Yes, unfortunately the BMS will have been blown - usually happens when a battery is completely dead (like cut or too badly expanded) great job though - would’ve worked perfectly on a still working but poor battery health phone! Still a ridiculous process for what should be a simple battery replacement
It’s mind boggling to think less than a decade prior, it was the norm to have user replaceable batteries. I even had a 2012 tablet, a Google Nexus 7, with a back that just simply clipped off and the battery was right there with a modular connector, and it was easy for tween me to swap out, not too different from working on a laptop.
@@orieraymond1263 I used iPhone for about 5 years and fully understand why some people use it, it has a simple OS! Some people like that. Personally just swapped back to samsung recently due to some MAJOR issues with my old 13 Pro
The chip might be volatile storage so it got wiped when you disconnected it from the old battery. LTT did a video a while ago regarding these dirty techniques to prevent battery cell repairs.
Wouldn't surprise me but others had success so I don't think thats the case for this battery. Unless being discharged for a long period of time effects it.
@@HughJeffreys Not to be a di@k, but you mean 'affects.' Only mentioning it because if it were me, I'd appreciate someone informing me that I had gotten it wrong. Cheers. Oh, and fu@k the fruit company.
Apple's "self repair" is a hilarious joke meant simply to appear like they give a damn about Right to Repair. Even as a certified Apple tech with WISE certification and seven years in the biz, I was still shocked at just how ridiculous the process was to simply replace a battery as an authorized third-party repair center. Just doing the required process for paperwork took 8x-10x what the actual repair took. It's maddening that people still buy these devices.
'Tis more a publicity stunt than a sincere move to open up repairs for their devices. You're still beholden to them with their official "repair" program.
You say its maddening that people buy these devices but that dismisses the fact that Apple devices (when not needing repairs) work really well. If these devices weren't any good... no one would buy them. The anti-repair mantra would just be the icing on the cake.
Spot welder for this!!?? Oh man! You are clearing out of knowing how to solder and far from electronics. You could have easilly used the solder station tip with flux and detach it in seconds. Also it was same procedure to solder it back to a new accumulator. What a mess dude! OMG.
Governments need to make it illegal to make it this difficult to replace a battery. The United States government especially does nothing in this regard at least EU pretends to care occasionally
Hi Hugh, try not dismantling the BMS before attaching the new battery. Some battery BMS looses it's identification as soon as the power goes out. It might be crucial to keep it powered during the transplant...
@@bdafonefixguyI’m confused too. Please Ferdinand, what exactly are you recommending? How would one keep power to it when you’re literally cutting the power leads to disconnect it?
Been doing this since I am a reseller and it’s not good to have unoriginal message when reselling. There are a few things you did wrong. 1. For iPhone 11 and up you need tag on flex to read the data with the programmer as they’re encrypted. 2. Every BMS board is paired with one device so connecting it to another phone will still show unoriginal message. 3 You firstly need to connect unoriginal battery/some power source to boot the phone so it shows unoriginal message, then you need to shut it off and connect the battery with the original BMS. One of these things could be causing a problem.
@@harleyquinnfpsyou can replace the battery on those models and it shouldn't have a problem they just started doing this on the iPhone 11 but if you want to keep trutone on your phone you will need a programmer to transfer the data from the old screen to the new screen. And you will need a battery flex adapter and a programmer to put in an aftermarket battery to keep the battery health and cycles count visible. And the 11 and newer models will still show that the screen in not the original apple screen for awhile but it will eventually go away
Having successfully restored battery health on a few iPhone 11 devices here are a few tips -Whereas with the iPhone Xs and Xr you can simply delete the charge cycles after welding the BMS board on the new battery, on the iPhone 11 you need to use a tag on flex cable between the battery and motherboard (Qianli battery tag-on) , otherwise the phone will still read the previous battery health. This tag on flex needs to be used for the reprogramming but also must stay on the battery after it has been installed. -Also, whenever you change the BMS board to a new battery, you first have to insert a battery from a different phone, this will make the battery warning message appear. Then you can put your new battery and the phone will then recalculate the battery health to the one you reprogrammed. Quite a complicated process simply to regain battery health, but it can be done.
Such sad thing to say a "tip" to replace a battery I like apple but their cooperate and greed that they are and turning phones into rental phones is simply unacceptable but with high power and so much money, so little things can be done about it
@@boodesultan12 Sadly, phones nowadays don't last as they supposed to be. Your phone will be obsolete after a year in terms of hardware and software with the devs dropping major updates that you are forced to install custom roms.
I would like to see you attempt this again but with a battery that is just worn out. At least it would prove that the technique works and that volatile memory isn’t the problem. But to be honest I’m amazed at the tools that are available now! Excellent work
We do these cell swaps at work in a large volume, the method you performed is for older models(Xs, Xr, SE2020, etc). On 11 and up you need a tag on cable in line in addition to the original BMS to fool it.
It is definitely ridiculous having to go through all of this just to be able to replace your phone's battery by yourself! However, it's good to know this solution exists, and it makes up for a great video 👍 For obvious reasons, the ability to fix-up the stuff you own either by yourself or by any qualified person definitely shouldn't be left to the manufacturer's discretion. Apple isn't the source of the problem but rather keeps taking advantage of a huge legislation gap. This is why we desperately need new laws to be passed in order to ensure the Right to repair remains one of consumers' essential rights. So thanks a lot for what you do Hugh! 👏
As a former Apple iPhone user, and person who fixes his own things, I am so disgusted that Apple has chosen to go this route. The reason I now have the Samsung Galaxy is because Apple went this route to make things extremely difficult for do it yourself repair. Recently I had to change the screen on my son's Galaxy a13 5G. Not including having to heat the phone to release the adhesive on the battery, it cost me $35 and took me a half hour. I was amazed at how easy it is to do compared to some of the things that I've had to go through to fix my older iPhones. As a firm believer in my right to repair my own products that I own, I refuse to do business with companies that will lock me out not because it's too difficult for me to perform the repair but because even though I'm capable of carrying the repair out they hide functionality behind a special product key or encryption that prevents me from repairing the product that I own.
Compare this to what used to be around 7 second repair, its insane. I understand why they might have used some more adhesive, but this- do i need to go further, you already know
BMSes from some companies may have software in internal bms ram memory. If you disconnect battery from bms, ram memory automatically wipes. You need to supply bms with the voltage on battery side while changing the battery
Great effort Hugh! I am constantly frustrated with how difficult manufacturers make it to repair things - and that's just on day to day basic appliances, not complicated tech stuff like this!! 😲
Hi Hugh, I've tried repairing a couple of phones (screens/battery) feeling empowered by your channel. I'd love to see you try this again with a different BMS. It's a shame it's become this difficult; but when there's a will there is a way!
There are special cables called BRC (battery repair cable). You use them in conjunction with the i2c programmer and then this will actually work. The BMS is encrypted, that's why you can't do anything. The cables are specific for each model and bypass the encryption. Also, you don't need a spot welder for this, just tin the pads of the bms and solder the terminals from above, it won't damage the battery.
You might want to charge that battery to 3.8v before trying again. Most phones and phone/laptop BMS will determine 3.6v as dead. It's possible the BMS undervoltage was triggered at 3.55v
You need an adapter called battery flex cable, it’s adapter so the programer can program and read the battery and it will stay on the battery after you connect it to your phone.
@@vincere_ With my dual booting 6.1.3 & 16 iOS iPhone 8 I put into a custom SE housing, my cellular calling jailbroken iPad and my dual triple boot iMac I hardly think I .. errr.. you know what? Never mind, you're right.
Awesome video as always! I'm pretty sure that the bms either stores the keys in volatile memory which gets wiped if the battery is completely empty or removed from the board, or it "sets a flag" which tells that the battery has emptied completely. At least many laptop battery packs needs to stay connected to power source while changing the battery cells... This is probably also how the companies switch the responsibility of battery safety, because deep discharging is not good for certain lithium chemistries. Still, there should be option to reset it. (probably also would be legal hassle, because the companies would not want to be responsible for any damages that might happen)
Spot welder for this!!?? Oh man! You are clearing out of knowing how to solder and far from electronics. Also 3.37 v battery IS TOTALLY DEAD ONE. This is exactly why your programmar didn't recognize IT!!! You can't connect THAT to anything. Jesus. You could have easilly used the solder station tip with flux and detach it in seconds. Also it was same procedure to solder it back to a new accumulator. What a mess dude! OMG.
Replaced a battery on my Poco f1. Apart from dropping and misplacing screws it was a straightforward process. I'm definitely for companies making this process easier.
To prevent people from changing battery BMS boards in the future, they might store the encrypted key in a RAM chip so if you remove the cell, they key is gone forever. Would sound like something Apple could do.
Apple will self destruct there phone before long meaning if you change the battery the phone just won't turn on even with a new battery or anything replaced will brick the phone
The thing is that you should not weld on a pre-calibrated BMS onto a battery anyways. It can lead to the battery getting overcharged or discharged to a point where it damages the battery, because not all batteries are 100% equal so the BMS has to be calibrated for the specific cell(s).
I had a phone repair shop from 2010 to 2016 and personally fixed over 16K devices. I saw this coming when Apple mated the fingerprint ID to their phones - I could replace the home button but the fingerprint ID lost its functionality. I knew it was just a matter of time before they made the iPhones non-repairable by 3rd party shops like mine. It was great while it lasted and I'm glad I no longer have to deal with Apple's under-handedness. (By the way, I must've had at least 30 batteries explode on me. I recommend wearing protective eyewear if you mess with phone batteries.)
This also points out Apple's dishonesty in a really nice way. They claim their battery anti-repair "features" are for safety, but they actually make replacing your battery more dangerous than before.
Hi Hugh, You need an intact battery to do this repair, “service” but has a working BMS and cell, you have to copy the data first ung J7000 then remove the BMS, then spot weld it to the new cell, then write the copied data to the new welded cell.
Bummer that it didn't work but it was still interesting to see the procedure. Do you have plans to do a follow-up BMS swap attempt with another battery?
At this point , i just wish the development on 'Graphene Solid-State' batteries can become available as soon as possible, that way, even if some of us mess up, it wont have the same destructive thermal runaway like 6:21 🤣 just saw ChargerLAB's video on the battery cell they got recently, its impressive, even when stabbed multiple times, there was no smoke..
Be aware that iPhone 11 and up, the BMS data is encrypted, you can’t reset cycle counts. BMS will force decrease battery health. Typically 500 cycles decrease 5%, which means you cannot restore full capacity (if you replaced the cell with a small original one). This limit does affect hardware. However, if “Not genuine” message appears, you actually get full capacity. The phone won’t limit its charge to a certain amount. Usually this method is used with a bigger capacity cell than the original cell, in order to compensate that 500 5% limit. After replacing the cell, BMS still has old health percentage, but BMS will recalibrate itself eventually. Sadly, if you replace with the original capacity cell paired with a 80% health BMS, you only get 90% available for you to use.
Hey, im sure the iPhone 11 batterys cannot be read else they could just reprogram the health to 100% and cycles to 0. This works on the iphone XS and XR. How ever if you buy a JC Battery Tag-On flex for the iPhone 11. You can activate it using the V1S and then set the Cycles to 0 and health to 100%. This tag on flex just pluggs into the original BMS Board and folds over to be able to hide besides the battery. This should work. Fingers crossed!
Technican here. 1. No the BMS does not need to power all the time, it has its data stored and this is legit repair technique. 2. This happens when battery can not communitace with the phone - usually one pin in battery connector is bent, so it does not make a contact. (This is not the case, since the other battery works fine) 3. I think he just broke the BMS by harsh manipulation. They break very easily. Then you need to transplant the chips onto other BMS, but that's obviously even harder.
I think the new battery that you soldered to the old bms is faulty because a normal iPhone battery should be at least 3.7v, there's a special device called Sunshine SS-915 to charge and activate the battery instead of jumping it from another battery.
As much as I'm not surprised by this outcome or the need to do such a thing to try to trick this phone into working 100%, I find myself laughing a bit that a company made a tiny spot welding machine for such a repair. I've seen that QianLi logo before on many of the other diagnostic stuff at the shop and it's pretty decent, all things considered. Gotta love it when a company takes it upon themselves to try to solve Apple's problems.
usually BMS needs to have power while swamping cells. if power is gone, BMS controller will disable itself. This is same for notebook cell replacement, when you install new batteries, it gives same errors. But if you do so BMS can't detect battery is swapped ( like supplying 4.2 to correct location while changing, it will work as it should.
I had to do this with my 13 pro after Apple refused to service my phone due to the screen being non genuine on their side, even though it was pulled from a functioning device it’s really annoying that apple goes to this length when there moto is reusing as much as they can to help out the planet if they wanted to help out the planet the should make there phones user fixable instead of making people buy new phones great video Hugh
As an employee of Best Buy Geek Squad and an "Apple certified technician" (lol) here in the states, I can say that even 7:30 is not a viable option for restoring the battery functionality. Apple's repairs operate on a hierarchy, and Apple will only fix a single fault with the device. If you have any other problem (say, a bad battery and a cracked screen), Apple will classify that as a "Multiple part failure" device and opt for a full phone replacement. Same goes if other faults are found, even if the customer does not want those repaired (IE cracked rear glass on an iPhone 11 and older). Apple will not let you just get one issue fixed. They must fix everything, which means that unless you JUST have a cracked screen or JUST a bad battery, you're going to be looking at a full phone replacement every single time. Additionally, any tampering with the phone (at least if Apple can tell during their repair or if you disclose that information to them) will immediately result in a requote for a full phone replacement, as well as a nullifying of Applecare coverage, meaning they will charge you the FULL PRICE of the device in question, regardless of your condition. For this particular phone, since it's been repaired by someone that isn't Apple or one of its "certified repair centers" (IE places like Geek Squad here in the US), and is displaying warning messages, Apple's diagnostics will immediately kick it to a full phone replacement due to multiple failures, and if 3rd party repairs are discovered, at full price instead of the $99 they charge if you have Applecare+. That's the world we live in now
Any chance the bms needs continuous current flowing to prevent locking up? Preventing exactly what you are trying to accomplish here? I'd like for you to try with a functioning battery beforehand if you are up for it.
Just keep in mind that the BMS may not work because you removed power completely or the previous battery was 100% dead and the voltage dropped to zero. The reason I am saying this is because it could be that some infromation on the battery is stored like RAM, as soon as you remove power, the information used by the iPhone to identify the battery as its own is lost.
Yeah, someone should dump some spicy pillows encased in difficult-to-open iPhones on Apple's doorstep and tell them that if they simply made the batteries more accessible, the spicy pillows would not be as much of a danger.
You’re a magician, Hugh! Edit: Apparently yesterday Elon Musk threatened the development and production of an ePHONE, if activists succeeded in persuading Apple and Google to keep Twitter out of their stores. I wish he would stick it to Apple in particular. The games those guys play to prevent the man-in-the-street from repairing his own phone is disheartening and dishonest.
I’ve been doing this for a long time but only on customers who care. I explain the procedure and most people don’t care about the message. The fact that it’s becoming necessary is very annoying, however, soon there will be aftermarket batteries available either with an aftermarket battery board built in or on a tag on flex. As for screens you can purchase screens that you can transplant the old screens chip onto. So possible but not usually for the user.
Before iPhone even existed, Sony was doing this with their camera and laptop batteries. Circa 2005, Texas Instrument begun marketing a BMS chip that allowed to market "Genuine" Sony batteries. When I tried the BMS swap at the time, I realised the BMS disabled itself as soon the input voltage (from the battery) drop to zero. I mean, the BMS has to be desoldered from the old battery while keeping some voltage applied. Could it be the case here? Best Regards, Anthony
4:22 you need a battery tag, the battery info is encrypted since iPhone 11, and you cannot read it or modify it unless you have the proper battery tag to plug it into the battery flex
Yes if you type in JCID Battery Tag on flex iPhone 11, it should show results of where you can purchase this. I believe there are some TH-cam videos demonstrating it's use too
That tends to happen with a small tear in the BMS. Like mentioned, could be blown but we've had more cases where BMS flex was torn or damaged and exposed the exact same problem. You have to be very careful or else you need to have Apple or an IRP shop fix it to get rid of the message
How do Apple and other companies legally get away with this? Can you imagine if you bought a car and could only go to a dealership to change the battery with them as its paired to the car!
Whet you said.... I'm pretty sure car companies are willing on it. Never mind, it happening. I think the Volkswagen Group EV already have such feature.
Dude, are you slow?? Only apple does this. Android manufacturers make it easy to replace their batteries, since there's no battery health, no need for calibration
Nice video, Jeffrey. I am glad you found those methods to bypass Apple messages. I know that the first times are not easy and you are new to this, but I think you will eventually figure it out. There is a youtube channel called REWA Technology that explains how to do these things in detail. I was surprised that they are doing those videos for years and repair shops can't learn from them. Yes, it takes time to weld it and do these jobs, but everyone would pay the extra buck for these things and there would be fewer Apple messages or even non.
Good try mate!! I hope in the future you'll get another opportunity to try this out on a phone that doesn't have such a badly damaged original battery. This looks like an interesting technique to explore further.
You must activate the battery before first use. Apply voltage from the power supply to the connector. Then, before inserting the battery, you must connect the service power supply to the motherboard and start and turn off the phone (so that there is a message about a non-original battery). From model 12 you need a special TAG - after programming it stays in the phone.
Here is a scary scenario for the iPhone 15 that I have heard being discussed in certain dark places. It is proposed that once Apple moves to solid state buttons and a titanium case, they will then weld the whole thing shut so it cannot be opened and is a complete solid sealed unit by replacing the Penta lobe screws with welds. If you crack the glass or damage it, it will be a full phone replacement because you will no longer be able to get into the phone. They are also supposedly adding a tattle tale sensor / microswitch that activates and scrambles all the encryption keys as a failsafe if you do manage to get into the phone. Once that key is changed the phone is bricked. to power this they will have a capacitor to provide just enough power for the scrambler to activate and failsafe signal the encryption chips.
AASP and apple care services still have to make money off of field repairs, completely locking the device will cut off this lucrative revenue stream. As we know the world richest company is good at making more money.
Frustrating - but I'm sure you'll try this again Hugh, you're not one to give up a good challenge! Nice spot welder too. I had a similar experience recently. Canon's original EOS batteries are expensive, so I recently rebuilt my 2016 LP-E6 battery pack that was no longer holding a good charge, and I had to desolder the BMS board once I had taken the pack apart. Cost me a fraction of an original new Canon battery pack (just 2 x 18500 Lithium Batteries at $6 each), and unlike the cheap 3rd party clone packs that have no BMS or protection circuitry, I now have a 'fresh' original pack that charges in a Canon charger, and even reports full health in the camera - I guess removing the old cells somehow reset the health status on the BMS. My only caution about this is the risk of doing a bad job, and having the battery short and catch fire inside my R6, so very much a 'do at your own risk' repair.
Well, you did successfully spot weld a defective part to a replacement battery and discover that it was in fact defective. There wasn't any other way to find out, so I don't see anything wrong with anything you did, and you still have the ability to fix who knows how many more that probably have good controllers. Sounds like a good start.
Hey Hugh! Sony Xperia Pro 512 smartphone - have you had a chance to look at this one and what is your opinion as far as repairability goes for Sony's smartphones??? I own both Apple and Samsung currently and really don't like either, yet these are older devices easier to tinker with then what they are selling today. I would gladly get the Sony if they are better for long term ownership and don't become throwaways when the battery dies. Keep up the awesome job mate 👍👍
you can do this without a spot welder. just use some solder between the battery terminals and the contacts on the board. it takes a bit more time cause you have to heat up the solder enough to melt it, but it's still easy even if you only have a soldering iron.
I think you don't need a spot welder, a soldering iron should be fine. Obviously Apple's software locks are terrible garbage! I don't think the BMS is dead, but more likely locked. This is nothing new, and prevents most laptop batteries from having the bare cells replaced. You need to charge your old battery fully, then same with the new one, then connect them in parallel before disconnecting the old one. If the BMS gets no power from a battery during even a fraction of a second, it's over!
I have great success rate swapping the bms over to the new cell. Sometimes you need to jump the battery or charge it outside the phone with 5v. And try to reinstall the battery to the phone and test. If it still shows 0%. Unplug the battery connector and plug it back in and press on it firmly. Try to power on the phone with the connector being pressed and try to charge it or check the health
that is a pretty ingenious idea. i would like to see a video where all the issues from swapping a logic board are fixed by also switching the controllers and chips responsible for software locks
I was going through a similar process looking at replacing an iPhone 11 battery and looked into all these tools. All together to order and ship I was looking at $135, not including the replacement part. Apple still offers battery replacement for these and they are charging $69. So the silver lining is that going the official route is cheaper (unless you work in bulk) at least in the US while living a moderate distance from an Apple store. At the core though, it is really annoying to have to do this though. There is a compromise here will informing customers of how genuine parts are, but since they're a business that will never happen.
This reminds me of something I ran into at work recently. USB C is getting more common on laptops, and we always joke that one day a manufacturer is gonna lock out 3rd party chargers. We use lenovo usbc chargers cause that's typically what we have the most of for our test benches. I can't remember the specific model, but one of the dell units we got in REFUSED to charge on anything BUT a dell usb c charger. In fact, I couldn't even get the damn thing to BOOT without using a dell charger.
Dell has been doing that before Apple. The charger sends a signal down one of the three connectors on the charger's cable. There is the outside barrel, inside barrel and inside pin. If you can generate the signal and send it down the line then it will activate the charge circuit. As usual Dell claims it's a protection circuit that third party chargers do not overcharge the battery causing a fire or explosion.
I honestly don’t mind the error message for the battery.. only down side is reselling it is more difficult, and generic batteries are usually very bad with fake advertised copacity.
Under the EU battery directive, Apple was forced to provide a battery upgrade service after they failed to comply with it, unfortunately there is no pricing control on this so apple can charge a fortune for this. So new regulations are currently being defined that allow the manufacturer to specify an "independent operator" or user replacement. It will specifically prevent the use of software to prevent repair.
You need to install a tag-on flex (jc or quanli) onto the new battery with the original bms board. Then, you need to use a programmer to reset its cycles and battery health to a 100%. Once this is done, take all batteries out of the iphone and use a dc power supply to power on the iphone. Or, if you dont have a dc power supply, you can use another aftermarket battery with an aftermarket bms board already installed to power the phone on. Let the phone power on which will trigger a "non genuine" battery parts message. Now you have tricked the motherboard and should immediately power off the phone. Finally, install the new battery with the transferred oem bms board and tag-on flex. Power on the device and watch the "non-genuine" battery message go away and should have your battery health at 100%. Hope this helps out!
the bms is always powered on and once you remove power, the volatile memory chip gets wiped. you have to keep the bms alive during the transplant and ur good to go
I found out the same thing on Siemens laptop battery, the bms is intentionally designed to go bad/wiped when you cut off the battery, Probably they have the firmware on a volatile ram so as soon you cut the power the firmware get lost and the bms microcontroller will have no firmware to work with. The suggested solution is to hook up a temporary voltage source to the bms while doing the transplant.
Hello hugh, the battery in order to work properly should be 3.7V and more. You shouldn’t jump start it with another battery. Try supplying the battery with 4.2V (charging voltage) from an external power supply. When the battery exceeds 3.7V it should start working properly
Before cutting the old battery from the charging, you need to have a constant 3.6v ish dc external power supply connected to the battery contacts on the board to "retain" health on the charge board.
I've given up on Samsung & Apple phones, my manufacture of choice now is Cubot. I've had their Quest rugged phone for number of years now, it's off to have a new charging port fitted in the next few days even though it's relatively easy to disassemble I'am terrible at soldering.
It is not uncommon for battery BMS information to be stored in on-chip SRAM. So if the battery fully dies or voltage is ever removed, it effectively erases everything. If the battery is not below critical voltage, you must temporarily tack on a power supply to maintain voltage to the BMS while the cell is being swapped.
Actually it started from xs series that you need to weld an old bms flex to not get a genuine battery message. After 11 though you need extra I2c flex that you connect in the battery flex and clear all the old data and thats how you get 100% battery health. But like you said, you can damage the bms flex in the process.
It is much safer to handle battery repairs\shipping when the battery is in a low charge state. With a near 0 charge the battery will not explode when punctured. You still need to charge back up but that will give you the chance to observe the battery for any sign of failure as it charges and disconnect just in case. If a battery is damaged, this method won't unleash the fury of a full charge when compromised. Just watch for any unusual heating or smoke as your signal to stop charging.
The BMS most likely set a permanent flag inside its non-volatile memory that this cell voltage went too low, which happened when the BMS was snapped of the original cell. Once this flag is set, the BMS won't charge the battery or function properly as a safety pre-caution. The same happens for most DJI drone batteries. They lock out when a single cell discharges to a voltage too low to be safe.
my mother in law is in her later 60's. she has had the same iphone 5 for over 10yrs now & it has better battery life than my 2020 iphone. she has never updated her iphone , and it runs perfectly & im confident that is why her iphone runs perfectly. ive since stopped updating iphone, and i wont be buying another one. any company that actively sabotages the products they sell, shouldnt be patronized , plain & simple.
i designed a few BMS boards, some IC have protection system that disable cell swap, in ICs with i was working on, there was threshold voltage usually set around cell chemistry breakdown*, so when cell voltage drops under that voltage IC trigger total shutdown for safety, becouse you are cutting board from any voltage source you are trigering "cell death" signal, and when you connect it in to new cell it doesnt allow to use it becouse for IC its marvelously alive and its hazard...or in apple case repair attempt, in my work to get around this i was making this procedure: 1)measure old cell voltage 2)solder to BMS 2 wires connected to power supply 3)apply to BMS --->SAME
i think the battery has a non voletile memory bit in it so when u removed it u needed to keep supplying the power to the bms module then only it will be tricked, or else it will report battery bad never let the terminals go zero...
5:05 I’ve had the same issue when replacing an iPhone XS with a new battery cell, even after transferring the serial number and resetting the health and cycle count. I tried placing in another battery with a different non-reprogrammed BMS board. The battery percentage was displayed correctly, however the non genuine battery message obviously pops up. I then put the new battery cell with the original BMS board back into the phone and it worked perfectly fine; no non genuine battery message, 100% battery health and battery percentage displayed correctly. My guess is that the logic board doesn’t change the displayed battery info if it detects the original BMS board until you plug in a different one.
Interesting that China continues to supply some of the best tools to due true phone repairs. Appreciate the continued attention you're giving this issue in your videos while still focusing on easy to follow instructions for anyone willing to take on the risk of this repair.
@@vincere_ sad that you have such a limited thought process. Yes, spot welding devices are not governed by IP laws, but they are neccessary because IP laws exist. Apple hiding behind their propriatary software / encoded hardware and them suing even open source projects into oblivion ( i mean just look at the lawsuits from jailbreak cases) make easy public solutions to the problems they create hard in the western world and require people to take extra steps (like transfering the bms instead of just doing a software swap) instead of easy software solutions
@@csPinKie Cherry-picking Apple as the reason why 'IP laws need to be abolished globally' seems to be a thought process much more inhibited by tunnel vision.
@@vincere_ excuse me, iam not cherry picking apple. It was just an example which can be transfered to any industry. Just because someone trademarketed an idea earlier doesnt mean that the should have an monopoly on it. The entire internet based industry showed during the last 30 years how well innovation and growth are possible without governmental restrictions
![[#2024MAMA] G-DRAGON - 무제(Untitled, 2014)+POWER+HOME SWEET HOME+뱅뱅뱅+FANTASTIC BABY | Mnet 241123 방송](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Ox29z5Nf1Uk/mqdefault.jpg)
"Replacing a battery is dangerous. So we'll make it even more dangerous" - Apple
And even more environmentally unfriendly.
@@SlartiMarvinbartfast
And basically making a little bomb as phone
Isn’t it more like
"Let us do the dangerous battery replacement while you file for a credit to pay us!"
Apple didn’t create this method of replacing a battery
@@sjdoiajsd but they used it in a product didn't they? They could've made it easy and less dangerous, and I can't think of a reason to not do that
Yes, unfortunately the BMS will have been blown - usually happens when a battery is completely dead (like cut or too badly expanded) great job though - would’ve worked perfectly on a still working but poor battery health phone! Still a ridiculous process for what should be a simple battery replacement
It’s mind boggling to think less than a decade prior, it was the norm to have user replaceable batteries. I even had a 2012 tablet, a Google Nexus 7, with a back that just simply clipped off and the battery was right there with a modular connector, and it was easy for tween me to swap out, not too different from working on a laptop.
@@JustARegularNerd i mean you just have to look at most thinkpads, the batteries are as replaceable as a usb stick
Why are people still using iPhone? I don't understand
@@orieraymond1263 I used iPhone for about 5 years and fully understand why some people use it, it has a simple OS! Some people like that. Personally just swapped back to samsung recently due to some MAJOR issues with my old 13 Pro
@@miku6921 I have never own an iphone, only samsung s5 is my best phone, now im on motorolla.
The chip might be volatile storage so it got wiped when you disconnected it from the old battery. LTT did a video a while ago regarding these dirty techniques to prevent battery cell repairs.
Wouldn't surprise me but others had success so I don't think thats the case for this battery. Unless being discharged for a long period of time effects it.
@@HughJeffreys then possibly it was just the case of a dead chip. But either way it's not a practical repair as you pointed out.
Yeah, it's called "the evil BMS"
@@sihamhamda47 yep
@@HughJeffreys Not to be a di@k, but you mean 'affects.'
Only mentioning it because if it were me, I'd appreciate someone informing me that I had gotten it wrong.
Cheers.
Oh, and fu@k the fruit company.
Apple's "self repair" is a hilarious joke meant simply to appear like they give a damn about Right to Repair. Even as a certified Apple tech with WISE certification and seven years in the biz, I was still shocked at just how ridiculous the process was to simply replace a battery as an authorized third-party repair center. Just doing the required process for paperwork took 8x-10x what the actual repair took. It's maddening that people still buy these devices.
If you bite an apple, and leave it in the air for how long apple has been standing on top, it'd be rotten to the core, so ofc they'd do such things.
'Tis more a publicity stunt than a sincere move to open up repairs for their devices. You're still beholden to them with their official "repair" program.
You say its maddening that people buy these devices but that dismisses the fact that Apple devices (when not needing repairs) work really well. If these devices weren't any good... no one would buy them. The anti-repair mantra would just be the icing on the cake.
The walled garden isn't a selling point.
@@romevang Lol, they're well polished shit. It attracts those that think shiny is pretty
Another quality video by Hugh Jeffrey’s. A man who actually cares about devices.
Agreed
@@mudchute4dlr Agreed
I genuinely hate Apple at this point in time.
@@olimpather i've always hated apple and their stupid "security measures" which literally feel like some helicopter parents.
Spot welder for this!!??
Oh man! You are clearing out of knowing how to solder and far from electronics.
You could have easilly used the solder station tip with flux and detach it in seconds. Also it was same procedure to solder it back to a new accumulator.
What a mess dude! OMG.
Governments need to make it illegal to make it this difficult to replace a battery. The United States government especially does nothing in this regard at least EU pretends to care occasionally
It's not difficult to replace a battery, it's just that you lose some info in settings by using a shitty third party one.
@@leebeeskeethat way of thinking makes them more powerful and continue their agenda.
Hi Hugh, try not dismantling the BMS before attaching the new battery. Some battery BMS looses it's identification as soon as the power goes out. It might be crucial to keep it powered during the transplant...
I was thinking the same thing. Something to keep in mind next time.
Not this one, he just break the BMS by harsh manipulation
um . u cant keep it powered while u cut the thing from the battery to weld to a new 1 what are you trying to say??
@@bdafonefixguyI’m confused too. Please Ferdinand, what exactly are you recommending? How would one keep power to it when you’re literally cutting the power leads to disconnect it?
where r u op
This should be criminal! There’s no reason to make replacing a battery this hard
Unfortunately Apple has turned into a scum company. Never buy Apple.
$
Agree. Governments need to act
Fr
Just like modern cars, trucks, and suv's.
This young man never ceases to amaze me!
100% agree. Best tech I’ve ever seen on TH-cam
Been doing this since I am a reseller and it’s not good to have unoriginal message when reselling.
There are a few things you did wrong.
1. For iPhone 11 and up you need tag on flex to read the data with the programmer as they’re encrypted.
2. Every BMS board is paired with one device so connecting it to another phone will still show unoriginal message.
3 You firstly need to connect unoriginal battery/some power source to boot the phone so it shows unoriginal message, then you need to shut it off and connect the battery with the original BMS.
One of these things could be causing a problem.
Hello do iphone x and 8 have same issue? Or i can just replace with any battery
@@harleyquinnfpsyou can replace the battery on those models and it shouldn't have a problem they just started doing this on the iPhone 11 but if you want to keep trutone on your phone you will need a programmer to transfer the data from the old screen to the new screen. And you will need a battery flex adapter and a programmer to put in an aftermarket battery to keep the battery health and cycles count visible. And the 11 and newer models will still show that the screen in not the original apple screen for awhile but it will eventually go away
@@allanbarr5186 So that's why it doesn't show in 3utools.
And the replaced display is terrible especially without true tone.
Rip iPhone 8plus
Having successfully restored battery health on a few iPhone 11 devices here are a few tips
-Whereas with the iPhone Xs and Xr you can simply delete the charge cycles after welding the BMS board on the new battery, on the iPhone 11 you need to use a tag on flex cable between the battery and motherboard (Qianli battery tag-on) , otherwise the phone will still read the previous battery health. This tag on flex needs to be used for the reprogramming but also must stay on the battery after it has been installed.
-Also, whenever you change the BMS board to a new battery, you first have to insert a battery from a different phone, this will make the battery warning message appear. Then you can put your new battery and the phone will then recalculate the battery health to the one you reprogrammed.
Quite a complicated process simply to regain battery health, but it can be done.
Such sad thing to say a "tip" to replace a battery
I like apple but their cooperate and greed that they are and turning phones into rental phones is simply unacceptable but with high power and so much money, so little things can be done about it
@@boodesultan12 Sadly, phones nowadays don't last as they supposed to be. Your phone will be obsolete after a year in terms of hardware and software with the devs dropping major updates that you are forced to install custom roms.
JC Programmer needs JC Flex
Easy fix, stop buying Apple products!
Or just get a android
"You will own nothing (not even the right to repair your *own* phone) and will be happy," love, Klaus and Tim.
*Germany
FTFY
and they do it. haha Klaus, nice programming
I would like to see you attempt this again but with a battery that is just worn out. At least it would prove that the technique works and that volatile memory isn’t the problem.
But to be honest I’m amazed at the tools that are available now!
Excellent work
We do these cell swaps at work in a large volume, the method you performed is for older models(Xs, Xr, SE2020, etc). On 11 and up you need a tag on cable in line in addition to the original BMS to fool it.
It is definitely ridiculous having to go through all of this just to be able to replace your phone's battery by yourself! However, it's good to know this solution exists, and it makes up for a great video 👍
For obvious reasons, the ability to fix-up the stuff you own either by yourself or by any qualified person definitely shouldn't be left to the manufacturer's discretion.
Apple isn't the source of the problem but rather keeps taking advantage of a huge legislation gap. This is why we desperately need new laws to be passed in order to ensure the Right to repair remains one of consumers' essential rights.
So thanks a lot for what you do Hugh! 👏
As a former Apple iPhone user, and person who fixes his own things, I am so disgusted that Apple has chosen to go this route. The reason I now have the Samsung Galaxy is because Apple went this route to make things extremely difficult for do it yourself repair. Recently I had to change the screen on my son's Galaxy a13 5G. Not including having to heat the phone to release the adhesive on the battery, it cost me $35 and took me a half hour. I was amazed at how easy it is to do compared to some of the things that I've had to go through to fix my older iPhones. As a firm believer in my right to repair my own products that I own, I refuse to do business with companies that will lock me out not because it's too difficult for me to perform the repair but because even though I'm capable of carrying the repair out they hide functionality behind a special product key or encryption that prevents me from repairing the product that I own.
Cope harder nobody cares as a current iPhone user
Compare this to what used to be around 7 second repair, its insane. I understand why they might have used some more adhesive, but this-
do i need to go further, you already know
BMSes from some companies may have software in internal bms ram memory. If you disconnect battery from bms, ram memory automatically wipes. You need to supply bms with the voltage on battery side while changing the battery
Great effort Hugh! I am constantly frustrated with how difficult manufacturers make it to repair things - and that's just on day to day basic appliances, not complicated tech stuff like this!! 😲
Hi Hugh, I've tried repairing a couple of phones (screens/battery) feeling empowered by your channel. I'd love to see you try this again with a different BMS. It's a shame it's become this difficult; but when there's a will there is a way!
There are special cables called BRC (battery repair cable). You use them in conjunction with the i2c programmer and then this will actually work. The BMS is encrypted, that's why you can't do anything. The cables are specific for each model and bypass the encryption.
Also, you don't need a spot welder for this, just tin the pads of the bms and solder the terminals from above, it won't damage the battery.
You also need an X (for X series) or SE2 (for 11s and SEs) battery to corrupt the battery data on the phone.
You might want to charge that battery to 3.8v before trying again. Most phones and phone/laptop BMS will determine 3.6v as dead. It's possible the BMS undervoltage was triggered at 3.55v
You need an adapter called battery flex cable, it’s adapter so the programer can program and read the battery and it will stay on the battery after you connect it to your phone.
No, you need to stop playing this silly game and choose another phone company.
@@HyperVectra Imagine being as defeatist as you.
@@vincere_ With my dual booting 6.1.3 & 16 iOS iPhone 8 I put into a custom SE housing, my cellular calling jailbroken iPad and my dual triple boot iMac I hardly think I .. errr.. you know what? Never mind, you're right.
I love how people still buy from a company who is doing everything in their power to be anti consumer...
Exceptional content, keep it up!
Pure stupidity, people buy them to be seen with them. They're as useless as an overpriced Rolex watch.
Awesome video as always! I'm pretty sure that the bms either stores the keys in volatile memory which gets wiped if the battery is completely empty or removed from the board, or it "sets a flag" which tells that the battery has emptied completely. At least many laptop battery packs needs to stay connected to power source while changing the battery cells... This is probably also how the companies switch the responsibility of battery safety, because deep discharging is not good for certain lithium chemistries. Still, there should be option to reset it. (probably also would be legal hassle, because the companies would not want to be responsible for any damages that might happen)
Spot welder for this!!??
Oh man! You are clearing out of knowing how to solder and far from electronics. Also 3.37 v battery IS TOTALLY DEAD ONE. This is exactly why your programmar didn't recognize IT!!! You can't connect THAT to anything. Jesus.
You could have easilly used the solder station tip with flux and detach it in seconds. Also it was same procedure to solder it back to a new accumulator.
What a mess dude! OMG.
Replaced a battery on my Poco f1. Apart from dropping and misplacing screws it was a straightforward process. I'm definitely for companies making this process easier.
To prevent people from changing battery BMS boards in the future, they might store the encrypted key in a RAM chip so if you remove the cell, they key is gone forever. Would sound like something Apple could do.
You’re a serious candidate to be hired as a chief engineer for Apple products.
Don't give them any new ideas
Apple will self destruct there phone before long meaning if you change the battery the phone just won't turn on even with a new battery or anything replaced will brick the phone
The thing is that you should not weld on a pre-calibrated BMS onto a battery anyways. It can lead to the battery getting overcharged or discharged to a point where it damages the battery, because not all batteries are 100% equal so the BMS has to be calibrated for the specific cell(s).
Granted, this replacement may not have gone correctly, but I've learned WHY it didn't work and I think that's a success. High quality content here :D
I had a phone repair shop from 2010 to 2016 and personally fixed over 16K devices. I saw this coming when Apple mated the fingerprint ID to their phones - I could replace the home button but the fingerprint ID lost its functionality. I knew it was just a matter of time before they made the iPhones non-repairable by 3rd party shops like mine. It was great while it lasted and I'm glad I no longer have to deal with Apple's under-handedness. (By the way, I must've had at least 30 batteries explode on me. I recommend wearing protective eyewear if you mess with phone batteries.)
This also points out Apple's dishonesty in a really nice way. They claim their battery anti-repair "features" are for safety, but they actually make replacing your battery more dangerous than before.
Hi Hugh, You need an intact battery to do this repair, “service” but has a working BMS and cell, you have to copy the data first ung J7000 then remove the BMS, then spot weld it to the new cell, then write the copied data to the new welded cell.
Bummer that it didn't work but it was still interesting to see the procedure. Do you have plans to do a follow-up BMS swap attempt with another battery?
Hopefully. I didn't have any more phones or batteries to test with which is why i only did the one in this video.
I really appreciate your efforts in favor of right to repair! Thank you!
At this point , i just wish the development on 'Graphene Solid-State' batteries can become available as soon as possible, that way, even if some of us mess up, it wont have the same destructive thermal runaway like 6:21 🤣
just saw ChargerLAB's video on the battery cell they got recently, its impressive, even when stabbed multiple times, there was no smoke..
Be aware that
iPhone 11 and up, the BMS data is encrypted, you can’t reset cycle counts.
BMS will force decrease battery health. Typically 500 cycles decrease 5%, which means you cannot restore full capacity (if you replaced the cell with a small original one). This limit does affect hardware.
However, if “Not genuine” message appears, you actually get full capacity. The phone won’t limit its charge to a certain amount.
Usually this method is used with a bigger capacity cell than the original cell, in order to compensate that 500 5% limit.
After replacing the cell, BMS still has old health percentage, but BMS will recalibrate itself eventually.
Sadly, if you replace with the original capacity cell paired with a 80% health BMS, you only get 90% available for you to use.
Hey, im sure the iPhone 11 batterys cannot be read else they could just reprogram the health to 100% and cycles to 0. This works on the iphone XS and XR. How ever if you buy a JC Battery Tag-On flex for the iPhone 11. You can activate it using the V1S and then set the Cycles to 0 and health to 100%. This tag on flex just pluggs into the original BMS Board and folds over to be able to hide besides the battery. This should work. Fingers crossed!
Technican here.
1. No the BMS does not need to power all the time, it has its data stored and this is legit repair technique.
2. This happens when battery can not communitace with the phone - usually one pin in battery connector is bent, so it does not make a contact. (This is not the case, since the other battery works fine)
3. I think he just broke the BMS by harsh manipulation. They break very easily. Then you need to transplant the chips onto other BMS, but that's obviously even harder.
So with my iPhone 13 I should be able to replace the battery without any special software or anything?
I think the new battery that you soldered to the old bms is faulty because a normal iPhone battery should be at least 3.7v, there's a special device called Sunshine SS-915 to charge and activate the battery instead of jumping it from another battery.
As much as I'm not surprised by this outcome or the need to do such a thing to try to trick this phone into working 100%, I find myself laughing a bit that a company made a tiny spot welding machine for such a repair. I've seen that QianLi logo before on many of the other diagnostic stuff at the shop and it's pretty decent, all things considered. Gotta love it when a company takes it upon themselves to try to solve Apple's problems.
Problems or mischief?
I hope that in the future, Apple could allow 3rd Party Repair. If THEY REALLY CARE about the environment, they should allow this!!!
U can do all of this with a regular solder station. Ive done hundreds.
That welder is pretty ehh. No warning time before welding? Just straight power pulse when you short the wires?
usually BMS needs to have power while swamping cells. if power is gone, BMS controller will disable itself. This is same for notebook cell replacement, when you install new batteries, it gives same errors. But if you do so BMS can't detect battery is swapped ( like supplying 4.2 to correct location while changing, it will work as it should.
I had to do this with my 13 pro after Apple refused to service my phone due to the screen being non genuine on their side, even though it was pulled from a functioning device it’s really annoying that apple goes to this length when there moto is reusing as much as they can to help out the planet if they wanted to help out the planet the should make there phones user fixable instead of making people buy new phones great video Hugh
Yeah their motto is “We’re fake AF”. It’s 100% about the bottom line, not the environment
As an employee of Best Buy Geek Squad and an "Apple certified technician" (lol) here in the states, I can say that even 7:30 is not a viable option for restoring the battery functionality. Apple's repairs operate on a hierarchy, and Apple will only fix a single fault with the device. If you have any other problem (say, a bad battery and a cracked screen), Apple will classify that as a "Multiple part failure" device and opt for a full phone replacement. Same goes if other faults are found, even if the customer does not want those repaired (IE cracked rear glass on an iPhone 11 and older). Apple will not let you just get one issue fixed. They must fix everything, which means that unless you JUST have a cracked screen or JUST a bad battery, you're going to be looking at a full phone replacement every single time.
Additionally, any tampering with the phone (at least if Apple can tell during their repair or if you disclose that information to them) will immediately result in a requote for a full phone replacement, as well as a nullifying of Applecare coverage, meaning they will charge you the FULL PRICE of the device in question, regardless of your condition. For this particular phone, since it's been repaired by someone that isn't Apple or one of its "certified repair centers" (IE places like Geek Squad here in the US), and is displaying warning messages, Apple's diagnostics will immediately kick it to a full phone replacement due to multiple failures, and if 3rd party repairs are discovered, at full price instead of the $99 they charge if you have Applecare+. That's the world we live in now
No wonder apple spending on billion dollar(US) to stop 3rd party repair. 😅
Any chance the bms needs continuous current flowing to prevent locking up? Preventing exactly what you are trying to accomplish here?
I'd like for you to try with a functioning battery beforehand if you are up for it.
Just keep in mind that the BMS may not work because you removed power completely or the previous battery was 100% dead and the voltage dropped to zero. The reason I am saying this is because it could be that some infromation on the battery is stored like RAM, as soon as you remove power, the information used by the iPhone to identify the battery as its own is lost.
Not true on this baterry
@@mareksawana356 battery*
Whenever a company complains that repair could cause safety hazards, they should just look at what they’ve created.
Yeah, someone should dump some spicy pillows encased in difficult-to-open iPhones on Apple's doorstep and tell them that if they simply made the batteries more accessible, the spicy pillows would not be as much of a danger.
You’re a magician, Hugh!
Edit:
Apparently yesterday Elon Musk threatened the development and production of an ePHONE, if activists succeeded in persuading Apple and Google to keep Twitter out of their stores.
I wish he would stick it to Apple in particular. The games those guys play to prevent the man-in-the-street from repairing his own phone is disheartening and dishonest.
I’ve been doing this for a long time but only on customers who care. I explain the procedure and most people don’t care about the message. The fact that it’s becoming necessary is very annoying, however, soon there will be aftermarket batteries available either with an aftermarket battery board built in or on a tag on flex. As for screens you can purchase screens that you can transplant the old screens chip onto. So possible but not usually for the user.
Before iPhone even existed, Sony was doing this with their camera and laptop batteries. Circa 2005, Texas Instrument begun marketing a BMS chip that allowed to market "Genuine" Sony batteries. When I tried the BMS swap at the time, I realised the BMS disabled itself as soon the input voltage (from the battery) drop to zero. I mean, the BMS has to be desoldered from the old battery while keeping some voltage applied. Could it be the case here?
Best Regards,
Anthony
Makita drill batteries are the same. It’s a “safety feature.”
4:22 you need a battery tag, the battery info is encrypted since iPhone 11, and you cannot read it or modify it unless you have the proper battery tag to plug it into the battery flex
Yes if you type in JCID Battery Tag on flex iPhone 11, it should show results of where you can purchase this. I believe there are some TH-cam videos demonstrating it's use too
That tends to happen with a small tear in the BMS. Like mentioned, could be blown but we've had more cases where BMS flex was torn or damaged and exposed the exact same problem. You have to be very careful or else you need to have Apple or an IRP shop fix it to get rid of the message
Another master piece, thanks hughie, i already miss your videos
How do Apple and other companies legally get away with this? Can you imagine if you bought a car and could only go to a dealership to change the battery with them as its paired to the car!
Whet you said.... I'm pretty sure car companies are willing on it.
Never mind, it happening. I think the Volkswagen Group EV already have such feature.
Dude, are you slow?? Only apple does this. Android manufacturers make it easy to replace their batteries, since there's no battery health, no need for calibration
Nice video, Jeffrey. I am glad you found those methods to bypass Apple messages. I know that the first times are not easy and you are new to this, but I think you will eventually figure it out. There is a youtube channel called REWA Technology that explains how to do these things in detail. I was surprised that they are doing those videos for years and repair shops can't learn from them. Yes, it takes time to weld it and do these jobs, but everyone would pay the extra buck for these things and there would be fewer Apple messages or even non.
Good try mate!! I hope in the future you'll get another opportunity to try this out on a phone that doesn't have such a badly damaged original battery. This looks like an interesting technique to explore further.
You must activate the battery before first use. Apply voltage from the power supply to the connector. Then, before inserting the battery, you must connect the service power supply to the motherboard and start and turn off the phone (so that there is a message about a non-original battery). From model 12 you need a special TAG - after programming it stays in the phone.
from iphone 11 you need the tag on flex
Here is a scary scenario for the iPhone 15 that I have heard being discussed in certain dark places. It is proposed that once Apple moves to solid state buttons and a titanium case, they will then weld the whole thing shut so it cannot be opened and is a complete solid sealed unit by replacing the Penta lobe screws with welds. If you crack the glass or damage it, it will be a full phone replacement because you will no longer be able to get into the phone. They are also supposedly adding a tattle tale sensor / microswitch that activates and scrambles all the encryption keys as a failsafe if you do manage to get into the phone. Once that key is changed the phone is bricked. to power this they will have a capacitor to provide just enough power for the scrambler to activate and failsafe signal the encryption chips.
That sounds like hell
Yet another reason to go android
AASP and apple care services still have to make money off of field repairs, completely locking the device will cut off this lucrative revenue stream. As we know the world richest company is good at making more money.
Frustrating - but I'm sure you'll try this again Hugh, you're not one to give up a good challenge! Nice spot welder too.
I had a similar experience recently. Canon's original EOS batteries are expensive, so I recently rebuilt my 2016 LP-E6 battery pack that was no longer holding a good charge, and I had to desolder the BMS board once I had taken the pack apart. Cost me a fraction of an original new Canon battery pack (just 2 x 18500 Lithium Batteries at $6 each), and unlike the cheap 3rd party clone packs that have no BMS or protection circuitry, I now have a 'fresh' original pack that charges in a Canon charger, and even reports full health in the camera - I guess removing the old cells somehow reset the health status on the BMS. My only caution about this is the risk of doing a bad job, and having the battery short and catch fire inside my R6, so very much a 'do at your own risk' repair.
Well, you did successfully spot weld a defective part to a replacement battery and discover that it was in fact defective. There wasn't any other way to find out, so I don't see anything wrong with anything you did, and you still have the ability to fix who knows how many more that probably have good controllers. Sounds like a good start.
@@VzVegeta I've had it since 2000 but it started out as Attorney Barnabas Collins on the ebay help pages. Everyone called me ABC.
Sadly, you nailed it with your outro. The only way they are ever going to stop these sorts of practices is if people stop buying their phones.
This is weird, but cool
Hey Hugh! Sony Xperia Pro 512 smartphone - have you had a chance to look at this one and what is your opinion as far as repairability goes for Sony's smartphones??? I own both Apple and Samsung currently and really don't like either, yet these are older devices easier to tinker with then what they are selling today. I would gladly get the Sony if they are better for long term ownership and don't become throwaways when the battery dies.
Keep up the awesome job mate 👍👍
as if it couldn't get any harder.
That's what she said.
you can do this without a spot welder. just use some solder between the battery terminals and the contacts on the board. it takes a bit more time cause you have to heat up the solder enough to melt it, but it's still easy even if you only have a soldering iron.
time for a law requiring replacement batteries to be user installable...simply inexcuseable gibberish from Apple and Samsung and co.
Great video Hugh. I've got the same spot welder, haven't used it yet. Shame you were set up from the beginning with a dud BMS board. Next time 👍
I think you don't need a spot welder, a soldering iron should be fine.
Obviously Apple's software locks are terrible garbage!
I don't think the BMS is dead, but more likely locked. This is nothing new, and prevents most laptop batteries from having the bare cells replaced.
You need to charge your old battery fully, then same with the new one, then connect them in parallel before disconnecting the old one.
If the BMS gets no power from a battery during even a fraction of a second, it's over!
You should look at REWA videos, they do a good job showing the iphone 12 screen replacement that removes those messages, and bms batteries transfer.
I have great success rate swapping the bms over to the new cell. Sometimes you need to jump the battery or charge it outside the phone with 5v. And try to reinstall the battery to the phone and test. If it still shows 0%. Unplug the battery connector and plug it back in and press on it firmly. Try to power on the phone with the connector being pressed and try to charge it or check the health
that is a pretty ingenious idea. i would like to see a video where all the issues from swapping a logic board are fixed by also switching the controllers and chips responsible for software locks
Ninth
I was going through a similar process looking at replacing an iPhone 11 battery and looked into all these tools. All together to order and ship I was looking at $135, not including the replacement part. Apple still offers battery replacement for these and they are charging $69. So the silver lining is that going the official route is cheaper (unless you work in bulk) at least in the US while living a moderate distance from an Apple store. At the core though, it is really annoying to have to do this though. There is a compromise here will informing customers of how genuine parts are, but since they're a business that will never happen.
This reminds me of something I ran into at work recently. USB C is getting more common on laptops, and we always joke that one day a manufacturer is gonna lock out 3rd party chargers. We use lenovo usbc chargers cause that's typically what we have the most of for our test benches. I can't remember the specific model, but one of the dell units we got in REFUSED to charge on anything BUT a dell usb c charger. In fact, I couldn't even get the damn thing to BOOT without using a dell charger.
Yes Dell is just like Apple. Third party batteries don't work either.
Dell has been doing that before Apple. The charger sends a signal down one of the three connectors on the charger's cable. There is the outside barrel, inside barrel and inside pin. If you can generate the signal and send it down the line then it will activate the charge circuit. As usual Dell claims it's a protection circuit that third party chargers do not overcharge the battery causing a fire or explosion.
I honestly don’t mind the error message for the battery.. only down side is reselling it is more difficult, and generic batteries are usually very bad with fake advertised copacity.
BMS might also work like an old eprom exposed to light when it is disconnected from power. Data wipes never to be recovered.
Under the EU battery directive, Apple was forced to provide a battery upgrade service after they failed to comply with it, unfortunately there is no pricing control on this so apple can charge a fortune for this. So new regulations are currently being defined that allow the manufacturer to specify an "independent operator" or user replacement. It will specifically prevent the use of software to prevent repair.
Apple: no you can't change the battery you have to over pay for it
hugh: haha spot welder go brrrrrrrr
You need to install a tag-on flex (jc or quanli) onto the new battery with the original bms board. Then, you need to use a programmer to reset its cycles and battery health to a 100%. Once this is done, take all batteries out of the iphone and use a dc power supply to power on the iphone. Or, if you dont have a dc power supply, you can use another aftermarket battery with an aftermarket bms board already installed to power the phone on. Let the phone power on which will trigger a "non genuine" battery parts message. Now you have tricked the motherboard and should immediately power off the phone. Finally, install the new battery with the transferred oem bms board and tag-on flex. Power on the device and watch the "non-genuine" battery message go away and should have your battery health at 100%.
Hope this helps out!
the bms is always powered on and once you remove power, the volatile memory chip gets wiped. you have to keep the bms alive during the transplant and ur good to go
I found out the same thing on Siemens laptop battery, the bms is intentionally designed to go bad/wiped when you cut off the battery,
Probably they have the firmware on a volatile ram so as soon you cut the power the firmware get lost and the bms microcontroller will have no firmware to work with.
The suggested solution is to hook up a temporary voltage source to the bms while doing the transplant.
Hello hugh, the battery in order to work properly should be 3.7V and more.
You shouldn’t jump start it with another battery.
Try supplying the battery with 4.2V (charging voltage) from an external power supply.
When the battery exceeds 3.7V it should start working properly
1:31 oh! It’s dangerous to do so! Battery can explode.
Replace iPhone battery now. Requires a spot welder didn’t.
Before cutting the old battery from the charging, you need to have a constant 3.6v ish dc external power supply connected to the battery contacts on the board to "retain" health on the charge board.
I've given up on Samsung & Apple phones, my manufacture of choice now is Cubot. I've had their Quest rugged phone for number of years now, it's off to have a new charging port fitted in the next few days even though it's relatively easy to disassemble I'am terrible at soldering.
It is not uncommon for battery BMS information to be stored in on-chip SRAM. So if the battery fully dies or voltage is ever removed, it effectively erases everything. If the battery is not below critical voltage, you must temporarily tack on a power supply to maintain voltage to the BMS while the cell is being swapped.
Actually it started from xs series that you need to weld an old bms flex to not get a genuine battery message. After 11 though you need extra I2c flex that you connect in the battery flex and clear all the old data and thats how you get 100% battery health.
But like you said, you can damage the bms flex in the process.
My last iPhone was the X. Repairs are a must for phones and making it difficult just to extort exorbitant prices for a company repair is uncalled for.
In the laptops if you disconnect the power from the chip, the chip bricks the battery unit.
It is much safer to handle battery repairs\shipping when the battery is in a low charge state. With a near 0 charge the battery will not explode when punctured.
You still need to charge back up but that will give you the chance to observe the battery for any sign of failure as it charges and disconnect just in case. If a battery is damaged, this method won't unleash the fury of a full charge when compromised. Just watch for any unusual heating or smoke as your signal to stop charging.
The BMS most likely set a permanent flag inside its non-volatile memory that this cell voltage went too low, which happened when the BMS was snapped of the original cell. Once this flag is set, the BMS won't charge the battery or function properly as a safety pre-caution. The same happens for most DJI drone batteries. They lock out when a single cell discharges to a voltage too low to be safe.
my mother in law is in her later 60's. she has had the same iphone 5 for over 10yrs now & it has better battery life than my 2020 iphone. she has never updated her iphone , and it runs perfectly & im confident that is why her iphone runs perfectly. ive since stopped updating iphone, and i wont be buying another one. any company that actively sabotages the products they sell, shouldnt be patronized , plain & simple.
i designed a few BMS boards, some IC have protection system that disable cell swap, in ICs with i was working on, there was threshold voltage usually set around cell chemistry breakdown*, so when cell voltage drops under that voltage IC trigger total shutdown for safety, becouse you are cutting board from any voltage source you are trigering "cell death" signal, and when you connect it in to new cell it doesnt allow to use it becouse for IC its marvelously alive and its hazard...or in apple case repair attempt, in my work to get around this i was making this procedure:
1)measure old cell voltage
2)solder to BMS 2 wires connected to power supply
3)apply to BMS --->SAME
Hi Hugh, copying TrueTone data (to a genuine screen) is possible now for iPhone 12/12 Pro and 13 (not 13 Pro) with the latest J1VS programmer.
i think the battery has a non voletile memory bit in it so when u removed it u needed to keep supplying the power to the bms module then only it will be tricked, or else it will report battery bad never let the terminals go zero...
5:05 I’ve had the same issue when replacing an iPhone XS with a new battery cell, even after transferring the serial number and resetting the health and cycle count. I tried placing in another battery with a different non-reprogrammed BMS board. The battery percentage was displayed correctly, however the non genuine battery message obviously pops up. I then put the new battery cell with the original BMS board back into the phone and it worked perfectly fine; no non genuine battery message, 100% battery health and battery percentage displayed correctly. My guess is that the logic board doesn’t change the displayed battery info if it detects the original BMS board until you plug in a different one.
Interesting that China continues to supply some of the best tools to due true phone repairs. Appreciate the continued attention you're giving this issue in your videos while still focusing on easy to follow instructions for anyone willing to take on the risk of this repair.
Why interesting? They simple show how innovative the entire world could be if we would abolish intellectual „property“
@@csPinKie Spot-welding devices are not governed by IP laws lmao.
@@vincere_ sad that you have such a limited thought process.
Yes, spot welding devices are not governed by IP laws, but they are neccessary because IP laws exist.
Apple hiding behind their propriatary software / encoded hardware and them suing even open source projects into oblivion ( i mean just look at the lawsuits from jailbreak cases) make easy public solutions to the problems they create hard in the western world and require people to take extra steps (like transfering the bms instead of just doing a software swap) instead of easy software solutions
@@csPinKie Cherry-picking Apple as the reason why 'IP laws need to be abolished globally' seems to be a thought process much more inhibited by tunnel vision.
@@vincere_ excuse me, iam not cherry picking apple.
It was just an example which can be transfered to any industry.
Just because someone trademarketed an idea earlier doesnt mean that the should have an monopoly on it.
The entire internet based industry showed during the last 30 years how well innovation and growth are possible without governmental restrictions