Ya know thank god Jim decided to do this podcast- and we have it all in audio- …. Side note: I appreciate old(er) people so much they are always so knowledgeable and know so much but Jim is walking history when it comes to wrestling and I hope he keeps on for many more years to come
I cannot wait for Corny to review the 4/27/22 ladder match between Scorpio Sky and Sammy Guevara. It had everything Cornette loves: barbed wire ladders, hockey fights, no selling, and hotshotting the title. I swear he’s going to need 2 Sprite Zeros for this one!
The high risk twisting 450 Force Kick made me angry. Then the cutter redux (which Cody and Sammy did better in that other barely-months-old ladder match) pushed it into parody. Then the girls got the fella’s backs like they were playing pool joust. I enjoy a lot of aye eeh dubya. This was not part of that.
That was honestly an excellent question, no need to laugh at it. I learned something new and I've been a fan for over 20 years. This is what makes Cornette awesome.
You know how there's a difference when the word 'funny' means 'haha' and when it means 'strange'? I take the laughter as something like that. The laughter isn't ridicule, it's more a commentary on the nature of the belt and what it means to hold it, as well as what the public thinks it means.
Love hearing about how much the old school wrestlers were protective of their money and image. Makes me think none of them would put up with modern WWEs ridiculous name changes and third party crack downs .
They wouldn’t put up with it as long as there was another territory they could go to. Back in the 70s they were 20 or 30 different territories. A guy could go spend a year in each one and it’s a career. So it really didn’t matter how much he pissed off the promoter; as long as he could draw money somebody else would hire him.
I disagree a little. Those guys worked hard for every penny as they struggled to make ends meet. Today they’d get paid a whole lot more for a lot less work. I think most would relish that idea. A lot of money buys a lot of pride .
The Winged Eagle hasn't aged well though because it looks small compared to the Big Gold belt. That's why the Big Eagle belt was made in 1998 which looked alot better in comparison to the smaller Winged Eagle. When Flair won the Winged Eagle you could see it didn't look right around his waist even though it was the same size as the NWA globed title. AEW belt is a good size, it reminds you of the Mid-South North American title. The AWA belt from the early 80's was a good looking title and influenced the design of the Big Gold belt.
@@wesleymorris2699 I remember when Hogan debuted the Winged eagle I didn’t like it compared to the Hogan 87 belt. The Big eagle black strap was better than Winged eagle as well
See, now, THIS is the real story about "putting down deposits for the championships" that we needed to hear. We keep hearing about, "oh it's about *the belt* and only the belt" and them giving us insane numbers just because Big Gold had a couple of extra jewels in it, and here's Jim giving us the truth: it was a security deposit for the prestige of being trusted as the champion, and if that champion betrayed that trust he would not get his deposit back. Thank you for your detailed explanation, Jim!
What I find interesting is that when Jim Duggan finally wins the title.... UWF comes to be! And I bet that the person who won that title... needed a crane to get that home! "Honey! Look what I won at Jake's BBQ!"
Tim got the papers from me. Facts are, Sam returned the Rogers belt deposit to Vince Sr., in 2 installments of $5K each BEFORE the switch, and further Sam did NOT withhold the money Vince owed the NWA for dues and the % of Rogers' title defenses, which seems to me would just have been normal business practice, and had to keep dunning Vince for the money. Vince was crying poormouth and Sam either bought it or went along to try to keep the peace. I'm not sure what Lou's story about the money being in a briefcase the night of the match was about.
I'm surprised that Jim didn't mention when Stan Hansen rode over the AWA championship with his tractor completely destroying it, then sent it back to Verne Gagne.
What happens if the champion loses the belt? for example the champion bangs a ring rat. The rat slips him a mickey and knocks him out. Then she walks away with the belt. Honestly i would be shocked if this hasn't happened before.
@@kalen2465 A slightly lesser known story is thar the WWWF belt went MIA once, when someone broke into Bruno's car late one night after a show and stole it along with his ring gear.
NWA, mid 80s to 90, had the nicest belt designs of probably any era, by far. The main titles were all top notch but even the secondary belts were beautiful. The old TV title is timeless, the US tag belts were incredible, even the obscure ones, like the Western States Heritage Title were magnificently designed.
Getting the belt back before the wrestler leaves the terrority became a bigger deal in the age of national TV. I'm sure Easy E had big plans on how he wanted Bret to throw Vince's belt in the bin live on Nitro.
According to Bret, in his contract. He stated that after Survivor Series, he would have dropped the belt to Micheals. The next night on Raw. So, he would have not left with the belt to wcw.
They would get their deposit back once the title changed hands. In R-Truth's case, he would've actually made money by leaving the deposit and letting interest build in between reigns.
Story goes when Big Show won his first belt in WCW, a lot of guys ribbed him how he is now the champion and had to wear the belt out in public… so he would walk around airports with the strap across his shoulder… one day Sting saw him and said “what the f**k are you doing?”
The Nikits Mulkovich cast Crockett NWA World Tag belts don't date back to the 70's. Jimmy Snika and Ray Stevens were the first team that wore them in 1980.
There was also the (in)famous letter from Eddie Quinn to Sam in the aftermath of the Thesz-Carpentier-Thesz switch, where he refers to the return of Carpentier's '$10,000'.
"They oughta make the president of The United States put up a deposit." I'm all for taking monetary incentives away from politicians, but when the federal government is acting like the territorial system we've probably gone too far. Theodore Roosevelt would have supported it though.
The NWA DOME GLOBED World title in my opinion, not the new ugly thing they, the new NWA uses, but the one that was worn by Ric Flair, Harley Race, Tommy Rich, Dusty Rhoads, Kerry Von Erich, and Terry Funk, is the coolest looking belt ever, but that's just my opinion. Also the old United States title, era 1984-1985 that JCP used was also another great designed title the 10 pounds of silver, and the painted version of it too...
To answer the question of did a belt ever get lost, the answer is yes and quite recently. Chris Jericho left the brand new AEW belt in a limo and it disappeared for a short time but he did get it back. Also, Randy Savage ruined the original IC title belt by taking a can of brass cleaner to it which is why it looked dull during his reign.
Wrestlers in the WWE do not travel with the belts. They are handed them in Gorilla before going out and they give them back when they walk in Gorilla coming back. Famous footage of this exchange is when Brock Lesnar walked into Gorilla and tossed the belt at Vince McMahon. However ... champions in WWE sometimes carry around a replica they acquired at the WWE shop that any fan can buy. Another note ... the RAW when half the WWE Roster was being held on the Runway in Saudi Arabia. So was the WWE Championship. So Brock Lesnar who left on a different plane was on the next night RAW sporting an official WWE replica belt the WWE had to acquire from one of the consession stands in the arena. When Punk did the angle where he left the WWE as WWE champion. They had the tournament for a new champion. While Punk was doing appearances on talk shows an interviews. He was allowed to take the belt. The belt that Cena won was an official WWE replica belt any fan could buy while Punk had the actual belt.
At one point the champions did travel with a belt but the office had separate belts that they kept nice looking for TV. I don't know if that's true today since they run so few house shows.
@@steveomac385 I am not sure. NXT rules may have been different. The reason for the WWE belts no longer traveling with the wrestler is 2 fold. Wrestlers having added responsibility and risk of leaving it behind. Wrestlers showing up on other shows with it. Which was less risk after WCW was bought by WWE The last wrestler to travel with the WWE Championship is CM Punk. They dropped the rule during his angle so he could show up in public with it to give the appearance he officially left the WWE with the world title when he won it after the "Pipe Bomb" segment.
I could listen to a whole episode on this subject. The history, designs and changes, and interesting trivia about the belts. Another cool fact is that Steve Austin has said he has the original IC belt that he carried in a safe. But then I also wonder, what happens when a promotion folds? Who keeps the belts? For instance, did Larry Zbyszko keep the AWA belt since he was the last champion?
Depending on the belt, some of the jewels would have been missing just by the way the belts were handled and used. The original big gold was probably one of the best made belts, as far as plates because it was actually sterling silver with gold plating on top and was originally two-tone. Most other belts were made of brass (real old ones) or zinc and, are basically big plates of zinc, like a big belt buckle with bolts welded on the back so they could screw onto the leather. The jewels were fake rubies, cubic zirconia or Swarovski crystals, so not really worth much. Belts broke a lot, especially regular WWF or WCW belts, I’m sure ECW belts broke often as they were abused often. I can’t imagine anyone ripping off a side plate etc, it’s doable but would be noticeable it was ripped off etc. Now Steiner did the ultimate grab, switching out the Crumrine for the cast copy towards end of WCW, which is why WWE never got the original belt.
Great story was when they gave the new intercontinental championship belt to Randy Savage, he was so obsessive about shining the belt it stripped the varnish off of it. The red coloration of the logo was pretty much done. You could see it on TV after 4 months
Scott Hall gave his IC belt to two kids with HIV/AIDS while visiting them on the Springer show. It was a totally impromptu thing. He had a great story about them having to call Vince and ask that a new belt get ordered, and he’d pay for it. He was scared shitless and finally fessed up, and Vince “you did the right thing. You’re not paying for it.”
Wow, what a story 😆 I said this when Rhea lost her title belt but why don't the companies hold the belts and give them to the champion when they need it for a match or segment like the production company would an actor for a movie prop? They are technically company property and the wrestlers are employees or at least "contractors" for that company. 🤷🏼♂️ In the modern era, that just seems to be much safer than letting the champions carry them everywhere they go 😂
I am so jealous of the guys that were in wrestling in the 80’s and 90s. I would of had a blast to be in the wrestling business with all the stories that are about how the business was ran. You guys made my childhood amazing.
I remember when Flair went to the WWE (with the big gold belt). That left WCW without a belt, so Luger beat Windham in a steel cage for the title (I believe great American Bash). However they used a Florida tag team belt, slapped a plate over it and had “world heavyweight champion” engraved on it
Wrong. First. Flair went to the WWF (didn't become WWE until 2002). The belt (not title) Luger was handed was Dusty's PWF belt. It wasn't a tag belt, it was the PWF Heavyweight belt. It simply had trophy shop pieces covering up the PWF name.
Interestingly, even though Flair had been stripped of the WCW title after he left, he was still recognized as the NWA champion. Up until that point WCW was still a member of the NWA and it wasn't until Flair appeared on WWF television that he was stripped of the title and it was because of this that the title went vacant for a couple of years.
I love how Jim keeps saying "Manny and Rude left with the belts" when that isn't true. Manny stayed with Crockett for another 4 months after Rude left. Lmao
Rude walked off with one belt so Crockett just let Manny keep the other one. Which is good because Manny ended up owing a guy some money, the guy got that tag belt, and resold it. Joe Price got it and had the plates casted and now we can get copies of Manny's belt.
I feel like I remember a similar question almost exactly the same like 3 months ago. If not I'm just creating Cornette answers in my dreams from listening from him too much.
I always like J.R.'s take on belts. They are just props and right now there are way too many props out there. I don't even remember how many belts are out there right now in AEW.
The issue between Flair and Jim Herd, when Herd fired Flair and demanded the World Title back, Flair demanded the deposit back first but Herd refused to pay so Ric took the belt with him to the WWF, that wasn't entirely due to Herd's stupidity and arrogance, though that was part of it. When Ted Turner bought WCW and the territories started dying off the NWA/WCW Belt went into a sort of legal grey area as to who owned it and who held the deposit, when the shit hit the fan and Flair wanted his money it turned out neither side was willing to take responsibility, Herd and the WCW office said it was the NWA Title and the NWA had to pay while the NWA Board (what was left of them) said it was now the WCW Title and WCW had to pay, so Ric said "Fine, since it doesn't belong to either of you then I guess it's mine!", and both sides got bit in the ass.
You only got the deposit back after you dropped the belt. Giving the deposit back before that would be stupid. Flair wasn't entitled to the deposit since he refused to drop it. It also wasn't WCW's responsibility to give him the deposit, it was the NWA's.
@@Rjensen2 you obviously aren't paying attention, Flair was willing to drop it, just to the right person and that wasn't Luger, you get the deposit back when you're no longer the champion, Herd fired him so Flair was indeed entitled to the deposit. As for who owed the money, doesn't matter, since neither took responsibility both ended up crying.
@@FerretJohn HE REFUSED TO DROP THE BELT, WHICH WAS THE WHOLE POINT TO PUTTING A DEPOSIT DOWN!!! He lost his rights to it's return when he refused to drop the belt back. It wasn't his belt, or title.
What was the difference between the silver and the gold NWA titles.? Other than one being the NWA world heavyweight championship, and the other one being the national heavyweight champion? Before it became the United States championship
@@Rjensen2 I understand that difference. I'm talking about status wise they were both world championships from NWA national wrestling alliance so if he's the national heavyweight champion Ric flairo is what the national world heavyweight champion? That's what I was asking about! So that national heavyweight championship was like the intercontinental title then?
@@melvincahill5898 no, the U.S. title was what the IC title was, the number 2 singles title. The National title was MAYBE 3, but probably 4 after the TV title.
@@Rjensen2 I understand that Robert. I'm talking about before the national heavyweight championship belt became the United States title. I mean Greg Valentine and Roddy Piper had some great dog collar matches over that national heavyweight championship Ric flair held it Ricky steamboat held it Jimmy snuka I believe held it I mean the list goes on so they don't count that belt either for Ric flair being a champion because they don't call it the world champion
Blue-strap Attitude Era “big eagle” is the best belt of all time in any organization. It’s truly a piece of art that a REAL CHAMPION would wear. The spinner belt was the worst, easily. Even worse than the current one.
so at some point, someone's gonna be out of pocket. New/incoming champ, current/outgoing champ, and the company. I wonder on the details of money transfer. All done in cash?
Did each NWA territory have their own belt and then there were NWA belts? And if all the promoters voted on a champion, did that champion have to wrestle in all the territories or just in the territory he was signed to?
In theory there was only one world heavyweight and one world jr. heavyweight champion and they were supposed to defend in every territory. In practice it wasn't always, or even usually, that simple. The other titles were in each territory---they had their own US champions, world tag champions, etc.
@James Hagan awa broke away before wwwf. 1960/1963. The NWA member territories weren't supposed to have their own world champions but like I said that worked better on paper than it did in real life.
@James Hagan as far as recognized World titles in the wrestling press, after the NWA there was the WWA next, then the AWA and then the WWWF timeline wise, if we start at the time that Thesz more or less unified the world titles. If we go back before that of course there were multiple claims
![ค้าง (STILL) - GEMINI [ OFFICIAL MV ]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Ftxx3hk5vkU/mqdefault.jpg)
l love hearing old wrestling stories from Jim. He is a walking encyclopedia of wrestling history
Ya know thank god Jim decided to do this podcast- and we have it all in audio- …. Side note: I appreciate old(er) people so much they are always so knowledgeable and know so much but Jim is walking history when it comes to wrestling and I hope he keeps on for many more years to come
He's the best
Hes great
@@Captdrax he's the greatest
Hated him in wrestling(his character so to speak) but LOVE HIS PODCAST..can listen all day
I cannot wait for Corny to review the 4/27/22 ladder match between Scorpio Sky and Sammy Guevara. It had everything Cornette loves: barbed wire ladders, hockey fights, no selling, and hotshotting the title. I swear he’s going to need 2 Sprite Zeros for this one!
How about another 450 Swanton corkscrew splash bomb off a ladder straight to the mat misses scorpio and he sells it again Scorpio does smh 🤦♂️
@@2FICGamingHD Was gonna say the same. He's gonna have a fucking field day 🤣
The high risk twisting 450 Force Kick made me angry. Then the cutter redux (which Cody and Sammy did better in that other barely-months-old ladder match) pushed it into parody. Then the girls got the fella’s backs like they were playing pool joust.
I enjoy a lot of aye eeh dubya. This was not part of that.
And no selling when Sammy hit the barbed wire lmao. And springboarding off the ropes on the ladder like right after
The botch is something I know Cornette would love to talk about. Can't wait to hear about it.
That was honestly an excellent question, no need to laugh at it. I learned something new and I've been a fan for over 20 years. This is what makes Cornette awesome.
You know how there's a difference when the word 'funny' means 'haha' and when it means 'strange'? I take the laughter as something like that. The laughter isn't ridicule, it's more a commentary on the nature of the belt and what it means to hold it, as well as what the public thinks it means.
Love hearing about how much the old school wrestlers were protective of their money and image. Makes me think none of them would put up with modern WWEs ridiculous name changes and third party crack downs .
No they wouldn’t
They did put up with wwe shit in the 80s and 90s
@@cozya6877 good point, even then they were changing their gimmicks and names. Look at Red Rooster!
They wouldn’t put up with it as long as there was another territory they could go to.
Back in the 70s they were 20 or 30 different territories. A guy could go spend a year in each one and it’s a career. So it really didn’t matter how much he pissed off the promoter; as long as he could draw money somebody else would hire him.
I disagree a little. Those guys worked hard for every penny as they struggled to make ends meet. Today they’d get paid a whole lot more for a lot less work. I think most would relish that idea. A lot of money buys a lot of pride .
These stories are my favorites. I never get tired of sitting under Jim’s tree of knowledge.
Belts don't mean as much anymore. They are just props.
I think evidence of that was when it was Big Show vs Big Bossman for the world title... in the middle of the show.
Winged eagle and big gold are so damn Iconic I don’t know how you could choose between
The Winged Eagle hasn't aged well though because it looks small compared to the Big Gold belt. That's why the Big Eagle belt was made in 1998 which looked alot better in comparison to the smaller Winged Eagle. When Flair won the Winged Eagle you could see it didn't look right around his waist even though it was the same size as the NWA globed title. AEW belt is a good size, it reminds you of the Mid-South North American title. The AWA belt from the early 80's was a good looking title and influenced the design of the Big Gold belt.
@@wesleymorris2699 I remember when Hogan debuted the Winged eagle I didn’t like it compared to the Hogan 87 belt. The Big eagle black strap was better than Winged eagle as well
I like the winged eagle best, but that's because it's the one I always saw Bret Hart with. That probably makes a difference.
See, now, THIS is the real story about "putting down deposits for the championships" that we needed to hear. We keep hearing about, "oh it's about *the belt* and only the belt" and them giving us insane numbers just because Big Gold had a couple of extra jewels in it, and here's Jim giving us the truth: it was a security deposit for the prestige of being trusted as the champion, and if that champion betrayed that trust he would not get his deposit back. Thank you for your detailed explanation, Jim!
"Summer of '91, that great Bryan Adams song."
Eh, close enough...
I believe Kevin Von Eric said in an interview that He carved the KVE in the belt
Honestly not mentioning Brian in emails should be a new running joke
He gets so pissy about it it's hilarious
Or even better send them addressed to Jim and Jim's stooge 😆
nobody is here to listen to brian lets be real here
@@MarsofAritia he thinks people are, so we should fuck with that...
Bill Watts North American Belt was given away is a Trivia Contest in Mid South or UWF, I was there.
What I find interesting is that when Jim Duggan finally wins the title....
UWF comes to be!
And I bet that the person who won that title... needed a crane to get that home!
"Honey! Look what I won at Jake's BBQ!"
There should be a whole show on 'Belt stories'..Imagine road stories of being lost,stolen,held for ransom...😳
I thought Conrad Thompson was doing a series like that once some time ago......not sure what came of it though.
Tim got the papers from me. Facts are, Sam returned the Rogers belt deposit to Vince Sr., in 2 installments of $5K each BEFORE the switch, and further Sam did NOT withhold the money Vince owed the NWA for dues and the % of Rogers' title defenses, which seems to me would just have been normal business practice, and had to keep dunning Vince for the money. Vince was crying poormouth and Sam either bought it or went along to try to keep the peace. I'm not sure what Lou's story about the money being in a briefcase the night of the match was about.
I'm surprised that Jim didn't mention when Stan Hansen rode over the AWA championship with his tractor completely destroying it, then sent it back to Verne Gagne.
You're surprised he didn't talk about an old story told hundreds of times?
What happens if the champion loses the belt? for example the champion bangs a ring rat. The rat slips him a mickey and knocks him out. Then she walks away with the belt. Honestly i would be shocked if this hasn't happened before.
@@Rjensen2 yes its been told a lot of times, because its one of the most iconic moments in wrestling history.
He rode over a BELT. And it wasn't destroyed. Bockwinkel had it repaired and kept it.
@@kalen2465 A slightly lesser known story is thar the WWWF belt went MIA once, when someone broke into Bruno's car late one night after a show and stole it along with his ring gear.
NWA, mid 80s to 90, had the nicest belt designs of probably any era, by far. The main titles were all top notch but even the secondary belts were beautiful. The old TV title is timeless, the US tag belts were incredible, even the obscure ones, like the Western States Heritage Title were magnificently designed.
true indeed
Love the shout out to Bluefield WV. You can still catch wrestling there 2 times a month at the Green Valley Skating Rink
I much prefer hearing Cornette talk about classic wrestling such as this as opposed to hearing him talk about modern stuff
My favourite belt has to be the Mid-South North American Heavyweight Championship belt. Looked amazing when Magnum held it
MID SOUTH BABY!!!! thats my favorite territory!
@ Honest Abe The belt looked great, but it weighed 27 lbs. from what I've heard. Nice to be champ, must have been brutal to carry around.
That was a big ass belt!!
@@michaelmarino7391 dayummmm haha. Like a fucking claymore
That belt has to be the inspiration for the new AEW Women’s belt right?
Jim cornette the voice of my childhood and the greatest manager of all time!
2nd greatest. Bobby Heenan was the greatest. Corny would say and has said the same thing.
Ya Bobby the Brain rules. Him and Guerilla Monsoon were gold. RIP
@@gothard5 Ty I was gonna correct this fool putting Jim #1 , The Brain baby #1
Getting the belt back before the wrestler leaves the terrority became a bigger deal in the age of national TV. I'm sure Easy E had big plans on how he wanted Bret to throw Vince's belt in the bin live on Nitro.
after madusa and the razor and diesel thing turner would not have let him bin a belt at most there would have been a bischoff commentary line
Vince had no problem having Ric. Flair walk around with the belt when he jumped
@@keithzatkalik5805 As pointed out, Flair had a legal claim to owning that belt.
Bret would have never done that though.
According to Bret, in his contract. He stated that after Survivor Series, he would have dropped the belt to Micheals. The next night on Raw. So, he would have not left with the belt to wcw.
Imagine using that deposit rule now for the 24/7 title. WWE is really missing out on a bunch-a deposits here :p
That would have sucked for R Truth
@@gothard5 :( dang! you're right. I wouldn't have wished that for Truth. The man's a WWE treasure
They would get their deposit back once the title changed hands. In R-Truth's case, he would've actually made money by leaving the deposit and letting interest build in between reigns.
After the discussion about Paige and Sammy I thought this was gonna be about a different kind of "belt deposit"
Except Sammy and Tay only posed naked with the TNT belt unlike Paige who had someone "deposited" on the Women's NXT title.
"The airline losing it" lol
Jim "Whatever the F" Cornette 😂
Story goes when Big Show won his first belt in WCW, a lot of guys ribbed him how he is now the champion and had to wear the belt out in public… so he would walk around airports with the strap across his shoulder… one day Sting saw him and said “what the f**k are you doing?”
Sting told him to take it off because he looked like an idiot. Hulk Hogan pranked Big Show and told him to wear the belt through the airport.
The Nikits Mulkovich cast Crockett NWA World Tag belts don't date back to the 70's. Jimmy Snika and Ray Stevens were the first team that wore them in 1980.
There was also the (in)famous letter from Eddie Quinn to Sam in the aftermath of the Thesz-Carpentier-Thesz switch, where he refers to the return of Carpentier's '$10,000'.
$30,000 in 1986 is equivalent in purchasing power to about $78,696.35 today........that wcw belt was expensive!
It actually only cost $20,000.
@@MrNWA4Life if so, that is still ALOT of money for a wrestling championship belt...
Ric Flair talked about this stuff on his own podcast. The time he took the WCW belt to wwf in 1992.
"They oughta make the president of The United States put up a deposit." I'm all for taking monetary incentives away from politicians, but when the federal government is acting like the territorial system we've probably gone too far. Theodore Roosevelt would have supported it though.
The NWA DOME GLOBED World title in my opinion, not the new ugly thing they, the new NWA uses, but the one that was worn by Ric Flair, Harley Race, Tommy Rich, Dusty Rhoads, Kerry Von Erich, and Terry Funk, is the coolest looking belt ever, but that's just my opinion. Also the old United States title, era 1984-1985 that JCP used was also another great designed title the 10 pounds of silver, and the painted version of it too...
To answer the question of did a belt ever get lost, the answer is yes and quite recently. Chris Jericho left the brand new AEW belt in a limo and it disappeared for a short time but he did get it back. Also, Randy Savage ruined the original IC title belt by taking a can of brass cleaner to it which is why it looked dull during his reign.
Wrestlers in the WWE do not travel with the belts. They are handed them in Gorilla before going out and they give them back when they walk in Gorilla coming back. Famous footage of this exchange is when Brock Lesnar walked into Gorilla and tossed the belt at Vince McMahon.
However ... champions in WWE sometimes carry around a replica they acquired at the WWE shop that any fan can buy.
Another note ... the RAW when half the WWE Roster was being held on the Runway in Saudi Arabia. So was the WWE Championship. So Brock Lesnar who left on a different plane was on the next night RAW sporting an official WWE replica belt the WWE had to acquire from one of the consession stands in the arena.
When Punk did the angle where he left the WWE as WWE champion. They had the tournament for a new champion. While Punk was doing appearances on talk shows an interviews. He was allowed to take the belt. The belt that Cena won was an official WWE replica belt any fan could buy while Punk had the actual belt.
At one point the champions did travel with a belt but the office had separate belts that they kept nice looking for TV. I don't know if that's true today since they run so few house shows.
Why even have a real belt at that point? 😆
So the belt in the Page videos was a replica?
@@robfinlay8058 Still true. They still have the House show belts and the TV belts.
@@steveomac385 I am not sure. NXT rules may have been different. The reason for the WWE belts no longer traveling with the wrestler is 2 fold. Wrestlers having added responsibility and risk of leaving it behind. Wrestlers showing up on other shows with it. Which was less risk after WCW was bought by WWE
The last wrestler to travel with the WWE Championship is CM Punk. They dropped the rule during his angle so he could show up in public with it to give the appearance he officially left the WWE with the world title when he won it after the "Pipe Bomb" segment.
I could listen to a whole episode on this subject. The history, designs and changes, and interesting trivia about the belts. Another cool fact is that Steve Austin has said he has the original IC belt that he carried in a safe. But then I also wonder, what happens when a promotion folds? Who keeps the belts? For instance, did Larry Zbyszko keep the AWA belt since he was the last champion?
LZ did and still owns it.
Has anyone ever tried keeping a piece of the belt?
Hypothetical example, they give the big gold belt back, but some of the "jewels" are missing?
Depending on the belt, some of the jewels would have been missing just by the way the belts were handled and used. The original big gold was probably one of the best made belts, as far as plates because it was actually sterling silver with gold plating on top and was originally two-tone. Most other belts were made of brass (real old ones) or zinc and, are basically big plates of zinc, like a big belt buckle with bolts welded on the back so they could screw onto the leather. The jewels were fake rubies, cubic zirconia or Swarovski crystals, so not really worth much. Belts broke a lot, especially regular WWF or WCW belts, I’m sure ECW belts broke often as they were abused often. I can’t imagine anyone ripping off a side plate etc, it’s doable but would be noticeable it was ripped off etc.
Now Steiner did the ultimate grab, switching out the Crumrine for the cast copy towards end of WCW, which is why WWE never got the original belt.
Well, somebody somewhere somehow did take the straightness out of the top crown.
Great story was when they gave the new intercontinental championship belt to Randy Savage, he was so obsessive about shining the belt it stripped the varnish off of it. The red coloration of the logo was pretty much done. You could see it on TV after 4 months
In WWF since Hogan, the champs keep the belt. They keep one and one is used for tv and photos. They never have to travel with a belt
Lmao, no they didn't. Most of the time, guys had many belts. There were around 30 winged eagles used.
Awesome Shoot Today Jim!!😎🐐🐐
The most beautiful belt in wrestling has to be the WCW World championship belt. Feels like a big prize you would want to have on your shoulders
The United States champion belt in WCW was GREAT. The one Goldberg won from Raven.
@@charliefromstarkvillemissi1852 oh yess. Beautiful.
Let me tell you about the John Cena spinner belt...
@@joseortega7815 😁😂😂.
Uh no.
Scott Hall gave his IC belt to two kids with HIV/AIDS while visiting them on the Springer show. It was a totally impromptu thing.
He had a great story about them having to call Vince and ask that a new belt get ordered, and he’d pay for it. He was scared shitless and finally fessed up, and Vince “you did the right thing. You’re not paying for it.”
Wow, what a story 😆 I said this when Rhea lost her title belt but why don't the companies hold the belts and give them to the champion when they need it for a match or segment like the production company would an actor for a movie prop? They are technically company property and the wrestlers are employees or at least "contractors" for that company. 🤷🏼♂️ In the modern era, that just seems to be much safer than letting the champions carry them everywhere they go 😂
I actually thought that was how it worked
They only bring the real belt to big shows(Ppv’s) or if a switch is taking place. Otherwise they use duplicates.
Someone should find the Bruno stolen belt article and send it to him or Brian to read it
They already have.
@@Rjensen2 send me the clip
Manny Fernandez, I used to like him as a kid. Then TH-cam told the truth on how much a delusional character he was in real life.
Not unlike Sgt. Slaughter.
You know a belt has some history when it features the Canadian Red Ensign and not the Maple Leaf.
The belt was done long after the change was made.
The way Jim says dubya is so pure
Where are your Friends Brian!!! Still! Jim and Brian „whatever“ he said
Paige had the most famous deposit on a belt issue until the whole thing was cleaned up.
I see what you did there
It was glorious.
Was it Paige, or Brad Maddox?
Love listening to wrestling history.
I really enjoy listening to Jim when he's not ranting about AEW.
I am so jealous of the guys that were in wrestling in the 80’s and 90s. I would of had a blast to be in the wrestling business with all the stories that are about how the business was ran. You guys made my childhood amazing.
12:07 lmfao.
Lmaoo Jim: that Bryan Adams song the summer of 91 hahahaha you mean summer of 69???
I love the part in the show where you get to understand the illustration haha
Love these history videos fascinating stuff.
I've asked this question before on email but guess mine never got picked to be asked.
Ah, poor baby.
Shout out to my hometown. Nice
Been watching old days on peacock
..good times
Didn't Flair help pay Stings first deposit for the belt?
Huh? I highly doubt Sting paid one, and I doubt even more that Flair could afford it, or would even do it.
I remember when Flair went to the WWE (with the big gold belt). That left WCW without a belt, so Luger beat Windham in a steel cage for the title (I believe great American Bash). However they used a Florida tag team belt, slapped a plate over it and had “world heavyweight champion” engraved on it
Yeah I remember that it's like the best example of what happens went someone leaves and has possession of the actual belt.
Wrong. First. Flair went to the WWF (didn't become WWE until 2002). The belt (not title) Luger was handed was Dusty's PWF belt. It wasn't a tag belt, it was the PWF Heavyweight belt. It simply had trophy shop pieces covering up the PWF name.
@@MrNWA4Life thanks for the correction
it was dusty rhodes western heritag belt
Interestingly, even though Flair had been stripped of the WCW title after he left, he was still recognized as the NWA champion. Up until that point WCW was still a member of the NWA and it wasn't until Flair appeared on WWF television that he was stripped of the title and it was because of this that the title went vacant for a couple of years.
I love how Jim keeps saying "Manny and Rude left with the belts" when that isn't true. Manny stayed with Crockett for another 4 months after Rude left. Lmao
Well I'm sure he didn't mean they left at exactly the same time.
Rude walked off with one belt so Crockett just let Manny keep the other one. Which is good because Manny ended up owing a guy some money, the guy got that tag belt, and resold it. Joe Price got it and had the plates casted and now we can get copies of Manny's belt.
I would love to sit and talk to Jim about wrestling and not what it has turned into now
Thank you for the mental image of bill watt's furious memo
Macho man stained the ic belt with wax 😂
No he didn't. He used brasso, because he was an idiot. It took off most of the gold plating.
the nwa "10 lbs. of gold" was the best hwc belt...ever.
I thought The Word Heavyweight Tag Team Belts in Gold with the Eagle looked pretty cool too. Actually, All of the NWA/JCP era belts looked great....
I feel like I remember a similar question almost exactly the same like 3 months ago.
If not I'm just creating Cornette answers in my dreams from listening from him too much.
Big Goldy cost $20,000 not $30,000.
love the marks not understanding the deposit
I always like J.R.'s take on belts. They are just props and right now there are way too many props out there. I don't even remember how many belts are out there right now in AEW.
Less than WWE have.
@@freemankeyz not counting the ROH belts, and Triple A Tag Belts have been defended on AEW tv and are shown weekly.
@@CockyBalboa nothing wrong with co-promotion. I can see if a fan can't tell the different but those belt are not technically AEW belts.
Can't wait to listen to this story!!
Does that thumbnail belt supposed to have a face or am I tripping balls
I think it's just pareidolia due to parts of it baring slight resemblances to facial features while being in roughly the right spots.
Can't unsee
Ooohhh Travis used Jim’s shoot middle initial in the artwork!
Good one
Aint no way you already watched this whole thing. Liar
“KVR “Kerry Von Rick!!!!
Tales of TNA would be nice
Agreed. The biggest little indie.
So go watch the dozens of interviews where he did just that.
Go Bluefield! Just about shit myself. I live 8 miles away... in the middle of nowhere.... literally the boogerwoods.
"OH I just got that thank you." Hahah classic jim
Someone should ask Jericho about this... 🤔
It's the same cash and carry often found in boxing.
The issue between Flair and Jim Herd, when Herd fired Flair and demanded the World Title back, Flair demanded the deposit back first but Herd refused to pay so Ric took the belt with him to the WWF, that wasn't entirely due to Herd's stupidity and arrogance, though that was part of it. When Ted Turner bought WCW and the territories started dying off the NWA/WCW Belt went into a sort of legal grey area as to who owned it and who held the deposit, when the shit hit the fan and Flair wanted his money it turned out neither side was willing to take responsibility, Herd and the WCW office said it was the NWA Title and the NWA had to pay while the NWA Board (what was left of them) said it was now the WCW Title and WCW had to pay, so Ric said "Fine, since it doesn't belong to either of you then I guess it's mine!", and both sides got bit in the ass.
You only got the deposit back after you dropped the belt. Giving the deposit back before that would be stupid. Flair wasn't entitled to the deposit since he refused to drop it.
It also wasn't WCW's responsibility to give him the deposit, it was the NWA's.
@@Rjensen2 you obviously aren't paying attention, Flair was willing to drop it, just to the right person and that wasn't Luger, you get the deposit back when you're no longer the champion, Herd fired him so Flair was indeed entitled to the deposit. As for who owed the money, doesn't matter, since neither took responsibility both ended up crying.
@@FerretJohn Wrong.
It was Windham that he refused to put over.
@@FerretJohn HE REFUSED TO DROP THE BELT, WHICH WAS THE WHOLE POINT TO PUTTING A DEPOSIT DOWN!!! He lost his rights to it's return when he refused to drop the belt back. It wasn't his belt, or title.
@@FerretJohn and since WCW and the NWA were two completely different companies, I'd say it definitely did matter.
In 🌽y we trust.
Good question.
This is Gold
"JMC" I got kayfabed i thought his middle initial was E
I love and respect Jim as a wrestling history book, but he really needs to leave the "political shit" at home. Know you're audience Jim.
Hes an idiot about politics. Everyone is i suppose.
What was the difference between the silver and the gold NWA titles.? Other than one being the NWA world heavyweight championship, and the other one being the national heavyweight champion? Before it became the United States championship
One was etched, the other one wasn't.
@@Rjensen2 I understand that difference. I'm talking about status wise they were both world championships from NWA national wrestling alliance so if he's the national heavyweight champion Ric flairo is what the national world heavyweight champion? That's what I was asking about! So that national heavyweight championship was like the intercontinental title then?
@@melvincahill5898 no, the U.S. title was what the IC title was, the number 2 singles title. The National title was MAYBE 3, but probably 4 after the TV title.
@@Rjensen2 I understand that Robert. I'm talking about before the national heavyweight championship belt became the United States title. I mean Greg Valentine and Roddy Piper had some great dog collar matches over that national heavyweight championship Ric flair held it Ricky steamboat held it Jimmy snuka I believe held it I mean the list goes on so they don't count that belt either for Ric flair being a champion because they don't call it the world champion
@@melvincahill5898 the National title and U.S. title were completely separate.
Blue-strap Attitude Era “big eagle” is the best belt of all time in any organization. It’s truly a piece of art that a REAL CHAMPION would wear.
The spinner belt was the worst, easily. Even worse than the current one.
So, you are THE Charlie from Starkville, Mississippi
spinner was the worst, for sure. the big penny tag belts a close second. my favorite would be the IC belt in the late 90s
@@shrews12001 that IC belt was decent, but I always felt the 80’s IC belt is the second-best belt ever.
No this guy is a fake the real Charlie is a figment of Brian Last imagination
Golden eagle belt that Bret Hart had was my fav.
Today's title belt are not worth keeping. 😝
As a wrestler I definitely would have wanted to keep a 1977 WWWF title belt.
so at some point, someone's gonna be out of pocket. New/incoming champ, current/outgoing champ, and the company. I wonder on the details of money transfer. All done in cash?
Usually wire transfer back in the day,
2022: where is the Big Gold Belt now?
BGB?
Tell me everything you know about belts...lol
Wonder how much Jericho lost when his brand-new AEW Championship was stolen..?
Bryan Adams "Summer 69?"
Haha, Jim carving his initials on the belt. Should it be JEC since he went by "James E." on camera?
He colored the U.S. tag belts with magic marker.
Interesting
Did each NWA territory have their own belt and then there were NWA belts? And if all the promoters voted on a champion, did that champion have to wrestle in all the territories or just in the territory he was signed to?
In theory there was only one world heavyweight and one world jr. heavyweight champion and they were supposed to defend in every territory. In practice it wasn't always, or even usually, that simple. The other titles were in each territory---they had their own US champions, world tag champions, etc.
@James Hagan awa broke away before wwwf. 1960/1963. The NWA member territories weren't supposed to have their own world champions but like I said that worked better on paper than it did in real life.
@James Hagan as far as recognized World titles in the wrestling press, after the NWA there was the WWA next, then the AWA and then the WWWF timeline wise, if we start at the time that Thesz more or less unified the world titles. If we go back before that of course there were multiple claims
yes each territory had their own belts nwa let them use the name but didnt reconize them as thw nwa had their own belts
Yeah, they definitely need to make the president of the US get the hell out of office. Especially those Dems Cornette loves so much.
Stay mad RaPepublican 🤡
Terry Taylor?
How much was the belt deposit for the TNA Beer Drinking belt?
You were thinking the other item that he was going to say was what rhymes with Rick but it starts with a D in his hand😂😂😂😂
Belts mean nothing
Nowadays yeah
I wish people would learn the difference between a BELT and a title.