No worries...! I imagined something like that... Also, could you let me know about that book Rob was using to explain about the Sidon river? The one that is out of stock, or the editorial is not publishing any more? I want to acquire it and read it. Thanks for all you do...!
There is a story in my family history that Joseph Smith met my 4 great Grand Dad as he was traveling in New York. He ran into him as a young boy he was apparently poking around some bones he had found. Joseph pulled up on his horse and looked at him and said, " The next time I see you, I will bring a book about those people and who they were." My Grand Father's name was Russell King Homer. The next time he saw Joseph, he had become a young man. Joseph gave him the book, and it was the Book of Mormon. Russell joined the Church and was part of the great LDS migration story and ended up in Northern Utah. I'm also a 4 great grand son of Martin Harris and two other Grand Father's who were born in Nauvoo and fled for their lives.
@scottpound411 yup :) Brigham Young is my 4th great Uncle lol Martin Harris 2nd Wife was Caroline Young she was pregnant with my 2nd great Grand mother when she walked to Utah with the LDS migration:)
Lucy Mack Smith's biography of her son, Joseph - talks about how Joseph was tutored by Moroni before he received the plates - and regaled the family with stories of the people who used to live upon this land. Kirkland to Jackson County are what Joseph referred to as the "plains of the Nephites". Anyone who thinks Joseph didn't know, hasn't read history
First foreign speaking mission called by Joseph himself? Try and guess we're he went and what tiny island they landed on? I think elder Cook mentioned it in last conference if you listen closely
@@101mythbuster- Nope . Check out Wayne May's (Historical Archeololgist) work on th8s very topic . He's published lots here on Y-T. If your "kniwledge" is as wide and deep as you _claim_ , this will be of inestimable value to you .
I’m glad that there were certain issues addressed in this video. I personally stumbled across an archaeological site while walking my dog in the woods and found artifacts and pottery and other things along with what looked like possible burial sites. I tried to get the local government and authorities, archaeologist, etc. involved, and at first they were enthusiastic and then for some reason they just shut down and stopped communicating with me. I was trying to raise the alarm because I thought this area was in danger of being developed and destroyed, and I thought it might be important historically. It was the strangest thing I’ve ever experienced. Then I started to do my own research over period of two years, and I realized what had happened. Papers and information had already been written about the whole area And if I came out with what I knew, and they had to add it to the local history, it would literally rewrite things that had already been assumed, were set in stone so to speak. This meant that more than one reputable archaeologist would have to recant having said that there was no further evidence in the area to suggest that certain things or people had lived there. so because of pride and arrogance, parts of history are being totally swept under the carpet and ignored. After realizing this, and fuming over being shut down and silenced, I decided to take things further afield. I ended up contacting specialists and anthropologists working on different projects and were experts in their field working in other states and asked if I could use their study materials and the information they had learned over years about certain things. They were happy to help and it allowed me to understand what I was looking at even better. I realized that the place was an important settlement which had connections to other sites nearby that were ceremonial, and they had links to the Hopewell culture further up north. This is very important because it was presumed that there were no traces of Hopewell culture in this area or in my state. They were incorrect. There are artifacts and things that have been discovered that definitely show this area was inhabited by people who had connections to that particular culture, and also Mississippian south eastern ceremonial complex hubs in neighboring areas which are now neighboring states hundreds of miles away. There are still important things to be discovered here, but unfortunately, the powers that should not be have made it very difficult for me to get back into the area and do any more research or exploring. They’ve even resorted to threatening family members that live in the neighborhood with financial penalties or legal consequences. I have personally been threatened with being arrested. They are not kidding around. It’s sad. Really sad. The local government is clearly involved in this as well, as is the large corporate property development company, and the management company overseeing the residential side of things. It’s very frustrating, disappointing, knowing that there is something important there, and also knowing that these areas are being damaged by pot hunters and people who don’t know what they are doing that are destroying all the evidence or taking it away. Fortunately, I was able to get enough evidence together and take photos and plot things on a map to create a persuasive argument. When I filed the report, I was completely ignored and blanked. I did not even receive a response or an acknowledgment of what I had submitted. I have been to numerous archaeological sites and several states across eastern America, and seen similar places that were clearly settlements with similar characteristics. They are ignoring the information they have been shown, so that indicates that there may be involvement or corruption at the state level which is astonishing and disturbing. It never ceases to amaze me, the level of corruption between corporations and governments. So after two years of research and spending money out of my own pocket, and even getting other organizations, scientists, people who believe in what I was doing involved in ended up going nowhere. Grrr.
@@debbiemelander289 no problem. I did manage to recover some of the evidence before it was destroyed by development. Luckily, there are allowances in the rules and regulations in those cases. Unfortunately, for every place that is discovered 10 more are bulldozed or destroyed completely. Some of them without ever having been discovered. I suppose it Hass to be enough for us that there is at least some evidence that is compelling enough to at least create a reasonable probability in the minds of anyone who is doubting that the book of Mormon is real, the people in it were real, and there are in fact things that were left behind by these people. The rest we have to take on faith and I think that was the point. Besides, the spirit guides some of us to find things and you would be surprised how much is actually around you right under your nose or right beneath your feet at any given time. The Lord will cause the earth to reveal the truth of all things in good time.
I'm 79. I grew up with the Meso Theory. a decade ago I happen to pick up a book about the Heartland Theory. I immediately knew it was true, even when I saw things that were dispelling it. The more I learn the more absolutely convinced I am that THIS land of America (The US) was the land of the Nephites. Add the scripture, DNA and plant/animal info and I have ZERO doubt. Thank you Rod Meldrum and Wayne May. Is it germain to my salvation? No, but it sure makes it clear where the New Jerusalen will be. and that is important. Wake up boys! If this didn't convince you, NOTHING WILL! If you're afraid to take a side, then why is that? Perhaps because you're afraid of llosing viewers? I hope you have more courage than that.
I was raised on the Meso American model. At home and at church. From a young girl there were things about it that didn’t make sense to me. As I read the Book Of Mormon on my own and with my family the holes in the Meso theory that I could see left me confused and frustrated. I pondered and prayed a lot about it. I found myself harboring an inclination that the book took place much farther north that I was taught. About 16 years ago my prayers were answered when a friend gave me a DVD of Rod Meldrum explaining all the questions in my heart. I had a spiritual confirmation that day through further prayer that the land of promise spoken of in the Book of Mormon, where the Nephites and Lamanites also lived was the land I live on. I testify that when we are ready for more meat of the gospel, when we earnestly seek for more light and knowledge the Lord will grant the righteous desires of our hearts. Reading the Book of Mormon with that new understanding has brought it to life for me in ways I had never experienced before. I wish that for everyone who desires it too. Knock and it shall be opened. Seek and yea shall receive.
@@101mythbusterI agree, it's an embarrassing thing to listen to the heartlanders testify that they have come to that conclusion after much prayer as if those who look at the Mesoamerican model don't believe in prayer. To me it's a means of hijacking the debate the sane as when Evangelicals tell us they have prayed and know Mormonism is false.
I always felt the same thing from a young age. Maybe personal revelation but had no scientific basis to back it up. I just felt the scriptures laid it out plain.
@BrianTerrill I told my personal experience. There’s no insinuation on my end of anyone’s lack of prayer or cause for embarrassment. It’s simply my experience. Perhaps you and mythbuster should look inside for the cause of your own negative reactions to my personal experience. Why did you internalize it the way you did? Why are you projecting? Why did you take my words personal when they had nothing to do with you? I don’t mean any harm. Just barring my testimony on this topic. Your testimony wouldn’t offend me even if I didn’t agree with it. Best Wishes!
You should look into the DNA of the animals that were brought here by the Jaredites. The Texas Longhorn has been extensively studied and I think the results were interesting since the original conclusion of the researchers was that they came here about 2,500 years ago and they were most closely related to the Ankara, which is a breed from Iraq. Beyond that you should look at sheep and goats and fish. I have seen a pamphlet and I can’t find it, but it talked about a fish in Ohio, whose only relative lived in the Euphrates river. I was flabbergasted at the time, it might have been a poster, but I just can’t find it again. It does remind be of the Book of Mormon because the Jaredites brought fish with them.
@@rodneyjamesmcguire Maybe. Here is something you need to know though. Archeologists and scientists aren’t always reporting correctly. There’s so much proof on that. Watch Scott Wolter he will get you started on the Smithsonian. Watch every early episode. That’s when I started to hear things and did some deep research. Not just Wikipedia or Google. Graham Hancock helps too. Science and history has not been taught to us correctly.
@@rodneyjamesmcguire The DNA evidence doesn’t clearly support that. It is not closely related to Spanish cattle. It’s more closely related to the Ankara. Which is a breed popular in Iraq. Populations of them were found far North as New York. Maybe taking credit for the Longhorn was just another way to steal the Natives stuff.
Rod Meldrum is such an awesome guy! I am so thankful for him and all those who put so much of their time and effort into helping us better understand things that were lost.
@@watson666 the artifacts and history of the native peoples here known as the Hopewell amd Adena. The Smithsonian tried to destroy and hide it all under "manifest destiny" doctrine. They wanted the world to think of them as "savages" with no history but a hunter gatherer culture.
42:10 Not only does the BOM does not mention the existence of any other people, it actually states goes one step further: 2 Nephi 1: 8 "And behold, it is wisdom that this land should be kept as yet from the knowledge of other nations; for behold, many nations would overrun the land, that there would be no place for an inheritance."
More than one interpretation can be given to that verse. It can also be true if people come to the America's and don't go back to their homeland, the people of that homeland will not know of the new world. Remember, Columbus thought he could sail straight across the sea to China. People in 15th century Mediterranean Europe had no idea the American continent existed. So that verse in Nephi is satisfied if word of the new land does not go back to the old world. The new world stays hidden until someone goes back with news of the discovery. And the Book of Mormon gives plenty of internal evidence and anthropology gives evidence of other people already being present when the Lehite and Jaredite groups arrive.
@@UtahKent I appreciate your thoughts on this, and I used to interpret 2 Nephi 1:8 in a similar manner. However, as I've delved deeper into my studies, the presence of other civilizations in America during the Nephite time, such as the Olmec, Zapotec, and Mayans, adds more complexity to the issue. Considering that these peoples existed in the Mesoamerican region during the Nephite and Lamanite times, if the verse didn't include them, then interaction and possibly intermingling between them and the Nephites and Lamanites would likely have occurred. This would suggest that the Book of Mormon should document changes in cultural traditions over time. However, textual evidence from the Book of Mormon seems to contradict that possibility. For example, in Alma 54:17, Ammoron still adheres to the Lamanite tradition of the Nephites usurping the right of the government. This suggests a lack of cultural or racial mixing, which might be expected if other nations were heavily integrated.
@@DavoBenjamin We forget that the Jaredites coexisted in a different part of the land up until at least ~130 BC. Because Coriantumr was found by the people of Zarahemla.
@@UtahKent I agree that other nations, apart from the Jaredites, coexisted in a different part of the land. But they could not have mixed. This is evident by the fact that the Nephites and the Lamanites maintained their culture. The Lamanites always maintained a feeling of being cheated of the right of government because their ancestors were the elder brothers. If they had mixed with other nations, then this unique culture would have been changed. Like I mentioned, the BOM does not mention the existence of any other people, not because there were no other peoples, but because the Nephites did not know of any other peoples. While I agree that the BOM mentions that the Nephites thought the land north was desolate because of other people (there is no mention that the Jaredites were aware of other civilizations), there is no mention of meeting other nations other than Coriantumr, the last Jaredite, and Mulekites, who founded Zarahemla.
As the associate editor for a major scientific journal, I will affirm Rod’s statements about the prejudices in the scientific community. It should be pointed out that Biblically Judah and Joseph had different mothers, and though they are identified as being sisters, there is nothing that indicates they had the same mother. So there is nothing that says that maternal DNA would link descendants of Joseph with descendants of Judah. Also we would expect that Jaredites would be linked with Asians if we believe the Asians and the Jaredites came from Tower of Babel. I could easily believe that South American cultures are of Jaredite descent. It is folly to think that we have the records of all people who have immigrated to the western hemisphere. The people who are using the DNA arguments against the Book of Mormon use a lot of very narrow focused postulates to put their faith on.
The statues and temples found in Mesoamerica and in Asia are too similar at and made at a different time than the Jaredites. They would have had to have their idols and architecture evolve at exactly the same rate and direction on two continents. They obviously went from one spot to the other across the Pacific, but I haven’t seen any evidence that they went back-and-forth a lot… enough that the cultures would be the same. I could be wrong, just some thing I thought I’d point out and see if you have had an answer for that because it’s bothered me.
Well, with the DNA, you can add that Joseph had married an Egyptian, and the Jews material ancestor is Tamar, with the Davidic line including Rahab the Harlot from non Israelite Jericho Moabite Ruth. The only common DNA between those tribes is Jacob's
I thought Seminary was Cemetary. It was strange that they would go early in the morning, sit around, and read scriptures. Then my sister told me about a beetle she saw on her leg at seminary, and screamed... so at the time, I assumed it made sense. Now... not so much. I still wonder why a beetle was in the church. 😂
My wife just got me a copy of Rod's book for Christmas. "To Mom from Barb" written on the inside cover. Sorry Mom, your loss is my gain. My aunt first showed me this book about 20 years ago. Happy to have a copy now.
The heartland model is the only one that makes sense to me given all the data, history and evidence I don’t know why rods book is out of print. I have it and it is awesome.
@@jmhatutubeyes, I have. I read most recently exploring the lands of the book of Mormon, revised edition by Joseph and Blake Allen. It’s almost 1000 pages and it says nothing really. I was amazed at how little evidence is in Mesoamerica. In contrast, I am extremely impressed with the evidences for the heartland model. After years of research, I believe it is obvious where the book of Mormon occurred. I do, however, believe that Christ went to the people of Mesoamerica after his resurrection, and is known as the feathered serpent or Quetzalcoatl in that culture. Cortez was mistaken for the great white God that should return from the East. I remember learning that in second grade from my non LDS teacher. Otherwise, the evidence doesn’t stack up for Guatemala.
Yeah was raised on the Mesio-American theory. Taught it on my mission back in the 70's so what is your point? As a older more experienced person now who has done his own homework over the years. I can spiritually and mentally say that it happened in the Heartland of America not in Mesio-America!!! We all have to find this out for yourselves.
Rod Meldrum's videos the five disc set was what started my long road of research and discovery. I have tons of stuff I have collected over the years. Images, videos, books, etc. one of the interesting things I have found was all the videos of people looking for artifacts. These people spend years searching for arrowheads all round the waterways of eastern states from Florida to New York. As far west as Kansas. This is so popular they have conventions in many states where they show their collections. Just look on TH-cam and you will find videos about it.
Rod is legit!!! No other Book of Mormon model makes sense. The heartland model best fits the scriptures and Joseph's comments. Thanks for having him on.
If your wondering how Moroni got the plates along with the rest to the little Hill in New York…here is what we know. At the final battle in 385ad Mormon assigned 21 men, think of Seal Team Six…to accompany his son to deliver the records to New York. We know they had the Liahona…basically a hand held Garmin GPS like device. Both Mormon and Moroni said they knew the 3 Nephites…so I think they went with them…that’s the 24 mentioned in the Book of Mormon that hide on top of Cumorah probably in the cave that the 12 wagon loads of records that Moroni moved to from Shim. Now on Columbus’s 4th voyage he sails south from the Mediterranean down the coast of Africa until he picks up the trade winds blowing west and he sails directly to Guatemala in 3 weeks. In his journal he writes about Mayan ocean capable canoes “as long as a Spanish Gall-ion and very seaworthy…they carried 25 men. Moroni could travel by boat up the Mississippi then up the Ohio and onto the Alegany River and travel by boat to within 34 miles of Palmyra. Now let me do some Rod Meldrum speculation…we know Moroni tells those with him not to return home. So I would speculate he told them to settle there and start their lives over. Maybe this group were the ancestors to the Mohicans…a fiercely feared warrior tribe alined with the Iroquois Nation much like the Spartans. William Penn lost every battle trying to take Pennsylvania…he finally raised enough money to buy it. He said when he was negotiating with them in their villages he felt like he was in a Jewish Barrio in London…these may be the Jewish dependents Rod is finding.
Meldrum is the man!! Heartland all day long…. but my testimony isn’t at all based on that. Thanks again for the great shows and the work you’re doing!!
I think Meldrom is a foney who is pushing HIS OWN AGENDA to GET GAIN, PERSONAL PRAISE & MAKE MONEY OFF THE CHURCH. I DON'T TRUST HIM!!! The BOM is true & it is not important where it took place. There were hundreds of thousands of people during this time. Some in America AND Also South/ (Mezo) America. Think about it.... he spends every day trying to prove he is right. & any other opinion is wrong. PUKE!
Br. Michael B Rush's new book "The Book of Enoch Vol 2". had several dna chapters. Not only from the i United States native Americans and also how possibly the Northern countries of Europe that have that dna that the American Indians have. At least the ones up in the northern part of America that actually traveled north in ships in the Book of Mormon. It is an amazing book.
If I remember correctly, all of that is in Volume 1 talking about how Nephites could have crossed the seas back to the European continent when Hagoth left with his two expeditions. Yes Michael Rush's book is amazing and thought-provoking. It does my heart good to see that he is a "Heartlander"!
1:33:57 at the end of the Book of Mormon the Lamanites pursued and pushed to the Northern area where Nephites were and then settled. The native histories mentioned there being 4 first peoples, some were in the land from the beginning, some came by boat and came north and south and west from the East, but the same pattern of event in the Book of Mormon occurred again after the time of the Book of Mormon illustrating the pattern of behavior and culture. I just love all this, I can’t wait for each dispensation head to give an understanding of all that has occurred in their time. Also the 3 Nephites are recorded from the furthest North to the furthest south of the American continents, and the Holy people taught all of them over these many generations.
I fires me up when people say “no one knows, I don’t know, you don’t know” it’s not significant to salvation but as we receive more understanding under principles and doctrine, one can recognize collateral light/knowledge much like Jared seeing the hand of the Lord, just to a more subtle extent. But no worldly evidences can sufficiently demonstrate a spiritual understanding for those who have made up their mind that it cannot be understood by anyone if it is not recognized by everyone. We have spiritual witnesses, by that I mean we don’t know if the Pearly Gates swing open or slide open but we know they open, of course a critic will not accept it if we cannot provide every desired detail. We know for certain that Moroni and the record were at the Hill Cumorah, that event of the Book of Mormon is definitively in North America, at a very Northern portion of North America. Even the land of Missouri to Ohio covers a similar amount of land between Egypt and Israel. “No one can really know” that is very similar to saying no one can know the church is true. When we state that we are asked what we mean by that, we do not have the most detailed answer with published documentation proving what we testify of, we tell of the authority, and the second witness of the Book of Mormon. The same can be said of the areas of the Book of Mormon. It has wide influence, but the record we have was his up at the northernmost location of the Book of Mormon. I love you guys, keep it up, this has been a passion study of mine since my youth.
Yes, yes! Amen! There are things we can absolutely know. And in regards to the Book of Mormon geography, we do know for certain some things right here and right now. So stop hedging your bets and allow the truth to influence your methodology of gaining more truth.
I agree, we CAN know with with a pretty high degree of certainty, that is why the MesoAmerican model is most certainly the correct one. It is truly sad there is still a debate about this.
"27 And it came to pass that the king sent a proclamation throughout all the land, amongst all his people who were in all his land, who were in all the regions round about, which was bordering even to the sea, on the east and on the west, and which was divided from the land of Zarahemla by a narrow strip of wilderness, which ran from the sea east even to the sea west, and round about on the borders of the seashore, and the borders of the wilderness which was on the north by the land of Zarahemla, through the borders of Manti, by the head of the river Sidon, running from the east towards the west-and thus were the Lamanites and the Nephites divided. 28 Now, the more idle part of the Lamanites lived in the wilderness, and dwelt in tents; and they were spread through the wilderness on the west, in the land of Nephi; yea, and also on the west of the land of Zarahemla, in the borders by the seashore, and on the west in the land of Nephi, in the place of their fathers’ first inheritance, and thus bordering along by the seashore. 29 And also there were many Lamanites on the east by the seashore, whither the Nephites had driven them. And thus the Nephites were nearly surrounded by the Lamanites; nevertheless the Nephites had taken possession of all the northern parts of the land bordering on the wilderness, at the head of the river Sidon, from the east to the west, round about on the wilderness side; on the north, even until they came to the land which they called Bountiful. (Alma 22:27-29)
43:02 this information is so easy to refute. The fact is Jews married outside of their culture more often than is being presented here. Esther, anyone? Even Ruth, who was a Moabite. So it is not as cut and dry as he is presenting.
Hey, I'm only a half hour in and enjoying this discussion so much. Love Rod and all he works for. 😊 Have you looked at all into the book 'Traced' by Dr. Nathaniel Jeanson? He follows the patriarchal line of DNA and has some fascinating discoveries in the last 3-5 years.
The Sac, Fox and Ojibwa tribes have a unique DNA haplo-marker identifying them as Hebrews. Also, the Cherokee have an oral tradition that their ancestors escaped (their word) from a place across the ocean called Masada.
Thanks for having Rod on. Lots of haters in the comment section, but I'm glad you guys keep on going. I don't know why this subject has to be so emotional for people.
I love Rod Meldrum! When I first read the Book of Mormon on my own I was 11 in CA, I was learning about Native American History in Social Studies and it hit me that the remnants of the people in the Book of Mormon had to be part of these Natives if not the very descendants. I excitedly told my teacher and he told me Brigham Young made up the Book of Mormon…. I excitedly told my family just for them to point out the introduction….. I learn only when I ask the question apparently. It wasn’t till my mission in Cache Valley UT when I heard about Rod Meldrum and since then I have learned geography was not so simple and many groups have moved in and out, and Lehi’s family and Mulekites and Jaredites have had influences all over and are not always a pure line as the Book of Mormon mentions other peoples.
Just look at all Southern California Indian tribes , and channel islands ,start there and look at the Indian Chumash,tongvas, kumeyaay,( ( tarahumara, tribes, these tribes have àlot of cumora in there language , just saying ? Xnever marked the spot... Just saying
@@davidcarruth5906 I use to build trail in the central coast of CA, I got to work with archeologists which were excavating whale bones from an indigenous people they said was about 20,000 years old, but it seemed odd that indigenous groups were hunting whale that far back, it made me think of the Jaredites though. All those giants found on Catalina Island, Adamites? Chinese made it to the Americas many times early on, BoM is just a single record of many many groups.
Ok ….I have spoken with Rod Meldrum a couple of times. He is well meaning but wildly creative and loose with his”facts”. Please invite Dr. John Lund to talk on your show. He has written 2 books on where the Book of Mormon lands are located. He takes the very words of Joseph Smith, John Taylor and Wilford Woodruff who collectively authored as the co-editors of the official Church publication “Times and Season” that clearly state the primary events of the Book of Mormon took place In Guatemala. Rod Meldrum tries to explain these articles away, but never in their lives as apostles or prophets did they ever change alter or redact those stories. If Rod had been alive in the 1800’s he would have been the greatest snake oil salesman of them all. Dr. Lund’s books are “Meso America and the Book of Mormon…Is this the PLACE?” His 2nd book is titled “Joseph Smith and the geography of the Book of Mormon”. Dr. Lund takes the words from the Times and Seasons articles and using the same word crunch formula used by the FBI to convict the “Uni-bommer” in court…determined that those articles were indeed written collectively by those three men. Rod plays fast and loose with all kinds of hear say and altered facts including being told to stop misleading the public on incorrect usage of DNA evidence…but he continues to slither around selling his oil to celebrities in an effort to gain support for his enterprise.
I will add some of my own speculation that would help Rod Meldrum if he would be open to it. Remember that in the Book of Mormon in 55 BC Hagoth, most likely a Jewish Rabbi, persuades 5,400 people to leave Zarahemla. They build “ships” and sail north. 1 year later Hagoth returns to gather the rest of the people…proof he did not get lost…and sails back north. I believe they sailed north from the Yucatan region to the Mississippi River and beyond. Rod is most likely finding their “Hebrew” evidence as they their descendants would have continued to practice the Mosaic Law…being they missed the arrival of Jesus Christ. When I asked Rod about where Hagoth went he said “they sailed north out of Zarahemla on the Mississippi River up through the Great Lakes then through the Northwest passage….the one Admiral Byrd couldn’t find with steamships, and around Alaska down through the treacherous Straits and onto Hawaii. This they did in simple sailing boats…then returned one year later and did it all again. By the way…DNA evidence has now proven the Polynesian’s origins date to Jerodite times not Nephites…that’s one of the reasons why David O. McKay refused to print on Church presses Joseph Fielding Smiths book. By the way, Rod has found compelling information…if he would embrace the fact he is finding artifacts from Hagoth and their descendants he wouldn’t get himself in so much trouble. Please get Dr. Lund on your show….by the way, Rod will not publicly debate Dr. Lund on this subject.
@@Thehaystack7999 that's very true too jaridite, mulikites, muli is big Polynesian names.. definitely the best theory to me? But all I know is the best sailor in world according to Capt Cook are Polynesian s they landed on every island in Pacific Ocean, and somehow missed the two biggest 🏝️
I remember running across that article in Nature or Science magazine (was a copy editor for dozens, can't remember) in the late 1990's, started researching, found Wayne May's work, and never looked back. Heartland is the answer.
Just messing with you! I just became a patreon member. This interview did it for me. I have enjoyed your content from the very start. I wish I could give more. Thank you for what you are doing! This is wonderful material!
@@thestickofjoseph you really need to look at Polynesian, and California, and first foreign speaking mission called outside USA? Brigham Young. Settled along Colorado River ares Dow to Chihuahua. Wilfred woodruffs journal on , Hopi, Zuni, Laguna,etc . Architecture, building, language, Aztec codecs, atzlan, Colorado River(red) rivers , rivers that flow from south to north? Little Colorado, gold, silver, copper, native Americans don't join the church? Polynesian do? Why, Spanish trail, or Indian trail witch goes right through Utah valley? No, temples , and church got thrown out of east coast not many members to this Day around old Church sites? Why? That not important land for church! Utah Utah aaha in (Juda) udaa. Geography of Utah lake flowing in dead sea ... Salt lake, river Jordan ? Everything adds up in West , there is so much more , but no one even looks right in front of there eyes unbelievable!!
@@james8996 I don't know were ham land is , but i do know we're best land in world is as far ad GDP, and agricultural best ground is , not mex or heartland! Just stating facts here...
The promises and prophecies from the mouth of the Lord and the Prophets has me sold on the geography. All of that being said, the geography will matter more after the testimony of the prophecies and testimony of Christ are planted in our hearts firmly.
The problem isn’t your mics. It’s the room you’re in. Too much echo - to reduce this, add acoustic tiles on your walls (assuming that’s an option for you😊👍🏻). Great video!!
If the Book of Mormon can be proven scientifically, then faith would be pointless, Moroni's invitation and promise meaningless and ultimately our reason for coming to earth unnecessary. Developing a relationship with Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ by opening our hearts to the influence of the Holy Ghost is why the Book of Mormon exists and why we're here. Rod, your work is the reason why many people will be introduced to it and take it seriously and read it. Great interview. DG
James E. Rice is the 2nd great grandson of Amasa Lyman an Apostle serving along with the Prophet Joseph Smith Jr., and was Joseph's counselor for one year while Sidney was living in NY. When Sidney came back he was reinstated, and Amasa returned to his position with the 12 Apostles. Jim Rice had access to unique and privileged info, and he sought out important restoration info often, and many revelations on his own. I, Diana Jo B. Rice, also share collateral lineages with both Emma and Joseph. As does also Jim connect with Joseph & Hyram Smith's lines way back in the 1700 hundreds thru Samuel Smith Senior, and Rachael Marvin thru their youngest son Nathaniel Smith.
In the prophet, Joseph Smith's own testimony in the introductory pages of the Book of Mormon, he testifies of Moroni's first visit to him; "He said there was a book deposited, written upon gold plates, giving an account of the former inhabitants of this continent, and the source from whence they sprang." Moroni told Joseph Smith that the record found on the gold plates is about the earlier inhabitants of THIS continent. The continent where Joseph and Moroni were at, at that moment during that first meeting of the two was the North American continent. Not South America, not Africa, Europe, Asia or Antarctica, but THIS continent. I am pretty confident that both Joseph and Moroni understood that the continent that they were located on at that moment was the North American continent. I don't know how more plain a prophet and an angel can be. If you cant take their word for it, why bother even worrying about it one way or the other.
The land of the BofM was prophesied to have all nations flow unto it. USA is the only land that has happened to. Ellis Island records show that from 1880 to 1920 25 million people came to USA. They did not go to central or South America. The heartland model has numerous prophesies that other lands don’t have.
How can this continue to be debated. It’s the text and purposes of the scriptural record that were so clearly laid out here that must be relied upon. Meldrum is right. We cannot ignore the prophecies-when taken with everything we know from the D&C, too, it’s undeniable the Book of Mormon took place in what we now called the United States. Did anyone really ever think Nephi was prophesying about any other nation?
Did Nephi prophesy of any other nation? Um, yes: "12 And I looked and beheld a man among the Gentiles, who was separated from the seed of my brethren by the many waters; and I beheld the Spirit of God, that it came down and wrought upon the man; and he went forth upon the many waters, even unto the seed of my brethren, who were in the promised land." (1 Nephi 13:12) This has been confirmed by prophets to be Christopher Columbus who never set foot on any territory that would become part of our current nation called the United States. He did land in Central and South America
Ive been thinking for the last year now that the Book of Mormon Central America location theory is the worst idea taught and peddled to the saints and will have a cost the church won't want to spiritually pay.
Fantastic interview! Another 70 page book you might be interested in concerning DNA is called Face of a Nephite by David Read. He would make a wonderful guest. A humble and knowledgeable man!
One thing I found out recently which I thought important to add to this discussion: Rod brings up, beginning at 1:19:00, his opinion that the Sidon River in the Book of Mormon flows south and not north, based on what he said was one definition of the 'head' of a river in the 1828 version of the Merriam-Webster dictionary, which has one definition of the 'head' of a river at that time meaning the confluence or downstream emptying spot for the river into a larger body of water. However, from a reading of Lehi's dream in 1 Nephi 8:13-14, is very clear in its definition of the head of the river that flowed past the tree of life, that the head was the source of the river, not its destination: 13 And as I cast my eyes round about, that perhaps I might discover my family also, I beheld a ariver of water; and it ran along, and it was near the tree of which I was partaking the fruit. 14 And I looked to behold from whence it came; and I saw the head thereof a little way off; and at the head thereof I beheld your mother Sariah, and Sam, and aNephi; and they stood as if they knew not whither they should go. So my take on this is: why would the Book of Mormon use a different definition for the head of a river in Nephi vs. the definition elsewhere, such as in Alma? To me, this is a clear indication that the Sidon River flowed north and not south. The other evidence for this is that the land of Nephi was very consistently described as uphill and southward from the city of Zarahemla, with the city of Manti in between. Since the river Sidon's 'head' was near Manti, this also implies a northward flow. Rod mentions that Mesoamerican proponents such as Kirk deliberately leave out things that don't agree with their model, but Rod is doing this same thing by leaving 1 Nephi 8:13-14 out of his argument :)
“And if thou wilt make me an altar of stone, thou shalt not build it of hewn stone: for if thou lift up thy tool upon it, thou hast polluted it.” -Yahweh (Exodus) “Neither shalt thou go up by steps unto mine altar, that thy nakedness be not discovered thereon.” -Yahweh (Exodus) And I, Nephi, did build a temple; and I did construct it after the manner of Solomon save it were not built of so many precious things; for they were not to be found upon the land, wherefore, it could not be built like unto Solomon's temple. -Nephi Both temples built in Jerusalem were single story buildings having ramps until the courts, then there were steps to step up into the court, the altars in both temples were rough stone not hewn, and compared to all the Ziggurats that the other cultures surrounding Israel built (Egypt, Babylonia and Asia) the Jewish temples were ant size and a joke The buildings found in Mesoamerica match the ziggurat building style, many of them being exact copies of those found in Asia, not Solomon’s, whereas all over in the Heartland of America is found platforms, having ramps, with the platform area being the exact size the temple area in Jerusalem describes for both temples No hewn stone, no steps, temples built after the manner of Solomon’s… nowhere in Mesoamerica can you find these traits on their buildings But come up into North America and you do Just a thought…
Years ago when that DNA thing came out I started my own investigation and although I'm no scientist, I could see that the scientist didn't really know enough to definitively say that there was no Hebrew DNA in native American populations. I concluded that eventually the right DNA would be found.
It's funny how DNA has been found in cavemen skeletons and has been used to link to living individuals nearby. We've used it to solve genealogical mysteries going back hundreds of years. Millions have done DNA testing and yet nothing has been found to support middle eastern origins for the indigenous tribes? thousands of years have been tracked with populations with y DNA and yet... we cannot find y DNA in the Americas which fits the book of Mormon? Weird, huh?
As a non active Member currently. I can tell you honestly, tell the Heartland (USA) non-believers one thing. No Country south of North America is protecting Israel. 🤷 The Book of Mormon happened in the Heartland.
during by readings I have seen where Joseph Smith Jr. while in Navoo said, as he pointed across the Missippi river to Montross, Iowa there is where Zarahemla was located
The east and west seas are the great lakes (remember they are far larger than the sea of Galilee). The narrow passage could be theNiagara Passage (means narrow neck or passage) or east of the ancient marshy black swamp in northern Indiana. It also had many poisonous snakes referred to.
No the Great Lakes are not the East and West Seas. Do you even know that hypothesis was created by critics of the Book of Mormon who were trying to prove Joseph Smith just made it up?
Wow! Holding those microphones for 2 hrs must have been hard. Bet you couldn't move your arms afterwards.😊. Really enjoyed the interview. Thanks for sharing (& holding those mics)
Exodus 20:25 And if thou wilt make me an altar of stone, thou shalt not build it of hewn stone: for if thou lift up thy tool upon it, thou hast polluted it. 26 Neither shalt thou go up by steps unto mine altar, that thy nakedness be not discovered thereon. The pyramids in Mesoamerica violate the Law of Moses.
They don’t have the right plants or animals to follow the law. They also would have followed a lunar calendar for planting and harvesting which also corresponded with their holy days. They could not have followed their calendar correctly and Meso people admit that. They will tell you that they would have had to make substitutions. Also they did not have hewn stone alters (I believe someone posted about that), Mesoamerica is full of those. Check out Amberli Nelson. She has a whole presentation on it.
@@GregFessiathe temples in Mesoamerica for the most part postdated the crucifixion, and the rule regarding the ramp as opposed to stairs only applied to the alter of burnt offerings. There were also stairs in King Solomon's temple.
What's the name of the book out of print he keeps quoting from? Really appreciated this. Definitely need a round 2 and 3 follow up here. So much untapped information. Really appreciated it!!!
I'm a Heartland fan here, and had to laugh when Rod was trying to get you boys to commit! Regardless of location, the Book of Mormon is true and all the events stated therein happened somewhere on this earth 🙂
For Non-LDS DNA sources. I would suggest looking at Donald Yates Cherokee DNA work and "Answers in Genesis" Native Americans origins. Many don't know there was a Native American record written on wood planks that was translated. This record gives the history of the Lenni-Lanape migration from Siberia to the Eastern US (Delaware). The interesting thing with this record is that it gives an account of a great battle or series of battles with a people called the Talegas (mound buiders, possibly white). Onces they defeated the moundbuilders they divided up there lands with other people (people they called ancestors to the Iroquois). "Answers in Genesis" believes this record matches the DNA haplogroup Q and the linguistic of the record with native Americans. The onandagus in the Zelph account seems to match Lenni-Lanape phonetics.
@kylethedalek Donald Yates is trying to track down the DNA of the Cherokee to validate the tribe's oral account of descending from the tribe of Judah. He is just testing DNA from the tribe and publishing his results. So he seems trustworthy. "Answers in Genesis" is using DNA, linguist maps, and the Lenni-Lanape translated records to make a point on Native American origin. They believe the crossing of the bearing straight was 900 AD, and the Lenni-Lanape made war with the people of Cahokia. I believe they crossed around 200AD to 300AD and made war with the Hopewell. In their record, they say they made war with the Talegus and then inhabited their land around the great lakes. The Great Lakes were inhabited by the Hopewell who are gone from History around 400AD. The academics believe the Lenni-Lanape record to be fraud with little proof. One of the reason they claim it is fraud is based on Joseph Smith and the Book of Mormon, even though translation isn't connected to Joseph Smith. Is there any evidence to back up the Lenni-Lanape record? Yes. Kalamath Native Americans have similar linguistics and history. Native American customs and phonetics are similar to the Lenni-Lanape. The Ket in Siberia have similar linguistics to many Native Americans like the Navajo.
There was a common belief that the mound builders were white long before the book of Mormon was known about. It was common in Joseph Smith's time. It proposed that dark skinned people were inferior and couldn't have built burial mounds. So the only logical step was that the white mound builders were killed by the dark skinned inhabitants. Oddly enough, that fits the book of Mormon ideology and supports the white supremist colonialist ideas of the westward expansion
I am very interested in the topic and I love the guest. Honestly, the hosts are making so much effort to "explain" and "simplify" that it is difficult to remain with the conversation.
Thanks Rod for updating us on all your wonderful, overwhelming information of what I consider great evidence of the truth that, right here in the Heartland of America is where the Nephites and Lamanites lived. When I was 16, I read the Book of Mormon and that was back in the 1970s and we had a Globe on a stand at our house. And after I had read the Book of Mormon and gained a great, deep abiding testimony of it, I looked on the Globe and I said to myself where are the Seas North, East, South and West on the American Continent? My eyes were led to the Great Lakes of America and the narrow neck of land! And then my eyes were LED down to the Mississippi River and the light turned on in my mind and I realized it wasn't this small, little trickling creek of a river, but it was a huge, large river that could take bodies downstream to the Sea. It all made sense to me! This was the River Sideon and at the age of 16, I just knew that this American Gontinent was the geography of the Nephites and Lamanites. But I could not prove it to anybody so I kept it to myself all these years. Thank you Rod for bringing the realization of all the things that were revealed to me long ago, to be true!
Once you know there is no question..... just like we are counseled by James and Moroni" Ask in faith with real intent, and you will recieve the truth of it"
As soon as Rod said something about mink raising I instantly thought of you, and then TSOJ mentioned you! Super cool. Question, does your Carter line descend from William Carter of D&C or the other William Carter who went west with Brigham and plowed the first crops in SLC and even St George, UT?
On the part of look at a geography. You cannot look at the lay of the land in 2022 or 2023 to pen point 2600-year-old needle. Lands have changed dramatically in the pass 2600 years.
Excellent presentation! Rod Meldrum has such great answers because he is a dedicated and sincere Truthseeker with enthusiasm and tenancy to keep at it through thick and thin for many years! Bravo!
Alma 46: 17 “And it came to pass that when he [Captain Moroni] had poured out his soul to God, he named all the land which was south of the land Desolation, yea, and in fine, all the land, both on the north and on the south-A chosen land, and the land of liberty.” Everything South of the land Desolation was declared a land of Liberty by Captain Moroni. In the Meso American model, the United States was even north of the Land Desolation.. I know this declaration was considered specific for its time but I would still find it odd that the actual Land of Liberty today would be excluded from this prophetic declaration. Heartland Theory all the way for me!! It’s just common sense considering we have a lost civilization that matches the Nephite timeline, almost to the T.
For more information on the covenant running with the land of America, look Elder Ahmad S. Corbitt's 2022 talk to the J. Reuben Clark Law Society. Super perspective changing. President Oaks was there. It is completely compatible with Rod's research, but definitely more humbling.
100 percent conversion comes from the manifestation of the spirit ! I love and support what you guys are doing. I have been following Rod for years. By their fruits you will know them.
1:56:20 I don't really understand this point because Yes, there is tons and tons of archeology in Meso America, but NONE of it matches Book of Mormon timeframes! On the other hand, the remains of the Hopewell and Adena cultures in the heartland are exact matches for the Nephites and Jaredites.
The prophets seers and revelators are curiously quiet. They are operating from a position of fear on these matters. The Kinderhook Plates caught Josepg Smith. Mark Hoffman embarrassed the brothren in the 1980s. The Egyptial Burial scrolls caught them in a mess in 1967, and it has only gotten worse since then. Then the DNA is not helping, so they have young lds lads making videos trying to save the Church themselves with the Brethren quiet in SLC. What a mess. The LDS Prophets told us who the Nephite and Lamenite people were. They said they were the native tribes in North America. Find their buried cities, massive battlefields, breastplates, swords, helmets, chariots... If you sustain your prophets, stop the nonsense about South America. The problem... The evidence for North America isn't working out, so everyone is looking someplace else. Your prophets told you they were in North America. Sustain them. Have confidence in them. Prove that the DNA a d history of those peoples was that of the Book of Mormon. The archeology of the Bible sustains the Bible. The archeology of the Book of Mormon should do the same for LDS Prophets who recieved word from God.
God testified to me that Joseph Smith, The LDS church are true but we must always remember the Church is only as good as its members, the members are the church. The temple is just a brick and mortar building its the people inside that make it Holy. Stand in holy places.
When I first read The Book of Mormon, I felt:" why must it always be Americans...that can manage to spread all the glory as the book instructs?" Well... no other South Anerican country did that in its origin . We need ya ...USA clan! Accept and proceed pls
@@thestickofjoseph The tribes I'm aware of which also have haplogroup X DNA are the Tarahumara, Huichol, and Yanomami. It's not X2 like in the Algonquin. It's X6 and X7. These tribes are all located in or near Mesoamerica. I'm linking one article on the Yanomami specifically. Information on X6 and X7 is a little harder to come by than X2. I could get you some more info though if you have trouble finding it. Feel free to reach out. mtDNA Variation in the Yanomami: Evidence for Additional New ... - NCBI www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1915132/pdf/ajhg00020-0219.pdf
The Native American version of Haplogroup X is clearly concentrated in Northeast North America, but there does seem to have been some ancient mixing throughout the Americas
I can't help but feel that the Heartland theory resonates with me far more than the Mesoamerican theory. I've felt that my entire life, even before all the Heartlander evidence became mainstream.
Can't wait to see Wayne May back in your TH-cam channel. I hope you get to go on tour with him or Rod Meldrum. I haven't been able to, but I have heard it's awesome. When my family had a family reunion in Nauvoo we had an opportunity to visit a site near there. This family we found out about owns about twenty six acres of land on which there are numbers of burial mound, fortifications (earthen walls and ditches) point of entrance, and other interesting stuff.
There are four documented migrations from Asia as well as the Book of Mormon. The Nephites did not take up the whole of the Americas they just had a part of it. It was incredibly hard back in the day to cross the cruel dessert plains of Texas. There just was no water.
So...all of the civilizations of North and South America are the Lamanites, and they all appeared only after 400 A.D.? The Incas, the Aztecs, the Mayans, the Seminoles, the Cherokee, the Navajo, the Hopewell Mound Builders, the Cree, the Ojibwa, the Inuit...all of them are from the same group and only went their separate ways 1600 years ago? Am I understanding this correctly?
Could the Lamanites have assimilated with a darker skinned people causing their posterity to have darker skin. The always seemed to outnumber the Nephites by 3:1 (my estimate). There was also the “profession of nehors”, who were they?
The two useless divisions within the church. -Meso v Heartland -Seer Stone v Urim & Thummim Everyone in heaven shaking their heads at all of us for dividing ourselves. Because we all know it’s Heartland and Urim & Thummim!
Remember nearly everyone who believes in the Heartland Model were MesoAmerica first. There is no division. Just a few trying to hang onto the rabbit hole that is MesoAmerica.
Hopefully it’s just a “division” in opinion, not really dividing us against each other. I think it’s kinda okay having different opinions (thought I think Joseph and other prophetic voices were very clear about it happening in North America). And about the seer stone and Urim and Tumim I think it’s very important to trust what Joseph said.
Im a big fan of your program. I love the choice of people to interview. I especially like this particular subject of where the Book of Mormon took place and the DNA discoveries. Thank you so much. May I make an observation and suggestion. I think you need to sit at a round table so that the presenter has a place to keep his laptop and books, papers etc and the hand held microphones are distracting. If you were seated at a table that would be solved. And, another observation. When you wear black you disappear into the background. You are very professional and well informed. Wonderful work guys.
IMPORTANT NOTICE: AT 33:26 WE FAST FORWARDED SOME OFF THE DISCUSSION IT WAS KIND OF REDUNDANT AND WE FORGOT TO PUT A VOICE OVER EXPLAINING THAT.😅
No worries...! I imagined something like that... Also, could you let me know about that book Rob was using to explain about the Sidon river? The one that is out of stock, or the editorial is not publishing any more? I want to acquire it and read it. Thanks for all you do...!
What is the name of the Book that is a good help while reading the Book of Mormon?
I thought you might like pastor Mike Winger
th-cam.com/play/PLi-tJmIiOS7OiXmZg8ikq8Eh0OPwfEi1N.html&si=jCKb74g5TxPEpFh4
@@videocineasta😊
Contact me about old photographs of Ohio mounds!!! asap
There is a story in my family history that Joseph Smith met my 4 great Grand Dad as he was traveling in New York. He ran into him as a young boy he was apparently poking around some bones he had found. Joseph pulled up on his horse and looked at him and said, " The next time I see you, I will bring a book about those people and who they were." My Grand Father's name was Russell King Homer. The next time he saw Joseph, he had become a young man. Joseph gave him the book, and it was the Book of Mormon. Russell joined the Church and was part of the great LDS migration story and ended up in Northern Utah. I'm also a 4 great grand son of Martin Harris and two other Grand Father's who were born in Nauvoo and fled for their lives.
Family History Stories are important for filling in the blanks in history. Thank you for sharing this!!
Bro is part of history 😅
@scottpound411 yup :) Brigham Young is my 4th great Uncle lol Martin Harris 2nd Wife was Caroline Young she was pregnant with my 2nd great Grand mother when she walked to Utah with the LDS migration:)
Great story! Thank you for sharing!
@@davidstarr3566 wow 😯
Lucy Mack Smith's biography of her son, Joseph - talks about how Joseph was tutored by Moroni before he received the plates - and regaled the family with stories of the people who used to live upon this land. Kirkland to Jackson County are what Joseph referred to as the "plains of the Nephites".
Anyone who thinks Joseph didn't know, hasn't read history
Nor have they read View of the Hebrews by Ethan Smith 1823 or The Late War Between the United States and Great Britain 1819.
First foreign speaking mission called by Joseph himself? Try and guess we're he went and what tiny island they landed on? I think elder Cook mentioned it in last conference if you listen closely
And those who don't want to know _won't_ .
I'm very acquainted with early church history and am quite certain Joseph Smith never made any revelatory claims about Book of Mormon geography.
@@101mythbuster- Nope . Check out Wayne May's (Historical Archeololgist) work on th8s very topic .
He's published lots here on Y-T. If your "kniwledge" is as wide and deep as you _claim_ , this will be of inestimable value to you .
I’m glad that there were certain issues addressed in this video. I personally stumbled across an archaeological site while walking my dog in the woods and found artifacts and pottery and other things along with what looked like possible burial sites. I tried to get the local government and authorities, archaeologist, etc. involved, and at first they were enthusiastic and then for some reason they just shut down and stopped communicating with me.
I was trying to raise the alarm because I thought this area was in danger of being developed and destroyed, and I thought it might be important historically. It was the strangest thing I’ve ever experienced. Then I started to do my own research over period of two years, and I realized what had happened. Papers and information had already been written about the whole area And if I came out with what I knew, and they had to add it to the local history, it would literally rewrite things that had already been assumed, were set in stone so to speak.
This meant that more than one reputable archaeologist would have to recant having said that there was no further evidence in the area to suggest that certain things or people had lived there. so because of pride and arrogance, parts of history are being totally swept under the carpet and ignored. After realizing this, and fuming over being shut down and silenced, I decided to take things further afield.
I ended up contacting specialists and anthropologists working on different projects and were experts in their field working in other states and asked if I could use their study materials and the information they had learned over years about certain things. They were happy to help and it allowed me to understand what I was looking at even better.
I realized that the place was an important settlement which had connections to other sites nearby that were ceremonial, and they had links to the Hopewell culture further up north. This is very important because it was presumed that there were no traces of Hopewell culture in this area or in my state. They were incorrect.
There are artifacts and things that have been discovered that definitely show this area was inhabited by people who had connections to that particular culture, and also Mississippian south eastern ceremonial complex hubs in neighboring areas which are now neighboring states hundreds of miles away.
There are still important things to be discovered here, but unfortunately, the powers that should not be have made it very difficult for me to get back into the area and do any more research or exploring. They’ve even resorted to threatening family members that live in the neighborhood with financial penalties or legal consequences. I have personally been threatened with being arrested. They are not kidding around.
It’s sad. Really sad. The local government is clearly involved in this as well, as is the large corporate property development company, and the management company overseeing the residential side of things. It’s very frustrating, disappointing, knowing that there is something important there, and also knowing that these areas are being damaged by pot hunters and people who don’t know what they are doing that are destroying all the evidence or taking it away.
Fortunately, I was able to get enough evidence together and take photos and plot things on a map to create a persuasive argument. When I filed the report, I was completely ignored and blanked. I did not even receive a response or an acknowledgment of what I had submitted. I have been to numerous archaeological sites and several states across eastern America, and seen similar places that were clearly settlements with similar characteristics.
They are ignoring the information they have been shown, so that indicates that there may be involvement or corruption at the state level which is astonishing and disturbing. It never ceases to amaze me, the level of corruption between corporations and governments. So after two years of research and spending money out of my own pocket, and even getting other organizations, scientists, people who believe in what I was doing involved in ended up going nowhere. Grrr.
Wow! I’m glad you got to see the artifacts at least. Thanks for sharing!
@@debbiemelander289 no problem. I did manage to recover some of the evidence before it was destroyed by development. Luckily, there are allowances in the rules and regulations in those cases. Unfortunately, for every place that is discovered 10 more are bulldozed or destroyed completely. Some of them without ever having been discovered. I suppose it Hass to be enough for us that there is at least some evidence that is compelling enough to at least create a reasonable probability in the minds of anyone who is doubting that the book of Mormon is real, the people in it were real, and there are in fact things that were left behind by these people. The rest we have to take on faith and I think that was the point. Besides, the spirit guides some of us to find things and you would be surprised how much is actually around you right under your nose or right beneath your feet at any given time. The Lord will cause the earth to reveal the truth of all things in good time.
What state and area did you find this?
@@taressaearl7838 southeastern, United States. South Carolina. Piedmont region.
You’re a champ! Never say die.
I'm 79. I grew up with the Meso Theory. a decade ago I happen to pick up a book about the Heartland Theory. I immediately knew it was true, even when I saw things that were dispelling it. The more I learn the more absolutely convinced I am that THIS land of America (The US) was the land of the Nephites. Add the scripture, DNA and plant/animal info and I have ZERO doubt. Thank you Rod Meldrum and Wayne May. Is it germain to my salvation? No, but it sure makes it clear where the New Jerusalen will be. and that is important.
Wake up boys! If this didn't convince you, NOTHING WILL! If you're afraid to take a side, then why is that? Perhaps because you're afraid of llosing viewers? I hope you have more courage than that.
I was raised on the Meso American model. At home and at church. From a young girl there were things about it that didn’t make sense to me. As I read the Book Of Mormon on my own and with my family the holes in the Meso theory that I could see left me confused and frustrated. I pondered and prayed a lot about it. I found myself harboring an inclination that the book took place much farther north that I was taught. About 16 years ago my prayers were answered when a friend gave me a DVD of Rod Meldrum explaining all the questions in my heart. I had a spiritual confirmation that day through further prayer that the land of promise spoken of in the Book of Mormon, where the Nephites and Lamanites also lived was the land I live on. I testify that when we are ready for more meat of the gospel, when we earnestly seek for more light and knowledge the Lord will grant the righteous desires of our hearts. Reading the Book of Mormon with that new understanding has brought it to life for me in ways I had never experienced before. I wish that for everyone who desires it too. Knock and it shall be opened. Seek and yea shall receive.
Baloney
@@101mythbusteryour response shows where your heart is
@@101mythbusterI agree, it's an embarrassing thing to listen to the heartlanders testify that they have come to that conclusion after much prayer as if those who look at the Mesoamerican model don't believe in prayer. To me it's a means of hijacking the debate the sane as when Evangelicals tell us they have prayed and know Mormonism is false.
I always felt the same thing from a young age. Maybe personal revelation but had no scientific basis to back it up. I just felt the scriptures laid it out plain.
@BrianTerrill I told my personal experience. There’s no insinuation on my end of anyone’s lack of prayer or cause for embarrassment. It’s simply my experience. Perhaps you and mythbuster should look inside for the cause of your own negative reactions to my personal experience. Why did you internalize it the way you did? Why are you projecting? Why did you take my words personal when they had nothing to do with you? I don’t mean any harm. Just barring my testimony on this topic. Your testimony wouldn’t offend me even if I didn’t agree with it. Best Wishes!
You should look into the DNA of the animals that were brought here by the Jaredites. The Texas Longhorn has been extensively studied and I think the results were interesting since the original conclusion of the researchers was that they came here about 2,500 years ago and they were most closely related to the Ankara, which is a breed from Iraq.
Beyond that you should look at sheep and goats and fish.
I have seen a pamphlet and I can’t find it, but it talked about a fish in Ohio, whose only relative lived in the Euphrates river. I was flabbergasted at the time, it might have been a poster, but I just can’t find it again. It does remind be of the Book of Mormon because the Jaredites brought fish with them.
How interesting! I live in ohio. I’ll do some digging.
Not to mention the cureloms and cumoms.
The Texas Longhorn was brought here by the Spanish...
@@rodneyjamesmcguire Maybe. Here is something you need to know though. Archeologists and scientists aren’t always reporting correctly. There’s so much proof on that. Watch Scott Wolter he will get you started on the Smithsonian. Watch every early episode. That’s when I started to hear things and did some deep research. Not just Wikipedia or Google. Graham Hancock helps too. Science and history has not been taught to us correctly.
@@rodneyjamesmcguire The DNA evidence doesn’t clearly support that. It is not closely related to Spanish cattle. It’s more closely related to the Ankara. Which is a breed popular in Iraq. Populations of them were found far North as New York. Maybe taking credit for the Longhorn was just another way to steal the Natives stuff.
Rod Meldrum is such an awesome guy! I am so thankful for him and all those who put so much of their time and effort into helping us better understand things that were lost.
What was lost?
@@watson666 the artifacts and history of the native peoples here known as the Hopewell amd Adena. The Smithsonian tried to destroy and hide it all under "manifest destiny" doctrine. They wanted the world to think of them as "savages" with no history but a hunter gatherer culture.
42:10 Not only does the BOM does not mention the existence of any other people, it actually states goes one step further:
2 Nephi 1: 8 "And behold, it is wisdom that this land should be kept as yet from the knowledge of other nations; for behold, many nations would overrun the land, that there would be no place for an inheritance."
More than one interpretation can be given to that verse. It can also be true if people come to the America's and don't go back to their homeland, the people of that homeland will not know of the new world. Remember, Columbus thought he could sail straight across the sea to China. People in 15th century Mediterranean Europe had no idea the American continent existed.
So that verse in Nephi is satisfied if word of the new land does not go back to the old world. The new world stays hidden until someone goes back with news of the discovery.
And the Book of Mormon gives plenty of internal evidence and anthropology gives evidence of other people already being present when the Lehite and Jaredite groups arrive.
@@UtahKent I appreciate your thoughts on this, and I used to interpret 2 Nephi 1:8 in a similar manner. However, as I've delved deeper into my studies, the presence of other civilizations in America during the Nephite time, such as the Olmec, Zapotec, and Mayans, adds more complexity to the issue.
Considering that these peoples existed in the Mesoamerican region during the Nephite and Lamanite times, if the verse didn't include them, then interaction and possibly intermingling between them and the Nephites and Lamanites would likely have occurred. This would suggest that the Book of Mormon should document changes in cultural traditions over time. However, textual evidence from the Book of Mormon seems to contradict that possibility. For example, in Alma 54:17, Ammoron still adheres to the Lamanite tradition of the Nephites usurping the right of the government. This suggests a lack of cultural or racial mixing, which might be expected if other nations were heavily integrated.
@@DavoBenjamin We forget that the Jaredites coexisted in a different part of the land up until at least ~130 BC. Because Coriantumr was found by the people of Zarahemla.
@@UtahKent I agree that other nations, apart from the Jaredites, coexisted in a different part of the land. But they could not have mixed. This is evident by the fact that the Nephites and the Lamanites maintained their culture. The Lamanites always maintained a feeling of being cheated of the right of government because their ancestors were the elder brothers. If they had mixed with other nations, then this unique culture would have been changed. Like I mentioned, the BOM does not mention the existence of any other people, not because there were no other peoples, but because the Nephites did not know of any other peoples. While I agree that the BOM mentions that the Nephites thought the land north was desolate because of other people (there is no mention that the Jaredites were aware of other civilizations), there is no mention of meeting other nations other than Coriantumr, the last Jaredite, and Mulekites, who founded Zarahemla.
@@UtahKent
It’s very clear.
Please do a part 2 with Meldrum!
This info rings more true than anything else I've ever been shown. It. Just. Makes. Sense.
And you can tell he has good and honest intentions.
The spirit has confirmed this to be true to me as well, it makes sense and it feels right too :)
I love the Book of Mormon! The peace and clarity it brings to me is amazing!
As the associate editor for a major scientific journal, I will affirm Rod’s statements about the prejudices in the scientific community. It should be pointed out that Biblically Judah and Joseph had different mothers, and though they are identified as being sisters, there is nothing that indicates they had the same mother. So there is nothing that says that maternal DNA would link descendants of Joseph with descendants of Judah. Also we would expect that Jaredites would be linked with Asians if we believe the Asians and the Jaredites came from Tower of Babel. I could easily believe that South American cultures are of Jaredite descent. It is folly to think that we have the records of all people who have immigrated to the western hemisphere. The people who are using the DNA arguments against the Book of Mormon use a lot of very narrow focused postulates to put their faith on.
The statues and temples found in Mesoamerica and in Asia are too similar at and made at a different time than the Jaredites. They would have had to have their idols and architecture evolve at exactly the same rate and direction on two continents. They obviously went from one spot to the other across the Pacific, but I haven’t seen any evidence that they went back-and-forth a lot… enough that the cultures would be the same. I could be wrong, just some thing I thought I’d point out and see if you have had an answer for that because it’s bothered me.
@@heelsidehero7581 The Jaredites, Mulekites and Lehites crossed the Atlantic, NOT the Pacific Ocean.
@@brucelloyd7496 that’s my point. They aren’t any of the peoples the Book of Mormon talks about.
@@heelsidehero7581 The Mayans are connected to the Hindu of southeast Asia. Compare their pyramid structures.
Well, with the DNA, you can add that Joseph had married an Egyptian, and the Jews material ancestor is Tamar, with the Davidic line including Rahab the Harlot from non Israelite Jericho Moabite Ruth. The only common DNA between those tribes is Jacob's
Good job explaining. When I was a littlie boy I thought people were saying Empty
Sea not MTC. I was so confused 😂
Now I'll never think of "MTC" the same again 😄
I thought Seminary was Cemetary.
It was strange that they would go early in the morning, sit around, and read scriptures. Then my sister told me about a beetle she saw on her leg at seminary, and screamed... so at the time, I assumed it made sense. Now... not so much. I still wonder why a beetle was in the church. 😂
My wife just got me a copy of Rod's book for Christmas. "To Mom from Barb" written on the inside cover. Sorry Mom, your loss is my gain. My aunt first showed me this book about 20 years ago. Happy to have a copy now.
Can’t wait for part 2! :)
The heartland model is the only one that makes sense to me given all the data, history and evidence I don’t know why rods book is out of print. I have it and it is awesome.
Amen!! I have it too, great book. I have the Annotated Edition of The Book of Mormon too another great book!!
Sure, so long as you ignore the vast majority of data, history and evidence.
Have you even looked at the Mesoamerican model?
@@jmhatutubeyes, I have. I read most recently exploring the lands of the book of Mormon, revised edition by Joseph and Blake Allen. It’s almost 1000 pages and it says nothing really. I was amazed at how little evidence is in Mesoamerica. In contrast, I am extremely impressed with the evidences for the heartland model. After years of research, I believe it is obvious where the book of Mormon occurred. I do, however, believe that Christ went to the people of Mesoamerica after his resurrection, and is known as the feathered serpent or Quetzalcoatl in that culture. Cortez was mistaken for the great white God that should return from the East. I remember learning that in second grade from my non LDS teacher. Otherwise, the evidence doesn’t stack up for Guatemala.
Yeah was raised on the Mesio-American theory. Taught it on my mission back in the 70's so what is your point? As a older more experienced person now who has done his own homework over the years. I can spiritually and mentally say that it happened in the Heartland of America not in Mesio-America!!! We all have to find this out for yourselves.
Rod Meldrum's videos the five disc set was what started my long road of research and discovery. I have tons of stuff I have collected over the years. Images, videos, books, etc. one of the interesting things I have found was all the videos of people looking for artifacts. These people spend years searching for arrowheads all round the waterways of eastern states from Florida to New York. As far west as Kansas. This is so popular they have conventions in many states where they show their collections. Just look on TH-cam and you will find videos about it.
Rod is legit!!! No other Book of Mormon model makes sense. The heartland model best fits the scriptures and Joseph's comments. Thanks for having him on.
Really?
If your wondering how Moroni got the plates along with the rest to the little Hill in New York…here is what we know. At the final battle in 385ad Mormon assigned 21 men, think of Seal Team Six…to accompany his son to deliver the records to New York. We know they had the Liahona…basically a hand held Garmin GPS like device. Both Mormon and Moroni said they knew the 3 Nephites…so I think they went with them…that’s the 24 mentioned in the Book of Mormon that hide on top of Cumorah probably in the cave that the 12 wagon loads of records that Moroni moved to from Shim. Now on Columbus’s 4th voyage he sails south from the Mediterranean down the coast of Africa until he picks up the trade winds blowing west and he sails directly to Guatemala in 3 weeks. In his journal he writes about Mayan ocean capable canoes “as long as a Spanish Gall-ion and very seaworthy…they carried 25 men. Moroni could travel by boat up the Mississippi then up the Ohio and onto the Alegany River and travel by boat to within 34 miles of Palmyra. Now let me do some Rod Meldrum speculation…we know Moroni tells those with him not to return home. So I would speculate he told them to settle there and start their lives over. Maybe this group were the ancestors to the Mohicans…a fiercely feared warrior tribe alined with the Iroquois Nation much like the Spartans. William Penn lost every battle trying to take Pennsylvania…he finally raised enough money to buy it. He said when he was negotiating with them in their villages he felt like he was in a Jewish Barrio in London…these may be the Jewish dependents Rod is finding.
Con’t…..correction…Jewish descendants…along with the Nephites of Hagoth…that’sa pretty large group in the heartland.
Meldrum is the man!! Heartland all day long…. but my testimony isn’t at all based on that. Thanks again for the great shows and the work you’re doing!!
Everything I have read about the heartland theory requires people to ignore certain facts to embrace it.
I think Meldrom is a foney who is pushing HIS OWN AGENDA to GET GAIN, PERSONAL PRAISE & MAKE MONEY OFF THE CHURCH. I DON'T TRUST HIM!!!
The BOM is true & it is not important where it took place. There were hundreds of thousands of people during this time. Some in America AND Also South/ (Mezo) America. Think about it.... he spends every day trying to prove he is right. & any other opinion is wrong. PUKE!
Mesoramerica sir
Consider where the plates were originally found by Joseph smith that is your starting point then work backwards
Love it! Thank you for this great episode!
Br. Michael B Rush's new book "The Book of Enoch Vol 2". had several dna chapters. Not only from the i United States native Americans and also how possibly the Northern countries of Europe that have that dna that the American Indians have. At least the ones up in the northern part of America that actually traveled north in ships in the Book of Mormon. It is an amazing book.
Where can vol 2 be purchased?
How did you find volume 2 already?!
If I remember correctly, all of that is in Volume 1 talking about how Nephites could have crossed the seas back to the European continent when Hagoth left with his two expeditions. Yes Michael Rush's book is amazing and thought-provoking. It does my heart good to see that he is a "Heartlander"!
That is in Volume 1 were he theorizes that Hagoth people might have gone to German and become part of Germanic tribe
Also Michael Rush would be a great guest!
1:33:57 at the end of the Book of Mormon the Lamanites pursued and pushed to the Northern area where Nephites were and then settled. The native histories mentioned there being 4 first peoples, some were in the land from the beginning, some came by boat and came north and south and west from the East, but the same pattern of event in the Book of Mormon occurred again after the time of the Book of Mormon illustrating the pattern of behavior and culture. I just love all this, I can’t wait for each dispensation head to give an understanding of all that has occurred in their time.
Also the 3 Nephites are recorded from the furthest North to the furthest south of the American continents, and the Holy people taught all of them over these many generations.
I fires me up when people say “no one knows, I don’t know, you don’t know” it’s not significant to salvation but as we receive more understanding under principles and doctrine, one can recognize collateral light/knowledge much like Jared seeing the hand of the Lord, just to a more subtle extent. But no worldly evidences can sufficiently demonstrate a spiritual understanding for those who have made up their mind that it cannot be understood by anyone if it is not recognized by everyone.
We have spiritual witnesses, by that I mean we don’t know if the Pearly Gates swing open or slide open but we know they open, of course a critic will not accept it if we cannot provide every desired detail.
We know for certain that Moroni and the record were at the Hill Cumorah, that event of the Book of Mormon is definitively in North America, at a very Northern portion of North America. Even the land of Missouri to Ohio covers a similar amount of land between Egypt and Israel. “No one can really know” that is very similar to saying no one can know the church is true. When we state that we are asked what we mean by that, we do not have the most detailed answer with published documentation proving what we testify of, we tell of the authority, and the second witness of the Book of Mormon. The same can be said of the areas of the Book of Mormon. It has wide influence, but the record we have was his up at the northernmost location of the Book of Mormon. I love you guys, keep it up, this has been a passion study of mine since my youth.
Yes, yes! Amen!
There are things we can absolutely know. And in regards to the Book of Mormon geography, we do know for certain some things right here and right now. So stop hedging your bets and allow the truth to influence your methodology of gaining more truth.
I agree, we CAN know with with a pretty high degree of certainty, that is why the MesoAmerican model is most certainly the correct one. It is truly sad there is still a debate about this.
"27 And it came to pass that the king sent a proclamation throughout all the land, amongst all his people who were in all his land, who were in all the regions round about, which was bordering even to the sea, on the east and on the west, and which was divided from the land of Zarahemla by a narrow strip of wilderness, which ran from the sea east even to the sea west, and round about on the borders of the seashore, and the borders of the wilderness which was on the north by the land of Zarahemla, through the borders of Manti, by the head of the river Sidon, running from the east towards the west-and thus were the Lamanites and the Nephites divided.
28 Now, the more idle part of the Lamanites lived in the wilderness, and dwelt in tents; and they were spread through the wilderness on the west, in the land of Nephi; yea, and also on the west of the land of Zarahemla, in the borders by the seashore, and on the west in the land of Nephi, in the place of their fathers’ first inheritance, and thus bordering along by the seashore.
29 And also there were many Lamanites on the east by the seashore, whither the Nephites had driven them. And thus the Nephites were nearly surrounded by the Lamanites; nevertheless the Nephites had taken possession of all the northern parts of the land bordering on the wilderness, at the head of the river Sidon, from the east to the west, round about on the wilderness side; on the north, even until they came to the land which they called Bountiful. (Alma 22:27-29)
Amazing!!! I have the annotated BoM and Rod's book on Heartlands, both incredible and very hard to deny that the BoM took place in North America.
43:02 this information is so easy to refute. The fact is Jews married outside of their culture more often than is being presented here. Esther, anyone? Even Ruth, who was a Moabite. So it is not as cut and dry as he is presenting.
So, Jews intermixed with the Amer-indians in New World?
2:02:00 don’t forget about the mic Mac tribe in New York. They had a written language before Columbus.
I love love love Rod Meldrum!
Hey, I'm only a half hour in and enjoying this discussion so much. Love Rod and all he works for. 😊 Have you looked at all into the book 'Traced' by Dr. Nathaniel Jeanson? He follows the patriarchal line of DNA and has some fascinating discoveries in the last 3-5 years.
Dr Jeanson is a young earther (smart scientist) and he is looking for some pure bloods for Native American DNA testing.
He is looking for all kinds of DNA sampling but mainly men.
David O McKay told all of the Navaho Nation and all of us that they were Laminites.
Joseph smith also said the same thing. Many have. Very cool!
Read from Wilford woodruff.... Nephites.... Zuni, Laguna,Hopi.
Gordon B Hinkley also told the people of Guatemala they were descendants of Lehi
It’s not true there’s DNA evidence in my Navajo blood , I checked not a drop from a Jew. My ancestors claim different
The Sac, Fox and Ojibwa tribes have a unique DNA haplo-marker identifying them as Hebrews. Also, the Cherokee have an oral tradition that their ancestors escaped (their word) from a place across the ocean called Masada.
that is completely false. you have been misled
@@alanschannel1495 not false - look up haplogroup x on Wikipedia, my brother
Thanks for having Rod M. On.
Y’all are next level! Love your channel! ❤️☀️
Awesome discussion as usual. Thank you!! Best to trust spiritual witnesses!!
Lies
Thanks for having Rod on. Lots of haters in the comment section, but I'm glad you guys keep on going. I don't know why this subject has to be so emotional for people.
I love Rod Meldrum! When I first read the Book of Mormon on my own I was 11 in CA, I was learning about Native American History in Social Studies and it hit me that the remnants of the people in the Book of Mormon had to be part of these Natives if not the very descendants. I excitedly told my teacher and he told me Brigham Young made up the Book of Mormon…. I excitedly told my family just for them to point out the introduction….. I learn only when I ask the question apparently. It wasn’t till my mission in Cache Valley UT when I heard about Rod Meldrum and since then I have learned geography was not so simple and many groups have moved in and out, and Lehi’s family and Mulekites and Jaredites have had influences all over and are not always a pure line as the Book of Mormon mentions other peoples.
Just look at all Southern California Indian tribes , and channel islands ,start there and look at the Indian Chumash,tongvas, kumeyaay,( ( tarahumara, tribes, these tribes have àlot of cumora in there language , just saying ? Xnever marked the spot... Just saying
@@davidcarruth5906 I use to build trail in the central coast of CA, I got to work with archeologists which were excavating whale bones from an indigenous people they said was about 20,000 years old, but it seemed odd that indigenous groups were hunting whale that far back, it made me think of the Jaredites though. All those giants found on Catalina Island, Adamites? Chinese made it to the Americas many times early on, BoM is just a single record of many many groups.
Ok ….I have spoken with Rod Meldrum a couple of times. He is well meaning but wildly creative and loose with his”facts”. Please invite Dr. John Lund to talk on your show. He has written 2 books on where the Book of Mormon lands are located. He takes the very words of Joseph Smith, John Taylor and Wilford Woodruff who collectively authored as the co-editors of the official Church publication “Times and Season” that clearly state the primary events of the Book of Mormon took place In Guatemala. Rod Meldrum tries to explain these articles away, but never in their lives as apostles or prophets did they ever change alter or redact those stories. If Rod had been alive in the 1800’s he would have been the greatest snake oil salesman of them all. Dr. Lund’s books are “Meso America and the Book of Mormon…Is this the PLACE?” His 2nd book is titled “Joseph Smith and the geography of the Book of Mormon”. Dr. Lund takes the words from the Times and Seasons articles and using the same word crunch formula used by the FBI to convict the “Uni-bommer” in court…determined that those articles were indeed written collectively by those three men. Rod plays fast and loose with all kinds of hear say and altered facts including being told to stop misleading the public on incorrect usage of DNA evidence…but he continues to slither around selling his oil to celebrities in an effort to gain support for his enterprise.
I will add some of my own speculation that would help Rod Meldrum if he would be open to it. Remember that in the Book of Mormon in 55 BC Hagoth, most likely a Jewish Rabbi, persuades 5,400 people to leave Zarahemla. They build “ships” and sail north. 1 year later Hagoth returns to gather the rest of the people…proof he did not get lost…and sails back north. I believe they sailed north from the Yucatan region to the Mississippi River and beyond. Rod is most likely finding their “Hebrew” evidence as they their descendants would have continued to practice the Mosaic Law…being they missed the arrival of Jesus Christ. When I asked Rod about where Hagoth went he said “they sailed north out of Zarahemla on the Mississippi River up through the Great Lakes then through the Northwest passage….the one Admiral Byrd couldn’t find with steamships, and around Alaska down through the treacherous Straits and onto Hawaii. This they did in simple sailing boats…then returned one year later and did it all again. By the way…DNA evidence has now proven the Polynesian’s origins date to Jerodite times not Nephites…that’s one of the reasons why David O. McKay refused to print on Church presses Joseph Fielding Smiths book. By the way, Rod has found compelling information…if he would embrace the fact he is finding artifacts from Hagoth and their descendants he wouldn’t get himself in so much trouble. Please get Dr. Lund on your show….by the way, Rod will not publicly debate Dr. Lund on this subject.
@@Thehaystack7999 that's very true too jaridite, mulikites, muli is big Polynesian names.. definitely the best theory to me? But all I know is the best sailor in world according to Capt Cook are Polynesian s they landed on every island in Pacific Ocean, and somehow missed the two biggest 🏝️
Im glad he was honest up front in saying he is heavily biased and doesn’t base his belief on the physical evidence.
Cope.
I remember running across that article in Nature or Science magazine (was a copy editor for dozens, can't remember) in the late 1990's, started researching, found Wayne May's work, and never looked back.
Heartland is the answer.
Great discussion!
I grew up with Rod and he's always been so amazing! Loved hearing this!
I am becoming a regular doner . . . IF you have Rod on for a part 2!
Consider it done good sir. God bless you!
Just messing with you! I just became a patreon member. This interview did it for me. I have enjoyed your content from the very start. I wish I could give more. Thank you for what you are doing! This is wonderful material!
@@james8996 you do realize that Thomas Ferguson only looked in meso America right?
@@thestickofjoseph you really need to look at Polynesian, and California, and first foreign speaking mission called outside USA? Brigham Young. Settled along Colorado River ares Dow to Chihuahua. Wilfred woodruffs journal on , Hopi, Zuni, Laguna,etc . Architecture, building, language, Aztec codecs, atzlan, Colorado River(red) rivers , rivers that flow from south to north? Little Colorado, gold, silver, copper, native Americans don't join the church? Polynesian do? Why, Spanish trail, or Indian trail witch goes right through Utah valley? No, temples , and church got thrown out of east coast not many members to this Day around old Church sites? Why? That not important land for church! Utah Utah aaha in (Juda) udaa. Geography of Utah lake flowing in dead sea ... Salt lake, river Jordan ? Everything adds up in West , there is so much more , but no one even looks right in front of there eyes unbelievable!!
@@james8996 I don't know were ham land is , but i do know we're best land in world is as far ad GDP, and agricultural best ground is , not mex or heartland! Just stating facts here...
The promises and prophecies from the mouth of the Lord and the Prophets has me sold on the geography. All of that being said, the geography will matter more after the testimony of the prophecies and testimony of Christ are planted in our hearts firmly.
The problem isn’t your mics. It’s the room you’re in. Too much echo - to reduce this, add acoustic tiles on your walls (assuming that’s an option for you😊👍🏻). Great video!!
If the Book of Mormon can be proven scientifically, then faith would be pointless, Moroni's invitation and promise meaningless and ultimately our reason for coming to earth unnecessary. Developing a relationship with Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ by opening our hearts to the influence of the Holy Ghost is why the Book of Mormon exists and why we're here. Rod, your work is the reason why many people will be introduced to it and take it seriously and read it. Great interview. DG
James E. Rice is the 2nd great grandson of Amasa Lyman an Apostle serving along with the Prophet Joseph Smith Jr., and was Joseph's counselor for one year while Sidney was living in NY. When Sidney came back he was reinstated, and Amasa returned to his position with the 12 Apostles. Jim Rice had access to unique and privileged info, and he sought out important restoration info often, and many revelations on his own.
I, Diana Jo B. Rice, also share collateral lineages with both Emma and Joseph. As does also Jim connect with Joseph & Hyram Smith's lines way back in the 1700 hundreds thru Samuel Smith Senior, and Rachael Marvin thru their youngest son Nathaniel Smith.
In the prophet, Joseph Smith's own testimony in the introductory pages of the Book of Mormon, he testifies of Moroni's first visit to him; "He said there was a book deposited, written upon gold plates, giving an account of the former inhabitants of this continent, and the source from whence they sprang." Moroni told Joseph Smith that the record found on the gold plates is about the earlier inhabitants of THIS continent. The continent where Joseph and Moroni were at, at that moment during that first meeting of the two was the North American continent. Not South America, not Africa, Europe, Asia or Antarctica, but THIS continent. I am pretty confident that both Joseph and Moroni understood that the continent that they were located on at that moment was the North American continent. I don't know how more plain a prophet and an angel can be. If you cant take their word for it, why bother even worrying about it one way or the other.
The land of the BofM was prophesied to have all nations flow unto it.
USA is the only land that has happened to. Ellis Island records show that from 1880 to 1920 25 million people came to USA.
They did not go to central or South America.
The heartland model has numerous prophesies that other lands don’t have.
You need to look west my friend!
That's absolutely not true. You can find every nationality in Mexico as well as the US. The same is true for many parts of South America
Wow this is awesome so glad I found this channel and I know for sure the Book of Mormon no doubt happened in the heartland thanks 🙏🏽 for sharing.
How can this continue to be debated. It’s the text and purposes of the scriptural record that were so clearly laid out here that must be relied upon. Meldrum is right. We cannot ignore the prophecies-when taken with everything we know from the D&C, too, it’s undeniable the Book of Mormon took place in what we now called the United States. Did anyone really ever think Nephi was prophesying about any other nation?
Agreed
Did Nephi prophesy of any other nation? Um, yes:
"12 And I looked and beheld a man among the Gentiles, who was separated from the seed of my brethren by the many waters; and I beheld the Spirit of God, that it came down and wrought upon the man; and he went forth upon the many waters, even unto the seed of my brethren, who were in the promised land." (1 Nephi 13:12)
This has been confirmed by prophets to be Christopher Columbus who never set foot on any territory that would become part of our current nation called the United States. He did land in Central and South America
Ive been thinking for the last year now that the Book of Mormon Central America location theory is the worst idea taught and peddled to the saints and will have a cost the church won't want to spiritually pay.
Fantastic interview! Another 70 page book you might be interested in concerning DNA is called Face of a Nephite by David Read. He would make a wonderful guest. A humble and knowledgeable man!
Is it factual or full of crackpot theories that a regular person wouldn't verify before saying the author was knowledgeable?
One thing I found out recently which I thought important to add to this discussion:
Rod brings up, beginning at 1:19:00, his opinion that the Sidon River in the Book of Mormon flows south and not north, based on what he said was one definition of the 'head' of a river in the 1828 version of the Merriam-Webster dictionary, which has one definition of the 'head' of a river at that time meaning the confluence or downstream emptying spot for the river into a larger body of water. However, from a reading of Lehi's dream in 1 Nephi 8:13-14, is very clear in its definition of the head of the river that flowed past the tree of life, that the head was the source of the river, not its destination:
13 And as I cast my eyes round about, that perhaps I might discover my family also, I beheld a ariver of water; and it ran along, and it was near the tree of which I was partaking the fruit.
14 And I looked to behold from whence it came; and I saw the head thereof a little way off; and at the head thereof I beheld your mother Sariah, and Sam, and aNephi; and they stood as if they knew not whither they should go.
So my take on this is: why would the Book of Mormon use a different definition for the head of a river in Nephi vs. the definition elsewhere, such as in Alma? To me, this is a clear indication that the Sidon River flowed north and not south. The other evidence for this is that the land of Nephi was very consistently described as uphill and southward from the city of Zarahemla, with the city of Manti in between. Since the river Sidon's 'head' was near Manti, this also implies a northward flow.
Rod mentions that Mesoamerican proponents such as Kirk deliberately leave out things that don't agree with their model, but Rod is doing this same thing by leaving 1 Nephi 8:13-14 out of his argument :)
“And if thou wilt make me an altar of stone, thou shalt not build it of hewn stone: for if thou lift up thy tool upon it, thou hast polluted it.”
-Yahweh (Exodus)
“Neither shalt thou go up by steps unto mine altar, that thy nakedness be not discovered thereon.”
-Yahweh (Exodus)
And I, Nephi, did build a temple; and I did construct it after the manner of Solomon save it were not built of so many precious things; for they were not to be found upon the land, wherefore, it could not be built like unto Solomon's temple.
-Nephi
Both temples built in Jerusalem were single story buildings having ramps until the courts, then there were steps to step up into the court, the altars in both temples were rough stone not hewn, and compared to all the Ziggurats that the other cultures surrounding Israel built (Egypt, Babylonia and Asia) the Jewish temples were ant size and a joke
The buildings found in Mesoamerica match the ziggurat building style, many of them being exact copies of those found in Asia, not Solomon’s, whereas all over in the Heartland of America is found platforms, having ramps, with the platform area being the exact size the temple area in Jerusalem describes for both temples
No hewn stone, no steps, temples built after the manner of Solomon’s… nowhere in Mesoamerica can you find these traits on their buildings
But come up into North America and you do
Just a thought…
Good job, just found your channel. Love Heartland Theory. Good conversation. Thank you.
Years ago when that DNA thing came out I started my own investigation and although I'm no scientist, I could see that the scientist didn't really know enough to definitively say that there was no Hebrew DNA in native American populations. I concluded that eventually the right DNA would be found.
It's funny how DNA has been found in cavemen skeletons and has been used to link to living individuals nearby. We've used it to solve genealogical mysteries going back hundreds of years. Millions have done DNA testing and yet nothing has been found to support middle eastern origins for the indigenous tribes?
thousands of years have been tracked with populations with y DNA and yet... we cannot find y DNA in the Americas which fits the book of Mormon? Weird, huh?
I feel this man has a sound mind and really seeks after truth.
As a non active Member currently. I can tell you honestly, tell the Heartland (USA) non-believers one thing. No Country south of North America is protecting Israel. 🤷 The Book of Mormon happened in the Heartland.
That’s a really good point
during by readings I have seen where Joseph Smith Jr. while in Navoo said, as he pointed across the Missippi river to Montross, Iowa there is where Zarahemla was located
The east and west seas are the great lakes (remember they are far larger than the sea of Galilee). The narrow passage could be theNiagara Passage (means narrow neck or passage) or east of the ancient marshy black swamp in northern Indiana. It also had many poisonous snakes referred to.
No the Great Lakes are not the East and West Seas. Do you even know that hypothesis was created by critics of the Book of Mormon who were trying to prove Joseph Smith just made it up?
Wow! Holding those microphones for 2 hrs must have been hard. Bet you couldn't move your arms afterwards.😊. Really enjoyed the interview. Thanks for sharing (& holding those mics)
I have the annotated Book of Mormon and Love it!
I love Rod. Also love your between the lines videos. Would love to see you pick those back up for 2024.
Joseph mentioned a holy man who was known from Cumorah to the Rocky Mountains, if I recall correctly.
Holy man, I meant. AutoCORRUPT.
Cumora know find it! Kumeyaay, tarahumara.. cyama.... Kali ono if you figure out the last word you will find cumora
That’s right. It’s in reference to Onandagus who was known from Cumorah or East Sea to the Rocky Mountains
@@shawndieboldbut that's not in the Book of Mormon.
Also, the Law of Moses could not have been practiced in Mesoamerica. That’s a huge problem for the meso people.
Could you explain why? I’ve heard this argument that the needed sacrificial animals wouldn’t be present in Meso?? Thanks.
Exodus 20:25 And if thou wilt make me an altar of stone, thou shalt not build it of hewn stone: for if thou lift up thy tool upon it, thou hast polluted it. 26 Neither shalt thou go up by steps unto mine altar, that thy nakedness be not discovered thereon.
The pyramids in Mesoamerica violate the Law of Moses.
They don’t have the right plants or animals to follow the law. They also would have followed a lunar calendar for planting and harvesting which also corresponded with their holy days. They could not have followed their calendar correctly and Meso people admit that. They will tell you that they would have had to make substitutions. Also they did not have hewn stone alters (I believe someone posted about that), Mesoamerica is full of those. Check out Amberli Nelson. She has a whole presentation on it.
th-cam.com/video/pRPpqQ44qHo/w-d-xo.htmlsi=yPTGaclSXtBDf61r
@@GregFessiathe temples in Mesoamerica for the most part postdated the crucifixion, and the rule regarding the ramp as opposed to stairs only applied to the alter of burnt offerings. There were also stairs in King Solomon's temple.
What's the name of the book out of print he keeps quoting from?
Really appreciated this. Definitely need a round 2 and 3 follow up here. So much untapped information. Really appreciated it!!!
I'm a Heartland fan here, and had to laugh when Rod was trying to get you boys to commit! Regardless of location, the Book of Mormon is true and all the events stated therein happened somewhere on this earth 🙂
Rod was SAVAGE! I mean when you look at the evidence it's not even close. The Book of Mormon happened in the US.
Or not at all.
In my opinion those who say the evidence shows it was all in the US sound like they are smoking pot. That's my honest feeling
Always fascinating.
Rodney Meldrum is awesome!
For Non-LDS DNA sources. I would suggest looking at Donald Yates Cherokee DNA work and "Answers in Genesis" Native Americans origins.
Many don't know there was a Native American record written on wood planks that was translated. This record gives the history of the Lenni-Lanape migration from Siberia to the Eastern US (Delaware). The interesting thing with this record is that it gives an account of a great battle or series of battles with a people called the Talegas (mound buiders, possibly white). Onces they defeated the moundbuilders they divided up there lands with other people (people they called ancestors to the Iroquois). "Answers in Genesis" believes this record matches the DNA haplogroup Q and the linguistic of the record with native Americans. The onandagus in the Zelph account seems to match Lenni-Lanape phonetics.
Yes he is a great source
How do you know he is trustworthy?
@kylethedalek Donald Yates is trying to track down the DNA of the Cherokee to validate the tribe's oral account of descending from the tribe of Judah. He is just testing DNA from the tribe and publishing his results. So he seems trustworthy.
"Answers in Genesis" is using DNA, linguist maps, and the Lenni-Lanape translated records to make a point on Native American origin. They believe the crossing of the bearing straight was 900 AD, and the Lenni-Lanape made war with the people of Cahokia. I believe they crossed around 200AD to 300AD and made war with the Hopewell. In their record, they say they made war with the Talegus and then inhabited their land around the great lakes. The Great Lakes were inhabited by the Hopewell who are gone from History around 400AD. The academics believe the Lenni-Lanape record to be fraud with little proof. One of the reason they claim it is fraud is based on Joseph Smith and the Book of Mormon, even though translation isn't connected to Joseph Smith. Is there any evidence to back up the Lenni-Lanape record? Yes. Kalamath Native Americans have similar linguistics and history. Native American customs and phonetics are similar to the Lenni-Lanape. The Ket in Siberia have similar linguistics to many Native Americans like the Navajo.
“Answers in Genesis” Brilliant and impeccable Credentials
There was a common belief that the mound builders were white long before the book of Mormon was known about. It was common in Joseph Smith's time. It proposed that dark skinned people were inferior and couldn't have built burial mounds. So the only logical step was that the white mound builders were killed by the dark skinned inhabitants. Oddly enough, that fits the book of Mormon ideology and supports the white supremist colonialist ideas of the westward expansion
Love Rod Meldrum! Thanks for this!
I am very interested in the topic and I love the guest.
Honestly, the hosts are making so much effort to "explain" and "simplify" that it is difficult to remain with the conversation.
Thanks Rod for updating us on all your wonderful, overwhelming information of what I consider great evidence of the truth that, right here in the Heartland of America is where the Nephites and Lamanites lived. When I was 16, I read the Book of Mormon and that was back in the 1970s and we had a Globe on a stand at our house. And after I had read the Book of Mormon and gained a great, deep abiding testimony of it, I looked on the Globe and I said to myself where are the Seas North, East, South and West on the American Continent? My eyes were led to the Great Lakes of America and the narrow neck of land! And then my eyes were LED down to the Mississippi River and the light turned on in my mind and I realized it wasn't this small, little trickling creek of a river, but it was a huge, large river that could take bodies downstream to the Sea. It all made sense to me! This was the River Sideon and at the age of 16, I just knew that this American Gontinent was the geography of the Nephites and Lamanites. But I could not prove it to anybody so I kept it to myself all these years. Thank you Rod for bringing the realization of all the things that were revealed to me long ago, to be true!
Just passing by to say that I loved the video. Thank you so much.
Awesome content guys
Once you know there is no question..... just like we are counseled by James and Moroni" Ask in faith with real intent, and you will recieve the truth of it"
Ha ha ha thanks for the shout out!
Whoop whoop
As soon as Rod said something about mink raising I instantly thought of you, and then TSOJ mentioned you! Super cool.
Question, does your Carter line descend from William Carter of D&C or the other William Carter who went west with Brigham and plowed the first crops in SLC and even St George, UT?
On the part of look at a geography. You cannot look at the lay of the land in 2022 or 2023 to pen point 2600-year-old needle. Lands have changed dramatically in the pass 2600 years.
Excellent presentation! Rod Meldrum has such great answers because he is a dedicated and sincere Truthseeker with enthusiasm and tenancy to keep at it through thick and thin for many years! Bravo!
Well if you think his answers are great that means you don't study enough and are qn easy dupe.
Alma 46: 17
“And it came to pass that when he [Captain Moroni] had poured out his soul to God, he named all the land which was south of the land Desolation, yea, and in fine, all the land, both on the north and on the south-A chosen land, and the land of liberty.”
Everything South of the land Desolation was declared a land of Liberty by Captain Moroni. In the Meso American model, the United States was even north of the Land Desolation.. I know this declaration was considered specific for its time but I would still find it odd that the actual Land of Liberty today would be excluded from this prophetic declaration.
Heartland Theory all the way for me!! It’s just common sense considering we have a lost civilization that matches the Nephite timeline, almost to the T.
For more information on the covenant running with the land of America, look Elder Ahmad S. Corbitt's 2022 talk to the J. Reuben Clark Law Society. Super perspective changing. President Oaks was there. It is completely compatible with Rod's research, but definitely more humbling.
Thanks for the recommendation. Love Elder Corbitt
100 percent conversion comes from the manifestation of the spirit ! I love and support what you guys are doing. I have been following Rod for years. By their fruits you will know them.
1:56:20 I don't really understand this point because Yes, there is tons and tons of archeology in Meso America, but NONE of it matches Book of Mormon timeframes! On the other hand, the remains of the Hopewell and Adena cultures in the heartland are exact matches for the Nephites and Jaredites.
Sure is cold out there!
The prophets seers and revelators are curiously quiet. They are operating from a position of fear on these matters. The Kinderhook Plates caught Josepg Smith. Mark Hoffman embarrassed the brothren in the 1980s. The Egyptial Burial scrolls caught them in a mess in 1967, and it has only gotten worse since then.
Then the DNA is not helping, so they have young lds lads making videos trying to save the Church themselves with the Brethren quiet in SLC.
What a mess.
The LDS Prophets told us who the Nephite and Lamenite people were. They said they were the native tribes in North America.
Find their buried cities, massive battlefields, breastplates, swords, helmets, chariots... If you sustain your prophets, stop the nonsense about South America.
The problem... The evidence for North America isn't working out, so everyone is looking someplace else.
Your prophets told you they were in North America. Sustain them. Have confidence in them. Prove that the DNA a d history of those peoples was that of the Book of Mormon.
The archeology of the Bible sustains the Bible. The archeology of the Book of Mormon should do the same for LDS Prophets who recieved word from God.
I totally was going to join patreon after the Christmas post, but wasn't sure if it was active, as there was only 1 post. 😅
God testified to me that Joseph Smith, The LDS church are true but we must always remember the Church is only as good as its members, the members are the church. The temple is just a brick and mortar building its the people inside that make it Holy. Stand in holy places.
Loved this conversation,I have always leaned towards heartland thinking. Where can I get the name of rod Meldrums book on the Heartland?
When I first read The Book of Mormon, I felt:" why must it always be Americans...that can manage to spread all the glory as the book instructs?"
Well... no other South Anerican country did that in its origin . We need ya ...USA clan! Accept and proceed pls
Heartland for the win 💯
I don't think many people realize this but haplogroup X DNA exists in South/Central America too.
Send us the reference link??
@@thestickofjoseph The tribes I'm aware of which also have haplogroup X DNA are the Tarahumara, Huichol, and Yanomami. It's not X2 like in the Algonquin. It's X6 and X7. These tribes are all located in or near Mesoamerica. I'm linking one article on the Yanomami specifically. Information on X6 and X7 is a little harder to come by than X2. I could get you some more info though if you have trouble finding it. Feel free to reach out.
mtDNA Variation in the Yanomami: Evidence for Additional New ... - NCBI www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1915132/pdf/ajhg00020-0219.pdf
Thank you! Excited to look into this!!
The Native American version of Haplogroup X is clearly concentrated in Northeast North America, but there does seem to have been some ancient mixing throughout the Americas
@@Jon316-y5u different haplotypes within haplogroup X though.
I can't help but feel that the Heartland theory resonates with me far more than the Mesoamerican theory. I've felt that my entire life, even before all the Heartlander evidence became mainstream.
Can't wait to see Wayne May back in your TH-cam channel. I hope you get to go on tour with him or Rod Meldrum.
I haven't been able to, but I have heard it's awesome. When my family had a family reunion in Nauvoo we had an opportunity to visit a site near there. This family we found out about owns about twenty six acres of land on which there are numbers of burial mound, fortifications (earthen walls and ditches) point of entrance, and other interesting stuff.
Interview David Lindsley
“The Nephites Lived Where?”
Interview David Read
“The Face of a Nephite”
Interview Bruce Porter
“The Gospel of Politics”
There are four documented migrations from Asia as well as the Book of Mormon. The Nephites did not take up the whole of the Americas they just had a part of it. It was incredibly hard back in the day to cross the cruel dessert plains of Texas. There just was no water.
There's also a thousand years of unaccounted history after the close of the BoM.
So...all of the civilizations of North and South America are the Lamanites, and they all appeared only after 400 A.D.? The Incas, the Aztecs, the Mayans, the Seminoles, the Cherokee, the Navajo, the Hopewell Mound Builders, the Cree, the Ojibwa, the Inuit...all of them are from the same group and only went their separate ways 1600 years ago? Am I understanding this correctly?
You seem to understand their misunderstanding correctly.
Could the Lamanites have assimilated with a darker skinned people causing their posterity to have darker skin. The always seemed to outnumber the Nephites by 3:1 (my estimate). There was also the “profession of nehors”, who were they?
The two useless divisions within the church.
-Meso v Heartland
-Seer Stone v Urim & Thummim
Everyone in heaven shaking their heads at all of us for dividing ourselves.
Because we all know it’s Heartland and Urim & Thummim!
Remember nearly everyone who believes in the Heartland Model were MesoAmerica first. There is no division. Just a few trying to hang onto the rabbit hole that is MesoAmerica.
Hopefully it’s just a “division” in opinion, not really dividing us against each other. I think it’s kinda okay having different opinions (thought I think Joseph and other prophetic voices were very clear about it happening in North America).
And about the seer stone and Urim and Tumim I think it’s very important to trust what Joseph said.
Haha I like what you did there and I agree 💯
Wow this was fascinating
Great video. I bought two books today.😊
25:56 "im gonna try to break this down to laymans terms"
"And lemuels"
Lol😂
😂 we think alike haha!
Im a big fan of your program. I love the choice of people to interview. I especially like this particular subject of where the Book of Mormon took place and the DNA discoveries. Thank you so much. May I make an observation and suggestion. I think you need to sit at a round table so that the presenter has a place to keep his laptop and books, papers etc and the hand held microphones are distracting. If you were seated at a table that would be solved. And, another observation. When you wear black you disappear into the background. You are very professional and well informed. Wonderful work guys.