Hi Scott. I was a close friend of the pilot of this accident. I actually sold him my Cessna 150 to him about 12 years ago and his hangar was next to mine. He had been showing me the various planes that he was looking at and the A36 was one of them. He showed me all the equipment that came with it and he was very excited about this plane. I told him that it was a lot of plane. He told me after he bought it that he was going to attend a special 15 hour or so intensive training on the A36 which he did before the cross country flight home with an instructor. He really wanted a Diamondstar DA40 like mine for a very long time but when he started looking at planes this one caught his eye. It was his ultimate dream plane. As it turns out he would have been better off moving up to something like the Diamond. Your comments are really good and I hope that this accident teaches all pilots, new or old, that we have to really think about what we're doing in ANY plane.
Hi Ron, I'm am also very sorry for your loss, and prayers go out to you, and your close friend's family, for their devastating and life-altering loss. Peace, one love, and God bless.
Ron . . . lessons learned here could be carried, to all walks of life. The 'quick & dirty' of this is ALWAYS plan. Doing anything ad hoc with have an inexorable high price to pay, for that moment as well . . . as long term !
@@arthurmontana8791 I think the subtle point from the guy who has flown so many bushes is that a long-lived career is best determined by honest judgment of when to taxi, vs when to stay at the tie-down. Better to ditch the flight plan than the aircraft.
@@77thTrombone So true. However, there are times when "honest judgment" can be elusive. At times - sometimes just minutes when the decision is made - there are external and internal pressures and circumstances that can cloud one's judgment. One internal pressure can be something called "hubris". It's killed highly skilled, very experienced pilots and their crews. Those who boast about their flying time and accident-free record hint at that type of hubris.
@@arthurmontana8791 well said. I certainly see that point & concur. I also recall a statement from a movie ("Anger Mgt?") _Emotions are like kids. You don't want them driving the car, but you can't put them in the trunk, either._ It can be tough keeping them rascals out of high-value/high-risk decisions.
Hi Scott! I learned to fly at O85 and received my license in June of 2019. I very much enjoy your videos and find them informative, intuitive, and thought evoking. On my second or third flight lesson I was eyewitness to a fatal C-150 crash while I was performing my preflight. The C-150 was accelerating on runway 33 for takeoff when his engine sound caught my attention. The aircrafts engine was definitely in distress, and as an A&P mechanic, you know the sound of an engine not performing correctly at takeoff power. What baffles me to this day is that the takeoff roll continued. You know how the apron is where the flight school operates out of at Benton. My line of sight to the accident aircraft let me see the aircraft at about the 700 foot mark on the runway, yet the aircraft continued with the sound of the engine getting progressively worse. The C-150 rotated and struggled to climb at about the 1300-1700 ft position on the runway, broke ground, the engine continued to deteriorate, and at the threshold of RWY 15 the C-150 began to mush and the climb ceased. The pilot further pitched the aircraft up, the left wing started to drop, and I could see full left wing up aileron being used. The airplane seemed to pirouette off of its left wingtip, the nose abruptly went almost straight down through the vertical, the airplane disappeared from sight as it disappeared over Placer Street, and two or three seconds later I heard the bone jarring crunch of the airplane hitting the ground. My first thought was “Why didn’t you abort, why didn’t you stop?” I think it was probably one of the saddest crashes I have ever witnessed. I will never, ever forget that lesson! Needless to say, I cancelled my lesson that day, had to think a bit about that one!
Scott, I've been a very "blessed" pilot, in the fact that my decisions were not always grounded, yet here I am. You have opened my eyes. Can't ever thank you enough, sir.
Really appreciate what you're doing here. Hoping to be a new private pilot in this next month. This is really well presented and has definitely helped see more clearly the importance of performance and bail out planning and sadly the high cost of failing to do so. Always have a bail out. Thank you Scott!
For PP SEL like myself who has spent my 30 years of flying from an airport with 7200 and 6100ft runways, watching a video like this is even MORE informative because a pilot like me could take a situation like that for granted. Well done.
I remember my uncle's wife's brother flying over my uncle's house outside Prague Oklahoma circa 1975 in an A-36. Awe inspiring. My uncle had a Debonair and would take me up and teach me basics like how not to get lost or disoriented. Important stuff. We can never stop learning ever. Really appreciate these great learning videos Scott.
@@johnfitzpatrick2469 Not really... I. am saying keep it on the ground until you reach a speed past computed rotation. This pilot tried to get airborne too early and that attempt wasted a lot of energy he absolutely needed.
@@FlyWirescottperdue Exact concept used at the airlines ... called and improved takeoff but basically overspeed the aircraft to obtain better 2nd segment climb
To all pilots who want to enjoy their flying to a ripe old age, listen to pilots like this guy who know what they are talking about...A fan from the UK
Thank you for your excellent presentation. It will save some lives. I started flying in 1965 and devoured the Plane and Pilot and Flying magazine’s accident analysis. One article about below VFR and the Tower saved me from a sure accident on my long X country.
Scott, really nice breakdown of the performance. When a new to the T/M/S aircraft and part-time pilot flies close to the airplane limits it’s a good idea to have someone familiar with that aircraft do a reality check. Learning never stops I think videos like this is the new hangar flying
These videos are important ,they may not be nice to do ,but they are important they can save lives and stop mistakes being make ,keep them coming ,I'm all for saving someone's live.
Scott, Love your video's. Two points for me that are great take-aways : 1) Always reference your POH and calculate all pertinent information specific to your flight. 2) It doesn't matter who you have in the right seat, you are the PIC and you should plan accordingly. If it's outside of your personal criteria, then get with an instructor and practice this prior to any pleasure flights with passengers. It really hits home for me because I fly with friends that are professional pilot's. Keep the video's coming.......
Hi Scott, I bought a 35 Bonanza back in 1965. I had been in a Bonanza a few times and had no retract time, nor any flying time in a Bonanza. I flew it for 20 years, with no accidents. I found it to be a very easy aircraft to fly. Other friends had no reason not to let me fly their Bonanzas. Mu first tail dragger was a Boeing Stearman, which I also flew for 20 years. I learned all I could from friends that had Bonanzas. I'm sure they can get you in trouble, if you let the aircraft fly you!
Scott, just purchased an S35 after transitioning from a Cherokee 180. I'm 17 hours in an it's a dream to fly. I appreciate your videos and knowledge and look forward to your new videos. Please keep up the good work! You're doing a great service to us newbies.
You remind me of my drivers ed instructor in high school in the late 60's. He was a retired california highway patrolman. I still hear and appreciate his calm, reasoned voice to this day. I was a normal, somewhat impatient, somewhat know it all kid; but every word out of his mouth was so logical in every dimension of the driving experience, from the reason for driving laws, car performance, road conditions, human nature of both driver...and other drivers...as well as employing a personal moral ethic/ responsibility to driving. His process was impeccable in ever facet. I didn't fully understand at the time how I had fit myself into his template. It is a template that has been adaptable to every aspect of my life. Just wanted you to know how important your work is to those able to understand your offering.
Most of what you say is absolutely true. But now the rest of the story. the plane was TN with a Tornado alley setup with GAMI injectors. The gross weight was estimated at 4100 by NTSB and FAA with density altitude of 2800 ft. Due to smoke the vis was 2 3/4 miles so the pilot who was VFR only recruited a CFI that was at the field and indeed had no Bonanza experience so they could file IFR. Keep in mins, this A36 had NO toe brakes on the right side. There are two videos and a witness that saw the rollout. the videos did indeed showed flaps up. The aircraft was clocked by a CHP officer at 60 knots at about halfway down the runway and the pilot did not power up before releasing brakes instead just rolled out on the runway. The videos show the pilot trying to force the aircraft off of the ground. Though it did try, it never really left the ground as it did not achieve the required flaps up 78 knots required but the pilot frantically operated the elevator and finally towards the end of the runway you could see the aircraft nose up in about a 30 deg angle then slam back down then go off the runway where then you saw a plume of smoke. 4 Major mistakes were made. 1) He should of flown to Redding muni to get his passengers. 2) He did not power up at the end of the runway then release his brakes as called out for short field take off in the AFM. 3) Per AFM he should of had 12 degrees of flaps, he did not. 4) Pilot should of done everything possible to abort that take off about halfway down the runway. I will agree that inexperience and overconfidence in the aircraft caused this crash.
Thank you for taking time to produce these videos. I am not a GA pilot but I do fly with a friend who is very conservative. Your videos add to my thoughts while driving a car to the tune of 50-60K miles a year as well as run fast boats. In the boats you have to take many of the same rules into account. Thanks again, you help me be safe.
Scott, I LOVE Flywire. RE: 1989 A36 runway over run Great analysis. In the 1990's I was 1/2 owner of a 1978 A36 Bonanza. I never really liked this airplane. I have 750 hours in a C-172 RG I bought new in 1980, and I guess I'm partial to the old Cessna Say, in this video, your elevator trim tab is still in landing configuration. Please just be sure to set it back to Take Off position. For what it's worth, I always trim for take off before I hanger my plane. Yup, I've taken of with my elevator trim set like this and got a real surprise!
I’m a GA VFR 650 hr pilot and I train with CFIs and CFIIs at a min of 1.5 - 2 hrs flying time with an hr or so ground / week. Working on my Instrument rating. Thanks for posting these reviews..very helpful with my GA ADM .
Scott Yes I enjoyed this video I know it’s a year old however I just watched it today and I’m sharing it with my pilot friends Excellent report Bravo Five stars ⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️ Best wishes from Las Vegas Craig
You're absolutely right there's nothing better than getting first hand detailed information to try to put the accident perspective. No article is going to cover the spectrum like you do thank you again for serving our country, and for providing safety and wisdom to Future pilots to understand our history we're less likely to repeat it. God bless you keep up the good work
I bought (poorly maintained) Cherokee 140 in 1989 in the final 1/2 of pre private instruction. He taught me don't force it off the runway. It will only fly when it's ready. I love my stubborn little 140. So recently a year ago, I tried to force it off. It settled back on the wheels. This extended the takeoff toll. Technique is hold a little back pressure and she will float into ground effect zone when good and ready. I usually don't use flaps on takeoff. An article called it the stubborn little Cherokee 140. Keep in mind the airplane knows how to fly and she lets you go along for the ride; no sexual imeundo intended.
I think the thing that popped into my head, and I'm sure it's quite possibly the hardest thing for most human beings to be honest about in these kind of situations because of the "complications" that arise from the resulting decision, is your statement, " is this flight going to change the world?" That kind of honesty is so hard for us mortals to actually ask ourselves and deal with. Hence many of these accidents are the result. Great video and insight into needed info.👍
Once again an excellent presentation. Thanks Scott. I was a CFI back in the '70s and I wish I had the knowledge back then I have now, I would have been far better.
Very good reminder of the steps for planning for visiting an airport, especially calculating the abort distance. That is not covered enough in training.
After watching a bunch of your videos, thank you! I’m sure what I’m(we) am learning from you will save my life or someone else’s one day. Im very thankful for it. Perhaps something else to consider is the procedure for short field take off is pretty standard in small planes. Full aft, full power and wait for it to fly, whereas in the bonanza that’s not the case. It’s plausible that ignorance and inexperience on both the PIC and CFI is causel. Either is cause for all of us to seek more training and knowledge.
I grew up less than a mile from Benton Field. My grandfather actually crashed into that same hill at the North end of the runway while attempting to land towards the South. I don't know what year it was, but it had to be in the 50's or early 60's. Back around 1967, the neighbor boys and I had been pushing our bikes up a hill near our homes so we could ride down. The planes would circle this hill on final, and one of us noticed something being tossed from a Cessna. We watched it fall, and hit near a large oak tree, so we ran up 1/4 mile or so and found a paper grocery bag with a bottle opener, and a bunch of broken beer bottles. Someone had a party while flying.
I have not watched you a lot, perhaps 3 times, but you are clear and concise in your reviews. Most of what you say applies to life in general. PS. I am not a pilot.
I've used minimal airports but only when a better option wasn't available. RDD is only a 10 minute drive from O85. Why didn't they meet there and use RDD runway 34, which is about 7,000 ft. long? That would have given almost a mile of extra margin.
Clearly this pilot was not yet "at one" with his new airplane. The triple-threat of 1) at gross w/3 pax 2) short field 3) Not fully "at one" with plane - should have almost demanded him re-positioning to RDD alone. And this accident has little to do with a Fancy Bonanza, and everything to do with Basic Risk Factor calculation/evaluation. Good video. I bought a Piper ArrowIV last year and ferried it from FL. I ONLY flew in good,clear wx, flew mainly over interstates, landed at bigger airports (with higher than "perfect" airspeeds), and turned down the wife's want to go along. I tried to stack the deck in case of grief on this "new to me" plane. I also have a rule about being near to a interstate with pax (if possible), they are trusting me with their well-being.
I’m planning on getting my ppl in June 2021 and I totally agree with your take on the accident in review. Thanks for taking the time to bring awareness to current and future pilots!! Keep doing these videos.
Keep working and learning! When I flew fighters in the USAF we had a saying... Fight to Fly, Fly to fight and Fight to Win.... Fly, Fight and Win... or something like that. I have slept a few times since then;)
@@FlyWirescottperdue We have a saying in the Army, when the Air force is still fumbling with their remotes, we will be on target, but it might be late. Great video and don't stop at your PPL, get your instrument rating! Keep training and fly with experienced pilots as much as you can!
Keep them coming Scott. I agree that these are important. I also watch the ASI videos which are somber as well. Complacency can be lethal and we need to be reminded of it.
As an A36 owner, this was pertinent and eye opening. Mentally, I have the mindset that 2000 to 2500 feet of run way is 'plenty'... I better get rid of those ingrained first thoughts.... Excellent and timely.. Thanks Scott
Reminds me of a podcast by Jason Miller (TheFinerPoints) interviewing Brian Schiff on his refusal to take off with Steve Jobs and a lot of additional equipment on a short runway into terrain and hot weather. They drove to a better airport nearby, met the plane there, and had a safe flight. If it isn't safe, don't go, no matter who's asking! 👍😎
Scott, thanks for your analysis. I know how it feels discussing mishaps, especially when the final report isn’t out yet. I think you did a good job separating conjecture from fact but still adding your experienced take. I especially like the “leave yourself an out” discussion. I use this when teaching young Eagle Drivers who have their fangs through the floor as the support fighter in ACM. You know what I mean. Cheers
I earned my pilot's license in Redding at the Municipal airport. Later when building homes my partner bought a new 1978 T-210 that we operated out of Benton Field. Flown in and out of Benton Field very heavy frequently carrying 2- 5-gallon cans of Navajo White paint, an airless sprayer, extension cords, and other tools. We would look at the temp and the takeoff graph ballparking weight of some items in the performance manual but never exceeded what was needed to get out of there. Redding can get to over 100 degrees like Texas but it is a lot dryer. At the time I weighed in at about 160, much less than today. The T-210 if you've ever flown one takes some muscle to haul it off the runway even with takeoff trim. It needs some love to fly itself off the tarmac and my eyes were glued to the airspeed. I felt comfortable at 75 knots and just above. The stick is just heavy after liftoff including 10 degrees flaps, the gear and flaps retracted when the climb was well established. Then we made a right turn headed easterly climbing just to the peak of Mount Lassen on the south side then descended into Susanville and work on homes. Very sad to hear these events at an airport I know and flew out of frequently. Appreciate the analysis, it reminds us of the importance of reading and applying takeoff data before each departure. I know we all have a tendency to disregard that when we fly alone which a lot of including myself have done. It would be better to make it a habit alone or with passengers to run a weight and balance anyway. You just might need it if you get ramped if the FAA still does that. Thanks for the information and advice.
I agree with you Scott, reviewing this mishaps in a constructive way is very important, we as pilots must learn lessons where we can find them, in this cases accidents gives us the opportunity to draw those lessons to wide our minds in order to not repeat fatal mistakes or situations, thanks por posting this videos
Mario, thanks and great point. We have to learn from others mistakes. The path to becoming a better pilot doesn’t lie with committing all the mistakes yourself.
Finishing my private training with an instructor other than than the one that brought me most of the way...there were strong xwinds rolling and tossing the 152 on approach ... because of the pine trees so close..anywho, just near the numbers on approach he lost it the left, the plane rolled left. and became almost completely inverted...I seized control of the aircraft, spun her level and landed safely...His response, "..nice catch!" Just another example how my basic instructor's lessons saved my life..
@@FlyWirescottperdue ...working on my commercial, CFII in theright seat...climbing out of Addison, max rate of climb to 3k to transition across DFW airspace to Ft Worth, the AH began to fail and slowly rotate uo raising horizon, ..the CFII began to take over and said "...what are you doing!" I refused. No,no, no....I replied, "...AH has just failed." He looked bewildered..a few moments later at 2500 I, continuing climb turned westward to 270 and 3k...taking a piece of paper I covered offending AH, I explained, " .....all other instruments confirmed stable flight...ergo, AH defective and not suitable for reference...If I had relinquished control to the "superior" pilot and CFII would, without a clue and woukd of pulled vigorously up following that single instrument, and in max rate of climb most likely would of put us in a power on spiral dive at about 1000ft....I've recovered once from one as another pilot inadvertently entered one...don't think a thousand ft would be enough...way to close if I did for comfort.
A really good friend of mine,his son was involved in the horrible accident and was one of the 2 that lived but sadly passed away in the hospital about a month later.
I was told, many, many years ago by an eperienced pilot who flew them that V tail Bonanzas were called Fork Tailed Doctor Killers because although they were great airplanes, amatuer pilots with money just had to have them. A dream airplane. As for density altitude, most pilots that routinely take off "high" understand it. There was a Fokker Triplane replica which initially was flying along in high elevation just literally fell out of the sky when it found itself in the wrong denisity altitude situation. There is an interesting on board video on youtube of a high altitude take off that crashed when it ran out of runway.
Scott, your analyses are amazing. I'm an older flying wannabe--probably will never actually get the chance, to actually learn, but if I do I'm going to watch and re-watch every one of these, with a notepad in hand. I'd like to see you including some basic titles in to highlight key points, and then include them in the video description. At 14:34 you summarize these 2 key points: 1. Insist on a thorough initial training program for any new airplane. 2. Always, always, always have an abort option for every takeoff. But I"m seeing a couple of others. 3. Don't go anywhere without calculating everything. Study, check and recheck the math surrounding the performance limits of your airplane. 4. Don't let down your guard because you happen to be flying with a more experienced pilot in the right seat. This one is of course perhaps relatively minor, but I thought very insightful. BTW, perhaps you won't mind my including a link to Jon Kotwicki's (Fly8Ma) recent video that also covers points 2-3 very well, including exploring some of the thought processes that could lead one to go against better judgment: th-cam.com/video/wYRN-sWK8qc/w-d-xo.html
My brothers platoon sgt still did an AAR after they lost people on a mission. Uncomfortable for sure but needs to be reviewed or nobody will learn. Thanks for covering it.
I actually went from a 172 to a V35. But I went to my flight instructor and we sat down and made a training plan. We made sure we covered everything before I was able to solo and how many hours I needed to solo before hauling passengers. Unfortunately, we did not have a local BPPP Instructor so we had to improvise by coming up with a compromise plan. With all that said, I totally agree with your comments Scott. A Bonanza, not just an A36 or even any high-performance aircraft. You must have comprehensive training. Don't get overconfident, get familiar with the aircraft and its capabilities.
Excellent presentation. My takeaway is train the way you fly, fly the way you train. It’s sobering, and humbling, because there’s no such thing as a flight without risk. Risk is manageable to a certain degree, but always has a cost. In this case, it was tragically all-in for half the occupants.
Agree on the CFI over-confidence scenario. I've done it myself. In initial IFR training I found my mental attention off from normal and later I came to conclusion that I was subconsciously handing over the flight to the CFI. Not doing my normal mental gymnastics because it was easier to assume they had the hard stuff and wouldnt let me do something stupid. How stupid. :) Great insights. Not a bonanza flier but appreciate your videos.
I did it with my Dad in the Right seat. An ex-USAF Pilot. T-6,T-28-B-25 B-36, B-52, EB-66, T-39. Retired and bought a C-170B. Flew Air ambulance where I was usually the unpaid auto-pilot. The best was a Twin Beech that’s now in the Seattle Museum of Flight. www.museumofflight.org/aircraft/beech-c-45h-expeditor I loved those P&W R-985 engines. I soled first in 1979 when I could fly a 115 HP Citabria for $12.50/hour an an employee. In college and life so didn’t get my Private until ~1990 at the USAF Academy AeroClub. To high altitude for C-150s so I trained a 172 and later got signed off on a 172 XP. Moved to Texas and got in a partnership with a standard A-36 Bonanza. Got lots of time. Flew it all around the country. Even flew into Denver Stapleton to drop my parents off for an airline flight. I landed on a middle runway that had the terminal building as the “backstop” after the end of the runway. The partnership dissolved so I bought a 1973 Viking with a 300HP Lycoming. Not as fancy or fast but still a great plane. I had 100+ hours. Flew my Parents up to Kansas where she was raised. Routine Flight VFR. On landing the Viking would float a little being low and with that fat wing. I came in a bit too fast. I was past ½ down the runway before it settled and I got on the binders. Max braking and we stopped ~15 feet from the end of the runway. By myself, I would never have done that. It was an easy go around decision. That I did Not make because my Dad, now an airline pilot, didn’t say anything. It wasn’t because I would have been embarrassed. He had flown with me a lot. It was because he had 10000+ hours and I figured he’d say something if it didn’t seem right. After stopping for a few seconds, and my heart rate dropped below 200, I made a more than 90 degree turn to taxi to parking. Dad never said a word. Maybe because an overrun would have been directly into a ready to harvest wheat field. Although the exhaust or orange hot brakes probably would have started a fire. Eventually I bought a Marchetti SF-260W. Experimental as it was an ex-Libyan AF plane with armament panel (Hard points had been removed) that offered 200kg bombs, .30 caliber machine gun or rockets. The man who had it beautifully restored kept that panel and used a few of the switches for other things. Painted Ferrari Red. My checkout pilot, who I paid to fly up for a couple of days from Dallas, said this plane was the closest thing to a P-51 that he’d ever flown. He was a Warbird Checkout pilot. PIC was Right seat which I definitely wanted. The real HOTAS deal. The left seat had mechanical linkages for throttle and prop only. For the instructor. Like the brakes on the passenger side of a student driver car. It was aerobatic with inverted fuel and oil. I took some aerobatic lessons later but this tiny laminar flow winged plane used up lots of altitude. It would snap roll at the top of a loop before you could say s***. It was fun stuff but I just did the fun things like barrel rolls, lazy 8s, etc. I never sustained inverted flight as the instructor said this was not a good airplane to do that in. There had been several accidents in these during the 2 years before I bought it. Insurance was high. No one had ever survived an off airport landing. It had a canopy eject system. He told me to always wear a parachute (which I did) and to always bail out, if I had 500 feet, no matter how good the terrain looked. He also drilled into me to always be 90 knots over the runway threshold numbers when landing. It had a small laminar flow wing that flew until it suddenly didn’t. Stall practice was always very revealing. It bled speed off real fast so stopping was never a problem. High fixed costs and kids and work forced me to sell it eventually. Unfortunately I haven’t ever returned to flying. Although it was probably the most enjoyable thing I ever did in my life.
I have brought similar loads into Redding in a TC bonanza and I opted to use the bigger Redding airport. The TN airplane has worse takeoff performance, I can't imagine trying to get one of those out of Benton at gross. Unfortunately the TN Bonanza's are attractive to people upgrading because the engine is relatively easy to manage and it is a ton of power but the shortcoming of the TN system are often overlooked.
Great video. Part of preflight and pretake off briefing is the abort point. Verbalizing when committed to flight or not. Haven't done much high density altitude, but verbalizing the go/no go on the runway BEFORE power up, makes the decision much easier. Here, once powered up and over x speed, committed to flying, and plan to use all runway to do so with no out. Great video, and informative!!!
I work in agricultural and commercial lending and there are so many parallels. The reason is both fields involve risk, albeit in aviation the range of outcome includes severe injury or death to the pilot and passengers. However, in risk management in lending there are very heavy consequences when there is “get there-itis” but instead it’s “we’re doing the deal-itis”. You have to leave yourself an out, a plan B, you have to accurately assess the real risk you are taking on (takes experience and directed effort), and have ways to mitigate
Well done Sir. Awesome motherhood for preflight mission planning factors and basic airmanship. I think you hit the nail on the head with basic take-off performance planning. i.e. Accel Stop/Go distances and SID climb gradients. Always leave yourself an out, and accurate performance planning will help you decide when and how to do that. Excellent job! and Thanks for making our industry that much safer. Semper Fi.
Good points made. Besides takeoff performance and accelerate-stop in a twin, I always cover having to come back and land when choosing airports with short runways. Many are often surprised when I ask for a short field landing and the result is MUCH more actual runway used than what they planned on, especially high density altitude airports with higher TAS on approach. Often times I’m told, “I never use full flaps for landing”. Things can be quite different when the “usual” is a reduced flap landing on a 6000’ runway with inattention to the correct approach speed for the actual weight. A canned, one speed, POH approach speed based on maximum GW results in much more runway required than using a lower speed based on actual, IAS stalling speed for the actual weight flown. I like to have them observe their actual, full flap stall IAS at a weight they commonly fly, add 1.3 to that speed and use that for a full flap landing speed. What a difference a few knots make. In a Cessna 150 with minimal weight change, not so important. In my 185 with more than a 1700# useful load and a few STOL kits, very important. The POH says 78 MPH at GW. I drop that to 65 or 70 at GW, depending on the conditions, and down to 50 MPH at lighter weights. Having angle of attack would be better yet. Something yet to do... Use the POH recommended approach speed for landing at gross weight with an aerodynamically stock airplane. Approach and landing speeds can be adjusted from there. It used to be referred to as being a pilot and knowing your airplane. I’m old, so maybe I didn’t get the memo if that has changed.
Great analysis, in this situation it goes against gut feel to lower the nose and add airspeed near the end of the runway. It’s your only chance to get in front of the power curve.
Great explanation, Scott. The "70-50" rule-of-thumb was taught to me decades ago. AFTER I have done the homework, and elect to take off, I still want to see 70% of takeoff airspeed (or V2 in the larger stuff) by 50% of the field length. When conditions dictate 75-80% @ 50% of field length, then I get some coffee and re-think the program.
As an instructor I always taught my students the 70/50 rule. That is you need to achieve 70% VTOSS at or before 50% of the take off distance required. If you don't achieve this, you will not be able to get airborne in the distance required.
Please don't say "I don't mean to judge". You are judging and are correct to do so: you are not implying that the people involved are evil. Your observations are bang on.. we all make mistakes but can only learn when they are pointed out and presented with the correct course of action. We've all made mistakes flying and some of us (me included) are only able to comment by the grace of GOD.
Thanks for video. I cannt fly complex airplanes but your advices are very useful, especialy for unexperienced pilot like me. Note about FI or CFI on right seat is spot on, this describe my feelings about flight preparation and flying alone after obtaining license. Behavior is different when FI or examiner is in the right seat. Thanks a lot.
Good video, Scott. Training is important, as you said, and thinking about options for aborting the take-off is important, too. At least here in the US most airports have long-enough runways to give us that option, and I am grateful for that. (It's not the case everywhere in the world.) - Martin
Listening to you it show that pilot decisions is literally life or death . I agree with you that training must be done and should be fun and life saving. It’s not embarrassing to need more training but should be recognised by all pilots as part of the course.
I'll have to watch again , as a A/P mech. single engine fixed wing and a commercial rotary wing ,, this guy , looking at his hands he likes to work on his aircraft almost as much as flying them !!
Thank you! And thank you for referencing Dan Gryder's AQP training!! If it saves 1 life it is well worth it, the more, better!! I lost my certificate many years ago due to medical reasons that will not get better. I do still have many good friends that fly. It just breaks my heart every time an airplane goes down in a preventable accident. Thanks again and God Bless. --gary
I just started reviewing your channel and your assessments I couldn't be more pleased with your analogy flaps were definitely indicated on this flight and that aircraft is heavy I also believe that every pilot in training should look at photographs of crashes including bodies so they truly understand what is at stake with their judgment and the results it's all about performance thanks for your insight
Excellent analysis...100% agree about the right seat CFI overconfidence trap... ....oh, I’m a a high time pilot, F33a owner and a CFI-A, CFII & CFIG...etc...like Scott intimated - don’t be impressed (or let your guard down) by a qualified passenger...my personal minimums don’t change with your passenger list...nor do my responsibilities as PIC
A36 pilot here. The TN A36 actually has a T/O penalty when compared to the normally-aspirated model, and is noticeably heavier. Two strikes this pilot could not afford. Third was runway length. Combined with the very common misunderstanding that a powerful, capable airplane should be able to handle just about anything, and the trap was set. I have done it myself. On a very hot summer day, I accepted an intersection max gross weight T/O on 34L at Eugene (full tanks including 20-gallon tips) , 3 pax, baggage,. United traffic on final. Could I accept an immediate? You bet, and off we went to find some cooler air. But it soon became painfully obvious I had made a series of mistakes. Strike one, taking on all that fuel for a max gross weight departure on a hot day (there was no fuel at our destination up in the San Juans). Strike two, an intersection takeoff left half of 34L behind us. Strike two-and-a-half, allowing myself to be rushed. I'd neglected to drop T/O flaps. We were just half a strike away from the same outcome as the Bonanza this video is about. As we slowly gained speed, the yoke stayed heavy and it soon became very, very clear we were not going to be able to take off with comfortable margins of runway, much less runway left to stop if need be. I dropped flaps 1, the wheels grew light, skipped, and we were off for the San Juans. I was fortunate to be able to learn from those mistakes. But never, ever again.
![ทุกครั้งที่หลับตา (Lucid Dream) - AYLA's [ Official MV ]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/4i1OBAQyv58/mqdefault.jpg)
Hi Scott. I was a close friend of the pilot of this accident. I actually sold him my Cessna 150 to him about 12 years ago and his hangar was next to mine. He had been showing me the various planes that he was looking at and the A36 was one of them. He showed me all the equipment that came with it and he was very excited about this plane. I told him that it was a lot of plane. He told me after he bought it that he was going to attend a special 15 hour or so intensive training on the A36 which he did before the cross country flight home with an instructor. He really wanted a Diamondstar DA40 like mine for a very long time but when he started looking at planes this one caught his eye. It was his ultimate dream plane. As it turns out he would have been better off moving up to something like the Diamond. Your comments are really good and I hope that this accident teaches all pilots, new or old, that we have to really think about what we're doing in ANY plane.
Ron, I'm so sorry for your loss. I totally agree all of us, as pilots, need to stay sharp and on our game when we fly!
Ron, I’m sorry about your friend! Prayers to all his family and friends. God bless.
Hi Ron, I'm am also very sorry for your loss, and prayers go out to you, and your close friend's family, for their devastating and life-altering loss. Peace, one love, and God bless.
Ron . . . lessons learned here could be carried, to all walks of life. The 'quick & dirty' of this is ALWAYS plan. Doing anything ad hoc with have an inexorable high price to pay, for that moment as well . . . as long term !
I am a new owner of a36 , these videos really help me out . I feel very bad for the lost.
From an 8,000 hour, accident-free bush pilot: An astute presentation that imparts life saving advice.
Thanks John!
@@tomschwab5619 So very true. I would never boast about being an "accident-free" pilot.
@@arthurmontana8791 I think the subtle point from the guy who has flown so many bushes is that a long-lived career is best determined by honest judgment of when to taxi, vs when to stay at the tie-down.
Better to ditch the flight plan than the aircraft.
@@77thTrombone So true. However, there are times when "honest judgment" can be elusive. At times - sometimes just minutes when the decision is made - there are external and internal pressures and circumstances that can cloud one's judgment. One internal pressure can be something called "hubris". It's killed highly skilled, very experienced pilots and their crews. Those who boast about their flying time and accident-free record hint at that type of hubris.
@@arthurmontana8791 well said. I certainly see that point & concur.
I also recall a statement from a movie ("Anger Mgt?") _Emotions are like kids. You don't want them driving the car, but you can't put them in the trunk, either._ It can be tough keeping them rascals out of high-value/high-risk decisions.
It's obvious sir. Your concern for safety while flying, comes from the heart. 👍♥️
Hi Scott! I learned to fly at O85 and received my license in June of 2019. I very much enjoy your videos and find them informative, intuitive, and thought evoking. On my second or third flight lesson I was eyewitness to a fatal C-150 crash while I was performing my preflight. The C-150 was accelerating on runway 33 for takeoff when his engine sound caught my attention. The aircrafts engine was definitely in distress, and as an A&P mechanic, you know the sound of an engine not performing correctly at takeoff power. What baffles me to this day is that the takeoff roll continued. You know how the apron is where the flight school operates out of at Benton. My line of sight to the accident aircraft let me see the aircraft at about the 700 foot mark on the runway, yet the aircraft continued with the sound of the engine getting progressively worse. The C-150 rotated and struggled to climb at about the 1300-1700 ft position on the runway, broke ground, the engine continued to deteriorate, and at the threshold of RWY 15 the C-150 began to mush and the climb ceased. The pilot further pitched the aircraft up, the left wing started to drop, and I could see full left wing up aileron being used. The airplane seemed to pirouette off of its left wingtip, the nose abruptly went almost straight down through the vertical, the airplane disappeared from sight as it disappeared over Placer Street, and two or three seconds later I heard the bone jarring crunch of the airplane hitting the ground. My first thought was “Why didn’t you abort, why didn’t you stop?” I think it was probably one of the saddest crashes I have ever witnessed. I will never, ever forget that lesson! Needless to say, I cancelled my lesson that day, had to think a bit about that one!
That is an amazing story! What a shame!
Wow..TO witnesses would change anyone's perspective hopefully your in a positive way..making you much better pilot are you still flying?
Scott, I've been a very "blessed" pilot, in the fact that my decisions were not always grounded, yet here I am. You have opened my eyes. Can't ever thank you enough, sir.
Really appreciate what you're doing here. Hoping to be a new private pilot in this next month. This is really well presented and has definitely helped see more clearly the importance of performance and bail out planning and sadly the high cost of failing to do so. Always have a bail out. Thank you Scott!
For PP SEL like myself who has spent my 30 years of flying from an airport with 7200 and 6100ft runways, watching a video like this is even MORE informative because a pilot like me could take a situation like that for granted. Well done.
I fly a normally aspirated A36, have for years, and would never consider 4 passengers on a 2400 ft runway, under any conditions.
Combined with high altitude.
I remember my uncle's wife's brother flying over my uncle's house outside Prague Oklahoma circa 1975 in an A-36. Awe inspiring. My uncle had a Debonair and would take me up and teach me basics like how not to get lost or disoriented. Important stuff. We can never stop learning ever. Really appreciate these great learning videos Scott.
Thanks for watching!
Thanks for covering this Scott!
Thanks Juan! When are you coming to training?
blancolirio glad to see someone is concerned with aviation
Is he saying in other words: obtain greater airspeed by using the ground effect for a increased rate of climb.🎈
@@johnfitzpatrick2469 Not really... I. am saying keep it on the ground until you reach a speed past computed rotation. This pilot tried to get airborne too early and that attempt wasted a lot of energy he absolutely needed.
@@FlyWirescottperdue Exact concept used at the airlines ... called and improved takeoff but basically overspeed the aircraft to obtain better 2nd segment climb
To all pilots who want to enjoy their flying to a ripe old age, listen to pilots like this guy who know what they are talking about...A fan from the UK
Thanks Capt Ken! I loved my time in the UK!
Thank you for your excellent presentation. It will save some lives. I started flying in 1965 and devoured the Plane and Pilot and Flying magazine’s accident analysis. One article about below VFR and the Tower saved me from a sure accident on my long X country.
Scott, really nice breakdown of the performance. When a new to the T/M/S aircraft and part-time pilot flies close to the airplane limits it’s a good idea to have someone familiar with that aircraft do a reality check. Learning never stops
I think videos like this is the new hangar flying
Another brilliant insight. These videos are so important for all pilots and anyone interested in flying. Keep 'em coming.
These videos are important ,they may not be nice to do ,but they are important they can save lives and stop mistakes being make ,keep them coming ,I'm all for saving someone's live.
Scott, Love your video's. Two points for me that are great take-aways : 1) Always reference your POH and calculate all pertinent information specific to your flight. 2) It doesn't matter who you have in the right seat, you are the PIC and you should plan accordingly. If it's outside of your personal criteria, then get with an instructor and practice this prior to any pleasure flights with passengers. It really hits home for me because I fly with friends that are professional pilot's.
Keep the video's coming.......
Hi Scott, I bought a 35 Bonanza back in 1965. I had been in a Bonanza a few times and had no retract time, nor any flying time in a Bonanza. I flew it for 20 years, with no accidents. I found it to be a very easy aircraft to fly. Other friends had no reason not to let me fly their Bonanzas. Mu first tail dragger was a Boeing Stearman, which I also flew for 20 years. I learned all I could from friends that had Bonanzas. I'm sure they can get you in trouble, if you let the aircraft fly you!
My Dad always said fly the airplane, don't let the airplane fly you...
Scott, just purchased an S35 after transitioning from a Cherokee 180. I'm 17 hours in an it's a dream to fly. I appreciate your videos and knowledge and look forward to your new videos. Please keep up the good work! You're doing a great service to us newbies.
Thanks Ben. Enjoy the S35.
You remind me of my drivers ed instructor in high school in the late 60's.
He was a retired california highway patrolman. I still hear and appreciate his calm, reasoned voice to this day. I was a normal, somewhat impatient, somewhat know it all kid; but every word out of his mouth was so logical in every dimension of the driving experience, from the reason for driving laws, car performance, road conditions, human nature of both driver...and other drivers...as well as employing a personal moral ethic/ responsibility to driving. His process was impeccable in ever facet. I didn't fully understand at the time how I had fit myself into his template. It is a template that has been adaptable to every aspect of my life.
Just wanted you to know how important your work is to those able to understand your offering.
Thanks Terry, I'll take that as a compliment;)
As a student pilot with the dream of one day owning a bonanza these videos are invaluable.
Thank you for bringing this up! I get tremendous value from these. We have to learn from these accidents
Thanks Scott, there is so much to learn from aircraft accidents and you pointed that out with this particular terrible mishap.
Most of what you say is absolutely true. But now the rest of the story. the plane was TN with a Tornado alley setup with GAMI injectors. The gross weight was estimated at 4100 by NTSB and FAA with density altitude of 2800 ft. Due to smoke the vis was 2 3/4 miles so the pilot who was VFR only recruited a CFI that was at the field and indeed had no Bonanza experience so they could file IFR. Keep in mins, this A36 had NO toe brakes on the right side. There are two videos and a witness that saw the rollout. the videos did indeed showed flaps up. The aircraft was clocked by a CHP officer at 60 knots at about halfway down the runway and the pilot did not power up before releasing brakes instead just rolled out on the runway. The videos show the pilot trying to force the aircraft off of the ground. Though it did try, it never really left the ground as it did not achieve the required flaps up 78 knots required but the pilot frantically operated the elevator and finally towards the end of the runway you could see the aircraft nose up in about a 30 deg angle then slam back down then go off the runway where then you saw a plume of smoke. 4 Major mistakes were made. 1) He should of flown to Redding muni to get his passengers. 2) He did not power up at the end of the runway then release his brakes as called out for short field take off in the AFM. 3) Per AFM he should of had 12 degrees of flaps, he did not. 4) Pilot should of done everything possible to abort that take off about halfway down the runway. I will agree that inexperience and overconfidence in the aircraft caused this crash.
Thank you for taking time to produce these videos. I am not a GA pilot but I do fly with a friend who is very conservative. Your videos add to my thoughts while driving a car to the tune of 50-60K miles a year as well as run fast boats. In the boats you have to take many of the same rules into account. Thanks again, you help me be safe.
Very well done Scott! Unique presentation and detailed crash analysis. Thank you!
Thank you Darren!
I think this video is one of the best “what can we learn from this accident?” videos I’ve watched.
Thanks Kieran!
Scott, I LOVE Flywire.
RE: 1989 A36 runway over run
Great analysis. In the 1990's I was 1/2 owner of a 1978 A36 Bonanza. I never really liked this airplane. I have 750 hours in a C-172 RG I bought new in 1980, and I guess I'm partial to the old Cessna
Say, in this video, your elevator trim tab is still in landing configuration. Please just be sure to set it back to Take Off position. For what it's worth, I always trim for take off before I hanger my plane. Yup, I've taken of with my elevator trim set like this and got a real surprise!
I’m a GA VFR 650 hr pilot and I train with CFIs and CFIIs at a min of 1.5 - 2 hrs flying time with an hr or so ground / week. Working on my Instrument rating. Thanks for posting these reviews..very helpful with my GA ADM .
Glad to help! Keep flying!
Excellent breakdown of this accident. Your very thorough and well spoken. Thank you for your contribution to existing and future pilots
Thanks, Dan!
Information that should be weighed in gold... Thank you Scott for the excellent presentation.
Great analysis of this accident with emphasis on what we can all learn from it. This electronic hangar flying is great instruction. Good work!
Thanks Jim!
Scott
Yes I enjoyed this video I know it’s a year old however I just watched it today and I’m sharing it with my pilot friends
Excellent report
Bravo
Five stars
⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️
Best wishes from Las Vegas Craig
Outstanding analysis. Very non-judgemental, but calls a spade a spade. Excellent job! Will watch more of your videos.
Thanks!
You're absolutely right there's nothing better than getting first hand detailed information to try to put the accident perspective. No article is going to cover the spectrum like you do thank you again for serving our country, and for providing safety and wisdom to Future pilots to understand our history we're less likely to repeat it. God bless you keep up the good work
Thanks Sean!
I bought (poorly maintained) Cherokee 140 in 1989 in the final 1/2 of pre private instruction. He taught me don't force it off the runway. It will only fly when it's ready. I love my stubborn little 140. So recently a year ago, I tried to force it off. It settled back on the wheels. This extended the takeoff toll. Technique is hold a little back pressure and she will float into ground effect zone when good and ready. I usually don't use flaps on takeoff. An article called it the stubborn little Cherokee 140. Keep in mind the airplane knows how to fly and she lets you go along for the ride; no sexual imeundo intended.
Jeffrey- Good job... listen to the airplane!
I think the thing that popped into my head, and I'm sure it's quite possibly the hardest thing for most human beings to be honest about in these kind of situations because of the "complications" that arise from the resulting decision, is your statement, " is this flight going to change the world?" That kind of honesty is so hard for us mortals to actually ask ourselves and deal with. Hence many of these accidents are the result. Great video and insight into needed info.👍
Scott, you're good - you're so so good. Please keep posting.
Thanks, Scott! AQP is the standard! Excellent insights. And review! Great clips and content!
I have over 1000 hours in a 91’ A36 and this was a very informative video.
Well done ...
Thanks Patrick, I appreciate it!
That’s a BIG airplane!
Thank you sir. Although I'm not a pilot I'm sure those who do fly will really appreciate the information and knowledge you provided.
Once again an excellent presentation. Thanks Scott. I was a CFI back in the '70s and I wish I had the knowledge back then I have now, I would have been far better.
Very good reminder of the steps for planning for visiting an airport, especially calculating the abort distance. That is not covered enough in training.
Thanks for the video Scott, I do believe these are really important for all pilots to watch and discuss.
After watching a bunch of your videos, thank you! I’m sure what I’m(we) am learning from you will save my life or someone else’s one day. Im very thankful for it.
Perhaps something else to consider is the procedure for short field take off is pretty standard in small planes. Full aft, full power and wait for it to fly, whereas in the bonanza that’s not the case. It’s plausible that ignorance and inexperience on both the PIC and CFI is causel. Either is cause for all of us to seek more training and knowledge.
We need to learn from these accidents so when the others are in the situation they know the possible outcomes. I learned from this and thank you.
I appreciate that!
"Mitigating risk" is going to be part of my daily life in all areas. Good advice.
Thanks!
The 7 Ps...prior proper planning prevents piss poor performance.
@@joestalin5438 I try to live by that everyday!
I grew up less than a mile from Benton Field. My grandfather actually crashed into that same hill at the North end of the runway while attempting to land towards the South. I don't know what year it was, but it had to be in the 50's or early 60's. Back around 1967, the neighbor boys and I had been pushing our bikes up a hill near our homes so we could ride down. The planes would circle this hill on final, and one of us noticed something being tossed from a Cessna. We watched it fall, and hit near a large oak tree, so we ran up 1/4 mile or so and found a paper grocery bag with a bottle opener, and a bunch of broken beer bottles. Someone had a party while flying.
13:17-agree, fly like there’s no one else to help you fly.
I have not watched you a lot, perhaps 3 times, but you are clear and concise in your reviews. Most of what you say applies to life in general. PS. I am not a pilot.
I've used minimal airports but only when a better option wasn't available. RDD is only a 10 minute drive from O85. Why didn't they meet there and use RDD runway 34, which is about 7,000 ft. long? That would have given almost a mile of extra margin.
Clearly this pilot was not yet "at one" with his new airplane. The triple-threat of 1) at gross w/3 pax 2) short field 3) Not fully "at one" with plane - should have almost demanded him re-positioning to RDD alone. And this accident has little to do with a Fancy Bonanza, and everything to do with Basic Risk Factor calculation/evaluation. Good video.
I bought a Piper ArrowIV last year and ferried it from FL. I ONLY flew in good,clear wx, flew mainly over interstates, landed at bigger airports (with higher than "perfect" airspeeds), and turned down the wife's want to go along. I tried to stack the deck in case of grief on this "new to me" plane. I also have a rule about being near to a interstate with pax (if possible), they are trusting me with their well-being.
I’m planning on getting my ppl in June 2021 and I totally agree with your take on the accident in review. Thanks for taking the time to bring awareness to current and future pilots!! Keep doing these videos.
Keep working and learning! When I flew fighters in the USAF we had a saying... Fight to Fly, Fly to fight and Fight to Win.... Fly, Fight and Win... or something like that. I have slept a few times since then;)
FlyWire- scott perdue I love it!!! Do you give ground school class to attain ppl!
@@ronna1522 Ron, thanks. Hadn't even thought of doing that.
@@FlyWirescottperdue We have a saying in the Army, when the Air force is still fumbling with their remotes, we will be on target, but it might be late. Great video and don't stop at your PPL, get your instrument rating! Keep training and fly with experienced pilots as much as you can!
Keep them coming Scott. I agree that these are important. I also watch the ASI videos which are somber as well. Complacency can be lethal and we need to be reminded of it.
This is true lifesaving content! Keep up your good work...
As an A36 owner, this was pertinent and eye opening. Mentally, I have the mindset that 2000 to 2500 feet of run way is 'plenty'... I better get rid of those ingrained first thoughts.... Excellent and timely.. Thanks Scott
Thanks David!
Really good and instructive review, Scott. Thanks for sharing and on the emphasis of planning/training.
Reminds me of a podcast by Jason Miller (TheFinerPoints) interviewing Brian Schiff on his refusal to take off with Steve Jobs and a lot of additional equipment on a short runway into terrain and hot weather. They drove to a better airport nearby, met the plane there, and had a safe flight. If it isn't safe, don't go, no matter who's asking! 👍😎
Scott, thanks for your analysis. I know how it feels discussing mishaps, especially when the final report isn’t out yet. I think you did a good job separating conjecture from fact but still adding your experienced take. I especially like the “leave yourself an out” discussion. I use this when teaching young Eagle Drivers who have their fangs through the floor as the support fighter in ACM. You know what I mean. Cheers
CD. Thanks. I appreciate it. Student tried to kill me once in ACM... very close run thing. I still see it...
I earned my pilot's license in Redding at the Municipal airport. Later when building homes my partner bought a new 1978 T-210 that we operated out of Benton Field. Flown in and out of Benton Field very heavy frequently carrying 2- 5-gallon cans of Navajo White paint, an airless sprayer, extension cords, and other tools. We would look at the temp and the takeoff graph ballparking weight of some items in the performance manual but never exceeded what was needed to get out of there. Redding can get to over 100 degrees like Texas but it is a lot dryer. At the time I weighed in at about 160, much less than today.
The T-210 if you've ever flown one takes some muscle to haul it off the runway even with takeoff trim. It needs some love to fly itself off the tarmac and my eyes were glued to the airspeed. I felt comfortable at 75 knots and just above. The stick is just heavy after liftoff including 10 degrees flaps, the gear and flaps retracted when the climb was well established. Then we made a right turn headed easterly climbing just to the peak of Mount Lassen on the south side then descended into Susanville and work on homes. Very sad to hear these events at an airport I know and flew out of frequently.
Appreciate the analysis, it reminds us of the importance of reading and applying takeoff data before each departure. I know we all have a tendency to disregard that when we fly alone which a lot of including myself have done. It would be better to make it a habit alone or with passengers to run a weight and balance anyway. You just might need it if you get ramped if the FAA still does that. Thanks for the information and advice.
The 36 series did make some concessions in performance to get the load/CG range it has. And you've got to pay attention to it!
These type of videos and your effort are very important because as you hope, I have no doubt they save lives and or limbs.
Thanks Thomas, I hope!
Was recently planning a flight to Redding in my Comanche 250. Planned the flight to Redding muni due to the length of the Benton runway
Good choice Tom!
I agree with you Scott, reviewing this mishaps in a constructive way is very important, we as pilots must learn lessons where we can find them, in this cases accidents gives us the opportunity to draw those lessons to wide our minds in order to not repeat fatal mistakes or situations, thanks por posting this videos
Mario, thanks and great point. We have to learn from others mistakes. The path to becoming a better pilot doesn’t lie with committing all the mistakes yourself.
Finishing my private training with an instructor other than than the one that brought me most of the way...there were strong xwinds rolling and tossing the 152 on approach ... because of the pine trees so close..anywho, just near the numbers on approach he lost it the left, the plane rolled left. and became almost completely inverted...I seized control of the aircraft, spun her level and landed safely...His response, "..nice catch!" Just another example how my basic instructor's lessons saved my life..
Good job and a great reaction!
@@FlyWirescottperdue ...working on my commercial, CFII in theright seat...climbing out of Addison, max rate of climb to 3k to transition across DFW airspace to Ft Worth, the AH began to fail and slowly rotate uo raising horizon, ..the CFII began to take over and said "...what are you doing!" I refused. No,no, no....I replied, "...AH has just failed." He looked bewildered..a few moments later at 2500 I, continuing climb turned westward to 270 and 3k...taking a piece of paper I covered offending AH, I explained, " .....all other instruments confirmed stable flight...ergo, AH defective and not suitable for reference...If I had relinquished control to the "superior" pilot and CFII would, without a clue and woukd of pulled vigorously up following that single instrument, and in max rate of climb most likely would of put us in a power on spiral dive at about 1000ft....I've recovered once from one as another pilot inadvertently entered one...don't think a thousand ft would be enough...way to close if I did for comfort.
great video ty you definitely get a feel of security when a cfi
is sitting next to you my prayers to all involved
A really good friend of mine,his son was involved in the horrible accident and was one of the 2 that lived but sadly passed away in the hospital about a month later.
I was told, many, many years ago by an eperienced pilot who flew them that V tail Bonanzas were called Fork Tailed Doctor Killers because although they were great airplanes, amatuer pilots with money just had to have them. A dream airplane. As for density altitude, most pilots that routinely take off "high" understand it. There was a Fokker Triplane replica which initially was flying along in high elevation just literally fell out of the sky when it found itself in the wrong denisity altitude situation. There is an interesting on board video on youtube of a high altitude take off that crashed when it ran out of runway.
Good video Scott, you are correct. We as pilots need to review the facts and distill good and valuable information that can keep us safe when we fly.
Scott, your analyses are amazing. I'm an older flying wannabe--probably will never actually get the chance, to actually learn, but if I do I'm going to watch and re-watch every one of these, with a notepad in hand.
I'd like to see you including some basic titles in to highlight key points, and then include them in the video description. At 14:34 you summarize these 2 key points:
1. Insist on a thorough initial training program for any new airplane.
2. Always, always, always have an abort option for every takeoff.
But I"m seeing a couple of others.
3. Don't go anywhere without calculating everything. Study, check and recheck the math surrounding the performance limits of your airplane.
4. Don't let down your guard because you happen to be flying with a more experienced pilot in the right seat. This one is of course perhaps relatively minor, but I thought very insightful.
BTW, perhaps you won't mind my including a link to Jon Kotwicki's (Fly8Ma) recent video that also covers points 2-3 very well, including exploring some of the thought processes that could lead one to go against better judgment: th-cam.com/video/wYRN-sWK8qc/w-d-xo.html
Good suggestions Jim. We'll see;)
My brothers platoon sgt still did an AAR after they lost people on a mission. Uncomfortable for sure but needs to be reviewed or nobody will learn. Thanks for covering it.
I actually went from a 172 to a V35. But I went to my flight instructor and we sat down and made a training plan. We made sure we covered everything before I was able to solo and how many hours I needed to solo before hauling passengers. Unfortunately, we did not have a local BPPP Instructor so we had to improvise by coming up with a compromise plan. With all that said, I totally agree with your comments Scott. A Bonanza, not just an A36 or even any high-performance aircraft. You must have comprehensive training. Don't get overconfident, get familiar with the aircraft and its capabilities.
Excellent!
Wow!! If Juan Browne watches this channel, it must be darn good!!
High Praise, thanks.
My first chief flying instructor at my first job said, remember you don't have to go flying, it's not the Battle of Britain.
Excellent presentation. My takeaway is train the way you fly, fly the way you train. It’s sobering, and humbling, because there’s no such thing as a flight without risk. Risk is manageable to a certain degree, but always has a cost. In this case, it was tragically all-in for half the occupants.
Spot on, thanks for the comment!
Scott, Good reminder to plan as if the take-off will go wrong...its not often enough that we do just that. Thanks for the reminder.
Great video Scott! Every time I see your beautiful F-33, I just drool all over my keyboard. What a sharp airplane.
Thanks. Me to;) Charlie is the homer screen on my phone. It replaced the F15E;)
Agree on the CFI over-confidence scenario. I've done it myself. In initial IFR training I found my mental attention off from normal and later I came to conclusion that I was subconsciously handing over the flight to the CFI. Not doing my normal mental gymnastics because it was easier to assume they had the hard stuff and wouldnt let me do something stupid. How stupid. :) Great insights. Not a bonanza flier but appreciate your videos.
Thanks Bobby, I think stuff like that happens to all of us!
Agreed, it’s so true, even subconsciously.
I did it with my Dad in the Right seat. An ex-USAF Pilot. T-6,T-28-B-25 B-36, B-52, EB-66, T-39. Retired and bought a C-170B. Flew Air ambulance where I was usually the unpaid auto-pilot. The best was a Twin Beech that’s now in the Seattle Museum of Flight. www.museumofflight.org/aircraft/beech-c-45h-expeditor I loved those P&W R-985 engines. I soled first in 1979 when I could fly a 115 HP Citabria for $12.50/hour an an employee. In college and life so didn’t get my Private until ~1990 at the USAF Academy AeroClub. To high altitude for C-150s so I trained a 172 and later got signed off on a 172 XP. Moved to Texas and got in a partnership with a standard A-36 Bonanza. Got lots of time. Flew it all around the country. Even flew into Denver Stapleton to drop my parents off for an airline flight. I landed on a middle runway that had the terminal building as the “backstop” after the end of the runway. The partnership dissolved so I bought a 1973 Viking with a 300HP Lycoming. Not as fancy or fast but still a great plane. I had 100+ hours. Flew my Parents up to Kansas where she was raised. Routine Flight VFR. On landing the Viking would float a little being low and with that fat wing. I came in a bit too fast. I was past ½ down the runway before it settled and I got on the binders. Max braking and we stopped ~15 feet from the end of the runway. By myself, I would never have done that. It was an easy go around decision. That I did Not make because my Dad, now an airline pilot, didn’t say anything. It wasn’t because I would have been embarrassed. He had flown with me a lot. It was because he had 10000+ hours and I figured he’d say something if it didn’t seem right. After stopping for a few seconds, and my heart rate dropped below 200, I made a more than 90 degree turn to taxi to parking. Dad never said a word. Maybe because an overrun would have been directly into a ready to harvest wheat field. Although the exhaust or orange hot brakes probably would have started a fire.
Eventually I bought a Marchetti SF-260W. Experimental as it was an ex-Libyan AF plane with armament panel (Hard points had been removed) that offered 200kg bombs, .30 caliber machine gun or rockets. The man who had it beautifully restored kept that panel and used a few of the switches for other things. Painted Ferrari Red. My checkout pilot, who I paid to fly up for a couple of days from Dallas, said this plane was the closest thing to a P-51 that he’d ever flown. He was a Warbird Checkout pilot. PIC was Right seat which I definitely wanted. The real HOTAS deal. The left seat had mechanical linkages for throttle and prop only. For the instructor. Like the brakes on the passenger side of a student driver car. It was aerobatic with inverted fuel and oil. I took some aerobatic lessons later but this tiny laminar flow winged plane used up lots of altitude. It would snap roll at the top of a loop before you could say s***. It was fun stuff but I just did the fun things like barrel rolls, lazy 8s, etc. I never sustained inverted flight as the instructor said this was not a good airplane to do that in. There had been several accidents in these during the 2 years before I bought it. Insurance was high. No one had ever survived an off airport landing. It had a canopy eject system. He told me to always wear a parachute (which I did) and to always bail out, if I had 500 feet, no matter how good the terrain looked. He also drilled into me to always be 90 knots over the runway threshold numbers when landing. It had a small laminar flow wing that flew until it suddenly didn’t. Stall practice was always very revealing. It bled speed off real fast so stopping was never a problem. High fixed costs and kids and work forced me to sell it eventually. Unfortunately I haven’t ever returned to flying. Although it was probably the most enjoyable thing I ever did in my life.
I have brought similar loads into Redding in a TC bonanza and I opted to use the bigger Redding airport. The TN airplane has worse takeoff performance, I can't imagine trying to get one of those out of Benton at gross. Unfortunately the TN Bonanza's are attractive to people upgrading because the engine is relatively easy to manage and it is a ton of power but the shortcoming of the TN system are often overlooked.
You have a very important and appreciated job , it’s appreciated!
Excellent! Just wonderful commentary and analysis.
Your so right about what you are sareing with us. You can never learn enough about accidents. Thanks 👍
Thanks Philip!
Great analysis Gunny. Also enjoyed your recent ABS joint presentation located under training on the ABS website. Thank you.
Great to hear!
Great video. Part of preflight and pretake off briefing is the abort point. Verbalizing when committed to flight or not. Haven't done much high density altitude, but verbalizing the go/no go on the runway BEFORE power up, makes the decision much easier. Here, once powered up and over x speed, committed to flying, and plan to use all runway to do so with no out. Great video, and informative!!!
Thank you Richard!
Really enjoying your channel - pls keep them coming
We will!
I work in agricultural and commercial lending and there are so many parallels. The reason is both fields involve risk, albeit in aviation the range of outcome includes severe injury or death to the pilot and passengers. However, in risk management in lending there are very heavy consequences when there is “get there-itis” but instead it’s “we’re doing the deal-itis”. You have to leave yourself an out, a plan B, you have to accurately assess the real risk you are taking on (takes experience and directed effort), and have ways to mitigate
Go through all the maneuvers locally and explore the performance corners of the airplane... Amen Scott.
Well done Sir. Awesome motherhood for preflight mission planning factors and basic airmanship. I think you hit the nail on the head with basic take-off performance planning. i.e. Accel Stop/Go distances and SID climb gradients. Always leave yourself an out, and accurate performance planning will help you decide when and how to do that. Excellent job! and Thanks for making our industry that much safer. Semper Fi.
Well said! Thanks!
Good points made.
Besides takeoff performance and accelerate-stop in a twin, I always cover having to come back and land when choosing airports with short runways. Many are often surprised when I ask for a short field landing and the result is MUCH more actual runway used than what they planned on, especially high density altitude airports with higher TAS on approach.
Often times I’m told, “I never use full flaps for landing”. Things can be quite different when the “usual” is a reduced flap landing on a 6000’ runway with inattention to the correct approach speed for the actual weight. A canned, one speed, POH approach speed based on maximum GW results in much more runway required than using a lower speed based on actual, IAS stalling speed for the actual weight flown.
I like to have them observe their actual, full flap stall IAS at a weight they commonly fly, add 1.3 to that speed and use that for a full flap landing speed. What a difference a few knots make. In a Cessna 150 with minimal weight change, not so important. In my 185 with more than a 1700# useful load and a few STOL kits, very important. The POH says 78 MPH at GW. I drop that to 65 or 70 at GW, depending on the conditions, and down to 50 MPH at lighter weights. Having angle of attack would be better yet. Something yet to do...
Use the POH recommended approach speed for landing at gross weight with an aerodynamically stock airplane. Approach and landing speeds can be adjusted from there. It used to be referred to as being a pilot and knowing your airplane. I’m old, so maybe I didn’t get the memo if that has changed.
Great analysis, in this situation it goes against gut feel to lower the nose and add airspeed near the end of the runway. It’s your only chance to get in front of the power curve.
Manny, I probably missed the memo as well.
Great explanation, Scott. The "70-50" rule-of-thumb was taught to me decades ago. AFTER I have done the homework, and elect to take off, I still want to see 70% of takeoff airspeed (or V2 in the larger stuff) by 50% of the field length. When conditions dictate 75-80% @ 50% of field length, then I get some coffee and re-think the program.
Thankyou so much Scott for your wise words
As an instructor I always taught my students the 70/50 rule. That is you need to achieve 70% VTOSS at or before 50% of the take off distance required. If you don't achieve this, you will not be able to get airborne in the distance required.
Excellent, thanks!
Please don't say "I don't mean to judge".
You are judging and are correct to do so: you are not implying that the people involved are evil.
Your observations are bang on.. we all make mistakes but can only learn when they are pointed out and presented with the correct course of action.
We've all made mistakes flying and some of us (me included) are only able to comment by the grace of GOD.
Thanks Jet.
Thanks for video. I cannt fly complex airplanes but your advices are very useful, especialy for unexperienced pilot like me. Note about FI or CFI on right seat is spot on, this describe my feelings about flight preparation and flying alone after obtaining license. Behavior is different when FI or examiner is in the right seat. Thanks a lot.
Glad it was helpful! Keep flying and learning!
Great review. Learned some new facts re this mishap from your video. So sad when so many of these are preventable.
Good video, Scott. Training is important, as you said, and thinking about options for aborting the take-off is important, too. At least here in the US most airports have long-enough runways to give us that option, and I am grateful for that. (It's not the case everywhere in the world.)
- Martin
Listening to you it show that pilot decisions is literally life or death . I agree with you that training must be done and should be fun and life saving. It’s not embarrassing to need more training but should be recognised by all pilots as part of the course.
Great info on flying Scott. Sad situation when a 7,000 ft runway was on the south east end of the town.
Thanks Jon, and you're spot on.
I thought same thing Reading has a 7,000 foot small commercial airport. 2500’ fully loaded in my Warrior used to make me nervous. Why?
I'll have to watch again , as a A/P mech. single engine fixed wing and a commercial rotary wing ,, this guy , looking at his hands he likes to work on his aircraft almost as much as flying them !!
Thank you! And thank you for referencing Dan Gryder's AQP training!! If it saves 1 life it is well worth it, the more, better!! I lost my certificate many years ago due to medical reasons that will not get better. I do still have many good friends that fly. It just breaks my heart every time an airplane goes down in a preventable accident. Thanks again and God Bless. --gary
Thank your GTR. I hope you get to fly with your friends at times!
I just started reviewing your channel and your assessments I couldn't be more pleased with your analogy flaps were definitely indicated on this flight and that aircraft is heavy I also believe that every pilot in training should look at photographs of crashes including bodies so they truly understand what is at stake with their judgment and the results it's all about performance thanks for your insight
Thanks for watching and commenting Montana.
Excellent analysis...100% agree about the right seat CFI overconfidence trap...
....oh, I’m a a high time pilot, F33a owner and a CFI-A, CFII & CFIG...etc...like Scott intimated - don’t be impressed (or let your guard down) by a qualified passenger...my personal minimums don’t change with your passenger list...nor do my responsibilities as PIC
Well said!
A36 pilot here. The TN A36 actually has a T/O penalty when compared to the normally-aspirated model, and is noticeably heavier. Two strikes this pilot could not afford. Third was runway length. Combined with the very common misunderstanding that a powerful, capable airplane should be able to handle just about anything, and the trap was set.
I have done it myself.
On a very hot summer day, I accepted an intersection max gross weight T/O on 34L at Eugene (full tanks including 20-gallon tips) , 3 pax, baggage,. United traffic on final. Could I accept an immediate? You bet, and off we went to find some cooler air.
But it soon became painfully obvious I had made a series of mistakes. Strike one, taking on all that fuel for a max gross weight departure on a hot day (there was no fuel at our destination up in the San Juans). Strike two, an intersection takeoff left half of 34L behind us. Strike two-and-a-half, allowing myself to be rushed. I'd neglected to drop T/O flaps. We were just half a strike away from the same outcome as the Bonanza this video is about.
As we slowly gained speed, the yoke stayed heavy and it soon became very, very clear we were not going to be able to take off with comfortable margins of runway, much less runway left to stop if need be. I dropped flaps 1, the wheels grew light, skipped, and we were off for the San Juans.
I was fortunate to be able to learn from those mistakes. But never, ever again.
Great story!