The problem is that in making every character into a rushdown, 50/50 mixup machine the game feels very samey after a while. You are either applying pressure with long strings of aggression that grant you plus frames, or else you're waiting to get your turn back for ages because your opponent is doing the same. Neutral game and small Tekken has been reduced considerably. Heat just dumbs things down further, making combos even longer than they were, and chip damage punishes defensive play far too much. While SS is buffed, the horizontal movement is nerfed, with backdash being weaker and characters having long range distance covering moves to help them compensate for lack of movement. I feel that playing Tekken 8 feels far more monotonous and boring than previous entries. There are also way too many braindead characters that are played the same: Dragunov, Yoshi, Alisa, King, Nina, Feng, Shaheen, Lili, Law, Victor, and even Hei, have all very stupid stuff. Not only do characters feel samey, but players use characters in the same way as everyone else, so player identity and expression suffers. The problem with T7 was not so much too much backdash defensive play io, but the OP CH system that made closing the distance into your opponent an anxiety fest since you could get launched by anything. The game is also terribly optimized as well, plugging remains an issue, the matchmaking algorithm is bad.
@@danielsacilotto6235 Well said, u forgot one dumb character tho. Kuma. This character is extremely dumb and monotone now. Flowchart machine with an anxiety causing 50/50 and easily does a ridiculous amount of damage. Heihachi used to be more braindead in T7 imo.
@Spag Now it'd be a great time and opportunity to invite some of these players to a podcast to create a discussion and voice their complaints and opinions on the current state of the game and elaborate more on their point of view. And hopefully, the dev team would also watch the podcast as well and receive some constructive feedback.
I simply cannot understand why Heat Smash is plus on block. If a player does heat smash and it didn't land then it needs to be punished or at least give up the turn.
I think the main issue is simply that dang near everyone has extremely rewarding weighted mixups. Guessing is fine but the amount of reward you get off of your opponent guessing wrong is too high.
In other words, the tekken pro's cry because the game is balanced. The whole toxic tekken pro community always cry when tekken doesn't have very specific broken moves only they know to use properly and abuse. When everyone has a chance the game sucks if they can't frame trap you, then back dash, SS you all day. Sooo funny.
@@snakeeyes522 Tekken 8 is BALANCED? It DOESN'T have broken moves? Have you ever played this game? It took them ages to nerf Dragunov's QCF 4, and that move is STILL busted. At the current state, high ranks are entirely dominated by top or upper mid characters. It takes me 200 to 300 matches to find a single Asuka, Zafina or Azucena. However, I'll fight thousands of Jins, Kings, Dragunovs, Bryans and Yoshimitsus. The game could reduce the roster to 10 characters and I will barely notice. If you really think the game is balanced, you're probably using a busted character yourself and is mad that pro players are calling out how frustrating the game that allowed you to escape low ranks is.
@@snakeeyes522 "balanced" because many have broken stuff and not just 1 or 2? This doesn't change the fact that it's still unfun if the game is a casino-50/50-simulator and if you guess wrong you just die. It doesn't feel rewarding. The whole game feels like on steroids, way too many "perfects" because everything is overhyped.
*Make heat once in a fight. *Bring back character identity *balance op moves across the board - example: mid power crush heat engager. Power crush heat engager safe on block. These things are soo fing spammable.
Nah if they do that then they will have to buff heat heavily and we will be just goin back to rage drives design of stupidly strong button and god knows that would be a bad idea
I love how people want character identity, (not directed at OP) but then they will go and bitch about their character not having as great of a move compared to another character, I see that shit all the time.
@@jojofan2551 Nah just look at Leroy's once per match move. His cane is a bloody terrible move for one that you can only use once per match. Harada is OK with making bad stuff once per match lol
@MikeNmurdoc Nothing outside of Lei Wulong was fun in Tekken 7..Nobody wanted to fight they wanted to runaway and KBD all day..They all just did there best knee impressions..Turtle 7 as a guy who wants to attack in a fighting game..Lei Wulong was a character that you couldn't turtle against...
Lmao Marduk is not a 50/50 character. You mean everyone became a cheapass Mishima. If you guess vs Marduk you're losing. Literally everything he does is punishable. Tackle is breakable unlike Reina and Heihachis cheesy unbreakable throws.
I think it'd be fine, if heat were something that we earn, like starting the fight w zero heat meter and we slowly build it as the rounds progress, same with rage arts. It's just a bad idea to give fundamentally bad players extra chances to think that they're good.
Tekken 7 matches had anticipation. Lots of defensive play and then BOOM! an opportunity. T8 has been mind numbing mashing competition. Just my opinion who watches all tournaments but doesn't play(neither t7 not t8)
You are exactly right and anyone who isnt a complete numbnuts incapable of seeing past flashy lights on the screen can see this. I swear so many "gamers" are idiots who cant actually analyze a game past the surface level. Good on you for being able to understand without even playing.
I don't wanna lose a round to some mere bs because I played better than my opponent, I want to lose because someone blocks my d4 and launches me for it. Or someone ducking my string or sidestepping me and calling me out with a big balls hopkick. Not because of some ridiculous overtuned bullshit crushing move that a toddler can press by accident and win the game. All the crushing utilities in the game, the homing strings/realignment, u need to confirm the confirm of whiffing which makes defense extremely difficult. Plus u already get another 50/50 in your face. Mashing is more rewarding than playing precise... Also bring KBD back or change the range of a lot of moves. Remove RAGE damage on heat smash, should be the same always. Heat smash is literally a gun. U beat someone to rage, your opponent gets 2 pokes in, u hit a df4 (that wouldve killed but the pokes he did gave him a little bit of life back) he whiff punishes or catches you stepping with his heat smash gun in rage. 30% hp left. Boom rage art and u r dead. The most important asset of a creature in fighting is their brain, they nerfed the brain in Tekken 8. GGs. Thinking about that, the game does fit in this era we live in, with things like chatgpt, social media, prefab meals, service for everything etc. Ofc its luxury and convenient but very degenerate if u think about it.
The game is very rush down 50/50 that's why every character does have the same game plan and feel the same that's why the game got played out to me. Im not complaining if that's what theyre going for it is what it is. Every game doesnt need to cater to what I want if I dont like it I just move along 😂
just stopping by to say youre the goat bro I remember how you handled all the religion stuff on twitter and youre the best representative i believe the tekken scene has. keep going bro your words mean more than you might think they do.
Well said! Bro is literally a role model for me as a Muslim Pakistani living in a Western country having to do my best to maintain my identity. It's tough out here man. The globality of Tekken makes it much harder to get everyone on one level of understanding too, but Spag always puts that endless effort in which is inspiring to say the least
Tekken 7 was a masterpiece. To watch in tournaments, as well as gameplay. Tournament wise, there were so many memorable matches. I could watch T7 for hours.
It does need system change. There is basically no neutral in T8. Either this side is always plus or guessing or that side is always plus or guessing. I get that T7 had more neutral than needed but the answer is not make the neutral non existence but tone it doen a little
Imo its kind of pathetic of the balance team to never foresee all these balancing consequences beforehand. Tekken has existed for like 30yrs and they still can't make character balances that don't break their own fundamental system. This was very obvious with T7 DLC characters and the problem still remains. Its the elephant in the room. The devs make incredibley questionable balance changes, that are questionable even on paper, yet still go ahead and implement them. We can discuss what changes we want until we are blue in the face, but the devs made all these playtestable degenerative changes like they are just walking in the dark. The direction team and balance team are incompetent. Simple as. IMO, they need to hire a balance council with players like Anakin, Knee, etc. to help them understand the system of 10f fast but low damage/duckable/unsafe if knockdown or evasive etc. Because it is clear that the current team just do not grasp the fundamentals solidified in Tekken 5. The dev team as it stands do not inspire or deserve any faith.
I completely agree with you. This development/balance team has shown they are incompetent since Season 3 of Tekken 7. It really is wild how they cant forsee absolutely stupid shit like Dragunov running away from you when you sidestep his heat smash, or players retaining Rage Art after regaining their health above the Rage line. Like how fucking ass at your job do you have to be?
For every 2-3 good changes they sneak a dumbass buff for Yoshi, Ling, King etc.I really think they were trying to buff certain characters that very popular players played that would get more eyes on the game if they did well in tournament like Drag for JDCR, King for Majin, Yoshi for Eyemusician etc. but that obviously backfired when the characters have gotten so easy that it doesn't matter if you are a character specialist for 10-20 years when the better player can pick up your character and in a week be just as good if not better.
Games are made scrubby on purpose so randoms can finally win. There's no more respect for legacy skills and competitive integrity. Imagine you can use a car to race in a 100m sprint. Disgraceful from devs
Offense can be strong but give us keep out tools back and give us fast KBD. If someone is SO good at defense let them be like why remove it from the game. The casuals already bought and dropped the game so what is there to lose EDIT: Oh and let me say this T7 was my first and I was a casual but I loved watching tournaments. Even before I ever played the game I enjoyed watching it. Now I have basically no interest in watching T8 currently I’ll watch evo top 8 but like the gameplay is not nearly as compelling to me. There’s way less of a tug of war and it’s more of who gets blown up first
i hope they nerf yoshi to the ground. make him insignificant like he was in previous tekken games so atleast we can play and enjoy yoshi in peace without everyone just loosing their shit cuz GOD FORBID YOSHI GETS SOME LOVE IN THIS GAME.
Its never fun to watch people combo and pop an install and basically wait for like 8 seconds to take one more mixup and die. If its an anime game now give us burst or something like they tried with SC6, it was unironically one of the things they did right in that game.
I have a long time Tekken friend with whom I had countless of fun sessions througout Tekken 7. Now we rarely play T8 and it is mainly fun in lobby together because we are friends. Doing stuff with friends is fun. BUT the gameplay does not feels satisfying anymore. The pressure you can put out in T8 is simply too much. So either you hold back to have a fun back and forth. Or we try hard : someone just gets run over and doesnt get to play the game cause he guessed wrong a couple of times. T7 playing neutral felt more satisfying. Massive+frame mixups had to be earned more than easy to land heatengage moves.
@@YourTamedLion yes. They got rid of so many counter hit strings that lead into full combo. Then turn around and give everyone a 13 - 15 frame heat smash. Like what was the point of backtracking ?
@LesGrosPiedsDeDeejay There's something majestic about watching people doing something they're good at... Watching 50/50s instead of movement/fundamentals doesn't not appeal to me whatsoever. That's my opinion though.
@@LesGrosPiedsDeDeejay with T7 u have matches that are slow but easy to watch and easy to follow. Theres lots of mind games to it but also have the ability to just play aggressive if u wanted it. In T8, the majority of the matches end up in a snowball effect of just one character completely demolishing the other, and its a one sided set. Comebacks are waaayyy harder to see bcs of it. Heat makes it so that almost all matches become repetitive to watch and play.
Heat should never exist but it is now and fkn bamco wont just remove it entirely so wt they can do is to make it once per much and u need to work to earn it.
Heat system needs a change, it should be meter system where it fills and not available from the start and it remains like that for full match and not just 1 round like drive system in SF6. Chip damage needs to go. Movement (defensive) needs a buff and some good character balancing and then the game will be in ok state.
DING DING DING. More people need to realize that the crap we're experiencing now started back in Season 3 of T7. Many people were not very happy about all the "new tactics" and balancing changes they made which gave every character crazy wall carry, more damage and covered up character weaknesses(example Heihachi getting an easy WS launcher). All this stuff stems from whatever the fuck they did in T7. It went unnoticed and mostly ignored(other than busted ass Leroy and Fahk) because of the pandemic and the game riding off of the high of Season 2. The late stages of the game with characters like Feng, Kuni, Zafina and Marduck dominating due to being stupidly safe was not very liked. People wanted a fresh start with T8 and for them to tone back all those crazy buffs and instead they gave us...whatever the fuck T8 is. Highly, Highly, disappointing.
Chip needs to go or needs to be severely crippled. losing your entire healthbar while blocking in under 6 seconds is just flat out terrible for everyone involved and makes the game way more stressful than it needs to be ESPECIALLY in a game with as many plus frames as this one does where you're constantly locked down from pressure
One of the biggest issues with tekken 8 is that there shouldnt be 50/50 strings on some characters. In example Ninas 4,4,4 which can be mixed up to 4,4, 3+4 and she has can opener. Then tekken 8 isnt really consistent with the tracking. Like even with Lili some strings isnt possible to sidestep with guaranteed success. Sometimes you can sidestep it sometimes 2nd or 3rd hit of the string just is homing with no reason.
Nerf the mechanics. No one needs to start with a full stick of meter. No chicken is so fucking dumb. That widens the skill gap right there but they won't do that. Get rid of Chip and get rid of guard break. OR GIVE THEM TO EVERYONE. BALANCE THE MECHANICS NOT THE CHARACTER. STOP ACTING LIKE THIS GAME IS FINISHED LMFAO
@Someone_Somewhere7 all or nothing. That's my argument. IDC if they all charge or if they are all the last hit of a string that can be delayed and interrupted.
I agree with the game mechanics, I do not like playing Tekken 8 too much, like Kkokkoma said, it gets too much and too stressful. Even as an Eddy player, I know, I'll probably get stuff like: "You play Eddy, he is the ultimate 50/50 bullshit character," Yes, I know, but that does not mean I like playing that way, I am forced to play that way or I get steamrolled. In Tekken 7, 50/50's were my third used playstyle, behind Keepout and poking. The problem is that all of the characters play the same way, it's all a guessing game and it gets not only too much, but also boring after a long time. There are no special playstyles anymore, there is only agressiveness and 50/50's. Tekken 7 is definitely not a perfect game, but it at least people were more creative and not aggressive ass monkeys. I am not returning to Tekken 7, that game is over, but in Season 2 of Tekken 8, Bandai Namco needs to seriously do something about this system they have. I'll always support Tekken in what they want to do as one of my favorite franchises, but I cannot keep going like this in Season 2 for too long.
The addition of stances also increases the 50/50s. Maybe they could've made Tekken 8 more poking oriented like Tekken 4 to call it aggressive but instead they went with plus frame moves with crazy tracking that are rewarding on hit and on block.
the "I'll always support Tekken" attitude is what can allow them to not care to fix shit and pull the BS they pulled with shop, battle pass and DLC stage
@@ettoreozzy9932 That is not the point of my initial comment. I can support Bandai Namco and still voice my opinion on what needs to change about the game or what the hell is wrong with a lot of shit that I don't have time nor desire to go through. I support Tekken 8 for the game is tries to be, many people I know feel the same way, but the game needs some serious changes if it wants to keep attracting a big enough audience like the game is trying to do now, or else there will be problems. I didn't buy the stage or other unneeded DLC, only the characters because I need to lab them
What i don't like is how tekken 8 does away with any other playstyle that isn't rushdown aggression. Thats incredibly reductive. Player expression be damned. Being punished for being defensive is not what many want tekken to be.
Well Tekken 7 servers are still up you all who hate Tekken 8 can join together and play that..Instead crying in every post trying to turn Tekken 8 back into Turtle 7
@@tryingtochangemyways5074 Your showing your inability to listen. people are allowed to voice their concerns whether you like it or not. Stop trying to shutdown conversation when you hear something you don't like. Go play 8 instead of hate commenting here.
What i love about previous Tekken games is that have the ability to choose between defensive and aggressive u wanted it. T8 forces u to mindlessly play and that shit becomes repetitive to me.
Hey Spag, been awhile lol. I stopped playing in March and just tried the game again this week. Looks like nothing really changed, even perhaps got worse with all the DLC characters and purchasable content. Glad to see the game getting more flak and more negative reviews on Steam
Here's what I'd do if it were up to me: - Restore horizontal movement to T5 levels. - Junk heat. Replace it with a new meter mechanic that you'd build up from the start of every round, specifically by punishing and counter-hitting your opponent. Damage dealt during combos from CH-launching or launch-punishing your opponent would count towards your meter. This meter would be activated by doing certain attack inputs plus a dedicated activation button, analogous to the tag button in the tag games (activation would be optional), and in this state, certain attacks would have enhanced properties. - Get rid of chip damage. - Increase health bars to 200HP. - Partially reverse the nerf to CH tools. Give at least certain characters fast (
No matter how much we cry , we give opinions or give some advice to harada in tekken, he dont and wont give a fck! The game has spiral down very fast and there nothing we can do. We cry about it but yall still playing the game and buying stuff.
Is Ulsan's a complaint? I think his tweet is making fun of people who want strong defensive play to come back-- he's saying endless defensive backdashing gameplay like in t7 is silly. It's also so ridiculous that Arslan shares a clip demonstrating what he means-- and it's kuma getting a CH launcher into an oki 50/50. Like youre trying to say that didnt exist in TK7? some good points are raised with stance 50/50s, but that arslan tweet screams blinded by placing 65th. where were these comments when he won EVO on jul21st? absolutely no complaints
@@aflockofbricks8988 arslan himself bringed that playstyle to Tekken. Guy did go poke > kbd > poke > 50/50 situation on repeat. That's also how he still plays in t8 with Nina
I do think heat needs to be nerfed across the board. There is a reason why some moves are more punishable than others. It is to balance the risk-reward. Heat is bad because it increases the reward of a move, while also reducing the risk, turning it into a full advantage. Why does a launch punishable move become plus on block? Why does an i10 move turn into a counter hit launchers? Moreover, I think all fast heat engagers should not give a full combo, just a guaranteed follow-up.
I never played Tekken before 8, but leading up to 8, I watched the TWT for 7 and absolutely loved it. I love playing and watching Tekken 8. I've also loved playing and watching Guilty Gear Xrd/Strive, Street Fighter 5/6, DBFZ, etc. It's actually interesting to see people grouse about 50/50s so much in a fighting game, because some of my favorite viewing is old Xrd vids where those animals had to hold the most diabolical mix-ups I've ever seen, just because they got put into a corner. That game has Burst and you're *still* not safe from the schmix. So for me, coming into Tekken 8, nothing really felt that wild. I've spent many a round getting high/low mixed by Jin or whatever while I'm trying to learn the game. You just get washed and go next round. I can understand older Tekkens were in many ways different animals so 8 might be disappointing. That said, I have to wonder if some of the pro complaints are serving as springboards for people to justify their own blue rank plateau (or whatever rank it might be), blaming the game for their lack of continued progress without realizing that other people with their same character have achieved a higher rank in the exact same game. Pros complaining also isn't new, or unique to Tekken. Even pros get in a rut and their mental diminishes. If the devs are going to make changes, I like the idea of tweaking characters first and save systems as a last resort.
when someone lands a 50/50 it's pretty routine to someone who knows how the game works, but to someone who's new, that aggression and the action makes the game so much more fun to watch for them. ultimately, bamco's main goal is to get more new players interested in buying the game or watching their events because they're a business. making money is more important than making a good game in their eyes. they've already gotten our money, so our opinions don't matter as much as long as we're still buying every dlc character and running tournaments for them
Im curious what the sales are because after the initial sales announcement, its been radio silence. Also, stream/tournament views hasnt really increased that much. Interested in the numbers post year 1 hype
I think the problem with tekken 8 is it can become snowbally. The setups and oki to combos needs to be scaled or toned down like yoshi's oki setups and after a wall combo, the offensive character should be in negative frames just like in the older games. For season 2, I'd also like for the backdash to be buffed a bit like to 0.7m range like Dragunov's backdash ( he has the best backdash of 0.7-0.72) while the rest have an average backdash of 0.6m. With this, we can have a bit more defensive or zoning gameplay just like in T7.
U clearly missed the point on wt arslan trying to say coz my friend there is no amount of balancing can fix this game, it is a gameplay system problem and the example u brought to prove thats wrong is laughable actually u brought feng compared to kuma!! Really? First u cant just prove the entire point by mentioning one character compared to another from the top 5 characters in this game, secondly its a system problem coz the entire heat system was a mistake, we don't need to hide it in cameras anymore, be a man about it and just state the obvious, its over designed its screen freeze in the mid of the game is frustrating and killing the flow of the game and it managed to make every single character im the game play exactly the same. If konami somehow be a responsible company and respect their core fans they would make a mode without heat and chip dmg and completely rebalance the entire game i guarantee u that mode will be the most played and pros will play tournaments in that mode only.
@@GibbyVee im saying, i will make hard reads all day just to reset the offense only for the scrub to pop heat burst and put me back into a psuedo mix that won't work
They would have to remove heat for me to play tekken again and they arnt going to do that, after 6 years of playing tekken I stopped playing three months back and havent looked back. From my perspective i don't care much for the why or how, when I played tekken 8, whatever that is is just isnt tekken to me and that puts a fine line on it.
Arslan is right. If he made this comment on a Reddit page, I'm sure he'd be told to get good though. Playing against the same characters we keep seeing is stressful, and some of those characters are especially cancerous to repeatedly deal with. A match with Yoshi and Alisa feels like a circus act.
I personally think the developers should make the heat system like rage art , once the hp drops below 25% the player get access to heat burst making heat burst “do or die” element
I think they only need to do a couple of things and that can make Tekken 8 a lot better for both pro players and casual players. -Not only nerf characters like Yoshi, Nina and Dragunov but also nerf underrated yet powerful characters like Jin, Bryan,Kuma, Claudio and King. -Buff backdash and have a little bit larger map(not too large though) where getting one launch into wall mix ups/pressure isn't so easy.
Hey guys, if you want to have fun in Tekken, stay in blue ranks. I'm there, and there's sooooo much you can do with patience, almost no rush down at all.
I think would be nice if we could start the match without heat bar already full, it has to be empty; cheap damage would fill that bar, little by little giving it actually a purpose. Just this simple change would help a lot, giving also a reason to heat, becaming a real earned, rewarded, comeback mechanic.The engager could be used after a short bit of cheap damage to break up a situation with a lot of pressure, or later in the game with a full heat bar to add some layering and merit to the system. You would actually earn ur heat. I hope also ra would be same as t7.
My wishlist for season 2 for Harada and company to make the game better, -Buff Backdash(this is must) -Nerf Heat engagers(they shouldn't be +17 rather they should just be +7 or +8) -nerf characters like Nina, Yoshi, Bryan,Jin, Dragunov, Claudio and Kuma.
you can't play tekken in this game, neutral play doesn't exist it's just unga bunga plus frames, guessing, panic armor moves and custscenes that's it ...the charascters are highly overpowered, the combos are too long , the damage is ridiculous, one launch at round start and the round is over , the gameplay is highly boring and uninteresting.
Eskay is completely right. Tekken was never a pleasing game to look for spectators and Tekken 7 did A LOT to improve that - if you disagree try watching some older tekkens other people from other fightning games or communities will not get hyped over it. But I don't think the quality of the game should be considering but how much fun it is for spectators and people outside. To me the biggest problem is that playing Tekken 8 and it's gameplay is not fun. It's too much and it gets boring and tedious really fast.
I don't dislike the core mechanics, I like Heat and the way it works, but I feel like Heat is for some characters HUGE but for others is mid. 50/50s are problematic for some characters, I feel like characters that have the best 50/50 mixups are also characters that dominate the top tiers. For a game that relies on 50/50s so heavily, the Low Parry in its current state is really bad. It should take your extender and leave the damage untouched or it should scale your damage but keep your combo extender. I really like Tekken 8, I do think it is the best the series has been in a complete fashion for years. I just want some balance changes for our top tier characters, low parry made viable and the frames for some stuff adjusted. Tekken 8 has a lot of spammable strings that are 50/50s that have safe or even plus enders that require you to guess low / mid / high
Despite the many complaints about the current state of T8 from various pro players in the competitive Tekken scene, I still have high hopes where S2 will take the game since Murray and Harada have been monitoring every request and fixes to the game as of recent on Twitter/X. But yeah, best of luck to the devs though. 👍
I dunno about removal of defensive tools for defensive characters. Like I play Lili and her whole thing is her movement. Like if i had to choose between removing her new 50/50 or nerfing her ss i would rather remove former since I have primarily been playing the character as a movement based character and if I want to play a 50/50 character, I would just pick them up as pocket character rather than not having any movement based character in the game. One of most satisfying thing for me is to get a good whiff from a well timed ss when everyone is complaining about how movement is irrelevant in this game
I think one thing that is overlooked is how the monitzation practices, overall cost of the game is multiplying peoples dissatisfaction with the game play. Like critizim was harsh for T7 but nothing like ive seen in T8 and i think the consumer value ripped out of this game has had a monumental part to play for the average person. The game has lots of issues and instead of transparency and immediate fixes we got microtransactions smashed down our throats. In my country (Australia) standard edition is still $115, delux is $160, and ulitmate is $180. Characters are $12 and stages are $7.50. Now let me ask you if you paid $160 and the stages werent free because people didnt complain you would have piad $182.50 for all of aeason 1 content. If i bought standard i would have paid $173.50 with the characters and stages if they werent free. How the fuck does delux end up costing you more then standard? And, if you were paying close to $200 for a game (S1 content only) wouldn't you expect the game to deliver on the minimum front and address key gameplay and online functionality issues? The game is straight up a rip off from a consumer value point of view and the gameplay is not good enough to justify the price tag. This is least ive ever played a Tekken game and legacy players are dropping of because they hate the game. Some of my favourite pro player and content creators i rarely see stream or straight up quit. Ty, Joey Furry, Frame Whisperer, Arsenalty. Legacy player dont just leave without good reason and i think the reasons are pretty blatantly obvious and aligns with what Arslan, Kokkoma, Knee, Ulsan, and other pro paluers have been saying.
Heat sure isn't helping either, It's too rewarding and too often. I always said it should be buildable, so it would climax at the final rounds. To think Bamco wanted to give two heat smashes on each round was crazy
I want the heat meter to matter, start at zero and be earned through good play maybe even carry over between rounds. I want heat engagers to be activated through a secondary input the same as heat dashes hold forward after input. This would make gaining an advantage more skillful as you have to hit confirm heat engagers, with the added benefit of using a move without using your heat bar. I want low risk high reward moves to be nerfed in a way that still makes them viable but have counter play. I want chip damage to certain moves in heat to be straight up nerfed along with Yoshi's ability to heal an entire life bar of chip in one combo. Jun should be the healer it's like the one thing she had going for her. I want the bugs with clipping through characters and teleporting them around fixed. Leo as of last patch is bugged out even worse with Jack and the Bears pushing them through people at the wall. I want less tracking on string enders on many characters. I want the 2-wall splat safety net that was implemented with 1.0 should extend to side splat as well, on stages like arena you can walk them around the wall with jab dashes and if you mess up engage heat to reset it back to wall it clearly isn't intended. I want Anti cheat, it really needs to be implemented in this day and age, to at least stop the widely available free cheats from working and price out a lot of people. I want the heat activation non macro to work as intended as it is now its a crap shoot if it will come out when input, the one button macro is mandatory. I would love for Namco Support to not be a couple of people on twitter. Official webpage just returns server not found errors after you go through all the AI automated stuff. Why do problems have to trend on Twitter to be addressed that is awful. The Family Share on Steam needs to be addressed that's upward of 8 free alt accounts that can be used to rank boost and cheat if one gets banned the main account owner should get a ban as well. Its up to them to give auth to their account so change a EULA and get on with it. I want stage variety to be way higher starting at 4 through 6 the stages were plentiful and had lots of variety now every stage is small and everyone can carry to a wall no matter what. I mean Ortiz farm is pretty cool. I want who ever read this to have a nice day.
The funny part with all of this is that EU and especially NA aren't really getting as many upsets compared to T7 so far, the results for the Koreans and Pakistan players seems even more consistent even though this game has been scrubbed down and "anybody can win".
I think its in part because many of the EU and NA top players seem to REALLY not like this game and its showing up in their placements. Guys like Joey Fury and Anakin arent out competing and I suspect its in large part due to the game being...shit in terms of design and balance.
Devs just went too heavy-handed on aggression imo. Could have had a healthly medium. Also liked the point that you can do aggressive play without turning everyone into a 50/50 machine
I think they should scale chip damage back to about 25% of what it is now, then nerf the top tiers and we'll be solid after that. We do not need to get rid of heat or rage
I hope this game goes more a bit in the direction of T7. Right now, every character essentially do the same thing, pressure 50/50, heat mechanics and guessing game. Not as much fun as T7 was. The game does look very good, best looking tekken ever
Realistically im not too worried T7 in year one was a way different game than its final year. Character balance will come with time most likely after TWT ends. I anjoy the more active gameplay and guessing. T7 just felt like only 2 or 3 Characters got to do anything everyone else just held their breath and hoped for a good sidestep or low perry
Tbh i was getting tired of watching the arslan ash x knee show by the end of tekken 7. When I tune in to watch a tournament now and for those who sign up to play, there's at least an element of uncertainty that can work against even the classically considered "best players"
thats the problem, no one wanted to get gud so the devs dumped the skill off in T8 and now nobodies are winning and its not that impressive anymore. there isnt a barrier to skill anymore its just luck and oppressive combos with little to no way to escape or reverse a situation other than heat and rage farts its garbage.
I wouldn't say nobodies are winning, it's still a lot of pros that people know and respect but it's a wider variety of them and their different characters in top 8s which is infinitely more enjoyable as both a spectator and as a player To say that there's no barrier to skill and that it's just luck is a bit reductive. The skill barrier to success has been lowered, yes, and there is more of a luck/guessing component than T7 but then it's a matter of opinion if the downstream effects of that are preferred or not. Personally it's exciting to know that there's more of an "anything is possible" vibe with this game than there was in T7
arslan vs knee show? so you watch 1 tournament a year and get tired of it? so many tournaments, especially at the end of 7, where knee was nowhere to see and ulsan completly dominated koera... it really feels like you guys ehard that somewhere and now thats is why tekken7 was boring to watch for you.
I enjoy Tekken 8. But that’s probably because I’ll play for a couple weeks then stop. Then not pick it up until months later. Too busy to play frequently.
There are many many things I want to see in season two but above all I want to see safe power crush heat engagers put in the bin! The most scrub friendly move to have ever touched a fighting game.
They can fix Tekken 8 if they buff backdash a little so that new players can't just rely on 50/50 and heat so they will have to learn movement and basic Tekken skills to get better.
I personally think the Rev Major set between Knee and JDCR was decent, but there's definitely been better Tekken played, Qudans VS JDCR @ TWT2017, Korea VS Japan @ Master Cup 7 in TTT2, Anakin VS Everyone (lol) @ MLG in T6... I want to suggest that part of the reason people enjoyed the Rev Major match is because it's Knee VS JDCR, JDCR had dominated Knee for a while in TTT2 and early in T7, Knee was getting results VS JDCR in the Rev Major tourney, coupled with the fact that it was held in the Philippines where they LOVE Tekken and are a very vocal crowd. All these things combined to make it very momentous. The match itself is a bit overhyped though.
Tekken 8 tried to fix the turtle nature of 7, but did it with a god damn sledgehammer. There's definitely fun in playing it, but I don't think it has the legs to go the distance like 7 did, or at least not without changes. Hopefully Bandai realizes they need to tone down the game.
The fact that 28hr alisa main or a nina masher can beat a 1000hr specialist steve just tells me all I need to know about this dumbed down Make-a-Wish fighting game.
Always fun when you have to chase a character the entire round because they have broken backswing moves that allow them to escape everything you do with 0 consequences. Ironically, this is in the same game where the extreme opposite also happens, when other characters can rush you down infinitely and force 50/50s even when they are very minus and launch you if you dared to guess wrong or sidestep. Some characters can do both of these things as well. Tekken 8 is stressful.
Arslan says he doesnt want to get in a 50/50 guessing for his life after being comboed? Hilarious considering who he played in T7, especially in the last TWT finals.
I feel like no one talks about the tracking system… needs to be tone down. Also chip damage needs to be tone down imo, unreactable counterhit lows should be sidesteppable to both side… at least. Also some character has too much pressure tool that you have to respect otherwise you die in like 5 sec but if you do block them they easily break your guard and if you wanna get away by their pressure you just can’t… for example dragunov or Nina, howarang. 0 startap heat smashes shouldn’t exist in the game so as safe powercrushes. Somethimes you can’t punish unsafes moves for some reason.
Tekken 8 gives everyone a chance to win which is perfect for everyone and yeah I love seeing new faces rather than seeing Arslan always win every damn tournament like in Tekken 7. If they still want to play Tekken 7 rules then just play Tekken 7 maybe create tournaments for that game as well just like with the Smash Community
did spag just say yoshi has some of the best combos and pokes in the game? I know he's strong, but those are not things he's particularly special at compared to the rest of the roster
Just remove the Magic 4 in T7 and you will have a more fun game already... people can be more aggresive because they are not afraid of being magic 4ed.... T8 is just dumb 50/50 BS...
Ive played tekken since the first one and for very long ive always couldnt get into tekken because i didnt understand its movement. T8 was the first one where i was like okay im going to learn tekken this time. I learned more about the movement found some BNBs and now i love it. Maybe its because im just now "getting it" but im not seeing the same issue. Even with that Kuma clip you played. If the bryan would have delayed his getup wouldnt have kuma whiffed the high and then bryan could have retaliated. So is it really a matter of people being in constant 50/50 blenders being the issue or are people even pros actually forgetting or not doing the proper response. Idk im going to reinstall t7 and see how it feels now. Cause idk T8 isnt perfect but alot of people are making it seem like a baby game and i completely disagree.
Problem with Tekken 8 is that you won't actually realise how pathetic the game is if you are not spending money and travelling around the world. It's fun if you are playing this game in your home.
maybe you shouldn't plug on people in ranked, dickhead. glad i fuckin found you, ya bum scrub. you were the Devil Jin that plugged on me in the Dojo Stage. and fuck players who backdash all the time, you're just fishing for whiffs and have no real skill for aggression. this is why you plugged.
my favorite 50/50 is the loading screen debating if the yoshi is about to be a good yoshi or just yoshi
🤣
My favourite 50/50 is waiting for my opponent to plug during rage art (2 rounds in)
My fav 50/50 is yoshi flash my heat or spin my Rage art
Shrodingers yoshi. He's both and not both at the same time
It's more of a 90/10 whether you'll find a Yoshi or a good Yoshi
The problem is that in making every character into a rushdown, 50/50 mixup machine the game feels very samey after a while. You are either applying pressure with long strings of aggression that grant you plus frames, or else you're waiting to get your turn back for ages because your opponent is doing the same. Neutral game and small Tekken has been reduced considerably. Heat just dumbs things down further, making combos even longer than they were, and chip damage punishes defensive play far too much. While SS is buffed, the horizontal movement is nerfed, with backdash being weaker and characters having long range distance covering moves to help them compensate for lack of movement. I feel that playing Tekken 8 feels far more monotonous and boring than previous entries.
There are also way too many braindead characters that are played the same: Dragunov, Yoshi, Alisa, King, Nina, Feng, Shaheen, Lili, Law, Victor, and even Hei, have all very stupid stuff. Not only do characters feel samey, but players use characters in the same way as everyone else, so player identity and expression suffers.
The problem with T7 was not so much too much backdash defensive play io, but the OP CH system that made closing the distance into your opponent an anxiety fest since you could get launched by anything.
The game is also terribly optimized as well, plugging remains an issue, the matchmaking algorithm is bad.
Well said!
@@danielsacilotto6235 Well said, u forgot one dumb character tho. Kuma. This character is extremely dumb and monotone now. Flowchart machine with an anxiety causing 50/50 and easily does a ridiculous amount of damage. Heihachi used to be more braindead in T7 imo.
@@Doro4u I agree. Insane range, tracking, absolutely busted damage, pokes, plus the usual hurtbox awkwardness.
you’re probably a green rank lol Feng braindead smh ur delusional Feng is not braindead
@@codeine_ninja grow up retard
@Spag Now it'd be a great time and opportunity to invite some of these players to a podcast to create a discussion and voice their complaints and opinions on the current state of the game and elaborate more on their point of view.
And hopefully, the dev team would also watch the podcast as well and receive some constructive feedback.
Working on it!
You can talk and complain as much as you want, it’s all useless. We need to think about how to convey this to developers
I simply cannot understand why Heat Smash is plus on block. If a player does heat smash and it didn't land then it needs to be punished or at least give up the turn.
It tracks to bro. Heat smash plus heat burst plus heat engager power crush plus rage
Stupid heat, too OP, forced 50/50s 90% of the time. Too dumbed down that the game became a button mashing contest.
I think the main issue is simply that dang near everyone has extremely rewarding weighted mixups. Guessing is fine but the amount of reward you get off of your opponent guessing wrong is too high.
Especially in the smaller stages
In other words, the tekken pro's cry because the game is balanced. The whole toxic tekken pro community always cry when tekken doesn't have very specific broken moves only they know to use properly and abuse. When everyone has a chance the game sucks if they can't frame trap you, then back dash, SS you all day. Sooo funny.
@@snakeeyes522 Tekken 8 is BALANCED? It DOESN'T have broken moves? Have you ever played this game? It took them ages to nerf Dragunov's QCF 4, and that move is STILL busted. At the current state, high ranks are entirely dominated by top or upper mid characters. It takes me 200 to 300 matches to find a single Asuka, Zafina or Azucena. However, I'll fight thousands of Jins, Kings, Dragunovs, Bryans and Yoshimitsus. The game could reduce the roster to 10 characters and I will barely notice. If you really think the game is balanced, you're probably using a busted character yourself and is mad that pro players are calling out how frustrating the game that allowed you to escape low ranks is.
@@snakeeyes522woof, this post sounds like it was written by a six year old.
@@snakeeyes522 "balanced" because many have broken stuff and not just 1 or 2? This doesn't change the fact that it's still unfun if the game is a casino-50/50-simulator and if you guess wrong you just die. It doesn't feel rewarding. The whole game feels like on steroids, way too many "perfects" because everything is overhyped.
*Make heat once in a fight.
*Bring back character identity
*balance op moves across the board - example: mid power crush heat engager. Power crush heat engager safe on block. These things are soo fing spammable.
Nah if they do that then they will have to buff heat heavily and we will be just goin back to rage drives design of stupidly strong button and god knows that would be a bad idea
you mean a mid power crush slightly tacking heat engager launcher. that is safe, and regens..
I love how people want character identity, (not directed at OP) but then they will go and bitch about their character not having as great of a move compared to another character, I see that shit all the time.
@@lm_paranoid elaborate
@@jojofan2551 Nah just look at Leroy's once per match move. His cane is a bloody terrible move for one that you can only use once per match. Harada is OK with making bad stuff once per match lol
Its a very stressful game
tekken is a stressfull game lol
@skwadboss I think only 8
@@skwadboss Yes, but before 8 the fun made the stress worth it
Get gud I play it for hours and never stress..Currently on a 140 win streak
@MikeNmurdoc Nothing outside of Lei Wulong was fun in Tekken 7..Nobody wanted to fight they wanted to runaway and KBD all day..They all just did there best knee impressions..Turtle 7 as a guy who wants to attack in a fighting game..Lei Wulong was a character that you couldn't turtle against...
Literally everyone became marduk
Lmao Marduk is not a 50/50 character. You mean everyone became a cheapass Mishima. If you guess vs Marduk you're losing. Literally everything he does is punishable. Tackle is breakable unlike Reina and Heihachis cheesy unbreakable throws.
@@jinpachichulo7561 Marduk grab is pure 50/50. But I get what you're saying and I agree.
@@Acrophyllia lol that guy must be Marduk main , the downplay 😂🤦♀
@@Zenkai.boost.Kekkei.Genkai yeah he is stupid in his small head.
Not Marduk but Akuma
I think it'd be fine, if heat were something that we earn, like starting the fight w zero heat meter and we slowly build it as the rounds progress, same with rage arts. It's just a bad idea to give fundamentally bad players extra chances to think that they're good.
Tekken 7 matches had anticipation. Lots of defensive play and then BOOM! an opportunity. T8 has been mind numbing mashing competition. Just my opinion who watches all tournaments but doesn't play(neither t7 not t8)
Exactly, it was live high level boxing/chess. Beautiful. Now its swing without rhyme or reason and pray that one of your swings land.
Mind numbing mashing? No, it’s just more “BOOMs”
You are exactly right and anyone who isnt a complete numbnuts incapable of seeing past flashy lights on the screen can see this. I swear so many "gamers" are idiots who cant actually analyze a game past the surface level. Good on you for being able to understand without even playing.
Ooooh T7 low HP neutral situations. Like the sizzle of a firework you launched that slowly gets quiet.. into a BOOM. Super hype.
I don't wanna lose a round to some mere bs because I played better than my opponent, I want to lose because someone blocks my d4 and launches me for it. Or someone ducking my string or sidestepping me and calling me out with a big balls hopkick. Not because of some ridiculous overtuned bullshit crushing move that a toddler can press by accident and win the game. All the crushing utilities in the game, the homing strings/realignment, u need to confirm the confirm of whiffing which makes defense extremely difficult. Plus u already get another 50/50 in your face. Mashing is more rewarding than playing precise... Also bring KBD back or change the range of a lot of moves. Remove RAGE damage on heat smash, should be the same always. Heat smash is literally a gun. U beat someone to rage, your opponent gets 2 pokes in, u hit a df4 (that wouldve killed but the pokes he did gave him a little bit of life back) he whiff punishes or catches you stepping with his heat smash gun in rage. 30% hp left. Boom rage art and u r dead. The most important asset of a creature in fighting is their brain, they nerfed the brain in Tekken 8. GGs. Thinking about that, the game does fit in this era we live in, with things like chatgpt, social media, prefab meals, service for everything etc. Ofc its luxury and convenient but very degenerate if u think about it.
The game is very rush down 50/50 that's why every character does have the same game plan and feel the same that's why the game got played out to me. Im not complaining if that's what theyre going for it is what it is. Every game doesnt need to cater to what I want if I dont like it I just move along 😂
In turtle 7 everybody 🐢
Powercrush heat engagers ..chip dmg..Heat smash should not be invincible..Heatsmash should not be possible at lower than 1/2 meter.
just stopping by to say youre the goat bro I remember how you handled all the religion stuff on twitter and youre the best representative i believe the tekken scene has. keep going bro your words mean more than you might think they do.
Well said! Bro is literally a role model for me as a Muslim Pakistani living in a Western country having to do my best to maintain my identity. It's tough out here man. The globality of Tekken makes it much harder to get everyone on one level of understanding too, but Spag always puts that endless effort in which is inspiring to say the least
Tekken 7 was a masterpiece. To watch in tournaments, as well as gameplay. Tournament wise, there were so many memorable matches. I could watch T7 for hours.
It does need system change. There is basically no neutral in T8. Either this side is always plus or guessing or that side is always plus or guessing. I get that T7 had more neutral than needed but the answer is not make the neutral non existence but tone it doen a little
Imo its kind of pathetic of the balance team to never foresee all these balancing consequences beforehand. Tekken has existed for like 30yrs and they still can't make character balances that don't break their own fundamental system. This was very obvious with T7 DLC characters and the problem still remains. Its the elephant in the room. The devs make incredibley questionable balance changes, that are questionable even on paper, yet still go ahead and implement them.
We can discuss what changes we want until we are blue in the face, but the devs made all these playtestable degenerative changes like they are just walking in the dark. The direction team and balance team are incompetent. Simple as.
IMO, they need to hire a balance council with players like Anakin, Knee, etc. to help them understand the system of 10f fast but low damage/duckable/unsafe if knockdown or evasive etc. Because it is clear that the current team just do not grasp the fundamentals solidified in Tekken 5. The dev team as it stands do not inspire or deserve any faith.
I completely agree with you. This development/balance team has shown they are incompetent since Season 3 of Tekken 7. It really is wild how they cant forsee absolutely stupid shit like Dragunov running away from you when you sidestep his heat smash, or players retaining Rage Art after regaining their health above the Rage line. Like how fucking ass at your job do you have to be?
For every 2-3 good changes they sneak a dumbass buff for Yoshi, Ling, King etc.I really think they were trying to buff certain characters that very popular players played that would get more eyes on the game if they did well in tournament like Drag for JDCR, King for Majin, Yoshi for Eyemusician etc. but that obviously backfired when the characters have gotten so easy that it doesn't matter if you are a character specialist for 10-20 years when the better player can pick up your character and in a week be just as good if not better.
@@ATC43money
@@BEDCORN yeah, because soo many people picked up yoshi, king, alisa, nina etc. right? NO! they picked drag and drag only!
@@eVuLeXbot
Games are made scrubby on purpose so randoms can finally win. There's no more respect for legacy skills and competitive integrity. Imagine you can use a car to race in a 100m sprint. Disgraceful from devs
Offense can be strong but give us keep out tools back and give us fast KBD. If someone is SO good at defense let them be like why remove it from the game. The casuals already bought and dropped the game so what is there to lose
EDIT:
Oh and let me say this T7 was my first and I was a casual but I loved watching tournaments. Even before I ever played the game I enjoyed watching it. Now I have basically no interest in watching T8 currently I’ll watch evo top 8 but like the gameplay is not nearly as compelling to me. There’s way less of a tug of war and it’s more of who gets blown up first
i hope they nerf yoshi to the ground. make him insignificant like he was in previous tekken games so atleast we can play and enjoy yoshi in peace without everyone just loosing their shit cuz GOD FORBID YOSHI GETS SOME LOVE IN THIS GAME.
Its never fun to watch people combo and pop an install and basically wait for like 8 seconds to take one more mixup and die. If its an anime game now give us burst or something like they tried with SC6, it was unironically one of the things they did right in that game.
its not normal for people to spam bs nonstop and not have consequences. its almost as if this game promotes stupidity.
I have a long time Tekken friend with whom I had countless of fun sessions througout Tekken 7.
Now we rarely play T8 and it is mainly fun in lobby together because we are friends. Doing stuff with friends is fun.
BUT the gameplay does not feels satisfying anymore. The pressure you can put out in T8 is simply too much.
So either you hold back to have a fun back and forth.
Or we try hard : someone just gets run over and doesnt get to play the game cause he guessed wrong a couple of times.
T7 playing neutral felt more satisfying. Massive+frame mixups had to be earned more than easy to land heatengage moves.
@@YourTamedLion yes. They got rid of so many counter hit strings that lead into full combo. Then turn around and give everyone a 13 - 15 frame heat smash. Like what was the point of backtracking ?
I love it when I back dash or hold back and get hit because I didn’t hold back hard enough
Can't deny I liked watching T7 more😢
Yes. Tekken 8 is frustrating to watch, as it is to play.
Tekke 7 gave us some awesome tournament matches
How ?
It was 50 sec of kbd 3 moves/players and timeout
@LesGrosPiedsDeDeejay There's something majestic about watching people doing something they're good at... Watching 50/50s instead of movement/fundamentals doesn't not appeal to me whatsoever. That's my opinion though.
Kbd and sidestepping for 80 percent of the time with df1, 1 and sidestepping...go watch it's so slooooow and annoying
@@LesGrosPiedsDeDeejay with T7 u have matches that are slow but easy to watch and easy to follow. Theres lots of mind games to it but also have the ability to just play aggressive if u wanted it.
In T8, the majority of the matches end up in a snowball effect of just one character completely demolishing the other, and its a one sided set. Comebacks are waaayyy harder to see bcs of it. Heat makes it so that almost all matches become repetitive to watch and play.
Heat mechanics was a mistake. Putting heat available every round at any time was a critical mistake. I never even bought T8 and T7 was my main game.
I don't mind that they took a chance with heat, since it provides more spectacle. However they should've balanced it out by limiting rage art usage.
Heat should never exist but it is now and fkn bamco wont just remove it entirely so wt they can do is to make it once per much and u need to work to earn it.
Heat system needs a change, it should be meter system where it fills and not available from the start and it remains like that for full match and not just 1 round like drive system in SF6. Chip damage needs to go. Movement (defensive) needs a buff and some good character balancing and then the game will be in ok state.
Tekken 7 was one of the best fighting games tbh. It is such a good fighting game that had good pacing and depth
T7 started to become worse from s3 onward because they designed it with the same philosophies they designed t8.
DING DING DING. More people need to realize that the crap we're experiencing now started back in Season 3 of T7. Many people were not very happy about all the "new tactics" and balancing changes they made which gave every character crazy wall carry, more damage and covered up character weaknesses(example Heihachi getting an easy WS launcher).
All this stuff stems from whatever the fuck they did in T7. It went unnoticed and mostly ignored(other than busted ass Leroy and Fahk) because of the pandemic and the game riding off of the high of Season 2. The late stages of the game with characters like Feng, Kuni, Zafina and Marduck dominating due to being stupidly safe was not very liked. People wanted a fresh start with T8 and for them to tone back all those crazy buffs and instead they gave us...whatever the fuck T8 is. Highly, Highly, disappointing.
Chip needs to go or needs to be severely crippled. losing your entire healthbar while blocking in under 6 seconds is just flat out terrible for everyone involved and makes the game way more stressful than it needs to be ESPECIALLY in a game with as many plus frames as this one does where you're constantly locked down from pressure
One of the biggest issues with tekken 8 is that there shouldnt be 50/50 strings on some characters. In example Ninas 4,4,4 which can be mixed up to 4,4, 3+4 and she has can opener. Then tekken 8 isnt really consistent with the tracking. Like even with Lili some strings isnt possible to sidestep with guaranteed success. Sometimes you can sidestep it sometimes 2nd or 3rd hit of the string just is homing with no reason.
Nerf the mechanics.
No one needs to start with a full stick of meter.
No chicken is so fucking dumb.
That widens the skill gap right there but they won't do that.
Get rid of Chip and get rid of guard break. OR GIVE THEM TO EVERYONE.
BALANCE THE MECHANICS NOT THE CHARACTER. STOP ACTING LIKE THIS GAME IS FINISHED LMFAO
Guard breaks should only be universal if they need to be charged. Most of them come out WAY too fast considering they're usually assigned to a 50/50.
@Someone_Somewhere7 all or nothing. That's my argument. IDC if they all charge or if they are all the last hit of a string that can be delayed and interrupted.
@Someone_Somewhere7 yeah Steve got a guard break and a kempo step and they thought that was balance lmfaooooooo
I agree with the game mechanics, I do not like playing Tekken 8 too much, like Kkokkoma said, it gets too much and too stressful. Even as an Eddy player, I know, I'll probably get stuff like: "You play Eddy, he is the ultimate 50/50 bullshit character," Yes, I know, but that does not mean I like playing that way, I am forced to play that way or I get steamrolled. In Tekken 7, 50/50's were my third used playstyle, behind Keepout and poking. The problem is that all of the characters play the same way, it's all a guessing game and it gets not only too much, but also boring after a long time. There are no special playstyles anymore, there is only agressiveness and 50/50's. Tekken 7 is definitely not a perfect game, but it at least people were more creative and not aggressive ass monkeys. I am not returning to Tekken 7, that game is over, but in Season 2 of Tekken 8, Bandai Namco needs to seriously do something about this system they have. I'll always support Tekken in what they want to do as one of my favorite franchises, but I cannot keep going like this in Season 2 for too long.
The addition of stances also increases the 50/50s. Maybe they could've made Tekken 8 more poking oriented like Tekken 4 to call it aggressive but instead they went with plus frame moves with crazy tracking that are rewarding on hit and on block.
Well Tekken 7 servers are still up go play that game..
the "I'll always support Tekken" attitude is what can allow them to not care to fix shit and pull the BS they pulled with shop, battle pass and DLC stage
@@tryingtochangemyways5074 Well you obviously didn't read my comment. I specifically said that I will not go back to Tekken 7
@@ettoreozzy9932 That is not the point of my initial comment. I can support Bandai Namco and still voice my opinion on what needs to change about the game or what the hell is wrong with a lot of shit that I don't have time nor desire to go through. I support Tekken 8 for the game is tries to be, many people I know feel the same way, but the game needs some serious changes if it wants to keep attracting a big enough audience like the game is trying to do now, or else there will be problems. I didn't buy the stage or other unneeded DLC, only the characters because I need to lab them
What i don't like is how tekken 8 does away with any other playstyle that isn't rushdown aggression. Thats incredibly reductive. Player expression be damned. Being punished for being defensive is not what many want tekken to be.
Well Tekken 7 servers are still up you all who hate Tekken 8 can join together and play that..Instead crying in every post trying to turn Tekken 8 back into Turtle 7
@@tryingtochangemyways5074 Your showing your inability to listen. people are allowed to voice their concerns whether you like it or not. Stop trying to shutdown conversation when you hear something you don't like. Go play 8 instead of hate commenting here.
Orange player spotted
Then what is tekken as a whole?
What i love about previous Tekken games is that have the ability to choose between defensive and aggressive u wanted it. T8 forces u to mindlessly play and that shit becomes repetitive to me.
Hey Spag, been awhile lol. I stopped playing in March and just tried the game again this week. Looks like nothing really changed, even perhaps got worse with all the DLC characters and purchasable content. Glad to see the game getting more flak and more negative reviews on Steam
Here's what I'd do if it were up to me:
- Restore horizontal movement to T5 levels.
- Junk heat. Replace it with a new meter mechanic that you'd build up from the start of every round, specifically by punishing and counter-hitting your opponent. Damage dealt during combos from CH-launching or launch-punishing your opponent would count towards your meter. This meter would be activated by doing certain attack inputs plus a dedicated activation button, analogous to the tag button in the tag games (activation would be optional), and in this state, certain attacks would have enhanced properties.
- Get rid of chip damage.
- Increase health bars to 200HP.
- Partially reverse the nerf to CH tools. Give at least certain characters fast (
Want devs to finally listen, everyone just stop playing.
No matter how much we cry , we give opinions or give some advice to harada in tekken, he dont and wont give a fck! The game has spiral down very fast and there nothing we can do. We cry about it but yall still playing the game and buying stuff.
Is Ulsan's a complaint? I think his tweet is making fun of people who want strong defensive play to come back-- he's saying endless defensive backdashing gameplay like in t7 is silly. It's also so ridiculous that Arslan shares a clip demonstrating what he means-- and it's kuma getting a CH launcher into an oki 50/50. Like youre trying to say that didnt exist in TK7? some good points are raised with stance 50/50s, but that arslan tweet screams blinded by placing 65th. where were these comments when he won EVO on jul21st? absolutely no complaints
@@aflockofbricks8988 arslan himself bringed that playstyle to Tekken.
Guy did go poke > kbd > poke > 50/50 situation on repeat.
That's also how he still plays in t8 with Nina
@@LesGrosPiedsDeDeejayThat was just how you played Kuni tbf.
His Kazumi was offensive movement based, with perfect punishment.
Looking forward to the Fatal Fury game next year. Gives me a chance to get away from this terrible Tekken game and community
Community felt down after 8 , agree. Especially Reddit kids.
I do think heat needs to be nerfed across the board.
There is a reason why some moves are more punishable than others. It is to balance the risk-reward. Heat is bad because it increases the reward of a move, while also reducing the risk, turning it into a full advantage.
Why does a launch punishable move become plus on block? Why does an i10 move turn into a counter hit launchers?
Moreover, I think all fast heat engagers should not give a full combo, just a guaranteed follow-up.
Just remove heat
All I can say is less is more
True. Peak was tekken 5 DR. no bounce, no heat no rage art. but it was peak. why can't they just do that again
I never played Tekken before 8, but leading up to 8, I watched the TWT for 7 and absolutely loved it. I love playing and watching Tekken 8. I've also loved playing and watching Guilty Gear Xrd/Strive, Street Fighter 5/6, DBFZ, etc. It's actually interesting to see people grouse about 50/50s so much in a fighting game, because some of my favorite viewing is old Xrd vids where those animals had to hold the most diabolical mix-ups I've ever seen, just because they got put into a corner. That game has Burst and you're *still* not safe from the schmix.
So for me, coming into Tekken 8, nothing really felt that wild. I've spent many a round getting high/low mixed by Jin or whatever while I'm trying to learn the game. You just get washed and go next round. I can understand older Tekkens were in many ways different animals so 8 might be disappointing. That said, I have to wonder if some of the pro complaints are serving as springboards for people to justify their own blue rank plateau (or whatever rank it might be), blaming the game for their lack of continued progress without realizing that other people with their same character have achieved a higher rank in the exact same game.
Pros complaining also isn't new, or unique to Tekken. Even pros get in a rut and their mental diminishes. If the devs are going to make changes, I like the idea of tweaking characters first and save systems as a last resort.
when someone lands a 50/50 it's pretty routine to someone who knows how the game works, but to someone who's new, that aggression and the action makes the game so much more fun to watch for them.
ultimately, bamco's main goal is to get more new players interested in buying the game or watching their events because they're a business. making money is more important than making a good game in their eyes. they've already gotten our money, so our opinions don't matter as much as long as we're still buying every dlc character and running tournaments for them
Im curious what the sales are because after the initial sales announcement, its been radio silence. Also, stream/tournament views hasnt really increased that much. Interested in the numbers post year 1 hype
Bring back Defensive Tekken 8 for Season 2. Or i will never return. This game is garbage.
Tekken 7 is so much better .
I think the problem with tekken 8 is it can become snowbally. The setups and oki to combos needs to be scaled or toned down like yoshi's oki setups and after a wall combo, the offensive character should be in negative frames just like in the older games. For season 2, I'd also like for the backdash to be buffed a bit like to 0.7m range like Dragunov's backdash ( he has the best backdash of 0.7-0.72) while the rest have an average backdash of 0.6m. With this, we can have a bit more defensive or zoning gameplay just like in T7.
U clearly missed the point on wt arslan trying to say coz my friend there is no amount of balancing can fix this game, it is a gameplay system problem and the example u brought to prove thats wrong is laughable actually u brought feng compared to kuma!! Really? First u cant just prove the entire point by mentioning one character compared to another from the top 5 characters in this game, secondly its a system problem coz the entire heat system was a mistake, we don't need to hide it in cameras anymore, be a man about it and just state the obvious, its over designed its screen freeze in the mid of the game is frustrating and killing the flow of the game and it managed to make every single character im the game play exactly the same.
If konami somehow be a responsible company and respect their core fans they would make a mode without heat and chip dmg and completely rebalance the entire game i guarantee u that mode will be the most played and pros will play tournaments in that mode only.
T8 rewards mashers.
If the same player tried Tekken 7, they'd struggle so badly to get the offence going 😂.
Tekken 8 rewards people who attack..That's not mashing Tekken 7 rewards players who don't want to attack..That's the difference
@@tryingtochangemyways5074that’s funny
@@tryingtochangemyways5074incorrect tekken 7 reward fundamentals tekken 8 indeed reward mashing aka attacking when it’s very much not your turn
No. Yall do not want to block. The game gives you so many get out of jail free cards. I have to hard read the scrubbery all day.
@@GibbyVee im saying, i will make hard reads all day just to reset the offense only for the scrub to pop heat burst and put me back into a psuedo mix that won't work
A nice system change would be to let players choose between Rage or Heat. Having access to both in every round is too much.
They would have to remove heat for me to play tekken again and they arnt going to do that, after 6 years of playing tekken I stopped playing three months back and havent looked back.
From my perspective i don't care much for the why or how, when I played tekken 8, whatever that is is just isnt tekken to me and that puts a fine line on it.
Arslan is right. If he made this comment on a Reddit page, I'm sure he'd be told to get good though.
Playing against the same characters we keep seeing is stressful, and some of those characters are especially cancerous to repeatedly deal with. A match with Yoshi and Alisa feels like a circus act.
I personally think the developers should make the heat system like rage art , once the hp drops below 25% the player get access to heat burst making heat burst “do or die” element
I think they only need to do a couple of things and that can make Tekken 8 a lot better for both pro players and casual players.
-Not only nerf characters like Yoshi, Nina and Dragunov but also nerf underrated yet powerful characters like Jin, Bryan,Kuma, Claudio and King.
-Buff backdash and have a little bit larger map(not too large though) where getting one launch into wall mix ups/pressure isn't so easy.
Hey guys, if you want to have fun in Tekken, stay in blue ranks. I'm there, and there's sooooo much you can do with patience, almost no rush down at all.
I think would be nice if we could start the match without heat bar already full, it has to be empty; cheap damage would fill that bar, little by little giving it actually a purpose. Just this simple change would help a lot, giving also a reason to heat, becaming a real earned, rewarded, comeback mechanic.The engager could be used after a short bit of cheap damage to break up a situation with a lot of pressure, or later in the game with a full heat bar to add some layering and merit to the system. You would actually earn ur heat. I hope also ra would be same as t7.
My wishlist for season 2 for Harada and company to make the game better,
-Buff Backdash(this is must)
-Nerf Heat engagers(they shouldn't be +17 rather they should just be +7 or +8)
-nerf characters like Nina, Yoshi, Bryan,Jin, Dragunov, Claudio and Kuma.
you can't play tekken in this game, neutral play doesn't exist it's just unga bunga plus frames, guessing, panic armor moves and custscenes that's it ...the charascters are highly overpowered, the combos are too long , the damage is ridiculous, one launch at round start and the round is over , the gameplay is highly boring and uninteresting.
Eskay is completely right. Tekken was never a pleasing game to look for spectators and Tekken 7 did A LOT to improve that - if you disagree try watching some older tekkens other people from other fightning games or communities will not get hyped over it.
But I don't think the quality of the game should be considering but how much fun it is for spectators and people outside. To me the biggest problem is that playing Tekken 8 and it's gameplay is not fun. It's too much and it gets boring and tedious really fast.
I don't dislike the core mechanics, I like Heat and the way it works, but I feel like Heat is for some characters HUGE but for others is mid.
50/50s are problematic for some characters, I feel like characters that have the best 50/50 mixups are also characters that dominate the top tiers.
For a game that relies on 50/50s so heavily, the Low Parry in its current state is really bad. It should take your extender and leave the damage untouched or it should scale your damage but keep your combo extender.
I really like Tekken 8, I do think it is the best the series has been in a complete fashion for years. I just want some balance changes for our top tier characters, low parry made viable and the frames for some stuff adjusted. Tekken 8 has a lot of spammable strings that are 50/50s that have safe or even plus enders that require you to guess low / mid / high
Despite the many complaints about the current state of T8 from various pro players in the competitive Tekken scene, I still have high hopes where S2 will take the game since Murray and Harada have been monitoring every request and fixes to the game as of recent on Twitter/X. But yeah, best of luck to the devs though. 👍
I dunno about removal of defensive tools for defensive characters.
Like I play Lili and her whole thing is her movement. Like if i had to choose between removing her new 50/50 or nerfing her ss i would rather remove former since I have primarily been playing the character as a movement based character and if I want to play a 50/50 character, I would just pick them up as pocket character rather than not having any movement based character in the game. One of most satisfying thing for me is to get a good whiff from a well timed ss when everyone is complaining about how movement is irrelevant in this game
I think one thing that is overlooked is how the monitzation practices, overall cost of the game is multiplying peoples dissatisfaction with the game play. Like critizim was harsh for T7 but nothing like ive seen in T8 and i think the consumer value ripped out of this game has had a monumental part to play for the average person.
The game has lots of issues and instead of transparency and immediate fixes we got microtransactions smashed down our throats. In my country (Australia) standard edition is still $115, delux is $160, and ulitmate is $180. Characters are $12 and stages are $7.50. Now let me ask you if you paid $160 and the stages werent free because people didnt complain you would have piad $182.50 for all of aeason 1 content. If i bought standard i would have paid $173.50 with the characters and stages if they werent free. How the fuck does delux end up costing you more then standard? And, if you were paying close to $200 for a game (S1 content only) wouldn't you expect the game to deliver on the minimum front and address key gameplay and online functionality issues? The game is straight up a rip off from a consumer value point of view and the gameplay is not good enough to justify the price tag.
This is least ive ever played a Tekken game and legacy players are dropping of because they hate the game. Some of my favourite pro player and content creators i rarely see stream or straight up quit. Ty, Joey Furry, Frame Whisperer, Arsenalty. Legacy player dont just leave without good reason and i think the reasons are pretty blatantly obvious and aligns with what Arslan, Kokkoma, Knee, Ulsan, and other pro paluers have been saying.
this guy is a namco shill he doesn't have a real opinion on the matter, he just sugar coats the problems and yaps alot
Heat sure isn't helping either, It's too rewarding and too often. I always said it should be buildable, so it would climax at the final rounds. To think Bamco wanted to give two heat smashes on each round was crazy
ty for your honest coporate answer
I want the heat meter to matter, start at zero and be earned through good play maybe even carry over between rounds.
I want heat engagers to be activated through a secondary input the same as heat dashes hold forward after input. This would make gaining an advantage more skillful as you have to hit confirm heat engagers, with the added benefit of using a move without using your heat bar.
I want low risk high reward moves to be nerfed in a way that still makes them viable but have counter play.
I want chip damage to certain moves in heat to be straight up nerfed along with Yoshi's ability to heal an entire life bar of chip in one combo. Jun should be the healer it's like the one thing she had going for her.
I want the bugs with clipping through characters and teleporting them around fixed. Leo as of last patch is bugged out even worse with Jack and the Bears pushing them through people at the wall.
I want less tracking on string enders on many characters.
I want the 2-wall splat safety net that was implemented with 1.0 should extend to side splat as well, on stages like arena you can walk them around the wall with jab dashes and if you mess up engage heat to reset it back to wall it clearly isn't intended.
I want Anti cheat, it really needs to be implemented in this day and age, to at least stop the widely available free cheats from working and price out a lot of people.
I want the heat activation non macro to work as intended as it is now its a crap shoot if it will come out when input, the one button macro is mandatory.
I would love for Namco Support to not be a couple of people on twitter. Official webpage just returns server not found errors after you go through all the AI automated stuff. Why do problems have to trend on Twitter to be addressed that is awful.
The Family Share on Steam needs to be addressed that's upward of 8 free alt accounts that can be used to rank boost and cheat if one gets banned the main account owner should get a ban as well. Its up to them to give auth to their account so change a EULA and get on with it.
I want stage variety to be way higher starting at 4 through 6 the stages were plentiful and had lots of variety now every stage is small and everyone can carry to a wall no matter what. I mean Ortiz farm is pretty cool.
I want who ever read this to have a nice day.
But sf6 is literally based off strike or throw. Dragonrush allows you start strike throw from any distance
The funny part with all of this is that EU and especially NA aren't really getting as many upsets compared to T7 so far, the results for the Koreans and Pakistan players seems even more consistent even though this game has been scrubbed down and "anybody can win".
I think its in part because many of the EU and NA top players seem to REALLY not like this game and its showing up in their placements. Guys like Joey Fury and Anakin arent out competing and I suspect its in large part due to the game being...shit in terms of design and balance.
The chars in T8 are presented as their own caricatures from T7, but without their souls & personalities 😮😮😮
i would like heat to not be available every single round, it's way too powerful especially for some characters
They dont play their own damn game
Devs just went too heavy-handed on aggression imo. Could have had a healthly medium. Also liked the point that you can do aggressive play without turning everyone into a 50/50 machine
I think they should scale chip damage back to about 25% of what it is now, then nerf the top tiers and we'll be solid after that. We do not need to get rid of heat or rage
I hope this game goes more a bit in the direction of T7. Right now, every character essentially do the same thing, pressure 50/50, heat mechanics and guessing game. Not as much fun as T7 was. The game does look very good, best looking tekken ever
Realistically im not too worried T7 in year one was a way different game than its final year. Character balance will come with time most likely after TWT ends. I anjoy the more active gameplay and guessing. T7 just felt like only 2 or 3 Characters got to do anything everyone else just held their breath and hoped for a good sidestep or low perry
Tbh i was getting tired of watching the arslan ash x knee show by the end of tekken 7. When I tune in to watch a tournament now and for those who sign up to play, there's at least an element of uncertainty that can work against even the classically considered "best players"
thats the problem, no one wanted to get gud so the devs dumped the skill off in T8 and now nobodies are winning and its not that impressive anymore.
there isnt a barrier to skill anymore its just luck and oppressive combos with little to no way to escape or reverse a situation other than heat and rage farts its garbage.
I wouldn't say nobodies are winning, it's still a lot of pros that people know and respect but it's a wider variety of them and their different characters in top 8s which is infinitely more enjoyable as both a spectator and as a player
To say that there's no barrier to skill and that it's just luck is a bit reductive. The skill barrier to success has been lowered, yes, and there is more of a luck/guessing component than T7 but then it's a matter of opinion if the downstream effects of that are preferred or not. Personally it's exciting to know that there's more of an "anything is possible" vibe with this game than there was in T7
So you find it fair the game devolved to give weak players options to best better players?? That's fine to you?
arslan vs knee show? so you watch 1 tournament a year and get tired of it? so many tournaments, especially at the end of 7, where knee was nowhere to see and ulsan completly dominated koera... it really feels like you guys ehard that somewhere and now thats is why tekken7 was boring to watch for you.
I think removing the tools to deal with these insane mixups made the game balancing bad. So no matter what you have to eat the mixup.
I enjoy Tekken 8. But that’s probably because I’ll play for a couple weeks then stop. Then not pick it up until months later. Too busy to play frequently.
There are many many things I want to see in season two but above all I want to see safe power crush heat engagers put in the bin! The most scrub friendly move to have ever touched a fighting game.
They can fix Tekken 8 if they buff backdash a little so that new players can't just rely on 50/50 and heat so they will have to learn movement and basic Tekken skills to get better.
I personally think the Rev Major set between Knee and JDCR was decent, but there's definitely been better Tekken played, Qudans VS JDCR @ TWT2017, Korea VS Japan @ Master Cup 7 in TTT2, Anakin VS Everyone (lol) @ MLG in T6...
I want to suggest that part of the reason people enjoyed the Rev Major match is because it's Knee VS JDCR, JDCR had dominated Knee for a while in TTT2 and early in T7, Knee was getting results VS JDCR in the Rev Major tourney, coupled with the fact that it was held in the Philippines where they LOVE Tekken and are a very vocal crowd. All these things combined to make it very momentous. The match itself is a bit overhyped though.
Tekken 8 tried to fix the turtle nature of 7, but did it with a god damn sledgehammer.
There's definitely fun in playing it, but I don't think it has the legs to go the distance like 7 did, or at least not without changes.
Hopefully Bandai realizes they need to tone down the game.
At least Heat should be "meter" that you need to deserve and cannot use every round without thinking. That would help much
The fact that 28hr alisa main or a nina masher can beat a 1000hr specialist steve just tells me all I need to know about this dumbed down Make-a-Wish fighting game.
Oh wow I sure hope the people replying to Eskay's tweet are going to be sane and not start insulting those who disagree with them
Always fun when you have to chase a character the entire round because they have broken backswing moves that allow them to escape everything you do with 0 consequences. Ironically, this is in the same game where the extreme opposite also happens, when other characters can rush you down infinitely and force 50/50s even when they are very minus and launch you if you dared to guess wrong or sidestep. Some characters can do both of these things as well. Tekken 8 is stressful.
Arslan says he doesnt want to get in a 50/50 guessing for his life after being comboed? Hilarious considering who he played in T7, especially in the last TWT finals.
I'm ok with Tekken being this crowd pleaser now. I just wish a new virtua fighter arrives.
I feel like no one talks about the tracking system… needs to be tone down. Also chip damage needs to be tone down imo, unreactable counterhit lows should be sidesteppable to both side… at least. Also some character has too much pressure tool that you have to respect otherwise you die in like 5 sec but if you do block them they easily break your guard and if you wanna get away by their pressure you just can’t… for example dragunov or Nina, howarang. 0 startap heat smashes shouldn’t exist in the game so as safe powercrushes. Somethimes you can’t punish unsafes moves for some reason.
Tekken 8 gives everyone a chance to win which is perfect for everyone and yeah I love seeing new faces rather than seeing Arslan always win every damn tournament like in Tekken 7. If they still want to play Tekken 7 rules then just play Tekken 7 maybe create tournaments for that game as well just like with the Smash Community
Just nerf the damage that involves heat …..and change it to where all the auto-pilot attacks do way less damage……or add a perfect guard 😅
did spag just say yoshi has some of the best combos and pokes in the game?
I know he's strong, but those are not things he's particularly special at compared to the rest of the roster
Tekken 8 isn't good for competitive play, it may be fun for some casual players but not for professional players.
Just remove the Magic 4 in T7 and you will have a more fun game already... people can be more aggresive because they are not afraid of being magic 4ed....
T8 is just dumb 50/50 BS...
Ive played tekken since the first one and for very long ive always couldnt get into tekken because i didnt understand its movement. T8 was the first one where i was like okay im going to learn tekken this time. I learned more about the movement found some BNBs and now i love it. Maybe its because im just now "getting it" but im not seeing the same issue. Even with that Kuma clip you played. If the bryan would have delayed his getup wouldnt have kuma whiffed the high and then bryan could have retaliated. So is it really a matter of people being in constant 50/50 blenders being the issue or are people even pros actually forgetting or not doing the proper response. Idk im going to reinstall t7 and see how it feels now. Cause idk T8 isnt perfect but alot of people are making it seem like a baby game and i completely disagree.
Problem with Tekken 8 is that you won't actually realise how pathetic the game is if you are not spending money and travelling around the world. It's fun if you are playing this game in your home.
I just really want backdash to be better again. Buff movement. leave attacks, damage, chip, busted stuff in place
maybe you shouldn't plug on people in ranked, dickhead. glad i fuckin found you, ya bum scrub. you were the Devil Jin that plugged on me in the Dojo Stage. and fuck players who backdash all the time, you're just fishing for whiffs and have no real skill for aggression. this is why you plugged.
Actually, I started playing tekken after that match