Canon's making a huge mistake. Speak up.
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 7 ก.ค. 2024
- Here's the DPReview article: www.dpreview.com/news/3875526...
I recorded this over the weekend and reached out to our Canon rep for comment, of course. He got back to me and I added his response into the video after recording.
In short: Canon seems to be using their patents to block third parties from making lenses for the mirrorless RF mount. It's not uncommon for tech companies to do this; Apple does it so they can charge third parties to connect to their infrastructure. However, I think this is huge problem for Canon users because Chelsea & I built our careers on less expensive third party lenses... and that's true for hundreds of photographers I've known who built their careers using third-party lenses because they simply couldn't afford the expensive L lenses.
The fact is, it's not too late. Canon can listen, so please write a comment sharing your feelings and your experiences using third-party lenses. Contact Canon on social media and let them know what you think and how this impacts your feelings on the RF mount. - วิทยาศาสตร์และเทคโนโลยี
I recently bought an R5 with the expectation that the market would naturally expand with 3rd party products, lenses, etc... Had I known I was blindly investing into closed proprietary product ecosystem I certainly would NOT have gone with the R5. This is a bait and switch in my opinion - obviously there are no rules that state companies must allow for others to use their tech, but if you consider that the industry operates with 3rd party adoption over decades and decades, the argument could be made that this market adoption rate is as close to a given as could be expected. I feel like Canon owes it to their customers to disclaim their product strategy when it is this impactful to the way the product can be used in the market, as the market typically operates.
I was thinking of adding a Canon R5 to my kit. However, with no aftermarket lenses available, I won't consider Canon. I see a large number of aftermarket and native lenses for Canon's competitors. I don't like limitations. This is a declining market, and unless Canon is about to start making smartphones, they better recognize the foolishness of their ways. Canon, you are aggravating your potential buyers, just to make a few extra bucks. How foolish!
Go Fuji!!! I switched because of this problem
Yeah I was also thinking of upgrading to a R5 or R6 in a few months but having seen the recent moves from Canon I will just consider another camera brand. It a shame as I always was a Canon shooter and absolutely loves their bodies, but if there is no good 3rd party option I guess I will have to switch to a different, more customer-friendly, ecosystem.
agree, i would have bought an r5 or r6 but this limitation is ridiculous
Thanks, for sharing. Good luck in your pursuit of changing to a new lens system.
Just remember you will always get what you pay for. Simply put you pay crap you get crap.
I’m honestly so glad that this news came out. I’ve been waffling between Canon and Sony, with the biggest drawback to Canon being the lack of available RF mount lenses. I likely would have gone with Canon and waited (indefinitely) for some 3rd party lenses to come out. Sony is about to sell another a7iv!
Main reason I switched completely from canon to sony in 2019. Its just dumb at this point if you wanna praise canon still with this type of bs they pull. Welcome to the family! My favorite purchase besides my A7s3.
Hardware sadly is also basically dependent upon what type of client work one does, and sometime one will almost be forced to pick and choose (or worse switch) from one hardware to another.
Consider the big four companies... Sony, Canon, Nikon, and Fuji. For some other people that might need the gear, even consider m43. Best to rent first, then make buying decisions from there
Exactly my choice too 😁. Sony have made huge steps these past few years, certainly now with the A7iv, and I can't wait to get my hands on it!
I've got the Tamron 35 150 f2-2.8 lens and it's absolutely superb, actually sharper than my 2 GM zoom lenses. Sony would probably never make that lens and if they did it would probably be £3,000. 3rd party options are such a win for the customer
Tony you've inspired me to make my own video about this subject - something I've been tempted to do for a very long time, and the huge weight of comments it's picked up within 24 hours have certainly said a lot about how Canon's customers really feel. Thanks for having the cojones to publish this.
Cojones = balls 😁 Cajones = drawers
@@Omarography (edited) ;-)
Hi Chris!
Hi Chris, I am a great fan of your channel, and this one too... I have to agree with Tony that this is going to be Canon's undoing. I have always preferred Canon's footage to Sony, but Sony has made their cameras far more desirable in the past few years. For the past 10 years I have been using Canon 5Ds - the 2, 3 and 4... but when they discontinued them, and went with their new line... I simply made the business decision that to shell out another $25K + on Canon gear - especially the lenses, is simply not a viable option for me. Especially since I operate in South Asia where budgets for videography are a fraction of that in the USA or Europe. And even now Sony has some great Lenses that are out of my price range, but at least I will always buy the Sony camera bodies, and where possible use Sony Lenses, but failing that, I have some great Sigma lens options - and so do most of my customers.
Canon and Nikon banning third parting lenses has been a huge selling point for Sony.
I've been shooting Canon for ~15 years, starting with a point and shoot, then a rebel, then a 6D, 5D IV, finally to my current combo of an R5 and an RP. I've resisted any urge to switch systems to this point, but the lack of third party RF lenses is infuriating. To this point, I'd assumed it was just a matter of time before we'd see offerings on the market - to hear Canon is actively blocking third party manufacturers absolutely makes me second guess making any investment in the RF system. This maneuver is so incredibly short-sighted by Canon and is absolutely a deterrent to not only people wanting to buy into the RF system, but also to people sticking with the RF mount.
I couldn't agree more! I hope they hear us, loud and clear.
It's a big, big mistake for Canon not to give access to 3rd Parties to build RF lenses... And already now some of the most exciting lenses will be first launched for Sony platform. I just upgraded to Canon R some weeks ago... If I had this info some month ago I would have left to Sony or Nikon
I agree. And why I now have a Sony instead of a Canon camera
@@bigAll2000 My god, more Sony fanboys.
@@andylaauk I use Canon cameras and EF lenses for 20 years now and I started and stayed with Canon cameras BECAUSE of the lens choices!
Now Sony has the cheaper lenses and more variety, literally the opposite of 10 years ago. I would love to stay with Canon long-term, but I don't find the optics I want here anymore!
Currently shooting Fuji, I’m looking around after the XH2S came out. One of the strong appeal to Sony is clearly the lens options…..
Samyang, Viltrox and others are known for copying patented designs, ignoring copyright law and making profit off the work of other people. Canon puts money into R&D and makes money off licensing their researched and tested designs. A monopoly is never good, but what Viltrox is doing is the equivalent of me taking your photos, putting them on iStock under my own name and then complaining that you're stopping me from earning some money when you take out a copyright claim against me.
For better or worse, copyright law and the patent industry is what it is.
I was with Canon for about 20 years, and last two years I was waiting for something similar to R6 but with 24-30Mpx. But twelve hours after your video I ordered Sony a7 IV. Because I don't want to be vendor-locked by a bunch of marketologists/lawyers, instead I'll contribute to a more open economy and more client-oriented competitor. P.S. I love Sigma Art lenses.
My dad gave me his old Canon T3i, which is how I got into photography. When I wanted something better, I went to the 7D Mark II. Earlier this year I got an M6 Mark II. I've been using a mix of 3rd party and Canon lenses on all of them, and I was saving to buy the R7 next, but now I think I'm going to spend some time seriously evaluating some other cameras; the Fujifilm X-T4 in particular. The fact that Tamron and Sigma already offer lenses for X mount is a crucial factor in that consideration.
Currently shooting with a Canon 5D Mark IV and was planning to upgrade to an R5 sometime within the next 8 or so months, but now I'm second guessing that decision and may give Sony a closer look. For me personally, it goes beyond simply forcing me into Canon glass for native RF mount, more frustrating to me is the almost "bully" mentality that Canon is apparently displaying with this. I'm also concerned that if there isn't competition within the RF mount realm, what's to stop Canon from charging even more crazy money for lenses in the future? Very concerning Canon.
I have been using all my EF L lenses on the R5 w/adapter with great success. So I don’t see why so many are going ballistic over an issue that Canon addressed with great care.
bro... get you a sony, use cinematch, boom. done. =]
If you have lost of ef lens then it makes sense to just buy the ef to rf adaptor, but newer lenses seem to be smaller lighter and sharper.
I shoot both (literally only canon for the R5C + 5.2mm vr). Most of my pictures with sony for weddings, I have to turn down some of the sharpness. I'd highly look into the a7IV, swamps the canon R5 and if you shoot video, canon made so many mistakes on it.
@@craigfreeman9280 Why not sony A1? Sony can flawlessly use all the EF glass, while Nikon converts to just about nothing. Also good luck getting one
Thank god I bought a Sony. At the decision-making stage, I was thinking about Canon. The lack of third-party lenses was one of the biggest factors in my decision. Now I definitely do not regret it.
Very wise choice!
I shoot on 3 different systems,,, canon, Sony A7 and Nikon z7. I love the Sony’s ergonomics but the color space can be difficult to deal with… Canon and Nikon seem to look better right out of the can
@@scotthamilton1054 I can agree for Nikon, and of {not mentioned} Fuji - but Canon? I know that a lot of people are talking about "Canon colors" - but for me Canon pictures directly from camera are kind of washed out, lacking colors.
I agree that Sony FF is quite eye-candy, but I confess, I like it, and from experience - a lot of people likes it too.
What I love in Sony - is the fact that you can put practically any lens on those cameras. From good old Minolta MD or Konica, through more obscure lenses like adapted Yashinon, Meritar, up to old projector lenses. And 3rd party lenses base is absolutely HUGE :) with really awesome stuff, just to mention Sigma Art series
@@piorun23 Sony bought the camera business from Minolta when Minolta decided to focus on other products.
I shot Minolta film for decades but don't like Sony as company so I went with Canon for digital. I can't afford all of Canon's own lenses so I have a Sigma too. I would like to upgrade my current camera processor is from 2014 but this attitude from Canon is convincing me to switch to Nikon. (Both my brothers have Nikons and they like them a lot. )
I switched before and it looks like I have to switch again. If they think that brand loyalty is same now as it was with film they are wrong. They are making me think I should not have picked Canon in the first place. (And as for colors, all my Canons do not record yellow, on flowers for example - mums in my case, properly under all their different light settings. )
Thanks for this timely video. I've been a Canon shooter for 15 plus years and have been saving up to make the switch to mirrorless and buy the R5. The only thing holding me back has been trying to get some clarification on the compatibility of 3rd party lenses. Sorry Canon, now, someone else is getting my $7,000.00 budget!
I don't think it's "you" who should be saying "Sorry." But I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for Canon's corporate greed to waiver.
Wow I’m so glad I stumbled on this. I’ve been slowly building funds to replace my Eos 6D and was going to go for an R5 with adapter initially to reuse my large Tamron glass selection but slowly rebuild up 3rd party dedicated RF lenses as Canons aren’t priced for consumers imo. This is an absolute deal breaker for me so I’ll be looking at other platforms. Nice one canon.
I have been loyal to Canon since I owned an AE-1 35mm film camera. I currently have the R5. It was a stretch for my budget to upgrade to that body. The thought that Canon is willfully blocking third party lens manufacturing makes me feel betrayed by a company that I have advocated and defended in the past. My loyalty is not being rewarded.
Yours is a poor strategy. The lenses are all important. I personally know 2 people who bought R5 bodies, but coulsnt afford Canon R mount lenses, so are using adapted 3rd party lenses. The image quality of those tamron telephotos are no where near the quality of Canon RF glass, or, L series EF glass. And, I can sense thier frustration.
Glass is always the most important.
You’re right, Nor Dic. He should have never bought a Canon to begin with. Good work proving that to him. 🤪
@@nordic5490 agreed. Third party glass is perfect for the mom tographers for their shoots in the park, but not the professional shooter with longevity in mind.
@@coryhultquist580 Obviously you didn't bother watching this video, Tony clearly states that he and Chelsea never would have gotten into pro photography had it not been for those "mom photographer" lenses. There are many photographers who have done the same.
@@coryhultquist580 I think you'll be surprised by what you can get away with in professional photography
I remember buying the a6300 and researching lenses. I was looking for that perfect balance between image quality and affordability. At that time, nothing came close to Sigma’s 30mm f/1.4. Even after all these years, Sigma’s APS-C prime trinity is revered. So revered Sigma decided to extend the compatibility to Canon’s EF-M (basically extending the mount’s life for another 1.5 years). Third party brands matter, they actually keep the user loyal to a certain mount.
Just remember you will always get what you pay for. Simply put you pay for crap you get crap.
@@Davitor1 stop making the same comment everywhere. What crap are you talking about. There are 3rd party lenses that are very good. Lenses from big brands don't always mean quality
@@Davitor1 i have 2 of the 3 sigma lenses for the M mount and i consider them superior to Canon's primes.
@@Davitor1 There might be some truth to it sure (wouldn't call them crap though like you) but my Samyang 35mm f/1.4 is great. The first party sony g/gm lenses are most likely better but if I already get 80% (probably even more tbh) of the quality for less than 50% of the price why would I go with first party lenses when I cannot afford them anyway?.
@@Davitor1 you are surely not suggesting that Sigma lenses, especially in the art series are crap? That is simply not true
I switched from my Canon 6d to Sony a7iii when that first came out and I never looked back. I'm very disappointed in Canon's choice. Without 3rd party lense I honestly could never have progressed on my photography journey and would mainly have been bound by the nifty fifty those many years back. The 3rd parties are making things interesting ie Tamron releasing the 35-150 f 2-2.8 and 20-40mm 2.8. I hope down the road canon reconsiders but for the time being, I am very happy with Sony and their ability to deliver on what we actually requests 😀
This is really shocking and I’m surprised that Canon has restricted the adaptability of third party lens. I too was considering R5. Though I have canon prime but I also use third party lenses. Hoping that canon would consider their loyal customers’ suggestions.
You are correct about part of it...
"A company or set of companies" has restricted third party lenses. But the corporate answer is: it's Sigma and Leica.
But also items such as licensing costs from companies such as Canon and Nikon have not helped.
Canon do not care about people, they (like all huge companies) only care about profit. They don't care if they lose loyal customers, they have more coming around the corner.
Sony sips coffee: No, it's not a mistake. Keep on doing that!
Zun Tzu
Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake. - Napoleon Bonaparte
@@careylymanjones Ah my bad thought it was from art of war
I usually upgrade my camera body about every 5 years. For the last 18 years I have been a Canon user. On my last upgrade I picked up an R5 body. Had I known that Canon would abandon it's customer base by preventing 3rd party lens manufacturers from making RF mount lenses, I would have never purchased this body. Before this becomes common knowledge, I am considering selling my R5 while it still has some market value and switch to Sony. Sony is likely a better choice anyway and certainly more loyal to it's customer base.
Sony is no more loyal than Cannon. They used to use the "A" mount from Minolta (was full frame 35mm film). If you bought a half dozen lenses for a A-77II, they will not work on an A-7 of any variant, (even though many lenses were designed for full frame). They made an adaptor, but it has limited function. You want a new camera, fine. You buy all new glass. Will they do this again in the future? Who knows. They can change their mounts anytime they fancy.
@@DannyB-cs9vx Mounts change, and with the A-mount to E-mount switch it happened because they went from SLR bodies to mirrorless, which is the exact same reason Canon and Nikon had for their mount changes and is a perfectly valid technical justification for creating a new mount. Besides, it's not like A-mount was somehow short-lived: the first form of it came out in 1985 and the final lens came out in 2015 while the final camera body came out in 2016 (E-mount was introduced in 2010, so that's a five year transition period, while Canon dropped EF like a bad habit almost instantly once RF was out). And, as you said, they made (imperfect but still available) adapters. That's not PERFECT support, but it's nothing to sneeze at.
And, importantly, it's a far cry from Canon actively preventing third parties from making lenses for their current mount, which they have been doing since its introduction a few years ago. Mount changes aren't fun but they're inevitable whenever a massive shift happens in how the sensor, lens and viewfinder interact, but there's nothing inevitable about intentionally blocking third parties to crush competition and ensure the only options are Canon's own fantastic-but-expensive lenses.
Use the EF-EOS R Adapter for third party glass...
@@navis5284 As Tony pointed out in the video, this is less than ideal. These adapted lenses are often much bigger than a native mirrorless lens. Also the new mirrorless lenses are usually better performers. AND, companies like Sigma and Tamron are putting out new mirrorless lenses that don't exist in EF or RF mounts.
@@sethsez Cannon is free to license their tech to anyone they wish or not. How long has the EF been around? You got your monies worth. That is the message you give me. The person buying the Sony "A"mount lenses in 2015 got a good deal right? The 2016 camera was a great deal as well. Instant obsolescence. Sony was real loyal to them.
I still use the camera. For what I do it works just fine. Instead of buying the new "E" mount camera, I bought Olympus 4/3.
I've been shooting mostly Canon cameras ever since I got into photography as a teenager 38 years ago. As a collector, I have purchased hundreds of Canon cameras and lenses over the years. I'm a fan of mirrorless cameras due to their smaller size (body and glass) and adaptability to vintage glass. However, I too am concerned about the lack of 3rd party RF mount lenses. I am concerned enough that I've been considering Sony rather than buying pro RF mount cameras and lenses. I want to be able to use some of the cool new mirrorless lenses coming from Sigma.
Sony shooter, here. Sigma lenses are wonderful. I have the 24mm f/1.4 Art and the 70mm f/2.8 Macro Art lenses. Both are tack sharp. The AF on the 70 is a bit flakey, but who trusts AF for macro? AF on the 24mm is very good. Build quality on both is very good. They feel "professional" in the hand and in use. And both of them together cost me less than the 24mm f/1.4 G master would have.
Rumor has it that Sigma is about to release a DN version of their 50mm f/1.4 Art lens. For those unfamiliar with Sigma-speak, DN lenses are designed specifically for mirrorless, not just DSLR lenses with a tube stuck on the end. If it comes in with typical Art series pricing, it will probably be in the $800-900 range, comfortably under all of Sony's G and G master lenses.
This is exactly why I went with the A7IV over the R6. For me and many others, lens selection and support is the most important factor when it comes to buying a body.
You hit the nail on the head with this video Tony. Canon has really produced a compelling product lineup with their RF mount, but buyers need to be aware of what they're getting into. Good on you for raising the issue. This summer my friend who was shooting Nikon DSLR's professionally for many years decided to switch to a mirrorless system and had narrowed down his choices down to Sony and Canon. He asked me what I thought, and once I mentioned this 3rd party lens issue and showed him the difference in price (and he got to try them both out) he chose Sony.
Funny thing is, I was on the fence of buying an RF camera. Glad I didn't now.
Been a Canon shooter for over 15 yrs and I love Canon glass but I also loved that in many cases I could turn to 3rd party like Sigma and Tamron to obtain similar and in many cases, better quality for less. I switched to fully mirrorless last year but kept using I old EF lenses with an adaptor. The Idea was that RF glass is very expensive so I'll hold out cause there should be some RF third party glass in the horizon, I mean Sigma and Tamron have been killing it over at Sony. Surely there is some of that goodness coming this way right?... I think Canon is making a big mistake.
Nikon Z is actually great for Nikon DSLR user. IMHO Unless he's using it for wild life and sports, maybe only Nikon Z9 is the option for that.
@@apjgraphix it could be Canon's plan is to just wait a while before they allow 3rd party lenses. The thinking would go something like... While the mount is new they want to have only Canon options so they can cash in on the "early" adopters who are usually more willing to pay more. If I was a betting person though I'd guess they are either going to open that door soon or they never will. If they never allow 3rd party lenses, then perhaps the thinking is... they see themselves as the premium brand the way Apple does and they want to curate the experience from end to end and charge a premium price for a premium experience. With the canceling of the m-mount and now this, it's clear that Canon is not the consumer friendly option (were they ever though?).
@@DennisKapatos The problem is if Canon is too late in getting the early adopters. The facts are, even PRO photographers will not buy into a limited glass system when their glass gets old. EF lenses will soon be obsolete. New photographers will get an affordable system and once they have money, will get into a higher upgraded system of that BODY. They will not change to a new BODY/SYSTEM. Therefore, only a VERY limited amount of people will buy into Canon's new restrictive system. That will not be enough to make them profitable and in the long run, will hurt them.
This is insane. I actually thought as Canon was basically migrating everyone to RF they'd allow 3P lenses on so people could get cheap "starter" lenses while Canon would make the premium expensive ones. Instead they're just locking down the mount and only allowing native glass.
And the native glass isn't so premium either
I left Canon for Nikon in the 80s when they changed their lens mount to make it easier to accommodate the new autofocus feature. This caused anyone with a new camera body to have to buy all new lenses to fit the new bodies. In the 2000s they introduced APS-C lenses for the new digital cameras. These small sensor lenses would not mount on full-frame bodies so, again, customers had to buy all new lenses when they upgraded to FF. All this time Nikon made their lenses work on all their cameras. Is it any wonder Canon sells so many lenses. One thing you can always count on from Canon is they consider themselves number one and the customer will always be number two..
Nikon is blocking any 3rd party lenses that directly compete with lenses that Nikon is making.
Sony is blocking autofocus from working when a teleconverter is placed between a Sony body and a 3rd party lens.
To me, Sony is the least bad of the 3, but all are extremely anti-consumer.
I'm an engineer and always look for inexpensive compatibility. I bought a 6D a few years ago because it was the cheapest full frame body that I could find at Costco. It came with the nice kit L lens that was great for learning. Now I feel more comfortable with my kid photos. I'm not a professional or live from photography, it's simply a tool to record my kids life. But I've had a growth in my artistic skills and now I take photos of my kids from the stand point of a street photographer. Sometimes I do really real street photography 🤣. So I've been looking for and buying vintage lenses that give me new looks and styles. Even now I'm looking for something affordable that can just wow people. So blocking my ability to do the same after my 6D dies will just keep me from buying into the R series. I'm sure I can continue buying old 5D MII until I pass LOL.
I just had this conversation with high school kid that wanted to purchase their first camera. He was considering the Canon R6 and Sony A7iii. I gave him pros and cons for each. And the biggest con I had with Canon was not having third party glass. Once he seen the price difference he was really considering Sony.
I have been using the A7 III after having used Canon for well over 40 years and I love it. The price point and availability of lots and lots of own brand and third party lenses will open a wide spectrum of opportunities for anyone who wants to take the step to mirrorless.
I went through the same decision process when moving from APS-C few years back. Canon's bodies were not better enough to compensate for prices of lenses and lack of accessible glass. With Sony you can grow and have access to great quality glass for less.
Exactly Sony is for folks who can’t afford Canon.
@@Davitor1 or don’t like the way Canon is operating.
@@Davitor1 I don't know about that. I have owned a load of L-glass and always used the high end film bodies, my last being an EOS 1N. I just think that Sony fits the timeframe a lot better. The brand is much more interactive with consumers and like Tony said, they seem to like it when they are challenged by third parties. I find that Canon becomes more and more arrogant. An attitude which is not very becoming in a market that is heavily on the decline. A lot of their bread and butter (point and shoot and low end DSLR) was already killed by the smartphone industry. So why become such a snob in the part of the industry that still generates some revenue?
This is a deal breaker. After buying my first RF body, this comes a shocker and I would not be recommending Canon until and unless this change
Agreed. No new Canon purchases for me. Might unload the rest of my gear and migrate to Sony. All my dedicated astro cams use Sony sensors.
I don't mind Canon doing this as long as Canon plans to license their RF-mount to third parties. If this is the case in future I'd stay with Canon.
My first camera was a Canon AE-1 Program and (after some Minolta cameras) I was very pleased to inverst in a new Canon R6 and some native RF glass. I still enjoy using the R6 and my new glass. As I was never invested in (old) EF lenses I don't know whether I should invest in third party EF glass (like a Sigma 150-600) or wait until something similar is available for the RF-mount.
The RF-mount is rather new and I guess Canon isn't making "a big mistake" (as Tony said in this video) but Canon (as no.1) will establish a license system for the RF-mount. Third parties will be hesitant at first but if they want to make their profits also in RF glass they'll have to accept licenses! 🤔
I've been researching my next camera body upgrade and Canon has been in strong consideration up until now. If I can't get third party glass, that puts them near or at the bottom of the list for me. If Canon isn't giving serious consideration to how many photographers are going to avoid Canon bodies because of this decision, then they're making a serious error.
Hi Tony, my photography knowledge is next to zero:
I am buying a camera for my 13 year old son who needs one for school, he's taking GCSE Photography and really getting into it.
We're looking at the Canon 250D, and he really wants that one (I really want to get the 200D!)
We can't help noticing that Canon has deliberately disabled a pin in the hot shoe mount which apparently blocks it from using third party gear.
What you describe in the video is real, so thank you for speaking up.
Canon is the culture when it comes to photography, and moves such as these speak volumes in a manner I don't think it wants to speak.
We'll be fine, we'll muddle through with used gear, I'm sure.
But a clear message is being sent to people who want to start and over the long term, they will respond accordingly.
Thanks again for this video, we appreciate it.
Sigma Art lenses have always been my go to lenses for Canon, this change could cause a lot of us Canon users to sway away from upgrading our equipment and still keep the Canon brand in our camera bags. It's a bad idea because there is a market they might be detering from buying new Canon gear with third-party lenses.
Same here. I think I'll stick to DSLR for now. Was considering the EOS R 😢
Same here, this is good to know since my 7D Mark II is starting to show its age, and I use Sigma's 18-35mm and 50-100mm F/1.8 DC Art lenses as well as their 100-400mm F/5-63 DG Contemporary Lens. I would be uncomfortable upgrading to a mirrorless system if I cannot get a Sigma adaptor to convert the SLR lenses to a mirrorless system.
@@bryanwhite2685 I think the 6D Mark II is looking like a better option for me now. Won't want to be trapped into a lens system
I have 4 Sigma Art Primes and 2 Zooms. all EF. Love them.
Totally agree! Love those Signa ART lenses. They’ve been some of my favourite lenses I’ve ever had.
I think Canon is shooting themselves in the foot, pardon the pun. There are still lots of people who haven’t yet made the big switch from DSLR to mirrorless. And when we do, suddenly the decades-long lock-in breaks and if Canon won’t be loyal to its users, Sony and Nikon have some amazing camera systems and glass options too. Seeing this video helps me along my path to switching away from Canon.
I was on the fence between going from Canon to Sony. Because I'd be making that decision for the rest of my life - switching once is bad enough.
If Canon does not have Sigma lenses but Sony does, then I don't have to make that decision anymore - it will have been made for me...
I am so glad I found this video! I just ordered my first Canon mirrorless last month. To save a couple bucks I got a refurbished one directly from the Cannon website. Unfortunately, it was DOA. Their customer service was good, but made me go back to the drawing board on cameras as that one was no longer available. As a non-professional, low cost lens options are critical as I won't be investing $10k in my setup. Really appreciate this info.
Great video Tony, appreciate the candour. I will say this, I had two R5's and an R6 and an R. I've been with Canon for over a decade. After the overheating, the 30 minute record limit on prosumer cameras (R5 and R6), I honestly had enough and sold everything Canon and moved to Sony, never thought I'd say this, but Sony has been nothing but a blessing. Super happy with it, no record limit, beautiful image (especially from the later models), higher DR and just so intuitive to use.
i felt the same, bought a canon m50 with the intent of going into the canon ecosystem via efm-ef adapter and glass but after the last shenanigans over the past 2 years i went to sony and couldnt be happier.
@@baqcasanke seems to be most people these days bro
Canon is really making me think about jumping to Sony for the longest time because of this issue. It's a sad situation.
EF mount unexpectedly became popular with film productions. It was a great thing, as all of the sudden there were so many lenses out there that could be used, from professional cine to amateur photo ones, and so many cameras, including Arri Alexas embraced it. As cine cameras also get smaller, I was expecting the RF to follow in its steps (RED Komodo actually has RF mount), but Canon has to be less restrictive for this to happen. Otherwise the industry just might move on with another mount.
That would really set Canon back. I can see it happening and them having to claw their way back from it. I’m assuming there is massive R&D in cameras like there is in any other tech product.
The easiest way would be to collect 10$ from every third party lens sold. Bingo for everyone.
I started with a Canon AE-1 and followed the company up to the R5 Mark ll. But the it was time for a change, because the cameras lacked longer video record times and lenses became too expensive for the given quality. Today I own three SONY cameras. The FX-3 being the most expensive. Canon could have had all the alpha 7 users if the had listened to their customers.
When I began with DSLR photography around 2005, I went for Canon. I've had the 10D, 350D, 400D, 450D, 70D, 7D, 5D, 5DII, 6D and so on bodies. But when I bought my first mirrorless, the Sony NEX-3 when it came out in 2010, I immediately fell in love with the smaller form factor and the abilities it offered. I've had 5N, A5100, A7II, A6400, A7RII, A7III, etc. and in the meantime I've sold all the Canon gear I've had (the bodies and lenses such as 24-70 f2.8, 70-200 f2.8, 200L f2.8 II, 85 f1.4, etc.) around 2015. Third party lenses made Sony more affordable with up-to-date lenses. They make the whole market competitive and nowadays you can get a lens of your taste/habit/needs. When Canon and Nikon and the rest came out with their mirrorless systems it looked like there is a possibility to ever change my set to a different brand. But with such an inconvenient draw, I have lost - and I think a lot of other people too - my interest in Canon forever (or at least for a long period). If they behave like this, that would make their system less interesting for many people and that's not really helping with their market share. Versatility (and price of course) has a big impact at what system we all choose.
Thank you Tony. I was deciding between Sony A74 or the Canon R5 and this makes the decision really simple. I'm going with Sony. I can afford good glass but competition is good as it keeps pushing Sony to bring the very best glass to the market. There is nothing to push Canon. Canon if you are reading this, you made a bad choice, good luck with that. Hello Sony, I will shortly be a new customer. P.s. Why not Nikon? I've owned many Nikons in the past and loved them, but your latest model is too big and heavy, and you cannot quite match the autofocus of the Sony. The future choices for me are Sony or Nikon and never Canon.
@WhistleBit Are you high on something. 😂
@WhistleBit LMAO.....I hope this is a joke.
Your gonna love the a7iv. Sony has come a long way
Canon requirements are higher than Sony hence higher cost. Canon cameras and lenses are all assembled and made in Japan for quality control. Sony does have cameras made in Japan but only there Pro-video equipment.
@@metasploitstudios2257 I don't do phone photography, but, was shocked to see a 20x30 inch i phone picture at a neighbours house. Every bit as good as my panasonic G9 produces.
Being a wedding photographer the Canon RF system always seemed highly appealing to me. I‘m a Fuji user and I always will be. But sooner or later I will also start getting a FF system just because of the better low light capabilities. I have been tiptoeing around the R6, since I have already tested it and I loved the overall experience. Not having third party options at all absolutely makes this a non starter for me.
I‘m pretty sure that Canon will regret this decision in the near future. Nikon is catching up and if Panasonic comes out with a phase detect AF camera Canon will lose market shares.
I am excited to see what the next gen Panasonic FF will bring when they update their AF tech
This is also the same story for me! Moving from Fuji to FF for the same reasons, was about to buy 2x Canon R6's and have just bought 2x Sony A7 IV. I would have preferred
to go the Canon route, but not at those lens prices and I refuse to use an adaptor and carry large DSLR glass. Canon are shooting themselves in the foot.
@@edwinmccracken2686 Canon requirements are higher than Sony. Canon cameras and lenses are all assembled and made in Japan for quality control. Sony does have cameras made in Japan but only there Pro-video equipment.
I've been using Fuji for a year and I love it 💕💕✨
Well, I was considering a Canon R6 and I was hoping that the lack of a wide range of lens was due to the RF mount being so young, but glad I watched this video. It is time to switch. Glad that there are other good options like the Sony 7 IV, it is a pity that my EF L USM lenses are going to take a long rest, but I am not going to get stuck in a system that don't give me an option to choose.
I was interested in the the new R family, but went with a different format/ecosystem earlier this year, and I'd been second guessing having missed out on this new system. Not now. Non-OEM glass has been the meat and potatoes of my photography experience, and will continue to be.
I bought the R5 right when it came out and I have progressively gotten more and more frustrated by my purchase. Everything from the over-heating issue and how they resolved it to the lack of lenses, including the lack of third party options. I started my career on Nikon with a sigma lens. It legit jumpstarted my career as well. The game Canon is playing feels gross and makes me want to switch to another brand like Sony, even though I can afford Canon‘a lens now, and already own several.
I agree, Canon has every right to prevent 3rd party lens manufacturers from developing RF glass. Canon also has every right to charge extravagant prices for crappy quality RF glass. Canon also has every right to treat customers who spent a fortune investing in the RF system with the utmost arrogance thinkable.
Canon should not forget that at the end of the day customers have every right to choose what they want to buy down the road.
nice statement, dude.
the rf isnt crappy though?
Canon's RF glass is generally excellent... Class leading and innovative. Nothing crappy about it. Arguably, their RF lenses are the best Canon has ever made, and that's saying a lot.
But much of it is also pricey.
Not all... There's some reasonably priced stuff, too. And they cover the "necessities" pretty well. Even so, there are a lot of gaps in the system, which 3rd party manufacturers could full, at least temporarily.
But, other manufacturers are making great glass, too. Sony has been upgrading a lot of their lenses lately. Nikon has always been a superb lens maker. Even 3rd party like Sigma and Tamron are probably making the best they ever have, plus there are some new 3rd party makers producing excellent stuff.
RF glass is excellent but for the quality. I own 3 L class RF lenses out of which 2 have serious quality issues. I wonder if it is only me with an average of only .333. Am I just unlucky? I do not think so. I am ready to look seriously into alternatives.
“crappy quality RF Glass”?? I own 8 RF lens
All are exceptional, what RF lens are you using ?
Canon EF 70-200 f/4 L IS II USM vs RF 70-200 f/4 L IS. RF version is not lighter but more compact. Pulled out to 200 its approximately the same length. Well, I prefer internal zoom - of course I would love to have the compactness. When it comes to the AF, some reviews state that RF glass is a tat faster... not exactly sure about that, may be reasonable. However, there is fantastic EF glass out there and the adapter works like a charm. Its rather the other way round, older EF glass gets new life breathen into it when used on a mirrorless.
That said: I would love to see third party glass, e.g. a Sigma 35 f/1.4 ... that would be so nice.
Killing the third party glass market puts me out of the canon scene. Yikes!
I know so many photographers who switched to Sony pretty recently, and one big reason for all of them was there's SO much more lenses to choose from.
I wonder how a company like Canon is thinking to survive in the future without the strong support of third-party lens manufacturers for their system.
Pretty sure there is way more canon glass. Especially when you can seamlessly use EF glass on which goes back to 1987. Lol
@@southerncharity7928 That's the problem, they are aging glass.
I think so too - perhaps since I am one of those who have made the switch
@@southerncharity7928 Well, as already Tony is explaining in this video, adapting old SLR glass is anything else than a 100% replacement for dedicated mirrorless lenses.
The price of 10 bit video has kept me away from Sony. I have a Panasonic gh6 and really love it for both stills and especially video and now with internal prores at all video resolutions it's just a fabulous option.
I feel actively deceived!
Canon apparently intentionally hesitated to clearly communicate their policy on the now supposedly exclusive RF mount, keep it vague so that people believe what was well established in the EF system would continue with RF - 3rd party lens availability.
I fully expected the new mount to be 'open' for third parties to manufacture lenses for as well.
Not for one second did I think that the RF mount would be a closed system when purchasing my R5!
Having been with Canon for 25 years I was used to the EF mount being "open" as in allowing others to manufacture lenses for it. I was aware that Canon didn't actively share they protocol for AF like Sony did, but that's it.
I held out until the R5 arrived and then I told myself "finally, that looks pretty good".
I actively decided to stay with Canon for many years not only but also BECAUSE OF the much broader ED lens choice also from 3rd party makers. I was certain the same would continue for RF mount. Until then I'd keep using my EF glass and slowly transition when needed.
I feel actively deceived and thus ripped off by Canon because they did NOT publicly state their mount was gonna be closed to third party. Instead they said nothing and allow few AF lenses like the Samyang AF 85mm F1.4 RF to exist and be sold for quite some time. I accuse them for actively deceiving everyone by allowing these sales to continue for some time so that a lot of people kept buying RF cameras who expected the 3rd party vendors would broadly enter the RF lens market any time now. If Canon did harshly force this issue two years ago and people were aware of their stance before the R5 and R6 even got announced, I'm sure I wouldn't have purchased another Canon camera.
I would have guessed though that due to 'common law' their vagueness on the issue could be seen as deceitful to the customers.
No matter the legal implications, if they remain and enforce their position on their RF lens exclusivity I'm done with them.
I'll give them half a year to come to their senses. Let's see how this plays out!
@WhistleBit I own a Samyang 85mm F1.4, it has autofocus and works great...
I agree with every single word
Excellent video, Tony. Like you and Chelsea 13 years ago, I purchase OEM lenses when I can afford them, and 3rd party when I cannot. This has allowed me to equip not just myself, but my girlfriend, mom, and sister-in-law with high-quality, versatile, and full-fledged camera systems. While Nikon, Canon, Panasonic, and Olympus would have made more short-term profit from me if I had bought fewer, more expensive OEM lenses…they will be making much more from me over the coming years because now we are invested in those systems.
Two weeks ago I was about to purchase a Canon EOS M50 II, as an amateur upgrading from an Olympus E620 I thought this was a good choice. I have now, after seeing this and other TH-cam clips, decided that I had made the wrong choice, so I have purchased a Fujifilm X-T200. Thank you Tony & Chelsea for the heads up about the lens issue.
Totally agree with you, Tony! For most of my photography "career" (I'm more of a "serious hobbyist" than a professional) I've enjoyed using Canon point-and-shoots, Rebels, 7D's, etc. But when I upgraded from my Canon DSLR to mirrorless about a year ago, I switched to Sony. One of the big reasons why? Sony has an abundance of third-party professional quality glass available. I was able to get an A7 iii and Sigma 24-70 f2.8 for roughly $2,000 less than the Canon equivalent. As much as I enjoyed Canon cameras, for someone who's not a professional, that was far too much to be able to justify. I know that at the time I upgraded the RF system was still relatively new but I had a feeling that it would be quite a while (if ever) before Canon let third-party manufacturers sell autofocus lenses - which as it turns out looks to be the case. Now I'm more than happy with my Sony setup, and Canon has essentially lost me as a customer.
@WhistleBit LOL
@WhistleBit Guess who make the sensor... ah, yes, sony lmao
@WhistleBit You have no clue about what you are talking about, so fun.
I have been drooling over Canon bodies and glass ever since I bought my first camera, my M50, two years ago. But with how they simply left the EF-M mount out in the cold and now this, I'm seriously not enthused about choosing the RF mount when I upgrade to a full frame body. Panasonic was looking really good, even with the pretty slim selection of Panasonic glass, but now I'm looking at investing in an S5 with the 24-70 S Pro a lot harder than I was. Canon is industry leading, but with anti-consumer practices like this, I think their market share is going to take a pretty big hit.
Canon would as well struggle to compete against even Panasonic and L-Mount alliance in the long run.
For the price the Panasonic S5 is the best camera, but I don't know if L mount alliance would allow third party lenses
Fellow m50 owner here. As I learn more and will eventually want a bigger better camera body this news ensures Canon isn’t in consideration. The sigma 30mm contemporary on the ef-m mount is a great lens that I have really enjoyed and I picked it up at half the price of the canon ef-m 32mm.
I have had an AE-1, then AE-1 program. Power shots and the 24mm cartrage camera nightmare too. I was finally going to move up to a full frame dlsr but after this I am looking at trading all my Canon equipment for Sony.
@@amermeleitor So far I believe Sony is the best you can get. Samyang, Tamron, Sigma are doing magic on the E-mount, and Sony isn't sitting around and coming with impressive lenses as well for professionals and for people starting up like their great "normal" primes 35mm, 50mm, 85mm f/1.8. You can as well getaway with APS-C lenses if you are into video and have crop mode (outside A7Siii, FX9/FX6/FX3). Nikon Z9 is brilliant as well but you must always go after where are all the lenses you want and need and most mounts aren't as diverse and ready as E-Mount, ironically to Canon and Nikon that used to laugh at mirrorless and Sony.
Excellent and very timely subject. Thank you, Tony.
Soon after it's release, I bought a Canon EOS R, primarily for video (which is a minor part of my business) and to compliment my 5DM III and 5DM IV, for which I have many EF L lenses. I recently sold my 5D MIII and EOS R and bought an EOS R5. Fortunately I have the Canon Control Ring adapter, so I can use all of my EF mount lenses with the R5. I shoot mostly Real Estate/Architectural photography, and do a lot of headshots (using the EOS R with EF70-200 f/2.8L II). I will continue using the 5D MIV for the real estate work mainly because a 45MP photo is way larger than what I need for that work, which needs only about a 4MB photo. My plan is to to start selling my EF lenses, starting with my EF 70-200 f/2.8 II (which I use for headshots) and eventually replacing them all with RF mount lenses. I'll probably only keep my EF 16-35 f/4L because that is what I use for real estate photography. I wish that Canon would make it possible for the EOS R5 to adjust the size of the photo as is possible with the 5D camera (from 10 - 30 MP). I prefer Canon lenses over third party lenses, but the RF lenses are REALLY expensive. I remain hopeful that Canon will allow third party manufacturers like Sigma and Tamron to release RF mount lenses. I would most likely still purchase the Canon. My thought is that Canon is hesitant to do it because competition will force them to lower the prices on the RF lenses, which at the moment seems to be their golden egg. I think the patent issues is just an excuse. The real reason is the money, at least in my opinion.
So Canon, if you are reading this, I have two requests: PLEASE Enable the EOS R series bodies to produce various output sizes like the 5D (until that happens I have to keep my excellent 5D MIV), and let third party manufactures make RF mount lenses. Don't be afraid of the competition. You might have to sacrifice a little margin, but I am quite sure that you make up for that with sales volume from people like me, a CPS Platinum member, who prefer Canon lenses over Sigma, Tamron, etc.
Tony and Chelsea thank you so much for your content. As I plan to buy my next camera, which will be mirrorless, I definitely have to consider the availability of 3rd party glass. I feel, if companies like Cannon, decide not to allow 3rd party lenses, I will simply have to cross them off my list.
I didn't plan to switch to Canon anytime soon and now I'm definitely not as long as they're having these politics on their RF mount. Just no!
Such an important video, thanks Tony.
I’ve been longing for some of the tasty third party glass we see on Sony like the Sigma 35 1.2, the new 24 1.4 etc, it gets so many people into the camp and allows them to consider going name brand at a later date.
I love native RF glass, being lucky enough to own the 85 1.2, the 50 1.2 and the 70-200 2.8, but would love to see some better value options especially in the wide angles!
I’m stuck in the ecosystem. I didn’t know about this when I bought in. I wish I would’ve. It definitely would have been enough for me to give Sony a go.
Hopefully enough people will move away from Canon that they will reconsider this policy.
Thanks for this video. Totally with you on this. I may "just" be a hobby photographer or use my camera to complement my reportages, and, heck, I just went full frame a few motnhs ago, still on DLSR. But this really makes me hesitant to adopt mirrorless Canons any time in the near future. Lenses are expensive enough as it is, and this move by Canon just makes them much more expensive for this market segment - one we'll likely all have to adopt at some point and time because that's what is going to set the standards.
It makes me genuinely upset i bought a R6. I had some EF glass to adapt and was looking forward to when RF 3rd party stuff released to fill out the rest of my arsenal. I'm considering selling off my kit and switching over to sony soon. I had my eye on that 28-70 F2 and was saving for it - an amazing canon 1st party lens. But now i won't be picking up anything else for the RF or EF mount.
@WhistleBit Are you paid by apple to spread such non sense ? If not, this is sad
I have an R5 and love it. However, if I had known that I would not be able to buy 3rd party lenses for it I probably would have gone with Sony. I "assumed" and was wrong. Too much invested now to change. However, when recommending gear to friends I will point out this "BIG" IMHO (Opinion) drawback. Thanks for the video. Keep up the good work!
I am researching in photography for about a week now, because I am very interested in it and today I felt like it could be a hobby for my life. I am collecting as much information as I can before I am investing in it and I have to say that these facts make me feel bad about investing in a canon body.
Thanks for making this video.
It's a shame to hear that Vivitar can't sell their lenses for the new Canon. It's curious to hear that Canon is reviving the old R cameras with RF technology (I think those were mostly Leica products), but what's old is new I guess. The Vivitar 28-90 Series 1 was one of my favorite third party lenses when I was getting into photography.
Im a canon shooter and was looking to upgrade from a dslr to mirrorless but im having second thoughts now being on a budget.
I was thinking about converting to Canon RF because of the great Canon line-up. But hearing this, I think it is a deal breaker.
Yes, don’t do the mistake several of us did. Choose Sony if third party lenses are important for your work
Hearing what? Literally zero information. Tony has turned into a hack yelling at the clouds.
Thanks for laying this out so clearly. I've been a Canon EF/EF-S user and invested thousands of dollars in L/IS series glass over the years. I was just getting ready to make the switch to RF - sell all my existing bodies and glass and jump into the RF ecosystem. I know I'm just one guy, and I'm not a pro, but there are lot of us who fit this profile. It's a tough decision to make to sell everything, but then to be locked in to Canon glass forever?
Some hard numbers for my non-pro situation. I'd need to spend over $15,000 to replace all my current glass with new Canon-only RF glass. Even there, Canon does not have a replacement for my nicer Milky Way lenses at 24mm and 35mm, so buying into RF is more expensive and limits my choices.
I'd really love Canon to respond to this explain to us non-pros why we should even consider Canon. Don't get me wrong, I have always been a Canon shooter, love the platform, happy with the build quality, and I've taken some amazing shots, but why should I continue when Canon has now made me question if it's a good future.
I hope I get a response for all us non-pros who just want to take pictures, but are being forced to now look at other platforms because Canon is throwing it's weight around thinking it will help their bottom line.
That's the final straw... Thanks for making the decision easier canon🙂 I'm gonna start shopping for my new Sony camera now 📸👍
This video comes just in time for me. It is finally time to upgrade from my 7D Mark II but now with this news I doubt I will be going with Canon since lenses like the sigma 18-35mm f1.8 is a staple in my bag. Historically I had bought 5 Canon DSLR bodies and st least 7-8 L lenses and a handful of Sigma lenses. Time to look at the Sony or Nikon systems I suppose. Huge mistake Canon!!
Go for sony. Im using canon for last 10 years and very much disappointed with their monopoly
Great video Tony, you hit the nail on the head in this one. I'm really confused when I see people defending Canon here, and saying it won't affect them because they don't buy sigma lenses, which is just false. Lack of competition will affect everyone, including Canon themselves. This is not a minor issue and there needs to be a discussion about this.
I'm so glad you're addressing this! Canon won't lose market share if they open up, they'll be gaining it with more loyal followers. Those of us who have been shooting mirrorless for years like Olympus and Panasonic know what mirrorless is capable of and how important smaller, lighter and more affordable lenses really are. I just bought a Canon R7 to give it a try and because I really like the canon colors and menus, but I only plan on buying a few lenses for it. There's so little available glass that I would not have given canon another try if I needed more/better glass. I really hope the company catches on this time and their new system flies, but if they shoot themselves in the foot again I'll move on.
I don't see that Canon is key of this problem. Sure Canon stopped third parties from selling RF-mount glass. But if they do it for selling license for their RF-mount the problem will be the acceptance of third parties to pay for those licenses! Sooner or later third parties have to accept license for Canon's RF-mount if they want to make profits also in the RF-mount market. I don't see any reason why Canon shouldn't sell license for their RF-mount. Sure as every company Canon wants to make profit and not allowing third parties to take their share for free. So in licensing all Canon, third paries and consumer will profit from this new policy (as unpopular as it seems at first glance)! 🤔
I'm rather novice to the photo/video scene, my first (and current) camera being a 70d which i absolutely love to bits. However I've recently been dabbling with the idea of adding something like an R5/6 to my collection, but also I am aware of the lens costs, and have been holding out on seeing what 3rd party stuff will become available.
So i guess if that is the case I better start looking at other brands, which is a real shame cause I've loved every moment with my 70d, and really wanted to carry on with the brand, but probably wont be able to afford the accessories.
I honestly love the RF glass, I shoot canon since I started, love the colours I get from them I own a R, a R6 and I pre ordered an R7 2 days after the release and it never came in stock, neither my store or canon had any clue about when it would be available. (ok pandemic etc...)
But what kills it, Like you said I am also so frustrated to see other mounts getting cool new glass, I am building a business and don't have much money to buy RF pro options I do get good results with EF canon or 3rd party but I can tell the difference when it come to image stabilization and image quality (even my variable aperture 24-105 RF is better in studio than the older EF lenses).
I needed a 3rd body quickly so I've cancelled my pre-order and ordered myself an A7RIII, got a really good results with the samyang 24-70 and a viltrox 85 II, I'm now considering building a Sony ecosystem over making investment into canon pro glass.
My father pre-ordered the R7 in May, he was supposed to have it in mid-june. Fast forward to today, he still hasn't received it and he just learnt the news about lenses.
He's cancelling his pre-order and switching to Sony.
A couple of months ago I was comparing full frame options. I’ve always had Canon gear and didn’t care for some of Sony’s design decisions in the past. However, I just couldn’t swallow the cost of Canon’s RF lenses and noticed that Tamron wasn’t offering any RF options, so I looked at dozens of comparison reviews that ruled out Nikon (likely also the same 3rd party lockout) and chose the Sony A7IV plus Tamron lenses (I could have adapted the EF lenses but there isn’t a weather sealed adapter for Sony and there were reports of adapted lens performance hits). I’ve been truly amazed at the image quality and the ease of switching to Sony from Canon. If there was rumor of Canon letting in 3rd party lens manufacturers, then my choice may have been different. Canon lost a customer.
For someone starting out, 3rd party lenses mean everything. When I first started with photography, I bought a refurbished entry level Nikon on ebay, and started with a kit lens. My upgrades were a basic 50mm nikon prime for portraits, but I wanted a telephoto lens as well, and anything from Nikon was well out of my budget. I turned to Sigma for my telephoto lens which I still have and up until recently would have still used. without the option of a cheaper entry level alternative, it becomes financial gatekeeping. Moving to my current Canon EOS R, being my first full frame camera, I'm overjoyed with the opportunity to be a part of the next generation of camera technology with the mirrorless wave, and the new RF mount. I've seen what the difference in quality glass makes, and I do cringe a bit looking at some of the old photos I took, but without the opportunity to learn and grow on the 3rd party system, I wouldn't have the knowledge I do now. I really hope I didn't make the wrong change in brand moving to Canon, and this gets resolved.
This is a great video. As someone just getting into photography, I was making my choice between a Canon RF or a Nikon Z and I only settled on the RF because I had a decent number of friends who were willing to either donate or sell me their older EF lenses that they no longer used. Without that benefit of being able to get what is, essentially, thousands of dollars of lenses for a couple hundred, there would have been no way I would go with the RF. I am very lucky in that regard.
There are going to be a ton of amateur or beginner photographers who don't have that option available to them, and this is a major issue for them.
Been a Canon guy for 20 years. Recently serious consideration for going with Sony. This might be the nail in the coffin, as I've been looking at the R7 lately, but maybe not if this is Canon's future.
Wait for an a6xx refresh before you purchase is what I would suggest
For me this is a deal breaker plain and simple. Happily I make my living in the IT world and photography is a passion - I am, you may say, an advanced amateur who has bought tons of new & used camera equipment. Although my main focus is film I love my weird and wonderful new Chinese & Japanese lenses to go with my Sony mirror less systems. I also have a bunch of East & West German 30's & 40's glass which I treasure. Since I started off as a Canon user and still enjoy my EOS Elan 7 systems I had thought about buying one of Canons new cameras but now that isn't gonna happen. There is no way that Canon can ever provide the lens options for their new cameras that Sony can. It is a business decision and they will either profit or be hurt by it. In the IT world I learned to like "open source" and if Canon is now a "closed source" system them I'm out. So sad, too bad, time to move on -
I have a canon EOS r6 any good glass under 1000 bucks for landscape? I’m using the Ef lens from a Rebel T7 :/ and the images aren’t any where as sharp as I know they can be with the camera
Thanks so much for this video. I'm a 45 year committed Canon user currently using a 6D Mark II that needs replacing. I was looking only at Canon R options for a replacement but am frustrated at the cost and low selection in the RF lenses. I'm now leaning toward the Sony A7 line as an alternative new system. Since I'll need to upgrade everything my brand commitment is less of a priority. Third party lenses have always had a place in my system even though I've used mostly Canon L lenses. The games Canon is playing lens compatibility and having a ridiculous number of R camera options is frustrating me. I'm ready to move on to something more simple and flexible.
With the outrageous prices of the rf native lenses and banning of third party, canon is setting itself up for a monumental fall.
Intel stopped AMD, Zilog, Cyrix etc from selling Intel socket compatible CPUs. Did Intel set itself up for a monumental fall?
Third party can always make their own motherboards and own sockets.
Third party lens makers should make their own Camera bodies...
Yeah Canon's f2.8 line up is a massive $200 more that Sony's GM offerings.
@@Ramage7070 Sony sacked 20,000 workers in Japan and closed down their lens factory. So Sony's GM offerings are most probably just rebadged cheap lenses since Sony owns 15% of Tamron.
@@set3777 All lens brands have manufacturing elsewhere. Like Olympus made by Sigma or something like that. Zeiss has some lnenses made in a Japanese subsidiary. Basically one doesn't have one's own manufacturing these days. But Sigma does.
@@pizzablender Exclude Canon from your "ALL" conjecture.
Canon Cameras and their L lenses are made by Canon own factories in Japan. Some cheaper Canon lenses made by Canon own factories in Taiwan and Malaysia.
Well I’ve made the mistake of recently investing in the R5 then. Photography is only a hobby for me and I’m already struggling to find the lenses I want. I’m literally going online to look at the cost of Sony and Nikon alternatives now.
Yep you bought the wrong camera thinking the future would make it meet your needs. No one to blame but you.
Exactly as you guys say, and thanks for voicing what I had been thinking about Canon for the past several years. And this is the very reason I am returning to Nikon for the lens availability.
I started my photo career, in the early 70's. I had an Argus Cosina SLR with screw mount lenses.
Then, after going thru 3 bodies, because of light leaks, I bought my first professional camera In 1972. The first Canon F-1. I added many lenses and a motor drive which was heavy and shot at the blistering rate of, 3fps. I bought many other Canon cameras. EF, A1 to name a few.
Plus I got into weddings and other work using a complete Mamiya RB67 Pro S system camera. I started working in a camera store in 1974 till 1977. Then, in 1978, still shooting professionally, went to work as a rep for Miranda cameras and Soligor lenses. That lasted a few months, then Unicolor came along. Majority of their products were photo related chemicals for processing and printing. With all the equipment one needed to do. I taught photography, including darkroom, color and black and white. Then in 1980, I was hired as a Nikon rep. Still doing professional photography and my own darkroom work, when I had time. After Nikon, I shot as the team photographer for the indoor Kansas City Comets soccer team, till they folded. I also shot for the league, as well. Once that ended, I shot for the Kansas City Chiefs for a number of years as a " stringer". I wasn't the team photographer, but shot many games over the years.
All with film. On my Canons and then Nikons, I had many Nikon and Canon lenses, as well as 2nd party lenses. Mostly Tamron and Vivitar. Currently still have Nikon and Tamron lenses. I have shot a few lenses, name brand and second party lenses, that were fair. And shot with many name brand lenses that were really good. I rarely wound up with or saw poor photos, due to bad glass. Mostly poor composition and possibly out of focus photos. Real auto focusing, on SLRs came first in the 80's.
I kinda rambled on, but in reality, in current times and technology, few if any lenses are really bad, for one reason or another. And, if a poll was taken among mostly non professional photographers, videos and snap shots are what they want. They aren't looking for mural size photos. Hence, most if not all glass works just fine.
This is the very reason I transitioned to Sony. It was difficult to make the decision (who wants change?), but very glad I did. Not only do I feel I can get quality glass from 3rd party lenses, but I learned the transition was much easier than I thought it would be. Canon has good gear, but so does Sony.
If I had known this a month ago, I doubt I would've upgraded to my R5. Sure, I run L-glass for the more serious stuff, but not having the possibility to get a less expensive 3rd party lens for trying out new styles of photography that I'm not willing to spend thousands of dollars on just yet ... yeah, that sucks. Sure, I can still buy EF-glass and run with an adapter, and maybe I will, but I shouldn't have to.
I tried the Sigma EF 35mm f/1.4 and while I liked the results, the adapted combo was not what I was looking for. I'm planning to rent the RF 35mm from Canon, but it's not a tremendously exciting lens-and when they do release a premium 35mm prime, I doubt it'll be affordable...
@@ColinRobertson_LLAP You can bet your house the RF 35mm 1.2/1.4 will be EXTREMELY expensive.
I was going to buy a new Canon R5 camera this week. I cancelled my order after hearing this news about not having 3rd party lenses. Thank you for educating and informing me.
Without third-party lenses the RF-S cameras will just be a completely bad experience. Looking back at EF we never saw Canon give any kind of love to EF-S like other manufacturers did (other than maybe introducing the 17-55 back when full frame wasn't really an option). Sigma did an awesome job there with the almighty 18-35, and when we look at Sony's E mount, there's awesome lenses there like the 17-70 2.8 from Tamron.
I’m really getting tired of seeing all these new great lenses in my price range and sadly knowing that I won’t be able to take advantage of any of them. This is really making me think me think about selling all my canon gear and going to Sony. Not for now but for the future.
This is eye opening. I've been a long time Canon user, started with an AE-1. Had the 7d and now use the 7d2 and was ready to upgrade to mirror less. Actually in been thinking of getting the R6, my first full frame camera. I like the low light capabilities. Maybe I should rethink my next purchases. If I have to start over with lenses...
I started with an AE-1 as well. When I converted to digital the decision was what model of Canon to get. My wife and I have bodies several times over the years . I use a 60D and she has a full frame. Our lense collection is a mix of Canon and third party lenses. We are thinking about getting a mirrorless body. If Canon doesn't allow anyone else to make RF lenses, it doesn't make sense to continue with Canon. Sony, with an open source mentally, does make sense. Sony will have a new customer.
Well said and I love that practical light right of frame
I have R5, which I absolutly love. Today I use mostly Tamron 24-70 f2.8 and 70-200 f2.8. Yes, I have such an expensive camera with Tamron 3rd party EF lenses, and it's amazing. I used 3rd party lenses throughout my whole journey as a photographer, and knowing that we won't get any updated versions of lenses that are getting old sucks... It's not about why not to buy EF 3rd party lenses it's about getting the newest versions of a lens with the newest technology, utilizing better what the R5 can offer (for example faster focus speed). If this will not be changed, I might just sell my gear and move to Sony, and I really don't like the Sony cameras, but it's better than having nothing, or forced to pay so much for 1st party lenses
I’ve done a few videos on this over the last 2 years and after the info from the last 2 weeks I think it’s time to move on from Canon. I have really enjoyed my R5 but I don’t think I’m willing to be ok with Canon selling their L glass for SOOO much more than Sonys flagship equivalent and not allowing 3rd party. Now Canon is flat out bullying these companies. I think it’s time to move on to Sony.
Sony might have a crap rep for software updates and anti-consumer practices, but at least the ecosystem is somewhat healthy. I am rocking a Sigma 28-70 and it's really my dream combo for 80% of all the situations. I can't imagine doing that with just Sony glass.
@@piotrgraniszewski8544 Mostly everyone that I know that shoots Sony has more Sigma glass than Sony glass LOL
@WhistleBit: I watched that conference. They claim 50% gain in low light capabilities! Meanwhile big cameras have been stagnant for years and stacked sensors are even slightly worse than normal BSI ones when it comes to image quality.
Canon requirements are higher than Sony hence higher cost. Canon cameras and lenses are all assembled and made in Japan for quality control. Sony does have cameras made in Japan but only there Pro-video equipment.
@@Davitor1: which is why I prefer Sigma lenses.
"Canon is competing against itself..." I think you hit the jackpot here! Canon is on it 3rd gens of mirrorless bodies, but it has yet to complete its mirrorless lens lineup. The question is why? One possibility is the Canon's DSLR and EF lines are probably competing against its mirrorless platform. Now, Canon mirrorless users will have no choice but to rely on EF lenses via adapter to get the jobs done. It's very unlikely anyone would leave a system after spending several grants on a body just because... Canon wants to keep the DSLR market alive for as long as possible while keeping their mirrorless users at bait.
Another company who was scared of competing with itself was Kodak. We all know what happened to them.
Tony, the video transmits your passion about this subject, and I appreciate that. I also wholeheartedly agree with the points you make. It probably does make sense as a short to medium term business decision for Canon but leaves a bad feeling in terms of choosing a brand that supports photographers and their creativity. One would think that a company as big as Canon would take the high road and not feel threatened by "minor players". This never seemed to be an issue with Canon DSLRs as we always had the option to choose third party lenses. I hope this video gains some traction and helps to influence Canon's thinking. Thanks!
Yep I'm looking for a new mirror less body and extra lens for my work. I saw the new lens mount and realized it was going to be new lenses but i didn't think there was not going to 3rd party options for the glass. I guess this has shaped my decision somewhat. Ill need to shop further afield than just my usual preference for Canon. Great video by the by, very useful.
Sigma glass in particular has always stood out to me as being the same if not better in some cases. Especially with the art line up.
Canon has a lot of really slow lenses in the RF line. I was hoping for less expensive but much faster lenses from, say, Sigma.
I left Canon because Believed they didn't support or were interested in a photographer like me. My main body is now a Sony A7RIV. I have two Sony and two sigma lenses.
For street and a light pocketable camera I have a compact Fuji rangefinder style body and a couple of lenses. With the X-H2(s) Fuji now bosses the crop frame segment.
As a solution / set up this really works for me. I couldn't recreate the set up for the same money with Canon.
I was at WexPhoto/Calumet considering upgrading from a 5D Mk4 to the new R5 or R6 and they implied I could use my old L series lenses with a ring adaptor. I've not looked into it to see if there is any cropping or negative sides to this yet though.
I am retired and really enjoy my photography. I have a DSLR (Canon 80D) and mostly Tamron lenses because I cannot afford the more expensive Canon lenses. I was thinking to upgrade to the new R7 but will not if the only R lenses are Canon. I was wondering why Tamron was not announcing lenses for the R series (they have Sony versions) and now I know why. Thanks Tony for your timely info.
I've owned 2 Canon cameras (T3i and now a M50), but never Canon glass except the kit lens. But 3rd party let me put more budget into getting a better body at the time. But after their misstep on EOS M and now this, the M50 will be my last Canon body. And this comes as strictly a hobbyist, which Canon apparently doesn't want as a customer.
Intel stopped AMD, Zilog, Cyrix etc from selling Intel socket compatible CPUs.
You can always buy AMD motherboards with AMD sockets if you want to buy AMD CPUs.
Intel did NOT want to go bankrupt.
Same with Canon. Go and buy other camera bodies if all you want is to use NON-Canon lenses.
I'm already a Sony guy, but honestly this has put me off even considering a Canon in the future if I decide to change my gear. Even if they reverse course, it's too late. A company that makes a very short sighted choice like this once is bound to do it again.
Could you make a video clip show the lightings you set up for this video? Thanks.