Wood Stabilization and Production of Wood/Alumilite Blanks
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 6 มิ.ย. 2014
- This is a brief introduction to stabilization of wood by vacuum infiltration and casting of Wood/Alumilite hybrid blanks. The stopper blanks produced here are small, but the approach and methods are the same for larger projects.
Thank you for taking the time to show your skill...much appreciated...
Fantastic video, thank you for sharing! One thing missing is the glorious close-up of the final product!!
I really appreciate seeing a shop that looks like it's worked in. So many look like operating theaters. Thank you.
Excellent explanation and demonstration Doc....Now for me to get all the bits n pieces together to have a go myself...
cheers Mick!!!
Appreciate you taking the time to share with this I'm learning so much thank you
Thank you for taking the time and making the effort to produce this tutorial and it is great pleasure to listen to commentary that is clear, concise and in particular, doesn't repeat or labour the point. I have learned a lot from your production and now feel confident enough to give this a go. Also, that isn't messy: every thing at hand and enough clear space on the bench to work, that indicates efficient use of available space to me. Thanks again.
Very informative and clear video tutorial. Wonderful presentation as well. Thank you for taking the time and effort to share your knowledge. Much appreciated.
Excellent demo Doc. Thanks
Thanks for using our product!
Love the idea of beads or rice! Never thought of using it.
Very interesting and informative. Many thanks for sharing
I learned much from this video! Thanks for sharing!
Messy? That ain't Messy! LOL. I have pathways in my garage & think that you've done a great job of keeping your space useable!
Thanks for a great video, I just cut some redwood burl & am starting on my stabilizing adventure today!!!!!
Best Regards,
Jon
Thank you from a woodturning newbie. Subscribed
I use the Alumilite dyes. The color saturation and reproducibility is outstanding.
good video and you have inspired me to do a better job of cleaning my shop as well!
Very informative thank you
very precise and helpful. Many thanks for that. I see you have filters i. your pipettes to avoid accidents!
For anyone thinking of getting into pressure casting, I can recommend one air compressor. I did a LOT of research into quiet, long lasting compressors.
The Makita "Hotdog" Compressor is touted as probably the most quiet of the compressors readily available to the avg joe. I wanted a compressor I could use indoors and not wake up my family. This one fits the bill. It is only 2.6 gallon, so it only runs for short periods. It holds air fine, no leaks. Its an oiled compressor, so it needs maintenance once a year or so, depending on use. Daily use would require more. You can adjust the psi to 60psi so it never overfill's your pressure pot, still I always watch the gauge on my pot to be safe.
It does fine in my shop and has been used daily for 4 years now, flawlessly! Here's a link, first one I saw one doing a google search, I'm not affiliated with Northern Tool nor am I recommending them. They just show the compressor and give the stats on it. For $199.00 It is an Awesome Compressor!!
I have since replaced the compressor in the video. I have a California Air Tools compressor. Very quiet and not a bad price.
Thanks gonna check those compressor out, I have a oiless one, drivin me outta my mind with noise lol
Glad I stumbled onto this video. I have been trying to figure out how to stabilize then cast. It seems my stabilization efforts leave the piece of wood with much more mess. Yours seemed to be just on the bottom. My little toaster oven does not go that low in temp, now wonder if 200 or 220 is too hot...
Also, love your products. Thanks.
Very nice...
Very nice.....
Where, and what kind of vacuum pump do you use for the first wood stabilizing? it doesn't really show.
Nice video doc you really need a draw bar when you are polishing the bottle stopper to keep Morse taper from coming out at least in the videos that people are going to try to duplicate. I really liked the video though.
From one nerd to another, thank you. There are too many right brain folks that post how to videos that really miss some of the details that I need. You talked about mixing dyes. Which ones do you use and where do you get them from? What are they mixed with?
Dyes are from Alumilite. I mix the dye in Part A of the alumilite before combining with B to cast.
what can you cut the wood /resin combo im having a very hard time cutting it, either bandsaw or table saw,what blade?
Awesome! One thing. When you went from pumice to rotten, you went to the same area on the rag. If the latter is finer, will the finish not be limited to the "duller" finish provided by former. Kind of like the finish having surpassed the duller capability of the first buffer.
Question if I may. Where do you buy the rubber coated lead weight you use is this video. Thanks.
Those weights were leftovers from my lab when I retired. They can be purchased from any scientific supply house. Cole-Palmer is about the easiest to deal with (www.coleparmer.com/p/argos-technologies-vinyl-coated-lead-rings/68324?Ntt=lead+weights). You can make them by using the rubber coating dip available at Home Depot (www.homedepot.com/p/Plasti-Dip-14-5-oz-Black-Plasti-Dip-11603-6/202196703).
That is a painters pressure pot. With the move to low volume/ high pressure spray painting, these can be found pretty cheap.
What name of coating did you coat the lead with. I have lead but don't no what to coat it with. Thank you
Hi Zac
Will spirit stain work with cactus juice. are they compatable? thank you Leon
Thanks for the video. After removing the vacuum, I believe the process calls for a soak of double the time taken for the bubbling to stop? I noticed that the wood still floated after the vacuum, ideally you would want them to be sinking. Or maybe you don't need a complete stabilization for casting?
Mike, you have some really nice maple burl on your table top in your video. You mind or may I ask where you get it?
We are surrounded by Big Leaf Maple here. This probably came from my firewood pile or NorthWoods Figured Woods.
thanks for the glass beads technique to measure volume. also who makes the coat you are wearing? thanks
Rice and smal barley grains will work too. Anythinkg to estimate the empty space to be filled. The jacket is from Lee Valley but I don't see them on the website any longer.
Doc I don't know if you will see this message or not but I was wondering where you get pieces of wood like that? I make custom ice fishing rods and I think that handles made with acrylic/wood will look very sharp and really be a popular thing for me, I am just not sure where to find those pieces of waste wood like that.
Michael I have a 1"x12" x 18" vacuum chamber inside dimensions is 10 x 16 .. does it make any difference what size vacuum pump I have ? And if so what pump would you recommend ? Say through Amazon 3 CFM , 4 CFM , 6 CFM .. I have a HVAC Vacuum pump but I think its about wore out .. I put a glass of water in the chamber and I couldn't get to boil.. I'm at 3700 ft. elev.
thank you Jim in Nor. Cal.
Just for reference, the air is not "going back into solution." That is, it is not in either of the two parts of the mix. Rather, it is being introduced off our mixing process, and why we don't get wildly aggressive mixing most resins (so we don't have to torch them, and which won't work with thick pours like this).
are the alumilite dyes water based , or alchol based?
Great demonstration, What brand pot is that?
The stabilization pot is actually an anaerobic bacteria growth chamber left over from my lab. TurnTex has better ones. The pressure chamber is a paint sprayer made by California Air Products. Again, a left over.
Cool 😎
where can I get a vacuum chamber like the clear one you used here? Looking to try this, so looking at something reasonably priced (I hope)...
That used to be an anaerobic bacterial growth chamber in my lab. The Cactus Juice Web site has vacuum chamberes.
During the Cactus Juice infusion, the vacuum was about 27 inches of Mercury. Alumilite was set under 60 pounds of pressure.
In theory, no, but in practice, sort of. It’s all a matter of time. The HVAC pumps are not made to produce a powerful vacuum, just enough to pull material through coolant lines, sort of like bleeding your brake lines. With enough time, a weak pump, but not too weak, can extract the air sufficiently to get good replacement by the stabilizing resin. I went through a few of these pumps in the early stages of learning this method. A good vacuum pump is a handy tool. I use mine with my vacuum chuck as well as the stabilizing system. A pump capable of drawing a 27 inch vacuum is probably enough to do stabilization in a reasonable time. I use a Yellow Jacket 93600 pump. Not cheap, but I will probably never need another vacuum pump.
I'm watching your video you just said the catus juice was entering the wood as the air is releaved i don't understand under vacuum nothing should be able to enter the wood. this is why the wood should be left in the catus juice for a couple of days. i did it the same way you do until i watched jack lore vidio on you tube. where he showed leaving it soak in the catus juice and marked the container and it dropped. I'm not trying to be neg like i said i was doing it the same way until i watched him all i was doing was coating the out side. thanks you do great work.
I've not found that soaking beyond twice the time to extract the air produces better bye penetration.
Very informative . . . wonder where one gets a 20 gal vacumm chamber.
BVV, formerly know as Best Value Vacs.
Hey, quick question.. Is it possible to JUST use a vacuum chamber for the casting process? To sort of "de-gass" the resin? Or do I have to use a pressure pot? Not sure on how the resin will respond to beeing in vacuum.. Thx for an awesome video
Nanakiyami Vacuum doesn't work fast enough with Alumilite. The cook off time on Alumilite is about 7 minutes. You can't get all the bubbles out fast enough. You CAN degass using vacuum while both A and B are separate, then when you mix, be very gentle and do your best not to whip the mix or fold in any oxygen. Still you would need pressure. The pressure shrinks bubbles at multiples of 4 per atmosphere of pressure. We are getting about 3-4.5 atmospheres of pressure if you go as high as 60psi. This shrinks the bubbles by up to 28 times. This makes them so small you can't see them.
Nanakiyami Vacuum doesn't work fast enough with Alumilite. The cook off time on Alumilite is about 7 minutes. You can't get all the bubbles out fast enough. You CAN degass using vacuum while both A and B are separate, then when you mix, be very gentle and do your best not to whip the mix or fold in any oxygen. Still you would need pressure. The pressure shrinks bubbles at multiples of 4 per atmosphere of pressure. We are getting about 3-4.5 atmospheres of pressure if you go as high as 60psi. This shrinks the bubbles by up to 28 times. This makes them so small you can't see them.
Okiedokie! Thanks for the answer. Been wondering about that one for a while now. Gonna start stabilizing wood myself any time soon, so might as well read up on the subject before doing anything at all! =P Guess I'll have to get me a pressure pot aswell.Just need that last bit and the resin and then I'm good to go! ^_^ Again, Thanks!
Would the vacuum process (or the pressure one) work with common wood glued (titebond etc) butt joints or would the glue "mechanism" change because of the different material being introduced into the fibers?
Not vacuum certainly, but perhaps pressure might push the glue into the wood.
I wasn't clear, that's not exactly what I had in mind. What I mean is, would the vacuum infusion of a stabilizer like "cactus juice" affect the bond of a cured wood glue? Come to think of it, even if the infusion itself doesn't , the heating required to cure it might. If I had some material I would just try it, but I don't so I have to ask others. :)
OK, I see what you mean. The infused pieces glue up very well. If you mean infusing a piece already glued up, I don't know, never tried it.
I bought something called Wood Juice, it doesn't require heating. Have you ever tried it? I thought it was the same as Cactus Juice. Do you have any thoughts on using this other juice?
I've used it to repair a front door threshold that was showing dry rot until I had time to repair it. Not sure it would work in this application. Give it a try!
ok, thanks!
I am hoping to do a very deep casting (approx. 15 inches) and around 4" by 4". Most of the epoxy's I have read about recommend anywhere from 1/8 to 1/4 of an inch depth. How can I avoid showing the line of the different layers of epoxy that will form between pours? I have read that if you pour subsequent layers approx. 3-5 hours apart you can avoid those unsightly lines. Any suggestions would be much appreciated.
Sorry, no insights. I have never epoxy as a casting medium.
Thank you for getting back to me.
The B side has a tendency to gel if it gets cold. You can either pour the A side into the B cup or warm the B side so that it reverts back to a liquid.
I actually pour my A, add color, then pour my B side directly into the same cup and mix. Only 1 cup per mix. Just another way of doing it.
russianwolf1972 The B side can get very stiff. I keep both stocks off the concrete floor in a heated utility room.
should you leave your wood soak in the alumilite longer so the alumilite will penetrate in to the wood. jack lore on ytube showed marking is vacuum chamber and waiting 2 days and the solution dropped 3/8 of a inch he says some of his woods might have to stay in a week. just wondering. thanks
The wood in in Cactus Juice. The rule of thumb is soak twice the time needed for the bubbles to stop coming out of the wood.
that is what mr pakrat says leave in solution 24 hrs or so as a lot more resin is absorbed this is what i did had good results
Alumilite begins to harden in about 10 minutes and is cured with pressure, not vacuum. After breaking the vacuum, I now leave the wood in the Cactus Juice about twice as long as it took for the bubbles to stop coming out.
The soak twice as long as it takes to get rid of the bubbles rule has worked so far. I have never found a piece, even large ones, not fully saturated with Cactus Juice.
@@TheDoctorswoodshop, the wood should not float if it is fully saturated.
What is the difference between resin epoxy and aluminite?
Hi Doctor, how hard does this wood become? If you stabilize a cutting board this way, would the wood not be able to chip when someones using, for example, a hatchet against it? Ot is there another method you suggest that makes the wood extremely durable?
Stabilization maked the wood harder but not axe-proof hard. Remember it is easily cut with turning tools. It is more like the resin fills in the gaps in the woods structure. It isn't like acrylic, it isn't brittle. It would certainly resist a knife in a cutting board but the wood is not indestructible, just a lot tougher.
If you want durable wood items, start with Black Locust.
@@TheDoctorswoodshop Thanks so much Doctor that really helps.
Would plan steel weight be OK or would the cactus juice react to it. What type of rubber coating did you use and where can you buy it. I'm new at this. I had a lot of epoxy and thought I'd make a weight out of that now I'm using alumilite. Wrong, don't do that. That' s why I'm asking about your weight.
Steel weights should be fine. Epoxy not such a good idea. The weights are covered with the rubber dip solution you can get at Home Depot.
Hi sorry I cant hear what you use to stabilize the wood at the 0:50 Could someone tell me what is it?
Cactus Juice
It seems to me that a brief application of the same vacuum would pull much of the air out of the Alumilite, perhaps followed by the pressure chamber. The pressure basically is doing what the pressure release step at the end of the Cactus Juice does - driving the solution into areas of lower pressure. The difference is, once the Alumilite sets and pressure is returned to normal, there are compressed air bubbles trapped within the solid. May be not a big deal, but over time this internal pressure might initiate tiny stress points?
Seems like it should work but I've tried it and it doesn't. The problem with relying on vacuum to degas the Alumalite is that the polymerization reaction is exothermic, heat generating. Bubbles are continuously formed as the the material hardens. Given the short open time, vacuum degassing can't be done long enough to prevent bubble formation in the final casting. Your idea about small stress points is probably right. The larger the casting, the more likely fractures are to occur. If I am doing a big piece, like a bowl or peppermill blank or a large sphere, I vacuum degas the A and B stock before mixing.
What did you make the 20 gal chamber out of?
I bought the 20 gallon chamber, BestValueVacs.com
Would this work well with making kitchen knives?
I always use stabilized wood for knife scales. It is tougher and completely water resistant. I have never tried resin hybrids for that job but I'm pretty sure it would work fine.
What are these blanks used for
Trabalho incrivel, melhor video incrível, quanto tempo a resina ficou na panela de pressão ? Poderia me passar seu email ou facebook ..abraços
Estou feliz que você tenha gostado do vídeo. A resina é Alumilite, não é epóxi. Meu portugues é muito ruim. Me desculpe.
@@TheDoctorswoodshop poderia ser a resina epóxi no lugar da alumilite, pois no Brasil não temos esta resina alumilite, pode me passar seu contato email ou facebook ?
hi is there wood that does not need stabilizing such as bubinga?
im trying to make a handle and i have allergies for chemicals
thanks :)
The need for stabilization has more to do with the condition of the wood than the species of wood. Even babinga that is spalted and softened would require stabilization.
thank you! much appreciated :)
where can I get the molds and the fine pumice?
I make the molds from Plexiglass. The pumice comes from Woodcraft.
now where are you getting the wood like this ?
Josh Jenkins The wood comes from Northwoods Figured Woods in Gaston, Oregon.
Can a pressure pot work also?
NO!
Did you just keep the vacuum pump running for an hour?
I keep the pump running until the bubbles stop. Turn off the pump and close the vacuum valve. Let it sit about twice as long as it took to get the bubbles out.
@@michaelmeredith483 thank you for sharing
just a thought - how about trying a layer on top of the Cactus Juice and it will likely break down the bubbles at that level. A layer of oil - Mineral oil. Skim it off before extracting wood - if wanted. Martin
Like the anti-foam oil I used to use in the bacterial fermentors. Might work.
nice video where o u buy your burl from?
+Grussing Custom Knives
The burl is from North Woods Figured Woods.
Go look for them... I don't pay for any spalling, burl, ..
I found it a bit confusing when you mention "open Valve" closed valve". Relief valve? Vacuum pump hose valve? Wold be good to define it a bit more. Other than that, I enjoy and find very informative your other vids.
Pressure or vacuum?
Where did you get the clear cylinder
That was an anaerobic bacterial growth chamber I had in my lab.
Wouldn't the resin be stronger of you vacuumed all the bubbles out instead of pushing them back into solution?
***** Probably not but stronger or not, you do what you can do. The open time is too short to get the bubbles out by degassing. Pressure is the only way to make the bubbles disappear
TheDoctorswoodshop Fair enough.
Mouth pipetting? Old school. I like it.
Why not add the dye, as you did, then add the second part, until the scale reached double. Somewhat as I did over the years using other resins? It would cut a minute or so off your process, since you're not trying to scrape the second cup for that fraction of an ounce/gram of materials?
TOO, I guy tongue depressors and have used them for a few decades for little batches like this. With the kind of equipment we have, squaring the ends is no task at all.
CAN I BUY THE STABILIZTION ALUMILITE WOOD OR FINISHED WOOD PRODUCT?
CAN I BUY THE FINISHED PRODUCT/ALUMILITE RESIN WOOD?
Really interesting video,thanks..
Would you consider selling me a piece you've made, approx 4x8x4 inch block?
I don't sell the pieces I make but North Woods Figured Woods (nwfiguredwoods.com) has these pieces in stock.
OK Many thanks for the info. keep up the great work you do..
Did you say 480 deg's??????
hello doctorwoodshop, may i ask, what materials and machine do u used? can u list for me dr.? sorry newbie here dr. :)
Where do you get the blow tube
I think you mean pipettes, the tube I use to measure out the dye. Any scientific supply house or a soda straw will work just as well.
The level goes down because the dish gets back to its original size after letting the air in.
The level goes down because the Cactus Juice is absorbed, replacing air in the wood when the vacuum is broken. The volume of the vessel doesn't change under vacuum. Repeat the procedure with no wood in the chamber and the level does not change on vacuum release.
I agree. Wood needs to soak at least a few days to get good penetration. Many harder woods should get a week or two.
@@ambientartphotography2245 ,and the wood should not float like in the video if the stabilization process is done correctly.
No, curing us at 180 degrees.
Snort, couldn't afford quality Harbor Freight wheels for your grinder and had to suffer those silly CBN's..... [end smart Alex font]
Man your shop is a mess!
Thats like throwing paint on a canvas... anyone can do it... no creativity and tacky as all hell
Where, and what kind of vacuum pump do you use for the first wood stabilizing? it doesn't really show.
Where, and what kind of vacuum pump do you use for the first wood stabilizing? it doesn't really show.
Amazon has a 3.5 CFM vacuum pump for less than $50.
The pump in the video is one leftover from my lab. I now use a Yellow Jacket Bullet. It's been a very good pump. Make sure you set up a catch flask to keep the Cactus Juice out of your pump.