Discrimination does not occur in bigger or historical Gurudwaras. This is an issue of the local Gurudwaras in many villages of Punjab. Sadly, this has created a lot of problems like Derawaad, conversion, etc.
@@gauravpdaksh Establishment of different deras. People go to a local dera, worship the Baba who heads it. Blind faith, kala jadu, etc are practised. Changes the politics of that place. Baba receives political backing. This can result in Dera Sacha Sauda or Rampal like situation.
@@bijoydasudiya They will definitely have less representation than Jatts and Khatris. But rather than discrimination that's due to the prominence and the ancestral good will of the other. This can be improved by the economic upliftment.
"The stigma that is attached to a particular caste group is problematic and not the caste". Hope one day for our future generation's sake we are able to understand and correct it.
Absolutely wrong This whole caste consciousness is problematic. This whole nonsense kisan andolan is supported by jat caste only and only because of this Caste consciousness that they are my people my caste my samaj! Why do you think we have honor killings? It's to maintain the caste numbers and to maintain blood purity because even the dominant castes are not more than 20% of their state's population! Yadavs no matter how nationalist, capitalist or ideologically RW will vote for Samajwadi party because they see Akhilesh YADAV as their YADAV leader. Same for Dalits and Mayawati! Bureaucrats from a particular caste gets promotion even their caste leader is the politician in power. Gangsters of a particular caste are released if their caste member gets elected! I have even seen people giving oxygen cylinders to their caste poeple over others when corona was at peak! I agree that in short term we cannot annihilate caste but because it can't happen in short term doesn't mean that we normalise caste.
@@RD-pp9ds Agree in principle to your opinion but I also feel that we must strive towards the ideal but also accept the real. We don't need to embrace the caste identity but we need to also accept the reality. Doing away with caste identity in current conditions of our society will only create more fissures rather than remove it
@@IncredibleNeo what exactly do you mean when you say "we must accept the real" Obviously I'm not denying the existence of caste, I am accepting the reality. I also except that it's nearly impossible to annihilate caste in current circumstances and even a decade from now. But I am making a distinction between "what is" and "what should be"
I want to say to my fellow Hindus brothers and sisters to never discriminate any people from any caste. You can be proud on your caste but when you use it to subdue someone just because he or she born in so called lower caste is extremely inhumane. We all are children of same God. Respect your Dalits friends and treat them as their own. This discrimination must have to stop otherwise it will destroy our civilization. Please, I request you all with my folded hands. 🙏🕉️
First we need to discuss to these you with young generations and try to understand the historical context and if require use referrence of various leaders who write on this issue having said that only upper caste discriminate is not true with in sc st there are various hierarchy these need to be mentioned loudly otherwise we are not solving the issue holistically just episodic medicine we are doing
Wonderful discussion. Kushal I find your podcasts very informative, analytical and thought provoking. I have stopped watching news on television and mainly get my information on current affairs from a few goods podcast channels, and yours is one of the best
I am proud to be a Brahmin. I teach children with out any discrimination. My ethnicity is mine. I have lived in delhi when the stupidity of Khalistan happened. I lived in a home of an amrit chak in Canada. I still believe that you belong to this world 'my world' celebrated for your successes because we as Hindus don't care.
Are you proud that you were born brahmin? Or are you proud that you studied all Hindu scriptures for years and then became a brahmin? If you're proud that you were born in a certain caste then i am sorry, you need to get over this caste pride because this idea that i belong to a certain caste, my caste my people is the basis for all the casteism in India!
Most of dalits are agriculture labour. Inspite of it Punjab has been importing additional manpower from Bihar and UP! It seems Punjab is going through some abnormalities. Punjab is doing too much water and labour intensive agriculture, which will have adverse effects on its land and social stability in long run.
Annhilation of caste is not going to happen. ESPECIALLY when the government gives you categories. Oh you're general category, oh you're OBC or SC or ST. If the government categorises you, you can never EVER get rid of caste. It's a daily reminder that if you are of a certain caste you enjoy inherent privileges hence the government won't give anything to you or if you are of a certain caste, the system is built to uplift you but it still reminds you that you are lower caste and enjoying government support as a result. If a system endorses and reminds you of caste, it won't go away. So Kushal, if you enthusiastically support reservations, you support the permanent existence of caste. Plain and simple.
She should have atleast mentioned the Land Alienation Act 1900 brought in by British to limit land ownership to certain castes which resulted in further exploitation of discriminated castes. I got to know about this while I was reading an article about the rise of deras.
@@ravinderdhaliwal5495 I wasn't questioning your competence rather I think that act is quite relevant to the modern day casteism in Punjab. Anyways, it was a good podcast.
As a Brahmin I am ashamed that people of my caste still discriminate other castes in certain parts of the country. But I am never going to disown my caste. I am completely for annhilation of caste hierarchy and I will always work to stigmatize the use of "upper" and "lower" descriptives for caste. But sorry to say caste system is here to stay and I will always believe in it.
Why dalits have 1000+ castes ? Will u ask this question ? Why harijan dont marry to valmikis ? And why they become ravidashiya(harijan) and mazhabi( valmiki) in sikhism ? You r missing the whole point !!
@@punyashloka4946 That's what makes the case...? People themselves want to copy the behaviour of others just to make someone feel inferior and then blame others when the entire wall falls on them..🥴
@@punyashloka4946 point is casteism and it's existence not who is more or less...if something exists it's bound to be more or less in any way... Mayawati is an classic example.
What was missing from this discussion was talk about many other castes apart from Jats or Dalit castes. What is the position of Khatris, Aroras, Ramgarhias, Ramdassias,Kambojs, Sainis, Mohyals etc. Secondly, since this video was titled casteism in Punjab, we are forgetting completely about the 39% Hindu population in Punjab. What is going on there?
I don't agree that not electing a Dalit CM is necessarily equal to there being casteism. There is casteism for sure. But Rajasthan elected a Dalit CM a long time ago, does that somehow mean that casteism does not exist in Rajasthan? It's more complicated imo. And remember, with 39% no Hindu CM has ever gotten elected in Punjab.
A population of 33% has Only 2.4 % agriculture land. Whereas Dalits are very well versed in farming. It shows a great class devide in Punjab. It is quite strange communist movement has not hold its roots in such a fertile land for them.
#basant giri, communists are biggest enemies of peasants. Out of 10 crores people killed directly in 70 years by communists 80% were peasants, go and read the real history of Russia and China. I think you have been brainwashed by commie fake history that they are great champions of workers and peasants. They only want to grab farmer's lands in the name of collective farms or communes where everyone will be wage laborer with wages decided and paid by the commie controlled government. Punjab is lucky that there is no communist movement like bengal, otherwise it would have been in a much worse condition. And the enterprising Punjabis will never allow such a stupid ideology to spread in their state.
This is really sad to hear. Power to Dr. Kaur. Thanks Kushal for bringing her to us. What surprises me is the dependence on recognition by the upper caste. I am surprised that there has not been an offshoot religion among the SC/ST and other lower caste groups of India. How did the upper caste manage to wield such control over milenia? I am really curious about this. Has there been attempts to understand this? The caste system will now go away only when the lower castes what it to. Even if it does it will not go away in the manner that people think it will. The oppressed of today will 1) come to terms and take pride in who they are.2) They produce leaders of eminence that they can identify with and emulate.
SC/ST have literally been rebelling for a milenia though it succeeded after Ambedkar and phule. Not only that even Brahmins like Ramanuja and his diciple ramananda literaly scared the shit out of the orthodoxy during bhakti movement As far as religion is consider, there was no Hindu identity back then, you can find panthas (most of them don't like scriptures) breaking caste hierarchy but they are termed Hindu because of the definition in constitution A person who is not a jew, muslim or Christian is Hindu.
India never had or has effective statecraft n effective justice delivery system in place.civilisationally. So caste tribalism is a reality. Wherever effective State exists or existed, such tribaliam vanished. Whenever State falters, similar tribalism rose up. So we need focus on effective State n justice delivery, to address it.
You need to understand the sikh history where the Gurus never discriminated and made sure in the gurbani. Why cast has entered in sikhs is because of brahminical pressure of rss
There is no caste in Sikhi, however, catse has been pushed by OBC, BC and General classes cidified by law. Sikhi is against caste and you cannot change that.
There is general impression found outside of Punjab that mostly Jatts and traders reside in it. It is surprising to know that dalits are 33% in Punjab, yet they have no political say. Why Punjab has not produced a dalit leader of Mayawati stature? Why Kansi Ram was more successful in UP than Punjab?
If u see UP this state always was in centre of politics and still there and it produce various leader in different political spectrum and thus the issue of SC was in debate while in case of Punjab if u see in political space there is much discussion there and even earlier also if something happen then for some month due to certain issue debate was there still I'm current times why we are discussing Punjab due to farmers bill the other factors is population size of sikh and hindu and then with sikh the denomination will further decrease so getting that much attention you need to do some step which come in public debate further as kushal mentioned every state has unique challenge with respect to caste issue then u need to see land reform issue in UP population is much bigger land size holding decreased generations by generations but in Punjab still big zamindar are there and land reform is not that much successful and other reason as well.
I don't understand when people take pride of the caste they're born into. It's ridiculous and pathetic. Nobody should be proud or ashamed of their caste. It's just a thing that is outdated and serves no purpose anymore. I'm a Tamil brahmin and here in South India you can't easily make out if a person is brahmin or not just by their name. Same system should be applied to northern India as well and surname should be removed. That's the first step.
@@pritamgolatkar8862 what is in it that you're proud of? Have you achieved anything great personally? I'm neither proud nor ashamed of my caste or lineage but rather it is something that I'm born into and I just accept it and move on cuz it doesn't make sense to be proud of something that one doesn't have control over. Moreover it's not even an achievement in any sense. So my question to you is what is in it that makes you proud of?
@@vv6533 im proud and thankful to the almighty of the fact that I came to birth in a good well cultured family. And that my ancestors were good people who lived good virtuous life. Btw I believe in reincarnation so yes the kind of life lived now will lead to the birth into a well cultured family in the next is my theory. So you might say what have I achieved my point is maybe I had some points in the good books of the almighty that I was born in a good family. Now like you said I am Brahmin and I'm not proud as I have done nothing about it well that's your perspective bcoz you might not believe in reincarnation. I coming from Sudra Varna lineage do believe in reincarnation. Simple thats your perspective this is mine
@@pritamgolatkar8862 you can be grateful thankful to be born in a privileged caste but THERE'S NOTHING TO BE PROUD OF IT When a Brahmin or Rajput says that he's proud rajput or brahmin, he is basically supporting the same caste system AS IT THE CASTE SYSTEM BECAUSE OF WHICH HIS ANCESTORS WERE KINGS OR LEARNED MEN. ONE CAN BE PROUD OF INDIVIDUAL KINGS OR BRAHMINS AND THEIR ACHIEVEMENTS BUT BEING PROUD OF A GROUP IS JUST PLAIN AND SIMPLE CASTEISM
The reason why dalits became christians is a preplanned permission to convert whereas in rest of India it is not allowed and hindu org are against it. The same hindu organisation are now silent in Panjab conversion problem becase the target is sikh?
@@jitupattnaik6140 not necessarily A lot of Jat and dalit surnames are same in Punjab and Harayana Many castes have common surnames, you'll find Tomar Tanwar Chauhan, Bhati etc surnames in gujjars dalits jats as well as rajputs in Haryana and neighbouring regions!
🔖 If Punjab is an agricultural state why Dalit landholding is Lowest -1.5 percent, of all India. Sikhs are More Oppressive of Dalits than Hindus. But they have Loud mouths. 🔖🔖Communists and Congressis are strong in Punjab over 70 years. Yet they ***promoted feudalism in Punjab while Sanatan Dharma all over India. It suited their power Politics. They gave all riches of agricultural revolution to Jatts Only
Dr Dhaliwal should have researched that bollywood does not reflect true picture of panjab? Why jatts are propagated is due to a braminical pressure and a challenge that Panjab is different from rest of India. Gurus and Bhagats rejected brahmins culture as anti society. This is is the reason why dalits who were oppressed elsewhere found a comfortable place in Panjab...thanks to the Guru guidance
The one who is taking the interview is actually from the Highest caste in Punjab. Mehra is a 2.5 ghar Khatris along with Malhotra and Kapoor. Jatts are actually Shudra but have very high population so they are dominant Politically.
Which religion is best for untouchables of Punjab especially Chamar? Is it Buddhism, Islam or Sikhism? As far as I know, Ravidasia Sikhs are armed with swords but don't use it against discrimination by the higher castes. What's the use of Kirpan then?
Someone should do a study on the Mahants opening Deras in every Panjab village that helps soread caste and andh vishwas. Where did 13000 Mahants come from? Who trained them and sent them to compete with Gurdwaras in the villages?
Since when Missionaries offered free education, health, jobs etc?? 🔖Nowadays, its provided by the state Only. Missionaries, esp pastors are now fleecing money from poor Dalits, taking away their 10 percent incomes shamelessly
When we talk about conversion it's more about humiliation nd respect ,as far as economic conditions r concerned, it's almost same, it never get better bcoz of conversion.
The building of separated Gurudwaras was started when sgpc came infiltrated with rss brahmin...the strategy was to make jatts (who are also shudra) false believe they are higher cast so the dalits would easily fal in the lap of deras (deras have mushroomed up in 90s) This is a created problem by central agencies to Hinduism sikhs
Caste system same as in punjab or usa, canada ,uk ,California .When ever you meet any sikh punjabi old uncle. Very first thing they ask tu kehna da munda hai tera pind kehda hai , like they about to offer marriage proposal for you..Yuba city California, Brampton, in Canada. Those two cities are highly castized..
Cast and varn system is totally rejected in Sikh philosophy by Guru Sahiban. Guru says ਜਾਣਹੁ ਜੋਤਿ ਨ ਪੂਛਹੁ ਜਾਤੀ ਆਗੈ ਜਾਤਿ ਨ ਹੇ॥ Recognise God’s light withinall. Do not consider social status and cast. It is not hereafter. ਮਾਨਸ ਕੀ ਜਾਤ ਸਬੈ ਏਕੈ ਪਹਚਾਨਬੋ॥ Recognise whole human race as one. Moreover cast system is based on economic resources and former tribal setup. One can proud of his cast but he should not discriminate with other.
No. I didn't say that. It is my surname. I just mentioned people who sometimes use fake names to hide their caste. I am not hiding my caste identity anyway as I am proud of what I am.
@@ravinderdhaliwal5495 I'm not saying that you're hiding because of course you are discussing and declaring your caste out in open. But if someone met you for the first time, won't they assume that you are Jatt? Is it normal for people of your caste to have this surname?
Yes it is normal. You can meet a number of people who have these surnames resembling Jatt surnames. Now why it so, will make an interesting research. Will try to explore more and share with you all.
@@ravinderdhaliwal5495 Maam I Belong To Nai Caste But My Surname is Maan Mad We Are Using This From Centuries Before Sikhism Exits and in Panj Payare Our Caste Give Sons to Sikhism and You Now Nai Sikh is Known in Punjab is Bagat Sain Samaj If You Have Any Information About Bagat Sain Samaj Please Do Let Me Know I Am Eagrly Waiting For Your Reply Because of Casteism My Family Moved From Punjab 4the Generation Before We Are Living in Delhi and Well Educated and Well Settel My Community Literacy Rate Also Very High We Have Doctors Engineer Business Man I Am Also Businessman
Mehra the solution is implent Kanshiram formula...seats, positios, jobs, judges, police all should be based on numbers of population, this shd be implemented pan India. Can the rss and central govt agree
Mehra you are definitely rss man and bent on targeting panjab in low light ...why don't you do such analysis in UP bihar MP . Dr kaur tell me has the social status of dalits changed after becoming christians?
Bro Punjab is absolutely f*cked and has no future. Please accept reality. The young people are all immigrating, and the lower 'castes' are converting en masse. There is no Sikh future for the state beyond 15-20 years. In fact, Punjab might eventually do better as a Christian majority state than a minority (Jatt Sikh) led state.
What nonsense SC land holder is not the lowest in India . The figure is low because of higher populationof SC. Kushal Mehra is mocking on SC using jatt names is derogatory he should apologise as anchor shd not be having biases. He is not fit for the job?
Yeh khud hi apna gotra lgakar jativad ko brha rahi hai In punjab india mey sabse jada intercaste marriges ho rahi hai Akal Takhat ka jathedar Dalit Sikh hai Punjab mey castism desh mey sabse kamm hai, par Dalit Sikh dharte nahi, eska pore jorh se muqabla karte hai Jatt khud shudra hai ,
Atleast in central and western India particularly in Maharashtra and now in Gujarat neo buddhism is playing a major and positive role in the Upliftment of Dalits. It is because of ambedkarite movement Maharashtra had a range of dalit thinkers which reflected in pop culture also. And now slowly but surely this movement also penetrated in hindi Heartland like UP and MP and also had a presence in karnataka. I just hope Dalits from all over India start forming their own identity via movements like neo Buddhism
Ambedkar never wanted a separate dalit identity He wanted annihilation of caste His idea to destroy caste was intercaste marriages Intercaste marriages between 16% and 84% will demolish this dalit identity and a larger Hindu identity will remain We forget that Ambedkar was not a jinnah who wanted to preserve a separate Muslim identity
@@RD-pp9dsBabasaheb may not have wanted it but the reality is that it exist now . If he didn't want new identity than why did he converted to Buddhism.
Neo Buddhists and Ambedkarites are so ideologically dumb I swear. Hindutva alone has the ability to break the barriers of caste as we've seen in the Ram Janmabhoomi movement. Nobody gave a fu*k about your caste, only your hindu identity mattered. I think we should propagate hindutva more. It's acceptance and progressiveness among the hindu fold is what gives me hope for the future.
@@smoky3302 even patriachy exist, jihad exist, bigotry exist What is should not define what should be! What is natural is not necessarily good and what is good is not necessarily natural!
An interview with Dr suraj yengde would have enlightened us more on dis topic, I think he would hv thrown more light on the same topic about Punjab than this lady
![เขามัทรี - เอ็กซ์ ศุภกฤต - จอนนี่มิวสิค [ Official MV ]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/AS9ufKuQIVs/mqdefault.jpg)
Dr Kaur is to the point, Although I am Maharashtrian,what I listen in Punjabi songs is Jatt Jatt Jatt..
And forget Punjabi songs, Main Jatt Yamla Pagla Deewana was a Bollywood song depicting a Jatt Dharmendra.
@@harisadu8998 Old Punjabi songs are much better
@@harisadu8998Produced by the actors themselves, depicting old cultural punjabi hierarchy!
@@shivamrai2886 Brother i dont understand punjabi either...I just mentioned what i get to LISTEN if by chance i stumble upon any of the Punjabi song
@@hotboy1648 Old Punjabi songs tend to have nostalgia of the pind as a theme, never about caste nonsense
Discrimination does not occur in bigger or historical Gurudwaras. This is an issue of the local Gurudwaras in many villages of Punjab. Sadly, this has created a lot of problems like Derawaad, conversion, etc.
Derawaad meaning?
@@gauravpdaksh Establishment of different deras. People go to a local dera, worship the Baba who heads it. Blind faith, kala jadu, etc are practised. Changes the politics of that place. Baba receives political backing. This can result in Dera Sacha Sauda or Rampal like situation.
@@GurpreetSingh-we7js ok yes, thanks.
How many Mazhabis or Ravidasia or Ramgarhia Sikhs in the SGPC, Sir?
@@bijoydasudiya They will definitely have less representation than Jatts and Khatris. But rather than discrimination that's due to the prominence and the ancestral good will of the other. This can be improved by the economic upliftment.
"The stigma that is attached to a particular caste group is problematic and not the caste". Hope one day for our future generation's sake we are able to understand and correct it.
Absolutely wrong
This whole caste consciousness is problematic.
This whole nonsense kisan andolan is supported by jat caste only and only because of this Caste consciousness that they are my people my caste my samaj!
Why do you think we have honor killings? It's to maintain the caste numbers and to maintain blood purity because even the dominant castes are not more than 20% of their state's population!
Yadavs no matter how nationalist, capitalist or ideologically RW will vote for Samajwadi party because they see Akhilesh YADAV as their YADAV leader. Same for Dalits and Mayawati!
Bureaucrats from a particular caste gets promotion even their caste leader is the politician in power. Gangsters of a particular caste are released if their caste member gets elected!
I have even seen people giving oxygen cylinders to their caste poeple over others when corona was at peak!
I agree that in short term we cannot annihilate caste but because it can't happen in short term doesn't mean that we normalise caste.
@@RD-pp9ds Agree in principle to your opinion but I also feel that we must strive towards the ideal but also accept the real. We don't need to embrace the caste identity but we need to also accept the reality. Doing away with caste identity in current conditions of our society will only create more fissures rather than remove it
@@IncredibleNeo what exactly do you mean when you say "we must accept the real"
Obviously I'm not denying the existence of caste, I am accepting the reality. I also except that it's nearly impossible to annihilate caste in current circumstances and even a decade from now.
But I am making a distinction between "what is" and "what should be"
Punjab is fast becoming Christian...
I want to say to my fellow Hindus brothers and sisters to never discriminate any people from any caste. You can be proud on your caste but when you use it to subdue someone just because he or she born in so called lower caste is extremely inhumane. We all are children of same God. Respect your Dalits friends and treat them as their own. This discrimination must have to stop otherwise it will destroy our civilization. Please, I request you all with my folded hands. 🙏🕉️
First we need to discuss to these you with young generations and try to understand the historical context and if require use referrence of various leaders who write on this issue having said that only upper caste discriminate is not true with in sc st there are various hierarchy these need to be mentioned loudly otherwise we are not solving the issue holistically just episodic medicine we are doing
In Bollywood we tend to see a more Khatri/Arora depiction of Punjabis whereas in Punjabi films and songs, it seems to be very heavily Jatt dominated.
I am sanatani
Vern shudr
Jati chamar. Make is simple give respect to all
Wonderful discussion. Kushal I find your podcasts very informative, analytical and thought provoking. I have stopped watching news on television and mainly get my information on current affairs from a few goods podcast channels, and yours is one of the best
I am proud to be a Brahmin. I teach children with out any discrimination. My ethnicity is mine. I have lived in delhi when the stupidity of Khalistan happened. I lived in a home of an amrit chak in Canada. I still believe that you belong to this world 'my world' celebrated for your successes because we as Hindus don't care.
Are you proud that you were born brahmin?
Or are you proud that you studied all Hindu scriptures for years and then became a brahmin?
If you're proud that you were born in a certain caste then i am sorry, you need to get over this caste pride because this idea that i belong to a certain caste, my caste my people is the basis for all the casteism in India!
@@RD-pp9ds Why are you Gaslighting? You are partially right but , this is the wrong technique for a discussion .
I though rao are kshatriyas of south india
@@Pravar I am Brahmin born and by Karma.
@@kavithavrao rao were ruling class so I thought they are kashtriya
Most of dalits are agriculture labour. Inspite of it Punjab has been importing additional manpower from Bihar and UP! It seems Punjab is going through some abnormalities. Punjab is doing too much water and labour intensive agriculture, which will have adverse effects on its land and social stability in long run.
Much respect for Dr. Dhaliwal. Great poise. Great maturity. My best wishes for her.
Annhilation of caste is not going to happen. ESPECIALLY when the government gives you categories. Oh you're general category, oh you're OBC or SC or ST. If the government categorises you, you can never EVER get rid of caste. It's a daily reminder that if you are of a certain caste you enjoy inherent privileges hence the government won't give anything to you or if you are of a certain caste, the system is built to uplift you but it still reminds you that you are lower caste and enjoying government support as a result. If a system endorses and reminds you of caste, it won't go away. So Kushal, if you enthusiastically support reservations, you support the permanent existence of caste. Plain and simple.
But that caste privilege is mostly false nowadays atleast according to me and my experiences
She should have atleast mentioned the Land Alienation Act 1900 brought in by British to limit land ownership to certain castes which resulted in further exploitation of discriminated castes.
I got to know about this while I was reading an article about the rise of deras.
I know about it but it wasn’t possible to explain everything in an hour. May be later.
@@ravinderdhaliwal5495 I wasn't questioning your competence rather I think that act is quite relevant to the modern day casteism in Punjab. Anyways, it was a good podcast.
This was an amazing podcast . Thank you Dr Ravinder for the informative podcast
As a Brahmin I am ashamed that people of my caste still discriminate other castes in certain parts of the country. But I am never going to disown my caste. I am completely for annhilation of caste hierarchy and I will always work to stigmatize the use of "upper" and "lower" descriptives for caste. But sorry to say caste system is here to stay and I will always believe in it.
Rajiv malhotra has given solution for this.
We don't believe in caste , we don't have caste system , we have varna and jatti.
@Abhinandan Zambare No its Lead To Honour Killing in Punjab in Terms Casteism its Lethal in Punjab Worst State is Haryana & Punjab
Why dalits have 1000+ castes ?
Will u ask this question ?
Why harijan dont marry to valmikis ? And why they become ravidashiya(harijan) and mazhabi( valmiki) in sikhism ?
You r missing the whole point !!
@@saurabh6453Some do, some don’t. But you don’t even allow Dalits to ride a ghodi on the day of their wedding
Brilliant dr Ravinder kaur..
Kushal, we would love to hear her views on this farmer agitation, caste influence and akalis dominance, plz bring her again👍🏻👏
She is woke probably
Dalits themselves don't want to delete caste...from them....Chamar engineer wants to marry only chamaran....no balmiki...etc.
Thats because it is how caste works they are also part of this system caste is a hereichy where always someone is above you and someone is below you.
@@punyashloka4946 That's what makes the case...?
People themselves want to copy the behaviour of others just to make someone feel inferior and then blame others when the entire wall falls on them..🥴
@@darkprince2490 no you are wrong caste is a system of hierarchy ok it existed in ancient India too it was just most more flexible .
@@kk-tw2co that doesn't make upper caste any less casteist by any means.
@@punyashloka4946 point is casteism and it's existence not who is more or less...if something exists it's bound to be more or less in any way... Mayawati is an classic example.
What was missing from this discussion was talk about many other castes apart from Jats or Dalit castes. What is the position of Khatris, Aroras, Ramgarhias, Ramdassias,Kambojs, Sainis, Mohyals etc. Secondly, since this video was titled casteism in Punjab, we are forgetting completely about the 39% Hindu population in Punjab. What is going on there?
Are there any jatt Hindus ?
@@smoky3302 In Punjab? A few. Like Sunil Jakhar.
Are there any Hindus in punjab?
@@donalduncleusa6552 Silly question? 39% of Punjab is Hindu.
@@harisadu8998 no I didn't knew 39% were hindus I thought it might be 5-10%
All effort of sikh gurus wasted .Khatris have been sidelined from religion Whome ancestors laid the foundation of sikh religion.Sikh became sick.
ma punjab se hunn aur ravinder kaur ji ki har baat 100 percent sachh ha
Thank you for having this most important issues spoken in English🙏🙏🙏🙏
I don't agree that not electing a Dalit CM is necessarily equal to there being casteism. There is casteism for sure. But Rajasthan elected a Dalit CM a long time ago, does that somehow mean that casteism does not exist in Rajasthan? It's more complicated imo. And remember, with 39% no Hindu CM has ever gotten elected in Punjab.
Shove this RSS ideology in ur asss
A population of 33% has Only 2.4 % agriculture land. Whereas Dalits are very well versed in farming. It shows a great class devide in Punjab. It is quite strange communist movement has not hold its roots in such a fertile land for them.
#basant giri, communists are biggest enemies of peasants. Out of 10 crores people killed directly in 70 years by communists 80% were peasants, go and read the real history of Russia and China. I think you have been brainwashed by commie fake history that they are great champions of workers and peasants. They only want to grab farmer's lands in the name of collective farms or communes where everyone will be wage laborer with wages decided and paid by the commie controlled government. Punjab is lucky that there is no communist movement like bengal, otherwise it would have been in a much worse condition. And the enterprising Punjabis will never allow such a stupid ideology to spread in their state.
This is really sad to hear. Power to Dr. Kaur. Thanks Kushal for bringing her to us. What surprises me is the dependence on recognition by the upper caste. I am surprised that there has not been an offshoot religion among the SC/ST and other lower caste groups of India. How did the upper caste manage to wield such control over milenia? I am really curious about this. Has there been attempts to understand this?
The caste system will now go away only when the lower castes what it to. Even if it does it will not go away in the manner that people think it will. The oppressed of today will 1) come to terms and take pride in who they are.2) They produce leaders of eminence that they can identify with and emulate.
SC/ST have literally been rebelling for a milenia though it succeeded after Ambedkar and phule.
Not only that even Brahmins like Ramanuja and his diciple ramananda literaly scared the shit out of the orthodoxy during bhakti movement
As far as religion is consider, there was no Hindu identity back then, you can find panthas (most of them don't like scriptures) breaking caste hierarchy but they are termed Hindu because of the definition in constitution
A person who is not a jew, muslim or Christian is Hindu.
India never had or has effective statecraft n effective justice delivery system in place.civilisationally.
So caste tribalism is a reality.
Wherever effective State exists or existed, such tribaliam vanished. Whenever State falters, similar tribalism rose up.
So we need focus on effective State n justice delivery, to address it.
And they say Sikhism has no castism.
Sikhism ha s not
But sikh have
You need to understand the sikh history where the Gurus never discriminated and made sure in the gurbani. Why cast has entered in sikhs is because of brahminical pressure of rss
She’s very cute lady
There is no caste in Sikhi, however, catse has been pushed by OBC, BC and General classes cidified by law. Sikhi is against caste and you cannot change that.
There is general impression found outside of Punjab that mostly Jatts and traders reside in it. It is surprising to know that dalits are 33% in Punjab, yet they have no political say. Why Punjab has not produced a dalit leader of Mayawati stature? Why Kansi Ram was more successful in UP than Punjab?
If u see UP this state always was in centre of politics and still there and it produce various leader in different political spectrum and thus the issue of SC was in debate while in case of Punjab if u see in political space there is much discussion there and even earlier also if something happen then for some month due to certain issue debate was there still I'm current times why we are discussing Punjab due to farmers bill the other factors is population size of sikh and hindu and then with sikh the denomination will further decrease so getting that much attention you need to do some step which come in public debate further as kushal mentioned every state has unique challenge with respect to caste issue then u need to see land reform issue in UP population is much bigger land size holding decreased generations by generations but in Punjab still big zamindar are there and land reform is not that much successful and other reason as well.
Excellent debate." I agree capitalism will irrdicate casteism"
I don't understand when people take pride of the caste they're born into. It's ridiculous and pathetic. Nobody should be proud or ashamed of their caste. It's just a thing that is outdated and serves no purpose anymore. I'm a Tamil brahmin and here in South India you can't easily make out if a person is brahmin or not just by their name. Same system should be applied to northern India as well and surname should be removed. That's the first step.
Thats your perspective I'm proud of my kula and my lineage. Can't help if you feel ashamed of your kula and lineage.
@@pritamgolatkar8862 what is in it that you're proud of? Have you achieved anything great personally? I'm neither proud nor ashamed of my caste or lineage but rather it is something that I'm born into and I just accept it and move on cuz it doesn't make sense to be proud of something that one doesn't have control over. Moreover it's not even an achievement in any sense. So my question to you is what is in it that makes you proud of?
@@vv6533 im proud and thankful to the almighty of the fact that I came to birth in a good well cultured family. And that my ancestors were good people who lived good virtuous life.
Btw I believe in reincarnation so yes the kind of life lived now will lead to the birth into a well cultured family in the next is my theory. So you might say what have I achieved my point is maybe I had some points in the good books of the almighty that I was born in a good family.
Now like you said I am Brahmin and I'm not proud as I have done nothing about it well that's your perspective bcoz you might not believe in reincarnation.
I coming from Sudra Varna lineage do believe in reincarnation. Simple thats your perspective this is mine
@@pritamgolatkar8862 you can be grateful thankful to be born in a privileged caste but THERE'S NOTHING TO BE PROUD OF IT
When a Brahmin or Rajput says that he's proud rajput or brahmin, he is basically supporting the same caste system AS IT THE CASTE SYSTEM BECAUSE OF WHICH HIS ANCESTORS WERE KINGS OR LEARNED MEN.
ONE CAN BE PROUD OF INDIVIDUAL KINGS OR BRAHMINS AND THEIR ACHIEVEMENTS BUT BEING PROUD OF A GROUP IS JUST PLAIN AND SIMPLE CASTEISM
The reason why dalits became christians is a preplanned permission to convert whereas in rest of India it is not allowed and hindu org are against it. The same hindu organisation are now silent in Panjab conversion problem becase the target is sikh?
Dhaliwal is Dalit? Isn't that a common Jatt surname? Like Mo Dhaliwal or even Jagmeet Singh.
Dhaliwal is a village, many people in Punjab take up the name of their ancestral village as their surname.
@@jitupattnaik6140 not necessarily
A lot of Jat and dalit surnames are same in Punjab and Harayana
Many castes have common surnames, you'll find Tomar Tanwar Chauhan, Bhati etc surnames in gujjars dalits jats as well as rajputs in Haryana and neighbouring regions!
@@RD-pp9ds Nah bullshit Dalits steal jatt surnames in punjab
Much needed discussion
🔖 If Punjab is an agricultural state why Dalit landholding is Lowest -1.5 percent, of all India.
Sikhs are More Oppressive of Dalits than Hindus. But they have Loud mouths.
🔖🔖Communists and Congressis are strong in Punjab over 70 years. Yet they ***promoted feudalism in Punjab while Sanatan Dharma all over India. It suited their power Politics.
They gave all riches of agricultural revolution to Jatts Only
I am a dalit sikh SC
But here i feel safer than as BC s feel in UP
One of my friend told me about how thakurs treat them even in Colleges(2022)
@@HarpreetSingh-gb8wu may be its due to UP being bigger state than Punjab and casteism in UP is generally more complex than of Punjab
This nonsense of No Caste in Christianity ---- why there are Christian castes in India.
Why Black churches in USA.
Dr Dhaliwal should have researched that bollywood does not reflect true picture of panjab? Why jatts are propagated is due to a braminical pressure and a challenge that Panjab is different from rest of India. Gurus and Bhagats rejected brahmins culture as anti society.
This is is the reason why dalits who were oppressed elsewhere found a comfortable place in Panjab...thanks to the Guru guidance
The one who is taking the interview is actually from the Highest caste in Punjab. Mehra is a 2.5 ghar Khatris along with Malhotra and Kapoor. Jatts are actually Shudra but have very high population so they are dominant Politically.
Which religion is best for untouchables of Punjab especially Chamar? Is it Buddhism, Islam or Sikhism? As far as I know, Ravidasia Sikhs are armed with swords but don't use it against discrimination by the higher castes. What's the use of Kirpan then?
2:35 these names are funny as hell
Dr BR Ambedkar was one of the great leaders of India. Dalits should follow him instead of joining hands with communal forces.
Umm not wholly
Someone should do a study on the Mahants opening Deras in every Panjab village that helps soread caste and andh vishwas. Where did 13000 Mahants come from? Who trained them and sent them to compete with Gurdwaras in the villages?
Since when Missionaries offered free education, health, jobs etc??
🔖Nowadays, its provided by the state Only.
Missionaries, esp pastors are now fleecing money from poor Dalits, taking away their 10 percent incomes shamelessly
When we talk about conversion it's more about humiliation nd respect ,as far as economic conditions r concerned, it's almost same, it never get better bcoz of conversion.
The building of separated Gurudwaras was started when sgpc came infiltrated with rss brahmin...the strategy was to make jatts (who are also shudra) false believe they are higher cast so the dalits would easily fal in the lap of deras (deras have mushroomed up in 90s) This is a created problem by central agencies to Hinduism sikhs
Points of mam are good but very bookish ...
Caste system same as in punjab or usa, canada ,uk ,California .When ever you meet any sikh punjabi old uncle. Very first thing they ask tu kehna da munda hai tera pind kehda hai , like they about to offer marriage proposal for you..Yuba city California, Brampton, in Canada. Those two cities are highly castized..
Bhai agar aise topic hote hai toh punjabi ya hindi mai rakaha karo tabhi aap k kam views hai
Cast and varn system is totally rejected in Sikh philosophy by Guru Sahiban.
Guru says
ਜਾਣਹੁ ਜੋਤਿ ਨ ਪੂਛਹੁ ਜਾਤੀ ਆਗੈ ਜਾਤਿ ਨ ਹੇ॥
Recognise God’s light withinall. Do not consider social status and cast. It is not hereafter.
ਮਾਨਸ ਕੀ ਜਾਤ ਸਬੈ ਏਕੈ ਪਹਚਾਨਬੋ॥
Recognise whole human race as one.
Moreover cast system is based on economic resources and former tribal setup. One can proud of his cast but he should not discriminate with other.
Is Dr Kaur saying she uses Dhaliwal as a fake surname on purpose?
No. I didn't say that. It is my surname. I just mentioned people who sometimes use fake names to hide their caste. I am not hiding my caste identity anyway as I am proud of what I am.
@@ravinderdhaliwal5495 I'm not saying that you're hiding because of course you are discussing and declaring your caste out in open. But if someone met you for the first time, won't they assume that you are Jatt? Is it normal for people of your caste to have this surname?
Yes it is normal. You can meet a number of people who have these surnames resembling Jatt surnames. Now why it so, will make an interesting research. Will try to explore more and share with you all.
@@ravinderdhaliwal5495 Alright, thanks for your input Dr Kaur.
@@ravinderdhaliwal5495 Maam I Belong To Nai Caste But My Surname is Maan Mad We Are Using This From Centuries Before Sikhism Exits and in Panj Payare Our Caste Give Sons to Sikhism and You Now Nai Sikh is Known in Punjab is Bagat Sain Samaj If You Have Any Information About Bagat Sain Samaj Please Do Let Me Know I Am Eagrly Waiting For Your Reply Because of Casteism My Family Moved From Punjab 4the Generation Before We Are Living in Delhi and Well Educated and Well Settel My Community Literacy Rate Also Very High We Have Doctors Engineer Business Man I Am Also Businessman
Thanks
Kushal mehra thou u real punjabi by birth but u know nothing about cast discrimination scale of India...Punjab will rank very comfortably.
No madam deras are not teaching simplified Gurbani, what they do is breat their faith in sikhism and make them less education from gurbani.
Giani jail singh was Ramdassia tarkhan. Ravidassia are Chamar
Punjab and casteism - who knew!
Mehra the solution is implent Kanshiram formula...seats, positios, jobs, judges, police all should be based on numbers of population, this shd be implemented pan India.
Can the rss and central govt agree
Punjab is jatt ,jatt is Sikh,jatt is land owner
Dalit SIKH Scholar Giyani SARDAR DITT SINGH NE SIKH Dharam ko zinda rakha.
Problem je hai ki dalit leader nalayak hai,Dalito ko insaaf nahi dete
I recommend a movie ''Natrang'' Marathi
Dr Dhaliwal there is no cast humiliation of SC. This thoughts have been planted not your ground research
Mehra you are definitely rss man and bent on targeting panjab in low light ...why don't you do such analysis in UP bihar MP .
Dr kaur tell me has the social status of dalits changed after becoming christians?
Bro Punjab is absolutely f*cked and has no future. Please accept reality.
The young people are all immigrating, and the lower 'castes' are converting en masse.
There is no Sikh future for the state beyond 15-20 years.
In fact, Punjab might eventually do better as a Christian majority state than a minority (Jatt Sikh) led state.
What nonsense SC land holder is not the lowest in India . The figure is low because of higher populationof SC.
Kushal Mehra is mocking on SC using jatt names is derogatory he should apologise as anchor shd not be having biases. He is not fit for the job?
I think बाबा बालक नाथ and bhagat Dhanna Jatt also belonged to Punjab.
Jatt are come in bania category produce food and yadev come in bhiari shoodr come to punjab and work in jatts farm
Kushal Mehra should move away his Computer Screen to his Left and to back of his Mike.
He staring away tl Right side doesn't help his performance.
Yeh khud hi apna gotra lgakar jativad ko brha rahi hai
In punjab india mey sabse jada intercaste marriges ho rahi hai
Akal Takhat ka jathedar Dalit Sikh hai
Punjab mey castism desh mey sabse kamm hai, par Dalit Sikh dharte nahi, eska pore jorh se muqabla karte hai
Jatt khud shudra hai
,
She herself uses jatt surname as a sc
Did you even watch the full stream?
@@vatsalj7535 yeah
Je hunde honge tahi use kita ohne...faltu ch kon krda
@@AmarjeetKaur-vc8bo all of the SCs
@@AmarjeetKaur-vc8bo chamkila use to call himself half jatt (we know how) on stage lmaoo
Khatri born use talwar after guru nanak they start learning
Wat this guy is khatri he start learning after guru nanak khatri tell brahman that we don't want to fight we want to learn
,👍
Why dalits have 1000+ castes ??
They r not innconet either.
Sikhism = jattidm
Jat supermecy.
I am SC ravifasia sikh chammar.
But dont know why all of our certificates show us as ramdasia
.
01000th view lol😂
Atleast in central and western India particularly in Maharashtra and now in Gujarat neo buddhism is playing a major and positive role in the Upliftment of Dalits.
It is because of ambedkarite movement Maharashtra had a range of dalit thinkers which reflected in pop culture also.
And now slowly but surely this movement also penetrated in hindi Heartland like UP and MP and also had a presence in karnataka.
I just hope Dalits from all over India start forming their own identity via movements like neo Buddhism
Ambedkar never wanted a separate dalit identity
He wanted annihilation of caste
His idea to destroy caste was intercaste marriages
Intercaste marriages between 16% and 84% will demolish this dalit identity and a larger Hindu identity will remain
We forget that Ambedkar was not a jinnah who wanted to preserve a separate Muslim identity
@@RD-pp9dsBabasaheb may not have wanted it but the reality is that it exist now .
If he didn't want new identity than why did he converted to Buddhism.
@@RD-pp9ds but iam not against movement like hindutva .
If u can do that a bring a kind of social cohesion and integration fine.
Neo Buddhists and Ambedkarites are so ideologically dumb I swear.
Hindutva alone has the ability to break the barriers of caste as we've seen in the Ram Janmabhoomi movement. Nobody gave a fu*k about your caste, only your hindu identity mattered.
I think we should propagate hindutva more. It's acceptance and progressiveness among the hindu fold is what gives me hope for the future.
@@smoky3302 even patriachy exist, jihad exist, bigotry exist
What is should not define what should be!
What is natural is not necessarily good and what is good is not necessarily natural!
An interview with Dr suraj yengde would have enlightened us more on dis topic, I think he would hv thrown more light on the same topic about Punjab than this lady