the working class aesthetic is cool now?
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SOURCES/RESSOURCES 📚
Pierre Bourdieu, Distinction, 1979.
Alessandra Asteriti, "Ugly, Dirty, and Bad: Working class aesthetics reconsidered", Law & Literature, Vol.26, No.2, 2014.
Chal Ravens, "What Are Working People Supposed to Wear?", Novara Media, January 2023.
Other sources can be found throughout the video :)
MUSIC 🎙
Brooks - Chlorine '83 - thmatc.co/?l=C...
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Bonjour! Someone made me realise something I wish I included at the end of the video (aaaah too late) basically when I said that we almost never see depictions of the "non-functional" working-class in the public sphere, that we generally glorify the working class when it works when it produces value, well, i completely forgot to mention street art! Street art does represent a variety of working class people, some unemployed, some looked down upon like s*x workers or dr*g dealers. It forces people to see them even, to make them visible to the public and reclaim that space so voilà! hope you enjoyed the video✨
I wish everyone can dress whatever the way they want. The more there are choke points and barriers to entry, the more they are used against marginalized communities. In fashion and all walks of life.
I lived in a place where clothes and style are used to discriminate against a lot of people, it wasn't too fun for me there :) I can't begin to imagine what it was like for less privileged minorities.
Dressing randomly (not according to class or group) helps to normalize certain styles.
It was always there. John Galliano did a fashion show during the 2000's. It was called " Le bal des indigents " quelque chose comme cela.
Hi Alice - this was my first time watching one of your videos. Really enjoyed it! Reminded me of this song by Pulp: th-cam.com/video/yuTMWgOduFM/w-d-xo.html
From a Polish perspective there is nothing wrong in stealing good ideas we being in the crossroads of the north silk roads so we have a lot of different ideas coming through our ancestral lands. So the best ideas are stolen.
It’s definitely also a thing here in Copenhagen. I’ve been through the hardest economical struggle for the last 3/4 years, could only afford thrifting. Then to see fashion people cos-play working class aesthetic is so surreal.
"there's nothing rich folks love more than going downtown and slumming it with the poor"
I waited for this comment :D
HAHAHAHA
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You just unlocked memories😂
One thing to note too about actual working-class people wearing higher-end clothes and aesthetics is that it’s often required to be taken seriously in certain spaces.
Yeah, I'm most comfortable in my "native" clothes, as a working class kid, heavy, durable cargo pants, or overalls, usually work uniforms issued to workers, but when you go to certain events, or just out to town, it's often expected that you wear jeans and a nice t-shirt, which i hate wearing.
that's one of the reasons why I'm buying clothing that look as timeless as possible, I have to wear the 5 buck shirt over and over for the next few years
It is also their own motivation to prove to their peers that they are "moving up", or have "made it". That's why some common higher end brands (example: Gucci, Burberry, Mercedes, etc.) are popular luxury goods among the working & middle class, and the new rich.
growing up rolling around in the mountains, I had much to learn after moving to the city. in the mountains, work clothes or any clothes really got dirty quite easily, so I remember being amazed to see people wearing pure white in the cities. I still prefer practical clothes in private, yet it is usually not acceptable in public and in a formal setting. I wish that would change.
Yeah I think criticizing someone about a coat is even worse. Places where it gets cold you NEED a warm coat that is as durable as possible. It costs a lot of money regardless but it's better than freezing. NorthFace is a good brand so it is worn by people at all financial levels. I own 2 but I got them for free from my job at a call center, I would never think someone is rich if they owned 1.
One direct problem with the obsession with the working class aesthetic we have now is that people are swarming charity shops to pull out all of the fashionable good quality items from charity shops and selling them on for a massive markup. This leaves people that have to use charity shops with rubbish from Shein that probably costs less on the site than it does in the shop, and will fall apart as soon as you have to wash it. This prices working class people out of the sustainable and affordable practice now that it's fashionable. Capitalism ruins everything.
Is this really such an issue? I find it very doubtful that there is a shortage of secondhand clothes, I have been to many thrift stores and never struggled to find decent-quality clothes at a low price. And I find it very hard to believe that re-sellers are so popular that they would cause such a shortage to begin with.
Gatekeeping secondhand clothes is a very difficult take to agree with-- surely we should be working towards a less wasteful society where people of every class happily wear secondhand clothes. How can this be a bad thing?
People buying garbage off Shien know that they are doing exactly that. Working class people may just as well buy a higher-quality item that they may use for a long time or pass on to begin with-- this is indeed a major point in the video you just watched. Fast fashion should be killed, making excuses for it seems massively counterproductive.
I think people should embrace thriffting because of sustainability and slavelabor issues. However, if they are reselling them that could be a problem. As a person who is poor, there are fewer options available than there were I noticed. And thrift stores have marked up their prices.
@@sh-px3pein my case/country, there isn't rly a shortage of clothes, but bc there's been a significant increase in interest thrift shops have been marking up their prices to the point that sometimes it's just as expensive as buying new clothes. I just buy from church bazaars (? Not sure if that's how u say it) now since they're not looking to increase profit every month lol
@@sh-px3pe It depends where you are. I imagine there are loads of places where it’s not an issue at all, but there are lots of places where it’s getting hard to find anything other than fast fashion in charity shops because resellers grab everything the minute it goes out.
I am 100% on board with as many people shopping second hand as possible when they are actually going to wear the clothes, but I get really frustrated when a useful resource for people on lower budgets is getting, for want of a better phrase, gentrified.
@@sh-px3pe Resellers in some locations can absolutely be a problem. There are a lot of clothes out there, and a lot get donated. Most aren't suitable for rewearing. They're low quality, outdated and ugly. Nobody in their right mind is buying hideous, stained old junk that's fit for nothing but the bin. Working class people still want to look nice and we deserve nice clothes.
They also drive up prices so they're out of reach of those that need them. You used to be able to get a dress in charity shops for £3-4. Now it's £10+.
I'm sure you've heard of the Vimes boots theory of poverty. Being poor is more expensive. You can't afford to spend £100 on a pair of shoes that will last you a decade. So you buy shoes that cost £20 and fall apart in 6 months. By the end of the decade, you've spent £400 on shoes and you've still got wet feet. This goes for everything. A pre payment meter for your gas and electric is more expensive than a normal meter. Your car insurance costs more if you pay monthly. Your bus ticket? More expensive if you buy a weekly ticket instead of a monthly one.
Poor people should be better at budgeting is some moral superiority that I'm not into. I've been poor. Hell, I still am poor compared to most. I'm on disability benefits because my job working in care homes broke me. I can budget down to the penny and it's still not enough to buy the better value things. If I can't afford the £100 shoes now, I can't go around barefoot can I?
The commodification of proletariat's life style .Capitalism manages to surprise me all the time.
i mean they turned Che Guevara from revolutionary, to just shirt man lol
shouldn't be surprising *at all*. the endless banality of the movement of capital is precisely in its rapid & unreflective metabolism of everything with algorithmic efficiency.
After hustle culture (which I see as a mere byproduct of neo-liberal capitalistic society) turned ancient Greek philosophy into self-help and get ahead in life hacks... Nothing surprised me anymore...
How I felt being in a vintage consignment shop today and seeing 10 yo jeans with greens stains on the ass being sold for 80$
Or the rich are trying to not be eaten
"I wanna live like common people, I wanna do whatever common people do"
Yes!!!! I love pulp!
Certified posh boy here, and listening to that song always really messes with my head. When it comes to the working class experience, the fact is that I don't "get it" and I'll never get it. You have to stay humble and empathetic, but the inequality remains ever-presently chilling.
@@mac5565 i think that's its intention tbh, love pulp tho
@@mac5565 I'll send you my venmo info if you want to learn.
@@mac5565 tbh you aren't missing anything it's not that big of an experience
It's always only a matter of time before something that's deemed "for poor people" eventually becomes trendy and prices poor/working class people out of being able to afford those things. Lobster used to be a poor people food, but when upper class/rich people discovered it, it soon became marked up and too expensive for the working class. I'm not surprised at all that the same would happen with fashion.
this but with oxtail, vegetables, and bone marrow. what the fuck is left for people to eat??
it also happened with "dad" shoes, everyone hated them before but had to suck it up and now a bunch of dorks decided that they're cool and everyone suddenly loves them
@@maya07_11 I will say dad shoes are super comfy, so some people may have tried on a pair for giggles (they're not the coolest or cutest style to a lot of people) and realized why so many dads wear them.
Gentrification * sigh *
I understand the fashion part you talk about...but it's not necessarily their fault that they eat lobsters....lol. Also, let's not group middle class and lower class together. The middle class have a habit of denying their privilege as well.
The "slumming" aesthetic. You'll even see people from generational wealth (Lana Del Rey, Elon Musk, Taylor Swift, etc) fabricate backstories of coming from nothing because of the "cred". The concept of "hardworking, self-made, earned success" is often an illusion. Privilege isn't chosen, but denying it is. I have issues with the new Prince Harry biography because it downplays his privileges growing up - such as his false claim he had to use clearance sales at TK Maxx (which the store itself denied on Twitter because it never had clearance sales).
Taylor Swift has never said she comes from nothing, leave that woman alone for god's sake
His claim is definitely false, but to be fair to whoever ghost-wrote Harry's book, technically TK Maxx is a mixed brand outlet store, so everything is clearance/reduced, even if they are not technically putting on clearance sales
there r better examples than lana and taylor, i dont recall either of them ever saying they came from nothing
@@allllll5609 Is she someone that really needs defending? Just goes to show how valuable these peoples victimhood is to them. They have you believing they need your chivalry. Why don’t you find a better outlet for your time and energy,
“Privilege isnt chosen, but denying it is” Fucking fantastic line
I'm an old man (42 years OLD, to be exact,) and this reminds me of the mid-90s grunge fashion boom, when you had upper-middle to upper-class characters on TV wearing flannel and you saw fashion models strutting down the runway wearing flannel, ripped-up blue jeans, cardigans and wool beanies. Nevermind that such fashion came about because grunge musicians were forced to wear such clothing because they were dirt-poor and couldn't afford anything nicer, at least in the beginning.
..."Nevermind!" GET IT? Because it's grunge and, uh, Nirvana and all that... uh... anyway, yeah. I'm 42, did I mention that?
I share the memory and the feeling (43 y.o. inside). Wanted to add, lately I realized that the flannel shirts were never anything else but the north-western USA lumberjack cloth of choice and they still are. Where is Seattle (and Olympia and Aberdeen)? Northwest. So silly we saw flannel shirts on runways just because for Cobain and co that was what just was laying around.
As a 44yo Aussie, "flannies" were definitely still "bogan" (kinda like redneck), but have had their highs and lows through the fashion trends. I bought a op-shop flannie recently
... but it was from Madonna's "material girl" line but I still bought it cos I liked the cut out modification. I prefer buying proper rescued flannies modded ones from a friend who is a designer who mods herself but hey, this was $5
that also compares to the way the white teenagers started to wear saggy pants and snapbacks in the 2010s, which came from the hood where the kids didnt have the money to buy clothes that fit
@alexlight5650 Flannel is great in WA state bc half the state is desert too. It's warm in the west (like Seattle) and great for sun protection in the east (Wenatchee)
@@Go2daFuture that’s not “from the hood where people can’t afford to buy clothes that fit.” It was an aesthetic popularized in hiphop because sagging pants is done in prison & [some] gang culture. Gangsta rap had its heydey
in Poland we have a saying that goes like "poor people can't afford cheap things", which means you need to buy things that will least you very very long because you don't throw away your closet when fashion changes next season... I have leather jacket that is 23 years old...
In Afrikaans it's "goedkoop koop is duurkoop", buying cheap is buying expensive.
One of the most awkward experiences I ever had was when I got off a jobsite and went to grab lunch. I’m a carpenter and was fully kitted out for winter working outside. There were maybe like 5 people in this taco shop at 2pm, and the bartender asked me where I got “used Carhartt without so many holes”. Everyone there was dressed like the guys on my site but everything was new, and it was a weird enough revelation that I got my food to go.
carhartt has really nice overalls, they don't ride up so I can wear them when I go hiking and keep some gardening gloves in them so I can pick up rocks and snakes n stuff. I wish people would leave like atleast a little at thrifts cuz ill be caught dead before i wear jeans
That’s hilarious lmao
I like to look at the "poor" aspects as an aesthetic to make me feel better. I drive around my clunker and think, "This is quite the look... The rust creeping along the undercarriage has a certain romance to it." And when the screen on my phone cracked I thought, "There is something kind of cool about sporting a shattered phone." I don't know if the rust on my car is actually romantic or if the cracks on my phone screen were cool... But I felt better and thinking that way helps me enjoy life.
I do find it weird that rich people want to take the look. I'm not sure how it makes them feel better because if I could afford the best of the best I would and my broken stuff would be a bitter sweet memory.
i do that too
I do the same, instead of thinking about my situation in a negative light I try to tell myself “this is so punk” or “it’s like I’m in a movie, my life is so weird”
That's a cool way of being positive.
Honestly, fashion is by it's very nature an inexplicable chase for approval, I'm sure some have their head around it, but my motto is that you should try to wear what is functional and/or suits you.
Isn't that basic sense? But fashion has been around forever and is by definition a transient idea adopted by a group, usually wealthy ones or ones who want to look wealthy.
Imitation of someone considered desirable.
@funkyy And now Mom Jeans are expensive, and skinny cheaper and very low quality as well...
i do that too. I love ugly buildings in my tiny town and the neverending fields, my shoes always looked cooler when they were a bit worn down after a year or two
as someone who relied heavily on thrift stores and hand me downs in all their life, the popularization of hobocore has been gamechanging for me. now i get compliments on the exact same pieces and aesthetics i was bullied for, its now fashionable. im actually scared of the grunge/second hand thing becoming en passe, i do not like to buy new clothing, especially not in the range i can afford to. i really do hope that the y2k fake opulence aesthetic leaves soon.
My dad is officially a dripped out 70 yr old now for this exact reason 😂
I think this really only exists in white communities. In cities with the majority being black you will still get laughed at especially if you're black wearing those clothes. If you don't wear real polo you're going to get roasted for knock off.
We need a video on Western Europeans & Americans going backpacking for their "spiritual journey" and telling everyone that all it takes is ✨️ courage ✨️
...and relying on people's hospitality for free food and accommodation so they can travel cheaply and "authentically" whilst not contributing a penny to the local economy
I use the transportation system in Mexico city and I recently noticed how the machines where you put money in your card now have an option for french and english: Foreigners don't even use these services because it's "too dangerous" for them. Aside from the low and middle class, it's the indigenous people who rely on the subway for transportation but clearly there is no nahuatl or mixe option in the menu -.-
"Working class is beautiful when they add value or working . But when they don't it's ugly. " World is so hard
This is random but people often group middle class and lower class together. Those groups don't have the same struggles. Middle Class people and people from the west in general, tend to deny their privilege a lot...so watching us bash the rich is hilarious and a little hypocritical too.
@@katgreer6113 they absolutely have more in common than they have different between them
@@katgreer6113 middle class is a somewhat meaningless designation in the US, because we have a very tiny one. Most people are actually working class or what we call the professional class (parents or you are doctor, lawyer, engineer).
I don’t know how it is in Germany for instance, but ‘middle class’ here usually means you’re not worried about bills but you’re not traveling either.
A large portion of people calling themselves middle class and trying to avoid the stigmas here of being working poor or ‘privileged’ are either worried about utilities or worried about their international trip.
@@namedrop721 In the UK class is much more than just finances. There was this "chav couple" in my village growing up that won the national lottery. They bought a bigger house and fancy cars. But everyone still saw them as "rich chavs". People rolled their eyes at them. They were hated when they were poor and hated when they were rich. I am a upper-working class brit myself that had the opportunity to move to North America (I got a job in the movie industry through a chance encounter, there's no way in hell I would've been able to afford it myself and I'm so incredibly lucky).
It seems that class on this side of the pond is directly tied to finances, and actually moving out of your class is hard but actually possible. Unlike in the UK where, if you are born working class and by some stroke of dear luck actually make money, you need to change your accent and appearance and get "cultured" to fit in.
All in all, it's not really something that the americans I've spoken to about in preson it seem to be able to truly comprehend. Class in the UK is definitely cultural, and is intertwined in every part of british culture that people don't see. There are so many nuances to it that those outside of britain just couldn't know.
@@katgreer6113 speak for yourself I'm fucking poor
It's definitely weird. I grew up in a deprived ex mining town in the UK and it's definitely weird to see people want to emulate the working class. I just had some hand me down baggy joggers from my brother and some £2 Primark T-shirts and had those for years until I grew and had to get some more. Good thing about UK schooling is the uniform, it's expensive which is a pain but if there wasn't a uniform I wouldn't have had enough clothes for those 5 days and the weekend.
Just so long as they don't go too deep into it and actually think they're working class or from a shit area, then I think it's generally harmless and what is it for me to say anyway I have bigger concerns. I would say though the more sinister part of it arises when the more gang style side of things start to get emulated, because for me it just gets on my nerves when I see that in videos, there is nothing cool or trendy about worrying about if your mum is going to get mugged on her way to work. Also nothing particularly nice about having to actively avoid certain areas as to avoid trouble.
Good video and an interesting topic.
I saw jeans in a consignment shop today that looked like they came from a minor being sold for 80$ like this shit is really getting out of hand
I agree, I grew up on a council estate in the UK too. When I was in school, it was something we were bullied for and other parents at the school would tell their children not to be our friends or not to come to our house. Buying clothes from a charity shop was embarrassing or not having 5 sets of my uniform - its a comfort to hear I really wasn't a lone. But now its trendy and I see kids from middle/upper class neighbourhoods hanging around outside and acting like they are from there and 'dressing' like it as well..
The stereotype they are pushing effects people who actually live in these neighbourhoods and that is annoying for sure, but Like you say it is harmless now, yet they way these groups of kids are starting to 'act' like gangs to further this narrative they've created is starting to look a bit troubling.
@@cherrydrop9922 Same here but the girls at the private secondary schools had an obsession with Jack Wills jogging bottoms and Ugg boots, trying to lol las sloppy as possible spending as much as possible, baffling
@@cherrydrop9922 yes I shopped at charity shops with my mum and even volunteered at my local Oxfam and then all of a sudden charity shopping became super trendy and now I see items for the same as if not their retail price, it's actually insane
@@cherrydrop9922 I noticed it happens with mental illnesses too. There's people that act as if they had a mental illness because apparently that's cool now. I've seen people act and joke as if they had an eating disorder when they don't. The same with depression, etc. And I don't understand how can they say it's just humour, when they aren't mentally ill and it's not even funny. I have ocd and used to have bulimia, and I know it doesn't feel good to be mentally ill, I found all of that ridiculous. And I don't understand how it all even happened, like why is it cool now?.
Don't be comfortable on what you get as salary, give yourself more value and invest in your financial.
You have to clear provety out of your mind believe in your self, but never work under someone's for long, because is using you to get more wealth.
@@ronaldreagan-kf6wnI agree with you. Investment is the key to sustaining your financial longevity. And not just any investment but an investment with guaranteed return.
You're absolutely right, to be a successful in life required not only hard work but awareness and sometime opportunity at the moment, investment remains the best way to start.
yeah investment is the key to sustaining your financial longevity but venturing into any legit investment or business without a proper guidance of an expert can lead to great loss too.
@@nancystanley9051Obviously talking about been successful, I know I am blessed if not I wouldn't have met someone who is as spectacular as Debra Barton
Reusing items for more than just one thing: my younger coworkers laughing at my Kerry Butter container that I reuse to carry snacks at work. They weren't alive at a time where the Cool Whip container was the less expensive version of Tupperware. 😆
In Brazil, we often say that almost everyone buys tubs of ice cream mostly for using it as "Tupperware", and the ice cream just happens to be a nice bonus. There's another related joke (or rather, common occurrence) where you open the freezer, you see a tub of ice cream, you get all happy expecting to have some ice cream, but then you open it and it's yesterday's beans that have been frozen for later hahaha.
@@lucadipaolo1997 Just like the circular 'cookie tins' on Grandma's coffee table. "Aw, great! Maccaroons! I'll just...aww, no! ...just thimbles and leftover bolts and screws....”
and cookie boxes lol
omg thank you for bringing this up! when I moved in with my bf, he thought it was weird I saved butter containers, lunch meat containers (which where I live are sometimes just Tupperware that's made more cheaply). but it's not like he grew up rich or anything. his family is working class but somehow my wanting to refuse perfectly good plastic containers seemed a bit too thrifty to him haha
It stains less than the actual Tupperware for sale. I won't buy it ever again unless I want to invest in glass ones
The worst is they did the same for housing. House flipping became a rich person hobby, living in a RV became a lifestyle and even tiny homes started costing tens of thousands more
This!!!! The gentrification of neighbourhoods, at least in my city is becoming wild
53 yr old plumber sitting in my work truck. Today I’m stylishly dressed in my black Carhartt work pants and jacket. I think I’ve owned these pants for over 10 years, the jacket for 12. They both get washed at least 52 times a year in warm water. They have been through serious trials of mud, fire, blood and worse. These clothes have more meaning, memories, and purpose than most fashionable people would understand. There is the representation of an experience and then there is the experience. Wealth and poverty can sometimes be about more than money.
Very well said
Maybe someone can correct me but unfortunately i don’t think they make carhartt like they used to. Pretty sure quality has gone downhill compared to your indestructible pants hahah
my husband is on his way to wearing out his car heart I bought him. I came from poor working farm towns and I remember all the heavy duty Carhart's the guys would wear so I bought my husband one .he loves that coat keeps him toasty in negative temps , crawling under crawlspaces and working outside
@@youtubescholar my husband has had his Carhartt coat for the past 5 years , but yess a lot of brands have gone a bit cheaper. my husbands Dickies don't last that long - might get 3 years out of them if we're lucky and he does alot of squatting bending and crawling under crawlspaces and in attics as an HVAC tech
I was in a convince store after a crushing day at work on my way home to do some more work and this slob of a woman looks at me and says to her husband " I want my jacket to look like that !" My carhartt jacket is smoked from plumbing ,pipe fitting, welding , carpentry and working with other like minded men and women that are not fxxking around . It is covered in blood ,sweat and heavy metals . I looked at that stupid redneck and told her a jacket like this would ☠️ your lazy ass , her jaw dropped and her sack of shxt husband looked at the ground grabbed her arm and walked away . They can bury me in that jacket one day
(This is gonna be a bit longer!) Reminds me of one of my classmates whose parents are both very successful and wealthy. At the age of 16, he's already moved out in an expensive flat in our city center (I live in my city's "ghetto" and the rent is still super high), only eating organic food and never going to school because he finds the concept of it oppressive and tiring. When we had an orientation day in junior class at our city's university, he said he rejects the idea of going there because the uni is giving too much bourgeoisie. He's always talking about the working class and communism/socialism, being an avid supporter of Marx and he can't shut up about it to the point that when we're in a group he will observe people's hands to see whether or not they're "working class hands". All that attitude whilst living in absolute wealth and completely missing the point about current working class issues and not being able to relate AT ALL. Instead, this boy tried to give me MONEY bc he felt pity about me having jokingly told my friends I was too broke to buy me a new book.
I live in the ghetto and have an immigrant background, I'm trying to do my A-Levels to further enroll in Law school whilst working a cleaning job to support my mom (who already's got 3 jobs, btw) financially. Inflation and my mom's covid has worsened our situation a lot. There ain't a day my feet are not hurting. Having to see all these entitled privileged brats who romanticize a life like this makes my blood boil. Sometimes, my apartment complex won't have clean water or electricity, a lot of my friends' parents don't even pay the bills or pay for their tuition and I always hear about their struggles, being grateful my parents are at least supportive of my path. To anyone reading this, you DON'T want a life in poverty.
your friend clearly needs a reality check lol
@@aguschipo26 There are a lot out there like him
I think it’s overcompensation for their privilege. It may be a feeling of guilt too. I’ve run into a lot of rich kids like this too.
tell him marx wanted to abolish inheritance.....
Remminds me of a commie "friend" who did his best to live like borderline hobo, even tho he came from a priviledged background and had ihnerited some real state which he promptly sold in order to invest in the housing market. Still, he was not so nice, or guilty in the least. He would pester me months because I owed him 50 cents on ice cubes for a party, while I had payed for everyone's drinks and made food for everyone when he came to me asking for the money.
this one always bothered me. i grew up on thrift stores and hand me downs from siblings or church. i got made fun of for shopping at goodwill and wore mom jeans all of middle school because thats all that fit. then 2016 hit and i was a freshman and suddenly my thrifted sweaters and mom jeans got me the label of “art hoe”. i was so shocked to see my thrifted clothes were a popular style now! i still have shirts and pants that ive been wearing for 10+ years on top of the fact they were second hand (my oldest tshirt is as old as i am! 21!!) its just sad the affects it has had, other than being accepted as a “style”, which is good and bad. in school it meant less teasing but it had bigger more negative impacts than that because the prices have been raised and its harder to find actual nice clothes. resellers come through and deplete entire stores of all the nicer quality or cool clothes. I used to have so many good finds when i was younger but in recent years i havent had much luck. I could find and afford 10 whole outfits, now im lucky if i can afford let alone find 3 outfits. and shoes too!! omg i could go on all day about this, but ill stop here.
to be fair, the art hoe movement of the 2010s was started on tumblr by and for low income black queer youth to feel empowered by inserting themselves into popular art of the Western canon. The western art world has often co-opted art and culture from black people and other people of color around the world, while also dehumanizing, degrading, and/or fetishisizing those cultures. (some examples include Pablo Picasso's primitivist art and Paul Gauguin's inappropriate behavior towards French Polynesian women.) The movement was about disrupting that dynamic through affirming representation. It was co-opted by rich white liberals and career activists, and they made it cosplay-y, but it was always about more than an aesthetic. i do agree with you that current price inflation at thrift stores is ridiculous though, and resellers who completely deplete thrift stores of all their cool stuff suck.
Saying „oh damn, they got the Balenciagas!“ whenever I see someone working in hi vis is a joke I refuse to let go of because I am petty and bitter haha
I despise the trend
I call my high visibility clothes (for working in ship repairing) my balenciaga clothes. Balenciaga is such a joke now…
@@JustSilviaD Great sense of humour, if I may say so haha
also your job sounds cool af - keep up the good work and stay safe!
That's funny tbh lol
Reminds me of the Gucci protective goggles. Or was it Supreme ? I don't know or care tbh
Lmao
"Poverty Porn" is what it usually ends up being.
Berlin is a complicated city with a complicated history, but the style has never (really) changed. Big Jeans, tnf jackets and oversized hoodies or ugly sweaters has always been the style of that city (and probably every cool german teenager that wanted to emulate this vibe~). I think it has more to do with Berlin as a city being so closely associated with the working class that in order to fit in, you have to dress that way (the same way Frankfurt is associated with shady ways of making money so you have to dress "rich"). Think of Berlin Alexanderplatz or other famous pieces of german literature, most of them are written from the perspective of the working class. Maybe it has to do with no matter where you are from, in Berlin you automatically become working class with housing prices so high. So upper class children to moving to Berlin (temporarily!!!) can definetaly be classified as a trip to the working class, to try "addiction" or "homelessness" for a while. It also needs to be considered how this interlays with drug use glamorized as heroin chic or the more overall aesthetic of sickness. I think the grunge era is also a prime example for that combination.
No working class german associates Berlin with the working class lol. For us it's a cesspool of people studying for useless degrees, "artists", drug addicts, and other assorted characters, and of course the lovely circus of crooks and liars we call our government.
Most germans outside of Berlin hate Berlin and the people who live there.
If you want a working class city, look at stuff like Chemnitz, Kassel, Hamburg and other centers of industry.
In according with my experience of former expat in Berlin, I totally agree with you
@@giakolou2876 Absolutely not. Being working class is also pretty looked down upon here
@@MannoMaxnot as bad as in America lmao. Here you're treated as less than dirt if you aren't wearing lowie vitton or goochi, or whatever the fuck rich brats wear these days. The middle class in eruope is like 50%, while here it's 15%. 84% of people are in poverty.
I was a teenager in the 70s, middle-class. Back then it was normal to have one pair of jeans and two pairs of shoes. There wasn't much money for clothing and clothing was always passed on from older siblings to the younger ones, from brothers to sisters (not so much the other way, except unisex pieces like T-shirts) too. You would wash your jeans in the evening to wear them the next day. All this was normal middle-class.
That's not middle class omg, that's poverty
@@dela2612 Nope. All my friends had it that way too. It was normal 1970s. It probably would have been possible to spend more money on clothes, but it wan't customary back then. I went to a pretty good school and my father had a PhD and he worked as a director for a fairly large organization. Mother worked in a newspaper full time.
This is so difficult for someone from a younger generation (like me)
My parents grew up in the 70's and looking at old pictures and especially hearing anecdotes like "we had one outfit for school and church and another for work in the household, leisure time or working in the fields" And my mum nearly cried when I asked her how she didn't get bullied if they are bullying me because I wear the same pair of trousers two days in a row. She then explained to me that this was normal. And that while they were by no means wealthy, she didn't come from a poor family at all.
@@dela2612 that's definitely not poverty (They could afford to run the washing machine every night h e l l o)
That’s honestly hard to imagine as a younger person!! Like the other person said, I would’ve been bullied too. I am thankful for what I have, for the variety of outfits that I can enjoy. But I’m so curious about that! Even a capsule wardrobe these days probably has more options!
Where I live it’s cold and rainy so it can take days for clothes to dry and the houses are cold and damp so it can take days inside too. So I don’t think washing jeans every night would work out 😂 But having less pressure about clothing would be nice!
Marie Antoinette also did powerty-play XD She had a little hut where she and her friends pretended to be farmers
North Face is, or was, extremely upper class in the US. It was typically accompanied by Lululemon leggings, Ugg Boots, and a Tiffany necklace. Maybe it's different in the UK. But for a long time, Carhartt was the working class brand for blue collar labor. Suddenly, it became very trendy and the quality suffered. Bit of a shame. It seems everyone wants to be poor until they can't pay the bills and struggling to even buy food.
I don't agree with her statement about the north face being for working class people in the UK. Maybe that's how upper class people think, but I live in Bristol and it's def middle class or working class wanting to look richer. Plus... it really is expensive. Sure, great quality, but it's still out of reach for many unless it's second hand. I've had to rely on Primark stuff even though I'd obviously prefer to get high quality items. Sometimes you can't simply 'invest' because you literally have nothing to invest with!!
I can see middle or upper middle class having North Face items in the US too if they were given it as a gift or kept for a long time, but absolutely overpriced for working class or lower middle in the US
@@user-sm9md8mu5t Funny you mentioned that, my partner is from the UK and lives in Bristol and mentioned that it's more a trying to look richer thing. It's often hard to compare the countries at times because things are just different.
@@MissyLKS8 ohhh there's a really weird combination going on here! It's about status but many do glorify the working class aesthetic, especially if they come from money and don't want to be called posh. Hence, you'll find them giving speeches on why communism and anarchy is what we need, while at the same time heavily engaging in capitalistic practices.
They also go for the "I want you to believe this outfit didn't take any effort at all. Today I went for homeless chic but with branded or expensive vintage shop pieces only. Plus, I only shop sustainably but I also get 10 items per week, because fashion identity is extremely important".
Fashion in the city center can be super peculiar. The more extravagant, the better your fashion sense, unless you DO want to look posh (old money).
It's helpful to be such an outsider, because then it forces you to look into your own habits as well.
I'm from the US .When I was growing up North Face was an middle class and up type of coat. we couldn't afford to have a coat like that unless it was donated to a charity coat drive. I remember seeing alot of London Fog trench coats too but they weren't warm so we never grabbed them
Another great video! Reminds me of an old friend who had her college paid for, grew up in the suburbs, and now works at a tech startup. She was very much a “eat the rich but not my wealthy parents” kinda gal. She once got extremely mad at me for complaining about the homeless people harassing me outside of my apartment,but at the same refused to hang out at my place because it was “in the ghetto” and she didn’t feel safe.
i've met so many people like this i cannot even count😭
This is giving me flashbacks
Meanwhile here I am, someone who went from living with my poor mother to rich father, who constantly doesn't fucking understand how much the rich take their wealth for granted and don't understand how bad shit is.
patrick bateman sri lanka speech
@@seabreeze4559 LMFAOO
i'm student at oxbridge from a poor background and the opening of this vid resonated so much, its literally like everyone here, they dress like that and seem very genuine and nice but then i see their Instagram and it just screams wealth...
I think intention is a big factor here. What is the intention of someone rich or middle class who is wearing typically working class clothing?
Are they intentionally trying to glamourise the working class aesthetic without ever questioning why such an aesthetic exists in the first place? Or are they fetishising the working class because they feel guilty about being middle class? Or, at the very worst, are they cosplaying as someone working class? Your video reminds me of an article from a couple of years ago, about posh students at Durham University in the UK bullying and making fun of the working class students, except there's also a snippet in the article where a boy claims a posh girl said she wanted to sleep with him because she had a 'poverty fetish' (it was a Guardian article which I won't link in case TH-cam thinks this comment is spam).
Personally, as someone who grew up kind of working to lower middle class, I don't really associate the working class to an aesthetic. When I was a kid my shoes would have holes in them because asking my mum for a new pair was like asking for a kidney - so I would fill my shoes with paper to cover the holes and make the shoes last longer. That to me is the reality of the working class aesthetic, because it's not aesthetic, it's hidden. I think working class clothing is designed to mask a lot of the toil and trouble which the working class face, hence your point about function over form. Perhaps that's where form comes in though, in trying to mask one's struggle, one has to find clothing with the form of functionality, again related to a point that you made.
I don't really have any issue with a middle class or rich person wearing working class clothing, as long as it's not being done to fetishise or belittle working class culture, and not being used to get more likes on Instagram. Ultimately, if we want equality, then we have to accept rich people wearing working class clothing. However, we must also allow working class people like me to wear a £10,000 Gucci suit with a lion's head on it, and allow me to afford the damn thing too. Fair's fair! :)
Yes! I feel like my place in terms of which class I am is complicated and has shifted. But regardless, when I was at my poorest I was always trying to hide it like you said. I’d skip meals to save for an outing with a friend or for new shoes that looked nicer than they were. All so no one would think I was struggling. I would’ve gone hungry at times regardless but I feel like that shows how much I prioritised it. I was essentially using the appearance of being middle class to gain access to opportunities that might get me out of the position I was in. Was I more privileged than some to even manage that? Of course! But I guess my point is that when you actually are working class, looking working class instantly limits your opportunities and the help you can access. The people who invited me over for dinner, not knowing that I would’ve gone hungry otherwise, would never have invited me over if I actually looked like I was going hungry. I wouldn’t have gotten the job that allowed me some respite from that if I’d looked working class. I was referred to them through the govt employment agency, which was enough to cause me some trouble, but if I’d looked or sounded like it I wouldn’t have even been hired. If they’re going to copy the working class aesthetic they need to at least stop judging us for it!! Hopefully you get your lion’s head outfit one day 😂
The thing is, that no one can see the intention on the outside. It might make a difference to the wearer, but someone seeing them in the streets will not see the reason, just the result.
@@em6644 they mock us
This is literally like when rappers are like “i started in the hood”. The hip hop genre is one big rags to bitches story.
And?
There is a difference between true rags to riches stories (which are ultimately uncommon) vs the too common riches to more riches pipeline
This video has been turtle approved
"Derelicte, it is a fashion, a way of life inspired by the very homeless, the vagrants, the crackwhores that make this wonderful city so unique!"
It’s a quote from Zoolander, a comedy film.
Beat me to the reference!
@Trinity M you’re missing the point entirely. The quote is from Zoolander. It’s satire about this very thing.
@Trinity M girl take a nap.
@Trinity M Jeez, it's a quote from the comedy film Zoolander. Triggered much!??
This is kind of related to what you're talking about but it is more about how fast fashion has made people more apathetic and insensitive. I go to an art school in the U.S. and there are a lot of people down here who are really into fashion. The problem is that a lot of people will look at fashion and associate it with sub-cultures and stereotypes so when I go around not dressed stereotypically queer people will assume that I am straight even though I am Pan. Then some people will even think that being an Anarchist is an aesthetic so I will see a lot of 18 and 19 year old's dressed as punks convinced that they're rebelling. As far as my fashion goes I tend to dress more utilitarian/skater but I honestly don't know what type of impression I give off. To be honest it is just weird because I still feel like I am more of a stereotype in many people's eyes because of how I am Cuban but I am also an Anarchist with primitivist elements.
I relate to this so much. These people believe that they're rebelling against the system by buying stuff to appear that they follow these ideas.
This this!!
@@thekajalflaneur Thank you! It just doesn't make sense how people can genuinely say to my face that they can identify who is and who isn't queer simply by how we dress.
@@TheYoungKilljoy Yeah exactly.. It is why I find that in my opinion the 'new' counter culture is minimalist and doesn't focus on aesthetics and digital saturation.
hasn't that always been a thing though?
Rich people stopped displaying their wealth with their clothes and now display it with the beliefs they express
it's a dirty game
I'm middle class, but I wear a lot of clothes from my teenage years and hand-me-downs from my family. Some garments are faded with wear and tear, but are still useful. It's hard for me to let go of things, especially if they have sentimental value.
there's no such term as middle class. If one sells their labour, they are working class. No matter if they sell it toiling at a factory or sitting at an office desk as programmers or secretaries. They are all working class unless they possess means of production and hire people.
Working class and poverty isn't the same. I've lived both
Yes, and also I think it's hard to define what is poverty and what is a social class too (depends on the national standards, the type and amount of social helps provided by the state, the family history, etc). And i find it to make the debate about social class etc very difficult and dividing.
With fashion as an industry commodification of aesthetic is the only political outcome, when we push away from fast fashion and embrace thrifted or vintage as an aesthetic choice that then becomes the new scarce commodity and those who actually need to buy second hand lose out because wealthier individuals are buying up thrift inventory to mark up to eachother. I don't know how we can have fashion be an industry and aesthetic be a commodity without the structures of class warfare being recreated in some way.
In the small town where I'm from in Ireland, there is a "cottage orné" called Swiss Cottage which was built in the 1800s by the Butler family who lived in a castle nearby. They built this cottage for their daughter and her friends to have tea parties and play pleasant - which was popularised by Marie Antoinette with "The Queen's Hamlet". This trend reminded me of this 😅
🤣
The og cottagecore girlies.
marie didn't want her kids near court people
Imagine, saving up all year and buying a coat in a summer sale so you can be warmer next winter. Rich people could never. If I'm going to own a coat and it's my only one. It'll be a nice one if I can manage it. Also, you can get north face secondhand.
I also think a lot of what's considered "working class" clothes are items of clothing that are focused on function over form. It's why I like work boots (that are well made for it) as opposed to wingtips.
As someone who grew up in poverty and sometimes fumbled into the working class category (but hardly)... I won't be offended until they start thinking that using duct tape as a jean patch is cool🤣 but truth be told, it's just a trend and in a year they'll still be rich enough to buy three pairs of shoes each month while others get a new pair of shoes every four years. That's sadly just the way it is.
However, I do feel some sort of angst (that is totally created by my own self-pity) when I hear lower-middle-class individuals and even some working class who have enough money to properly sustain themselves and buy something when they need it, complain about how they don't have enough. We're growing up and living in an entirely consumption-based world where people think if they don't have the newest phone or the nicest clothes they're suddenly poor- that is not the same as living in poverty😭🤣
This has been going on for a long time, and for a variety of reasons. In the '40s and'50s, you could tell a person's "social class" by the suits and dresses they wore- the clothes semaphored their status in life. In the '60s and '70s, things started to change, with people becoming more discontent with this visible class divide: the wealthy started dressing more casually, the working class tried to dress up, but the latter can only go so far, whereas the former can spend as much as needed to achieve their look /s. In fact, in the '70s there were plenty of kids who would live the hippie lifestyle secure in the knowledge that if things wen wrong they could go back to their middle -or upper-class world, like these German kids are doing now. Dolce and Gabbana's street walker aesthetic in the '90s, along with ripped jeans, continued the trend. The conversation became more about being comfortable, but it also became more visually democratic, and it helped the social classes blend in more. Cosplaying a different class for street cred is not a good thing, but it could be the first step in a group's struggle to become aware, to walk a mile in someone's shoes. So, is it only about monetizing a "poverty aesthetic", or does it (perhaps inadvertently) also serve a more socialistic aspect?
Nah, rich kids trying to blend in with us only leads to those annoying pricks ruining what fun we have.
Is this kind of like how the upperclass ladies took their fashion from the local sex workers?
I am interested in reading about this if you know any articles or books?
reminds me of being in high school and saving up my pocket money to go buy a new tshirt or a book from the charity shop after school and being bullied for it, only to grow up and go to uni where private school girls from down south spend £80 on “vintage thrifted y2k” jeans that look like they’ve been worn daily for 10 years. One of said girls asked me why i always wear the same clothes. There is no issue with that if they’re clean surely? I explained im saving up for a car and think buying new clothes all the time is pointless and laughed asking why i don’t ask my dad to buy me a car…
Just a minor correction: That mural you said is in Berlin is actually on the outside of the Kulturpalast in Dresden, although you obviously will find similar murals in East Berlin. I live in Berlin but am also familiar with Dresden, so I just recognized it and was like... wait a minute that's not here, is it? :D Sorry for the nitpick, great video!
I love this topic because it’s so relevant. I think this trend is grotesque but I also think it’s always been this way. If you think of old money aesthetics and practices among the upper class (at least in the US), young wealthy people inherit clothes and heirlooms from their parents, grandparents and so on. They’d rather hold onto a well tailored double breasted coat with a hole in the pocket that their father gave them rather than spend hundreds, if not thousands, of dollars on a shiny new Canada Goose coat that everybody else has.
Meanwhile, the working class are always buying new things on retail because they never inherited these sorts of items. Big designer labels like Gucci or Fendi are aspirational because it symbolizes upward mobility. If you can get your hands on a relatively inexpensive Louis Vuitton knockoff on Canal street, it’s really to impress your coworkers within the same class group as you who probably can’t tell that it’s fake. Only the upper class person would be able to tell that it’s not the authentic bag.
In capitalism, the value of an object is determined by the supply versus the demand. If the supply is low and the demand is high, the value is great. If the manufacturer increases the supply to meet the demand of the common people, it may increase profits for the company but the value is steadily decreasing. Once an item or a brand becomes mainstream, it’s no longer appealing to the upper class.
The point is obscurity, exclusivity. Anything can become an upper class beauty or style trend as long as it excludes the average consumer. Take bleached eyebrows for example. Everyone I know in college was bleaching their brows because we all went to art school and we were pursuing careers and navigating spaces where we didn’t need to answer to a traditional employer who might not hire us because of our appearance. If a working class girl showed up for an average job interview with bleached eyebrows, a wolf cut and tattoos all over her body, she would likely not get the job.
Vintage and Consignment shopping, for example, is popular amongst these circles because the chance of someone wearing the same shirt you thrifted is extremely rare even if the item itself isn’t rare. The chances of you and your coworker or classmate wearing the same H&M top that was on sale last week is extremely high if everyone around you is shopping at the same 5 stores at the same mall nearby.
These upper class kids are intentionally subverting their style so that their taste is distinguishable solely to other upper class kids who are “in the know.” The rarity of the style choice determines the value of the person. Even if a rich kid is wearing a Hanes wife beater with his outfit, it’s considered high fashion not because the shirt is valuable but because the sartorial irony of styling a cheap wife beater with vintage designer clothes makes it “high brow.” I hope this makes sense because it shouldn’t make any sense but this is what these people are doing y’all…
I feel shame because I've totally played into this in a way without being aware of it, and to my disadvantage as well. I live with my single, lower middle class mom atm and work a part time job that barely pays me a livable wage and go to my local cc. Most of the left over money I get paid I spend on clothes, like "in the know" streetwear out of pure want, and that are technically out of my price range, because I think I desire for people to view me as being in the "in crowd" if that makes sense. It's like trying to signal to others that you're upper class without actually being that in order to reap its benefits. I justify to myself that by doing this It'll help me attract the right people for connections, and help me advance in the career I want, which is the artistic/entertainment realm so usually people care about appearance and dress well. I know I don't have the same lifestyle as those people I think are so cool living in places like LA or NYC or who go to universities with good bfa programs, but somehow I think emulating them is the closest I'll get to that lifestyle and will somehow help me someday be able live it. But its embarrassing to know that i've spent so much of money I didn't have on this expensive stuff for such a stupid reason and i'm ashamed that i've allowed capitalism to have such a grip on me in this way.
It also makes me feel like a phony because I support socialist movements and am involved in activism clubs and volunteer work, but wonder if wearing this stuff makes me a contradiction to the movement in that way, such as when Alice showed the guy wearing the north face jacket. idk :/
@@ytchannel1682 Don’t be ashamed! At the end of the day, money is nothing more than a tool. It comes and it goes. The system trains us to worship money and to feel like if we spend our money “irresponsibly” then it’s our fault if we can’t afford certain needs, but capitalism literally commodifies necessities that should be provided by the state and allows big corporations to brainwash us with ads making us feel like we need commodities like nice clothes and bags to be valued. I will be honest with you and say that your assumption is correct. I grew up upper middle class and went to NYU Tisch on a full ride and lived in LA after graduation. My single mom fell on hard times after the recession and was unemployed for many years so I have experienced the highest of highs and some pretty devastating lows when it comes to financial capital. But one thing I learned from this experience is that financial capital is only one variable that determines class. There is also cultural capital and social capital, which are not necessarily monetary based but the sorts of spaces where you may gain this sort of knowledge or these connections are often in elitist spaces like a big brand universities.
All this to say, you are right (unfortunately) that getting into the art world in any field is incredibly difficult if you aren’t a nepo baby and the main way into these industries is to make connections. Dressing the part is actually a huge portion of that entry point, but people don’t realize the style codes of these elitist circles are less obvious than just wearing a monogram designer bag. The people who should feel ashamed are the ones in the upper class who set the standard for who gets in and who stays out of these industries based on totally arbitrary standards of taste, social etiquette and beauty that don’t actually matter.
@@ytchannel1682 Listen girl, I am wearing a $50 Cometees Rage Against The Machine Bernie Sanders shirt as we speak and I have put this thing to USE! I have friends from college who are die hard Communists who love big name designer brands because that’s just who they are. There will always be contradictions in our lives because we’re human, but you can have fun with fashion and still believe in progressive causes. We express ourselves through clothing. As long as you’re making intentional choices when you shop, like staying away from fast fashion when you can or choosing sustainable brands when it’s affordable, you’re still being true to yourself and having fun!
@@sxt4447 I really appreciate your responses and your honesty, it really made me feel better about my consumption habits and the guilt i've associated with it, and you really opened up my perspective! I think the weird thing that sometimes gets to me the most out of all of this is the authenticity side of it. I constantly question that if by trying to emulate a lifestyle and class I don't belong in, does that make me inauthentic? or is it just survival in a way? Because on the surface level the desire for these items do come from the fact that I think they look cool, and because I like fashion and aesthetics, but more subconsciously I wonder if that desire stems more from class struggle and necessity for cultural and social capital like you said. It bothers me so much because even the concept of being inauthentic sends me into a bit of an existential crisis, but when you look at the reality of things now it almost like it's a necessary evil to be somewhat inauthentic in order to gain capital, especially if you're of a lower class. It's ironic because I feel like the art world is supposed to live on the principal of authenticity, but only a few people can afford to live truly authentic, while also having their safety nets. Sorry I'm kinda rambling haha, but you're response instantly made me think of all this, because I think it's where a lot of my guilt comes from!
In Australia, every private school kid is walking around thinking they are bogan / eshay and growing out mullets etc.
I think that Carhartt and Champion are some clothing brands that definitely got appropriated by the upper mid/ upper class. Used to be that I was made fun of relentlessly in school because I wore champion, which was a discount rack staple. now, a basic crew neck runs 80 dollars. Carhartt was made fun of because it was typically a hand me down. now, all you see is fresh clothes that havent seen a single day's work. it's shameful, really
I've noticed this for years and years in Melbourne, Australia where I grew up and still live. I always found it frustrating to see my well-off university classmates in the shabby, second-hand clothes that I used to be ashamed to wear when I was younger. I hated second-hand shopping as a kid, finding second-hand shops depressing and mildly repulsive. I feel very differently now, but nonetheless as I grew up, and got an income of my own, I so valued being able to buy good-quality, long-lasting clothes from more ethical brands. I'm not so bothered by this 'cosplay' anymore, mostly because I can recognise a real pride from the working class, and an empowerment knowing that we can be taste makers too. Having said that, when my rich classmate complains of being 'poor' - because she doesn't earn her own money, because her parents pay for all her expenses - I can't help but roll my eyes
one of my biggest ??? moments at art school was when someone told me, in all seriousness, that my clothes were so fashionable...i was still wearing the stuff that had gotten me socially ostracized in middle/high school (we weren't poor at that time but there wasn't a lot of money being allotted to clothes).
with regards to so many people from rich families calling themselves poor/"broke"....at some point i had an argument with an older student about whether or not to give a man on the street change. he said we were poor ourselves since we were just students; i disagreed since both of us were getting a lot of financial help from our relatives. i don't think the rich students calling themselves poor realize how a strong network of support is actually a form of wealth.
I’m from Melbourne too but have been living abroad for a few years and moving away from home seriously made me realise how much wealth and money is in the inner city. Also, private school culture still exists even when people leave school and go to uni. The rich kids will move to gentrified suburbs and distance themselves from their upper middle class families but still exist in a microcosm of elite Melbourne social circles who influence the art, music, fashion scene etc etc.
@@sandratran8335 fellow Melbournian and art school student confirming ^^^ social and cultural capital can still get you places. I don't wanna hear your art nepo septum piercing oat milk latte stick n poke tatt ass complain about being 'broke' and rent in gentrified suburbs. give the man some change goddammn
@@sandratran8335 oh my goodness do not get me started on the private school culture!! It's insane, when I started going to Melbourne uni was the first time I really saw how deep it runs, and just how icky it is... To put it kindly. On that note of rich kids distancing themselves from their wealth, my favourite game to play walking through uni was trying to spot "the private school kid who REALLY does not want you to know they went to a private school" - much as they like to cosplay working class, you can always tell!
She came from Greece she had a thirst for knowledge.
Honestly this enrages me so much 😭 let's make all the rich people who do this not have food and any stability and worry about being homeless constantly so they can walk the walk ❤❤❤❤
lmfao so true
It would be good 😅😅😅 come into my life!
Good idea
As somebody who constantly gets told she is rich because Shes (used to be) middle class, these are problems that we already have to think about😭. It’s really the millionaires and billionaires that are the problem
I agree but
This might be long but I believe it’ll be worth it.
I often see two most common situations where people will adopt a look associated with a certain class, group or culture. The first one is where these people are actually associated with that given group, either by affinity or by being inserted in that reality. This is the case for the real punks, the people who wear gorpcore cos they actually hike and so on. These people are dressing what they live, see and need.
The second one is the opposite, people who choose to dress a certain way to reference a culture they’re not part of. This can have many reasons but in the situation described in the video I see it as an attempt to try to portrait something less sterile than the individualist middle upper class lifestyle. People who live in those classes have such an individualistic life isolated from anyone else’s world that they don’t have a way to communicate nor to identify themselves through the semiotics of clothes if not by stealing other peoples style to mimic any type of expression.
Fashion to its core is a representation of a person’s personality but also of the culture they are part of. When the only culture you’re part of is your home’s, there’s nothing else to do but copy and hope that will give you some feelings of belonging and that’s very sad to see
I think you’re definitely right about the individualism! At least for more everyday people. It’s hard to imagine a big company having that motive though, I feel like they’re being disruptive and disrespectful on purpose because it creates controversy and therefore publicity
The north face is associated with working class in the UK? Hmm I live in the UK and I disagree - north face is a v. middle class brand.
I would never have called people who live in rentals 'homeless' ??? Is that a translation issue? They're renters, with shelter, not homeless, on the street. 🤨
The issue with this is that working class that actually need things like carhartts (me) or other working brands, is that the prices go up because they're in fad. I already can't afford many pairs of pants because they are expensive. But now it's going to get worse.
It comes in cycles. And it's even infected the music scene to a certain degree: Pulp had a song about this very topic called "Common People." And Mark E. Smith of The Fall was a proletariat musician till the very end, yet other alternative musicians copied his style and attitude to much greater commercial success. (Pixies, Pavement, Wet Leg, etc.)
That reminds me of this Jenna Marbles’ sketch she did about women where she describes having three looks: A Homeless Man, A Twelve Year Old Boy, and A Hooker. It is a testament to the wealthy their naïveté in the ways of poor and working class people.
What is that is Tommy Cash - an Estonian rapper and he does this 'ironically'. He had a shop branded Kanye East where he sold rugs and hoodies for horses. ;)
Aaaand he also grew up relatively poor in Eastern-Europe....
This has been going on since I was a poor child in the US. I'm 29 now. The brands I used to get made fun or judged for wearing out of necessity, have now been "appropriated" by high middle class to wealthy people who like the "poor" aesthetic. The truth is high fashion has been doing this since it's inception. It's not really a new concept per se. It's just a topic most people are uncomfortable talking about or even addressing in IRL fashion spaces or anywhere for that matter. Thrift stores have added to the problem only to a small extent and so has technology. It's not solely a capitalism issue. It's part of much broader transnational issues. It's definitely a street credibility thing I've noticed in major cities. The pattern I've seen is that it usually stems from a place where people who do this have no real self identity and use it to create a new version of themselves in many ways.
I would note that cultural appropriation is not inherently unethical, cultural misappropriation is.
Technically you are correct, but appropriation is also commonly used in the context of not having the permission to take that thing regardless of how you use it
And to most people taking something without permission is unethical
@green mayo man🍓 wait what hi
@green mayo man🍓 WAIT YOU COMMENTED ON ANNAMARIE'S VID HI LOL
@@RatClowns But how is that "permission" granted if we're talking about cultures and cultural practices? ...A contract between interested parties?
Im born and raised very working class American and I’ve been fetishizing the style for years. To embrace my lower status!!!
Can one fetishize themselves?
same, i like to wear secondhand clothes that have been gifted to me (basically all my jeans/clothes) and in a way i like my neighborhood too
Grew up working in a feed mill and now I work construction. I could buy a new pair of coveralls, but the ones I've patched together with fishing line over the years are one of a kind- I might look shabby to some, but these clothes are symbolic of my ability to fix things instead of just throwing them out like the wasteful bourgeois
i'm probably dumb but i'm a little confused at what the rich people are SUPPOSED to be wearing ngl. like the "working class" clothes just look like normal, comfortable clothes to me. like somebody in the comments has brought up flannel, which is just...a comfortable material. i have no sympathy for billionaires or whatever but with this specific issue i'm just failing to see how dressing comfortably in normal, non-flashy clothes is something the working class specifically have a patent on. if i was rich i don't think i'd be dressed up like i'm on the runway to go get a coffee or whatever. i don't know man. it just feels a little weird to call wearing regular, everyday clothes cultural appropriation. the only place i can see an issue is buying from thrift stores because you're taking cheaper options from people who actually need it
The function over form is very prominent in Asia, especially among low income families and working class people . For example, it is very rare to see them using glasses for drinking water or cold beverages. Instead, they use mugs or cups, many of them are actually free merchandise. Another exceptional example is the almost absence of different kinds of tissues that are common in the West. For families that can include tissues in their budget, they almost exclusively buy toilet rolls. Besides for wiping private parts, they are also found in living rooms, bedrooms even dining tables. Speaking of dining tables, they are often used as desks when not used for dining; dining spoons are used for scooping ice-cream, stirring hot drinks… the list goes on. As for fashion, men view polo shirts and short-sleeved shirts as clothing for going out and formal occasions; skirts are the women’s equivalent to men’s polo shirts.
The same can be said for their consumption of upscale brand, although which brands are considered “upscale” differ from country to country. For example, CK and Levi’s are considered “premium” in where I live, but probably not so in other countries.
Finally, the use of iPhone, regardless of how old the model is, is a must for the bourgeois-aesthetic of the working class youths.
Hi, just out of my own curiosity can I ask where you found this information and where I could read more about utility in homes vs. aesthetics especially in Asian culture? I wanna read more about this
My family does a lot of the same things you mentioned (we're north west US), we've never differentiated between cup/spoon/toilet paper usage (i have a tp roll in my room for when my nose runs). I think the only think that we dont really do is have specific formal events (mostly just clean niceish looking clothes, like a tshirt and jeans)
Demna Gvasalia is the epitome of this. He took our traumatizing childhood of growing up in a war-ridden Caucasus in the 90s and turned it into chique. I have such mixed feelings.
I feel like our trauma is being appropriated at Vetements and Balenciaga. But then it's weirdly nostalgic.
P.S. the person you are wondering about is Tommy Cash from Estonia. He's showing the aesthetic of growing up in Estonia and in a Russian neighborhood.
I live in Barcelona, and now this “trend” has slowly begun to seep into our streets. It’s almost grunge- working class. It’s a take on the aesthetics, but it’s been made more “punk” in a way. Personally, I like the overall look, and I was someone who had multicolored hair, gages, and piercings, but it’s the significance behind what it truly means. I think mainly of the kids who are adopting this style don’t see it as “appropriation”… honestly don’t even think they think about where it comes from. I think for most 16-26 year olds they just think it’s “cool.” And leave it at that. It’s super interesting though & loved the video. Subscribe & looking forward to more of your videos.
What I find kinda funny is that a lot of high fashion brands are made to sell overpriced stuff to poor people that want to look rich, while the rich want to look poor.
On the topic of poverty and the working class in the west, I must separate Europe from the US as the social system is so different and the class line is put on the different quality of life. The working class in Europe can afford most things, in the US most of the middle-class lives paycheck to paycheck being on brink of total ruin if they get sick and require hospitalisation. In Sweden where I live the traditional working class is not impoverished anymore, the lifestyle is fairly comfortable, with a vacation to Thailand once a year, nice housing and money to afford the latest electronics. The new impoverished class are immigrants and their descendants, who truly do start from 0 and did not inherit wealth or housing from grandparents. A satirical political tv-show "Herr talman" in Sweden proposed that that's why the socialist and left party was so for mass immigration, to increase the "new working class" that has the potential to develop class disdain and vote for the socialist/left party. Thou I think it's not the whole picture it does point out an interesting aspect of modern-day class division, Especially funny considering how many upper-middle-class young swedes living nowhere near immigrants I heard use the rinkeby accent primarily used in swedens most notorious ghetto.
The phrase culturally appropriate fashion of the working class seems to me just as ridiculous as the common use of cultural appropriation, it's impossible to draw a clear line so I personally don't bother with an attempt. There is no clear division of a working class and middle class, especially as one now can move between classes, as we have multiple working-class origin artists creating successful careers influencing fashion based on that experience, if the working-class experience isn't allowed to influence then it can't be profitable to market then working-class artist can't get a carer. If anything shouldn't the fact that fashion no longer segregates class be a good thing as it allows for more interaction, understanding and eventually empathy?
But on the other hand, no matter how much socialism/communism talks about eradicating class, in practice, people still create hierarchical systems, I suspect that it must be a natural instinct one actor has to fight or accept as part of humanity.
Both my parents come from the USSR and while all people (with the exemption of politicians and bosses) had the same income officially (and the traditionally working-class handy workers got extra income through black work) still there was class division, the intellectual/academic class was above the simple proletariat while earning the same or less, and to be a part of that class people went into higher educations and spend more time to study to get a harder profession to enter this class. Of course, logically people should do the easiest thing with the most profit, like maybe an electrician who gets the same official pay as the surgeon while spending less time as a student and being able to take on black work to get even more pay but due to the desire to become above others people went into harder educations. Maybe not every young person did it consciously but mostly due to parental pressure/grooming, I also presume that a part went to higher education from talent/passion but most consciously or subconsciously did it to avoid being part of the "pleabs".
It is very disheartening as a person who grew up in poverty and who now is a young woman in the working class to see all of the things that I used to be belittled before become some sort of lifestyle. When I was a child and I had to wash my clothes with well water and hang them up to dry I was “dirty.” I remember one particularly hurtful insult was when a friend told me I smelled like a wet dog. Now it’s been rebranded as “sustainable living?” The hand knit sweaters I wore because I could not afford a coat were ugly then, and now it’s cheque? What about my pearl earrings and the bun I would wear in a clip? And on one hand I am happy to see these that I love appreciated, but at the same time, it shouldn’t be a trend. It is a lifestyle that most people have no choice in, yet it seems the lifestyle is only glamorized when it is a choice
I have a north face coat that I got for $2.40 by using discounts and free gift cards I got for paying my bills with my credit card… so the people critiquing that guy for having a north face coat should understand they don’t have enough info… it sounds insane but you can get a $400 coat for nearly free in the right circumstances.
I own a couple that I got second hand.
I remember as a working class kid growing up in an expensive city, my mum would never buy clothes from fast fashion brands. She would check and always feel the material before buying anything. Till this day I wear a lot of tshirts and jeans I got when I was a teenager. Been a decade and the they do look worn but not shabby.
Rich people trying obsessively to blend in with us while simultaneously resenting us with every fiber of their being
It's not so different from white people acting like being East Asian is an aesthetic, while treating those with East Asian heritage with contempt.
Hi! I'm just here to say every aesthetic is cool now. That girl aesthetic, influencer aesthetic, old money aesthetic: they are rich girl looks, and they're trending now. Gansta aesthetic, streetwear aesthetic, joggers and tight y2k tops: they're "poor" people anesthetics, some of them even having influences that come from people that went to jail, and they're trending now. Ballerina aesthetic when you're not a dancer. Tennis girl aesthetic and you don't even play tennis. Streetwear aesthetic and you don't even like rap. Goth girl aesthetic and you're a normal genZ girl.
It's not that people fetishize one thing clearly, it's just that as a society we're all fantasizing with a lifestyle different than the ones we have. And fashion is reflecting our frustration with ourselves
I think you missed the point of that video. Alice never said dressing in a certain aesthetic is problematic or not okay. She explained that it is problematic how certain things get conceptualised as an aesthetic because that hurts the very people whoose life it commodifies. I think you hit the nail in the head when you said that fashion is about fantasizing a lifestyle different from the one we live. But you need to ask: why then do we make certain lifestyles into an aesthetic? If you watch PhilosophyTube, "it's about the notes not being played".
like costuber rich women dressing victorian
Very interesting. There’s also, imho, another aspect of rich people dressed as poor: a sense of vampirization of energies, rich people wants to appropriate energy that a fetishized gaze attributes to poor people. Wearing cheap clothes is like a rush of adrenaline, a momentaneous breath of real air.
This was common in the 1960s-70s counter culture, too. I think people thought of it as a form of solidarity and rejection of capitalism that time around, but this looks different.
now it's used for the aesthetic curation of the romanticized lifestyle of the "lower class"
I have a Carhartt coat my mom had for years. It it too big for me, but Carhartt cost loads, especially now. It has always been more expensive, but they can last decades, which is way we save up to buy them. People turning it into some sort of clout fashion is stupid, and we can easily tell you apart from the working class. .
Thank you for helping me put my finger on this concept, Alice! It's so common in universities as well. And even in progressive businesses or non profits. I've had I think three jobs since college where I, at some point, came to realize I was the only person working there who was actually living entirely on the wage we were making 😆
Great vid. I’ve been a big critic of these fashion trends ever since Jacobim Mugatu’s “Derelicte” campaign.
I agree with you !
What is totally dishonest and goes with the appropriation / cosplay of another population, is not assuming your identity.
For example : I'm from a very bourgeoise family. I didn't choose that, I'm not responsible for where I was born. But trying to hide it isn't honest (or even worse : lying and saying I'm a working class woman). When I have political conversations with working class friends, it wouldn't be fair to talk to them as if I was also from that class. Because I never lived some things that are part of their daily life since they're children, I never suffered from some of their constant problems. And it would be so disrespectful to them to act as if I really shared those things they live(d).
So I didn't choose my class, but I can choose what I do with my privileges, I can try to erase them by participating to the lutte des classes, eventho, personally and in an egocentric way, I won't benefit from the lutte des classes, and I will loose my privileges. But through this process, this lutte, I'm not going to lie about who I am : it wouldn't be fair to anybody.
I like this video cuz I hate all the rich people who have ripped t shirts like they are almost playing being in poverty
I think for me part of the reason I dress in ways that can be called this style is because despite growing up middle class, I was only 1 generation removed from being working class and 2 from abject poverty. My mother was still very frugal and while she did value buying nice things, she wanted them to last. I own a suitcase from l.l.bean that I have gotten them to repair 3 times (they have a lifetime warranty). I now have an expensive durable winter coat but the boots and coats I wore as a child were all hand me downs from my cousins as I would quickly grow out of them. My mom did value me looking good but also valued not making bad purchases and repairing the things that I own. I think having these values is positive even if your family is no longer poor.
The middle class is a myth created to weaken the working class. There is only the capitalist class and the working class. You are working class, even if you aren't living in abject poverty.
Everyone should watch the video "Why You're Not "Middle Class"" from the channel Second Thought
@@chatnoir9038 Seconding this! The working class/the rich distinction is so misinterpreted and misunderstood nowadays.
Middle class is a little of a shaky term, because it is more of a cultural illusion than a real thing.
I am "middle class" by looks now, but my parents are immigrants, my grandparents were born and raised in absolute poverty, and for 6 y of my life I was borderline homeless. So, am I middle class?
It's all just working class, that's why you struggle to fit into idea of a middle class too.
@@RubyJamez Interesting take. If you ask me the middle class is just a term made up by the bourgeoisie. Most who identify themselves as middle class do it based on their relation to capital or their occupation's social status, neglecting that some "working-class" occupations earn more than them. The Marxist way of viewing social classes is by analyzing a group's relation to the means of production in which most intermediate bosses or other stereotypical "middle-class" professions owns none and are by definition workers as well. This is my take:)
OR maybe they find the "poor people clothes" more comfortable and when they go home are under pressure from their families to conform to the dress code of their class. I'm 53 and deal with this every time I go back to my small Southern town to visit my mom. What I want to wear is jeans and a t-shirt, and not even a nice t-shirt. Some have a few small holes but are totally comfortable. What I end up wearing is what I will call Upper Middle Class White People clothes for a few days because it is just way easier to do that than deal with my 82 year old mother's disapproving looks, frowns, and noises.
not sure i agree with the take asking if there's no beauty in the life of a sex worker. in the context of working class women that engage in sex work, there really is no beauty in the fact that these women are forced to sell themselves to make money. i'd say the only women that can engage in sex work relatively safe is bourgeoise women.
also, what exactly do you mean when you say "sex work"? because if you're talking about proletarian women and the working class the more accurate term would be "prostitution". calling it "sex work" alludes that it's like any other job working class people enter into. but in reality it's just not the same.
realest take here
Hi please I'm confused, maybe it's because I'm at the beginning of this video, but how does wearing working class outfits refer to culture?
What culture are they taking it out of?
I'm not familiar with this kind of stuff so please feel free to enlighten me
Respectfully
thank you for all the lessons, Alice
i'm glad the takeaway from this video isn't "rich people should stop looking like theyre working class" but rather that people who aren't working class should use this opportunity to learn more, and "understand its values and beauty" as you say. i also think dressing with a working class aesthetic can be a form of rebellion for some upper class people. i'm from an american upper-class background and was expected to look "presentable" "classy" "put-together," aka conform to cishet white capitalist patriarchal standards of beauty and taste. i remember when i would rebel against this by dressing how i wanted, people would tell me that i looked homeless or even "trashy." but in reality i was dressing like the grunge and punk people that i admired. i think when people wear carhartt or other brands associating with the working class, and shop at thrift stores just to look cool and follow a trend, its annoying because they're not really disrupting society or going against the status quo. but if you're doing it to rebel against trends and societal expectations then i respect it.
So many fashion trends that working class or poor people create are jacked by the fashion industry. Suddenly things that were once deemed trashy or not stylish are deemed trendy and celebrated as innovative by the fashion industry. If you explore the roots of a trend chances are it came from the streets. It’s a lot more obvious now with the internet and social media. I remember when carhartts became trendy and the price went up. It’s ridiculous.
I also hate when people get angry when they see a working class or poor person because they have a smart phone or aren’t just buying 99 cent raked to eat. It’s ridiculous and cruel to perpetuate the idea that poor people are not allowed to have anything unless it’s the cheapest possible option.
This is fascinating to me, in that I had no idea that there was a sub culture of people that cared about these things. For me it seems extremely neurotic. For one's self confidence to be so dependent on the perceived aesthetic judgement of other people, to me, seems like a huge mistake. The classism, the hierarchical framework only holds power when people believe in it, it's like puff the magic dragon, it's not required, it doesn't help us, it holds no virtue, let it die. The only people that would want to cling to it are those who lack the self confidence to compete in a society on their own merit.
I’m reminded about how much time I spend NOT reading whenever I watch your videos. Thank you
In a saner society when money becomes obsolete and collaboration replaces competition, we would make the best long lasting products possible, so if you have tennis shoes, you know that it's the best there is available for everyone, no matter what color or form you choose. There would be no incentive to have more and more stuff that turns into waste because of advertisements telling you you're not cool enough. Clothing will be functional and if you want to be creative you'll have a 3D printer and volunteers that help you produce that tomato shaped dress you've just finished designing.
keep dreaming🤣
To be honest, the whole sentiment seems to boil down to one behavior I have seen in every rich/ western culture influenced person around me , which is the obvious hollowness of what they chase. They do not take the effort to care and learn about things that give life real meaning, like philosophy, work and genuine relationships, and then follow the "trendsetters" blindly. Except that the apparent "influencers" are not the trendsetters. Trendsetters are, ironically, the people society consistently and ruthlessly rejects. Nerds never had an easy life - even when the "nerdy" aesthetic got popular (not that they are to be pitied , they are living their best life away from pop culture). Meanwhile, the trend following crowd buys expensive pairs of nerdy looking glasses, and continues to live their empty lives.
In the US, all the “cool kids” are wearing carhart- clothing for people working outdoors in harsh conditions- think lineman, construction workers, etc.
I’m not “fashionable” myself, but I find it odd..
Preppy is out, car mechanic is in lol.
0:16 It is Tommy Cash, an Estonian rapper and singer :)
Is this really a problem?
THIS IS SOMETHING THAT HAS BEEEN HAPPENING!!!! this is literally where culture appropriate comes from!
Exactly it's been happening for eons. It's not anything new.
I have a cousin who's parents are relatively wealthy, they can and do literally get anything they ever want. I've literally watched them whine on the phone at their dad for almost an hour while we were trying to go into a club venue for him to get lava cakes from dominos delivered to them and when they asked me to tell their dad how they NEEED it, I was like "you could make a grilled cheese." To which they probably rolled their eyes. They wear thrifted clothes to "make their poor friends feel better." Really hoped it was just them. Guess not.
My mom grew up working class. Even though I would consider us middle class, I adapted a lot of the habits you mentioned. I'm like my mom and grandma in most cases
In regards of fashion, my mom always preferred to dress for function and fashion was just second. This means she has a lot of older good quality basics. Her siblings also had a simular approach. I'm the only cousin who has simulator proportions as them back then and who isn't really into fashion. Even though I'm the oldest cousin on my mom's side, I mainly own hand me downs (It really helped that my grandma hated throwing things out) . I wore my aunts first communion dress for mine. My winter clothes are my mom's and uncle's old ones. My favorite jacket belonged to my mom and 2 uncle's bevor I started wearing it.
When I was younger I was always kind of disappointed, that I had so many old clothes to wear, because shiny and new always seemed better. Now I've turned into my mom or grandma.
The only thing I have to buy are shoes, because they for some reason I got the most f-ed up shaped ones out of my family.
Sorry, got kind of off topic.
If my job involved me mostly being outside in the cold, I'd absolutely buy a 300 pound coat. Or I'd thrift it, lol
This is the video by you that I most enjoyed. It rings close to home (is that how you say in English?)
I am Portuguese and grow up in a village that has an historic castle and those adjecent small coble streets and the the village grows from there, large streets, building avenues. The people from the historic centre mostly were poor and/or ciganos (a Portuguese etny similar to Romani, that would sell clothes on the market and what not and have cultural rules like the men would grow the beard and wear all black for years if they grieving, long skirts and hair for the women, etc)
When I was younger I had collegueas that would make fun of those groups and the place I lived and bully the people from there. It never, well it bothered me, but it never got to me, because I loved my neighbourhood. It's the kind of place everyone helps each other. Those girls and one in particular was high middle class, would make those frequent vacations to those south america resorts etc and make fun of us, who despite living not that far from the beach, didn't had the money for the bus and would sometimes go back to school in September white as a goose.
Anyway, fast foward some years, that same girl, now that is trendy and cool, to not only go live there next to me, but she illegally took a space of my family, emptied it from our family belongs and is renting that on airbnb! It's surreal. And completely ilegal. And I will fight in the courts but is just to show how far some people go, even nowdays, with a colonial type mentality. Just the emotional schock it was to be closed off a space is ours, her family changed the locks, was horrific. They don't talk to anyone here.
Gentrifying neighbourhoods, dressing workclass, it's all part of a large scale narcissism, where some people really want it all. Here in our country, one of richest men, Ricardo Salgado, who stole money from a lot of families, calls it "to play like the poors play". This is real, he said that. That was about a large resort they built that is destroying the natural dunes and privatizes the beach for a 5 star hotel.
Send good vibes, I need them!
it hits close to home
Sending good vibes!!! That’s exactly why I hate air bnb. So many perfectly good homes are just gone! I can’t imagine how you must be feeling, she should never have been able to do that and I hope you can stop her. Your neighbourhood sounds lovely by the way! Places where everyone helps each other are so nice
illegally > get legal advice, some charities might help
it's genocidal, actually
UN defined genocide includes replacement