Making A Cheap Rivnut Installing Tool
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 16 ธ.ค. 2023
- G'day everyone,
In this video I will be making a quick tool to install rivet nuts / rivnuts. Rivnuts are a way to install threaded sections in this sheet metal. They work similar to a pop rivet. however they do require a special tool to install them. the cost is not too expensive, but since I won't be using these a whole lot, if I can avoid paying for the tool, I would like that.
#machining #diy - วิทยาศาสตร์และเทคโนโลยี
I use rivnuts quite frequently if you put them anywhere likely to corrode. Put some red Loctite around the section that compresses. It will stop them from spinning and reduce corrosion.
I would modify that suggestion slightly. Use the Loc-tite 609 retaining compound instead of thread retainer. ( 609 is general purpose. There is a stronger version.) I've used this on small sliding rods and needed an arbor press to separate the parts. It's wonderful stuff.
Very nice tip. I wonder how 640 would work since it has slightly higher gap filling properties
@@greenteagod It would probably work just fine. I just always have the red to hand. A spinning rivnut is a sad thing.
Just did what you said for a few fab'd mount plates for truck's engine bay. Awesome tip thank you.
Antiseize or ox guard is a much better option. Red loctite can break down or not seal properly still allowing corrosion. Plus side of anti-seize specifically sensor safe will allow you to maintain a permanent ground while preventing corrosion. Red loctite will also not stop galvanic corrosion which can be an issue when working with aluminum.
Rivnuts are adictive, once you start using them you put then in pretty much everything, so buying a Gun is prehaps not so bad after all. They also come in countersunk, but don´t hold up quite so well, in which case making a flair tool to countersink normal ones would be a nice project.
Or, make a dimple + die tool to dimple the surface of the sheet metal slightly bigger and slightly deeper than the flange of the rivnut, then the rivnut will sit flush nicely with the surface👍
There are also a hex shank type with a very small flange. Great for flush mounting, and with no chance of turning in the material
@@russcole5685Yep, the hex style are quite good, however they need an additional hex tool to punch a hex shaped hole in the panel prior to installing the hex rivnuts😁
Lol. This is very true. I bought a decent kit about a year ago thinking I just needed it for that one project. But like most tools. Once you have it you find a million different reasons to use it lol
Wait until you discover plus nuts.
Steel peg boards aren't thick enough to properly engage the hooks, but that is only half the the problem. The biggest problem is peg board holes come in two different sizes, Ø1/8" (3.2mm) and Ø1/4" (6.4mm) holes and most hook sets are advertised as "universal", meaning they work fairly well in the smaller hole peg boards but flop around like a hotdog in a hula-hoop in the larger hole boards, lol. If you have the larger hole style board you have to look for hooks that are specific to it. If you use an actual press-board peg board with the appropriate sized hooks and use the locking clips that come with most sets of hooks they work much better. Having said that, your method is way more rigid and durable. Thanks for another great video.
Bruce here,great piece of work and as a plus you thru in what to do with peg board you fix is tons better than my hot glue.
12:16 - after cutting the majority of the thrrad, the die bottoms out leaving a taper of partially cut threads. For some applications (like for pegbook hooks) this may be useful as it causes the hook to resist unscrewing.
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However other times it is annoying and you can't get the nut to seat. You need to grind a relief, an extra step that weaken the bolt.
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The solution is to flip the die over and run it back down the thread. For small threads you will get it all the way down, like how a bottoming tap works in a blind hole.
If it still won't pull down 100%, either relieve the shoulder with a dremel, or run a countersink into the nut to create a tiny counterbore.
I'd use a ratchet wrench to turn the nut
It was painful to watch how slow that must've been
Great idea
I was thinking it was an air ratchet job too.
Even better.
Reverse thread the nut and bolt to you can fix the nut in place and just use the bolt for both holding and crushing the insert
I admire your commitment to continue using a hand hack saw. I quickly went out and got the cheap 4x6 horizontal band saw from harbor freight. Honestly, for the price? It works like an absolute champ. Ive had zero stalls or anything of the sort so far from bar stock to solid round stock upwards of 2".. 4140 steel tool steel crs hrs etc. Honestly it has all the power it really needs, and shars sells starret blades of the proper size. It is definitely worth the investment and it can be modified into a "better" saw. Ive added coolant and a hydraulic cylinder to mine for feed control. The stock spring works fine just hard to adjust on the fly so i found myself cutting far slower than necessary
I would say just cut slow, not full wt. of the saw only till the blade has broken in and then let it cut at full speed for longer blade life.
Yup, it really does the job in a small shop. Mine works great for what I need and I got lucky that it cut very, very close to 90deg in the vertical out of the box.
To increase the usability of the tool I would use a ratchet spanner instead of the fixed one to drive the "pull" nut and just a jointed spanner to lock to bolt.
Thumbs up for the demonstrational chop sticks.
Use one of those ratcheting wrenches on the tool, so you dont have to change position. Resize the bolt head to smaller size so it fits inside the ratcheting wrench and just use smaller nut on ratchet.
Don't get me wrong, this is very nice and I do like it. Especially making the handle hinged and the wonderful ball end... But.
I was really hoping you were going to make a cam over tool to do it instead of the usual two nut method but with a very fancy washer.
Not knocking what you did which was top notch for what not knocking what you did which was top notch for The tool it is, I'm just looking for some kind of lever actuated cam pull that's better than the cheap $15 rivnut tool.
Nice tool. Another technique (if there's not a hole already) are the Flowdrill Thermal Friction Drills. They use friction (no cutting edges) to heat up the sheet until it's hot enough for the bit to push through and bend/flow the metal inwards to form a small tube. This can then be given more threads than the sheet thickness itself would allow. Cool as hell to watch in use. ha
Expensive and need quite a lot of power/rpms for that...
0:55 Normally, the thread should have the depth of the Diameter in steel. A M8 should have at least 8mm of depth. In aluminium you should have the factor 1.5 (12mm depth)
Thank you, I have always wondered this, especially if I was to use a helicoil for repair.
@brianm9962 It depends on the thread size and pitch. But if you use 1x diameter, you aren't wrong. It is the easy and quick version.
I don't calculate the depth of the thread, because it is already cut
A very nice little tool.
FWIW, pegboard was originally made of 1/8" thick pressed paper board (Masonite), and drilled with 1/8" holes. Pegboard hooks are designed to fit those specs. When hung in that material they stay put.
It is no surprise that they have no purchase in sheet metal "pegboard." Really, sheet metal pegboard ought to have hooks designed for its larger holes and thinner sheet.
Yeah the metal pegboard he has seem to have 1/4" holes when using 1/8" thick hooks (or whatever the metric equiv is).
Some advice that I’ve received from my father regarding rivnuts is that they aren’t designed for repeated use. Essentially, if you plan on using them for something that is meant to be disassembled and reassembled numerous times they don’t hold up very well. Just something to keep in mind.
If you want to use them repeatedly, fixing them with 1-2 spotwelds will usually keep them from loosening over time.
They also make stainless ones
@@ExplosiveBoy93At that point, just weld regular nuts to the metal and save a step.
Pretty cool design, thanks for the idea, i made one with a few changes… i made the body out of aluminum and pressed 4 neodymium magnets in the face, that helps keep it straight. i also made interchangeable tips for different threads and have the bolt fixed in place with minimal movement allowed to compress the rivet, i have the bearing fixed in place as well… all are minor changes i consider personal preference, overall your idea and it works great!! thanks
Adding a ratcheting spanner to that setup would make it a lot more enjoyable
Anything with two or more anchorage points will have the additional benefit of making the peg board more rigid. Good idea. Always enjoy your videos.
Maybe add a recess for rivnut head so the bottom of the tool is flush with sheet metal when you install rivnut? Use a washer sized to thickness of rivnut head? That way you will keep sheet metal flat and don't make it bulge?
This is a fantastic, simple tool! I would go to a pawn shop and look for a switching ratcheting wrench (spanner for you across the pond) and use that to replace the manual one if you spend a lot of time working on it. Or run down to your local cheap hardware store for a cheap one. The $10 would save a lot effort for lots of installations.
Nice simple shop improvment. Good on ya'!
I would have made the bolt keyed and use a electric drill to drive the nut because i´m lazy. Maybe ill do something like that in future, but as said, i´m lazy.
We use $300 air nutsert tools at work. Our nutserts have ridges on the flange for friction as they are spun in at 90PSI.
Rivnuts are a better way to improve the pegboard functionality, but where only moderate strength is needed, I used a method common on Japanese electronic equipment; use a dimpling and piercing tool instead of a drill to punch a hole in the sheet metal that is bent inwards around the circumference of the hole. You then have enough depth to tap about 3 turns of thread. It is very quick to do and nothing could be cheaper.
French (Schneider) electric industrial gear have such threads since 50s, i think that they use large punch presses beacouse they in some cases draw lots of material, and almost achive full lenght of threads. Metric standard says that you must have 80% of thread diametar.
The PERFECT job for a fly press!!!
You can hack these holes using a tapered centerpunch, just need it to be very gentle and have an accurate sized mandrel (about thread minor dial + 2x metal thickness, then trial and fit).
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For speed of assembly, find/harvest "trilobular" self-threading screws. These are easily identified by a slightly "Wankel Rotor" shaped end, which reforms and cuts the thread automatically. The screws are used in most automated assembly, so easily found in used equipment.
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Old DVD players use 3mm. Dog beds and other frames are usually 4mm. A fabulous source for larger ones is old treadmills where they use up to 6mm for the legs, handles, frame etc.
- Grab them with a hex driver when you are harvesting the DC mother and Driver board 😉
@@johncoops6897 ; Re fly press, spot on, and in using a tapered punch and die/mandrel, you get to attach metal to sheet metal without the gap caused by the head of the Rivnut.
@@keithammleter3824 - my dad was an engineer and I have inherited his tools. Aside from press tools there is also a metal tin full of hand punches, including a variety of those long tapered metal threadform punches.
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It's easy to see how much they have been used since they have dents in the sides of the (usually rectangulat) handle from being repeatedly bashed to unstick them from the hole! 😃
Personally I like to load my twist drill in my lathe with the corner edge as if it is a boring bar. The load seems to cut best and wear drills better that way too. What a fantastic build! Thanks for sharing!
I used to hate pegboard until I found some square holed pegboard with little plastic locking clips that hold the pegs in place. Called lockboard or something, I can't remember right now.
Lets me keep all my oversized tools and consumables hanging nicely where I can see them instead of digging through a dozen drawers trying to figure out where I stashed them at.
That pegboard idea is excellent. Definitely my next project.
Slipping a ratcheting spanner on before the socket would make life quick and simple.
Great! Now a two handed job is a three handed job. Nice machining.
Thanks for posting. A few constructive criticisms:
1. Your tool is rather bulky - and in particular - sticks a long ways out from the surface into which you're inserting the rivnut. For easy-access installations, a more typical rivnut setting tool is WAY faster and easier. For tight-access rivnut installation (very typical in cars), a much shallower tool is often required.
2. Rather than turning down and threading the tip of the M10 screw for the rivnut thread - drill/tap the M10 screw and use a piece of Grade 8+ all-thread for the arbor. This makes it replaceable should it break in the future.
3. Use a left-hand thread M10 screw. It'll prevent the phenomenon where you THINK your setting the rivnut; when you're ACTUALLY unthreading the rivnut off the tip off your arbor. Your tool counts on the thrust bearing to prevent any wrenching torque from being imparted onto the head of the rivnut - which works most of the time, but not always. This phenomenon is particularly bad in blind-hole installations where you can't see what you're doing. The arbor will rip the last couple threads out of the rivnut, leaving a partially-set rivnut in a tight-access spot. No choice then but to finagle a die grinder in there. It sux.
Beautiful craftsmanship.
Hey dude, just a heads up there's an editing error with just a black screen between 0:44-0:56. I love your content
Just gone in and snipped out. Uploaded the wrong file 😑
same at 12:04
You’re still awesome man keep up the good work brother
I have the Astro Pneumatic ADN38 that I use with a drill. Absolute game changer for easy to access jobs. But I would make my own like you did if I had the tools. Nice work
Cool creation! Nice work.
I have loved and HATED the exact same thing about pegboard… very nicely done.
Beautifully made!
Would a key on the bolt and a keyway through the body of the tool remove the necessity of holding the bolt with the socket?
that pegboard hook solution is hilarious how good it works
Very cool project. Thanks!!!
I'm always amazed by what you build. continued success
I hate buying Chinese tools,but that has become a fact of life, especially for a tool that I may not use frequently. That said, Amazon lists several Rivet Nut tools under $40 (USD). The kits come with a tool, 6 to 8 different size mandrels, 10 riv nuts for each size, and a plastic carrying case to keep it all together. I just bought one and I'm about to go out to the garage and use it on a project. I'll let you know how it does.
That is a great tool! If you use a ratcheting open end wrench, it would make the operation much smoother.
Great job. Thank you 😊
a tip: for metric fasteners, use a bolt with resistance class of 10 or 12
I really like your mechanical skill. I am learning the the way to apply the lathe. My son gave me a used lath. I always wanted one even if it is used.
I have an idea for your next shop tool project. A homemade metal cutting bandsaw.
Your content is awesome. Great work. You're definitely going to end up buying a rivnut gun. It's absolutely worth the money
Hey there mate, another awesome video. I have been trying to grow my channel, so i have been watching a lot of your channel lately looking at how you create has given me some good pointers. Keep up the good work and keep creating.
Must admit I bought a kit with a selection of sizes of rivnut from M3 to M12 and the application tool for less than £40 off Amazon a couple of months ago, a VonHaus, strange name for a chinese company. So far it has been great, not a lot of use yet, but when you need a rivnut, you need a rivnut.
If only I had a bunch of expensive machining equipment to make a cheap rivnut tool!
For non-industrial stuff, a bulbed rivet nut is great. No special tool, just push it through, then feed a bolt through, and tighten to expand it. Boom an easy threaded insert nut.
Tool looks great, you could probably add a notch and a spring loaded locking pin at the small end to keep the main bolt from spinning on demand, allowing you to set the depth, lock it and then use an impact gun or the ratchet on the nut itself rather than the static bolt. Using a spanner is all fun and games until you have to do it 15 times over in a fiddly spot.
i use zipties to fix tool holders to peg board. It work.
That is a great rivnut tools for very tight spaces wish I could meet one but don't have a lathe
Your method is even better than the commercial tool. With your shoulder on it, the insert crushes nicely centred. My tools often leave the insert slightly off centre, which causes lots of alignment issues.
I do hundred of rivnuts a month and will definitely be copying your shoulder idea when I build my tool.
Thanks again for another great video!!
If you do hundreds a month get a real tool. This is the slowest most manual way possible to install a rivnut
For a while, I worked for a company that used rivnuts by the 10,000's. My recommendation would be to look into an Avdel 74200. Pneumatic tool that will cut down installation time from a minute per rivnut to a few seconds.
@@russellv6234 the cheap harbour freight or princess auto tools handheld ones only cost $20 and are all done by feel. They wear out ridiculously fast and rarely can your hands do a good job of applying the right pressure consistently.
My tool cost about $300 and looks kinda like an 18” bolt cutter. You set it once and installation is consistent with excellent repeatability, but it still sometimes gets the rivnut slightly off center or angled if it gets misaligned during the first squeeze.
To go to an air operated installer I would be upwards of $1500 and still has the same problems if not perfectly operated.
I have a design I’m working on for a manual tool that hopefully will eliminate the misalignment issue, and was simply saying that the shoulder idea he has used will be incorporated into my design as well
I use rivnuts a lot in my line of work and never have an issue with using standard tools to set these. Sounds like you have some operator error going on. I have every tool from plier type to dual handle, to impact gun. When used properly, every tool sets perfectly. The most I have spent on any of these tools have been $70.
Cool video Maybe some options for most people that don't have a lathe
Pegboard made of wood/hardboard holds the hooks in place much better (a nice firm press/friction fit). Your sheet metal pegboard looks like it is very thin and has oversized holes.
great idea making your own rivnut tool but not everyone has a lathe and a milling machine 😂.
enjoyed your video.
Thanks for those great ideas👌and greetings from Luxemburg🖖
Great video
I wonder how well your thrust washers are going to hold up being soft. I say this as a neighbour did this with a similar sized needle thrust bearing on a Myford Super 7 cross slide IIRC and it didn't last long before he replaced them with the proper hardened washers. I ran into him at the local bearing supply shop where he was collecting the thrust washers and he told me the tale.
really nicely done! not too elaborate or too janky. You struck a good balance. I'm sure you'll use that tool a lot in the future!
Thanks for sharing. Mine I made with a grade 8 Allen head bolt and a gearwrench pass-thru socket. I guess you could use a pair of ratchet wrenches on a hex bolt.
Nice!
Seems to be working better then the original tools that I have for this. At least if you don't have enough strength in your hands to deform the nuts. Just wondering how long the bolts and nuts will last since they will wear when tightening them.... but a lot cheaper too then the special bolts for the original tools.
Very handy this tool, I have used lots and lots of this rivnuts on bikes, tools, rooms with metal walls like containers and such.
Most used here are M4, M5, M6 and lots and lots of M8.
Subbed! Quite a nice take on rivnut tool compared to others even the cheapy ones that you pull together with 2 hands.
What would really be interesting, since you seem to have a nice shop full of tool, is a design where you hold with the wrench and can use an impact or drill to spin the nut. That one might take a bit more thinking.
LOVE RIVNUTS! Harbor freight has a very cheap tool.
That’s an awesome idea and a really nice tool! It occurs to me that you could make it even easier to use by replacing the compression nut with one that is bigger than the bolt head. Then you could use a ratchet spanner to install the riv nut.
I wrote the same comment without reading yours first! 🤘
I mean, It’s an easy improvement!
Rivnuts are ALSO available in Stainless Steel and Aluminum!
Metric and Imperial thread sizes.
Well, of course they are available in various types 🙄
My favorite idea here was the peg board lol. I already got a cheap rivnut tool
They are made of many different metals, not just Steel, there's aluminum, bronze, stainless steel and probably many more variations. You do really need a good tool for steel and stainless steel, they are hard as heck and cheap tools just won't provide enough lever or be strong enough to handle needed strength
At least the tool is conceptually very simple so there are ample ways to make them!
6:50 that's a tool I've never seen, neat and something to remember!
You should look into a Porta band, it would make your life alot easier. Plus you can get an add on to make it like a bandsaw. I understand now that you don't have room for a horizontal bandsaw after watching a previous video. I can relate to that.
I just had the idea that if the depth of the sheet metal isn’t critical (as in contrast it would be in let’s say square pipe), you could just use the m8 screw and tap an m6, m5, m4,... section on it. So you could use one bolt for all these sizes...?
Lubricate the compression nut and the bolt thread with a decent moly grease. Amazing how much easier it makes the work and the threads will last longer as well.
Props to your machining skills and enjoyed the video! However, I'll stick to a quick purchase on Amazon 😂
Given all the extra holes to work with in this particular case I'd take strips of flat bar long enough to span two holes, with a threaded hole in one end and a plain one in the other, as anchor nuts.
3 threads of engagement are req'd to "break" the bolt.
I make rivnut setting tools from sockets. Get a 3/8 drive 5/8 or 3/4 deep socket and make that into a rivnut tool. Get a grade 8, 3/4 size bolt, fine thread is you can find one, about 2 to 3 inches long, drill out the threaded end of the bolt and tap thread it for the size rivnut you want to insert. Get a grade 8 or high quality long bolt or screw and cut off the head so all that is left if the long threaded part. Thread that into the end of the bolt tighten it and use red locktite on it.
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Thread a nut onto the 3/4 bolt and slide that into the socket so the smaller rivnut threaded end comes out the 3/8 square drive hole then put 1 or 2 grade 8 washers the right size for the rivnut on the smaller threaded rivnut side where it is sticking out the 3/8 square drive hole.
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Now all you need to do is turn the bolt head and the threaded bolt will unscrew from the nut inside the socket pulling the rivnet threaded stud out with it and setting the rivnut.
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Only problem I have with this setup is the quality of the rivnet threaded stud/rod. If you don't use the best bolt, like grade 8, you can find to make it, that threaded rod will deform, stretch and/or break. I find quality black Allen head style bolts are the toughest but it is hard to find them with enough thread. I have used the un-threaded top part of the bolt and welded or braised that into the end of the larger 3/4 bolt if I don't have a rivnut size bolt with enough threads.
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In this video Artisan guy goes through tons of trouble with lathe etc. Not necessary. Socket style like I described works perfect, use good oil or molly grease on the nut threads. If you want you can weld a handle on the socket but I don't because it ruins the socket. Vice grips work fine to hold it.
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Over the years I have made a lot of 5/8 to 3/4 bolts with rivnut studs sticking out of them. I take them out of the socket, thread a nut on the rivnut stud to keep the washers in place then throw them all in a box in my tool cabinet.
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I have all the sizes I need from 8/32 up, coarse and fine thread, to set any rivnut, they work with any 3/8 drive 5/8 or 3/4 deep socket so no need to keep the socket with them.
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Oh and the really cool thing about doing this like I describe using socket... instead of the artisan guys way? You don't need 3 hands. With the socket style, use one hand to hold the Vice grips and the other hand to turn the bolt head with a wrench or socket.
I don't have a metal lathe so I used half a dozen flat washers and smeared some grease on the one next to the nut. One open end wrench. one box end wrench. make sure the washers fit the bolt with very little space. Fender washers work good. voila'
I also made video about diy simple rivnut tool, its got some good views and earned me normal rivnut tool 😂
There are plastic pegboard locks that are fine for most usages. Cheap too. There are also several types of self locking peg hooks.
I don’t know if there are different styles but I bought some off eBay years ago. Wasn’t a huge fan. Cheers
This is an insane amount of work to save $110 on the real tool, and you only have one size. The Marson give you everything from #6 to 3/8. This is a case of a solution looking for a problem.
Nah just an afternoon trapped in a workshop on my day off
Didnt appear too insane to me.. neat little project. For what they are, the specialised tools are an insane amount of money though, and include mixed reviews.
Neat.
Could you lock the nut in place in the tool then use your socket wrench to move the bolt in and out? This would eliminate the need for the second wrench.
This video was riveting to watch
Mill a slot in the bolt. Drill and pin through the body and the bolt. Turn the nut, loose the ratchet.
Use a ratchet ring spanner for even faster installation
If you want to improve a little this project, make a custom bigger nut (the one that is actually black) and make it bigger, so that a ratchet wrench can be used instead of a regular wrench.
That would make the process of fixing the rivet quite faster.
I was thinking about a ratcheting wrench to but couldn’t you just use one the way it is. The wrench should slip over past the bolt down to the nut if they’re the same size.
@@johnnyb362 Yes. Although it's rather annoying to pass a same size ratcheting wrench over a nut/bolt. Increasing the size of the nut in this project solves that annoyance.
How did you get the hook thread to stop in the correct orientation? Just luck? Or it's one of those cases where there's a decent range that's firm enough?
It would be allot easier if you used an Allen head bolt. That is how the one I have is engineered. I bought it from a company here in the USA that specializes in fasteners like rivnuts , I won’t name the company because I’m sure they have a Patton on it. The nut that you turned with wrench was about 38.1mm so it is easier to grab with the wrench.
Looks really nice much better than the cheapo Chinese tool I bought 😀
Pegboard peg lock inserts are fairly cheap and quick. "pegitz" Just an FYI
Excellent job and excellent tool, as always. But it needs third hand for operating... 😉
Not sure if possible because I don't have the info handy but could you do 4mm, 5mm and 6mm on the same bolt in that order from the end of the bolt? Just step down to each size. It could be a 3 in one tool.
Great vid and keep em coming@
All it needs to make it better/easyer to use... a kind of fork that goes around the spanner to hold it in place. That way you only need to hold 1 handle
Im keen to see where this Tool, fits into your future projects.
You make the Tools you need , then reveal the REAL project 😉
Have you ever considered making a proper Taper Turning Attachment, for your new Late ?
Rivnuts work well in wood too, with a dab of epoxy or CA glue
thanks
12.9 grade cap head set screws are what is standard with the Air over Hydrolic rivnut tool i own
this couldnt have come at a better time. Just got a peg board and was thinking about a solution to hang things like battery chargers etc
As usual, terrific work, and commentary.