ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 13 ก.ย. 2024
- There is a mod called "sc evo complete" that allows players to play with Broodwar units against StarCraft 2 units! Here's me vs Winter playing StarCraft Terran vs StarCraft Protoss
Support the Modders of SC EVO Complete! www.paypal.com...
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🐷 Second Channel for Learning StarCraft 2: / pigrandom
🐷 Third Channel for Daily Pro Casts: / pigcasts
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🐷 Watch live at / x5_pig
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#Starcraft2 #SC2 #PiGStarcraft
5 bases before even building an observatory. Pig is the type of Protoss ape that Artosis has nightmares about
Ape together strong. 🦾
i honestly have no interest in watching anything but this mod right now. Its so much fun
This is the reason why I started playing Starcraft 2 online for the first time.
I feel like it will take a lot of time before I try Starcraft 2 races.
Yeah bro would’ve thought it would take this long. We want a ladder for this!
Agreed
The hardest part of playing Protoss in Brood War is doing all of the crazy macro that PiG did in this video but doing it in the shitty BW engine where the game is constantly fighting you. In SC2, macroing all of those bases is easy.
But true, long macro games in SC2 have bigger scale, also micro has much higher possible level due to nice responsiveness of game engine. So SC2 has its difficulties on the top level, and btw why the fck am I writing this if it isn't an "SC2 is shit compared to SC1" whine?
@@sviatoslavkocherov6008 Yea I'm not at all trying to bash either game (except for the game's engine which I absolutely am bashing because I find it so annoying to deal with) I'm merely pointing out how easy it is to do what PiG did in this video compared to how much more difficult it is to do in the game where it's actually supposed to be played.
I love seeing SC2 content creators discover Brood War balance. This mod is so great.
lol. Welcome to Broodwar. I played Broodwar at a high level. Never relaly got into SC2 seriously, but it's such a similar game obviously. Surprisingly your build as Protoss was pretty good. It worked out because he fast expanded but usually it's 1 gate core expo , robo, into 2 gate then third base. If he had vultures on the map you just lose. For Terran, you need to move around with vultures more and try to deny bases, also scan more. You need a lot more multi tasking. That's why Terran is so hard in BW. You need like 250 APM.
Hearing the siege tanks sing the Ride of the Valkyries will never not make me smile
I wonder if they ported over the sound bites from clicking on the same unit multiple times. The only thing better than the Ride of the Valkyries is listening to the guy about to drop the hammer and dispense some indiscriminate justice. Or the battlecruiser captain having to go number 1. Or the dropship doing her Ferro impersonation.
Bruv built his 8th base before Winter even got his 4th...
That is fairly standard in Broodwar, it is really hard for terran to get a 4th in TvP.
God I love the old sounds. especially the siege tank.
When aliens really sounded like aliens
Yes! The new siege tanks cannot compare.
@@matth1005 The only good thing about protoss in SC2 is the PILF Selendis.
Maybe it's the nostalgia talking but the Starcraft 1 game sounds were sooo much better
I don't think it's nostalgia, SC1 truly was Blizzard at their peak.
Agreed, the sounds are so much better, also prefer the design of SC1 the Protoss were really alien and not space elfs Like in SC 2 , Also prefer the zerg in SC 1.
I feel like they took a bad design decision with the whole universe. SC2 feels like Warcraft in space . Even with space magic.
On the other hand, i think Terrain is in the same level.
@@Lmaokekw975 the Overmind felt like an incomprehensibly intelligent being of pure thought connected to the deepest stands of the universe. SC2 Kerrigan feels like a cheesy action figure complete with canned one-liners. I agree about the terrans though, they had a badass underdog storyline in both games
1:00
BW workers are faster than the SC2 workers in this mod. The stats don't show it, because it just shows top speed (which is the same), but BW workers accel and brake faster, so they end up spending more time at top speed.
Load up a map with some BW and some SC2 computer players and just watch their mineral lines. The BW workers visibly, noticeably, demonstrably faster.
edit: my guess is because of the 8 mineral return for BW workers, so they sped them up a bit.
I think they need that kind of buff because they don't have Inject ChronoMULEs.
Yes but SC2 has Banelings. GG Atheists
thats to compensate the fact that in the mod sc1 units dont mine 8 minerals like they do in the original, thats why they have faster mining speed to compensate for that due to differences in game engines. Original starcraft workers get 8 mineral per trip versus sc2's 5
@@soldier22881 Couldn't they increase their carry capacity?
Probably not, because Terasin and Golden minerals do that too.
Makes sense.
@@karpai5427 not sure, guess its the person who created the mod didnt want to change it or somethin
Nice games! Science Vessel with EMP really helps out late game. Removes shields as well as energy.
The supply was like 80% probes in the first game
Every time I hear BW sounds, it just reminds me how uninspired SC2 sound design is. Everything is just so homogenous and lacking in character, like they just looked at every unit and said "what would this practically sound like" instead of thinking creatively. You really hear that with probes. In BW, they sound so strange and alien, with their warbled, distorted language. Gives you the sense they're semi-intelligent lifeforms that the protoss created. In SC2? BEEP BOOP I'M A WORKER ROBOT. REMEMBER WALL-E?
EDIT: I might have been wrong about SC2 probes since they use a lot of the SC1 sounds. I was thinking more of Probius in HotS.
That also extends to the OST. The StarCraft Terran OST is so iconic and memorable. The StarCraft 2 Terran OST sounds like generic action soundtrack.
@@michiduta07 Eh, it's not bad, but it doesn't have the PUNCH that SC1's does. That's the common theme with the sound design. It gets the job done, and that's about it. They took zero creative risk.
@@michiduta07 I love both SC 1&2 OST's, they're different for me, just can't be compared. But SC1 voice lines are much better, especially additional for tanks)))))
yes SC BW better than SC2 no question everyone agree!
but bruh this comment is literally look like complain only for the sake of complain at this point...
Of all iconic sound that should be complain like marine gun/ tank/ hydra/ etc, you went for probe? It is the only few sound in SC2 that good, it literally just remix of old sound and expand more lol, see what I mean that it look like you just complain for sake of it instead of have good reason why?
and Yes I saw your EDIT. still no excuse
and Yes this is a complain of a complain because I drunk as hell :p good day to all the crafter
@@surfing6824 If you saw my edit, then wtf are you commenting about it for? Never comment on YT drunk. My point still stands. Kinda sounds like you wrote out your comment and only expanded for the edit after, but were too stubborn (and drunk) to press backspace.
Numbwr 1 baby. But U need the dragoon range to out range the bunker
it seems that he already knows that, since the dragoons are outranging the bunker
I honestly hope Blizzard adds a SC1 evo mod ladder to the game. I think I speak for A LOT of people when I say that I love the units, meta, and game flow of Brood War more than SC2 and lack of warp gate/creep/mules, but the game's old engine, 12 unit select, lack of multiple building select, and horrific unit pathing is so unplayably bad that I can't make myself play it and just play SC2 instead. Many of the long term SC2 fans in the community might remember a mod called Starbow, and how popular that was for a stint. I was so sad that it died and nothing came of it, so I hope this mod takes things further and becomes more of a mainstay at the very least.
Also, Blizzard caved to the World of Warcraft community and realized people wanted to play the old expansions, and even made versions of the game that are based around the old game but with new balance patches, and it's more popular than the retail game and has completely saved game. I could definitely see this mod help bridge the giant gap between the Brood War and SC2 community, and make things fresher and also bring new blood into the scene.
i believe the workers move faster to compensate for not having chronoboost. looks like its a change to all sc1 races so they wont fall behind economically
I have one idea for a nieche interactions of Sc1&2 Terrans for this trio of mods (there are 3 versions of Starcraft Evolution Complete: port of Starcraft 1 with minor balancing, balance edition with new units and upgrades for Sc1, and finally *only* Sc1 without balance changes and with mosr Sc1 mechanics.) the other day, so I'm gonna tell it here, even if it doesn't fit as much here:
*What if Sc1 Terran could addon-steal from Sc2 Terran, with specifically Barracks?* It will be incredibly nieche, but we already *SHOULD* have it with Sc1 Queens "Infest Command Centre" ability *(which I want to see used in a match and see if it works on Sc2 Terran, especially on Orbitals and Planitaries)* , so it's would be fine to add!
Now for the specifics: all Sc1 Terran unit production structures could steal Sc2 Terran addons, which would give them either double que or ability to build any unit, that requers an Sc1 addon, and those unit's upgrades (a.k.a. if Sc1 buildings steal an Sc2 addon, it works the same as it works for Sc2 buildings.). Also, when Sc1 Barracks steals lab addon, *it gains an ability to research Combat Shields in this addon for Sc1 Marines,* since Official Blizzard Sc1 Marine skin for Sc2 already has it's own model for Combat Shields! I think it's so nieche, it doesn't need further balancing beyond just implementing it!
It's also works in reverse, although only for one building - *Sc2 Command Centers could steal Commsats, and use them even after turning to either Orbitals or Planitaries!*
Honestly, I want someone try 3 meme strats with Sc1 races in this mod, those being: *Mass Wraith for the Memes!* Queens with mass (Volatile) Infested Terrans from Infested Command Centers! And finally, *"Steal your army + I play 3 races at once" with mass Dark Archons!!!*
You need to scan more as Terran to scout your opponents builds so you don't get surprised in there are sudden tech switch. Scan is already a cheat code in BW since you're in the know of what's happening even they try their best to hide the tech. Also Goliath can mow those Carriers if you focus fire on them they die like in 2 to 3 volleys and their fire rate and range is great for a 2 supply ground unit. Also don't allow Protoss to get all the bases. Use Vultures to set mines to mining bases to deny them building Nexus and hide those Vultures in the corner of other starting locations to snipe Probes.
seems everyone wants to play bw t as sc2 t. Build up a predictable set of 3 units and then march out at a given timing. Clearly doesn't work
Spider mines are like Terran creep!
Mind control SCVs and build protoss terran mech
Q: How many gateways do you need?
Pig: Yes 😂
Love to see your terran game! It's a hard race but super strategic and fun to play. Thanks for the game!
Pig please try playing the all campaign units mod.
Every unit has like 5 different selections, including stuff like dragoons, or stalkers with 3 blinks.
There is so many cool possibilities.
1) Goliaths are the best anti-air tool of the Terran but you need to focus down Carries (if you catch them in open ground). Goliaths with upgrades match the range of the carriers but Carriers may reach up to 12 by Leashing the interceptors. This means that Carriers are best used over hilly terrain and not open ground where Goliaths could just get in range and wipe them out... Carrirs are quite expensive, take 6 supply and cost more than 3 Goliaths combined but 1 carrier CANNOT kill 3 goliaths in any shape or form. Goliaths suck against ground so transition to Goliaths needs to happen only if Toss plans to transition to mass Carriers (if you see more then 3 stargates than carriers are coming)....
2) Arbiters are the best Toss caster and that says a lot considering that Toss also has Templars and DarkArchons, both incredibly strong units... However all these units have the same counter: the Science Vessel. EMP hard-counters Protoss in SC1 as it takes out 100% of energy and 100% of the shields... And Toss needs his Arbiters and Templars to break through Terran lines...
Defensive Matrix is no joke either as it make tank/goliaths more resilient.
3) Vultures are IMBA (IMHO). They always were! There are 2 reasons for this:
- they are very-very fast which make them perfect for scouting, base denial and harass and they do bonus damage against small units (Zealots, zerglings, workers)
- they have the spider mine; probably the kings of area denial... Free units with the capability to kill expensive units like Dragoons, Templars and Reavers.
You need to build more Vultures and constantly harass with them. You have the APM so it should not be that hard :). I have seen games were only vultures and tanks were build (with turrets for detectors) and the Toss was not able to do anything...
PS. I have seen some comments regarding Ghosts... In the SC1 engine Ghosts would have been (mostly) useless against Toss as Lockdown needed to be casted individually by selecting each Ghost. That took a lot of micro and could have been countered by a single Arbiter with a good placement of a Stasis Field. However in the SC2 engine this is not the case. You can have several ghosts in one group and rapid fire Lock-down to stun several carriers at-once... The Ghost lockdown is crazy strong in SC2 as it has the same range as the carrier (8), is instant-cast and, unlike stasis field allows your units to hit (and kill) the stunned unit (but only works on mechanical: Dragoons, Reavers, Carriers ... you know the strong Toss units)...
PS2. In SC2 mode, the SC1 Terran is crazy OP as issues with path finding and group selection made it impossible for Terran to use its capabilities at the maximum.
Hahah I don't have time to watch this right now, but the thumbnail and title made me go in and give you a like and a comment.
I think that a lot of the problem I've been seeing with people playing this mod is they forget about entire units and their spells/abilities in relation to other units. Sc1 terran has lockdown, emp on the science vessel, a better version of irradiate I think (could be wrong), their BC's do more damage per shot at a slower rate of fire, making them able to 1 shot a lot of units if you have 5-6 of them. Everyone seems to go vulture, tank, goliath, or they try bio and ignore the firebat against light units (it has 60 hp, is the same size as a marine and has STIM! It's also cheap and low supply), as well as ghosts with lockdown and nukes (which are unexpected and can be hard to spot). There are more options than people seem to think, at least as far as I've seen so far. Maybe there are people playing a bit better, though being scouted early is still a big problem and can invalidate a lot of strats. I'm not the greatest player and don't have very good micro (my macro is not bad), my map vision is bad and my awareness is pitiful, so I may just be too incompetent to understand why nobody uses the things I've pointed out, but perhaps I've given some food for thought? Also, dark archon is crazy busted against zerg with maelstrom and mind control shouldn't be underestimated either.
Forgetting about Science Vessels is kinda weird, actually, since they are used in BW TvP, last I checked. The rest of that stuff is BW habits, but honestly I wouldn't be surprised if Ghosts were a lot more useful in SC2 than BW simply because of the simpler casting.
ghosts are pretty terrible in sc1. maybe in the sc2 engine they'd be better, but i dont think so. Occasionally someone tries to make them work (Sharp in ASL), but they are just too expensive for what they do.
Otherwise though i agree with you.
Seems Artosis way right all way along!
Thanks for the video!
43:53 amazing comedic timing lmao.
It’s not a pvt from brood war unless 1 zealot that goes across the map kills the Terran
Wraiths are a pretty good counter to Carriers. The issue is they are only good against air, so if they have a mixed army, or if they quick switch away from air, your wraiths aren't very good.
In bw you can keep mining the gas when it’s empty but it’ll only give you like +1 or whatever. It’s better than nothing. Does it work in this mod?
it gives 2 afaik
that 2nd game was a banger I loved it. Want more of this for sure.
You should obviously scan more for info and be ready for carrier transition. And since vessels could help vs arbiters if you can EMP them in time. Also when protoss runs carriers like than he screams HIT ME BRO, cuz goliaths focus fire can snipe them down pretty quick, in BW you need careful micro them over cliffs, to not get shot like that.
I wonder if Scouts are cheaper in this mod, since they buffed Zealot shields by 10 here.
im not sure how many shields zealots have in this mod, but 60 shields was the default in bw
Lol dude 37 gateways, yeah I think it's safe to say you're "gateway man"
The storm animation is so badass
I think the biggest buff that BW races get is the spellcaster QoL - provided they don't get picked apart by the more mobile SC2 counterparts before hand.
no one is building valcarys at a terran. püüüh, W H Y?
They are sooo great
You need to make ghosts with lockdown!
Can you get this mod on mac?
Why don't terrains build Valkyries when protoss go air? Why always Goliaths?
Soo nice design for KeSPA map preview
The mining really fast is because SC1 workers have ridiculous acceleration. They really are returning minerals faster because it takes them less time to turn around.
SC2 Terrans. I need mules.
SC1 Terrans. Hold my beer.
SC1 pylons have 3x the hp/shields of SC2 pylons, but they nerfed them to 250/250 for this mod.
9:10 Broodwar Terran is easy
*Flash* enters the chat
the goliath portrait looks awsome in this mod unlike wings of liberty campaign. man wings of liberty was a downgrade
should have hotkeyed your comsat stations!
Is there a reason every sc1 terran just goes tank/vulture and then gets surprised by air? It's a shame terran never got more than 3 units ;)
Stasis was brutal in BW and no different here... can't be removed with medic's restoration either, plus units tend to clump more.
Difficult for BW Terran to take bases, due to low mobility.
Battlecruisers are an all-in strategy that scarcely pays off due to storm and God forbid dark archons should your opponent scout your physics lab, and dropships are super slow, so you're stuck fighting on the ground.
Overall, BW Terrans are at an inherent disadvantage. Vultures go a long way but they can't win games by themselves versus competent opponents. Ghost's are meant to counter carriers but their lockdown ability apparently got nerfed in this mod (45 to 15 seconds), which feels unreasonable since they're so fragile and gas heavy to begin with.
Not sure I agree... Yes, Stasis is Brutal, but EMP is a good counter against it and against Storm and against Archons... I agree, BCs are slow (unlike the SC2 BCs) and generally not worth the investment but BCs are not "the go to units against Toss" at top level probably for good reasons......
Vultures are incredibly strong, and they have always been and not just because of mines but because they counter fast melee units (like zerglings and zealots with speed) while being being capable out-running Dragoons or drag them into mines.. Mines are just broken... I mean a free unit with splash damage capably of crippling several Dragoons or kill a bunch of Hydras in one shot should be considered broken...
In BW, terrans had a small macro disadvantage (mostly in lower leagues), since you needed to click each building to make units. Zerg where capable of making several units at once and Toss macro, while similar to terran had the advantage the units took longer to be made and where more expensive which gave you more time to do something else...
However considering that more than half of premier tournaments where won by Terrans and on ladder Terran has more the 54% win-rate against both Toss and Zerg, I would not call Terrran at disadvantage...
In SC2 engine, Terran (against Legacy Toss and Zerg) should, mathematically, be Broken. Lockdown become overpowered due to group casting (hence the nerf), Goliaths no longer have pathfinding issues which means that all of them get into the fight and, as a Toss you don't want to fight in the open Goliaths even if you have Carriers.
Due to having more minerals and SCVs at the begining, the Vulture timings have moved up considerably so, to survive as Toss you really, really need to lock your base properly and get detection ASAP. Pretty much to counter just 4 vultures (which cost about 75minerals each + 450/250 (for 2xfactory and 1xaddon) + 150(for 1xBarracks) + 200/200 (for speed and mines upgrades) = 1100/450) you need at least 2 Dragoon and 1 observer (250/100 + 25/75 + 500 (foe 2 x gates + 1x cybernetics core) + 250/300 (Robotics + Observatory) + 150/150 range upgrade for Dragoons = 1175/625. But in reality you kind of need 3 dragoons which add additional 125/50 resources...
I’m curious; why don’t you use army hotkeys? You’re always clicking the map and then grabbing your army for some reason, which seems way slower.
I believe he usually uses super customised hotkeys which are broken in this mod so he has to play with a setup he isn't used to.
Pig usually uses core, but his keybinds aren't carrying neatly over to the brood war mod (IIRC from the last stream). He's pretty used to box micro which is needed anyway so...
Is there any tutorial how i can install the mod? What do i have to download.. where do i have to put it etc. I couldnt find any video or article about it.
Could anyone give me a hint ? :)
So in Starcraft 2 most mods you dont have install manually you just go to the custom menu then click melee select any map you like then click "create with mod" and search for "SC: EVO Complete"
If blizzard came out with sc2:brood war edition, they might save sc2
dragoons with real pathing is just unfair.
FYI, Zealots got +10 Shields to compensate for the lack of speed
+20 lmao
They had 160 Total health always.
First it was 80/80 and in latest Brood War it is 100/60.
Kentrum is wrong!
Unless you talk about Sc2 Zealot. I don't know their stats.
@@karpai5427 SC2 zealots 50 shields, 100 HP, BW ones 60/100, but in this mod they have 70/100.
@@karpai5427 Yes, SC2 Zealots are 100/50, so bw Zealots have +20 shields in comparison
Zealot is 60/100 in BW, used to be 80/80. Probably 70/100 for mod balance.
No Vessel on late game terran 💀
is that macrosoft === winterstracrfat on the other team
sc1 tanks are soooo much better
The Dominion has fallen. If Edmund Duke was there, that Crucio sloppy excuse of a siege tank would not be accepted in the army.
K
oh man Idk about that custom bunker model, that looks bad lol
Eeally feel could've microed better instead of wave after wave
Brother, you build 37 gateways against a 3 base opponent and wish you could micro better?
Have a little fun in this game!