Are you sure vinegar is hydrochloric acid??? and not acetic acid ???I would seriously check out your types of acid before giving people advice on using acid, especially mixing acids with other chemicals like methylated spirits etc. Please check this out vinegar is not hydrochloric acid it is acetic acid, Hydrochloric acid is the acid that occurs in our stomachs. It is used in the concrete industry to clean of concrete build up on tools and agitators, please dont ever put hydrochloric acid on a guitar and be careful what you mix hydrochloric acid with e.g mixed with chlorine you will make mustard gas which is nasty stuff. Please be careful with the advise you give out vinegar is not hydrochloric acid it is acetic acid there is a huge difference.
@@DevilAndSons Please be very careful with chemicals careful in there labeling and there using it is very easy for things to go wrong very quickly with chemicals. I hate correcting people Daniel but when I saw this I thought for peoples safety it needed to be pointed out. Great channel mate and I love your creativity it is inspiring.
Really glad you showed the mirror and peeling off the tape! During the spraying I saw that texture and I thought "wow, there's something really wrong here, how come he isn't seeing that!", but then you were and it was part of your plan!!!
It's my pleasure. This is one of my most popular videos and I get lots of questions about using SprayMax. I'll be doing another video soon showing the different finishes.
You don't want to wait 24 hours between coats. The reason it says to wait 10-15 mins is because you want the layers to melt into each other. If you wait 24 hours, you'll just be laying over a dried coat.
You are right. There is however the need to wait 24 hours in certain cases. You need to wait 10 to 15 minutes between layers, but it's a bad idea to out on too many layers in one go as it can prevent the first layers from properly curing, or at least different rates of curing for the inner and outer layers which can cause issues. This is particularly a problem for 1k paints, but I think it would still be an issue here. I think it's unlikely you will need more than 3 coats, however if, like me, you have anything hand painted that has raised parts you may want to. In which case I recommend 24 hours to allow it fully cure, a light sand to allow for keying of the new layers, then apply the new coats - again no more than 3 in one session. I hope that makes sense.
Wet sanding works well also and helps the sand paper last longer without loading and clogging...but you need a towels or two to keep the mess under control.
There's a great community here on TH-cam and I'm so thankful for the people that subscribe and comment on my videos, the discussions add so much. Thanks for your contribution.
@@DevilAndSons I would really appreciate if somebody have some information how it works on a veneer surface as a refinish. Wish you all the best! Greetings from Bulgaria!
Thankyou Devil & sons ---now I think I see the problem ---typical Yankee slang ---googled it ---faulty aerosol application in certain areas--surely there must be a more civilised English description ---anyhow --very grateful for the explanation !
I was introduced to the word when I did a contemporary wood finishing course by my tutor, the same person that taught me French polishing. He was a British man in his 60s, so perhaps it is a traditionally used term?
Dev. Just a note, if you hold the activator release valve down after you've released the activator, technically, you are holding a valve open for mixture to return whence it came. Best not to hold it open after the activator release process is complete. Germans [von Frankfürt] don't tend to leave any ambiguity in their instructions 😃
Spray max says the pot life is 48 hrs at 68 deg. I recently activated a can and did a small job with plenty left over. The clear coat was still good, and sprayed well 1 week after activating it. It was in my garage where the temp was 65-70 degrees. I actually tested it on a painted can before using it on my car. It dried to touch in about 15 minutes, and fully dried after an hour. So I don't know why the manufacturer says it has a 2 day pot life. I could see it if it was a 2 part version intended to be used with a spray gun, in which case the mix would be exposed to air. So as long as it still sprays- it's good. Don't throw it out after 2 days.
Great tip. I have noticed with the cans I had that a few days later the little bit left still sprayed too (but I didn't need it) so I think you are right and this isn't a one off.
Not a tip, since this cannot be relied upon to work in all cases. A manufacturer's statement can be, even when edge cases may show them to be overly conservative. YMMV
After sanding extensively and triple priming --8 Coats of Chinese yellow nitro cellulose spray paint ---I can still see nasty scratches--holes etc --huge shrinking of this cheapo paint --will keep applying more coats! Maybe I will eventually get a smooth finish on my guitar body !
When you're using nitrocellulose you shouldn't really apply anything on top other than more nitro. Nitro also needs 2 weeks minimum before more coats and finishing. I tend to do ni more than three sessions of nitro application before waiting 2 weeks. When I'm finishing and buffing I wait a month after the last coat before doing anything.
Unless you are using a nitrocellulose lacquer you should lightly sand to allow the top coat something to bond with. However certain paints, like metallics and sparkles shouldn't be sanded. So with black you're OK to sand
Good point. I can't remember what I was thinking at the time. I think it may have been to help make sure that I didn't ship the acrylic paint when removing the tape, but I don't know if that would actually happen. Hmm. I'm doing a similar guitar at the moment and I am planning to do all 6 over the mirror.
Wowwwww how did you get that cracked mirror effect over the guitar so that its level with the rest of the surface you just sprayed? It's wildly gorgeous!
Zambia ---we have fabulous teak forests==but rather heavy --and mahogany --everywhere ---trying plywood as its lighter --but difficult to get a nice paint finish --- everything is imported --some things like 400 waterpaper ---are hens teeth --but we improvise ! Bush craft and U -Tube help me enormously !
I find that three coats in one session (15 minutes apart) is often enough. Don't forget though you still need to light sand first to help the spraymax key into the layer underneath.
Thanks. Definitely sand it so you can't see the runs. If you then run a lightly damp cloth over the paintwork and it looks good you can go ahead with the clear top coat (basically what it looks like wet is whatsit will look like with the clear on). Or you may want to out another thin base coat over the top.
Cheers. Do you mean the Love Cats one? I've had it years - it's hand screen printed by an artist, I think her name is Alice Roberts. I'll have to look it up.
It definitely isn't the best for guitars, but I love the colours and it's my go to. Thanks for commenting. Have you tried the new effects they have? There's some marbling, crackle, and rust. I want to give then all a go sometime.
@@DevilAndSons I agree that they do tend to build up and get a textured look, but that can be fixed in one of two ways. The first being a light sanding with 1000 the next day before you top coat it. The second way is the change the tip on the can to Montana's wide pattern. You do go through more material, but it lays more evenly. Also, if you notice a build up it may mean that you may want to increase the speed of your patern. I have tried the florescent colours and they are amazing. And lastly, is it me or does MTN94 have a sweet, candy like scent?
I recently switched to the wide tips, much improved finish, and yes to the sanding. I should look onto the flourescent too, I'd love to do a fluorescent guitar. So funny you can smell the colours. It's like eating smarties, I'm sure the different colours taste different, but not 100% sure.
@@DevilAndSons They don't have a whole lot of variety when it comes to the florescent colours, but they are stunning. I should note that the florescent colours are best when layed on top of a pure white; the R-9010 is a must. I usually will get excellent coverage with about ¾ of a can and the next day I do a light sanding and apply the remaining colour. I then top it off with Montanas high gloss 2K. Cheers, Andy
I am 74 --never heard the expression --only bubbling or -stippling or dry angular spray --never had "ORANGE PEEL " EFFECT ----ever --bad technique I suppose ?--been a luthier /car painter for 50 yrs ! got to hold can or spray nozzle ---at 90 deg to the guitar ---one foot away --
Great video, However your tip about the French polish technique caused a lot of issues for me. I use Montana gold paints and recently used a Montana crackle effect. I used the 50/50 mix stated in the vid and it caused the crackle paint to soften which as soon as you apply the Spraymax 2k clear, it caused bubbles to form on the clear. So basically I've had to sand and start again. Don't worry, I'm not blaming you :). Is there anything else you could suggest I could use to clean the surfaces before applying the clear that might be safer to use?
Thanks for letting me know. I've not heard of Montana crackle effect. I think you should do some practice tests before trying the main thing. I have a feeling the spraymax may cause that to happen as I wonder how strong the texture is to withstand the shrinking of a top coat. I am right that the crackle causes a textured surface? I'd be surprised if it were what you cleaned it with. You could try water instead but that will take longer to evaporate and may seep into the gaps in the crackle, which may be what happened with the crackle. The other thing that more basically may have happened is the bubbling just may be an incompatibility between the paint and the spraymax as I have found using other non-montana gold paints from a can has caused bubbles and wrinkles with various top coats - sometimes i have left it dry, lightly sanded, added a new top coat,repeated a few times and git quite a cool crackle/relic look. Feel free to email me some photos info@devilandsons.guitars and maybe I can suggest something.
@@DevilAndSons Just use neat methylated spirit. It evaporates to nothing. The french polisher sounds like he's using the vinegar to reduce costs of his much larger inventory. Adding an extra acid 'cut' to the clean is simply not necessary if you use a sufficient quantity of meths.
@@PedroPlckle interesting. The vinegar was because the acetic acid is hard to get hold of, which is more expensive than meths, so I doubt it was a cost cutting thing. I mean he used acetic acid but I use vinegar.
Now, that's confusing. In the UK we have methylated spirits but other countries don't have it. Someone suggested to me it is rubbing alcohol. Maybe if you Google for a methylated spirits equivalent on your country it will give you an answer that you can share here. It's purple here but the equivalent in other countries is most likely clear.
I have found that most times just 3 coats is enough. I think 24 hours is fine, but if you're not in a rush then leaving itv48 hours is a good idea. However if your wanting to put more coats on from the same can then I would wet sand after 24 hours and then apply the next coats as you don't really want to be using the same can with more time than that after you initially trigger the button underneath.
Im painting my bike fork and have a question. If some parts have an existing clear coat that I didn’t sand off will it be okay to spray this over it? Montana can gold spray was giving me a texture finish until I figured out why....I wasn’t shaking it long enough! So you can eliminate the texture by shaking the can for 5min
Yes, good shaking is key. I would always lightly sand anything that's there to ensure the new paint has something to key and grip against. Sounds like a cool project.
@@DevilAndSons the area that needed to be painted was painted and sanded down nice and smooth but surrounding area has existing clear coat. Is it safe when spraying the new painted area to spray over existing clear coat adjacent to it?
I still think spraying over anything without sanding it first runs the risk that it may peel, so if you are clear coating the newly painted area and it spills over to the old clear coat it could peel away from the old area in time. It may not. It's hard to picture but sounds like it's too much to sand all the adjacent area light and clear coat it all again. Also you may need a good clear coat on a bike as it may chip easily otherwise. I like spraymax 2k (I have a video on that too).
@@DevilAndSons thank you. I will try to find more info about spraying over clear. I think it’ll look funny if I tape it off and clear coat the decal section I painted. I would think the two clear coats may look different. I dont know. But I bought the 2k
It's a 3m full mask, with an abek 1 filter. I also have particulate filters on it as I use it for wood work too, I can't remember if they p1r filters or not.
So i'm at a stage where i put 3 coats of spraymax 2k on the guitar, there's some orange peel plus there are some vinyl stickers under there so i think i need to do another 3 coats. So, up to what grip of sandpaper do i go before doing the second session of 2k?
I always start carefully at this stage. I would use 800, you want to be careful not to go through the spraymax and sand any of the paint or stickers underneath. You won't have to work with anything finer before putting the next coat on. If you are getting orange peel you could try either a slightly further distance between your can and the body or moving slightly quicker - one cause of orange peel could be the thickness and these two elements will help. After another round of 3 coats if you still have orange peel or lumps from the vinyl start with the 800 and get finer, if it's looking flat and like it doesn't need more coats you can keep getting finer with the paper until you are ready to buff. I normally go 800, 1000, 1500 then buff. Sometimes I miss out the 800, and recently I have been adding 2000. Good luck.
@@DevilAndSons if i use the 800 to prep the second session of clear coat, won't that scratch the surface and make the clear coat look all white and non transparent? And if spray over that won't i seal those imperfections under the second session of clear coat? Thanx
It will definitely scratch and make it look white, but the next coat will hide all imperfections. If you are worried try 1000 grit. Basically though if you wipe the surface with something wet it will give the exact appearance that you will get with the next coat so you can see the cloudy white dissappear. Perhaps I should make a video on this topic? It's a very valid question to ask if you haven't done it before.
I have in the past when using nitro (you can apply some heat to help with that) and the odd can of poly (I had to sand back) but i haven't with this. But that doesn't mean to say you might not get it, you just need to be careful with application and make sure it's not too cold when you spray both in the room and the can itself. I always make sure the room is heated first in the winter and the cans are at room temperature. I don't leave the heating on though whilst I spray.
@@DevilAndSons yeah a Strat guitar body. I have some areas in the body that the colour coat is hazy. I'll try some no blush retarder from MOHAWK I'll see if it's working
That's a good idea. If the retarder is made for the sort of paint you have used it should work, I think it may depend on how long it has been left but not sure on the specifics. Good luck.
Can anyone tell me how long I need to wait to recoat using the 2k glamour clear coat. I ran out of paint on the third coat and I have some areas that aren't covered well and the finish isn't so glamorous on those areas. I have another can ordered that should be here in a week.
Hi. I don't know what the glamour paint is, but if it's like a metallic it's normally best not to sand the final coat. You could lightly sand what you have, apply the next layers and then the first clear coat layer - that you can sand. I would imagine it's a 48 hour dry, most 2Ks are 24 to 48 and should say on the can.
@@jimhmod I just did a really quick internet search, and I think the glamour is the same as the gloss, it's just the name used in the US. I may be wrong. In which case it's exactly the same as what I was using.
I think the can says 24 hours, although I have used them for 3 days in a row before - which I think was lucky due to temperatures. I would recommended spray one day, then 24 hours later, then not risk it.
Hei! Thanks for your video. I am wondering how much time it takes for 2k lacquer to fully solidify? I am on day 3, the surface seemed fine but after buffing the surface seem to accumulate even slight touches by fingers…That sucks really, as it will need an extra polishing & buffing
That doesn't sound right at all. I normally find it's fine within 24 hours and have never had it accumulate marks like that. Possibly it's on too thick but it sounds more like the two parts haven't mixed properly.
I keep seeing people use this 2k clear coat but the safety aspect seems to be underplayed with a variety of advice - there are professionals who say you should never use this product unless wearing an air fed mask and have high quality air filtration where its being sprayed Until that's explained better I will have to use nitro or acrylic with best 1k I can find
Safety is important. I believe nitro may be more toxic though. One of my suppliers no longer sells nitro to the public without them signing a waiver to say they are aware if the toxicity. Just a heads up there.
I'm sure it also depends on exposure. You should definitely use some kind of respirator at the very least with the 2k stuff and maintain good ventilation, but I don't think the risk is that high if you spray a guitar or two as a project once a year. But it obviously gets a lot more serious if you spray one every week or even more often. In that case, the air fed mask becomes a reasonable requirement. And, as pointed out, nitro is not that great either (no paints are, really). There's a reason nitro is downright banned in several countries while 2k stuff is available just fine even in "hobbyist" rattle cans.
I wouldn't advise it as it may well react badly and cause problems right away, or look OK to start then problems will arise later. They won't bond well. Although actually you can put lacquer on top of the poly.
I think that is also a poly and probably not the best thing to put over a lacquer. You may be able to seal the lacquer so it can be painted over. Are you just looking for a clear coat? Is there a reason you don't want to use a lacquer finish?
No luxuries here in the African bush ---we use TOOTHPASTE /wire wool and pot scouring powder to pollish & buff imported paint with ! necessity is the mother ---- of invention __
How many coats/bodies can you normally get out of a single can? What is the pot life of the can once the red button is pressed and mixed? I've considered using this product before, but without having a dedicated spray booth, I will not risk it with the flammability and chemicals.
I would definitely recommend doing this in a spray booth or outdoors (although their is a risk of dust). I normally manage 2 bodies out of a can although I hear some people can get a bit more. I did spray a guitar and neck and some additional parts I had painted and use up a whole can earlier this week. If you have one guitar to spray only you may have left over which although is a waste is probably worth it for the quality you get from this.
I haven't. I wouldn't imagine they would be a problem but I would always do a test first and personally would always use a sealer first too. I wonder if using this on bare wood would involve 3 coats, let it dry then sand flat followed by another three coats, mainly because of the wood grain needing filling. The 2k is pretty thick but probably not as good as a sealer or primer.
Brilliant, thanks for sharing your results when they happen. I have been getting one guitar per can, sometimes one guitar and a bit more. Although I just worked on a guitar that I had hand painted and needed up putting more than one can on to get it smooth - 3 layers at a time, let it dry 24 hours, sand , next 3 layers. It was roughly 6 layers per can.
help please , i just bought a brand new evh 5150 guitar - matte finish with a 5150 logo sticker on . can i paint with this clear coat to preserve matt paint from wearing off over time ? ive asked a luthier here in nz & he said no itd dampen the sound & won't do it .. should i try or avoid ? thank you
Thanks for commenting. Firstly if you put a clear coat on it would have to be a matt finish which would essentially be the same as what you have, unless you meant you wanted to give it a clear finish. Secondly the problem with matt is over time, as you play and brush against the surface, is that you are essentially polishing the surface so it will get a bit shiny - that's unavoidable (unless you don't play it). If you love the matt and don't like any signs of use you may just have to refinish the surface every few years (depending on how much you play), and that doesn't necessarily mean a new top coat but could be just reapplying the matt finish with wire wool (I wouldn't try that if you don't know what you are doing). Also I totally disagree that adding another top coat will dampen the sound, it's just the same as what isotherm but very slightly thicker now. My advice is to leave it, that effect the surface of any guitar that you play is unavoidable and I don't think you would notice the matt finish becoming too shiny for quite some time unless you either play a lot or polish your guitar regularly. When it needs a clean just use a barely damp cloth to wipe over it. I hope that helps. Also, cool guitar purchase!
This finish, IMO, is garbage. The can I bought was either defective or didn't release the hardener properly. Refinished my headlights and the finish crazed & was still soft 24 hours later. Waste of $30.
Hmm. That doesn't sound right at all. I wonder of ot was a defective can. I've never seen this craze or not harden. What is cold out when you did it, or damp? I'm not really sure what would cause that. Maybe some contamination on the headlight? That must have been so annoying for you, I guess you have to replace the headlamp or we're you able to remove what you had sprayed?
@@DevilAndSons I sanded it all out up to 2000 then polished. Turned out OK. I usually spray lacquer on my guitars, not a poly fan but for headlights, UV resistant urethane is the way to go.
Spray Max contains isocyanites, extremely toxic and enters through your skin, respirstor and gloves don't do the trick here. Everyone likes a cool looking guitar, but don't risk your health over it. Be safe and use regular clear coat or leave it up to the pros!
Are you sure vinegar is hydrochloric acid??? and not acetic acid ???I would seriously check out your types of acid before giving people advice on using acid, especially mixing acids with other chemicals like methylated spirits etc. Please check this out vinegar is not hydrochloric acid it is acetic acid, Hydrochloric acid is the acid that occurs in our stomachs. It is used in the concrete industry to clean of concrete build up on tools and agitators, please dont ever put hydrochloric acid on a guitar and be careful what you mix hydrochloric acid with e.g mixed with chlorine you will make mustard gas which is nasty stuff. Please be careful with the advise you give out vinegar is not hydrochloric acid it is acetic acid there is a huge difference.
Oops, you are totally right. I need to amend this....
I have pinned this comment.
@@DevilAndSons Please be very careful with chemicals careful in there labeling and there using it is very easy for things to go wrong very quickly with chemicals. I hate correcting people Daniel but when I saw this I thought for peoples safety it needed to be pointed out. Great channel mate and I love your creativity it is inspiring.
You are absolutely correct, what a terrible slip of the tongue. Safety first.
@@DevilAndSons Oh well you got another sub ....cheers from Down Under.
Really glad you showed the mirror and peeling off the tape! During the spraying I saw that texture and I thought "wow, there's something really wrong here, how come he isn't seeing that!", but then you were and it was part of your plan!!!
Ha, thanks. I decided to leave mentioning it until the end so I could get straight into the spraying.
Thanks for the great Video and the recommendation!
Cheers, your SprayMax-Team
It's my pleasure. This is one of my most popular videos and I get lots of questions about using SprayMax. I'll be doing another video soon showing the different finishes.
You don't want to wait 24 hours between coats. The reason it says to wait 10-15 mins is because you want the layers to melt into each other. If you wait 24 hours, you'll just be laying over a dried coat.
You are right. There is however the need to wait 24 hours in certain cases. You need to wait 10 to 15 minutes between layers, but it's a bad idea to out on too many layers in one go as it can prevent the first layers from properly curing, or at least different rates of curing for the inner and outer layers which can cause issues. This is particularly a problem for 1k paints, but I think it would still be an issue here. I think it's unlikely you will need more than 3 coats, however if, like me, you have anything hand painted that has raised parts you may want to. In which case I recommend 24 hours to allow it fully cure, a light sand to allow for keying of the new layers, then apply the new coats - again no more than 3 in one session. I hope that makes sense.
he wanted to sand it out. he did it right
@peterlennihan4996 thanks.
Wet sanding works well also and helps the sand paper last longer without loading and clogging...but you need a towels or two to keep the mess under control.
So much mess, the worst part of the process.
I found all the information i needed under the video. I'm simply amazed!
There's a great community here on TH-cam and I'm so thankful for the people that subscribe and comment on my videos, the discussions add so much. Thanks for your contribution.
@@DevilAndSons I would really appreciate if somebody have some information how it works on a veneer surface as a refinish. Wish you all the best! Greetings from Bulgaria!
I can't see why a veneer would be any different from a wood finish. As I also, it's worth a test on some spare bits.
Thankyou Devil & sons ---now I think I see the problem ---typical Yankee slang ---googled it ---faulty aerosol application in certain areas--surely there must be a more civilised English description ---anyhow --very grateful for the explanation !
I was introduced to the word when I did a contemporary wood finishing course by my tutor, the same person that taught me French polishing. He was a British man in his 60s, so perhaps it is a traditionally used term?
Dev. Just a note, if you hold the activator release valve down after you've released the activator, technically, you are holding a valve open for mixture to return whence it came. Best not to hold it open after the activator release process is complete. Germans [von Frankfürt] don't tend to leave any ambiguity in their instructions 😃
What a good point! Now I want to cut a can open to see how it works.
Spray max says the pot life is 48 hrs at 68 deg. I recently activated a can and did a small job with plenty left over. The clear coat was still
good, and sprayed well 1 week after activating it. It was in my garage where the temp was 65-70 degrees. I actually tested it on a painted can
before using it on my car. It dried to touch in about 15 minutes, and fully dried after an hour. So I don't know why the manufacturer says it
has a 2 day pot life. I could see it if it was a 2 part version intended to be used with a spray gun, in which case the mix would be exposed to
air. So as long as it still sprays- it's good. Don't throw it out after 2 days.
Great tip. I have noticed with the cans I had that a few days later the little bit left still sprayed too (but I didn't need it) so I think you are right and this isn't a one off.
Not a tip, since this cannot be relied upon to work in all cases. A manufacturer's statement can be, even when edge cases may show them to be overly conservative. YMMV
I think you are spot on with that, they don't want to risk someone having a bad experience so set the limits to ensure that. Thanks for your input.
Heard if you keep the can cold after activation, it'll last longer
I think this is probably the case. I feel like I should buy a can and just keep testing every 12 hours.
Thanks for the video. What grit of sand paper do you use to sand the clear before adding your final 3 coats of clear?
I use 600, and prefer a wet sand.
After sanding extensively and triple priming --8 Coats of Chinese yellow nitro cellulose spray paint ---I can still see nasty scratches--holes etc --huge shrinking of this cheapo paint --will keep applying more coats! Maybe I will eventually get a smooth finish on my guitar body !
When you're using nitrocellulose you shouldn't really apply anything on top other than more nitro. Nitro also needs 2 weeks minimum before more coats and finishing. I tend to do ni more than three sessions of nitro application before waiting 2 weeks. When I'm finishing and buffing I wait a month after the last coat before doing anything.
Nice job anyhow --well done !
Cheers, thanks so much.
Should I lightly scuff the base coat on a black guitar before spraying??
Unless you are using a nitrocellulose lacquer you should lightly sand to allow the top coat something to bond with. However certain paints, like metallics and sparkles shouldn't be sanded. So with black you're OK to sand
Looks good! But why wouldn’t you spray all 6 coats with the mirror unmasked?
Good point. I can't remember what I was thinking at the time. I think it may have been to help make sure that I didn't ship the acrylic paint when removing the tape, but I don't know if that would actually happen. Hmm. I'm doing a similar guitar at the moment and I am planning to do all 6 over the mirror.
@@DevilAndSons using rustoleum triple thick glaze would help with that. But whatever ya did worked! Looks good
Thanks. I need to look into that triple thick glaze
BUFFING & polishing final coat helps !
Wowwwww how did you get that cracked mirror effect over the guitar so that its level with the rest of the surface you just sprayed? It's wildly gorgeous!
Thanks.
Lots of trial and error to get that right.
Zambia ---we have fabulous teak forests==but rather heavy --and mahogany --everywhere ---trying plywood as its lighter --but difficult to get a nice paint finish ---
everything is imported --some things like 400 waterpaper ---are hens teeth --but we improvise ! Bush craft and U -Tube help me enormously !
Great information!! Thank you
It's a pleasure, thanks for commenting
How many coats of the spray max would you recommend doing if you don't have to sand an improperly prepped guitar?
I find that three coats in one session (15 minutes apart) is often enough. Don't forget though you still need to light sand first to help the spraymax key into the layer underneath.
Geat video! What should you do if there are runs in your base coat?
Thanks. Definitely sand it so you can't see the runs. If you then run a lightly damp cloth over the paintwork and it looks good you can go ahead with the clear top coat (basically what it looks like wet is whatsit will look like with the clear on). Or you may want to out another thin base coat over the top.
Nice t-shirt mate, and great video :-)
Cheers. Do you mean the Love Cats one? I've had it years - it's hand screen printed by an artist, I think her name is Alice Roberts. I'll have to look it up.
I love love love Montana spray paint.
It definitely isn't the best for guitars, but I love the colours and it's my go to. Thanks for commenting. Have you tried the new effects they have? There's some marbling, crackle, and rust. I want to give then all a go sometime.
@@DevilAndSons I agree that they do tend to build up and get a textured look, but that can be fixed in one of two ways. The first being a light sanding with 1000 the next day before you top coat it. The second way is the change the tip on the can to Montana's wide pattern. You do go through more material, but it lays more evenly. Also, if you notice a build up it may mean that you may want to increase the speed of your patern.
I have tried the florescent colours and they are amazing. And lastly, is it me or does MTN94 have a sweet, candy like scent?
I recently switched to the wide tips, much improved finish, and yes to the sanding. I should look onto the flourescent too, I'd love to do a fluorescent guitar.
So funny you can smell the colours. It's like eating smarties, I'm sure the different colours taste different, but not 100% sure.
@@DevilAndSons
They don't have a whole lot of variety when it comes to the florescent colours, but they are stunning. I should note that the florescent colours are best when layed on top of a pure white; the R-9010 is a must. I usually will get excellent coverage with about ¾ of a can and the next day I do a light sanding and apply the remaining colour. I then top it off with Montanas high gloss 2K.
Cheers,
Andy
Thanks Andy. How durable is the 2k top coat? I'm not sure I'll change to anything after using the spraymax.
I am 74 --never heard the expression --only bubbling or -stippling or dry angular spray --never had "ORANGE PEEL " EFFECT ----ever --bad technique I suppose ?--been a luthier /car painter for 50 yrs !
got to hold can or spray nozzle ---at 90 deg to the guitar ---one foot away --
That's cool. I'm sure you have phrases and descriptions I've never heard of. Thanks for watching and commenting. Great to make contact.
Great video, However your tip about the French polish technique caused a lot of issues for me. I use Montana gold paints and recently used a Montana crackle effect. I used the 50/50 mix stated in the vid and it caused the crackle paint to soften which as soon as you apply the Spraymax 2k clear, it caused bubbles to form on the clear. So basically I've had to sand and start again. Don't worry, I'm not blaming you :). Is there anything else you could suggest I could use to clean the surfaces before applying the clear that might be safer to use?
Thanks for letting me know. I've not heard of Montana crackle effect. I think you should do some practice tests before trying the main thing. I have a feeling the spraymax may cause that to happen as I wonder how strong the texture is to withstand the shrinking of a top coat. I am right that the crackle causes a textured surface? I'd be surprised if it were what you cleaned it with. You could try water instead but that will take longer to evaporate and may seep into the gaps in the crackle, which may be what happened with the crackle. The other thing that more basically may have happened is the bubbling just may be an incompatibility between the paint and the spraymax as I have found using other non-montana gold paints from a can has caused bubbles and wrinkles with various top coats - sometimes i have left it dry, lightly sanded, added a new top coat,repeated a few times and git quite a cool crackle/relic look. Feel free to email me some photos info@devilandsons.guitars and maybe I can suggest something.
@@DevilAndSons Just use neat methylated spirit. It evaporates to nothing. The french polisher sounds like he's using the vinegar to reduce costs of his much larger inventory. Adding an extra acid 'cut' to the clean is simply not necessary if you use a sufficient quantity of meths.
@@PedroPlckle interesting. The vinegar was because the acetic acid is hard to get hold of, which is more expensive than meths, so I doubt it was a cost cutting thing. I mean he used acetic acid but I use vinegar.
How long should I wait before sanding and buffing the 2k clear?
It's probably OK after 48 hours, but I try to leave it a week.
@@DevilAndSons Thanks!!
Orange PEEL ?---Paint peeling off /? ---NEVER HEARD OF IT !--What does it mean ?
It's when the surface of the paint looks like orange peel, textured with dimples. Often caused by the paint being applied too thickly.
What grit sandpaper you using there thanks
I use 600 between coats
I couldn’t understand what was the name of the 2 cleaning solutions he used…distilled white vinegar and??? Can someone please explain?Thanks
Now, that's confusing. In the UK we have methylated spirits but other countries don't have it. Someone suggested to me it is rubbing alcohol. Maybe if you Google for a methylated spirits equivalent on your country it will give you an answer that you can share here. It's purple here but the equivalent in other countries is most likely clear.
@@DevilAndSons Thanks for the information
Good luck with whatever you're working on, something fun I hope.
I just order a few cans. Question - how long should I wait to wet sand after applying the first 3 coats?
I have found that most times just 3 coats is enough. I think 24 hours is fine, but if you're not in a rush then leaving itv48 hours is a good idea. However if your wanting to put more coats on from the same can then I would wet sand after 24 hours and then apply the next coats as you don't really want to be using the same can with more time than that after you initially trigger the button underneath.
Could you use this on an acrylic art project that's based on metal canvas? I think I bought the wrong stuff. Hah
I can't see why not. I always recommend testing products compatibility especially the first time but I use it on acrylic all the time and it's fine.
Can I use Minwax polyurethane fast-drying spray on my guitar?
I've never used it, but I don't see why not. Polyurethane is a common finish for guitars.
Im painting my bike fork and have a question. If some parts have an existing clear coat that I didn’t sand off will it be okay to spray this over it? Montana can gold spray was giving me a texture finish until I figured out why....I wasn’t shaking it long enough! So you can eliminate the texture by shaking the can for 5min
Yes, good shaking is key. I would always lightly sand anything that's there to ensure the new paint has something to key and grip against. Sounds like a cool project.
@@DevilAndSons the area that needed to be painted was painted and sanded down nice and smooth but surrounding area has existing clear coat. Is it safe when spraying the new painted area to spray over existing clear coat adjacent to it?
I still think spraying over anything without sanding it first runs the risk that it may peel, so if you are clear coating the newly painted area and it spills over to the old clear coat it could peel away from the old area in time. It may not. It's hard to picture but sounds like it's too much to sand all the adjacent area light and clear coat it all again. Also you may need a good clear coat on a bike as it may chip easily otherwise. I like spraymax 2k (I have a video on that too).
@@DevilAndSons thank you. I will try to find more info about spraying over clear. I think it’ll look funny if I tape it off and clear coat the decal section I painted. I would think the two clear coats may look different. I dont know. But I bought the 2k
@@popaki9484 that may be a reason to spray it all perhaps. Good luck.
good vid, what respirator mask you using?
It's a 3m full mask, with an abek 1 filter. I also have particulate filters on it as I use it for wood work too, I can't remember if they p1r filters or not.
Also, thanks for watching.
So i'm at a stage where i put 3 coats of spraymax 2k on the guitar, there's some orange peel plus there are some vinyl stickers under there so i think i need to do another 3 coats. So, up to what grip of sandpaper do i go before doing the second session of 2k?
I always start carefully at this stage. I would use 800, you want to be careful not to go through the spraymax and sand any of the paint or stickers underneath. You won't have to work with anything finer before putting the next coat on. If you are getting orange peel you could try either a slightly further distance between your can and the body or moving slightly quicker - one cause of orange peel could be the thickness and these two elements will help. After another round of 3 coats if you still have orange peel or lumps from the vinyl start with the 800 and get finer, if it's looking flat and like it doesn't need more coats you can keep getting finer with the paper until you are ready to buff. I normally go 800, 1000, 1500 then buff. Sometimes I miss out the 800, and recently I have been adding 2000. Good luck.
@@DevilAndSons if i use the 800 to prep the second session of clear coat, won't that scratch the surface and make the clear coat look all white and non transparent? And if spray over that won't i seal those imperfections under the second session of clear coat?
Thanx
It will definitely scratch and make it look white, but the next coat will hide all imperfections. If you are worried try 1000 grit. Basically though if you wipe the surface with something wet it will give the exact appearance that you will get with the next coat so you can see the cloudy white dissappear. Perhaps I should make a video on this topic? It's a very valid question to ask if you haven't done it before.
@@DevilAndSons thanx for the clarification. Will have a video on my channel in a few days of me failing spectacularly!
Ha. I am sure there will be a video of you successfully creating something amazing.
Have you've ever had blushing problem (white/clear haze trapped moisture)? If so, how do you fix it
I have in the past when using nitro (you can apply some heat to help with that) and the odd can of poly (I had to sand back) but i haven't with this. But that doesn't mean to say you might not get it, you just need to be careful with application and make sure it's not too cold when you spray both in the room and the can itself. I always make sure the room is heated first in the winter and the cans are at room temperature. I don't leave the heating on though whilst I spray.
@@DevilAndSons Cool! Thanks!
Have you got a project planned?
@@DevilAndSons yeah a Strat guitar body. I have some areas in the body that the colour coat is hazy. I'll try some no blush retarder from MOHAWK I'll see if it's working
That's a good idea. If the retarder is made for the sort of paint you have used it should work, I think it may depend on how long it has been left but not sure on the specifics. Good luck.
Can anyone tell me how long I need to wait to recoat using the 2k glamour clear coat.
I ran out of paint on the third coat and I have some areas that aren't covered well and the finish isn't so glamorous on those areas.
I have another can ordered that should be here in a week.
Hi. I don't know what the glamour paint is, but if it's like a metallic it's normally best not to sand the final coat. You could lightly sand what you have, apply the next layers and then the first clear coat layer - that you can sand. I would imagine it's a 48 hour dry, most 2Ks are 24 to 48 and should say on the can.
@@DevilAndSons Thanks for the reply. It is the Spraymax 2k Galmour clear. No metallic just a fancy name for clear coat i guess.
@@jimhmod I just did a really quick internet search, and I think the glamour is the same as the gloss, it's just the name used in the US. I may be wrong. In which case it's exactly the same as what I was using.
Once you activate the 2 parts of the clear coat, what is the lifetime of the can i.e. total work time?
I think the can says 24 hours, although I have used them for 3 days in a row before - which I think was lucky due to temperatures. I would recommended spray one day, then 24 hours later, then not risk it.
48 hrs
Thanks for confirming 👍
Hei! Thanks for your video. I am wondering how much time it takes for 2k lacquer to fully solidify? I am on day 3, the surface seemed fine but after buffing the surface seem to accumulate even slight touches by fingers…That sucks really, as it will need an extra polishing & buffing
That doesn't sound right at all. I normally find it's fine within 24 hours and have never had it accumulate marks like that. Possibly it's on too thick but it sounds more like the two parts haven't mixed properly.
I keep seeing people use this 2k clear coat but the safety aspect seems to be underplayed with a variety of advice - there are professionals who say you should never use this product unless wearing an air fed mask and have high quality air filtration where its being sprayed
Until that's explained better I will have to use nitro or acrylic with best 1k I can find
Safety is important. I believe nitro may be more toxic though. One of my suppliers no longer sells nitro to the public without them signing a waiver to say they are aware if the toxicity. Just a heads up there.
@@DevilAndSons apparently there's a 2K formula that has removed the isocyanates but doesn't seem to be available
That would be good 👍 I wonder when we'll be seeing it available to buy?
I'm sure it also depends on exposure. You should definitely use some kind of respirator at the very least with the 2k stuff and maintain good ventilation, but I don't think the risk is that high if you spray a guitar or two as a project once a year. But it obviously gets a lot more serious if you spray one every week or even more often. In that case, the air fed mask becomes a reasonable requirement.
And, as pointed out, nitro is not that great either (no paints are, really). There's a reason nitro is downright banned in several countries while 2k stuff is available just fine even in "hobbyist" rattle cans.
I think you are spot on.
Can you use 2k over laquer?
I wouldn't advise it as it may well react badly and cause problems right away, or look OK to start then problems will arise later. They won't bond well. Although actually you can put lacquer on top of the poly.
@@DevilAndSons so if I use rustoleum instead I should be ok?
I think that is also a poly and probably not the best thing to put over a lacquer. You may be able to seal the lacquer so it can be painted over. Are you just looking for a clear coat? Is there a reason you don't want to use a lacquer finish?
@@DevilAndSons no my question is if I use rustoleum can I shoot 2k max over it?
I'm certain rustoleum is a urethane so yes. It's a brand I haven't used.
Have you tried it on leather?
I haven't. Are you planning something amazing?
@@DevilAndSons yessir I want to paint a part of a shoe with chameleon paint and seal it in with a high gloss finish
Cool. Maybe you'll need a more flexible finish, like something used by cosplayers?
this will absolutely not work for leather. this is a very hard, rigid coating. it will crack and peel off almost instantly.
I think you are right.
No luxuries here in the African bush ---we use TOOTHPASTE /wire wool and pot scouring powder to pollish & buff imported paint with !
necessity is the mother ---- of invention __
Wow, that sounds so interesting. Where are you based and what are you doing? Building from scratch or repainting an existing guitar?
Wow, that sounds so interesting. Where are you based and what are you doing? Building from scratch or repainting an existing guitar?
How many coats/bodies can you normally get out of a single can? What is the pot life of the can once the red button is pressed and mixed? I've considered using this product before, but without having a dedicated spray booth, I will not risk it with the flammability and chemicals.
I would definitely recommend doing this in a spray booth or outdoors (although their is a risk of dust). I normally manage 2 bodies out of a can although I hear some people can get a bit more. I did spray a guitar and neck and some additional parts I had painted and use up a whole can earlier this week. If you have one guitar to spray only you may have left over which although is a waste is probably worth it for the quality you get from this.
Next question. Have you ever used it over bare wood? I wonder if some oilier woods would give adhesion problems with the 2K?
I haven't. I wouldn't imagine they would be a problem but I would always do a test first and personally would always use a sealer first too. I wonder if using this on bare wood would involve 3 coats, let it dry then sand flat followed by another three coats, mainly because of the wood grain needing filling. The 2k is pretty thick but probably not as good as a sealer or primer.
I have 6 cans coming tomorrow, and two wood bodies that have been sealed with solarez. I'll update on how much I used.
Brilliant, thanks for sharing your results when they happen. I have been getting one guitar per can, sometimes one guitar and a bit more. Although I just worked on a guitar that I had hand painted and needed up putting more than one can on to get it smooth - 3 layers at a time, let it dry 24 hours, sand , next 3 layers. It was roughly 6 layers per can.
let go, the pin is blocking the hole otherwise
Is that how it works? A pin that breaks a seal?
What on earth is ORANGE PEEL? Americans use this expression a lot ---must be in the paint ??
It's when the paint dries with dimples like the peel of an orange. Often caused by applying too much paint in one go..
help please , i just bought a brand new evh 5150 guitar - matte finish with a 5150 logo sticker on .
can i paint with this clear coat to preserve matt paint from wearing off over time ?
ive asked a luthier here in nz & he said no itd dampen the sound & won't do it .. should i try or avoid ?
thank you
Thanks for commenting. Firstly if you put a clear coat on it would have to be a matt finish which would essentially be the same as what you have, unless you meant you wanted to give it a clear finish. Secondly the problem with matt is over time, as you play and brush against the surface, is that you are essentially polishing the surface so it will get a bit shiny - that's unavoidable (unless you don't play it). If you love the matt and don't like any signs of use you may just have to refinish the surface every few years (depending on how much you play), and that doesn't necessarily mean a new top coat but could be just reapplying the matt finish with wire wool (I wouldn't try that if you don't know what you are doing). Also I totally disagree that adding another top coat will dampen the sound, it's just the same as what isotherm but very slightly thicker now.
My advice is to leave it, that effect the surface of any guitar that you play is unavoidable and I don't think you would notice the matt finish becoming too shiny for quite some time unless you either play a lot or polish your guitar regularly. When it needs a clean just use a barely damp cloth to wipe over it.
I hope that helps. Also, cool guitar purchase!
@@DevilAndSons thank you so much for such a detailed reply 👌 very helpful
My pleasure. Thanks for watching.
This finish, IMO, is garbage.
The can I bought was either defective or didn't release the hardener properly.
Refinished my headlights and the finish crazed & was still soft 24 hours later.
Waste of $30.
Hmm. That doesn't sound right at all. I wonder of ot was a defective can. I've never seen this craze or not harden. What is cold out when you did it, or damp? I'm not really sure what would cause that. Maybe some contamination on the headlight? That must have been so annoying for you, I guess you have to replace the headlamp or we're you able to remove what you had sprayed?
@@DevilAndSons I sanded it all out up to 2000 then polished. Turned out OK.
I usually spray lacquer on my guitars, not a poly fan but for headlights, UV resistant urethane is the way to go.
Yeah, I think it's probably aimed more at that market than guitars. I'm definitely using it more than nitro these days though.
Spray Max contains isocyanites, extremely toxic and enters through your skin, respirstor and gloves don't do the trick here. Everyone likes a cool looking guitar, but don't risk your health over it. Be safe and use regular clear coat or leave it up to the pros!
I didn't realise the skin thing... thanks for sharing.
Just wear long sleeves, pants, & a respirator
And how about ur eyes? That shit is really toxic.
your not suppose to wear a mask, thats where the fun comes in. jkjkjkjkjkjkjkjkjkjkjkjkjk, kids dont listen to me
🤘🎸🤪
This is nasty shit breathing in 2k once can cause issues for life
I do worry about my future health doing this job, by try to wear the correct ppe wherever needed and use an extractor.
@@DevilAndSons btw, I been a little behind, Insomnium released a new single in March called "the conjurer" definitely a good one
Thanks for the heads up. I'm finding that I'm mainly have the radio on these days instead of picking music, must change that.