Very well explained. As someone who trains in both karate and judo I can see so much crossover. Combining the two in my training makes it so much more fun.
Kenji, I am subscribed to your channel as well. Can you make a response video to this video? I would be very interested in watching your response video.
@@igotmydd214 that would be interesting, I can do a video about judo style throws in karate Kata however I don't know as much on the Goju-ryu side and it's history. Although it would still be a good idea, thanks.
@@igotmydd214 I can add them into the video, however in my training I've only found one type of judo style throw in Naihanchi/Tekki. There are other techniques that can be used as throws and I'm sure there are more, but I use Naihanchi mostly as close quarters clinch fighting.
@@makenjikarate a followup for my suggestion: I was speaking of Naihanchi Shodan from the perspective of Shorin-Ryu, I believe it is called Tekki Shodan in Shotokan
Probably the Canon of Judo is the bible of Judo with Mifune bring generally regarded as the technician. The Gokyo is simply regarded as the basics. There are hundreds of throws in the full Judo Curriculum.
Great video. I trained Shotokan primarily, but have cross trained with other style and marveled at how Shotokan, and any karate style, dovetails so well with grappling techniques. Later as I developed a deeper understanding of karate history I realized how obvious the connection was. It really culminated with my study of Hoteikan Ryu in Brooklyn, which trains Shotokan, Judo and Sosuishi Ryu Jiu Jitsu. And yes, BJJ is a great complement to karate!
Goju kenpo throws has taught from Ichikawa Sosui are simple to throw so the Adversary can NOT break fall with Budo mind doing as much damage as posible to the person you are throwing, Throw to smash /break Chris Bubish resipent.
I'm a Hapkido 6th Dan. 10 years ago I decided that my throws needed to be better. Hapkido does do a lot of throws but most of them are joint lock related. Hapkido does have a strong Judo influence so I decided that cross training in Judo was the answer to improvement. Ten years later I have a Judo Shodan. It turns out that Judo is more sophisticated than I thought in the beginning. A Wado Ryu Nidan friend of mine wanted to teach more of the throws in that karate style so I told him to take some Judo, who better to teach it than the guys and gals who do 1,000 throws per practice.
I began to train with a friend whose style is shorin ryu, I was lucky to train with 2 profesional mma fighters a year before so when I look at those kata is striking clear all the joint locks, throws and other similarities with judo and jiu jitsu, many more than goju ryu katas.
Could you please do a history lesson on jiu-jitsu styles? Including Differentiation between each countries and how their styles compare to each. I think you would explain it well.
I love that you have Eiji Yoshikawa's Musashi in your bookcase. Awesome book! Curiously are you aware of the semi modern Budo martial art that's a mix of Karate (Japanese instead of Okinawan) and Judo known as Daido Juku/Kudo Karate?
What grade do you reccomend to start cross training in Judo? I am actually a 4th kyu in shotokan karate (orange belt), and we don't train throws at all at my dojo. I thought I would wait until I reach black belt to take some Judo lessons in order to complement my Karate
Great topic, and let me commend you on citing your sources! It can be rare, but is appreciated. Personally, I am a Jiu-Jitero who has crossed over and is now learning Shorin-Ryu since the first pandemic lockdowns happened in the US. Not having BJJ was a major adjustment, but since my Karate Renaissance, I have undergone quite a phase change in my martial understanding. I think anyone will have a raised awareness of their martial art, as well as their chosen art to cross train with. The best martial art in the West to crosstrain in would be BJJ(specifically for this period in time). My reasoning is that the instruction of BJJ is such that most Jiu-Jiteros will get extensive experience in instant feedback from pressurized situations. *exceptions are students who cannot free role or are in professions that prohibit them from injury. I would like to add the caveat that the best martial art for a Karateka to crosstrain in will most likely change in the near future. In a couple of years it maybe Greco-Roman or Sambo.
Cross training is so essential for a martial arts practitioner, especially for karateka IMO due to the watering down of karate from the move to being a "sport". BJJ is a must for anybody, even just to learn about dealing with people "posting" and using your hips to escape bad positions. I did BJJ for a year on and off (it never grabbed my passion) and I'm lucky enough to know enough to escape some bad positions from an amateur poor level opponent.
@@stupidfrog2205 BJJ is also going through a change at this time. As Sport BJJ rises in popularity, the more watered down it is getting. I am still invested in continuing my BJJ journey; I have a lot of mat time, and have a talent for it. I plan to practice my Karate when I get back to rolling, as liberally as I can that doesn't violate the rules or hurt my training partners. As an example, I am currently drilling fundamentals of blocking and striking (Karate) through the lens where they translate to frames, arm drags, and ankle picks in BJJ.
@@igotmydd214 that sounds like a very good way to mix the two together, especially if you can flow them together. I have a history in amateur boxing and kickboxing, I only took up karate in early 2020 and while I'm 100% on board with learning karate, I'm still crosstraining and trying to mix karate in with everything I've learned so far. We're not robots, if you flow your karate into your BJJ naturally than that's great. Especially from what I understand is that Karate was originally more of a close range fighting style, perfect for mixing in BJJ techniques when it inevitably goes to the ground. Plus I guess you'll fight like John Wick which is always cool😆
@@stupidfrog2205 That is also a fantastic mix to have up your sleeve. If I may suggest, look up Majid Raees and Sensei Seth on TH-cam. Both have really good technical videos from that perspective, particularly Majid. Man, to be able to fight like John Wick; That would be intense! I should probably do all my training in a suit...as I wrote the last part I realized like that sounds like a terrible start for a TikTok video , which I may or may not post in the future 😳
@@igotmydd214 Sensei Seth is great, I'll look into Majid Raees now. I gotta say Jesse Enkamp was one of my biggest inspirations for taking up karate (along with being a nerd for Japanese culture and having read Funakoshi's book on "The essence of karate", a few years ago) As I've gotten older I found I care less about practical stuff (it's still super important) and a little more about the "art" side. My passion had fizzled out a few years ago and I just went training/sparring to stay sharp and maintain my skills while trying to improve my sparring ability. Since taking up karate I feel like that passion is back, I'm training more than I have in years and I feel passionate about trying to find out if I can use my existing skills to apply the "less practical" karate techniques that are usually never used in sparring. I can't stress how much I feel karate has inspired me
Kodokan Judo is a synthesis of mainly two schools of Jujutsu, with influences and overlap from many schools. Originally it was called Jujutsu, but because it was for self-improvement instead of warfare, Jigoro Kano decided to call it Judo instead of Jujutsu. If a Jujutsu technique doesnt make its way into Judo (randori or kata), its either a weapons technique, or something strange and not common at all for a pre-Meiji warrior.
It does indeed. There are a few different terms but the most common ones I've seen are age-zuki for uppercut (meaning "rising punch") and kagi-zuki for hooks (meaning "key punch"). Uppercuts especially are common in kata.
This is very Karate centric isn't it? The reason why there are only 48ish throws that those throws are there because they utilise a specific throwing principle. I argue that nearly every possible throw can be put under one of those 48ish throws as a variation but don't take my word on it. I just began judo a few years ago and that's what someone at the dojo said
I have a quick question and it doesn’t have anything to do with this video,but karate was a art that had grappling in it right,even the old masters explained hikite,the pulling hand,why is it that the karate In Okinawa dosnt practice in a realistic way?like for example they do 3 step,with the unrealistic punch,stepping forward and the hand on the hip,if the old masters text is true and there’s evidence of real karate,why do masters in Okinawa practice the Japanese way,I have black belt rank in practical taekwondo and Kempo jitsu by the way😂😂,love your content,if u can answer this question pleas do✝️❤️🥋
In Goju Ryu we do practise the Hikite as a pulling motion to the Uke. But that have never been the sole use of hikite, it is also a way to generate more force to the punch by using a counter motion. But in Okinawa, and I believe all Goju Ryu styles practice both ways. Oh, and the Kihon of doing the Three step, as you call it, are very important as well to practice Kime (timing of the force you excert at the hit), movment and basic form. And that is not the Japanese way, it was practiced this way in Okinawa before Karate came to Japan.
@@Samlaren I would nvr pull my hand to the hip in a real fight,to unrealistic and there’s lots of evidence of why the power generation thing is wrong,look at boxers,muay Thai fighters they hit really really hard without having a unrealistic way of punching,and 3 step is something that the Japanese added to karate bc they didn’t know the true Bunkai for the application,your nvr gonna block like that in a real fight,takes to long and punches fly very fast,they were nvr blocks to begin with,all close distance techniques,sorry but this is very wrong,I did research and read my books 😂
@@AyeJordan7 Google "Mike Tyson Punch" and you see something that could be called a more realistic hikite. It is the same counter movment. All boxers use counter movment. Do you seriously mean that the non-punching hand stays in the same position when they punch? And what do you men by 3 step?
@@Samlaren u said the hikite can be used to generate more power,I thought u meant when a fighter punches that hand should stay on the hip,Whitch is completely unrealistic,they have to have something in it when it pulls back,and wat I meant by 3 step is when they say u punch and I block and then I strike which is also completely unrealistic and dangerous for karate practiceners to practice,it teaches defense against completely unrealistic attacks,”blocks”that were nvr intended to be used as blocks,and a lot of the counters are unrealistic bc in a fight u would have a moving oppenet,3 step sparring is something the Japanese added to karate ,one of the things that watered it down,but I see your point on hikite,using the hips as power generation ❤️,the stance also helps with that bc it’s more wider,more impact
@@AyeJordan7 Oh, now I am on the same page! The 3-step you mention is called Kihon Ippon Kumite, and is the first, and most basic form of fighting in Karate, and it is not something that was added in Japan, but is used in all Okinawan karate. It is not intended as a fighting form, even if it is called that, but a way to practice recieveng and counterstriking using basic techniques. And it is just the first form taught, and is not intended to simulate real fight but to practice basic techniques. The only kumite intended to simulate real fight is Kiso and Bunkai kumite. Other forms are just sparring (even go-kumite, full contact, is just sparring, not fighting). Regarding the unrealistic blocks, I have to say that the are used as Uke, and not blocks in Okinawan karate. IE both as blocks and attacks, depending on situation. I would say that in styles like Shotokan the block from the inside out, the Uchi or Ude uke, is not as common in higher level Goju practice, there we more often use the Kake uke (open hand block) or the Uchi koge uke (block withe inside of the arm) or even the teisho uke where you block with the lower palm of the hand. And I totally agree with you regarding the stance!
No? I havn't done any Judo for 30 years, but isnt the only differences that the O is over the hip, whereas Uki slips off, and to achieve the O you have to grip lower? I can be mistaken :-)
Ya, grip is pretty similar, but O is using the hip as a big fulcrum to lift up and over and uki you pull uke to the hip and you shift your weight and bow so they swivel around the hip
@@jedijudoka all countries during the time of ancient Greece practiced a version of MMA with weapons. Modern sport martial arts trains without weapons. In the mind of the West, other countries didn't exist until they were discovered by the west.
![[Live สด] การออกรางวัลสลากกินแบ่งรัฐบาล งวดวันที่ 16 ธันวาคม 2567](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/dNTiBBthKgQ/mqdefault.jpg)
Dude, you're awesome. Great content, well researched, and I learn something from every video. Well Done!
Very well explained. As someone who trains in both karate and judo I can see so much crossover. Combining the two in my training makes it so much more fun.
Kenji, I am subscribed to your channel as well. Can you make a response video to this video? I would be very interested in watching your response video.
@@igotmydd214 that would be interesting, I can do a video about judo style throws in karate Kata however I don't know as much on the Goju-ryu side and it's history. Although it would still be a good idea, thanks.
@@makenjikarate If I may suggest, can you describe how Judo throws that can be applied from the standpoint of Naihanchi Shodan?
@@igotmydd214 I can add them into the video, however in my training I've only found one type of judo style throw in Naihanchi/Tekki. There are other techniques that can be used as throws and I'm sure there are more, but I use Naihanchi mostly as close quarters clinch fighting.
@@makenjikarate a followup for my suggestion: I was speaking of Naihanchi Shodan from the perspective of Shorin-Ryu, I believe it is called Tekki Shodan in Shotokan
Every Karate guy should do Judo. If Judo is not available do wrestling or BJJ
Fantastic username!
Wrestling would be better than bjj or judo, because it doesn't require a gi.
I mix karate with BJJ because it's easier to learn for an older person. Judo is easy for younger people
Probably the Canon of Judo is the bible of Judo with Mifune bring generally regarded as the technician. The Gokyo is simply regarded as the basics. There are hundreds of throws in the full Judo Curriculum.
Great video. I trained Shotokan primarily, but have cross trained with other style and marveled at how Shotokan, and any karate style, dovetails so well with grappling techniques. Later as I developed a deeper understanding of karate history I realized how obvious the connection was. It really culminated with my study of Hoteikan Ryu in Brooklyn, which trains Shotokan, Judo and Sosuishi Ryu Jiu Jitsu.
And yes, BJJ is a great complement to karate!
Goju kenpo throws has taught from Ichikawa Sosui are simple to throw so the Adversary can NOT break fall
with Budo mind doing as much damage as posible to the person you are throwing,
Throw to smash /break
Chris Bubish resipent.
I'm a Hapkido 6th Dan. 10 years ago I decided that my throws needed to be better. Hapkido does do a lot of throws but most of them are joint lock related. Hapkido does have a strong Judo influence so I decided that cross training in Judo was the answer to improvement. Ten years later I have a Judo Shodan. It turns out that Judo is more sophisticated than I thought in the beginning. A Wado Ryu Nidan friend of mine wanted to teach more of the throws in that karate style so I told him to take some Judo, who better to teach it than the guys and gals who do 1,000 throws per practice.
Nice presentation! May I suggest also Karate-do Kyohan by Funakoshi for other examples of karate throws?
Nice video, I got a little lost in the middle but got back on track towards the end. Thank you 😊
Actually cross trining is the best you can do, because it provides with good new and old knoledge, and provides you from not sinking
Nice video, very informative 👍🏻
Very interesting theories.
Especially since u got some pretty cool books... I would like to see more pictures on the karate style of grappling...
I began to train with a friend whose style is shorin ryu, I was lucky to train with 2 profesional mma fighters a year before so when I look at those kata is striking clear all the joint locks, throws and other similarities with judo and jiu jitsu, many more than goju ryu katas.
Could you please do a history lesson on jiu-jitsu styles? Including Differentiation between each countries and how their styles compare to each. I think you would explain it well.
Funakoshi also listed some throws in Karate do Kyohan not in Judo. IIRC there are some throws in the Bubishi that aren’t in Judo as well.
Very interesting. Would love to see a comparison of joint locks in karate with a chinese or japanese style. Maybe Tau Chi, Eagle Claw or Aikido
I love that you have Eiji Yoshikawa's Musashi in your bookcase. Awesome book!
Curiously are you aware of the semi modern Budo martial art that's a mix of Karate (Japanese instead of Okinawan) and Judo known as Daido Juku/Kudo Karate?
What grade do you reccomend to start cross training in Judo? I am actually a 4th kyu in shotokan karate (orange belt), and we don't train throws at all at my dojo. I thought I would wait until I reach black belt to take some Judo lessons in order to complement my Karate
As soon as possible. Why wait? Get good at both simultaneously.
Great topic, and let me commend you on citing your sources! It can be rare, but is appreciated.
Personally, I am a Jiu-Jitero who has crossed over and is now learning Shorin-Ryu since the first pandemic lockdowns happened in the US. Not having BJJ was a major adjustment, but since my Karate Renaissance, I have undergone quite a phase change in my martial understanding.
I think anyone will have a raised awareness of their martial art, as well as their chosen art to cross train with. The best martial art in the West to crosstrain in would be BJJ(specifically for this period in time). My reasoning is that the instruction of BJJ is such that most Jiu-Jiteros will get extensive experience in instant feedback from pressurized situations. *exceptions are students who cannot free role or are in professions that prohibit them from injury.
I would like to add the caveat that the best martial art for a Karateka to crosstrain in will most likely change in the near future. In a couple of years it maybe Greco-Roman or Sambo.
Cross training is so essential for a martial arts practitioner, especially for karateka IMO due to the watering down of karate from the move to being a "sport".
BJJ is a must for anybody, even just to learn about dealing with people "posting" and using your hips to escape bad positions. I did BJJ for a year on and off (it never grabbed my passion) and I'm lucky enough to know enough to escape some bad positions from an amateur poor level opponent.
@@stupidfrog2205 BJJ is also going through a change at this time. As Sport BJJ rises in popularity, the more watered down it is getting.
I am still invested in continuing my BJJ journey; I have a lot of mat time, and have a talent for it. I plan to practice my Karate when I get back to rolling, as liberally as I can that doesn't violate the rules or hurt my training partners. As an example, I am currently drilling fundamentals of blocking and striking (Karate) through the lens where they translate to frames, arm drags, and ankle picks in BJJ.
@@igotmydd214 that sounds like a very good way to mix the two together, especially if you can flow them together. I have a history in amateur boxing and kickboxing, I only took up karate in early 2020 and while I'm 100% on board with learning karate, I'm still crosstraining and trying to mix karate in with everything I've learned so far.
We're not robots, if you flow your karate into your BJJ naturally than that's great. Especially from what I understand is that Karate was originally more of a close range fighting style, perfect for mixing in BJJ techniques when it inevitably goes to the ground.
Plus I guess you'll fight like John Wick which is always cool😆
@@stupidfrog2205 That is also a fantastic mix to have up your sleeve. If I may suggest, look up Majid Raees and Sensei Seth on TH-cam. Both have really good technical videos from that perspective, particularly Majid.
Man, to be able to fight like John Wick; That would be intense! I should probably do all my training in a suit...as I wrote the last part I realized like that sounds like a terrible start for a TikTok video , which I may or may not post in the future 😳
@@igotmydd214 Sensei Seth is great, I'll look into Majid Raees now. I gotta say Jesse Enkamp was one of my biggest inspirations for taking up karate (along with being a nerd for Japanese culture and having read Funakoshi's book on "The essence of karate", a few years ago)
As I've gotten older I found I care less about practical stuff (it's still super important) and a little more about the "art" side. My passion had fizzled out a few years ago and I just went training/sparring to stay sharp and maintain my skills while trying to improve my sparring ability.
Since taking up karate I feel like that passion is back, I'm training more than I have in years and I feel passionate about trying to find out if I can use my existing skills to apply the "less practical" karate techniques that are usually never used in sparring. I can't stress how much I feel karate has inspired me
I wonder how Okinawan karate throws compare to Tradational Jujutsu's throws, in terms of similaritys, execution, principles and key differences.
Kodokan Judo is a synthesis of mainly two schools of Jujutsu, with influences and overlap from many schools. Originally it was called Jujutsu, but because it was for self-improvement instead of warfare, Jigoro Kano decided to call it Judo instead of Jujutsu. If a Jujutsu technique doesnt make its way into Judo (randori or kata), its either a weapons technique, or something strange and not common at all for a pre-Meiji warrior.
Look harder. Tomoe Nage (although not called that) is clearly listed as technique 24 in the Bubishi. You know; the "Bible of Karate".
Why BJJ? What is your reasoning behind that?
Does karate have hooks and uppercuts?
mawashi-tzuki is what a hook is called, i believe... spelling may be off though haha. i forget what the uppercut is called though.
It does indeed. There are a few different terms but the most common ones I've seen are age-zuki for uppercut (meaning "rising punch") and kagi-zuki for hooks (meaning "key punch"). Uppercuts especially are common in kata.
@@GojuRyuPhilosopher oh can u answer my other question to please ✝️
This is very Karate centric isn't it? The reason why there are only 48ish throws that those throws are there because they utilise a specific throwing principle. I argue that nearly every possible throw can be put under one of those 48ish throws as a variation but don't take my word on it. I just began judo a few years ago and that's what someone at the dojo said
Kodokan judo has 67 throws, unless you meant karate has 48
I have a quick question and it doesn’t have anything to do with this video,but karate was a art that had grappling in it right,even the old masters explained hikite,the pulling hand,why is it that the karate In Okinawa dosnt practice in a realistic way?like for example they do 3 step,with the unrealistic punch,stepping forward and the hand on the hip,if the old masters text is true and there’s evidence of real karate,why do masters in Okinawa practice the Japanese way,I have black belt rank in practical taekwondo and Kempo jitsu by the way😂😂,love your content,if u can answer this question pleas do✝️❤️🥋
In Goju Ryu we do practise the Hikite as a pulling motion to the Uke. But that have never been the sole use of hikite, it is also a way to generate more force to the punch by using a counter motion. But in Okinawa, and I believe all Goju Ryu styles practice both ways.
Oh, and the Kihon of doing the Three step, as you call it, are very important as well to practice Kime (timing of the force you excert at the hit), movment and basic form. And that is not the Japanese way, it was practiced this way in Okinawa before Karate came to Japan.
@@Samlaren I would nvr pull my hand to the hip in a real fight,to unrealistic and there’s lots of evidence of why the power generation thing is wrong,look at boxers,muay Thai fighters they hit really really hard without having a unrealistic way of punching,and 3 step is something that the Japanese added to karate bc they didn’t know the true Bunkai for the application,your nvr gonna block like that in a real fight,takes to long and punches fly very fast,they were nvr blocks to begin with,all close distance techniques,sorry but this is very wrong,I did research and read my books 😂
@@AyeJordan7 Google "Mike Tyson Punch" and you see something that could be called a more realistic hikite. It is the same counter movment. All boxers use counter movment.
Do you seriously mean that the non-punching hand stays in the same position when they punch?
And what do you men by 3 step?
@@Samlaren u said the hikite can be used to generate more power,I thought u meant when a fighter punches that hand should stay on the hip,Whitch is completely unrealistic,they have to have something in it when it pulls back,and wat I meant by 3 step is when they say u punch and I block and then I strike which is also completely unrealistic and dangerous for karate practiceners to practice,it teaches defense against completely unrealistic attacks,”blocks”that were nvr intended to be used as blocks,and a lot of the counters are unrealistic bc in a fight u would have a moving oppenet,3 step sparring is something the Japanese added to karate ,one of the things that watered it down,but I see your point on hikite,using the hips as power generation ❤️,the stance also helps with that bc it’s more wider,more impact
@@AyeJordan7 Oh, now I am on the same page!
The 3-step you mention is called Kihon Ippon Kumite, and is the first, and most basic form of fighting in Karate, and it is not something that was added in Japan, but is used in all Okinawan karate. It is not intended as a fighting form, even if it is called that, but a way to practice recieveng and counterstriking using basic techniques.
And it is just the first form taught, and is not intended to simulate real fight but to practice basic techniques.
The only kumite intended to simulate real fight is Kiso and Bunkai kumite. Other forms are just sparring (even go-kumite, full contact, is just sparring, not fighting).
Regarding the unrealistic blocks, I have to say that the are used as Uke, and not blocks in Okinawan karate. IE both as blocks and attacks, depending on situation. I would say that in styles like Shotokan the block from the inside out, the Uchi or Ude uke, is not as common in higher level Goju practice, there we more often use the Kake uke (open hand block) or the Uchi koge uke (block withe inside of the arm) or even the teisho uke where you block with the lower palm of the hand.
And I totally agree with you regarding the stance!
Uki goshi and O goshi aren't that similar my dude
No? I havn't done any Judo for 30 years, but isnt the only differences that the O is over the hip, whereas Uki slips off, and to achieve the O you have to grip lower? I can be mistaken :-)
@@Samlaren no, you nailed the difference on the energy over the hip should feel. But it is THE important difference that begginers always make
@@Tamales21 Thank you! :)
Ya, grip is pretty similar, but O is using the hip as a big fulcrum to lift up and over and uki you pull uke to the hip and you shift your weight and bow so they swivel around the hip
Traditional karate is the original MMA
Nah, pankration in Ancient Greece has that title
@@jedijudoka all countries during the time of ancient Greece practiced a version of MMA with weapons.
Modern sport martial arts trains without weapons.
In the mind of the West, other countries didn't exist until they were discovered by the west.
No shit. 15:21
I hate the mma crap
You talk too much