Nanoweave affecting snipers: not really useful. Nanoweave affecting shotguns: eh, I think either way is fine. Nanoweave affecting MAX AI: probable what the suit slot should be for.
With 5 Levels, I think there should be 5 different types of damage it applies to (all would be Body Shot protection), so: Level 1: -20% Sniper Rounds Level 2: -20% Vehicle Guns (Basilisks, Kobalt, Walker, A2G Noseguns, ect.) Level 3: -15% Shotgun (good call Cami) Level 4: -15% Max AI (Good call Wagon) Level 5: -15% Knives I think that would go a long way to making Nanoweave a type of "cheese protection" for players who are particularly agrivated against these specific ways of dying. Limited in scope, yet effective at offering protection against these specific types of damage. It's just a though.
Also they should have adjusted nanoweave resistance against kobalt specifically and revert its nerf, there is really no reason to use kobalt over basilisk ESPECIALLY after sunderer m20 got buffed.
@@honorguard7616 That's a little harder to see in effect, but yes. I've been running ASC on my engineer for years now, and the buffs we've had in recent patches has just made that playstyle more lucrative.
I would say I love having the other suit slots trump nanoweave, it makes for more variety in load outs and general play. Off the top of my head I think your shotgun idea is good but I would like a little bit more broad utility from it. Never close to what it was, and how to achieve that I have no idea haha
What does it mean? It means you can actually look at the charts the game provides and they be accurate to the game experience. That was what always bothered me about nanoweave; the devs spent all this time meticulously balancing the time to kill of all these weapons, then provided a suit slot that throws all of them off. Now a weapon that kills in 7 shots inside 10 m will kill with 7 shots. What an idea. Though I always appreciate your expanded breakdowns Cami. Hope you have had some time to play through all the network issues.
adding shot guns to the nano weave list makes sense basicly anti on shot kill armor but, the shot guns are very fun and realistic in their current state I hope they remain that way for a while
i dont think shot guns need a nerf and hell i dont use them 70% of the time their range is already a good nerf its a right weapon for the fight atm hell yeah shotguns should rule close range like snipers and dmrs rule long range if you debuff shotguns lets get some buff to smg range. if you bring a dmr to close range or an assult rifle to close range you should be losing their mid range weapons the shot guns is close range only i think its fine where it sits
But how precisley nanoweave determines sniper bullet from carabine bullet??????? and how it is it can reduce dmg from much powerfoul sniper but not from carbine?
Personally I don't think that we outright need to change Nanoweave to be a shotgun counter. Because then everyone who's upset with how prevalent shotguns are just going to waste a suit slot on a very specific counter. The better solution would just be to change the falloff damage numbers on the shotguns themselves, so they're still effective in that 5m range, but outside of that it's like you're shooting tictacs at people. Granted, it's a lot of tictacs at once but still.
even if dev change the dmg fall off of shotgun, those kamikaze nightmare shotgun user still able jump right infront of ur face and make a honeycomb out of it. I think Nanoweave reduce dmg from shotgun would be a nice idea, also it should reduce dmg of vehicle heavy gun aswell. I mean that annoying Renegade Flasher.
The only drama I have with Nanoweave right now is that, if it is going to be kept in the game, it's scope is VERY narrow. I think it could be worthwhile adding AI MAX resistances to the bunch to increase the scope of coverage to make it a bit more interesting to run.
I saw a comment suggesting Nanoweave could be made to resist max damage and i kinda like the idea of that. Maxes have always dominated point holding especially when it comes to NC since their Max is made for close range it makes it extremely hard to take one out if they hold close range. Being able to survive one extra shot from a shotgun max or a few extra rounds from a VS or TR max i think would make it more consistent for infantry in specifically those CQC enviorments where maxs dominate. But then again, i may just be salty at the amount of times an NC max just one pumps me and i feel like i had zero counter play. But what theyve done to nanoweave now essentially removes it from the game. But oddly enough its not bad on Maxes now since itll help against the archer at max level. Anyone who has taken the time to read this nonsense let me know what you think. I wanna know if im dumb or not for this idea.
Personally I think shotguns are fine, although I do think flechette should be removed. Not because it's OP, I actually think it's almost perfectly balanced. But shotguns should be a tremendous risk/reward calculation. You don't let shotguns do good damage at 20m for the same reason you don't let bolts use a 1x or 2x scope. It's not impossible or unrealistic, but it makes them too good for too many situations.
@@mataznuiz oh no! Snipers are in my face and much easier to kill then the snipers on trees or in mountains or behind the whole enemy team. Whatever will we do?
@@Drakedrag74 Snipers at range are not a problem, its not a hitscan weapon so dont stand still and you are fine like 98% of the time. A CQC bolty is still not a hitscan weapon but with how PS2 base its hit detection on the client doing the shooting, you can often be dead before/just as you hear someone decloak because on their screen they decloaked and shot you "before" you reacted to the cloak sound playing on your client... and its much easier to hit something at close range than long range so even without hiding with cloak CQC bolties are still strong weapons. Throw in the advantage of corner peeking etc that also follows the same logic of delay between clients and you have fun interactions where you are dead before/just as you see someone even begin to step around a corner since again, on their screen they already peeked, aimed at your head and shot you before your client gets the information.
Honest shotguns I find harder to use then running something like the underboss or commissioner only. Pistols I find honestly better then most smgs and shotguns. Shotguns, pump action in general can be tricky. I find them a super tactical weapon in that you rely heavily on baiting and flanking and movement. Most pistols you can use like normal weapons and even dominate cqb with hip fire. On top of that all pistols can have insane reload with certain implants and the ammo pouch. This might sound off however I feel shotguns should have more pellets however a lower damage amount per pellet and larger spread. This would make them do better super super close however do awful in the 11m range you spoke about.
I'd say: make nanoweave the anti-cheese implant. You get reduction from shotguns and snipers, headshots included, allowing you to survive one sniper headshots.
I think the issue of making it resistente to 1 headshot, is that semi-auto snipers would probably suffer as well, and those already need two headshots, I can't imagine a third lol
Snipers should 1hko to the head, they just shouldn't be so easy for them to land said headshots. An easy way to fix cqc bolters is to not allow them to aim down sight while in stealth. Also put in bullet sway for strafing while shooting. Stop -> shoot -> move was commonplace in FPS games a decade ago and helped keep things more balanced
@@FusionshadowXJ the only reason its easy to hit headshots is that you stopped moving. otherwise, its skill built over time. its no different than the vets who can flick 180's and triple headshot you before you've broken their shield.
I saw where you were going with this before you arrived, and I agree. It is an even-handed and elegant solution to a minor problem, and addresses 2 issues at the same time. Starting with 15 and maybe modifying it to 20 if need be sounds like a good approach.
I'd say nanoweave affecting bodyshots of sniper rifles, shotguns, ai max weapons, heavy specific weapons (like the thumper and mcg) and vehicle weapons like the kobalt and bassies would be a healthy place for them
Honestly the Nano-weave nerf is a good point, and the sniper spam will get targeted by this more then naught (needs to also include AMRs and BRs, since now everyone can be a freakin sniper and camp). Considering how many laser beamed scoped weapons you fight you can render the 1 tap head-shot weapons to the same field and offer the chance of survival. 1) I fully believe shotguns are in a better place now (as far as standard ammunition, the rest is what makes it cancer), the shotguns had a limmit of 5 meters for a AT best 1 shot kill, now lets look at the list, you have handguns capable of 2-3 tapping you within 10 meters, ARs can delete you in 5 rounds and can hit you with that in the time it takes for you to get within that range, and SMGs out DPS you completely if you miss (also having practically no spread and recoil on some) 2) Shotguns require map knowledge and choke points to be effective, difference between this and what was done before (Aka: LMG, Heavy, Nano-weave armor) is that you have the ability to challenge this and do a lot of harm. Considering shotguns match range, you still have effective counters in CQB, and other factors such as team-play being at point, just cause a weapon is consistent doesn't make it broken if you look at its "Best used" to "Most used" scenarios. 3) Shotgun's should have magazine size shared with ammo types, not ammo types and magazine size, flachet + 10 round cap semi-autos are cancer, I use it myself and holding a corridor was blissfully easy when you can 2 tap at nearly double the range of a normal kill range. I can even make a Max freak out if I mag dump one within 10 meters, I can bring any max suit to near death with a single burst over the durration, most of the time this is within a trade of my personal being cause max suits delete me in 1 hit since they get a shotgun semi-auto that can shread vehicals as well as infantry. Opinion: Shotguns are fine, there ammo choices isnt. I'd argue that the shotgun should get slugs but lower the min damage against shields and reward it with multi headshot dmg, while for flachet they should receive a dirt nerf, 10 round cap needs to be 5, add in the ability to 10% dmg pen shields allowing them to preasure but not murder a force coming in (this increases viability against factions that shield stack harder then HP stack for a push). Fixes to choices people want to make useful 1) make nanoweave effect soldiers ability against max suits (hits -20% while shields active), would make shotguns more heavy orientated and require more support options to upkeep in defense 2) remove long ranged scopes from rifles (make it a recon specialty, the scopes shouldnt exeed 2x) as all thats happened is they buffed the fuck out of long ranged enguagements with BRs, AMRs (I've seen a 12 man squad sitting on a hill shooting the heat shell AMR at a spawn door just cause its easier then a freakin sniper and you can pick classes that heal and give endless ammo now), and I see a TON of people who just sit back and camp and its not a healthy game pace to just camp spawns for hours, it Will Kill player-base over time 3) Firepower choices need to be a thing, you can specialise or be a jack-of-all trades master of none, ARs merge the ground between a SMG and a Rifle, a shotgun fills the corner hold and sentry duty rolls holding tight chokes to make use of its ammo, smg for high mobility option between short and mid range ability, skilled weapons matter in the hands of the user no matter what. 4) skill is subjective, understand the situation and the risks it took to get to position and how long that player prob had to plan out the fight while he sat there getting to do nothing till then. (lots of shotgun players have to push from spawn, inside, threw a hail of gunfire to get to a door, just so they can push inside. this can be subjective but often isnt the case, so think of it this way, how many times did he die to get to that position before you say "No skill and isnt balanced" just so he/she could kill 3 to 4 people before getting grenade spammed off the map to repeat the action.
TTK in general is way too low now. Really? .5s is long enough to allow for reaction and getting in a better position? In reality the TTK is so low and the tickrate is so low that the other player has magdumped and killed you before it even registers on your screen. In 99% of cases the only deciding factor is who sees who first. This game shines with sustained firefights and lengthier more tactical engagements
Throw into account average player accuracy, and .5s TTK is slow by most standards in the FPS genre. The TTK of this game is right where it should barring a few exceptions.
@@CAMIKAZE78 It isn't. Most of the games you're citing as having a faster TTK only have a .3-.4s TTK. You will not notice a difference of 200ms on average because of the latency. I can tell you this right now: your Australian internet connection and the god-awful servers Daybreak uses have done far, far more to hamper your TTK than 200ms of *_theoretically possible_* TTK. Also? You can't really cite how so many veteran players are good at the headshot meta to the point where Nanoweave as it was was only negatively affecting less skilled/newer players... and then cite average player accuracy for TTK being "long" in PS2. I guarantee you that the veteran PS2 player has a better headshot hit ratio than your average Call of Duty veteran player. Thus, while in theory, Call of Duty might have on average 200ms faster TTKs... the actual TTK is not really all that different. Meaningfully, statistically speaking. You can't have your cake and eat it too.
Shotguns... I've actually come to love them recently after unlocking my Eclipse. The underbarrel shotgun is pretty good. I just love nailing those shots.
I notice more NC maxes using gorgons so nanoweave might be more useful there. But it's great that there is a choice in the slot now. Even ammo belt is pretty good with the reload speed improvement.
I assume Nanoweave 20% sniper fire mitigation + other sources of 20% small arms resist like Fortify = 40% sniper fire mitigation, right? Or they do not stack? Its now different resist types...
Sooo... you are saying that is a great moment to aurax my shotguns, right? ;) Got it! Jackhammers assemble! That said I REALLY REALLY like shotgun damage resistance idea for the nonweave. I would add small frag damage resistance (overall defense vs pellet "style" damage conceptually - like nonstacking 15-20%) so it has some use outside of the main thing and is not a total waste in all other scenarios. Sniper damage reduction is really really meh as you can't really predict when it will be of any real benefit, while with closed spaces you're bound to meet shotguns. Yeah you can meet bolters to, but bolters remain effective close and long range, while shotguns are not a threat in the open field so isntead of "maybe most of the time" type of selection you get a more situational and controllable "highly likely I'll get my face pelleted here" type of a deal.
Make it stop sniper headshots too. If it prevents me from being instantly terminated from a dot on the other side of the galaxy then that's worth a slot for me.
Thoughts on Flecettes + Smart Choke? Those both extend the range for sure. EDIT: The description on Flecettes is wrong. It removes 2 pellets from gen 1 shotguns, and 3 from gen 2. So it's much more of a tradeoff than you'd think.
Amazing scout rifle footage. Personally I more or less always gets cut off by a smarter-than-average LA that wants revenge. When it comes to Nanoweave & shotguns, I couldn't agree more. Thank you.
Now that I would like. Not sure it should be called nanoweave though. Impact armour instead. Has greater resistance against weapons that have extreme impact potential. Shotguns, sniper rifles, maybe even the revolvers? Just as a nice mild nerf to increase the possibility of faction pistols being used. 15% does sound acceptable too. However if we’re only going shotguns and snipers I recommend that the magscatter be excluded from them. It’s already a fairly weak weapon at the best of times, extra nerf will tank it’s usefulness.
i personally think not touching nano but changing shotgun damage drop off distance would be a better call for now nano has use in counter-sniping and while I admit it super circumstantial, most weapons / suitslot are themselves design to be circumstantial, so it goes in line with them (plus having low consistency in slow firing weapons feel terrible and your nanoweave change would add that)
I think nano weave is just pointless atm. The nerf was good thing but I kinda wanna my certs I spent on it back....if I die to a sniper at closer ranges where I have the ability to easily fight back it's usually a headshot and nano weave does nothing.
As Lex has said, the only change took place to the 1 cert cost upgrade, so it's not a huge loss in the grand scheme of things. IN saying that, it is pointless. It's good that it's not effecting the wider scope of the game now, but it could use some purpose in some areas if it is to stick around.
I binge watched your quartermaster overview. Would you consider bringing it back and covering the NSO and NS weapons? Keep up the awesome work. Getting back into PS2, last played around 2015 and it's awesome to see the game still kicking and how much has been added
Nobody talks about auto shotguns. How do people see them? Weak? Strong? I personally have found a lot of success with auto shotguns and ambusher jets, but would a pump be significantly better?
The shotgun dmg reduction sounds nice on paper, but I'd like it to go in a different direction, personally. I've always wondered if it could behave more like the crisis suit, where depending on what you did, it reacted. Off the top of my head, one possibility would be to have it give the damage reduction vs small arms ONLY FROM THE FRONT while ADS, at the cost of being more vulnerable to the sides and back. It would not be up all the time, and when it's up, you can flank them to counter it. Of course, there would have to be some sort of visual indicator so you can see who's using it. Would this be an interesting change? Definitely. Would it be good for the game? I have no idea. Any thoughts?
I think ps2 has a short time to kill compared to other games, and in the fight with so many people in ps2 you die so easy, you need te be a bit resistent.
I use the blackjack with smart choke and flechette and not a single time have i one shotted someone at 11m. There's so many factors at play on actual combat that those ranges are rather theoretical
Baby got killed a few too many times by shotguns huh? Look, if you dont want to deal with shotguns, and are currently using a LMG or AR, back up a few meters, the time it takes a shotgunner to close the distance to you, is the time it should take to kill them.
Implying every fight against a shotgun is head on and with ample warning before you get obliterated. We will all just pretend ambushers don’t exist, because even without them shotgunners can just insta kill you from behind or around a corner
2:22 - I'm sorry, but no. PS2 does not have a long TTK when most weapons are capable of killing in .5 seconds or less and with headshots being so much of the meta. You can keep repeating it, but it doesn't make it true. Especially when you get to the fact that veteran PS2 players have had it hammered into them - some for a decade - that headshots are the game and have gotten to the point where they are aimbots in human form now. Even when you take the community player skill out of the equation (and you shouldn't), and just look at games with absurdly low TTK numbers - like Call of Duty - it's not that different. Warzone has TTK averaging around a little under .4 seconds. Vanguard is apparently atrocious cancer (no surprise there) with some guns getting into .25 territory, but we also see Vanguard is about as popular as cancer with more people still playing Warzone and/or Cold War last I checked. Maybe correlation is actually causation there in some degree... Battlefield 2042 (another Vanguard like problem, there)? Not much different. With the majority of weapons being around .35 to .4. I'm sorry, but I don't think .2 seconds longer - on average - is a statically relevant "longer" time when I guarantee you the PS2 vet is going to be scoring more headshots more often than your average CoD "vet" or Battlefield vet (although there is crossover with BF and PS players and it would almost certainly be a lower gap compared to CoD players). *_Does Planetside 2 have a long time to kill compared to other multiplayer shooters? NO. Does it have a longER TTK? Yes, in theory, but barely._*
@@milsimprodigy "wrote an essay" - Two paragraphs isn't an essay. Although I'd see why you'd think that. "same conclusion cami does" - If by "same" you mean "complete opposite," then yes. "Seek help" - That's rich, "Milsimprodigy." Maybe spend less time screen grabbing comments just to post them and complain about them, yeah?
Shotgun damage dropoff needs to be steep, as in it should drop from 5m to 10m, not 8m to 18m as it currently is. 5m to 10m is still good enough for rounding corners, breaching chokepoints and brute-forcing MAXes from behind. 8m to 18m is what enables Light Assaults to pick you off from the roof of a low-rise building or from a balcony with a pump action.
Why? Shotguns are rarely picked compared to cqc carabine/SMG. Do that and the pick rate will be even lower. And just to point something out, I’ve been playing so much with the Serpent for example that I regularly engage target on a Pulsar C’s optimal range. On a carabine, your aim will impact the engagement range where you excelle (despite the dmg drop off) however the shotguns are limited by the spread (no pillet ammo equipped). So nerfing the max range of a shotgun will also nerf it’s medium range engagement making it more punishable (even more than it is right now). Shotgun should dominate CqC but there are still a lot of scenario where some carabine or hard hitting LMG have sometimes a higher TTK than some shotguns.
@@aquapendulum for the pump, yes but its the main goal of the pump action shotgun, isnt it ? It would be a dumb nerf just like the nerf on the power-knife. These weapons/Guns have the lowest pick rate because they are so situational and you want to nerf them ? As an external point of view, Id say you are frustrated to be killed by a random playing shotgun because he got you in his max range/optimal range and you cant accept that fact.
you know what's funny? the cqc bolt action rifles still 2 shot body shot infantry that have nanoweave at the ranges you'd engage someone with the cqc bolter (same deal with shot+knife), so it even fails in that sense now
I agree with the addition to reducing shotgun damage with Nanoweave however it will make NC makes unfairly weaker than other maxes. If I were to add additional traits to the Nanoweave I would add shotgun damage and max damage reduction to balance all factions evenly.
Personally, I would like to see AI MAX suit weaponry covered entirely within the scope of Nanoweave as well, but that mention escaped me in this video sadly.
@@Igor369 oh i didnt realize all the scout rifles and revolvers were automatic. i guess tank rounds and rocketpods counts as automatic infantry vs infantry too huh?
As someone who never used Nanoweave, I got used to shotguns turning me into swiss cheese a looooong time ago. That said, because I am terrible at the game, everything does..
To be honest i dont see the shotguns resistances be necesary in the game, it could better a heavy machine guns resistances or proyectal resistance a better option for deal with the AI weapons.
I disagree with nanoweave affecting shotguns. However, i think that smart choke should be removed from 1hk shotguns just to make them more unpredictable and take skill to use. I think nanoweave should be used for resistance against a2g and some ai hesh and maxes.
while the gen 2 pumps CAN theoretically ohko at 11m, it basically requires smartchoke and ADSing, which goes against the idea of shotguns (and SMGs really). they're supposed to be mobile, and dangerous in close quarters. and while that wouldn't be too much of an issue, SGs already got nerfed by removing the laser, so already their hipfire is kinda trash. if they reverted the SG changes, then I'd say go for it, no problem. even the 20% reduction. as it stands now though... i don't quite know. the pumps feel really bad IMO (at least, the blackjack/uppercut), but the autos are kinda good. i rarely mess with semi's so no comment on those. flechette rounds only really benefit certain SGs with higher pellet count, and otherwise cripple low pellet count SGs, but the range buff is pretty damn good (maybe nerf it to 1.5 or something) Anti-max as some have suggested would be pretty useful, but overall, I think anything that heavily affects primary weapon TTK is a no go in my book.
Realistically speaking, shotguns are dangerous to about 30m. One thing about the game is that its also not accounting for slugs Those things are even more brutal vs buckshot standard I still find nanoweave handy despite the reset to it.
@@CAMIKAZE78 Fair enough If it was based on real ballistics, most close range weapons would have a much more lethal range. Do you think nanoweave should have various effects based on classes? That way, it doesn't become a dead suit slot
Every time someone says word "consistency" i get triggered. And imagine after repeating that word multiple times suggesting change to nanoweave to make your "CoNsIsTeNt" weapon inconsistent once again. One shot at 6m or at 11m? Who knows? Does he wear nanoweave or not? Let's find out by clicking on this peasant! Consistency is just a bad excuse. I completely agree what nanoweave should been changed, because it was MUST USE tool and not just optional thing. This created pretty stale meta in suit slot department. However, i disagree with "it make game more consistent" statement. If everyone use Nanoweave, it's already consistent. You expect nanoweave every time and never gets surprised. And saying "it made them more CONSISTENT" about shotgun's enlarge of reach is just a bullshit. It's straight up buff what nobody asked for. "Yeah, let's just add flachette ammo and slap that smart choke on every shotgun in game, what can go wrong?" "Oh and don't forget to nerf slugs on pumps so they are no longer OHK at their miserable effective distance, with their pathetic projectile velocity, because you must actually put effort to use them and this is UNACCEPTABLE!!!!!!!!!111 No skill allowed. Fun ends here." This update is my biggest disapointment. Bad weapons still bad, good weapons still good. Meta didn't change at all. Butcher still shit, MSW-R and S tier LMG gets comp FOR NO FUCKING REASON. Blackmarket expansion apparently just one useless heavy weapon. Maybe they added 0.75ADS mult on Bull and Ursa? Nope! By the way, Nanoweave removal affects 167 and especially 200dmg model a lot more than 143, but there was no according changes to these weapons, they just got unequally stronger. Also, 20% dmg reduction to sniper rifles CHANGES NOTHING BTK wise. Why? How is that happen? Who came up with that number?
No, because not everyone used Nanoweave. It created an additional layer of damage models that applied to some players, and didn't to others. It allowed veterans who could farm headshots on newer players to further that skill gap. It generated a new headshot effective multiplier against certain targets. The very nature of Nanoweave, created an inconsistency that didn't need to exist. Also, no, those weapons didn't get stronger. They just got equalized. Higher damage profile weapons were more adversely effected by Nanoweave Armour, which actually made them weaker in the grand scheme of things (the numbers on this exist and don't lie). The playing field has been equalized. I agree, the sniper rifle bodyshot reduction is useless right now.
I think nanoweave armor should make any character I'm playing on my account take 50% less damage from all sources and give me 500% increases in cert gains. Any player not on my account has it equipped by default, only they take 50% more damage from me and every shot strips 5 certs and gives them to me
The Problem I have is. They should of just remove nano weave then. They nerfed it to bad, it is now no good for any situation. decrease body shot in Sniper rifles, is just to stupid. You most of the time would die from a head shot then a body shot, and unless you are already missing health, you would easily survive a single body hit anyways. Increase time to kill problem or no. Before, Nano Weave had something offer. sturdier at the costs of faster running, more grenades, explosive defense, more gun ammo, faster shield recharge, etc. While Nano Weave, might of been to strong, the nerf it got, and the fact players had to spend like 3000 certs to rank it 5. Is pretty insulting. they could of just lowered the value, and lower even more on certain weapons. But if they can't balance it right, then they should of just deleted it and refunded the certs. If they did that, I would be fine, and stay silence. C'mon let's be honest, their is absolutely NO advantages or use. In taking 20% less body hit damage from a Sniper Rifle. Especially if it's a bolt action, which would still kill you in 2 body shots.🙄
Who cares about balance. I care about fun, right now shotguns are fun to play against, the solution is easy and counterplay is not hard at all. Don't "balance" the game into an unfun situation where everything is just a variation of the same damn thing. Losing because something is so overpowered that there's no viable counterplay isn't fun, thats the only balance that should be taken into account.
I don't think shotguns are too much of an issue and them being strong in CQB makes sense. They SHOULD be the top tier choice for CQB fighting. However, if we did want to nerf their effective range, why not just do that on the weapon side of things than with nanoweave? I generally don't like having slots be something that counteracts one specific weapon class as that just screams, "this weapon is unbalanced, but I don't want to nerf it." That's weird design. If it has too much range, just dial back the range. Don't over-complicate things.
Using Nanoweave to bring Shotguns specifically into better balance just feels bad though, honestly. Couldn't the numbers on shotguns be modified to accomplish the same thing? Sure it would be more work but at least that leaves Nanoweave open to have a more useful or broader rework. Honestly I don't miss Nanoweave, currently what I miss is the Darklight Implant from PS1 lol Feels like 90% of my deaths lately are from all the infiltrators running around that my eyes just have trouble seeing.
I personally want the bullets to have higher velocities. I just can't get over those 500m/s nerf darts. I know it's for balance and making it easier for new players. Still can't get over it.
The gameplay is built around close fights, so increasing velocity would just mean everyone is shooting a laser now without ballistics. Planetside 2 would turn into Sniperside 2
Has there been a giant shotgun meta that's shifting the population to running shotguns the way Beatlejuice did for 8 years? As somebody that doesn't even use shotguns I have NOT witnessed a giant shift with a crazy amount of my deaths coming from shotguns. They are effective, but not broken. It's too soon to be pushing for them to be nerfed. Heavies have had essentially an AEK-971 for the better half of a decade. Let's talk shotgun nerfs when they have had more time to actually be an issue
What we really is is Nanoweave to reduce headshot damage from DMRs and Sniper rifles, as well as a 20% reduction from MAX anti-infantry weapons, and 20% from shotguns. What nanoweave SHOULD be, is an anti-cheese slot, that you equip if the enemy is using cheap and easy tactics. It should allow light assualts and heavies to directly engage in MAXes without being instantly eviscerated for it from max spamming enemies.
I the idea of nanoweave armor being effective in reducing the effective range of shotguns. If that could be applied to sniper rifles, AI max guns, and vehicle machine guns like the basilisk and the kobolt, I can see this being worth a glance or two.
Whys there so much hate for 1shooties u have to hit or ur fucked, autos tho highest dmg, dps n reload speed of all shooties and they get no hate what so ever
If Nanoweave is going to stay anti-sniper only, it needs to take one headshots kills off the table for all classes except infiltrators when equipped. Otherwise, I agree, it's pretty useless in it's current form.
You don't need to nerf the damage just change the spread at distance. Shotguns are ment to be powerful at close ranges. Change the spread and your problem is solved without doing all that math.
I’m never a fan of “fixing” an issue with an attachment, the issue being shotguns being too consistent. Ultimately it just makes the attachment necessary to have fun. Additionally, every other suit a lot gives a sort of passive benefit. If shotguns got properly balanced and weren’t run in a majority of fights then why would you run a suit slot that only occasionally benefits you when you could be saved more often by having more nades, more ammo, more run speed, or more shield recharge? I think it would be interesting if nanoweave were totally removed, but all other suit slots have a health penalty trade off (as if you needed lighter armor to make space for grenades, etc). Haven’t put much thought into this idea, but I think it would be interesting.
This doesn't exactly relate to the video however... Hello and I'm a returning player. Can anyone help me find an Aus discord/ORG that is active? Any help would be appreciated thank you
Nanoweave affecting snipers: not really useful.
Nanoweave affecting shotguns: eh, I think either way is fine.
Nanoweave affecting MAX AI: probable what the suit slot should be for.
True, what do you think about it mitigating vehicular munitions?
With 5 Levels, I think there should be 5 different types of damage it applies to (all would be Body Shot protection), so:
Level 1: -20% Sniper Rounds
Level 2: -20% Vehicle Guns (Basilisks, Kobalt, Walker, A2G Noseguns, ect.)
Level 3: -15% Shotgun (good call Cami)
Level 4: -15% Max AI (Good call Wagon)
Level 5: -15% Knives
I think that would go a long way to making Nanoweave a type of "cheese protection" for players who are particularly agrivated against these specific ways of dying. Limited in scope, yet effective at offering protection against these specific types of damage. It's just a though.
I like the anti-cheese idea. It would be a great pick for solo players.
Also they should have adjusted nanoweave resistance against kobalt specifically and revert its nerf, there is really no reason to use kobalt over basilisk ESPECIALLY after sunderer m20 got buffed.
Couldn't agree more mate, it's something I think I should have addressed in the video.
With nanoweave changed, I see all the heavy assaults running maxed out flak armor now.
c4 was a mistake
@@Kitty_kisses97 Why do you say that?
and asc
@@honorguard7616 That's a little harder to see in effect, but yes. I've been running ASC on my engineer for years now, and the buffs we've had in recent patches has just made that playstyle more lucrative.
I would say I love having the other suit slots trump nanoweave, it makes for more variety in load outs and general play. Off the top of my head I think your shotgun idea is good but I would like a little bit more broad utility from it. Never close to what it was, and how to achieve that I have no idea haha
What does it mean? It means you can actually look at the charts the game provides and they be accurate to the game experience. That was what always bothered me about nanoweave; the devs spent all this time meticulously balancing the time to kill of all these weapons, then provided a suit slot that throws all of them off. Now a weapon that kills in 7 shots inside 10 m will kill with 7 shots. What an idea.
Though I always appreciate your expanded breakdowns Cami. Hope you have had some time to play through all the network issues.
"Now a weapon that kills in 7 shots inside 10 m will kill with 7 shots. What an idea."
Haha, carapace medic on triple source hp regen goes brrr.
Thanks mate, appreciate it. It's been a great adjustment to the game in my eyes.
adding shot guns to the nano weave list makes sense basicly anti on shot kill armor but, the shot guns are very fun and realistic in their current state I hope they remain that way for a while
that will have too much impact to pump action shotgun.
Thanks! I share most of your vids in our discord, kudos.
i dont think shot guns need a nerf and hell i dont use them 70% of the time their range is already a good nerf its a right weapon for the fight atm hell yeah shotguns should rule close range like snipers and dmrs rule long range if you debuff shotguns lets get some buff to smg range. if you bring a dmr to close range or an assult rifle to close range you should be losing their mid range weapons the shot guns is close range only i think its fine where it sits
You would be correct if 90% of capture points weren’t in buildings or CQC environments
But how precisley nanoweave determines sniper bullet from carabine bullet??????? and how it is it can reduce dmg from much powerfoul sniper but not from carbine?
so early it isnt even HD yet :P
Im just kind of excited that i can justify running other suit slots now, like Adrenaline Pump and Advanced Shield Capacitor.
Agreed my friend.
Cami: "Damage reduction to shotguns."
Me: *looks at NC Maxes
Also me: "I'll have three please."
Nc max which shoots confetti if you are further than two meters away from it
@@sansgaster4877 You might have a point if 90% of this game wasn't doorway camping.
@@caseyb1346 Good thing C4 exists then
WE NEED PLANETSIDE 2 CLASSIC. Just to remember the old balance
Personally I don't think that we outright need to change Nanoweave to be a shotgun counter. Because then everyone who's upset with how prevalent shotguns are just going to waste a suit slot on a very specific counter. The better solution would just be to change the falloff damage numbers on the shotguns themselves, so they're still effective in that 5m range, but outside of that it's like you're shooting tictacs at people. Granted, it's a lot of tictacs at once but still.
even if dev change the dmg fall off of shotgun, those kamikaze nightmare shotgun user still able jump right infront of ur face and make a honeycomb out of it. I think Nanoweave reduce dmg from shotgun would be a nice idea, also it should reduce dmg of vehicle heavy gun aswell. I mean that annoying Renegade Flasher.
The only drama I have with Nanoweave right now is that, if it is going to be kept in the game, it's scope is VERY narrow. I think it could be worthwhile adding AI MAX resistances to the bunch to increase the scope of coverage to make it a bit more interesting to run.
something to counter Skill Suit directly would be a great, but that gonna make TR Max even less effective compare to another faction.
I like how he doesn’t just piss all over the update, but provides a solution
Criticism is an important thing to offer, when there's solutions provided. It's something I learned a lot over the years. Cheers mate.
I saw a comment suggesting Nanoweave could be made to resist max damage and i kinda like the idea of that. Maxes have always dominated point holding especially when it comes to NC since their Max is made for close range it makes it extremely hard to take one out if they hold close range. Being able to survive one extra shot from a shotgun max or a few extra rounds from a VS or TR max i think would make it more consistent for infantry in specifically those CQC enviorments where maxs dominate. But then again, i may just be salty at the amount of times an NC max just one pumps me and i feel like i had zero counter play. But what theyve done to nanoweave now essentially removes it from the game. But oddly enough its not bad on Maxes now since itll help against the archer at max level. Anyone who has taken the time to read this nonsense let me know what you think. I wanna know if im dumb or not for this idea.
MAXes have their own suit slots, basically their own versions of old nanoweave and flak IIRC, as well as nanite auto repair.
Personally I think shotguns are fine, although I do think flechette should be removed. Not because it's OP, I actually think it's almost perfectly balanced. But shotguns should be a tremendous risk/reward calculation. You don't let shotguns do good damage at 20m for the same reason you don't let bolts use a 1x or 2x scope. It's not impossible or unrealistic, but it makes them too good for too many situations.
"for the same reason you don't let bolts use a 1x or 2x scope"
Excuse me? Shortbow, Ghost, Tsar and the NC bolt can equip those scopes
@@missk1697 yea and thats partly why ppl hate cqc bolters
@@mataznuiz oh no! Snipers are in my face and much easier to kill then the snipers on trees or in mountains or behind the whole enemy team. Whatever will we do?
@@Drakedrag74 Snipers at range are not a problem, its not a hitscan weapon so dont stand still and you are fine like 98% of the time. A CQC bolty is still not a hitscan weapon but with how PS2 base its hit detection on the client doing the shooting, you can often be dead before/just as you hear someone decloak because on their screen they decloaked and shot you "before" you reacted to the cloak sound playing on your client... and its much easier to hit something at close range than long range so even without hiding with cloak CQC bolties are still strong weapons.
Throw in the advantage of corner peeking etc that also follows the same logic of delay between clients and you have fun interactions where you are dead before/just as you see someone even begin to step around a corner since again, on their screen they already peeked, aimed at your head and shot you before your client gets the information.
Honest shotguns I find harder to use then running something like the underboss or commissioner only. Pistols I find honestly better then most smgs and shotguns. Shotguns, pump action in general can be tricky. I find them a super tactical weapon in that you rely heavily on baiting and flanking and movement. Most pistols you can use like normal weapons and even dominate cqb with hip fire. On top of that all pistols can have insane reload with certain implants and the ammo pouch.
This might sound off however I feel shotguns should have more pellets however a lower damage amount per pellet and larger spread. This would make them do better super super close however do awful in the 11m range you spoke about.
If you can aim semi-competently, pistols are one of the strongest weapons class in the game.
I'd say: make nanoweave the anti-cheese implant. You get reduction from shotguns and snipers, headshots included, allowing you to survive one sniper headshots.
I think the issue of making it resistente to 1 headshot, is that semi-auto snipers would probably suffer as well, and those already need two headshots, I can't imagine a third lol
Snipers should 1hko to the head, they just shouldn't be so easy for them to land said headshots. An easy way to fix cqc bolters is to not allow them to aim down sight while in stealth. Also put in bullet sway for strafing while shooting. Stop -> shoot -> move was commonplace in FPS games a decade ago and helped keep things more balanced
That would make it even more meta than ever before.
@@FusionshadowXJ the only reason its easy to hit headshots is that you stopped moving. otherwise, its skill built over time. its no different than the vets who can flick 180's and triple headshot you before you've broken their shield.
I saw where you were going with this before you arrived, and I agree. It is an even-handed and elegant solution to a minor problem, and addresses 2 issues at the same time. Starting with 15 and maybe modifying it to 20 if need be sounds like a good approach.
Appreciate it mate. Glad you like the proposals.
I'd say nanoweave affecting bodyshots of sniper rifles, shotguns, ai max weapons, heavy specific weapons (like the thumper and mcg) and vehicle weapons like the kobalt and bassies would be a healthy place for them
When are you going to review the spark-33 stomper?
Honestly the Nano-weave nerf is a good point, and the sniper spam will get targeted by this more then naught (needs to also include AMRs and BRs, since now everyone can be a freakin sniper and camp). Considering how many laser beamed scoped weapons you fight you can render the 1 tap head-shot weapons to the same field and offer the chance of survival.
1) I fully believe shotguns are in a better place now (as far as standard ammunition, the rest is what makes it cancer), the shotguns had a limmit of 5 meters for a AT best 1 shot kill, now lets look at the list, you have handguns capable of 2-3 tapping you within 10 meters, ARs can delete you in 5 rounds and can hit you with that in the time it takes for you to get within that range, and SMGs out DPS you completely if you miss (also having practically no spread and recoil on some)
2) Shotguns require map knowledge and choke points to be effective, difference between this and what was done before (Aka: LMG, Heavy, Nano-weave armor) is that you have the ability to challenge this and do a lot of harm. Considering shotguns match range, you still have effective counters in CQB, and other factors such as team-play being at point, just cause a weapon is consistent doesn't make it broken if you look at its "Best used" to "Most used" scenarios.
3) Shotgun's should have magazine size shared with ammo types, not ammo types and magazine size, flachet + 10 round cap semi-autos are cancer, I use it myself and holding a corridor was blissfully easy when you can 2 tap at nearly double the range of a normal kill range. I can even make a Max freak out if I mag dump one within 10 meters, I can bring any max suit to near death with a single burst over the durration, most of the time this is within a trade of my personal being cause max suits delete me in 1 hit since they get a shotgun semi-auto that can shread vehicals as well as infantry.
Opinion: Shotguns are fine, there ammo choices isnt. I'd argue that the shotgun should get slugs but lower the min damage against shields and reward it with multi headshot dmg, while for flachet they should receive a dirt nerf, 10 round cap needs to be 5, add in the ability to 10% dmg pen shields allowing them to preasure but not murder a force coming in (this increases viability against factions that shield stack harder then HP stack for a push).
Fixes to choices people want to make useful
1) make nanoweave effect soldiers ability against max suits (hits -20% while shields active), would make shotguns more heavy orientated and require more support options to upkeep in defense
2) remove long ranged scopes from rifles (make it a recon specialty, the scopes shouldnt exeed 2x) as all thats happened is they buffed the fuck out of long ranged enguagements with BRs, AMRs (I've seen a 12 man squad sitting on a hill shooting the heat shell AMR at a spawn door just cause its easier then a freakin sniper and you can pick classes that heal and give endless ammo now), and I see a TON of people who just sit back and camp and its not a healthy game pace to just camp spawns for hours, it Will Kill player-base over time
3) Firepower choices need to be a thing, you can specialise or be a jack-of-all trades master of none, ARs merge the ground between a SMG and a Rifle, a shotgun fills the corner hold and sentry duty rolls holding tight chokes to make use of its ammo, smg for high mobility option between short and mid range ability, skilled weapons matter in the hands of the user no matter what.
4) skill is subjective, understand the situation and the risks it took to get to position and how long that player prob had to plan out the fight while he sat there getting to do nothing till then. (lots of shotgun players have to push from spawn, inside, threw a hail of gunfire to get to a door, just so they can push inside. this can be subjective but often isnt the case, so think of it this way, how many times did he die to get to that position before you say "No skill and isnt balanced" just so he/she could kill 3 to 4 people before getting grenade spammed off the map to repeat the action.
TTK in general is way too low now. Really? .5s is long enough to allow for reaction and getting in a better position? In reality the TTK is so low and the tickrate is so low that the other player has magdumped and killed you before it even registers on your screen. In 99% of cases the only deciding factor is who sees who first. This game shines with sustained firefights and lengthier more tactical engagements
Throw into account average player accuracy, and .5s TTK is slow by most standards in the FPS genre. The TTK of this game is right where it should barring a few exceptions.
@@CAMIKAZE78
It isn't. Most of the games you're citing as having a faster TTK only have a .3-.4s TTK. You will not notice a difference of 200ms on average because of the latency. I can tell you this right now: your Australian internet connection and the god-awful servers Daybreak uses have done far, far more to hamper your TTK than 200ms of *_theoretically possible_* TTK. Also? You can't really cite how so many veteran players are good at the headshot meta to the point where Nanoweave as it was was only negatively affecting less skilled/newer players... and then cite average player accuracy for TTK being "long" in PS2. I guarantee you that the veteran PS2 player has a better headshot hit ratio than your average Call of Duty veteran player. Thus, while in theory, Call of Duty might have on average 200ms faster TTKs... the actual TTK is not really all that different. Meaningfully, statistically speaking. You can't have your cake and eat it too.
Shotguns... I've actually come to love them recently after unlocking my Eclipse. The underbarrel shotgun is pretty good. I just love nailing those shots.
Hi! i have a question. 2 years ago you recorded a film, i mean "Light Assault Guide". is it still working and can i use the same set up now?
Completely agree with you
As simple as that
I notice more NC maxes using gorgons so nanoweave might be more useful there.
But it's great that there is a choice in the slot now. Even ammo belt is pretty good with the reload speed improvement.
I assume Nanoweave 20% sniper fire mitigation + other sources of 20% small arms resist like Fortify = 40% sniper fire mitigation, right?
Or they do not stack? Its now different resist types...
Sooo... you are saying that is a great moment to aurax my shotguns, right? ;) Got it! Jackhammers assemble!
That said I REALLY REALLY like shotgun damage resistance idea for the nonweave. I would add small frag damage resistance (overall defense vs pellet "style" damage conceptually - like nonstacking 15-20%) so it has some use outside of the main thing and is not a total waste in all other scenarios. Sniper damage reduction is really really meh as you can't really predict when it will be of any real benefit, while with closed spaces you're bound to meet shotguns. Yeah you can meet bolters to, but bolters remain effective close and long range, while shotguns are not a threat in the open field so isntead of "maybe most of the time" type of selection you get a more situational and controllable "highly likely I'll get my face pelleted here" type of a deal.
Make it stop sniper headshots too. If it prevents me from being instantly terminated from a dot on the other side of the galaxy then that's worth a slot for me.
Having a different suit slot for my Heavy Assault will be weird, not too sure which one I'd use
I wonder why you use Bishop on Infil instead of Impetus?
Agreed, ttk of auto weapons are to long to justify 1 hit ko shotguns from 10 meters
What about under-barrel shotguns?
What is your thoughts on NSO Defector?
Thoughts on Flecettes + Smart Choke? Those both extend the range for sure.
EDIT: The description on Flecettes is wrong. It removes 2 pellets from gen 1 shotguns, and 3 from gen 2. So it's much more of a tradeoff than you'd think.
I like it the way it is but I cant aim and mostly use the archer.
Amazing scout rifle footage. Personally I more or less always gets cut off by a smarter-than-average LA that wants revenge. When it comes to Nanoweave & shotguns, I couldn't agree more. Thank you.
I can sympathize, I Main LA typically with a blackhand for "countersniping" and can get a little zealous when I see an infiltrator being ignored
Could someone list what are the Gen 1 and Gen 2 shotguns are? i don't know how to lnow that
Now that I would like. Not sure it should be called nanoweave though. Impact armour instead. Has greater resistance against weapons that have extreme impact potential. Shotguns, sniper rifles, maybe even the revolvers? Just as a nice mild nerf to increase the possibility of faction pistols being used. 15% does sound acceptable too.
However if we’re only going shotguns and snipers I recommend that the magscatter be excluded from them. It’s already a fairly weak weapon at the best of times, extra nerf will tank it’s usefulness.
Definitely would like to see MAX AI weapons added to the list myself as well.
i personally think not touching nano but changing shotgun damage drop off distance would be a better call
for now nano has use in counter-sniping and while I admit it super circumstantial, most weapons / suitslot are themselves design to be circumstantial, so it goes in line with them (plus having low consistency in slow firing weapons feel terrible and your nanoweave change would add that)
I think nano weave is just pointless atm. The nerf was good thing but I kinda wanna my certs I spent on it back....if I die to a sniper at closer ranges where I have the ability to easily fight back it's usually a headshot and nano weave does nothing.
You want that 1 cert back, dude? Level 1, which used to cost 1 cert was the only rank of NWA that actually mattered. Are you okay?
As Lex has said, the only change took place to the 1 cert cost upgrade, so it's not a huge loss in the grand scheme of things. IN saying that, it is pointless. It's good that it's not effecting the wider scope of the game now, but it could use some purpose in some areas if it is to stick around.
What shotgun are you using here? I cant get my cone that tight for love or money.
I agree the infantry combat has been a lot better, and smoother flowing fights. Aside from the ping issues.
what are your game setting? your game looks so much better than mine and I have pretty much all on high aside shadows and flora o.O
I binge watched your quartermaster overview. Would you consider bringing it back and covering the NSO and NS weapons? Keep up the awesome work. Getting back into PS2, last played around 2015 and it's awesome to see the game still kicking and how much has been added
Wait why are you not getting insta triple headshotted?!, why do you have 3 sec to react to someone shooting you?
Nobody talks about auto shotguns. How do people see them? Weak? Strong?
I personally have found a lot of success with auto shotguns and ambusher jets, but would a pump be significantly better?
The shotgun dmg reduction sounds nice on paper, but I'd like it to go in a different direction, personally. I've always wondered if it could behave more like the crisis suit, where depending on what you did, it reacted. Off the top of my head, one possibility would be to have it give the damage reduction vs small arms ONLY FROM THE FRONT while ADS, at the cost of being more vulnerable to the sides and back. It would not be up all the time, and when it's up, you can flank them to counter it. Of course, there would have to be some sort of visual indicator so you can see who's using it. Would this be an interesting change? Definitely. Would it be good for the game? I have no idea. Any thoughts?
I think ps2 has a short time to kill compared to other games, and in the fight with so many people in ps2 you die so easy, you need te be a bit resistent.
I use the blackjack with smart choke and flechette and not a single time have i one shotted someone at 11m. There's so many factors at play on actual combat that those ranges are rather theoretical
Baby got killed a few too many times by shotguns huh? Look, if you dont want to deal with shotguns, and are currently using a LMG or AR, back up a few meters, the time it takes a shotgunner to close the distance to you, is the time it should take to kill them.
Implying every fight against a shotgun is head on and with ample warning before you get obliterated. We will all just pretend ambushers don’t exist, because even without them shotgunners can just insta kill you from behind or around a corner
What about AI MAX weapons?
Me sitting here watching this amazing gameplay and at the same time I'm hurting inside cause I'm like send them NC insects back to the spawn tomb
I loved symbiote with ads and assimilate
2:22 - I'm sorry, but no. PS2 does not have a long TTK when most weapons are capable of killing in .5 seconds or less and with headshots being so much of the meta. You can keep repeating it, but it doesn't make it true. Especially when you get to the fact that veteran PS2 players have had it hammered into them - some for a decade - that headshots are the game and have gotten to the point where they are aimbots in human form now. Even when you take the community player skill out of the equation (and you shouldn't), and just look at games with absurdly low TTK numbers - like Call of Duty - it's not that different. Warzone has TTK averaging around a little under .4 seconds. Vanguard is apparently atrocious cancer (no surprise there) with some guns getting into .25 territory, but we also see Vanguard is about as popular as cancer with more people still playing Warzone and/or Cold War last I checked. Maybe correlation is actually causation there in some degree... Battlefield 2042 (another Vanguard like problem, there)? Not much different. With the majority of weapons being around .35 to .4.
I'm sorry, but I don't think .2 seconds longer - on average - is a statically relevant "longer" time when I guarantee you the PS2 vet is going to be scoring more headshots more often than your average CoD "vet" or Battlefield vet (although there is crossover with BF and PS players and it would almost certainly be a lower gap compared to CoD players).
*_Does Planetside 2 have a long time to kill compared to other multiplayer shooters? NO. Does it have a longER TTK? Yes, in theory, but barely._*
You wrote an essay to argue about 200ms and to come to the same conclusion cami does in the video. Seek help.
@@milsimprodigy
"wrote an essay" - Two paragraphs isn't an essay. Although I'd see why you'd think that.
"same conclusion cami does" - If by "same" you mean "complete opposite," then yes.
"Seek help" - That's rich, "Milsimprodigy." Maybe spend less time screen grabbing comments just to post them and complain about them, yeah?
@@matchesburn cope
@@milsimprodigy
rope
Shotgun damage dropoff needs to be steep, as in it should drop from 5m to 10m, not 8m to 18m as it currently is. 5m to 10m is still good enough for rounding corners, breaching chokepoints and brute-forcing MAXes from behind. 8m to 18m is what enables Light Assaults to pick you off from the roof of a low-rise building or from a balcony with a pump action.
Why? Shotguns are rarely picked compared to cqc carabine/SMG. Do that and the pick rate will be even lower.
And just to point something out, I’ve been playing so much with the Serpent for example that I regularly engage target on a Pulsar C’s optimal range. On a carabine, your aim will impact the engagement range where you excelle (despite the dmg drop off) however the shotguns are limited by the spread (no pillet ammo equipped).
So nerfing the max range of a shotgun will also nerf it’s medium range engagement making it more punishable (even more than it is right now).
Shotgun should dominate CqC but there are still a lot of scenario where some carabine or hard hitting LMG have sometimes a higher TTK than some shotguns.
@@GeoBGO 4 words: 1-hit-kill potential.
@@aquapendulum for the pump, yes but its the main goal of the pump action shotgun, isnt it ?
It would be a dumb nerf just like the nerf on the power-knife. These weapons/Guns have the lowest pick rate because they are so situational and you want to nerf them ?
As an external point of view, Id say you are frustrated to be killed by a random playing shotgun because he got you in his max range/optimal range and you cant accept that fact.
Sentinel's Stamp of a Approval. ~StSalter
From the games I played before planetside and hearing the time to kill is long confuses me so much
I was a team fortress 2 player
you know what's funny? the cqc bolt action rifles still 2 shot body shot infantry that have nanoweave at the ranges you'd engage someone with the cqc bolter (same deal with shot+knife), so it even fails in that sense now
i think the debuff to shottys is a good idea, it would definitely mean using a shotty would need some required accuracy which is needed.
I agree with the addition to reducing shotgun damage with Nanoweave however it will make NC makes unfairly weaker than other maxes. If I were to add additional traits to the Nanoweave I would add shotgun damage and max damage reduction to balance all factions evenly.
Personally, I would like to see AI MAX suit weaponry covered entirely within the scope of Nanoweave as well, but that mention escaped me in this video sadly.
yes, make nanoweave the anti-cheese option, but dont forget to give reduction against all anti-infantry max weapons too.
Ah yes "if it is not an automatic infantry vs infantry weapon it is cheese" logic...........
@@Igor369 oh i didnt realize all the scout rifles and revolvers were automatic. i guess tank rounds and rocketpods counts as automatic infantry vs infantry too huh?
@@Harmsxway i did not know tank shooting at infantry is infantry vs infantry.
@@Igor369 according to your logic if it not resisted by nanoweave than its an automatic infantry vs infantry weapon.
You have a point with shotguns, but i still like the change of nanowave.
If only they didn't also nerf the frelling server with the armory update.
What handgun is he using!? It’s beautiful looks like spare rations from Destiny 2 lol
As someone who never used Nanoweave, I got used to shotguns turning me into swiss cheese a looooong time ago. That said, because I am terrible at the game, everything does..
To be honest i dont see the shotguns resistances be necesary in the game, it could better a heavy machine guns resistances or proyectal resistance a better option for deal with the AI weapons.
I disagree with nanoweave affecting shotguns. However, i think that smart choke should be removed from 1hk shotguns just to make them more unpredictable and take skill to use. I think nanoweave should be used for resistance against a2g and some ai hesh and maxes.
A gun not being predictable isn't skill that's literally just RNG.
nano-flak merge?
Broke: Nanoweave armor reworked
Woke: Connery server latency reworked
Bespoke: not breaking the server in the first place.
@@violenceandpoetry Naaaaah, expecting the game to actually work is too much of a demand, dont be toxic to the devs XD
while the gen 2 pumps CAN theoretically ohko at 11m, it basically requires smartchoke and ADSing, which goes against the idea of shotguns (and SMGs really). they're supposed to be mobile, and dangerous in close quarters. and while that wouldn't be too much of an issue, SGs already got nerfed by removing the laser, so already their hipfire is kinda trash.
if they reverted the SG changes, then I'd say go for it, no problem. even the 20% reduction.
as it stands now though... i don't quite know.
the pumps feel really bad IMO (at least, the blackjack/uppercut), but the autos are kinda good. i rarely mess with semi's so no comment on those.
flechette rounds only really benefit certain SGs with higher pellet count, and otherwise cripple low pellet count SGs, but the range buff is pretty damn good (maybe nerf it to 1.5 or something)
Anti-max as some have suggested would be pretty useful, but overall, I think anything that heavily affects primary weapon TTK is a no go in my book.
Nanoweave still protects against small arms on nso only on ps5
Realistically speaking, shotguns are dangerous to about 30m.
One thing about the game is that its also not accounting for slugs
Those things are even more brutal vs buckshot standard
I still find nanoweave handy despite the reset to it.
The way I see it, the game should not be balanced around "realism" if it effects the actual enjoyment of the game.
@@CAMIKAZE78 Fair enough
If it was based on real ballistics, most close range weapons would have a much more lethal range.
Do you think nanoweave should have various effects based on classes?
That way, it doesn't become a dead suit slot
Every time someone says word "consistency" i get triggered.
And imagine after repeating that word multiple times suggesting change to nanoweave to make your "CoNsIsTeNt" weapon inconsistent once again. One shot at 6m or at 11m? Who knows? Does he wear nanoweave or not? Let's find out by clicking on this peasant!
Consistency is just a bad excuse. I completely agree what nanoweave should been changed, because it was MUST USE tool and not just optional thing. This created pretty stale meta in suit slot department. However, i disagree with "it make game more consistent" statement. If everyone use Nanoweave, it's already consistent. You expect nanoweave every time and never gets surprised.
And saying "it made them more CONSISTENT" about shotgun's enlarge of reach is just a bullshit. It's straight up buff what nobody asked for. "Yeah, let's just add flachette ammo and slap that smart choke on every shotgun in game, what can go wrong?" "Oh and don't forget to nerf slugs on pumps so they are no longer OHK at their miserable effective distance, with their pathetic projectile velocity, because you must actually put effort to use them and this is UNACCEPTABLE!!!!!!!!!111 No skill allowed. Fun ends here."
This update is my biggest disapointment. Bad weapons still bad, good weapons still good. Meta didn't change at all. Butcher still shit, MSW-R and S tier LMG gets comp FOR NO FUCKING REASON. Blackmarket expansion apparently just one useless heavy weapon. Maybe they added 0.75ADS mult on Bull and Ursa? Nope! By the way, Nanoweave removal affects 167 and especially 200dmg model a lot more than 143, but there was no according changes to these weapons, they just got unequally stronger. Also, 20% dmg reduction to sniper rifles CHANGES NOTHING BTK wise. Why? How is that happen? Who came up with that number?
Archer.
No, because not everyone used Nanoweave. It created an additional layer of damage models that applied to some players, and didn't to others. It allowed veterans who could farm headshots on newer players to further that skill gap. It generated a new headshot effective multiplier against certain targets. The very nature of Nanoweave, created an inconsistency that didn't need to exist.
Also, no, those weapons didn't get stronger. They just got equalized. Higher damage profile weapons were more adversely effected by Nanoweave Armour, which actually made them weaker in the grand scheme of things (the numbers on this exist and don't lie). The playing field has been equalized. I agree, the sniper rifle bodyshot reduction is useless right now.
I think nanoweave armor should make any character I'm playing on my account take 50% less damage from all sources and give me 500% increases in cert gains. Any player not on my account has it equipped by default, only they take 50% more damage from me and every shot strips 5 certs and gives them to me
The Problem I have is. They should of just remove nano weave then. They nerfed it to bad, it is now no good for any situation. decrease body shot in Sniper rifles, is just to stupid. You most of the time would die from a head shot then a body shot, and unless you are already missing health, you would easily survive a single body hit anyways.
Increase time to kill problem or no. Before, Nano Weave had something offer. sturdier at the costs of faster running, more grenades, explosive defense, more gun ammo, faster shield recharge, etc.
While Nano Weave, might of been to strong, the nerf it got, and the fact players had to spend like 3000 certs to rank it 5. Is pretty insulting. they could of just lowered the value, and lower even more on certain weapons.
But if they can't balance it right, then they should of just deleted it and refunded the certs. If they did that, I would be fine, and stay silence.
C'mon let's be honest, their is absolutely NO advantages or use. In taking 20% less body hit damage from a Sniper Rifle. Especially if it's a bolt action, which would still kill you in 2 body shots.🙄
They should bring nanoweave back i dont care what others think , its needed
Who cares about balance. I care about fun, right now shotguns are fun to play against, the solution is easy and counterplay is not hard at all. Don't "balance" the game into an unfun situation where everything is just a variation of the same damn thing. Losing because something is so overpowered that there's no viable counterplay isn't fun, thats the only balance that should be taken into account.
I don't think shotguns are too much of an issue and them being strong in CQB makes sense. They SHOULD be the top tier choice for CQB fighting. However, if we did want to nerf their effective range, why not just do that on the weapon side of things than with nanoweave? I generally don't like having slots be something that counteracts one specific weapon class as that just screams, "this weapon is unbalanced, but I don't want to nerf it." That's weird design. If it has too much range, just dial back the range. Don't over-complicate things.
Using Nanoweave to bring Shotguns specifically into better balance just feels bad though, honestly. Couldn't the numbers on shotguns be modified to accomplish the same thing? Sure it would be more work but at least that leaves Nanoweave open to have a more useful or broader rework. Honestly I don't miss Nanoweave, currently what I miss is the Darklight Implant from PS1 lol Feels like 90% of my deaths lately are from all the infiltrators running around that my eyes just have trouble seeing.
Infiltrators once again are winners in every update.
Removing damage reduction from nanowave, gives even less time to react against SMG infiltrator.
A comment to feed engagement to our overlord, the almighty algorithm!
I'm more curious what the new lore is behind this change lol.
Honestly, Game feels good and im happy if we leave things as they are
I personally want the bullets to have higher velocities. I just can't get over those 500m/s nerf darts. I know it's for balance and making it easier for new players. Still can't get over it.
The gameplay is built around close fights, so increasing velocity would just mean everyone is shooting a laser now without ballistics.
Planetside 2 would turn into Sniperside 2
Whenever a sniper hits me they headshotted me and kill me in 1 shot so it's really not useful
Ask any deer hunter, Shotguns are shockingly accurate at longer ranges than most people think.
Has there been a giant shotgun meta that's shifting the population to running shotguns the way Beatlejuice did for 8 years? As somebody that doesn't even use shotguns I have NOT witnessed a giant shift with a crazy amount of my deaths coming from shotguns. They are effective, but not broken. It's too soon to be pushing for them to be nerfed. Heavies have had essentially an AEK-971 for the better half of a decade. Let's talk shotgun nerfs when they have had more time to actually be an issue
What we really is is Nanoweave to reduce headshot damage from DMRs and Sniper rifles, as well as a 20% reduction from MAX anti-infantry weapons, and 20% from shotguns. What nanoweave SHOULD be, is an anti-cheese slot, that you equip if the enemy is using cheap and easy tactics. It should allow light assualts and heavies to directly engage in MAXes without being instantly eviscerated for it from max spamming enemies.
I the idea of nanoweave armor being effective in reducing the effective range of shotguns. If that could be applied to sniper rifles, AI max guns, and vehicle machine guns like the basilisk and the kobolt, I can see this being worth a glance or two.
Whys there so much hate for 1shooties u have to hit or ur fucked, autos tho highest dmg, dps n reload speed of all shooties and they get no hate what so ever
If Nanoweave is going to stay anti-sniper only, it needs to take one headshots kills off the table for all classes except infiltrators when equipped. Otherwise, I agree, it's pretty useless in it's current form.
Since I first heard you mention the shotgun nanoweave I completely agreed. Thanks for making a video essay on it.
I kinda wish the sniper resist was higher ,feels kinda useless
You don't need to nerf the damage just change the spread at distance. Shotguns are ment to be powerful at close ranges. Change the spread and your problem is solved without doing all that math.
I’m never a fan of “fixing” an issue with an attachment, the issue being shotguns being too consistent. Ultimately it just makes the attachment necessary to have fun.
Additionally, every other suit a lot gives a sort of passive benefit. If shotguns got properly balanced and weren’t run in a majority of fights then why would you run a suit slot that only occasionally benefits you when you could be saved more often by having more nades, more ammo, more run speed, or more shield recharge?
I think it would be interesting if nanoweave were totally removed, but all other suit slots have a health penalty trade off (as if you needed lighter armor to make space for grenades, etc). Haven’t put much thought into this idea, but I think it would be interesting.
ngl sometimes I wish they'd just raise the damage tier of every automatic weapon by one tier
how many times you going to talk about this nerf?
Awesome idea, nano weve definitely needs a buff bc it's useless as is.
Nanoweave not being good is a bad idea because most suit slots are good
This isn't a change, this is a gentle attempt at deleting it.
Not that it's a bad idea.
This doesn't exactly relate to the video however...
Hello and I'm a returning player. Can anyone help me find an Aus discord/ORG that is active? Any help would be appreciated thank you