Your videos are always incredibly informative and brutally honest. I love it. Keep up the good work 👍 You'll also have to do a video on your upgrades for this controller and do comparative tests. Would definitely be worth the watch 😁
Convince the KO Moto people and fans of that! hahaha Thanks...I try to be honest if at all possible with anything I tear down. I found a Vietnamese guy that upgraded his EM150 significantly. It's probably pretty noisy in the higher frequency ranges since he didn't add any ceramics, bu still, the fact that he was added another 30% more current is amusing! I jsut want it to operate optimally as it was delivered to me so I'm not going to add mosfets to it, just fix a few niggling details.
@@de-bodgery I think efficiency upgrades are better than pushing something to the limits of the components. I like things that last more than 5 mins so if you're saying this Chinese controller has the ability to be improved and upgraded then it's a good bit of kit as it also means it could also be easily repaired. I have a bac2000 and it's fantastic, but it can't really be improved or repaired without wrecking it.k
@@TheMickarus EM150 is a pretty solid design and easy to repair. Nothing ASI makes is easy to repair! ASI does FOC quite well. No complaints about their motor control as they have been developing FOC motor controllers longer than any other contender. ASI is however becoming less and less relevant due to their control issues over their products. They don't want average people configuring their controllers! They don't want people educated in how to set them up. ASI is literally putting themselves out of business with their overly controlling business practices.
Another good vid 👍 One thing that stood out for me was how the solder did not come through from the bottom up to the top side on the Fet legs. Possibly little impact, but if it is better to get to the body of the Fet with less legs as possible , not doing that, than as much solder at that point of connection should be considered, no? Cheers
Thanks for the deep dive on this board, one question though: you've mentioned that with a few mods this could carry 200A continuous, by going with the wider part on the TO package legs could it be bumped to 300A (75A x 4)? Another question, is there any sort of current splitting feature for these MOSFETs, so that one doesn't get more overloaded than the others during peak discharge?
mosfet are easy to paralel, because they have positive temp/resistance characteristics... So if you have 4 mosfets and one is carrying 10 more amps then other three, then this one will heat up more, an increase its resistance - so current lowers throught this one and other three will carry more current.
300 amps is more of a maximum and not something you can rely on for regular use. 200a should be no problem, probably even 250 amps. It will need ceramic caps added as a minimum to accomplish all of this. They are already in parallel and dividing the total current between them.
Any sights set on reviewing the EM-200 and or EM-260 controllers? Far driver would be cool too…the big ones 96850 961800 etc 😅. Very impressed by your content I feel that I am an infant in the world of electronics and for some reason got way more into electronics than mechanics once I got out of school. I am a big fan of this kind of expertly reviewed technical content…non-biased, fact driven, ah it’s refreshing. I have lots of digging left to do in your channel so my bad if I’m asking for something you have already done.
It all depends on availability of the hardware. I personally can afford to buy only so much stuff any given month. I need people to send/lend/give me hardware too. That's how I did this tear down. So the EM-200, EM-260, EM-300, etc are all controllers that I'd like to review. I'm uploading a video now for the Far Driver 96530. I probably have a 96850 coming soon, but that's up to the good will of others if that happens. I have other hardware yet to do tear downs for. Things come my way as they come my way! *** Thank you for the compliment. Please tell your friends to watch my videos and to subscribe. My YT channel is growing, but it's not able to pay for itself yet.
Hello. I just bought the Votol em100 motor controller. Since it was not compatible with my motor, I programmed it with the program cable. However, when I removed the program cable, a static electricity jump occurred. The device does not work at all and does not connect with the PC program. Can you help me?
One of 2 things has happened... 1. You fried the CPU with whatever "spark" occurred. They are low voltage devices (3.3v) and typical static discharge is something like 10,000 to 1 million volts. 2. The CPU contains flash memory in it. Static can corrupt flash. It may be recoverable if you can reflash the CPU. You will need the firmware and an STlink to do that. Opening the controller is needed as well. Pretty sure in my tear downs for this controller, I show where the programming port is.
We run on of these controllers on a small MX pit bike. It is fantastic. I love the way it works. But we have one problem that has plagued us from the very beginning 1 1/2 yrs ago. It will randomly cut off... If the track is relatively smooth its never an issue ... but if the track is very rough.. or the chain gets too loose.. it will randomly cut off... almost as if the rear wheel is loosing where it is compared to the motor.. I was told that with the amps we are running (250 busbar & 250 peak) that the controller isn't keeping up.. Maybe you could give me some insight... thanks
I've heard of others having that issue. The firmware cuts power when current rises too high. It's not really an issue persay, but a safety feature so you don't blow up the controller.
@@de-bodgery.... personally I feel it has more to do with the Hall sensor being only 60 degrees.. I have lowered the current and the issue still exists ..When he would use the rear brake to turn the bike... ie .. backing it into a corner and the pressed on gear to the shaft would scoot a little... it would cut off..even on a smooth track.. . I used to weld the gear to the shaft until QS started making the gear & shaft as one..but the problem still exists .... not as bad... but still exists .. only when the chain gets a little loose and you are flying through a whoop section.. it will cut off after the section when entering the corner.... making sure the chain slack is good & no problem... we just encountered this 2 weeks ago.. then we went to a track that was very rough (last weekend) and had a slight issue a couple times... and it always happens when entering a corner... with the throttle mostly off..after a nasty section.. never full throttle.... our practice track is kinda smooth with bigger jumps so he is holding it wide open most of the time...a good test for max current and how long the battery will last.. there is never an issue there..This is an unbeatable combination...we love the way it performs except for the cutting off issue .. I think an encoder would fix the situation. Votol does not support an encoder.. the CL700 does..and they have an encoder for the QS motor... your thoughts?
That's possible, but eliminate other things. Default the controller back to factory settings and set it up again. Flash memory in the CPU can get corrupted and this will reset it back to no settings. Did you recently get a firmware update for the controller? Maybe there is a bug in it? If your firmware is old, see if there is a new version you can apply. Try another throttle. I think after you eliminate all the other possibilities, then the actual electronics are what's left.
Hi! Im using em 100 votol controller using votol pc program it says always overcurrent when I twist throttle it makes rough rotation on the hub. But the hall sensor from the hub are all working. Can you help me?
I have a problem with my sabvoton 72150 😐 on the hall plug is Red and Black 5v but from Black to any colour it is only 3v 😐 Controller Show me hallfault but All Halls are work. Maybe the internal pullup? Hope you can help 😊🙏
@@de-bodgery i have now put on each signal line frome the hall a 5v line with a 6,8 kOhm resistor. Now it is 5v but the sabvoton says hallfault anyware😪 is IT possible that the internal pullup resistor from the sabvoton is damaged? Can i replace them ? 😅😪🙈
@@de-bodgery i have only this motor. Maybee it works when i put the 6.8kohm resistor that i have current one one each signal line from the Halls in parallel and from the 3 resistor in parallel a wirre to each signal line from the halls?
Good day to you sir. I recently updated firmware from a bin file i downloaded online. Stupid of me i ran out of batter from my laptop and interrupted my download. After plugging my laptop i cannot connect to my controller anymore. Is my votol em50 bricked already? I also noticed my learning cable is plugged together all the time. Used it no problem until i perform an interupted bin upgrade. Can i do something about my controller or its already junk? Thanks.
disconnect the the phase wires if you haven't already. Do you still have the short? If you do, then you've got blown mosfets. Opening the shell is just a matter of removing the screws. However, if you don't know how to repair electronics, this won't help you much.
@@anthonyC193 If you don't know how to do this one task, I don't recommend you trying a controller repair. If you are in the USA, maybe send it to me? If you are in Europe, I know a few people like myself there that might be able to repair it for you.
I have a Votol EM-100 (or its variant EM-100s, etc), but it is factory locked. No setting can be applied. Can we just copy the firmware from other Votol so it can become a "normal" Votol with adjustable settings?
@@de-bodgery i havent opened it because it is still under warranty, lol. but I do think I need to unlock this thing. firmware, I could not find for em100, only find for em50.
@@de-bodgery I have question , maybe you can advise me. I have votol em 100 s, this controller pretty much same like em150. I`m planing add more mosfets , two more on each shoulder( want add 3 , but no mach space).What you think when add more mosfets , nesesary change mosfet - driver transistors ? From manufacture in em 100 driver transistors is Y2 (ss8550) 1.5 A sounds like should cary 5 mosfets in one time
@@ІванДрушляк The EM100 has empty locations for more mosfets? I knew they had 2 less per phase than the 150. I'd look over the driver electronics. Are they the same as the 150? If they are, you should have no problem adding another set of mosfets per phase. Biggest issue here is gate current. You won't be able to add more mosfets than the gate circuits can handle. I doubt they will drive 6 or 7 per bank! Next issue is what mosfet is in the EM100? You will do best if you get all new mosfets so they are from the same production batch. I don't know what you have now in it, but that's generally a good idea if you intend to run the controller hard.
@@de-bodgery Mosfets are Magnachip MDP1991, 3 in parallel . I know about issue with gate current, as I understand to solve this problem need to swap transisrors on driver circuit for more powerfull. Or You mean not enough change transistrors in driver circuit for more powerful? Can be problems with power source that provide voltage and current for gates?
@@de-bodgery I saw one guy from Vietnam add more 4 mosfets on shoulder on em 150s, and get 600 peek amps. But unfortunately i dont know all details of mod
Magnachips and yes, I believe they are Korean. It's specifically the MDP10N027 in this controller. It's one of the best mosfets in TO-220 I've ever found.
Your videos are always incredibly informative and brutally honest. I love it. Keep up the good work 👍 You'll also have to do a video on your upgrades for this controller and do comparative tests. Would definitely be worth the watch 😁
Convince the KO Moto people and fans of that! hahaha Thanks...I try to be honest if at all possible with anything I tear down. I found a Vietnamese guy that upgraded his EM150 significantly. It's probably pretty noisy in the higher frequency ranges since he didn't add any ceramics, bu still, the fact that he was added another 30% more current is amusing! I jsut want it to operate optimally as it was delivered to me so I'm not going to add mosfets to it, just fix a few niggling details.
@@de-bodgery I think efficiency upgrades are better than pushing something to the limits of the components. I like things that last more than 5 mins so if you're saying this Chinese controller has the ability to be improved and upgraded then it's a good bit of kit as it also means it could also be easily repaired. I have a bac2000 and it's fantastic, but it can't really be improved or repaired without wrecking it.k
@@TheMickarus EM150 is a pretty solid design and easy to repair. Nothing ASI makes is easy to repair! ASI does FOC quite well. No complaints about their motor control as they have been developing FOC motor controllers longer than any other contender. ASI is however becoming less and less relevant due to their control issues over their products. They don't want average people configuring their controllers! They don't want people educated in how to set them up. ASI is literally putting themselves out of business with their overly controlling business practices.
I liked your review
What if you include detailed volt tracing for how far can be maintened and bench test all wiring function
Another good vid 👍
One thing that stood out for me was how the solder did not come through from the bottom up to the top side on the Fet legs. Possibly little impact, but if it is better to get to the body of the Fet with less legs as possible , not doing that, than as much solder at that point of connection should be considered, no?
Cheers
Thanks! More solder at the base of the legs won't matter much. The legs are already too long and that matters more.
lol keep on keepin on ill see you in the next one
Thanks for the deep dive on this board, one question though: you've mentioned that with a few mods this could carry 200A continuous, by going with the wider part on the TO package legs could it be bumped to 300A (75A x 4)? Another question, is there any sort of current splitting feature for these MOSFETs, so that one doesn't get more overloaded than the others during peak discharge?
mosfet are easy to paralel, because they have positive temp/resistance characteristics... So if you have 4 mosfets and one is carrying 10 more amps then other three, then this one will heat up more, an increase its resistance - so current lowers throught this one and other three will carry more current.
@@stepusak guessing this is not the same for IGBTs then
@@wagnerbrochini3892 It is
300 amps is more of a maximum and not something you can rely on for regular use. 200a should be no problem, probably even 250 amps. It will need ceramic caps added as a minimum to accomplish all of this. They are already in parallel and dividing the total current between them.
Any sights set on reviewing the EM-200 and or EM-260 controllers? Far driver would be cool too…the big ones 96850 961800 etc 😅. Very impressed by your content I feel that I am an infant in the world of electronics and for some reason got way more into electronics than mechanics once I got out of school. I am a big fan of this kind of expertly reviewed technical content…non-biased, fact driven, ah it’s refreshing. I have lots of digging left to do in your channel so my bad if I’m asking for something you have already done.
It all depends on availability of the hardware. I personally can afford to buy only so much stuff any given month. I need people to send/lend/give me hardware too. That's how I did this tear down. So the EM-200, EM-260, EM-300, etc are all controllers that I'd like to review. I'm uploading a video now for the Far Driver 96530. I probably have a 96850 coming soon, but that's up to the good will of others if that happens. I have other hardware yet to do tear downs for. Things come my way as they come my way!
***
Thank you for the compliment. Please tell your friends to watch my videos and to subscribe. My YT channel is growing, but it's not able to pay for itself yet.
best controller out there for the money for sure lol
Probably. But the software is a nightmare
Hello. I just bought the Votol em100 motor controller. Since it was not compatible with my motor, I programmed it with the program cable. However, when I removed the program cable, a static electricity jump occurred. The device does not work at all and does not connect with the PC program. Can you help me?
One of 2 things has happened...
1. You fried the CPU with whatever "spark" occurred. They are low voltage devices (3.3v) and typical static discharge is something like 10,000 to 1 million volts.
2. The CPU contains flash memory in it. Static can corrupt flash. It may be recoverable if you can reflash the CPU. You will need the firmware and an STlink to do that. Opening the controller is needed as well. Pretty sure in my tear downs for this controller, I show where the programming port is.
We run on of these controllers on a small MX pit bike. It is fantastic. I love the way it works. But we have one problem that has plagued us from the very beginning 1 1/2 yrs ago. It will randomly cut off... If the track is relatively smooth its never an issue ... but if the track is very rough.. or the chain gets too loose.. it will randomly cut off... almost as if the rear wheel is loosing where it is compared to the motor.. I was told that with the amps we are running (250 busbar & 250 peak) that the controller isn't keeping up.. Maybe you could give me some insight... thanks
I've heard of others having that issue. The firmware cuts power when current rises too high. It's not really an issue persay, but a safety feature so you don't blow up the controller.
@@de-bodgery.... personally I feel it has more to do with the Hall sensor being only 60 degrees.. I have lowered the current and the issue still exists ..When he would use the rear brake to turn the bike... ie .. backing it into a corner and the pressed on gear to the shaft would scoot a little... it would cut off..even on a smooth track.. . I used to weld the gear to the shaft until QS started making the gear & shaft as one..but the problem still exists .... not as bad... but still exists .. only when the chain gets a little loose and you are flying through a whoop section.. it will cut off after the section when entering the corner.... making sure the chain slack is good & no problem... we just encountered this 2 weeks ago.. then we went to a track that was very rough (last weekend) and had a slight issue a couple times... and it always happens when entering a corner... with the throttle mostly off..after a nasty section.. never full throttle.... our practice track is kinda smooth with bigger jumps so he is holding it wide open most of the time...a good test for max current and how long the battery will last.. there is never an issue there..This is an unbeatable combination...we love the way it performs except for the cutting off issue .. I think an encoder would fix the situation. Votol does not support an encoder.. the CL700 does..and they have an encoder for the QS motor... your thoughts?
@@ardenbriggs1190 Areyou sure your halls are at 60 degrees and not 120 degrees which is far moire common?
Yes
I tried sending you a screenshot of the program page.. it is set at hall shift angle 60
Hi after 3 months of use there is a cut off when small load is present at 20% throtle.... what would you think is culprit? component?
That's possible, but eliminate other things. Default the controller back to factory settings and set it up again. Flash memory in the CPU can get corrupted and this will reset it back to no settings. Did you recently get a firmware update for the controller? Maybe there is a bug in it? If your firmware is old, see if there is a new version you can apply. Try another throttle. I think after you eliminate all the other possibilities, then the actual electronics are what's left.
Hi! Im using em 100 votol controller using votol pc program it says always overcurrent when I twist throttle it makes rough rotation on the hub. But the hall sensor from the hub are all working. Can you help me?
Have you contacted Votol for support?
I have a problem with my sabvoton 72150 😐 on the hall plug is Red and Black 5v but from Black to any colour it is only 3v 😐 Controller Show me hallfault but All Halls are work. Maybe the internal pullup? Hope you can help 😊🙏
Sounds like you are pulling down the 5v line.
@@de-bodgery i have now put on each signal line frome the hall a 5v line with a 6,8 kOhm resistor. Now it is 5v but the sabvoton says hallfault anyware😪 is IT possible that the internal pullup resistor from the sabvoton is damaged? Can i replace them ? 😅😪🙈
@@E-BIKE_Madness Try another motor. Do you still get hall faults?
@@de-bodgery i have only this motor. Maybee it works when i put the 6.8kohm resistor that i have current one one each signal line from the Halls in parallel and from the 3 resistor in parallel a wirre to each signal line from the halls?
@@E-BIKE_Madness second controller? I'd try some other main peice of hardware before you started fiddling with resistors.
Is there any blue print available for this circuit
I think you want schematics. I'm sure they exist.
Good day to you sir. I recently updated firmware from a bin file i downloaded online. Stupid of me i ran out of batter from my laptop and interrupted my download. After plugging my laptop i cannot connect to my controller anymore. Is my votol em50 bricked already? I also noticed my learning cable is plugged together all the time. Used it no problem until i perform an interupted bin upgrade. Can i do something about my controller or its already junk? Thanks.
debricking most controllers isn/t that hard.
@@de-bodgery how to debrick sir. Could you teach me?
@@ericsantiago3743 you need an stlink and the formware file
hello, how did you open it? mine has a short between GND and the yellow motor wire
disconnect the the phase wires if you haven't already. Do you still have the short? If you do, then you've got blown mosfets. Opening the shell is just a matter of removing the screws. However, if you don't know how to repair electronics, this won't help you much.
@@de-bodgery Yes a mosfet is blown. Can u tell me please how to extract it from the heat sink? thanks
@@anthonyC193 If you don't know how to do this one task, I don't recommend you trying a controller repair. If you are in the USA, maybe send it to me? If you are in Europe, I know a few people like myself there that might be able to repair it for you.
I have a Votol EM-100 (or its variant EM-100s, etc), but it is factory locked. No setting can be applied. Can we just copy the firmware from other Votol so it can become a "normal" Votol with adjustable settings?
Maybe,..
Does ir use the STM32F103 CPU? Do you have the firmware file you can flash to it? Do you have an STlink?
@@de-bodgery i havent opened it because it is still under warranty, lol. but I do think I need to unlock this thing.
firmware, I could not find for em100, only find for em50.
@@de-bodgeryhi sir, require em50 and em100 firmware for stm32F103c8 (I have st-link) old ic and also replaced new one (blue pill)
@@shravyaSbharadwaj Have you contacted Votol?
@@de-bodgery no sir
What capacity do you recommend to install in the places indicated in the video?
6 10-20uf ceramics per location ought to be pretty good.
@@de-bodgery
I have question , maybe you can advise me. I have votol em 100 s, this controller pretty much same like em150. I`m planing add more mosfets , two more on each shoulder( want add 3 , but no mach space).What you think when add more mosfets , nesesary change mosfet - driver transistors ? From manufacture in em 100 driver transistors is Y2 (ss8550) 1.5 A sounds like should cary 5 mosfets in one time
@@ІванДрушляк The EM100 has empty locations for more mosfets? I knew they had 2 less per phase than the 150. I'd look over the driver electronics. Are they the same as the 150? If they are, you should have no problem adding another set of mosfets per phase. Biggest issue here is gate current. You won't be able to add more mosfets than the gate circuits can handle. I doubt they will drive 6 or 7 per bank! Next issue is what mosfet is in the EM100? You will do best if you get all new mosfets so they are from the same production batch. I don't know what you have now in it, but that's generally a good idea if you intend to run the controller hard.
@@de-bodgery
Mosfets are Magnachip MDP1991, 3 in parallel . I know about issue with gate current, as I understand to solve this problem need to swap transisrors on driver circuit for more powerfull. Or You mean not enough change transistrors in driver circuit for more powerful? Can be problems with power source that provide voltage and current for gates?
@@de-bodgery
I saw one guy from Vietnam add more 4 mosfets on shoulder on em 150s, and get 600 peek amps. But unfortunately i dont know all details of mod
can backup firmware em150
IF I had the controller...
Wait? Mdp is korean right?
What is MDP?
@@de-bodgery magnachip mdp###
Magnachips and yes, I believe they are Korean. It's specifically the MDP10N027 in this controller. It's one of the best mosfets in TO-220 I've ever found.
厉害呀😂
🥰🥰❤️❤️👋