Ender 3 Part Fan Or No Part Fan - Chris's Basement
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 18 พ.ค. 2019
- In this one we do some tests on the Ender 3 with part cooling. This video was because of the video Chuck did over at Filament Friday.
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I consider this as a peer review. When you can take a scenario and get the same results tested by multiple people that's just good science ;)
Peer review, great way to put it. Thanks Mike!
Another great video. It’s like a perfect compliment to chucks video. I follow you both and Now I feel doubly educated
Thanks! Excellent!
AHA! I knew there was more to this story! Good call on the hot end fan!
Man, I love your videos :)
I constantly learn something new from you.
Thanks!
Ha! Great to hear, thanks for watching!
Thanks! Yes.. you've answered my amazement over Chuck's video. I definately need part cooling.. no way around that.
You're welcome, glad I could help.
Thanks for posting this video. After I saw Chuck's video, I had several questions regarding the Ender 3's cooling and how he was getting those results. I almost ordered one just to satisfy my curiosity, but my wife would start getting pissed if more 3D printers started showing up! You've confirmed my suspicions. I thought either the hot end fan was doing some cooling or the part cooling fan was doing nothing. Thanks to your video, the mystery is solved! I like the way you didn't slam Chuck, he's a good guy.
Thanks Robby, same here, it is something I always wanted to test, just never did. Thanks to Chuck I finally got around to it. I look up to Chuck he's who I want to be when I grow up. :)
great video... I came to this conclusion having a hard time printing ABS. Even small pieces suffered a lot from warping.
Thanks! Yeah, I would guess ABS would be a real challenge here.
Great addition to Chucks video. Now I know more than I did 6:34 minutes ago lol. Thanks Chris
lol, thanks Spike!
That makes a lot of sense actually, that explains why Michael at Teaching Tech found almost no difference using some fan ducts with the stock fan. Thanks for this great video.
Thanks Alex, glad I could help.
Both you guys are high on my list of much watch video content. It would be nice to expand this testing using petg filament. I found out that the glass surface I print on with my Tevo Little Monster, even with a coating of hair spray popped some glass surface off after cooing! Bummer!
Interesting test
Thanks for sharing👍😀
Thanks Asger!
Thanks you for all do Chris
Thanks Chris!!!
Very interesting test. But now I wonder how my profiles will work with your silver tape setup. Maybe I’ll have to make another video ;)
Thanks Chuck! That's a good point, I am going to make a blocking plate for it and try some PETG before and after.
Right on Chris:) I think you should try the same test on ABS!
I should, I will do some PETG for sure.
Everyone in the comments is mentioning it ruining their ABS prints, but I have exactly the opposite problem with my Ender 3. I print a lot of ABS, and every hot end cooler I've printed has killed the quality so I keep going back to the boring stock unit. I think the air spilling actually gives the parts just enough cooling, without causing warping like the blast from a part cooling fan does. Perhaps the big difference is that I print in an enclosure (read: highly customised cardboard box) and get around 45-50°c ambient.
What I also found really interesting, is when I tried printing with a "reverse flow" hot end cooler (thing:3419531) to get the airflow away from the print, my chamber temperature actually dropped by about 7°c (iirc) from what I usually get, presumably because of the loss of convection airflow over the build plate!
You've got kind of a perfect storm thing going on. that's interesting.
Great video!
Thank you!
great video
Thanks Romio!
I know a lot of people use the PETSFANG ducts for their CR-10 and Tevo and it’s very impressive. I’m using his Aero Evolve on my CR-10S with my E3D Titan Aero. It’s impressive the airflow!
Very nice!
Chris Riley check out the Aero Evolve on Thingiverse. The instructions are a bit sparse but it’s a rare one piece solution...then add your ABL probe preference
Ooh, I like that blue.
Thanks! I like it too, light but not too light.
Back when I got my CR-10 I tested different fang setups and found one that improved the print quality even further, compared to the stock setup. Later on the Ender3 I installed the fang too. These considerations where kind of missing here. Nevertheless a good and nice video, that's just my two cents.
which fang was it for the Cr-10 ?
Combination of Chucks and Chris results: just print a better airflow duct or change ur coldend cooling that way the part get's cooled by the coldend fan, too. Sweet. With normal ptfe tubes, it's sorta impossible printing in temps up 240°C due to the fact ptfe will degenerate which results in nasty toxic fumes. U need to upgrade to an all metal hotend to print material in higher temps that don't need part cooling at all.
Also a great point. Not sure what cap tube can get up too, but probably not much higher.
Hey Chris where can I buy the correct sized thermistor, and other proper mk3 replacement parts, for my mk3 beside Prusa.com....they always seem to be out....thanks Chris....LOVE DA CHANNEL!
Thanks man! Here you go, it's a standard E3D. www.printedsolid.com/collections/prusa/products/prusa-mk2-mk3-thermistor-cartridge
Brilliant
Thanks David!
Very cool
Thanks Paul!
I just noticed today my parts fan wasnt spinning and possibly never has lol.. but my ender 3 still makes really nice prints
Nice! That's a really good slicer profile.
The geeetech a10 has the block off plate you discussed. Check it out. I guess I know what machine I'll print petg on lol
Cool, I think I am going to make one.
I also seen chuck's vid, but one thing about part cooling that I am not 100% sure about is if its best to pinpoint a small as possible area around the nozzle or just blast the print surface with fans.. in my own reckoning it would make sense go with the former, it be interesting to find out how much part cooling is actually needed and the effect it has on the bed surface as well the print adhesion, especially if the temperature difference is great enough - maybe too much can be a bad thing?
I am not 100% sure on this either really. I would like to get a couple of different fan setups and an air pump and see what works best.
Dope. I'm subscribing
Thanks for the sub!
Interesting video Chris. :) How about testing some of the usual suspects in custom parts cooling like the Petsfang, Bullseye or maybe a BantaMount?
Thanks! That's a good idea, we can give that a try.
I once tried to print a small lowpoly Pikachu on the Ender with bullseye part cooler and the parts cooling fan mounted 90 degrees rotated thus blowing sideways and not into the fanduct. Print epically failed. The object was so small that plastic wasn't able to cool beyond melting/glasstemperature and it got totally mushy bending upwards.
So part size and resulting layer printing durations are also key to whether you need cooling or not.
Agreed and that's where Chucks video comes in.
Hey Chris! I know your advice was to get the gen L but... I just really wanted to get the skr v1.3 😅I ordered them with the 2208's (v3) and a lv8729 for the extruder and a tft35 touch screen and I'll be building them into my pretty much stoke ender 3. I'll worrie about octopi and bltouch later. Would it be posible to make a step by step video on that? There are a lot of good videos on the gen L but I haven't found much as clear as yours on the skr v1.3
SKR video will be out tomorrow!
Awesome!!!
Hey Chris, great video! Have you printer PETG on an Ender3??
Thanks! I have and it comes out a bit stringy, I think I will make a hotend plate and try again.
Chris Riley i really like to know if you can get rid of that petg stringing because that’s also my problem on the Cr 10 mini
@@Hasitier Hey I do PETG pretty regular on my CR10 and Ender 3. This is from my Ender 3. Very minimal stringing. I use cap tube, a SeeMeCNC EZR extruder. You want to make sure the filament is really dry. I run retraction at 6mm at 25mm a second. I can send you a profile if you want. I do 30%-50% fan most of the time.
Here is my Gcode if you want to look at the settings:
drive.google.com/open?id=1NNUXaq57RNMd_gsSBCApreZbJ0fDHymH
Here is a PETG benchy I did recently, this is Ic3d filament. I could probably get the stringing down a little more if I re-dried the filament and tweaked the slicer a little more:
photos.app.goo.gl/Vxwb7WSkAZhGHNUn6
Chris Riley hey Chris, thanks Dir the response. I also use Capricorn PTFE Tube but with the stock extruder. Maybe my filament is a bit wet because sometimes it stays on the machine for days with no use. Maybe I’ll have to get some kind of dryer for it?
@@Hasitier I use the MatterHackers Print Dry, but any food dehydrator should work fine.
cooling or no cooling is obvious to me. but one thing i'm curious is what kind of cooling? do those fancy cooler improve things? Is a noctua 40mmx20mm enough or do you really need a loud blower? what percentage is cool enough? I'd love a video like that from you :) specially blower vs normal
Hmmmm, interesting, I would have to find a good way to test that. I will think on it.
@@ChrisRiley yesss thanks xD The blower fan and sudden fast movements of my printer are the loudest things right now. the CFMs of the noctua 20mm and an avarage 5015 blower are not THAT far off. not to mention my blower already is at 60% max. if i set it to 100% and extrude filament in air it shoots it backwards it's funny xD
I'm going back to the stock cooling fan on my ender 3. I've printed just about every fang style cooling duct out there and have had more problems with layer adhesion when using them. I usually turn the fan down to 40% speed to get them to not over cool the part. You proved a small amount of air around the nozzle works, why does everyone think you need a 2 fan cooling duct with a hurricane of air at the nozzle?
I have always wondered the same thing. I started way back with a desk fan, it worked great!
Can you make video about diamond hotend?
ooooo diamond, where do you get those?
@@ChrisRiley here www.aliexpress.com/item/E3D-V6-long-distance-heatsink-Brass-Color-Nozzle-3-IN-1-OUT-0-4mm-For-1/32516709281.html?spm=2114.search0604.3.1.2b1f4846SjlIir&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_3_10065_10068_10547_319_10059_10884_317_10548_10887_10696_321_322_10084_453_10083_454_10103_10618_10307_537_536,searchweb201603_53,ppcSwitch_0&algo_expid=a3ceef1f-ddd9-4597-a242-2a78613d94eb-0&algo_pvid=a3ceef1f-ddd9-4597-a242-2a78613d94eb&transAbTest=ae803_5
I havent used layer cooling fan for 5 years, its only useful for PLA with steep. You dont use it with ABS, PETG, NYLON
Agreed, I don't use it on anything accept PLA.
I’ve always wondered about this. So it makes sense to go with one of the “aftermarket” part cooling shrouds? Or for PLA it doesn’t matter?
On these machines for PLA in the stock config, doesn't really look like it matters.
And that’s the majority of hobbyists out there. Maybe some PETG, but I think PLA is the plastic of choice.
Although the Hero Me fan duct looks so cool!
@@JohnDStrand Agreed!
@@JohnDStrand True, I have tried fan and no fan on PETG, seems to work about the same if you get it dialed in.
What is causing your stringing on the Benchy?, I printed one on my Ender 3 and got no stringing, I used the standard Ender 3 profile in Cura
It's mostly impacted by the fact I use Z lift on everything.
Science!
Science!
What is the gcode for enabling and disabling the fans? I need to test mine and can't find the gcode anywhere!
Now a days you can do M106 S0 for off and M106 S255 for full blast.
Chris please tell me how to activate the part cooling fan. Mine hasn't been turning on during prints.
Give it a test first. Try Pronter face and run a M160 S255 to make sure it kicks on.
@@ChrisRiley newbie here just installing a new mobo on my printer looking to test fans. I'm seeing other GCode reference M106 for fans, not M160.
Are GCode commands standard across all makes?
@@theunfrailhale I think it’s a typo, m106 is what I use
Also your question basically depends on the firmware, most printers are based on Marlin so there’s a high change it’s the same
@@probablyblue426 cheers dude.
Ah Ha! Now we know.
Thanks Chris.
Ha! Yep! Thanks Ron!
Is it true you are making SKR 1.3 vid soon? I hope so! :)
Yep! Came out yesterday!
@@ChrisRiley Thanks, I asked like half hour before you released :)
Shots fired!!! Shots fired!!! Just kidding. Chuck is awesome and this is a great addition to his experiment.
lol, Chuck is the man!
On my ender 3 display the fan says 255 speed. Should that be set to 100%.
Correct, 0-255 255 being 100%.
I personally need the fan on my a8, as I print relatively fast (80mm/s 2000 acceleration), so I do need a fan to cool down the plastic, I find the quality drops from prusa level to crappy printer
but I have a really good duct that I made myself for low back pressure and high flow, with a 5020 fan
without fan the sides look very droopy, the details look bad, the chimney looks like a blob, the bridges are very bad
Nice, 5020's are where it's at.
ender 3 with ABS, fan on layer sep, fan off perfect.
Nice!
How about Part 2 PETG?
A lot of people are asking about it, I probably should.
Defiantly agree, that printer must warp ABS parts like a champ! hahaha Which is something you don't want
lol, yeah, no ABS on the stock setup I would guess.
Cool.. hehe, get it? But seriously, yeah, cooling when properly directed. No cooling on abs tho '..
lol, got it. ;)
So the conclusion is that everyone else in the 3d printing scene except for Chuck hasn't been wrong all this time regarding part cooling, the Ender 3 is just not a very good design.
I don't think this will surprise anyone, but it's still important to show why this is the case.
My pizza printer needs a cheese cooling fan i think
Wel, I mean, you wouldn't want to burn your mouth. ;)
Chep sent me.
Lol, welcome.
Also on the PETG bandwagon
I use it more and more all the time now.