ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 3 ส.ค. 2024
- Splatoon 3 is a fantastic game and it's evident that the Splatoon community all care about the success of the game, but that doesn't mean that they agree on everything. The divides between the Competitive and Casual sides of Splatoon can sometimes lead to disagreements and animosity that could be doing more harm than good to the future of Splatoon 3 and beyond. With reactions to Splatoon 3 winning Best Multiplayer at the 2022 Game Awards being very mixed (with some still claiming that it's "just a kids game"), I believe that fixing the divide between competitive and casual Splatoon players could be the key to changing this stereotype and accelerating Splatoon 3's growth. But just how do we do that? Let's find out!
Timestamps/Chapters
0:00 - Intro
0:30 - Why We Need To Fix The Divide
3:07 - The Causes of The Comp vs Casual Divide
3:43 - Communication
6:11 - Accessibility
8:55 - Visibility
#splatoon3 #nintendoswitch #splatoon3gameplay
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Theres no way people are saying "Casuals are ruining the game". Bruh thats like 90% of the playerbase, theyre MAKING the game.
This video is completely right. Ugh I just wish that the stigma or "irrelevancy" on the esport side of gaming for splatoon just went away. More attention needs to be brought to this issue imo
Oh I know you
the main reason for this is that people see the game as strictly a kids game that has no potential to be competitive or a big esport. the only real way to get rid of this is for the scene to grow to a huge scale so it is recognized for what it is, something that is very unlikely unfortunately
The truth is most of peoples "opinons" aren't actually opinions but they just take them from other popular streamers who know 0 things about the game and pass it off as thier own. Why people dont see this game as good is because it is a very new addition to the nintendo franchise and people assume just because it has colors means it's just for kids and only for kids that's actually not true splatoon is a game that dosen't exclude kids from the audience theres a difference. Many people judge things based on first impressions and opinions from other people if they see your game as bad and so do most others they will also pass it as their opinon which is exactly why Nintendo switch sports failed. Overall if you are gonna judge something at least have your original opinon and dig in a little bit into the game. I get it not everyone has a switch and it's not gonna be easy for most people who are outsiders to nintendo to understand they think that this game is just some low quality fortnite or overwatch kidified to make a couple bucks which is completely bogus but the biggest and main reason to the current outsider view of this game is mainly because of the big streamers who dont put much thought into what they are actually insulting and it hurts a lot as a casual player.
As they always say. "Never judge a game based on only a few opinions of others."
I wish people would stop trying to turn every multiplayer PvP game into a sweaty eSport.
I personally see sports in general as irrelevant.
I am a casual player, and the first question I am always asked when I talk to people about splatoon is why don’t I play competitively. My answer is always I suck at video games, or I just like to play the game for fun. It gets frustrating after a while because it feels like every interaction I have with splatoon players is all about being competitive. I first got into splatoon when it first came out. I normally despise all shooters because I generally suck at them and I don’t like competitive games, but splatoon was different. It was more focused on having fun rather than being the best of the best. But now it’s ether you play competitively or you suffer people constantly harassing you to play competitively. Your solution to the “comp vs casual” argument is for all casual players to become competitive. Most of us don’t want that. Most of us like using wepons that might be “bad” in competitive play, most of us just want to have fun, and most of us like to just play with friends. I’m always told that the more I play the better I will get but I’ve been playing for years and I have barely improved at all. I just don’t see the point in taking a game I love to play for fun and turning it into a chore I have to grind at to get better. I personally hope that the two communities can grow separately and not merge. Because while there may be a lot of fight between people, it’s better than pushing out people like me who just don’t want to play competitively and never will.
Hello I don't consider myself competitive as I only play turf war casually but when I've gone into x battles I've reached top 500 the way I got so good at the game was by doing exactly what you're doing (just having fun)
"Just be better"
"I have a life and do not only play Splatoon against people with 1000+ hours in B rank"
I agree completely with everything in this comment. You’ve put to words what I’ve been feeling for years. More people need to hear this!
As someone who likes to experiment with gimmicks, fun builds, or various ideas: i like to learn about the game and improve myself, but also know i probably won't get far competitively(so i might be somewhere in-between?)
On visibility - Tournaments need to start putting their stuff on youtube. Competitive players doing so is cool, but that's going to appeal more to people already into competitive. To get casual players into watching the competitive stuff, it needs to be the tournament stream that's available VoD, because that's the most new-to-watching friendly content since commentators can explain nuances that casual players might miss (or even 'what the hell just happened'), colour commentators can highlight things that teams are likely thinking about in a way you're not going to get from hearing the team's communication,, and so forth.
Funnily enough Nintendo does keep the VoDs of their tournament videos on TH-cam, but they are so long that because they don't do highlights or anything similar only those that are already interested in the competitive scene will ever think of watching even just a minute of that VoD
@@TheBaxes Between work, errands, chores, and everything else eating away at my time; if i happen to see a vid more than an hour long, it's not very likely i'll click on it(even if it happens to look interesting: i've passed up *many* vids i wanted to watch simply because of the necessary time investment)
I just want to play Ranked Modes without getting KO'd in 30 seconds man
Maybe one day I won't have to explain top players know how to dodge missiles... one day...
all seriousness good vid
It would be a good short like Morsa did about Killer wail
Just squid roll.
Squid roll or lure them away if you can
Hi chara
the marketing for Splatoon could be its downfall as its shown as turf war and for kids. PLEASE, Nintendo, show the ranked modes. show the competitive stuff. your game will sell a lot better, and for what? a couple or less days of voice acting and in game filming?
I think the game was killed in the west by the first games terrible marketing. Ads like the "you're a kid now" one are nostalgic and fun but they make it seem like a kids game heavily. this stigma killed a lot of potential players and made people think of splatoon as just a stupid silly little kids game, when its clearly not
Just look at how the fanbases of other online multi games reacted when splatoon won best multiplayer game of 2022. A LOT of people have this thought about the game, largely due in part to first impressions from its art style, but the advertising doesnt help either. Splatoon is a complicated game, when you take it seriously. But Nintendo doesn’t show any of that. There is a huge competitive side to its fanbase and they aren’t represented at all.
@@pokaay3163 Because Nintendo's target audience isn't gamers. It's families - which may sound weird, given they're literally a video game company. But choosing to target families is what made it such a successful company. And for that reason, Nintendo is most likely going to continue to focus on appealing to kids over competitive players. Because it very clearly works. Splatoon 3 has done crazy well, because it's so unique and approachable. There's definitely a high skill ceiling, but I've seen literal 5 year olds play too. People act like Nintendo not making games targeted at a niche group of ultra competitive gamers is wasted money, but no group will ever be as profitable as kids lol. It's why Fortnite, Minecraft and Roblox are so mega big - because there's so many kids playing them
Comp and casuals: (intense bickering)
Me: (Laughs in salmon)
M&M pfp
There's overfishing salmon
salmon is a bad gamemode
@@merge9585 correct, but salmon is a cooperative game mode so whenever you encounter one the shift usually becomes easier.
@@lemon66111 no, it's not. you can dislike it, but from a design standpoint it's amazing what they did with this game mode.
This is a great video! If I may add, I think the matchmaking is also adding to this divide, as not having the proper ranking system we used to is putting people who just want a good time up with comp players so it must add to the general distaste.
Sucks because I’d love to get into competitive, but getting shredded constantly is demoralizing
Exactly. People don't mind the casual or competitive side of Splatoon, but when they mix, it alienates the casuals.
I'm a mid level comp player, and I'd never heard about this argument. I knew that the communities were separate, but I thought that they just didn't interact. All my friends except my teammates are casual, and the only thing that happens is that I get called sweaty. The idea of comp being almost exclusively on discord is absolutely true, as I don't use any other social media but know a lot of comp servers and practice with dozens of other teams.
On Reddit, TH-cam and Twitter there is def an constant debate about it. I'm technically I guess a casual player? I play mostly ranked and salmon run and definitely follow the competitive scene and try and improve myself but I don't intend to play tournaments or anything. I mostly see more casual players insulting people of high skill more than anything else. Hell, even the fact that only the top 5% of people got a gold trophy in big run sent reddit into a spiral with hundreds of people saying it was bullshit that only "overfishers with no life whatsoever ruined the entire big run for everyone by being sweaty and getting too many eggs". But, it is reddit, so this behavior is to be expected
@@leftovernoise wow, I didn’t know people were getting angry over players who got gold in big run lmao. Though I agree with you on seeing casual players having this negative view on comp players, and as someone who wants to dip their toe into the competitive scene it’s kinda disheartening.
The thing is, there is a booming competitive scene in Japan, and many people there get into it for the competitive aspect. It isn't unusual for a tournament to gather teams in triple digits, biggest ones gather thousands. The western community just doesn't do enough.
Also the game itself isn't very conducive to learning how to play well, somehow making a worse ranking and matchmaking system every subsequent title. Even matches lead to everyone involved improving, while one-sided stomps don't give anything to either side, as weaker team doesn't get a chance to do anything and stronger one meets little resistance. Splatoon 2 started treating rank as a reward everyone deserves rather than measure of skill but X was still ~5% of players by the end, bad but still workable. S+ in first season of 3 was almost 40% of all players who play ranked, all matched together, all unable to derank. Splatoon 1 separated players into distinct player pools much better, resulting in far more even matches in any rank, and S+ was a brutal containment fight club for top 1% of players. A lot of top teams back then recruited with the requirement of "can maintain S+∞" (can keep winning past S+99), nowadays solo queue performance is rarely a consideration beyond "not an A- player".
Me who has been on the low end of competitive since splat3 :
"There's a debate?"
As someone who is still relatively new, as much as I get annoyed with people always talking about comps, I do admire the strategies they have and I hope I can learn further from them so I can do better and have less tilts 😂
Super agree with the communication part. As a married human communication is always better than not. I know comparing marriage to a gaming community sounds weird but it applies to everything. Including gaming communities. If we can all get along, we can propel our community further.
i think a reason why there's a big divide with comp and casual players is because they're constantly at each others' throats, especially on twitter. you would get a casual player (i don't know how to put this more lighty, sorry) whining about a certain thing and then having pros acting all snarky in reply and it's just awful on both ends.
Ive been playing this game ever since its wii u days and i dont the idea that casual players are people who are new to the game.
Your video has a lot of good points and ideas on how the comp side can grow/improve itself, i just take issue with the idea that people that play casual do so because they arent ready for competitive.
Not everyone wants to be a competitive player. I'm with you that the comp scene should be easier to find for the people that do, but you have to acknowledge that it isnt for everyone.
Something i wished you wouldve mentioned was the difference comp and casual have when it comes to matching. One has teams that can give callouts and coordinate on the fly while the other has no idea what their teammates loadouts are until the game nearly starts. Two completely different experiences from the same base game.
Genuinly i think the biggest disconnect between comp and casual is that the only way to solo queue anarchy gamemodes comes with a ranking system. Turf war and tower control are two different ball games, losing points trying to get a feel for the game isnt the best motivator to keep at it. Or the other way around, comp players can play the game modes they really like and just have fun with it. Maybe even try out new loadouts or play meme builds like we get to in turf war.
I might a diehard casual player but i would love to see the comp scene flourish. I heard talk about how the new job code in salmon run will make competitive play more fair and i didnt even know comp sr even existed till then LMAOO
You mentioning Squid School and ProChara as great examples of showing competitive is extremely accurate because when I got Splatoon 3 as effectively my first Splatoon game, seeing their stuff was what made me at all interested in the competitive scene. I don't know if I'll ever try to play because I feel like I'm not that good at the game and think I prefer it on a more casual level, but having them show me that competitive exists has pushed my understanding of the game a lot in just the few months I've had it
See and I would love to get more serious about competitive play in splatoon. But it's really hard to find teammates. Everytime I've tried interacting with the competitive side, I just get stonewalled.
Like the gay protest???
@@milfmacron What in the goddamn?
@@milfmacron 😭
@@milfmacron stonewall was a RIOT
I'm one of the few in my friend group with a switch. Whenever I recommend this game, I always make sure to highlight the short match length and what that means at higher levels of gameplay. Accuracy and being able to switch from Offense to Defense at any given moment can really make this game intense
If I’m honest, I think that the growth in popularity for competitive players will only even itself out as more casual players will just leave. As a casual player who can only play about once a week, it’s not fun playing turf wars when you always lose. Sure there’s salmon runs to play, and I can just grind in story mode, but eventually I’ll get bored if I can’t play a third of the games main features. I do know that this can be resolved with some ranking algorithms for turf wars just like they have in the other battle stages but I don’t see that coming in the future.
This is a really good video. Im very new and just getting started to the comp scene. My friends are very casual and dont really want to hear what I say about weapons, so we disagree a lot on what weapons are good or not
Aww, welcome! ^^ I hope you have tons of fun with the game either way!
The Comp Vs Casual Augument is valid like they say "Splatoon is for Kids" "Splatoon is for Toddlers" "Splatoon Sucks" "Splatoon 3 Sucks" and so on, i use to hate Fortnite sense 2018 like "Fortnite is a losers game" "Fortnite is dogshit" "Fortnite is designed by kids" until i try Zero Build on Chapter 3 Season 3 on Fortnite, and it's good, i like Zero Build.
I need to try to understand like gamer rage on Splatoon, because it's a kid friendly game, and everyone like Adults, Teens, and Kids play the game, i may deal with annoyance, and triggered rage moments, but i got to not let my blood pressure go off the roof from Gamer Rage. I am a ex-Twitter user, people say "Splatoon is a babies game" IT'S HILARIOUS! (I still trying to reduce gamer rage)
Nintendo needs to fix this online, and matchmaking like Americans, and Europe has to deal with WALMART WIFI, MCDONALDS WIFI, and DIAL UP from laggy players, the latency is hilarious.
Twitter sucks anyways, it's not good for our health, not good for the gaming community, ther full of bullying. I only use Discord.
Also please don't put comments on screen if you're only have them there for half a second. It's annoying having to double tap to go back ten seconds and then hope I manage to pause the video at the right spot
it's hard to communicate when my only options are "booyah" and "this way" unless you mean on social media than that's a good idea
I've personally just had a bad experience with competitive players in game. I'm trying to shift from being more casual to more competitive but finding groups is hard and it feels like a closed off community from the outside.
I have NO interest in playing competitive Splatoon. I DO want to WATCH competitive gameplay. The trouble I’m having is knowing when tournaments are happening, and where I can watch them. Nintendo’s first party tournaments are easy to catch, they announce them on Twitter, and stream on TH-cam. But I have no idea who I have to follow, or where I have to look to find 3rd party tournaments. How do I find them?
A lot of the tournament organizers stream their events, such as Inkling Performance Labs, Little Squid League, Dapple Productions, and From the Ink up. all of these are good to follow for ongoing tournaments.
People think it's a kid's game for another reason - nobody who's not already invested cares about Story Mode. Splatoon has ALWAYS had the strongest campaign stories I've ever seen in a primarily multiplayer game, and they're definitely not exactly kiddie stories. Climate catastrophe, traumatic memory loss, and hypercapitalist dystopia are VERY heavy topics to cover.
As someone who used to be a casual player and working to comp, it’s crazy how different they are from being on both sides
Thank you for your point of view!
I'm a casual who only plays Turf War 'and Salmon Run' so the closest thing to a 'problem' that I have ever faced are the few times when the players I'm matched with are clearly way more skilled and completely dominate the next few rounds, to the point that it's really demoralizing, and it makes me question my own skill.
I know it sounds dumb, but it's from those rounds that makes me too hesitant from playing anything but Turf War! because I really don't want to be 'That player' who is clearly way less skilled and is pulling the team down into loss after loss.
......I am super jealous that us casuals can't use the other modes map layouts for Turf War though! I mean, just imagine if every couple of rounds instead of the usual Turf War map it uses one from Clam blitz, or Tower Control! I know I really want to play Turf War on the Clam blitz/Rainmaker Mahi Mahi Resort layout~!
I’d say go ahead, don’t worry about that. If you’re scared that you will drag people down. Anyone can choose to pause the series and queue again if they don’t want to play with you. Also there is open mode where there’s really no penalty for losing. In the end you bought the game, you have full right to play every mode. If someone blames you for not being able to rank up, it just means they aren’t skilled enough themselves to recognize their own flaws. If you want to get better, watching tips for the weapon you’re playing is a very good start. If you get crushed without knowing why, it’s probably not your fault. There are many small details in the game that makes a huge different, but it’s nearly impossible to figure out on your own, and sometimes you have to search it up. Good luck and please don’t be deterred from playing for others’ sake!
Yeah tbh I feel like the comp vs casual debate wouldn't be nearly as much of a problem if the mathmaking was better
@@somebodyyoudontknow3980 True. I'm tired of playing with people above my level
Yesss I've literally only had the game for a couple of weeks now, and I'm slowly improving, but I hate having to play against people who are obviously more skilled than me. It's not their fault for being good ofc, I just think the matchmaking needs to be way better. 😭
It's nice to see a video on this that isn't just pointing the finger at 1 side
I think it's also minorly important to mention that the Splatoon comp community is connected to the Smash and Melee communities- a scene that has had the same problems on a larger scale for a lot longer than even most other esports.
Not that have any way to connect the two, just throwing it out there that there's a different Nintendo game with the same community issues.
Another thing, maybe this is just a mid level comp thing but “FA hell” is absolutely real. Due to this I feel like a lot of people lose hope of finding a team because it takes so long. Many people I know in the scene were FA’s for months and many eventually stopped trying to find teams. Another thing hampering the accessibility of the comp scene to new players.
I'm french and it's really interesting because here in France, we have a official Twitter Account and a official Discord since the debuts of Splatoon 2 ! And in contrary to the NA Twitter Account, there aren't juste here to post news ! They are hosting official tournament and are often talking about competition !
(For info, Nintendo France was doing a tournament this last week (yes during Big Run), and the finale was pretty insane haha !)
We have channels to discuss gear composition, to let teams search Players or the inverse, to promote others tournaments, etc....
And I'm really surprised that they never did the same in NA or just English Speaking Countries, even with the release Splatoon 3 !
So, Nintendo should take notes from... Nintendo themselves I suppose ? It's weird, why our country is the only one where they care about the competition ?
I'm not much in PvP these days but there's been a massive "comp vs casual" problem in Salmon Run too. All of these points you talk about here apply to Salmon Running too. I'm somewhat of a veteran in the Overfishing community (trying to get as many golden eggs as possible through utilizing all of the optimization techniques with a competent team), and I know a thing or two about SR lol, but a lot of times casual players just shrug off my advice. They don't realize how much power they DO have in SR, despite the poor weapon/RNG/teammates you may get. There is ALWAYS something you can do to help your team.
But I digress. The problem in the SR community currently is that the experienced [comp] players prefer to play with other experienced players, which leaves the newer [casual] players feeling frustrated and left out. The experienced players prefer the consistent results they know they can only get with other veterans. I feel bad for the new up-and-coming competitive SR players, because I feel like not enough veterans are willing to take them under their wing, so to speak. Even I am guilty of not helping out the newer players as much as I should... >.>
There's a competitive salmon run community?? That sounds wicked fun!! Where can I find more? :0
this is a well made video! love the title/thumbnail, rlly eyecatching, and i love the topic choice and the way you tackle it
but The Music is so goofy i immediately started giggling
One point that this video (and the competitive scene) both miss is that what many “casual” players find fun about this game is the variety of available weapons. In some ways, competitive play eliminates this. The developers balance for the majority of their player base, and this means that once you pass certain skill levels you need to be much better than your opponents if you want to play certain weapons.
I’m aware that this isn’t a problem with the PEOPLE in the competitive scene necessarily, but the idea that those who find this game fun would always want to move in that direction really needs to be examined. So many main weapons, specials, and sub weapons are simply “eliminated” from play in competitive, and for many players that is not FUN.
Anticipating responses, I am aware that people play “niche” or “subpar” weapons in competitive, but it is always a choice and a huge investment of skill.
I’m a pretty causal player, but I adore the competitive scene. High level Splatoon is one of my favorite high level games to watch. I think one thing keeping me from playing ranked battles a lot more, thus keeping me out of competitive play is the lack of VC. The fact that Splatoon 3 is a multiplayer game released in 2022 by one of the biggest game companies lacks voice chat boggles my mind. Strategizing with randoms, especially in those low ranked lobbies is super difficult for lower level players with our basic voice chat. Turf war doesn’t require much strategy in casual play, so it’s what I tend to stick with
Someone liked this comment and it sent me a notification so I thought I’d update anyone. One month later I just (literally seconds ago I’m playing while writing this) hit S rank solo queueing. I’m becoming more and more interested in the ins and outs of the game and haven’t touched turf war in weeks. Maybe a competitive team is something to try out…
I don’t want to sound negative, but most of these points are just wrong or irrelevant. The real issue with Splatoon 3 is something that we cannot control- the meta. It’s not just missiles, it’s Splashomatic, Sloshing machine, E-liter, ninja squid stealth jump and last ditch effort. The fun part of Splatoon comes from each players individuality. But comp Splatoon takes that and throws it away for what is meta. Not their fault, but it is very off putting for casuals. That is where the divide truly comes from.
I’m commenting here in hopes to better the algorithm. This is something every Splatoon player needs to be aware of
My brother only played splatoon 3 for like 2 hours and he's EXTREAMLY convinced the splat roller is the best and ''all pros use it'', I try to tell him that most weapons are good in their own way but he just refuses to listen.. and he keeps comparing the heavy splatling (which I main) to his beloved roller
I mean sure roller is a good attacking weapon but it dosent have that much range since its meele, splatling has range simillar to some chargers and it's good in turfing and attacking from distance, although it's not good at really close range fights. All weapons have upsides and downsides but he just looks down at all weapons that aren't the splat roller
Comp vs casual is a false dichotomy. The average player is neither.
I’m loving this style of video! I do agree with what you are saying too
My level of engagement with the Splatoon community is mostly just watching Squid School lol. (Seriously, Gem is great check out his channel)
Awesome game play and commentary🎉❤
content is the way i found out about competitive splatoon, along with finding fun new mains :D, thanks Chara 💪
This video is soo correct!! But also Nintendo is to blame for their terrible matchmaking system! Playing this game and getting a 14 lose streak because teammates, or competitive people are just simply at different skills levels. I know it's not in their control but stuff like the way the ranked system is that really upsets me as it doesn't really tell you anyone's rank at the end of the game. Why not? Why am I not allowed to see that.
it's so bad, the matchmaking is basically putting jackals up against tigers and then punishes the Jackals for losing
Nailed your points in this video. In general you can only expect Nintendo to shaft any competitive communities of their games like what happened to Smash, and both causal and competitive people should be more understanding of each other (and also casuals should not be envious of one another either like how a lot of people were mad at overfishers who got the golden Cohozuna statue in Big Run). Just have fun playing whatever mode you like in the game (even Clam it's unironically good), hope it gets easier to make competitive teams in the future like you mentioned.
a year later and im here to complain that match making isnt any better. just got rolled 3 times in a row by teams with perfect gear all around in c-
im remembering why i never play anything but singleplayer or salmon run :// which is sad cause i actually enjoy other gamemodes
its just that theres literally no chance to get better when you get splatted in 3 seconds cause a a japanese player with perfect gear whos probbably lvl 3* joined the other team
Thank you for such an imformative video
ur take on visibility is so right. i've seen fortnite streamers live on both twitch and tiktok which is huge imo. this one girl i always see on tiktok mentioned how she gained about double the amount of twitch subs since being on tiktok. i've seen lives of people showing older fortnite gameplay too. so bringing in the older splatoon players through nostalgia would work as well as bringing new players in by being on a popular platform like tiktok. sorry if this outlook is completely wrong i'm just more focused on the popularity of the game. it's very popular, but no one really talks about it from what i see, and compared to the numbers of active players, there should be so much more views on splatoon content. overall i just think that nintendo shouldn't just expect people to partake in the community if they don't advertise. i also literally have like no clue what this "comp vs casual" is about i got the game for xmas and this is my first time hearing about it
yea, i was playing ranked (not streak) team wasnt even helping the objective, just fighting for kills
oh and also, make a casual and comp version for all modes, so we can actually play comp when we want? this solves the problem, me personally prefers turf war but theres so many casuals firing in random directions, and bugs make it worse
I think for visibility, it is streamer's job to introduce pro players in splatoon, especially those who give content about how to play splatoon.
but, I personally want splatoon team to work with someone who know much about splatoon strategy, and making their own 'streamer' for in-game and youtube (the same content), to make content about tips and tricks weekly. and I think it is better if the video is only 5-15 minutes long.
also they should make a feature about weapon training. we can have a free practice before we buy a weapon, but we dont know how to use it to have advantage over opponents that have already know the basic strategies in splatoon. I know there is maybe so much ways to use one weapon, but at last train them in the most easiest strategy with it.
Im S+3 and im a casual Player, i think.
180 game hours👌
Splatton community is the best, love u all♥️
This video NEEDS more expsoure. You're doing god's work.
where’s the rest of the casual players like me that aren’t blaming the competitive players for match making imbalances? you play based on your personal skill level if you suck, you suck and your team will be weaker for it.
I had to get my butt whooped many times in Splatoon2 to learn how to get good ?! I blamed everything my teammates, and people who play the game more competitively but what it came down to was .. my own ability to play? When it comes down to it just practice! Unless you’re playing ranked modes. Then clearly as you progress, the people the you face are going to be playing to win.
I actually remember being interested in competitive Splatoon back in 2018, but had no connection to that side of the house until 2020.
One issue I have with Splatoon's competitive (non-JP) community is that it seems to be really hard to actually follow as a spectator. Videos/VODs from recent tournaments are few and far between, getting info on teams and rotations is an investigation exercise in itself, and there's no singular place where I can follow round-ups in case I skipped something.
I can provide mediation if necessary haha
I’m the most casual casual to ever casual but they let me in the commentary booth every now and again so I must be doing something right :P
I'll always be of the mindset that comp and casual players need to stay faaaaaaaaaaaaaar away from eachother in every aspect.
They should never have to interact, and its better for the game because casuals can just enjoy what the game has to offer and have fun, while the comp players can keep honing their skills against players that will give them a challenge.
I have no interest in being a comp player nor watching comp gameplay because I despise how sweaty it is, and will always advocate that comp players stay away from me and my casual games.
Its also a weird stance to think comp scenes make games more popular. If anything, focusing on comp scenes just ensures a game dies faster.
meanwhile im just here chilling on salmon run 😂
Salmon Run is more niche than PVP modes, but I like it more. I just wish it relied on skill more than the quality of your team.
Competitive salmon run is called "overfishing." You might like it.
Personally I think marketing to kids is not a bad strategy. A lot of competitive players already has a preferred game to compete on, they won’t switch to platoon just because there is a competitive side, especially when most competitive players play on PC. On the other hand, kids don’t understand the competitive side of things and don’t care as much. Splatoon may be one of the first games they picked up that has a competitive side. Instead of being frustrated at losing or figuring out how to get good, they can enjoy turf war. And when they grow up and become interested in playing competitively, guess what games will they start with? Splatoon! Because they are already familiar with it. That’s what I think anyways. By marketing towards kids Nintendo can create its own supply of competitive players, without needing to compete with other competitive games.
Big ego's on both sides of the coin.
The common ground is we all like this game and have fun playing it.
who is better doesn't matter
The huge thing about the Splatoon scene when it comes to Comp vs Casual is that a lot of people in the Casual Side of it still see the game as a strictly *kids* game rather than a game that has a mix of every age in it and is competitively viable. A good example is the recent hot button topic on twitter: The Christmas debate. The main argument used from the casual side during this debacle is that "All the new players are probably children and you're an asshole if you don't take it easy on them", and the main arguments from the Comp side is that it's not just kids who will end up having the newbie tag (since splat 1 and 2 vets will also have the newbie tag when they start), people can take advantage of the newbie tag strat to win games, comp players shouldn't be blamed for terrible matchmaking, and that it's ridiculous to tell players that they shouldn't play how they want to in order to protect a possible random kid's feelings and ability to have fun.
With the Comp vs Casual debate, I don't necessarily feel as though it will kill the franchise. The Smash scene has had it's fair share of similar issues (Mainly with the Fighting Game Community) and it's been thriving for years. However, what I do feel like it will kill is Casual Players will to play the game. Casual Players regularly butt heads with Comp Players over issues such as the one I mentioned above, and genuinely see those that don't see the game as just a kids game as "toxic", which has resulted in Casual Players leaving entirely. The game will more than likely turn into a Smash Bros. type situation and have a more dominant competitive look, with more players joining strictly for comp reasons.
I think that there is another problem between comp and casual which is game modes. Playing Turf War is such a different experience to playing the Anarchy modes that they really feel like two different silos entirely. This isn't as big a problem for a lot of other competitive games. Overwatch has the same objectives in both ranked and casual play, even if the scoring systems are a little different. Competitive Smash players might play with some more restrictive rule sets, but the fundamental objective of play is the same whether you're Esam (good) or me (less good). The huge difference between Turf War and Anarchy is something that has honestly kept me from entering into comp. I want to change that soon, now that I've built up a bit of fundamentals, but it's really more of an uphill climb than any other game I've played.
I think the aesthetics of Splatoon itself could be improved upon more to go in that direction: And it to a great degree even already has. For example the player models themselves looking much more mature now. The style has become more and more well mixed to be a game for everyone, with Octo Expansion being the absolute highlight, but there is a lot of other small things they could do to keep this up. I think the guns are the biggest issue in that regard, because the main guns are always literally modeled after children's toys, which still adds a lot to the childish aesthetic. Designs like the Rainmaker, E-Liter, Octoshot, Octobrush etc. are a lot better in my opinion at catching the new Splatoon vibe as well as making the aesthetic more for everyone while still remaining cartoonish
There's definitely a lot of trouble getting people to not just immediately dismiss the game as a dumb kids game that Nintendo's marketing really doesn't help.
I've bought every Splatoon game since the first one but ended up barely playing both Splat1 and Splat2 after the first month or so of buying them when I wasn't able to convince a single person I know to even give it a chance.
There's definitely an attitude among older Nintendo fans to dismiss anything Nintendo puts out that isn't an existing franchise going back to at least the GameCube or so. Hell even I'm guilty of it, I completely dismissed and even derided ARMS even though I've never even watched any gameplay footage of it nevermind trying it myself, and might well have done the same to Splatoon if the queue for the demo booth hadn't been really short at EGX 2014.
Thankfully I've been enjoying Splatoon 3 so much that I've been playing at least a match a day nearly every day since release even exclusively solo-queueing Anarchy Battles, but it's still a real bummer when just about every one I know rolls their eyes or groans derisively if Splatoon so much as comes up.
I think another big issue is not being able to play anarchy battles with friends. The way Fortnite has their arena mode is how I wish Splatoon did it. With the random teams it can get very frustrating ending up with 2 aerosprays, an e-liter, and a sloshing machine meanwhile the other team can have a brush, e-liter, blaster, and splattershot (aka a really well team to cover all areas of range.) And with splatoon being a paid game and not having everyone at every time be able to just download and play, you are gonna get more newer players who need help to start but oh look! No communication, messaging system, or other ways to find that teammate! I played a game with someone and we were REALLY good! completed a series with 5-0 win streak! I added him, he accepted but we can't communicate how to ever play again so he just sits there rotting in my friends list till I one day see if he is online again! The other issue for me is the game modes. I am TERRIBLE at rainmaker but with splat zones I can control it really well and hold it in a 2V4! But every time I wanna play it, the selection is Rainmaker and Clam Blitz. It's just frustrating. Nintendo NEEDS to implement a ton of things or their player base is gonna stay like this and I really don't want that for this game.
OH and the punishment point system is terrible. I'm like S+0 but with -500 points. I win a series but only get 200 points with all gold? Meanwhile I loose a series and it takes 170 away + an entering fee.
I agree to this video. The biggest enemy to the splatoon community is nintendo themselves more on how they market the game I've only seen them show ranked ONCE on the new chill season update and basically that's it (Not including the dedicated ranked trailers)
People assume its nintendo guys and it has colors so it must be a game for 5 year olds and will no way whatsoever have a comp community. Compared to your average FPS there is so much content in the game and unlike Modern warfare game coming out once a year with 1 new skin and a new map every 6 games splatoon has too much. It's obvious the devs put alot of love into this game but the marketing team is ruining that effort.
Here's an experience to further this discussion. I was trying to get my friend into Splatoon (Splatoon 2 specifically), he plays overwatch and other shooters. He was bad at turf war but was willing to keep trying. I mained Flingza, and the matchmaking put us in a match where we were on opposite sides. We lost two players yet we won (cause low lvl players and I used splat 2 flingza). He gave up on the game even though I only wanted him to keep playing and never verbally discouraged him, I only played how I usually do. While much of the divide is due to unnecessary tension; Balance, weapon choice, and the gaping problems most people dismiss with Turf War- the "beginner mode" -make it hard to give this game a chance cause anyone who introduces you, whether intentional or not, will be leagues ahead of you through just playing normally compared to other shooters. Splatoon is like no other shooter, well...EVER really..., keep that in mind.
He probably needed to try a different weapon that felt better to use and stick with it for a good bit of time. Reconning stages would of been really good for him to practice on before throwing himself into matches. He can get familar with the maps, test the gear, the actual range of the main and sub weapon and special on the current stage without being hounded by the opposing team. While rollers are beginner friendly, there's other weapons he might of taken to that would of suited him better. Rollers get bullied a lot and its just the unfortunate side effect of being a beginner friendly class with shorter range than average across the board. Maybe some day he will be willing to try again.
@@ShadowSkyX thx for tips, also I was the one using flingza, I was almost max level x rank flingza main
Well-said
honestly accessibility is the biggest issue. you CAN say that nintendo does care about competitive splatoon, since there are official tournaments and leaderboards, but no amount of official or community support for it will change the fact that a lot of casual players have no idea what's going on there or how to find a team (i didn't even know you had to have a team at all until i looked into it for the first time). and even with a resource like that twitter account at 8:16 there's still a lot of language used all over that page that is its own can of worms to decode.
like, what is a 'div', and why do i need to have a div 3 or higher to join most of these teams? what does a 'slayer' playstyle mean? how am i supposed to know what my playstyle is, in these terms, if i have no experience with competitive play? do rankings from past seasons/games actually matter in this? casual players just aren't going to get into the competitive scene if they're getting blocked at every turn. a lot more people are interested than one might think, but it seems impossible to get started to someone who hasn't participated in a tournament or anything before.
it's like learning how to use chopsticks, or how to tie your shoes. second nature if you already know how to do it, but once you know, it's that much harder to explain to a newbie. and if you're the newbie in question, you'll only get more and more frustrated at everyone who acts like it's so easy, without giving any effort to explaining it in a way you understand. this also ties into communication, or lack thereof.
The Comp vs Casual scene I have witnessed a whole bunch, I used to play casual but now I’m starting to lean into low level competitive splatoon. Most people that play splatoon competitively are purely “splatoon competitive players” the thing is that… most of them don’t have the same general traction as many other TH-camrs that play a variety of games. (The more games you play = wider audience) and the popular TH-camrs that make like 2 videos on it usually don’t take it farther than “wow this is a fun kids game that y’all should play” they never take it farther than that since it’s their first time playing, people are influenced by their favorite creators, thus making most believe it’s just a funny little kids game.
Now, time for the controversy between Comp Vs Casual. Generally, the “Casual” side is more diverse. There is a difference between “playing for fun” and “playing for fun and being good at the game” the Comp side isn’t the general side for “good players” you can still be really good and identify yourself as playing casual. Comp is taking it FURTHER. By communicating to teammates, being a part of a competitive community, etc…
Casual players think that they know every aspect for the game, and competitive players KNOW pretty much every aspect of the game. Competitive players don’t sprout out randomly, everyone starts out casual at one point. Everyone probably has gotten mad at a “sweaty” player by just being good. I think part of the issue is just different skill levels talking to each other online, thinking that they are the big shot. Casuals don’t understand competitive aspects of the game, and competitive players can’t actually “teach” them their experience with the competitive side of splatoon without some backlash, we already know the whole tenta missile thingy from the video. It’s just super confusing because this is how most casual Vs competitive arguements go:
Cas: why do you do this? It seems useless
Com: well you see… *mumbo jumbo*
Cas: no, that can’t be right. Because *mumbo jumbo*
Com: nonono. Im right see?
Cas: no you’re wrong! My experience is different
And it continues….. there’s probably some variation of it and such but what point I’m trying to get across is that casual players need to listen. And not take their experiences for granted (this also applies for competitive) and competitive players need to know that casual players are just like them. And not just “bad players” or “people that don’t know anything” because it’s false! You both know something about the game, it’s just two different paths that end up in a war. It’s kinda like a evolution tree
New person === Casual ===
Do I take it further?
Yes: Competitive player
No, I’m going to play for fun!: Casual
Another thing. I’m probably super wrong at some points. I’m still relatively new to the competitive scene and the casual era that I’ve been in is in the past so…. Lemme know what you think.
I'm really new to splatoon, playing the game to be more specific
I have been following the releases since the first game, but I haven't been able to get my hands on a switch until last week, I got splatoon almost immediately after
I'm a little upset I couldn't have joined sooner, but a budget is a budget and I was yet to earn any money for myself when the game first came out
But now that I have it, I do wish to learn more, if only I had time to, with school and all, I don't know what anything you've talked about means and idk anyone else who does, all my friends only joined because I did, so we are all new to it
Im more of a casual player, but I do wish to join more competitive stuff, I just struggle to understand my weapons and I have to use them a lot before hand because explaining does nothing for me, I'm a visual learner after all, I didn't even know all of this was a problem, of that there were need for servers to do competitive stuff
Ngl, it makes me a bit nervous to get more competitive, but I do want to try at try at the very least
Sounds like you're trying a bunch of things at this phase in your life. Don't be afraid to pivot in another direction if it seems healthier or a better fit for you
@@soridosuneku thanks for the advice
And yeah, there is a lot going on, but nothing i haven't chosen for myself, or nothing too distressing besides medical concerns
I do wish to still try and get better in splatoon but I'll stay on the casual side as of now :]
If you’re a visual learner, watching competitive players play might help. Also you can watch your own replays from the terminal, and see how you died, what you did well and what others did well.
@@dgxdcoder8791 oooh! I'll make sure to do that when I have the time to then ^^
I did see that function but I didn't quite understand it much haha
I’m also fairly new to playing Splatoon 3 (hell, Splatoon 3 is my first splatoon game. I didn’t have a wii u back then and i wasn’t that interested in Splatoon 2 when it came out). I don’t really plan on going super competitive with this game cause i kinda learned the hard way when going super competitive in smash (it wasn’t fun for me or the other players). However, I do plan on getting a bit better at using my weapons (I think I main Splattershot, according to the NSO app on my phone). Overall, while I don’t plan on joining the competitive scene, I do consider on watching professionals play in tournaments (I may be a more casual player, but I love top competitive play).
I think the argument "splatoon is for kids" is such a hypocritical statement, as it implies other games like Apex or Valorant aren't swarming with 12 year olds. Like, I get it, the game is more colorful than other shooters, but any video game is gonna have kids in their playerbase because believe it or not,just because a game is M rated doesn't mean it won't have kids playing it. If anything, more kids play M rated games than adults, just look at the COD Fandom.
I’m quite new to splatoon compared to most people (splatoon 3 is my first splatoon game) so it was quite hard to even get anarchy ranked battles. And let me just say this. They aren’t really my thing. Though, I’m not going to get mad at someone depending on what they like. I see the fun people are having in comp and I’m seeing how many people are making friends together! I really hope those people on both sides will just stop talking about how the other side is wrong. We can all like what we like right? And just as my mum says a lot, don’t yuck somebody else’s yum. :]
"don't yuck somebody else's yum. :]" that is a delicious quote and i will be using it.
I mostly play Ranked but the game is so fun all around that when I ask my Splatoon friends to play I let them decide the mode. I had no idea that some people were like this, I play the game to have fun honestly :( even if I'm playing with 12 years old that squid party in a match
I’m also new to the splatoon franchise lol. I enjoy playing things on a casual level and having fun in turf wars.
loved the video but the music its a bit annoying 😭
Yeah why she got that goofy ahh music playing
thats why comp and casual fans should just make out
2:10 BLALALALALALALALAAL
Is it weird that I am both i pretty much only play turf war but when I've gone into x rank I've gotten top 500 twice
Mmmmm i only have comments on 2 points which would be the competitive vs casuals and visibility. And ill put a TDLR aswell. So with the first point its a common thing that’ll happen in most games ill use apex as an example as I’ve played it a lot more than splatoon(splatoon 3 is my first splatoon and im rank A no motion controls). So the thing about it is casual start to hate the competitve players when their competitve side impedes on their normal play which makes sense like if you’ve been doing something a certain way for a while and someone comes along and tells you yeah nawh we cant do it like that anymore you’d be a little tee’d off especially if it never affected you. So all thought nerfs and buffs are part of the natural landscape of gaming casuals dont like their way of playing to be impeded upon as for competitive players want a healthy environment for their competitve landscape. To remedy this we got like a couple options which splatoon wouldnt do cause i mean 3 games in and they dont have like a normal unranked version of the competitve game modes. If they had that casual players could play the competitve game modes casually and experience it first hand. People might say why dont they just play the competitive mode, id say people like to win as well as relax and for example i love tower control but i dont like to have to constantly be on edge when i play some days i just wanna lay down play and chill but i do t have access to that however from the time i did play tower control i was able to experience what competitive players complained about cause i was there to experience it. Like tentamissles for example wouldnt bother any player as much in regular turf war as it does in tower control so the lack of knowledge comes from the lack of homogeny of gameplay. As for a lot of other games the competitive game mode is the main game like the same weapon in normal BR in apex is gonna be the same weapon in ranked as well as the goal will also be the same so no matter what is tweaked we all knew what it was like before so if something was nerfed there is a better understanding. And same with visibility, visibility comes from within the game aswell like we all see the anarchy option when we’re gonna queue up for any turf battle but the actual experience it we have to play anarchy and with the knowledge that its a ranked mode deters the average person because when you think ranked you think sweats even though sweats exist everywhere but the average gamer would think theres more in the ranked mode thus avoiding it all together. Imma be honest i lost my train thought whilst typing this so imma just leave this where it is its like 12am im tired 😭
TDLR : casual dont have a way of directly experiencing the struggles of competitive players because turf war doesnt offer the same level of strife the actual competitive gamemodes have.
There is a casual ranked mode in Splatoon 3, which is the other anarchy mode (I forgot what it’s called). Basically it’s a low-risk low-reward version of anarchy series, with only -2 points lost when you lose and +8 points when you win. This is the mode I go to when I want to test a new weapon in ranked or just play some casual ranked lol
@@toolio5268 but technically it isnt casual though cause eventually if you win too much you’d eventually hit that point where you hit that competitive barrier where the games just arent fun cause here you are just tryna playing casually while you have a team a full stacks going all out because they wanna rank up yet you just wanna play your favorite gamemode.
@@toolio5268 like after reach rank A as a casual player i just stopped cause im just tryna relax cause although like i said i do love tower control i just wanna come home from work and just vibe with music maybe win some maybe lose some but i dont wanna be hyper focused and thats where you gotta look at the game from the casual perspective like
Imagine becoming a try hard competitive in a game with terrible servers, bad balancing, and god awful maps lul.
Believe me Comp v casual is hurting Call of Duty VERY BADLY!
This sort of divide isn't exclusive to Splatoon. It's present in games like Team Fortress 2, PvZ:B4N, even games like Paladins that have direct eSport support from the devs. This is because casual and competitive mindsets are inherently different from one another. Casual players look at Splatoon 3 and see a game. Competitive players look at Splatoon 3 and see a sport. They are looking at the same thing, but aren't seeing the same thing. The divide is internal, not external.
What does comp mean for its player base like daang dude i thought i was a comp player by playing ranked battles
THE NUMBER ONE GAY? I didnt know there was such disdain between cas and comp. I just get mad at my Salmon Run teammates at times
I loved the second game, but only played 3 for a few weeks before giving up. I could not win a single match and the people who I spoke to were all hard-core players who told me that I was a loser and that I needed to stop playing. I tried to tough it out, but having the same results and getting berated when I would ask for help led me to abandon the game and sell my copy. I just couldn't do it anymore.
You just bumped into idiots
@@yoel2947 Yeah, probably. They ruined the experience for me. I understand that you have knuckleheads in every genre, every game space, but I can usually ignore them, find my own way, and enjoy the experience. But I could not win any match and when I legitimately sought help and advice, they told me to stop playing because it would clear up the player pool of losers. I tried, but it wasn't worth it for me. I still have memories of the second game so I will always have that. Nothing against people who are playing and enjoying the third game. I am glad you are having fun.
What a coward way out huh
@@charliem177 Damn, those people are some toxic losers. I’m sorry those jerks sucked the joy out of Splatoon for you. That must be awful
@charliem The first few weeks were really bad because all the top players from Splatoon 2 were buying the game and working their way up the ranks. Things have calmed down a lot. I'm not a great player (not yet A- in ranked mode) and win about half my matches in turf war. If you still open the game, give it a try again. (Though Christmas may bring another influx.)
... Kids VS kid
I think the game was killed in the west by the first games terrible marketing. Ads like the "you're a kid now" one are nostalgic and fun but they make it seem like a kids game heavily. this stigma killed a lot of potential players and made people think of splatoon as just a stupid silly little kids game, when its clearly not
I usually just highlight "hey salmon run is just cod zombies on steroids" and that usually works
and personally, i kinda prefer not having zoomer toxic dudes in splatoon. makes the community better jbkfd
I would love to play competitively but I deactivated my Twitter in protest of Elon Muskrat and I don’t get on Twitch like ever or often 🙃
I tried joining some casual Splatoon groups on FB and even then got a lot of transphobic comments. It’s all enough to turn me away from getting into something “serious” like playing my favorite game competitively
9:15 me
100% based video but knowing nintendo and the history of competitive smash, i won’t hope competitive splatoon grows much more then it already is
I agree but I don’t see a path to what you’re promoting
I had to stop watching halfway through. It seems odd to present turf war and ranked modes as the only two options people have when playing this game.
It’s just a stupid little kids game
Guys just show them Tartar’s concept art
The music in the background of this video makes it hard to take you seriously
I'm confused. Is this video trying to pretend that the developers don't almost solely listen to the comp community? It's the casual community suffering, not the competitive community.
You're running a rapid blaster on Tower Control. Opinion invalidated /j
people are sheep, if the big streamers stop shit talking it then it may grow
I disagree, competitive isn't the only way to de-stigmatize a game. I believe, voice chat in pubs, better dpad communication options, expanding to other platforms and a perhaps even a free-to-play model would be better. I doubt any of it will happen however
How tf would being free to play help? Nintendo would get no money out of it
@@gleebo9519 Technically they would still make money due to how you have to pay for Nintendo's online subscription to play their games online.
@concavepgons True, but the campaign would be free and it'd only be £20 a year (at a minimum)