Sikhi and Abortion followed by a discussion on Rape
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 7 ก.ย. 2024
- Bhai Jagraj Singh did a talk on the sensitive subject of Abortion. This is not often discussed within the Panth so many are left unaware of what Sikhi says. Many women are left distraught after having gone through such emotional and physical pain. However, find out more in this video about what we understand from Sikhi about Abortion. Note: there was also a follow on discussion about Rape. Must watch till the end!
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Man, really miss Bhai Sahib.
I think one of my first memory's would have been inside the womb, I could swear it was like a light bright coloured orange glow, with small veins running across, that must have been my first memory, then the next memory was as a baby in my mothers arms, in the hospital waiting room, watching tv, then after that I don't remember anything until the age of 3 Years old, after the age of 3, my memory started to work for the first time properly and carried on from there.
Superbly said :)
There is no one answer to this problem, We must deal with it on a Case by Case Bases
Except rape their is no excuse to kill baby in womb.
@Nathan Nitai Das It didn't happened coz of her Stupidity so that would be or should be Mother's decision. And to assume if the child(he/she) is given a chance at Life but the Mother didn't or couldn't able to Love them, that would be cruel.
@Nathan Nitai DasFor child's own benefit. Don't get me wrong I do believe it's a Life(even fetus). But In the case of ra¶e I see suffering for both, remember for Mother, that Child would be the constant reminder of that incident. Only way the Child could have better chance at normal Life if the Mother give him/her for adoption but WE have no right to force that decision on Her. That's just my take on it.
And tbh I wouldn't want to be the that child.
@Nathan Nitai Das And it's a different story in place like America, the stats says only 1% cause of abortion is ra¶e 75% is just Wmn care about their bodies and career more than child. And even want Govt. to pay for abortion. 🤦
So our opinion doesn't matter anyway.
@Nathan Nitai Das the foetus isn’t going to mind being aborted. It’s not even going to notice.
Bhai Jagraj Singh Ji, what is the most gurmat thing to do if the most compassionate decision would be an abortion (for example, child will suffer a considerable amount if it were to be born). The decisions we make also come with a karm value.
+Jazz B VJKK VJKF, in each case there is Karma on both sides. If the child will suffer after a natural birth, then its maybe that the soul in that childs body chose to have that suffering to atone or learn about suffering. Decisions should take all factors into account.
Very informative!
A lot of the time rape is not about satisfaction but about power.
+Sasha KSK I learned that partially from it's always sunny in philadelphia
Either that or it's a risky mating strategy.
Whats this guys name? Id love to see more vids from him?
Bhai Jagraj Singh Ji founder of Basics of Sikhi he has passed though he was a great Parcharik
what if its the case whereby the unborn child, after medical examination through ultrasound by doctors, is diagnosed with dysfunctional kidneys, downs syndrome and liver problems or something serious of that sort? In such a situation, would it be acceptable to abort the baby solely on the grounds that you (as the parent) would not want your child to suffer with such conditions throughout its life? I have seen many children born with conditions that i have mentioned above and they suffer throughout their lives. Please answer my question because i have been pondering over this for many weeks!
The fact they were born with what you said is part of Wahegurus Hukam or will, so we must not interfere in God's will. It's all based on the Karma Principle.
@@invadergryder but then, why do we seek medical treatments for our illnesses if those are also in acc to hukam?
@@rozqr4320 you should check out a Singh called Naanak naam - what is hukam? Hukam is inevitable but we also have situations where we are able to make an impact. For example, a grown adult sees 2 children fighting. That’s hukam, but the grown adult can intervene and break the fight. (Choice/ free will.) on the flip side, say there’s a child watching 2 adults fight, then that’s hukam too that they can’t intervene. With abortion, yes we have the choice to terminate life but we shouldn’t because that’s a lot deeper (as jagraj veer ji explains in this video) that life has its own karma and lekha to fulfill, coming in the way of that will never be good for us. Back to what you said about medical interventions, we live in a society that’s technologically rich. This is also hukam. And we can choose to fight illnesses with medicine etc which is us playing our part in hukam.
No excuse because of physical ailment to child. That is maharaj's khed for reasons we don't know.
@Nathan Nitai Das bilkul sahi veerji
you're missing an E in the title, rape to rap, thought this chat was about music
+mans cha Same Here...
Sorry but Christians believe every child is born with original sin, the opposite of pure. That is why they baptise them, in order to cleanse them from that original sin.
No, Jesus Christ died so that wouldnt happen
is there any more guidance on miscarriage?
if it s a natural ocurrance, then it is hukam...
Jugraj Singh, with humility i would say that, yes everything is a hukam.. if rape is hukam.. so is the decision of the victim to abort.. we dont know the karma of the soul who chose a raped womb.. if the victim chooses to abort.. so be it.. it is hukam.. life and death are same for a sikh.. it has to be the choice of a woman.. we cant legislate these kind of things.. or say what is right or wrong.. the will of victim decides hukam.. again mine is an opinion as is yours.. but this logic of hukam has made women suffer a lot in abramic set of religions and indian religions.. to put things in perspective, I have heard people use hukam analogy to explain the inferior treatment of women .. they say that women have periods so they should not do kirtan in darbar sahib amritsar..
I am sorry but the topic of rape is revolting to me.. we can have sympathy with the victim but we cant feel their pain.. for us to teach a rape victim to accept that child.. looking at whome the victim would be constantly reminded of that monster who violated her is beyond my comprehension..
I am not into a debate felt that i should try to put in words my inner voice.
WJKKWJKF
I totally second that!
Yes she should get rid of the fetus
So should the child be murdered in their own mother's womb because another committed the crime of rape? The child deserves no sympathy? The child should have their head squeezed with forceps until a white liquid oozes out because of another persons actions? Disgusting lack of consideration shown here.
@@lamaramariewilson6746 It's against gurmat n is unacceptable in Sikhi. Abortions is banned in Sikhi and why because majority of them are out of convenience and because parents decided to sleep around. I guarantee u if ppl had real self control then at least 80% of abortions will drop. And rape I also think abortions shouldn't be allowed because the baby also has no say in it
@@premsingh-yi4dg so let me ask you this, if you came home and there were a group of homeless people that got into your house during a blizzard and they had starving children what would you do? If you call the police and have them removed it is your right is it not?🤔What if they were to die if they were to be put out in the blizzard 🥶 🤔 huh. You would send them on their way, well the same thing with a fetus. I’m am well versed in the fact of reincarnation and I know for a fact that the soul (our true selves) don’t always come into the developing fetus at conception so no one can try that with me... I rather see the baby “die” than be sent into a brothal! Yesss there are people who sell their kids. And FYI, a shit ton of abortions are because of illness or maybe the kid will come out f Ed up.
The man is dead and yet I disagree with him in many places. Now the question is how society sees it? Will the society allow the bastard child from the rape to live? Will he let himself live? That bastard child will be scorned in the society for the rest of his life. And the rape victim's life will also be ruined. Society will abuse that girl as an adulteress and the child from rape as a bastard for the rest of his life. And that kid won't even be able to go to school properly. These are all emotional words. The reality is not like that. Especially the conservative society is worse off. Although abortion is bad, it is not always bad. Sometimes abortion can save a girl's life. Where will you go without abortion when the situation arises that the girl will die after giving birth? To say this, I remembered another thing, if a married girl is raped, then how will the husband of that married girl see the child that will come from that rape? And what will happen to the married girl's husband? But there is no money to run the family. This problem comes out when there is a war. Here you have to act according to the situation. There is no discussion in religion about what is punishment for this if you do this, so we should avoid it. Life should be managed wisely.
👌🏻👌🏻👌🏻👏🏻👏🏻🙇♀️🙇♀️
True
If nothing happens outside of hukam, and a mother decides to have an abortion, isn't that inside hukam as well?
Yes but then her bad karma is also part of Hukam... everything is in Hukam... but not everything is in the Guru's hukam. You should watch out vide on "what is Hukam?"
Basics of Sikhi there is karma and there are consequences.. what if that abortion was a balancing act of karma for the soul in womb??you cant decide what is good or bad.. a lot of souls lost physical bodies when fighting with Gurus or in hunting.. that doesnt mean that Gurus accumulated bad karma ..
Basics of Sikhi Guru's hukam is also the voice within.. that is what we listen to when we meditate.. let the victim decide.. let her listen to her inner voice.. Nowhere has guru told us to accept a child from rape.. no parcharak has the right to teach such acceptance in case of rape.. the gurbani used by you is your interpretation.. it is according to ur state of consciuosness.. dont use "Guru's hukam" logic.. it is flawed.. Guru's hukam would be on case to case basis depending on karma.. when we dont have that privilege.. inner conscience of the victim decides.. making the victim fear the wrath of disobeying guru's hukam is abuse of the words "Guru's hukam".
God takes care of us in the womb and outside of it.. in the body and outside of it.. Yes Human life is important but it fails to convince me that the mental pain of the victim is worth the human life coming out of a rape..
God bless us all with with samatt, love, bliss and the experience of oneness!
Love to all.
@@gurjotkundlas I think your point fails to see that no matter how painful and tragic rape is, it doesn’t take away from the fact that abortion is terminating a whole other being with their own karam. I can’t imagine Guru ji saying you can have an abortion because your a victim of rape. Again, this shows how little we understand hukam. Your coming from a viewpoint of emotions which is touching but hukam is outside of that. We have to learn to accept hukam regardless of whether it’s pleasing or displeasing. Sorry if I’ve offended anyone just my thoughts based on my journey with guru.
@@Cocoon2000 Bhen ji you are right. Puraatan Rehatname and our Itihaas shows that SIkhi has advocated for protection of innocent life. Till today Khalsa is not permitted to associate or share food (Roti Beti Ki Saanjh) with the Dhir Malie, Ram Raiye, Meene (those who have Guru other than 11 Guru Sahibaan) and also Kuri Maar- THose who kill their children before and after birth . And Sri Akaal Takht Sahib has given hukamnama against sex selective abortion (but a lot of people will say blah blah blah infringement on choice..) Khalsa is Timeless, it is society that has ROtted. THough i dont agree with them on some topics (such as Raag Mala) SInghs of AKJ on channel Gurmat Bibek have provided insightful videos both on why abortion is incorrect according to Gurmat and also how actually an abortion is carried out.
Bring a baby in the world when you are ready. It is always a choice.
No it isn't
Taking someones life shouldn't be a choice
@@aditi4280 it kinda is
A woman can control whether she gets pregnant (if she wasnt raped). If you dont want children, dont get pregnant.
@@aditi4280 If it's not a life then what is it, that baby has their own unique DNA , grows, and develops and one day will be a fully grown person.
I think that the mother should always be able to make the choice. It is wrong to force a woman through such a painful, and permanently body-altering process.
Of course, I don't think abortion is totally okay, but neither is forcing a person to birth a child.
Ah, yet another whiny female apologist. Forcing men to work shitty jobs to pay for children isn't a 'painful, permanent body altering process'? I've got back pain, bad eyes, little to no hearing, and bad knees from LABOR jobs that would kill my wife in a week, and the risk of myself dying while trying to provide for said children is way, WAY higher. Have some fuckin' respect, fool.
No one forced the mother to have sex. She made the decision and so she must meet the consequences.
This is the dumbest take ever.
I don't think it is okay to forcefully rip apart a child limb from limb with a vacuum.
@@guntassingh9432 Hanji Veerji you are right, and your view is in accordance with Gurbani, Puraatan Rehatname, and current Gurmat Rehat Maryada.