Hey guys, sorry my mic was in the shot throughout the video… 🤦♂️ Forgot to mention, be sure to leave a 1 Star Review for every dealership that sports greedy markups. Help people become aware of these tactics…
Are you aware of the car dealership contribution to local politicians election campaign. In return for their donation, they make state law that forbids car company from selling car directly to their customers. This is that state of political corruption at the highest. The interest of the general public, the people who voted them into office, are the same people who create laws to make you pay 25% more than if you buys directly from the car manufacturers.
@@Tendertroll1 Nah, Trump is not enough of a strongman. He promised to lock up Hillary in 2016 and never followed through. What kind of a dictator/tough guy is that? We need a guy like China's president Xi who'll redraw the map of North America to incorporate Mexico and Canada. Or maybe someone like Hungary's Viktor Orban who'll deconstruct these pesky democratic institutions we have.
Same here I have a Toyota Rav4 2009 95k and was trying to switch to a 3rd road seat. But damn their prices were outrageous 😢😢 Too overpriced, I think I'm looking at the Mitsubishi outlander 2022 or 23
We liked Hondas but ended up buying a Jetta from daughter in 22 and a CX-5 for my wife in 23 so he's right Toyota/Honda are losing people but it's their own fault for not figuring out a way to get chips. Somehow Mazda is able to do it. I've had several Mazda's all have been great and they drive better than Toyota/Honda
I think franchise dealers need to be a thing of the past. I think manufacturers need to sale directly to the public where we pay delivery fees only from distribution centers and have their own automotive shops while partnering with other automotive shops across the world. People are tired of getting taken advantage of from greedy businesses.
I agree, dealers need to concert to service/maintenance centers only. They have gotten to the point where their “sale service” is now a disservice to people.
Doesn’t work. If you look into industries where manufacturers can choose not to have dealers, their sales people and sales outlets end up behaving very similarly. The person in charge has the same desires to maximize profits and is hiring from the same population of workers. In fact, it can be worse. Going to another location may result in getting very similar treatment you got from the first place you didn’t like. Or, even worse, you might even be stuck with a given sales person based on your address! Besides all this, fixed pricing is an illusion because most sales involve a trade.
In 2021 I went shopping for a 2021 4Runner TRD Pro and at every dealership that had one available they marked it up $5-10k. I happened into a local AutoNation and asked the salesperson if they had any upcoming. He had 1 in black that was coming in and had not been allocated to anyone. The question of additional market was answered in “We don’t do that”. I put a refundable $500 deposit and 3 weeks later he called and said my vehicle had just arrived. I went down and drove it home at MSRP. I WILL NEVER PAY OVER MSRP PERIOD
This is 2023 and I just looked up a Grand Highlander Platinum on Auto Nation. Their "MSRP" is same as Toyota's actual MSRP plus the markups or about 4k higher than actual MSRP. Wish what you stated was still true but doesn't appear to be.
was looking for a 2020 sequoia trd pro army green,located in in Huntington Beach toyota,called them to ask them for the price,they sent a picture of the window sticker,missed the mark up and just saw the msrp of 65k,drove down to see it and they had it at 85k with the markup,ended up driving it home for 73k
Not defending the dealerships at all when I say markups would stop if everyone decided to stop paying. But, people do pay the markups. It's unfortunate.
Or just buy the car directly from Toyota online and have the car be shipped from the docks or train yards to a tow truck and have it deliver to the customers house and get rid of the dealership franchise all together
20 years ago a Toyota dealer tried to charge me for a warranty repair. When I complained to Toyota, their attitude was "and your problem is?". Now I hope they are beginning to see that they shouldn't let stealerships screw their customers.
I have been a loyal Toyota owner for years. My Sienna was recently t-boned and totally lost, I told the dealership how the Sienna saved my family from serious injury and wanted a replacement badly. They love the story but won’t sale without charging thousands mark up, I ended up buying a Mecedes. This is how Toyota dealership screw up the original loyal customer
Glad you are ok bro. Their mark up is insane. I was looking to traded my Rav4 2009 with 95k for a 3rd road seat, but their prices are outrageous and overwhelming MRSP. I prob going for a Mitsubishi outlander 22-23
Lol you showed them! Now you have a Mercedes that loses 30% in value when I drive it off the lot and costs thousands in repairs, instead of a reliable Toyota that holds its value.
@@mojozepeda Says the fanboy/Toyota salesman. Better to buy a car that depreciates faster than fork over cash to a greedy scumbag. But you don't even have to do that. There are good vehicles in every market segment that can be bought without being taken by thieves.
BMW and Mercedes do not charge these huge markups. Now that Acura and Lexus prices have become so jacked up due to supposed reliabiliy it makes sense to go to German brands for new cars.
You are talking nonsense. According to Reuters, Toyota sales are up 5.1% in first half of 2023 so they are not limiting supply. Dealerships are very probably making it look like supply is limited by having few cars on their lot so buyers think there is limited supply and pay the rip off mark ups
@@davidgirvan6007Have you tired to buy one? Just try and buy a Rav 4. They will likely have zero on the lot and a 6 month wait last. Pre-Covid, you could pick from a half dozen on the lot. They are prioritizing other countries where they make higher margins than the US and sending less cars here where the dealers get the big profits rather than the manufacturers because of they way we sell cars. The car edge went over this strategy in detail.
Toyota is not limiting supply of cars; the assembly line workers who put their cars together are getting killed trying to catch up to the demand and backlog. Most people don't understand that Toyota doesn't build extra vehicles -- they only build vehicles that are already sold.
As a Toyota loyalist (2020 4Runner, 2015 Highlander, 2010 FJ Cruiser) I agree completely with everything you said. Between the dealer mark ups and move to turbo/hybrid power trains, my loyalty is waning.....
I ordered a 2023 Tundra TRD Pro from Palmer's Toyota in Mobile, AL. The original price was $55,000, and when I got to the dealership to pick it up, they marked it up to $85,000. I am 54 years old and have always owned a Toyota. This incident coupled with the powered-down engine has me looking elsewhere for my next truck. Sorry Toyota, I have to cut my losses and move on.
mano, good for you in having a backbone. i sold cars and bought my last used car private sale inb 2018 - 07 camry. but even pre covid they were jerking me around. good think I sold cars in college. was a little awkward but walked out of two rip off dealershiops.
As a 20+ year loyal Toyota customer, I am so disappointed in what they are allowing their dealerships to do. The last new one I bought was in 2021 before the craziness. Bought used privately since. Time to start looking at other alternatives, but sadly I can see others eventually doing the same thing. The new car market is so messed up.
THIS IS TOYOTA's PLAN. They want to go consumer direct like Tesla (its much more profitable for the manufacturer) so they are purposefully limiting dealer inventory to force dealers out of business. Dealer's are fighting back with mark ups. Dealers either raise prices on limited inventory or go under. What would you do?
Now I am switching to VW, as they have cars in stock and their dealers are not marking up a single penny. I am fine to compromise on certain things… at least I don’t have to wait a year and spend 10 grand more
Almost bought a 2021 Tundra TRD Pro from an actual Toyota dealership about a month ago. Agreed to asking price. When it came time to seal the deal, I was getting hit w/a $3,995 fee. I asked him to break that down for me. $1k was for the spare key and floor mats, $2995 was for a "recon" fee, essentially a detail. I asked "does't the spare key/floor mats come with it? He said some people don't need those things, although either way it was non-negotiable. I laughed out loud and walked away. They called back the next day and I didn't answer. So slimy! Ended buying my Pro from a private party 2 days later for much cheaper, and yes I got the spare keys/floor mats for no additional cost!
07 camry. always buy private sale used. good for you. stood your ground. I see the toyota world fleeing to mazda and toyota and other makers for that matter.
Recently got a 2023 Tacoma TRD Pro. While I was shopping, one dealership wanted $10k over msrp - their attitude was take it or leave it. And while I can afford that markup, I walked away because I didn’t want to encourage that detestable behavior. (I think everyone should do the same.) I ended up finding another dealership that was willing to work with me. And yes, they still tacked on that paint protection, window tint, etc.
Disgusting is the perfect word for it--I have no sympathy for them. People spend years saving their hard-earned money for a car only to get screwed by these greedy dealerships when they want to buy.
I’ll never buy a another Toyota again in my life . I’ll be damn if some S.O.B is going to make me beg to be Screwed over and talked down too and then try too add $11,000 worth of bogus price increases and worthless add ons . They can kiss my Ass . Oh what a feeling !!!
As a consumer, I truly appreciate your efforts in this video. You nailed it, and I thank you for sharing your thoughts. Our wallets should vote NO to high dealer markups and learn how to do more with less!
Unfortunately, as long as customers keep paying these inflated prices, the dealers have no reason to stop. Until they have vehicles sitting on the lot not selling, this practice is not going to go away.
Certainly too many people walk in asking, what's the monthly payment? With no concept of a 48 mo loan vs a 72 mo loan. With interest rates as the are now, that person with a 72 mo loan ends up paying double the price!
I’ve been loyal to Toyota from 1990 until March of this year. I went to a Toyota dealership and they had no stock on new vehicles. The ones that came in, only a few over a couple of weeks, had market adjustment crap which jacked the prices up as much as 10k on Tacomas. I drove literally 2 miles down the road to the local Honda dealership and they had new vehicles on the ground. Vehicles had some add-ons like tint, mounding, clear bra, etc. but markups were not outrageous. Needless to say, I have my first ever Honda sitting in my driveway.
this post covid market is very weird. some dealerships have tons of cars: others have none. I think people have to expand their radius for buying. Personally, I will never buy a new car and will always stick with private sale. 07 camry bought in 2018 with 106k miles $4600 .dealt with dealerships then. tired of the games and being insulted. wanted 7 or 8k for same cars. next up 2015 to 2017 camry but that is far down the road. only have 144k miles. now.
LONGO TOYOTA here in Southern California does not charge more than MSRP. Got all my vehicles through them. As i hear, they're hated by other Toyota dealerships for doing so.
That salesperson saying "I got bills to pay," reminded me of a service manager (different manufacturer) who told me "we don't work for free here," when I asked him to itemize the bill for me because they just had one number on a piece of paper. Typical response from people who have something to hide.
@@douglasscovil3447 I didn't go back there. Especially since my AC was never fixed (I ended up fixing it by accident 7 years later when I found two wires not connected). Unfortunately, there weren't many Lotus dealers around to choose from.
Exactly. My friend went to Toyota dealer in GA and they ask him $5000 to list up his name and he was told to pay full amount when he gets a car. It is non-sense. In Japan, Toyota looks doing similar thing. These days, Toyota is crazy.
Thank you! Glad you brought up this issue. Most dealership do this here in Socal. Toyota needs to bring end to this! Whenever I hear markup/dealer add-on I just get up and leave. People, please stop paying markup! Great and helpful video.
Toyota Dealers are coming out with "Mandatory Fees" such as "Extended Warranties and Prepaid Maintenance Plans" My 2022 Tacoma was $41,000 plus $4,000 mark up. Then when it came to delivery date, they demanded $72,000 and mandatory financing, no cash buy. Pissed me off and we argued down to $67,000
Toyota already lost my brother as a customer this past March when he was looking to get a Corolla Cross. Every Toyota dealer in our area was charging $5000 Market Adjustment fee over MSRP so he ended up getting a Mazda CX-30 for $2000 under MSRP. If this keeps up when I'm ready to buy they'll loose me as a customer too. I currently have a Toyota and have had 2 others before so I'm a fan but they're driving loyal customers away.
@@joseperezpaz9986 If you are comfortable paying more than you should then more power to you but me not caving in serves two purposes: 1. I don't let anyone take advantage of me. 2. A message to Toyota and their dealers that I don't have to have a Toyota and I'm more than willing to go to their competition. Currently we have a Toyota, a Mazda, and a Honda and we love them all so I have no problems going with either one of them. I do think that Toyota are the best but Hondas and Mazdas are close enough behind for me to leave a Toyota dealer.
@@joseperezpaz9986 then you keep being a slave to them and pay the mark up fees. I'm not going to. BTW, my daily driver is a 2015 Mazda with over 160K trouble free miles so far. I had a Honda with 300K miles before I sold it. I also had a Toyota Pickup I sold with 300K miles. I kbow Toyota vehicles are good but not that good to be taken advantage of by the dealers. So you keep encouraging them to charge the mark ups while I sit back and see what happens.
As consumers, we should call out and promote dealerships that don’t use the markup scam as a business model. That would be free advertising for them and it would increase their sales volume. The plus side of it is that manufacturers financially reward (cash back incentive) dealerships with high sales volume. That would be a win-win approach😊
Just subbed to your channel. You've spoken exactly how I felt about their dirty dealerships as well as going from bigger NA to smaller turbo and hybrid displacements. I believe Toyota could threaten to not allocate vehicles to the dealers who are dishonest and rip off their customers but they choose not to do so. Love Toyotas still, but I'm beginning to shop around for other manufacturers. Great channel btw!
In 6-9 months from now, these dealers will be calling and begging all the customers they scared away with their tactics throughout this last couple year anomaly. I'm already starting to see vehicle inventories start building back up, even at the higher volume dealers in my area. My bet is absolutely by 2024 the market will implode. Lots of overleveraged people who overpaid on their vehicles during the last few years will walk away from their cars and cause an auto loan collapse with delinquencies.
I doubt they’ll be “calling & begging” customers. People will continue to bury themselves in debt as they’ve done the last 3 years just to keep up with the latest & greatest. People are mosty to blame for purchasing overpriced vehicles. 🤷🏽♂️
@@Memo76ers It's not just vehicles. It's everything right now. I've seen multiple bubbles in my days and how they burst. Most laugh and say it will never happen, then pow.
Toyota and other non-UAW car builders may actually come out on top as a massive UAW strike is looming. The 24' models for the Big 3 could be seriously delayed. This might put Toyota and others right back in the driver seat.
Yeah, my local Toyota dealer here in Beaverton, Oregon employs "The Cheyanne Package" method rather than ADM. I told them to take a hike. They've lost my business forever, and I buy a new car every 2 years.
I want to give a shout out to Allen Williams and Greentree Toyota in Danbury CT for being one of the last honest dealerships. I just purchase a 40th anniversary 4Runner today at MSRP. They do not mark up any vehicles, including on pre-orders for the new LC. Honestly the best car buying experience I’ve ever had.
Let's go SUPPORT the dealership in Danbury CT GREENTREE TOYOTA! YES finaly an honest dealership. I'd drive there in a heart beat to get MSRP. That's how true honesty works in my book! Transparency means everything to a customer or anyone as a matter of fact and will drive more business their way.😊
That’s good to hear, I live nearby and am currently shopping for a replacement for the Volvo my son totaled. My wife wants another Volvo, but if they play these markup games, I’ll stop by Greentree and see if they have something she is interested in.
@@mikeb1520 that’s funny, I traded my FJ two years ago for a Volvo wagon. Fast forward two years, love the Volvo and my wife took it for her daily and we decided to trade in her Honda for my 4Runner. Both of excellent vehicles.
@@thelearnedgoatthe old car was an S80 and my wife wants another Volvo sedan because of the safety record, my son walked away from a collision of someone pulling out in front of him with no time to react, so I am 99% sure the next one will be another Volvo, but she is more frugal than I am, and I’m a tightwad, so we’ll see how tied to the brand she is if they play the markup game. It’s always good to have a backup plan, and I have always heard good things about Greentree, so I appreciate hearing your experience.
Thank you for bringing this up. We need more feedbacks like this from customers and hopefully Toyota corporate get this message and fix something. This is disgusting.
I’m 36 years old and have bought probably 15 new cars in my life. Toyota is by far the worst dealership experience I’ve ever had. Deceptive advertising, hidden fees, high pressure sales tactics. Disgusting. I walked away from a 4 runner and I’ll never consider a Toyota again. I filed a complaint with my states consumer protection board and hope I get an update.
I’m sorry to hear that you had such a poor experience… but I totally understand. Toyota dealers have gotten terrible over the last 10-15 years unfortunately.
I have dealt with multiple Toyota dealers in my area buying 2 new Toyotas during the pandemic period. Easily 80% of Toyota dealers in my area use these crooked tactics.
I was a Toyota customer. This year I decided to upgrade my cars. I went to Toyota website and then call the dealers. Over the phone they were nice. At the dealer all of them gave me an over MSRP price between 2 to $5,000 plus expensive/unnecessary accessories, ej, paint protection, special air for the tires, localizer?! for another 2 to $3.000. Now my garage has a new Tesla Y and a Honda.
I literally flew from Texas to Michigan to buy my 4Runner because 1). They had the trim I wanted in stock and 2). They sold it at msrp. These greedy dealerships continue to charge these markups because people keep paying them.
Yep you’re exactly right… the joys of living in the “gotta have it first, gotta have it now” society. 😔 Happy to hear you got the 4Runner you wanted without paying into the greedy tactics! Congrats.
I remember paying $4 for a lousy tasting burger from Five Guys. Now they have the audacity to charge over $13 for their lousy burgers because people are willing to pay for them. Either everyone in this country has been lying on their tax returns or people lost touch with reality. People are freely throwing money away like the "bad day" can never happen to them.
I do a similar thing. I call it auctioning off to the LOWEST bidder. If I can spend 6 or 10 hrs contacting dealers and save myself $5 grand on a vehicle, that's time well spent ! You CAN afford to buy a $400 plane ticket, and drive the car back and still save plenty of money. I usually reserve a uhaul, drive my pickup and tow it back instead of flying.
I wanted to buy a new Highlander in 2021 and wanted to test drive one first at a couple of different dealerships. They all had that attitude and acted like I was wasting their time to ask for a test drive. After I got tired of their behavior I drove a little further down the street and bought a brand new Subaru Forester. I’m glad they did that, I love my Subaru and will probably get another one when it’s time for me to trade again.
Just experienced this same thing- also went with a Subaru. The Toyota salesperson just dodged our questions and when we asked about trim levels and options- he just scrolled through his screen real fast to show the trim levels and options and speaking so fast and referencing X, Y and Z. It was so off putting. I would have been an easy sell too. Went to Subaru- and it was an entirely different kind of sales approach, from beginning to end.
For anyone near Denton, Texas, Toyota of Denton hasn’t done markups or dealer adds for now or all of COVID. I’m not affiliated with them; they’re just my local dealer being good humans.
Their prices online also say “SRP” instead of “MSRP” So they’re not listing the Manufacturer’s suggested price. Thats just an acronym the dealer came up with on their own. This “SRP” is becoming a more common wording tactic from dealers to consumers who know no better.
I WAS a loyal Toyota customer. But when I tried to buy a new Prius(my 3rd), 6 different dealerships in the Houston area were all playing games with the “additional markups”. Bought my 1st Toyota (Tacoma) in 1999 & kept it 20 years. No more…I’m shopping other brands because I’m sick & tired of their games!
Thank you for calling them out. I wish this was a trend from the TH-cam and automotive review community. But many won’t do it because they want to be invited to the launch of *insert here*. Good job man! Keep it up.
Appreciate it brother… I wish that was the case too… personally, I’ve come to accept the fact that I’m too honest to get Toyota event invites… and I’m okay with that =]
You'll enjoy life more just being REAL . Just watched a Scotty Kilmer video on the new cx-90. Dude is supposed to be a mechanic, he's supposed to be giving you good advice, but he came off like Mazda SHILL . Didn't mention any of the stupid engineering choices they made on the drive train (ie. Timing belt on back of the engine) He talked about how comfortable the seats were. OMG, anyone can tell me that!! He's supposedly a mechanic and doesn't tell you what a nightmare any work will be??
The first thing I do when I sit down at a dealership is tell the salesman " I'm not here to waste your time or mine....I'm prepared to pay MSRP total, no extras, no add-ons, ....this also includes my registration renewal" If I get any answer other than "Ok, no problem" or something similar, I'm out the door. They will try to bring in a "closer" to start running a line of gibberish and spinning yarns about why there are these markups........It's just not worth it.
Glad I have a dealer with a sense of morals in my area, was able to get $3k under MSRP on my TRD off road premium 4runner. No way I would’ve spent a dime over MSRP, it’s absurd at this point to be charging those markups
I am trying to purchase a hew 2023 4runner trd off road premium. What was your negotiation process for a discounted $3k below MSRP? Thank you in advance.
Spot on. I cancelled Sequoia Pro after putting down my deposit last year. And they raised almost 15k "market adjustment". Nope. My 4th gen 4runner with 235k still rolling strong.
I have this personal rule that i only shop at dealerships that do not charge any markups. This means that even if the vehicle i want doesn’t have any markup, i would still avoid a dealership if i see they have markups on any of their other new vehicles for sale.
MSRP means Manufacturer SUGGESTED Retail Price. In these unusal times (supply chain and chip shortage problems), the Toyota Dealerships would go out of business if they sold 10 cars a month at MSRP. The Japanese Car Manufacturers allow dealerships to earn relatively small margins per vehicle, and the dealerships make most of their money on earning fees on future mainteance. If the Toyota Dealerships can only make a few hundred bucks per vehicle, on the few cars they are allocated each month, hey will go out of business. In Vancouver, BC Canada, the Toyota Dealerships' lots are almost totally empty. There are no cars on the lots. It is surprising that the Toyota Dealerships are still in business. They must be losing their shirts right now.
People are unfortunately, a bit silly when it comes to vehicles. I don't buy anything that doesn't have a rebate . If there's a truck or car or SUV that never has a rebate, then I just don't buy that vehicle. Period. I don't shop for a particular vehicle. I'm not lured by sexy angles..in the end its ALL just sheet metal. I decided I want an SUV with a minimum of 90 cubic ft cargo space and a normally aspirated V6, AWD and that was the category I shopped in for the best deal. Even in 2023, Thay gave me about 7 comparable affordable options. I bought a totally different brand than what I thought at the beginning of the process. I saved $5000 and it's working out well! When you decide you need a particular singular vehicle, You've just shot yourself in the foot, you've given up a lot of your bargaining power. If you need a truck, shop for a truck, not a Toyota Tacoma. You may be pleasantly surprised at the results.
Been wanting a Tacoma since I was a kid. Finally graduating college this semester and I was looking at getting one within the next 2-3 years but idk how I feel about these price markups and the new hybrid engines/4 cylinders. I also don’t know how I feel about the MSRP being so high for a small truck. Even the 4Runners are pretty expensive and don’t even get me started with the crazy high tundra prices. I really hope the car market crashes badly because these prices are ridiculous!! Great video man, thanks for the explanation!!
The problem is that if consumers keep spending the money this issue will never end . There is so much info on the web and it takes an hour of solid research with videos like this or car edge there is zero reason to not be informed.
I sold my 21 Tundra in anticipation of the 22, and as of now, I am finally getting deals. But I am hesitant now because I see so many people having issues with the truck. But I will NEVER pay a market adjustment! I would rather ride a bike to work! I was a faithful customer of a local dealership, but when I called and they wanted a MA, I was like go @ yourself. I will never buy a vehicle from them ever again. But even the dealers that are not adding MA's are adding add-ons that are just as deplorable and greedy. I also blame Toyota for not taking action... Payback will come with these interest rates.
2022 was first year of Tundra. They have already fixed a lot of things in the 2nd year 2023. I know because I have owned both have a 2023 trd pro. 3rd year will be even better. I would trust their twin turbo hybrid any day over Ford F150s turbo hybrid. I wish NA v8 would stay but our dumb government is dictating these changes.
For God's sake don't buy any car made in 2021 or 2022! Those are covid cars. Even Toyota and Honda had problems delivering a quality product across the lineups. Be sure and dig deep for user reviews if you ever consider one of those. But I'd recommend against it. Even my 2023 is missing a chipset, so it's lacking some backup radar , but at least the '23s seem to be more stable.. So far.
Every dealership I’ve been too acts like they are doing you a favor by selling you a car . They piss on you and tell you it’s raining , then attempt to sell you a 20 dollar umbrella for 500 bucks
During these high cost of vehicles, I managed to find a v8 2022 Ram Rebel (used with 1000 miles) with the package that included the option that included 4 auto high, 33 gallon tank, level 2 equipment that included heated seats, 12 inch screen, and the red interior with the surround sound system, the truck is not fancy but has the basic things i was looking for, the total cost out the door was $59K (yes this amount included taxes and fees). My heart was set on a new Tundra but it as out of stock everywhere I looked and it was too expensive due to the markups(this is the biggest turnoff) and the last thing was the 2nd row floor was not flat. With my Ram Rebel, I can put the seats up and sleep comfortably.
Honestly this new Tundra is worse than the last generation. You’re not missing out buy not buying it. If you really want a Tundra, then get the previous generation since it comes with a V8.
I agree that the new gen Tundra was a step backwards compared to the 21 and older model. Glad you got into a nice Rebel, congrats man! Happy to hear it’s meeting your needs well. 🙌 They are great trucks.
Here in the DFW all the dealerships except Subaru (which had even less inventory) were charging mandatory $5000-10000 in addition to msrp. When I asked the salesman if I refused to pay the markup, could we still purchase the vehicle. They all said no and they were willing to let me walk
I agree with you. Get rid of the dealerships especially those that are charging markups. Go to direct sales methodology and reduce the price a little to be invoice plus some percentage to take care of the new buying method of going direct and covering those additional employees and process to do the deals.
I had a client that ordered a stupid RAV4. When it came in late they charged them $10k more than the agreed price. They didn’t walk away, she said they charged almost $1k for floor mats and snuck in other costs. She said after everything was done the car was close to $55k out the door. They tried to get student pricing because the person financing it is going to collage. They said they have to have a job. They said she does have a job. The sales person said you have to make enough money. He wouldn’t say how much. They should of walked away.
We the people could take care of this stuff quickly but like everything else in life no one will band together to address these issues. I HATE buying a car. I decided on a 21' 4Runner in Feb 2021 and paid a little under sticker. Got this before the craziness started. I love the basic aspects of my 4Runner and plan to keep well into retirement. Thanks for the videos.
I hear you man… unfortunately we live in the “gotta have it first and gotta have it now” society… some folks are just far more likely to get suckered by dealers. Would love to see Toyota intervene and put a halt to these tactics. 🤞🏻 You definitely bought the right vehicle to retire with. Congrats! 🙌
Report them to the manufacturer. Convince anybody and everybody to call and report them to the manufacturer. Tell them that this dealership is damaging the reputation of the company and could cost Toyota customers and money. You would be surprised at what they will do to that dealership.
Problem is most other brands are literally half the car. Double the problems, half the longevity, twice the depreciation so simple math still makes them the best choice. Honda fans… it’s not 1990 anymore.
I am a former customer of Priority Toyota purchased a 2018 4Runner Limited. Thinking that I was a return customer that they would offer a fair deal on a new 4Runner. Boy was I wrong!!! They tried to add an additional $5,000 to the MSRP and then low ball my trade in. I walked out!! Then they called and said they had a TRD Pro come in that was close to what we were looking for. We stopped by to take a look and they had a $14,999 markup on it!!! We found a dealership that is selling us a 4Runner at MSRP! Waiting for it to arrive hopefully they are true to there word!
Agree with your take on this. I am a long time Toyota fan and I’ve bought many new Toyotas. I currently have a Tacoma Trd, pro and a LandCruiser but sadly these will be the last two new Toyotas I buy I don’t think the problem can be solely blamed on the dealerships as I think Toyota North America has made numerous poor decisions over the past few years.
Carmax the same, 2,3 over what the car is "worth" . If you follow car's you know what there depreciation is per year by manufacturer taking in consideration of miles and service records if you can get them. This is not rocket science when they are over charging .
The best part is I've argued with sales managers over this tactic the last several years and some of them actually have the audacity to say in order to stay in business they have to do this to compete with other dealerships 😂. It's absolutely mind-boggling and the only way it's going to stop is when Toyota tells them if you sell them over MSRP you're not going to get another allocation and then it will stop and only then. These dealerships are literally keeping sales numbers down for Toyota across the board they can easily be selling way more vehicles but these dealerships are killing the average consumers experience when they're shopping different brands.
I think the Toyota Dealerships are doing this with the full knowledge of Toyota Japan. The Toyota Dealerships have million of dollars of overhead and whatever few cars they get allocated from Toyota Japan (due to chip shortage and supply chain problems) is all they will get to sell, so they have little choice but to sell at huge markups just to survive.
@@williamlau2405 Absolute nonsense, I talked to a few dealerships that do not do markups or add-ons and they told me they make plenty of money per vehicle they sell and they have no need to mark anything up to make good money per vehicle . These dealerships have been in business for many many years. If the honest ones can survive so can all of them, its pure greed.
I bought a Lexus back on 06-03-23. When I got on the list I was told, in no uncertain terms, there would be no price negotiation. Pay the MSRP or "...the door is over there". When the car arrived they tried to stick me with a vague mark up, but in the end I only paid the MSRP and even got a $2500 discount because I ended up buying a very similar vehicle with a more expensive "luxury" package. The sales guy clearly didn't have to do that, but we'd hit it off and even he felt bad about the attempted mark up. I have no doubt that if I went back in to buy a new car today I would not be so lucky.
100% agree with every single word of yours. Even tho I recently purchased a new Lexus RX350h(without markup likely for marketing purposes), I’m still pissed at Toyota for letting these crooked dealerships take advantage of their loyal customers. If Toyota doesn’t fix this, never again will I purchase any Toyota products in future.
@@subaruamazon I feel like they have some sort of allocation power to clamp down. The dealership is technically a private company that sells Toyotas. So they can technically do whatever they want… but Toyota has some sort of power in the equation for sure.
The invoice price vs MSRP aren’t always clear to me. I’ve had dealers show me what they purport to be their invoice price, and I gotta say if that’s truly their invoice price they’re not making much money. I’ve heard the dealers make their money off services. But who knows. It’s entirely possible I was shown a fake invoice. As for the up charges for services etc. Lexus dealer wanted to charge me $1200 for the clear bra. I found out who their contractor is that puts on the bra and reached out to them directly. Got it done by them for $700. Lexus wanted to charge me $1,000 for five year tire hazard warranty. I went to discount tire and got a five year warranty for $250.
Haha $1000 for tire hazard 🤦♂️ Yeah I’m with you. My example numbers here are likely higher than reality but the point remains the same, they don’t need to sell above sticker to make ends meet as a dealership. I know it’s at least $3-5K per vehicle they make. Varies a little vehicle to vehicle too of course. I agree that their biggest cash cow is their service department. I’ve heard that a number of times too. 👍
Dealers can get all kinds of kickbacks on the back end. A high volume dealer can get back $500 per vehicle if they meet a quota that month. Often they get more than that on a particular model. So showing you the invoice tells you only part of the picture. That's why I always do my dealing over the phone. After I've been out to test drive, I call around and get an "out the door" price from at least 3 dealers before I even go there with intent to buy. It seems I often have more leverage with dealers further away. They know they've got to come up with something to get you to drive an hour away. Once you get a good price, you can always call your local dealer to match it. It's about 50/50 whether they will or not. Sometimes they think your bluffing about driving an hr or 2 away to save a couple grand or more. I'm not bluffing.😂😂
I hate to admit but I paid a 2k mark up for my octane pro out of Wyoming. But there was a big positive out of this. I could have gotten one at sticker but would have received 41k for my current TRD ORP. The Wyoming dealer gave me 45k and no doc fee as well as a free cargo tray. Honestly this felt like a really good deal so I jumped on it.
@@UntamedMotors Thank you, sir! Also, I appreciated the only add-on being floormats ($179) from the regional distributor. The keyword for those add-ons from the dealer is "etch". Use that word and the dealer will know that you know more than the average bear.
The only price that matters is the price out the door. They can charge you a $40k doc fee as long as the car is only $1. Make an OTD offer and let them figure out the arrangements. If they come back over your offer walk out.
Trying to find a Toyota GR Corolla at msrp is like finding the holy grail. I keep hoping Toyota will turn to a direct to customer sales model. But wouldn’t that be really complicated for them to do at this point? I attempted to reach out to Toyota US headquarters about my experiences with dealerships, and they didn’t seem to care at all.
Bro tell me about it, found a circuit edition in heavy metal and Jesus fuck. They wanted 66k😐like fuck no, a damn Corolla at 66,000? Might as well go get a Lexus or something nicer. Found a morizo edition too, wanted 90k💀
Curious to know what's your thoughts on sales at MSRP? As a long-time new car buyer, this was unheard of, you always worked with a dealer around invoice price, knowing that they were even "winning" at invoice price. Now they (Toyota in particular) won't budge from MSRP and many of us old timers consider that a "mark up".
Even in Sept 2023,chevy dealers are doing the same . The shortage should be waaay over by now. Covid has been over for a year everywhere except California and China. 😂😂
you have to roll with the times. Msrp is a good deal. take it if you can get it. eventually there will be a glut and you will be able to buy under msrp. we have to get over this covid supply like crap.
Dealerships especially in big cities are rich conglomerates and corporations. Other businesses are sued for price gouging. Why not dealerships? Dealership accessory markups ridiculous. Don't forget administrative and processing fees they add to the deal. Shop around. Ask alot of questions before sitting down to sign.
As a millennial, I'm super interested in the Tesla direct-to-consumer model. The fact that I can spec my car the exact way I want it, and have it delivered to a (lucky to me) local Tesla shop is amazing. I bought a 4Runner in early 2021 as my first new car and had a horrible dealership experience. I love my 4Runner, but it would be tough for me to consider a new Toyota now. Tesla has their own issues for sure, but I love the idea of never having to deal with a traditional car dealership again.
Vote with your feet. Take a drive to a city. Can't swing a dead cat without hitting a dealership. If they charge ADM or dumb upgrades, walk away. Post Edit: There are numerous states that have laws which specifically forbid auto makers from selling their vehicles directly to customers. Tesla has been fighting this for awhile. Some states outright banned Tesla sales. In my state, the state specifically allowed Tesla to operate only 3 stores statewide, they banned all other auto makers from direct sales to customers. Blame your local goverments.
Hi Great video. In response to your question: Been Toyota/Lexus family for decades, with 4 in the driveway now, but newest is 2007 and now post-covid BS we are looking to begin upgrading. Seeing what you describe with price markups, and sadly also with their offerings. I am NOT going to buy a 4 cylinder turbo lexus RX350. We do not buy a lexus to have a loud, high-revving whiney motor under the hood, and I highly doubt it will reach the 320K miles we currently have on our 07 model (which has no issues other than outdated tech). Have never bought a Honda/Acura, but at least their RDX/MDX still comes with a gasser V6. Sadly we are forced to consider this...
Yep. I want a TRD PRO Tacoma but we all know it’s going to be hard to get and the price will be marked up. I’ll just get something else that’s more available. Probably will go with an American brand even though there not as reliable.
My local Toyota and Honda dealerships have not only lost sales to me in the last few months, but they have also lost all future sales because of this BS markup tactic.
I have seen recently that a local Toyota dealership had additional markup 11000 markup above the MSRP on one of the new Corollas. Also, they have an up charge of 500.00 for the brake lights to flash. I totally agree that it would be nice to purchase directly from the manufacturer. Thanks for sharing. 👍
I went to my local Toyota dealership asking for the new Prius Prime. The sales said it is not in stock but when they get one, it will be $60k. What a rip off. This is at Toyota of Richardson.
You are absolutely correct! If a customer wants to buy a Toyota today they should be warned that Toyota dealers will rob you. I walked away. I can hear it in your voice, you like most of us loyal Toyota owners, we don’t appreciate getting crapped on. Shame on these dealers. I did find a nice Honda last month and wasn’t screwed by them. This could be an opportunity for Honda to step up and show Toyota how to treat consumers.
I have 4 Toyota's currently. A Sienna, a Tacoma, Two Camry's...One Camry is a Hybrid. Over the last three years, I have spent 4K between replacing the Hybrid battery and the ABS Module. No more hybrids for me.
We’ve bought four new Toyotas at our local dealership the past 30 years. After being jerked around last year with the ordering process and markups we bought another brand. We will never buy another Toyota.
I once was force to wait over 2 hrs for a simple oil change and saw customers come and leave before me at my Toyota dealership, I never went back and simply do my own oil change now.
Greedy dealerships, and hidden fees an trying to sale extended warranties cars are getting unaffordable. New twin turbo is not getting better gas milage, just a system that can cost a lot more when the turbo goes out.
I got lucky I guess, when buying my 2023 4Runner SR5 last week. Dealer knew one was coming in and that I wanted NO add-ons - I wanted to pick and install what I wanted aftermarket. They not only respected that but sold it to me at $2600 below MSRP. I was appreciative!
I would be happy if Toyota just did a direct to sales option where i could just buy it for 10% under MSRP and have a nice car arriving at my house within a week.
I worked for a Subaru dealer through COVID and the chip shortage. Subaru and a couple other manufacturers locked down on the markups pretty quickly. They would threaten allocations if we were doing that. Toyota, Kia, and Mercedes were by far the worst in my local market. The *cheyenne package* is nonsense. Doc fees however pay for the accounting and legal paperwork because managing a franchise dealer is expensive. The average gap between cost and MSRP is rarely over 2k. Banks are at fault for the rates, legally a dealer can’t markup a rate more than 2%. And for the most part they’re only marked up for 60-72 months. I’ve been out of it for a minute and have no problem spilling secrets 😉
Especially only Toyota dealerships , Toyota should get rid of dealerships and plan direct sale to customer like Tesla. They will make more profit and for service please authorize small shops as authorized service center - thats all car buyers are looking for.
U bring up EXCELLENT points young man. I'm a 70yr old senior. It's business/corporate GREED. How much profit IS PROFIT?🤔 Americans are gluttons, they will be lured into vehicles no matter what the consequences are (repossesions). WHY are there so many trucks/SUV's on lots. WHO can afford price/plus fuel? $1000 mo payments?? More than a damn mortgage. Dont get a truck because u WANT one. If u need for a business or home improvement, do u REALLY need a TRD? If u just want because if u make payments, u want to like your vehicle, then SAVE UP FOR BEFORE U BUY! Live within your means. I wanted a RAV4 hybrid or a Camry hybrid, but I'm retired. I settled for a Prius. I'm quite satisfied, got mine in 2019 (great time), AND ITS PAID FOR. I'd love a gen 5, but why pay extra/& make payments again? I AGREE w/turbo engines, but the public wants "power" EVEN IN PRII! Practicality folks, & MOST OF ALL, SUPPLY vs DEMAND. Hold off if u can! ✊🖖🇺🇸
Dealership games have always been a problem. The buyer has leverage but one has to make compromises. I got my 4R TRD Pro for below sticker price, but I showed up to buy it just as the next year model was arriving, at the end of the month, with pristine credit and not wanting a limited-run color. I also got lucky because I was in a market where markups exist but they are not as ghastly as they are in California, for example. Still, the dealership tried to sneak in a "new" 4Runner with 1,000 miles on it. I caught them in the act, and they magically produced one with only 10 miles on it. I declined any optional bling. So do your research and try to give yourself every advantage you can. I am not on their side, but to me it's obvious that dealerships are there to make money.
True. Dealers and their demos piss me off. I was shopping for a 2015 CX-9 AWD back in the day. The only one my regular dealer had was fully loaded and off-lot because the car manager was out using it as his own personal toy. When they told it had 1400 miles on it, I wasn't even interested . Kept shopping and found one 2 hrs away that had only the options I wanted, and only 3 miles on it. Plus got more off the sticker and a higher trade in value!
Thanks to our greedy Toyota dealer in Bloomington Indiana, I went to Tesla…wow! Thank you grifting dealer!! LOVE my Tesla! My wife bought a ‘23 Sienna from Indy and when we got home she gets out and says “sure wish Tesla made a van”. Bye Toyota!
I worked in sales for a Honda dealer for 12 years and we were only able to get MSRP for cars that were in high demand and then only until the supply caught up with the demand. Now with Honda the max profit from cost to MSRP was less than 4,000 and most were under 1,000. So I have to doubt the 7-10 thousand statement. Your sell more to get more was the way it was for years when the manufacturers were oversupplying but since the pandemic era shortages they figured out that less supply means less expensive incentives that are needed. Remember negotiating is part of the process and you can always walk away from a deal you don’t like.
Hey guys, sorry my mic was in the shot throughout the video… 🤦♂️
Forgot to mention, be sure to leave a 1 Star Review for every dealership that sports greedy markups. Help people become aware of these tactics…
Great you mentioned this. Hopefully with enough 1 star reviews they'll stop the greedy practice.
Keep making videos and show this nasty dealers, don't forget to mention people have to stop saying yes to everything
Let’s start a petition to corporate stating that we want to buy directly from Toyota manufacturing and not the dealership.
Your mic was totally fine! :)
Thanks for bringing this to our attention man.. it's sad the amount of power they have over us consumers and there's just nothing we can do about it
The dealerships have definitely gotten about as bad as our politicians.
Honestly.. capitalism has ruined everything.. even our grocery stores and utility companies are all doing this crap just because they can
Are you aware of the car dealership contribution to local politicians election campaign. In return for their donation, they make state law that forbids car company from selling car directly to their customers. This is that state of political corruption at the highest. The interest of the general public, the people who voted them into office, are the same people who create laws to make you pay 25% more than if you buys directly from the car manufacturers.
Unfortunately, there will always be a group of people that protect theif like politicians and dealership.
I hope trump get elected in 2024. We need a new president
@@Tendertroll1 Nah, Trump is not enough of a strongman. He promised to lock up Hillary in 2016 and never followed through. What kind of a dictator/tough guy is that? We need a guy like China's president Xi who'll redraw the map of North America to incorporate Mexico and Canada. Or maybe someone like Hungary's Viktor Orban who'll deconstruct these pesky democratic institutions we have.
Toyota lost my family because of the mark ups. It sucks because I really wanted our next vehicle to be a Toyota but the dealers are scumbags.
Same here I have a Toyota Rav4 2009 95k and was trying to switch to a 3rd road seat. But damn their prices were outrageous 😢😢
Too overpriced, I think I'm looking at the Mitsubishi outlander 2022 or 23
We liked Hondas but ended up buying a Jetta from daughter in 22 and a CX-5 for my wife in 23 so he's right Toyota/Honda are losing people but it's their own fault for not figuring out a way to get chips. Somehow Mazda is able to do it. I've had several Mazda's all have been great and they drive better than Toyota/Honda
hope ur leasing that Outlander.
Same for us. Prius Prime, $10K over MSRP and the deal wasn't interested in showing me a Corolla Hatchback. We bought a Mazda instead.
Just stay away from the over priced, over engineered cx-90
I think franchise dealers need to be a thing of the past. I think manufacturers need to sale directly to the public where we pay delivery fees only from distribution centers and have their own automotive shops while partnering with other automotive shops across the world. People are tired of getting taken advantage of from greedy businesses.
I agree, dealers need to concert to service/maintenance centers only. They have gotten to the point where their “sale service” is now a disservice to people.
Doesn’t work. If you look into industries where manufacturers can choose not to have dealers, their sales people and sales outlets end up behaving very similarly. The person in charge has the same desires to maximize profits and is hiring from the same population of workers.
In fact, it can be worse. Going to another location may result in getting very similar treatment you got from the first place you didn’t like. Or, even worse, you might even be stuck with a given sales person based on your address!
Besides all this, fixed pricing is an illusion because most sales involve a trade.
Manufacturers don’t want to be retailers bro
I have been saying for the longest. They ripped so many ppl up. Which is crazy.
Can we buy directly from them.?
we would need a way to view/test drive all models tho
In 2021 I went shopping for a 2021 4Runner TRD Pro and at every dealership that had one available they marked it up $5-10k. I happened into a local AutoNation and asked the salesperson if they had any upcoming. He had 1 in black that was coming in and had not been allocated to anyone. The question of additional market was answered in “We don’t do that”. I put a refundable $500 deposit and 3 weeks later he called and said my vehicle had just arrived. I went down and drove it home at MSRP. I WILL NEVER PAY OVER MSRP PERIOD
Glad to hear that worked out well! Congrats. Markups are just pure nonsense…
This is 2023 and I just looked up a Grand Highlander Platinum on Auto Nation. Their "MSRP" is same as Toyota's actual MSRP plus the markups or about 4k higher than actual MSRP. Wish what you stated was still true but doesn't appear to be.
You should leave the name of the dealership there are so few honest ones left.
was looking for a 2020 sequoia trd pro army green,located in in Huntington Beach toyota,called them to ask them for the price,they sent a picture of the window sticker,missed the mark up and just saw the msrp of 65k,drove down to see it and they had it at 85k with the markup,ended up driving it home for 73k
@@nerister You paid $8K more than MSRP? Yikes!
This Predatory tactics of this dealers should stop. Toyota needs to step up ,set up a hotline for consumers to call to report evil markups
They don’t care if they did they’d produce enough vehicles to meet demand
Not defending the dealerships at all when I say markups would stop if everyone decided to stop paying. But, people do pay the markups. It's unfortunate.
Lynch Toyota! This is sad
Yeah I would love to see Toyota empowering customers to call out dealers for doing this… would make dealers think twice before doing it. 👍
Or just buy the car directly from Toyota online and have the car be shipped from the docks or train yards to a tow truck and have it deliver to the customers house and get rid of the dealership franchise all together
20 years ago a Toyota dealer tried to charge me for a warranty repair. When I complained to Toyota, their attitude was "and your problem is?". Now I hope they are beginning to see that they shouldn't let stealerships screw their customers.
I have been a loyal Toyota owner for years. My Sienna was recently t-boned and totally lost, I told the dealership how the Sienna saved my family from serious injury and wanted a replacement badly. They love the story but won’t sale without charging thousands mark up, I ended up buying a Mecedes. This is how Toyota dealership screw up the original loyal customer
Wow that is absolutely ridiculous… greed is a powerful thing. Glad to hear you and your family were okay. 🙏🏼
Glad you are ok bro. Their mark up is insane. I was looking to traded my Rav4 2009 with 95k for a 3rd road seat, but their prices are outrageous and overwhelming MRSP.
I prob going for a Mitsubishi outlander 22-23
Lol you showed them! Now you have a Mercedes that loses 30% in value when I drive it off the lot and costs thousands in repairs, instead of a reliable Toyota that holds its value.
@@mojozepeda Says the fanboy/Toyota salesman. Better to buy a car that depreciates faster than fork over cash to a greedy scumbag. But you don't even have to do that. There are good vehicles in every market segment that can be bought without being taken by thieves.
BMW and Mercedes do not charge these huge markups. Now that Acura and Lexus prices have become so jacked up due to supposed reliabiliy it makes sense to go to German brands for new cars.
What your missing is Toyota is purposely limiting supply. The tight supply allows the dealers to charge over MSRP. Thanks Toyota. Thanks alot.
I went to a couples of them and their lots were pretty much empty. N the one they had it was over the MRSP😢
Yes they have said they are limiting production, with the profits they are making and how small the market is for the prices its good business.
You are talking nonsense. According to Reuters, Toyota sales are up 5.1% in first half of 2023 so they are not limiting supply. Dealerships are very probably making it look like supply is limited by having few cars on their lot so buyers think there is limited supply and pay the rip off mark ups
@@davidgirvan6007Have you tired to buy one? Just try and buy a Rav 4. They will likely have zero on the lot and a 6 month wait last. Pre-Covid, you could pick from a half dozen on the lot. They are prioritizing other countries where they make higher margins than the US and sending less cars here where the dealers get the big profits rather than the manufacturers because of they way we sell cars. The car edge went over this strategy in detail.
Toyota is not limiting supply of cars; the assembly line workers who put their cars together are getting killed trying to catch up to the demand and backlog. Most people don't understand that Toyota doesn't build extra vehicles -- they only build vehicles that are already sold.
As a Toyota loyalist (2020 4Runner, 2015 Highlander, 2010 FJ Cruiser) I agree completely with everything you said. Between the dealer mark ups and move to turbo/hybrid power trains, my loyalty is waning.....
Thanks brother, I’m right there with you.
@rustyhumphrey9457 Loyalty will get you nowhere is this business.
The government literally forced Toyota out of their most reliable motors.
As it should be. Nobody should be an enabler to thieves.
IT'S NOT TOYOTA'S FAULT, BLAME THE GOVERNMENT.
I ordered a 2023 Tundra TRD Pro from Palmer's Toyota in Mobile, AL. The original price was $55,000, and when I got to the dealership to pick it up, they marked it up to $85,000. I am 54 years old and have always owned a Toyota. This incident coupled with the powered-down engine has me looking elsewhere for my next truck. Sorry Toyota, I have to cut my losses and move on.
mano, good for you in having a backbone. i sold cars and bought my last used car private sale inb 2018 - 07 camry. but even pre covid they were jerking me around. good think I sold cars in college. was a little awkward but walked out of two rip off dealershiops.
Try toyota at PCB , FL.
As a 20+ year loyal Toyota customer, I am so disappointed in what they are allowing their dealerships to do. The last new one I bought was in 2021 before the craziness. Bought used privately since. Time to start looking at other alternatives, but sadly I can see others eventually doing the same thing. The new car market is so messed up.
Yeah I would have hoped for Toyota to intervene with this stuff… and prevent it from continuing.
THIS IS TOYOTA's PLAN. They want to go consumer direct like Tesla (its much more profitable for the manufacturer) so they are purposefully limiting dealer inventory to force dealers out of business. Dealer's are fighting back with mark ups. Dealers either raise prices on limited inventory or go under. What would you do?
Well, I’m a die hard Toyota consumer and yesterday I went to the Honda dealer, bought a new Honda, discounted price and it’s a very nice car
Now I am switching to VW, as they have cars in stock and their dealers are not marking up a single penny. I am fine to compromise on certain things… at least I don’t have to wait a year and spend 10 grand more
I bought my last new Toyota in2017 and I hope I don’t have to buy a new one for another 10 years.
Almost bought a 2021 Tundra TRD Pro from an actual Toyota dealership about a month ago. Agreed to asking price. When it came time to seal the deal, I was getting hit w/a $3,995 fee. I asked him to break that down for me. $1k was for the spare key and floor mats, $2995 was for a "recon" fee, essentially a detail. I asked "does't the spare key/floor mats come with it? He said some people don't need those things, although either way it was non-negotiable. I laughed out loud and walked away. They called back the next day and I didn't answer. So slimy! Ended buying my Pro from a private party 2 days later for much cheaper, and yes I got the spare keys/floor mats for no additional cost!
07 camry. always buy private sale used. good for you. stood your ground. I see the toyota world fleeing to mazda and toyota and other makers for that matter.
mazda and subaru.
Recently got a 2023 Tacoma TRD Pro. While I was shopping, one dealership wanted $10k over msrp - their attitude was take it or leave it. And while I can afford that markup, I walked away because I didn’t want to encourage that detestable behavior. (I think everyone should do the same.) I ended up finding another dealership that was willing to work with me. And yes, they still tacked on that paint protection, window tint, etc.
And you were dumb enough to pay for it... Dealer 1 Sam 0
Thank you.
I just did the same I'm not give them 10k for nothing
@@jtalonrider4769 same here,we need to teach these greedy dealership a lesson.
Same here.
Disgusting is the perfect word for it--I have no sympathy for them. People spend years saving their hard-earned money for a car only to get screwed by these greedy dealerships when they want to buy.
I’ll never buy a another Toyota again in my life . I’ll be damn if some S.O.B is going to make me beg to be Screwed over and talked down too and then try too add $11,000 worth of bogus price increases and worthless add ons . They can kiss my Ass . Oh what a feeling !!!
@@donaldpiper9763 Completely agree. Hope they lose their asses in sales.
Great! More Toyotas for the rest of us.
@@donaldpiper9763 sold cars in college. 07 camry here. I d recommend buying private sale newer toyota or mazda.
As a consumer, I truly appreciate your efforts in this video. You nailed it, and I thank you for sharing your thoughts. Our wallets should vote NO to high dealer markups and learn how to do more with less!
I really that feedback man, thank you. I couldn’t agree more… we need more folks to boycott greedy dealers like this. 👍
Unfortunately, as long as customers keep paying these inflated prices, the dealers have no reason to stop. Until they have vehicles sitting on the lot not selling, this practice is not going to go away.
Yeah, that’s the unfortunate truth… =\
Certainly too many people walk in asking, what's the monthly payment?
With no concept of a 48 mo loan vs a 72 mo loan.
With interest rates as the are now, that person with a 72 mo loan ends up paying double the price!
I’ve been loyal to Toyota from 1990 until March of this year. I went to a Toyota dealership and they had no stock on new vehicles. The ones that came in, only a few over a couple of weeks, had market adjustment crap which jacked the prices up as much as 10k on Tacomas. I drove literally 2 miles down the road to the local Honda dealership and they had new vehicles on the ground. Vehicles had some add-ons like tint, mounding, clear bra, etc. but markups were not outrageous. Needless to say, I have my first ever Honda sitting in my driveway.
Good pick. I got a new 2023 Honda Civic Hatchback with no mark up at all. I got it for MSRP and some free add ons 🎉
this post covid market is very weird. some dealerships have tons of cars: others have none. I think people have to expand their radius for buying. Personally, I will never buy a new car and will always stick with private sale. 07 camry bought in 2018 with 106k miles $4600 .dealt with dealerships then. tired of the games and being insulted. wanted 7 or 8k for same cars. next up 2015 to 2017 camry but that is far down the road. only have 144k miles. now.
LONGO TOYOTA here in Southern California does not charge more than MSRP. Got all my vehicles through them. As i hear, they're hated by other Toyota dealerships for doing so.
Get rid of STEALERSHIPS!!!! We want direct buy from manufacturer!
That salesperson saying "I got bills to pay," reminded me of a service manager (different manufacturer) who told me "we don't work for free here," when I asked him to itemize the bill for me because they just had one number on a piece of paper. Typical response from people who have something to hide.
if the dealership won't even itemize the bill for you, you should get up and leave immediately...the customer always has the power to walk away.
@@douglasscovil3447 I didn't go back there. Especially since my AC was never fixed (I ended up fixing it by accident 7 years later when I found two wires not connected). Unfortunately, there weren't many Lotus dealers around to choose from.
Exactly. My friend went to Toyota dealer in GA and they ask him $5000 to list up his name and he was told to pay full amount when he gets a car.
It is non-sense.
In Japan, Toyota looks doing similar thing.
These days, Toyota is crazy.
Thank you! Glad you brought up this issue. Most dealership do this here in Socal. Toyota needs to bring end to this! Whenever I hear markup/dealer add-on I just get up and leave. People, please stop paying markup! Great and helpful video.
Most so cal dealerships are charging $7k to $10k on the new sienna.
Such is the sad state of abusive car dealership. Squeeze ever penny from your pocket and they are doing it while laughing at your face.
Exactly right !!!
Toyota Dealers are coming out with "Mandatory Fees" such as "Extended Warranties and Prepaid Maintenance Plans" My 2022 Tacoma was $41,000 plus $4,000 mark up. Then when it came to delivery date, they demanded $72,000 and mandatory financing, no cash buy. Pissed me off and we argued down to $67,000
Toyota already lost my brother as a customer this past March when he was looking to get a Corolla Cross. Every Toyota dealer in our area was charging $5000 Market Adjustment fee over MSRP so he ended up getting a Mazda CX-30 for $2000 under MSRP. If this keeps up when I'm ready to buy they'll loose me as a customer too. I currently have a Toyota and have had 2 others before so I'm a fan but they're driving loyal customers away.
But the cheaper car not the better car.
@@joseperezpaz9986 If you are comfortable paying more than you should then more power to you but me not caving in serves two purposes: 1. I don't let anyone take advantage of me. 2. A message to Toyota and their dealers that I don't have to have a Toyota and I'm more than willing to go to their competition. Currently we have a Toyota, a Mazda, and a Honda and we love them all so I have no problems going with either one of them. I do think that Toyota are the best but Hondas and Mazdas are close enough behind for me to leave a Toyota dealer.
@@tmwei396 Mazda are nowhere near Toyotas you’ll soon find out.
Congrats on the CX30! And nice job on not succumbing to the greedy Toyota dealer. 👍
@@joseperezpaz9986 then you keep being a slave to them and pay the mark up fees. I'm not going to. BTW, my daily driver is a 2015 Mazda with over 160K trouble free miles so far. I had a Honda with 300K miles before I sold it. I also had a Toyota Pickup I sold with 300K miles. I kbow Toyota vehicles are good but not that good to be taken advantage of by the dealers. So you keep encouraging them to charge the mark ups while I sit back and see what happens.
Any job that requires you to lie every
day is a one way trip to the lake of fire.
Haha ain’t that the truth… I’d have a hard time looking myself in the mirror if I were these people. =\
As consumers, we should call out and promote dealerships that don’t use the markup scam as a business model. That would be free advertising for them and it would increase their sales volume. The plus side of it is that manufacturers financially reward (cash back incentive) dealerships with high sales volume. That would be a win-win approach😊
Agreed! Good honest dealers still exist, they should be celebrated! 🙌
The only one I saw was in Oregon. 2k under MSRP!
@@chrismcalister4428 Do you recall who it was? That's a big drive for me, but I'd do it to work with a fair dealer.
@@marceinthemountains Toyota of Gladestone.
Thank you!@@chrismcalister4428
Just subbed to your channel. You've spoken exactly how I felt about their dirty dealerships as well as going from bigger NA to smaller turbo and hybrid displacements. I believe Toyota could threaten to not allocate vehicles to the dealers who are dishonest and rip off their customers but they choose not to do so. Love Toyotas still, but I'm beginning to shop around for other manufacturers. Great channel btw!
a herd of toyota buyers are moving to mazda and subaru. 07 camry here private sale. will buy used probably forever.
In 6-9 months from now, these dealers will be calling and begging all the customers they scared away with their tactics throughout this last couple year anomaly. I'm already starting to see vehicle inventories start building back up, even at the higher volume dealers in my area. My bet is absolutely by 2024 the market will implode. Lots of overleveraged people who overpaid on their vehicles during the last few years will walk away from their cars and cause an auto loan collapse with delinquencies.
I doubt they’ll be “calling & begging” customers. People will continue to bury themselves in debt as they’ve done the last 3 years just to keep up with the latest & greatest. People are mosty to blame for purchasing overpriced vehicles. 🤷🏽♂️
@@Memo76ers It's not just vehicles. It's everything right now. I've seen multiple bubbles in my days and how they burst. Most laugh and say it will never happen, then pow.
Lol. Doubt it.
Toyota and other non-UAW car builders may actually come out on top as a massive UAW strike is looming. The 24' models for the Big 3 could be seriously delayed. This might put Toyota and others right back in the driver seat.
@@Integratedcraig It will put Toyota and others' DEALERS right back in the driver seat.
Yeah, my local Toyota dealer here in Beaverton, Oregon employs "The Cheyanne Package" method rather than ADM. I told them to take a hike. They've lost my business forever, and I buy a new car every 2 years.
I want to give a shout out to Allen Williams and Greentree Toyota in Danbury CT for being one of the last honest dealerships. I just purchase a 40th anniversary 4Runner today at MSRP. They do not mark up any vehicles, including on pre-orders for the new LC. Honestly the best car buying experience I’ve ever had.
That is great to hear, thank you for sharing with the group here. Good, honest dealers still exist! 👍
Let's go SUPPORT the dealership in Danbury CT GREENTREE TOYOTA! YES finaly an honest dealership. I'd drive there in a heart beat to get MSRP. That's how true honesty works in my book! Transparency means everything to a customer or anyone as a matter of fact and will drive more business their way.😊
That’s good to hear, I live nearby and am currently shopping for a replacement for the Volvo my son totaled. My wife wants another Volvo, but if they play these markup games, I’ll stop by Greentree and see if they have something she is interested in.
@@mikeb1520 that’s funny, I traded my FJ two years ago for a Volvo wagon. Fast forward two years, love the Volvo and my wife took it for her daily and we decided to trade in her Honda for my 4Runner. Both of excellent vehicles.
@@thelearnedgoatthe old car was an S80 and my wife wants another Volvo sedan because of the safety record, my son walked away from a collision of someone pulling out in front of him with no time to react, so I am 99% sure the next one will be another Volvo, but she is more frugal than I am, and I’m a tightwad, so we’ll see how tied to the brand she is if they play the markup game. It’s always good to have a backup plan, and I have always heard good things about Greentree, so I appreciate hearing your experience.
Thank you for bringing this up. We need more feedbacks like this from customers and hopefully Toyota corporate get this message and fix something. This is disgusting.
I’m 36 years old and have bought probably 15 new cars in my life. Toyota is by far the worst dealership experience I’ve ever had. Deceptive advertising, hidden fees, high pressure sales tactics. Disgusting. I walked away from a 4 runner and I’ll never consider a Toyota again. I filed a complaint with my states consumer protection board and hope I get an update.
I’m sorry to hear that you had such a poor experience… but I totally understand. Toyota dealers have gotten terrible over the last 10-15 years unfortunately.
I have dealt with multiple Toyota dealers in my area buying 2 new Toyotas during the pandemic period. Easily 80% of Toyota dealers in my area use these crooked tactics.
It’s such a shame Toyota allows it to continue… takes the joy out of the car buying experience. 😔
You are full of sh*t, if not give me the dealer name you brought from?
I was a Toyota customer. This year I decided to upgrade my cars. I went to Toyota website and then call the dealers. Over the phone they were nice. At the dealer all of them gave me an over MSRP price between 2 to $5,000 plus expensive/unnecessary accessories, ej, paint protection, special air for the tires, localizer?! for another 2 to $3.000. Now my garage has a new Tesla Y and a Honda.
I literally flew from Texas to Michigan to buy my 4Runner because 1). They had the trim I wanted in stock and 2). They sold it at msrp.
These greedy dealerships continue to charge these markups because people keep paying them.
Yep you’re exactly right… the joys of living in the “gotta have it first, gotta have it now” society. 😔 Happy to hear you got the 4Runner you wanted without paying into the greedy tactics! Congrats.
I remember paying $4 for a lousy tasting burger from Five Guys. Now they have the audacity to charge over $13 for their lousy burgers because people are willing to pay for them. Either everyone in this country has been lying on their tax returns or people lost touch with reality. People are freely throwing money away like the "bad day" can never happen to them.
Did you drive it back?
@@Thats_X_ yes I did.
I do a similar thing.
I call it auctioning off to the LOWEST bidder.
If I can spend 6 or 10 hrs contacting dealers and save myself $5 grand on a vehicle, that's time well spent !
You CAN afford to buy a $400 plane ticket, and drive the car back and still save plenty of money.
I usually reserve a uhaul, drive my pickup and tow it back instead of flying.
I wanted to buy a new Highlander in 2021 and wanted to test drive one first at a couple of different dealerships. They all had that attitude and acted like I was wasting their time to ask for a test drive. After I got tired of their behavior I drove a little further down the street and bought a brand new Subaru Forester. I’m glad they did that, I love my Subaru and will probably get another one when it’s time for me to trade again.
Just experienced this same thing- also went with a Subaru. The Toyota salesperson just dodged our questions and when we asked about trim levels and options- he just scrolled through his screen real fast to show the trim levels and options and speaking so fast and referencing X, Y and Z. It was so off putting. I would have been an easy sell too. Went to Subaru- and it was an entirely different kind of sales approach, from beginning to end.
07 camry here. the Toyota world is moving to subaru and mazda.
For anyone near Denton, Texas, Toyota of Denton hasn’t done markups or dealer adds for now or all of COVID. I’m not affiliated with them; they’re just my local dealer being good humans.
I just checked their inventory, they most certainly do have a $5k markup on their TRD Pros.
Their prices online also say
“SRP” instead of “MSRP”
So they’re not listing the Manufacturer’s suggested price. Thats just an acronym the dealer came up with on their own. This “SRP” is becoming a more common wording tactic from dealers to consumers who know no better.
@@k_c1429 that’s disappointing. They haven’t actually had any on the lot in years. I wonder if they’d stick to the mArkup if you said no?
That is great to hear, I appreciate you sharing for the group to see. 🙌
My local Toyota dealership didn't mark up my special order tacoma, but did add features I didn't request. Aweful experience
That kinda stuff is so annoying… sorry to hear man. =\
I WAS a loyal Toyota customer. But when I tried to buy a new Prius(my 3rd), 6 different dealerships in the Houston area were all playing games with the “additional markups”. Bought my 1st Toyota (Tacoma) in 1999 & kept it 20 years. No more…I’m shopping other brands because I’m sick & tired of their games!
Every brand dealer is doing this except Subaru but no one wants a Subaru
Most dealerships, sales & finance personnel, mechanics, realtors, and lawyers are crooks and not needed at all.
Thank you for calling them out. I wish this was a trend from the TH-cam and automotive review community. But many won’t do it because they want to be invited to the launch of *insert here*. Good job man! Keep it up.
Appreciate it brother… I wish that was the case too… personally, I’ve come to accept the fact that I’m too honest to get Toyota event invites… and I’m okay with that =]
You'll enjoy life more just being REAL .
Just watched a Scotty
Kilmer video on the new cx-90.
Dude is supposed to be a mechanic, he's supposed to be giving you good advice, but he came off like Mazda SHILL .
Didn't mention any of the stupid engineering choices they made on the drive train (ie. Timing belt on back of the engine)
He talked about how comfortable the seats were.
OMG, anyone can tell me that!!
He's supposedly a mechanic and doesn't tell you what a nightmare any work will be??
The first thing I do when I sit down at a dealership is tell the salesman " I'm not here to waste your time or mine....I'm prepared to pay MSRP total, no extras, no add-ons, ....this also includes my registration renewal" If I get any answer other than "Ok, no problem" or something similar, I'm out the door. They will try to bring in a "closer" to start running a line of gibberish and spinning yarns about why there are these markups........It's just not worth it.
Glad I have a dealer with a sense of morals in my area, was able to get $3k under MSRP on my TRD off road premium 4runner. No way I would’ve spent a dime over MSRP, it’s absurd at this point to be charging those markups
That’s great to hear! Good honest dealers still exist. It’s a shame that the terrible ones often overshadow the good ones… =\
I am trying to purchase a hew 2023 4runner trd off road premium. What was your negotiation process for a discounted $3k below MSRP? Thank you in advance.
You are full of sh*t. If not what is the dealer name?
Spot on. I cancelled Sequoia Pro after putting down my deposit last year. And they raised almost 15k "market adjustment". Nope. My 4th gen 4runner with 235k still rolling strong.
I have this personal rule that i only shop at dealerships that do not charge any markups.
This means that even if the vehicle i want doesn’t have any markup, i would still avoid a dealership if i see they have markups on any of their other new vehicles for sale.
I think a lot more people should live by this rule too. I love it 🙌
Wow, even more brutal for morals. I like it.
MSRP means Manufacturer SUGGESTED Retail Price. In these unusal times (supply chain and chip shortage problems), the Toyota Dealerships would go out of business if they sold 10 cars a month at MSRP. The Japanese Car Manufacturers allow dealerships to earn relatively small margins per vehicle, and the dealerships make most of their money on earning fees on future mainteance. If the Toyota Dealerships can only make a few hundred bucks per vehicle, on the few cars they are allocated each month, hey will go out of business. In Vancouver, BC Canada, the Toyota Dealerships' lots are almost totally empty. There are no cars on the lots. It is surprising that the Toyota Dealerships are still in business. They must be losing their shirts right now.
People are unfortunately, a bit silly when it comes to vehicles.
I don't buy anything that doesn't have a rebate .
If there's a truck or car or SUV that never has a rebate, then I just don't buy that vehicle. Period.
I don't shop for a particular vehicle. I'm not lured by sexy angles..in the end its ALL just sheet metal.
I decided I want an SUV with a minimum of 90 cubic ft cargo space and a normally aspirated V6, AWD and that was the category I shopped in for the best deal.
Even in 2023,
Thay gave me about 7 comparable affordable options. I bought a totally different brand than what I thought at the beginning of the process. I saved $5000 and it's working out well! When you decide you need a particular singular vehicle,
You've just shot yourself in the foot, you've given up a lot of your bargaining power.
If you need a truck, shop for a truck, not a Toyota Tacoma. You may be pleasantly surprised at the results.
If people keep buying cars over MSRP dealerships will never stop unfortunately. People act like Toyota is the only car out there.
Been wanting a Tacoma since I was a kid. Finally graduating college this semester and I was looking at getting one within the next 2-3 years but idk how I feel about these price markups and the new hybrid engines/4 cylinders. I also don’t know how I feel about the MSRP being so high for a small truck. Even the 4Runners are pretty expensive and don’t even get me started with the crazy high tundra prices. I really hope the car market crashes badly because these prices are ridiculous!! Great video man, thanks for the explanation!!
Buy used let the suckers pay the high prices
@@JeremyHoutgoogleplus that’s exactly what I was thinking!!😂
The problem is that if consumers keep spending the money this issue will never end . There is so much info on the web and it takes an hour of solid research with videos like this or car edge there is zero reason to not be informed.
sadly people snap there rip off prices up.
I sold my 21 Tundra in anticipation of the 22, and as of now, I am finally getting deals. But I am hesitant now because I see so many people having issues with the truck. But I will NEVER pay a market adjustment! I would rather ride a bike to work! I was a faithful customer of a local dealership, but when I called and they wanted a MA, I was like go @ yourself.
I will never buy a vehicle from them ever again. But even the dealers that are not adding MA's are adding add-ons that are just as deplorable and greedy. I also blame Toyota for not taking action... Payback will come with these interest rates.
2022 was first year of Tundra. They have already fixed a lot of things in the 2nd year 2023. I know because I have owned both have a 2023 trd pro. 3rd year will be even better. I would trust their twin turbo hybrid any day over Ford F150s turbo hybrid.
I wish NA v8 would stay but our dumb government is dictating these changes.
Yeah having owned both, the 21 is the far superior truck imo. I too am shocked Toyota hasn’t clamped down on this nonsense… =\
For God's sake don't buy any car made in 2021 or 2022! Those are covid cars.
Even Toyota and Honda had problems delivering a quality product across the lineups.
Be sure and dig deep for user reviews if you ever consider one of those. But I'd recommend against it.
Even my 2023 is missing a chipset, so it's lacking some backup radar , but at least the '23s seem to be more stable..
So far.
@@ginakerry2588 You are very correct! I still feel it is an issue...
Every dealership I’ve been too acts like they are doing you a favor by selling you a car . They piss on you and tell you it’s raining , then attempt to sell you a 20 dollar umbrella for 500 bucks
During these high cost of vehicles, I managed to find a v8 2022 Ram Rebel (used with 1000 miles) with the package that included the option that included 4 auto high, 33 gallon tank, level 2 equipment that included heated seats, 12 inch screen, and the red interior with the surround sound system, the truck is not fancy but has the basic things i was looking for, the total cost out the door was $59K (yes this amount included taxes and fees). My heart was set on a new Tundra but it as out of stock everywhere I looked and it was too expensive due to the markups(this is the biggest turnoff) and the last thing was the 2nd row floor was not flat. With my Ram Rebel, I can put the seats up and sleep comfortably.
Honestly this new Tundra is worse than the last generation. You’re not missing out buy not buying it. If you really want a Tundra, then get the previous generation since it comes with a V8.
I agree that the new gen Tundra was a step backwards compared to the 21 and older model. Glad you got into a nice Rebel, congrats man! Happy to hear it’s meeting your needs well. 🙌 They are great trucks.
To be sure if you can save $5k or even $10 by switching brands, then you can afford even a couple of repair bills and still come out ahead.
Here in the DFW all the dealerships except Subaru (which had even less inventory) were charging mandatory $5000-10000 in addition to msrp. When I asked the salesman if I refused to pay the markup, could we still purchase the vehicle. They all said no and they were willing to let me walk
how bout okc? new orleans? expand your radius.
I agree with you. Get rid of the dealerships especially those that are charging markups. Go to direct sales methodology and reduce the price a little to be invoice plus some percentage to take care of the new buying method of going direct and covering those additional employees and process to do the deals.
As if the Manufacturer wouldn't simply charge a markup.
We just bought a Mazda BELOW invoice.
@@cs1992there’s a reason you bought a Mazda for under Invoice 😂😂
Yeah people shouldn’t have to stress out and call a hundred dealers just to feel like they got a fair deal. Time to put the customer first… 👌
@@UntamedMotors they don’t have to. Most Toyotas are selling under Msrp unless they are Hybrid or Pros. So maybe y’all can stop crying already.
It’s not just Toyota, jeep, Ford and most of the other popular auto makers are doing it too.
Thank you for pointing out Toyota stealerships , I totally agree.
I had a client that ordered a stupid RAV4. When it came in late they charged them $10k more than the agreed price. They didn’t walk away, she said they charged almost $1k for floor mats and snuck in other costs. She said after everything was done the car was close to $55k out the door. They tried to get student pricing because the person financing it is going to collage. They said they have to have a job. They said she does have a job. The sales person said you have to make enough money. He wouldn’t say how much. They should of walked away.
We the people could take care of this stuff quickly but like everything else in life no one will band together to address these issues. I HATE buying a car. I decided on a 21' 4Runner in Feb 2021 and paid a little under sticker. Got this before the craziness started. I love the basic aspects of my 4Runner and plan to keep well into retirement. Thanks for the videos.
I hear you man… unfortunately we live in the “gotta have it first and gotta have it now” society… some folks are just far more likely to get suckered by dealers. Would love to see Toyota intervene and put a halt to these tactics. 🤞🏻 You definitely bought the right vehicle to retire with. Congrats! 🙌
Name your dealership and I’ll be there! 😊
Report them to the manufacturer. Convince anybody and everybody to call and report them to the manufacturer. Tell them that this dealership is damaging the reputation of the company and could cost Toyota customers and money. You would be surprised at what they will do to that dealership.
I agree 100%
They are ruining the brand and make people want to try other brands for sure.
Problem is most other brands are literally half the car. Double the problems, half the longevity, twice the depreciation so simple math still makes them the best choice. Honda fans… it’s not 1990 anymore.
I am a former customer of Priority Toyota purchased a 2018 4Runner Limited. Thinking that I was a return customer that they would offer a fair deal on a new 4Runner. Boy was I wrong!!! They tried to add an additional $5,000 to the MSRP and then low ball my trade in. I walked out!! Then they called and said they had a TRD Pro come in that was close to what we were looking for. We stopped by to take a look and they had a $14,999 markup on it!!! We found a dealership that is selling us a 4Runner at MSRP! Waiting for it to arrive hopefully they are true to there word!
Agree with your take on this. I am a long time Toyota fan and I’ve bought many new Toyotas. I currently have a Tacoma Trd, pro and a LandCruiser but sadly these will be the last two new Toyotas I buy I don’t think the problem can be solely blamed on the dealerships as I think Toyota North America has made numerous poor decisions over the past few years.
Thank you for a frank talk. Almost all their used cars on the lot was 2-3K too much. Now I’m looking elsewhere.
Carmax the same, 2,3 over what the car is "worth" . If you follow car's you know what there depreciation is per year by manufacturer taking in consideration of miles and service records if you can get them. This is not rocket science when they are over charging .
The best part is I've argued with sales managers over this tactic the last several years and some of them actually have the audacity to say in order to stay in business they have to do this to compete with other dealerships 😂. It's absolutely mind-boggling and the only way it's going to stop is when Toyota tells them if you sell them over MSRP you're not going to get another allocation and then it will stop and only then. These dealerships are literally keeping sales numbers down for Toyota across the board they can easily be selling way more vehicles but these dealerships are killing the average consumers experience when they're shopping different brands.
I think the intelligent sales managers would think they could add to their customer base by not adding MA's!
@@shortythefrenchiethat's correct, and there are some out there however most are short sighted.
Yeah some dealers will go to great lengths to pull the “oh woe is me” card, it’s a shame. Hope Toyota begins to take action in this like you say… 🤞🏻
I think the Toyota Dealerships are doing this with the full knowledge of Toyota Japan. The Toyota Dealerships have million of dollars of overhead and whatever few cars they get allocated from Toyota Japan (due to chip shortage and supply chain problems) is all they will get to sell, so they have little choice but to sell at huge markups just to survive.
@@williamlau2405 Absolute nonsense, I talked to a few dealerships that do not do markups or add-ons and they told me they make plenty of money per vehicle they sell and they have no need to mark anything up to make good money per vehicle . These dealerships have been in business for many many years. If the honest ones can survive so can all of them, its pure greed.
Every time I contacted a dealership about buying a Tacoma they wanted MSRP. I told them I would pay 2k under MSRP. They all said no. I WALKED AWAY!
I bought a Lexus back on 06-03-23. When I got on the list I was told, in no uncertain terms, there would be no price negotiation. Pay the MSRP or "...the door is over there". When the car arrived they tried to stick me with a vague mark up, but in the end I only paid the MSRP and even got a $2500 discount because I ended up buying a very similar vehicle with a more expensive "luxury" package. The sales guy clearly didn't have to do that, but we'd hit it off and even he felt bad about the attempted mark up. I have no doubt that if I went back in to buy a new car today I would not be so lucky.
100% agree with every single word of yours. Even tho I recently purchased a new Lexus RX350h(without markup likely for marketing purposes), I’m still pissed at Toyota for letting these crooked dealerships take advantage of their loyal customers. If Toyota doesn’t fix this, never again will I purchase any Toyota products in future.
Thanks brother, and congrats on the RX350h… those are sweet! Great choice. I agree, I’m shocked Toyota hasn’t clamped down on this nonsense by now…
@@UntamedMotors can they or cant they? what is the truth? they are independent businesses.
@@subaruamazon I feel like they have some sort of allocation power to clamp down. The dealership is technically a private company that sells Toyotas. So they can technically do whatever they want… but Toyota has some sort of power in the equation for sure.
@@UntamedMotors so more allocation to the stand up dealerships no?
Get rid of car dealerships, they are not needed or wanted.
The invoice price vs MSRP aren’t always clear to me. I’ve had dealers show me what they purport to be their invoice price, and I gotta say if that’s truly their invoice price they’re not making much money. I’ve heard the dealers make their money off services. But who knows. It’s entirely possible I was shown a fake invoice.
As for the up charges for services etc. Lexus dealer wanted to charge me $1200 for the clear bra. I found out who their contractor is that puts on the bra and reached out to them directly. Got it done by them for $700.
Lexus wanted to charge me $1,000 for five year tire hazard warranty. I went to discount tire and got a five year warranty for $250.
Haha $1000 for tire hazard 🤦♂️
Yeah I’m with you. My example numbers here are likely higher than reality but the point remains the same, they don’t need to sell above sticker to make ends meet as a dealership. I know it’s at least $3-5K per vehicle they make. Varies a little vehicle to vehicle too of course. I agree that their biggest cash cow is their service department. I’ve heard that a number of times too. 👍
Invoice isn't cost. Manufacturer's give "dealer cash" to dealerships that hit certain volume benchmarks
Dealers can get all kinds of kickbacks on the back end.
A high volume dealer can get back $500 per vehicle if they meet a quota that month.
Often they get more than that on a particular model.
So showing you the invoice tells you only part of the picture.
That's why I always do my dealing over the phone.
After I've been out to test drive, I call around and get an "out the door" price from at least 3 dealers before I even go there with intent to buy.
It seems I often have more leverage with dealers further away. They know they've got to come up with something to get you to drive an hour away.
Once you get a good price, you can always call your local dealer to match it. It's about 50/50 whether they will or not.
Sometimes they think your bluffing about driving an hr or 2 away to save a couple grand or more.
I'm not bluffing.😂😂
@@ginakerry2588 this is helpful. I like approach of calling around before going in.
My local Toyota dealer went as high as $11,000 mark up on Tacomas last year.
Absolutely ridiculous smh 🤦♂️
I hate to admit but I paid a 2k mark up for my octane pro out of Wyoming. But there was a big positive out of this. I could have gotten one at sticker but would have received 41k for my current TRD ORP. The Wyoming dealer gave me 45k and no doc fee as well as a free cargo tray. Honestly this felt like a really good deal so I jumped on it.
Yeah the trade value plays a vital role. Sounds to me you got a great deal, all things considered. Congrats man!
@@UntamedMotors Thank you, sir! Also, I appreciated the only add-on being floormats ($179) from the regional distributor. The keyword for those add-ons from the dealer is "etch". Use that word and the dealer will know that you know more than the average bear.
The only price that matters is the price out the door. They can charge you a $40k doc fee as long as the car is only $1. Make an OTD offer and let them figure out the arrangements. If they come back over your offer walk out.
@@charlescurran1289 Indeed.
Local dealers are also inflating the price on replacement components.
Trying to find a Toyota GR Corolla at msrp is like finding the holy grail.
I keep hoping Toyota will turn to a direct to customer sales model. But wouldn’t that be really complicated for them to do at this point?
I attempted to reach out to Toyota US headquarters about my experiences with dealerships, and they didn’t seem to care at all.
Bro tell me about it, found a circuit edition in heavy metal and Jesus fuck. They wanted 66k😐like fuck no, a damn Corolla at 66,000? Might as well go get a Lexus or something nicer. Found a morizo edition too, wanted 90k💀
supply and demand. limited edition.@@moisesramirez5242
The problem is there’s always going to be idiots who just blindly pay the markups.
That’s the sad truth… =\
Curious to know what's your thoughts on sales at MSRP? As a long-time new car buyer, this was unheard of, you always worked with a dealer around invoice price, knowing that they were even "winning" at invoice price. Now they (Toyota in particular) won't budge from MSRP and many of us old timers consider that a "mark up".
Even in Sept 2023,chevy dealers are doing the same . The shortage should be waaay over by now. Covid has been over for a year everywhere except California and China. 😂😂
you have to roll with the times. Msrp is a good deal. take it if you can get it. eventually there will be a glut and you will be able to buy under msrp. we have to get over this covid supply like crap.
Dealerships especially in big cities are rich conglomerates and corporations. Other businesses are sued for price gouging. Why not dealerships? Dealership accessory markups ridiculous. Don't forget administrative and processing fees they add to the deal.
Shop around. Ask alot of questions before sitting down to sign.
As a millennial, I'm super interested in the Tesla direct-to-consumer model. The fact that I can spec my car the exact way I want it, and have it delivered to a (lucky to me) local Tesla shop is amazing. I bought a 4Runner in early 2021 as my first new car and had a horrible dealership experience. I love my 4Runner, but it would be tough for me to consider a new Toyota now. Tesla has their own issues for sure, but I love the idea of never having to deal with a traditional car dealership again.
I agree. Millennials and GenZ are not going to put up with this.
Yep, but unfortunately this sh*t of a model - the car dealership - is almost engrained in the constitution@@DrNoSpectre
Also Toyota is obviously losing the EV race. They’re stuck on old technology and even their shareholders are starting to revolt.
Agreed, it’s time to eliminate all dealerships. They already benefited enough from scamming people during hardship.
Vote with your feet. Take a drive to a city. Can't swing a dead cat without hitting a dealership. If they charge ADM or dumb upgrades, walk away. Post Edit: There are numerous states that have laws which specifically forbid auto makers from selling their vehicles directly to customers. Tesla has been fighting this for awhile. Some states outright banned Tesla sales. In my state, the state specifically allowed Tesla to operate only 3 stores statewide, they banned all other auto makers from direct sales to customers. Blame your local goverments.
Tried 6 different Toyota dealerships in the Houston area; they were all playing similar games. Being in a city is zero help.
Well said, I agree 100%
Need more folks to do this… unfortunately we live in a “gotta have it first, gotta have it now” society… =\
Hi Great video. In response to your question: Been Toyota/Lexus family for decades, with 4 in the driveway now, but newest is 2007 and now post-covid BS we are looking to begin upgrading. Seeing what you describe with price markups, and sadly also with their offerings. I am NOT going to buy a 4 cylinder turbo lexus RX350. We do not buy a lexus to have a loud, high-revving whiney motor under the hood, and I highly doubt it will reach the 320K miles we currently have on our 07 model (which has no issues other than outdated tech). Have never bought a Honda/Acura, but at least their RDX/MDX still comes with a gasser V6. Sadly we are forced to consider this...
Yep. I want a TRD PRO Tacoma but we all know it’s going to be hard to get and the price will be marked up. I’ll just get something else that’s more available. Probably will go with an American brand even though there not as reliable.
They will keep the vehicle until they can sell it under MSRP.
Just stay away from those Fords. They're the #1 selling truck, who would want that???
A Toyota is obviously substantially better. 😂😂
@@ginakerry2588 Yup! They are a headache, don't do it!
My local Toyota and Honda dealerships have not only lost sales to me in the last few months, but they have also lost all future sales because of this BS markup tactic.
I have seen recently that a local Toyota dealership had additional markup 11000 markup above the MSRP on one of the new Corollas. Also, they have an up charge of 500.00 for the brake lights to flash. I totally agree that it would be nice to purchase directly from the manufacturer. Thanks for sharing. 👍
I went to my local Toyota dealership asking for the new Prius Prime. The sales said it is not in stock but when they get one, it will be $60k. What a rip off. This is at Toyota of Richardson.
"Oh there's going to be a mark-up."
"There is, goodbye.
Dealerships need to be banned.
Ur not the only one posting these types of videos hope the customers raise awareness
You are absolutely correct! If a customer wants to buy a Toyota today they should be warned that Toyota dealers will rob you. I walked away. I can hear it in your voice, you like most of us loyal Toyota owners, we don’t appreciate getting crapped on. Shame on these dealers. I did find a nice Honda last month and wasn’t screwed by them. This could be an opportunity for Honda to step up and show Toyota how to treat consumers.
I have 4 Toyota's currently. A Sienna, a Tacoma, Two Camry's...One Camry is a Hybrid. Over the last three years, I have spent 4K between replacing the Hybrid battery and the ABS Module. No more hybrids for me.
We’ve bought four new Toyotas at our local dealership the past 30 years. After being jerked around last year with the ordering process and markups we bought another brand. We will never buy another Toyota.
I once was force to wait over 2 hrs for a simple oil change and saw customers come and leave before me at my Toyota dealership, I never went back and simply do my own oil change now.
Greedy dealerships, and hidden fees an trying to sale extended warranties cars are getting unaffordable. New twin turbo is not getting better gas milage, just a system that can cost a lot more when the turbo goes out.
I got lucky I guess, when buying my 2023 4Runner SR5 last week. Dealer knew one was coming in and that I wanted NO add-ons - I wanted to pick and install what I wanted aftermarket. They not only respected that but sold it to me at $2600 below MSRP. I was appreciative!
wow gail home run
I would be happy if Toyota just did a direct to sales option where i could just buy it for 10% under MSRP and have a nice car arriving at my house within a week.
Now, they discount over $4k on the tundra and no one is buying. They have a lot on their lot.
I worked for a Subaru dealer through COVID and the chip shortage. Subaru and a couple other manufacturers locked down on the markups pretty quickly. They would threaten allocations if we were doing that. Toyota, Kia, and Mercedes were by far the worst in my local market.
The *cheyenne package* is nonsense. Doc fees however pay for the accounting and legal paperwork because managing a franchise dealer is expensive. The average gap between cost and MSRP is rarely over 2k.
Banks are at fault for the rates, legally a dealer can’t markup a rate more than 2%. And for the most part they’re only marked up for 60-72 months.
I’ve been out of it for a minute and have no problem spilling secrets 😉
Especially only Toyota dealerships , Toyota should get rid of dealerships and plan direct sale to customer like Tesla. They will make more profit and for service please authorize small shops as authorized service center - thats all car buyers are looking for.
U bring up EXCELLENT points young man. I'm a 70yr old senior. It's business/corporate GREED. How much profit IS PROFIT?🤔 Americans are gluttons, they will be lured into vehicles no matter what the consequences are (repossesions). WHY are there so many trucks/SUV's on lots. WHO can afford price/plus fuel? $1000 mo payments?? More than a damn mortgage. Dont get a truck because u WANT one. If u need for a business or home improvement, do u REALLY need a TRD? If u just want because if u make payments, u want to like your vehicle, then SAVE UP FOR BEFORE U BUY! Live within your means. I wanted a RAV4 hybrid or a Camry hybrid, but I'm retired. I settled for a Prius. I'm quite satisfied, got mine in 2019 (great time), AND ITS PAID FOR. I'd love a gen 5, but why pay extra/& make payments again? I AGREE w/turbo engines, but the public wants "power" EVEN IN PRII! Practicality folks, & MOST OF ALL, SUPPLY vs DEMAND. Hold off if u can! ✊🖖🇺🇸
Dealership games have always been a problem. The buyer has leverage but one has to make compromises. I got my 4R TRD Pro for below sticker price, but I showed up to buy it just as the next year model was arriving, at the end of the month, with pristine credit and not wanting a limited-run color. I also got lucky because I was in a market where markups exist but they are not as ghastly as they are in California, for example.
Still, the dealership tried to sneak in a "new" 4Runner with 1,000 miles on it. I caught them in the act, and they magically produced one with only 10 miles on it. I declined any optional bling.
So do your research and try to give yourself every advantage you can. I am not on their side, but to me it's obvious that dealerships are there to make money.
True. Dealers and their demos piss me off.
I was shopping for a 2015 CX-9 AWD back in the day. The only one my regular dealer had was fully loaded and off-lot because the car manager was out using it as his own personal toy. When they told it had 1400 miles on it, I wasn't even interested .
Kept shopping and found one 2 hrs away that had only the options I wanted, and only 3 miles on it. Plus got more off the sticker and a higher trade in value!
Thanks to our greedy Toyota dealer in Bloomington Indiana, I went to Tesla…wow! Thank you grifting dealer!! LOVE my Tesla! My wife bought a ‘23 Sienna from Indy and when we got home she gets out and says “sure wish Tesla made a van”. Bye Toyota!
I worked in sales for a Honda dealer for 12 years and we were only able to get MSRP for cars that were in high demand and then only until the supply caught up with the demand. Now with Honda the max profit from cost to MSRP was less than 4,000 and most were under 1,000. So I have to doubt the 7-10 thousand statement. Your sell more to get more was the way it was for years when the manufacturers were oversupplying but since the pandemic era shortages they figured out that less supply means less expensive incentives that are needed. Remember negotiating is part of the process and you can always walk away from a deal you don’t like.