out.
Geese Howard's "Predictable!" and "Too Easy!" voice clips probably do the most mental damage of any parry sound effect.
I really like the big loud parries in sfv that try and emulate the 3S sound effect, that ryu and gill have, but they dont wind up being parry characters so i didnt include any of that stuff in
You fool, this is how I play sol badguy in XrdR2
Gasp a platypus GASP PARRY THE PLATYPUS!
You made a video...... About The Parry Archetype.... and you didn't even show a Glimpse of GEESE HOWARD!?!?
Okay but for real, Good Video 👍
Ill go into it more in another video, but i consider geese a boss character, and not a parry character. Hes designed from the ground up to play anti-SNK, and the parry is just part of that. Same goes for characters like goenitz and rugal, all people designed to eat quarters rather than be part of a fighting game archetype. Hope you look forward to the geese coverage.
@@DarumaFGC Oh I definitely Will 😁
I usually call it a counter never a parry
Hm, would you consider characters with emphasized armor as parry characters? Midori in Fantasy Strike has a strong parry: if hit during the active frames, no damage, throws out a fast attack, usually punishing whatever hit. On that punish hitting, he gets a buff: he will automatically do a special throw if in range of the opponent. His super art has 0 startup and transforms him into a Dragon who has moves with infinite super armor. So a common strategy with full meter is to read an attack (eg, predict oki when waking up), reversal transform to Dragon, reversal from that to start a long range command grab with infinite super armor.. his overall gameplan depends on hitting you when you think you're hitting him. So I think he's a parry character as opposed to say, "an install character" or "snowball", curious what others think
I mostly move armored moves into the bully category, characters whose gameplan specifically is to say "no" to the opponents gameplan. With a whole kit of anti-whatever moves, be it anti-fireball, anti--low, anti-air. etc. More on that idea in the bully video to explain my thesis.
Nothing better than a enki parry on round start to get the mental stack going 💪🏽
Its provocative, it gets the people going!
zangief tundra storm kek
I love Geese and other characters with great Powerful feeling parries none of this SF parries give me those SNK giga flip parries.
Also you never mentioned Geese man's literally got 4 fucking
One of my favourite parries ever is SFV Ryu's VT2, amazing animation, very satisfying wallbounce and it confirms into either a cool DP or critical art, but being a V trigger parry, it's basically useless, since people aren't going to take risks when you have 20 seconds where you can parry them for 50%. I also love Jins Astral super in Blazblue, parrying anything into a literal instant kill is unbelievable. But I'd agree, SNK overall do them best for both practicality and impact. Not to mention geeses parry in Tekken too
@@DarumaFGC tbh the VS2 not being g a parry but a guardpoint yet using the same animation as the VT2 was certainly interesting.
I just wish Blazblue had a faster parry based character…..basically Hibiki Kohaku but the air counter is an everything counter.
I really really like Answers dumb parry equivalents in XRD rev 2, and hope to see him return but simplified to some degree in strive. I think the lame thing about both kohaku and answer is how situational their moves are, and seeing them work more universally would be very, very cool
Chaka from Jojo's HTFT
As for the "ego", this applies to all players who like to win by dominating. Why does no one say that perry is the same as dp, blitz shield or any other reversal. And a good opponent, who knows the matchup, will not let you parry yourself just like that, in short, that's all bullshit.
I did say its a weak win condition, theres definitely discussion to be had on why a DP is a very strong move to have, but a parry is relatively weak, not least of which being that DP is a true reversal and beats throws, while the vast majority of the time, parries are specifically designed to be weak to throws.
But yes, ego, pattern recognition and mind game are all inextricably linked to fighting games and are all massively important to even landing a parry in the first place, i dont really see a way you could argue around that.
"The way of the silent fist"
Tbh I don't really think Leroy is a parry character but rather an all-rounder. Asuka is more a parry character if anything.
Asuka is too, but while leroy could play without it, i think the intense strength of his parries are inextricable as to his strength competitively, theyre a real core to why hes strong at high level, and largely because they let him play against characters like geese and akuma where others cant
I'm offended by the lack of Jiren in the video. but yeah, I never considered, but I do end up gravitating to parry characters
Unfortunately Jiren is so lamely designed (both visually and mechanically) as well as the fact he was strongest due to glitched interactions, that eventually got patched out, he didnt really make the cut.
Bro you a character colour swap of Leon Massey 😭? Jk your style is pretty interesting and it's entertaining yet concise.
I appreciate the kind words and the comparison to someone much much bigger than me in the fgc 🙏
... Incineroar in smash? I'd argue revenge is as important as his alolan whip.
It ties his kit together but you often go full sets without seeing it land, it's not as imperative as I'd like for it to be to definitively say he's a parry character, even though it's visibly important
i assume youre familiar with the other archetype archive on youtube?
Some commenters have brought it up, but ive never seen it
Wait a second, this isn't Yu-gi-oh... Eh, why not.
Combos, metas and tier lists, its like, 50% of yugioh? Kinda
My darling Hisako didn't make the video :(
Wish i could fit everyone! Maybe someday ill have a team for editing so putting in more characters and games will be way easier, but currently thats just in my dreams for now.
Parry = defensive state that neutralizes damage or creates an advantageous situation for the defender
Counter = Special state or stance that causes an attack when interacted with
What attack comes out when you parry in SF3 or 6?
What attack comes out when you use Baiken's 'parry'?
Yall fucking up the terminology.
The deliniation just isn't useful here, counter is specifically a term used for when you hit someone throughout the duration of a move, and there's a whole other archetype specifically based on that, including characters like Chun Li, Shaheen, Johnny, etc. And while some of the characters in this video don't immediately damage the opponent when their parry is landed, like Anji, or Baiken, other ones do, does that really change their archetype or the name of the archetype? It's just confusing to name these guys counter characters instead of parry characters. It conveys the idea significantly cleaner.
@@DarumaFGC what you’re talking about is a counter hit. And I 100% don’t agree with you purely because I know the difference and the terms have clear distinctions. If you don’t want to go by that, that’s fine. But in terms of what the word parry means versus counter, you’re wrong and this video is wrong. It’ll just perpetuate the wrong term and there is nothing I can do about it except stand on the technical distinction.
God damn this song is like the Rules of Nature of guilty gear. amazing song with an absolute god-tier part
I feel like your ego definition is a bit broad, especially for category 3. Can you explain how liking more interactions in a fight is an ego-driven style in a way that doesn't also make literally all other styles also ego-driven? I don't disagree fundamentally and types 1 and 2 I think you're right stem from ego more directly
There's a smugness to it, picking a 5-touch character in a 3-touch game, is just saying "I'm better than you" to your opponent. Albeit, this is something that only comes into play at a very high level, where damage is actually optimal. But it does mean you have faith in your ability to guess correctly MUCH more times than your opponent, plus when you factor in the actual method by which you win as a parry character, which is dedicating to hard reads, it's a concoction that adds up to it.
@@DarumaFGC Ah right, there's the variable I was missing. I was imagining it mutual, that you by virtue of how your character works can TURN a 3-touch game into a 5-touch game for both sides (maybe they just can't get in well enough to do optimal combos or you have unique but limited combo breaking options), which would then not be ego-driven. But it's haughty to believe you can 5-touch 3-touchers consistently yeah, that's ego play.
I was playing strive and then I fought against a Baiken that parried me to death in a round, but with the knowledge that he would try to parry I proceeded to play a little slower so the parry timing was off and I got the combo consistently.
Baiken 😫
I've been told I'm a bit of a "parry character" myself.
with how much you push Ego, I'm surprised there was no Blue Lock refferences.
Haven't ever watched it read it, unfortunately
@DarumaFGC long story short, the whole thing is about building up a strong striker player in soccer. And the guy heading the Blue Lock project that the story is about believes the key to that is a strong... well, ego. The kind of person who would rather get a hat trick and score tons of points himself, even if team play is the supposed 'better' strategy
I wonder wich character in For Honor would be a parry hero? Or are they all parry characters?
baiken keeps parrying the engagement ring
In her eyes, everyone else belongs under the tatami mat
Crazy to put kof on the screen in a video about parry and not include geese Howard
Ill go into him in depth in the boss character video, because i think rather than to play a straightforward "will he/wont he parry" game, he instead is designed from the ground up to play anti-SNK, the parry is part of that but much like other SNK bosses he has extremely strong projectiles that you cant short hop forward through, forcing you to hard dedicate, and then he can just blow you up with anti air etc. While hes been toned down in playable appearances (somewhat) hes literally just designed to eat your money, and id say the same of bison, shao khan, etc. Ill go into it deeper in the boss character video though, which should be soonish if these comments are implying a demand for geese
@@DarumaFGC hell yea thats dope
These videos are so inaccurate
Sorry to hear you disagree my man, glad you took the time out to consider my pov regardless
Hakumen is my Lord.
And the GOAT
As a Strive Anji player, I'm glad that he's getting a bit of a spotlight here.
That said, I really feel like his AC+R form is much more indicative of a Parry playstyle, as his Guard Points are a lot more engaging than just Anji's spin in Strive.
Anji could throw moves with guard points and practically have a dance between them and the opponent, where if the opponent tries to step out of the gap that Anji makes he can keep going and punish the opponent for doing so. It sounds more like an armor character, but I still find it to fit a bit closer to a Parry Character.
To me, Anji in Strive feels more just like a bluffing character, that is to start with safe strings and build up a lot of RISC and meter, then to open them up once the opponent is paralyzed into blocking. Spin is a supplement for Anji to further call out an opponent, either after conditioning them to get impatient and throw something out or just in general as a means to dissuade approaches. It's complicated, but I like what your video covers here.
I try my best to make my videos both as broad and as relevant as I can, so I try and cover their major presence in modern games, particularly iconic characters, or in ACR/XRD Baikens case, exceptions to the rule or outsider examples of the playstyle. And I try only take one character from each game, so the footage doesn't wind up too repetitive, so for me it wound up being more pressing to cover Baiken. But I do agree with all you've said, but while guard point is functionally identical to a parry, it would've been a lot of work to include a section fully explaining guard point and showing it off fully too.
I fucking love parry character. Anji, Hakumen, Kasumi Todoh, Geese Howard (he technically counts as a chameleon but I play him as a parry character) etc etc etc I love them all. So fucking fun
Its one of the most satisfying wincons, even if its one of the hardest
Love the risk of rain ost
One of my favourite games ever, easily.
You ask about archetypes to focus on, so I actually have one I never see mentioned, save to denigrate a certain playstyle as "turtling", and that's the defensive character. Often charge characters (thanks to stand-outs like Guile), but the characters that focus heavily on defense and punishing pokes and whiffs as their primary form of dealing damage. Usually come with short but hard hitting combos and better than average reach with quick start-ups (but usually longer than average recoveries), this is an archetype that seems to be disappearing from fighting games, save for a few hold-outs... much to my annoyance, or finding their kits retooled to make them more offensive (see: Blanka). I'd really like to see this one addressed in some way.
I think turtling is more of a playstyle than a toolkit, it was realised after very early competitive history of sf2 that guiles turtling was degenerately strong at a competitive level, so a lot of the balance was pushed away from him PURELY relying on flash kick and booms, and he's been forced to play much more aggressively ever since. Turtling is still something to mix in mid round and use and consider as part of your toolkit, and not only as a charge character but sometimes as shotos and all sorts, but for sure I'll discuss charge characters sometime soon. They're very interesting because they're so strong defensively and have to turn that defense into offence
Ayy yall, if you're new to fighting games, or on that sf6 grind, don't click off this shit. This man has some sauce that is fighting game universal, he is speaking HIGH KEY facts.
Thank you for the kind words 🙏 praise be
And what about "catch" keyword? Like in Axel's and Tastament's kit. Or Freeman's super from Garou. Do they count as parry?
In the old guilty gears, catch just referred to eating literally anything with active frames, so in effect it's a parry, as is guard point on someone like XX Anji or KOF Maxima, since you dedicate to blocking a high or low move and attack by blocking that attack, the effect is the same even if the methods different.
4:40 Muse Dash moment!
Shoka Sakurane moment
I think that there are 2 things in this video: counter and parry characters. To me a counter is kinda automatic, your opponent tries to hit you you get a counter that triggers automatically. A parry is find it similar to a dodge in the sense that your opponents is left wide open for an attack but your are free to choose what to with that opening.
Coming from DBFZ Videl has a dodge that can make enemies whiff and you can get a medium starter combo. But also you’ve got Jiren that has 2 counters, 1 for hits only, and the other for any attack and then trigger a certain counterattack kinda immediately.
Idk what to do with this info but while being similar I think that they also can work separately. Or not, with UI Goku having a dodge that transports him next to the opponent but also a lvl1 counter that ALSO transports him next to the opponent but this one actually has a automatic attack attached to it when triggered
At the end of the day it winds up the same in affect, and a lot of these characters have both, so its not really worth subdividing the archetype. Its more just the case that you have more options to use a dodge against than you do an out and out parry
I don't think being able to parry deserves its own category. I feel that characters that can parry have tools that better describe their playstyle
EDIT: After watching the video, the only characters I can truly put in this category are hakumen and xx baiken. Baiken past xx becomes less reliant of the parry mechanic and the parry on anji's spin does so little for him as a character that I only ever see spin as movement. I have neither utilized it or seen it utilized as a significant part of his game plan outside of low elo knowledge checkers
I go over this better in my facilitation video "what is an archetype" where i define how these decisions are made, but i think theres a fine, but very sharp and obvious line between characters who have a parry purely for defence, and ones who need their parry for their offense, without their parries these characters become extremely incomplete and somewhat unplayable, its important enough it defines them.
what is the game at 0:16 ?
Under Night, a sequel was just announced at EVO this year
Absolutely excellent video my guy! Earned my subscription and thumbs up
Cheers 🍻 Hope you enjoy the content and welcome to the Daruma Dojo
The girl with the anchor; which game is that footage?
Oh I must be sleep-deprived, that's May.
The disaster of passion
Parry the world.
✊️
my favorite parry character is and forever will be hakumen it feels so good to land and since it's on one button and I don't have to react super quick if I get it it feels pretty effective even though I can't convert it at my level
Blazblue has the best ones, i love landing jins astral and getting a literal instakill off a hard read
I think it'll be pretty cool if you cover the steamrolling characters like hakan and jamie from street fighter and susanoo from bbcf
Id probably use the term snowball character, but these will definitely appear soon. They were actually on this weeks poll, but lost to the trap character. The strategy behind them is extremely interesting.
That parry from the first guilty gear games looks so broken 😂, she can hit you from any block?
Its pretty complicated and i could do a video just on XX and XRD baiken, but yeah she can do that off any block, but if she does it to a jab or something its unsafe.
I have mad respect for people who plays Parry characters. I cannot use them for crap in most games.
Its a weird one, because it absolutely has a skill bell curve. Meaning that it gets really really good in silver/gold ranks, and then when you get to diamond/platinum ranks, it immediately has an extremely harsh fall off in viability. Since players in the top 10% are much much better at both the mindgame and the actual mechanical gameplan of their character.
Great video, my man! Fgc all the way, the new Golden Age is here. Everybody, get on your fighting games!!
Cheers! I'm happy for the appreciation and glad you liked the video!
What about the footsies characters?
Absolutely on its way 🍻 few to get to first though
@@DarumaFGC is Jubei from Samurai Shodown a parry character?
Yeah man, asuka jun and my girl baiken be the funniest characters i've played, the sheer joy of UNO REVERSE an easy read, it got to a point where when i play them against my Friends and i do a parry we all go "OOOOHHLEEH" during the animation 😂
And now we've got a brand new parry character in Tekken 8 with a spot dodge, praise be
@@DarumaFGC as a coffee addict my self, azucena gonna replace lucky Chloe as my new mainalonf asuka and Lili, ready to piss other people off with all those parry
Thanks for the video!!! Loved it!! My best friend is bringing Injustice 2 to my house today and i'm gonna try Black Canary and her super fun parrys today, i'll have the advice of this video in mind hahaha
Hope it helps somewhat! This was a lot more based in general strategy and theory than the other AA episodes thus far, so its a bit of a departure and experiment vs the rest of my content, but im glad its been well recieved thus far!
Hakumen’s like a mix of a brawler, midranger and parry character. When you have meter he plays like a brawler where you use his A and B normals, as well as 214A and 623A to keep your pressure going or just to get in. Most of the game you’ll use his normals like 4C, j.C keep space and gain meter as well as beat zoners. Then his counters tie it all together by disrupting the enemies offense and preventing the enemy from playing aggressive. Maybe more of just a footsies character than a midranger but I play him like one depending on the opponent.
Hes already very good and obviously very unique and tied together, so im not suggesting any changes, but because of how slow the meter gain is and the fact that while you do have to play very defensively at the start of each round, hes defined by just how slow his meter regenerates, and that would prevent me placing him in another archetype. Since to play him at a high level and prevent the opponent running all over you, you have to be willing to throw out quarter circle A and D often when 1/2 bars of meter is all youve got. In that way, while spacing is very important, i wouldnt really consider him a footsies character since someone like chun li is actually the winning party in the situation when shes shimmying back and forth, while hakumens shimmying is when hes on the backfoot, and hes on the defensive to buy time
@@DarumaFGC Yea you’re right now that I think about it
I play Sol in ACPR but I want to learn Baiken and yes you are absolutely correct, getting to say "No you dont" is very satisfying to me.
Some random thoughts on shotos relevant to the series as a whole that you have definitely already considered but I am typing anyway. Having a fireball, dragon punch and move that brings you up and forward doesn't really say anything about what the character actually Does, does it? You could fit those three moves into the toolkit of any archetype and they would still be that archetype and a shoto. Mostly just a thought I had.
Also Terry, Rock, Sol and Ragna are Terrys. They are similar to but distinct from shotos. This is one of the sillier hills I will die on.
I will not remove you from your silly hill, even though ive already named these dudes as brawlers in my brawler video, but youre free to have your own name and call them terrys if you wish. But yes i have my own (already EXTREMELY controversial, if comments are anything to go by) thoughts on shotos, and the awful, terrible, very bad term "anime shoto" and i have come to the conclusion that to be a shoto, you not only need a DP, a fireball, and a COUNTER-PROJECTILE tatsu (sorry ken), but you need to wholly rely on these moves and have little to nothing else going on. Because i think the defining trait of the shoto, and one i think Ryu would agree with me on, is honesty. I think shoto not only should be, but has to be the only fighting game archetype where honesty must be inherent, because the instant you start adding mixups and such, it becomes really difficult to convincingly point to someone and say "he plays like ryu" and they becomes a character that shoto players dont want to play, and that shoto-counter strategy doesnt apply to. Honesty in this case is referring to the idea that DP, Tatsu, and Projectile are all clear, single-purpose moves, that have incredibly obvious and simple use cases.
Ill go into this further in a very large video all about these characters, and actually splitting some famous examples of these in twain, and akuma will be getting his own archetype he shares with some probably unexpected characters. So stay tuned for all that jazz and be sure to read the comments on that one, youll see people atop many silly hills there too i assure you.
@@DarumaFGC It's more that I think that a grounded fireball, some sort DP, rushpunch, flipkick and jumping punch is something different than what shotos are even if they are of course overlapping.
Anyway I think defining the shoto by those three moves and honesty is interesting even if I am not sure I agree with you. I think I am sticking with that the term "shoto" mostly just describes what their moves are but not what they do. I think "This is a shoto who is a zoner" which gives you both an idea of their special moves and their playstyle is more useful than splitting hairs on what is and is not a shoto.
The Honest Character is definitely an archetype though, but you can have honest characters that are shotos and honest characters that are not shotos.
My favorite one is Anji Mito, autoguard is always so fun to hit
Hakumen to me is like one of the all time best designed fighting game kits. His damage might be on the extreme side but for the game that blazblue is he plays a shockingly honest and fair game, you tend to come out feeling like the more technically skilled player in a match, rather than say a more mind game focused character where you feel a different sort of satisfaction since you succesfully confused the life out of your opponent
Thanks for covering my favorite archetype!
Always welcome!
Baiken plus R is such monster
I always be wondering what they were thinking with that 😂
Nearly everyone in plus r is a super experimental and weird version of an pre existing archetype or at the time, a brand new one. Id like to do videos on the design of the game someday because how much certain things like sol having sidewinder and such fundamentally change his character is really really interesting and yet discussion on it is little to none.
@@DarumaFGC sounds super interesting I'd watch it for sure if you made it