Jag's new ad without a car in it but a non woman woman in it will probably kill the brand and spare people financial pain. The mid life crisis guys will want to drive something else.
They won’t use that advert in the home of Jaguar - India where Tata is based. Even before this whenever I see someone in a modern Jag I feel sorry for them.
Jaguars are more aimed at old men, not mid life... They depreciate fast and is a display of wealth by showing how often you can afford to change your car
Here’s a big tip from,one who has been down the the road and comes from a family of engineers: don’t buy expensive cars.Simple. Buy an older, simpler car. Choose a well regarded one and one that was widely sold back on the day. Spares will be plentiful and amazingly cheap, mechanics will know all the wrinkles and in a pinch you can just walk away from a car if it gets to be a pain in the arse and buy another one.
In the 1960s the foreign secretary in Wilsons govt was a piss artist called George Brown. He always drove jags but famously said 'I don't buy them new, I buy them when they are two years old and by then all the problems with them have been repaired'. Nothings changed since then.
@@mr.richardryan7506 I remember Brown, I think it was when Hugh Gaitskell died in 1963, they dragged Brown live on the evening news, he was truly sloshed for all the Country to see. Labour won the election in 1964 though. Wilsons car was a Rover and it had a super large ashtray in the back for his pipe!
Which, magazine rates cars over the short, medium and long term in terms of reliability. Jaguar, scores badly in the short term, but gets better in the medium term. So, probably some truth to it.
My story. 😔 I bought a three year old XF, trading in an S-Type, from a Jaguar main stealer. A beautiful XF in Premium Luxury spec but upgraded to what would become a Portfolio spec. My dream car. It was serviced by Jaguar and in the time I had it, it had well over £10K of warranty repairs. I spent more time without it than I had it. Then, less than a month out of warranty, the engine ate itself. I had an AA inspection and they determined that the DPF had failed causing diesel to get into the engine oil. I ended up dealing with JLR, directly, and the eventual outcome was them basically saying, ‘Go ahead, try sueing us.’ It caused so much anguish and distress that I decided to scrap a 6 year old Jaguar. I lost so much money that my next car was a Fiesta which I bought for £100. It still hurts , now. Shocking company selling shocking cars.
Seems a bit silly to scrap a 6 year old car because of a bad engine, surely you could have sourced another engine and had it fitted without spending more than a car that new is worth
something was not right with that AA diagnosis. dpf is located behind engine on the exhaust pipe. it has no connection with diesel injectors nor engine. was it just clogged?? weird.
terrible experience, but please be advised as any good mechanic will tell you that small amounts of fuel will always end up in the oil - this is one reason why regular oil changes are important, and earlier than what the manufacturer recommends - they want them to fail but last long enough so it fails out of warrantee.
Oh that's a terrible experience. I also had a Jaguar XF 3.2D Premium Luxury. Bought it used with 47K on the clock, and put 100,000 miles on it in short order. I used it to drive between Aberdeen and Durham twice a week (around 900 miles round trip). Never had an issue. The fact that it was being used for (very) long journeys probably helped it a lot.
Fortunately when my car failed on the forecourt on day one and the garage begged to be allowed to fix it I knew this. Following two further instances, the third instance I refused and I said I wanted my money back. They refused because I had gone over their version of the 14 day right to return. However what a kerfuffle with them sending a rather large man to "inspect" the vehicle and literally. Try to bully me into letting them have another go at it. I said no, he said that was all they would do I advised that if the money wasn't back on my card within 7 working days I would sue for damage etc etc as well. He drove away, the big boss rang me to say he would refund. Amazing what sticking to your guns does.
In any negotiation, the other side will push back on your first attempt. Even if they say if you are thinking of suing us, keep in mind that we have won every case. For one thing, it is probably not true that they’ve never returned a customer’s money.
I had much the same experience, also with Jaguar. New car, after a couple of days the power steering started squealing, there was a knocking from the suspension and the passenger window leaked. Took it back, they had it for 2 months, picked it up and a couple of days later, problems returned. So back to the dealer, asked for a refund and got the "Sorry sir, it's over 30 days" routine. I showed them the CRA section, they still refused, so I took them to court. Quick and pretty painless, judge basically just asked if I was willing to accept a replacement, and I refused because after that experience, I never wanted to do business with Jaguar again. I think the dealers are well aware of the law, but just assume their customers do not, or pressurise their customers into waiving their rights. There is a good reason why dealers are often referred to as "stealers" after all.
When I was a little girl I have so many memories of my grandad dad and 2 uncles all with their heads under the bonnet of a car and I was always ferrying cups of tea out to them desperately hoping I would be asked to hold or pass them a spanner or anything, happy days
This happened to me, the garage just refused. I had purchased this through finance, I contacted the finance company, discussed my problem, and informed them I will not be paying for the car as it’s not fit for purpose, 24 hours it was collected and refunded.
The 30-day rejection period SHOULD (in law and in my opinion) start AGAIN for the full 30 days after such a repair made within the original 30-day period, with the latest 30-day period now being taken as the original period.
@ I agree, 30 days is completely out of keeping given the complexity of cars these days and their propensity to exhibit faults. But even within the existing law this ‘remaining balance of the 30 days’ completely undermines any reasonable protection. I.e. “The law is *a* ass!”
allways frustrating when large businesses ignore/break the law insisting they are following company policy. like a companies policy ever trumps legal regulations.
Thank heavens for the black belt barrister. He has clarified so many every day law dilemmas for us the public. So many thanks to you sir for your dedication to your channel.
I had a Jaguar too - in fact I have had 7 now. The last one I had has turned me off for life. A serious design flaw caused the engine to blow, a replacement was unavailable because demand is far higher than supply - this was the 3.0 diesel v6 engine developed by Peugeot. The smaller Ingenium engines have problems, the 5.0 v8 petrol engines fail due to plastic parts on the cam chain guides. It's unforgivable, they have been building them long enough but penny pinching is ruining the product.
Been a problem for a long time. Purchasing departments under pressure to reduce costs from bean counters quite often getting a new supplier without consulting anyone. In my experience anyway.
To fault find an electrical parasitic draw - get a multimeter and connect it to your battery. Then pull one fuse at a time until the voltage drops on the multimeter. When you find the fuse you will know which circuit to look at. Doing this will save you £££'s and then you can find a mechanic if needed to fix it
I thought this too hearing the story, taking months and charging thousands is far from fair, it was clearly a skill and or process issue that resulted in this timeliness and bill.
I forgot to say that you need to set the multimeter to amps and connect it inbetween the battery negative terminal and negative connector. Plenty of tutorial vids on YT
@@danielriddell441 I assumed you'd meant to measure current, though depending on how strong the load is you may be able to check in volts too and wait until you see a rise in the voltage but this is way less instantaneous than measuring amps and nowhere near as reliable.
Exactly what I was going to say. It is pretty easy to find out which circuit the draw is coming from with nothing more than a multimeter, a fuse puller and a saturday morning. If the draw is coming from a non essential circuit, like the electric seats, you could just pull it and use the car. Once you've found the circuit a thermal camera can pinpoint where the short is if you can get at the wires in question to look. Otherwise you'll be tracing the wires for that circuit and paying attention to anywhere they move, can be strained or pass by anything that can scrape them.
From my memory, in the 80's the Dealerships complained to the Manufacturers that people would buy a car and then take it back to their favourite local garage for servicing. Manufacturers then started to make a lot of things dealer only. Vauxhall produced deep recessed spark plugs and copywrited the tool. Old cars had a body that would rust pretty quickly ensuring new car sales over time. Then came the 7 year body warranties from foreign competitors etc and every manufacturer upped their game. But, the game is to sell new cars. So, you now have fully loaded cars with so many electronic and computer components that they are ticking time bombs. Everyone knows that you need to keep your PC backed up in case it fails, but consumers still buy brand new cars without giving reliability a second thought. The problem as you have found out, if it is an electrical fault it literally could be anything and anywhere in the vehicle. One last thing, headlight bulb on an old car £2 and five minutes to fit. Now, you could have to strip the whole of the front end off a vehicle to be able to access the headlight cluster. The light could cost £150 plus and you'll have labour charges on top. Me thinks that we would all be better driving classic cars. Keep up the good work. My go to channel.
My dad asked me why I bought an 18 year old car (45k miles when I bought it) this is why- sure it's a Merc and repairs will likely still be costly but i love how it looks and it's not stuffed to the brim with needless creature comforts. The A/C works perfectly, that's plenty for me
£150 for a headlamp? A friend of mine bought a top of the range Citroën for his missus, and she damaged a headlamp in a car park ding. The whole cluster had to be replaced and the part alone cost over £1000 before VAT. 😱 😱 😱
@@robm8809 No, I know that you can pay way over that, but until it happens to you most people wouldn't believe it. I prefer the £2 option every time. All the best
AVOID Jaguar at all costs. The ipace nearly killed me. It decided to self steer across 2 lanes of the M4. Plus god only knows how many other issues. They are pretty cars, belong in a museum, not on the road.
Not the transmission system. An ABS sensor failed, so it steered the car. It doesn’t make any sense, but might affect any Jaguar. But agree the ipace does have more than its fair share of problems. Being lied to by the dealer added insult to injury.
@@michaelcarney6280 It was a EV, but the problem could occur with an ICE. It was a software problem. Somehow JLR had managed to let an ABS sensor problem affect the automatic lane control of the car. It steered itself without reason.
I work as a super yacht Sprayer and a friend I used to work with was from the car painting in, he worked at a BMW dealership and told me stories of brand new BMW that had horrendous accidents before being sold and he had to fix them. Some of these "new" cars you see in the showroom are complete mess.
Many years in the retail motor trade has taught me you should only buy German or Japanese cars. My wife has owned three cars in twenty one years all Japanese and different makes all have been faultless.
Love german cars. Had a 6 yr old VW passat. Bought 2nd hand 3 yrs old. Driving to germany on holiday the turbo went. Went to a local vw garage in germany expecting a pretty large bill. Repaired within 4 days, didn't charge a single penny. Said it should not have gone faulty at that age. Brilliant service.
I've had German cars for quite some time. All have had issues, my current A6 will go to the great scrap yard in ths sky. My wife's Hondas have been faultless almost. But next car in the New Year will hopefully be a Lexus, the most reliable and cheapest car to run over 10 years.
We have a 2012 Toyota RAV4 ... for the most part its been fine, but its not been "faultless". We had to replace the drive shaft last year !! What a horrible sound for a car to make that was :)
In the 1960's it was recommended that you buy two jags. One to drive and one for spares. John Prescott (RIP) knew this. Nice to see some things don't change
Taking a parasitic draw issue to a main dealer. Terrible plan. You need an old school mechanic whos good with wiring. Most wont want to deal with it and certainly most car dealers wont.
Always pay in part for a car using a credit card. It gives you incredible leverage in the event of a problem, to the extent the credit card company can take ALL the money back. I've done that.
Easy diagnosis. Ammeter on the battery. See the drain on the ammeter. Pull fuses until the drain stops. That fuse narrows down the source of the drain. Investigate that one area and wiring.
This happened to me. My brand new Jaguar F pace broke down within the 30 days. I had the right to reject but the problem was the waiting list for a new car was months (all brands).The car was repaired after 6 weeks. Going forward the Jag is 14 months old and when I went to replace it with my 3rd new Jaguar F pace they told me I can but only with what was left in stock because they have stopped production. The ones in stock didn't have the colour or spec I wanted. I have seen the new advert for Jaguar and feel that Jaguar have let down their loyal customers. Obviously now I won't be buying a Jaguar because I am not ready to go electric. So now I am looking at other brands.
@@davidgavin7280 I wasn't. When I first heard of it on the Internet I phoned the dealer. They told me not to worry and that the F Pace was still in production until next year. Then they phoned me to say that all production had stopped and it was a shock to them also.
My friend has a F Pace. He's had nothing but expensive problems since day one. They're more focused on sexualising the brand. On their shoulders be it. RIP Jaguar.
Buy a Lexus, I've had 11 so far and never had a single problem that wasn't solved very quickly. I've always been given a courtesy car and the dealership experience is second to none! You really are made to feel like family. One big plus has been that all repairs and service are subject to a warranty! Brilliant cars.
shocking that lawyers and judges dont know all the details of the law - imagine another professional saying this! they would be sued - time to reform our lawyers
No-one can be expected to know everything and there are an insane number of laws, many with hundreds of clauses, each dealing with specific situations. The key in any profession is not to know all the answers but to know how to find out.
I've owned many cars over the years including Jaguar, but a few years back I took a gamble on a Mazda6 and have never changed brands since......so reliable due to a manual gearbox and a naturally aspirated engine.
I lost £10k on my Mazda6, in less than 2 years...turbo went, headgasket failed and, after all the money I spent on those issues, it still had an overheating problem. We tried everything, but couldn't get to the bottom of the fault. Such a shame, because it was a beautiful car. Maybe mine was the last one off the production line, on a Friday afternoon 🤔
@SilverbackMatt01 Yeah, it was a 2.2 diesel auto. Just buying it, it was the most money I've ever spent on a car. Gone back to cheap and cheerful, after that disaster.
I’m an 18 year old electrical and electronics engineering student - I have always had strong views on consumer rights & right to repair, despite the fact I’ll probably be forced into signing NDAs when I start working designing electronics/electrical systems. Funnily enough, my dad’s 2019 discovery sport suddenly developed the exact same fault yesterday. Probably some parasitic load in there arising from a fault. I remember when he first brought it, I said “with all this technology comes more room for issues” and my word has prevailed. Unrelated, i’m also planning on becoming a magistrate!
Good luck! I retired this year from the other end of the same career. Always try to keep your interests wide, there are often opportunities to switch threads, I have worked in a huge range of technologies and its been enlightening and rewarding.
My 1988 Citroen AX broke down going to a mountain pass in France a year later. It started to lose power and came to a halt, wheezing like I di when going up the stars nowadays. I opened the bonnet and noticed that parts of the top of the engine were no longer there. I reasoned that it must be the air intake box, but it was nowhere to be seen. Luckily, after a short walk down the hill , I saw bits of black plastic on the road. The pieces just clipped back together very easily and I was able to mount it back on the engine. I even got some applause from the restaurant near to where I had broken down Now try doing that with a modern car.
Excellent video, it’s about time this issue was aired more publicly. Also applies to touring caravans and motorhomes. Waiting to see if you mention the Consumer Credit Act ? WELL DONE YOU DID!!!!! I used to teach this to dealer management and sales staff. I am a companies worst customer!
I've had two Ladas. The last one was an Estate. Drove like a tank but so reliable. Got it up to 96mph on M25. Drove away in snow straightaway when others were struggling. They were real work horses.
Granted in today's snow the Landrover has its advantages but my personal preference is to drive a 1970 Rover or one of the equally ancient Triumphs we still have - simple, never a problem, easy to fix, no lights shutting the car down, no demands for this or that. I have enough trouble suffering an abusive relationship with the government without adding one from my car into the mix. I would not accept a new car as a gift.
Not quite car related but from someone who works in IT, I can't even count the times that someone has called me up to report a particular problem and then asked how long and how much it will take to fix before we've even had chance to look at the issue. Sure, in some cases you can make an educated guess at what it might be but that is often speculation until we have access to it not least because in many cases the customer either doesn't or can't describe the issue to us in a way that makes sense, doesn't answer honestly to follow up questions we ask to add clarification or just gets frustrated with us because they are trying to cover up something they have knowingly caused and instead of helping us to help them, they just want a fixed upfront price/timescale there and then before we've had time to investigate the issue properly and thorougly. I do sympathise with people working in other sectors who have the same thing, whether it's automotive, healthcare etc.
I suspect anyone who has had anything to do with solicitors and their colossal fee structures will surely be thinking BBB has been "hoist with his own petard".
u hit that on head steve..up to 750 an hour for barristers...as they say if u cant afford to run and repair it to be in that elite dont friggin buy it..plenty of vids from down to earth joe blogs that have found probs and said be wary these not reliable...is that a statistic of elite brands now build something unreliable and reap what u sow lol..back in the day volvo owner demanded his product to achieve 1 million miles...and they did.
New car it’s all coded. Get yourself the software or a code reader Rhian’s what they charge you £100 for. Gives a code and the fault. Had bmw do a recall. Bust something, charged me to look at it, charged me to do a fix that didn’t work. Complained. BMW said they trusted the dealer. Got the software myself. Figured it out on TH-cam and fixed it myself. Knowing what I know now it’s amazing to work out how they didn’t k ow how to fix it. Mind boggling as the software tells you exactly what to do step by step and it works.
I had a problem on my Alfa Romeo Giulia just out of warranty. Around 12 different warnings, stop start not available, ESC not available, couldn’t select driving modes and it was even trying to steer in a weird way. everywhere I looked on the Internet told me it could be the main computer etc and likely to cost thousands! It was an ABS sensor, 15 minute job and 40 quid for the parts. It’s worth noting that you can buy a fairly decent scanner for £100 and get a good start on what might be wrong with a modern car.
@seanryan325 Oh I guarantee it did, husband is an auto electrician for Jaguar. Moving the seat back and forth over time would have damaged the trapped wire.
Great upload. Most consumer situations are solved through common sense, but some professions are dramatic per default, sales people from cars to insurances, bankers or financial in general. Always creating smoke to seek hiding... Your upload is refreshingly clear, very heplful in addition to common sense, thank you!
You are being to kind, I have no doubt you are more than aware that the dealer and their legal representatives are well aware of the law, they just hope the customer isn't.
I bought a Jaguar from a main dealer which had a problem that they refused to acknowledge so I resolved it myself and stopped paying the Jaguar finance twenty years ago. Apart from a couple of letters I never heard anything and still have the car.
A lot of people seem to be having a go at Jaguar. This isn't just a problem with Jaguar. My wife has a Ford Fiesta. The engine management light came on so we took it to the Ford main dealership in our area. They charge my wife £3,000+ and weren't able to resolve the issue. In desperation we took it to a small local garage. They diagnosed the fault within a few hours and charge a few hundred pounds. The mechanic was extremely pleasant and helpful unlike the Ford dealership who were very dismissive when we challenged what they had done for the horrendous bill my wife received.
Did I hear that correctly? A judge may not be aware of the relevant parts of the law under which he is expected to make a judgment? Is it not incumbent upon him then, before the case commences, to make sure that he is?
You can only trust a specialist independent garage. I also have a Jaguar. My Jaguar specialist is £75 per hour and instinctively finds the faults. Simply because 9 times out of ten they have experienced the same fault before. Can save you £thousands!!
Rubbish. Virtually anything can cause drain on the electrical system and plugging a gizmo into the obd port is not going to tell you diddly squat where it is or on which component. It is just a case of going through everything and trying to isolate it and work out what component is draining the system. Even on the diagnostics through the obd a lot of fault codes are thrown up by another sensor or component or even corroded connectors can throw up a false fault code.
man, nightmare. electricals are a fkn nightmare to trace, i had an issue where my car would just NOT start randomly - absolutely nothing when you turned the key. turned out the earth strap fixing to the car body was loose.
My son bought a used Range Rover approved vehicle a few years ago with the same sort of battery discharge problem. They dealer had it back four times under warranty and never fixed it but took it back with a fair px. Out of warranty you may be berrer off going to a brand specialist, not genuine dealer. Loads are around and usually charge less and may have more experience and give better service than some dealerships.
My brother had a Range Rover it was so faulty and went in for repair so often. That one day when my brother started it up, the on board computer asked if they were doing the usual commute to the main dealer.
I was sorry to hear your battery drain experience. I would expect a competent auto-electrician to trace that fault in a couple of hours, probably much less, it isn't difficult for heavy battery drains like the one you described. Unfortunately, most dealers and garages do not employ an auto-electrician but unless the consumer has a reasonable level of knowledge they are unlikely to be aware of this.
Thank you. My friend had an issue, just like this. Second hand Jag from a trader. Driving 15 minutes latest warming sign no coolant. Ok, benifit of the doubt, pull into petrol station tops up, allows car to cool down. Hour or so later, same thing, limp mode. No coolant . There was a hole/leak after struggling to get hold of them on the phone. Lots of time wasted. Dealer wouldn't return the vehicle to. A whole day lost, nothing but stress and half a deposit lost. Crazy. The dealer is in the outskirts of Luton.
Really good topic to cover. Thanks. I have unfortunately also met ‘trained’ car dealers of various brands who have conveniently interpreted the legislation in their favour.
Could you do a similar episode on new property purchases. With new apartments getting a schedule of defects remedied can be extremely hard work - even when a substantial (very) purchase price arises.
The Jaguar horror story is playing out in our house. We have jaguar x350 xj8. Sitting in the garage that we can’t get a part for, having already replaced the radiator and other parts we need yet another part no longer in stock. The car is much admired when we’re out but if we don’t get the part it’ll go for scrap. Built in obsolescence
Electrical fault finding on a car can be a headache, but if the tech is a qualified car electrician or any other form of electrician, it shold not take more than a day to find the circuit causing the problem. I had one on my Discovery - its an older TD5 model, and it took me only around 3 hours to find a fault that was causing battery drain (I am an electrical engineer) and then about 20 minutes to then find the exact location of the issue - seat heater - easy to fix. We had a new Discovery D5, at 42,000 miles it went in for a major service, the main stealer failed to put new oil in, thus when they started it the engine siezed, they first argued that it was not their issue, JLR refused a new engine as it was not their fault, eventually I convinced the main stealer that it was in their interests to replace the engine because it was their fault. After 30,000 miles, roughly, this new engine developed faults that caused it to break down regularly, we had changed from the main stealer to an approved independent, who found out the engine they had put into to the Disco was not new, it had been removed from a test vehicle by JLR and had covered an estimated 100,000 miles. Some legal letters exchanged, the afore mentioned main stealer CEO agreed for a new engine to be fitted, shipped direct from JLR to the independent who fitted it at the cost of the main stealer. Two months after that was done we sold the car - it was just not a good one and we wanted nothing to do with it. JLR are off our purchase list. I still have my 20 yr old Discovery - I can work on that - but we have got rid of my Mercedes (financial sink hole) and bought a Kia Hybrid - brilliant car, high quality, 1/3rd the cost of the Discovery, just as many bells and whistles and does what we need.
Main Stealer 😅👍. JLR are not good enough. People are quickly becoming wise to them. These so called lesser brands are proving to be far superior than JLR.
Parasitic draws of power are a common thing in vehicles, and because of the number of components can be insanely difficult to diagnose, an example is the a/c fails ,compressor is working ok, the cause may be the clutch actuator failed or a refrigerant leak, if its a leak in the evaporator coil unit, it is a mammoth task to find, let alone repair. Cars are a cost to us, but the repair bill can be worse.
im doing a LLM contract module atm and i didnt even know this (s22(6)). Contract is a struggle for me lol, you would make a great lecturer. I wont forget this now.
My son had a similar problem with his jeep. Noone could find the problem so I suggested he have a power of is connection switch installed under the bonnet. As long as he does this the vehicle does not drain it's battery and noone can steal it unless they open the bonnet and look! No greasy tools to play with required and very cheap to have installed.
Let me tell you about when a Porsche was in for routine maintenance...it was driven back to the home...and was written off en route due to the dealer's driver's incompetence. Most importantly, the driver was not harmed so please don't worry on that score.
It’s a bit like a Custody clock when a prisoner goes to hospital, the Custody clock stops and doesn’t restart until the prisoner is booked back in to Custody 👍
First task is to put a DC clamp meter on and find out what the drain value is (max allowed 20 to 50 mA) Then pull the fuses one by one until it till it stops . Also it could be relays or alternator diode these can be unplugged .Don't think under seat wiring fused but can be unplugged which allows seat removal . Rally quick disconnect terminal for racing or boats is better than removing it each time with spanner.
Having worked with over my time ex dealer mechanics i will say many are poor and because of the training and systems they have to fiollow they really lack the think out the box skills , just because its a make dealer doesnt mean they really know how to troubleshoot and if its warranty they will be poor.
Sale date is 'Zero months in service'. 30 days is '1 month in service'. 6 months is 6 months in service. 12 months is 1 year in service. Jaguar UK Warranty is 36 months Jaguar USA & Canada Warranty is 48 months. Within 1 month in service, take it to dealer. The day you take it back is the 'Time in Service' until you get the car back. Repeated faults. You can demand a 'Buy back', or repairs under 'Good will'. Jaguar Cars 'bought back' about 50 cars per year. 200,000 cars produced in a year. That's when I was in the Warranty Reporting Dept. Before Dec 2020. I'm retired.
This short term right to reject, extension is a really eye opener. Thank you so much for airing this. Your advice is so valuable. Perhaps the Government should set up a Ministry to appoint a Secrets of Consumer Law Minister. I'd vote for you BBB.
It’s unfortunate what happened with your Jaguar but modern cars are complex. Having said that going by the current draw you were experiencing would not have been difficult to find, wherever you took it seemed typical of garages without the personal with experience to do this hence your bill. At my current rate I would anticipate around £250 and fixed within a couple of days. I have an always do communicate with my customers regarding ongoing repairs.
Black Belt Barrister but White Belt Car Buyer. Jaguar, has always been synonymous with aggravation and depreciation. Constructively, I subscribe to "Which" magazine. It does an annual review of cars in terms of short, mid and long term reliability. Jaguar, scores badly in the short term but better in the medium term. Personally, I only buy used, tried and tested used cars.
Daniel I vividly recall something similar being discussed on our Sunday morning presentations. Thanks for the review. My nephew had an M4 CS a few weeks ago, upon the first service (1250 miles) they accidentally damaged the carbon seat. Long story short, they were quick to react but offered a repair, l recall advice from you years ago so we refused. In fairness, they totally agreed and the seat has been replaced with new. Gold star for BMW. Best
As someone whos spent many years working within a prestige dealership i can confirm that new cars are not necessarily free from having damage repaired before it goes on sale or is even sold , i have seen a new customer smash into 3 new cars on a forecourt and all the dealer did was send them to an approved bodyshop to get them repaired. They then put them back up for sale as new , i wont name the dealership but i will say they were all top spec Bmws though ..
What happens if, say, a garage carries out a repair which then lasts for two weeks (taking you outside the one month period) and then breaks down with the same problem again? Can you reject, or do you have to accept another "repair".
Had the 30 day issue when buying from Cinch, 3 days in tensioner broke on drive belt and destroyed the engine. In to Cinch preferred dealer that day. 14 weeks later get the car back and after first real use we realise there are a multitude of other issues so contact cinch to reject. It took another 4 months of backwards and forwards before they collected it as they were insistent the 30 days (and their own 14 days) had expired!
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Imagine a lawyer being surprised by someone billing by the hour spent with no end in sight.....
Beautifully put .
😂 Good observation.
LOL. True dat.
Yeah you ain't kidding ha.
I shouldn't laugh.........but I did.
Dear Jaguar meet Bud Light.
And Boots.
Absolutely
lol soooo true
See the speech made by their Director of Brand Strategy: Santino Pietrosanti. He speaks but doesn't appear to be concerned with cars.
Boycott - Pus ‘n Boots
Jag's new ad without a car in it but a non woman woman in it will probably kill the brand and spare people financial pain. The mid life crisis guys will want to drive something else.
They won’t use that advert in the home of Jaguar - India where Tata is based.
Even before this whenever I see someone in a modern Jag I feel sorry for them.
Jaguars are more aimed at old men, not mid life... They depreciate fast and is a display of wealth by showing how often you can afford to change your car
Not sure I'm convinced.
Viz cartoon strip trannymagnet man at Jaguar
Gentlemen let's not be hasty here. Let's at least find out how big a penis they are packing
Here’s a big tip from,one who has been down the the road and comes from a family of engineers: don’t buy expensive cars.Simple. Buy an older, simpler car. Choose a well regarded one and one that was widely sold back on the day. Spares will be plentiful and amazingly cheap, mechanics will know all the wrinkles and in a pinch you can just walk away from a car if it gets to be a pain in the arse and buy another one.
So true! My Father used to say "less things there are in a car, less things will break" :-D
In the 1960s the foreign secretary in Wilsons govt was a piss artist called George Brown.
He always drove jags but famously said 'I don't buy them new, I buy them when they are two years old and by then all the problems with them have been repaired'.
Nothings changed since then.
Thought that was 2 jags Preston! 🤨
@@mr.richardryan7506 I remember Brown, I think it was when Hugh Gaitskell died in 1963, they dragged Brown live on the evening news, he was truly sloshed for all the Country to see. Labour won the election in 1964 though. Wilsons car was a Rover and it had a super large ashtray in the back for his pipe!
@@thevegandragon4676 You mean 2 Jags Prescott, but he was part of the Blair lot.
Much like Harlys 🧐
Which, magazine rates cars over the short, medium and long term in terms of reliability. Jaguar, scores badly in the short term, but gets better in the medium term. So, probably some truth to it.
My story. 😔
I bought a three year old XF, trading in an S-Type, from a Jaguar main stealer.
A beautiful XF in Premium Luxury spec but upgraded to what would become a Portfolio spec.
My dream car.
It was serviced by Jaguar and in the time I had it, it had well over £10K of warranty repairs. I spent more time without it than I had it.
Then, less than a month out of warranty, the engine ate itself.
I had an AA inspection and they determined that the DPF had failed causing diesel to get into the engine oil.
I ended up dealing with JLR, directly, and the eventual outcome was them basically saying, ‘Go ahead, try sueing us.’
It caused so much anguish and distress that I decided to scrap a 6 year old Jaguar.
I lost so much money that my next car was a Fiesta which I bought for £100.
It still hurts , now.
Shocking company selling shocking cars.
Gutted for you, never had it that bad.
Seems a bit silly to scrap a 6 year old car because of a bad engine, surely you could have sourced another engine and had it fitted without spending more than a car that new is worth
something was not right with that AA diagnosis. dpf is located behind engine on the exhaust pipe. it has no connection with diesel injectors nor engine. was it just clogged?? weird.
terrible experience, but please be advised as any good mechanic will tell you that small amounts of fuel will always end up in the oil - this is one reason why regular oil changes are important, and earlier than what the manufacturer recommends - they want them to fail but last long enough so it fails out of warrantee.
Oh that's a terrible experience. I also had a Jaguar XF 3.2D Premium Luxury. Bought it used with 47K on the clock, and put 100,000 miles on it in short order. I used it to drive between Aberdeen and Durham twice a week (around 900 miles round trip). Never had an issue. The fact that it was being used for (very) long journeys probably helped it a lot.
I've always heard they were bad. That new advert was probably a good warning for consumers to avoid them.
It comes with the new trans-mission.
Fortunately when my car failed on the forecourt on day one and the garage begged to be allowed to fix it I knew this. Following two further instances, the third instance I refused and I said I wanted my money back. They refused because I had gone over their version of the 14 day right to return. However what a kerfuffle with them sending a rather large man to "inspect" the vehicle and literally. Try to bully me into letting them have another go at it. I said no, he said that was all they would do I advised that if the money wasn't back on my card within 7 working days I would sue for damage etc etc as well. He drove away, the big boss rang me to say he would refund. Amazing what sticking to your guns does.
In any negotiation, the other side will push back on your first attempt. Even if they say if you are thinking of suing us, keep in mind that we have won every case. For one thing, it is probably not true that they’ve never returned a customer’s money.
I had much the same experience, also with Jaguar. New car, after a couple of days the power steering started squealing, there was a knocking from the suspension and the passenger window leaked. Took it back, they had it for 2 months, picked it up and a couple of days later, problems returned. So back to the dealer, asked for a refund and got the "Sorry sir, it's over 30 days" routine. I showed them the CRA section, they still refused, so I took them to court. Quick and pretty painless, judge basically just asked if I was willing to accept a replacement, and I refused because after that experience, I never wanted to do business with Jaguar again.
I think the dealers are well aware of the law, but just assume their customers do not, or pressurise their customers into waiving their rights. There is a good reason why dealers are often referred to as "stealers" after all.
It's only good for winning drag races.
Have you seen Jaguar's latest advert?! What the actual f**k?!
Jaguar are finished.
"Create exuberant". Bro, do you even grammar?
I though ti was a clip from "Zulu".
Boycott
@@onedaywewill😂😂😂
When I was a little girl I have so many memories of my grandad dad and 2 uncles all with their heads under the bonnet of a car and I was always ferrying cups of tea out to them desperately hoping I would be asked to hold or pass them a spanner or anything, happy days
Sweet, did you end up working on your own car's
@johngibson3837 unfortunately not life had other plans for me
This happened to me, the garage just refused. I had purchased this through finance, I contacted the finance company, discussed my problem, and informed them I will not be paying for the car as it’s not fit for purpose, 24 hours it was collected and refunded.
I hope lots of people see your comment.
Wow, great result!
It’s the finance company that owns your car. This can make it difficult to return
The 30-day rejection period SHOULD (in law and in my opinion) start AGAIN for the full 30 days after such a repair made within the original 30-day period, with the latest 30-day period now being taken as the original period.
30 days is way too short. The cost and complexity of todays cars, it should be at least 6 months to a year. Or even up to its first MOT.
@ I agree, 30 days is completely out of keeping given the complexity of cars these days and their propensity to exhibit faults. But even within the existing law this ‘remaining balance of the 30 days’ completely undermines any reasonable protection. I.e. “The law is *a* ass!”
allways frustrating when large businesses ignore/break the law insisting they are following company policy. like a companies policy ever trumps legal regulations.
Thank heavens for the black belt barrister. He has clarified so many every day law dilemmas for us the public. So many thanks to you sir for your dedication to your channel.
I had a Jaguar too - in fact I have had 7 now. The last one I had has turned me off for life. A serious design flaw caused the engine to blow, a replacement was unavailable because demand is far higher than supply - this was the 3.0 diesel v6 engine developed by Peugeot. The smaller Ingenium engines have problems, the 5.0 v8 petrol engines fail due to plastic parts on the cam chain guides. It's unforgivable, they have been building them long enough but penny pinching is ruining the product.
Been a problem for a long time. Purchasing departments under pressure to reduce costs from bean counters quite often getting a new supplier without consulting anyone. In my experience anyway.
To fault find an electrical parasitic draw - get a multimeter and connect it to your battery. Then pull one fuse at a time until the voltage drops on the multimeter. When you find the fuse you will know which circuit to look at. Doing this will save you £££'s and then you can find a mechanic if needed to fix it
I thought this too hearing the story, taking months and charging thousands is far from fair, it was clearly a skill and or process issue that resulted in this timeliness and bill.
I forgot to say that you need to set the multimeter to amps and connect it inbetween the battery negative terminal and negative connector. Plenty of tutorial vids on YT
@@danielriddell441 I assumed you'd meant to measure current, though depending on how strong the load is you may be able to check in volts too and wait until you see a rise in the voltage but this is way less instantaneous than measuring amps and nowhere near as reliable.
Exactly what I was going to say. It is pretty easy to find out which circuit the draw is coming from with nothing more than a multimeter, a fuse puller and a saturday morning.
If the draw is coming from a non essential circuit, like the electric seats, you could just pull it and use the car.
Once you've found the circuit a thermal camera can pinpoint where the short is if you can get at the wires in question to look. Otherwise you'll be tracing the wires for that circuit and paying attention to anywhere they move, can be strained or pass by anything that can scrape them.
It isnt that easy especially on a modern jag that has multple can systems , touching fuses just wakes stuff up .
From my memory, in the 80's the Dealerships complained to the Manufacturers that people would buy a car and then take it back to their favourite local garage for servicing. Manufacturers then started to make a lot of things dealer only. Vauxhall produced deep recessed spark plugs and copywrited the tool. Old cars had a body that would rust pretty quickly ensuring new car sales over time. Then came the 7 year body warranties from foreign competitors etc and every manufacturer upped their game. But, the game is to sell new cars. So, you now have fully loaded cars with so many electronic and computer components that they are ticking time bombs. Everyone knows that you need to keep your PC backed up in case it fails, but consumers still buy brand new cars without giving reliability a second thought. The problem as you have found out, if it is an electrical fault it literally could be anything and anywhere in the vehicle.
One last thing, headlight bulb on an old car £2 and five minutes to fit. Now, you could have to strip the whole of the front end off a vehicle to be able to access the headlight cluster. The light could cost £150 plus and you'll have labour charges on top. Me thinks that we would all be better driving classic cars.
Keep up the good work. My go to channel.
My dad asked me why I bought an 18 year old car (45k miles when I bought it) this is why- sure it's a Merc and repairs will likely still be costly but i love how it looks and it's not stuffed to the brim with needless creature comforts. The A/C works perfectly, that's plenty for me
£150 for a headlamp? A friend of mine bought a top of the range Citroën for his missus, and she damaged a headlamp in a car park ding. The whole cluster had to be replaced and the part alone cost over £1000 before VAT. 😱 😱 😱
@@robm8809 No, I know that you can pay way over that, but until it happens to you most people wouldn't believe it. I prefer the £2 option every time. All the best
@@Ultravox1981 Me too! All the best. :)
AVOID Jaguar at all costs. The ipace nearly killed me. It decided to self steer across 2 lanes of the M4. Plus god only knows how many other issues. They are pretty cars, belong in a museum, not on the road.
XJR on the drive ICE rules
Not the transmission system. An ABS sensor failed, so it steered the car. It doesn’t make any sense, but might affect any Jaguar. But agree the ipace does have more than its fair share of problems. Being lied to by the dealer added insult to injury.
Sad, such a big name, and such behavior. (consumers and workers suffer managerial inferior-performance).
@@MakePumps16 So is this an EV or an ice car you're talking about
@@michaelcarney6280 It was a EV, but the problem could occur with an ICE. It was a software problem. Somehow JLR had managed to let an ABS sensor problem affect the automatic lane control of the car. It steered itself without reason.
I work as a super yacht Sprayer and a friend I used to work with was from the car painting in, he worked at a BMW dealership and told me stories of brand new BMW that had horrendous accidents before being sold and he had to fix them. Some of these "new" cars you see in the showroom are complete mess.
Many years in the retail motor trade has taught me you should only buy German or Japanese cars. My wife has owned three cars in twenty one years all Japanese and different makes all have been faultless.
Love german cars. Had a 6 yr old VW passat. Bought 2nd hand 3 yrs old. Driving to germany on holiday the turbo went. Went to a local vw garage in germany expecting a pretty large bill. Repaired within 4 days, didn't charge a single penny. Said it should not have gone faulty at that age. Brilliant service.
Toyota all the way, bought a Toyota IQ new in 2009 and never had a problem other than normal wear and tear items.
@@Man_v_Cars My Toyota Hybrid over 8 years old, faultless.
I've had German cars for quite some time. All have had issues, my current A6 will go to the great scrap yard in ths sky. My wife's Hondas have been faultless almost. But next car in the New Year will hopefully be a Lexus, the most reliable and cheapest car to run over 10 years.
We have a 2012 Toyota RAV4 ... for the most part its been fine, but its not been "faultless". We had to replace the drive shaft last year !! What a horrible sound for a car to make that was :)
A barrister surprised by someone else taking the piss.
In the 1960's it was recommended that you buy two jags. One to drive and one for spares. John Prescott (RIP) knew this. Nice to see some things don't change
Taking a parasitic draw issue to a main dealer. Terrible plan. You need an old school mechanic whos good with wiring. Most wont want to deal with it and certainly most car dealers wont.
Drive expensive cars, pay expensive bills.
No consumer asked for any of the complexity that makes recent cars disposable rubbish.
Disposable and unrepairable by the "owner"
Always pay in part for a car using a credit card. It gives you incredible leverage in the event of a problem, to the extent the credit card company can take ALL the money back. I've done that.
Easy diagnosis. Ammeter on the battery. See the drain on the ammeter. Pull fuses until the drain stops. That fuse narrows down the source of the drain. Investigate that one area and wiring.
Simples!
My husband’s Mercedes gives him endless trouble. My Honda Jazz, nothing.
3 bars in does the stereo play random notes?
This happened to me. My brand new Jaguar F pace broke down within the 30 days. I had the right to reject but the problem was the waiting list for a new car was months (all brands).The car was repaired after 6 weeks. Going forward the Jag is 14 months old and when I went to replace it with my 3rd new Jaguar F pace they told me I can but only with what was left in stock because they have stopped production. The ones in stock didn't have the colour or spec I wanted. I have seen the new advert for Jaguar and feel that Jaguar have let down their loyal customers. Obviously now I won't be buying a Jaguar because I am not ready to go electric. So now I am looking at other brands.
If you were that regular a Jag purchaser you'd have been well aware of Jag stopping all production
Buy an old Skoda and achieve inner peace :)
@@davidgavin7280 I wasn't. When I first heard of it on the Internet I phoned the dealer. They told me not to worry and that the F Pace was still in production until next year. Then they phoned me to say that all production had stopped and it was a shock to them also.
My friend has a F Pace. He's had nothing but expensive problems since day one. They're more focused on sexualising the brand. On their shoulders be it. RIP Jaguar.
Buy a Lexus, I've had 11 so far and never had a single problem that wasn't solved very quickly. I've always been given a courtesy car and the dealership experience is second to none! You really are made to feel like family. One big plus has been that all repairs and service are subject to a warranty! Brilliant cars.
Sshh! Don't tell everyone. The prices will go up.
shocking that lawyers and judges dont know all the details of the law - imagine another professional saying this! they would be sued - time to reform our lawyers
No-one can be expected to know everything and there are an insane number of laws, many with hundreds of clauses, each dealing with specific situations. The key in any profession is not to know all the answers but to know how to find out.
After seeing their latest add I'd be too embarrassed to be seen driving one.
I've owned many cars over the years including Jaguar, but a few years back I took a gamble on a Mazda6 and have never changed brands since......so reliable due to a manual gearbox and a naturally aspirated engine.
I lost £10k on my Mazda6, in less than 2 years...turbo went, headgasket failed and, after all the money I spent on those issues, it still had an overheating problem. We tried everything, but couldn't get to the bottom of the fault. Such a shame, because it was a beautiful car. Maybe mine was the last one off the production line, on a Friday afternoon 🤔
@@AnnieRed66 Was it a diesel? ....or some of the US versions 2.5 petrol came with a turbo.
@SilverbackMatt01 Yeah, it was a 2.2 diesel auto. Just buying it, it was the most money I've ever spent on a car. Gone back to cheap and cheerful, after that disaster.
I have been with Toyota for 32 years I must say never had any issues or problems not like I had with British cars before I went Japanese
@@AnnieRed66 Yes the 2.2 diesel was the problem child of the Mazda engine range, shame really.....went like a rocket.
I’m an 18 year old electrical and electronics engineering student - I have always had strong views on consumer rights & right to repair, despite the fact I’ll probably be forced into signing NDAs when I start working designing electronics/electrical systems. Funnily enough, my dad’s 2019 discovery sport suddenly developed the exact same fault yesterday. Probably some parasitic load in there arising from a fault. I remember when he first brought it, I said “with all this technology comes more room for issues” and my word has prevailed. Unrelated, i’m also planning on becoming a magistrate!
Oh do feck off.
if thats the case, consider changing your user name as you don't want it coming back to bite you in 30 years. Good luck with your plans.
Glad to hear that.
I have been doing this for 53 years so from DC generators to ECMs it’s tricky when things fail out in the field.
Good luck! I retired this year from the other end of the same career. Always try to keep your interests wide, there are often opportunities to switch threads, I have worked in a huge range of technologies and its been enlightening and rewarding.
😂@@davidgavin7280
It was in the garage that long I forgot I had it 😂😂😂😂🤣🤣🤣🤣🏴🏴🏴🏴🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧
Excellent advice. Thank you 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
I'm 60 years old and don't recall Jags not having at least electrical faults wrong with them.
They should have been allowed to wither on the vine in the sixties when they were effectively bankrupt !
@@AJ-qn6gd I thought that they were all given to: One firm to rule them all and in the dark something something.
My 1988 Citroen AX broke down going to a mountain pass in France a year later.
It started to lose power and came to a halt, wheezing like I di when going up the stars nowadays.
I opened the bonnet and noticed that parts of the top of the engine were no longer there.
I reasoned that it must be the air intake box, but it was nowhere to be seen.
Luckily, after a short walk down the hill , I saw bits of black plastic on the road.
The pieces just clipped back together very easily and I was able to mount it back on the engine.
I even got some applause from the restaurant near to where I had broken down
Now try doing that with a modern car.
Excellent video, it’s about time this issue was aired more publicly. Also applies to touring caravans and motorhomes. Waiting to see if you mention the Consumer Credit Act ? WELL DONE YOU DID!!!!! I used to teach this to dealer management and sales staff. I am a companies worst customer!
Never had those problems with my Lada Riva …. 🚙 😊
They ran on a dynamo, like the old fashioned bike lights, stop pedalling and the bulb goes out.
I've had two Ladas. The last one was an Estate. Drove like a tank but so reliable. Got it up to 96mph on M25. Drove away in snow straightaway when others were struggling. They were real work horses.
Most problems with modern cars, regardless of brand are electrical. So many sensors, accessories, gadgets etc etc!!🙄🙄🇬🇧
Modern cars are just too complicated. I want a car that's mechanically basic, electrically straightforward
GO WOKE… GO BROKE!
Your turn next Jaguar! 😖
Granted in today's snow the Landrover has its advantages but my personal preference is to drive a 1970 Rover or one of the equally ancient Triumphs we still have - simple, never a problem, easy to fix, no lights shutting the car down, no demands for this or that. I have enough trouble suffering an abusive relationship with the government without adding one from my car into the mix. I would not accept a new car as a gift.
I had a XJ8. It was very thirsty but was lovely to drive and was reliable. This was back in the 1990s.
Not quite car related but from someone who works in IT, I can't even count the times that someone has called me up to report a particular problem and then asked how long and how much it will take to fix before we've even had chance to look at the issue. Sure, in some cases you can make an educated guess at what it might be but that is often speculation until we have access to it not least because in many cases the customer either doesn't or can't describe the issue to us in a way that makes sense, doesn't answer honestly to follow up questions we ask to add clarification or just gets frustrated with us because they are trying to cover up something they have knowingly caused and instead of helping us to help them, they just want a fixed upfront price/timescale there and then before we've had time to investigate the issue properly and thorougly. I do sympathise with people working in other sectors who have the same thing, whether it's automotive, healthcare etc.
I suspect anyone who has had anything to do with solicitors and their colossal fee structures will surely be thinking BBB has been "hoist with his own petard".
u hit that on head steve..up to 750 an hour for barristers...as they say if u cant afford to run and repair it to be in that elite dont friggin buy it..plenty of vids from down to earth joe blogs that have found probs and said be wary these not reliable...is that a statistic of elite brands now build something unreliable and reap what u sow lol..back in the day volvo owner demanded his product to achieve 1 million miles...and they did.
New car it’s all coded. Get yourself the software or a code reader Rhian’s what they charge you £100 for. Gives a code and the fault. Had bmw do a recall. Bust something, charged me to look at it, charged me to do a fix that didn’t work. Complained. BMW said they trusted the dealer. Got the software myself. Figured it out on TH-cam and fixed it myself. Knowing what I know now it’s amazing to work out how they didn’t k ow how to fix it. Mind boggling as the software tells you exactly what to do step by step and it works.
Here in the States we call it the Lemon law.
This happened to us, its good to know this if we ever find ourselves in the same situation.
I had a problem on my Alfa Romeo Giulia just out of warranty. Around 12 different warnings, stop start not available, ESC not available, couldn’t select driving modes and it was even trying to steer in a weird way. everywhere I looked on the Internet told me it could be the main computer etc and likely to cost thousands! It was an ABS sensor, 15 minute job and 40 quid for the parts. It’s worth noting that you can buy a fairly decent scanner for £100 and get a good start on what might be wrong with a modern car.
Wire's caught under seats is a common problem at Jaguar....It should never have past their testing.
I doubt it happened in production.
@seanryan325 Oh I guarantee it did, husband is an auto electrician for Jaguar. Moving the seat back and forth over time would have damaged the trapped wire.
Utter amazing, the Japanese would have bound better-insulated conductors in some sort of plastic conduit to end the trouble.
@@elenastansbie9940 Owners to J engineers: "please re-engineer your cable-sets under the seats, and retrofit at no charge".
What testing!
Great upload. Most consumer situations are solved through common sense, but some professions are dramatic per default, sales people from cars to insurances, bankers or financial in general. Always creating smoke to seek hiding... Your upload is refreshingly clear, very heplful in addition to common sense, thank you!
They're called "Stealerships" for a reason... 🙄😂
You are being to kind, I have no doubt you are more than aware that the dealer and their legal representatives are well aware of the law, they just hope the customer isn't.
I bought a Jaguar from a main dealer which had a problem that they refused to acknowledge so I resolved it myself and stopped paying the Jaguar finance twenty years ago. Apart from a couple of letters I never heard anything and still have the car.
A lot of people seem to be having a go at Jaguar. This isn't just a problem with Jaguar. My wife has a Ford Fiesta. The engine management light came on so we took it to the Ford main dealership in our area. They charge my wife £3,000+ and weren't able to resolve the issue. In desperation we took it to a small local garage. They diagnosed the fault within a few hours and charge a few hundred pounds. The mechanic was extremely pleasant and helpful unlike the Ford dealership who were very dismissive when we challenged what they had done for the horrendous bill my wife received.
I have been an auto electrician for 53 years, nowadays everything built is essentially using the same technology they can all fail and do.
Did I hear that correctly? A judge may not be aware of the relevant parts of the law under which he is expected to make a judgment? Is it not incumbent upon him then, before the case commences, to make sure that he is?
How can you expect anyone to be able to keep up with every law?
Are you stupid?
This can get rather complicated where, the car is returned saying it is fixed, but the fault remains.
You can only trust a specialist independent garage. I also have a Jaguar. My Jaguar specialist is £75 per hour and instinctively finds the faults. Simply because 9 times out of ten they have experienced the same fault before. Can save you £thousands!!
Garages have a diagnostic tool which identifies the electric problems within 5 minutes in the USA. Scam.
lol .
Rubbish. Virtually anything can cause drain on the electrical system and plugging a gizmo into the obd port is not going to tell you diddly squat where it is or on which component. It is just a case of going through everything and trying to isolate it and work out what component is draining the system. Even on the diagnostics through the obd a lot of fault codes are thrown up by another sensor or component or even corroded connectors can throw up a false fault code.
you have no idea what youre talking about
man, nightmare. electricals are a fkn nightmare to trace, i had an issue where my car would just NOT start randomly - absolutely nothing when you turned the key. turned out the earth strap fixing to the car body was loose.
I expect mechanics have much to complain about lawyers' hourly rates. 😄
My son bought a used Range Rover approved vehicle a few years ago with the same sort of battery discharge problem. They dealer had it back four times under warranty and never fixed it but took it back with a fair px. Out of warranty you may be berrer off going to a brand specialist, not genuine dealer. Loads are around and usually charge less and may have more experience and give better service than some dealerships.
They're the worst vehicles for reliability...
My brother had a Range Rover it was so faulty and went in for repair so often. That one day when my brother started it up, the on board computer asked if they were doing the usual commute to the main dealer.
I was sorry to hear your battery drain experience. I would expect a competent auto-electrician to trace that fault in a couple of hours, probably much less, it isn't difficult for heavy battery drains like the one you described.
Unfortunately, most dealers and garages do not employ an auto-electrician but unless the consumer has a reasonable level of knowledge they are unlikely to be aware of this.
Correct. all my working life doing just this.
This is relevant for ALL MANUFACTURERS, not only Jaguar.
Thank you. My friend had an issue, just like this. Second hand Jag from a trader. Driving 15 minutes latest warming sign no coolant. Ok, benifit of the doubt, pull into petrol station tops up, allows car to cool down. Hour or so later, same thing, limp mode. No coolant . There was a hole/leak after struggling to get hold of them on the phone. Lots of time wasted. Dealer wouldn't return the vehicle to. A whole day lost, nothing but stress and half a deposit lost. Crazy. The dealer is in the outskirts of Luton.
Really good topic to cover. Thanks. I have unfortunately also met ‘trained’ car dealers of various brands who have conveniently interpreted the legislation in their favour.
Could you do a similar episode on new property purchases. With new apartments getting a schedule of defects remedied can be extremely hard work - even when a substantial (very) purchase price arises.
I drive a 2010 Toyota Tacoma , 14yrs old 👍 All I've done in 14yrs is oil/gas , set of tires and breaks 👍Zero problems
Toyota Hybrid, 8 years flawless motoring.
The Jaguar horror story is playing out in our house. We have jaguar x350 xj8. Sitting in the garage that we can’t get a part for, having already replaced the radiator and other parts we need yet another part no longer in stock. The car is much admired when we’re out but if we don’t get the part it’ll go for scrap. Built in obsolescence
Which part?
Electrical fault finding on a car can be a headache, but if the tech is a qualified car electrician or any other form of electrician, it shold not take more than a day to find the circuit causing the problem. I had one on my Discovery - its an older TD5 model, and it took me only around 3 hours to find a fault that was causing battery drain (I am an electrical engineer) and then about 20 minutes to then find the exact location of the issue - seat heater - easy to fix.
We had a new Discovery D5, at 42,000 miles it went in for a major service, the main stealer failed to put new oil in, thus when they started it the engine siezed, they first argued that it was not their issue, JLR refused a new engine as it was not their fault, eventually I convinced the main stealer that it was in their interests to replace the engine because it was their fault. After 30,000 miles, roughly, this new engine developed faults that caused it to break down regularly, we had changed from the main stealer to an approved independent, who found out the engine they had put into to the Disco was not new, it had been removed from a test vehicle by JLR and had covered an estimated 100,000 miles. Some legal letters exchanged, the afore mentioned main stealer CEO agreed for a new engine to be fitted, shipped direct from JLR to the independent who fitted it at the cost of the main stealer. Two months after that was done we sold the car - it was just not a good one and we wanted nothing to do with it. JLR are off our purchase list. I still have my 20 yr old Discovery - I can work on that - but we have got rid of my Mercedes (financial sink hole) and bought a Kia Hybrid - brilliant car, high quality, 1/3rd the cost of the Discovery, just as many bells and whistles and does what we need.
Main Stealer 😅👍. JLR are not good enough. People are quickly becoming wise to them. These so called lesser brands are proving to be far superior than JLR.
What does your story tell us? Jaguar don't know how to build cars! Go woke, go broke! Bye Jaguar!
Parasitic draws of power are a common thing in vehicles, and because of the number of components can be insanely difficult to diagnose, an example is the a/c fails ,compressor is working ok, the cause may be the clutch actuator failed or a refrigerant leak, if its a leak in the evaporator coil unit, it is a mammoth task to find, let alone repair. Cars are a cost to us, but the repair bill can be worse.
Car servicing is one of the biggest rip-offs in the UK.
I had a jaguar....and atari jaguar. I saw the new ad and i thought....yeah i am sure that will sell cars...
im doing a LLM contract module atm and i didnt even know this (s22(6)). Contract is a struggle for me lol, you would make a great lecturer. I wont forget this now.
My son had a similar problem with his jeep. Noone could find the problem so I suggested he have a power of is connection switch installed under the bonnet. As long as he does this the vehicle does not drain it's battery and noone can steal it unless they open the bonnet and look!
No greasy tools to play with required and very cheap to have installed.
Thank you for the info, I will keep it in my back pocket
Let me tell you about when a Porsche was in for routine maintenance...it was driven back to the home...and was written off en route due to the dealer's driver's incompetence. Most importantly, the driver was not harmed so please don't worry on that score.
What an absolutely brilliant vid, I’m sure this would help so many people. Good for you!
It’s a bit like a Custody clock when a prisoner goes to hospital, the Custody clock stops and doesn’t restart until the prisoner is booked back in to Custody 👍
If he is chained to a bed he is still in custody.
@ What exactly is your point?
First task is to put a DC clamp meter on and find out what the drain value is (max allowed 20 to 50 mA) Then pull the fuses one by one until it till it stops . Also it could be relays or alternator diode these can be unplugged .Don't think under seat wiring fused but can be unplugged which allows seat removal . Rally quick disconnect terminal for racing or boats is better than removing it each time with spanner.
Make cars cheap and simple again - like making new 2CVs and VW Beetles. Cheap - and easy to work on yourself.
Having worked with over my time ex dealer mechanics i will say many are poor and because of the training and systems they have to fiollow they really lack the think out the box skills , just because its a make dealer doesnt mean they really know how to troubleshoot and if its warranty they will be poor.
They haven't built a proper Jaguar for decades.....
F-Type and XJ were both proper jags made in recent years, in the case of the F-type till very recently.
Sale date is 'Zero months in service'.
30 days is '1 month in service'.
6 months is 6 months in service.
12 months is 1 year in service.
Jaguar UK Warranty is 36 months
Jaguar USA & Canada Warranty is 48 months.
Within 1 month in service, take it to dealer. The day you take it back is the 'Time in Service' until you get the car back.
Repeated faults. You can demand a 'Buy back', or repairs under 'Good will'. Jaguar Cars 'bought back' about 50 cars per year. 200,000 cars produced in a year. That's when I was in the Warranty Reporting Dept. Before Dec 2020. I'm retired.
Harrys Garage addressed the technical faults (similar to your problem) with high end cars, certainly worth viewing.
This short term right to reject, extension is a really eye opener. Thank you so much for airing this. Your advice is so valuable.
Perhaps the Government should set up a Ministry to appoint a Secrets of Consumer Law Minister. I'd vote for you BBB.
A lawyer talking about how a car repairer charges an hourly fee to find the problem..
How many lawyers charge a fixed fee to their customers....
It’s unfortunate what happened with your Jaguar but modern cars are complex.
Having said that going by the current draw you were experiencing would not have been difficult to find, wherever you took it seemed typical of garages without the personal with experience to do this hence your bill. At my current rate I would anticipate around £250 and fixed within a couple of days. I have an always do communicate with my customers regarding ongoing repairs.
Black Belt Barrister but White Belt Car Buyer. Jaguar, has always been synonymous with aggravation and depreciation. Constructively, I subscribe to "Which" magazine. It does an annual review of cars in terms of short, mid and long term reliability. Jaguar, scores badly in the short term but better in the medium term. Personally, I only buy used, tried and tested used cars.
Ha ha- good job you didn’t buy a Land Rover! The people in the sister Jaguar customer service team had a much easier time!
Daniel
I vividly recall something similar being discussed on our Sunday morning presentations.
Thanks for the review.
My nephew had an M4 CS a few weeks ago, upon the first service (1250 miles) they accidentally damaged the carbon seat.
Long story short, they were quick to react but offered a repair, l recall advice from you years ago so we refused. In fairness, they totally agreed and the seat has been replaced with new.
Gold star for BMW.
Best
I’ve heard some inside secrets about this new car. It’s got two gears, ‘forward and progressive’. And it runs off soy milk. 😮
Well that Jag ad should see the marketing team fired.
As someone whos spent many years working within a prestige dealership i can confirm that new cars are not necessarily free from having damage repaired before it goes on sale or is even sold , i have seen a new customer smash into 3 new cars on a forecourt and all the dealer did was send them to an approved bodyshop to get them repaired. They then put them back up for sale as new , i wont name the dealership but i will say they were all top spec Bmws though ..
The car ‘repair’ racket is indeed disgusting and should be called out!
What happens if, say, a garage carries out a repair which then lasts for two weeks (taking you outside the one month period) and then breaks down with the same problem again? Can you reject, or do you have to accept another "repair".
Had the 30 day issue when buying from Cinch, 3 days in tensioner broke on drive belt and destroyed the engine. In to Cinch preferred dealer that day. 14 weeks later get the car back and after first real use we realise there are a multitude of other issues so contact cinch to reject. It took another 4 months of backwards and forwards before they collected it as they were insistent the 30 days (and their own 14 days) had expired!