ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 มิ.ย. 2024
- The omen will be a central topic in the shadow of the erdtree as we have seen from gameplay trailer a few months ago. In this video i want to share with you a short theory that clarifies the true nature of omenhood and where their curse comes from.
I hope you enjoy this one and i wish you all a good DLC release!
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Timestamp:
00:00 - Intro
00:45 - Omen of the Crucible
03:00 - The Curse
05:40 - Dung Eater & Defilement
10:00- A Prediction
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Today I had originally intended to release the third part of the emancipation theory.
However, as time was rapidly running out before the release of shadow of the erdtree, I realized that I would not be able to deliver what was my most complicated video in a satisfactory manner, and so rather than rush it out or not release anything, I was reminded on stream that now would be the perfect time to talk about something very much relevant to the DLC that I had given up on addressing before it’s release.
I hope you guys enjoy this shorter video
I'll use this opportunity to say that I'm very much looking forward to that third video about the emancipation theory. I consider it thematically very plausible. Supporting evidence, meanwhile, I find hard to come by, but that's pretty much the same for any interpretation of Elden Ring's backstory.
It was a great vid. Some lore channels I don't like at all but yours is fantastic.
I'm gonna state my theory first. I think the omens horns are a symbol of divinity and the power they grant the omen and all associated with growing horns from their body share this trait veing the ability to spirit call without needing a connection to the erdtree like the obelisks and spirit calling bells.
Beyond this to elaborate, what made marika a god was controlling the cycle of life, death, and rebirth with spirit calling being an aspect of that and this based on the omen, the ancestral followers and their budding horn and the hornsent whom seem to have been the culture that considered horns divine in the ancestral followers bussing horn description.
You were big right
"If everyone is cursed, no one is cursed!" -The Dung Eater, probably.
Dung eater on top 🔥🔥
If horns are revealed to be a particularly holy aspect in the Pre-Erdtree civilization, then it makes sense that the Golden Order would revile them above other aspects of the Crucible in this seemingly arbitrary way.
I agree. It’s a classic case of obliterating the culture and reducing them to nothing while writing their own history for them. Omen dream of something awful that happened to them and I wouldn’t be surprised if it wasn’t them specifically, so much as a shared consciousness surrounding their people’s slaughter and destruction at the hands of the Golden Order.
Especially given what we learn about the shamans and the hornsent in Shadow of the Erdtree
Except the reality is that Marika hates the crucible because those who revered it killed and tortured her people.
Gonna pretend that wasn't a spoiler 😢
My opinion on the dung eater is basically that he is this really edgy asshole that had a rough life, falsly associated himself with the omens since he was locked away in the filth of the sewer, and festered into this curse propogating demon.
When i see an omen, i feel sympathy. The apathetic and bitter rage of the cursed omen is something i can understand. Or at least on some level forgive.
However when i look at the dung eater. I see a sad lonely gross abhorent monster of a man that faced justified consequences for abhorrent violations of (relatively) innocent people, and blamed everyone else, and associated himself with the people he saw as peers.
The briar shield. (The one with the maiden getting her eyes thorned) Mentions a girl who had her eyes crushed by the briars of sin before being reborn blind. I do believe this is irina/hyetta, and because of that blindness she is "pushed" towards madness. Sin begets sin.
So in the way you say that the omen curse isnt evil, its filthy. When the dung eater defiles his victims they come back cursed.
Since they are cursed and bitter they became monsters, since they are monsters they are spurned and defiled, and from that filth came the dung eater.
Some kind of mass defilement on some level had to have happened in the past for all these omen to start popping up in the capital. And I'm starting to think the erdtree itself is doing the defilement. Just look at erdtree burial, that doesn't look very clean or pleasant for the corpses involved.
Lastly "can't fit all this into one comment" but on the note of the state of ones death affecting the results of rebirth. When Irina shows up in liurnia she seemingly has no memory. Who else is wounded, and has little memory of their purpose?
Melina.
(My irina theory could be disproven if its actually shabriri possesing her. But also Hyetta's corpse stays in the weeping peninsula so perhaps shes somehow bodiless too. She even burns up at the end of her quest.)
Dung eater gives me incel vibes, they too eat shet
If accurate, then it would make for an interesting allegory, as that supposed mechanism of the curse would mimic the real world mechanism of abuse.
I think its reasonable to assume, despite not being refrenced in game, that both Morgott AND Mogh were visited by the formless mother. After all the use of hemmorage seems to be exclusive to them among other omens. Makes sense to me that Morgott just rejected his bloodflame, containing it in his sword instead.
the is another omen in game who use bloodflame aside from them
I'd also note that Mohg does not use the signature muddy wraith flames of the Omen at all, which suggests to me that his contact with the Formless Mother is less an Omen thing and more akin to Malenia and the Scarlet Rot.
@@Nemo12417 when morgot uses bloodblames, the wraith flames disapear too. I wonder if the formless mother's blessing also wards of or consume the vengeful spirits.
I think it could be intresting as the formless mother is the only thing that brought mohg a measure of peace from the torture he's been subjected to his whole life, could explain why he is so on board with her.
@@Kosmos_eroh wow I love this idea!
I'm pretty sure he does it to them alive, and they die from the injurys, case in point bogart asking you to finish him off, I think the dung eater is copying what the golden order did to the land of shadow, they probably cursed that land to boost there own realm in some way
The eyes of the frenzy sprout from places of despair, like the battlefield in front of the volcano manor
The rot comes from stagnant water
I could see defilement causing the curse
What causes the greater will? Order itself?
I think the greater will is just the one in charge currently and the other outer gods need to use something to get in, so the greater will’s presence just is there.
Yeah, it's kegare as always.
This is clearly Omen propaganda 🤷♂️
get off your alt account, Radagon
10/10 comment
State-backed political hit piece on Marika so close to the dlc... Couldn't be more blatant.
#OLM
Heresy, purity will lay this folly to rest.
The Hornsent seem to fit the bill here. Now look into what they did to the people of Shaman Village and a particular person who hails from there.
And now we have the Hornsent. People around before the Golden Order? Check.
No signs of being cursed? Check.
Persecuted by the Golden Order? Double Check.
Oh no he's clueless
They deserved the L from Marika ngl
@@gaet1893to be fair it’s probably a particular caste of hornsent rather than them all
@@gaet1893genocide is bad
There's one small issue: there's no omen in Miquella's Heiligtree.
If there was a means to purify the curse of omenhood, Miquella's rebirth process would have been viable for it. (Especially since it works on the artificial albinaurics.)
But no omen ever seemed to even try to make it to his embrace.
Perhaps it was simply an oversight, or perhaps there was a real reason why omen and omen alone seem to be excluded from Miquella's Heiligtree.
To be fair, unlike the Albinaurics and Misbegottens, the Omen are actively imprisoned and put in confinement. They basically can't be found on the surface besides the very few used on the battlefield. They don't seem to have the option to form an organized group to revolt or make a pilgrimage to the Haligtree.
Yeah I don't think the Omen have the leeway to make it to the haligtree. They're trapped underground and in old battlefields as soldiers of the Golden Order.
Well this aged well.
Great touch using the journey ost, really underrated for how beautiful it is
I’m curious if the “Omen Curse” is less caused by filth and it’s more that the Grace is expunged by filth. “Omen Curse” is Golden Order propaganda. Those “cursed” are in reality spurned by Grace and reborn as Omen or Misbegotten.
Perhaps “Omen” is the true form before the Erdtree?
I do draw a distinction between just omenhood and the curse. I think people might be born omen due to whatever mechanism, but they won't necessarely have cursed blood like they do in the golden order.
Omenhood itself could be described as a curse ofc, but isn't the curse i am talking about if that makes sense
I can't wait for the dlc, so I can see people doing karate while haveing a dior parfume
i'm bouta dual wield perfume bottles and commit omen genocide, if nobody got me, i know that Greater Will got me, can i get an amen?
@@ironymaiden1089 amen
@@ironymaiden1089yuuuup. Alot of marika slander recently....time for golden inquisition
@@ironymaiden1089omen
Parfum is very manly. Karate is very manly. This combination is for the manliest men. *Applies baby oil*
I really love the lore of Elden Ring it’s astonishing how well it’s written compared to other games more generic games.
Have you played Bloodborne?
I'm discovered this video after playing the DLC and it's surprising how right you were. Good analysis job right there !
Oooh, ooh. I had come to a similar conclusion but I didn't know what to do about or how to explain the dung eaters actions. Very excited for this video to drop.
Mohg literally got blood doodoo everywhere in his region
Delete this
In relation to this curse that the omens have and the spirits summoned from it, what relation do the revenants, and wraith callers have to the curse with their wraith calling bells?
The way the revenants summon in are also with that yellowy energy associated with the spirits. Both are found in filthy environments or in old swamped ruins, but they do not contain the spirits within themselves like the omen do/can.
Also, omen with more and more horns seem to be directly related to being able to call forth more power of this curse. One example is the omen boss fight shows this, with the one shorn of horns uses a blood axe, and the one with many horn growths uses the curse.
Sidenote on the revenants and wraith callers, what is their association with holiness versus healing? The royal revenant boss has innate holy resistance, but they also seem to operate on D&D principles of healing magic versus undead. Seems to be a very unusual set of distinct characteristics.
Very good video. Fascinating subject, I thought about this curse for some time and it always seemed so off to me.
I love the pairing of DOS2 music with Elden Ring. Great video!
Beautifully explained! I absolutely agree. Thank you for making this 🙌🏻 earned a subscribe for sure
Brilliant. Simply brilliant. Love your content, thank-you
Great stuff as always
Cool video as always Kosmos, glad you could make it in time ! Long message ahead, but for some reason I am fascinated by the topic of Omen and their horns.
We discussed it a little bit in your last stream, but I'm still very curious about why there seems to be a specificity about horns among other aspects of the Crucible. There is a clear distinction between Omen and Misbegotten, despite how they appear to be even closer to the Crucible since they show more aspects of it (but not horns, or very little of them, and even visually the stubs they have seem different to the Omen horns).
Omen horns are a "big deal", Gideon mentions them in passing as if it was a saying people have (something being more wicked than an Omen horn). Surely, it might simply come down to the original inhabitants of the Lands Between having horns as part of their being, but it's still very conspicuous. Ancestral Followers want living things to experience sprouting, and that sprouting is again specifically horns, or antlers, which seem similar in more ways than one.
And on that topic, there's also a thing about how many Omens, or otherwise horned individuals, *only* show them on their head and nowhere else. All the Omens we've seen so far from the DLC, sanguine nobles, horned lions (!!), and maybe we can even count Albinaurics. But also Mohg and Morgott (who also has a few on his tail but nowhere else on his body but his head). That makes me think that horns sprouting all over the Omen we know are a corruption of even that from the original system. That maybe due to the stagnation of the current order, and births being very few, the "blessing" of horns might get a bit too strong on the people who are born with them.
On the question of their horns and the curse being separate things, I really like the idea that you bring up. Omen blood is probably a potent thing, potentially divine even. Its nature might be to attract spirits, since ancestral followers seem to want to do something like that, but due to kegare, the Omen blood attracts wraiths instead. Interestingly, you can summon the Dung Eater on sewer Mohg, which is strange in the sense that he likes Omen, but on the other hand he might need their defiled blood (or rather the blood that's been defiled, if it is not cursed in nature as you suggest) to curse other people since his own blood is not that of Omen, even if he swims in shit all day it's not enough to actually curse others.
Obligatory mention of the GEQ in any lore theory: If horns are signifiers of divine beings from the previous age, and if the GEQ was the goddess of the previous age, did she have horns ? There are Omen-looking horns on the Drake set, despite dragons not being particularly horny. But as everybody knows and agrees with, Placidusax was the GEQ's lord, so...
Watch none of this be alluded to in the DLC, even if there are Omen all over the place. 👌😂🔫
You raise some good point, i have also been wonderinf about what differentiate the omen from misbegotten, and i do wonder if it's that omen can be born from anyone while misbegottens are born of other misbegottens.
It's strange that only mohg and morgot have other aspects of the crucible while all other omen have just horns, i do wonder if the horns aren't more "sacred" because they are closer to more primordial plant like aspect of the crucible (crackpot i know, but i keep thinking of elden john roots and ancient dynasty tree planting) After all the ancestral follower stuff really conflates horns with branches and flowers buding
@@Kosmos_er I feel like Omen might be naturally born this way yeah, and Misbegotten I feel like might have come about from people who were sad they didn't have cool horns so they tried to get them by coming in contact with the Crucible, like forcing fate. And now they could be fucked on a genetic level, but since they're not "really" blessed by the Crucible like Omen, they're not treated exactly the same way. MAYBE.
@@Kosmos_er Yes, I think the horns are considered most sacred because they physically mirror the branches of a tree, along with the roots of a tree and the holy lightning that are depicted in the ancient version of the elden ring
I always assumed that killing the omen off was either a greater will thing or; or related to Marika wanting more control, but I never assumed that Marika would have been motivated by revenge for the shamans. It paints the whole conflict with even more shades of grey, and does a lot to “humanize” Marika becoming a god for a reason. It also really made Jar making a lot worse and gross too; the Hornsent had some interesting practices.
I knew the Dung Eater was a good guy all along.
This is a very interesting theory, I love it.
The concept that the golden order worshippers wat to remove is the Aspect of the Crucible
Because life is one is not orderly.
Great work! I have a question you might be able to answer. For pretty much the whole time the game's been out, the presence of seedbed curses in Elphael has been a curiosity to me. I seriously doubt Dungeater has been there, but the corpses we find them on are just like the others throughout the lands between that seem to be his victims. There are no Omen anywhere near the Haligtree, and though we can assume Mohg has been there at least to steal Miquella away we don't really associate seedbed curses with him. What do you think they're doing there, and who is responsible? It's been driving me crazy for 2 years!
I can't recall any omen in haligtree at all, and the seddbed curse seem to be a signature of the dung eat, so i guess he just made his way there. Might be a boring answer but it's the onlt one that spring to mind for me.
@Kosmos_er the simplest answer is probably right, and it's true he travels around via invasion rather than physically, so perhaps he found a loophole there. Maybe if you're correct about the Omen "curse" being more about defilement than the Omen themselves, he could have been attracted there by those individuals via some aspect they possessed, or by the rot and poison elements building in the vicinity? Thank you for responding :)
I always imagined that him being rejected by the golden order basically gave him a free pass to the Haligtree. I personally think the Haligtree Seedbed Curse is, chronologically, the first one Dung Eater made. He was subsequently exiled/ ran away from the Haligtree to continue with his dung eating.
It’s so hard to get people to understand that the Golden Order, the dominant faction of the Lands Between that demands unfaltering and blind zealotry, lies about everything.
That line “they were never saints, they just happened to be on the losing side of a war” immediately made me think Omen. Omen and all the Crucible touching critters.
Omen are signs of things to come. Omen in Elden Ring are reminders of what was.
Here’s a list of Omen & Crucible related critters:
Everything but bland humans.
Ok, no.
Omen, Sanguine Nobles, Sanguine Albinaurics, Misbegotten, Demihumans, Miranda Flowers, Land Squirts, Land Octopus, Erdtree, modern Dragons, Erdtree Guardians, Crucible Knights, Rykard, Snakemen, Godskins, Beastmen, Ancestral Followers, the Netflix show Sweet Tooth.
He actually did it! Praise!
"Heresy is not native to the world; it is but a contrivance. All things can be conjoined." Considering Omens and Albinaurics alike can both have their eyes shine with gold to drop extra runes I don't think any of them are as cursed and reviled by life as some in the Lands Between think they are. I mean, we know Sites of Grace are in the Land of Shadow as well and they're likely connected to the Erdtree given the mounds of earth under the sprites indicating a connection to its root system.
Nice. I pretty much agree with the prediction. I think we could summarize the whole game as a critique of the fact that we forgot our animal nature and as a result our intelligence became a catalyst that divided us rather than the opposite (the curse that the Dungeater is speaking about), leading to the whole story of Marika/Greater will and its consequences. Btw what's the last song used ?
The last song was "sin and divinity"
It would be funny if we learn that dlc lands (despite purge) turns out to be a better place to live than the lands between.
Oh, and due to the position that dung eaters victims are found & how the soul in Japanese culture is near the lower intestine. It’s regarded that what he does to his victims is - he literally eats their souls out of their butt which is why he is called as he is.
This isn’t even the first time a fromsoftware enemy does this. For the headless in sekiro will rip out wolf’s soul the same way if your grabbed by them.
This is a great theory and I'm confident it's at least a step in the right direction. But what I'm mire convinced of is that being "omen" or touched by the crucible was once very common, possibly even the norm, but the Golden Order has been systematically eliminating anyone with ties to the crucible and as such omen traits have diminished over time.
Dung Eater is just a player RPing a cursed character. Much like if we made a frenzied build only character
Great video. The more I play the DLC, the more it's obvious that the Omen and the natural world order (the Crucible/Crucible era) have a larger part to play in the story of SotE.
I've been assuming it's kind of like the undead curse - it's a curse, but put in place by the ruling powers to keep a certain selection of the population in line.
Awesome video
Really cool video. Just so I am clear, you are saying that the curse itself are the wraiths that haunt their nightmares, which some can manifest as the brown/yellow wraith flame?
Yes but to be specific, the wraiths are attracted by the cursed blood rather
Me reading the title: :0
Ive always had the impression that omens are able to breed naturally - or more naturally - than a majority of those in the lands between. The horns, like roots, seem to absorb souls and be able to reproduce them which goes against the "blessed" rebirth the Erdtree offers, same as those that Live in Death not returning to the Erdtree. The Dungeater, with this spirit but not the physical body, is obsessed with this reproduction.
Interesting theory. I've played a little of the DLC and so far it seems to match what you're saying. The omen-like entities seem much less defiled and cursed than the omens underneath Leyndell.
Because they are mistreated and filthy, the Hornsent warriors are absolute units and possess an ancient elegance.
And the Curseblades wear those long drapes because they are ascetics.
The description of the Bloodrose in 1.10 says "...that bloom in blood-soaked soil."
Where is the "festering blood" description from? Is that a previous patch or a Japanese version translation?
That will teach me to use the wiki for the descriptions
"Blood-slick roses that bloom in festering blood."
If it's not in current patch then sorry about that. I would guess CNT or 1.0 I'll check the JP when I have a moment
Reject modernity, embrace the crucible.
I find it interesting that the wraiths have that golden-black color. Almost like a refinement/mixture of golden order energy and deathblight energy
Hmmmm I don't know, I don't believe the omen curse has anything to with blood, only reason I say that, and I do mean the only reason I believe, when we defeat Morgot in the capital, look at his body while he's saying no one can enter the Erdtree, he literally has no horns, I'm sure we didn't drain him of his blood to remove the omen blood, it's something "more powerful" as to why they are in the lands between still, something outer godly is going on in reality
I suspect in Morgott's case, he was being granted Grace as reward for his defense of the Erdtree. His body dissolves into golden particles when Godfrey cradles him, and they form the Guidance of Grace directing Godfrey to fight you.
Welp, this video turned out to be pretty much 100% correct. At least about the ancient civilization built around the aspects of the Crucible.
Can you name the music used around the 02:00-04:00 mark? I swear I've heard it somewhere
Ori, midnight burrow
@@Kosmos_er Thank you!
while i personally disagree with the theory you did a great job on the video and this was really well thought out
They're called Omens for a reason. You can have good omens or bad omens, it all depends on how you interpret them.
you nailed it
wow!
2 days!
Been saying this!
ça fait beaucoup de présomptions l'ami
_kegare intensifies_
More marika slander
do Nodo exist
Illusion
I get that they are an oppressed group but like objectively having those horns is a detriment. I mean mohg is missing an eye because he has a horn growing into it. He will eventually die if it grows more. I don’t like that the only options are cutting the horns off or just not dealing with it at all
It’s possible the Mogh’s eye stabbing was a result of the Formless Mother’s influence. She does seem to have a weird sadomasochism thing going.
17k views and 1000 likes 😢
as a tarnished i too revile them and make sure they die in those sewers like the filth they are, for the amount of runes i lost trying to do a run back xD
I hope this is not linked to the DLC
the dlc has a lot of both omen and crucible stuff in it, the trailer even hinted at mesmer's war against them
it doesnt have any dlc footage or spoiler if that's what you mean
@@Kosmos_er yeah thats what I meant, thanks
Well done. I love this theory and I'm taking it as canon
Still no Godwyn….I’m unsubscribing for 3 days.
nooooo
@@Kosmos_erit’s all good, I’m subbing
but only for 3 days
@@Kosmos_er Okay. Maybe just one day.
Baby made
Look at this Omen lover. Shame!
Omen lover 😂
The fuck is wrong with lightning dude, my eyes hurt
Marika did nothing wrong.
I love how you stupid right-wingers are so politically obsessed that you can't even help but be racist in a fucking fantasy world. Your dogwhistling even extends to the video game lore discussion you participate in. You people cannot help but be hateful. Even if the people you're hating on are fictional, horned brutes. But tbh, I should have known this game would be rife with neo-Nazis. The main antagonists are blonde, blue-eyed godlike white Europeans. And even seeing how fucked up the setting became because of those characters, your under-developed 4chan brain forces you to say it's "based" because it even slightly resembles real-life White Nationalism. You people are pathetic.
Saw this comment, was sussed out, looked at who you're subbed to, and surprise surprise! Bro watches Tim Pool, Dankula, Tucker Carlson, subs to Donald Trump for some reason despite being Canadian, and various other right-wing propagandists were in there, too. You people are literally so fucking easy to spot lol
THE LIONS IN THE BASE GAME HAVE _HORNS?????_
HOW DID I NOT KNOW THIS?? THIS SAYS SO MUCH ABOUT THE DLC
Awesome video