Ninja V vs Video Assist 12G // The choice is not that obvious, unless..+ RAW footage for download
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 16 มิ.ย. 2024
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Should you pick the Atomos Ninja V(+) or the Black Magic Video Assist to use with your GH6?
I’ve been using and testing both of them and the choice is not as obvious as you might think.
Let’s talk about it!
Download the sample RAW footage and support me on Patreon 🙏 / redframetech
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🔻Selection of gear I use🔻
🎥CAMERAS & LENSES
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🖥️MONITOR/RECORDER
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▶️GIMBAL
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▶️AUDIO & TIMECODE
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▶️LIGHTS
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▶️EDITING
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00:00 - Intro
00:25 - Build quality
03:46 - Audio
04:09 - Codecs & storage
05:05 - Tools & UI
07:02 - RAW
07:50 - Patreon
09:13 - Which one?
#lumixgh6 #ninjaV #blackmagic - วิทยาศาสตร์และเทคโนโลยี
The Black Magic Video Assist got a $200 price reduction!
Are you able to link it ?
@@DASwealthSure thing! I don’t have a universal link though, so if you can tell which country you’re in I can provide you with the right link
Video Assist can be used as a webcam!? OMG... never know but need it. Thanks a lot for the info!
Regarding formats RAW, dumb for sure, but at least they have same batteries....
With Atomos stock down 90%, maybe Blackmagic can buy them and put BRAW on the Ninjas.
😄 that would be great
That’s the dream. Fuck atomos
😂😂😂@@frannyfranman
Sir. Thank you Sir. Eight months ago I asked you to build this video and you did. More important, you answered many of my questions. I was out of the country and off-line, so I could not watch youtube to see this when you posted it.
You’re most welcome! 🙂
This is an insightful comparison.
Thank you for your presentation.
Overall I highly recommend NinjaV+ over NinjaV, not sure about new recent versions. For V+ as a bundle with accesory kit, they includes very nice pouch, batteries, a case, AND h.265 included without extra pay (that was not obvious at purchase time). But overall I would go with mini Assist 5" or if you don't need portability 7" would be great, better to pay a little bit extra and get more featured device.... Didn't deal with BM customer support, but for Atomos they are very nice, FYI......
Need to check BM Assist if they have it, but on NinjaV/V+ the huge disappointment that they do not have horizontal flip, to make it like a mirror when recording yourself, so little simple thing that make it very uncomfortable.
If Black Magic make it with SSD tray like on NinjaV it will be awesome. Ninja is not bad, but quality is way too different, like (a bit) a toy (Ninja) and professional tough device. As well dual battery slot with hot swap is nice. Having both, Ninja is nice especially for SSD simplicity. Overall for the price BM Assist is much better regarding price/features. AND compatible with RAW recording for Resolve.
I purchased the Nitze cage for the BMVA 5" 12g, along with a USB-C cable with a right-angle neck at the plug, and that seemed to solve the problem with the terribly placed plug.
That sounds like a great solution. Thanks for sharing!
Great vid & thanks. I put a NATO rail on the bottom of my video assist which solved the stupid usb c issue and is more sturdy than a monitor mount.
Thanks!
That’s a great solution. Thanks for sharing!
Nice🎉!I use fcp so ya know at this time wich im using.the ssd caddy on the ninja only prefers the thin atom x w the connect module so i has 2 angelbird 4tb raw ssds at over 2000us each that now sit on my desk for storage unless if i want to take the connect module off . Shooting raw can be a extreme financial challenge. Great content! Nice ta know . Great show Red.Thank You
Yeah, it’s usually not worth it for me either shooting raw. Gets very expensive indeed!
Hi
Great review have both as well...Run and Gun I shoot mostly with Video Assist because thé 2500 nit IS much better in Sunny weather....I find the focus peaking better in the Video ASSIST you can fine tune IT AND Expo tools works Like they schould so pre lut.
You have andycine lunchbox II Wich is a great solution for SSD caddie a diy but easy to make.
You forget to mention the CDNG raw convertor...Wich make Proresraw avaible in Resolve
Thanks Filip!
You’re right, I forgot to mention RAW converter..
Yeah, I’ve seen the Andycine Lunchbox. Maybe I’ll get it at some point. The Video Assist is indeed much brighter which is great outdoors in sunny weather. The rest of the time the Ninja is bright enough for me. But the pre lut exposure tools on the video assist is much better than the Ninja.
Thanks for watching!
Hey thanks for the explanation! Great video. Now im more confused than ever
I use an FX30 and am appauled by the idea of having to use SATA drives, Atomos seems very money grubby with their subscriptions and credits systems if i ever want addons/upgrades.
Which makes me lean toward the VA.
I'm quite new to this and am wondering what the advantage would be of plugging in my mic into the recorder as opposed to plugging it into the camera?
I guess if i plug in an SSD in the USB C, the VA would be lighter as opposed to the Ninja because that has to have the SATA drive inserted in the screen. Im planning on using an external battery anyhow.
Thinking of it, what is the difference in power consumption?
If you had an FX30 which one would you pick? :)
Thanks again, great video!! Groetjes!
I saw your other comments first 😄
Yeah, the SATA drive is not ideal. But there’s a nice, small solution for that by Andycine called the lunchbox (takes NVMe). Nothing will stick out the side with that.
Plugging an SSD into the VA is convenient, but requires some extra bracket to mount it to, making less compact.
Power consumption is quite similar between the Ninja and the VA.
You’re right, Atomos charges for everything, but so far I’ve only paid for the latest feature pack upgrade (will be doing a live stream about it this Saturday 🙂). I don’t need the rest of what they offer. But if you do, it can get expensive..
Regarding a mic plugged into a recorder (Ninja V): it gives you an additional audio source. You can have a mic plugged into your camera and another one into the recorder. The recorder will record that (analog) input onto a separate stereo track.
Hope that helps! Bedankt voor het kijken 🙂
@@RedFrameTech Hey thank you for your quick and extensive reply!
I heard of the Andycine and read a few mixed comments on it, plus im not a big fan of having to buy a housing and then having to build it myself.
Also I designed an SSD holder (similar to what DSLR shooter designed for his compact camera) But one that in my opinion actually works ( I couldnt for the life of me get the T7 in and out of the holder becaue the USB C port is too strong and the holder was too tight) So i wouldnt mind using my own design offcourse (if you want to see it i could upload it to Printables if you are interested (Its not completely finished))
Plus also the added weight on top of the camera as opposed lower and more toward the battery feels like it makes the rig a bit more stable.
The mic thing is indeed interesting and i will keep that in mind!
Thanks again for your quick and extensive reply! :) bedankt voor de videos!
@@mick0matic Yeah, I get your concerns. I would be interested to see your SSD holder design!
The monitor mount complaint… where the usb-c port is right next to the mount… is a non-issue. Just use the other mount in the right. Thats why there are 3 of them.
Also if you purchase the smallrig articulating magic arm with NATO clamp, you have plenty of space to use the middle mount and plug in a usb-c.
If that’s your preferred way to mount it, then perfect 👍 For me though, I prefer to have my monitor centred on top of my camera. Mounting it off-centre messes with weight balance. Which makes the usb c port placement an issue for me.
you can use a trick for fast startup the Ninja V.
Click one time fast and then hold the power buttom
Interesting! But doesn't seem to work on mine. Won't turn on at all that way. Which firmware is yours on? Mine's on 10.93.00
I love braw with davinci, but i havent used alot of pro res cuz im a pc user, that might change im teying to get an m2 soon
Thx for the comparison, Sebastiaan 🙏
can you roughly speak on the hdmi latency of both devices paired with your Lumix? From what I've read it seems to be bad with both but maybe one is less bad than the other 😅
Greetings from Germany ✌🏼
Thanks for watching!
They’re about the same. It’s more about the camera than it is about the monitor though. Latency on the GH6 can be reduced by turning off audio over HDMI.
@@RedFrameTech thx for your quick response ✌🏼 and yes, that's why I asked specifically about the Lumix because I was considering to pair my S1H / S5 II with one of them.
Does that mean you could still get audio via recording analog directly into the atomos, when audio over HDMI is turned off? That could be a decision maker (because I consider the 7 inch video assist with it's mini XLRs too large for the setup I'm looking for)
Thx again and I'll leave you alone now 😄🤝🏻
You can indeed record analog audio directly into the Ninja V with audio over hdmi turned off. There’s a live stream on my channel where I explain how that works.
And, I am happy to answer any questions 😉
@@RedFrameTech I actually watched the stream, that's why I recalled the analog option :P thx a lot and keep up the great work 👍🏻
It is bad. I use S5IIX with Blackmagic 12G 5 inch, and it is bad. I chatted to Lumix officials and it is because of the HDMI limitations, meaning it can't be fixed.
I'd love to shoot and experiment with RAW on my Panasonic GH6 and future G9, but sadly I can't. 😪😪😪
I edit in Resolve, the only editing software worth playing with, and I have an Atomos Ninja. And never the twain shall meet. 😵💫😵💫
The waveform exposing for the viewing LUT got me into a lot of trouble and cause me to miss some amazing filming opportunities. Thankfully you helped me "Trouble Shoot" this strange problem.
Panasonic cameras can film in LOG and you can monitor them with a Viewing LUT. And you can still expose correctly with the Waveform as if you were looking at LOG footage. SO WHY CAN'T ATAMOS ALLOW THIS?
Agggggg
Great episode, and i really like your lighting setup. She-who-must-be-obayed would never let me turn a room into a makeshift studio for my hobby. In truth, I've got enough toys as it is and I can live with this. 😜😜
Thanks Frank!
My studio is absolutely tiny.. It’s about 2 by 3 meters, is also my office and holds most of my gear.. but it is nice to have a studio for sure. Once I have the budget I plan on making a bigger studio, but for now it’ll do just fine.
What I forgot to mention in this video is that you can convert ProResRAW into CDNG with RAW Converter and use it in Resolve. But the free version only converts the first 300 frames, which I did for this video. It’s not ideal, but for the sake of playing around with RAW it can be an option. File sizes are massive though! There’s both BRAW and ProResRAW footage available on my Patreon page (had to put it behind some sort of paywall to hopefully cover the cost of the cloud storage needed).
Yeah, the Atomos exposure issue.. glad I was able to help you figure it out
@@RedFrameTech Seems like a 2 by 3 meter filming space seems to be the sweet spot for most TH-camrs and they do very well.
I'd like to experiment with RAW footage however from the tutorials and walk-throughs that I've seen ProRes HQ has as much detail in its bit-rate and grading versatility except for the one thing, "White Balance".
Maybe you could do a comparison with the pros and cons of BRAW and ProRes (Not RAW) after the footage has been through the digital washer and finally been published/delivered to TH-cam or the client?
Would the client or TH-cam viewer even notice the difference after all the effort of shooting in RAW and post production compared to the more easily accessible codec of ProRes?
Obviously Bit-rate and colour depth have a major part to play but surely there must be a point of diminishing returns for all that storage needed to capture and edit?
From what I've seen H.265 4:2:2 at 400bps is virtually the same as ProRes LT. And I'd really have to look very hard to spot the difference between H.265 4:2:2 and ProRes 422 or HQ, when they are viewed unedited.
@@frankinblackpool That would be an interesting comparison to make. I'll add that to the list of videos to make.
There are 90-degree USB adapters for the Video assist.
Yeah I am aware of that, but that doesn’t solve the issue. The adapter will still be in the way of the monitor mount
yeahhh ninja is much 'cheaper' without the additional accessories but once you need the accessories, va is much better price. you paid straight with all the stuffs you need without any accessories. prores raw vs braw? looking at most of the reviewers, braw is much better to pick rather than prores raw.
Another thing you can do with the video assist is getting HDMI from camera and send it to another monitor via SDI. I don’t think you can do that on a ninja, even with the SDI upgrade.
That's interesting! So it's an HDMI to SDI converter as well. Good to know and thanks for watching!
@@RedFrameTech The BMD VA convert sdi to hdmi and hdmi to sdi. Also you can simultaneosly otput to hdmi and sdi. The monitor can downscale the image automatically to 1080 if your monitor can't handle 4k.
I have been shooting with a nikon z6 ii and black magic assist in video format prores 422 10bit output from camera . Is that raw?
No that’s not raw. Prores is a codec, thus not raw
you have to pay for the modification of the z6ii to do Nlog, and therefore to do Braw output
i just got the 7” video assist as a capture card of sorts but it VERY quickly replaced the shogun i
The video assist is great! Happy to hear it works well for you. I still have both the Ninja V and the VA 5” and use them both depending on the situation
@@RedFrameTech yah I have the Original shogun and inferno that stay on different rigs and the Hollyland mars m1 that is the most used by far with the built in transmission but the brightness of the video assist is what keeps making me need to use it
What about the 5 ultra vs the assist..i think the ultra would win, and gh6 is great with braw i guess but its not the best camera to use a monitor like that with
I have no experience with the Ultra (I’ve only used the Ninja V from Atomos), but it sure seems like a very successor/step up. I am curious though: why do think the GH6 is not a great camera for a monitor like that?
Nice, but this video left me more skeptical about what to choose.
Exactly! So, both Atomos and Black Magic need to do a better job at designing their product. I can’t make these devices better than they are with my video 😅
the video assist 7" have nice mics inputs...
True and very nice, but in a different price range and size
Can you you black magic video assist on Sony a7iv?
As long as the camera has a clean HDMI out, it will work
Hey, you said the Video Assist can act as a web cam if connected through USB, can it output 4K signal for streaming in 4K?
No 4K unfortunately. 1080p is the max
@@RedFrameTech thanks for the info, pity it can't do 4K. I think the Atem mini pro switcher is 1080p too.
@@AexoeroVYup, the Atems are 1080 too. The Osee GoStream has 4K HDMI inputs. Could be a great alternative to an Atem
@@RedFrameTech thanks for the recommendation but it seems Osee is 1080 too. They need to update their devices to 4K!
Yeah, you're right! Sorry. I had it confused with a device from OBSBOT that has not been released yet. I'm expecting to receive it this month and start testing it. This is supposed to be a 4K switcher
Did you encounter a pink, warm magenta color shift on your display of Video Assist ??
I haven’t. Perhaps yours needs to be re-calibrated
@@RedFrameTech Thanks for the answer, is it in monitor calibration or external with calibrator?
@@markomihailovic3020 Within the menu there’s an option to adjust LCD temperature and LCD tint. As far as I know, this is the only way it can be ‘calibrated’
@@RedFrameTech Thanks a lot!
Hello, I need the raw footage on 12 bits for download, please upload on google drive
Hi. It’s available for download via my Patreon page
It's the BlackMagic compatible with Sony alpha Siii or FX30!?
The BlackMagic just records whatever video signal the camera is putting out. So, as long as your camera can send a clean HDMI video feed out, it's compatible. Both devices don't 'talk' to each other.
RAW compatibility is a different story. You'll have to look up your camera's specs to see if it can output BRAW over HDMI. As far as I know though, your cameras can't output BRAW.
@@RedFrameTech Ok I understand now, I checked and actually they don't give it compatible for braw in Sony Models, so I imagine that via HDMI I can only record in Rec 709 format in fullHD, 4K etc. I'm not very familiar with external monitors and I'm starting to find out now to make the purchase. Can I ask you another question?
Sure! Ask away 🙂@@michelegobbifilms
For example, if I recorded in the camera in 1080p 100m 1/200 in the Visual Assist via HDMI, could I record in 1080p60? Or am I obligated to keep the same parameters? I honestly have no idea how it works and I find little information online here in Italy. So I hope U can help me @RedFrameTech 😂
@@michelegobbifilms The Video Assist will record whatever the camera is putting out over HDMI. That means that if you’re shooting 1080p 60fps in-camera, the camera will also put 1080p 60fps out over HDMI. Some cameras can downscale the output (for example 4K internal and 1080p over HDMI), but that’s just resolution. All other parameters stay as they are in-camera, so you can’t record in a different frame rate on the Video Assist than your camera is set to.
Look at it like this: Simply put, an external monitor/recorder is a fancy tiny computer monitor or TV that displays a video signal from whatever source is connected to it via HDMI. With a TV it could be a set-top box and with a computer monitor..well.. a computer 🙂 An external camera monitor/recorder just also happens to have all sorts of tools built in and is able to record the video signal, but the principle of the connection is the same (except for RAW).
I use a BMPCC 4K so the Video Assist all the way.
Makes perfect sense!
6:45 agree 100! Shouldn't monitor LUT exposures.
If only Atomos would listen..