@2:30 my one critism for this episode. The second Bird of Prey supporting the Defiant. Nothing ever hits it. But it's wing randomly explodes causing it to crash into the Jem'hadar battlecruiser.
@@anthonylasalle7392 Took a lot of zooming and slowing down, but theres a Dominion torpedo that swipes it and I guess that was enough to sheer it off? I mean its only a B'rel tbf. I don't suppose its particularly strong structurally.
@@anthonylasalle7392 if you slow mo it, the wing takes a glancing blow from the battle cruiser's torpedo barrage and disintegrates. According to the (excellent) Haynes Workshop Manual for the B'rel class Klingon Bird Of Prey, the wings contain warp coils, and so warp plasma. The loss of pressure in the distribution manifold probably led to a catastrophic core imbalance. If you want to complain about Birds Of Prey though, just a few frames earlier, that same BOP destroys its own squadron leader with friendly fire! At least they didn't have to live with their dishonour for very long!
Still one of the best tv battle sequences ever. One of as in comparison to the other battles in the Dominion War. When they did battles, they did them right.
@@saquist The "Way of the Warrior" was amazing, no doubt about it. But when speaking of sheer magnitude of story line, nothing tops "Sacrifice of Angels". It was the culmination of a 7 episode arc, something which has never been done in the history of Trek. Everything was on the line and nothing was left off the table. Granted, I wish the ending wasn't so Deus Ex Machina. To me, Way of the Warrior was like "Lord of the Rings"The Two Towers", and "Sacrifice of Angels" was Trek's "Return of the King".
@@Zero8880 Its strange you should make those comparisons because the Return of the King Battle was also lesser than the Two Towers Battle of Helms Deep. I think suspense makes a battle better. In Return of the King and Sacrifice of Angels there was no significant loss to finalize the battle. The victories were complete without cost. But Battle of Helms deep was grim and ugly...a story unto itself. The elves and their general were completely massacred. And during Way of the Warrior the Klingons take heavy causalities and a state of war between the Federation and Klingons is the result.
This battle looked AMAZING in the DS9 "What We Left Behind" documentary that I saw. The work that they put into bringing everything up to 4K standards was truly something else. Although we only saw a bit of the re-done battle from Sacrifice of Angels, what we DID see was absolutely gorgeous!!! The clips of the episodes that were 4K looked awesome too. DS9 could do with a re-master re-release! They did it with TOS and TNG, bring on the rest but DS9 next haha!!
The defiant: entire battle with a fleet of enemies and warps out to save Ds9 The Voyager: takes one shot from a random light cruiser in the delta quadrant "warp drive is offline captain"
@@a.dykeman1980 Nah, Voyager always had a cloaked Starbase around it to repair the hull and make things nice and shiny at the end of each episode it was involved in a major fight. How else do you explain the extra torpedoes they always seemed to have and extra shuttle craft, not to mention the resources to build not one, but 2 different delta flyers.... It couldn't just be down to completely lazy writing.
You can get a glimpse of DS9 in HD already, thanks to the documentary "What We Left Behind". Some of the remastered live-action and space-scenes can also be seen here on YT. :-) th-cam.com/video/XIepSqPZnnI/w-d-xo.html
As someone who likes Discovery =, i have to admit DS9s battle scenes were superior. More coherent and moved at a ace where you could distinguish the different ships. Less quick edits and close ups make for better viewing experience.
That pair of gleaming 642m long battleships effortlessly laying waste to that Cardie garbage scow. #tipofthespear #galaxyclasswarship #dispersalpatternsierra
No it doesn't.Multiple galaxies ganging up on an antiquated ship and failing to do more then cripple it when other smaller ships would have had a bigger effect is an embarassment if anything. But then that's ok because the galaxy class was never designed to be a military ship so don't know where you got the "meaningful military investment") from.
I remember back when I was a teenager. Yeah I saw a but of Next Generation but I wasn't really a Trek fan. I was home during summer vacation and Spike TV channel was doing a DS9 marathon. I'd never seen DS9 so I was like ok cool. After the first day I was hooked. Fast forward a few days later and this is where we're at. This first really huge fleet battle in all of ST. You best believe I was hype af.
"any other ships make it?" "no sir...the other ships don't have main cast on board so they don't get to do anything other than die voicelessly in the wilderness for our sake"
Man these DS9 Dominion war seasons were so great back in the day! No visiting planets on some diplomatic yawn mission or taking the morally higher ground and walking away from a fight as usual. Just a no bs, no quarters asked or given war.
Dukat really got overconfident. As soon as the Klingons came in he should've ordered all his ships to move. Because of him ordering to stand still he left his forces to be picked off one by one.
The use of fighters by the Federation is interesting, shows an all or nothing point of the war. Fighters are such an interesting concept in Trek, on the one hand they are going to larger than most sci-fi fighters due to Trek being Trek, 2-7 crew maybe but they can still get picked off easy due to the accuracy and power of Trek weapons, but on the other hand we know in Trek even a very small ship can carry devastating firepower. Still....probs not the ship you want to be in such an engagement.
1:20 Have you ever noticed how that Miranda-class ahead of the Defiant's starboard bow is MUCH smaller than the one off the Defiant's starboard-aft? ? ;)
Great episode but I would have concentrated the battle footage into 90 seconds straight in the first segment to jolt the viewer into "this is important episode" territory. I remember being disappointed on first viewing that they kept cutting away from battle to give endless exposition of things that previous 6 episodes already made abundantly clear.
Erm, I thought the Defiant was meant to be hard, yet at the start fo this clip you see an old BoP destroying a Jem'Hadar ship easier than the Defiant did...
I only now notice that the Dominion Battleship explodes because the right hand Bird of Prey accidentally crashed into it. How dare you use my own spells against me, Potter!
Never understood why they had to get so close. Both to friendly ships and the enemy. Surely keeping a distance shooting each other would still be effective? Well dominion side they just ram their ships so more reason to keep a distance?
It would have been funny the prophets or wormhole aliens sent them to the delta quadrant and the dominion ships had to deal with hundreds of borg ships,that would have been some battle.
Yea! Image if they really had a whole hour of ship fighting with no characters! Tight. I bet they would have gotten away with it with a correct set up from previous episodes.
Sisko, "we have no choice but to fight our way through". Emmmmm, Captain,, where did all the Klingon ships come from?? Ehhhh from all the vast empty space around both our fleets... So ensign, what you're telling me is that we could have went around the enemy fleet very easily, gotten to ds9 to accomplish our mission in time?? Yip
always wondered where the enterprise E was during this war. Wasn't the Sovereign class supposed to be the most advanced ship star fleet had at the time?
I love how the Galaxies are just trolling around without much concern in this battle since at this point they have their shield and weapon upgrades, making them the second toughest ship in the war after a Dominion Dreadnaught. If only we could have seen USS Sovereign and USS Enterprise-E tearing up some Dominion Battleships.
@@ianhirst1148 Usually seeing ships of the same class as another "hero" ship can be distracting, and same goes for seeing a Prometheus doing some elaborate moves. Remember, the Defiant is supposed to be the "star" of any ship battle scenes.
@@agnosticnixie I don’t think the Sovereign even appeared in DS9, which does make sense because it would absolutely steal the show from whatever other ships are onscreen.
Kinda nice to see the Galaxy class kicking butt instead of being easily destroyed. They must have needed extensive refits to be able to take a beating.
Same goes for Klingon Birds of Prey. The only ship that ever seems to survive to get through for the actual objective, is the Defiant. Besides the Breen battle at Chintoka, of course. General says to escort the Defiant, you might as well tell your family and friends goodbye because you're not coming out alive. Unless you're in an escape pod. Then you might live to see another day. Maybe. What I never figured out is, why send in two Miranda Class ships as escort? They had more Defiant Class ships so why not send them in as escort. They're all just as maneuverable as each other and are all tough, even if the escorts wouldn't have the ablative armor, so they'd have an easier time keeping up and avoid getting blown up. For at least a little bit longer than the Miranda Class ships lasted. The BoP should have gone in with a Vor'Cha class attack ship (or 2) to take the bulk of the fire from the heavy dominion ships so their smaller ships would be less of a priority target. They'd have had a better chance of making it through. They also need an Overdrive gear to help them keep up with the Defiant. lol It's like pairing up a Cadillac with a Lamborghini. Both are good looking cars, but the L is just too fast for the Cady to keep up.
Starfleet: "Hey Klingons can you do us a bit of a favor?" Klingon Empire: "Whaaaaat, need help exploring some stupid nebula or something?'' Starfleet: " We need your help attacking this heavily armed space station that's protected by hundreds of Dominion ships" Klingon Empire: "Oh darling, you make me so happy"
1:38 to 1:59 Starfleet Command Highest Commendations issued to The Crews of The Miranda Class Starships (Known for Taking It for The Team) U.S.S. Sitak NCC-32591 or NCC-33921 and The U.S.S. Majestic NCC-31000 Loss in Action providing Combat Escort To The Starship U.S.S. Defiant NX-74205.
Given how fragile those are and how advanced drone technology already is in 2019, wouldn't it have made more sense to pilot them as unmanned vehicles? Or at the very least outfit them with a ton of firepower and hold them back as destroyers instead of in the fight as cannon fodder?
This is shockingly good CG work for the time and for a tv show. These scenes have held up much better than Babylon 5 or Space Above and Beyond’s visuals.
@@bellgrand O ye, I wanna get around to Battlestar Galactica eventually too. Never heard of Galactic Heroes actually, will add that to the list. I watched the Expanse earlier this year. Watching Mandalorean atm. Last year I rewatched all of DS9, SG1, SGA, and Dark Matter. I'm not good at binging, it always takes me a month or longer to finish a show 😆 O ye, Strange New Worlds is pretty good too.
@@toddsmitts i feel like the Federation should really built powerful warships and give officers military training, but still focus on peace and exploration
@@toddsmitts You are actually wrong about that. In the episode Call to Arms, Deep Space Nines shields which had been augmented with Federation technology held. Weyoun was surprised by this development to which Dukat stated "I find it wise to never underestimate Star Fleets technical expertise... Or Captain Siskos persistence". Star Fleet reworked the shields to work better.
porpus99 The dominion ships were using a new type of weapon that the federation hadn’t encountered before. They had similar issues the first time they encountered disrupter type weapons on starships.
@@toddsmitts They do work, just not that well. The Galaxy class starship can hold its own for a while, but older ships like the Miranda and Excelsior just don't have the same power output, which is why their shields fail quite quickly.
@@danielwalker26 None of these shows are specifically ‘about’ space battles. But the battles in Discovery and Picard were poorly presented visually and dull
@Drew Kestrel I would imagine they were specially tuned up from the luxury cruiseliner that was the Enterprise. No families in that saucer section i'll wager
As previously mentioned - the first time this episode aired it was one thing seeing 4 Galaxy class on screen giving the Dominion a fucking good kicking - but later on...ya know AFTER the commercial break...the Defiant is damaged, coms are out - a few panels exploded (thanks non-existent starfleet sci-fi tech that can create transparent aluminum capable of surviving an impact with a planet but cant make a god damn surge protector) and even Obrian is beginning to wonder how much of a beating this ship can take.. but when they cut to the wide shot you still see them going - - amongst a smaller federation fleet no less - still kicking ass! I mean seriously - as a die-hard trek / sci-fi fleet battle lover I have to be honest and I know I am not the only one but when that Cardasian ship was messing about with those poor outdated cannon fodder Miranda class ships - when not one but TWO Galaxy Class - you know - the Federations most powerful overall class of ships at that time more or less - that have phaser's that hit harder than some species Torpedos - oh and the beam is the size of a small house so yeah - they step in and be like "um...scuse me....new number whos this BITCH!" - anyway as a trek fan when that moment happened...of COURSE it was a "Hell Yeah fuckem up!" We / I was so sick of seeing the Federation always have to go on the defensive - and sure the battle was only won due to the Klingons but man those Galaxy Class finally got to go John Wick on the Dominion! Now get this - GET THIS! - Imagin - you see out of the corner of the wide shot a saucer section flying around - your like "um what?" but then you see a stardrive fly near it firing everything its goe - HOLY FUCK SAUCER SEPERATION MID-BATTLE! NOW THAT WOULD HAVE BEEN AMAZING! Sorry for the use of colorful metaphors...but I am enjoying my evening off and heck - that was pretty damn funny typing that ;) Don't remember the scene? Go look it up!
The Defiant was heavily over rated, purely because it was a "Hero" ship, on paper it's no stronger or tougher than a Excelsior class ship. In that entire battle the ships that were the real dangers were the Akira class ships, they were monsters that were covered in torpedo tubes, had the phaser power matching the larger Galaxy class & were almost certainly the carriers of those fighters seeing as originally they were designed with the mid decks of the saucer section as one massive hanger bay. They really should have made a series with an Akira as the Hero ship, maybe as a post Voyager series having the Borg regroup & start a full force counter attack war, then we'd see that ship doing what it was meant to, fight Borg.
The Akira came out several years after the Defiant and the producers underestimated how popular it would be (It was only intended to fill screen space initially) Plus the Defiant IS pretty powerful for it's size (That's the key here, 'for it's size') Plus the cloak it had at it's introduction. An Excelsior's worth of power in a ship the size of a B'rel Bird of Prey? Pretty powerful IMO.
What the Dominion mustve been thinking when the Defiant came back out the Wormhole all like "just took out 10.000 Dominion ships in less than a minute, no sweat" Dominion: "WTF is that ship made of?"
Funny story surrounding this episode Berman: "Okay so were going to wrap up the Dominion war with this episode right?" Moore: "IT'S A FUCKING WAR! THEY CAN LAST AGES!"
The shots of Starfleet ships as DS9 were actually recycled from "Way of the Warrior" and "Blaze of Glory". (I remember the latter, because it was the first exterior shot where we saw the Defiant docked at the station).
I like the treatment the Galaxy Class got on DS9 after the destruction of the Odyssey. Fully outfitted for war with that massive powerplant focused on nothing but shields and weapons? Fuck around and find out.
In one nod to comm officer contact federation flag officer we want to join you. Sisko responds Agreed provisionally but if you screw us over you will pay dearly with your lives. Comma go dead. Contacts dominion high command so to inform you for your destruction of our cities we going to vaporise the jem hadar. As for the founder the remnants of the obsidion order aboard my ship have a little experiment. All hail star fleet. Comms go dead
I’ll summarize the ending for you: Sisko: Hey Prophet wormhole aliens, can you do Bajor and me a solid? Prophet wormhole aliens: Eh? Oh yea sure fam we got ya.
Just a thing I noticed all the time... sounded like one of the Bird of Prey ships lost steam, fighting off the mother ship Jemh'dar one...maybe it was pinpointing the exact parts of the ship....to destroy it....but, the Klingon ship was destroyed after that.....😒😒
The Galaxy class ships revenging their sister ship, the USS Odyssey. What a satisfying battle! You can pick on one Galaxy class, but more will come back and unleash their fury upon you. Dominion learned that the hard way.
The Odyssey did not deserve her fate, but she was avenged with this beautiful scene, opening with two War-refit GCS' unloading phasers on a Galor picking on Mirandas. Must have felt so good for thos Captains cutting through the chaff so effortlessly, sending PTSD to Glinms and Guls for generations to come.
I really wish we got to see the Akira class doing what it does best in Star Trek, laying down an insane amount of torpedo fire. I can just imagine 3 or 4 Akira's side by side 15 rapid fire torpedo tubes on each ship just unleashing a hellfire of quantum torpedoes at the Dominion/Cardassian lines just destroying ship after ship.
Love DS9 and this episode so much. One problem I do have with it, not the actual episode but some in universe stuff, is Starfleet’s fleet doctrine. It makes no sense in a war. They have way to many different types of ships of different ages and capabilities. For war in the post DS9 time they need a few dedicated classes of ships. They should compliment each other and fill in each other's weaknesses. They need a new heavily armed carrier that launches Defiants and provides long range torpedo attacks, C&C, communications and sensor data, logistics and repairs. The carrier should be protected by 8 Steamrunner and 24 Saber class ships as well as drones and its own weapons. They make up the rear guard as the group advances. The carrier wing consists of 3 squadrons made up of Defiant’s, 75 ships in total. The carrier Attack group should be made up of 10 Prometheus and 2 Sovereign class vessels. 5 Prometheuses to Each Sovereign. Each combat fleet should be made up of 5 carrier strike groups.
If you watch this at .75x speed the ship scenes take on a slower, mass suggestive grace more like wrath of kahn maneuver speeds....makes the battle have more scale and weight....starships need slow grace not xwing bank turns
Notice the glaring inconsistencies of the shields. Every ship must have them. However, on many attacks, for instance the Defiant, just merrily flies through the formation popping off Cardasian Cruisers as if they had no shields at all. Same thing with Federation ships getting taken out with a first shot. You would think that the Federation (and the bad guys) would consider the loss of 400+ crew members in a single ship as a good requirement to have more sturdier defenses. On the other hand, how dare I bring up these engineering dilemmas when it so much fun watching ships getting blown to pieces.
i highly doubt during war time they would have that many people on those ships, they would have the minimum amount necessary as they would likely run out of officers before they run out of ships
Military equipment is designed to function with a certain crew complement from the smallest to the largest. A fighter aircraft has a single person in the cockpit (except for the two-seaters). An aircraft carrier has 5000 people on it. They all have a job to do. There are no "excess" personnel you could do without if you want to accomplish a mission. I worked in the Pentagon for 40 years and spent 15 years in the Army. I know what I am talking about. And while I am at it, I may as well bring up the fact in many cases of combat you see space ships targeting a ship and missing that ship. I would hope that by the 24th century targeting equipment would be 100% accurate. When you lock on and fire, you get a hit. Maybe the shot would be ineffective due to shielding, but you would still get that hit and not just blast open space. The weapons we have now in the military have those capabilities. In fact, we used these kinds of smart weapons in the first Gulf War in 1991, 27 years ago.
Never been in the military but there would not be infinite manpower, you need people with skills to do jobs, so i do think the federation would face that crisis, because thousands of captains were killed in the dominion war, there is only so much personnel. Thank you for you're service.
Regarding infinite manpower, we have that capability today. It is called the military draft. When you reach the age of 18 (in the USA) you are required to register with the Selective Service so the government can call you up if there is a wartime situation that requires more manpower. Look here: www.sss.gov/Registration-Info It is not inconceivable that they would have a system like this in the 24th century. And don't forget the Federation consists of many different worlds with billions of potential candidates. I don't know where you got your casualty statistics but it is highly unlikely that "thousands" of captains were lost. There is only one captain per ship. If he gets killed his First Officer takes over. In order to lose thousands of captains you have to lose roughly the same number of ships. As far as skills are concerned, the military invests in a huge enterprise to train every person in the military to do the job they are assigned to.
Military draft isn't viable anymore except in the most extreme of circumstances. After WW2 we started moving from a large standing army with basic weapons to a smaller 'professional army' The weapons and equipment now needs far more training to use properly and it takes longer to build such equipment. The registration is used more for a low-key buffer system now, the U.S. would have to be on the verge of invasion with the bulk of our Active Military, Reserves, and National Guard decimated before they would resort to a draft again. As to the starship shields, you're right, but I always just wrote it off as the ships we see exploding have just taken a lot of 'off-screen' damage that lowered their shields before the scenes we see. They had already been in combat for a while before the ships started exploding. (Although the initial engagement happened off-screen, they could have been fighting for a couple minutes all the way up to ten) Of course the REAL reason is because the screenwriters wanted to do it this way. I can only assume it's because they had such a massive number of ships, but didn't want to spend hours showing their defenses getting beaten down before we started seeing combat resolutions.
For a ship to fly past through an explosion in space unscathed as if no debris flying off from all direction at high speed is only possible in the Star Trek universe. In space, the battle is a noisy affair. And the Dominian fleet was redirected to Tatooine, in a galaxy of far, far away.
@DARK 6 So, deflector shield should be the same forcefield that stop the phaser and photon torpedoes fire. Does it mean that the forcefield selectively don't cover the native ship own capability to fire their own projectiles, which make the turret susceptible to enemy fire, or how can certain molecules can make it through the deflector and others can't? Like earth forcefield, it blocks charged particles from the sun but it won't stop anything metallic from punching through.
Fighters are a nuisance weapon and ideal for a combat situation like this, in the trek universe it boils down to who losses shields first. The fighters go in draw fire away from the large expensive capital ships, the resources that go into a fighter as well as manpower needed is far less than a mother ship, expendability. They pack enough of a punch to weaken shields as well as targets of opportunity along the way and easier flanking maneuvers to divert attention and cause general chaos in the skirmish, the capital ships act as artillery delivering the killing blows. Basically the fighters are an expendable force that draws fire away from the main fleet while adding more opportunity to weaken enemy shields enough to deliver a killing blow.
If youre ever flying into battle on a Miranda class ship, make sure you have an up to date last will and testament.
Holy shit, better have your affairs in order. Lol
For being 25yrs old, this animation holds up pretty good.
It held up better than me.
@2:30 my one critism for this episode. The second Bird of Prey supporting the Defiant. Nothing ever hits it. But it's wing randomly explodes causing it to crash into the Jem'hadar battlecruiser.
@@anthonylasalle7392 Took a lot of zooming and slowing down, but theres a Dominion torpedo that swipes it and I guess that was enough to sheer it off? I mean its only a B'rel tbf. I don't suppose its particularly strong structurally.
Back then it was amazing.... today ehh.... I think it's just below "pretty good"
I'd just call it "good" for now, but it's not long for this world 😆
@@anthonylasalle7392 if you slow mo it, the wing takes a glancing blow from the battle cruiser's torpedo barrage and disintegrates. According to the (excellent) Haynes Workshop Manual for the B'rel class Klingon Bird Of Prey, the wings contain warp coils, and so warp plasma. The loss of pressure in the distribution manifold probably led to a catastrophic core imbalance.
If you want to complain about Birds Of Prey though, just a few frames earlier, that same BOP destroys its own squadron leader with friendly fire! At least they didn't have to live with their dishonour for very long!
For me, this is still THE GREATEST moment in television history.
I was 7 years old. 1:30 - 1:35 was the most epic thing I had ever seen.
Still one of the best tv battle sequences ever. One of as in comparison to the other battles in the Dominion War. When they did battles, they did them right.
The Way of the Warrior was the best Battle Star Trek has EVER Seen BAR NONE. No crappy CGI.
@@saquist The "Way of the Warrior" was amazing, no doubt about it. But when speaking of sheer magnitude of story line, nothing tops "Sacrifice of Angels". It was the culmination of a 7 episode arc, something which has never been done in the history of Trek. Everything was on the line and nothing was left off the table. Granted, I wish the ending wasn't so Deus Ex Machina. To me, Way of the Warrior was like "Lord of the Rings"The Two Towers", and "Sacrifice of Angels" was Trek's "Return of the King".
@@Zero8880 Its strange you should make those comparisons because the Return of the King Battle was also lesser than the Two Towers Battle of Helms Deep.
I think suspense makes a battle better. In Return of the King and Sacrifice of Angels there was no significant loss to finalize the battle. The victories were complete without cost.
But Battle of Helms deep was grim and ugly...a story unto itself. The elves and their general were completely massacred. And during Way of the Warrior the Klingons take heavy causalities and a state of war between the Federation and Klingons is the result.
This battle looked AMAZING in the DS9 "What We Left Behind" documentary that I saw. The work that they put into bringing everything up to 4K standards was truly something else. Although we only saw a bit of the re-done battle from Sacrifice of Angels, what we DID see was absolutely gorgeous!!! The clips of the episodes that were 4K looked awesome too. DS9 could do with a re-master re-release! They did it with TOS and TNG, bring on the rest but DS9 next haha!!
The defiant: entire battle with a fleet of enemies and warps out to save Ds9
The Voyager: takes one shot from a random light cruiser in the delta quadrant "warp drive is offline captain"
The difference between a warship and a science ship.
To be fair, Voyager probably had more hull patches in it than proper Armor after two or three seasons
@@a.dykeman1980 Nah, Voyager always had a cloaked Starbase around it to repair the hull and make things nice and shiny at the end of each episode it was involved in a major fight.
How else do you explain the extra torpedoes they always seemed to have and extra shuttle craft, not to mention the resources to build not one, but 2 different delta flyers....
It couldn't just be down to completely lazy writing.
Something about the Galaxy Class ships working together in battle is such visually great eye candy.
DS9 was always my favorite of all the shows but this Armada vs Armada Was amazing. Those small fighters were putting in work.
One of Treks all time greatest sequences. Is the Venture and Magellan creasing that one Galor.
it will be great when DS9 comes out on Blue Ray remastered, the detail in these fights is going to be great!
Not going to happen
You can get a glimpse of DS9 in HD already, thanks to the documentary "What We Left Behind". Some of the remastered live-action and space-scenes can also be seen here on YT. :-)
th-cam.com/video/XIepSqPZnnI/w-d-xo.html
Sadly the entire show most likely will never happen
As someone who likes Discovery =, i have to admit DS9s battle scenes were superior. More coherent and moved at a ace where you could distinguish the different ships. Less quick edits and close ups make for better viewing experience.
As someone who has watched every incarnation of Star Trek except TAS and Discovery S2, I think ST Discovery is bad but you have my respect.
That is one hell of a space battle. lol
DS9 has some of the best space battles in sci fi history.
When the Klingon’s joined the fight, I was filled with adrenaline!
Please notice at minute 1:24 to 1:26, that one excelsior on the right of the galaxys just flooring it towards the dominion wall. XD
Yeager class spotted at 3:28.
Hahah a disgrace of a kitbash
My favorite part is when the Reliant gets blown to bits!
This scene clearly illustrates The Galaxy Class Development Project as a meaningful military investment.
That pair of gleaming 642m long battleships effortlessly laying waste to that Cardie garbage scow. #tipofthespear #galaxyclasswarship #dispersalpatternsierra
The fucking spoonheads need to remember their masters.
They should separate saucers and have even more firepower.
No it doesn't.Multiple galaxies ganging up on an antiquated ship and failing to do more then cripple it when other smaller ships would have had a bigger effect is an embarassment if anything. But then that's ok because the galaxy class was never designed to be a military ship so don't know where you got the "meaningful military investment") from.
@@libertinarey In terms of firepower, it is a military ship. because Starfleet is considered military.
I remember back when I was a teenager. Yeah I saw a but of Next Generation but I wasn't really a Trek fan. I was home during summer vacation and Spike TV channel was doing a DS9 marathon. I'd never seen DS9 so I was like ok cool. After the first day I was hooked. Fast forward a few days later and this is where we're at. This first really huge fleet battle in all of ST. You best believe I was hype af.
Let’s all give a thumbs up if we think this video deserves more views!
Thank you. I have not done a lot of work on this channel for a while. check out the other version on this channel with music.
"any other ships make it?"
"no sir...the other ships don't have main cast on board so they don't get to do anything other than die voicelessly in the wilderness for our sake"
Well said.
Man these DS9 Dominion war seasons were so great back in the day! No visiting planets on some diplomatic yawn mission or taking the morally higher ground and walking away from a fight as usual. Just a no bs, no quarters asked or given war.
Dukat really got overconfident. As soon as the Klingons came in he should've ordered all his ships to move. Because of him ordering to stand still he left his forces to be picked off one by one.
The use of fighters by the Federation is interesting, shows an all or nothing point of the war. Fighters are such an interesting concept in Trek, on the one hand they are going to larger than most sci-fi fighters due to Trek being Trek, 2-7 crew maybe but they can still get picked off easy due to the accuracy and power of Trek weapons, but on the other hand we know in Trek even a very small ship can carry devastating firepower.
Still....probs not the ship you want to be in such an engagement.
Better than Star Wars.
Obviously.
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
@@mikek0135 🤣¹⁰⁰
@mrbuck5059: Oh yeah? Well 🤣 ^1000
1:20 Have you ever noticed how that Miranda-class ahead of the Defiant's starboard bow is MUCH smaller than the one off the Defiant's starboard-aft? ? ;)
I wonder if real explosions in space looks like overlaid fireball graphics
1:18 CHARGE
Defiant goes in & the oncoming Dominion force pulls a "fuck this shit I'm out". The Prophets//Wormhole Aliens is just a cover. :P
Greatest Battle in Star Trek history
Great episode but I would have concentrated the battle footage into 90 seconds straight in the first segment to jolt the viewer into "this is important episode" territory. I remember being disappointed on first viewing that they kept cutting away from battle to give endless exposition of things that previous 6 episodes already made abundantly clear.
Erm, I thought the Defiant was meant to be hard, yet at the start fo this clip you see an old BoP destroying a Jem'Hadar ship easier than the Defiant did...
Power Levels are bullshit
Victory is life.
Today is a good day to die.
"It's never a Good Day to lose a Friend". LT.CMDR .Jadzia Dax DS9 Bloodoath.
You are what starfleet considers a non com
I'm gonna make a technology that allows ships to fire while cloaked. I'm gonna make so much latinium.
I only now notice that the Dominion Battleship explodes because the right hand Bird of Prey accidentally crashed into it.
How dare you use my own spells against me, Potter!
Never understood why they had to get so close. Both to friendly ships and the enemy. Surely keeping a distance shooting each other would still be effective? Well dominion side they just ram their ships so more reason to keep a distance?
It would have been funny the prophets or wormhole aliens sent them to the delta quadrant and the dominion ships had to deal with hundreds of borg ships,that would have been some battle.
Yea! Image if they really had a whole hour of ship fighting with no characters! Tight. I bet they would have gotten away with it with a correct set up from previous episodes.
I wish I had the time to go through the whole of Star Trek to stitch space battle scenes.
At first glance, this looks like a bigger engagement than the battle at Wolf-359. Of course, that had a completely different outcome.
It's much bigger than Wolf 359. That was around 30 ships I believe. This was nearly 2000 as stated in the episode.
Sisko, "we have no choice but to fight our way through". Emmmmm, Captain,, where did all the Klingon ships come from?? Ehhhh from all the vast empty space around both our fleets... So ensign, what you're telling me is that we could have went around the enemy fleet very easily, gotten to ds9 to accomplish our mission in time?? Yip
thanks. Tasha
You know those fighter torpedoes were really effective. Why didn't they use them more?
Bc they only have 2. They can't carry more.
@@KH4444444444Nthe show some pumping out like 3 double round bursts.
always wondered where the enterprise E was during this war. Wasn't the Sovereign class supposed to be the most advanced ship star fleet had at the time?
@Lima Neris At the very least, include the prototype USS Sovereign. Surprised we never saw it as the flagship of Admiral Ross.
I guess they just had to remove them to have an excuse to show that overhyped Defiant.
The Enterprise D was destroyed a few weeks before season 4 of DS9 when Worf joins the crew. Maybe the Enterprise E or Sovereign wasn’t ready then
Are shields even a thing anymore?
Did anyone ever figure out why no one has shields in this show?
after having a bad day and watching this turns my mood around 360degrees
A 50 year old Ambassador -class to the rescue?
I love how the Galaxies are just trolling around without much concern in this battle since at this point they have their shield and weapon upgrades, making them the second toughest ship in the war after a Dominion Dreadnaught.
If only we could have seen USS Sovereign and USS Enterprise-E tearing up some Dominion Battleships.
or other Defiant class ships or the Prometheus with must- vector assualt mode.
@@ianhirst1148 Usually seeing ships of the same class as another "hero" ship can be distracting, and same goes for seeing a Prometheus doing some elaborate moves.
Remember, the Defiant is supposed to be the "star" of any ship battle scenes.
Tragically the most use of the Sovereign and Intrepid the DS9 team was allowed was, like, background stuff
@@agnosticnixie I don’t think the Sovereign even appeared in DS9, which does make sense because it would absolutely steal the show from whatever other ships are onscreen.
@@BeastBoom24 There's at least one LCARS display of a Sovereign in the background in some of the big admiralty scenes
after so many years i still get excited about those galaxy class starships teaming up against the galor
Kinda nice to see the Galaxy class kicking butt instead of being easily destroyed. They must have needed extensive refits to be able to take a beating.
Fair to say that ship was out of commission.
for me its how the miranda class ships take those dominion torpedoes. especially the first one where the force just sends in flipping backwards
They literally push it out of the way. They just shoved them aside like "Dude, move it! We got places to be!"
Just sad the Enterprise-D wasn't present for all this.
A lesson for all future Ship Captains: Don't ever be a ship in escort formation with the U.S.S. Defiant.
correction. Future Miranda Captains
RIP those crewmen and women, but they got cool deaths, not just a bit explosion but the ship's being punctured, burned and flipped into a roll.
Same goes for Klingon Birds of Prey. The only ship that ever seems to survive to get through for the actual objective, is the Defiant. Besides the Breen battle at Chintoka, of course. General says to escort the Defiant, you might as well tell your family and friends goodbye because you're not coming out alive. Unless you're in an escape pod. Then you might live to see another day. Maybe.
What I never figured out is, why send in two Miranda Class ships as escort? They had more Defiant Class ships so why not send them in as escort. They're all just as maneuverable as each other and are all tough, even if the escorts wouldn't have the ablative armor, so they'd have an easier time keeping up and avoid getting blown up. For at least a little bit longer than the Miranda Class ships lasted. The BoP should have gone in with a Vor'Cha class attack ship (or 2) to take the bulk of the fire from the heavy dominion ships so their smaller ships would be less of a priority target. They'd have had a better chance of making it through. They also need an Overdrive gear to help them keep up with the Defiant. lol It's like pairing up a Cadillac with a Lamborghini. Both are good looking cars, but the L is just too fast for the Cady to keep up.
Mirandas are surprisingly nippy which you can see in the final battle scene of the series when the Dominion retreats to Cardassia.
😂😂😂😂
You've got to love that Klingon entrance. Just coming in out of the sun with all guns blazing. Epic.
Starfleet: "Hey Klingons can you do us a bit of a favor?"
Klingon Empire: "Whaaaaat, need help exploring some stupid nebula or something?''
Starfleet: " We need your help attacking this heavily armed space station that's protected by hundreds of Dominion ships"
Klingon Empire: "Oh darling, you make me so happy"
Man thoes Klingon Vor'cha Class Battlecruisers are sexy ships
where you see a vor'cha battlecruiser i saw a few b'rel bird of prey
@@incrediblemichael th-cam.com/video/CUQ2nmKNH3Y/w-d-xo.html
Did you rly missed the two vor'cha here in this shot?
@@elricvanekimus actually 3. but you only see part of the 3rd one.
Attack cruisers, not Battlecruisers.
Buy a model and cover it.
Miranda Class: The Red Shirt ships of Starfleet.
and piloted by storm troopers who can't hit a thing!
1:38 to 1:59 Starfleet Command Highest Commendations issued to The Crews of The Miranda Class Starships (Known for Taking It for The Team) U.S.S. Sitak NCC-32591 or NCC-33921 and The U.S.S. Majestic NCC-31000 Loss in Action providing Combat Escort To The Starship U.S.S. Defiant NX-74205.
Ironically, the first Miranda we ever see (USS Reliant) was entirely crewed by red shirts.
dont forget the Oberth
Given how fragile those are and how advanced drone technology already is in 2019, wouldn't it have made more sense to pilot them as unmanned vehicles? Or at the very least outfit them with a ton of firepower and hold them back as destroyers instead of in the fight as cannon fodder?
This is shockingly good CG work for the time and for a tv show. These scenes have held up much better than Babylon 5 or Space Above and Beyond’s visuals.
I know, right? It's hard to imagine that they were running in parallel.
damn, list more scifis I didn't watch yet 😆
@@Broockle The Expanse? Battlestar Galactica? The Legend of the Galactic Heroes?
@@bellgrand
O ye, I wanna get around to Battlestar Galactica eventually too. Never heard of Galactic Heroes actually, will add that to the list.
I watched the Expanse earlier this year.
Watching Mandalorean atm.
Last year I rewatched all of DS9, SG1, SGA, and Dark Matter.
I'm not good at binging, it always takes me a month or longer to finish a show 😆
O ye, Strange New Worlds is pretty good too.
The final season of Babylon 5 holds up. Look at the bombardment of Centauri Prime
I guess everyone got the same message, that shields would be delivered on Tuesday but the battle was on Monday.
Federation shields don't work against Dominion weapons, so at least some ships like the Defiant are equipped with ablative armor.
@@toddsmitts i feel like the Federation should really built powerful warships and give officers military training, but still focus on peace and exploration
@@toddsmitts You are actually wrong about that. In the episode Call to Arms, Deep Space Nines shields which had been augmented with Federation technology held. Weyoun was surprised by this development to which Dukat stated "I find it wise to never underestimate Star Fleets technical expertise... Or Captain Siskos persistence". Star Fleet reworked the shields to work better.
porpus99 The dominion ships were using a new type of weapon that the federation hadn’t encountered before. They had similar issues the first time they encountered disrupter type weapons on starships.
@@toddsmitts They do work, just not that well. The Galaxy class starship can hold its own for a while, but older ships like the Miranda and Excelsior just don't have the same power output, which is why their shields fail quite quickly.
To the makers of Discovery and Picard, this is how you make a battle look coherent and interesting.
Picard isn't about space battles though.
@@danielwalker26 None of these shows are specifically ‘about’ space battles. But the battles in Discovery and Picard were poorly presented visually and dull
And real weapon sounds....not some video arcade kind.
Yah! If you have 24 ep.in a series u can do it.
@@Ithinkiwill66 'Real' weapon sounds? *looks at the rest of Star Trek* Nope, those are fake too. Because its sci-fi.
"and now, the conclusion" gave me chills as a youngling
Anyone noticed the Galaxy class ship doing dogfight maneuvers on the background at 2:02?
I do now thanks, seeing the Galaxy class vessels in this was a treat.
They were bringing the heat!
@Drew Kestrel I would imagine they were specially tuned up from the luxury cruiseliner that was the Enterprise. No families in that saucer section i'll wager
I think I counted eight Galaxy class starships at least in this battle.
@@Noobsaibot21 Full on Galaxy class battleship mode!!
As previously mentioned - the first time this episode aired it was one thing seeing 4 Galaxy class on screen giving the Dominion a fucking good kicking - but later on...ya know AFTER the commercial break...the Defiant is damaged, coms are out - a few panels exploded (thanks non-existent starfleet sci-fi tech that can create transparent aluminum capable of surviving an impact with a planet but cant make a god damn surge protector) and even Obrian is beginning to wonder how much of a beating this ship can take.. but when they cut to the wide shot you still see them going - - amongst a smaller federation fleet no less - still kicking ass! I mean seriously - as a die-hard trek / sci-fi fleet battle lover I have to be honest and I know I am not the only one but when that Cardasian ship was messing about with those poor outdated cannon fodder Miranda class ships -
when not one but TWO Galaxy Class - you know - the Federations most powerful overall class of ships at that time more or less - that have phaser's that hit harder than some species Torpedos - oh and the beam is the size of a small house so yeah - they step in and be like "um...scuse me....new number whos this BITCH!" - anyway as a trek fan when that moment happened...of COURSE it was a "Hell Yeah fuckem up!" We / I was so sick of seeing the Federation always have to go on the defensive - and sure the battle was only won due to the Klingons but man those Galaxy Class finally got to go John Wick on the Dominion! Now get this - GET THIS! - Imagin - you see out of the corner of the wide shot a saucer section flying around - your like "um what?" but then you see a stardrive fly near it firing everything its goe - HOLY FUCK SAUCER SEPERATION MID-BATTLE! NOW THAT WOULD HAVE BEEN AMAZING! Sorry for the use of colorful metaphors...but I am enjoying my evening off and heck - that was pretty damn funny typing that ;) Don't remember the scene? Go look it up!
THE BREEN SHIPS HAVE POWERFUL WEAPONS, CAN DESTROY ONE GALAXY CLASS SHIP
The balls on those Federation fighters.
Fighters? More like suicide bombers. They should have used drones with remote control
Did you also notice every ship that escorts the Defiant gets obliterated? First it was a few fighters, then two Mirandas, then three Birds of Prey....
The Defiant was heavily over rated, purely because it was a "Hero" ship, on paper it's no stronger or tougher than a Excelsior class ship.
In that entire battle the ships that were the real dangers were the Akira class ships, they were monsters that were covered in torpedo tubes, had the phaser power matching the larger Galaxy class & were almost certainly the carriers of those fighters seeing as originally they were designed with the mid decks of the saucer section as one massive hanger bay.
They really should have made a series with an Akira as the Hero ship, maybe as a post Voyager series having the Borg regroup & start a full force counter attack war, then we'd see that ship doing what it was meant to, fight Borg.
The Akira came out several years after the Defiant and the producers underestimated how popular it would be (It was only intended to fill screen space initially) Plus the Defiant IS pretty powerful for it's size (That's the key here, 'for it's size') Plus the cloak it had at it's introduction. An Excelsior's worth of power in a ship the size of a B'rel Bird of Prey? Pretty powerful IMO.
Yes, the Defiant has the firepower of an excelsior, with the size and manuverability of a Bird of Prey! That's a pretty deadly ship.
Last time on STAR TREK DEEP SPACE 9 and now the conclusion of
"When Shit Gets Real"
What the Dominion mustve been thinking when the Defiant came back out the Wormhole all like "just took out 10.000 Dominion ships in less than a minute, no sweat"
Dominion: "WTF is that ship made of?"
Plot armor
Solid undammageablium and prophet shielding
The count was only 2800
Plotarmourium
Siskonium
Funny story surrounding this episode
Berman: "Okay so were going to wrap up the Dominion war with this episode right?"
Moore: "IT'S A FUCKING WAR! THEY CAN LAST AGES!"
I always like the scene at the end of the episode. With the federation ships docked at DS9! A Hard fought and well earned Victory!
What would have made it better is if they threw in some klingon ships aswell.
They had to find Martok a barrel of blood wine for Sisko.
The shots of Starfleet ships as DS9 were actually recycled from "Way of the Warrior" and "Blaze of Glory". (I remember the latter, because it was the first exterior shot where we saw the Defiant docked at the station).
This is the same scene as at the end of the battle in The way of the warrior.
I could actually hear the "OOOF" that the Galor made when it got bashed by the two Galaxy ships.....
What makes it great is it was picking on those Miranda's in the background then big brothers shows up.
Or the metallic ringing when that Miranda escorting the Defiant is taken out and tumbles towards the screen.
Not to mention the noise of someone crapping their pants on the bridge.
1:30 Always looved that scene! Galaxy class ships just slowly turning to SPANK the crap out of that cardassian ship!
WallyWinka same. I think they are paying back what the dominion done to the Odyssey!
RIP Odyssey, really liked the captain
RIP Captain Keogh.
While not meant specifically for combat, galaxy class ships have a ridiculous amount of firepower
If you look closely at the saucer section the registry says ncc-1701-d
Picard to Galor Class: We could continue firing on one another, and in such and engagement, you would be at a disadvantage.
Good thing the Klingons showed up. Even the mighty USS Defiant can only handle about 10 or 20 ships before showing signs of actually taking damage.
Well, except for the Explodium-lined control panels, those things blow out nearly every episode. I swear I've seen one blow out at least twice.
The Federation needs to invest in surge protectors.
Anne Sorou but they got such a good deal on the explodium from that ferengi! It would be a waste not to put it to use!
I like the treatment the Galaxy Class got on DS9 after the destruction of the Odyssey. Fully outfitted for war with that massive powerplant focused on nothing but shields and weapons? Fuck around and find out.
2:28-2:34 Klingon Bird of Prey's crew arrives at Sto'Vo'Kor - "Yeah, we took out a Dominion battle cruiser. What did you all do?"
"I was in a Federation fighter. I died in less than 30 seconds and got zero kills."
They'd have the angry crew of the bop they friendly fired to deal with first
"I was caught in the explosion from that one you jackass."
@@thavidu78 LMAO !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
@@thavidu78 LOL Brilliant!
Cardassian's the Italian's of the 24th century
In one nod to comm officer contact federation flag officer we want to join you. Sisko responds Agreed provisionally but if you screw us over you will pay dearly with your lives. Comma go dead. Contacts dominion high command so to inform you for your destruction of our cities we going to vaporise the jem hadar. As for the founder the remnants of the obsidion order aboard my ship have a little experiment. All hail star fleet. Comms go dead
I'm Italian and I can't get mad at that sad but true
Cardassians; plurals; apostrophes; Italians; morons; schools.
More like Germans or Prussians.
😂👍🏻
2:17- Damn that galaxy class ship has really taken a battering.
Would have loved to have seen the enterprise e in action
I’ll summarize the ending for you:
Sisko: Hey Prophet wormhole aliens, can you do Bajor and me a solid?
Prophet wormhole aliens: Eh? Oh yea sure fam we got ya.
for some reason I love the Blaster fire from the Kllingon ships than I do from the federation ships , if that makes sense.
what the Heavy Thump the Disruptors give compared to the Defiants High Whistle pew pew?
Just a thing I noticed all the time... sounded like one of the Bird of Prey ships lost steam, fighting off the mother ship Jemh'dar one...maybe it was pinpointing the exact parts of the ship....to destroy it....but, the Klingon ship was destroyed after that.....😒😒
The Galaxy class ships revenging their sister ship, the USS Odyssey. What a satisfying battle! You can pick on one Galaxy class, but more will come back and unleash their fury upon you. Dominion learned that the hard way.
The Odyssey did not deserve her fate, but she was avenged with this beautiful scene, opening with two War-refit GCS' unloading phasers on a Galor picking on Mirandas. Must have felt so good for thos Captains cutting through the chaff so effortlessly, sending PTSD to Glinms and Guls for generations to come.
1:19 "That's right, I said closer! Move as close as you can and engage those Star Destroyers at point blank range!"
I don't know why but I can hear Sisko saying that line perfectly.
Damn I love the sound of Klingon disruptors.
Klingon friendly fire at 2:24
Hah! "GET OUT 'DA WAY!"
that explosion came from the Cardassian Galor.
Also is there a green topedo one moment before ? it would be the only case I know a BoP fires a torpedo in DS9
Somebody wanted a promotion.
carnage2681 no...Klingon torpedos are red. Romulan torpedos are green
I really wish we got to see the Akira class doing what it does best in Star Trek, laying down an insane amount of torpedo fire. I can just imagine 3 or 4 Akira's side by side 15 rapid fire torpedo tubes on each ship just unleashing a hellfire of quantum torpedoes at the Dominion/Cardassian lines just destroying ship after ship.
i could've done with a few more of these battle scenes.
1:33 - I still love it when that Galor gets bitch slapped by the two Galaxy Class ships!
I know it's for dramatic effect, but these ships are implausibly close to each other given how fast they are moving. xD
Yup. The Expanse does it pretty good beltalowda.
Love DS9 and this episode so much. One problem I do have with it, not the actual episode but some in universe stuff, is Starfleet’s fleet doctrine. It makes no sense in a war. They have way to many different types of ships of different ages and capabilities. For war in the post DS9 time they need a few dedicated classes of ships. They should compliment each other and fill in each other's weaknesses. They need a new heavily armed carrier that launches Defiants and provides long range torpedo attacks, C&C, communications and sensor data, logistics and repairs. The carrier should be protected by 8 Steamrunner and 24 Saber class ships as well as drones and its own weapons. They make up the rear guard as the group advances. The carrier wing consists of 3 squadrons made up of Defiant’s, 75 ships in total. The carrier Attack group should be made up of 10 Prometheus and 2 Sovereign class vessels. 5 Prometheuses to Each Sovereign. Each combat fleet should be made up of 5 carrier strike groups.
Someone played too much Armada
@@derrickmoses1507 I miss that game. Still got it somewhere and my Windows XP still runs fine.
@@dennisdahl3 running armada 2 on win 10
If they remastered elite Force, I'd probably cry
The promethius class was still experimental.
Really well done. Seriously, that was awesome.
I like your Galaxian class Av.
#RealStarTrek ...nuff said.
If you watch this at .75x speed the ship scenes take on a slower, mass suggestive grace more like wrath of kahn maneuver speeds....makes the battle have more scale and weight....starships need slow grace not xwing bank turns
I'm trying this immediately.
Starfleet wins.
Ships and pew-pew = most impressive ever shown in Trek
Eye candy = epic (for the time)
Tactics and strategy = pathetic, tragic
Almost 25 years later and this battle still holds up well.
I like the fact in this we saw the power of war refit Galaxy-class ships and how there phasers simply ignored the shields on the Cardassian ships.
1:37. The way the galaxy class shot at the galor class is majestic in a way
Notice the glaring inconsistencies of the shields. Every ship must have them. However, on many attacks, for instance the Defiant, just merrily flies through the formation popping off Cardasian Cruisers as if they had no shields at all. Same thing with Federation ships getting taken out with a first shot. You would think that the Federation (and the bad guys) would consider the loss of 400+ crew members in a single ship as a good requirement to have more sturdier defenses. On the other hand, how dare I bring up these engineering dilemmas when it so much fun watching ships getting blown to pieces.
i highly doubt during war time they would have that many people on those ships, they would have the minimum amount necessary as they would likely run out of officers before they run out of ships
Military equipment is designed to function with a certain crew complement from the smallest to the largest. A fighter aircraft has a single person in the cockpit (except for the two-seaters). An aircraft carrier has 5000 people on it. They all have a job to do. There are no "excess" personnel you could do without if you want to accomplish a mission. I worked in the Pentagon for 40 years and spent 15 years in the Army. I know what I am talking about. And while I am at it, I may as well bring up the fact in many cases of combat you see space ships targeting a ship and missing that ship. I would hope that by the 24th century targeting equipment would be 100% accurate. When you lock on and fire, you get a hit. Maybe the shot would be ineffective due to shielding, but you would still get that hit and not just blast open space. The weapons we have now in the military have those capabilities. In fact, we used these kinds of smart weapons in the first Gulf War in 1991, 27 years ago.
Never been in the military but there would not be infinite manpower, you need people with skills to do jobs, so i do think the federation would face that crisis, because thousands of captains were killed in the dominion war, there is only so much personnel. Thank you for you're service.
Regarding infinite manpower, we have that capability today. It is called the military draft. When you reach the age of 18 (in the USA) you are required to register with the Selective Service so the government can call you up if there is a wartime situation that requires more manpower. Look here: www.sss.gov/Registration-Info It is not inconceivable that they would have a system like this in the 24th century. And don't forget the Federation consists of many different worlds with billions of potential candidates. I don't know where you got your casualty statistics but it is highly unlikely that "thousands" of captains were lost. There is only one captain per ship. If he gets killed his First Officer takes over. In order to lose thousands of captains you have to lose roughly the same number of ships. As far as skills are concerned, the military invests in a huge enterprise to train every person in the military to do the job they are assigned to.
Military draft isn't viable anymore except in the most extreme of circumstances. After WW2 we started moving from a large standing army with basic weapons to a smaller 'professional army' The weapons and equipment now needs far more training to use properly and it takes longer to build such equipment. The registration is used more for a low-key buffer system now, the U.S. would have to be on the verge of invasion with the bulk of our Active Military, Reserves, and National Guard decimated before they would resort to a draft again.
As to the starship shields, you're right, but I always just wrote it off as the ships we see exploding have just taken a lot of 'off-screen' damage that lowered their shields before the scenes we see. They had already been in combat for a while before the ships started exploding. (Although the initial engagement happened off-screen, they could have been fighting for a couple minutes all the way up to ten)
Of course the REAL reason is because the screenwriters wanted to do it this way. I can only assume it's because they had such a massive number of ships, but didn't want to spend hours showing their defenses getting beaten down before we started seeing combat resolutions.
For a ship to fly past through an explosion in space unscathed as if no debris flying off from all direction at high speed is only possible in the Star Trek universe. In space, the battle is a noisy affair. And the Dominian fleet was redirected to Tatooine, in a galaxy of far, far away.
@DARK 6 So, deflector shield should be the same forcefield that stop the phaser and photon torpedoes fire. Does it mean that the forcefield selectively don't cover the native ship own capability to fire their own projectiles, which make the turret susceptible to enemy fire, or how can certain molecules can make it through the deflector and others can't? Like earth forcefield, it blocks charged particles from the sun but it won't stop anything metallic from punching through.
Well the Rebellion would be crushed, along with the Galactic Empire.
watch the remastered 4k fan version, sparks and debris fly away from ship destruction. It's so well-done.
The ending was a cop-out. Really disappointed by that whole wishing away the enemy fleet thing.
Edit: Those Federation fighters fight like Nali!
1:30 and thats why i love the galaxy class #RIPenterprised #fuckthesovereign
1:34 nothing has ever made me feel as triumphant as a Terran as this.
GCS war-refit has destroyed the chat.
Fighters are a nuisance weapon and ideal for a combat situation like this, in the trek universe it boils down to who losses shields first. The fighters go in draw fire away from the large expensive capital ships, the resources that go into a fighter as well as manpower needed is far less than a mother ship, expendability. They pack enough of a punch to weaken shields as well as targets of opportunity along the way and easier flanking maneuvers to divert attention and cause general chaos in the skirmish, the capital ships act as artillery delivering the killing blows. Basically the fighters are an expendable force that draws fire away from the main fleet while adding more opportunity to weaken enemy shields enough to deliver a killing blow.
*_THANK YOU_*
I totally love the bit when the Galaxy wings 93 & 94 attack the Cardassian Galor class Cruisers
DS9 Rocks
I always love the big capital ships laying the smackdown on the Galors at 1:30 .
What if you wanted to invade the Federation but the prophets said "3:11"