The CS job market is really tanking for new comers; three of my recent graduate friends have still not found a job since last year, yet, for some reason, 2 others that had experience found one within 2-3 months after graduating since they had experience. In short, it is still solid for folks with experience based on what I have seen from myself, friends and family. Going for a second degree may not be the best choice depending on your financial situation, especially here in the U.S. an advanced degree aka continuing to get a Masters in the same degree is shorter and looks better on a resume. HR usually asks about the highest level of education, not how many degrees. Take what I said with a grain of salt; it is only based on my bubble.
@@mephiles6432 If you don't know how to use your first degree you have no chance of benefiting from yet another. Getting a string of superficial qualifications is completely useless if you won't lean how to apply yourselves. Your first degree is plenty there to get you going in life. After that you might opt to go to graduate school in order to specialise - not get another Bachelor's instead. Absolutely terrible, confused people.
I feel like a lot of people that will be coming across this video (and Maria's videos in general) likely are A. struggling with finding work or B. currently in uni/college and feeling discouraged. The best advice I could give too you if you are in camp A or B seeking jobs, as someone who graduated this spring and working as a software engineer, I would really look at verticals that are oftentimes overlooked. Healthcare, construction, manufacturing, etc are all industries that would LOVE someone who has a lot of drive and little immediate know-how. Don't give up!
I'm literally doing it the opposite way. Dropped out of engineering and now doing maths and CS. I hate engineering at college, but I do like some of the jobs available so I'll just do a masters in it if needed. But I do really like your message. I was really naive too, going back with a fresh mindset and not forcing yourself through it is the best (if possible). Wish you the best with engineering.
Yep, I did not love CS in college mainly because my school focused on theory rather than actual programming. Programming became fun once I started doing it, but I love physics and engineering more so I made the switch.
unlike software development. there's no such thing as conversion masters to engineering, it's a heavy subject and you need to have bachelors first, before doing any advanced engineering masters
Hm, I can’t agree. I thought it was very fun. Just sometimes annoying since you’re obliged to do homework instead of working on your own. I really dislike such pressure but other than that it was fun learning new stuff
I've been a web developer for some 5 years until I got laid off in May. Seeing where the whole industry is heading not just in terms of employment but also the insanity that webdev has become I'm just done with it and I'm getting my master's in stats now at 36. We got this!
You are feeling depressed because you’re struggling to find a job that uses your degree, and getting another engineering degree might not actually be the answer. It seems like you are doing it as a way to escape the reality of the job market, even though you already know there’s no guarantee of a job at the end of that path either. I went through something similar. I graduated with a bachelor's degree in mechanical engineering, finished at the top of my class, and passed the FE exam. Yet, after a year of applications, I couldn’t find work as a mechanical engineer. My backup plan was to pursue software engineering, and thankfully, I found a job in that field. Looking back, I wouldn’t go back to mechanical or any other type of engineering. If you’d like my advice, I would be happy to help. I am sure there are better options for you than going back to college for another degree.
I'm glad you have a new plan, but I wish it worked for you with compsci. I also started studying in 2019, we may be the same age. My degree is 5.5 years, I got into my job during the covid IT boom, and I already have 3 years of experience. This is all in Moscow. You are a really talanted person, and I wish you all the best, hope the bull market comes soon (and the war ends) and the companies start hiring
I also did a second degree to retrain - although my degrees were 14 years apart. My number one tip: Be ABSOLUTELY, ABSOLUTELY sure and motivated that what you're going to do is MEANINGFUL to you. Don't do stuff just for the money; find something that personally fulfills you. And figure this out before you return to college/university.
This video came at such a perfect timing. I’m currently studying CS (second year) and I’m already considering going to another university to study either mech or elec engineering after finishing my CS degree. I don’t like college at all, but I’ve realized that I am genuinely interested in engineering enough to go to university for a second time to study it. Like you said, if you see that you are willing to suffer for something (and in my case, put money into it, because currently I have certain financial benefits that allow me to study basically debt free in my current college) then it’s a good indication that you like it/are interested in it (which applies to a lot more than just a college degrees). I’m still planning on completing my CS degree, just to prove to myself that I can finish something (CS is actually my second attempt at a degree, I’m actually a third year student but second year CS student). I like CS enough to study it, but I’m not much interested in working solely on software or data. Plus, having a degree in both CS and either mech or elec gives you a well-rounded knowledge on certain topics, specifically if you combine cs with elec engineering, or so I’ve read. So maybe completing CS will be a better choice for me. I hope your experience with engineering is much better than that with cs. And let’s see how things go. Anyhow, thank you for thus video and I look forward to further ones (I love this channel).
Going back to get an MA in Psychology after getting my MSc in Mathematics and spending time working in University, a startup and finance. I finally feel like I made the right choice! :)
I had no idea what to expect what from this, but I think it is great. I completely agree with the bottom line of this video: in life, if something is important to you, you must be willing to suffer for it(when the time calls for you to suffer). At age 26, I have only learned this like a year of 2 years ago. You're wise for your age. Keep up the hard work and block out the bull crap from the haters.💙👍🏽
Being out of school will teach you and change you in ways you can’t anticipate, so I would recommend people take a gap year, or a few. I’m getting my CS degree at 26 after dropping out at 20. There’s no rush. Enjoying a class doesn’t mean you will like the job that comes after, and disliking a class doesn’t mean you wouldn’t love the associated career.
I was in dental school some years ago, I absolutely hated it, it was literally hell on earth. Experiencing Insults, aggression and contempt from the tutors on a daily basis at the clinic in front of your patients. I am doing a CS degree now, and I am on year 2 which has lots of math. I just love it, I can't wait to come back from work and study for uni. It's like light years better than dental school.
as a dentist in his 30 , I am also trying to change to software engineering mostly because I don't see myself working as a dentist for 30 more years and want to have more flexibility in my life like working remotely. Also I am quite the introvert, meeting people everyday the whole day is not easy, especially considering many of those are scared. I am starting now, probably late in life and doing this while working as a dentist 60% of the week, good luck to me
@@zazi77 good luck buddy, I am 42 , I have worked as a dentist almost 20 years and I know how bad it is , in this day and time. Go follow your dream. Stay away from something that creates negativity in your life. You are not late in life pal
This is a relatable story to what I have experienced. Got a degree, decided to do teacher training because I didn’t want to do anything with my degree, and now realising that I don’t want to do that either, so I’ve started a part time degree to get an integrated master’s in astrophysics. It’ll be a tough decade ahead but it will be completely worth it in the end!
as someone who lives in the tropics. its interesting to hear 26°c being called hot, it's probably the coldest it'll ever get in my area these days. it's 36°c as im typing this, i'm melting
I work as a Principal Software Engineer. Before this job, i went on a 2.5 year career break to take care of my daughter and support my wife's medical career. When i came out of the break (in summer of 2024) I instantly realized the harsh reality of the job market. I am glad i was able to land my current job eventually, but i was getting absolutely no responses from any of the applications i was dropping (despite having many years of experience). I watched some of your recent videos during the job hunt phase. I have some startup dreams but to realize/implement it adequately, i feel like i need to take solid two years of mechanical engineering and math classes (if not a full 4 year degree). I just can't afford two more years of break, both in terms of time and money. Good luck with your degree, though! Happy for you.
Thanks a lot for posting this, really needed somebody else to say it out loud. I studied psychology since I wanted to "understand" psychopathology but they throw at you so much outdated stuff (psychoanalysis) and a lot of psychologists have zero to little scientific thinking, and would rather avoid biology at all costs (at least where I live). Fell in love with psychology, but extremely disappointed with psychologists as a whole. Currently doing a MPsy but I'll get into med school and have a 2nd degree. It's no easy choice, but I'm proud I decided to do so
I'm also going through uni for the second time. i also did not have the best time the first time but so far university is Much less stressful and much more fulfilling. having that fully developed frontal lobe really helps lol. Hoping for the best for you :D
1. Use your GenEd courses to refine your communication skills. Knowing how to speak, present ideas, and read with understanding is important. You will *always* need to learn more in whatever field you're in, and you likely won't get it at college - as stupid as it sounds, no matter what your major is you'll never learn enough. 2. Everyone learns differently. Watch videos, take notes, record lectures (where allowed), do a little bit of everything until a pattern emerges that works for you - and find more than one method, because one may not be available sometimes. Also, note taking doesn't have to be super organized at the time. Write a number and scribble down an idea or a page number. Don't get caught in the details. Just write down what it will take to remind you of what the concept was. 3. If you are attending a publicly funded school, remember that the school is motivated to see you graduate. Here's the thing most students don't know: if you are stressed or your life has hit a bump - maybe you got sick for several weeks, the school can provide programs to help you. It may delay your graduation (they may move your classes to another term), or they might find funds to help pay for a single semester, or several other things. Life happens, but schools have programs to help - but *you* have to tell your advisor and be willing to work with them. Also, if it's just one course you can try asking an instructor for an extension, but it's often better to ask your advisor. The school will then reach out to your instructor(s) to see if they are willing to work with the school. As an instructor, I prefer for the school's retention coordinator to assist in working with the student. It's sort of like a contract between the school and the student to encourage them to not procrastinate. 4. Ask questions - for the love of everything... I have students who either never ask any questions or wait until a deadline before asking questions. Your instructor hates it when you don't ask questions and despises it when you wait until the last second. Seriously. If you ask me early in the week, I have lots more time then and I can take more time to explain extra things you might be missing. I also cannot read your mind. When I taught CompSci in the classroom I walked around the lab when students were there (I'm old - computers where in labs, or terminals for mainframes were in labs). As I walked around in the lab, I could sometimes see that a student was having a problem by the look on their face. However, I teach online now and am completely dependent on students asking questions. If you work on projects for a classroom on a home computer/laptop I'd still not be able to see your face if I wasn't walking around. 5. Modern CompSci is sometimes taught wrong IMHO. There's no explanation as to what comes *before* you start coding on the keyboard. That's wrong, and far too many schools have brushed that away with RAD tools. Nobody discusses proper GUI development either, or the necessary psychology needed to understand it (even though it'd only take a few minutes to read about some necessary basics in a $5 book on the topic). OK - enough of my rants. I'm not at all sure that getting a second bachelors is worth your money. Most of it will be a recap of GenEd. You'll have around 6-8 courses tied to your engineering degree. You could have taken them separately, unless the GenEd courses were more than five years old. Then you'd likely be required to take them. You might also have been better with certificates covering the same material. Most jobs these days only look to see that you completed some college, then look to see what certificates you have. I'm sure your college didn't tell you that.
Great video Maria....I would like to share for future Maria completing her engineering degree. Having been in the workforce for a...ahem....few decades. I noticed many (motivated) peeps climb up the corporate ladder faster when combining their technical degree(s) with an MBA. Aside from academic credentials....you are 100% correct about motivation. There was even a few TED talks on the topic....that grit (perseverance) and motivation is the largest factor in a person's success
That last point is so key. The point isn’t to get a good grade or pass a test, the point is to learn. If everything you are being taught is dreadfully boring and aggravating and no fun, that may be a good sign that a career path ain’t it, and it’s very likely that there is something else out there that you actually do like learning and would enjoy focusing on. Better to make the change now than wish you did 30 years down the line 🤷
What engineering are you doing? If you have a strong CS and Math background you could likely get into those fields without the extra 4 years by doing some projects or getting a job at a research lab in the area (post bachelor programs).
@@pr0jectmaria Both are super cool areas, I can't speak much to Mechanical Engineering (Zach star has a rather good video on Mech E career prospects same with EE), but I can give a bit of advice for EE coming from a similar-ish background. For reference I'm interested pretty much exclusively in research so don't expect me to recommend the best paying areas lol. If you love electromagnetism and physics, you'll love RF/power/semiconductors (like solid state physics). If you liked the comp sci parts Comp E/firmware/IoT may be the way to go since you do still code, but your interviews focus way more on FPGAs and ASIC design type problems and the work is way cooler than standard div centering.
@@pr0jectmaria I definitely recommend Electrical Engineering. If you're coming from a CS background, you'll find a lot of key concepts are similar, making the transition much easier than starting fresh. (Speaking from experience-I did a diploma in Avionics and I'm now studying CS.)
I'm envious cause you have a double bachelors in computer science and math. As much as I'd like to build stuff as an engineer and how much protection I'd from AI, I'm getting older, so I'm going to stick with my mathematics degree and use the knowledge I've gained from there. I quit my Masters in Economics due to not meeting the grades, but I've gotten some lessons from it that I can combine with machine learning as well as other skills I'll teach myself. Welp, good luck with your career. You're still young and got time for another degree.
I am in my late twenties...Planning to do the same. I felt Isolated cuz not a lot of people do that atleast around me...Planning to do something in maths and finance. Thanks...great advice.
Genuine Question: Did you look into going into a Master's Program? Almost no one needs a second bachelors. You perhaps would need to take a pre-req or two but with a degree in Mathematics, a graduate program would have certainly accepted you. Unless of course you specifically don't want a Master's for whatever reason. Truly though there is almost no reason to re-do a 4 year. A Master's would be a higher level degree in the subject matter, that you would achieve in half the time. Once again though not trying to be rude or anything (I've been told I'm not good with tone), but genuinely wondering about the thought process. Hope it all works out.
>and to sum up the 4 years that spent pursuing this degree, I would call it the worst years of my life. top place. like right here couldn't relate more
Hmmm, huge respect to you for this decision! But I do think it might be good to think of other options which could be hugely beneficial considering you do already have a degree. Though I know this could be ignorant given I don't know your situation or how the US university system works (as an Aussie). But with that said I would be curious to know if you've maybe looked into stuff like graduate certificates or diplomas in engineering or maybe even find further study outside of CS like an engineering masters conversion program. My uni for example has multiple graduate diplomas for most types of engineering which which any student with a STEM Batchelor's degree can enroll without any consideration of grades. It would just be a shame to have to start again ya know...
the human Journey is so Weird. I have a degree in Civil Engineering and currently in the process of learning Programming and computer science but I'm not at any cost willing to go back to school because collage really did a number on me. In addition to the fact that you don't really need a collage to learn computer science from programing languages to framework and even compilers and every thing else is provide by some amazing people an amazing communities. but Honestly anyone that figured out what they wanted to become at 18 is very lucky. it's way better that making a U-Turn at the beginning of you 30s.
Where I did university, it was possible to combine two degrees in a massive multi-year grind. In my case CS and Engineering. Looking back, there are a lot of people who change careers (Physics into CS, engineering into biological science etc) where the pivot doesn't require a full other degree though.
it sounds so cliche but I look back with envy now to have the possibility to learn an organised curriculum guilt free of being too late or old, or to have to do a double debt. Guys, learning is a privilege, when you'll work you'll cherish the time when it was your "full time job" and now you have to pay for it, look for resources and organise the little free time at your disposal
I’m a CS major and mostly interested in Discrete Math. Eventually I have to take a class called Automata Theory which I hear is more like Discrete Math. So, I’m looking forward to that. I kinda want to just take more theory classes instead. I look at other Engineering majors and what they have to take, and it’s not interesting to me. So, I stick to Computer Science. Anyway, thanks for the reminder how Education is our responsibility. It really is🧐
I’m doing the opposite. Did masters in mechanical engineering and moving to Software Engineering since there aren’t much jobs in Mechanical Engg. Although I’m studying SWE from an Online School.
This is better than geomaxing & getting paid $1250 / month to code in a developing nation where nobody speaks English but something else as the lingua franca. Good plan, Maria.
Hey Maria, do you find your engineering courses pretty easy because of your math background? Also, will you be able to graduate in less than 4 years? Asking because I may be in a similar situation lol.
I really think a master's would do you better than 2 bachelor degrees...that's my plan anyway. I have a bachelor's in IT and I'm planning for a master's in accounting lol
I wanted to do that too, but the student loan programs don't loan for 2nd bachelors. But I could get money for a master's degree. More degrees more better.
Why do so many people think alike?😅 I'm still on my way getting my bachelor in CS, but the past weeks I've been regretting not going the engineering route. It's not too late to switch since I'm only a sophomore, but I've been going through hell and I don't want that to be in vain🙃
I'm a bit confused, you did CS and were learning how to program? Also, I'm a clinical psychologist, working with applied AI and doing a masters in computer engineering. Life is crazy like this, so I support making carreer changes. But I would never go back to undergrad, respect.
Someone on reddit once wrote this piece of advice, probably phrased differently, but I have remembered its meaning ever since: "Every job comes with its own shit sandwich, so the question you should ask yourself is, which flavour of shit sandwich do you prefer?"
Why did you decide to quit IT and pursue your career in engineering? Could you please make video about this topic, telling about what motivates you to such a change?
A video would be overkill. The answer is as simple as this: I didn't listen to myself before and now I am. I went into CS because of the "benefits", not because of interest, and after trying and failing to find a job, I realized I am not willing to suffer for CS. But I am willing to suffer through undergrad all over if it means doing what I want!
If I could go back, the first thing I would tell my younger self is to try and figure out what to do with my life WAY before college even. Forget trying to make friends as a kid. I would have spent the entirety of my grade school years trying to nail down the career I wanted and then using all that other free time to get a head start on mastering the necessary skills. If I had done that, then maybe I wouldn't currently be 34 years old, jobless, $54k in debt, struggling with imposter syndrome (or do I actually suck?), and totally lost in life. I'm most likely going to be joining the Air Force early next year. Although my CS degree and previous work experience as a software engineer will give me more opportunities in the military, it's still disappointing my life turned out this way.
Same brother, except I have a job and if I get fired (laid-off) we will be identical and I'm pretty sure that's gonna happen sometime in the near future.
Even those who are currently on the 'right' path (or the illusion of), have a job and are no longer in debt, imposter syndrome will always be a thing. You will learn to deal with it. It's not easy, though.
I don't want to be that person but: you are repeating your mistake. Taking the first thing you think you have interest and automatically going "I need a degree on it" it's a quick way only to hate yourself even more in the future and accumulate debt. But good luck.
I want to say it too.. "that I will do what I want to do as in what I expect from myself and what is it that brings me most joy and makes me okay with the related suffering" but can you really go with it?... I mean at this stage of life we can't help but to rely on people especially our parents... what if our thoughts and dreams doesn't align with theirs... it's difficult to make our own decisions when we don't have much control over our life and financially we are empty... we might want to do something that may not have much financial certainty... we may have passion and extreme desire but to actually achieve that we will need support.. it's not like college is free or anything that we want to involve with is free.. so what do we do?
Good Question. I asked myself the same thing often, but at the end of the day, parents approval or not, finances or not, outside support or not, if you really want something, you will have to carve the path yourself to get there. At some point, I stopped waiting for this "support" to come to me, I went out and found it myself. In fact I didn't have to look far, because I was my main support all this time. Look to yourself as a form of support, because no one wants to help you more then you.
You're speaking Russian too? :o That's cool Maria, welcome to the Club. How old are you actually? 😅 And: Are you visiting the courses in presence or only online?
Lol feel like you gave up too soon. If you're looking for a $80-$100k full-stack developer job in Connecticut let me know. It ain't much but it's an easy job.
@@Randorandom232because she’s smart enough to see the amount of effort she needs to put in to compete against people with no degree and Certs in an oversaturated industry is a poor use of her time and she’s better off studying something gatekept by a degree with greater job security. on top of that, she enjoys it
@@Randorandom232 she mentions enjoying it. The rest is just an assumption of mine given how hard of a worker she is and how little success she's had breaking into CS despite her efforts and credentials. I think she just did the math and realised there was a better way. But you're right, it is out of the blue for us viewers.
@@ila9063 The best thing you can do to get an entry level developer position is graduate from a well known school and have connections. The next best thing you can do is to just make things, if that's a drag for you and doesn't spark joy then changing degrees is probably the move haha.
I want to work in cybersecurity but there are no cybersecurity degrees around here meaning I have to choose if I want to study CS most of which I already know or CE/EE which interests me more but is harder 🥳
Your best bet is looking for a company that does training for new people into that position. Google “employer sponsored cohort/bootcamps”, that’s how I got into the industry as a software dev after my first bootcamp
You know the CS job market is beyond cooked when people would rather get a whole engineering degree instead 😭
It is, that's why I'm also going back to uni for an engineering degree.
If you're young, getting another Bachelor's degree isn't a bad idea. And Engineering is a great choice!
The CS job market is really tanking for new comers; three of my recent graduate friends have still not found a job since last year, yet, for some reason, 2 others that had experience found one within 2-3 months after graduating since they had experience. In short, it is still solid for folks with experience based on what I have seen from myself, friends and family. Going for a second degree may not be the best choice depending on your financial situation, especially here in the U.S. an advanced degree aka continuing to get a Masters in the same degree is shorter and looks better on a resume. HR usually asks about the highest level of education, not how many degrees. Take what I said with a grain of salt; it is only based on my bubble.
@@mephiles6432 If you don't know how to use your first degree you have no chance of benefiting from yet another. Getting a string of superficial qualifications is completely useless if you won't lean how to apply yourselves. Your first degree is plenty there to get you going in life. After that you might opt to go to graduate school in order to specialise - not get another Bachelor's instead. Absolutely terrible, confused people.
@@Christy_Brown at this point it's better to get another random job, and develop you own software and start a company on the side.
Holy $hit, I could never go through uni all over again - mad respect/sympathy lol
Yeah, it seems like a lot!
Yeah seriously. I graduated in software engineering and no way would I go back again. I’d rather work retail or some basic government job than that
@@lte6983 this is how I feel and I’m not even done yet. I need to get my shit together (all for the sake of a degree).
It would be hard :(
@@harrison6082 Honestly it is not that bad. I like learning and I study on my own often so it is no sweat. It is difficult but I enjoy it!
I feel like a lot of people that will be coming across this video (and Maria's videos in general) likely are A. struggling with finding work or B. currently in uni/college and feeling discouraged.
The best advice I could give too you if you are in camp A or B seeking jobs, as someone who graduated this spring and working as a software engineer, I would really look at verticals that are oftentimes overlooked.
Healthcare, construction, manufacturing, etc are all industries that would LOVE someone who has a lot of drive and little immediate know-how.
Don't give up!
Dam you so right
I'm literally doing it the opposite way. Dropped out of engineering and now doing maths and CS. I hate engineering at college, but I do like some of the jobs available so I'll just do a masters in it if needed.
But I do really like your message. I was really naive too, going back with a fresh mindset and not forcing yourself through it is the best (if possible). Wish you the best with engineering.
same here XD
wait but not maths 😂😂😂
Yep, I did not love CS in college mainly because my school focused on theory rather than actual programming. Programming became fun once I started doing it, but I love physics and engineering more so I made the switch.
@@pr0jectmariawhat kind of engineering are you doing?
unlike software development. there's no such thing as conversion masters to engineering, it's a heavy subject and you need to have bachelors first, before doing any advanced engineering masters
I laughed so hard when Maria calling her 4 years in CS the worst years of her life lol I also have a CS degree, can't agree more
Hm, I can’t agree. I thought it was very fun. Just sometimes annoying since you’re obliged to do homework instead of working on your own. I really dislike such pressure but other than that it was fun learning new stuff
I've been a web developer for some 5 years until I got laid off in May. Seeing where the whole industry is heading not just in terms of employment but also the insanity that webdev has become I'm just done with it and I'm getting my master's in stats now at 36. We got this!
You are feeling depressed because you’re struggling to find a job that uses your degree, and getting another engineering degree might not actually be the answer. It seems like you are doing it as a way to escape the reality of the job market, even though you already know there’s no guarantee of a job at the end of that path either.
I went through something similar. I graduated with a bachelor's degree in mechanical engineering, finished at the top of my class, and passed the FE exam. Yet, after a year of applications, I couldn’t find work as a mechanical engineer. My backup plan was to pursue software engineering, and thankfully, I found a job in that field. Looking back, I wouldn’t go back to mechanical or any other type of engineering.
If you’d like my advice, I would be happy to help. I am sure there are better options for you than going back to college for another degree.
The most important message of your video is "are you willing to suffer through the path you are on?" to accomplish your goals
I'm glad you have a new plan, but I wish it worked for you with compsci. I also started studying in 2019, we may be the same age. My degree is 5.5 years, I got into my job during the covid IT boom, and I already have 3 years of experience. This is all in Moscow. You are a really talanted person, and I wish you all the best, hope the bull market comes soon (and the war ends) and the companies start hiring
I also wished it did, but no matter how hard I pushed myself, I could never fully enjoy it. I also wish you the best fellow Russian. :)
I also did a second degree to retrain - although my degrees were 14 years apart.
My number one tip:
Be ABSOLUTELY, ABSOLUTELY sure and motivated that what you're going to do is MEANINGFUL to you. Don't do stuff just for the money; find something that personally fulfills you. And figure this out before you return to college/university.
This video came at such a perfect timing. I’m currently studying CS (second year) and I’m already considering going to another university to study either mech or elec engineering after finishing my CS degree. I don’t like college at all, but I’ve realized that I am genuinely interested in engineering enough to go to university for a second time to study it.
Like you said, if you see that you are willing to suffer for something (and in my case, put money into it, because currently I have certain financial benefits that allow me to study basically debt free in my current college) then it’s a good indication that you like it/are interested in it (which applies to a lot more than just a college degrees).
I’m still planning on completing my CS degree, just to prove to myself that I can finish something (CS is actually my second attempt at a degree, I’m actually a third year student but second year CS student). I like CS enough to study it, but I’m not much interested in working solely on software or data. Plus, having a degree in both CS and either mech or elec gives you a well-rounded knowledge on certain topics, specifically if you combine cs with elec engineering, or so I’ve read. So maybe completing CS will be a better choice for me.
I hope your experience with engineering is much better than that with cs. And let’s see how things go. Anyhow, thank you for thus video and I look forward to further ones (I love this channel).
Going back to get an MA in Psychology after getting my MSc in Mathematics and spending time working in University, a startup and finance. I finally feel like I made the right choice! :)
Going back for a second BS degree in Comp Engineering and wow is it hard to balance w/adult life, so much respect to you for pursuing these goals!!!
I had no idea what to expect what from this, but I think it is great. I completely agree with the bottom line of this video: in life, if something is important to you, you must be willing to suffer for it(when the time calls for you to suffer). At age 26, I have only learned this like a year of 2 years ago. You're wise for your age. Keep up the hard work and block out the bull crap from the haters.💙👍🏽
Being out of school will teach you and change you in ways you can’t anticipate, so I would recommend people take a gap year, or a few. I’m getting my CS degree at 26 after dropping out at 20. There’s no rush. Enjoying a class doesn’t mean you will like the job that comes after, and disliking a class doesn’t mean you wouldn’t love the associated career.
I was in dental school some years ago, I absolutely hated it, it was literally hell on earth. Experiencing Insults, aggression and contempt from the tutors on a daily basis at the clinic in front of your patients. I am doing a CS degree now, and I am on year 2 which has lots of math. I just love it, I can't wait to come back from work and study for uni. It's like light years better than dental school.
as a dentist in his 30 , I am also trying to change to software engineering mostly because I don't see myself working as a dentist for 30 more years and want to have more flexibility in my life like working remotely. Also I am quite the introvert, meeting people everyday the whole day is not easy, especially considering many of those are scared. I am starting now, probably late in life and doing this while working as a dentist 60% of the week, good luck to me
@@zazi77 good luck buddy, I am 42 , I have worked as a dentist almost 20 years and I know how bad it is , in this day and time. Go follow your dream. Stay away from something that creates negativity in your life. You are not late in life pal
Good luck getting a job in tech now. It is better to be a dentist earning $200k, than being an unemployed cs-graduate.
@@jimj2683 in europe the situation is different
@@jimj2683 in europe in different , my salary is 30k , not 200k. This is true for SW developers too, salaries are much lower than USA
the difference between being a kid and an adult is when you take full responsibility for yourself and your actions. really hammer in that last point.
This is a relatable story to what I have experienced. Got a degree, decided to do teacher training because I didn’t want to do anything with my degree, and now realising that I don’t want to do that either, so I’ve started a part time degree to get an integrated master’s in astrophysics. It’ll be a tough decade ahead but it will be completely worth it in the end!
My education is my responsibility. In other words, I have to be proactive in my life.
as someone who lives in the tropics. its interesting to hear 26°c being called hot, it's probably the coldest it'll ever get in my area these days. it's 36°c as im typing this, i'm melting
I work as a Principal Software Engineer. Before this job, i went on a 2.5 year career break to take care of my daughter and support my wife's medical career. When i came out of the break (in summer of 2024) I instantly realized the harsh reality of the job market. I am glad i was able to land my current job eventually, but i was getting absolutely no responses from any of the applications i was dropping (despite having many years of experience). I watched some of your recent videos during the job hunt phase. I have some startup dreams but to realize/implement it adequately, i feel like i need to take solid two years of mechanical engineering and math classes (if not a full 4 year degree). I just can't afford two more years of break, both in terms of time and money. Good luck with your degree, though! Happy for you.
Are you willing to suffer for it? - Great question to ask yourself.
Thanks a lot for posting this, really needed somebody else to say it out loud. I studied psychology since I wanted to "understand" psychopathology but they throw at you so much outdated stuff (psychoanalysis) and a lot of psychologists have zero to little scientific thinking, and would rather avoid biology at all costs (at least where I live). Fell in love with psychology, but extremely disappointed with psychologists as a whole. Currently doing a MPsy but I'll get into med school and have a 2nd degree. It's no easy choice, but I'm proud I decided to do so
I'm also going through uni for the second time. i also did not have the best time the first time but so far university is Much less stressful and much more fulfilling. having that fully developed frontal lobe really helps lol. Hoping for the best for you :D
1. Use your GenEd courses to refine your communication skills. Knowing how to speak, present ideas, and read with understanding is important. You will *always* need to learn more in whatever field you're in, and you likely won't get it at college - as stupid as it sounds, no matter what your major is you'll never learn enough.
2. Everyone learns differently. Watch videos, take notes, record lectures (where allowed), do a little bit of everything until a pattern emerges that works for you - and find more than one method, because one may not be available sometimes. Also, note taking doesn't have to be super organized at the time. Write a number and scribble down an idea or a page number. Don't get caught in the details. Just write down what it will take to remind you of what the concept was.
3. If you are attending a publicly funded school, remember that the school is motivated to see you graduate. Here's the thing most students don't know: if you are stressed or your life has hit a bump - maybe you got sick for several weeks, the school can provide programs to help you. It may delay your graduation (they may move your classes to another term), or they might find funds to help pay for a single semester, or several other things. Life happens, but schools have programs to help - but *you* have to tell your advisor and be willing to work with them. Also, if it's just one course you can try asking an instructor for an extension, but it's often better to ask your advisor. The school will then reach out to your instructor(s) to see if they are willing to work with the school. As an instructor, I prefer for the school's retention coordinator to assist in working with the student. It's sort of like a contract between the school and the student to encourage them to not procrastinate.
4. Ask questions - for the love of everything... I have students who either never ask any questions or wait until a deadline before asking questions. Your instructor hates it when you don't ask questions and despises it when you wait until the last second. Seriously. If you ask me early in the week, I have lots more time then and I can take more time to explain extra things you might be missing. I also cannot read your mind. When I taught CompSci in the classroom I walked around the lab when students were there (I'm old - computers where in labs, or terminals for mainframes were in labs). As I walked around in the lab, I could sometimes see that a student was having a problem by the look on their face. However, I teach online now and am completely dependent on students asking questions. If you work on projects for a classroom on a home computer/laptop I'd still not be able to see your face if I wasn't walking around.
5. Modern CompSci is sometimes taught wrong IMHO. There's no explanation as to what comes *before* you start coding on the keyboard. That's wrong, and far too many schools have brushed that away with RAD tools. Nobody discusses proper GUI development either, or the necessary psychology needed to understand it (even though it'd only take a few minutes to read about some necessary basics in a $5 book on the topic). OK - enough of my rants.
I'm not at all sure that getting a second bachelors is worth your money. Most of it will be a recap of GenEd. You'll have around 6-8 courses tied to your engineering degree. You could have taken them separately, unless the GenEd courses were more than five years old. Then you'd likely be required to take them. You might also have been better with certificates covering the same material. Most jobs these days only look to see that you completed some college, then look to see what certificates you have. I'm sure your college didn't tell you that.
Great video Maria....I would like to share for future Maria completing her engineering degree. Having been in the workforce for a...ahem....few decades. I noticed many (motivated) peeps climb up the corporate ladder faster when combining their technical degree(s) with an MBA. Aside from academic credentials....you are 100% correct about motivation. There was even a few TED talks on the topic....that grit (perseverance) and motivation is the largest factor in a person's success
That last point is so key. The point isn’t to get a good grade or pass a test, the point is to learn.
If everything you are being taught is dreadfully boring and aggravating and no fun, that may be a good sign that a career path ain’t it, and it’s very likely that there is something else out there that you actually do like learning and would enjoy focusing on. Better to make the change now than wish you did 30 years down the line 🤷
What engineering are you doing? If you have a strong CS and Math background you could likely get into those fields without the extra 4 years by doing some projects or getting a job at a research lab in the area (post bachelor programs).
I am deciding between Mech or Elec. Electrical seems better for my background but I am still exploring my options!
She can’t get a cs job so I don’t think it’s reasonable to assume she has a strong cs background.
@@pr0jectmaria Both are super cool areas, I can't speak much to Mechanical Engineering (Zach star has a rather good video on Mech E career prospects same with EE), but I can give a bit of advice for EE coming from a similar-ish background.
For reference I'm interested pretty much exclusively in research so don't expect me to recommend the best paying areas lol.
If you love electromagnetism and physics, you'll love RF/power/semiconductors (like solid state physics). If you liked the comp sci parts Comp E/firmware/IoT may be the way to go since you do still code, but your interviews focus way more on FPGAs and ASIC design type problems and the work is way cooler than standard div centering.
@@pr0jectmaria
I definitely recommend Electrical Engineering. If you're coming from a CS background, you'll find a lot of key concepts are similar, making the transition much easier than starting fresh. (Speaking from experience-I did a diploma in Avionics and I'm now studying CS.)
@@pr0jectmaria you can do both with Mechatronics ;)
The fact that the CS job market is beyond cooked, is so frustrating!.
I love the SUPERDRY logo, they make amazing sunglasses.
I'm envious cause you have a double bachelors in computer science and math. As much as I'd like to build stuff as an engineer and how much protection I'd from AI, I'm getting older, so I'm going to stick with my mathematics degree and use the knowledge I've gained from there. I quit my Masters in Economics due to not meeting the grades, but I've gotten some lessons from it that I can combine with machine learning as well as other skills I'll teach myself. Welp, good luck with your career. You're still young and got time for another degree.
толстовка "все очень круто, но надо переделать" ахах топ
Watching it again feels like I'm so dumb from these ambitions is outrageous
I am in my late twenties...Planning to do the same. I felt Isolated cuz not a lot of people do that atleast around me...Planning to do something in maths and finance. Thanks...great advice.
Halfway through my CS degree and im going to jump ship and move to social work.
Genuine Question: Did you look into going into a Master's Program? Almost no one needs a second bachelors. You perhaps would need to take a pre-req or two but with a degree in Mathematics, a graduate program would have certainly accepted you. Unless of course you specifically don't want a Master's for whatever reason.
Truly though there is almost no reason to re-do a 4 year. A Master's would be a higher level degree in the subject matter, that you would achieve in half the time. Once again though not trying to be rude or anything (I've been told I'm not good with tone), but genuinely wondering about the thought process. Hope it all works out.
>and to sum up the 4 years that spent pursuing this degree, I would call it the worst years of my life. top place. like right here
couldn't relate more
Bruh, you did it smart, though. I have an English degree and I went back for Animation. I am probably going to end up goose farming.
thank you for the video, i dont know how the youtube recommended this but this is exactly what i needed
Hmmm, huge respect to you for this decision! But I do think it might be good to think of other options which could be hugely beneficial considering you do already have a degree. Though I know this could be ignorant given I don't know your situation or how the US university system works (as an Aussie).
But with that said I would be curious to know if you've maybe looked into stuff like graduate certificates or diplomas in engineering or maybe even find further study outside of CS like an engineering masters conversion program. My uni for example has multiple graduate diplomas for most types of engineering which which any student with a STEM Batchelor's degree can enroll without any consideration of grades.
It would just be a shame to have to start again ya know...
Pretty insane thing to do these days.
Why not a bridge to masters program ?
the human Journey is so Weird. I have a degree in Civil Engineering and currently in the process of learning Programming and computer science but I'm not at any cost willing to go back to school because collage really did a number on me. In addition to the fact that you don't really need a collage to learn computer science from programing languages to framework and even compilers and every thing else is provide by some amazing people an amazing communities. but Honestly anyone that figured out what they wanted to become at 18 is very lucky. it's way better that making a U-Turn at the beginning of you 30s.
So there is someone else like me going for another degree, guess I'm not so crazy after all. Awesome Video.
i like the setup
Where I did university, it was possible to combine two degrees in a massive multi-year grind. In my case CS and Engineering. Looking back, there are a lot of people who change careers (Physics into CS, engineering into biological science etc) where the pivot doesn't require a full other degree though.
I'm doing the same thing! And my retirement goal is to be a sheep farmer hahahaha
Why not an electrical engineering masters?
I’m also going back to school to pursue a BS in CE. Good luck!
cool hair style😊
it sounds so cliche but I look back with envy now to have the possibility to learn an organised curriculum guilt free of being too late or old, or to have to do a double debt. Guys, learning is a privilege, when you'll work you'll cherish the time when it was your "full time job" and now you have to pay for it, look for resources and organise the little free time at your disposal
A blessing from the gods
i have similar experience but instead of finishing cs i switched to mechanical engr
I think with most programs, a CS degee and Math Degree would make you eligible for a Masters degree in some engineering fields, maybe EE or CE?
Because building shit is awesome.
you better not be unemployed after this
😅
I’m a CS major and mostly interested in Discrete Math. Eventually I have to take a class called Automata Theory which I hear is more like Discrete Math. So, I’m looking forward to that. I kinda want to just take more theory classes instead. I look at other Engineering majors and what they have to take, and it’s not interesting to me. So, I stick to Computer Science. Anyway, thanks for the reminder how Education is our responsibility. It really is🧐
You are smart and beautiful : you will successful in TH-cam 😊
any chance you could tell me where you bought your chair? also you are awesome
jesus its bad enough to go once imagine willingly going a second time to still end up broke
Love u . Keep it up pls
I’m doing the opposite. Did masters in mechanical engineering and moving to Software Engineering since there aren’t much jobs in Mechanical Engg. Although I’m studying SWE from an Online School.
i would definitely go back to uni!!
This is better than geomaxing & getting paid $1250 / month to code in a developing nation where nobody speaks English but something else as the lingua franca. Good plan, Maria.
Hey Maria, do you find your engineering courses pretty easy because of your math background? Also, will you be able to graduate in less than 4 years?
Asking because I may be in a similar situation lol.
only 80? i live in Saudi it gets up to 50 c in the summer.
Thanks for doing this
Nice video. Where you able to skip some of the classes that you completed from the previous degree? Like gen ed. classes or calc.
I really think a master's would do you better than 2 bachelor degrees...that's my plan anyway. I have a bachelor's in IT and I'm planning for a master's in accounting lol
i finished my second bachelor in CS this year, then the whole job market fell down! Haha
And what is the second bachelor you are persuing? I'm curious
80F = 26c and she is suffering due to heat. She trully is Skyrim native😂
I wanna cry I was thinking abt doing that but am too broke to go to uni again😭😭😭😭
I wanted to do that too, but the student loan programs don't loan for 2nd bachelors. But I could get money for a master's degree. More degrees more better.
Why do so many people think alike?😅 I'm still on my way getting my bachelor in CS, but the past weeks I've been regretting not going the engineering route. It's not too late to switch since I'm only a sophomore, but I've been going through hell and I don't want that to be in vain🙃
It's giving nasa and space X vibes
Hi Maria, I have a project might be very interesting to work on
I'm a bit confused, you did CS and were learning how to program?
Also, I'm a clinical psychologist, working with applied AI and doing a masters in computer engineering. Life is crazy like this, so I support making carreer changes. But I would never go back to undergrad, respect.
A lot of cs programs are absolute garbage so she probably never learned any coding. Just passed the required courses.
why is comp sci dead? I grew up thinking you were guaranteed a great paying job if you could code
Got oversaturated
Plus ai
Someone on reddit once wrote this piece of advice, probably phrased differently, but I have remembered its meaning ever since: "Every job comes with its own shit sandwich, so the question you should ask yourself is, which flavour of shit sandwich do you prefer?"
thank u i will do the thing rn
Why did you decide to quit IT and pursue your career in engineering? Could you please make video about this topic, telling about what motivates you to such a change?
bro the market is cooked
A video would be overkill. The answer is as simple as this: I didn't listen to myself before and now I am. I went into CS because of the "benefits", not because of interest, and after trying and failing to find a job, I realized I am not willing to suffer for CS. But I am willing to suffer through undergrad all over if it means doing what I want!
What kind of engineering? Would like to see a vid on your thought process on career shift.
80 fahrenheit is 26 celsius you consider that hot ?
I'm also getting a second degree in engineering (electrical engineering).
As a person from where college is totally free, always that i listen that it is not affordable sounds strange and a little sad
Are you in Germany
If I could go back, the first thing I would tell my younger self is to try and figure out what to do with my life WAY before college even. Forget trying to make friends as a kid. I would have spent the entirety of my grade school years trying to nail down the career I wanted and then using all that other free time to get a head start on mastering the necessary skills.
If I had done that, then maybe I wouldn't currently be 34 years old, jobless, $54k in debt, struggling with imposter syndrome (or do I actually suck?), and totally lost in life. I'm most likely going to be joining the Air Force early next year. Although my CS degree and previous work experience as a software engineer will give me more opportunities in the military, it's still disappointing my life turned out this way.
Same brother, except I have a job and if I get fired (laid-off) we will be identical and I'm pretty sure that's gonna happen sometime in the near future.
Even those who are currently on the 'right' path (or the illusion of), have a job and are no longer in debt, imposter syndrome will always be a thing. You will learn to deal with it. It's not easy, though.
I don't want to be that person but: you are repeating your mistake. Taking the first thing you think you have interest and automatically going "I need a degree on it" it's a quick way only to hate yourself even more in the future and accumulate debt. But good luck.
Great point
I want to say it too.. "that I will do what I want to do as in what I expect from myself and what is it that brings me most joy and makes me okay with the related suffering"
but can you really go with it?... I mean at this stage of life we can't help but to rely on people especially our parents... what if our thoughts and dreams doesn't align with theirs...
it's difficult to make our own decisions when we don't have much control over our life and financially we are empty...
we might want to do something that may not have much financial certainty... we may have passion and extreme desire but to actually achieve that we will need support..
it's not like college is free or anything that we want to involve with is free..
so what do we do?
Good Question. I asked myself the same thing often, but at the end of the day, parents approval or not, finances or not, outside support or not, if you really want something, you will have to carve the path yourself to get there. At some point, I stopped waiting for this "support" to come to me, I went out and found it myself. In fact I didn't have to look far, because I was my main support all this time. Look to yourself as a form of support, because no one wants to help you more then you.
Idk man i am studying cs in zurich but its so boring man. Just working on my startup instead.
What do you mean by suffering? I dont think im willing to really suffer fir anything...
yo Boys we gotta assemble cuz Maria just uploaded a video
You're speaking Russian too? :o
That's cool Maria, welcome to the Club.
How old are you actually? 😅
And: Are you visiting the courses in presence or only online?
How rich do you have to be to able to afford the college twice? demn. my entire family had ass sweats trying to send me through college on time.
Her parents probably makes $200K at least. And if she was a male they probably wouldn’t be so supportive.
@@bennoarchimboldi6245she doesn't look rich
continue to be random :) please keep changing to what you what
That's so relatable. How do you know if you think you are doing ok because you don't have to study Calculus all over again?
Hey look there's rock ahead be careful
Ah-
Lol feel like you gave up too soon. If you're looking for a $80-$100k full-stack developer job in Connecticut let me know. It ain't much but it's an easy job.
I don't really understand why she's taking on a new major.
@@Randorandom232because she’s smart enough to see the amount of effort she needs to put in to compete against people with no degree and Certs in an oversaturated industry is a poor use of her time and she’s better off studying something gatekept by a degree with greater job security. on top of that, she enjoys it
@@ila9063 ty, I must have missed this in the video! It seemed out of the blue
@@Randorandom232 she mentions enjoying it. The rest is just an assumption of mine given how hard of a worker she is and how little success she's had breaking into CS despite her efforts and credentials. I think she just did the math and realised there was a better way.
But you're right, it is out of the blue for us viewers.
@@ila9063 The best thing you can do to get an entry level developer position is graduate from a well known school and have connections. The next best thing you can do is to just make things, if that's a drag for you and doesn't spark joy then changing degrees is probably the move haha.
I want to work in cybersecurity but there are no cybersecurity degrees around here meaning I have to choose if I want to study CS most of which I already know or CE/EE which interests me more but is harder 🥳
Your best bet is looking for a company that does training for new people into that position. Google “employer sponsored cohort/bootcamps”, that’s how I got into the industry as a software dev after my first bootcamp
What are you studying?!?!!!!