Air Shock or Coil Shock on a Trail Bike? I tested both and I'm surprised!
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 15 ก.ค. 2020
- So what is the deal with coil shocks on trail bikes? Use the code REMY15 on www.dvosuspension.com and click here to support my channel and help me to do more edits like this! bit.ly/39xojyn
WHAT I RIDE:
Jenson: bit.ly/39xojyn
Frame: www.cube.eu/fr/cube-bikes/
Suspensions: www.dvosuspension.com USE CODE REMY15
Tires, wheels, cassettes and guide: www.ethirteen.com USE CODE REMY20
Brakes:
Grips, seats: bit.ly/2OBhD9s
Bars, stems and hydraulic post: bit.ly/2usJSjK
Pedals: bit.ly/2UD37Sq
Cranks and Shifter/Der: bit.ly/2vfRYfT
Rigid post: bit.ly/3bwesdc
Chain: bit.ly/31DUAjS
Mud Guards: www.themudhugger.co.uk USE CODE REMY20
EQUIPMENT:
Helmets, protection, gear: bit.ly/2vjjgSh
Glasses and goggles: www.julbo.com/fr_fr/
Hydration:
Bike racks: bit.ly/2S8NMat
Nutrition: www.ergogenicsnutrition.com USE CODE remy10
Non riding gear: www.shop.lululemon.com
Luggage: www.douchebags.com
Trainer: www.tacx.com/
Socks: www.dissentlabs.com
Custom Watch: nokturnalwatches.com/products...
SERVICES AND MAINTENANCE:
Lube, wash: www.wd40bike.com
Tools: bit.ly/2OAKcEc
Shop: www.evolutionwhistlershop.com
Suspensions: www.vorsprungsuspension.com
Bike racks: www.steadyrack.com USE CODE remy10
Quiet bike: stfubike.com USE CODE REMY15
Thanks for watching, see you on the trails or on TH-cam
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#dvojadex #remymetailler #mountainbiking - กีฬา
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Jenson USA has some big sales: bit.ly/3fBd0YF ! Save money and support my channel at the same time!
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Man you aren't joking. Fly had some jerseys over 58% off. Now I'm kicking myself I didn't get more.
I wonder if having coil on the front would get a positive real ride review too? Good stuff man!
Correction: it was Fast House. They came in today. ✌
for european people is this side bad!! everything is in inch!!! METRIC !!!!! at the helmets, i dont know which size!! and i cant copy the inch numbers, to calculate into cm! this side must change much !
@@overtoomm 1 inch = 2.54cm.
To convert inches to centimeters multiply your figure by 2.54
Hey Remy! Je pensais à remplacer mes roues pour une paire un peu plus robuste. Tu roules sur les LG 1 Race Carbon? Ton discount code est toujours valide? Cheers!
Class act how you stopped to make sure the kid was ok. Its moments like that when you can see what kind of a person someone is. Great Job!
Yep he is the gentleman of TH-cam bikers. Positive language, good manners.
Hi Remy... I like how you stopped to make sure if the 2 mini-shredders were ok. Not too many people would do that, but as a Dad-shredder I appreciate it.
BTW - Great comparison test. I'm going to see about a coil spring on my Devinci Troy.
I appreciate that!
Thelostco here on youtube has a video or too with the coil on the Troy. They make some good videos as well :)
Surpriiiise...Troy and Spartan 2021 now with coil!!!
The upload has stopped! Sorry for the delay. Will see you in a few hours... SORRY
Thx for the info 👍🏼
Ah ok
are you sponsored by cube?
i enjoy when you compare components. not many professional riders do that. really cool to have your thoughts on topics like this one!
Have 3 rides on my new Cube Stereo 170 TM. Amazing bike! Wouldn't have bought it without watching you shred on a Cube!
I thought you were noticeably faster and more comfortably in control with the coil shock.
*[Gets dust and gravel in his eyes]*
"AH, THE DERT IS NICE!"
Thanks for this vid, it was really great, I’ve been racking my brains over this choice for several weeks now and you’ve help me out a great deal. Happy trails my friend, Keep Pedaling!!!!
Thanks for your video. I was debating on a coil shock for my next bike... I was leaning towards the coil and your review was helpful.
Yup, loving my coil shock but don't ride it near as hard and well as you do of course! Great video Remy!!!
Merci beaucoup Rémy. grateful to your insight with DVO.... i bought a Topaz 2 trunnion from them with your promo for my already amazing Giant Trance x2 and didn't realize how much a positive difference it would make? AMAZING plush and supportive. i can confidently go faster with more control. also upgraded my bar to one-up carbon WOW. softer yes. and finally... watching you ride with other amazing riders...Mullet rocks. just overall more fun playful and comfortable. MERCI. je les adore toute a fait. impeccable.
Just bought a 2019 Transition Sentinel that has the Jade X Coil and the Onyx fork. Way more bike than I know how to even handle at the current point in my riding progression, but after this video, I am super excited to get out and shred once it gets here!
Awesome video! I just tried my first coil from EXT on my Megatower. Just got my air shock back. Be interesting to go back to air and feel the difference. Wish I had done back to back like yourself now haha.
Great video! I'm loving mine!
Awesome. Very informative and incredible riding 🤘🏼 Thank you!
You make me feel super confident on my impulse buy or a jade x coil today. Gonna be sick on the ripmo af with the coil fork.
Look at Sprindex, their springs are adjustable rate. I have their 490-560 lb spring on my Commencal Meta TR 29 SX, it's amazing. I can adjust the rate just a few seconds by twisting the adjuster.
I'm just in the process of doing this on my other half's Trek Remedy, so it was really helpful to get her to understand the benefits of sticking a coil, whilst also doing a back to back comparison, through your video. She totally digs your content and we totally love your accent!
Coil on a remedy is a great upgrade. Changed the bike completely in my opinion.
I agree with the content, but I some difficulty deciphering Remy's accent. I got hooked on hearing what he had to say because his information and test parameters were spot on.
I have done a coil vs. air shock test too and came to the conlcusion, that coil shocks are poppier than air shocks. Quite contrary to what all the people say. Now I have the EXT Storia LOK V3 and it's even poppier. I will not go back to air anytime soon.
Harz Enduro really? I have the Ext Storia Lok V2 in my Nukeproof Mega 290 and while it’s perfect in absorbing small and big hits and the ride feel and traction are unreal, I always feel like I can’t get that backwheel up as easy as I’d like.
I really noticed that yesterday, because I bought a Fox Float X2 for the time my Storia is at service at Schnurr-Tech.
Installing the X2 really made the bike easier to jump and more playful so I’m kinda questioning if I should sell the Storia.
I’ll ride it after the service for a few months and maybe it’ll be better in the popping department after the service.
Btw. I grew up in Goslar and know some of the nice trails the Harz has to offer!
ist auch nicht verwunderlich. Braucht man sich nur mal Prüfstandläufe ansehen. Im ersten Moment sind Stahlfedern deutlich sensibler. In der Mitte, wo man das poppige fühlt sind sie min. genau so wie eine Luftfeder....
@@michaelh5942 speak English
Great video Rémy! I’ve never seen someone ride those trials that fast, must be the suspension 😝!
Ronnie's sauce I heard...
Nice feedback, directly from the trail, very scientific approach, really! And wow this trail! The only thing we could saybis that since there is two different mountings depending on the shock type, this directly changes the kinematic. It will be interesting to use the coil shock on the air mounting and vice versa, i am sure the feeling will be different. La bise
Hey Rémy, it's a really good video, so much so that I decided to buy the DVO Jade X. Sadly there are none in stock anywhere including DVO.
Your comparative observation of coil versus air shock is very interesting to me as an engineer! You noticed the coil offering more sensitivity & feedback for the small bumps, and greater apparent traction. After watching & listening to your real-time narrative, I suddenly realized why the coil makes a more responsive shock.
The air shock requires a seal between its piston & cylinder, adding static friction that must be overcome with a significant difference of pressure before forcing the piston to move in response; by contrast, the spring is unrestrained by friction, thus is free to move without delay.
I'm now thinking about how to conveniently 'tune' the coil on a ride!
Thanks for your initial research & evidence!
great insight!
Late post, but check out Sprindex rear springs. Adjustable spring rate coils. Love mine.
Surprised no one is using magnetic oil yet to electronically adjust a coil shock yet. This tech is in cars already.
Very informative video! Recently referred someone to this video, and your channel, who was inquiring on Reddit about switching to a coil shock on their Propain Tyee.
I also personally just switched to a coil shock on my Ibis Ripmo AF from the Topaz air. And I experienced better traction, and control with the coil almost immediately. I found the Topaz v1 air to be unsupportive in the 2nd half of it's travel, but with no volume spacers installed. I did order the AVR kit from DVO, but stumbled upon a smoking deal on a Push ElevenSix coil already tuned for my Ripmo AF. No regrets.
Just got the Jade, excited to try it
I went to coil on my Tracer and I love it!
I tried this same test but in my case with the coil I cased 3/4 of the jumps instead of the usual half. I did like that extra braking traction on detroit rock city though.
Great review and riding. The coil preformed better with the coil to my view.
Yo remy! I'm going to whistler this weekend, hope to see you there bro🤙
very nice Videos! I always watch them to get ready for my ride :) may thanks and best greetings from Austria!
I noticed the same things on mine. I am riding an Ibis Ripmo AF and it came with the Topaz. I just switched to the Jade X coil and I feel like I get way more small bump sensitivity and more overall traction. Yet I still have a lot of midstroke support and pop. The bike is still super playful which was surprising to me. I actually like climbing tech stuff better too. I am getting through more rocks and roots on the uphills due to the better sensitivity and traction.
Hey man how did you switch? I'm in the exact same boat and really want a Jade for my Ripmo. Did your LBS do it or did you contact DVO directly?
Great video, I love the detailed comparison. What would you say about coil shocks on shorter travel (130 - 150) bikes used for more XC and All Mountain riding?
For me air just feels faster despite a tiny little difference in traction. With coil the plush feel is nice but the glued down traction sometimes can feel slower when going full speed.
Can’t wait for this alarm set
Amazing video! Really felt through the camera how glued the bike was to the ground with the coil shock. Great review!
I agree. The coil had a smoother response to hits and there was less noise coming from the bike. Just my no knowledge observation. Man, Remy can really rail and puts those components under real stress, which hits the top bar on performance.
Steve from Vorsprung suspension... IMO one of the best suspension gurus around. People like to rave about those guys over at Fox, but Steve and the dude from Mojo are A Cut Above. Steve is much more technical and analytical. Vorsprung suspension videos are priceless info 👍
Awesome video, great info!
I haven't had coil since the late 90s ... then decided to put a DHX2 and a Marzocchi coil on my bike.. pretty much out of curiosity.
Small bumps sure feel better. Less diving/buckling/blowing through sections of the stroke ... sure ...
But the extra traction you get is SHOCKING. Even at places where you wouldn't expect, like a gravel road, or slimy rocks/roots.
nice demonstration Rémy, I'll be sure to refer back to this when I get a downhill bike. Mad skills also.
Swapping to a coil on my bike showed up the flaws of the fork more. Luftkappe sorted that out. Wouldn’t go back to air now. Coil suits my slow and steady approach much better.
Definitely I Went To A Coil Up Front 😁
Loved my DVO Jade on my old YT Jeffsy, completely changed that bike for the best. Jade X definitely on my shortlist for upgrades to my YT Capra
I'm torn between the Capra and Jeffsy right now! How bad is the Capra/how much better is the Jeffsy at climbing? I'm definitely looking for something leaning a bit more Enduro
@@jessebwells I think the Capra 29 climbs just fine. I had the MK1 Jeffsy and it climbed fine too. I was looking for something a bit more "enduro" and YT had a great deal and bikes were in stock vs. the Jeffsy 29 (mk2) was not in stock at the time, so that drove some of the decision. However I had no regrets, I love my Capra 29, it climbs well enough for me, and it descends amazing. I'd say if you're more concerned with climbing the Jeffsy might be the way to go, or maybe even the Izzo. But if climbing is more just a necessity to descend then the Capra is awesome (it's also great for shuttle and uplift days)
I want one for my capra too. DVO is out of stock on the 230 x 65 so I'm not sure what I'm gonna do
Super cool vid Remy!,
I have both of these shocks as well. The biggest things I noticed are how the back end is just magically silent over high speed chunk with the Jade-X. The other thing is with both shocks set in the open position, I get a lot more pedaling efficiency with the Topaz air shock. When I'm on the air shock, I really don't mind climbing with the shock wide open. With the Jade-X it can get a little too active, and you just feel it absorbing your power. So for the kind of general trail riding I do, I'm reaching for that lockout a lot more with the Jade-X. The last thing I'll say is for big hits the coil is going to blow through it's travel a little faster. That same linear spring rate that gives such smooth access to all of your stroke in that high speed chunk does cost you a little bit of bottom out resistance. Anyway, DVO is a great company, and they're very lucky to have a guy like you to show how hard you can shred on this stuff!
@CT Singletrack, hey!
Could you elaborate a little bit more about blowing your whole travel faster, on the big hits? I'm wondering whether coil helps with such smashing (I.e. bigger drops), or is it rather a worse option regarding air shocks. Ty in advance
Great video! Waiting desperately for the new Jade Twin for the DH rig. Any idea when it will be out?
Jade X Coil FTW!!!! Best shock I've ever ridden/Owned!
Blake Michal: So to keep things informative and useful what have you ridden and owned? And how did they compare to your coil experience. Be specific. Thanks.
@@mrsmartypants_1 Best shock I have ever ridden. Had a Fox X2 - night and day better. Easy to tune, climbs way way better than the X2 - because the climbing was so much better the weight was not even a factor. Bike sticks to the ground now, much better control and it is still poppy. X2 was tricky to get tuned correctly. Jade X only has a few adjustments but compression felt spot on. Even in trail mode it works really well. When locked out it is very locked out.
I love your Cube Stereo 170 i wished that i also ride for cube
Awesome video!! You fly like you're left handed.. That would be an instant yard sale for me, LOL.. keep up the good work.
Great video remy! Very informative! 👍
Appreciate it!
Every time he zips by those trees, I feel like the handle bar is going to hit one of the trees LOL. That happened to me the other day. It sucked! Now I've got to mentally get back into the game to start going fast again.
I bought STFU and I used your code, cant wait to test it out
Absolut love your Videos, I wish I could ride like you
Great job remy, I really enjoy comparisons like this and are wondering what the times were? 👍
I have not done time runs. I would need to do that on a separate days. I did the feeling only by feeling.
Ok cool, thanks remy 😎👍
The bike looks sick dude 🤘😎
I’ve ridden coil since the mid 90’s on multiple S-Brand models and a GT RTS2. I only changed in 2021 with purchase of my Intense Carbine. My current setup is a Onyx SC D1 fork with the Topaz T1 out back. I find riding air isn’t as controlled and missing the rear grip I was accustomed to. I’m going to try the Jade X because I’m missing the feel of coil. I ride SoCal park, natural aggressive enduro and DH terrain.
great videos! Can you explain what you mean by progressivity and rebound related to you suspension on a future video ?
19:30 oh hey bear lol
The missing EDC tool is triggering me haha
sponsored by different tool company
Went from mtb video to planet earth and back totally amazing.
Interesting video! I been thinking of putting a coil on my V1 Ripmo. I'm a trail rider and don't really jump or do any aggressive riding ( small drops and jumps). I'm aware the traction is better with the coil. Apart from that I'm wondering if it would be worth the change? I currently have a DPX2 on the bike.
Fantastic video
I thought Steve and star wipe transition are inseparable! :D
On the steep sections when you were braking I could hear the difference in traction
Need to try a air, only ever had spring 😐
good job. love the chanel
@1:08 Thor makes suspension services after his career as a super hero... he looks really excited about it.
Great video, very helpful. May I ask what you mean when you say “the bike doesn’t sit as much on the travel”?
a 170mm super Enduro Bikes is not what I understand as a trail bike but oh well, nice riding:) I enjoyed
I'm a newbie with an old hardtail to practice on, but I've been addicted to youtube MTB videos for the last three weeks. My wife says I'm obsessed and that's OK, I need the encouragement, lol. Anyway, I thought air was the only option and coil was old school. I'm in the process of building a bike mentally and after seeing this video, coil shocks are now a serious contender. Great comparison test and I'm looking forward to seeing more of your past and future videos. How do you address the issue, if for example you buy a bike equipped with an air shock and you want to change it over to coil?
as someone who has been riding for 3 years (not very long), I'd say to you that the difference between coil and air is small potatoes compared to all the things you need to learn as you begin to ride. technique and practice is going to make a much bigger difference than your shock :) i say this as I sit here with a broken collar bone because i made a rookie mistake after landing a jump haha
@@monkymind4316 yeah I was still sitting down at the lip! 🤣 Jk
@@monkymind4316 lol I was joking. I landed and then grabbed front brake to slow down for a turn and washed out the front wheel. Thanks for your condolences :)
Hi Remy, can you tell me what tire pressures you run at Whistler over rocky ground? Thanks in advance and thanks for the videos.
I don't ride on the same level as you but I felt the Topaz was a bit sluggish and slow to react right out of the box. I changed out the oil to Redline Like Water and it helped speed up the action and rebound, making it more playful and hug the ground better. It still feels a bit slow on the rebound and the only option would be to remove one of the rebound shims. Still for my typical ride, the Topaz is awesome, especially since I ride more singletracks and have to pedal uphill a lot. The lower weight of the air shock pays off in that aspect.
For sure. The coil felt more fun for me. So I ended up riding a bit better.
Have you made a video about how to make your bike silent as yours? Also did you make a video on how to scrub and whip?
Yup, once you try the coil there's no going back. It sticks to the ground, and holds a line when things get rowdy. Deflection is the big problem with air..... getting bounced off your technical line sucks. Yes you can fiddle with settings for days, but it never fixes the problem without compromise. Just buy the coil and love MTB again!
What is popularity of coil vs air with the pros?
Thank you Remy ;)
cant waitttt
Bike was so quite...super impressed
Nice video! Could you write how many clicks do you have on jade X? :)
Nice vid as always.
One cuestion, how much SAG do you run with the coil shock?
I do not ever measure SAG. It depends on the bike, trail, what I like etc... For a knowledge rider I feel it does not give any valid info.
yep I want one.
and with a Sprindex coil, it's the next level yet again. adjust coil spring rate in small increments as needed, on the fly. it's a game changer IME.
Yes that's awesome. Can't wait to try one.
Yesterday when I saw the picture of you pointing to your coil spring I read and article on why coil is making a comeback, very interesting. Maybe this will be permanent?
Maybe? You'll see the video:)
Hi, i have the same frame as you and I am deciding between coil or air shox so thank's for your opinion
Hey Remy... I think you forgot to mention the discount code for backcountry brewing! Haha!
Ehehehe guess who is going to enjoy an IPA tonight!
You are the CEO of a perfectionist
What kind of chest protector is that? Great video, you shred, subbed
one more amazing and very informative video @Rémy !
They also have progressive coils now that feel more like an air shock for the last 25-30% of the travel
Most coils use 1/3rd of their travel with a polymer bumper...like bikes from the 90s....think about that. The Ext does not ;-0
Hi Remy, was wondering what settings you run on the jade x coil? I know it's different for every rider but I'm looking for a baseline to tune off of. Cheers!
I need to count the rebound click but I use a 450 spring and put up to 1.5 turn of preload depending the trail. There is no low speed or high speed externally.
nice review! are you using 27.5 x 2.6 ? i notice front and rear are wide
Coil all the way. So good small sensitivity and reliability.
I put a coil on my HD4 - I found climbing traction and braking traction to be better, but I find it a lot harder to tell how much travel I'm using. I know it feels deep, I definitely haven't bottomed out, but I haven't sorted out spring weight/preload (i.e. I've tried a 550 with little preload and a 500 with some preload) to get consistent sag and try to use more of the available travel.
Overall, I haven't noticed a revolutionary improvement, but it feels better in a few areas for sure.
How was the 550 with little preload vs preload w the 500? Thx for sharing 🤘🏼
@@goride365 About the same? It's just a bit softer, maybe just a bit closer to an appropriate sag. I'll stick with the 500, but only because I've actually managed to lose some weight during COVID.
Quinn Duffy may i ask how much you weigh
@@slick4415 Around 90kg/200lbs give or take
Quinn Duffy okay thanks
"Trail bike"
Ah yes, here we have the classic 170mm trail bike....
Most mtbs are trail bikes
@@frostbitepokin9520 no trail bike have around 120-150mm of travel
@@M1lan2124 I’m talking about the fact that most mountain bikes are ridden on trails, therefore they’re “trail bikes” 😂😂
@@frostbitepokin9520 OH lol
Salut Rémy super vidéo, quel pression mets tu dans tes pneus en bikepark ?
It depends. Currently 22 and 24
Thank you this helped me a lot. Though what is the difference between 450 and 500 and are there any greater numbers than this or lesser. Thank you. By the way, do you speak french.
Once you go coil, you get spoiled. It only took me about a minute to realize how much better coil is for rear shock and fork when I rode a buddy's bike. More planted, better feel, handles big hits and chatter better, etc. The only down for coil is the weight if you are pedaling up a lot. Now you got to move to a coil fork.
Totally agree. Coil on the fork is night and day too. Even in the new Fox 36, it feels horrible compared to my old Pike with coil. Waiting for coil kits for 2021 Fox. The weight is not even worth considering as a negative in my opinion.
A few more pluses for coil are the enhanced lifespan/durability (no air seals to go bad) and you don't have as many things on your bike that you need to mess with. Assuming that your weight stays the same the spring rate doesn't need to get messed with for a LONG time. Yes air seals for a good fork/shock hold air pretty well you will still need to put air in them on occasion. Being able to check tire pressure and whether or not your drivetrain needs lube and being ready to ride is nice. I like bikes that don't need to get messed with and just plain work. Coil just plain works.
Your riding is sick! What size of frame you riding? 18' ? And your head angle is on 64.4 or 65 ?
My set up is slightly different. It will be equivalent to 64.4
So I guess both shocks work great if you are a superhuman rider. :D
Awesome video Remy! I just switched to coil on my trail bike and man i love the way it feels! Did you feel like you had better braking control with the coil?? Also was that coil the ideal size for your weight? im curious to know if its better to run a spring on the softer side and use compression settings for added support or is it better to run it a little stiffer and use only very little compression...? Thanks again man! These videos are awesome!
Yes I did felt I had a bit more grip.That spring was perfect for me. It depends your style. That shock does not offer much settings has it's all internal. I was very happy like that though. On a downhill bike having the low and high speed though is needed.
Where's the #Remy20 for Backcountry brewing?
Great vid man, thanks!
ahaha
What chain stay protector or whatever do you recommend to quiet the bike from chain slap? I'm thinking about buying the propain Tyee and I've read the it's loud. Can you confirm? Do you have a solution for that? BTW I love your videos!
use an STFU System